What Post Modernism Is
The DataRat
Well, when The DataRat first mentioned that
he'd write an article explaining Post Modernism
( PoMo ), he envisioned a "quick and dirty" one-
article description. Popular expectation has
made that an impossibility. Instead, it's become
a project.So, here goes: It'll be a series of articles about
Post Modernism. These will take a while to
compose and edit, so please be patient while
waiting for them all to be posted.The Genevan Rodent also asks your indulgence
regarding the format. Advanced features he'll
use require publishing the series in HTML. If you
don't have an HTML-enabled newsreader, both
Microsoft and Netscape offer FREE ones on-line
for download at their respective web sites.If you don't have an HTML-capable newsreader,
it's time to get out of the Stone Age and into the
20th. Century -because the 21st. Century is almost
here !The DataRat
.
The DataRat
So far, your favorite rodent has concentrated on
what "Christian" Post Modernism looks like. He
thinks you'll recognize it in a lot of posters here in
the religious newsgroups.
The term "Post Modernism" started as a description
of schools of art and architecture. Go to any downtown
area of any major American city, and you'll see the
influence of PoMo architecture in the sameness of the
high-rise buildings.
General Principles of Post Modernity:
1.) Denial of absolute truth; acceptance only of relative
truth.
2.) All-inclusiveness ( except for those who make
exclusive truth claims ).
3.) Tolerance for everyone ( except those deemed
"intolerant" ).
4.) Pacifism ( except towards those who make
exclusive truth claims or are deemed "intolerant" ).
5.) Equality ( everybody treated the same, and
differences pretended not to exist ).
Post Modernism, especially in science, also denies the
existence of objective reality. ( You might want to keep
this in mind the next time you read that "scientists" have
linked smoking with warts, ingrown toenails, and adult
balding. )
As Kevin and Amy have already pointed-out, being the
dominant philosophy in America, Post Modernism is so
pervasive that it seems natural. We're saturated with
it, and don't question it.
So, when a high ranking Cardinal in the Romanist
church says that devout Buddhists and Hindu's will go
to heaven, nobody gives it a second thought. That
the Christian Bible says otherwise is NOT a
consideration.
And -even here in the Christian newsgroups- when
people present the Gospel of Niceness, instead of the
Gospel of Christ, most don't give it a second thought !
End of series...
The DataRat
Paul Duca
The DataRat wrote:
Well, when The DataRat first mentioned that
he'd write an article explaining Post Modernism
( PoMo ), he envisioned a "quick and dirty" one-
article description. Popular expectation has
made that an impossibility. Instead, it's become
a project.So, here goes: It'll be a series of articles about
Post Modernism. These will take a while to
compose and edit, so please be patient while
waiting for them all to be posted.The Genevan Rodent also asks your indulgence
regarding the format. Advanced features he'll
use require publishing the series in HTML. If you
don't have an HTML-enabled newsreader, both
Microsoft and Netscape offer FREE ones on-line
for download at their respective web sites.If you don't have an HTML-capable newsreader,
it's time to get out of the Stone Age and into the
20th. Century -because the 21st. Century is almost
here !
Why bother, if everything is going to collaspe with Y2K--and sanctimonious twits like you are out of our hair one way or another.
Paul
.
Mycroft
Note in passing:
It appears that everybody loves to pick and choose which Bible passages they want to believe. I have observed this over and over with the conservative/fundamentalist lot who ignore scripture praising ethnic cleansing, slavery, executions for various minor infractions, and Mosaic Law (while insisting it still applies to gays). They also love to dismiss evidence of the inclusive and loving Jesus while emphasizing the qualities of God which are condemnatory and punishing (and the fact that Jesus was harshest towards the very qualities the cons/fund's espouse).
The DataRat <dat...@home.com> wrote in message news:375B0321...@home.com...If "truth is relative", we can pick and choose what
truthes we want to believe. And, if we can do THAT,
we can certainly ignore Bible passages that disagree
with our PoMo iteration of Jesus.
.
Eric Sneddon
far it has not been successfully applied to any field of knowledge. To
suggest that any of the elements that the DR is attributing to it are
not the result of the modernist movement (or existed far in advance of
that) has yet to be demonstrated. This is much like the tendency of some
people to obfuscate the issues by referring to the mystery
(incomprehensibility) of the trinity, in an effort to veil their own
agendas.
Mycroft wrote:
>
> Note in passing:
> It appears that everybody loves to pick and choose which Bible
> passages they want to believe. I have observed this over and over with
> the conservative/fundamentalist lot who ignore scripture praising
> ethnic cleansing, slavery, executions for various minor infractions,
> and Mosaic Law (while insisting it still applies to gays). They also
> love to dismiss evidence of the inclusive and loving Jesus while
> emphasizing the qualities of God which are condemnatory and punishing
> (and the fact that Jesus was harshest towards the very qualities the
> cons/fund's espouse).This "post modernist" stuff is a straw
> man.Mycroft
>
> The DataRat <dat...@home.com> wrote in message
> news:375B0321...@home.com...
>
> If "truth is relative", we can pick and choose
> what
> truthes we want to believe. And, if we can do
> THAT,
> we can certainly ignore Bible passages that
> disagree
> with our PoMo iteration of Jesus.
>
>
>
>
>
> .
>
>
--
Eric
;柵
And Sharkey says: Hey Kemosabe! Long time no see.
He says: Hey sport. You connect the dots. You pick up the pieces.
Sharkey's Night, Laurie Anderson
Mycroft
--
Remove XXX to contact
Supergirl <Super...@home.com> wrote in message news:jlJ63.54459$tE.6...@news2.rdc1.on.home.com...Paul,You made me laugh. Not the twit remarks, but how Y2K is going to cause a crash and how Data shouldn't bother with his posts on post modernism. It was just funny, because I, too, wonder if the Y2K bug will cause a total collapse.SG
N20
The DataRat wrote in message <375AF2FD...@home.com>...is good for
me, and your truth is good for you".Relative truth.
The old bygone era is the Modern Age. The PoMo
era is the New Age. "New Age", sound familiar to
anyone ?Continued...
The DataRat
.
TheReverend
Mycroft wrote in message <7jh8ee$52c$1...@fir.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...
TheReverend
The DataRat wrote in message <375B0B4B...@home.com>...
>General Principles of Post Modernity:
>
>1.) Denial of absolute truth; acceptance only of relative
> truth.
>
>2.) All-inclusiveness ( except for those who make
> exclusive truth claims ).
>
>3.) Tolerance for everyone ( except those deemed
> "intolerant" ).
>
>4.) Pacifism ( except towards those who make
> exclusive truth claims or are deemed "intolerant" ).
>
>5.) Equality ( everybody treated the same, and
> differences pretended not to exist ).
>
>As Kevin and Amy have already pointed-out, being the
>dominant philosophy in America, Post Modernism is so
>pervasive that it seems natural. We're saturated with
>it, and don't question it.
>
Rodent, I think you summary of Post-Modernism is a fair summary.
