JERU vs. THE FUGEES..... what's the deal?
Quiz
What's the deal with this beef between Fugees and Jeru the Damaja?
Anybody know...
ie:
"...no matter who you damage, you're still a false prophet"
'Zealots" -Fugees
"I heard some emcees want to bring it but a female is one of their
strongest men
when I step, don't seek refuge, make it happen, the rappin ..."
'Black Cowboys' -Jeru the Damaja
Anybody who the history behind this?
peace
quizativ
--
Straight No Chaser ONLINE
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/richard_howes
Layaway061
Who cares, i hate the fuckin FUGEES anyway
Quizativ
Layaway061 <layaw...@aol.com> wrote in article
<541npq$4...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>...
> Who cares, i hate the fuckin FUGEES anyway
>
Probabaly because they were successful, probabaly not because you think
they "suck". That would be my guess. Now take your fuckin stupid
worthless answers back to your ass.... where they came from... man...
say something intelligent or don't say anything at all.
punk
out
quizativ
Sun Spark -- Seventh Dimenshun
Quiz (richar...@mindlink.bc.ca) wrote:
: What's the deal with this beef between Fugees and Jeru the Damaja?
: Anybody know...
: ie:
: peace
: quizativ
I dont know what the deal is behind this.....but in my opinion if they
ever battled.. jeru would take all three out.. jeru's lyrics are musch
deeper than all the fugees combined....he will attack subliminally and
then come straight forward....oh well
peace
SuN SpArK the Alien-8-er
kxm...@psu.edu
>What's the deal with this beef between Fugees and Jeru the Damaja?
>Anybody know...
>
>ie:
>
>"...no matter who you damage, you're still a false prophet"
>'Zealots" -Fugees
>
>"I heard some emcees want to bring it but a female is one of their
>strongest men
>when I step, don't seek refuge, make it happen, the rappin ..."
>'Black Cowboys' -Jeru the Damaja
>
>Anybody who the history behind this?
>
>peace
>
>quizativ
Damn that first post was a hell of an observation.
Personally I think the thought that the Fugees was even thinkin' of
callin' Jeru a false prophet is hilarious.
I was cool with the Fugees until they started with this "Killing Me
Softly" garbage.
They was in the process of making a video for that "Cowboys" cut and
stopped in mid-production to make a video for "Killing Me Softly"
instead.
They weren't just taking credit for that single, which there is
nothing wrong with, but they tried to build a career out of it.
Dumb Move.
That just makes it harder for other artists because now all the
reccompanies
are going to say....
"We want you to make some songs with R&B appeal on your albumn."
"So cut out some of that hardcore."
Jeru not only is true to HipHop but he comes with matematically filled
knowledge in his lyrics.
Why would the Fugees start a beef with Jeru anyway?
Desperation?
Layaway061
alright you stupid fuck, you only like rap albums that go fuckin QUADRUPLE
platinum. I like bands that dont rely on having commercial songs. Let me
guess, you probably also like BONE too. Dont come here anymore, the
FUGEES are a fuckin TIRED band and so is your stupid ass.
Layaway061
OH yeah, and another thing, the reason JERU doesnt like the fugees is
because they remixed some BOB MARLEY songs and put lyrics that they
thought up. Jeru feels that no one should ever remix BOB MARLEY songs for
monetary gain and to redo lyrics to a marley song is terrible in his view.
SUDDEN DEATH
In article <54405v$18...@r02n01.cac.psu.edu>, kxm...@psu.edu writes:
>>What's the deal with this beef between Fugees and Jeru the Damaja?
>>Anybody know...
>>
>>ie:
>>
>>"...no matter who you damage, you're still a false prophet"
>>'Zealots" -Fugees
>>
>>"I heard some emcees want to bring it but a female is one of their
>>strongest men
>>when I step, don't seek refuge, make it happen, the rappin ..."
>>'Black Cowboys' -Jeru the Damaja
>>
>>Anybody who the history behind this?
>>
>>peace
>>
>>quizativ
>
>
>Damn that first post was a hell of an observation.
>
>Personally I think the thought that the Fugees was even thinkin' of
>callin' Jeru a false prophet is hilarious.
>
>I was cool with the Fugees until they started with this "Killing Me
>Softly" garbage.
