Frogs Of War Loose
Eagal
WAS PREDICTED BY NOSTRADAMUS AS OPENING SALVO:
Expanding the prior post ("3 Planes: As 3 Brothers And 3 Frogs!"),
so this is the third, most complete version, concentrating on specific
astrological cues to the timing of the WTC attack, all of which had
been discussed in detail during the months prior...
{For newcomers, dabblers, and those expecting a single quatrain to
have all the answers, or to find someone who has perfect knowledge
and deify them, look elsewhere. You will not find your simple-minded
solutions here. My work is about immersion, investigation, postulating
and testing, revising and persevering. If you have not been aware of
my efforts, this is not my concern. Someone has posted a link to a
site where I'd contributed to a forum on X.72 between August and
October '99: most of what I wrote still holds, except for the third
line interpretation, which underwent a transformation on a.p.n after
I used V.86 to predict something in the water off NYC 31 Oct [EgyptAir
990], then accomplished the "October translation" of Angolmois as
Angol month, a month for which the Anglos have a special name - at
first thought November as Blood/Wind month, then found January 2000
as Wolf Month, and its King the lunar eclipse the 21st, revived from
the cryptic murdering of your only son [Moon is sole satellite] while
making a vow to Venus [VIII.32], which was probably in V.72 [Venus
in a course so virtuous as to becloud whole quality of Sun - Venus
had no aspects for a long period during conjunct of Sun and Mercury].}
While many of the conditions I had expected to attend a major tragic
incident prevailed at the time of the WTC attack, I had abandoned a
daily calculation which would have pinpointed the onset due to the
discovery of an even more ominous configuration 9 June 2002, and felt
it would weaken the impact of my message to continue unsuccessfully
identifying intervening critical periods, though often my precise
comments appeared to coincide with events in the immediate future
with a specificity and synchronicity defying mere chance. Often I
found myself being drawn into ridiculous debates over some innocuous
statements of fact by the "resident expert" Peter Lemesurier, and
vindicated ultimately by repeated fulfillments of my arguments via
news events transpiring during our interchanges. I did manage, also,
to make the warnings from the final lines of X.45 and VIII.72 as my
final commentary weeks prior, which turn out to be integrated with
the catastrophic prophecies considered in an unexpected manner, with
each piece of the puzzle providing an encapsulated view of the tragedy
by illuminating distinct aspects, and utilizing parallel metaphors.
Looking at the chart 11 September 2001 for NYC at 8:48am EDT (time
and place of the first terrorist jet crash), the Moon was 28,06'
Gemini, VOID OF COURSE after having made its last aspect with JUNO,
heading towards lead planet MARS aspect: this was defined as a DARK
TEMPLE, nullifying the Juno-Mars characters. Also, there were many
oppositions set up: Mars opp Moon & Node; Venus opp Uranus; Pluto
opp Saturn & Vesta; Jupiter opp Ceres. My major premise was that
Mercury would be conjunct the Ascendant when the explosion of VI.97
took place, and that coincides so precisely with the first crash
there is no question it could be a predicted timing cue fulfilled
horribly.
It was settled on a.p.n that X.17's Angouleme, from which lamentable
cries are heard, could indeed be NYC, since it was Verrazano's
original name for the region, to honor that French noble family:
X.17's first part is cryptic, though I related the wretched maid's
yearning enclosed in the stomach as a famine of Eucharist in the Holy
Land; line 3 has the Angouleme wailing, and it ends -
Et au germain mariage forclos
And to the germane marriage foreclosure
This is NOT a marriage of first cousins, but the "pertinent or
relevant" (the coinciding basic meaning of germain at its root)
union of Mercury and the Ascendant (as revealed elsewhere); the
foreclosure means that it was held exclusively (my own theory),
dealt with in advance (a daily calculation made for a year prior),
and precluded (by my own termination of the process before it
actualized). And I would interpret the word "cousine" in line 2
of X.35 as "comrade or counterpart," rendering -
Puine royal flagrant d'ardent libide
Pour se jouir de cousine germaine;
Habit de femme au temple a'Arthemide,
Allant meurtri par inconnu du Maine.
Puny royal flagrant in ardent lust
To enjoy his pertinent counterpart;
Habit of women at the temple of Artemis,
Going to be murdered by the unconsidered one of Maine.
The "puny royal" is Mercury, tiny planet near the Sun, and line 2
indicates the Mercury-Ascendant conjunct event will occur, suggesting
burning lust as for consummating a first-cousin marriage; but I
submit the latter part, while refering the lunar temple concept I
developed, has not yet occurred since it involves the mystical
childbirth by the character already identified as Vesta - she should
be the "Reine Ergaste," or Queen in Labor, of X.17, her child being
the true flame of VI.19 which will engulf the lady who would put
the Innocents to the fire. Scripture requires manifestation of some
unquenchable fire as the major event, which the nightmarish scenario
recently undergone does not fulfill, though the sites are still
smoldering. Had the assault on the WTC occurred during a war, it
would have been considered a war crime, since attacks on civilians
violate the international rules of war - perhaps this is why V.19
prefaced its opening of war through "jeune" by saying, "Broken the
pact." I doubt Maine is a reference to the ship whose destruction
fomented the Spanish-American War...
For the void of course Moon we have I.62 predicting a great loss
before the lunar cycle is perfected - "What will become of the letters!"
he wrote, as we've seen papers scattered over miles from ground zero;
and III.97, where the first part was related to the change in papal
law 22 Nov '99 wherein Masses ceased in the Holy Land (what Jesus
indicated as signal for Tribulation to commence - the same abomination
of desolation Daniel prophesied which later arose under Antiochus IV
Epiphanes "standing in the holy place"), the latter portion predicts
the great barbarian empire to be corrupted before the lunar cycle
is determined. Void of course temples are designated black, as in
VI.16 -
Les noirs du temple du lieu de Negrisilve
Feront auberge et feu de Lombardie
The black ones of the temple in the place of the Black Forest
Will make a tavern and hearth of Lombardy
Lombardy related to Pope St. Pius V 30 April, another time Mars was
lead planet when the Los Alamos fire raged (using V.42 "les Allobrox"):
so the real forest fire appears a cozily controlled blaze compared
to the life-obliterating events at the WTC - so what N. really meant
by line 1 was a place seeming like a forest of blackened "silver"
(the English equivalent combined with translation), i.e., the attack
site of mangled, scorched metal.
Unfortunately, after I had deciphered VI.10's first two lines as
relating to a period of alternating valid and null temples following
the coloring of pacts (VII.18) [explained as gag order imposed on
foreign planned parenthood clinics], after two such periods were
analyzed in the proper timeframe the effort was discontinued. If
only I had figured out line 3's "Rouges et jaunes," I might have
settled on 11 September had I gotten to Francois 1er's birthday as
pivotal: "Red's and yellow's" I thought, adding apostrophes for
possession, indicating a temple pair - but I determined yellow could
either be Jupiter (Mars, Jupiter in VI.35) or Juno (close to the
written "jaune" and fitting with war opened through "jeune" in V.19).
The latter turned out to be correct, but as stated the calculations
were halted after discovery of the later Sun-Saturn-Node phenomenon.
Rouges et jaunes leur embleront les leurs,
Sang, terre, peste, faim, feu d'eau affollee
Red's and Juno's will carry theirs off from them,
Blood, dirt, plague, hunger, fire appeased by water
Those carried off in line 3 are the innummerable deceased victims;
line 4 hints that some future horror may involve fire that cannot
be extinguished with water. If this is the war-stirring Three Frog
scenario fomenting Revelation's Battle of Armageddon, further and
more incredible cataclysms may await: I.91 tells us while it will
appear to the mortals they are the authors of a great conflict, the
deity plans a greater affliction unbeknownst to either side.
It appears we have entered the period revealed to George Washington
via an oft-reported vision known as "America's Third Crisis," an
episode in national history whose scope will dwarf both the War of
Independence and the War Between the States. It will be a period
of tribulation, and the Union may have to deal with more enemies
than one would expect, but ultimately it will not be destroyed,
both in Washington's vision, and in my analysis encompassing all
the Biblical and apocryphal prophecies, as well as those of other
cultures and faiths. America is an integral part of the prophecies
of Nostradamus, and even if it suffers terribly, the Union will
endure.
It occurred to me after my previous post ("Three Brothers Put World
In Trouble," excerpted below) that if the three kamikaze planes could
be interpreted as the three brothers who put the world in trouble by
harming themselves to murder, they could probably also be the three
unclean spirits like frogs of Apoc. 16:13,14, nothwithstanding their
sources as being from the respective mouths of the dragon, beast and
false prophet -
"I saw three unclean spirits like frogs...For they are spirits of
demons, performing signs, which go out to the kings of the earth and
of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of
God Almighty...And they gathered them together to the place called in
Hebrew Armageddon."
Nostradamus has his own frog references in several quatrains already
considered, though worth reviewing: these are II.32 and IX.60 (also
linked via the Dalmatia codeword), X.44 (ending with the same shadow
mentioned in line 1 of the next, X.45, 21 June solar eclipse), VI.46
(another Eagle quatrain) and V.3, which will be discussed interspersed
with the parts of the last post below...
> Several weeks ago, in the post entitled "Updated Saturnin Analysis"
> (a follow-up to "Saturnin Anniversary Theory"), I hypothesized the
> June 21 '01 total solar eclipse and subsequent Peruvian earthquake
> 23 June were the subjects of X.45 through a rather complicated
> network of associations, and described how VIII.72 appeared to also
> refer to the Peruvian quake as well as the Siberian plane crash 4 July,
> the US Independence Day holiday. I noted in both quatrains the final
> line had yet to manifest, and the timing of the other events made it
> appear imminent: VIII.72 ends, "Vainqueur vaincu cheval manger l'aveine"
> - "Conqueror vanquished, horse to eat the oats"; X.45 concludes,
> "Roi Orleans donnera mur legitime" - "Orleans King will give a lawful
> wall," which I translated as, "...will make a wall legitimate."
>
> I was certain the meaning would become apparent soon, and with the
> horrific destruction of the World Trade Center complex and
> simultaneous terrorist attack on the Pentagon using hijacked jumbo
> jets as suicide bombing devices, it has been fulfilled, although
> my correct use of the prophecies assisted no one. It is now clear
> that this new technique of flying commercial airplanes full of fuel
> into targets could well be what was meant by the horse (plane) eating
> the oats (target), consuming by fire; the US seen as a conqueror now
> suddenly vanquished by this event, though it seemed an implausible
> prediction when I determined it to be for our near future. The line
> about the Orleans king was more difficult to decipher: at first I
> thought of Charles VII, who was coronated after Joan of Arc captured
> Orleans - but that was in July, not September; so I realized the
> subject should be the line of Valois-Orleans kings which began with
> Louis XII in 1498 and ended with Henry III in 1589 - in between there
> was Francois I (1515-1547), Henry II (1547-1559), Francois II (1559-
> 1560), and Charles X (1560-1574)... After doing the necessary research
> it was discovered that Francois I was born in Cognac 12 September 1494!
V.3 line 1 bears a likely reference to Francois 1er as successor to
the Duchy, which is what the Orleans title was, being the son of
Charles de Valois-Orleans, perhaps why N. sets the date of death at
his birthday (as in II.13 line 2, wherein line 1 implies murder by
suicide - "The body no longer to be taken without [sacrificing] the
soul"):
Le successeur de la Duche viendra,
Beaucoup plus outre que la mer de Toscane;
Gauloise branche la Florence tiendra,
Dans son giron d'accord nautique Rane.
The successor to the Duchy will come,
Very far beyond the Tuscan Sea;
A Gallic branch will hold Florence,
Nautical Frog in its gyron by agreement.
Gallic branch is someone using his own verses, Florence was associated
with 13 February St. Catherine de Ricci, date of El Salvador quake,
also the meaning in VI.36:
Ni bien ni mal par bataille terrestre
Ne parviendra aux confins de Perouse;
Rebeller Pise, Florence voir mal etre,
Roi nuit blesse sur mulet a noire housse.
Neither good nor ill through battle terrestrial
Will reach the confines Peruvian;
Pisa to rebel, Florence to see evil to be,
Night-king wounded on a mule with black covering.
Pisa here may apply to Blessed Dominic Vernagalli of 20 April, date
of the mistaken shooting down of the missionary plane in Peru the
day Saturn entered Gemini; I cannot explain why the 13 Feb event
would be mentioned next via Florence (quake to El Salvador one month
after previous tremor), but consider this for the final line - the
World Trade Center twin towers is the Night-King, the dominating
feature of the NYC skyline when lit up. Thus the mule, like the
horse eating oats in X.45, represents the plane, but in VI.36 we see
the Night-King damage is the vanquishing of X.45: the black casing or
covering is probably a prediction of the planes being "cloaked" by
having switched off the transponders. Notice a land battle which
does not involve Peru is the subject of the first two lines, apparently
pivoted off the fulfillment of the final line.
> So not the day of the event, but the day after may have been hinted
> in X.45: and the verb "donner" not only means to give, but to strike,
> so that a lawful (civilian) wall (Wall Street?) being struck is the
> topic. And this incident appears to have a more precise prophecy
> elsewhere, with VIII.72's "horse" misleading by its singularity...
Though V.3 spoke of a singular Frog, this is perhaps a subterfuge:
frogs' blood prepared for Dalmatia in II.32; "Frogs to shake Luisitanian
help" in IX.60 ("Barbarian conflict from the black Headdress," related
to Tuskaloosa tornado 16 Dec '00, Choctaw for Black Warrior) and
Dalmatia to tremble with bloodshed. IX.60's Great Ishmael's identity
is crucial and his ambush of the Christian army at landing should be
considered, along with X.31, whose Ishmaelites finding open places
could regard the terrorist teams using gaps in security to accomplish
their horrendous mission.
The Frog again in VI.46 -
Un juste sera en exil renvoye
Par pestilence aux confins Nonseggle;
Reponse au rouge le fera devoye,
Roi retirant a la Rane et a l'Aigle.
A righteous one will be into exile discharged
Through pestilence at the confines of Noon-Castration;
Response to the red will make it go awry,
King withdrawing at the Frog and at the Eagle.
