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Katie Higgins Cannot Deflect Her Way Out Of Being Refuted By Shakyamuni, Nichiren Daishonin, the Gohonzon and the Daimoku +^
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Chas.
Nov 20, 2022, 5:26:37 AM11/20/22
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Katie Higgins Cannot Deflect Her Way Out Of Being Refuted By Shakyamuni, Nichiren Daishonin, the Gohonzon and the Daimoku +
On Thursday, November 9, 2017 at 9:17:40 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> I'm not going to repost links to my responses to your 4 points. The salient response is that you have been shown your error regarding the True Buddha. Failing to acknowledge that, you aren't s follower of Nichiren- and you don't even respect your own branded SGI Buddhist scholars.
>
> You have been misled -. But you now willfully remain ignorant - too lazy to investigate the challenges to your views . The polar pppodite of Nichiren!
>
> In Nichiren's time Tendai monks favored other Buddha's - now you and Shoshu follow suit- same disregard of the Eternal Buddha. Little do you care to know -the consistent thread is Tendai influence -/ your doctrines were hatched 100 + years after Nichiren's passing !
>
> All serious minds seekers of the Buddha's teachings will have no trouble discovering what you are too lazy to pursue .
>
> Have it your way ,Chas - practice according to your preferences , your comfort level-. Your error is calling what you believe, Nichiren's teachings .
>
> ~ Katie
No, no, no, you don't get off that easy.
Your "answers" come down to one simplistic error: that there are thousands of references to Shakyamuni as the one great eternal Buddha by Nichiren Daishonin, which you all in Nichiren Shu have taken as a fine reason for the dehumanizing deification of that poor man as a man-God like Jesus or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth like Jehovah: which means we need to erect statues of HIM and kneel and slobber over HIS GREATNESS until our expiration.
THAT is what you think Nichiren Daishonin intended from your infantile rhetorical perspective. And to summarize: that is the side-product of "expedient means" in a nutshell.
Nichiren Daishonin had no choice but to speak in the common vernacular of Buddhism in the time to the common people who spoke and read it: to refer to the eternal Buddha and juxtapose his true teachings in the Lotus Sutra against "other Buddhas" in the competition in the marketplace of Buddhist ideas, he had no choice but to compare the Great Shakyamuni and the Lotus Sutra against the evils of True Word's Mahavairochana, or Nembutsu's Amida, or the Medicine Master's (Reiki) Yakushi-kyo, or the Zen Void which is the complete breakdown of the eternal Buddha and the destruction of the true teachings.
In the context of that battle, he rightly chose that talking about "Myoho-Renge" as the eternal Buddha in the common vernacular of Buddhist rhetorical speech to common people would be to completely abandon all hope of creating a Sangha. No one would hear a single word of what he had to say.
Of course, when speaking to his academic equal, the former Tendai monk Sairen-bō Nichijō, whom he converted when they were both confined to Sado, he could speak about the actual name of the entity and "Myoho-Renge", in the "Entity of the Mystic Law" Gosho.
The side effect of this expedient means is the open sore of misled followers of Nichiren Daishonin and misleading traitorous priests (Nichiren Shu) that would distort his Buddhism after his death into a cult of statue-worshiping idolatry of Shakyamuni.
That open sore on Nichiren Daishonin's Buddhism of the Lotus Sutra is you: Katie Higgins.
That problem, which he foresaw, would become Nikko Shonin and Nichimoku Shonin's problem, which they solved by being a team: Nichimoku Shonin as High Priest of the Fuji School during the 43 years from 1290-1333, while Nikko Shonin taught the youth.
And that problem is now the SGI's and mine, talking to completely deluded persons such as yourself. To have to abandon dialogue and take up polemics.
This is why it is important to set aside expedient means at the first opportunity (which Nikko Shonin did and then later, Nichikan Shonin rooted out the statue worshipers again.)
Hence, once again, my 4 points HAVE NOT BEEN ANSWERED BY YOU.
And I think they might never be, because there is no viable construct supporting your distortions of Nichiren Daishonin's Buddhism of the Lotus Sutra into a dehumanizing deification of Shakyamuni as God Almighty, Creator of Heaven and Earth like Jehovah or as a man-God like Jesus Christ. Statue-worshiping idolatry IS NOT Buddhism, it is an outrageous and insupportable attack on the Lotus Sutra itself.
{1.} Nichiren Daishonin's own golden words in the Gosho refute your idolatry of Shakyamuni directly ("Myoho-Renge" is "the actual name of the entity", not Shakyamuni or Nichiren Daishonin.)
{2.} The Lotus Sutra refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (In the past, 15 elder brothers, father and grandfather, and in the future his disciples and even Devadatta: all are great Buddhas just like Shakyamuni.) These are his golden words you deny.
{3.} The Gohonzon refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (the prominence of "Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren" over all other entities, Nichiren being the common mortal who is chanting and raising the banner of Myoho.)
{4.} Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (we chant neither Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu, nor Nam-Nichiren-Butsu.) This is what you chant every day, Katie Higgins, even though you deny the truth of it.
You simply need to wise up and stop deflecting away from this central point of faith, Katie Higgins.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Friday, November 10, 2017 at 1:02:12 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Your SGI Guy , Hiroshi Kanno also says Shakyamuni is the Eternal Buddha - He reads and studies Nichiren's writings . Guess you still don't , Chas 😬
>
> ~ Katie
I don't necessarily agree with everyone under the SGI according to all their views of Nichiren Daishonin's Buddhism of the Lotus Sutra, as I said: it's a big umbrella and the topic is difficult. So much expedient means has been employed in the past, that it's simply hard to perceive the truth. However, analysis is my specialty. When I was an undergraduate, I scored in the 90s percentile on all four parts of the GRE, but I scored in the 99th percentile on the analysis part. There is no 100th percentile. I may not be a very nice person, but I have the virtue of being right, once I hack my way through the forest of confused rhetoric that surrounds most of everything.
And this widespread confusion is true in every field of endeavor right now. The particle physics community is going through fits because the insiders in the academy led by Princeton's Institute for Advanced Study, which is led Edward Witten, are 100% totally committed to String Theory (and its children Supergravity, Superstrings, Cosmic Inflation, the Multiverse and other superstitious nonsense) and they are completely in control of who gets to be appointed to a research position in the top six schools: and all recent experimental work at CERN and elsewhere is murdering their "theories" right and left. It is all hogwash and that can be understood by looking at the community of particle physics outsiders led by Peter Woit of "Not Even Wrong" fame throwing brickbats at them.
So the top academics in every field behaving badly is the new standard, why should Buddhism be any different?
Nevertheless, I will continue to confront you, Katie Higgins, with the inconvenient truth that, once again, my 4 points HAVE NOT BEEN ANSWERED BY YOU. And deflecting with this type of nonsense will not change that fact.
And I think they might not ever be, because there is no viable construct supporting your distortions of Nichiren Daishonin's Buddhism of the Lotus Sutra into a dehumanizing deification of Shakyamuni as God Almighty, Creator of Heaven and Earth like Jehovah or as a man-God like Jesus Christ. Statue-worshiping idolatry IS NOT Buddhism, it is an outrageous and insupportable attack on the Lotus Sutra itself.
-> 1: Nichiren Daishonin's own golden words in the Gosho refute your idolatry of Shakyamuni directly ("Myoho-Renge" is "the actual name of the entity", not Shakyamuni or Nichiren Daishonin.)
-> 2: The Lotus Sutra refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (In the past, 15 elder brothers, father and grandfather, and in the future his disciples and even Devadatta: all are great Buddhas just like Shakyamuni.) These are his golden words you deny.
-> 3: The Gohonzon refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (the prominence of "Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren" over all other entities, Nichiren being the common mortal who is chanting and raising the banner of Myoho.)
-> 4: Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (we chant neither Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu, nor Nam-Nichiren-Butsu.) This is what you chant every day, Katie Higgins, even though you deny the truth of it.
You simply need to focus on these points and stop deflecting away from this central point of faith, Katie Higgins.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Tuesday, November 14, 2017 at 6:38:49 PM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
>
> >>"Katie Higgins Cannot Deflect Her Way Out Of Being Refuted By Shakyamuni, Nichiren Daishonin, the Gohonzon and the Daimoku "<<
>
> These are your personal views. Until you are wiling to investigate the veracity of the doctrines you uphold, there is no point in engaging you .
>
> You idle away your time defending an organization led by a billionaire, rather than study and research Nichiren's correct teachings.
>
> Unlike you, Chas, I have supported my statements regarding the main doctrines of Nichiren's Buddhism-- you have both The Three Treasures (Buddha) and Daimoku (teaching) WRONG!
>
> And it shows, Chas-- your glaring errors pervade your discourse and your behavior here.
>
> ~Katie
These would be simply my personal views were it not for deductive logic, which is part of reason and "Buddhism is reason" - Nichiren Daishonin.
Referring to my 4 points you cannot rationally respond to:
[0.] The premises of these four points are taken on faith by all followers of Nichiren Daishonin: Gosho, Lotus Sutra, Gohonzon and the Daimoku. These are the tenets of faith in Nichiren Daishonin's Buddhism of the Lotus Sutra.
[1.] I could possibly agree with you if Nichiren Daishonin said that "Skakyamuni Butsu" was "the actual name of the entity", but he didn't say that. Instead, Nichiren Daishonin said that "the actual name of the entity" was "Myoho-Renge" in the Gosho "Entity of the Mystic Law" and in fact he repeats "Myoho-Renge" 15 or so times in that Gosho, extolling its various attributes and characteristics as the eternal Buddha.
[2.] I could possibly agree with you if Shakyamuni Buddha in the Lotus Sutra had said that he was the only Great Buddha, with a life span of his enlightenment encompassing all others, but he didn't say that. Instead, Shaykyamuni Buddha said that he was preceded, concurrent with and followed in time with other Great Buddhas, his 15 brothers, his father, his grandfather, his various disciples, the Dragon King's daughter, and even Devadatta.
[3.] I could possibly agree with you if the name Shakyamuni-Butsu ran down the center of the Gohonzon most prominently dominating the mandala of the Lotus Sutra, but it is not like that. Instead, the Gohonzon is dominated down the center most boldy, by Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren since Nichiren Daishonin is the "common mortal" who is the true Buddha chanting the Daimoku and raising the mandala of the Law at the heart of the Lotus Sutra in the mirror of his life, inscribed in Sumi ink.
