Dream: "The Urinating Dog"
*Hemidactylus*
living room carpet and over the kitchen tile and started peeing. I
yelled and she stopped, but not until after leaving a large puddle. I
proceeded to soak it up with paper towels. The odd thing in this dream
was tht the carpet was a dark bluish color, where my carpet is
actually not that color.
Does this relate to my being stuck in the perennial adolescent stage,
like the typical American, Mats?
*Hemidactylus*
not.
The obvious is that I consciously know that dogs drink water and
eventually, like other mammals with kidneys and a bladder, need to
relieve themselves. One hopes this will occur when they are outside,
but perhaps I harbor a deep unconscious fear that my dog will go on my
carpet. Accidents do happen. This may be a matter of deep seated
anxiety, like the test anxiety dreams.
But then maybe I can turn to Jung for answers. In MDR_ he talks of a
disturbing thought he struggled with where God sits upon a throne and
releases a turd upon a cathedral. Maybe my dream, as the anti-Jung, is
a total inversion of Jung's disturbing thought. Instead of God it is
my dog. God is male, my dog is female. And the body function is
different although she could have puked instead. And my dream lacks a
cathedral, which is is telling, since I never attend church. It is
merely a relatively bare floor that she does the bad deed upon
instead. Maybe its a corrective for my radical materialism.
Or going even deeper maybe the floor is a metaphor (or metafloor). The
floor represents Jung's psychodynamic system. The structure of the
psyche is represented as the borderline between the carpet and tile.
The tile is the thin veneer of the personal unconscious. The carpet is
the collective unconscious. The carpet has two layers, the upper
fabric itself represents the epigenetic layer and the padding beneath
is the more archaic genetic layer. That the carpet is blue may be that
it represents the deep blue sea, wich is a metaphor for the unconcious
depths.
My dog is my doppelganger, in some ways my opposite, playing wild
Enkidu to my civilized Gilgamesh out to slay Humbaba. Or she is my
anima. Or she is my angel of wrath sent as a Destroyer against the
Jungian system. But she causes more lasting damage to the carpet than
the tile, which is easily cleaned. I actively wipe up with paper
towels, which represent my critical thoughts, which are more able to
spare the complex theory than the archetypes. As absorbent as the
sheets are, the CU could not be spared.
Trinacrium
Mats will be pleased to know I reversed Gilgamesh and Enkidu in a
previous post, actually a previous incarnation.
My understanding of your dream is when you're peed on by an animal,
that is a good thing.
Ron
Trinacrium
elephant. A lot of people drawn to Jung dream in alchemical symbols. I
think you may be there. Mats, too, but his dreams are fabrications.
There's a difference. The blue carpet would indicate the unconscious.
The tile floor is a blockage possibly, a contrast between the two. A
blockage would be the ego lapsing partially into the anima.
Can you believe someone citing Time Magazine as an authority?
Ron
M Winther
This dream is proper for a person on an unrefined spiritual level,
yes. That's why you repeatedly dream that you must catch up on your
studies in the seat of learning. Such dreams, pointing at the
refinement of spiritual consciousness, are the workings of Ternarius.
Your dog dream was perhaps kindled by my saying that you should stop
barking up the wrong tree, etc. To me, discussion groups are public
spheres. Everytime I go out on the Internet, it's like going outdoors.
One doesn't break a wind or take a pee in the public. But many people
seem to think that they are still in their own living room. They
behave like ill-mannered dogs, peeing on the carpet.
The dark blue carpet, then, represents an outdoor "space", namely
"cyberspace". After all, this cyberspace reaches directly into
people's living rooms, and that's probably why they are still,
mentally, inside their own home. After all, we remain Stone Age
people, and it's not easy to comprehend, emotionally and with our
instincts, that when we position ourselves on that dark blue door in
the living room, then we are suddenly among peers in the outside
world.
This ill-mannered demeanour, then, partly deriving from the stupid
instinctual dog inside man, tends to spread from cyberspace onto the
kitchen tiles. This means that ill manner on the Internet would tend
to infect also personal life. Comparatively, John Cleese started to
behave in private life like he behaved in Faulty Towers. His wife left
him, and he had to attend psychotherapy to get back on the tracks
again (I can't vouch for it, it's only what I heard).
Mats Winther
cog...@stanford.edu
wrote:
> Den 2007-12-09 21:37:10 skrev *Hemidactylus* <ecph...@hotmail.com>:
>
> > I had a strange dream last night. My dog squatted halfway over the
> > living room carpet and over the kitchen tile and started peeing. I
> > yelled and she stopped, but not until after leaving a large puddle. I
> > proceeded to soak it up with paper towels. The odd thing in this dream
> > was tht the carpet was a dark bluish color, where my carpet is
> > actually not that color.