Non for ninth hour, noon, "segg" means an adult animal which has been
castrated in Scandinavian: first two lines about the rescue-recovery
effort at the WTC attacked site. Line 3 is quite disturbing (since
"the red" is explosive destruction, as it regarded the Cole bombing
in VI.91), and I would hope line 4 merely concerns GWB being secluded
as a cautionary measure during the onslaught.
> Around the time of the election, the issue of the three brothers arose,
> and VIII.46 suggested the three were Mars, Cock and Eagle of France -
> but this was a faulty interpretation: line 1 related to the 25 Dec '00
> Chinese disco fire (St. Stephen's day for St.-Paul-of-My-Soul asylum
> connection), line 2 warns about the next two destroying monsters
> (simultaneous attacks at NYC and Pentagon), line 3 reveals during this
> event Mars will be leading planet (reigning by having the lowest
> locational value of any planet in any sign), and line 4 promises
> the three brothers scenario to the Rooster (presumed to be President
> George W. Bush using election quatrains) and French Eagle. While I had
> often noted the frequent reign of Mars as it entered new signs, the
> current period complies with Mars reaching 0 degrees Capricorn 8 Sept
> 2pm EDT, and losing its enthroned status via Mars-Lilith sextile
> 13 Sept 5am EDT. Had I known which Orleans king was referenced, my
> strongest caution should have been for 12 Sept, too late anyway...
>
> The rest of the "three brothers" scenario is outlined in VIII.17 and
> IX.36. Of course the "brothers" are not people at all, but the planes
> which reached critical targets (excluding the fourth plane which
> crashed near Pittsburgh); all 3 of these planes were destined for Los
> Angeles, which sustained a massively felt quake causing no injuries
> 9 Sept 5pm PDT, and two strong aftershocks, the last of which occurred
> a few hours before the first plane struck (thus the quakes could be
> perceived as some oblique divine warning). Also notable is how the
> Ascendant conjuncted Mercury 8:43am EDT, 5 minutes before the onslaught
> against the first World Trade Center tower: I had developed this
> calculation for the timing of a major disaster, though I suspect this
> is not the ultimate catastrophe predicted.
It is entirely likely that the Mercury-Ascendant conjunct situation
prevailing at the time of the initial WTC tower strike fulfilled the
condition of Mercury being insulted by warlike noise in IV.28, as well
as VI.97's mentioned of the Normans or Northmathrs, since conjunction
with the Ascendant is referred to as a North-math calculation, which
only astrologers can perform. And again, it is NOT 45 degrees, which
would be "quarante-cinq degres" - instead he has written "Cinq et
quarante degres," an improper form not used elsewhere even in verse,
meaning "Five and forty degrees," or 40.5, close to the actual lattitude
of NYC ("grande cite neuve," great new city).
> Les biens aises subit seront demis,
> Par les trois freres le monde mis en trouble;
> Cite marine saisiront ennemis,
> Faim, feu, sang, peste, et de tous maux le double.
>
> Those well-off will be in sudden demise,
> By the three brothers the world put in trouble;
> Marine city startled by enemies,
> Hunger, fire, blood, plague, and for all evils the double.
>
> The affluence of many doomed WTC financiers seems implied; the marine
> location is given; and VIII.17 may even play off the double disaster
> of both lofty towers being struck, as well as another attack on the
> Pentagon being concurrent - and possibly, the crisis escalating when
> rescue crews got caught in the actual collapse of the towers, and
> even the suggestion of some further incident in NYC which would be
> compounded upon the already stupefying tragedy.
>
> While the first two lines of IX.36 were interpreted as possibly
> relating to the 2000 US election results, the last two present the
> nature of the "three brothers" mission of mayhem:
>
> Perpet. captif temps! que foudre en la hune,
> Lorsque trois freres se blesseront et meurtre
>
> Perpetual captive times! what lightning from the top,
> When three brothers will wound themselves and murder
>
> The suicidal terrorism was spelled out clearly, though it did not
> seem to apply to anything until these events transpired...
There is little point to repeating my warning about the implications
surrounding 9 June 2002, since there is already more anxiety than we
should have to handle.
Eagal
Ismaelites trouveront lieux ouverts
Ishmaelites will find open places
[X.31, line 2]
Grand Ismael mettra son promontoire
Great Ishmael will set up his promontory
[IX.60, line 3]
Proche a descendre l'armee Crucigere
Sera guettee par les Ismaelites
Approaching descent the Cross-bearing army
Will be ambushed by the Ishmaelites
[IX.43, lines 1 & 2]
Deborah P. Jackson
mean the end of the word!!!
Eagal <cjs...@cnmnetwork.com> wrote in message
news:81d2acae.01091...@posting.google.com...
michihiro
--
C===][michihiro======>>> >< v>'>
"Eagal" <cjs...@cnmnetwork.com> wrote in message
news:81d2acae.01091...@posting.google.com...
Down South
HTH :)
"michihiro" <anon...@theworld.net> wrote in message
news:6zSo7.30126$OW.51...@typhoon.hawaii.rr.com...
Eagal
THE FORTRESS ALSO ABLAZE
In addendum to my original post under this title, I felt there must
be some correspondence between the astrological conditions during the
respective assaults of each plane crash and the attribution of each
of the unclean frog-like entities to a different origin: the Book of
Revelations does not contain useless remarks. So after examining the
three charts, I found a specific conjunction coincided with or
preceded each, which might solve this mystery. Of course the first
strike, AA Flight 11 into the WTC North Tower, followed the conjunct
of Mercury and the Ascendant by only 5 minutes: while Nostradamus
acknowledges the Node as the Dragon's Head, the temple calculation
of 28 May '00 with Vesta and Mercury signified the situation of
Apoc. 12, wherein Vesta as the pregnant woman facing the dragon
indicated Mercury is the latter character, with both comprising
the two Vestals of the quatrains. So the first demonic entity
proceeding from the mouth of the dragon could be St. John's method
of denoting the Mercury-Ascendant conjunct.
UA Flight 175 (also from Boston) struck the WTC South Tower 18
minutes later, 9:06am EDT, and the major shift which had occurred
in the chart during the interim was a conjunct of Juno (which was
the last lunar aspect for the Gemini Moon) with the Part of Fortune:
thus the Apocalypse seems to, in this instance, equate the beast
with Fortune, or associate it with "the mouth of the beast."
Here yet another quatrain may provide yet another prediction of
the terrorist attack (and I would suggest the number of verses
that could be related are a gauge for how pivotal the event is),
one I have often returned to, for which I may now have the definitive
interpretation. The WTC twin towers appear to be designated via
the theme of a regal structure: the Royal edifice of IV.100; the
Night-king of VI.36; and, therefore probably also the palace of
II.66...
Par grands dangers le captif echappe,
Peu de temps grand la fortune changee;
Dans le palais le peuple est attrape,
Par bon augure la cite assiege.
Through great dangers the captive escaped,
In a short time fortune greatly changed;
Within the palace the people are trapped,
Through a good omen the city besieged.
Here N. may clearly be describing the 8:58am EDT Fortune-Juno
conjunct, using the still-standing tower as "captive" to the event,
doomed to suffer the same fate as its twin shortly after the
notable shift in Fortune. One may also regard the final line of
II.93, wherein a castle (or fortress, apparently the Pentagon)
is in conflagration simultaneous with the palace.
In the chart for Arlington, VA, 9:43am EDT, 78W 39N, when AA Flight
77 hit the Pentagon, there is a synchronous conjunction of Juno and
the Medium Coeli (Midheaven, tenth house cusp), which might solve
the riddle of the "false prophet" in this context (the astrological
coincidence in this case is quite precise temporally).
Another line whose meaning seems clearer now begins I.28 -
La tour de Boucq craindra fuste Barbare
The tower for a He-goat will dread the Barbarian foist
I had been attempting to analyze this from the perspective of
a Capricorn timing cue, but now it appears the mountain goat
reference was merely a suggestion of the extreme height of the
tower(s), so that such an animal would more easily be able to
utilize the stairs for escape...
Eagal
Eagal
AND OTHER PROBLEMS
Some of the following material should probably be under another
thread, "Retaliatory Response Rhymes." But the idea of now suddenly
being swept up in the Battle of Armageddon seems so overwhelming
it should be addressed (since I made the connection, I will do so):
this location, Har-Megiddo, mountain of Megiddo, indicates the
ancient Palestinian battlefield, the plain of Esdraelon, where the
fortune of many kings was decided - it is thought to be symbolic of a
monumental struggle, nothing more in itself. If the WTC-Pentagon
suicide assault was the 3-frog event, this means at least six more
subtle signs have gone unnoticed, with society oblivious to most
prophetic fulfillment. To now reconstruct the 1999 European eclipse
and subsequent Istanbul quake deaths as the darkness and pain associated
with the fifth bowl, and so on back in time, may be possible. But as
with the quatrains, we should resign ourselves to never being able to
know everything, since when we try too hard to make things fit, it
rarely turns out to be correct. I know some of what I've posted on
a.p.n has been confirmed as virtually oracular intuitive and logical
genuine interpretations of aspects of incidents prior to manifestation,
while at other times I have floundered with some desperate speculations:
the existence of the former urges me to simply filter out the latter.
Seeing the Ishmaelites alone brings one to the lines already shown;
but equating the great Ishmael with X.58's young Macedonian provides
a whole other series of informative verses. Taking the original word,
"AEmathien," it appears an anagram for something to translate as
Anathema, loathed one. This is the character upon whom the monarch of
a mourning nation makes war. Other "Macedonian" verses are IX.38,64,93.
L'entree de Blaye par Rochelle et l'Anglois
Passera outre le grand Aemathien:
Non loin d'Agen attendra le Gaulois,
Secours Narbonne decu par entretien.
The entrance of Bleak and Rocky for the English
While pass beyond the great Anathema:
Not far from Agen will await the Gaul,
Scar relief beguiled through discussion.
The syntax in IX.38 line 1 is garbled, related to VI.60 line 3,
"Rouan, Rochelle par ceux de l'Armorique" - "Ruin, Rocky for those of
America"!
We've gone through the Armorica (Brittany) use for America since IV.95's
"Victor puine en Armonique terre" followed opposition of vestals Mercury
and Vesta as "Puny victor on American soil" was fulfilled via presidency
of GWB under the circumstances we all know. The anger many Democrats
felt over possible election hijinx has converted into an instinctive
rallying around our leader in wartime; perhaps the crisis has allowed
us to perceive reactions we might not otherwise. It is good that other
nations are involved, however it was American presence on Saudi soil
(arranged with the same type of reluctant permission the US now has
from Pakistan) which so angered certain factions to execute the 11 Sept
attack, suggesting further escalation even if a base is established.
There are also reports of a financial motive involving selling stock
short beforehand to take advantage of the current drop in prices: even
if this is so, it would not change the resolve of some to commit the
same acts in the name of their theocracy.
The scar (Narbon in German) could be the WTC ground zero ruin site,
linked with Mars via the city name, as in II.59 and IX.64.
L'AEmathion passer monts Pyrenees,
En Mars Narbon ne fera resistance;
Par mer et terre fera si grand menee,
Cap. n'ayant terre sure pour demeurance.
The Anathema to pass the Pyrenees mountains,
While of Mars scar will make no resistance;
Through sea and land there will be such great intrigue,
Capitol will have no safe area for residence.
IX.64 seems rocky indeed. IX.93 concerns a pivotal battle:
Les ennemis du fort bien eloignes,
Par chariots conduits le bastion;
Par sur les murs de Bourges egrenes,
Quand Hercules battra l'Haemathion.
The enemies quite far from the fort,
The bastion brought by wagons;
The walls of Bourges crumbled at the top,
When Hercules will strike the Anathema.
I would take Hercules as the US, the superpower loved or hated around
the world for whatever reasons. It is quite specific, and could be
a prediction regarding the initial military response. But the various
twists, and any underlying karmic causes of which these are somehow
the effects, are matters which may not be broached completely...
V.77's King of France rendering the Martial quirinal vulcanal of course
no seems to be Francois 1er, to be combined with X.45's Orleans king, etc.
X.61's conspirators discovered through the matron (Juno lunar) seem to
have been the terrorists -
Betta, Vienne, Emorte, Sacarbance,
Voudront livrer aux Barbares Pannone;
Par pique et feu enorme violence,
Les conjures decouverts par matrone.
Blockhead, of Life, and Death, Graveldance,
Will want to deliver Austria to the Barbarians;
Through pike and fire enormous violence,
The conspirators discovered through the matron.
Perhaps the four names in line 1 refer to the four hijacked planes, with
the last landing in a Pennsylvania field killing only those aboard as
the Graveldance craft. The Austrian remark could relate to the cable
car inferno in Kaprun, Austria 11 November 2000. But since Neptune (the
pike) had no significant role in the 11 Sept charts, line 3 probably
hints at the further, more catastrophic fiery event (now hypothesized
at 10 June '02).
The war being prepared in IX.55 may be ready at Nancy according to X.7,
*whenever* that is.
Le grand conflit qu'on apprete a Nancy,
L'Aemathien dira tout je soumets
The great conflict which they prepare for Nancy,
The Anathema will say I subdue all
The pair of lines seems aligned with the ambush of IX.43, while as stated
prior, III.29 curiously represents the response as straightforward, while
VI.46 provides a caution (final line could be translated, "King
withdrawing from the Frog and to the Eagle"). One might wonder whether
N. was covering his bases: but experience has shown that each of the
separate predictions will eventually be actualized either in tandem or
some pre-ordained sequence, though it might take imagination as well as
some diverse, obscure information to comprehend how...
Du feu celeste au Royal edifice
Quand la lumiere de Mars defaillira,
Sept mois grande guerre, mort gent de malefice;
Rouan, Eureux au Roy ne faillira.
From the sky-borne fire at the Royal edifice
When the luminescence of Mars will default,
"Sept" month great war, people dead by malevolence;
Crafty, Triumphant the King will not be at fault.
Eagal
Palais, oiseaux, par oiseau dechasse,
Bien tot apres le prince parvenu
Palace, bird, by bird chased out,
Quite soon after the prince arrived
___________________________________
And my Lord Jesus Christ, our King, said to me,
"Let us go into the holy mountain."
And we, the twelve disciples, went with Him and entreated Him
to show us one of our righteous brethren who had departed from the world
that we might see in what form they are, and taking courage might
encourage the men who should hear us. And as we prayed, suddenly there
were two men, standing before the Lord, on whom we were not able to look.