I'm about to record a parody of that called "Slow, Painful Death." It's about
how the song was overplayed to the point where I personally would rather die
than listen to it again.
I'll post the lyrics if you're interested. Let me know.
->Later.....Spice ____ _____ _____ _____ __ __
SUDDEN | \| _ |/ _ \|_ _| | | |
0 0 @ * | |\ |_ | | |_| |
< ^ | | | _| |_| _ |
---- ~~~~ | |/ |_ _ | | |
before after |___/|____|__| |__| |_| |__| |__|
'Wassup' B. David Harrison
On 17 Oct 1996, SUDDEN DEATH wrote:
> In article <54405v$18...@r02n01.cac.psu.edu>, kxm...@psu.edu writes:
> >>What's the deal with this beef between Fugees and Jeru the Damaja?
> >>Anybody know...
> >>
> >>ie:
> >>
> >>"...no matter who you damage, you're still a false prophet"
> >>'Zealots" -Fugees
> >>
> >>"I heard some emcees want to bring it but a female is one of their
> >>strongest men
> >>when I step, don't seek refuge, make it happen, the rappin ..."
> >>'Black Cowboys' -Jeru the Damaja
> >>
> >>Anybody who the history behind this?
> >>
> >>peace
> >>
> >>quizativ
> >
> >
> >Damn that first post was a hell of an observation.
> >
> >Personally I think the thought that the Fugees was even thinkin' of
> >callin' Jeru a false prophet is hilarious.
> >
> >I was cool with the Fugees until they started with this "Killing Me
> >Softly" garbage.
I love it... when this album dropped, heads were all over it... once
they learned that the mainstream was diggin' it, it wasn't cool to like
them anymore. When "The Score" came out... everybody was up in here
talking about how fly it was... now they're dissin' it left and right. I
agree... K.M.S. got played to death- I will also admit that I kinda liked
it (can't say the same for the Marley cover). I think that the Fugee's
got fucked over by the marketing department. They got pumped up as a
crossover band and lost their credibility. What would y'all be saying if
they'd dropped some of the more straight hip-hop tunes off the album as
the main singles.
David
Quiz
Layaway061 <layaw...@aol.com> wrote in article
<545snl$g...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>...
Hold up. I really hope that you didn't just address me as a "stupid
fuck".... If so...... my man... you just don't even know... you just
don't even know.
Now, in response to your "accusations" let me take you to school.
I have been "coming here" for several years (in fact I'm probably one of
the only people who have stuck with the wack ng for this long) and I aint
about to stop now on your account. I know and understand more, have lived
more about underground hip hop than you probabaly ever have knows, do know,
or will know. That's why I don't have to front like I'm only down with
underground shit. Kid, i'm down with dope hip hop music. Multi-platinum or
sold on the street corner.
I do a radio show presently that plays and supports more underground hip
hop than you would know what do with. So don't talk to me about commercial
rap. Aiight. Cause you just don't even know.
No I'm not down with Bone. First, it doesn't appeal to me. Second it
doesn't even matter because Bone is not hip hop. That shit is R&B kid...
get in straight.
I like bands who have good music. I don't pay attention to wether Fugees
were a success because they "relied on commercial songs"... I pay attention
to the fact that they have some true talent and are using it in creative
and innovative ways, and they have some extremely good music. Bands only
get tired if you treat as if they are fashion. Which apears to be what you
are doing. It's "cool" for you to be down with "underground
non-commercial" shit... so you gotta stand up for yourlself and make niose
about how you're so down all the time... That's how I'm seeing you. if
you don't wanna be seen theat way. Don't portray yourself that way.
Schools out... go crying to your mom's and tell her Quiz says thanx!
quizativ
Aaron
In article <Pine.OSF.3.95.961017...@saul5.u.washington.edu>,
wa...@u.washington.edu says...
Ain't that the truth. I definately agree with ya there. I still think The
Fugeees got mad talent. I've been thinking what David said for quite some
time now. First suckin' and swallowing. Then spittin' it up in their face.
Aaron
Aaron
In article <01bbbccc$ac46ec20$37ca...@deep.mindlink.net.deep.mindlink.net>,
richar...@mindlink.bc.ca says...
