10 BEST MC's EVER - UNDISPUTED

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Slim Shady

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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Hi, i put a lot of thought into this and I think I have came up with the
most accurate list ever created. Check it out:
1) Black Thought- No matter what you say, Black Thought is the best. He
always comes with hot hot music to make us nod our heads and his lyrics are
flawless. From Organix to The Roots Come Alive, Thought is the greatest so
far.
2) Guru- Sure, he would'nt be everything he is without that hot DJ Primier
production behind his lyrics, but either way what he says is dope.
Representin' for years kid.
3) Rakim- The God. Almost picked him #1. But na, 'cause he's not the best.
You know that. Don't deny it. His new shit isn't very good either. He's a
legend though.
4) KRS-1- Without a doubt the best battle rapper. A good MC all in all.
5) Prodigy- Still young, he has great rhymes. This QB nigga can hang with
the big dogs anyday. And anyone with the guts to fuck with Death Row gets
points too. That Infamous nigga is nice, and he murdas his shit.
6) Common- Almost put him higher. He's great, I know. I love Common like the
next man. But he just hasn't had enough albums to prove new things to me.
When his new shit drops, I'm sure he'll be in the top 5.
7) Biggie- With just two albums this cat is a legend. He spit pimpalystic
rhymes about his hoes, grimy rhymes about murda, true rhymes about life.
8) Mos Def- Maybe if he had slightly more to prove I'd put him higher. He's
nice, don't get me wrong. He'll always be one of the best, amazingly with
only one solo album. Oh yeah, go cop dat.
9) Andre' Of OutKast- Personally my favorite MC. I'm not gonna trip and say
he's the best 'cause all the cats above him are better. He's my fav though,
andto me every OutKast album so far was a classic.
10. Q-Tip- It seems as if he's fallen off the map since his days of early
ATCQ, but he'll always be around. It's most likely that we've already heard
his best, but only time will tell. "Vivrant Thing" was a disappointment to
me, a true ATCQ fan. Damn, was he aiming for a hit. With ATCQ he never did
that. Oh well.

there u go lemme know what u think

--
"Its the Q to the B, with the M-O,B-B, Queensbridge, Brooklyn
and we D double-E P"- "Queit Storm (RMX)"

"What the fuck you sayin? You're a pimp whateva, limp dick,
Fred Durst needs to rehearse, needs to reverse, what he sayin?"
-"All In The Family"

"You come, from a perfect world, a world that, thru
me away, today, today, today to run away"
-"Coma White"

Kazuya

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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Your list is OK, I guess. I don't agree with all of them, but I can see how
someone could put all 10 of them on a list. Guru was ranked a little high,
though. He was straight up puttin' out some Mickey Mouse lyrics for awhile
there.
--
peace Kazuya


drtywrm131

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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Okay this post is asking for drama.

Here it goes. I am gonna do this quick cuz i gotta catch a plane, so the
order may not be perfect.

1. B.I.G. - I love this man for puttin the East Coast back on top of the
game. Although he only had 2 albums they are both must haves for any hiphop
collection.
2. Jay-Z - I haven't seen him drop anything wack yet. I will admit his
material is starting to get a lil repetetive but his wordplay and ability to
make u feel it are on point.
3. Redman - Nobody wants to give this mic murdera his props he has
consistenly created tight albums from day one and has not changed his style.
4. Nasty Nas - How could he not be on anyones list.
5. KRS - Although for me he has never created an album where every song was
tight except for my philosophy, as an emcee he is complete. Battle,
Freestyle, Performance.
6. Common - His albums provide me with the astonishing fact that, you aint
gotta be thugged out to be off the hook! Consistent emcee
7. Big Daddy Kane - Many of you all may not remember Kanes lyrical weaponry,
but he was an emcee that changed the game when he was spittin until he got
too smooth. He still deserves mad props.
8. Big Pun - Before you judge, just ask yourself is Capital Punishment a
classic or what?
9. Eminem - Here is where i will get hate mail! Regardless of the fact that
he is white, this kid sends chills through my body when i hear him spit, his
wordplay is exciting and completely focused. And how many people are running
around now rhyming in the style that he made popular.
10. Canibus - I know his album was wack and i know he hasn't done much but i
would be terrified if i ever had to battle him. That is why i like him for
his "up in your face" style of rhymin. And just like Eminem he sends a
tingle through my brain when listening to him. (especially his mix-tape
appearances)

So there you have it. Honorable Mention to Mos Def, Rass Kas, Xzibit, Will
Smith, LL Cool J, Method Man, Busta Rhymes, Wordsworth, Beanie Siegel, Rah
Digga, and Last Emperor.
I am sure i forgot some but i gotta go. peace DRTY

--
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre
minds

A to the L

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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Definately feeling all the choices on drtywrm131's list....

My 10 would be:

1) Puffy
2) Master P
3) Mase..........NAH Seriously

Its like this....(in no order cos I don't have enough time)
(I'm a big fan of freestyle so any emcees that come off the top of the dome
well get mad props on my list....so-)

1) Supernatural
2) Lord Finesse
3) Ras Kass
4) Redman
5) Common
6) Eminem
7) Chino XL
8) Big Daddy Kane
9) Master Ace
10) Grand Daddy I.U. (ever heard this guy? butter.)

PEACE

A to the L


drtywrm131 <henr...@rcn.com> wrote in message
news:7vh6jh$8e9$1...@autumn.news.rcn.net...

Slim Shady

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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aight im straight up with you. You're right about Guru, I think I shoulda
put Common there now that I put some thought to it. Well, it's ok cause I
didn't really mean for the list to be in order except to verify that Thought
is the greatest ever. He's #1

Kazuya wrote in message <7vgtvg$nb1$1...@fir.prod.itd.earthlink.net>...

Robert Prall

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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1. Ras Kass - he has tight rhymes. he's way underrated.
2. Mad Skillz - like an eastcoast raskass. he's tight, but underrated.
3. Common - he's been on and off, but he can usually rip.
4. Canibus - most don't feel him. don't know why. he has skills.
5. Eminem - the white canibus. ya'll don't feel him either. he has skills.
6. Xzibit - i've always felt xzibit. his rhymes have always been tight.
7. Jay Z - he spits rhymes that are dope. but usually, he sounds the same.
8. Nas - his first album caught us by suprise. he can still drop tight rhymes.
9. Raekwon - overall tightest wu member. not my favorite though.
10.KRS - he spits tight lyrics, but that's it.

Alberto Martinez

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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GURU, Rakim, KRS-1, Common, and Q-Tip I agree with you on. However, Biggie is in
now way a great (or good ) lyricsit. His rhymes are one note and he really has
nothing to add that already hasn't been added. If he were still alive, he
probably would have fallen off two years ago.

Alberto Martinez

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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Drama? More like disaster! Here goes:

drtywrm131 wrote:

> Okay this post is asking for drama.
>
> Here it goes. I am gonna do this quick cuz i gotta catch a plane, so the
> order may not be perfect.
>
> 1. B.I.G. - I love this man for puttin the East Coast back on top of the
> game. Although he only had 2 albums they are both must haves for any hiphop
> collection.

If he were still alive, he'd fall off two years ago. He was getting stale.

> 2. Jay-Z - I haven't seen him drop anything wack yet. I will admit his
> material is starting to get a lil repetetive but his wordplay and ability to
> make u feel it are on point.

"Can I get a Fuck you..", Jigga what", "It's a Hard Knock Life," Thse are the
songs of a good MC? No Way!! Jay-Z is crap!! Fuck him and his commercial ass.

> 3. Redman - Nobody wants to give this mic murdera his props he has
> consistenly created tight albums from day one and has not changed his style.

He's okay, but he's also gone commercial, too.

> 4. Nasty Nas - How could he not be on anyones list.

Not now he ain't. He's not only commercial, but a pale immitator of the rich
pimps/ bikini clad hoes that are ruining hip hop videos with its repetitiveness.

> 5. KRS - Although for me he has never created an album where every song was
> tight except for my philosophy, as an emcee he is complete. Battle,
> Freestyle, Performance.

That I can agree with.