For a light came from them which shone more than the sun, and their
rainments also were glistening, such as the eye of man never saw...
And when we suddenly saw them, we marvelled. And I approached God Jesus
Christ and said to Him, "My Lord, who is this?" And He said to me,
"These are Moses and Elias."
And I said to Him, "Where then are Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the other
righteous fathers?" And He showed us a great open garden. It was full
of fair trees and blessed fruits, full of the fragrance of perfume.
It's fragrance was beautiful and that fragrance reached to us.
And my Lord and God Jesus Christ said unto me,
"Hast thou seen the companies of the fathers?
As is their rest, so also is the honour and glory of those who will be
persecuted for My righteousness' sake."
And I said to Him, "My Lord, wilt thou that I make here three tabernacles,
one for Thee, one for Moses, and one for Elias?"
And He said to me in wrath,
"Satan maketh war against thee,
And has veiled thine understanding,
And the good things of this world conquer thee.
Thine eyes must be opened,
And thine ears unstopped..."
And behold there came suddenly a voice from heaven saying,
"This is My Son, whom I love and in whom I have pleasure-"
And there came a great and exceeding white cloud over our heads and
bore away our Lord and Moses and Elias.
And I trembled and was afraid, and we looked up and the heavens opened
and we saw men in the flesh, and they came and greeted our Lord and Moses
and Elias, and went into the second heaven.
And great fear and amazement took place in heaven;
The angels flocked together that the word of Scripture might be fulfilled
which saith: "Open the gates, ye princes!"
After that heaven was shut, that had been opened.
And we prayed and went down from the mountain,
And we praised God who hath written the names of the righteous in heaven
in the Book of Life.
Eagal
MECHANICS EXEGESIS:
While the media ridicules attempts to link the WTC-Pentagon attack
with any prophecies by Nostradamus, I on the other hand must face the
realization that had I simply continued the procedure involving temple
calculations initiated after April 2000, the nullified [Juno / Mars]
condition of 11 September would have certainly merited a caution,
since the same verses I have used after the event to illuminate the
fulfillments were utilized prior to develop the temple theory.
After the solar eclipse and Peruvian earthquake in June 2001, having
perceived these events referred to in two verses which both had as
final lines the images of a superpower in upheaval and the ominous
French king affecting a wall should have been alerting enough to
prompt the table including a warning for that date. Concentrating on
the June 2002 date is valid, but I knew it was too far, hence the 23
July "Updated Saturnin Analyis" message which warned of this sort of
imminent trouble only vaguely. But only someone who continued the
calculations on their own using my guidelines would have arrived at
the life-saving answer, because the location of NYC was the basis for
the Mercury-Ascendant conjunct theory: without knowing the WTC
specifically was involved, leaving the city that day would have been
possible. The post-mortems may be prepared so much more easily than
projecting into the future because the quatrains offer information in
such a fragmentary fashion that one may be aware of a particular
phrase in one place without having any idea it manifests within the
context set up by other verses: so certain conditions are anticipated
generally by simply existing, while others may be sought out at
certain times because of understanding only a fraction of the
available clues.
While the foreclosure of the pertinent union in X.17,35 neatly offers
a prediction that I would not complete the task of warning about the
correct NYC Mercury-Ascendant conjunct (how many times I've written
that phrase as a prophesied explosive trigger-time before 11 Sept!),
but only set up the correct parameters, a similar remark about failing
to determine the identity of X.45's Orleans king (Francois 1er, b. 12
Sept 1494) until afterwards may begin IX.84 -
Roi expose parfera l'hecatombe
Apres avoir trouve son origine
The exposed King will perfect the slaughter
Later to have found his origin
Even though things often seem to manifest as I say they will, at times
derived from my intuitive study of various resources to unlock the
concealed meanings, with a track record of being correct about
elements of my postulations too consistently to relegate to mere
chance, I have to tell myself that having provided a warning about NYC
on that particular date would not have saved a single life. Maybe I
am wrong: it was a school orientation day, and those who accompanied
their child that morning avoided work and lived - perhaps if they knew
there was a caution they would have been more likely to choose the
child over work. But as I said, most people have contempt for the
prophecies because they are incapable of making any sense of them
themselves; and I sincerely doubt anyone else shared enough faith in
my calculations to continue them without me. If I do not make an
esoteric statement which seems obvious to me, it is unlikely to
suddenly become common knowledge.
As horrible as the 11 Sept attack was, I have reproduced since that
time many quatrains which potentially detailed every aspect of the
incidents, along with their astrological situations and political
repercussions, and we have remaining to be fulfilled an entire other
cataclysmic series ascribable to a future event, wherein 7 million die
- the maritime Lion, the great POW, etc. The hellish deliberate
disasters that have brought us to the brink of a war which has all the
earmarks of Armageddon must pale in comparison to such a city-wide
devastation. My initial premise was that the great city which is
destroyed at the pouring of the seventh bowl is NYC has only been
reinforced by the WTC tower collapses manifesting to convert thousands
of defenseless working people into the Vulcan corpses of IX.74, since
those who bury the bodies are called dead: VIII.17 says the evils will
be doubled, and it seems the WTC loss is a prelude to the global
catastrophe being centered in NYC. I had thought the Brookhaven RHIC
would be the source, and one might think with the war some atomic
device is a more likely means to fulfillment: but V.19's Royal one of
gold augmented by brass still appears to be the Ion Collider; and the
"unheard-one of Maine" from X.35 seems to be the RHIC also, though
anything is possible.
I've stated IV.67 is involved, without having explained line 1 -
L'an que Saturne et Mars egaux combust
The year that Saturn and Mars equal combustion
Recalling my interpretation of IV.97 (notice first numeral inverted,
6 to 9) circa the 2000 election, 2001 was revealed as complying with
line 1 -
L'an que Mercure, Mars, Venus retrograde
The year that Mercury, Mars, Venus retrograde
A similar first line, similar numeration - perhaps because they denote
the same year!
I had posted the dates of these retrogressions, but did not comprehend
whatever significance this information held intrinsically. Retracing
the planetary motions, when Saturn entered Gemini 20 April '01, Mars
was already in retrograde headed for the midst of Sagittarius: thus
when Mars finally reached Capricorn 8 September '01, the constraint of
Saturn and Mars was met, giving us I.83's furious Mars.
La gent etrange divisera butins,
Saturne en Mars son regard furieux;
Horrible strage aux Toscans et Latins,
Grecs, qui seront a frapper curieux.
The foreign people will separate gains,
Saturn into Mars his aspect furious;
Horrible slaughter of the Tuscans and Latins,
Greeks, who to strike will be aroused.
The division in line 1 as the Florida recount, followed by Saturn's
new reign, then that of Mars, whose fury manifests in the slaughter.
It is likely the Tuscans and Latins symbolize those within respective
WTC towers, while those at the Pentagon as the Greeks are naturally
interested in retaliating (given reality as subtext).
It often seemed there were too many indicators or disaster, and some
remain unclear, but having looked into the near future to test the
validity of the "Saturnin Anniversary Theory," as modified for the 10
June '02 Vesta-Pluto lunar temple period, some configurations appear
to supply prophesied conditions.
First, X.17's labouring Queen must be Vesta reigning, as she is not 10
June, seeing Venus as the wretched maid: however, when Vesta does
reign it is only for a few hours after entering Cancer on 14 May 2002
7:01am EDT - and Venus is alongside at 22,40' Gemini, with no other
celestial bodies between them (thus Vesta may be able to "see" Venus
as described). But Ceres enters Aries 2:09pm EDT, which may apply to
III.75's plague arriving with the great "gousse" (Gauss discoverer
pun, husk meaning fits with harvest goddess).
I will not detail again why 9 June is astrologically pivotal using the
prophecies, having done that in other posts, but here is another
factor not yet discovered: the 10 June '02 temple has its
Mercury-Ascendant conjunct 4:22am EDT (same calculation that yields
8:43am EDT for 11 Sept '01)...
10 June EDT
2:31am to 3:48am Pallas-Juno opposition
2:50am Neptune trine Moon
3:46am Vesta adjacent Moon
4:22am Mercury conjunct Ascendant
IX.84's final line about the Roman with Medusine standard is Minerva
or Pallas, through whom an event occurs - a torrent opening a tomb of
marble and lead. As stated, the prophecies are such that this line
could have a dire manifestation aligned with other catastrophic
predictions although it might seem innocuous on the surface
(especially since the first portion may concern the attack in an
oblique way). Because the incident is "borne of Vesta," it should not
happen before 3:46am EDT. Once the three demonic frog-spirits have
appeared to foment war, it will not be long before the seventh bowl is
poured out on the air. This most terrible affliction should noisily
bring the "new fire through marshes" of IX.29, the star burning for
seven days (II.41), and the other similar references already
postulated to arrive prematurely.
Eagal
Au revolu du grand nombre septieme,
Apparaitra au temps jeux d'Hecatombe,
Non eloigne du grand age millieme,
Que les entres sortiront de leur tombe.
For the completion of the great seventh number,
It will appear at the time of the slaughtering games,
From the great millennial age not far,
When the mummies will go out from their tomb.
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
Eagal wrote:
> THE GREAT ANATHEMA
> AND OTHER PROBLEMS
>
> Some of the following material should probably be under another
> thread, "Retaliatory Response Rhymes." But the idea of now suddenly
> being swept up in the Battle of Armageddon seems so overwhelming
> it should be addressed (since I made the connection, I will do so):
> this location, Har-Megiddo, mountain of Megiddo, indicates the
> ancient Palestinian battlefield, the plain of Esdraelon, where the
> fortune of many kings was decided - it is thought to be symbolic of a
> monumental struggle, nothing more in itself. If the WTC-Pentagon
> suicide assault was the 3-frog event
I appreciate that much of what you are doing comes under the category
of pattern recognition.
Numerous people from different sciences and other disciplines have
determined that there are certain fundamental structures of Reality.
I need not follow your argument in detail to be able to perceive that
you have devoted sufficient energy to your particular discipline to
be able to perceive certain aspects of this structure which are not
widely recognized or accepted by people who are simply not as
concentrated.
But let me address this symbol of the 'three frogs of war', which
is taken from the Revelation of John in reference to the 'dragon,
the beast, and the false prophet'.
Given that the 'dragon' is a symbol for the media, the 'frog' which
comes out of the dragon's mouth in the censorship of the Truth;
given that the 'false prophet' is the religious establishment, the
'frog' that comes out of the false prophet's mouth is LIES and
the contradiction of Revealed Truth. And, given that the 'beast' is
a symbol for the political-military establishment, the frog that
comes out of the beast's mouth are the specific orders for the
military manifestation of this conflict.
All three of these aspects are ESSENTIAL to the eruption of
this battle: CENSORSHIP, LIES, and the MILITARY aspect.
And the elimination of any ONE of them would seriously
geopardize the whole mechanism.
This is merely another element demonstrating the reality of
what I have referred to as "fractal Prophecies", as is the fact
that the last time there was such a massive outbreak of
"hoof and mouth" disease (or maybe 'foot in mouth' disease)
was in 1967, the same year as the Six Day War in Israel.
I do not present this as in any way an argument.
I am merely pointing out another element of reality which
appears to recur over time.
Michael Cecil
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
Eagal wrote:
> THE GREAT ANATHEMA
> AND OTHER PROBLEMS
>
> Some of the following material should probably be under another
> thread, "Retaliatory Response Rhymes." But the idea of now suddenly
> being swept up in the Battle of Armageddon seems so overwhelming
> it should be addressed (since I made the connection, I will do so):
> this location, Har-Megiddo, mountain of Megiddo, indicates the
> ancient Palestinian battlefield, the plain of Esdraelon, where the
> fortune of many kings was decided - it is thought to be symbolic of a
> monumental struggle, nothing more in itself. If the WTC-Pentagon
> suicide assault was the 3-frog event
Oh, by the way, I would point out that the face of Satan is believed
by some to have appeared in the smoke arising from the WTC and
NOT the Pentagon.
Perhaps the WTC is symbolic of the 'beast with *two* horns like a lamb
but that speaks with the voice of the dragon' (cf. Revelations 13:11)
and signifies the media establishment and the religious establishment
which undergirds the present economic structure on this planet.
And, of course, the military aspect of this, symbolized by the Pentagon,
signifies that the media and the religious establishment are backed
up by military FORCE. This military FORCE is the ultimate voice of
the "dragon".
The media in the United States and Israel have suppressed the Truth
and the United States military is now being tasked to WEAPONIZE
this censorship and suppression of the Truth.
Michael Cecil
Dee
lambkin. Out of the mouths of the 3 will come 3 foul spirits resembling
frogs.
...................
(28SW2) Michael Cecil wrote in message <3BAC8638...@earthlink.net>...
Eagal
ENSNARED BY CONSPIRATORS
My previous message ("Coordinated Astral Mechanics Exegesis") should
demonstrate that anyone commenting on whether the prophecies have any
validity must have as prerequisite a basic comprehension of
astronomical
information for the period being considered, and how references to
certain
planetary situations might be subtly encoded. In retrospect, it is
sadly
obvious that the Martian reign so long-postponed by retrogression
after
the beginning of Saturn's long cycle should have been anticipated as
time
for a massacre, given not so much what was written in separate
quatrains,
as the impression certain disjointed yet similar lines create when
correlated. "Saturn and Mars" heretofore has been thought of as
indicating
a conjunction only, not outline a scenario of consecutive critical
passages
into new signs. Every "dark temple" does not attend disaster; every
reign of Mars may not merit a warning (despite I.15). The prophecies
brought the subject of retrogression up for a reason, but may dare the
user to develop a hunch to acquire the crucial answer; unfortunately,
if
one constructs and adheres to faulty hypotheses, the confusion can
become
compounded - but deriving a correct esoteric fact can also be pivotal
without any overt evidence of validity.