Couldn't have said it better myself. Right on holmes.
APage20301
Jeru take out Lauryn?? HAhhahahah. Lauryn's freestyle is 500 times better
than Jeru's freestyle. She would punish him. And I like Jeru. The reason
for the beef IMO is because Jeru is a sexist MF who dissed sisters with
that song "The Bytches". So Lauryn probably wants to get at him anyway.
She would tear him out the frame, no doubt. Only Common and Aceyalone
could serve her from what I've heard of her freeestyle. There may be a few
others, but she is very good off the top.
Out.
Alan
Quizativ
APage20301 <apage...@aol.com> wrote in article
<54e5kd$j...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>...
Yo kid...you really don't look any deeper than the surface of something do
you?
Jery is not a sexist. Listen to the song again. He's talking about
"bitches" as opposed to "the queens". He's praising women (the queens)
who are for real, who respect themselves and who are intelligent and worthy
of the love and respect that they deserve and get. And most of all he's
dissing the "bitches" that front on men, front on themselves and don't
respect themselves. Aint nothing sexist about that.
Lauryn could do a song called "the bastards" or "the assholes"... and she
would be talkign about those men who front on themsleves and don't respect
themselves, don't respect women and all that shit.... You wouldn't say
she was sexist. She'd be doing the same thing Jeru did.
No question Lauren could take Jeru out in a freestyle. The question is
not who would win in a freetyle battle. The question is why are they
feuding. Your explanation about that sexist "bullshit" is not valid. It
was not Lauren who dissed Jeru, it was one of the two other dudes. For
all we know Lauren doens't have a problem with Jeru, it's Wyclef who
does...
School's out. Time to go home for milk and cookies with ya moms.... tell
her I'll call her on the weekend.
quiz
Malik
APage20301 wrote:
>
> Jeru take out Lauryn?? HAhhahahah. Lauryn's freestyle is 500 times better
> than Jeru's freestyle. She would punish him. And I like Jeru. The reason
> for the beef IMO is because Jeru is a sexist MF who dissed sisters with
> that song "The Bytches". So Lauryn probably wants to get at him anyway.
> She would tear him out the frame, no doubt.
I agree...
Only Common and Aceyalone
> could serve her from what I've heard of her freeestyle.
no way, I've heard at least 100 kids off the head that would destroy her
There may be a few
> others, but she is very good off the top.
that's true...maybe the best female freestyler
Malik
Dainja Domain
Malik <ma...@greyspace.com> wrote:
>I agree...
>Malik
She can't be the best female freestyler. Jeru would have that ass for
lunch!!!!!! The song Bitches doesn't diss all sisters.
---------------------------------------------------------------
Even through I maybe killing off your children,
I'm just a nigga hustling trying to make a million.
---------------------------------------------------------------
FACEMOB '96
---------------------------------------------------------------
SmOkeZxOnE
In article <54e5kd$j...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>, apage...@aol.com
(APage20301) writes:
>Lauryn's freestyle is 500 times better
>than Jeru's freestyle. She would punish him. And I like Jeru. The reason
>for the beef IMO is because Jeru is a sexist MF who dissed sisters with
>that song "The Bytches". So Lauryn probably wants to get at him anyway.
>She would tear him out the frame, no doubt. Only Common and Aceyalone
>could serve her from what I've heard of her freeestyle. There may be a
few
>others, but she is very good off the top.
You really think L-Boogie's freestyle is that good? I heard a little bit
of her freestyling, but I didn't really think she was all that...she
wasn't bad, Wyclef was a little better, but again like you said I'm used
to hearing freestyle from mic champs like Common, Abstract, and E-double,
who is one of THE best freestylers I have ever heard.
smokez
Mista Ryte
Just curious... I was playin 'The Score' since the day it came out, before
MTV got a hold of it, and my 'not-as-much-into-rap-as-me' friends were
like, 'ahh, that's shit'. But as soon as MTV got a hold of Fugees, you
could never hang out with these friends w/o them mouthing the lyrics to
Killing Me Softly or Fu-Gee-La. Hell, MTV probably doesn't even know they
had a first album...
To me, Vocab will always be the shit...