> >
> > Does this relate to my being stuck in the perennial adolescent stage,
> > like the typical American, Mats?
> >
Your instinct(your dog) is peeing on your thinking function(blue carpet)
and your sensation function(kitchen floor). The dreams say what they
mean and mean what they say. The amplification tends toward ego
inflation.
*Hemidactylus*
> In article <opt23zpigs3bzrao@kalroten>, "M Winther" <m...@swipnet.se>
> wrote:
>
> > Den 2007-12-09 21:37:10 skrev *Hemidactylus* <ecpho...@hotmail.com>:
>
> > > I had a strange dream last night. My dog squatted halfway over the
> > > living room carpet and over the kitchen tile and started peeing. I
> > > yelled and she stopped, but not until after leaving a large puddle. I
> > > proceeded to soak it up with paper towels. The odd thing in this dream
> > > was tht the carpet was a dark bluish color, where my carpet is
> > > actually not that color.
>
> > > Does this relate to my being stuck in the perennial adolescent stage,
> > > like the typical American, Mats?
>
> Your instinct(your dog) is peeing on your thinking function(blue carpet)
> and your sensation function(kitchen floor). The dreams say what they
> mean and mean what they say. The amplification tends toward ego
> inflation.
>
is just a floor. Maybe my dog, symbolizing my dog, really had to go,
symbolizing a natural body function.
What manifests is manifest. Nothing is latent.
Isabella
on the border - the line between unconscious and conscious. A dog is loyal,
it is instinct and sensing - it can relate to that aspect of you and
indicate it is bottled up and needs to spill over so that this aspect is
more integrated in your conscious/unconscious. You yelled at the dog to
stop, but it was already too late and you were left to clean up the mess.
Generally, you have a set schedule for your dog walking, as most people -
but this aspect of you does not operate under a set schedule, you have to
pay attention to it, be more in tune with it - it will come out anyway, but
you will be forced to deal with it instead of paying attention all along.
Isabella
"*Hemidactylus*" <ecph...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:25b6400e-365d-4bac...@s12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
M Winther
> Dark blue reminds me of water, the unconscious, and your dog was urinating
> on the border - the line between unconscious and conscious. A dog is loyal,
> it is instinct and sensing - it can relate to that aspect of you and
> indicate it is bottled up and needs to spill over so that this aspect is
> more integrated in your conscious/unconscious. You yelled at the dog to
> stop, but it was already too late and you were left to clean up the mess.
> Generally, you have a set schedule for your dog walking, as most people -
> but this aspect of you does not operate under a set schedule, you have to
> pay attention to it, be more in tune with it - it will come out anyway, but
> you will be forced to deal with it instead of paying attention all along.
>
> Isabella
>
No, it means that he urinated on *my* carpet. My living room carpet is
actually blue! The dream says that he is behaving like an incontinent dog.
Mats
Trinacrium
> Den 2007-12-13 02:01:02 skrev Isabella <isabellari...@comcast.net>:
>
> > Dark blue reminds me of water, the unconscious, and your dog was urinating
> > on the border - the line between unconscious and conscious. A dog is loyal,
> > it is instinct and sensing - it can relate to that aspect of you and
> > indicate it is bottled up and needs to spill over so that this aspect is
> > more integrated in your conscious/unconscious. You yelled at the dog to
> > stop, but it was already too late and you were left to clean up the mess.
> > Generally, you have a set schedule for your dog walking, as most people -
> > but this aspect of you does not operate under a set schedule, you have to
> > pay attention to it, be more in tune with it - it will come out anyway, but
> > you will be forced to deal with it instead of paying attention all along.
>
> > Isabella
>
> No, it means that he urinated on *my* carpet. My living room carpet is
> actually blue! The dream says that he is behaving like an incontinent dog.
>
> Mats
>
>
>
> >news:25b6400e-365d-4bac...@s12g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> >> I had a strange dream last night. My dog squatted halfway over the
> >> living room carpet and over the kitchen tile and started peeing. I
> >> yelled and she stopped, but not until after leaving a large puddle. I
> >> proceeded to soak it up with paper towels. The odd thing in this dream
> >> was tht the carpet was a dark bluish color, where my carpet is
> >> actually not that color.
>
> >> Does this relate to my being stuck in the perennial adolescent stage,
> >> like the typical American, Mats?