I have studied post-modernism and its effect on the church fairly
extensively. While I don't always agree with you (I have been reading
but not posting in these newsgroups for a few weeks), your series of
postings on post-modernism were quite accurate. I think that this
"relativistic-morality" is a hideous at best. As I think again about how
pervasive the post-modern worldview is in our culture, I think of how
guilty the church is for not taking a stand. Unfortunately, the church
has become a product of our sick and demented society. Christians
must stand up against the values of our culture.
Christians must stand up for truth.
"A wise man scales the city of the mighty,
and brings down the stronghold in which they trust. (Prov. 21:22)
Christians must arise and bring down the beliefs so strongly held
by our sick and demented culture.
God Bless,
TheReverend.
Eric Sneddon
modernist concept.
Its more like, do unto others as you would have others do unto you, love thy
neighbor as thyself, and let he who is without sin, etc..
TheReverend wrote:
> Rodent, I think you summary of Post-Modernism is a fair summary.
> I have studied post-modernism and its effect on the church fairly
> extensively. While I don't always agree with you (I have been reading
> but not posting in these newsgroups for a few weeks), your series of
> postings on post-modernism were quite accurate. I think that this
> "relativistic-morality" is a hideous at best. As I think again about how
> pervasive the post-modern worldview is in our culture, I think of how
> guilty the church is for not taking a stand. Unfortunately, the church
> has become a product of our sick and demented society. Christians
> must stand up against the values of our culture.
> Christians must stand up for truth.
--
N20
Mycroft wrote in message <7jh8ee$52c$1...@fir.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...Total collapse? No.Partial outages and inconveniences? Probably.Unless you live in Russia or China. Then, watch out!Mycroft
--
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N20
The DataRat wrote in message <375B0B4B...@home.com>...
>Post Modernism, especially in science, also denies the
>existence of objective reality. ( You might want to keep
>this in mind the next time you read that "scientists" have
>linked smoking with warts, ingrown toenails, and adult
>balding. )
>>
>The DataRat
>
Are you refuting the Heisenberg Uncertainty principal?
remember, all you have, all you've had and all you will ever have is what
you directly experience - so to submit that there is an objective universe
is a statement that cannot be supported in any way. Have you read Atlas
Shrugged?
nos
N20
To borrow terminology from the Anglicans, New
Agers
are just "low church"
PoMo's. Real card-carrying
Post
Moderns are University professors and coffee
house intellectuals. New Agers chant mantras,
have
"power pyramids", visit
psychics, or whatever this
week's
spiritual fad is.
And, while the high brow Post Modern elite don't
believe in things spiritual, they share one common
attribute with New Agers: NO ABSOLUTE TRUTH !God is ok with them. As long as it isn't an
exclusive god. In this regard, Hinduism is the
perfect New Age religion because it has a whole
pantheon of gods that get along with each other.Conversely, the mean old Jehovah of the Bible is
"a jealous God" ( Exodus 20:5, cf Exodus 34:14,
Nahum 1:2 ). He claims exclusivity.So, the PoMo's -aided and abetted by earlier
Dispensationalism- created an artifical dichotomy
between the New Testament and the Old. The
God of the OT was "mean and unloving", while
Jesus in the NT is sort of a "Do yer own thing,
man" hippie guru.Continued...
The DataRat
.
Kevin & Amy
"As I think again about how pervasive the post-modern worldview is in our culture, I think of how guilty the church is for not taking a stand. Unfortunately, the church has become a product of our sick and demented society. Christians must stand up against the values of our culture. Christians must stand up for truth."
Amy
Non Nobis!
Kevin & Amy
http://southsound.com/NonNobis
. . . . . . . . . . . . .
non nobis domine non nobis
sed nomini tuo da gloriam
Sunny
Sunny
Sunny
I don't agree with the pope's claims (or whoever claims it) that Hindu's and
Buddhists will go to heaven. I posted a similar message in this ng already
telling someone that I thought Christianity was the ONLY way to salvation.
I'm not into philosophy and logical reasonings of Christ. I've already
stated that in this ng as well. You misinterpreted my belief in the
niceness of Christianity to mean that I don't believe at all in the
"harshness" (for lack of a better word) of it. You misunderstood that my
willingness to embrace the love and peace of Jesus meant that I was
unwilling to embrace the rebuke and teaching of absolute truth. The only
thing you can claim that I disagree with you on is the predestination thing.
But I don't believe that ALL RELIGIONS are right, and I don't believe that
Jesus ONLY taught niceness, and I don't believe that Jehovah is mean and
Jesus is nice, and I DO believe in absolute truth! There's obviously been a
communication problem, and obviously you've misjudged my niceness. If being
a "nice" Christian still makes me a pomo, then maybe I am, but as far as the
theology and all the other things you said makes people post mod, I"M NOT
POST-MODERN! The only thing you "got me on' is armenianism, and that
Jesus ALSO taught the virtues. But I still believe those two issues, and
stand by it. So if that makes me pomo in your eyes, there's nothing more I
can say. But you can't say that I agree with post-modern theology.
SG
Sunny
Just because I've come to this ng and talked incessantly about being nice,
and yada yada yada, doesn't mean that that's the extent of my beliefs. It
just means that that's PART of my beliefs. I've not been given a fair
chance inhere, I've been judged on one issue. But again, I say loud and
clear, I DO BELIEVE IN ABSOLUTE TRUTH. I just believe inpresenting it in a
manner condusive (I hope that is the right word) to human decency, and with
PURE motives, and not to purposely make people feel inadequate, inferior, or
degraded.
SG
Sunny
The DataRat
"And it goes much deeper to the men
of our churches, the covenantal heads
of households."
Amen.
The feminist man-haters ( like Carole Long )
all think the Biblical role of men confers
somekind of special ...and undeserved...
privilege on males. Quite the opposite.
Firstly, men are to be servant-leaders. Our
"privileged" role is to sacrifice our self-interest
in favor of God, church, wife, and children.
Secondly, we have the responsibility when
either our church or our family falls short.
"This is ideal, and doesn't work out today yet
because of sin and ignorance, mostly on the
part of the covenant heads."
What Amy is talking about is the "responsibility"
that the Calvinist Rodent mentioned above.
Women shouldn't be whining about equality with
men. Christian women should be kicking us
in the butt for not living up the the responsibility we
have as covenant heads of family and church !
The DataRat
The DataRat
"I simply say that we disagree on certain issues,
and i never once said that there is no absolute truth."
First of all, Sunny, you don't ACT like you believe in
absolute truth. If you do believe in absolute truth,
you're awful wishy-washy about it. And, the Reformed
Rodent judges people by their actions rather than their
claimed beliefs.
Second, there are several points of Post Modernism.
( SEE: The last article of Bro. Rat's series. ) You fit
enough of the five or so points to qualify as a PoMo.
The DataRat
The DataRat
"...you ignore the fact that he spoke more of love
than of division. And that the bible in it's entirety
speaks more of love..."
Ok, Sunny, it's not -as Raul previously pointed out-
a matter of battling proof texts. We DON'T count
up all the verses for love, then all the verses for
division, then go with the one which has the highest
tally !
DON'T work ~that~ way.
Good hermeneutics requires that we harmonize
Scripture. What 2 Timothy 2:15 calls "rightly dividing
the word of truth" ( KJV; "handling accurately the
word of truth" NASB ).