--
Mista Ryte
Check my 'net site: http://watt.seas.virginia.edu/~rww6g
"UVA is not a charm school..." -Jodie Foster,
SILENCE OF THE LAMBS
Donte Demon Cooper
the beef between the fugees and Jeru is that most people
(science) feel those who know never feel the need to show. In
other words calling yourself a prophet in essence makes you a
false prophet. Unfortunately, the fugees picked Jeru, who I view as
a prophet as far as hiphop goes, which was the wrong move
UNIVERSAL
Quizativ
Donte Demon Cooper <dd...@Virginia.EDU> wrote in article
<DzpM9...@Virginia.EDU>...
FINALLY!!!!! Thank you unirversal. A rational and intelligent response
to my original post about FUgees and Jeru feuding.
ALl you punks who posted shit like... "nah Jeru would win... L-Boogie is on
his dick"... "nah L-Boogie has the best freestyle" were posting silly
nonsense. Any true fan of Jeru's would never say any of the above... if
you truly understand Jeru or L-Boogie's mindstate's and level of thought...
you would be posting much more interetsing and intelligent posts. Such as
the one above. Use it as an example.... maybe we can turn the bullshit
discussion around here into somthing substantial.
peace
quiz
APage20301
In article
<01bbbed3$54f77120$57ca...@deep.mindlink.net.deep.mindlink.net>,
"Quizativ" <richar...@mindlink.bc.ca> writes:
>Lauryn could do a song called "the bastards" or "the assholes"... and she
>would be talkign about those men who front on themsleves and don't
respect
>themselves, don't respect women and all that shit....
Lauryn would NOT write a song like this because Lauryn puts thought into
everything she writes. Jeru seemed to have wrote "Da Bytchez", IMO, while
he was emotional about situations with *certain* females. A prophet
doesn't get emotional when they're trying to impart words unto the people.
A true prophet always speaks from the higher moral ground, not from
something as base as personal animosity.
IMHO, the song Jeru wrote is sexist because the FOCUS of the song is on
"Da Bythez". Quizativ, I believe you are the one that doesn't look much
below the surface. If you did, you would see that what Jeru was saying was
the same as what Ice Cube was saying in "A Bitch Is a Bitch". The
essential point is men do not (and should *never* have) the right to
categorize women, period. The simplistic division of women into either
queens or bitches is ridiculously patriachal. This is an extension of the
virgin/whore stereotype that has existed since Victorian times, but since
you don't look below the surface, you can't see the underlying patronizing
tone of this philosophy ("do what I say makes you a queen or you are a
bitch"). This is like saying "there are good black people and there are
niggers". Don't you see how a white person saying that would be
patronizing and racist? A man dividing women into two simple categories is
equally patronizing, and sexist. Women should have the right to define
themselves rather than have their identities defined by men and, as
complex human beings, women cannot be defined and divided into simple
categories in any case. This is a classic case of patriachy. The male -
who believes himself to be somehow wiser than the female (here, in the
sense that Jeru names himself a "prophet") - tells her how she should act
to be a "lady", implying that if she steps out of these boundaries she is
less than moral and deserving of social ostracism or other ill treatment.
A ridiculous, sexist presumption.
>School's out. Time to go home for milk and cookies with ya moms....
tell
>her I'll call her on the weekend.
This last statement is a personal attack that makes you look immature.
Please refrain from such juvenile behavior.
PS: I feel that if Lauryn had a philosophical difference with Jeru, the
rest of her crew (since they are tight like a family) would be able to see
eye to eye with that. After all, why would you all assume that Praz
wouldn't be as offended by Jeru's sexism as Lauryn would be?
Thinking deeply...
Alan
APage20301
In article <54k26i$q...@news.ycc.yale.edu>, Beth Lewis
<beth....@yale.edu> writes:
>JERU is one of the best freestyle MCs to ever touch the mic.
What? Have you heard Jeru freestyle? Now, remember, I define "freestyle"
as rhyming off the top of the head on any topic. Some people define
"freestyling" as rhyming your writtens over someone else's instrumental
(no lie, I know people who define it this way). A lot of old school heads
say that freestyle was originally a term for rhymes with no main topic. I
stick to the new school definition, though, because 95% of heads today
aren't trying to go back to how brothers and sisters were rhyming in the
late seventies, early eighties..