> 6. Common - His albums provide me with the astonishing fact that, you aint
> gotta be thugged out to be off the hook! Consistent emcee

Consistent, real, tight, and glad he ain't mixed up with all this commercial
Puffy/ Master P/ Jay-Z/ DMX/ crap.

> 7. Big Daddy Kane - Many of you all may not remember Kanes lyrical weaponry,
> but he was an emcee that changed the game when he was spittin until he got
> too smooth. He still deserves mad props.

What has he done since "Ain't no Half Steppin?"

> 8. Big Pun - Before you judge, just ask yourself is Capital Punishment a
> classic or what?

He's just two footsteps away from cardiac arrest. he ain't a rapper, he's a
warehouse.

> 9. Eminem - Here is where i will get hate mail! Regardless of the fact that
> he is white, this kid sends chills through my body when i hear him spit, his
> wordplay is exciting and completely focused. And how many people are running
> around now rhyming in the style that he made popular.

It ain't that he's white, just that he's annoying.

> 10. Canibus - I know his album was wack and i know he hasn't done much but i
> would be terrified if i ever had to battle him. That is why i like him for
> his "up in your face" style of rhymin. And just like Eminem he sends a
> tingle through my brain when listening to him. (especially his mix-tape
> appearances)

Don't give Cannibus any credit. Without LL, nobody would care who he was. First
he disses LL and gets fighting tips from Mike Tyson of all people, then he does
a song about he's like "I Honor You." What kind of fake shit is that?

LstDonSldr

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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WHAT THE HELL? Not 1 person has put the Best Rapper Of All Time? 2Pac
what's that all about

Verbal

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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trying to set a definate rank of the top ten emcees of all time near
impossible, i gotta disagree with q tip and prodigy being on your list, but
really with tip because hes fallen waaaaaay the fuck off. anyo these are my
favorite emcees in no particular order


B.I.G.
Kool Keith
GZA
Canibus
KRS
Guru
Black Thought
Killah Priest
Jay Z

MAD MAX

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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Every body list was okay (whoever put the blackthrought on their list
much respect) but how can ya'll sleep on 2Pac. I'm not trying 2 say he
was the best rapper but he had a big effect on rap music. He gave us
great song like "Changes, Dear mama, I ain't mad a cha, keep ya head up,
and etc. True he did attack big and other rappers but that just show how
real he was. A lot of rapper talk about shooting crooked cops, dissing
fake rappers, and etc. but 2pac was one of the few rap who actually can
say these thing happen 2 him. I'm not trying 2 say that made him a great
rapper i just pac kept that thug image real. speaking of that when pac
claim thug life early in his career people were like " why does he have
2 say that?" Now almost every rapper(mobb deep ,nore, c-murder, memphis
bleek and etc.) are claiming thug life in their music. I believe pac is
not the best rapper (rakim is) but he is one of the top ten rapper just
look at the effect he had on rap music after his death. MAD MAX


mi...@webtv.net

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Oct 31, 1999, 2:00:00 AM10/31/99
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"How many rappers do you know like this?// Also claimin that they're riding but they really turn bitch// It don't make sense Either you're a soldier from the start// or an actor with a record deal tryin to play the part like dat"
~Xzibit

"Your index finger couldn't trigger a bottle of windex"
~Chino XL

"You must be lookin' somewhere else like biggie smalls lazy eye"
~Ras Kass

meenan

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Nov 1, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/1/99
to Slim Shady

On Sun, 31 Oct 1999, Slim Shady wrote:

> Hi, i put a lot of thought into this and I think I have came up with the
> most accurate list ever created. Check it out:
> 1) Black Thought- No matter what you say, Black Thought is the best. He
> always comes with hot hot music to make us nod our heads and his lyrics are
> flawless. From Organix to The Roots Come Alive, Thought is the greatest so
> far.

While thought is damn nice, I wouldn't put him at #1--probably middle of
the top ten (5,6,7). He's never, to my knowledge, come weak, and he
has me rewindin a lot, but the best? I doubt it.

> 2) Guru- Sure, he would'nt be everything he is without that hot DJ Primier
> production behind his lyrics, but either way what he says is dope.
> Representin' for years kid.

what the fuck? I'm a huge GS fan, but there's a lot of MCs out there
that'll smoke Guru--I'd keep him in the top 25. While he brings wisdom
constantly, has he ever dropped a rhyme that was so technically (as in the
rhyme scheme) dope it had you buggin...I doubt it. definitely ill though.

> 3) Rakim- The God. Almost picked him #1. But na, 'cause he's not the best.
> You know that. Don't deny it. His new shit isn't very good either. He's a
> legend though.

You're under 21, aren't you? If you remember Ra's arrival (or at least
heard 'paid in full' within a year of it's release), you'd think a lil
differently, IMO. Before Rakim, MCing was just not the same. Ra brought
something completely new to the mic, and his lyricism and presence on wax
was undeniable. Number 1 no doubt, IMO.


> 4) KRS-1- Without a doubt the best battle rapper. A good MC all in all.

when describing KRS, "good" shouldn't come out of your mouth. How about
"sick", "deep," even "awe inspiring"? While many say he's number one,
I give rakim the nod, but it's close.
--another cat it helps to have heard years back. No doubt, thewre are MCs
out there with more technical skill, and better voices, but no one passes
Ra and KRs when it comes to influencing MCs, and hip-hop as whole.

> 5) Prodigy- Still young, he has great rhymes. This QB nigga can hang with
> the big dogs anyday. And anyone with the guts to fuck with Death Row gets
> points too. That Infamous nigga is nice, and he murdas his shit.

--again, WTF? Top 5? While i like prodigy (he was even on my top ten
about a year ago), this is absurd, IMO. Question, how many different
kinds of rhymes hae you heard him kick? Thug shit, pretty much
exclusively. While he's one of the best at that (next to Kool G
Rap--where's he on your list?), he doesn't do much else. Doesn't battle,
and gets personal mostly on teh thug tip. He's dope, but there are so
many that are better, IMO

> 6) Common- Almost put him higher. He's great, I know. I love Common like the
> next man. But he just hasn't had enough albums to prove new things to me.
> When his new shit drops, I'm sure he'll be in the top 5.

I put commmon at #3 now--he's definitely the best to arrive in the 90s,
IMO. wordplay, battle skills, introspection, and a 'fun' MC to listen to.

> 7) Biggie- With just two albums this cat is a legend. He spit pimpalystic
> rhymes about his hoes, grimy rhymes about murda, true rhymes about life.


--i just disagree with heads giving biggie this amount of props. He had a
dope record, and some versatility, but I just don't think if he was still
alive, heads would consider him one of the masters.

> 8) Mos Def- Maybe if he had slightly more to prove I'd put him higher. He's
> nice, don't get me wrong. He'll always be one of the best, amazingly with
> only one solo album. Oh yeah, go cop dat.

--this one's tough. I may agree, but I'd have to really rack my brain to
be sure. He's ill as fuck, but top 10? With just one solo record? I
guess I'd put him around here (maybe 9). I see him moving up as time
passes--I love this kid.

> 9) Andre' Of OutKast- Personally my favorite MC. I'm not gonna trip and say
> he's the best 'cause all the cats above him are better. He's my fav though,
> andto me every OutKast album so far was a classic.

--yeah, I'ma agree here (i think--i might move him down to ten).

> 10. Q-Tip- It seems as if he's fallen off the map since his days of early
> ATCQ, but he'll always be around. It's most likely that we've already heard
> his best, but only time will tell. "Vivrant Thing" was a disappointment to
> me, a true ATCQ fan. Damn, was he aiming for a hit. With ATCQ he never did
> that. Oh well.

Nah, I think q-tip is dope, but it's more his personality than his actual
skill. While this is a commendable trait, I wouldn't rank him this high.
But, we need some old NAtive Tongue shit on the list--so I'ma go w/
Posdnuos.