[4.] I could possibly agree with you if we Nichiren Daishonin, Nikko Shonin, Nichimoku Shonin and their followers of the SGI chanted Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu, but we don't chant that. Instead, we chant Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo, the Law at the heart of the Lotus Sutra containing the "actual name of the entity", Myoho-Renge.
If all that were so and the world turned on its head, I could possibly agree with you, and your Nichiren Shu priests and academics and Mark Rogow, Katie Higgins. However, it is not so and the world is upright and you are so incredibly 180 degrees wrong that no one in their right mind can possibly agree with you.
You are, to quote that champion of Karl Popper the theoretical physicist Wolfgang Pauli, "Not even wrong," Katie Higgins.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 3:58:36 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Great- now your errors should be clear - !!
>
> BUDDHA is Shakyamuni -
> TEACHING the Lotus Sutra/ practice- chanting the tittle of the Lotus Sutra
> ORDER is Nichiren and his followers.
>
> Literally thousands of passages written by Nichiren support this doctrine — please notice how scholars and sincere followers who READ Nichiren's collected works are in agreement on this. Many are equally aware of the corruption that comprises your Shoshu lineage.
>
> ~ Katie
I would put it differently: Shakyamuni Buddha, Nichiren Daishonin and some of the High Priests of the Fuji School (and no one from Nichiren Shu) and the three presidents of the SGI are great Buddhas, along with Shakyamuni's 15 brothers and his father and his grandfather in the remote past, and Shakyamuni's various disciples predicted in the Lotus Sutra, along with the Dragon King's daughter and even Devadatta. Along with all those Buddhas named in the Lotus Sutra are the historic ones are of course, and finally according to Nichiren Daishonin: all common mortals are the true Buddha.
BUDDHA: the actual name is Myoho-Renge
TEACHING: the Lotus Sutra in its many historic and future forms/ practice for now is exactly according to Nichiren Daishonin's Gosho.
ORDER: Nichiren Daishonin's true followers only exist inside the SGI.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 12:54:41 PM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Wow ! You got all that from a disputed Gosho ! And you still have no clue
[snip]
You call the Lotus Sutra quote about the 15 brothers disputed?
Here it is again:
In the remote past there were also others who preached in parallel to Shakymuni and before him: Shakyamuni's grandfather, his father the Buddha Great Universal Wisdom Excellence and 15 brothers:
The Parable of the Phantom City, LS-7, pp 156-157:
http://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/lsoc/Content/7#para-35
.... "Now, monks, the buddha Great Universal Wisdom Excellence
.... passed ten small kalpas before the Law of the buddhas
.... finally appeared before him and he attained supreme
.... perfect enlightenment. Before this buddha left the
.... householder's life, he had sixteen sons, the first of whom
.... was named Wisdom Accumulated. These sons each had various
.... kinds of rare objects and toys of one kind or another, but
.... when they heard that their father had attained supreme
.... perfect enlightenment, they all threw aside their rare
.... objects and went to where the buddha was. Their mothers,
.... weeping, followed after them.
....
.... "Their grandfather, who was a wheel-turning sage king,
.... along with a hundred chief ministers, as well as a
.... hundred, thousand, ten thousand, million of his subjects,
.... all together surrounded the sons and followed them to the
.... place of enlightenment, all wishing to draw close to the
.... thus come one Great Universal Wisdom Excellence, to offer
.... alms, pay honor, venerate, and praise him. When they
.... arrived, they bowed before his feet, touching their heads
.... to the ground.
He and his fifteen brothers all preached in different Buddha lands:
From the Lotus Sutra, Chapter 7, "Parable of the Phantom City", pp.172-173:
http://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/lsoc/Content/7#para-282
.... "You monks, I will now tell you this. These disciples of
.... the buddha, these sixteen shramaneras, have now all
.... attained supreme perfect enlightenment. In the lands in the
.... ten directions they are at present preaching the Law, with
.... immeasurable hundreds, thousands, ten thousands, millions
.... of bodhisattvas and voice-hearers for their retinues. Two
.... of these shramaneras have become buddhas in the eastern
.... region. One is named Akshobhya and lives in the Land of
.... Joy. The other is named Sumeru Peak. Two are buddhas in the
.... southeastern region, one named Lion Voice, the other named
.... Lion Appearance. Two are buddhas in the southern region,
.... one named Void-Dwelling, the other named Ever Extinguished.
.... Two are buddhas in the southwestern region, one named
.... Emperor Appearance, the other named Brahma Appearance. Two
.... are buddhas in the western region, one named Amitayus, the
.... other named Saving All from Worldly Suffering. Two are
.... buddhas in the northwestern region, one named Tamala Leaf
.... Sandalwood Fragrance Transcendental Power, the other named
.... Sumeru Appearance. Two are buddhas in the northern region,
.... one named Cloud Freedom, the other named Cloud Freedom
.... King. Of the buddhas of the northeastern region, one is
.... named Destroying All Worldly Fears. THE SIXTEENTH IS I,
.... SHAKYAMUNI BUDDHA, WHO IN THIS SAHA LAND HAVE ATTAINED
.... SUPREME PERFECT ENLIGHTENMENT.
I won't bother to point out the list of disciples of Shakyamuni being prophesied as great Buddhas in the future, as well as the Dragon King's daughter and Devadatta.
Clearly, you do not bother to actually read the Lotus Sutra. All you do is inaccurately spout, whereas I accurately quote.
Is the Gohonzon disputed? With Shakyamuni and Many Treasures on the same top row and no more prominent than the Four Bodhisattvas (ourselves, the Bodhisattvas of the Earth.)
Is Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo disputed? You know, what we chant instead of Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu or Nam-Nichiren-Butsu? That's my alternate documentation for "Myoho-Renge" being "the actual name of the entity" since you dispute the Gosho in large part (any Gosho letter that disagrees with you and your Nichiren Shu priests in your statue-worshiping of a falsely deified Shakyamuni as a man-God like Jesus, or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth, like Jehovah.)
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Friday, November 17, 2017 at 1:49:31 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Nichiren specifically refers to " Shakyamuni of the Life Span chapter"— I realize it is difficult to believe and difficult to understand , but the Eternal Buddha did manifest in human body, and preached for 40 years before " revealing the truth "- A major truth is revealed in the Life Span chapter of the Lotus Sutra, where Shakyamuni talks about himself. All the years you recited the Juryo chapter doing Gongyo , I bet you weren't even curious about what you were saying - now you "preach" discarding recitation of Gongyo !
[snip]
> ~ Katie
You don't even listen to yourself!
"Shakyamuni OF THE LIFE SPAN CHAPTER" is not the Shakyamuni of any other time in his life. When anyone recites the Lotus Sutra they manifest their true humanity, whose eternal name is not "Shakyamuni of the Life Span chapter", but instead "Myoho-Renge", which is why we chant Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo and not Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu.
Before Shakyamuni there was a "Great Universal Wisdom Excellence of the Life Span Chapter", and concurrent with him there are his brothers "Akshobhya of the Life Span Chapter", "Sumeru Peak of the Life Span Chapter", etc. and later a "Heavenly King of the Life Span Chapter," previously known as Devadatta.
That is, unless you believe that when Shakyamuni talks about all of these other Buddhas, either he is lying, or that he would be referring to another teaching entirely from the Lotus Sutra and the Life Span Chapter when he talks about them "preaching the Law"?
The Parable of the Phantom City, LS-7, pp 156-157:
http://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/lsoc/Content/7#para-35
.. "Now, monks, the buddha Great Universal Wisdom Excellence
.. passed ten small kalpas before the Law of the buddhas
.. finally appeared before him and he attained supreme
.. perfect enlightenment. Before this buddha left the
.. householder's life, he had sixteen sons, the first of whom
.. was named Wisdom Accumulated. These sons each had various
.. kinds of rare objects and toys of one kind or another, but
.. when they heard that their father had attained supreme
.. perfect enlightenment, they all threw aside their rare
.. objects and went to where the buddha was. Their mothers,
.. weeping, followed after them.
..
.. "Their grandfather, who was a wheel-turning sage king,
.. along with a hundred chief ministers, as well as a
.. hundred, thousand, ten thousand, million of his subjects,
.. all together surrounded the sons and followed them to the
.. place of enlightenment, all wishing to draw close to the
.. thus come one Great Universal Wisdom Excellence, to offer
.. alms, pay honor, venerate, and praise him. When they
.. arrived, they bowed before his feet, touching their heads
.. to the ground.
Shakyamuni and his fifteen older brothers all preached in different Buddha lands:
From the Lotus Sutra, Chapter 7, "Parable of the Phantom City", pp.172-173:
http://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/lsoc/Content/7#para-282
.. "You monks, I will now tell you this. These disciples of
.. the buddha, these sixteen shramaneras, have now all
.. attained supreme perfect enlightenment. In the lands in the
.. ten directions they are at present preaching the Law, with
.. immeasurable hundreds, thousands, ten thousands, millions
.. of bodhisattvas and voice-hearers for their retinues. Two
.. of these shramaneras have become buddhas in the eastern
.. region. One is named Akshobhya and lives in the Land of
.. Joy. The other is named Sumeru Peak. Two are buddhas in the
.. southeastern region, one named Lion Voice, the other named
.. Lion Appearance. Two are buddhas in the southern region,
.. one named Void-Dwelling, the other named Ever Extinguished.
.. Two are buddhas in the southwestern region, one named
.. Emperor Appearance, the other named Brahma Appearance. Two
.. are buddhas in the western region, one named Amitayus, the
.. other named Saving All from Worldly Suffering. Two are
.. buddhas in the northwestern region, one named Tamala Leaf
.. Sandalwood Fragrance Transcendental Power, the other named
.. Sumeru Appearance. Two are buddhas in the northern region,
.. one named Cloud Freedom, the other named Cloud Freedom
.. King. Of the buddhas of the northeastern region, one is
.. named Destroying All Worldly Fears. THE SIXTEENTH IS I,
.. SHAKYAMUNI BUDDHA, WHO IN THIS SAHA LAND HAVE ATTAINED
.. SUPREME PERFECT ENLIGHTENMENT.
And here is Devadatta in the future.