This makes for a more complete -and complex- picture
of the Lord. Neither the mean, old OT God of the
"Higher" Criticism, nor the New Age God-O'-Love.
The real God of the Bible loves His chosen ones, but
hates sinners ( Psalm 5:5, 11:5 ). He saves from sin,
but He also "maintains His wrath against His enemies"
( Nahum 1:2 NIV ). He is "slow to anger" ( Psalm 145:8
NASB ), yet He sends "terror" upon those He wishes
( 2 Chronicles 14:14 NIV ).
The right dividing of the Word involves knowing who
and when.
The DataRat
The DataRat
"I was only trying to get YOU to see that
there were ALSO the scriptures on peace,
kindness, love, etc..."
Thanks so much, Sunny, but the Genevan
Rodent is familiar with all those passages.
"They all are Christ-oriented (the Protestant
ones anyway)..."
There are many protestant churches with just
as despicable heresies as the Church of Rome !
Try the Seventh Day Adventists, Anabaptists,
Boston Church of Christ, Christian Scientists, a
lot of Pentecostal churches, most Charismatic
churches, the Oneness churches, the
Christadelphians, The Way International, the
Children of God, many non-denominational
churches, etc., etc.
What you are espousing is called Relational
Theology: If you have a relationship with
Jezzus, you're a "Christian". Sorry, but followers
of "a different gospel" and "another Jesus" DON'T
qualify !
The DataRat
The DataRat
"Just because I've come to this ng and talked
incessantly about being nice, and yada yada yada,
doesn't mean that that's the extent of my beliefs."
We judge you by what you do.
The DataRat
Rick Hall
<Xta73.58$WL....@news2.rdc1.on.home.com>...
> By the way,
> Just because I've come to this ng and talked incessantly about being
nice,
> and yada yada yada, doesn't mean that that's the extent of my beliefs.
> just means that that's PART of my beliefs. I've not been given a fair
> chance inhere, I've been judged on one issue. But again, I say loud and
> clear, I DO BELIEVE IN ABSOLUTE TRUTH. I just believe inpresenting it
in a
> manner condusive (I hope that is the right word) to human decency, and
with
> PURE motives, and not to purposely make people feel inadequate, inferior,
or
> degraded.
> SG
>
>
Take heart. If you have been misjudged, people will come around and
recognize it. I understand that it is hard not to get riled up when you
are perceiving attacks on your person or your beliefs. Best practice is to
brush them off. If the person doing the attacking is someone otherwise
worth listening to, then listen, and see if they have a point. If they are
not, then ignore them all together.
I saw someone post an article bemoaning the evils of kill files. I am
telling you they are a good thing. If you waste your time arguing with
some people on here who have no interest in promoting any truth, but merely
at tearing other people down, you are just going to get frustrated. Those
people are generally fairly easy to spot. You will know for sure when you
post the question 'OK, so we know what you are against, but what are you
for?' and you will get no answer.
Keep up, post arguments, ask and answer questions. When you make your
statements, cite scriptures. Prove why you are right. When you disagree
with something prove why it is wrong. If someone calls you a name, let it
pass. You won't convince that person probably, but there is a large
audience here. That is who you are ministering to.
Rick
P.S. I did not mention the names of people I ignore, because I don't want
to give them any credit. I do not consider DataRat to be one of these
people, but we are all entitled to our own opinions.
Mycroft
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The DataRat <dat...@home.com> wrote in message
news:375B0B4B...@home.com...
>
>
> So far, your favorite rodent has concentrated on
> what "Christian" Post Modernism looks like. He
> thinks you'll recognize it in a lot of posters here in
> the religious newsgroups.
>
> The term "Post Modernism" started as a description
> of schools of art and architecture. Go to any downtown
> area of any major American city, and you'll see the
> influence of PoMo architecture in the sameness of the
> high-rise buildings.
>
> General Principles of Post Modernity:
>
> 1.) Denial of absolute truth; acceptance only of relative
> truth.
>
> 2.) All-inclusiveness ( except for those who make
> exclusive truth claims ).
>
> 3.) Tolerance for everyone ( except those deemed
> "intolerant" ).
>
> 4.) Pacifism ( except towards those who make
> exclusive truth claims or are deemed "intolerant" ).
>
> 5.) Equality ( everybody treated the same, and
> differences pretended not to exist ).
>
> Post Modernism, especially in science, also denies the
> existence of objective reality. ( You might want to keep
> this in mind the next time you read that "scientists" have
> linked smoking with warts, ingrown toenails, and adult
> balding. )
>
> As Kevin and Amy have already pointed-out, being the
> dominant philosophy in America, Post Modernism is so
> pervasive that it seems natural. We're saturated with
> it, and don't question it.
>
TheReverend
The DataRat wrote in message <375D4585...@home.com>...
>
>What Amy is talking about is the "responsibility"
>that the Calvinist Rodent mentioned above.
>
>Women shouldn't be whining about equality with
>men. Christian women should be kicking us
>in the butt for not living up the the responsibility we
>have as covenant heads of family and church !
>
I agree with the DataRat but I am not sure if every man is like that. Men
need to live up to their responsibility but some men already are doing this
Perhaps, it is unfair to characterize all men like this.
TheReverend
TheReverend
Kevin & Amy wrote in message ...
"TheReverend" <the.re...@home.com> wrote:
"Unfortunately, the church has become a product of our sick and demented society. Christians must stand up against the values of our culture. Christians must stand up for truth."
Thank you for your response, Amy. Perhaps I should clarify what I meant. What I meant is that the church has too freely accepted the values and beliefs of 20th cen. North American culture. We Christians are more influenced by our culture than we are influencing our culture. We should be trying to transform our culture for christ but instead, we are being transformed by non-christian beleif systems like Post-Modernism.
God Bless,
The Reverend.
Kevin & Amy
Thanks for clarifying this, DR.
"This is ideal, and doesn't work out today yet
because of sin and ignorance, mostly on the
part of the covenant heads."
What Amy is talking about is the "responsibility"
that the Calvinist Rodent mentioned above.
Women shouldn't be whining about equality with
men. Christian women should be kicking us
in the butt for not living up the the responsibility we
have as covenant heads of family and church !
Exactly!
The DataRat
Kevin & Amy
Her dishonesty:
You know, somehow I recall an oft-repeated mantra, "why are you so mean to me?"
" I was not so much annoyed with how everyone treated me and "hurt my feelings" as I was annoyed with how I felt God's mercy was being misrepresented." "None of your judgements matter; it's God's judgement that I care about."
Additionally:
Apparently not! She couldn't get past her hurt feelings to see why we felt her "biblical" pronouncements were anything but Biblical.
"I am just as devoted, and just as willing to learn..."
Her dispensationalism:
This is one of the many gross errors of this heresy which teaches, contrary to Scripture, that God established two methods of salvation: Salvation by Law, which, according to this heresy, is how people were saved in the Old Testament; and Salvation by Grace, which is erroneously presented as antithetical to the Law of God, and is how people are saved in this parenthetical "Church Age." Salvation has always been by Faith, evidenced by obedience.
" He sent Jesus for us to abolish the old route to salvation: salvation through the law."
So do Mormons and Russellites (for that matter, so did Jim Jones and David Koresh). You can prove anything from the Bible if you pull verses out of their context and ignore a host of others, which dispensationalism does (among other heresies).