--I'd subtract biggie, tip, guru, and prodigy for sure.
I'd add pos, kool g rap, slug (from atmosphere--this kid is ridiculously
sick with words, voice, delivery, and versatility), and either Redman or
Del (probably redman right now, but Del should pass him soon). I didn't
put then in order because that would take careful scrutiny, and I haven't
updated my list in a while.
other favorites--Boots from the Coup, Lyrics Born (latyrx), tash, etc.

Jamal

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Nov 1, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/1/99
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1) Rakim
2) Prodigy & Havoc (equally good)
3) KRS-one
4)Kool G Rap
5)Biggie
6)Nasty Nas
7)Common
8)Guru
9) Big Daddy Kane
10) Redman
Honorable mentions: Capone-n-Noreaga, Large Professor, Jay-z, Pete Rock,
Rebel INS, Black Thought, Buckshot, Pharoahe Monch, Krumbsnatcha


BradChamp

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Nov 2, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/2/99
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>impossible, i gotta disagree with q tip and prodigy being on your list, but
>really with tip because hes fallen waaaaaay the fuck off. anyo thes

He'll always be a legend though...If anyone deserves to get paid it's him, and
I'm glad he's finally getting his due.. Even if he is putting out lower quality
music now, I can never dislike him because of the classic albums he's dorpped
in the past. He's the D'angelo of Hip Hop.

Kool

Oswald Defense Lawyer

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Nov 2, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/2/99
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What? No Big Daddy Kane? Unheard of now, but he was untouchable back then.

Slim Shady wrote:

> Hi, i put a lot of thought into this and I think I have came up with the
> most accurate list ever created. Check it out:
> 1) Black Thought- No matter what you say, Black Thought is the best. He
> always comes with hot hot music to make us nod our heads and his lyrics are
> flawless. From Organix to The Roots Come Alive, Thought is the greatest so
> far.

> 2) Guru- Sure, he would'nt be everything he is without that hot DJ Primier
> production behind his lyrics, but either way what he says is dope.
> Representin' for years kid.

> 3) Rakim- The God. Almost picked him #1. But na, 'cause he's not the best.
> You know that. Don't deny it. His new shit isn't very good either. He's a
> legend though.

> 4) KRS-1- Without a doubt the best battle rapper. A good MC all in all.

> 5) Prodigy- Still young, he has great rhymes. This QB nigga can hang with
> the big dogs anyday. And anyone with the guts to fuck with Death Row gets
> points too. That Infamous nigga is nice, and he murdas his shit.

> 6) Common- Almost put him higher. He's great, I know. I love Common like the
> next man. But he just hasn't had enough albums to prove new things to me.
> When his new shit drops, I'm sure he'll be in the top 5.

> 7) Biggie- With just two albums this cat is a legend. He spit pimpalystic
> rhymes about his hoes, grimy rhymes about murda, true rhymes about life.

> 8) Mos Def- Maybe if he had slightly more to prove I'd put him higher. He's
> nice, don't get me wrong. He'll always be one of the best, amazingly with
> only one solo album. Oh yeah, go cop dat.

> 9) Andre' Of OutKast- Personally my favorite MC. I'm not gonna trip and say
> he's the best 'cause all the cats above him are better. He's my fav though,
> andto me every OutKast album so far was a classic.

> 10. Q-Tip- It seems as if he's fallen off the map since his days of early
> ATCQ, but he'll always be around. It's most likely that we've already heard
> his best, but only time will tell. "Vivrant Thing" was a disappointment to
> me, a true ATCQ fan. Damn, was he aiming for a hit. With ATCQ he never did
> that. Oh well.
>

Kenneth Kaniff From Conneticut

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Nov 2, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/2/99
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>1) Black Thought-
Yeah, Black Thoughts my favorite rapper, but I would call him the best ever
until he releases a solo LP


"I'm just a mean person, you've never seen worse than, so when Slim get this
M-16 burstin', you gettin' spun backwards, like every word of obscene cursin'
on the b-side of my first single with the clean version!!" - Eminem on
OldWorldDisorder's "365"

Redeem

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Nov 2, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/2/99
to
The two MC's that I 'rewind' the most are, Chino XL and Posdnous
I get more from these two cause I'm always rewinding to decipher their
lines......

......Redeem......

''I remove manholes at night with no sound,
check the next day who stayed underground ''

cory licorish

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Nov 2, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/2/99
to
the quote below says it all

Common says:
Fuck a mic check, I bring my flow in cash.

MAD MAX

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Nov 2, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/2/99
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Q-TIP IS A NICE M.C. BUT I HAVE 2 DISAGREE WITH SOMETHING YOU SAID.
"Q-TIP DROP CLASSIC ALBUM" TRUE Q-TIP WAS IN ONE HIP HOP BEST GROUPS.
But he didn't drop does record alone there was 2 other members in the
group. MAD MAX


Dave

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Nov 3, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/3/99
to
Hehe - the subject always makes me smile, as folk either tend to include
the dope rappers of the day and often blur the line between technical
brilliance and simply being seen as cool in the industry.

Of course, I am as biased as the next man but tend to veer towards the
87-92 period for most of my list.

In no particular order (and off the top of my head)

1 - Big Daddy Kane - My all time favorite MC, he had the image, the
style and the technical delivery to match.

2 - LL Cool J - A lot of you guys are forgetting how dope LL was back in
the day. At his best when delivering angry rhymes I don't think anyone
could really touch him in full flight (Check out It Gets No Rougher,
Rock The Bells (original) or To Da Break of Dawn for reference). Not so
good with his softer style though, sadly.

3 - Rakim - Definately up there. Paid in Full, Follow the Leader. Almost
hypnotic when he is on form.

4 - Grand Daddy I.U - Agree with the original poster here. Very, very
tight delivery, smooth style and fun to listen to.

5 - Chuck D - Perhaps too obvious for some, but technically he is
excellent. I thought he had lost some of this pin-point delivery on
recent PE albums but when he dropped 'Autobiography...' it showed him
back on form.

6 - KRS-One - Different from all the above as he utilises a different
style of rapping (offbeat) but still awesome.

7 - Nas - The first of the 'newer' MCs out there on my list, mainly for
'Illmatic' than anything else, he displays skills that indicates that he
could be Rakims natural successor.

8 - Chino XL - Just the one album, so need to hear more from him, but
suspect that he could well be one of the tightest MCs out there. Good
skills and entertaining too.

9 - Eminen - Same as for Chino really, There has been precious few white
MCs with any real technical skills (Pete Nice/Serch/Blade excepted) and
Eminem looks like the cream of the crop at the moment.

10 - Redman - Skills, skills and more skills. Not only technically
excellent but quite possibly one of the most CONSISTENT rappers on my
list.

There. I have probably forgotten loads of rappers who should be
included, but that gives you an idea of my top 10. Of course, I also
love less technically gifted rappers such as Busta, Too $hort, Rza
amongst others - these are just the ones I believe to be technically
superb.

As for 2-Pac?

I know it is probably not in line with general opinion but I felt on the
whole the man was overrated as a rapper. Yes, All Eyez on Me was a dope
album but he was far from tight technically (quite apart from his
multi-layered vocals sometimes becoming irritating on his early albums).
His rep only started to grow around the time of the 'Juice' movie - when
he made the transition from Digital Underground member to solo rapper
people were sleeping on him bigtime. I think it is the image and the
attitude of 2pac that people fell for, not his lyrical skills or
dexterity.

and Wu?

Nahhh. They TRY to sound so technical but I don't buy it. Their subject
matter is also stale and any originality seems to originate from the
Rza. The only member with true technical ability would be Method Man.
But thats only an OPINION ;)

D.

Bish...@webtv.net

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Nov 3, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/3/99
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SeAn_...@webtv.net

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Nov 3, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/3/99
to
1. 2pac - even if u dont like him 4 shyt he started that east west shyt.
he was still the greatest.

2. Nas/Rakim - its hard to make a choice between them for 2nd, even
though Rakim old school so he gonna get more respect.

