FANUC Sytstem 6M "NOT READY" (Help?)
Dale Mahalko
milling machine with a 10-position tool changer, up and running.
A local high school where I provide tech support got this thing for
free. It apparantly was still in use in February at a machine shop,
but then the original owners upgraded their CNC hardware. Not needing
this thing anymore, they took this FANUC machine and set it outside
with a tarp over it, it mostly sat there out in the sun and rain, then
changed hands a couple times, until this high school got it a few
weeks ago for free.
However, even after sitting outside in the rain, and the mouse
onslaught, it does power up and shows no alarms on the CRT or on any
of the circuit boards, so I guess all is more or less working
properly.
However, it needs something done to make it work, and I don't know
what. When turned on, it quickly says "SLAVE READY", "BUBBLE READ",
then stops at "NOT READY" and doesn't go into XYZ axis mode.
Yes, I've cleaned out the mouse nest (and the dead mice) in the
operator's control panel box, and we resoldered the few wires the mice
chewed off on the Feedrate Override control (feel free to laugh here).
But other than this, I can find nothing wrong with it.
The "Diagnose" and "Parameter" buttons work, and I can page through
the machine's settings, so the computer is alive and running OK, but
it seems to be expecting me to do something, and nobody around here
knows anything about it.
The manuals we have for it are a grimy mess, pages stuck together, and
we're apparantly missing the back end of the Operator's manual with
its appendices (cuts off in the middle of "testing system RAM"). We do
have the complete Maintenance manual, but it's in terrible shape.
There's supposed to be a "connecting" manual for it but we didn't get
that one. Can replacement manuals be ordered to replace our current
ratty ones? The maintenance manual mentions these three manuals and
part numbers:
B-55264E - Operator's Manual
B-52263E - Connecting Manual
B-51649E - Maintenance Manual
Speaking of the manuals, FANUC was apparantly a Japanese-only company
in 1982, and they seem to have followed the long tradition of terrible
Japanese-to-English translations, by use of a Japanese-to-English
dictionary, done by a Japanese fellow too proud to ask a native
English speaker to proofread their translation...
Consequently, while the manuals seem to be written in English words,
the grammar and usage is sometimes bizarre and confusing. Are any
"better" manuals now available for the System 6M? Did someone realize
what a mess these manuals are and hopefully rewrote them, doing a
proper translation with proofreading by fluent English speakers? Also,
I note in some of the schematics that some drawings have labels
written in Japanese with no English translation. Arrrgghhh.. hope
those labels weren't important..
So with this "Japanglish" translation trouble in mind, the ONLY
reference I can find anywhere for this "NOT READY" problem is the
following text in the Operator's Manual on page 32. This appears to be
describing what is normally supposed to be happening when you see the
"NOT READY" message, and then what the problem is for why it won't
proceed to XYZ position mode after a few moments of showing "NOT
READY":
1. INTERRUPT RELEASE
2. EMERGENCY STOP MONITORING
3. POSITION CONTROL LSI SET
4. MCC IN VELOCITY CONTROLL UNIT ON
(Note) When this screen does not proceed to the next sequence.
i. Emergency stop signal is extended up.
Oh, of course! Why didn't I think of that before? The problem is
merely that the "emergency stop signal is extended up."
Except, you see, I have no idea what this emergency stop "signal" is,
or what "extended up" is supposed to mean, and there is absolutely no
reference on how to fix this problem anywhere in the Operator's or
Maintenance manuals. (Maybe it's mentioned in the appendices which are
missing from our Operator's manual??)
The phrase "extended up" is probably supposed to mean something else
in English, but with the bizarre japanese/english translation, I have
no idea what the problem really is or how to fix it.
We've tried cleaning the emergency stop switch with contact cleaner,
but that hasn't helped. I've checked it with a volt-ohm meter and the
switch appears to be working. The wiring to it and all along the
cabling path is all apparantly undamaged and in good condition.. but
I'm running out of ideas here..
Any suggestions?
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Dale Mahalko -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Technical Support / Network Administrator
Lake Holcombe School District - Holcombe, WI
Email: mah...@lakeholcombe.k12.wi.us
Cornell School District - Cornell, WI
Email: dmah...@cornell.k12.wi.us
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Kirk Gordon
means that the machine is in an Emergency Stop condition. Emergency
stop is a series of normally closed inputs from the machine to the
control, managed by the PLC, which must be satisfied before the control
will complete the power-up sequence and deliver power to the servo
drives. Typical elements in the E-Stop circuit include one or more
normally closed E-stop pushbuttons (some of which lock when depressed -
they need to be twisted to release them), hydraulic pressure sensors (if
the machine uses hydraulics), air pressure sensors (if the machine needs
air), and sensors for fluid levels in way-lube tanks, hydraulic tanks,
spindle-oil reservoirs, etc. Some machines also need to know that
things like turrets, tool changers, parts-counters, access doors, etc.,
are closed, locked, zeroed, or confirmed by sensors or limit/prox
switches. Your machine certainly has some of these devices and
requirements, but probably doesn't have all of them. The exact usage
and configuration are determined by the machine-tool builder, and have
nothing to do with Fanuc.