" I quoted legitimate, word for word scriptures, and THAT is God's word, not my own."
Here is her postmodern relativistic polytheism in all its glory. All roads lead to heaven. There's more than one way to the Father! I don't really doubt that she believes the truth deep down in her heart, but this is just the point. What she says, what's in her head, her theology, isn't consistent with what is likely in her heart.
"None of us, even myself, should be so arrogant as to assume that our way and our interpretations are the only correct ones."
No. Data just happened to be quicker than the rest of us. That's all.
"...as soon as Data jumped on me, the rest of you followed his lead."
Uh, which is it? Perhaps she should have said, "I'm signing off for a while..." I only highlight this to illustrate that she is typing faster than she's thinking. She needs to think more carefully about what she says she believes.
"... I'm signing off for good...but hopefully I'll be back."
How can she, when she doesn't understand what He says to her? DataRat, Mrs. Rat, the GoldRushes, Amy and I have tried to tell her in so many ways how contrary to Scripture her views were, but she, in pharisaical fashion, sanctimoniously throws her head back, folds her arms and voices a resounding "I don't care! You hurt my feelings!" That is pride and arrogance.
"... I know where I stand with my Father."
Sorry, but I thought God's Word was a pretty reliable standard by which to judge truth and falsehood. Again, she evidences her humanistic postmodernism.
"And with all due respect, none of you really know HOW He'll judge me or yourselves even."
I hope the Holy Spirit will remove the scales of pride and self-centeredness from her eyes. I pray our words, variously thrown at her in both gracious and sarcastic manners, will take root, so that, one day, it'll click with her and she'll say, "Oh! THAT'S what they were talking about!"
Non Nobis!
Kevin
http://southsound.com/NonNobis
__________________
non nobis domine non nobis
sed nomini tuo da gloriam
----------
From: "Sunny" <Super...@Noway.com>
Newsgroups: alt.religion.christian.presbyterian,alt.religion.christian.biblestudy,alt.bible,alt.religion.apologetics,alt.christnet.christianlife
Subject: Re: Debating Scripture
Date: Tue, Jun 8, 1999, 1:28 AM
Kevin,
Thank you for your Christian response to me. That's all I was ever asking for, was for everyone to post in a decent manner. I have held these same beliefs that I speak about for many years, and the churches I attended all taught what I speak of as well. I have many Christian friends that agree with me, and many that don't. But the ones that don't, though they would voice their opinions, and though they "knew" they were right, never ridiculed me or anyone else, and they never made fun of, ganged up on, or insulted anyone. I understand that you all disagree with my beliefs, and I respect that. I do not respect the manner in which everyone acted, for biblically, it was not acceptable, even if you think it was. And Kevin, just as you're not the brood of vipers that you believe I think you to be, neither am I heathen, and ungodly. I obviously have different views, but I am just as devoted, and just as willing to learn and grow as God's child. Just because we disagree on views, and interpretations, doesn't make me heathen, and it doesn't mean I'm not your sister in Christ. No denomination is the only right one, no doctrine, no theology. We all are imperfect, flawed humans, so how in the world can any of us expect to know everything that God is, and requires of us. We can come close I suppose, but all of us, ALL of us, will continue to be corrected, and continue to learn new things. I was not so much annoyed with how everyone treated me and "hurt my feelings" as I was annoyed with how I felt God's mercy was being misrepresented. For the Bible tells us that God's mercy is bestowed on us, and His grace. He sent Jesus for us to abolish the old route to salvation: salvation through the law. He allowed us grace to be saved through Christ's sacrifice. And finally, to end this post. I did quote scriptures quite frequently, and I was continually mocked that that was the gospel according to "stupidgirl", etc... That's not fair. I quoted legitimate, word for word scriptures, and THAT is God's word, not my own. None of us, even myself, should be so arrogant as to assume that our way and our interpretations are the only correct ones. And also, I am sorry I assumed that none of you encourage, but from the start, as soon as Data jumped on me, the rest of you followed his lead. No one ever approached it in a decent manner from the start, and that's why I got defensive. Anyway, I'm signing off for good soon, for I'm going to Tennessee to be with my mammaw as she's recovering from major surgery. Some will say I've fled, or given up, etc... and that's fine. Think what you want; but hopefully I'll be back, and maybe things will go smoother. I did learn something, though. I learned that I shouldn't argue as much, I shouldn't care what anyone thinks of me, as long as I know where I stand with my Father. None of your judgements matter; it's God's judgement that I care about. And with all due respect, none of you really know HOW He'll judge me or yourselves even. Thank you Kevin, for your post.
Supergirl
The DataRat
"Here is her postmodern relativistic polytheism
in all its glory."
Quite so.
The DataRat now confers upon Sunny the coveted
title of: Resident Newsgroup PoMo !
The DataRat
The DataRat
"...as soon as Data jumped on me, the rest of
you followed his lead."
Actually, Stupidgirl, it was Ronda who jumped
on you ( remember: "little girl" ). THEN, the rest
of us followed her lead !
The DataRat
The DataRat
"... I'm signing off for good...but hopefully I'll be back."
What will we do for PoMo Niceness Police while you're
gone, Sunny ?
The DataRat
Janie
Very well said. I applaud you. BTW I will be praying for your Grandmothers
health concerns.
Sincerely,
Janie
Sunny wrote in message ...
Kevin & Amy
Amy
Elaine put this at the bottom of her post, and Janie was
a respondant.
Does anyone have any information about this group?
We would be most interested to know what it is and what
their agenda is.
Ronda
Ben Hopkins
>
> "...you ignore the fact that he spoke more of love
> than of division. And that the bible in it's entirety
>
> Ok, Sunny, it's not -as Raul previously pointed out-
> a matter of battling proof texts. We DON'T count
> up all the verses for love, then all the verses for
> division, then go with the one which has the highest
> tally !
>
> DON'T work ~that~ way.
BUT -- I'll bet that if you did catagorize the passages, and tallied
up the counts, that judgement & division would win out over harmony &
unity.
Dave Wood
> "And it goes much deeper to the men
> of our churches, the covenantal heads
> of households."
DataRat wrote:
> The feminist man-haters ( like Carole Long )
> all think the Biblical role of men confers
> somekind of special ...and undeserved...
> privilege on males. Quite the opposite.
I agree with both Amy's understanding of the
various roles of participants in a household.
I also agree with DataRat re the 'Quite the
opposite' line of thought.
Men are commanded to love their wives as
Christ loved the Chruch! Don't know about
you but that leaves very little room for the
so-called male-dominance, barefoot and
pregnant, philosophy!
DataRat wrote
> Women shouldn't be whining about equality with
> men. Christian women should be kicking us
> in the butt for not living up the the responsibility we
> have as covenant heads of family and church !
Amen.
Dave
The pessimist bemoans the easterly wind.
The optimist happily awaits a change.
The realist changes tack.
The DataRat
Don't know, Ronda. Suspicious, though, isn't it ?
Web search for "Women for the Word" was negative.
The DataRat
The DataRat
Apparently they're associated with the United Methodists.