A blue floor is the unconscious. Your dream author chose that for your
consumption, not a blue pool, pond or ocean for a reason. The dream
author uses perennial symbols. Mats knows this. He's joshin' ya. The
dog clearly represents Mats, peeing on your floors, holding you back
in your progress. This is the war between the US and Sweden. On a
serious note, almost anything having to do with this group will relate
to ego inflation. I look forward to seeing more from Stanford, from
Mats too. He doesn't post here as often as he should, I think we all
agree.
But I'd pay close attention to Isabella.
Rons
*Hemidactylus*
interpretation and symbology. People are all over the place on this.
Sometimes a dog is just a dog and a floor is just a floor. At best it
may be an anxiety of mine that my dog will soil the carpet and this
scenario was explored by my psyche. No archetypes need apply. Sure
dogs and humans have been pals for quite a while, but I could have
just as easily dreamt a cat peed on my rug. A I suppose my dog must be
dreaming stuffbased on her little wold view too, maybe chasing me
around the house demanding jerky treats or something. Is this a
reflection of her doggy CU producing an archetype of the unrespondent
owner. Over the miilenia dogs have hd the constant expriences of
humans not giving them treats when they want them. Ths exprience has
imprinted itself on the canine psyche andis expressed in nighly dreams
where the pooch must chase their owner in a futile effort to fork it
over...that dog biscuit dammit. Sometimes obstacles are placed in
their way like hissing cats and fire hydrants.
Those are cadidates for two more archetypes, the hissing cat and the
fire hydrant. If a dog squints really hard it might see a tube
projecting from the hydrant. This tube vision compels me to look for
medieval symbols of the great phallus hydrant.
Isabella
Isabella
"M Winther" <ml...@swipnet.se> wrote in message
news:opt29okonq3bzrao@kalroten...
Trinacrium
In all seriousness, there is a proper interpretation of this dream.
Isabella and I came up with similar symbols for the blue carpet. Dream
interpretations can begin with one meaning and end with another
meaning. Symbols may be that a blue carpet is your unconscious one
moment, then the shadow of the unconscious the next.
The symbol is more a tour guide than a set sign. If you look at the
symbol as a stop sign, that's about all you're going to get out of it
and it's usually is a sign of some resistance. And I know it's tough.
You have these ancient alchemical symbols in front of you and you
can't make sense of them because of the temporal associations, the way
a dream communicates its message, and there's always rationalization
when the meaning doesn't come through.
The dog is a symbol of faithfulness and therefore related to clergy.
He indicates a way for you to follow, as the flock follows the dog,
the congregation follows the priest. In this case, he's giving you two
options. The urine is a penetrating substance, therefore an alchemical
substance.
The dog has a long association with the process of transformation. The
substance he leaves seeks. It's holy water.
You've had questions in this forum about church. There's a conflict.
You don't want to waste your time in a fundamentalist church. There's
distrust but also attraction. When you say, maybe a cigar is just a
cigar, that's your own appeal to fundamentalism.
Science is a fundamentalist religion. There, a cigar is just a cigar.
Those with strong scientific backgrounds want exactness. The tile
floor symbolizes the conflict. You can either, fall into the abyss of
the unconscious and experience suffering, or you can subscribe to a
simpler view, something that doesn't go beyond the floor. That's the
safety and efficiency of a church. You don't have to worry about all
this except on Sundays.
My experience with this Jungian thing, you don't make the choice,
you're somehow chosen. It's difficult to impossible to shake off once
begun.
Cues for individuation are both inside and outside. Does the
unconscious know the difference? Every sense perception, whether in a
dream or waking is pregnant with messages.
In my case, if I bicycle west of my house, it's like opening one of my
wife's native dreams, rich with Native American symbols, coyotes,
hawks scooping up plentiful endangered species, rattlers, deer, elk,
and rabbits. It's a sort of Cheyenne vision quest.
Rons
M Winther
>>
> I think this thread points to deep seated flaws in dream
> interpretation and symbology. People are all over the place on this.
> Sometimes a dog is just a dog and a floor is just a floor. At best it
> may be an anxiety of mine that my dog will soil the carpet and this
> scenario was explored by my psyche. No archetypes need apply. Sure
> dogs and humans have been pals for quite a while, but I could have
> just as easily dreamt a cat peed on my rug. A I suppose my dog must be
> dreaming stuffbased on her little wold view too, maybe chasing me
> around the house demanding jerky treats or something. Is this a
> reflection of her doggy CU producing an archetype of the unrespondent
> owner. Over the miilenia dogs have hd the constant expriences of
> humans not giving them treats when they want them. Ths exprience has
> imprinted itself on the canine psyche andis expressed in nighly dreams
> where the pooch must chase their owner in a futile effort to fork it
> over...that dog biscuit dammit. Sometimes obstacles are placed in
> their way like hissing cats and fire hydrants.