You should have (or you need to get) the machine builder's manuals
that include the ladder diagrams for the machine. These will show what
inputs are part of the E-Stop circuit, and how they're wired. Each
element in the ladder list will have an "address" associated with it.
On a Fanuc control, inputs to the PLC are X addresses; and outputs are Y
addresses. The control itself uses the same system; but each device
treats "input" and "output" from a self-centered viewpoint. For
example, an input from a pushbutton on the operator's panel will be read
as an input (X) by the PLC, which might then send a corresponding output
(Y) to the Fanuc control. The control, however, will treat the PLC's
signal as an input, and it'll be another X address when it gets to the
Fanuc.
When you look through the ladder diagrams, read them from right to
left, for diagnostic work. Look at the far right for an element labeled
"E-Stop", or "Ready", or maybe "NCR" (NC Ready). When you find one of
these, then read toward the left to find out what inputs contribute to
satisfying the Ready condition. Each of these inputs (or results of
logic operations on inputs) will have an address. The diagnostics
screen on your control shows you the state of each of these addresses,
so that you can find out which one's not happy or right.
For example, let's say that you find a signal on the right side of a
page that's labeled "E-Stop" with a horizontal line over the top of it.
(This is typical notation for Fanuc and it's customers in the '80's.)
The line or bar means "Not". So, when this element is energized, you
have a "Not E-Stop" condition. The machine is ready. (If you find
something like "Ready" or "NCR", these will probably use "right-side-up"
notation, and will mean just what they say. In either case, this
element must be active (energized) for the machine to power on. Find
the address assigned to it - something like maybe X6.4, and then look
for that on the control's diagnostic screen. Note that each of the main
address numbers is an 8-bit byte, and each address shown in the ladder
is a single bit. X6.4, therefore, means byte number 6, bit number 4.
Also, keep in mind that, when you look at the diagnotic screen, the bits
are numbered from 0 to 7, and from right to left. That means X6.4 would
be the bit shown active (1) in this example ---> X6 00010000
In your case, the Not-E-Stop element must be high (1), for the
machine to be ready. It won't, in your case, until you find the source
of the problem. Look at the ladder again, and check each of the
addresses for each of the switches, coils, or other elements, that are
needed to satisfy and energize the E-Stop item. Then read the state of
each of these on the diagnostic screen. One (or more) of them won't be
right, and that's the problem that you're looking for.
Remember, these are fail-safe, normally CLOSED inputs. This means
that their state might read backwards, if you're not used to looking at
this stuff, and you'll need to be sure you know what you're reading.
Something that's shown on the ladder diagram as normally closed, (the
E-Stop pushbutton, for example) will show up as a 1 on the diagnostic
screen when it's in the passive state (button not pressed) to satisfy
the conditions for activating the Not-E-Stop. Something that's shown
normally open (like maybe a relay contact, or a symbolic contact from
other logic operations) will have to show up as 1 (active state) in the
diagnostics. Because these elements are wired in series, all of them
must be in the right state for Not-E-Stop to turn on, and to to let the
machine run.
When you find (or think you've found) the source of an unhappy input,
then the ladder diagram should give you information you need about what
physical device the input represents. That's where you go looking for
your problem.
Now that you've read all that, here's my best guess about what to be
alert for. Machines that have been wet, cold, weathered, hosts to
rodents, etc., tend to have lots of trouble with corroded or oxydized
wires, connections, and contacts. And, since the E-Stop stuff is all
normally closed, anything that's not conducting, even when it appears to
be physically connected, is the same as any other open circuit, and
looks to the Fanuc like it's not supposed to be running.
For more detailed advice, you might post the brand/model of the
machine-tool you're using, or contact the manufacturer or importer.
Most of them have an old fart like me laying around who's seen
everything twice, and who might be able to tell you exactly where to
look.
Hope this helps! Good luck.
Kirk Gordon
http://www.gordon-eng.com
Jdyer
Dale Mahalko wrote:
If there's a PRP button push it in for 5 seconds ,also check fo a 4th
(A/C) axis toggle
switch that may have to turned off if rotary table is disconnected .I've
run Matsuura's
and Mitsui VMCs with this setup
ff
Dale Mahalko wrote:
> I'm trying to get an old 1982 Fanuc System-6M Model-B, CNC vertical
> milling machine with a 10-position tool changer, up and running.
>
> (snip)
> However, it needs something done to make it work, and I don't know
> what. When turned on, it quickly says "SLAVE READY", "BUBBLE READ",
> then stops at "NOT READY" and doesn't go into XYZ axis mode.