From the Lotus Sutra, Chapter 12, "Devadatta", pp.223-224:
http://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/lsoc/Content/12#para-35
.. Then the Buddha said to the four kinds of believers:
.. "Devadatta, after immeasurable kalpas have passed, will
.. attain buddhahood. He will be called Heavenly King Thus
.. Come One, worthy of offerings, of right and universal
.. knowledge, perfect clarity and conduct, well gone,
.. understanding the world, unexcelled worthy, trainer of
.. people, teacher of heavenly and human beings, buddha,
.. world-honored one. His world will be called Heavenly Way,
.. and at that time Heavenly King Buddha will abide in the
.. world for twenty medium kalpas, broadly preaching the
.. wonderful Law for the sake of living beings. Living beings
.. numerous as Ganges sands will attain the fruit of
.. arhatship. Immeasurable numbers of living beings will
.. conceive the desire to become cause-awakened ones, living
.. beings numerous as Ganges sands will conceive a desire for
.. the unsurpassed way, will gain the truth of birthlessness,
.. and will never regress. After Heavenly King Buddha enters
.. parinirvana, his Correct Law will endure in the world for
.. twenty medium kalpas. The relics from his whole body will
.. be housed in a tower built of the seven treasures, sixty
.. yojanas in height and forty yojanas in width and depth. All
.. the heavenly and human beings will take assorted flowers,
.. powdered incense, incense for burning, paste incense,
.. clothing, necklaces, streamers and banners, jeweled
.. canopies, music and songs of praise and offer them with
.. obeisance to the wonderful seven-jeweled tower.
.. Immeasurable numbers of living beings will attain the
.. fruits of arhatship, numberless living beings will become
.. enlightened as pratyekabuddhas, and unimaginable numbers of
.. living beings will conceive a desire for enlightenment and
.. will reach the level of no regression."
So, Katie, is Shakyamuni lying or not? Or is Nichiren Daishonin correct when he says that they are all (and we are all) "Myoho-Renge", which is "the actual name of the entity" ?
You see, I believe that he preached those passages in the Lotus Sutra specifically to defy those such as yourself that would seek to deify him later, by putting himself in context with other great Buddhas preaching the Law elsewhere.
These passages were preached SPECIFICALLY TO REFUTE STATUE-WORSHIPING DISTORTERS OF BUDDHISM SUCH AS YOU, MARK ROGOW AND THE TRAITOROUS PRIESTS OF NICHIREN SHU.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Wednesday, November 22, 2017 at 7:05:17 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> CHAS four points answered for the LAST time.
> >
> > [1:] Nichiren Daishonin's own golden words in the Gosho refute your idolatry of Shakyamuni directly ("Myoho-Renge" is "the actual name of the entity", not Shakyamuni or Nichiren Daishonin.)
>
> - show quoted text -
> This is from a Disputed Gosho-- not in Nichrien's hand, does not bear nNichiren's seal;-- not consistent with authentic Major Writings. As Nichiren himself stated-- refuted texts are not permitted in formal religious debate.
> >
> > [2:] The Lotus Sutra refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (In the past, 15 elder brothers, father and grandfather, and in the future his disciples and even Devadatta: all are great Buddhas just like Shakyamuni.) These are his golden words you deny.
>
> HERE (again) Chas analyzes the Lotus sutra while disbelieving the portions Nichiren recommended for daily recitation-- (disregarding the eternal Buddha, Shakyamuni=slander) No FAITH=No WISDOM. Sorry, Chas-- you have not attained the wisdom of the Buddha :-( - YOUR analysis is bunk and your arrogance knows no bounds (Ikeda-bot NOT follower of Nichiren)
>
>
> > > [3:] The Gohonzon refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (the prominence of "Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren" over all other entities, Nichiren being the common mortal who is chanting and raising the banner of Myoho.)
>
> FYI Chas- Myoho-renge-kyo is the TITLE- the ESSENCE of the Lotus Sutra, which Nichiren does not separate from Shakyamnui, the Buddha who entrusted Nichiren with propagation of "Myoho-renge-kyo"
> BTW- NAMU- is written on the Gohonzon- means "to devote one's life" --to "The Lotus sutra"
>
> > [4:] Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (we chant neither Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu, nor Nam-Nichiren-Butsu.) This is what you chant every day, Katie Higgins, even though you deny the truth of it.
>
> Here we go again - for the hearing impaired hobo, Chas: "Dehumanizing deification"? Your term, Chas-- your fantasy, Chas-- I have no clue what you are saying, but it sure doesn't resonate with me.
> >
> > Katie is referencing the teachings of Nichiren-- anyone can do it!!
> >
>
> Hope you like this format for "answering" your dimwitted points, chas-- I will not be addressing your bunk from now on,
>
> ~Katie
Evading my four points IS NOT answering my four points.
On point 1.
No one of any repute, except disreputable you, disputes the "Entity of the Mystic Law" Gosho, that is not an answer, it's an evasion.
On point 2.
Those quotes do not require interpretation (see the posting above):
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.religion.buddhism.nichiren/Q-0eZk5t90k/y7xXKQ7ZAgAJ
either the Buddha is describing his family history, or he is lying and then that part of the Lotus Sutra is a lie. Which of these are you claiming?
On point 3.
Another evasion. Shakyamuni's name is not any more prominent than Many Treasures or the Four Bodhisattvas surrounding those two on the top row. The Goshonzon is centered around the "actual name of the entity" , which is "Myoho-Renge", not another name.
On point 4.
Another evasion. It's the "actual name of the entity" that counts when you chant, not other names that did not exist before the Shakya clan existed, like yesterday, in the kalpa perspective.
Evading is not answering. Either the Lotus Sutra, Shakyamuni, the Gohonzon, Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo and Nichiren Daishonin are all lying, or you, Katie Higgins, ARE TOTALLY WRONG!
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Sunday, November 26, 2017 at 12:30:42 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Sorry? I don't see a quote from Nichiren supporting your "theory " that Shakyamuni is NOT distinguished as the ONE Buddha who can rescue all living beings in this world. If you cannot supply a quote from an authentic writing of Nichiren - free of " translation manipulations " , then you are merely imitating what SGI and the licentious priests who " made up " their doctrines have gotten away with — promoting their own personal views and passing them off as Nichiren's teachings .
>
> Nichiren ONLY and ALWAYS refers to Shakyamuni as the ONE Buddha to whom we owe the greatest debt of gtatitude!
>
> You are saying Nichiren lied? Again !! Interesting how all of your " mind revelations " are predicated on disregarding the majority of Nichiren's writings ( that have been translated )- not much of a plug for YOUR original Buddha.
>
> ~ Katie
Are you maintaining that the Great Buddhas that Shakyamuni predicts in the future and those that came before him, his anonymous grandfather, his father Great Universal Wisdom Excellence, his 15 brothers Akshobhya, Sumeru Peak, Lion Voice, Lion Appearance, Void-Dwelling, Ever Extinguished, Emperor Appearance, Brahma Appearance, Amitayus, Worldly Suffering, Tamala Leaf Sandalwood Fragrance Transcendental Power, Sumeru Appearance, Cloud Freedom, Cloud Freedom King, All Worldly Fears and finally Devadatta in the future Heavenly King Thus Come One and many others, that all those Great Buddhas are fake? That they are not also speaking about manifesting the body of "Myoho-Renge" in the Juryo chapter? Do you think he would mention them if they were preaching something other than the Juryo chapter?
Or is it more likely that Nichiren Daishonin speaks in the vernacular of the time, in the language and understanding of the people he is talking to, in dealing with the conflict between those who follow Shakyamuni and those who follow Amida, Mahavairochana, Yakushi Nyorai, and the Zen void, without complicating that critical battle with these details, in other words, that Nichiren Daishonin is using expedient means and Shakyamuni is telling the truth?
I think the latter is more likely, and where Nichiren Daishonin states that every single character of the Lotus Sutra is the truth, that he is speaking from the heart.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Sunday, November 26, 2017 at 11:44:25 PM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Buddhist scholar Kitagawa Zencho , who is proficient in medieval Japanese and Classical Chinese, and can read Nichiren's Original writings , wrote " The Words of the Lotus Sutra "
>
> I shared quotes from "Opening the Eyes of Wooden and Psinted Images" and other Gosho from the Showa Teihon in recent posts . Here is an educated perspective on Nichiren's attitude toward the Buddha's own words :
>
> "Nichiren did not regard the sutras merely as the Buddha's " skillful mean," that is , as glosses on the Buddha's awakening or as guidebook to enlightenment. Rather, Nichiren revered the sutras, and the Lotus Sutra in particular, as the Buddha's very words, or, we might say, the Buddha's edicts. This absolute confidence in the sutras is consistent with his interpretive stance of " relying on the Dharma and not on persons "...If we had to sum up Nichiren's attitude toward the written words of the Sutra in succinct expression, we could call it one of "faith."
>
> If one wants to know how Shakyamuni Buddha is distinguished from all other Buddhas, or how these other Buddhas are related to Shakyamuni , there are about a thousand passages in Nichiren's collective writings that address these topics. No need to speculate regarding Nichiren's teachings about the ONE Buddha to whom we owe the greatest debt of gratitude.
>
That continues to evade, while sharpening my criticism.
If Nichiren Daishonin regarded the Lotus Sutra as the ultimate truth, then how could his own meaning conflict with that truth?
It could not.
Therefore your interpretation of what Nichiren Daishonin means in those "thousands" of passages from the Gosho is in fact incorrect.
If Shakyamuni is speaking the truth when addressing the history of great Buddhas before him, concurrent to him, and after him (which he surely is,) then the fact that he is making that point so clearly and directly means that he is refuting you, Nichiren Shu, and the Theravada/Hinayana believers that the eternal Buddha is named Shakyamuni, a prince of a ruling family from thousands of years ago, the Shakyas.
He is thoroughly refuting your belief in his personal role as supreme deity.
What Nichiren Daishonin states makes more sense, that there are many great Buddhas, who preach the same Lotus Sutra many times, perhaps each of us getting our turn at some point. That the "actual name of the entity" for each of us is "Myoho-Renge", which is why each of us can attain enlightenment by reciting the one phrase preached by ALL THE GREAT BUDDHAS.
Numberless major world system dust particle kalpas is a longer time than the mind can grasp, and there is more than enough time there for a finite number of living beings to each become a great Buddha.
-Chas.
____________________________________________
On Tuesday, March 27, 2018 at 7:52:37 PM UTC-7, Katie Higgins wrote:
> And @chas cannot deal with SGI Buddhist scholars :
>
> Here's a passage of writing from SGI Buddhist scholar , Professor Hiroshi Kanno :
>
> " The Practice of Bodhisattva Never Disparaging in the Lotus Sutra and it's Reception in China and Japan" :
>
> " Why is it that all sentient beings are able to attain Buddhahood, including the arhat? It is because Sakyamuni Buddha , endowed with eternal life, continues to teach and deliver us sentient beings. The notion that the Sakyamuni Buddha who passed away at age 80 is a provisional manifestation and that his original essence is eternally existent is clarified in the chapter on the Life Span if the Thus Come One. Through practice if the Bodhisattva path, sustained by the vast power of Sakyamuni Buddha, it becomes possible for people to attain Buddhahood."