3. Biggie - Even though he was a trend ..he was still the best of our
time ....though i feel if he didnt die he wouldnt have got as much
respect ...niggaz didnt call him the greatest until he died
4. Too Short - Str8 Pimp

5. Canibus - can be the greatest if he get his shyt together

6. NWA (as a group) - they started the rap most yall listening to now

7. DMX - i been listenin' to DMX since bout '93 so it aint going by his
Ruff Ryder shyt..and he was even better back then

8. Mystikal - This nigga could tear up any track

9. LL Cool J - reason i put LL here is cause he been here since the
begining and still put niggaz like canibus on his azz ...he do get a
lil' sweet sometimes ..but he still got skillz

10. Scarface - that nigga been doing his thing 4 years and still hard


A to the L

unread,
Nov 4, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/4/99
to
number 1 - spell SHIT with an I please

number 2 - your list is wack (Mystikal and DMX?)

number 3 - try 10-12 years for Scarface

PEACE

A to the L

<SeAn_...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:10429-38...@storefull-234.iap.bryant.webtv.net...

Bish...@webtv.net

unread,
Nov 4, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/4/99
to

Nefarious

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Nov 4, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/4/99
to
okay... you know my shit... say it along with me

1. Kool Keith
2. Esham
3. Big Pun (out of nowhere, simply because he has the best rhyming
schemes I ever heard)
4. Kid Rock (loses rank for being commercial boy)
5. AMG (hatehatehate all you want, but IMO, BBHMM is a classic)
6. Sicx
7. E-40 (hatehatehate)
8. X-Raided (siccsiccsicc)
9. MC Ren (Shock of the Hour - Villian In Black... fuck that Ruthless
for Life crap)
10. Slick Rick (Behind Bars is a classic... flameflameflame)


Kazuya

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Nov 4, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/4/99
to

Nefarious <Nefar...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:25048-38...@storefull-285.iap.bryant.webtv.net...

> okay... you know my shit... say it along with me
>

> 9. MC Ren (Shock of the Hour - Villian In Black... fuck that Ruthless
> for Life crap)

Hmmm... I thought I was the only one who liked "Shock of the Hour"... I
think I'll go listen to F what you heard and Shock of the Hour.
--
peace Kazuya

Kaz

unread,
Nov 5, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/5/99
to
Some of these choices are appauling, word up. I couldn't help but add my
two cents. Aight here's my top 5..

#1. Rakim- This is the closest to perfection on a microphone that
they'll ever be. His voice is so amazing and unique and stands apart
from any other emcee's. Rakim has an incredible flow and mic presence.
He's a pioneer of dope lyricism and literrally changed how emcees are
perceived. He made emceein' an artform with his lyrical mastery and
artistry. His rhymes will always stand the test of time. You can
literrally take many of the lyrics he wrote over a decade ago and
compare them to many of the emcee's rhyme who are out today and Ra's
will stand superior. He was truly before his time. Not too mention he
inspired me to write rhymes.

The next 4 are in no particular order.

Big Daddy Kane- Back in the day he was only second to Rakim. He had an
amazing swift flow and mic presence. Kane was very versatile as well. He
could spit ill battle rhymes, punchlines, or even be political. Kane was
very Narcisistic which was his downfall. He wanted to be a sex symbol on
the mic as well as a respected emcee but that didn't work and Kane fell
off fast. Too many damn love ballads hurt him as well.

GZA- this man is so underrated it's pitiful. Definitely one of the
dopest emcee's of the 90's. GZA has an incredible voice, mic presence,
and he's a dope lyricist. I think heads sleep on GZA because he's not as
forth comming with himself as many emcees are. GZA keeps a low profile
in the Clan and really doesn't get the true recognition he deserves

Biggie & Nas- I put these two together becuz both of them only had/has 1
classic album. "Life After Death" wasn't as good as "Ready To Die".
Unfortunately BIG passed before his time and really didn't have time to
solitify or sure up his legacy. He had an amazing flow, voice, and
lyrics. Nas on the other hand has "Illmatic" to his claim but that's it.
He's fallen off hard but for that brief moment he shined brightly on
"Illmatic".

"Those who can't see why my style is confusin' to cynics/ must be on
hallucinogenics/ like those judges who thought Holyfield wasn't losin'
to Lennox"

-Kaz


True080979

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Nov 5, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/5/99
to
well, i gotta throw in my two cents.. these are my top 5 emcees all time,
most meaningful to me. If you don't know, I'm a young gun, listening since
barely high school. So if you don't see KRS One or Heavy D, its cus they aren't
what drove me to rap...

1 Nas
when he chooses to shine, he does. yeah, he got the jigginess in him now, but
you cannot deny the points he makes... classic jams like Street Dreams remix
with R Kelly, fast Life with Kool G Rap, Firm Biz Remix establish his
greatness, but seem to be forgotten.

2 Biggie
no one was able to capture both sentimenst , the street mentality and the
mainstream appeal at the same time... you want tight lyrics? listen to Juicy...
you want a dance beat? listen to Juicy... fella rocked the mic like no other...


3 Scarface
story teller that excels at his trade. fella is and artist with the mic, using
it as his bruch and his words as the pallete, using the music as his canvas...
beautiful imagery seldom found in many rappers today


I can't say who's the greatest ever, cus I when I listen to rappers in the
past... and anyone who says KRS is the best, suck a dick. Personally, he ain't
shit....

Mr. Bravo

www.mrbravo.8m.com

meenan

unread,
Nov 5, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/5/99
to True080979
yo, son....

>>>>I can't say who's the greatest ever, cus I when I listen to rappers in
>>>the past... and anyone who says KRS is the best, suck a dick.
>>>>Personally, he ain't shit....<<<<
I hate to judge someone by such arbitrary factors, but statements like
this illustrate how young you are (both physically and mentally). How are
you going to tell heads who respect an artist from a time obviously WAY
before yours to eat a dick. These are the same cats you should be
respecting, as they've experienced hip-hop in a way you haven't. It's all
good to give dap to those MCs you started out listening to, but to
renounce all others is absolutely moronic. Reasons like this are why
people like me have difficulty taking young heads too serioulsly (at least
until they've put a few years in). true, I wasn't in 123 park in the mid
'70s, catching Kool Herc, coke la rock, etc, but do you hear me say "suck
a dick. they ain't shit," to heads that were there and whose preferences
have developed from these experiences. In this culture, the motto 'each
one teach one' reigns, and if you refuse to be a student, you'll never be
abler to affectively teach (not to mention the value of your uneducated
opionions drop). I'm not telling you "like KRS's style, and think he's
the best." But, I expect more than pigheaded 'suck a dick'-style
ignorance from heads I respect.
--meenan


"I'm so ahead of my time, when i talk there's a seven second delay"
--wordsworth

True080979

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Nov 5, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/5/99
to
>Subject: Re: 10 BEST MC's EVER - UNDISPUTED
>From: meenan mme...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu
>Date: Fri, 05 November 1999 01:37 PM EST
>Message-id: <Pine.A41.3.95.991105...@red.weeg.uiowa.edu>

>I hate to judge someone by such arbitrary factors, but statements like
>this illustrate how young you are (both physically and mentally).

You know, in retrospect that statement was a little overstated, but I still
stand by it based on my listening experiences on KRS. Yes, he does have some
good tracks and can put out some thought provoking lyrics, but I PERSONALLY
think he's way over valued. Alot of cats constantly put him in the top three -
five cats in the game, but he has doen nothing to influence me. I have listened
to some of his albums and actually own two of them, and thats why I put a
judgement on him. I don't talk about anyone else because I have either listened
to theem (ATCQ is the essense of Hip Hop back then), am still evaluating them
(Rakim was no doubt a pioneer, but he's had his share of non choice cuts) or
haven't listened to them at all (UTFO, Big Daddy Kane, whoever) and thus dont
judge them. I have listened to KRS thoroughly and his music has done nothing
for me. Yeah, I am a young gun and still got a long way to go.
My statement was geared really towards heads who seem to put KRS on a
pesdestal and cast judgement on me because I don't respect him. I think I
should have put that in there to clarify my thoughts, that I am guilty of.
Perhaps, but I flt at that time I had to say it, so I stick by it. Kinda like
when someone says "Mase sucks dick" when to me Mase introduced me to the double
and triple end rhymes (yes folks he has them, and you can t front on the Mase
of old), but I ain't gonna diss them ... I guess I should have listened to my
own advice for once instead of that immature kid in me. I'll restate that
thought:

"KRS in my opinion is given far too much credit, and anyone who thinks
otherwise can enlighten me with facts on how he is a major influence in my
life..."