Such was the "Urn" theory involving Pluto and Chiron, arising from the
use of VIII.29 in late 1999, perhaps utilized for X.50's large urn 21
January '01, as some augury regarding the current administration
perhaps:
the seven celestial bodies could be those before the shadow (21 June
solar eclipse) in X.44 line 4, and those comprising the heavy club in
VI.82 line 3, which would mean both Pluto and Chiron occupy the Goblet
later. 10 June 2002's Vesta-Pluto combination revisits X.8 line 2
seeming
to regard their conjunct Jan '00; borne of Vesta has been clearly
shown,
with X.6's Vesta sepulchral fire; a Pluto lunar after the "Pow"
("Pau")
is suggested in IV.70 line 4, "chief will come to hunt" - chief of the
world aspecting goddess of hunt. But as for Chiron, it must have some
other role, since Vesta must be in the temple: it may be in IX.41 -
Le grand CHYREN se saisir d'Auignon
The great CHIRON will seize Avignon
Examining the weeks prior to 10 June, X.17 and III.75 focusing on the
very brief reign of Vesta 14 May and its proximity to Venus could be
guiding the user to observe the Venus-Vesta conjunct 23 May '02 2:30pm
EDT,
when both will be roughly opposed by Chiron alone.
June 2002 aspects
04 Uranus-Pallas conjunct
08 Chiron opposes Mars
09 Sun-Saturn-Node conjuncts [opposing Pluto]
10 Pallas opposes Juno
10 Saturn-Jupiter adjacency
Again, 9 June 2002 complies with Preface par. 5 and should be the
major
(possibly third) fulfillment of IX.83. The Mercury-Ascendant conjunct
being coincident with Neptune at Midheaven makes it the one mounted on
courier and pike (V.1) as well as Corinth and Ephesus in perplexity
(III.3). It is the feastday for St. Vincent of Agen, mentioned in
IX.38
as being near a troubling incident: this makes sense, since X.35
requires
Vesta in the temple, occuring 10 June - and VII.12's stating those of
Agen are razed should be apply to an action on the 10th. Perhaps
other
events will occur in the interim, such as the eclipse and quake of
late
June which brought me to VIII.72 and X.45 and the conjecture that
their
fateful final lines would soon find synchronous manifestation, so some
unexpected new confirmation may appear without resorting to subjective
analyses of astrological conditions. There are several lines which
have
been determined to potentially apply to an Ion Collider explosion,
such
as IX.24's swallowing of raw nuclei, and VIII.35's error of meson...
Many of the city names taken literally have turned out to be
translatable
as adjectives or lead to saintly calendric data. For instance, the
"Pannone" of X.61, which should mean Pannonia or Hungary, is very
close
to "panneau," a snare: thus the explanation involving an incident in
Austro-Hungary should be discarded, rendering the simpler notion of
four conspirators (the hijacked planes receiving odd nick-names in
line
1) wanting to deliver a snare to the country called Barbarian - the
idea
of delivering Hungary, as it is written on the surface, is absurd.
The walls of Bourges line in IX.93 seems similarly enigmatic:
Par sur les murs de Bourges egrenes
From above the walls of the Bourgeoisie shelled
Rather than walls being crumbled at the top, an air raid could be
described. Bourges is close to bourgeoisie, civilian townsfolk.
The 11 Sept attack may be obliquely referenced in VI.89 line 3, "Wasps
and flies, paternal love vexed," given III.29's "fathers fallen" as
the
collapsed dominant WTC twin towers: perhaps N. is envisioning 2 as
wasps
(probably those attacking the WTC, a powerful sting), 2 as flies (the
one inflicting only partial damage to the Pentagon, and the other not
reaching its target at all). Line 4 presents us with the falsifying
Cup-bearer before the Goblet is tried: this could designate the
attack,
which was initiated at the Mercury-Ascendant conjunct, as an imitator
of
the Seventh Bowl cataclysm due to the same timing cue - after all,
Vesta and Mercury as the two vestals suggests the Vesta lunar is not
sufficient in itself as trigger (so VI.97 may get doubly fulfilled).
Revelations does not make it clear the three unclean frog-like spirits
attack the great city, which suffers after the Seventh Bowl is poured
on
the air, but N. might by declaring both milk and frogs' blood are
prepared for Dalmatia (II.32) - milk rises from the abyss in I.21.
So it seems there are several indicators that the WTC attack is a
strong
sign that a more destructive event is to affect NYC later: the Goblet
of divine fury to be tried in the same place where the Cup-bearer
(Mercury-Ascendant conjunct) had previously falsified; IX.74's austere
prediction of massive homicide in an affluent city ("Done and done,"
subtly hinting the dual planned crashes into the paired towers),
against
those working like oxen, wherein those burying the "Vulcan corpses"
appear doomed themselves.
The WTC-Pentagon attack was obviously prophesied accurately regarding
the
timing, specific details, and general trends. The same probably holds
for the Seventh Bowl event, focused towards the Sun-Saturn-Node triple
conjunct, and fine-tuned into the Vesta-Pluto temple the following
day.
Eagal
La vraie flamme engloutira la dame
Qui voudra mettre les Innocents a feu
The true flame will engulf the lady
Who would put the Innocents to the fire
Eagal
THE RENEGADE PLANES
A minor correction about the symbolism of the wasps and flies...
> The 11 Sept attack may be obliquely referenced in VI.89 line 3, "Wasps
> and flies, paternal love vexed," given III.29's "fathers fallen" as
> the collapsed dominant WTC twin towers: {* perhaps N. is envisioning 2 as
> wasps (probably those attacking the WTC, a powerful sting), 2 as flies (the
> one inflicting only partial damage to the Pentagon, and the other not
> reaching its target at all). *}
While the fly insect connotes evil (as in Beelzebub as "Lord of the
Flies"),
the relevant contrast here is that flies do not sting at all, while
wasps
are more venomous than bees - hence the wasps mixed in with the flies
may
be a simple analogy suggesting some flights becoming airborne hazards
via
hijackers trained as suicide pilots with plans to destroy landmarks.
This would explains why both wasps and flies are pluralized, the
latter merely indicating routine flights rather than a new occurrence.
The critical portion of the analysis remains plausible -
> Line 4 presents us with the falsifying Cup-bearer before the Goblet is
tried: this could designate the attack, which was initiated at the
Mercury-Ascendant conjunct, as an imitator of the Seventh Bowl
cataclysm
due to the same timing cue ...
Eagal
Guepes et mouches, fitine amour faches,
Poccilateur faucer, Cyphe tente
Wasps and flies, paternal love vexed,
Cup-bearer to falsify, Goblet tried
_____________________________________
Navale pugne, terre, peres tombe:
Viendront si haut eleves enguerris
Pugnacious to Navy, territories, fathers fallen:
They will come to be elevated very high in making war
[III.29]
Eagal
TOGETHER NEAR URN:
As stated prior, had I focused on the 8-13 Sept '01 reign of Mars and
generated the temple calculations, 11 Sept would have been noticed as
the only dark temple in the period, complying with the requirements of
a terrible Martian throne and the war-fomenting destructive conspiracy
arriving through Juno:
September '01 Mercury-Ascendant conjuncts EDT
08 8:36am Moon @ 18,50' Taurus between aspects with Sun & Uranus
09 8:38am Moon @ 1,35' Gemini, between Mars & Lilith aspects
10 8:41am Moon @ 14,39' Gemini, between Mercury & Saturn lunars
11 8:43am Moon @ 28,03' Gemini, void of course - [Juno / Mars] null
12 8:45am Moon @ 11,51' Cancer, Jupiter & Pluto "in the temple"
13 8:47am Moon @ 26,05' Cancer, Chiron & Juno
Having hypothesized a further, more catastrophic event for NYC 10 June
2002, which could be the Goblet, Seventh Bowl, etc., the final line of
IX.73 appears related, indicating "Sun, Mars, Mercury" near the urn:
it is unclear whether "near" means prior to or following, even if the
"hurne" is determined to be a cataclysmic occurrence (rather than the
sign Aquarius, as in the traditional interpretation, or an esoteric
reference to Pluto and Chiron, as considered using VIII.29 and VI.70
for their conjunct in late 1999).
In 2002, the sequence of Sun, Mars, Mercury will exist in Leo from 25 July
(around Noon EDT) until 6 August. Jupiter will enter Leo 1 August...
Eagal
Dans Fois entre Roi ceiulee Turban,
Et regnera moins evolu Saturne;
Roi Turban blanc Bizance coeur ban,
Sol, Mars, Mercure pres la hurne.
Eagal
ELEVATED UNDER SUN, NOT VENUS:
La regne et loi sous Venus eleve,
Saturne aura sus Iupiter empire;
La loi et regne par le Soleil leve,
Par Saturnins endurera le pire.
The reign and law under Venus elevated,
Over Jupiter Saturn will have dominion;
The law and reign through the Sun uplifted,
The worst will be endured by the Saturnins.
I brought up V.24 around the Taurean Alignment of 5 May 2000, noting that
the arrival of Venus 30 April '00 maximized the number of celestial bodies
in Taurus, in explanation of the first line. But then Saturn had a greater
locational value than Jupiter: so line 2 was fulfilled when Saturn enjoyed
its brief reign beginning 9 August '00, with Jupiter ahead of it being
relegated as one of its subjects.
Line 3 thus seems to have deleted the entire sequence wherein Saturn
retrograded out of (Oct '00) then re-entered Gemini (20 April '01)
[which may be the topic of other quatrains, such as I.54], as well as
the fateful arrival of Mars thereafter {I.83,IV.67,V.14}, apparently to
make a hidden reference to another alignment paralleling that of line 1
(its contextually similar rhyming partner), presumably in which the Sun's
entry into the sign of the grouping will complete the effect.
21 May 2002 when the Sun enters Gemini around 1:30am EDT, it will be the
fourth planet there, along with Mercury @ 8,53', Saturn @ 15,58', Mars
@ 25,12'; and the line continues into Cancer with Venus @ 0,48', Vesta
@ 2,47' and finally Jupiter @ 14,28'. So this could be the "sceptre"
relevant to the birth of the Child in Revelations, rather than the Taurean
alignment (which could have been described in X.67), since its arrival
immediately precedes the 10 June 2002 critical "Saturnin" time theorized.
Eagal
La loi du Sol et Venus contendus,
Appropriant l'esprit de prophetie:
Ni l'un ni l'autre ne seront entendus,
Par Sol tiendra la loi du grand Messie.
The law of the Sun and Venus contended,
The spirit of prophesy appropriating:
Neither one nor the other will be comprehended,
The law of the great Messiah through Sun will be holding.
[V.53]
Eagal
OF MARS & JUPITER: VI.35
Another astrological condition possibly presented as significant in
VI.35 will exist in what may be the aftermath of the projected Goblet
cataclysm: this is the conjunction of Mars and Jupiter @ 23,30' Cancer
3 July 2002 (not long after the conjectured 10 June onset) 9am EDT.
Pres de Rion, et proche a blanche laine,
Aries, Taurus, Cancer, Leo, la Vierge,
Mars, Iupiter, le Sol ardera grande plaine,
Bois et cites lettres caches au cierge.
Near the Dark, and close to white wool,
Aries, Taurus, Cancer, Leo, Virgo,
Mars, Jupiter, the Sun will burn a great plain,
Woods and cities' letters hidden in the candle.
I.62's image of lost letters may be contrasting here with such
intensive consuming fire that no wafting papers may be observed when
it is unleashed, enveloping cities and countryside alike. And the
"ardent cierge" from line 3 of VIII.80 should be the same candle...
Gemini missing from line 2 corresponds with the lunar sign 11 Sept at
the void of course period of the attacks (although I had a different
theory involving the 23 Nov '99 Gemini lunar using I.52 & IV.28 - the
month ended with Moon in Virgo, and this was linked with III.97 part
one).
"Rion" is obviously "Noir" backwards, meaning Black or Darkness.
The white wool is a Messianic symbol -
"His head and hair were white like wool, white as snow,
And His eyes like a flame of fire" (Apoc. 1:14)
So the August 1st entry of Jupiter into Leo after some previous Mars
reign, following the pattern of the "Saturn and Mars" remarks, appears
to be the wrong method, with the other astronomical indications
coalescing to render the 3 July date more likely for the prophecy than
a month later.
The Darkness and the candle appear related, whereas the burning of the
great plain (Great Plain?) may be a consequential incident manifesting
according to the cryptic schedule, which often reads in retrospect
after fulfillment like a macabre cosmic obituary for those taken
violently, unexpectedly, and en masse.
There are inevitable problems in attempting to use the prophecies to
time and report future events: first, there is no way of effectively
cross-referencing certain undisclosed concepts, such as the Tower =
the palace = the Royal edifice = the Night-King, or the great Ishmael
= the Macedonian as the Anathema, etc. - without the words being the
same, there is confusion; secondly, the failure to adequately
interpret warnings prior may be included as part of the predictions,
such as the timing key Mercury-Ascendant conjunct foreclosure and the
belated discovery of the birthday of the Orleans king; third, one must
rely on intuition to some extent to sort out obliquely hidden
astronomical timing data from actual events and so forth - to know
what type of information is being offered in a general sense; a fourth
difficulty is that even if the city names can be properly deciphered
into various adjectives, anagrams, calendric dates via saintly
feastdays and so on, realizing the actual places which will be
affected and precisely how to translate prepositions to construct a
plausible scenario is quite elusive; fifthly, my efforts have proven
that even if one does most of that correctly, conceives of
calculations that prove integral to the momentous events in the
immediate future, and engages in a series of conjectures which
manifest as true, there has to be patient perseverance, and vigilance
in acquiring and evaluating the pertinent data over long periods of
time; and a final difficulty worth mentioning is that without
consistent accurate success, the public cannot determine whether there
is any validity to particular statements about prophecies, and even
with that it is unlikely many would take such warnings seriously
enough to benefit from them.
Des innocents le sang de veuve et vierge,
Tant de maux faits par moyen se grand Rouge;
Saints simulacres trempes en ardent cierge,
De frayeur crainte ne verra nul qui bouge.
For the innocents the blood of widow and virgin,
By means of the very great Red so many evils done;
Holy images plunged into wax effulgent,
In frightened terror those seen to budge none.
Now the innocents of line 1 seem to be those of IX.52, i.e.,
casualties of 11 Sept, which were not predominantly womenfolk: I had
thought the widow and virgin were saints, but perhaps they indicate
collateral damage in a future retaliatory strike, which does not
necessarily have to occur during another reign of Mars. The great Red
one being Mars would explain things neatly, an overlooked Martian
theme viewed as solar catastrophe. The latter portion seems to
concern the later "scepter cataclysm" - thus my noting the 26 Jan '01
Bhuj, India quake could be the topic of line 4 was probably incorrect
(although VIII.52 does still seem to have predicted that event
cryptically).