>
>
> @chas has yet to produce evidence in Nichiren's own words that " deal(s) with the existence of other Buddhas preaching the Law in other Buddha realms"-- SO, why should I?
>
> So-- no quote by Nichiren and @chas is practicing Nichiren's Buddhism--
>
> ~Katie
The good Professor has an argument with Nichiren Daishonin and the Gosho, not me. I simply quote Nichiren Daishonin and Sensei, and I have never quoted Professor Hanno.
In the SGI published Gosho, "The True Aspect of All Phenomena", Nichiren Daishonin writes:
https://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/wnd-1/Content/40#para-4
... THEREFORE, THE TWO BUDDHAS, SHAKYAMUNI AND MANY TREASURES,
... ARE BUDDHAS WHO ARE FUNCTIONS [OF MYOHO-RENGE-KYO]. IT IS
... MYOHO-RENGE-KYO THAT IS THE TRUE BUDDHA. [Note 4. Here the
... entity of Myoho-renge-kyo is identified as the "true
... Buddha" and its function as a "provisional Buddha."] This
... is what is described in the sutra as "the Thus Come One's
... secret and his transcendental powers." [Note 5. Lotus
... Sutra, chap. 16.] The "Thus Come One's secret" refers to
... the entity of the Buddha's three bodies, and it refers to
... the true Buddha. "His transcendental powers" refers to the
... functions of the three bodies, and it refers to provisional
... Buddhas. A COMMON MORTAL IS AN ENTITY OF THE THREE BODIES,
... AND A TRUE BUDDHA. A BUDDHA IS A FUNCTION OF THE THREE
... BODIES, AND A PROVISIONAL BUDDHA. IN THAT CASE, THOUGH IT
... IS THOUGHT THAT SHAKYAMUNI BUDDHA POSSESSES THE THREE
... VIRTUES OF SOVEREIGN, TEACHER, AND PARENT FOR THE SAKE OF
... ALL OF US LIVING BEINGS, THAT IS NOT SO. ON THE CONTRARY,
... IT IS COMMON MORTALS WHO ENDOW HIM WITH THE THREE VIRTUES.
...
... The "Thus Come One" is explained clearly in T'ien-t'ai's
... commentary as follows: "The Thus Come One is a general
... designation for the Buddhas of the ten directions and the
... three existences, for the two Buddhas, the three Buddhas,
... [Note 6. The two Buddhas refer to a Buddha in his true,
... original status (the Dharma body) and a Buddha in the form
... in which he appears in response to the people's desires in
... order to save them (the manifested body). The three Buddhas
... indicate the three bodies of a Buddha—the Dharma body, the
... reward body, and the manifested body.] the true Buddha, and
... provisional Buddhas." [Note 7. The Words and Phrases of the
... Lotus Sutra.] The "true Buddha" here means common mortals,
... whereas "provisional Buddhas" means Buddhas. However,
... because of the difference between ordinary people and
... Buddhas that stems from the disparity between delusion and
... enlightenment, ordinary people are unaware that they are
... endowed with both the entity and the functions of the three
... bodies.
Now, you and the statue-worshipers of Nichiren Shu, who falsely deify Shakyamuni as a manGod like Jesus, or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth like Yahweh/Elohim/Jehovah/Allah ... you all may declare that Gosho and others like it (The Entity of the Mystic Law, etc.) that speak of Myoho-Renge as the "actual name of the entity" ... as forged, amended or faked ... but anyone in the SGI making such a declaration is violating the 3rd of the 26 Admonitions of Nikko:
3.There will [in the future] appear persons who slander our school, saying that the Gosho are forged writings. You must not associate with such evil priests.
Those who publicly advocate the violation of Nikko's 26 Admonitions, that Mr. Toda asked us to "engrave in our hearts" will find their way out of the SGI at some point.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Wednesday, March 28, 2018 at 8:13:59 AM UTC-7, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Let's focus on "intellectual HONESTY", shall we @chas?
>
> You say : >>"The good Professor has an argument with Nichiren Daishonin and the Gosho, not me. I simply quote Nichiren Daishonin and Sensei, and I have never quoted Professor Hanno. ">>
>
> But you DON'T say the obvious: YOU do not read, study the work of the Buddhist scholars supported by your $$ donations to SGI. WHY? you don't trust SGI's "Good Professors"? Clearly you cannot quote from writings you have not READ. No surprise here, @chas,
>
> What IS surprising is your abject disregard for any source that refutes what you are touting here-- AND your claim to "understanding passages of the Lotus Sutra" that YOU analyze and make conclusions about that you CANNOT support with Nichiren's own words.
>
> YOU are still on your soap box-- spewing same 'ol bunk, you are happy to report that you disregard your own SGI Buddhist Scholar who could explain that the Showa Teihon in the only credible source of Nichiren's writings and your "main corpus" is not included in the referenced sources Kanno uses to back up his scholarly articles.
>
> HONESTLY, @chas shows intellectual impairment-- coupled with a mean streak .
>
> ~Katie
Once again, your distorted characterizations of what I do speak to your intellectual dishonesty:
||| But you DON'T say the obvious: YOU do not read, study the
||| work of the Buddhist scholars supported by your $$
||| donations to SGI. WHY? you don't trust SGI's "Good
||| Professors"? Clearly you cannot quote from writings you
||| have not READ. No surprise here, @chas,
|||
||| What IS surprising is your abject disregard for any source
||| that refutes what you are touting here-- AND your claim to
||| "understanding passages of the Lotus Sutra" that YOU
||| analyze and make conclusions about that you CANNOT support
||| with Nichiren's own words.
What I have is abject disregard for what anyone says about Buddhism that disagrees with what Nichiren Daishonin preaches and writes in the Gosho Zenshu, in the Gosho Translation Committee and Burton Watson's translation, and also what the Buddha preaches in the Supreme teaching of the Lotus Sutra in Burton Watson's most recent translation of that. Both of those available to anyone (and any scholar) at:
http://nichirenlibrary.org
I quote from that source and disagreements with those two men are unsupportable as correct.
If you find someone authoritative that wants to quibble with that position in the SGI, I would be happy to field any questions they might have.
I would remind them, however, of who they are aligning with, when they side with you, because your record is clearly documented:
1. Katie Higgins's utter hatred of the SGI as a religious organization, and Katie Higgins's false accusations of the enrichment of the SGI leadership on the donations of sincere members.
2. Katie Higgins's expressed abject hatred and loathing of President Ikeda.
3. Katie Higgins's false prophecy (through her attack dog Iain Dewar) of the decline and failure of the Kosen Rufu movement of the SGI, their growing loss of membership and dismal future prospects because of Katie Higgins's fake news that the SGI is harboring hateful leaders that abuse the members who are now leaving in droves.
4. Katie Higgins's false declaration (through her attack dog Iain Dewar) that the SGI through political organizations is secretly militaristic and Noel's fake news that their anti-war and anti-nuclear efforts are farcical.
5. Finally, Katie Higgins's attempts to start her own Sangha and independent movement chiefly to thwart the movement for Kosen Rufu by the SGI, supporting the worship of statues of a falsely deified Shakyamuni as a manGod like Jesus, or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth like Yahweh/Elohim/Jehovah/Allah, in perfect alignment with the Five Senior priests who founded Nichiren Shu upon their immediate betrayal of Nichiren Daishonin after his death.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 3:46:45 AM UTC-7, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Nice try @chas - you fail to note that Nichiren spoke just as plainly about Shakyamuni in his treatises , written in Classical Chinese
>
> Or didn't you know that ?
>
> What you simply refuse to acknowledge is your "quotes" come from a few problematic works - that do not accord with Nichiren's Major writings or the teachings in his larger body of work . Ask your Professor H, Kanno to explain this to you - if you're a contributing member of SGI this should be a free service for you .
>
> ~ Katie
If Professor Kanno is sincerely from the SGI and has differences of opinion with Nichiren Daishonin on principles then he will not be the SGI leading study academic for long. Here's Nichiren Daishonin quoting T'ien-T'ai (whom you hate) regarding "Myoho-Renge" as the "actual name of the entity" (upper-cased for your edification):
From "The Entity of the Mystic Law," WND I, pp. 420-421:
https://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/wnd-1/Content/47#para-31
... Question: The Great Teacher T'ien-t'ai has explained that
... the term Myoho-renge is used in two different senses, one
... meaning the entity of Myoho-renge and the other being
... figurative in meaning. What are these two kinds of renge,
... or lotus?
...
... Answer: The figurative renge, or lotus, is explained in
... detail in the three metaphors of the lotus blossom
... enfolding the seed, the lotus blossom opening to reveal the
... seed inside, and the lotus blossom falling and the seed
... ripening, so one should refer to them. The lotus that
... is the entity of Myoho-renge is explained in the seventh
... volume of The Profound Meaning of the Lotus Sutra as
... follows: "RENGE, OR LOTUS, IS NOT A SYMBOL; IT IS THE
... ACTUAL NAME OF THE ENTITY. FOR EXAMPLE, AT THE BEGINNING OF
... THE KALPA OF CONTINUANCE, THE VARIOUS THINGS IN THE WORLD
... HAD NO NAMES. THE SAGE OBSERVED THE PRINCIPLES THAT GOVERN
... THEM AND ON THAT BASIS MADE UP NAMES FOR THEM." He also
... writes: "Now the name renge is not intended as a symbol for
... anything. It is the teaching expounded in the Lotus Sutra.
... The teaching expounded in the Lotus Sutra is pure and
... undefiled and explains the subtleties of cause and effect.
... Therefore, it is called renge, or lotus. THIS NAME
... DESIGNATES THE TRUE ENTITY THAT THE MEDITATION BASED ON THE
... LOTUS SUTRA REVEALS, AND IS NOT A METAPHOR OR FIGURATIVE
... TERM."
-Chas.
_______________________________________________
Quoting from "The Entity of the Mystic Law", Writings of Nichiren Daishonin, p. 418 ...
The Complete and Final Teaching on Perfect Enlightenment Sutra declares, "The beginningless illusions and ignorance that beset all living beings are all produced by the perfectly enlightened mind of the Thus Come Ones."