Peace,
Alan
Beth Lewis
JERU is one of the best freestyle MCs to ever touch the mic. He is
original,intelligent, and the shit he says is just fuckin amazing. If you
really payed attention to the lyrics on "BITCHES" you'd know who he was
refering to.He's not dissing females and he makes it very clear in the
song. I'm sure L-BOOGIE is all on JERU's dick so she'd know better and
back up if a battle was near.
Hooch
+-- - quoting apage...@aol.com from a message to All
+--- -- - ------ -- -+
ap> Jeru take out Lauryn?? HAhhahahah. Lauryn's freestyle is 500 times
ap> than Jeru's freestyle. She would punish him. And I like Jeru. The
ap> for the beef IMO is because Jeru is a sexist MF who dissed sisters
ap> that song "The Bytches". So Lauryn probably wants to get at him
ap> She would tear him out the frame, no doubt. Only Common and Aceyalone
ap> could serve her from what I've heard of her freeestyle. There may be
ap> others, but she is very good off the top.
He is no sexist at all. He made a clear distinction in that song between
"queens" and "bitches", although he concentrated on "Da Bichez." He showed
respect to the women he felt deserved it.
--- Ho...@Erebus.Magsystems.Com
~~~ Telegard v3.02/mL
--
Quizativ
Hello again...
> >Lauryn could do a song called "the bastards" or "the assholes"... and
she
> >would be talkign about those men who front on themsleves and don't
> respect
> >themselves, don't respect women and all that shit....
>
> Lauryn would NOT write a song like this because Lauryn puts thought into
> everything she writes. Jeru seemed to have wrote "Da Bytchez", IMO, while
> he was emotional about situations with *certain* females. A prophet
> doesn't get emotional when they're trying to impart words unto the
people.
> A true prophet always speaks from the higher moral ground, not from
> something as base as personal animosity.
I don't beleive Jeru is a "Prophet", true or fake. I never said he was.
So that renders this argument invalid. He's a human being, just like the
rest of us and therefore prone to being emotional about certain things.
>
> IMHO, the song Jeru wrote is sexist because the FOCUS of the song is on
> "Da Bythez".
If he was saying ALL women were 'bitches', then it WOULD be sexist. He is
not saying this, therefore it is not sexist.
>Quizativ, I believe you are the one that doesn't look much
> below the surface. If you did, you would see that what Jeru was saying
was
> the same as what Ice Cube was saying in "A Bitch Is a Bitch".
A bitch IS a bitch and a _queen is a queen_ ... a _lady_ is a _lady_.....
a _man is a man_ and a an _asshole is an asshole_. It all has to do with
me (and Jeru) being able to respect someone who respects themselves.
When I said you don't look below the surface, I meant that you wren't
seeing what Jeru was really saying in the song. I still don't think you
do.
>The
> essential point is men do not (and should *never* have) the right to
> categorize women, period. The simplistic division of women into either
> queens or bitches is ridiculously patriachal. This is an extension of the
> virgin/whore stereotype that has existed since Victorian times, but since
> you don't look below the surface, you can't see the underlying
patronizing
> tone of this philosophy ("do what I say makes you a queen or you are a
> bitch"). This is like saying "there are good black people and there are
> niggers". Don't you see how a white person saying that would be
> patronizing and racist? A man dividing women into two simple categories
is
> equally patronizing, and sexist. Women should have the right to define
> themselves rather than have their identities defined by men and, as
> complex human beings, women cannot be defined and divided into simple
> categories in any case. This is a classic case of patriachy. The male -
> who believes himself to be somehow wiser than the female (here, in the
> sense that Jeru names himself a "prophet") - tells her how she should act
> to be a "lady", implying that if she steps out of these boundaries she is
> less than moral and deserving of social ostracism or other ill treatment.
> A ridiculous, sexist presumption.
Nah man. I am not seeing it that way at all. Not because I don't
understand what you are saying. I just don't agree with it. I don't
think Jeru thinks he is "wiser than women". He probabaly think he's wiser
than just about everybody in general :) but that's besides the point.