Eagal
Then I saw that the man who wrote the book at the word of the Lord,
Opened the book of destruction,
Of that destruction which the last twelve shepherds wrought,
And pointed out before the Lord of the sheep,
That they destroyed more than those who preceded them.
I saw also that the Lord of the sheep came to them,
And taking in His hand the Scepter of His wrath seized the earth,
Which became rent asunder...
[Henoch 89]
_______________________________
The earth is violently broken,
The earth is split open,
The earth is shaken exceedingly.
The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard,
And shall totter like a hut;
Its transgression shall be heavy upon it,
And it will fall, and not rise again.
It shall come to pass in that day
That the Lord will punish on high the host of exalted ones,
And on earth the kings of the earth.
They will be gathered together,
As prisoners are gathered in the pit,
And will be shut up in the prison;
After many days they will be punished.
Then the Moon will be disgraced
And the Sun ashamed,
For the Lord of Hosts will reign
On Mount Zion and in Jerusalem,
And shall be glorified in the sight of His ancients.
[Isaiah 24]
Eagal
FATEFUL FATAL FOIST...
This installment is an attempt to tie more loose ends raised elsewhere
in this thread, covering miscellaneous material in corollary to prior
statements; the scope appears expansive, but the emphasis is on
recurrent themes to reveal consistent scenarios through parallel
references. Since deciphering these predictions properly will very
likely result in acquiring knowledge about inevitable, inflexible
incidents in the immediate future (as has been proven through my posts
on numerous occasions), the question of enhancing the probability of
those events by conceiving of and discussing them is extremely
troubling: yet for all the non-catastrophic dates focused on without
the required conditions, only to have the pivotal disastrous assault
occur with all the necessary parameters met (even ones incorrectly
overlooked), with the enigma of the Orleans king raised about six
weeks prior then solved afterwards as also prophesied, and the timing
key expounded upon for over a year as the NYC Mercury-Ascendant theory
verified by the first strike but oddly arriving at a time when I
neglected to notice Mars'momentous return and focus on its five-day
reign thus fulfilled the prediction of the pertinent union foreclosed,
suggests the use of prophecy is guided by factors far more subtly
powerful than one might imagine. Only when something is supposed to
happen will it occur: I doubt incorrect projections and theories about
prophecies actually influence reality to conform to the interpreted
predictions - many fulfilled events have been earthquakes, tornadoes,
accidental plane crashes, and so forth, which were known to not be
consequences of deliberate human action, and sometimes while their
time had not been cautioned about specifically, the details often
compellingly fit some line or verse. Perhaps subconsciously I knew
after determining the final lines of X.45 and VIII.72 would occur
imminently (23 July post about the 21 June total solar eclipse and 23
June Peruvian quake) that this event had a military overthrow aspect
("Conqueror vanquished") which seemed too alarmist a message: too many
recent news items seemed to be in the prophecies, so focusing on the
Sun-Saturn-Node triple conjunct appeared more prudent than looking a
few weeks ahead. Of course it was a mistake to ignore Mars after
Saturn, since my method would have pinpointed the place of the attack
at the time five minutes prior: we can never go back in time, have me
post in August a warning about 11 September's dark [Juno / Mars]
temple (along with the furious retrograded Mars concept), and observe
whether there would be any change. That opportunity to use the
prophecies to save lives by encouraging people to avoid the otherwise
unforseen tragedy is gone forever. Perhaps it was as in III.40, and I
simply tired of tolling the death knell; what is offered are
suggestions, not every solution. We can only go forward, find the
next event, and hope some good may come from the disclosure of genuine
esoteric facts, even though their proof may emerge from horrific
happenings that nonetheless will exist as forseen by this
extraordinary modern prophet (a contention which I am certain will be
less subject to debate as time progresses). By aligning lines of
similar themes to discern consistent applicable scenarios, various
confirmative and revelatory material may be elicited beyond the points
already made, prompting these further observations:
III.92's tardy Saturn fits the August '00 brief reign of Saturn before
it retrograded out then re-entered Gemini 20 April '01...
Le monde proche du dernier periode,
Saturne encore tard sera de retour,
Translat empire devers nation Brodde,
L'oeil arrache a Narbon par Autour.
The world nears the final period,
Saturn will again be late in return,
Empire transmuted towards a nation Prodded,
The eye plucked out at Scar by Auteur.
Old Norse "broddr" spike, Middle English "brodden" goad, prod, related
to Bristled, meaning assuming an aggressive appearance due to
provocation. The Scar is the WTC ruin site; Auteur can mean a
mastermind perpetrator. The eye put out appears again in III.41,
after "Bossu" (Hunchback if translated, though "Bos" in Dutch means
Bush!) is elected by the council - the injury is caused by a "coup
voulant," or flying blow!
The altered nation theme is also in V.45, with another reference (as
VIII.43) to the two unstable things:
Le grand Empire sera tot desole
Et translate pres d'arduenne silue:
Les deux batards par l'aine decolle,
Et regnera Aenobarbe, nez de milve.
The great Empire will soon be desolated
And altered near the ardent silver place:
The two unstable ones at the groin decollared,
And Bronzebeard will reign, hawk-nose on his face.
Not the forest of Ardennes, but a WTC aftermath image as in VI.16 line
3. Removing the circumflex and accent from "aine" makes it groin
instead of elder, an appropriate description of the relative area
struck on each tower, consistent with the "segg" castration of VI.46.
Line 4 could be an attempt to physically describe the perpetrator,
which compares with one having a black and frizzled beard but
subjugates a cruel and proud people through the acquisition of skill
(perhaps flight instruction) in II.79. The military influence the US
has exerted in the Middle East has been a source of resentment,
although a diplomatic resolution appears unattainable when there is
not even an admission of responsibility.
Since Francois 1er was not only king successor to duchy of Orleans,
but of the Angoumois royal house (X.17), he is a possible great king
of Angolmois (X.72) [another translation offered this October]. Both
the Istanbul quake of 1999 (following the July approach of Cassini and
preceding its fly-by by 20.5 hours {and the 13 Jan '01 El Salvador
quake preceded the 15 Jan '01 Stardust spacecraft fly-by - also called
a "gravity assist," these near-Earth manuevers at near-comet speeds
achieve acceleration by slowing the world infinitessimally, but
probably enough to trigger serious quakes}), and the 11 September
assault involved Mars: the quake occurred when the Moon entered
Scorpio, where Mars was in the Grand Cross formation; the attack
arriving at the hypothesized Mercury-Ascendant trigger came before the
ill-fated nullified temple lunar for post-retrograde furiously
reigning Mars. So X.72 could be about two massively lethal events
wherein Mars was the negative influence: Mars in cruel Scorpio in 1999
activated by the Moon (fair Libra and philosophical Sagittarius before
and after); and Mars as an angry King whose reign was too long delayed
in 2001 (the prior and next reigns of Mars more benign).
VIII.67's confusing election won by neither one nor the other came up
earlier - ending with "Steel, Column great protection" now appears
somewhat sardonic of the WTC collapse, if not also referring to some
surviving by finding safety near such vertical structures. It is
unclear whether the overwhelming in sudden ruins of III.39 applies,
having a tempest and Ligurian (Leaguer) coward as source(s).
VIII.34 wherein 7 million perish requires a prior victory of the Lion
over the Lion: this may refer to the 11 August 1999 total solar
eclipse (I.37, V.54) and the 21 January 2000 total lunar eclipse
(VIII.32), since the Moon was in Leo during both - these may be the
two eclipses put into utter route of VIII.15, unless that is for
November 2003, when a total lunar eclipse on the 9th will be followed
by a total solar on the 23rd.
II.94's maritime Lion may not be astrological, but a scriptural
reference to the roaring noisiness of the primary Tribulation event:
the "GREAT Pow" of line 1 receives a timing hint in IV.70, when
reaching Pow ("Pau") the chief (of the world, Satanic Pluto) will come
to hunt (Diana, goddess of the Moon and the Hunt) - 10 June 2002's
Vesta-Pluto temple has Pluto retrograding, coming towards its lunar
aspect.
V.87's year Saturn comes out of bondage could be 2003, with its Trojan
blood remark recalling VI.52's onset of the Trojan expectation, death
born, joined in month "six" - obviously June, with the 10th still in
springtime as II.52 declares, perhaps providing the frightful wind
oddly arriving in springtime (in addition to the usual Winter Solstice
wind) for the great maritime city in IX.48.
The shift from 9 June (IX.38's Agen for St. Vincent) to the 10th makes
a number of possible references to saintly feastdays apparent: VI.60's
deception by monk and preacher ("pretre")for instance - the monk would
be St. Evermund of Fontenay (died 720), a married courtier who built
monasteries and became a monk and abbot (and his wife a nun); the
preacher as Blessed John Dominici de Banchini (1376-1419),
miraculously healed of a speech impediment, happily since he belonged
to the Order of the Preachers. IX.24 may have begun its fulfillment
in 2000 focusing on the 28 May Vesta-Mercury temple (St. Germanus of
Paris' feastday) because of Apoc. 12, 29 May Defenestration of Prague
anniversary, 30 May for St. Joan of Arc as Maid of Orleans, then
suggests passing the Denis cloisters, which should be 3 June for St.
Charles Lwanga and company (first martyr named Denis), but by
pluralizing leaves open the possiblity of a two-year gap, to be
resumed in the final line where "Nonnain, Mallods" (malades?) swallow
raw nuclei. The Nonnain Nun could be Blessed Amata of San Sisto, a
Dominican nun (died 1270); for Malades, or Maladies there is St.
Landericus of Paris (died 661), the bishop who built the city's first
hospital, dedicated to St. Christopher. There is also St. Censurius
of Auxerre (died 486), which figures in IV.84, whose final line about
Mars, Venus and the Sun conglomerating in summer was fulfilled 21 June
2000 -
Un grand d'Auxerre mourra bien miserable,
Chasses de ceux qui sous lui ont ete;
A great one will die quite miserably at Auxerre,
Driven out by those which had been under it
If the great one is the Brookhaven RHIC, its underground circular
accelerator may be the topic.
V.84's shadowy parents could be Vesta and Pluto; taking Rouen and
Evreux as 8 June for Sts. Medard and Elgard might prove useful ("Who
revered the power of the great King will want to destroy through Rouen
and Evreux"), being the day prior to pivotal 9 June.
I.94 has the new Mars through vengeance & remorse, then the Lady
honored through force of terror, thus providing the astrological
scenario linking 11 Sept '01 and 10 June '02: notice Vesta's disaster
does not require a dark temple, since both here and in IX.74 the word
"honor" is used. The 9 June Sun and Saturn conjunct occurs before the
Moon's course is determined by Mercury lunar conjunct, as required by
Preface par. 25, but the associated event itself happens the following
day when Vesta is being honored in a valid (i.e., non-nullified)
temple.
Le nouveau Mars par vindicte et remort,
Dame par force de frayeur honoree
VIII.87 has an effective conspiracy of death, questionable election,
innocent blood and remorse:
Mort conspiree viendra en plein effet,
Charge donnee et voyage de mort;
Elu, cree, recu par siens defait,
Sang d'innocence devant soi par remords.
Death conspired will come into full effect,
Given charge and voyage of death;
Elected, created, received through his own defeat,
Blood of innocence before him for remorse.
Line 2 adequately describes the conspirators' suicidal sabotage
mission aboard hijacked flights.
VIII.85 regards the light being removed for Aquilon -
Entre Bayonne et sainct Iean de Lux
Sera pose de Mars la promotoire;
Aux Hanix d'Aquilon Nanar otera lux,
Puis suffoque au lit sans adjutoire.
Between Bayonne and saint Jean of Light
Will be placed her promontory from Mars;
At the Annex of Aquilon Dwarf will remove light,
Suffocated in bed then lacking assistance.
Taking Bayonne as 18 June (Waterloo battle bayonnets) and St. Jean of
Light as Joan of Arc for 30 May, the middle of this period is 9 June,
the Sun-Saturn conjunct day in 2002. "La promotoire" is incorrect: it
should be "promontoire" and masculine for promontory, or "promotrice"
for a female promoter; Vesta is the next character to watch "from
Mars"' own event 11 Sept '01, with her promontory set up 9 June for
the temple on the 10th. The acknowledgement assistance exists is a
positive comment, indicating correct usage of the prophecies which
could prove life-saving. The Dwarf should be Mercury, reinforcing the
concept of another Mercury-Ascendant trigger.
In VIII.40 vengeance is sought against the Saturnins, with just blood
spilled through Taurus and the Golden, i.e, the Libran scales: the
pairing of Taurus and Libra is ominous also in I.28 - if these are
lunar periods after 10 June, Taurus starts 4 July '02, and Libra 15
July '02.
IX.29 calls for a reprise, or repeat of Quentin and Bales: St. Quentin
for Oct 31 has had two unpleasant events, plane crashes - EgyptAir 990
'99 (V.86), and a Singapore plane '00 (II.17). "Balez" is not for
Calais, but phonetic for English "Bales, as in hay, recalling the
repeating Ceres-Neptune temples late June, early July '00 as in VI.91
- but here there may be another 2-year gap, with the astrological
"bales" ultimately burning June/July 2002. IX.29 begins with the
theme of a dubious leader resigning due to a conglomeration of
overwhelming problems; this may be related to X.32 having a two-reign
for a leader chosen, presumably after the contested election widely
recognized as fulfilling IX.4. So while GWB enjoys tremendous
support, the current crisis being a matter of survival for all
Americans, the manner in which the election was resolved (gift of
VIII.61) played into the awaiting series of quatrains involving
catastrophes and Apocalyptic upheaval (like V.83), although the
relation is not direct. Staying with my original interpretation of
IX.73, the Turbans are deliberately misleading and the subjects are
GWB and WJC: the Byzantium reference for the 1999 Istanbul quake
(during Clinton's presidency), and a reign for the other (of
"ceiulee" ["celui" anagram variant] Turban possibly involving the
issuing of black elite Ranger berets to all armed forces) which does
not surpass a cycle of Saturn (its current Gemini phase which started
20 April ends June 2003) and suggests the grouping of Sun, Mars and
Mercury which occurs 22 July to 6 August 2002.