Thanks for setting me straight...

Mr. Bravo

www.mrbravo.8m.com

A to the L

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Nov 5, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/5/99
to
Damn you are asking for flames with this post....

Ok here's some nice emcees for all you recently-turned-to-hiphop-heads....

1) Showbiz & AG - Runaway Slaves: One of the dopest 1st albums ever
made...that Represent joint with the whole DITC crew...off the hook!

2) Grand Daddy I.U. - One of THE best microphone poets....on a par with Kane
and Rakim (yes Rakim!). The Smooth Assassin....

3) Master Ace (not Masta Ase Inc) - Check this guy before he turned west
coast funkish. Take A Look Around and SlaughtaHouse are two of the best rap
albums EVER made....

4) Jungle Brothers - OK most people know these guys...but Done By The Forces
Of Nature is on a par with PE's It Takes A Nation for that political
think-about-it-type shit

5) Ultramagnetic MCS - The original blueprint for Wu-Tang. A whole squad of
ill emcees who talked some crazy bugged out shit. Anybody who hasn't heard
Ego Trip or Chorus Line and claims they are hiphop should be shot.

Now talk to me....

PEACE

A to the L

True080979 <true0...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19991105023630...@ng-bj1.aol.com...

> I can't say who's the greatest ever, cus I when I listen to rappers in the
> past... and anyone who says KRS is the best, suck a dick. Personally, he
ain't
> shit....
>

> Mr. Bravo
>
> www.mrbravo.8m.com
>

A to the L

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Nov 5, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/5/99
to
OK Bravo - I really got to put you in check....
I understand that you don't like KRS-One. OK, he may not be everyone's type
of emcee. But to say that, then in the same post, quote Mase as an influence
is really asking for a flaming frenzy in here.
Also you say that Tribe was the essence of hip hop "back then". Back when?
Tribe came out around 89-90. Krs was dropping shit in 85-86. Way before
Tribe were on release. When KRS was dropping at the start, the essence was
Run DMC, BDP, and Juice Crew to name a few acts. Kurtis Blow, Whodini,
Spoonie Gee (all nice acts in their own right) were most or less making way
for these new acts who set the trend for the way you listen to hip hop
today.
I know that younger heads may not have heard, or may not want to hear, some
of the older acts. But like meenan says, you have to know and respect your
history.
Bravo pick up a Big Daddy Kane album, or a Master Ace album, or Run DMC's
Tougher Than Leather (a mad joint IMO). Then compare the flow, the lyrics,
the HUNGER of these emcees, to the majority of todays rappers. These guys
had to put out dope shit because this was before rap became the monster it
was today.To go platinum then was almost unheard of, so they had to shift
units among their own community. These are the real emcees.
Older heads than me could probably throw a lot of shit at me for not
mentioning Furious Five, Sugarhill, Cold Crush etc. But I think that if
younger guys were to go back to this period (86-90-ish), they'll find the
nicest emcees were all in this period.
Sorry for the length of this post....but I was a bit pissed off by the way
you so casually dismissed the depth of feeling in here with regard to old
school rappers. (In a later posting under a different subject, you said that
if KRS-One represents hiphop you're gonna stick to rap.....
With this attitude maybe you should....)

This is not a dis, and I look forward to seeing your reply....

PEACE

A to the L


A to the L
True080979 <true0...@aol.com> wrote in message

news:19991105135917...@ng-cp1.aol.com...

Bish...@webtv.net

unread,
Nov 5, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/5/99
to

True080979

unread,
Nov 5, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/5/99
to
I knew when I speak MY thoughts that people would get pissed because MY
thoughts don't give a certain respect to certain artists. So I'll clarify even
more...

> quote Mase as an influence
>is really asking for a flaming frenzy in here.

Ok, it either shows I don't have lyrical skill and follow strictly
commercial rap and only rap about shiny siuts and shit or I'm brave enough to
say what I feelwithoput regard to whatever purists or other hip hop heads may
say.
I've heard Run DMC's joint, pretty nice, I've heard Big Daddy Kane's "Raw"
and "Ain't No Half Steppin", all that... now, I ain't dissing anyone when I say
Mase was a personal influence, no matter how much I get flamed. I began writing
in that way and carry that kind of confident attitude. Yo, that's me son, and
I wasn't raised on 5 % percent and preaching the contradictions of a so called
God of rap. To me, (old) Mase is better than KRS (then and now), and that's how
I feel, because Mase had a better effect on me than anything KRS put out. the
reason I do speak of KRS is because I have heard his songs and albums (Criminal
Minded, All Means Necceassry {<--- tight}, Sex and Violence lol, and all the
other ish...) and honestly put, none had any effect on me, except ? maybe ? All
Means.. and Return....

Does that lesson my skills? Fuck no. In this post, the guy asked "greatest
emcees of all time" and I put doen MY list, which means it will be different
then anyone elses. Hey, I ain't gonna pass judgement on people I haven't heard.
You want a comprehensive effort, look up the Source or Blaze, I'm here to give
my opinion, and I'm gonna judge on what I've heard. who knows, maybe when i
hear the entire collection of Posdnous or Too Short I may think they are the
greatest, but until then I'm keeping MY opinion as is...

>Tribe came out around 89-90. Krs was dropping shit in 85-86. Way before
>Tribe were on release.

Yeah, and? Vanilla Ice dropped shit way before alot of emcees, but that
don't mean shit. And yeah, I'm talking of the period ATCQ was around that they
were tight, before them, I can respect all the art in hip hop, but it's like a
car enthusiast (<---spelling) comparing a Model T to a Chevy Silverado now...
you gotta respect the Model T for being the prototype, the beginning, but
things evolve into something better I never said I didn't respect him for
beeing infulential to the community as a whole, but only those heads who get at
me because he wasn't in my list or I say he ain't shit ( i took back one
ccomment, and only because it was a unneccessary)... simple fact is, he ain't
anything to me, and
I understand hunger, man, that's me, and I understand that, but so far with
all the hip hop I have listened to, and believe me, I ain't no casual listner,
I don't delve into the history as much as I should maybe, but when the post
said "greatest of all time" I ain't gonna post bullshit just so that you guys
can think " aw, Mr. Bravo knows his shit". nah, I'm gonna post what I feel, and
that why I only posted 3 names, becasue when I was typing, they were the only
ones I could relate to my writing. Theres plenty ofgood emcees out there, and
myabe I'm blind, but shit, I'd rather be blind than pass blind judgement.

i respect my history and its past, but like you said, I don't have to like
certain instances. You are right, I never understand what hip hop was back
then, just like you may never understand certain injustices in life, and I
don't understand the cconcepts of marriage :) but I judge what I do know, and
you nor anybody will say my opinion is wrong with revelance to me...

>if KRS-One represents hiphop you're gonna stick to rap.....
>With this attitude maybe you should....)

well, i just might if you and the rest of Boogie Down Productions give me more
heat :)

no disses here, just doing my best *laughs* impersonation of RMHH...
sorry for the legnth, but do reply...

Mr. Bravo

"I'm a always want you when nobody wants you
If I die now my love will still haunt you"

Mase, Only You Remix

Redeem

unread,
Nov 6, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/6/99
to
Basically, Bravo and the others (deleted argument) discussion comes down to
this, if you wern't around to grow up with that song or that album or the
meaning it had, then you aint gonna have the same feel for it. The lyrics to
the 'Bridge' isn't gonna be as dope if you dont know what it refers to or it
is the past and you wasn't rewinding it back then. It's like watching an old
boxing fight, people talking about Ali and Frazier, ''they were the best,
not you young'uns''. Although these fights were incredible and most fight
fans can see this, gimmie the Lennox vs Holyfield any day. Because? It's
New. It's current. It's boxers we have grown up with. (ooh, maybe I should
change this title to an OTP).