I don't see a problem with my saying there are _good, moral, rightieous and
self respecting human beings_ and there are _low down, good for nothing,
stupid, self-involved, pathetic immoral human beings". Jeru is applying
this concept to women. He's not telling them how to act. He is
describing the type of women that he personally feels he can love ans
respect _as an equal individual_ who also EQUALLY respects him. It is
not "patriarchy" at work.... . No, women do not have to listen to what
he says, they don't have to be what he says they should be.... they are
welcome to dissrespect themselves.... but then they simply shouldn't demand
respect from those around them (other women OR men). It's logical.
It's all about respect for ouselves and one another. It's not sexist.
>
> >School's out. Time to go home for milk and cookies with ya moms....
> tell
> >her I'll call her on the weekend.
>
> This last statement is a personal attack that makes you look immature.
> Please refrain from such juvenile behavior.
Ummm.... why did you just attack me personally??? huh??? calling me
juvenile?!?... man... how childish of you
Hehehehe... man you just dont' have a sense of humour don't you. It
wasn't a personal attack... It was just illustrating in a humourous
fashion how I had just proved my point :) Sorry to 'throw you off'
like that... I didn't know you had such poor balance. ooooppps... ah
shit... was that personal attack... damn I must be a little kiddie....
everybody on this newsgroup thinks I'm a child now.... ah man
>
> PS: I feel that if Lauryn had a philosophical difference with Jeru, the
> rest of her crew (since they are tight like a family) would be able to
see
> eye to eye with that. After all, why would you all assume that Praz
> wouldn't be as offended by Jeru's sexism as Lauryn would be?
Hmmm. Ok good point. If the supposed sexism is in fact a factor in their
feuding (whcih I doubt) then you're right, there's no reason why the rest
of the crew wouldn't feel the same way as Lauryn does. I still maintian
that it's probabaly not a factor.
peace
quizativ
the rugged "child"
:)
Kate Holcomb
Here is what Jeru really says (or very close to it)
"I'm not talkin bout the queens, but.. what
the bitches
Not the young ladies, but.. what
the biches."
In no way does he talk shit about any other type of wome other than a
bitch.
These two artists, are the top two in rap today!!! No Shit!!!
Thes albums are all ya need!!
WIZE UP!!
DAN...@ykt0.attnet.or.jp
Sorry yo, I think Jeru can tap that ass when it comes to free style.
The kid is madd ill.. L boogie is ill too but i dont think she can take
that kid!!
APage20301
In article <3270A1...@uscub.colorado.edu>, Kate Holcomb
<kathryn...@uscub.colorado.edu> writes:
>In no way does he talk shit about any other type of wome other than a
>bitch.
>
>
Who gave him the right to call ANY woman a "bitch"? Who gave him the right
to judge, period? Jeru is NOT a prophet. He's a human being and he doesn't
have the right to judge or label anyone. Women cannot be divided into neat
categories of "bitches" and "queens" because women are three-dimensional
human beings, not the type of two-dimensional characters Jeru talks about
in "Da Bytchez". A woman that seems to be a "bitch" to Jeru may go home
and be a "queen" to her children or she may be a "queen" in the level of
her intellect. You can't judge people and say what they are arbitrarily
and Jeru certainly can't judge a whole section of the female population on
Earth ("all women with these qualities equals bitch") just because he's
met a few women who were less than genuine (And, again, they may "act like
bitches" to him, but be percieved as a queen by the next man - it's all in
the eyes of the beholder).
Working under Jeru's assertion that money hungry women are "bitches", I
argue that women who are money-hungry are trapped in the capitalist
mindstate, the same mindstate that many people in America are
unfortunately caught up within, i.e. materialism. Calling such women
"bitches" - if one assumes Jeru has the right to call anyone names - does
nothing to alleviate this widespread mindstate.
Besides that, Jeru's reasoning implies that any woman who Jeru considers
less than a queen is a bitch. This virgin/whore categorical division of
women is a ridiculous, patriarchial theory which should be left with the
other dead ideas of the America's (and the world's) sexist/racist past.
Alan
Redz
What would you rather have? A Prophet or a Profit?
-Redz
There's 2 sides to me one's slick & one's clever
When I see a fly girl, I put em both together
-My nigga 'Z'
Quizativ
Redz <to...@aol.com> wrote in article
<5557d7$l...@sparky.navsea.navy.mil>...
>
>
> What would you rather have? A Prophet or a Profit?