Also appear to be associated with the RCA ( the "Reformed"
version of the UMC ! )
But, they're non-denominational. Sound sort of
Disciples of Christ like.
See:
http://www.geocities.com/Wellesley/Atrium/2978/join.html
May be a product of Christian Believers United (CBU).
See:
They're some sort of "Messianic Jewish-Christian"
Pentecostal group that may be the parent organization.
The DataRat
Sunny
Sunny
Maybe you'll be a little more humble.
SG
Sunny
love side. I recognized the "sword" side, and I believe in it totally, but
you SEEMED not to believe in the love verses, and I was only trying to
voice those.
SG
The DataRat
"I'll bet that if you did catagorize the passages, and tallied
up the counts, that judgement & division would win out over
harmony & unity."
True. The OT is about 77% of the Bible. And, that is our
primer on judgment, damnation, and division.
The DataRat
Sunny
be. I belonged to an inter-denominational church in one city I used to live
in, and now I belong to a Christian Vineyard Fellowship (not the kind that
is of the Toronto mindset, however, the one that was kicked out of vineyard.
I'm not sure of the movement they had promoted, but my church wasn't and
isn't into that.
SG
Sunny
SG
The DataRat
"YOU shouldn't JUDGE me by anything.
That's our Father's job."
Says YOU and Post Modernism.
Scripture says differently:
"Judge with righteous judgment"
( John 7:24 NASB )
The DataRat
michael burt
<XXXlo...@earthlink.netX> wrote:
> 'Post-Modernism' = anything DataRat dislikes.
Post Modernism = God is evolving, different than yesterday and different
again tomorrow. Whatever He says, you can disregard it, for God's Word is
in flux changing to meet the fluid passing of re-imaging to human sophia.
i.e. God must be re-imaged to the latest passing trends and images of
psychobable.
Below comments taken from Did the Virgin Mary Live and Die in England?
Victor Dunstan, Megiddo Press Ltd, Wales; 1985, page 80.
***
It is unfortunate that very early on in human history man decided to
create God in his own image. The ågod made in man¼s image is, of course,
ever changing. From time to time he has been racist and anti-racist,
pro-slavery and anti-slavery, Capitalist and Communist, Catholic and
Protestant, pro-war and anti-war, pro-abortion and anti-abortion-he has
even been anti-Semetic!
God has been made to be whatever the people who believe in him WANT him to be.
We may like what the scriptures teach or we many not like what the
scriptures teach but it is doubtful if our likes or dislikes will succeed
in changing the nature of the Great Universal Spirit. It is wholly
erroneous to assume that those parts of the scriptures with which we agree
are right and those parts of the scripture with which we disagree are
wrong. With what logic do we assume that the inspiration behind the
scriptures must be like us and have OUR morality?
You don¼t like the idea? Don¼t blame the writer I¼m only telling you what
the Good Book says and don¼t blame God-He won¼t take a blind bit of notice
of you!
It is probably the åAchilles Heel¼ of the Christian church that it markets
God in a very much the same way as a detergent manufacturer markets soap
powder. In a primitive form of market research they ask, åWhat do people
want, what will they buy? Allright let¼s make something like that !¼ So
our churches produce a god that is acceptable to their åbuying public¼ and
God becomes packaged according to current fad irrespective of whether that
fad is jingoistic or pacific.
As the Baptist preacher the late Charles Haddon Spurgeon a little
cynically remarked åMen will have God anywhere except on His throne.¼
***
It is time to return God to His throne in a nation that places their trust
in the Lord. Littleton has showed the way of the alternative lifestyle.
--
May God Bless You,
Michael
Character Counts. It is not hypocritical to set a high goal and occasionally fail. It is hypocritical to set a low goal and occasionally succeed.
N20
Mycroft wrote in message <7jjkd9$3bn$1...@oak.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...
All you need are the mutant virus-laden bees whose sting turns us into Aliens.If you haven't seen the "X Files" movie I recommend it - it'd fit right into your paranoid system.M
--
Remove XXX to contact
N20 <n...@granite.net.au> wrote in message news:E4973.67$uA2...@nswpull.telstra.net...
Eric Sneddon
michael burt wrote:
> Post Modernism = God is evolving, different than yesterday and different
> again tomorrow. Whatever He says, you can disregard it, for God's Word is
> in flux changing to meet the fluid passing of re-imaging to human sophia.
> i.e. God must be re-imaged to the latest passing trends and images of
> psychobable.
Eric
;柵
And Sharkey says: Hey Kemosabe! Long time no see.
He says: Hey sport. You connect the dots. You pick up the pieces.
Sharkey's Night, Laurie Anderson
Rabbit
The DataRat wrote:
>
> "Just because I've come to this ng and talked
> incessantly about being nice, and yada yada yada,
> doesn't mean that that's the extent of my beliefs."
>
> We judge you by what you do.
As we do you. You spoke earlier with Sunny about rightly dividing
scripture, and taking all verses regarding (specifically) Jesus'
harshness to the religious elist and His and others' exhortations to be
loving into account. It is the opinion of many that you have been rude
and slanderous (meaning false associations, like your Nazi or Ogre-like
pictures). Ephesians 4:29 states "Do not let any unwholesome talk come
out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up
according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.". By
extension (since there was no internet then) I believe this includes
this medium, and note that the tactics you have been using are not
helpful or building up or beneficial. Your information is not at issue;
you must continue to argue and fight the good fight (as you apparently
see it), but I exhort you in Christ's name to tone down the sarcasm. It
is most certainly getting in the way of any truths you are submitting,
in case you expect any of your detractors to be able to hear you.
>
> The DataRat
Rabbit
Ben Hopkins
But, I was talking about the NT, specifically, Jesus' own
words. The ones in RED, if you have a RLE, which I don't
because I don't like them.
Mycroft
--
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N20 <n...@granite.net.au> wrote in message news:rHt73.114$FM2....@nswpull.telstra.net...
Royce Buehler
In article <7jjknu$3mb$1...@oak.prod.itd.earthlink.net>, "Mycroft" <XXXlo...@earthlink.netX> writes:
> 'Post-Modernism' = anything DataRat dislikes.
That is exactly the way DataRat uses the term. For him, it is a catch-all
term of abuse, to be hurled at anybody he wishes to insult but doesn't
wish to engage in discussion with.
When anyone tells DataRat, "You are wrong about X", DataRat replies:
"I don't have to talk to you. You are beneath me. You are PoMo."
In other words, when someone says, "DataRat, you say X, but that is
false; the truth is not-X", DataRat falsely accuses them of claiming that X
and not-X are equally true. This is convenient for him, because it relieves him
of any responsibility for coming up with *reasons* why X is supposedly
true.
> The DataRat <dat...@home.com> wrote in message
> news:375B0B4B...@home.com...
> >
> > General Principles of Post Modernity:
> >
> > 1.) Denial of absolute truth; acceptance only of relative
> > truth.
[assorted oversimplifications snipped. Though I must admit,
anyone who allows the postmodernists all the complexifications
and arid academic distinctions they want to make is going to
waste his own and everyone else's time.]