On Thursday, November 9, 2017 at 9:17:40 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> I'm not going to repost links to my responses to your 4 points. The salient response is that you have been shown your error regarding the True Buddha. Failing to acknowledge that, you aren't s follower of Nichiren- and you don't even respect your own branded SGI Buddhist scholars.
>
> You have been misled -. But you now willfully remain ignorant - too lazy to investigate the challenges to your views . The polar pppodite of Nichiren!
>
> In Nichiren's time Tendai monks favored other Buddha's - now you and Shoshu follow suit- same disregard of the Eternal Buddha. Little do you care to know -the consistent thread is Tendai influence -/ your doctrines were hatched 100 + years after Nichiren's passing !
>
> All serious minds seekers of the Buddha's teachings will have no trouble discovering what you are too lazy to pursue .
>
> Have it your way ,Chas - practice according to your preferences , your comfort level-. Your error is calling what you believe, Nichiren's teachings .
>
> ~ Katie
No, no, no, you don't get off that easy.
Your "answers" come down to one simplistic error: that there are thousands of references to Shakyamuni as the one great eternal Buddha by Nichiren Daishonin, which you all in Nichiren Shu have taken as a fine reason for the dehumanizing deification of that poor man as a man-God like Jesus or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth like Jehovah: which means we need to erect statues of HIM and kneel and slobber over HIS GREATNESS until our expiration.
THAT is what you think Nichiren Daishonin intended from your infantile rhetorical perspective. And to summarize: that is the side-product of "expedient means" in a nutshell.
Nichiren Daishonin had no choice but to speak in the common vernacular of Buddhism in the time to the common people who spoke and read it: to refer to the eternal Buddha and juxtapose his true teachings in the Lotus Sutra against "other Buddhas" in the competition in the marketplace of Buddhist ideas, he had no choice but to compare the Great Shakyamuni and the Lotus Sutra against the evils of True Word's Mahavairochana, or Nembutsu's Amida, or the Medicine Master's (Reiki) Yakushi-kyo, or the Zen Void which is the complete breakdown of the eternal Buddha and the destruction of the true teachings.
In the context of that battle, he rightly chose that talking about "Myoho-Renge" as the eternal Buddha in the common vernacular of Buddhist rhetorical speech to common people would be to completely abandon all hope of creating a Sangha. No one would hear a single word of what he had to say.
Of course, when speaking to his academic equal, the former Tendai monk Sairen-bō Nichijō, whom he converted when they were both confined to Sado, he could speak about the actual name of the entity and "Myoho-Renge", in the "Entity of the Mystic Law" Gosho.
The side effect of this expedient means is the open sore of misled followers of Nichiren Daishonin and misleading traitorous priests (Nichiren Shu) that would distort his Buddhism after his death into a cult of statue-worshiping idolatry of Shakyamuni.
That open sore on Nichiren Daishonin's Buddhism of the Lotus Sutra is you: Katie Higgins.
That problem, which he foresaw, would become Nikko Shonin and Nichimoku Shonin's problem, which they solved by being a team: Nichimoku Shonin as High Priest of the Fuji School during the 43 years from 1290-1333, while Nikko Shonin taught the youth.
And that problem is now the SGI's and mine, talking to completely deluded persons such as yourself. To have to abandon dialogue and take up polemics.
This is why it is important to set aside expedient means at the first opportunity (which Nikko Shonin did and then later, Nichikan Shonin rooted out the statue worshipers again.)
Hence, once again, my 4 points HAVE NOT BEEN ANSWERED BY YOU.
And I think they might never be, because there is no viable construct supporting your distortions of Nichiren Daishonin's Buddhism of the Lotus Sutra into a dehumanizing deification of Shakyamuni as God Almighty, Creator of Heaven and Earth like Jehovah or as a man-God like Jesus Christ. Statue-worshiping idolatry IS NOT Buddhism, it is an outrageous and insupportable attack on the Lotus Sutra itself.
{1.} Nichiren Daishonin's own golden words in the Gosho refute your idolatry of Shakyamuni directly ("Myoho-Renge" is "the actual name of the entity", not Shakyamuni or Nichiren Daishonin.)
{2.} The Lotus Sutra refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (In the past, 15 elder brothers, father and grandfather, and in the future his disciples and even Devadatta: all are great Buddhas just like Shakyamuni.) These are his golden words you deny.
{3.} The Gohonzon refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (the prominence of "Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren" over all other entities, Nichiren being the common mortal who is chanting and raising the banner of Myoho.)
{4.} Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (we chant neither Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu, nor Nam-Nichiren-Butsu.) This is what you chant every day, Katie Higgins, even though you deny the truth of it.
You simply need to wise up and stop deflecting away from this central point of faith, Katie Higgins.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Friday, November 10, 2017 at 1:02:12 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Your SGI Guy , Hiroshi Kanno also says Shakyamuni is the Eternal Buddha - He reads and studies Nichiren's writings . Guess you still don't , Chas 😬
>
> ~ Katie
I don't necessarily agree with everyone under the SGI according to all their views of Nichiren Daishonin's Buddhism of the Lotus Sutra, as I said: it's a big umbrella and the topic is difficult. So much expedient means has been employed in the past, that it's simply hard to perceive the truth. However, analysis is my specialty. When I was an undergraduate, I scored in the 90s percentile on all four parts of the GRE, but I scored in the 99th percentile on the analysis part. There is no 100th percentile. I may not be a very nice person, but I have the virtue of being right, once I hack my way through the forest of confused rhetoric that surrounds most of everything.
And this widespread confusion is true in every field of endeavor right now. The particle physics community is going through fits because the insiders in the academy led by Princeton's Institute for Advanced Study, which is led Edward Witten, are 100% totally committed to String Theory (and its children Supergravity, Superstrings, Cosmic Inflation, the Multiverse and other superstitious nonsense) and they are completely in control of who gets to be appointed to a research position in the top six schools: and all recent experimental work at CERN and elsewhere is murdering their "theories" right and left. It is all hogwash and that can be understood by looking at the community of particle physics outsiders led by Peter Woit of "Not Even Wrong" fame throwing brickbats at them.
So the top academics in every field behaving badly is the new standard, why should Buddhism be any different?
Nevertheless, I will continue to confront you, Katie Higgins, with the inconvenient truth that, once again, my 4 points HAVE NOT BEEN ANSWERED BY YOU. And deflecting with this type of nonsense will not change that fact.
And I think they might not ever be, because there is no viable construct supporting your distortions of Nichiren Daishonin's Buddhism of the Lotus Sutra into a dehumanizing deification of Shakyamuni as God Almighty, Creator of Heaven and Earth like Jehovah or as a man-God like Jesus Christ. Statue-worshiping idolatry IS NOT Buddhism, it is an outrageous and insupportable attack on the Lotus Sutra itself.
-> 1: Nichiren Daishonin's own golden words in the Gosho refute your idolatry of Shakyamuni directly ("Myoho-Renge" is "the actual name of the entity", not Shakyamuni or Nichiren Daishonin.)
-> 2: The Lotus Sutra refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (In the past, 15 elder brothers, father and grandfather, and in the future his disciples and even Devadatta: all are great Buddhas just like Shakyamuni.) These are his golden words you deny.
-> 3: The Gohonzon refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (the prominence of "Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren" over all other entities, Nichiren being the common mortal who is chanting and raising the banner of Myoho.)
-> 4: Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (we chant neither Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu, nor Nam-Nichiren-Butsu.) This is what you chant every day, Katie Higgins, even though you deny the truth of it.
You simply need to focus on these points and stop deflecting away from this central point of faith, Katie Higgins.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Tuesday, November 14, 2017 at 6:38:49 PM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
>
> >>"Katie Higgins Cannot Deflect Her Way Out Of Being Refuted By Shakyamuni, Nichiren Daishonin, the Gohonzon and the Daimoku "<<
>
> These are your personal views. Until you are wiling to investigate the veracity of the doctrines you uphold, there is no point in engaging you .
>
> You idle away your time defending an organization led by a billionaire, rather than study and research Nichiren's correct teachings.
>
> Unlike you, Chas, I have supported my statements regarding the main doctrines of Nichiren's Buddhism-- you have both The Three Treasures (Buddha) and Daimoku (teaching) WRONG!
>
> And it shows, Chas-- your glaring errors pervade your discourse and your behavior here.
>
> ~Katie
These would be simply my personal views were it not for deductive logic, which is part of reason and "Buddhism is reason" - Nichiren Daishonin.
Referring to my 4 points you cannot rationally respond to:
[0.] The premises of these four points are taken on faith by all followers of Nichiren Daishonin: Gosho, Lotus Sutra, Gohonzon and the Daimoku. These are the tenets of faith in Nichiren Daishonin's Buddhism of the Lotus Sutra.
[1.] I could possibly agree with you if Nichiren Daishonin said that "Skakyamuni Butsu" was "the actual name of the entity", but he didn't say that. Instead, Nichiren Daishonin said that "the actual name of the entity" was "Myoho-Renge" in the Gosho "Entity of the Mystic Law" and in fact he repeats "Myoho-Renge" 15 or so times in that Gosho, extolling its various attributes and characteristics as the eternal Buddha.
[2.] I could possibly agree with you if Shakyamuni Buddha in the Lotus Sutra had said that he was the only Great Buddha, with a life span of his enlightenment encompassing all others, but he didn't say that. Instead, Shaykyamuni Buddha said that he was preceded, concurrent with and followed in time with other Great Buddhas, his 15 brothers, his father, his grandfather, his various disciples, the Dragon King's daughter, and even Devadatta.
[3.] I could possibly agree with you if the name Shakyamuni-Butsu ran down the center of the Gohonzon most prominently dominating the mandala of the Lotus Sutra, but it is not like that. Instead, the Gohonzon is dominated down the center most boldy, by Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren since Nichiren Daishonin is the "common mortal" who is the true Buddha chanting the Daimoku and raising the mandala of the Law at the heart of the Lotus Sutra in the mirror of his life, inscribed in Sumi ink.
[4.] I could possibly agree with you if we Nichiren Daishonin, Nikko Shonin, Nichimoku Shonin and their followers of the SGI chanted Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu, but we don't chant that. Instead, we chant Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo, the Law at the heart of the Lotus Sutra containing the "actual name of the entity", Myoho-Renge.
If all that were so and the world turned on its head, I could possibly agree with you, and your Nichiren Shu priests and academics and Mark Rogow, Katie Higgins. However, it is not so and the world is upright and you are so incredibly 180 degrees wrong that no one in their right mind can possibly agree with you.