The PERFECT EXAMPLE!!: I KNOW that Rakim is one of the best to ever grab the
Mic and tear up the crowd. BUT, But, I dont feel him like others, and most
of the rap world. I grew up with hiphop at that time, but my selection was
limited, due to what reasons I dont know. So I never felt his electric
rhymes at their peak, when you had NEVER heard shit like that before. But I
still recognise him as being 'possibly the greatest'. I would be stupid not
to, but he isn't one of my favourites, why? 'cause of many damned reasons
that most people are not going to post about cause their is no reason,
instead just respect peoples choices. Who mentioned TooShort? I cant stand
him, but that aint to say he is shit....
Getme?

And stop apologizing for the length of these posts! Let's make Rmhh Jealous,
I'm gonna go think of twelve OTP posts, you all do the same. PEACE.

.......Redeem......

- You down with OTP? yeah you know me! -

Rane of Terror

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Nov 6, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/6/99
to
>To me, (old) Mase is better than KRS (then and now), and that's how
>I feel, because Mase had a better effect on me than anything KRS put out. the
>reason I do speak of KRS is because I have heard his songs and albums
>(Criminal
>Minded, All Means Necceassry {<--- tight}, Sex and Violence lol, and all the
>other ish...) and honestly put, none had any effect on me, except ? maybe ?
All
>Means.. and Return....

finally, someone who agrees with me (except for the Mase part). KRS never did
shit for me. everytime I tell some backpacking hip hop head that I don't like
KRS, they always come at me with some bullshit about how much he's done for hip
hop. frankly, though, I don't give two shits. he may have been a pioneer, he
may have paved the way for many emcees today, but, point blank, I think he's
weak. Gimme Jay-Z over this cat anyday.

"The great mind skatin through space and time, vibratin through the bassline to
stun mankind, reclined in the leather seat, the casette blasts, vocals to smash
out the bulletproof glass"-Inspectah Deck

Rane of Terror

unread,
Nov 6, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/6/99
to
this is my list...numbers 6-10 change constantly depending on the mood I'm in,
but 1-5 remain the same pretty much for me.

1-Biggie
2-Gza/Genius
3-Rakim
4-Inspectah Deck
5-Prodigy
6-Andre Benjamin
7-Jay-Z
8-Guru
9-Method Man
10-Redman

these are some emcees Im currently feeling though:
Beanie Siegal
Prodigy
Jadakiss
Redman
Method Man
Jay-Z

Delirium

unread,
Nov 6, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/6/99
to
Rane of Terror wrote:
> finally, someone who agrees with me (except for the Mase part). KRS never did
> shit for me. everytime I tell some backpacking hip hop head that I don't like
> KRS, they always come at me with some bullshit about how much he's done for hip
> hop. frankly, though, I don't give two shits. he may have been a pioneer, he
> may have paved the way for many emcees today, but, point blank, I think he's
> weak. Gimme Jay-Z over this cat anyday.

you don't give two shits that he helped make hip-hop what it is today
huh? fuck jay-z the guy is a gimmick. pop. his material is tired.
i'll take krs over jay-z any day. you're entitled to your opinion
though. you could say you ain't feeling krs and that's cool but don't
front on the fact that without him we wouldn't have many cats that we do
today.

Rane of Terror

unread,
Nov 6, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/6/99
to
>you don't give two shits that he helped make hip-hop what it is today
>huh?

i didn't mean it like that. i meant like i could give to shits...hm, let me try
and explain....
i think krs one is corny, and then people tell me all this shit he's done for
hip hop. ill respect him for that, but i dont give two shits for what these
people are saying, it's not like what he's done for hip hop is gonna change my
opinion on him


fuck jay-z the guy is a gimmick. pop.

fuck krs-1, he's wack

his material is tired.

just like krs one is washed up

>i'll take krs over jay-z any day. you're entitled to your opinion
>though.

exactly

you could say you ain't feeling krs and that's cool but don't
>front on the fact that without him we wouldn't have many cats that we do
>today.

i ain't fronting on that fact, i just don't give a fuck what he's done, it
doesn't make him a better emcee.

MAD MAX

unread,
Nov 6, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/6/99
to
Krs-one would kill jay-z in a battle. you must be a pussy ass rap fans 2
still like sellout jay-z. MAD MAX


Rodrigo

unread,
Nov 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/7/99
to Rane of Terror

Well, I agree. KRS is all good for whats he has done for the
community, but he ain;t shit lyrically to me. He supposedly has a good
live show, but I have never been to his performance.
What? You don't like Mase? LOL, you know no one does now, but I
still like his shit.

Mr. Bravo

www.mrbravo.8m.com

"And then these ni**as don't understand why I dont want no family
"What do i need a hooker for when I getting head from Brandy?"

Mase, Same Ni**as

On 6 Nov 1999, Rane of Terror wrote:

> >To me, (old) Mase is better than KRS (then and now), and that's how
> >I feel, because Mase had a better effect on me than anything KRS put out. the
> >reason I do speak of KRS is because I have heard his songs and albums
> >(Criminal
> >Minded, All Means Necceassry {<--- tight}, Sex and Violence lol, and all the
> >other ish...) and honestly put, none had any effect on me, except ? maybe ?
> All
> >Means.. and Return....
>

> finally, someone who agrees with me (except for the Mase part). KRS never did
> shit for me. everytime I tell some backpacking hip hop head that I don't like
> KRS, they always come at me with some bullshit about how much he's done for hip
> hop. frankly, though, I don't give two shits. he may have been a pioneer, he
> may have paved the way for many emcees today, but, point blank, I think he's
> weak. Gimme Jay-Z over this cat anyday.
>
>
>

> "The great mind skatin through space and time, vibratin through the bassline to
> stun mankind, reclined in the leather seat, the casette blasts, vocals to smash
> out the bulletproof glass"-Inspectah Deck
>
>

Take Care, God Bless...


Rodrigo

unread,
Nov 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/7/99
to

Redeem, thank you...

Mr. Bravo

www.mrbravo.8m.com

Take Care, God Bless...


Rane of Terror

unread,
Nov 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/7/99
to
> Well, I agree. KRS is all good for whats he has done for the
>community, but he ain;t shit lyrically to me. He supposedly has a good
>live show, but I have never been to his performance.
> What? You don't like Mase? LOL, you know no one does now, but I
>still like his shit.

naw, i really aint feeling mase. don't get me wrong though, i was feeling him
when he first came out, but he got boring real quick. i own his first album,
and i like like 3 or 4 songs on it. didnt fuck with the second album though,
did he respond to jay-z on his second album? i heard mase tried fucking wit
jigga and jigga gave it to him:
"I bruise wack rap niggas, severly punish 'em, 'specially those that get fucked
for they publishin', heh, it's always gotta be the weakest nigga out the crew,
I'll probably make more money off your album than you, you see the respect I
get everytime I come through, check your own videos, you always be number 2,
niggas talking real breezy on them r and b records, well, im platinum a million
times, nigga, check the credits, S. Carter, ghostwriter, and for the right
price...I can even make yo shit tighter."

>Mr. Bravo

>www.mrbravo.8m.com

>"And then these ni**as don't understand why I dont want no family
>"What do i need a hooker for when I getting head from Brandy?"

>Mase, Same Ni**as

"Don't hate the playa OR the game babes, just hate the way I play it"-yours
truly
"If I got twenty, my brother get ten"-Method Man

Rodrigo

unread,
Nov 7, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/7/99
to Rane of Terror

Actually, Mase did respond to Jay- Z's rebuttal, it's a song
called Do What Players Do, featuring 8Ball and Mysonne, and it's a phat
track. It's on that Southern tip, but It's got this chill ass beat that
gets you to relax. It really is a tight song... here's the lyrics,
courtesy of Mr. Bravo and OHHLA.com, from the Violator soundtrack...