>
> Those are cadidates for two more archetypes, the hissing cat and the
> fire hydrant. If a dog squints really hard it might see a tube
> projecting from the hydrant. This tube vision compels me to look for
> medieval symbols of the great phallus hydrant.
>
There is a slang expression in American English (Jung, by the way,
loved American slang) namely "pissing around" or "pissing about". The
dog in your dream is pissing around. It portrays what you are doing.
And that's why you try to put some effort in the rapid human evolution
thread. At least, it's a try.
Mats
M Winther
>
> A blue floor is the unconscious. Your dream author chose that for your
> consumption, not a blue pool, pond or ocean for a reason. The dream
> author uses perennial symbols. Mats knows this. He's joshin' ya. The
> dog clearly represents Mats, peeing on your floors, holding you back
> in your progress. This is the war between the US and Sweden. On a
> serious note, almost anything having to do with this group will relate
> to ego inflation. I look forward to seeing more from Stanford, from
> Mats too. He doesn't post here as often as he should, I think we all
> agree.
> But I'd pay close attention to Isabella.
>
> Rons
>
You are projecting your own ego inflation on members of this group. If
you're so in love with Isabella, which you repeat again and again, I
advice you to subscribe to Yahoo group "Gospel of Thomas" where she
rules supreme. It's like a pack of dogs endlessly pissing around. Get a
glimpse of hell, and what awaits you in the afterworld if you aren't
good.
Mats
*Hemidactylus*
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surstr%C3%B6mming
I like a little fish sauce when I'm eating Thai or Malaysian dood, but
that picture in the wiki article looks like a bait bucket. I have this
mental images of cans of rotting fish exploding coating people with
stench. It that an accurate depiction of Swedih culture?
If you're going to criticize other countries, you might make sure you
get your own in order first.
M Winther
Yes, I and many Swedes eat it nowadays as a special treat once a
year. It must be eaten with mandel (almond) potatoes and tunnbröd
(a very thin soft white bread), and schnapps. Surströmming (sour
herring) is subjected to the same fermenting(?) process as
sauerkraut. It's very, very tasty.
Mats
*Hemidactylus*
boat. I enjoy seaweed as do many Asian peoples. Pressed laver is good
as is seaweed salad.
Surstromming strikes me as what remains in a bait bucket after a
weekend of fishing in the hot sun.
I also like kimchi much better than sauerkraut.
Doesn't it strike you that Europeans and Asians:
1. Pickle cabbage (sauerkraut and kimchi).
2. Like fermented fish.
3. Eat seaweed.
Not all that different really.
Trinacrium
I have your dream pictured in my mind as an alchemical woodcut. On the
left is the impenetrable tile floor. On the right is the soft blue
carpet. Between these two is your dog. Visible on the tile is a
puddle, on the blue floor a dark spot. The dog says you can go either
way. It's your choice.
And I think it's obvious to anyone, given the level of emotion, from
the words chosen, the only one projecting anything on this site is
young Mats.
However, in a formal act of empathy toward this poor soul (small dog
run over by a bus) I have legally changed my name.
There's no absolute authority here. Isabella has much to offer. She
has the dream insights Mats is missing. I think it's obvious Mats is
weak on dreams. He's turned Jung into the tile side where there's no
access to his unconscious. To Mats, Jung is just a cigar.
But he's good for some things. I'd like to check out the Gospel
according to Thomas where Isabella does good work apparently and Mats
is jealous out of mind.
Rons
Isabella
where you make up a saying that was never in the Gospel of Thomas replacing
the actual last saying in Thomas - now that's inflation. It is with this
that you visited the Thomas list. I only wonder if you also like to rewrite
any other gospels - for instance, let's start with the canonical gospels and
your rewrite of those.
Isabella
"M Winther" <ml...@swipnet.se> wrote in message
news:opt3bbfwcg3bzrao@kalroten...
*Hemidactylus*
> Speaking of ego inflation, your post "logion 114" directly above this thread
> where you make up a saying that was never in the Gospel of Thomas replacing
> the actual last saying in Thomas - now that's inflation. It is with this
> that you visited the Thomas list. I only wonder if you also like to rewrite
> any other gospels - for instance, let's start with the canonical gospels and
> your rewrite of those.
>
M Winther
> Speaking of ego inflation, your post "logion 114" directly above this thread
> where you make up a saying that was never in the Gospel of Thomas replacing
> the actual last saying in Thomas - now that's inflation. It is with this
> that you visited the Thomas list. I only wonder if you also like to rewrite
> any other gospels - for instance, let's start with the canonical gospels and
> your rewrite of those.