The asses also wanting Carmany (crimson land) in X.31, could be the
Ishmaelites of the previous line (because of the word "also"), though
the supporters being covered by dirt is yet inscrutable.
The three nights of darkness may be in the prophecies beyond V.83 and
II.52, through the magnanimous deed of Chyren Selin (VIII.54), which
may be in II.79 where Chiron from far away removes all the captives of
the Crescent banner - because 12 June 2002's lunar temple pairs Chiron
and Ceres, that day marking the dissipation of enveloping darkness..
Nancy from X.7 was already solved, since the city has as patron St.
King Sigebert III (631-656), described in X.9 as the surname of one
posthumous like socks' perfume, never a king so horrible in his
province - this is February First, but perhaps 2003 since X.9 has the
sovereign prince born to the infamous woman (Vesta's Apocalyptic
Child) prior in line 2. IV.95 has the war lasting 3 years 7 months
from 11 Sept '01, though its course is not very clear without more
in-depth analysis. The ambush near Parma in V.22 seems to be the same
as that in IX.43. I.91 states that when humans believe they are the
authors of a great conflict, the deities have a greater affliction
prepared, which may be that of the Scepter, as in V.48:
Apres la grande affliction du sceptre,
Deux ennemis par eux seront defaits
After the great allfiction of the scepter,
Both enemies will be defeated by waters
Literally, line 2 has them defeated by each other or themselves, but
if "eux" becomes "eaux," both sides are overcome by waters, fitting
cataclysmic verses like X.6's flood with the Vesta sepulchre fire, and
the basic Anaxagoric revolution notion linked with the Sun-Saturn
event (also coinciding with the Sun-borne Scepter hinted at in
V.24,53).
There are many complex end-time prophecies from various sources: there
are obvious consistencies between them, although there also seem to be
discontinuities requiring resolution; knowledge of these
non-Nostradamian prophecies which could relate to this period remains
a constant subtext in my approach to the current interpretations.
Eagal
Et sera au mois d'Octobre que quelque grande translation sera faite,
et telle que l'on cuidera le pesanteur de la terre avoir perdu son
naturel mouvement, et etre abimee en perpetuelles tenebres, seront
precedents au temps vernail, et s'en ensuivant apres d'extremes
changments, permutations de regnes, par grands tremblements de terre,
avec pullulation de la nueve Babylone, fille miserable augmentee par
l'abomination du premier holocauste, et ne tiendra tant seulement que
septante trois ans, sept mois, puis apres en sortira de la tige celle
qui avait demeure tant longtemps sterile, procedant du cinquantieme
degre, qui renouvellera toute l'Eglise Chretienne. Et sera faite
grande paix, union et concorde entr'uns des enfants des fronts egares,
et separes par divers regnes...
And it will be in the month of October that some great translation
will be made. And it will become such that one will believe the
gravity of the world has lost its natural movement and that it is to
be plunged into the abyss of eternal darkness. There will be
precedents in the springtime [of 2000], and ensuing from them
afterwards extreme changes: alterations in leadership, through great
tremblings of the earth, with the germination of the new Babylon,
miserable maiden augmented through the abomination of the first
holocaust [splitting of atom in December 1938], which will only last
for seventy-three years and seven months [to end in 2012]. In those
times there will issue from the stock which had remained barren for so
long, proceeding from the fiftieth degree, one who will renew the
entire Christian Church. And a great peace will be established, with
union and concord between some of the children of opposite ideas, who
have been separated by diverse realms...
Eagal
PARIS AFTER THE PESTILENCE:
Seeing line 3 of X.72 as another reference to Francois 1er (great King
of Angoumois, the royal house for whom Verrazano originally named NYC)
for a 12 September link to the monstrous events of the prior day
raises the question of why 1999 is mentioned in line 1: the answer may
lie in the full interpretation for the first portion, which indicated
the month the Cassini spacecraft was heading towards Earth for a
gravity-assist fly-by after having orbited Venus - before its arrival
possibly precipitated the devastating Istanbul quake, I used certain
verses with apparent references both to 1999 and Cassini (such as
V.32) to postulate that it would strike NYC with its payload of 72
pounds of plutonium fuel (prematurely applying VI.97 and others I
incorrectly thought related). The suggestion may be that raising
those elements early was the resuscitation of line 3, regarding an
actual disaster in NYC caused by flying craft occurring later: the
haphazard, secretly redundant way the prophecies are offered makes it
difficult to sort out events, especially in cases where the necessary
information is deliberately omitted to manipulate the interpreter. By
the time the pivotal NYC event had occurred, I had developed a method
(lunar temple theory) and rationale (dark temple with Juno and Mars
sought) which would have allowed the reader to pinpoint the attack
time to within five minutes (though these particular calculations were
not made, as also prophesied), as well as finding two lines to be
imminently manifested which described the event cryptically in ways
which became obvious in retrospect and illuminated other related
enigmatic passages (23 July post, based on X.45 & VIII.72 in regards
to the 21 June solar eclipse and 23 June Peruvian quake). So
Nostradamus probably acknowledges in X.72 that it was his intention to
cause an interpreter to assume Cassini would produce destruction like
that of 11 September. The welfare of the new city facing condemnation
is predicted to be foremost on the mind of "the bird of prey for
heaven" in I.24, whose third line goes back to the freeing of the
Kosovo captives in 1999; the "royal bird" makes a nightly augury "Sept
mois devant," before "Sept" month, in V.81.
Aenobarbe (Bronzebeard) as AEmathien (Anathema), the great Ishmael,
Autour (Auteur) and the frizzled black beard (II.79) may be perplexing
when applied to the typical interpretation of V.59 line 9 -
Devers l'Espagne au secours Aenobarbe
Towards Spain Bronzebeard to the rescue
With Spain as Western land, and "au secours" as an interjective
quotation,
Towards the Western land, "Rescue, help! Bronzebeard!"
Bronzebeard reigning in V.45's final line could regard his popularity
in some parts of the world for having accomplished the destruction of
the two unstable things in line 3.
Another reference to the 9 June 2002 Uranus-Pallas temple may exist in
III.4 -
Quand seront proches le defaut des lunaires,
De l'un a l'autre ne distant grandement,
Froid, siccite, danger vers les frontieres,
Meme ou l'oracle a pris commencement.
When they will be near the default of the lunars,
From one to the other no great distance,
Cold, dryness, danger towards coastal frontiers,
Even where the oracle took root to commence.
As stated prior, the Uranus (Heaven) and Pallas (Minerva) characters
(the former being the great grandfather of the latter) will be
post-conjunction, with the Mercury-Ascendant conjunct time (4:25am
EDT) placing the Moon (@ 28,55' Taurus) between aspects with both,
Pallas (@ 29,00' Aquarius) being the last aspect for the Taurus Moon -
thus it is a "near-default" situation, with Uranus @ 28,49' Aquarius
only 11 minutes of a degree from its temple partner. But it is the 10
June 2002 temple (4:22am EDT) which is pinpointed as critical
elsewhere.
Relating the Ishmaelites to the Asses of X.31 because of the word
"also" may not be valid, however if the Saturnin event is an accident
the retaliation in VIII.40 would be an error, while on the other hand
if it is deliberate and also the great affliction of I.91 this does
not comply with the theme of higher beings intervening in a human
conflict. Returning to the great band being sustained in II.59, and
the new (experimental?) band betrayed by "feu eteint" (extinguishing
or consuming fire as in X.6), the 900 scientists working on the
Brookhaven collision physics project still seems most plausible.
Moreover, the Asses relate substantively with the "asiniers"
(ass-drivers) in VI.17 who are burned by "limes" (files or rasps),
which recalls the areas in the RHIC where the opposing loops of
accelerated particles interact, melting gold nuclei sans electrons by
having them strike each other -
Apres les limes brules les asiniers,
Contraint seront changer d'habits divers:
Les Saturnins brules par les meuniers,
Hors la plupart qui ne sera couverte.
After the files burned the ass-drivers,
They will be obliged to change from garbs diverse:
The Saturnins burned by the millers,
Outside, the majority who will not be covered.
The millers are the ass-drivers, only one event is being considered:
one of insufferably great heat, and detrimental to all in the open
air; "Saturnin" is a timing key, as utilized for the Sun-Saturn
conjunct with void of course Moon with the Node making the conjunct
significantly triple (9 June '02 condition).
Comparing 1 Feb in 2002 and 2003, the notable element in the latter
case is that Neptune will be near conjunct with both the Sun and the
Moon, and all three opposing Jupiter: the reference to the great guard
of the great Neptune and his trident soldiers in II.59 could be
related; also V.66 speaks of glittering metals with Sun and Moon after
the vestal ruin of the "aqueduct"; and there are warnings about
Neptune being unfavorable in I.77, II.78, VI.90 which may apply.
As to the virgins of IV.35, perhaps the Vesta-Venus conjunct 23 May
2002 was intended: if the "seuls Rois" means lonely Kings guarding
because VI.36's Night-king as the WTC has been destroyed, these would
be the massive buildings still comprising the NYC skyline; thus
Tuscany and Corsica would be NYC and Long Island; and the lightning
like sword and lance (with a cutthroat metaphor) which arrives by
night would be something further, since 4:22am is nighttime while
8:48am was morning.
Another indication GWB may choose to prematurely end his presidency 25
July to 6 August 2002 (beyond those discussed in X.32, IX.29 and
IX.73) could be in VI.15:
L'Espagnol Roi en Capricorn mince,
Feint et trahi par le grand Vvitemberg
The King of the Western land in Capricorn thins,
Deceived and betrayed by the great Accelerator
Although the quatrain plays off Martin Luther's Protestant declaration
in Wittenberg (and the embrace of his message in Nuremberg), the word
"vite" meaning fast is implied (a particle accelerator, which could
cause the destruction described, is quite plausible). The Capricorn
clue appears a confirmation, and a clarification for IX.73, whose
"Sun, Mars, Mercury" alignment opens a 12-day window, which is
preceded by the Moon leaving Capricorn soon after midnight EDT 24 July
(the condition is met 25 July around noon, when the Moon is nearly 18
degrees into Aquarius) - so 25 July 2002 seems the critical date for
such an announcement, if the 10 June cataclysm has transpired. ("He
must continue a short time," Apoc. 17:10?)
To solve the final line of IX.55, which offers a similar timing hint
with "Mars, Mercury, Jupiter," one must probably look further, since
the first portion speaks of a year of pestilence after the West has
prepared for some horrible war: the Mar-Jupiter conjunct (VI.35?) of 3
July 2002 occurs without the proximity of Mercury; but the stipulation
is met briefly 26 September 2004...
Sang, feu, Mercure, Mars, Iupiter en France
Mercury, Mars, Jupiter: blood, fire in France
Since this is probably a prediction involving the capital city of
Paris, the calculation is in GMT using DST: between the Ceres-Mercury
conjunct around 11:33pm 26 September and the Mars-Jupiter conjunct
12:49am 27 September 2004 the planets will assume the required
relative positions: this is a temporal window of only about an hour
and fifteen minutes!
Eagal
Then will men and women come to the place prepared for them. By their
tongues with which they have blasphemed the way of righteousness will
they be hung up. There is spread out for them unquenchable fire. And
behold again another place: this is a great pit filled, in which are
those who have denied righteousness; and angels of punishment visit
them and here do they kindle upon them the fire of their punishment.
And the murderers and those who have made common cause with them are
cast into the fire, in a place full of venomous beasts, and they are
tormented without rest, as they feel their pains, and their worms are
as numerous as a dark cloud. And the angel Ezrael will bring forth
the souls of them that have been killed and they shall see the torment
of those who killed them, and they shall say to one another,
"Righteousness and justice is the judgement of God. For we have
indeed heard, but did not believe that we would come to this place of
eternal judgement." And near this flame is a great and very deep pit
and into it there flow all kinds of things from everywhere: horrifying
things and excretions...
Ezrael, angel of wrath, brings men and women with the half of their
bodies burning and casts them into a place of darkness, the hell of
men; and a spirit of wrath chastises them with all manner of
chastisement, and a worm that never sleeps consumes their entrails.
These are the persecutors and betrayers of My righteous ones. And
near to those who live thus were other men and women who chew their
tongues, and they are tormented with red hot irons and have their eyes
burned. These are the slanderers and those who doubt My
righteousness. Other men and women, whose deeds were done in
deception, have their lips cut off and fire enters into their mouth
and into their entrails. These are those who slew the martyrs by
their lying...
And near to them still other men and women who were burned and turned
in the fire and were baked. These are they who forsook the way of
God, and followed the abominable path of the devils...
Furthermore the angel Ezrael brings children and maidens to show to
them who are punished. They will be punished with pain, with hanging
up, and with many wounds which flesh-eating birds inflict. These are
they that have confidence in their sins...
--Apocalypse of St. Peter
("Sorry, no virgins and dates!")
Eagal
TWO REDS MAKE CHEER TOGETHER
2003 is being rejected for the ambush scenario, with 2002 more likely
for some complex reasons, but before getting into that and more,
here's something I posted 13 July, 1999:
* * * * * * * * *
Subject: Re: Cassini & Comet Lee
Newsgroups: alt.prophecies.nostradamus
Date: 1999/07/13
The four arms of the conjoined twin of I.58 suggest the Grand Cross,
and
around July 4 Mars and Jupiter slipped into their respective zodiacal
slots, completing three of the four planetary cross components. In
V.99
we have another reference to the four fixed signs in which the Grand
Cross is forming, however here N. substitutes Milan (milano, melano =
dark) for Fossen (ditch or pit), and instead of being concerned with
the
formation of the configuration simply begins with the Scorpio
component
(the most fateful), and continues backwards through the zodiac with
those relating to Leo, Taurus and Aquarius:
Milan, Ferrare, Turin, et Aquilleye,
Capue, Brundis vexes par gent Celtique:
Par le Lion et phalange aquilee,
Quand Rome aura le chef vieux Britannique.
Milan, Ferrara, Turin, and Aquileia,
Capua, Brindisi vexed by the Celtic nation:
By the Lion and eagle's phalanx,
When Rome will have the old British chief.
Capua = cape, hood, cowl => Capitol? Brindisi is an Italian drinking
toast derived from the German phrase, "Ich bring dirs," meaning to
offer
a vessel of refreshment: transmutation of Liberty's torch into an
upheld
overflowing cup may be suggested.