Mase---
Sauve House motherfucker, All Out motherfucker
Wanna blow motherfucker? Team nigga til I'm low motherfucker
Yo, I went from O-T to O-C to all the paper
Leads to fatigue then ? the gators
If ain't about the money nigga? Call me later
How many niggaz talk Benzes? Seen in one
Not videos and picture shit, those don't count
I'm the nigga talkin millions and, own the amount
Mr. Frosty, the nigga never fold for chips
When the money on the line bitch I roll trips
Cut a bitch off for a week and let her know what she miss
Hundred grand worth of shit nigga glow on my wrist
Bought a range just to go with the six
When I flip for these chips, shit is never over a bitch
You got some nerve, I can give a kiler one word, get em
You will see how many niggaz miss him
I put pellets in the air let the shit hit em
Put the gun inside his mouth and let the clip kiss him
Shit you drive all tinted, I put my honey in it
Won't, stop your bank, ain't enough money in it
Live a lifestyle rarely told, what you know about
floatin down Eighth, gettin head in the Rolls
You had, money like that you wouldn't be measurin those
You motherfuckin barely sold, barely gold
Niggaz send it rough I send it back the same way it came
You ain't dissin me until you say my name, motherfucker

It's a typical feud, two rich fools who don't want to call each
others name, but I guess it's dead now that Mase is going to school...

Mr. Bravo

www.mrbravo.8m.com

Take Care, God Bless...


meenan

unread,
Nov 8, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/8/99
to True080979
yo, son....

>>>My statement was geared really towards heads who seem to put KRS on a
pesdestal and cast judgement on me because I don't respect him. I think I
should have put that in there to clarify my thoughts, that I am guilty of.
Perhaps, but I flt at that time I had to say it, so I stick by it. Kinda
like when someone says "Mase sucks dick" when to me Mase introduced me to
the double and triple end rhymes (yes folks he has them, and you can t
front on the Mase of old), but I ain't gonna diss them ... I guess I
should have listened to my own advice for once instead of that immature
kid in me. I'll restate that thought:>>>>

--This is my major problem: How are you (and other youg heads) gonna
bitch about pioneers 'falling off', and therefore losing (or never gaining
you respect), but are quick to point heads in the direction of the 'old
mase'? Do you mean mase before he was signed, mase on his first album,
what? Bottom line: There was no 'old mase' mase is a wack cat who sold
out before he began. Regardless of his 'mixtape days' (how long did THEY
last?), he's still wack. And to credit him with influencing you with
'double and triple ended rhymes' is also ridiculous. If he did, it's a
result of your failure to recognize them before, not a result of his
lyrical innovation. Another thing: I read that you 'don't respect him',
regarding KRS...and in another post "does that affect my skills? Hell
no"...is this correct? IF so, here's the response...
I assume you are (as a self-proclaimed 'MC') familiar with the sixteen bar
rhyme style (i.e. when MCs refer to a verse, they call it '16 bars' as
it's the standard length). You probably rhyme in this style, most MCs do.
KRS-ONE invented it....that alone makes him worthy of your respect,
because you wouldn't be rapping in the same style if it weren't for him.
Maybe you don't like his voice, or his arrogance, or message, or beats, or
whatever, but he basically gave you the foundation for your (and many
other 1990s MCs) style.

>>>>"KRS in my opinion is given far too much credit, and anyone who thinks
otherwise can enlighten me with facts on how he is a major influence in my
life...">>>>>

See above...maybe you were unaware of what I just stated (as in nobody
told you before), but go back and listen to shit before KRS, then after
KRS. Just as Rakim birthed modern lyricism, KRS built the modern
technical style. That is how he's an influence on your life.
Now do you feel he is given too much credit (or at least after checking my
facts with heads that you trust)? Probably not...Heads like you are
usually stubborn and fairly unwilling to accept the statements of heads
that have obviously been students of the game for much longer.

meenan

unread,
Nov 8, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/8/99
to A to the L
Well, I'm upset I never noticed this post before....butttt

"I'm so ahead of my time, when i talk there's a seven second delay"
--wordsworth


On Fri, 5 Nov 1999, A to the L wrote:

> Damn you are asking for flames with this post....
>

--if you're talking about that bravo cat, you're right...

> Ok here's some nice emcees for all you recently-turned-to-hiphop-heads....
>
> 1) Showbiz & AG - Runaway Slaves: One of the dopest 1st albums ever
> made...that Represent joint with the whole DITC crew...off the hook!
>

Extremely underrated record. Still gets a couple spins a month out of me.
For those who don't know...the "Represent" track he mentioned contains a
very early (1992, I think...or was ir 91) verse by none other thatn Big L.


> 2) Grand Daddy I.U. - One of THE best microphone poets....on a par with Kane
> and Rakim (yes Rakim!). The Smooth Assassin....
>

I'm really not too familiar with this cat, but this is the second time
he's come so strongly recommended, so I gotta start diggin.
But, if he's not 'on par with Rakim', you're gonna hear from me. " Nobody
beats the R", IMO.

> 3) Master Ace (not Masta Ase Inc) - Check this guy before he turned west
> coast funkish. Take A Look Around and SlaughtaHouse are two of the best rap
> albums EVER made....
>

Aiighht....as long as It's before he went to that funk formula crap. But,
two of the best? Wow, IMO, I wouldn't go that far...but it's your call, I
guess.


> 4) Jungle Brothers - OK most people know these guys...but Done By The Forces
> Of Nature is on a par with PE's It Takes A Nation for that political
> think-about-it-type shit
>

Again, I love the JBs...but I wouldn;t put any of their work on par with
"It Takes a Nation". But then, I don't think I 'd put anything up there
with that record.


> 5) Ultramagnetic MCS - The original blueprint for Wu-Tang. A whole squad of
> ill emcees who talked some crazy bugged out shit. Anybody who hasn't heard
> Ego Trip or Chorus Line and claims they are hiphop should be shot.
>

Yo, you're right about their influence, but I can't help but disagree.
The original blueprint for Wu-Tang was Crash Crew (RZA even copped one of
their beats, and later said..."these arte the first cats to havde a
clan."). UMCs are ill though.

--Meenan

> Now talk to me....
>
I thought I just did that.

> PEACE
>
> A to the L
>

> True080979 <true0...@aol.com> wrote in message

True080979

unread,
Nov 8, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/8/99
to
Ok, heres the email Mr. Mean Man sent me...

Subj: Re: 10 BEST MC's EVER - UNDISPUTED
Date: 11/8/99 1:35:48 PM Central Standard Time
From: mme...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu (meenan)
To: true0...@aol.com (True080979)


>
>yo, son....
>
>>>My statement was geared really towards heads who >seem to put KRS on a
>pesdestal and cast judgement on me because I don't >respect him. I think I
>should have put that in there to clarify my thoughts, that I >am guilty of.
>Perhaps, but I flt at that time I had to say it, so I stick by it. >Kinda
>like when someone says "Mase sucks dick" when to me >Mase introduced me to
>the double and triple end rhymes (yes folks he has them, >and you can t
>front on the Mase of old), but I ain't gonna diss them ... I >guess I
>should have listened to my own advice for once instead >of that immature
>kid in me. I'll restate that thought:>>>>

Well, this is still how I feel, and if you got a problem, I think Redeem
explained it best in his post...

>--This is my major problem: How are you (and other youg >heads) gonna
>bitch about pioneers 'falling off', and therefore losing (or >never gaining

OK, how can someone fall off if they were never held to the same pedestal
you have them on? I personally don't feel a good 85% of what KRS does, so he
was NEVER on a pedestal to fall off of, but then again, that's my personal
opinion. Maybe to you, he has fallen off, because he use to be this God of
rap... sorry to hear that, but this "young" head hasn't bitched about him
falling off...