> > Post Modernism, especially in science, also denies the
> > existence of objective reality. ( You might want to keep
> > this in mind the next time you read that "scientists" have
> > linked smoking with warts, ingrown toenails, and adult
> > balding. )
Which is of course the purest possible nonsense. DataRat dislikes
certain scientific results; he therefore claims that the scientists
who present those results "deny the existence of objective reality"
because of their postmodernism. I.e., once again DR's effective
definition of postmodernist is "disagress with or displeases DataRat."
There are no PoMo scientists. The whole enterprise of science has
come under virulent attack from postmodernists, precisely because
scientists continue to adhere to belief in objective truth, arrived at
by objective methods. Postmodernists have flooded the humanities in
many universities, but they haven't made a dent in the science
faculties.
And they never will. Postmodernism is, to a very large degree, just
a symptom of academic envy. Science, because it has a handle on how
to approach objective truth, has a lot of prestige. The humanities,
for better or for worse, have lost prestige in comparison. So professional
academicians in the humanities have taken to knocking "truth". It's
petty, and childish, and (thank God) already running out of steam.
> > So, when a high ranking Cardinal in the Romanist
> > church says that devout Buddhists and Hindu's will go
> > to heaven, nobody gives it a second thought. That
> > the Christian Bible says otherwise is NOT a
> > consideration.
I doubt any high ranking cardinal has said that. What has been established
doctrine within the RCC for centuries is that devout Buddhists and
Hindus *might* go to heaven, at God's prerogative. In RC doctrine,
_Extra ecclesiam nulla salus_ ("There is no salvation outside the church"),
but if God chooses to save some of those folks, then they're in the church,
whether we know it or not and whether they know it or not.
The RCC doesn't say there is no such thing as truth or falsehood. It
says that the DataRat's claim "All Buddhists and Hindus, unless they
convert to strict five-point Calvinism, are going to Hell" is a FALSE
claim.
If DataRat were honest, he could say that his doctrine is correct and
theirs is incorrect. But then he would have to actually engage in
thought to justify his doctrine. So he takes the dishonest route of
claiming that the good Cardinal said "DataRat and I contradict each
other, but we're both right." That would indeed be PoMo; but, unless
DR can produce a direct quote to the contrary, that's not what the
cardinal was saying.
YOU ARE WRONG, DataRat. Can I be any clearer? Your theology is peurile,
sententious, pointlessly offensive, sub-biblical, and false. I'm not saying
my theology and yours are just as good, each for its own respective believers.
I am saying that you need to go sit at Jesus' feet for a few decades and
come back when you are ready to deal with reality rather than with the
FALSE God-as-cosmic-tyrant catechism that you have memorized by rote.
[Pause here, while DataRat indulges in his usual blithe name-calling,
comforting himself with the baseless assertion that this poster is
"PoMo". ;-) ]
--
Royce Buehler bue...@space.mit.edu
"Comme un fou se croit Dieu, nous nous croyons mortels"
-- Pierre Delalande
Tweaker
N20 wrote:
Paranoia? Check out FEMA's own website. nos
Mycroft wrote in message <7jjkd9$3bn$1...@oak.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...All you need are the mutant virus-laden bees whose sting turns us into Aliens.If you haven't seen the "X Files" movie I recommend it - it'd fit right into your paranoid system.M
--
Remove XXX to contact
N20 <n...@granite.net.au> wrote in message news:E4973.67$uA2...@nswpull.telstra.net...In fact Japan and Brazil will be the hardest hit countries. As for the good ol' USA, well you can expect martial law instigated by FEMA regardless of what actually happens. The UN are already on your land, the camps are ready for the right-wing conservitive militia dissidents. The NWO order will be here then. Then the final battle between China and the UN.....The dragon from the east nos
Eric Sneddon
Dave Wood wrote:
> Do you really have any idea what you are talking about above?It is the
> commoditisation of education that is driving the wedge youdescribe -
> not some silly litte inter-departmental squabble.nb: clue I am not
> from a humanities department.
Too much money chasing too few real degrees.
--
Janie
I agree with your post. We have been hearing alot in this NG about being
using tough tactics to rebuke Christians. I still maintain, kindness,
compassion and empathy toward both believers and non-believers is the best
way to reach them. Jesus used these ways Himself for the most part. Yes,
He did become angry when it was appropriate, but still He showed love. No
matter what anyone says, I think thats the example we should follow. Being
kind to others is NOT Post Modernism as several have suggested.
Sincerely,
Janie
--Believer
TheReverend wrote in message <375d...@newsfeed.intergate.ca>...
Kevin & Amy wrote in message ...
"TheReverend" <the.re...@home.com> wrote:
"Unfortunately, the church has become a product of our sick and demented
society. Christians must stand up against the values of our culture.
Christians must stand up for truth."
Thank you for your response, Amy. Perhaps I should clarify what I
meant. What I meant is that the church has too freely accepted the values
and beliefs of 20th cen. North American culture. We Christians are more
influenced by our culture than we are influencing our culture. We should be
trying to transform our culture for christ but instead, we are being
transformed by non-christian beleif systems like Post-Modernism.
God Bless,
The Reverend.
Rev. Illuminatus Maximus
> --------------0A0794133C8E954AB117FFAD
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>
>
> The New Age of Post Modernism:
>
> [Image]
>
> PoMo's, at least the more sophisticated ones,
> divide history into at least two major components:
>
> * The Modern Age, and
>
> * Post-Modernity
>
> In the Modern Age there was right and wrong, good
> and bad, God and Satan.
Catholic & Protestant, black & white, Muslims & Infidels....
People fought over
> religion, ideology, and -more than anything- truth.
Got news for you - they still do.
>
> Pilate may have been the world's first PoMo when
> he rhetorically asked Jesus, "What is truth ?" ( John
> 18:38 ).
>
> Post Modernism rejects the concept of absolute
> truth. Absolute causes strife, and -even- wars.
> Instead, PoMo's recognize "truth claims".
Well, how do you determine who is absolutely right? Every group has its
own criterion.
>
> Truth Claims are relative. "I have my truth, and you
> have your truth" is their refrain. "My truth is good for
> me, and your truth is good for you".
Islamic rulers conquered nomadic tribes and forced them to abandon
polytheism and convert to Islam. That was the end of the jahiliya ("iron
age") in the Arabian penisula.
Which side can claim "absolute truth" in this conflict? If neither, on
what do you base your claim to truth?
Regards,
Rev. Illuminatus Maximus
Supreme Chief, Gnostic Friends Network
http://www.enemies.com/
Ouroboros: the Gnostic Webring
http://members.tripod.com/~TempleOfGnosis/join.html
Dave Wood
> come under virulent attack from postmodernists, precisely because
> scientists continue to adhere to belief in objective truth, arrived at
> by objective methods. Postmodernists have flooded the humanities in
> many universities, but they haven't made a dent in the science
> faculties.
> And they never will. Postmodernism is, to a very large degree, just
> a symptom of academic envy. Science, because it has a handle on how
> to approach objective truth, has a lot of prestige. The humanities,
> for better or for worse, have lost prestige in comparison. So professional
> academicians in the humanities have taken to knocking "truth". It's
> petty, and childish, and (thank God) already running out of steam.