You are, to quote that champion of Karl Popper the theoretical physicist Wolfgang Pauli, "Not even wrong," Katie Higgins.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 3:58:36 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Great- now your errors should be clear - !!
>
> BUDDHA is Shakyamuni -
> TEACHING the Lotus Sutra/ practice- chanting the tittle of the Lotus Sutra
> ORDER is Nichiren and his followers.
>
> Literally thousands of passages written by Nichiren support this doctrine — please notice how scholars and sincere followers who READ Nichiren's collected works are in agreement on this. Many are equally aware of the corruption that comprises your Shoshu lineage.
>
> ~ Katie
I would put it differently: Shakyamuni Buddha, Nichiren Daishonin and some of the High Priests of the Fuji School (and no one from Nichiren Shu) and the three presidents of the SGI are great Buddhas, along with Shakyamuni's 15 brothers and his father and his grandfather in the remote past, and Shakyamuni's various disciples predicted in the Lotus Sutra, along with the Dragon King's daughter and even Devadatta. Along with all those Buddhas named in the Lotus Sutra are the historic ones are of course, and finally according to Nichiren Daishonin: all common mortals are the true Buddha.
BUDDHA: the actual name is Myoho-Renge
TEACHING: the Lotus Sutra in its many historic and future forms/ practice for now is exactly according to Nichiren Daishonin's Gosho.
ORDER: Nichiren Daishonin's true followers only exist inside the SGI.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Wednesday, November 15, 2017 at 12:54:41 PM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Wow ! You got all that from a disputed Gosho ! And you still have no clue
[snip]
You call the Lotus Sutra quote about the 15 brothers disputed?
Here it is again:
In the remote past there were also others who preached in parallel to Shakymuni and before him: Shakyamuni's grandfather, his father the Buddha Great Universal Wisdom Excellence and 15 brothers:
The Parable of the Phantom City, LS-7, pp 156-157:
http://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/lsoc/Content/7#para-35
.... "Now, monks, the buddha Great Universal Wisdom Excellence
.... passed ten small kalpas before the Law of the buddhas
.... finally appeared before him and he attained supreme
.... perfect enlightenment. Before this buddha left the
.... householder's life, he had sixteen sons, the first of whom
.... was named Wisdom Accumulated. These sons each had various
.... kinds of rare objects and toys of one kind or another, but
.... when they heard that their father had attained supreme
.... perfect enlightenment, they all threw aside their rare
.... objects and went to where the buddha was. Their mothers,
.... weeping, followed after them.
....
.... "Their grandfather, who was a wheel-turning sage king,
.... along with a hundred chief ministers, as well as a
.... hundred, thousand, ten thousand, million of his subjects,
.... all together surrounded the sons and followed them to the
.... place of enlightenment, all wishing to draw close to the
.... thus come one Great Universal Wisdom Excellence, to offer
.... alms, pay honor, venerate, and praise him. When they
.... arrived, they bowed before his feet, touching their heads
.... to the ground.
He and his fifteen brothers all preached in different Buddha lands:
From the Lotus Sutra, Chapter 7, "Parable of the Phantom City", pp.172-173:
http://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/lsoc/Content/7#para-282
.... "You monks, I will now tell you this. These disciples of
.... the buddha, these sixteen shramaneras, have now all
.... attained supreme perfect enlightenment. In the lands in the
.... ten directions they are at present preaching the Law, with
.... immeasurable hundreds, thousands, ten thousands, millions
.... of bodhisattvas and voice-hearers for their retinues. Two
.... of these shramaneras have become buddhas in the eastern
.... region. One is named Akshobhya and lives in the Land of
.... Joy. The other is named Sumeru Peak. Two are buddhas in the
.... southeastern region, one named Lion Voice, the other named
.... Lion Appearance. Two are buddhas in the southern region,
.... one named Void-Dwelling, the other named Ever Extinguished.
.... Two are buddhas in the southwestern region, one named
.... Emperor Appearance, the other named Brahma Appearance. Two
.... are buddhas in the western region, one named Amitayus, the
.... other named Saving All from Worldly Suffering. Two are
.... buddhas in the northwestern region, one named Tamala Leaf
.... Sandalwood Fragrance Transcendental Power, the other named
.... Sumeru Appearance. Two are buddhas in the northern region,
.... one named Cloud Freedom, the other named Cloud Freedom
.... King. Of the buddhas of the northeastern region, one is
.... named Destroying All Worldly Fears. THE SIXTEENTH IS I,
.... SHAKYAMUNI BUDDHA, WHO IN THIS SAHA LAND HAVE ATTAINED
.... SUPREME PERFECT ENLIGHTENMENT.
I won't bother to point out the list of disciples of Shakyamuni being prophesied as great Buddhas in the future, as well as the Dragon King's daughter and Devadatta.
Clearly, you do not bother to actually read the Lotus Sutra. All you do is inaccurately spout, whereas I accurately quote.
Is the Gohonzon disputed? With Shakyamuni and Many Treasures on the same top row and no more prominent than the Four Bodhisattvas (ourselves, the Bodhisattvas of the Earth.)
Is Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo disputed? You know, what we chant instead of Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu or Nam-Nichiren-Butsu? That's my alternate documentation for "Myoho-Renge" being "the actual name of the entity" since you dispute the Gosho in large part (any Gosho letter that disagrees with you and your Nichiren Shu priests in your statue-worshiping of a falsely deified Shakyamuni as a man-God like Jesus, or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth, like Jehovah.)
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Friday, November 17, 2017 at 1:49:31 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Nichiren specifically refers to " Shakyamuni of the Life Span chapter"— I realize it is difficult to believe and difficult to understand , but the Eternal Buddha did manifest in human body, and preached for 40 years before " revealing the truth "- A major truth is revealed in the Life Span chapter of the Lotus Sutra, where Shakyamuni talks about himself. All the years you recited the Juryo chapter doing Gongyo , I bet you weren't even curious about what you were saying - now you "preach" discarding recitation of Gongyo !
[snip]
> ~ Katie
You don't even listen to yourself!
"Shakyamuni OF THE LIFE SPAN CHAPTER" is not the Shakyamuni of any other time in his life. When anyone recites the Lotus Sutra they manifest their true humanity, whose eternal name is not "Shakyamuni of the Life Span chapter", but instead "Myoho-Renge", which is why we chant Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo and not Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu.
Before Shakyamuni there was a "Great Universal Wisdom Excellence of the Life Span Chapter", and concurrent with him there are his brothers "Akshobhya of the Life Span Chapter", "Sumeru Peak of the Life Span Chapter", etc. and later a "Heavenly King of the Life Span Chapter," previously known as Devadatta.
That is, unless you believe that when Shakyamuni talks about all of these other Buddhas, either he is lying, or that he would be referring to another teaching entirely from the Lotus Sutra and the Life Span Chapter when he talks about them "preaching the Law"?
The Parable of the Phantom City, LS-7, pp 156-157:
http://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/lsoc/Content/7#para-35
.. "Now, monks, the buddha Great Universal Wisdom Excellence
.. passed ten small kalpas before the Law of the buddhas
.. finally appeared before him and he attained supreme
.. perfect enlightenment. Before this buddha left the
.. householder's life, he had sixteen sons, the first of whom
.. was named Wisdom Accumulated. These sons each had various
.. kinds of rare objects and toys of one kind or another, but
.. when they heard that their father had attained supreme
.. perfect enlightenment, they all threw aside their rare
.. objects and went to where the buddha was. Their mothers,
.. weeping, followed after them.
..
.. "Their grandfather, who was a wheel-turning sage king,
.. along with a hundred chief ministers, as well as a
.. hundred, thousand, ten thousand, million of his subjects,
.. all together surrounded the sons and followed them to the
.. place of enlightenment, all wishing to draw close to the
.. thus come one Great Universal Wisdom Excellence, to offer
.. alms, pay honor, venerate, and praise him. When they
.. arrived, they bowed before his feet, touching their heads
.. to the ground.
Shakyamuni and his fifteen older brothers all preached in different Buddha lands:
From the Lotus Sutra, Chapter 7, "Parable of the Phantom City", pp.172-173:
http://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/lsoc/Content/7#para-282
.. "You monks, I will now tell you this. These disciples of
.. the buddha, these sixteen shramaneras, have now all
.. attained supreme perfect enlightenment. In the lands in the
.. ten directions they are at present preaching the Law, with
.. immeasurable hundreds, thousands, ten thousands, millions
.. of bodhisattvas and voice-hearers for their retinues. Two
.. of these shramaneras have become buddhas in the eastern
.. region. One is named Akshobhya and lives in the Land of
.. Joy. The other is named Sumeru Peak. Two are buddhas in the
.. southeastern region, one named Lion Voice, the other named
.. Lion Appearance. Two are buddhas in the southern region,
.. one named Void-Dwelling, the other named Ever Extinguished.
.. Two are buddhas in the southwestern region, one named
.. Emperor Appearance, the other named Brahma Appearance. Two
.. are buddhas in the western region, one named Amitayus, the
.. other named Saving All from Worldly Suffering. Two are
.. buddhas in the northwestern region, one named Tamala Leaf
.. Sandalwood Fragrance Transcendental Power, the other named
.. Sumeru Appearance. Two are buddhas in the northern region,
.. one named Cloud Freedom, the other named Cloud Freedom
.. King. Of the buddhas of the northeastern region, one is
.. named Destroying All Worldly Fears. THE SIXTEENTH IS I,
.. SHAKYAMUNI BUDDHA, WHO IN THIS SAHA LAND HAVE ATTAINED
.. SUPREME PERFECT ENLIGHTENMENT.
And here is Devadatta in the future.
From the Lotus Sutra, Chapter 12, "Devadatta", pp.223-224:
http://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/lsoc/Content/12#para-35
.. Then the Buddha said to the four kinds of believers:
.. "Devadatta, after immeasurable kalpas have passed, will
.. attain buddhahood. He will be called Heavenly King Thus
.. Come One, worthy of offerings, of right and universal
.. knowledge, perfect clarity and conduct, well gone,
.. understanding the world, unexcelled worthy, trainer of
.. people, teacher of heavenly and human beings, buddha,
.. world-honored one. His world will be called Heavenly Way,
.. and at that time Heavenly King Buddha will abide in the
.. world for twenty medium kalpas, broadly preaching the
.. wonderful Law for the sake of living beings. Living beings
.. numerous as Ganges sands will attain the fruit of
.. arhatship. Immeasurable numbers of living beings will
.. conceive the desire to become cause-awakened ones, living
.. beings numerous as Ganges sands will conceive a desire for
.. the unsurpassed way, will gain the truth of birthlessness,
.. and will never regress. After Heavenly King Buddha enters
.. parinirvana, his Correct Law will endure in the world for
.. twenty medium kalpas. The relics from his whole body will
.. be housed in a tower built of the seven treasures, sixty
.. yojanas in height and forty yojanas in width and depth. All
.. the heavenly and human beings will take assorted flowers,
.. powdered incense, incense for burning, paste incense,
.. clothing, necklaces, streamers and banners, jeweled
.. canopies, music and songs of praise and offer them with
.. obeisance to the wonderful seven-jeweled tower.