I used to run a 6T control of that vintage. There was a button with no
label
that had to be pushed to reset the control after any alarm condition. It
was
supposed to be lighted when the control was ready but the bulb was burned
out.
Also the machine would stop dead with no alarm message if the lube oil
was low.
I'm thinking on your mill it could be a limit switch in the tool changer
or
or possibly a relay in the back.
Fred
George
you more.
Check all of your over travel switches and thermal overloads (things like
cooling fans, oil pumps etc) It is most likely in an E Stop condition. When
I have this problem on my Matsuura I use a jumper wire to "bypass" the e
stop chain, then I just keep moving it "up" a switch till I find the
culprit.
Dale Mahalko <mah...@lakeholcombe.k12.wi.us> wrote in message
news:3bf81c51...@news.mw.centurytel.net...
Andy
I assume that you are oushing the power on button once to power up the
machine. Right after that you may need to push that same button a 2nd
time to power up the drives.
1.Main Power on Disconnect on control cabinet
2.Pull out any E-Stop
3.Power on the control and then wait, give it a minute or 2
4.Push the same power on button and the servo's should kick in
5.Then you should be able to home or ref the machine.
Good Luck
Andy
Dale Mahalko
wrote:
[..]
> Now that you've read all that, here's my best guess about what to be
>alert for. Machines that have been wet, cold, weathered, hosts to
>rodents, etc., tend to have lots of trouble with corroded or oxydized
>wires, connections, and contacts. And, since the E-Stop stuff is all
>normally closed, anything that's not conducting, even when it appears to
>be physically connected, is the same as any other open circuit, and
>looks to the Fanuc like it's not supposed to be running.
Um, wow, thanks for all the info, everyone.
Yes, the terminals on the back of the emergency stop switch are in
absolutely horrendous condition. I am considering filing the
connectors and the terminal posts to get all that corrosion off.
It's bizarre. The other wiring for the control panel switches and
lights is in more or less okay condition (some switches are "sticky"
but some WD-40 helps) but that could be because everything else was
soldered. The Emergency Stop appears to be the only thing with screw
terminals on the back.
I have "wiggled" all the various connectors and they made
"cracklin/creaking" sounds when I did that, but I have not yet
unscrewed the Honda connectors and reseated them. A good cleaning of
all connectors probably would help, but It's unclear how I might
manage to clean all those Honda pins and those tiny pin-sockets to
remove any corrosion. (I could use a wire brush on the pins, but what
about those sockets?)
I'm in the process of tracing the wiring, but the cable-run diagrams
in the machine's schematics are more or less useless. It appears the
people who made the drawings failed to erase extra lines, so sometimes
it's hard to tell if one wire crosses another or joins into another
bundle, or what exactly.
I can see that all inputs head to a large rectangular input board
covered with resistors and four large Honda connectors along the
bottom edge of the board. I expect the emergency stop is among those.
The operator's manual does have wiring diagrams but I haven't surveyed
them completely. (Now that everyone has told me about it, I will go
through them in the next few weeks.)
The little square power control board where the ON/OFF buttons connect
has a switch labeled DOOR, but it is simply jumpered and not used, so
I at least know that is not the problem.
The coolant sump is currently empty. When we first got it, I pulled
that drawer out of the back of the machine, and scraped an inch-deep
layer of scum out of the bottom. It looks like the original owners
didn't even bother to drain it before sticking the thing outside.
However, there doesn't appear to be any "fluid-level" sensors
anywhere. There's just a pump with a suction tube sticking down into a
screened-off area. With the condition this tank was in (yecchh!) maybe
I should open up the suction pump and see how much goo is built up in
there? (Can it even spin??)
Also, there was this bizarre ultra-heavy-duty cable tucked into the
sump drawer. It appears to go from the main power relay, out the back
of the machine some 25 feet in an inch-diameter gray 4-conductor
cable, then is apparantly just wire-nutted to a second inch-diameter
gray 3-conductor cable, and then runs back another 25 feet, into the
machine, and over to what appears to be power input for the spindle
servo board. I assume this was for a remote emergency cutoff of the
spindle power.
The whole cable was covered in coolant slime, so I wiped down the
cables to clean the gunk off. The ends where the cables join appears
to be sealed inside little clear rubbery caps, closed off with
twist-ties, but their condition is currently unknown. For all I know,
these cables and the ends were soaking in that coolant crap all summer
long as it evaporated. (Likely cutting the ends off and rewiring it
would be a Good Idea..)
> For more detailed advice, you might post the brand/model of the
>machine-tool you're using, or contact the manufacturer or importer.
>Most of them have an old fart like me laying around who's seen
>everything twice, and who might be able to tell you exactly where to
>look.