>
> -Redz
Hmmm.. that's tough one kid.... :)
peace
quiz
Quizativ
APage20301 <apage...@aol.com> wrote in article
<554kba$5...@newsbf02.news.aol.com>...
> In article <3270A1...@uscub.colorado.edu>, Kate Holcomb
> <kathryn...@uscub.colorado.edu> writes:
>
> >In no way does he talk shit about any other type of wome other than a
> >bitch.
> >
> >
>
> Who gave him the right to call ANY woman a "bitch"? Who gave him the
right
> to judge, period? Jeru is NOT a prophet. He's a human being and he
doesn't
He gave himself the right. HE as an individual in this existance has the
right. The only thing he can be absolutly sure of is that he exists
somehow, and that he has the ability and need to somehow establish where
he stands in the world and to put certain things around him into logical
perspective.
> have the right to judge or label anyone. Women cannot be divided into
neat
> categories of "bitches" and "queens" because women are three-dimensional
> human beings, not the type of two-dimensional characters Jeru talks about
> in "Da Bytchez". A woman that seems to be a "bitch" to Jeru may go home
> and be a "queen" to her children or she may be a "queen" in the level of
> her intellect.
>You can't judge people and say what they are arbitrarily
> and Jeru certainly can't judge a whole section of the female population
on
> Earth ("all women with these qualities equals bitch") just because he's
> met a few women who were less than genuine (And, again, they may "act
like
> bitches" to him, but be percieved as a queen by the next man - it's all
in
> the eyes of the beholder).
So she's a so-called "queen" to her kids. She's a bitch to Jeru, so she
shouldn't complain if Jeru then calls her that. If she's using him for
his papes, or whatever, she's being a bitch to him. That's what counts,
_to him_. So he wrote a song about it.
(BTW I suppose if everything is in the "eye of the beholder", Hitler on
one hand was a real nice guy and he did a lot of real nice things for his
people. ... yeah kid... "the eye of the beholder".... you're right
.....right... sure... nobody has the right to pass judgment.... ok....)
Now, I refuse to accept the posibitly of a "queen of intellect" stooping to
the levels of disrespecting her fellow human beings. If one is truly an
intellectual "queen", you/she would surely realize the irrationality of
such actions. Treating one's brother or sister in an devious and "evil"
manner is not a sign of true righteousness, which would be a necessary
quality for "queen".
Still you say, I'm still "classifying women"... yeah, no kidding. Of
course I am. Everything in this world is much more complicated that is
seems. We reduce almost everything into simplistic terms in order to make
sense of it all. That's a natural human trait. If we were to take into
account all causes and dimensions relating to every part of our lives we
would hardly be able to get past the idea of what it means to wake up in
the morning let alone be able to establish our identity's and our
relationships with other people and things in the world. So, yes, women
are very complicated and multidimensional, as are men, as are weather
patterns, as is almost everything. But, for example, we need to be able to
establish that a black bear is a potential threat when we run across one in
the woods. Before it's about to claw us to death, we don't sit there
trying to convince ourselves that we shouldn't judge the bear as being
'bad' because it is a multi-dimensional creature with a complete variety of
complex characteristics which cause it to react certain ways in certain
situations. No, we go "oh shit"... "that's a black bear", "Black bears
can dangerous", "I better warn people that there's a black bear around"...
"but first I have to establish how I'm going to get out of it's clutches".
Understand?
> Working under Jeru's assertion that money hungry women are "bitches", I
> argue that women who are money-hungry are trapped in the capitalist
> mindstate, the same mindstate that many people in America are
> unfortunately caught up within, i.e. materialism. Calling such women
> "bitches" - if one assumes Jeru has the right to call anyone names - does
> nothing to alleviate this widespread mindstate.
Capatalism does not mean disrespect your brother in mankind and use him for
his money. Jeru attacks that unfortunate root of modern society, the
terrible foundation of materialism. HE attacks this reality NON-STOP.
Part of his attack focusses on the women who find themselves trapped by it.
Their actions when caught by this tool of the devil in in Jeru's mind are
the actions of a "bitch". He's striving to defeat "ignorance" and to try
and get through to these women caught your so-called "mindstate" (which
sounds more like an excuse for these people more than anything else).