* * * * * * * * *
Yes, the Capitol of the nation and New York City predicted to be vexed
for (not "by") the Celtic nation, after the Grand Cross which was
forming - during the seventh month of 1999! This bears out my theory
that there was a deliberately misleading connection between the
Istanbul quake of 17 August 1999 and the 11 September 2001 attack on
the US completely justifying my confusion while using these
prophecies, and explaining why many of my correct predictions have
been incomplete. Line 3 is the upcoming cataclysm, going "through"
(not "by" - the prepositions are quite flexible) the Lion: the phalanx
may be preparation using prophecy. If line 4's old British chief of
Rome is John Paul II, the nationality should be Polish; perhaps it is
the English chief of V.59 with too long a stay at Nimes (Nemesis,
goddess of divine retribution), with one or neither as the Pope...
VI.22's Nephew of (not "at") London could definitely be New YORK,
named after a city in Great Britain: this placed is murdered or
wounded ("meurtri") during a period of false peace within the
territory of the great celestial temple (first strike five minutes
after central calculation for lunar temple of Mercury-Ascendant).
According to the current speculation, Pluto and Chiron emerge as the
Urn-bearing planets since onset will arrive 10 June 2002 between Vesta
and Pluto lunars, then alleviation will come two days later when
Chiron has its temple lunar: V.41, which idenitifies John Paul II by
his birth during a solar eclipse, declares that his actions result in
his own blood rising in the ancient Urn, apparently concerning his
stopping celebration of the Mass in the Holy Land in November 1999 (an
event paired with the calamity I can only associate with the events of
11 September 2001 in III.97, and empire corrupted with Moon void of
course) - this clearly suggests he will not survive the globally
catastrophic event. Presupposing this lends clarity to the otherwise
random offerings of information, which include temporal jumbling and
contextual shifts.
V.22 starts with the great one of Rome giving up the ghost, though the
next part precedes chronologically, wherein the foreign army is in
great terror ambushed by squadrons near Parma; finally, this will be
followed by the two reds making cheer together. Vesta (red flame) and
Mars (red planet) have already been postulated for the two reds: they
will conjunct 23 June 2002 10am EDT @ 17,23' Cancer. Finding Parma
was more problematic, but St. John of Parma (abbot, died 982)
presented himself as perfect, since his feastday is 22 May, or 5/22,
matching the quatrain's enumeration! 22 May '02 is the time of the
Vesta-Venus conjunct, however regarding IV.35 these are not the
virgins: Venus proved herself the harlot 27 April 2000 (X.8 line 3 as
presaging Apoc. 18:8); thus the presence of the lengthy Minerva-Juno
opposition near the end of which the crucial Vesta lunar occurs 10
June is the likeliest meaning - Juno is the matron, again no virgin,
so the subject should be the simultaneous Vesta lunar and Minervan
opposition at 3:46am EDT 10 June '02. Notice Vesta and Minerva were
in a trine aspect (both at @19,17') 9 August 2000 during that
Chiron-Ceres temple (Mercury-Ascendant conjunct 4:56am EDT), the day
Saturn started its brief reign before retrograding out of Gemini: this
condition was compared to Apoc. 14:14-18, using the Nostradamian
"King" Chiron (VI.70, IV.34) as the crowned figure on the cloud (Moon,
which had last conjuncted Chiron), and Ceres of the harvest asking the
former character to reap; the other pair who gather clusters of the
vine for the winepress were identified as Vesta (due to power over
fire) and Pallas, because of its concurrent aspect. Thus the brief
reign may have been the initial reaping of the Scythe (no Rapture
evident, and that would have been its only time), during which the
Vesta-Pallas aspect was a presage of their participation in the bloody
"winepress" event during the later, complete cycle of Saturn which
began 20 April 2001.
Le Duc voudra les siens exterminer,
Envoyera les plus forts lieux etranges:
Par tyrannie Bize et Luc ruiner,
Puis les Barbares sans vin feront vendanges.
The Duke will want to exterminate his followers,
He will send the strongest to strange places:
Through tyranny to ruin Luck and Pisa-tower,
Then the Barbarians without wine will make vintages.
IX.80's Duke is taken as Mercury, exterminating his followers meaning
disaster when Mercury is at the Ecliptic or Ascendant, with the
tragedies defined as displacing the strongest: line 3 is the first
such instance, using Pisa to summon a Tower image (as explicitly
stated in I.28 only), and Lucca for Luck to indicate the Juno-Fortune
conjunct between the striking of the WTC twin towers (the subject of
II.66) - only the first strike is associated with the Duke Mercury.
Line 4 is the winepress horror of Apoc. 14:19,20 -
"So the angel thrust his sickle into the earth and gathered the vine
of the earth, and threw it into the great winepress of the wrath of
God. And the winepress was trampled outside the city, and blood came
out of the winepress, up to the horses' bridles, for one thousand six
hundred furlongs."
The pair Pisa and Lucca also appear in IX.5, which has already been
connected with the 2000 US election, again with a tyrannical theme -
Tiers doigt du pied au premier semblera
A un nouveau monarch de bas haut,
Qui Pyse et Lucques Tyran occupera
Du precedent corriger le defaut.
Third digit of the foot will seem first
To a new monarch from low high come,
Whose Pisa and Luck a Tyrant will hold accursed,
For correcting the fault his predecessor done.
The first portion was related to Florida being the "foot" of the US,
the Palm Beach county butterfly ballot having Gore's hole in third
position, and his only failing to acquire Florida's electoral votes
through a series of unsavory circumstances (confused and
disenfranchised voters, questionable absentee ballot issues,
temporarily missing ballot boxes, etc.) could have made him seem first
even to GWB. Line 4 may offer the sardonic commentary that such a
disaster occuring during his presidency hardly fulfills the campaign
promise of restoring dignity lost from the failings of the Clinton
administration.
Le circuit de grand fait ruineux,
Le nom septieme du cinquieme sera:
D'un tiers plus grand l'etrange belliqueux,
Mouton, Lutece, Aix ne garantira.
The great ruinous deed of a circuit-ring,
The seventh name from the fifth will be:
From an utmost third the foreign war-mongering,
Sheep, Lettuce, Axe - there will be no guarantee.
II.88's first line suggests the Brookhaven RHIC circular heavy ion
collider accelerator, which should be the means of delivering the
seventh bowl, same concept as the great seventh number in X.74. Line
2 merely indicates that the Sixth bowl is so esoteric an event as to
be unnotable - it should be the "clearing of spiritual light"
Nostradamus wrote of, allowing for comprehension of these cryptic
predictions, thus making the way ready for the Kings of the rising sun
(similar to the role of John the Baptist in the First Coming of
Christ). I have offered the Istanbul quake for the fifth bowl, but
the entire sequence remains mysterious. The third of the
suicidally-flown jets 11 September was the only one to strike a
military target, thus manifesting the third line. As for line 4,
perhaps it has to do with the US being in the unusual position of
planning a potential military retaliation against a nation for whom it
provides food and humanitarian aid.
Vin sur la table en sera repandu,
Le tiers n'aura celle qu'il pretendait;
Deux fois du noir de Parme descendu,
Perouse a Pise fera ce qu'il cuidait.
Wine on the table some will be spilled,
The third will only have that which it claimed;
From Parma two nighttimes descended,
Peru's will do to Pisa that which he believed.
VII.5's "third" seems to be the same, the third plane into the
Pentagon, after the spilling of blood (red wine metaphor) via the pair
assaulting the WTC minutes prior. Parma (22 May 2002) may only be a
time marker with no major event of its own, from which the extended
darkness occurs. This "night of three nights" is written to denote
the end of God's mercy to the wicked, after which the world will be
found to be spinning in the reverse direction. Line 4 could regard
my 23 July post using X.45 and VIII.72 to determine the Peruvian quake
would be followed by their final lines of a conqueror vanquished and a
sturdy wall being struck would be simultaneously fulfilled: as stated,
any successful usage of the prophecies should be part of them.
Having 1 February as the time of the ambush locks it into 2002, since
there is no Vesta-Mars conjunct at the proper time in 2003. Thus a
series of corrections should be made from the previous message.
Neptune's trident soldiers in II.59 are most likely the other planets
within the alignment on 1 February 2002: within 28 degrees will be
Pallas, Mercury, Neptune, Sun, Venus, Ceres, and Uranus; the focus on
Neptune being unfavorable in VI.90 probably suggests the Neptunian
conjunct with the Part of Fortune, which in the critical location
(35N, 70E, +4:30 GMT) would occur locally at 1:15pm. As for V.66, the
vestal edifice and ruined aqueduct should be the explosive outset 10
June 4:22am EDT, beyond which the Sun and Moon will conjunct (New
Moon) with the glittering metals concurrent, as Trajan's lamp engraved
with gold continues to burn: Sun and Moon unite 10 June 7:46pm EDT.
The temple calculation for 1 February '02 (done for NYC as always)
renders Mercury-Ascendant conjunct 6:37am EST, Moon at 1,46' Libra,
void of course between aspects with Vesta @ 28,44' Taurus and Mercury
@ 2,10' Aquarius - a dark temple with the two vestals...
Le fils de Mamon sera elu dans Rome,
Et les deux grands seront mis en defaut
The son of Mammon will be elected in Rome,
And the two greats will be set in default
X.18 line 3 should regard the last papal election according to St.
Malachy, number 111 "Gloria Olivae," Glory of the Olive, which most
people agree indicates Cardinal Martini; Peter the Roman receives no
number in the ominous finale of Malachy's prophecy. Line 4 apparently
concerns the celestial temple conditions the day of the military
ambush which precedes the arrival of the Urn, which also makes the
election of a new pope necessary - so this unexpectedly may work with
V.22, using a fuddled timing hint, since Nostradamus may have been
challenging us to be diligent.
Par le trepas du tres-vieillard Pontife,
Sera elu Romain de bon age,
Qui sera dit que la siege debiffe,
Et long tiendra et de piquant ouvrage.
Through the decease of the Pontiff very old,
A Roman of good age will win election,
Who weakens the see it will be told,
And will hold long and in biting action.
V.56 is probably another prediction of this final papal choice.
The word for decease, "trepas," looks like the English "trespass."
Leur grande cite d'hurlements plaintes et crie,
Castor et Pollux ennemis dans la lice
Their great city with howlings, lamentations and screams,
Castor and Pollux enemies in the arena
Line 3 of II.90 seems to apply to the WTC destruction, especially
since the Moon was void of course in Gemini, whose stars are Castor
and Pollux.
Eagal
* * * * * * * * *
The war beginning without
A normal battle...
Before you can see the Messiah reign...
See -
WORLD
WAR
THREE!
FROGS -
Shall open it!
The world WAR
That will be the Armageddon
WAR...
THE WAR -
Starts -
With a -
Frog demon!
"Starts with a frog -
Trio -
Who're unclean"
Frogs open
War up...
Eagal
& A SIMPLER VERSION
Stating the obvious, the 7 October military action seems to be the
"response to the red" of VI.46, and possibly the shelling of walls
from above when Hercules strikes (the Anathema) in IX.93 line 3.
Since the nation is on alert and the prophecies only vaguely declare
fears are well founded (until the specific events conjectured for
2002), the focus herein will shift elsewhere, towards issues which are
comfortably remote, since they concern future rather than current
events. It is amazing to consider Nostradamus not only saw the
future, but offers us evocative depictions of people in crisis written
in such an intricate manner that he could control genuine future
comprehension: and he did this as a servant of Jesus Christ, modestly
not wishing to even proclaim himself a prophet. Whatever form these
bloody battles and catastrophes take, the result of human activity is
predestined: the Second Coming scenario will somehow save some few
worthy souls from the utter destruction that threatens all life on the
planet. Telling people where they went wrong does not necessarily
change their behaviour: belief comes from within, it cannot be given
through logic. People may want the same things basically, but once
they are indoctrinated with cultural biases and various ideologies
clashes inevitably occur. The mis-application of religion has been
perhaps the most destructive influence on humanity; and pure
Christianity is, in physical terms, so unempowering that one is apt to
revert to some Old Testament doctrine and pretend they are consistent,
to justify the route that seems easier. War seems to be about
hatred, but maybe it is more about doubt: doubt that the enemy
deserves to live, doubt that they can listen to reason, doubt that
they can be trusted. The United States has a spiritual origin: an
angel showed George Washington a vision of the Revolutionary War
outcome, the War Between the States, and even a third crisis
conforming to the current situation. Since the US does not enforce
Christianity or any religious observance it is unlikely to conduct a
crusade, beyond the fact that Christianity is not about Crusades: that
was a papal error recently acknowledged - "Blessed are the peace
makers," etc. It is more about true martyrdom: accepting persecution,
maybe even with some forgiveness, rather than surrendering to a
spiritual lie; not destroying as many who disagree with you as
possible at the expense of your own life, expecting to be forgiven.
And the real power of Christianity, an entirely spiritual ideology,
was never stated to be in this world until the time of the Second
Coming. America may play an integral role in the manifestation of
that end-time scenario, but that can only happen through the will of
God: some codewords for the US have been Aquilon, probably for the
Bald Eagle symbol, the Barbarian Empire, which could refer to a
Judao-Christian-Agnostic combination or other factors, and, notably in
X.31, "Le saint Empire," or Holy Empire - rather than mere
ambivalence, a dichotomous view seems expressed.
Now looking back to VI.19, the first two lines regard Vesta being
engulfed by the true flame, as the Lady who would put the Innocents to
the fire, wherein the Innocents are the casualties at the WTC - and it
is the 11 September 2001 assault which seems mentioned in line 3, but
the subject is a nearby (preceding) event, i.e. the 8 April 2000
Osprey crash, made clear by predicting the knife-wielding man causing
panic at the Seville Good Friday procession in line 4, thirteen days
later.
Six jours l'assaut devant cite donne;
Livree sera forte et apre bataille,
Trois la rendront, et a eux pardonne,
La reste a feu at a sang tranche taille.
Six days the assault before the city given;
A strong and harsh battle will be executing,
Three will render it, and to themselves gave pardon,
The rest to fire and to bloody slicing and cutting.
