Insanity Definition and Pres Debate (NON-POLITICAL)

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Allen

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Oct 13, 1992, 2:41:01 PM10/13/92
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Does anyone out there remember the source of the quote, "Insanity is
doing the same thing over and over again and expecting something
different to happen?" (or words to that effect).

I was listening to the debate on Sunday with some 12-Steppers and we
all enjoyed this particular quote. All of us knew it and suspected it
to be recovery-oriented, but could not think of the source. Does
anyone out there have an idea? Go ahead, shoot me if it's the Big
Book ... :-)


*********************************************************************
the only thing that speaks the truth is the eloquence of passing time
the spoken word is a jacket too tight

Phil Weiss

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Oct 13, 1992, 5:18:53 PM10/13/92
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>
> Does anyone out there remember the source of the quote, "Insanity is
> doing the same thing over and over again and expecting something
> different to happen?" (or words to that effect).
>
> I was listening to the debate on Sunday with some 12-Steppers and we
> all enjoyed this particular quote. All of us knew it and suspected it
> to be recovery-oriented, but could not think of the source. Does
> anyone out there have an idea? Go ahead, shoot me if it's the Big
> Book ... :-)
>

_Alcoholics Anonymous_ says alcoholic insanity is the lack of
proportion and the ability to think straight.

The other quote may be in the stories. I don't know. I don't
read the stories much (they don't have directions on how to
stay sober). Other "approved" literature may or may not have
the quote in it. I have heard it repeated much at meetings.

Of course, I also hear "You are alright just the way you are."
and "We love you til you love yourself." and "There are no
musts in recovery." and a lot of other lines which are pretty
much bunk as well too.

Phil.
--
Philip Weiss Laboratory for Applied Logic we...@leopard.cs.uidaho.edu
(Disclaimer: My views are not their views) weis...@snake.cs.uidaho.edu

Heart Dancer

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Oct 13, 1992, 9:33:05 PM10/13/92
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In article <1992Oct13.1...@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov>, c...@tyr.JPL.NASA.gov (Allen) writes:
>> Does anyone out there remember the source of the quote, "Insanity is
>> doing the same thing over and over again and expecting something
>> different to happen?" (or words to that effect).

The last time I heard it, it was attributed to "either John Bradshaw or
Earnie Larson. I don't know who said it first."

BJ

Phil Weiss

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Oct 14, 1992, 1:29:42 PM10/14/92
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WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING

The following comment is my opinion, and as such, probably doesn't
count for shit.

WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING WARNING

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

>> Does anyone out there remember the source of the quote, "Insanity is
>> doing the same thing over and over again and expecting something
>> different to happen?" (or words to that effect).

> The last time I heard it, it was attributed to "either John Bradshaw or
> Earnie Larson. I don't know who said it first."

That would figure. There are two ideal examples of recovery.

gpo...@hebb.uoregon.edu

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Oct 14, 1992, 4:32:32 PM10/14/92
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In article <1992Oct14....@csc.ti.com> barb...@csc.ti.com (Heart
It is from the second step section of the How it Works chapter of the Narcotics
Anonymous Basic Text. Now, the dope fiends may have stolen it from somewhere
else (we're like that, you know) but you will find it there.

--geoff

Allen Halsell

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Oct 14, 1992, 6:26:31 PM10/14/92
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In article <1992Oct14.2...@nntp.uoregon.edu>, gpo...@hebb.uoregon.edu writes:
> In article <1992Oct14....@csc.ti.com> barb...@csc.ti.com (Heart
> Dancer) writes:
> >In article <1992Oct13.1...@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov>, c...@tyr.JPL.NASA.gov
> (Allen) writes:
> >>> Does anyone out there remember the source of the quote, "Insanity is
> >>> doing the same thing over and over again and expecting something
> >>> different to happen?" (or words to that effect).
> >
> >The last time I heard it, it was attributed to "either John Bradshaw or
> >Earnie Larson. I don't know who said it first."
> >
> It is from the second step section of the How it Works chapter of the Narcotics
> Anonymous Basic Text. Now, the dope fiends may have stolen it from somewhere
> else (we're like that, you know) but you will find it there.

This might make sense then, considering that Bill C quoted it. Thanks
for a reasonable response among all the flaming.

Bob Thomas

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Oct 15, 1992, 10:57:06 AM10/15/92
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in article <1992Oct14....@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov>, a bunch of
people say a lot of things.

+> >>> Does anyone out there remember the source of the quote, "Insanity is
+> >>> doing the same thing over and over again and expecting something
+> >>> different to happen?" (or words to that effect).
+> >
+> >The last time I heard it, it was attributed to "either John Bradshaw or
+> >Earnie Larson. I don't know who said it first."
+> >
+> It is from the second step section of the How it Works chapter of the Narcotics
+> Anonymous Basic Text. Now, the dope fiends may have stolen it from somewhere
+> else (we're like that, you know) but you will find it there.

The saying was around before the first draft of the Basic Text
was written. It was also around before John Bradshaw hit the
big-time. I'm not sure how long Ernie Larson has been on the
workshop circuit, but I heard the saying 14 years ago when I
was in finishing school. ("Finishing school" is slang for a
treatment center. I've also heard them referred to as "dude
ranches.")

Bob T.

joni.dunlap

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Oct 15, 1992, 6:59:01 PM10/15/92
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In article <1992Oct13.1...@elroy.jpl.nasa.gov> c...@tyr.JPL.NASA.gov (Allen) writes:
>Does anyone out there remember the source of the quote, "Insanity is
>doing the same thing over and over again and expecting something
>different to happen?" (or words to that effect).

I think it is insanity is doing the same thing over and expecting
different results.

This comes from the NA text. I think it is either said in the first or
second step. Sorry don't have my book here.

Jason Steven West

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Oct 18, 1992, 8:47:19 PM10/18/92
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The first time that I heard this quote was from, Narcotics Anonymous
in their "basic text". Third edition, page 21, under Step 2. There
could be earlier refrences that I haven't read.

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