You sound like you're excusing un-righteous, materialistic behaviour, it's
like you're saying "it's ok", we have no right to say it's not. BUT ....
see.....I beleive we do.
>
> Besides that, Jeru's reasoning implies that any woman who Jeru considers
> less than a queen is a bitch. This virgin/whore categorical division of
> women is a ridiculous, patriarchial theory which should be left with the
> other dead ideas of the America's (and the world's) sexist/racist past.
>
You're so caught up in attacking modern western (patriarchal, capalist)
society that you fail to realise the even deeper ideas that lie behind it.
Ignorance is the real problem. Jeru has set out to "seek" knowledge,
build "wisdom" and destroy "ignorance" (the very thing which is the
foundation for the all societal "ideals" or rather 'ills' which you are
complaining about). Ignorance causes sexism. Ignorance causes racism.
Ignorance causes materialism, Ignorance prevents the acheivement of
absolute righteousness. _Ignorance_, my friend, it's all based on
ignorance. If you really understand Jeru, and you really understand what
he means in his song, you understand this.
I doubt you will see the light... and you will probabaly continue to argue
with me. But I hope there are others out there who see what I'm trying
to get at...
The basis for my argument is described roughly as...
A women or man who disrespects his or her equal counterpart in humanity, in
search of the releif of things like 'lust', 'greed' or 'revenge', likely
does so in _ignorance_ of the _true implications_ of his or her actions.
They contribute to the 'greater evil' rather of the 'greater good' and are
not to mention ignoring the simple fact that "what goes around comes around
twice as hard on Judgement Day"...
Anybody agree? Disagree?
peace
quizativ
Sun Spark -- Seventh Dimenshun
APage20301 (apage...@aol.com) wrote:
: Jeru take out Lauryn?? HAhhahahah. Lauryn's freestyle is 500 times better
: than Jeru's freestyle. She would punish him. And I like Jeru. The reason
: for the beef IMO is because Jeru is a sexist MF who dissed sisters with
: that song "The Bytches". So Lauryn probably wants to get at him anyway.
: She would tear him out the frame, no doubt. Only Common and Aceyalone
: could serve her from what I've heard of her freeestyle. There may be a few
: others, but she is very good off the top.
: Out.
: Alan
Yea .. there is no question that jeru cant freestyle.. but yo.. my man
APATHY and SUPERNATURAL from ALIEN NATION would serve LAUREN up on a
thanksgiving platter. But see JERU never dissed Sistas on the song "da
Bitchez" tell me.. HAVE U EVER HEARD THAT SONG?? that song is dissin those
hoes who are only out for the dough. The song starts off liek this " A
queen is a queen, and a stunt is a stunt" now tell me who is he dissin??
peace
SuN SpArK
METRO 1
Sun Spark -- Seventh Dimenshun <suns...@newshost.li.net> wrote in article
<55bhf7$o...@linet06.li.net>...
> APage20301 (apage...@aol.com) wrote:
> : Jeru take out Lauryn?? HAhhahahah. Lauryn's freestyle is 500 times
better
> : than Jeru's freestyle. She would punish him. And I like Jeru. The
reason
> : for the beef IMO is because Jeru is a sexist MF who dissed sisters with
> : that song "The Bytches". So Lauryn probably wants to get at him anyway.
> : She would tear him out the frame, no doubt. Only Common and Aceyalone
> : could serve her from what I've heard of her freeestyle. There may be a
few
> : others, but she is very good off the top.
>
> : Out.
>
> : Alan
how in the HELL can say that lauryn is nice off the top. she comes with
crazy writtens and uses her album lyrics, too. ive seen three shows with
the fugees live and she "freestyled" the same each time. even on that mtv
(my brother was watchin and i just happen to be there, honest) award show
she came with the writtens.
im out -
METRO!
Layaway059
I LOVE JERU. He is the only one in Hip-Hop today that will voice his
opinion about other rappers and the shit they do. On his new album he
disses FOXY, PUFFY, The FUGEES. Everything he raps about on the new album
is totally true and he doesnt give a shit who he disses. All of those
rappers i just mentioned are THE ONES corrupting hip-hop today. Sorry, i
left out Lil' Kim. hehehehehe
My Damn 2 Cents!!