> doctrine within the RCC for centuries is that devout Buddhists and
> Hindus *might* go to heaven, at God's prerogative. In RC doctrine,
> _Extra ecclesiam nulla salus_ ("There is no salvation outside the church"),
> but if God chooses to save some of those folks, then they're in the church,
> whether we know it or not and whether they know it or not.
> The RCC doesn't say there is no such thing as truth or falsehood. It
> says that the DataRat's claim "All Buddhists and Hindus, unless they
> convert to strict five-point Calvinism, are going to Hell" is a FALSE
> claim.
Paul Duca
The DataRat wrote:
> The OT is about 77% of the Bible. And, that is our
> primer on judgment, damnation, and division.
>
>
That's the only reason why the DataRat has any truck with it...
Paul
Eric Sneddon
One can demonstrate anger in the process of protecting one's loved ones.
The DataRat wrote:
> What kind of Post Modern double-
> talk is this ? Jesus was angry
> but still showed love ? Perhaps
> He was lovingly angry ? Sheesh !
en...@enemies.com
"TheReverend" <the.re...@home.com> wrote:
>
Hey Moggin, I thought you would find this thread entertaining
> The DataRat wrote in message <375B0B4B...@home.com>...
>
> >General Principles of Post Modernity:
> >
> >1.) Denial of absolute truth; acceptance only of relative
> > truth.
> >
> >2.) All-inclusiveness ( except for those who make
> > exclusive truth claims ).
> >
> >3.) Tolerance for everyone ( except those deemed
> > "intolerant" ).
> >
> >4.) Pacifism ( except towards those who make
> > exclusive truth claims or are deemed "intolerant" ).
> >
> >5.) Equality ( everybody treated the same, and
> > differences pretended not to exist ).
> >
> >As Kevin and Amy have already pointed-out, being the
> >dominant philosophy in America, Post Modernism is so
> >pervasive that it seems natural. We're saturated with
> >it, and don't question it.
> >
>
> Rodent, I think you summary of Post-Modernism is a fair summary.
> I have studied post-modernism and its effect on the church fairly
> extensively. While I don't always agree with you (I have been reading
> but not posting in these newsgroups for a few weeks), your series of
> postings on post-modernism were quite accurate. I think that this
> "relativistic-morality" is a hideous at best. As I think again about
how
> pervasive the post-modern worldview is in our culture, I think of how
> guilty the church is for not taking a stand. Unfortunately, the
church
> has become a product of our sick and demented society. Christians
> must stand up against the values of our culture.
> Christians must stand up for truth.
>
> "A wise man scales the city of the mighty,
> and brings down the stronghold in which they trust. (Prov. 21:22)
>
> Christians must arise and bring down the beliefs so strongly held
> by our sick and demented culture.
>
> God Bless,
> TheReverend.
>
>
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
Rabbit
In my college fellowship, someone asked my girlfriend-at-the-time, "How
do you know Jesus really said all these things?" and she replied,
"Because the words are in red, silly!"
Ben Hopkins wrote:
>
> The DataRat wrote:
> >
> > "I'll bet that if you did catagorize the passages, and tallied
> > up the counts, that judgement & division would win out over
> > harmony & unity."
> >
> > True. The OT is about 77% of the Bible. And, that is our
> > primer on judgment, damnation, and division.
>
Rabbit
One simple thing. Jesus was God himself. No other man was. He proved
it in His resurrection. All the others: Buddha, Mohammed, etc. are
still in their graves.
If Jesus has not risen from His grave, then yes, we're all deluded. You
betcha.
en...@enemies.com
Hercules was the son of Zeus and he rose from the grave. Mithras was the
son of God and he rose from the grave too (had a last supper & was
crucified as well, actually, about 300 years before Christ.) And let's
not forget Osiris!
All told the world has had about 16 different divine children/saviors
who were put to death and rose from the grave... such beliefs were
common to the pagan mysteries religions in the Mediterranean basin right
around the time Christianity took hold, actually...
I wonder which one is absolutely true... Maybe they all are.
Of course, as a gnostic, I look to spiritual resurrection, not a
physical one - the whole idea of walking corpses kind of creeps me out,
anyway.
-vincent33
bue...@space.mitnos.pamedu (Royce Buehler) wrote:
>
> In article <7jjknu$3mb$1...@oak.prod.itd.earthlink.net>, "Mycroft"
<XXXlo...@earthlink.netX> writes:
> > 'Post-Modernism' = anything DataRat dislikes.
>
> That is exactly the way DataRat uses the term. For him, it is a
catch-all
> term of abuse, to be hurled at anybody he wishes to insult but doesn't
> wish to engage in discussion with.
>
> When anyone tells DataRat, "You are wrong about X", DataRat replies:
> "I don't have to talk to you. You are beneath me. You are PoMo."
>
> In other words, when someone says, "DataRat, you say X, but that is
> false; the truth is not-X", DataRat falsely accuses them of claiming
that X
> and not-X are equally true. This is convenient for him, because it
relieves him
> of any responsibility for coming up with *reasons* why X is supposedly
> true.
>
"There's glory for you," Humpty said.
"I don't know what you mean by 'glory,'" Alice said.
Humpty Dumpty smiled contemptuously. "of course you don't; till I
tell you. I meant 'there's a nice knock-down argument for you!'"
"But 'glory' doesn't mean 'a nice knock-down argument,'" Alice
objected.
"When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone,
"it means just what I choose it to; neither more nor less."
"The question is," said Alice, "Where you can make words mean so
many different things."
"The question is," said Humpty Dumpty, "which is to be master;
that's all."
-v33
Ben Mitts
dapreacher is willing to listen to what you hold as beliefs! In the Book of
Romans are the The five Doctrines of Christian Faith would you care to
comment on these Doctrines. Maybe if you took time out and shared on
what you hold these Doctrines to be we all, myself included, would have
a better handle on where you are coming from. I have nothing against
being nice in Christian Love, do it all the time, but I tell people why I am
doing it, not just that we should just "do it" Unbelievers dont know what
you are talking about. They are driven by worldly thinking and actions, so
trying to get them to love each other as Christians Love one another, or
are supposed to, usually brings on what you are experiencing right now.
You are beginning to handle yourself properly in here. Sometimes one
gets banged arounf a bit but all in all you are being given Christian love
even though you dont understand it right now. Continue on and let those
who can teach you properly show you where you need repooof and direct-
ion. I did not learn how to witness properly until I allowed myself to be
taught certain things in order to witness effectively. Men taught me much,
but God through His Holy Spirit taught me directly on how, what, when
and why, He wanted from me in regards to sharing the plan of Salvation.
You need to make sure that He is in total control of how and why you are
here. This not offered in a dispariging way but is offered by an observer
who has been there done that.
The approach you have taken is not entirely wrong, on the contrary it
has many good points. Keep those and throw out the others and begin
anew. Keep you personality out of here, continue only in Christian Love
and be ready to accept help from from those who you believe are attack-
ing you, they are not. Believe it or not they are simpling trying to sort
out your beliefs/Doctrine and The bible. Dont necessarily agree with
everyone. Again, unbelievers have no clue as to what what you are
doing here and most could care less. In regards to believers take it
one step at a time. Stay on the subject and stick with it until all points
are discussed. Always remember there is a great storehouse of Wid-
dom, Bible knowledge, and Testamonies out here that God wants you
to tap into which will increase your Christian Walk of Faith such that
you will become the effective witness that God wants, not what you
think you should be like. You will fail miserably if you walk as you think
you should, but as you let the Spirit of God move you people will see
the True Light of Jesus in you and will listen.
lastily, when confronted as to maybe being wrong in what you write
dont lash out immediately assuming you are being attacked by Be-
lievers. We are trying to sort you out so that when you need help in
witnessing here you will have all the support you need to be effective.