>you respect), but are quick to point heads in the direction >of the 'old
>mase'? Do you mean mase before he was signed, >mase on his first album,
>what? Bottom line: There was no 'old mase' mase is a >wack cat who sold
>out before he began. Regardless of his 'mixtape days' >(how long did THEY
>last?), he's still wack. And to credit him with influencing >you with
>'double and triple ended rhymes' is also ridiculous. If he >did, it's a
>result of your failure to recognize them before, not a result

I knew I'd catch slack for my statement, but I stand by it. Yo, we don't
have Hot 97 over here in Texas, all we have is Rap A Lot, DJ Screw, and others.
Also, I wasn't allowed to listen to rap when I was young, I have the strictest
parents you could have. I listened to 2Pac's 2pacalypse and Strictly for my
Niggas and that shit was dope to me, then I heard Chronic and all... i can
relate to all that shit about being poor and not having hope because I was like
that, but thank God my parents strived to better everything. I've been writing
rhymes believe it or not since elementary, I'm sure alot of us have, but it
isn't until we develop a sense of being and knowing who you are that we either
continue with that gift, or just say fuck it. Everyone in SA Town raps the
same, Kid Frost slow with bass heavy song shit, about blunts, guns, drugs,
bitches, and gangs, and honestly I can't relate to fucking 20 bitches, smoking
endo, and getting pissy drunk... call me what you wnat, but that's me, and
thats not real to me... I wanted something different, cus I dreamed (and still
do) that I wanted the best for my family, all that shiny shit for them, all
that money for them, because I really don't care much for it. Anyways, when I
heard Mase use the cadence he used, thats when said Thats how I want to
write... he was different, and I wanted that. that's how he was able to
influence me... maybe if I heard KRS back in the day, I'd be just like you...
but I didn't

>of his
>lyrical innovation. Another thing: I read that you 'don't >respect him',
>regarding KRS...and in another post "does that affect my >skills? Hell
>no"...is this correct? IF so, here's the response...
>I assume you are (as a self-proclaimed 'MC') familiar >with the sixteen bar
>rhyme style (i.e. when MCs refer to a verse, they call it '16 >bars' as
>it's the standard length). You probably rhyme in this style, >most MCs do.
>KRS-ONE invented it....that alone makes him worthy of >your respect,
>because you wouldn't be rapping in the same style if it >weren't for him.
>Maybe you don't like his voice, or his arrogance, or >message, or beats, or
>whatever, but he basically gave you the foundation for >your (and many
>other 1990s MCs) style.

Clarify yourself and check what I said before you start cut and pasting my
shit to make your point. I've said I do respect him for what hes done for the
community as a whole, but as far as me liking his songs and his shit, no...
hey, if he invented that rhyme pattern, then great, but that don't mean shit
kid... If you are going to use that chain of events, then I need to give all my
respect and love to Herc and the Sugarhill Gang for starting this shit, but I
don't think so... once again, I respect them for what they did, aand I'm ure at
that time thier music was hot, and I still feel some of it, but you nor anybody
will force me to like them.

>>>>"KRS in my opinion is given far too much credit, and >anyone who thinks
>otherwise can enlighten me with facts on how he is a >major influence in my
>life...">>>>>
>
>See above...maybe you were unaware of what I just >stated (as in nobody
>told you before), but go back and listen to shit before >KRS, then after
>KRS. Just as Rakim birthed modern lyricism, KRS built >the modern
>technical style. That is how he's an influence on your life.

Honestly, you don't give a shit who influenced me, nor do I care who
influenced you. All I know is that when I drop my rhymes, they represent me,
not my influences. your theory ( an example, just to show length)....

I was influenced (partly) by Mase
Mase was influnced by L
Lwas influenced by Ras
Ras was influenced by rakim
Rakim was influenced by KRS

Hey, if Mase was influenced by so so, thats his deal. Lets just say Mase was
influenced directly by KRS... does that chancge anything? No, because KRS did
nothing to influence me, and if Mase did and he followed the same regimen that
KRS did, then that simply means that Mase had a better way to convey that
influence
Once I set up a tutorial program for students that couldn't pass the state
mandated test. I helped 11 out of 14 students graduate, by I used basically the
same lesson plans that those teachers who couldn't get these kids to pass used.
In fact, three of the students were taught basic algebra by my calculus
teacher. Now, that teacher influenced my way of thought, and I influened those
students way of thought... are they going to credit him with helping them pass
the TAAS test? Hell fucking no, even if he was my teacher, they are going to
say "Rodrigo helped me graduate" even if my teacher set the pricinples in
place, it was I who was able to interpret them to these students...

>Now do you feel he is given too much credit (or at least >after checking my
>facts with heads that you trust)? Probably not...Heads >like you are
>usually stubborn and fairly unwilling to accept the >statements of heads
>that have obviously been students of the game for much >longer.
>--meenan

I really don't consider myself stubborn; if I'm proven wrong, I can accept
it and learn from it. Fact is, you are trying to place a right or wrong answer
on something that doesn'y have that type of answer... Face it man, I respexct
that guy for his achievements, but I ain't gonna say "huh, yeah, he's a big
influence in my life..." you must be out of your fucking mind...

Mr. Bravo

it starts on Dec.12...

A to the L

unread,
Nov 8, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/8/99
to
Meenan, big up for the response.

Its nice to see a few "older" heads in here who actually like to get
involved in these petty squabbles with the children....

Mase v KRS?
Thats like saying:
Camron v Kane
Puffy v Kool G Rap

;)

PEACE

A to the L


meenan <mme...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu> wrote in message
news:Pine.A41.3.95.991108...@black.weeg.uiowa.edu...

meenan

unread,
Nov 8, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/8/99
to A to the L
peace, cat....
Yo, when did cats start giving us 'joint posts' as if our 'collective
opinion' can be refuted in one fell swoop? And why can't these lil cats
get my name right (not 'mean' --meenan, how fucking hard is that? you got
it right--good lookin)? Well,
I see we're both getting a lil tired (and busy) of fighting 'the good
fight'. Especially when any time you try to tell a kid something he may
not have been 'around' for...he wants to refute you [me]. WTF?
I don't know who's telling these kids they know what's up (cuz I never
had anyone telling me that coming up--and I still haven't come up quite
yet.
peace,
meenan

"I'm so ahead of my time, when i talk there's a seven second delay"
--wordsworth

> > Again, I love the JBs....but I wouldn;t put any of their work on par with

Paschal

unread,
Nov 9, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/9/99
to
I agree with you

Here is something to ponder...
What if the "old school" artists had some of the technology that SOME of the
weak rhyme writting wanna be underground half rappers have today, there would
not even be a conversationabout are the best.
If you take out the special effects half of these guys out there could not
give a tape , CD or record away.

Master Ace, slaughterhouse was tight...

> 3) Master Ace (not Masta Ase Inc) - Check this guy before he turned west
>> > coast funkish. Take A Look Around and SlaughtaHouse are two of the best
>rap
>> > albums EVER made....

I guess i can't leave without reminding you of something-
LL said it " I'm bad as can be, taking out all rookies,so forget oreos, eat
Cool J cookies......"
paschal
"I take 7 Mc's and put'em in a line";
" Add seven more brothers who think they can rhyme";
" well it will take seven more before I go for mine";
" now thats 21 MC's ate up at the same time".
Now that is rap (lets bring back the old school)

Suspect

unread,
Nov 9, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/9/99
to

True080979 wrote in message
<19991105023630...@ng-bj1.aol.com>...

>I can't say who's the greatest ever, cus I when I listen to rappers in the
>past... and anyone who says KRS is the best, suck a dick. Personally, he
ain't
>shit....
>
>Mr. Bravo
>
>www.mrbravo.8m.com
>

He aint shit, yo he had Master B aka Bud Bundy in his video.
Honestly can you tell me he aint shit, He had my favorite emcee,
of all time Master B, you know Married With Children For Life (MWC).

Suspect

-What haters say Rakim bit Rass Kass, go to hell with rass with you.-

Suspect

unread,
Nov 9, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/9/99
to
I like pussy, and ass so im a pussy ass rap fan.
Im guessing you a drop the soap, anal underground
rap fan? Insane Spct

Im just like that yo!

MAD MAX wrote in message
<27392-38...@storefull-271.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...

Kuwait Kuwait

unread,
Nov 9, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/9/99
to
Bravo, I was tryin to reach you to finish up that collabo, ICQ me at
44084840

Peace

A to the L

unread,
Nov 9, 1999, 3:00:00 AM11/9/99
to
Damn right....

PEACE

A to the L

meenan <mme...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu> wrote in message

news:Pine.A41.3.95.991108...@red.weeg.uiowa.edu...

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