As to "what model" it is, I will try to dig deeper. But it seems to be
something entirely built by Fanuc. I say this because the spindle
motor has the name "FANUC" on it, and it seems odd that some other
company would be using Fanuc's spindle motor. (But I know nothing of
the company. Were Fanuc servos considered to be "common" parts?)
Being a "computer nerd" by trade, rather than a machinist, here is my
ASCII-art rendering of this machine... :)
.--.
| |
| | <<-- Z-axis
| | DC servo
.--------'.-'---.
frame is all | | |
painted blue ->> | | |
| | |
_____|_________|_____|____
| ________________________|---.
operators .-||-. | | | |
control |/\::||\| | | CPU o |
"pendant" |\/::||o\ | | cabinet |
| |====|\ o\ | | |
`--->> |o-oo| \ o\ _____| | _______ |
`----' \_o\| | | / tape \ |
empty tool || | | \_reader/ |
holder is --->> _\/_ | | |
"parked" on __[____]_ | | || |
wooden 2x4 |_________| | | rs232 o |
on bed for ___| | | | |
shipping |___|_________|__| `-----------'
| |---.
| |___| << coolant
`------------------' sump drawer
servo cabinet CPU cabinet
.------------------. .------------------.
|.--..--..--..-..-.| | .--------------. |
||X ||Y ||Z || || || | | |||| | | <expansion
||sr||sr||sr|`-'`-'| | | CPU |||| | | boards:
||vo||vo||vo|.----.| | |board |||| | | ROM
|`--'`--'`--'|spin|| | `--------------' | BMU
| .-----. |dle || | .---..---------. | 4th axis
| |relay| | || | |pwr||stabilizr| | Puncher
| |panel| |srvo|| | `---'`---------' |
| `-----' `----'| | .--------------. |
| _ [xf] [xf] | | |signal i/o brd| |
|[_] [mr] [mr] | | `--------------' |
`------------------' `------------------'
After Thanksgiving break I'll borrow a digital camera and make a
webpage on the school's website for y'all. :)
Thanks for all the help. I mainly need to troll through those wiring
diagrams at this point.
-Dale
bearings2199
Make sure you down load the parameters or have a good copy of them.
Then either on one of the boards or some builders mounted a switch
near the tape reader there will be a switch to initilize the memory.
You will not lose any software. After load the parameters back in.
This particular machine will almost always do this if it has been off
for a couple of months.
Mike Barros
Dale Mahalko
Yes, there's a few sheets with parameter values scribbled on the
pages, but I'm concerned about wiping out whatever parameters are
already in the machine. I assume those tell it where the spindle head
is located, where the bed servos are currently at, etc, so I guess I
don't see how changing that stuff would help it.
It seems like reinserting the old parameters might do more harm than
good, as it now drives the bed right off the drive screws, because
with the old paramters it thought the table was still two feet to the
left... ;)
But if nothing else gets it working, I'll give this a try. I'll
probably write down the current parameters in it before wiping them
out, though.. that way at least I could revert back if those parameter
changes don't help.
-Dale
blakes...@gmail.com
surendr...@gmail.com
On pressing power on button
the display screen shows slave ready, bubble read and stop at not ready
All key board keys and e stop push buttons are function less no further
booting of controller is possible and can not access digno,or para
checked all power points and voltages and are ok
checked all connections and wirings found ok
Reiserted all cabel connections
Reinserted all cards pc, rom,bmu,CRT,
Master pCb is ok
All switches, settings are checked and found ok
All E stop switches are off
But of no use
can any budy help
surendra
Michael A. Terrell
active.
--
Never piss off an Engineer!
They don't get mad.
They don't get even.
They go for over unity! ;-)
realbus...@gmail.com
I have a 1985 Amada OCTO 334 with a Fanuc System 6Mb Series M31 Version 03 Controller. I have recently began running it after it sat for a couple months. It ran successfully for a 3 weeks no problems. Shut it down on Friday and come in Monday to turn it on and it did not go into "NC Ready" status. check the alarm code and its spits out a external alarm 14 emergency/reset. I have checked both emergency switches and check most relays concerning the emergency signal circuit (EMX,EM).I've checked under the diagnostics and #38 bit #4 is the emergency stop button. It is a 0 and if i'm not mistaken it should be a 1. I did a little test of watching the signal for the emergency switch on the machine and can watch the signal turn from 1 to 0 when i push it and from 0 back to 1 when when i release it. So although i've checked the switch already , i believe it has something to do with the signal that comes from the controllers switch and where ever that signal is carried is where i can find the problem .I have been informed that the code is a builders alarm and not just an alarm the the NC. If so how could i find out what initial check the NC is checking that may not be passing (low hydraulic oil, low air pressure etc.)
Is there a relay i dont know about?
Could it be a bad ground or the wire coming from the switch have a break in it?
any suggestions or brainstorming would be appreciated!