.. Immeasurable numbers of living beings will attain the
.. fruits of arhatship, numberless living beings will become
.. enlightened as pratyekabuddhas, and unimaginable numbers of
.. living beings will conceive a desire for enlightenment and
.. will reach the level of no regression."
So, Katie, is Shakyamuni lying or not? Or is Nichiren Daishonin correct when he says that they are all (and we are all) "Myoho-Renge", which is "the actual name of the entity" ?
You see, I believe that he preached those passages in the Lotus Sutra specifically to defy those such as yourself that would seek to deify him later, by putting himself in context with other great Buddhas preaching the Law elsewhere.
These passages were preached SPECIFICALLY TO REFUTE STATUE-WORSHIPING DISTORTERS OF BUDDHISM SUCH AS YOU, MARK ROGOW AND THE TRAITOROUS PRIESTS OF NICHIREN SHU.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Wednesday, November 22, 2017 at 7:05:17 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> CHAS four points answered for the LAST time.
> >
> > [1:] Nichiren Daishonin's own golden words in the Gosho refute your idolatry of Shakyamuni directly ("Myoho-Renge" is "the actual name of the entity", not Shakyamuni or Nichiren Daishonin.)
>
> - show quoted text -
> This is from a Disputed Gosho-- not in Nichrien's hand, does not bear nNichiren's seal;-- not consistent with authentic Major Writings. As Nichiren himself stated-- refuted texts are not permitted in formal religious debate.
> >
> > [2:] The Lotus Sutra refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (In the past, 15 elder brothers, father and grandfather, and in the future his disciples and even Devadatta: all are great Buddhas just like Shakyamuni.) These are his golden words you deny.
>
> HERE (again) Chas analyzes the Lotus sutra while disbelieving the portions Nichiren recommended for daily recitation-- (disregarding the eternal Buddha, Shakyamuni=slander) No FAITH=No WISDOM. Sorry, Chas-- you have not attained the wisdom of the Buddha :-( - YOUR analysis is bunk and your arrogance knows no bounds (Ikeda-bot NOT follower of Nichiren)
>
>
> > > [3:] The Gohonzon refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (the prominence of "Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo Nichiren" over all other entities, Nichiren being the common mortal who is chanting and raising the banner of Myoho.)
>
> FYI Chas- Myoho-renge-kyo is the TITLE- the ESSENCE of the Lotus Sutra, which Nichiren does not separate from Shakyamnui, the Buddha who entrusted Nichiren with propagation of "Myoho-renge-kyo"
> BTW- NAMU- is written on the Gohonzon- means "to devote one's life" --to "The Lotus sutra"
>
> > [4:] Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo refutes this dehumanizing deification directly (we chant neither Nam-Shakyamuni-Butsu, nor Nam-Nichiren-Butsu.) This is what you chant every day, Katie Higgins, even though you deny the truth of it.
>
> Here we go again - for the hearing impaired hobo, Chas: "Dehumanizing deification"? Your term, Chas-- your fantasy, Chas-- I have no clue what you are saying, but it sure doesn't resonate with me.
> >
> > Katie is referencing the teachings of Nichiren-- anyone can do it!!
> >
>
> Hope you like this format for "answering" your dimwitted points, chas-- I will not be addressing your bunk from now on,
>
> ~Katie
Evading my four points IS NOT answering my four points.
On point 1.
No one of any repute, except disreputable you, disputes the "Entity of the Mystic Law" Gosho, that is not an answer, it's an evasion.
On point 2.
Those quotes do not require interpretation (see the posting above):
https://groups.google.com/d/msg/alt.religion.buddhism.nichiren/Q-0eZk5t90k/y7xXKQ7ZAgAJ
either the Buddha is describing his family history, or he is lying and then that part of the Lotus Sutra is a lie. Which of these are you claiming?
On point 3.
Another evasion. Shakyamuni's name is not any more prominent than Many Treasures or the Four Bodhisattvas surrounding those two on the top row. The Goshonzon is centered around the "actual name of the entity" , which is "Myoho-Renge", not another name.
On point 4.
Another evasion. It's the "actual name of the entity" that counts when you chant, not other names that did not exist before the Shakya clan existed, like yesterday, in the kalpa perspective.
Evading is not answering. Either the Lotus Sutra, Shakyamuni, the Gohonzon, Nam-Myoho-Renge-Kyo and Nichiren Daishonin are all lying, or you, Katie Higgins, ARE TOTALLY WRONG!
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Sunday, November 26, 2017 at 12:30:42 AM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Sorry? I don't see a quote from Nichiren supporting your "theory " that Shakyamuni is NOT distinguished as the ONE Buddha who can rescue all living beings in this world. If you cannot supply a quote from an authentic writing of Nichiren - free of " translation manipulations " , then you are merely imitating what SGI and the licentious priests who " made up " their doctrines have gotten away with — promoting their own personal views and passing them off as Nichiren's teachings .
>
> Nichiren ONLY and ALWAYS refers to Shakyamuni as the ONE Buddha to whom we owe the greatest debt of gtatitude!
>
> You are saying Nichiren lied? Again !! Interesting how all of your " mind revelations " are predicated on disregarding the majority of Nichiren's writings ( that have been translated )- not much of a plug for YOUR original Buddha.
>
> ~ Katie
Are you maintaining that the Great Buddhas that Shakyamuni predicts in the future and those that came before him, his anonymous grandfather, his father Great Universal Wisdom Excellence, his 15 brothers Akshobhya, Sumeru Peak, Lion Voice, Lion Appearance, Void-Dwelling, Ever Extinguished, Emperor Appearance, Brahma Appearance, Amitayus, Worldly Suffering, Tamala Leaf Sandalwood Fragrance Transcendental Power, Sumeru Appearance, Cloud Freedom, Cloud Freedom King, All Worldly Fears and finally Devadatta in the future Heavenly King Thus Come One and many others, that all those Great Buddhas are fake? That they are not also speaking about manifesting the body of "Myoho-Renge" in the Juryo chapter? Do you think he would mention them if they were preaching something other than the Juryo chapter?
Or is it more likely that Nichiren Daishonin speaks in the vernacular of the time, in the language and understanding of the people he is talking to, in dealing with the conflict between those who follow Shakyamuni and those who follow Amida, Mahavairochana, Yakushi Nyorai, and the Zen void, without complicating that critical battle with these details, in other words, that Nichiren Daishonin is using expedient means and Shakyamuni is telling the truth?
I think the latter is more likely, and where Nichiren Daishonin states that every single character of the Lotus Sutra is the truth, that he is speaking from the heart.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Sunday, November 26, 2017 at 11:44:25 PM UTC-8, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Buddhist scholar Kitagawa Zencho , who is proficient in medieval Japanese and Classical Chinese, and can read Nichiren's Original writings , wrote " The Words of the Lotus Sutra "
>
> I shared quotes from "Opening the Eyes of Wooden and Psinted Images" and other Gosho from the Showa Teihon in recent posts . Here is an educated perspective on Nichiren's attitude toward the Buddha's own words :
>
> "Nichiren did not regard the sutras merely as the Buddha's " skillful mean," that is , as glosses on the Buddha's awakening or as guidebook to enlightenment. Rather, Nichiren revered the sutras, and the Lotus Sutra in particular, as the Buddha's very words, or, we might say, the Buddha's edicts. This absolute confidence in the sutras is consistent with his interpretive stance of " relying on the Dharma and not on persons "...If we had to sum up Nichiren's attitude toward the written words of the Sutra in succinct expression, we could call it one of "faith."
>
> If one wants to know how Shakyamuni Buddha is distinguished from all other Buddhas, or how these other Buddhas are related to Shakyamuni , there are about a thousand passages in Nichiren's collective writings that address these topics. No need to speculate regarding Nichiren's teachings about the ONE Buddha to whom we owe the greatest debt of gratitude.
>
That continues to evade, while sharpening my criticism.
If Nichiren Daishonin regarded the Lotus Sutra as the ultimate truth, then how could his own meaning conflict with that truth?
It could not.
Therefore your interpretation of what Nichiren Daishonin means in those "thousands" of passages from the Gosho is in fact incorrect.
If Shakyamuni is speaking the truth when addressing the history of great Buddhas before him, concurrent to him, and after him (which he surely is,) then the fact that he is making that point so clearly and directly means that he is refuting you, Nichiren Shu, and the Theravada/Hinayana believers that the eternal Buddha is named Shakyamuni, a prince of a ruling family from thousands of years ago, the Shakyas.
He is thoroughly refuting your belief in his personal role as supreme deity.
What Nichiren Daishonin states makes more sense, that there are many great Buddhas, who preach the same Lotus Sutra many times, perhaps each of us getting our turn at some point. That the "actual name of the entity" for each of us is "Myoho-Renge", which is why each of us can attain enlightenment by reciting the one phrase preached by ALL THE GREAT BUDDHAS.
Numberless major world system dust particle kalpas is a longer time than the mind can grasp, and there is more than enough time there for a finite number of living beings to each become a great Buddha.
-Chas.
____________________________________________
On Tuesday, March 27, 2018 at 7:52:37 PM UTC-7, Katie Higgins wrote:
> And @chas cannot deal with SGI Buddhist scholars :
>
> Here's a passage of writing from SGI Buddhist scholar , Professor Hiroshi Kanno :
>
> " The Practice of Bodhisattva Never Disparaging in the Lotus Sutra and it's Reception in China and Japan" :
>
> " Why is it that all sentient beings are able to attain Buddhahood, including the arhat? It is because Sakyamuni Buddha , endowed with eternal life, continues to teach and deliver us sentient beings. The notion that the Sakyamuni Buddha who passed away at age 80 is a provisional manifestation and that his original essence is eternally existent is clarified in the chapter on the Life Span if the Thus Come One. Through practice if the Bodhisattva path, sustained by the vast power of Sakyamuni Buddha, it becomes possible for people to attain Buddhahood."