Hey! I got blasted pretty hard in here I learned who could be trusted to
lean on in here for support. I dont always agree with The Rats, the
Goldrushes, Kevin and Amy, or anyone else for that matter, they dont
always agree with me! But what we all have in common is a sound
basic Christian Doctrine only found in The Bible. I think you have been
accepted here but you are making it very difficult. Will we always be
testy?, sometimes yes sometimes no, but if we have to show displeas-
re with both Believers as well as Unbelievers we will do it. You will learn
how to do it also, as long as you remember to Walk by Faith. Again, the
work in here is to destroy the works of Satan and his enemy.
Ben Mitts
dapreacher
May God continue to richly Bless you
in all things
In Jesus's Name
======================================================================
Rabbit
can coexist. DR, God *IS* love, and God *DOES* demonstrate anger. Are
these inconsistent? Does God cease to become love when He is angry? I
think not.
When you are angry at your wife, do you not love her also, even when you
are angry?
Parents, when you are angry at your children, do you not also discipline
with love?
DR, God can be angry and love at the same time. This is not PoMo. If
you disagree, you need to demonstrate Biblically that God does not love
when He is angry. Calling something PoMo does not make it so. Please
elucidate.
The DataRat wrote:
>
>
> Janie-the-PoMo wrote:
>
> "Yes, He did become angry when
>
> it was appropriate, but still
> He showed
> love."
>
> The DataRat responds:
>
> What kind of Post Modern
> double-
> talk is this ? Jesus was
> angry
> but still showed love ?
> Perhaps
> He was lovingly angry ?
> Sheesh !
>
>
> .
Rick Hall
>
> "I don't know what you mean by 'glory,'" Alice said.
>
> Humpty Dumpty smiled contemptuously. "of course you don't; till I
> tell you. I meant 'there's a nice knock-down argument for you!'"
>
> "But 'glory' doesn't mean 'a nice knock-down argument,'" Alice
> objected.
>
> "When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone,
> "it means just what I choose it to; neither more nor less."
>
> "The question is," said Alice, "Where you can make words mean so
> many different things."
>
> "The question is," said Humpty Dumpty, "which is to be master;
> that's all."
>
Wow, this theme has jumped threads. how exciting. Lewis Carroll is much
more fun than "my dictionary says this ..."
Rick
Mycroft
TheReverend <the.re...@home.com> wrote in message news:375c...@newsfeed.intergate.ca...This thread is supposed to be discussing Post-Modernism...not Y2K. Please keep on topic. It is way to easy to get off topic.Thank you,God Bless,TheReverend.Mycroft wrote in message <7jh8ee$52c$1...@fir.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...Total collapse? No.Partial outages and inconveniences? Probably.Unless you live in Russia or China. Then, watch out!Mycroft
Eric Sneddon
"PoMo," is the new Boogie Man.
-vincent33 wrote:
> "The question is," said Humpty Dumpty, "which is to be master;
> that's all."
--
Janie
have had years of experience. The Fathers love is similar.
And Data Rat, God gets angry with you ,but still loves you and shows love to
you each day as He does me and everyone. He gives us air to breath, food to
eat, and lots of blessings we don't deserve.
Sincerely,
Janie
The DataRat wrote in message <375F9185...@home.com>...
Janie
toward violence might have difficulty. I get angry with my Husband
sometimes, but I still can show him love. God disciplines us with love all
the time. Jesus was capable of this and more and to suggest its double talk
reduces the Savior and what HE IS! I for one shall give Him all the
praise and glory due Him.
Sincerely,
Janie
Janie wrote in message <7js57u$h2p$1...@cletus.bright.net>...
Janie
you comic book. You are so transparent!
Janie
The DataRat wrote in message <37619B95...@home.com>...
>
>
> Janie-the-Hypocrite wrote:
>
> "As a Mother raising my children I
> have had years of experience."
>
>
> The DataRat responds:
>
> THAT'S the part you don't get:
> Nobody here needs a PoMo
> mommy wagging her finger at
> the participants !
>
>
>
.
>
>
>
Janie
Why do you refer to yourself in third person?
Just wondered.
Janie
The DataRat wrote in message <375AE563...@home.com>...
>
>
> Well, when The DataRat first mentioned that
> he'd write an article explaining Post Modernism
> ( PoMo ), he envisioned a "quick and dirty" one-
> article description. Popular expectation has
> made that an impossibility. Instead, it's become
> a project.
>
> So, here goes: It'll be a series of articles about
> Post Modernism. These will take a while to
> compose and edit, so please be patient while
> waiting for them all to be posted.
>
> The Genevan Rodent also asks your indulgence
> regarding the format. Advanced features he'll
> use require publishing the series in HTML. If you
> don't have an HTML-enabled newsreader, both
> Microsoft and Netscape offer FREE ones on-line
> for download at their respective web sites.
>
> If you don't have an HTML-capable newsreader,
> it's time to get out of the Stone Age and into the
> 20th. Century -because the 21st. Century is almost
> here !
>
> The DataRat
>
>
.
>
michael burt
<ri...@tayloreel.com> wrote:
> > "There's glory for you," Humpty said.
> >
> > "I don't know what you mean by 'glory,'" Alice said.
> >
> > Humpty Dumpty smiled contemptuously. "of course you don't; till I
> > tell you. I meant 'there's a nice knock-down argument for you!'"
> >
> > "But 'glory' doesn't mean 'a nice knock-down argument,'" Alice
> > objected.
> >
> > "When I use a word," Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone,
> > "it means just what I choose it to; neither more nor less."
> >
> > "The question is," said Alice, "Where you can make words mean so
> > many different things."
> >
> > "The question is," said Humpty Dumpty, "which is to be master;
> > that's all."
> >
>
> Wow, this theme has jumped threads. how exciting. Lewis Carroll is much
> more fun than "my dictionary says this ..."
Lewis Carroll is more that a children's story.
--
May God Bless You,
Michael
Character Counts. It is not hypocritical to set a high goal and occasionally fail. It is hypocritical to set a low goal and occasionally succeed.
Rick Hall
<mikeburt-140...@pon-mi23-51.ix.netcom.com>...
> Lewis Carroll is more that a children's story.
>
I don't know if anyone else would be interested, but I would love to see
you elaborate on this.
Rick
TheReverend
Janie wrote in message <7ju17e$bap$3...@cletus.bright.net>...
>DR-Guess I hit a nerve hugh?? It seems that when someone does you resort to
>you comic book. You are so transparent!
>Janie
>
Or else, he resorts to name-calling or insulting the person's
intelligence....or he just simply stops responding. Maybe he conceeds
defeat on this point ???
Just a thought,
TheReverend.
dirtybird...
actually determine and make me understand post modernism... really!!! but
expect debate... *G*