>
> Isabella
>
>
>
>
That little mistake is because scholars say that logion 114 doesn't
belong in the gospel, it was added to the Gospel of Thomas only at a
relatively late stage. It speaks of a transformation of the female
into the male, of a kind that occurs in numerous gnostic ascetic
texts. Because of this I had removed 114 from my harddisk version.
But in the next message I instead used 115 for my fake logion.
So it's not due to ego inflation, and you know this because I've
already explained this to you. So this accusation gives a fine
portrayal of your personality. It's not a beautiful sight. Long ago I
saw, in the dream, the members of the group in the shape of vases
and urns in a moonlit room. One of them, a female, was particularly
beautiful; a semi-transparent slender vase in bluish colour with a
rare form to its neck. Some people have a beautiful soul, and it is
striking how certain women wholly lack interest in this aspect of
beauty. It seems like you have no qualms of exposing your awful
ugliness in the public. It strikes me as very odd while women are
generally much occupied by beauty.
Mats
Isabella
> Den 2007-12-15 05:15:19 skrev Isabella <isabel...@comcast.net>:
> That little mistake is because scholars say that logion 114 doesn't
> belong in the gospel, it was added to the Gospel of Thomas only at a
> relatively late stage. It speaks of a transformation of the female
> into the male, of a kind that occurs in numerous gnostic ascetic
> texts. Because of this I had removed 114 from my harddisk version.
> But in the next message I instead used 115 for my fake logion.
The truth is, that there are some scholars that said it might have been
added, this by no means is a fact - doesn't matter - you still wrote your
own, whatever you number it.
>
> So it's not due to ego inflation, and you know this because I've
> already explained this to you. So this accusation gives a fine
> portrayal of your personality.
Actually, the very fact that you would do this speaks volumes to me, that's
what I already know.
It's not a beautiful sight. Long ago I
> saw, in the dream, the members of the group in the shape of vases
> and urns in a moonlit room. One of them, a female, was particularly
> beautiful; a semi-transparent slender vase in bluish colour with a
> rare form to its neck. Some people have a beautiful soul, and it is
> striking how certain women wholly lack interest in this aspect of
> beauty. It seems like you have no qualms of exposing your awful
> ugliness in the public. It strikes me as very odd while women are
> generally much occupied by beauty.
That's just special.
Isabella
Isabella
The new Wisconsin slogan.
Isabella
p.b
> loved American slang)
Who told you that?
The words related to "mom"....yep ok...:-)
pieter
M Winther
I got that from JB Wheelwright in a filmed interview when he told
about his encounters with Jung. Jung protested when he said he
had decided to become an analyst.
Mats
p.b
What has that to do with slang?
Carl Jung was several times in the US but was not fond of it and you exactly
why :-)
The dominance of the mother (compensations) in society was his biggest
problem.
with America.
The little tricks of changing the archetype of the mother into the archetype
of the hero
(hero is no archetype but an image, lol)
He loved to speak English and loved Harris Tweed from England.
greetings,
pieter
M Winther
Yes, he was very fond of the English and he clad like an Englishman. Jung
used American slang in his conversations with Wheelwright. He said
"..I'll bet!..", etc., when Wheelwright tried to convince him that his decision
to become an analyst was the real thing for him (patient always want to
become analysts, Jung complained). Jung was very much into the
spontaneous expression of the unconscious, and he tried to be
spontaneous himself.
Mats
p.b
The way you speak about Jung gives me the impression that he is the father
you never had.
This point you never makes clear in your comments so maybe you are not aware
of it.
If you not aware of it, it gives kind of inflation in your comments :-)
greetings,
pieter
M Winther
In what way have I elevated Jung in my latest comments? What is it in
my comments that points at ego-inflation? Why is it that each other person
in discussion groups are impertinent nitwits like you?
Mats
p.b
> in discussion groups are impertinent nitwits like you?
>
> Mats
This sentence is not reacting on my content...that's called inflation....:-)
Why you are not reacting on that part of the father?
You're not serious...you are creating "cult"....for what reason?
pieter
M Winther
Your English is hard to understand. You asked me where I got the
idea that Jung loved American slang. I answered that Wheelwright
said so in a filmed interview and he gave an example. Why do you
such great problems with tjhis trivial information? I am not creating
"cult". In fact, I have written a critique of Jung, in my "Dependency"
article. It is you who overestimate yourself, thnking that you can pin
people down after hearing a few sentences.
Mats