>
>
> @chas has yet to produce evidence in Nichiren's own words that " deal(s) with the existence of other Buddhas preaching the Law in other Buddha realms"-- SO, why should I?
>
> So-- no quote by Nichiren and @chas is practicing Nichiren's Buddhism--
>
> ~Katie
The good Professor has an argument with Nichiren Daishonin and the Gosho, not me. I simply quote Nichiren Daishonin and Sensei, and I have never quoted Professor Hanno.
In the SGI published Gosho, "The True Aspect of All Phenomena", Nichiren Daishonin writes:
https://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/wnd-1/Content/40#para-4
... THEREFORE, THE TWO BUDDHAS, SHAKYAMUNI AND MANY TREASURES,
... ARE BUDDHAS WHO ARE FUNCTIONS [OF MYOHO-RENGE-KYO]. IT IS
... MYOHO-RENGE-KYO THAT IS THE TRUE BUDDHA. [Note 4. Here the
... entity of Myoho-renge-kyo is identified as the "true
... Buddha" and its function as a "provisional Buddha."] This
... is what is described in the sutra as "the Thus Come One's
... secret and his transcendental powers." [Note 5. Lotus
... Sutra, chap. 16.] The "Thus Come One's secret" refers to
... the entity of the Buddha's three bodies, and it refers to
... the true Buddha. "His transcendental powers" refers to the
... functions of the three bodies, and it refers to provisional
... Buddhas. A COMMON MORTAL IS AN ENTITY OF THE THREE BODIES,
... AND A TRUE BUDDHA. A BUDDHA IS A FUNCTION OF THE THREE
... BODIES, AND A PROVISIONAL BUDDHA. IN THAT CASE, THOUGH IT
... IS THOUGHT THAT SHAKYAMUNI BUDDHA POSSESSES THE THREE
... VIRTUES OF SOVEREIGN, TEACHER, AND PARENT FOR THE SAKE OF
... ALL OF US LIVING BEINGS, THAT IS NOT SO. ON THE CONTRARY,
... IT IS COMMON MORTALS WHO ENDOW HIM WITH THE THREE VIRTUES.
...
... The "Thus Come One" is explained clearly in T'ien-t'ai's
... commentary as follows: "The Thus Come One is a general
... designation for the Buddhas of the ten directions and the
... three existences, for the two Buddhas, the three Buddhas,
... [Note 6. The two Buddhas refer to a Buddha in his true,
... original status (the Dharma body) and a Buddha in the form
... in which he appears in response to the people's desires in
... order to save them (the manifested body). The three Buddhas
... indicate the three bodies of a Buddha—the Dharma body, the
... reward body, and the manifested body.] the true Buddha, and
... provisional Buddhas." [Note 7. The Words and Phrases of the
... Lotus Sutra.] The "true Buddha" here means common mortals,
... whereas "provisional Buddhas" means Buddhas. However,
... because of the difference between ordinary people and
... Buddhas that stems from the disparity between delusion and
... enlightenment, ordinary people are unaware that they are
... endowed with both the entity and the functions of the three
... bodies.
Now, you and the statue-worshipers of Nichiren Shu, who falsely deify Shakyamuni as a manGod like Jesus, or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth like Yahweh/Elohim/Jehovah/Allah ... you all may declare that Gosho and others like it (The Entity of the Mystic Law, etc.) that speak of Myoho-Renge as the "actual name of the entity" ... as forged, amended or faked ... but anyone in the SGI making such a declaration is violating the 3rd of the 26 Admonitions of Nikko:
3.There will [in the future] appear persons who slander our school, saying that the Gosho are forged writings. You must not associate with such evil priests.
Those who publicly advocate the violation of Nikko's 26 Admonitions, that Mr. Toda asked us to "engrave in our hearts" will find their way out of the SGI at some point.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Wednesday, March 28, 2018 at 8:13:59 AM UTC-7, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Let's focus on "intellectual HONESTY", shall we @chas?
>
> You say : >>"The good Professor has an argument with Nichiren Daishonin and the Gosho, not me. I simply quote Nichiren Daishonin and Sensei, and I have never quoted Professor Hanno. ">>
>
> But you DON'T say the obvious: YOU do not read, study the work of the Buddhist scholars supported by your $$ donations to SGI. WHY? you don't trust SGI's "Good Professors"? Clearly you cannot quote from writings you have not READ. No surprise here, @chas,
>
> What IS surprising is your abject disregard for any source that refutes what you are touting here-- AND your claim to "understanding passages of the Lotus Sutra" that YOU analyze and make conclusions about that you CANNOT support with Nichiren's own words.
>
> YOU are still on your soap box-- spewing same 'ol bunk, you are happy to report that you disregard your own SGI Buddhist Scholar who could explain that the Showa Teihon in the only credible source of Nichiren's writings and your "main corpus" is not included in the referenced sources Kanno uses to back up his scholarly articles.
>
> HONESTLY, @chas shows intellectual impairment-- coupled with a mean streak .
>
> ~Katie
Once again, your distorted characterizations of what I do speak to your intellectual dishonesty:
||| But you DON'T say the obvious: YOU do not read, study the
||| work of the Buddhist scholars supported by your $$
||| donations to SGI. WHY? you don't trust SGI's "Good
||| Professors"? Clearly you cannot quote from writings you
||| have not READ. No surprise here, @chas,
|||
||| What IS surprising is your abject disregard for any source
||| that refutes what you are touting here-- AND your claim to
||| "understanding passages of the Lotus Sutra" that YOU
||| analyze and make conclusions about that you CANNOT support
||| with Nichiren's own words.
What I have is abject disregard for what anyone says about Buddhism that disagrees with what Nichiren Daishonin preaches and writes in the Gosho Zenshu, in the Gosho Translation Committee and Burton Watson's translation, and also what the Buddha preaches in the Supreme teaching of the Lotus Sutra in Burton Watson's most recent translation of that. Both of those available to anyone (and any scholar) at:
http://nichirenlibrary.org
I quote from that source and disagreements with those two men are unsupportable as correct.
If you find someone authoritative that wants to quibble with that position in the SGI, I would be happy to field any questions they might have.
I would remind them, however, of who they are aligning with, when they side with you, because your record is clearly documented:
1. Katie Higgins's utter hatred of the SGI as a religious organization, and Katie Higgins's false accusations of the enrichment of the SGI leadership on the donations of sincere members.
2. Katie Higgins's expressed abject hatred and loathing of President Ikeda.
3. Katie Higgins's false prophecy (through her attack dog Iain Dewar) of the decline and failure of the Kosen Rufu movement of the SGI, their growing loss of membership and dismal future prospects because of Katie Higgins's fake news that the SGI is harboring hateful leaders that abuse the members who are now leaving in droves.
4. Katie Higgins's false declaration (through her attack dog Iain Dewar) that the SGI through political organizations is secretly militaristic and Noel's fake news that their anti-war and anti-nuclear efforts are farcical.
5. Finally, Katie Higgins's attempts to start her own Sangha and independent movement chiefly to thwart the movement for Kosen Rufu by the SGI, supporting the worship of statues of a falsely deified Shakyamuni as a manGod like Jesus, or as God Almighty Creator of Heaven and Earth like Yahweh/Elohim/Jehovah/Allah, in perfect alignment with the Five Senior priests who founded Nichiren Shu upon their immediate betrayal of Nichiren Daishonin after his death.
-Chas.
___________________________________________________________
On Friday, March 30, 2018 at 3:46:45 AM UTC-7, Katie Higgins wrote:
> Nice try @chas - you fail to note that Nichiren spoke just as plainly about Shakyamuni in his treatises , written in Classical Chinese
>
> Or didn't you know that ?
>
> What you simply refuse to acknowledge is your "quotes" come from a few problematic works - that do not accord with Nichiren's Major writings or the teachings in his larger body of work . Ask your Professor H, Kanno to explain this to you - if you're a contributing member of SGI this should be a free service for you .
>
> ~ Katie
If Professor Kanno is sincerely from the SGI and has differences of opinion with Nichiren Daishonin on principles then he will not be the SGI leading study academic for long. Here's Nichiren Daishonin quoting T'ien-T'ai (whom you hate) regarding "Myoho-Renge" as the "actual name of the entity" (upper-cased for your edification):
From "The Entity of the Mystic Law," WND I, pp. 420-421:
https://www.nichirenlibrary.org/en/wnd-1/Content/47#para-31
... Question: The Great Teacher T'ien-t'ai has explained that
... the term Myoho-renge is used in two different senses, one
... meaning the entity of Myoho-renge and the other being
... figurative in meaning. What are these two kinds of renge,
... or lotus?
...
... Answer: The figurative renge, or lotus, is explained in
... detail in the three metaphors of the lotus blossom
... enfolding the seed, the lotus blossom opening to reveal the
... seed inside, and the lotus blossom falling and the seed
... ripening, so one should refer to them. The lotus that
... is the entity of Myoho-renge is explained in the seventh
... volume of The Profound Meaning of the Lotus Sutra as
... follows: "RENGE, OR LOTUS, IS NOT A SYMBOL; IT IS THE
... ACTUAL NAME OF THE ENTITY. FOR EXAMPLE, AT THE BEGINNING OF
... THE KALPA OF CONTINUANCE, THE VARIOUS THINGS IN THE WORLD
... HAD NO NAMES. THE SAGE OBSERVED THE PRINCIPLES THAT GOVERN
... THEM AND ON THAT BASIS MADE UP NAMES FOR THEM." He also
... writes: "Now the name renge is not intended as a symbol for
... anything. It is the teaching expounded in the Lotus Sutra.
... The teaching expounded in the Lotus Sutra is pure and
... undefiled and explains the subtleties of cause and effect.
... Therefore, it is called renge, or lotus. THIS NAME
... DESIGNATES THE TRUE ENTITY THAT THE MEDITATION BASED ON THE
... LOTUS SUTRA REVEALS, AND IS NOT A METAPHOR OR FIGURATIVE
... TERM."
-Chas.
_______________________________________________
Quoting from "The Entity of the Mystic Law", Writings of Nichiren Daishonin, p. 418 ...
The Complete and Final Teaching on Perfect Enlightenment Sutra declares, "The beginningless illusions and ignorance that beset all living beings are all produced by the perfectly enlightened mind of the Thus Come Ones."
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