III.22 turns out to not hinge on the Livree -> Lievre (Hare) anagram
after all, though there seem to be both NYC crises (11 Sept '01 and
projected 10 June '02) presented as a single event, to obscure the
actual sequence while still making valid predictions. Thus line 1
tells us that though the great star burns seven days (II.41), only the
first six affect the city directly. Line 2 seems a connecting
flexible line, while the next clearly recalls the three terrorist
pilots (wrongly) believing themselves absolved as they headed into
their targets; line 4 could regard either the ill-fate of others being
engineered then, or some description of the unexpectedly later
incident in line 1 (it is similar to I.80 line 4, "March, April. May,
June great tearing and clipping").
VI.20's imaginary union of short duration as the 11 Sept '01
Mercury-Ascendant conjunct, and people suffering from the vessels in
line 3 appears the Seventh Bowl affliction: thus in line 2, wherein
some are changed and most reformed, could be the result of the
Warning experience coincident with the explosive cataclysm, a
phenomenon predicted by Garabandal Marian visionaries. Line 4 does
not appear to provide a clue to the demise of Rome, but rather
confirms the notion that the current pope perishes during the Goblet
or Seventh Bowl period, requiring Rome to then have a "new Leopard,"
an odd code for a pope (especially considering the beast of Apoc. 13,
which resembles a leopard with the feet of a bear and mouth of a
lion).
Apparaitra vers le Septentrion,
Non loin de Cancer l'etoile chevelue;
Suze, Sienne, Boece, Eretrion,
Mourra de Rome grand, la nuit disparue.
It will appear towards Ursa Major,
Not far from Cancer the bearded star;
Susa, Siena, Boetia, Eretria,
The great one of Rome will die, the night over.
VI.6 again repeats the theme of a pope dying synchronous with some
significant "night" period ending, although everything up to that
final line had been fulfilled by 7 September 1999. Comet Lee was
discovered in early 1999 when not far from Cancer, with only the Lynx
constellation separating it from Polaris at the end of the Big Dipper.
Boetia is a Greek province including Eretria, which was near the
epicenter of the Athens quake 7 Sept '99, registering 5.9 and killing
143. For the Susa and Siena quakes, 1998 was probably intended: Susa
had a 4.1 on 11 April '98; and Siena a 4.1 on 20 May '98. But the
Athens quake may appear overtly in V.91 -
Au grand marche qu'on dit des mesongers,
Du tout Torrent et champ Athenien,
Seront surpris par les chevaux legers,
Par Albanois Mars, Leo, Sat. un versien.
At the great market where one says they speak lies,
For all the Torrent and field Athenian,
By fickle horses they will be surprised,
For Albany's, Mars, Leo, Saturn one version.
"Torrent" is Latin for seething or parching, and perhaps it regards
the waters between the Greek Isles being disturbed, but there is also
the Torrens system of land title registration using governmental
guarantee (its knighted conceiver died 1884) - so this could be a hint
at the Boetia, Eretria region being considered in VI.6. Line 4 could
be an attempt to delineate the time of the major NYC cataclysm (felt
globally, and in the state capital of course) through the same means
used in IX.55 and IX.73, i.e., order of alignment for three celestial
bodies. In this case, Leo would be substituting for the Sun, which
rules Leo: this again confirms 10 June 2002, since after the
Sun-Saturn conjunct 9 June the requirement is met - at the critical
time, Mars will be @ 8,26' Cancer, Sun @ 19,17' Gemini, and Saturn @
18,34' Gemini.
Barbare empire par le tiers usurpe,
La plupart de son sang mettra a mort;
Par mort senile par lui le quart frappe,
Pour peur que sang par le sang ne soit mort.
Barabarian empire through the third usurped,
It will put to death a majority of its blood;
Through its own doting death the fourth disrupt,
For fear that the blood through the blood be not dead.
III.59's third may again be the third of the hijacked jets striking an
intended target, namely the one crashing into the Pentagon. Because
corraled passengers aboard diverted UA Flight 93 using cell phones had
the opportunity to learn about the WTC (8:48am & 9:06am EDT) and
Pentagon (9:43am EDT) crashes due to the later timing, they realized
national security was at stake and apparently managed to bring the
plane down in a Pennsylvania field without harm to anyone on the
ground (10:10am EDT): this is very likely what lines 3 and 4 are
about, attacking the conspirators for being complicit in the other
horrors of that morning, because the lateness made that part of the
attack uncoordinated.
Eagal
And all will see how I come upon an eternal shining cloud, and the
angels of God who will sit with Me on the throne of My glory at the
right hand of My heavenly Father. He will set a crown upon My head.
As soon as the nations see it, they will weep, each nation for itself.
And He shall command them to go into the river of fire, while the
deeds of each individual one of them stand before them. Recompense
shall be given to each according to his work. As for the elect who
have done good, they will come to Me and will not see death by
devouring fire. But the evil creatures, the sinners and the
hypocrites will stand in the depths of the darkness that passes not
away, and their punishment is the fire, and the angels bring forward
their sins and prepare for them a place wherein they shall be punished
for ever, each according to his offense.
--Apocalypse of Saint Peter
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
Eagal wrote:
> ROME'S NEW LEOPARD;
> & A SIMPLER VERSION
>
> Since the US does not enforce
> Christianity
This is PRECISELY what the United States military is
doing.
Bin Laden has terrorists that follow his orders.
Pat Robertson, Billy Graham, Jack Van Impe and
the Vatican, on the other hand, have the United
States military to follow their orders and probably
the British, the French and the Italians as well,
and maybe even the Germans...
All Christian countries.
All 'marketing' aside, these Christian organizations
MUST deny both the reason that Mohammed was
sent by God as well as the Revelations he received.
They cannot HELP but define Islam as the "anti-
Christ".
Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran,
Column XVII of the "Scroll of the War of the Sons
of Light")
One4Jesus
>
>Pat Robertson, Billy Graham, Jack Van Impe and
>the Vatican, on the other hand, have the United
>States military to follow their orders and probably
>the British, the French and the Italians as well,
>and maybe even the Germans...
>
did not have offices in the Pentagon. Furthermore, to suggest that these
clergymen have sufficient political clout to be in a position to order the U.S.
military into action is not only insane, but an insult to the finest and most
technologically advanced military defense on the planet. It seems to me that
you are another one of the players that simply wants to portray what is going on
in Afghanistan as a Holy War, with the U.S. as the perpetrators. Please, go to
New York and help pull the rotting dead bodies out of the wreckage caused by Bin
Laden and his associates. Get a whiff of decaying flesh and look at the
thousands upon thousands of innocent lives lost, the broken families, the dead
children. Our country is doing its best to recover, and to try to bring the
perpetrators to justice. Either get behind it or move to Afghanistan.
JonJ...@aol.com
says...
> Either get behind it or move to Afghanistan.
Boy, Deja vu. It starts all over - the tired old refrain of
ignorant, short-sighted people:
"Deutschland über alles"
"My country, right or wrong"
"America, love it or leave it"
Dee
(28SW2) Michael Cecil wrote in message <3BC1B4EC...@earthlink.net>...
>
>
>Eagal wrote:
>
>> ROME'S NEW LEOPARD;
>> & A SIMPLER VERSION
>>
>> Since the US does not enforce
>> Christianity
>
>This is PRECISELY what the United States military is
>doing.
>
>Bin Laden has terrorists that follow his orders.
>
>Pat Robertson, Billy Graham, Jack Van Impe and
>the Vatican, on the other hand, have the United
>States military to follow their orders and probably
>the British, the French and the Italians as well,
>and maybe even the Germans...
Then binny is probably dead meat.
Eagal
> Eagal wrote:
>
> > ROME'S NEW LEOPARD;
> > & A SIMPLER VERSION
> >
> > Since the US does not enforce
> > Christianity
>
> This is PRECISELY what the United States military is
> doing.
I disagree. The religious overtones are completely one-sided, casting
the US as a demonic force because of perceived oppression and other
grievances, appealing to a faction that, in the estimation of some
moderate Muslims, perverts their own sacred teachings. It is obvious
the destruction of the WTC is being used precisely as the Frog
prophecy states: a sign to gather around as we've seen in the protests
abroad and the statements. The US does not even want to eliminate the
Taliban, because they represent an important group which cannot be
ignored: but many have hoped the US would intervene for human rights
issues before these events. Special care has been taken with the
meals being dropped so they do not violate the local beliefs: no
enforced contact with unclean animal products, etc. Hardly an attempt
at proselytization.
> Bin Laden has terrorists that follow his orders.
>
> Pat Robertson, Billy Graham, Jack Van Impe and
> the Vatican, on the other hand, have the United
> States military to follow their orders and probably
> the British, the French and the Italians as well,
> and maybe even the Germans...
>
> All Christian countries.
There is a difference between calling oneself a Christian and actually
being a representative of Christ, just as one may falsely claim to be
following any great avatar while acting contrary to their teachings.
The Nazis preached that Jesus was great, but Hitler greater...
> All 'marketing' aside, these Christian organizations
> MUST deny both the reason that Mohammed was
> sent by God as well as the Revelations he received.
If you know the truth, why do you care what they think?
My Master says the blind will lead the blind into a pit -
And that I will fall in too if I push them in!
> They cannot HELP but define Islam as the "anti-
> Christ".
It is not up to them what the Antichrist prophecy manifests as: even
in the Qiyamah only Hadrat Isa (Jesus) can slay him, just like in
John's Revelations. Of course false prophets on both sides try to
whip up the sin of bloodlust in the end-times: the caliber of our
souls is being weighed and tested. In fact, we have heard the exact
opposite from the fundamentalists, who considered it an ideal
opportunity to agree that US society is decadent enough to deserve
such treatment - subsequent outrage prompted a retraction, however.
There is a constant reassurance that the US respects the practice of
Islam and all religions, except when they are defined and practiced
genocidally (the same attitude would be held towards Christians, such
as in Bosnia). Many of the things done in that region have no
religious basis: those enveloping outfits for women came from Indian
gentry circa 1850!
Supporting people being executed wholesale simply because it is
assumed they are predominantly Christian rather than Islamic, one
would think the title of anti-Christ would be readily assumed, by
definition. Whether or not you are affiliated with THE Antichrist may
prove moot, since his purpose may be to mislead a particular group who
would have done right otherwise, with many others already doing the
devil's bidding on their own.
> Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran,
> Column XVII of the "Scroll of the War of the Sons
> of Light")
The modern American public takes a dim view of public executions
whether or not they are mandated in books that are assumed to be of
divine origin, especially when it is their own surprise massive
slaughter...
While NYC does conform to the great city of Babylon prophecy, the
attack on the twin towers was not a new divine retribution against
more Towers of Babel: there simply is a city named Babylon on Long
Island! When an act of God destroys people, it is Fate; when people
destroy each other, it is Iniquity.
I gave advance notice of the 7 October bombings as well, via my
interpretation of IX.93 line 3, walls of the middle class shelled from
above: indeed, there have been some civilian domiciles disturbed, and
we know very little about those casualties. Again, it was possible to
be more specific beforehand using
V.18 -
De deuil mourra l'infelix proflige,
Celebrera son vitrix l'hecatombe,
Pristine loi, franc edit redige,
Le mur et Prince au septieme jour tombe.
In grief the overcome forlorn will die,
He will celebrate his victories, the slaughter,
Pristine law, free edict drawn up,
The wall and Prince fall on the seventh day.
Line 1, WTC attack victims; line 2, taped statement; line 3,
international coalition against terrorism (which also affects Muslim
countries internally); line 4 fulfilled Sunday October Seven 2001,
Car mon anniversaire
N'etait tombe au dimanche puisque onze ans
(Savoir plus pouvez faire
Lisez tout ce que j'ecrit d'un cinq zero)
Anyway, about the "Mars, Leo, Saturn" theory from V.91, notice in the
final line of VI.4 it returns reversed, adding the fact that Mars will
be in Cancer:
Saturne, Leo, Mars, Cancer en rapine
Saturn, Leo, Mars, Cancer in plunder
The Rhine no longer to flow past Cologne, all changed except the old
language...
Again, the US did not seek this crisis, so it is disingenuous to be
proclaiming the insidiousness of its intentions ---
Barbare empire par le tiers usurpe,
La plupart de son sang mettra a mort;
Par mort senile par lui le quart frappe,
Pour peur que sang par le sang ne soit mort.
Barbarian empire through the third usurped,
The majority will put to death its blood;
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
Eagal wrote:
> "(28SW2) Michael Cecil" <mj...@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:<3BC1B4EC...@earthlink.net>...
> > Eagal wrote:
> >
> > > ROME'S NEW LEOPARD;
> > > & A SIMPLER VERSION
> > >
> > > Since the US does not enforce
> > > Christianity
> >
> > This is PRECISELY what the United States military is
> > doing.
>
> I disagree.
Of course you do.
> The religious overtones are completely one-sided, casting
> the US as a demonic force
Pat Robertson casts Islam as a demonic force.
LISTEN to him.
But this is the fundamental implication of Christian
theology even among the 'moderate' Christians:
that Mohammed was at LEAST a LIAR; and, thus,
"in league with Satan".
The doctrines of Christianity--and the specific denial
and rejection of the Revelations received by Mohammed--
are an incitement to violence.
Israel casts Palestinians as a demonic force.
> because of perceived oppression
It is not merely perceived; it is quite real.
> and other
> grievances,
like maybe the slaughter of hundres of thousands of
Iraqi civilians, acting in concert with Saddam Hussein?
> appealing to a faction that, in the estimation of some
> moderate Muslims, perverts their own sacred teachings.
Sure.
> It is obvious
> the destruction of the WTC is being used precisely as the Frog
> prophecy states: a sign to gather around as we've seen in the protests
> abroad and the statements.
But the international media is ACCOMPLISHING this.
Can you not SEE this?
HOW could there be this war without the international media
publicizing the 'RATIONALE' for this war to get people
MOTIVATED to SUPPORT this war? On BOTH sides.
And the Christian religious officials and their accomplice sluts in
the media are involved in this as well.
Even the SECULAR media protects the economic interests of
the whore of Babylon.
> The US does not even want to eliminate the
> Taliban,
Why not?
For the same reason that it did not want to eliminate Saddam
Hussein???????
That it NEEDS a Muslim "anti-Christ" against which to project
its evil and to demonstrate the comparative 'Truth' and 'Light'
of Judaeo-Christianity?
> because they represent an important group which cannot be
> ignored:
So did the Nazis.
> but many have hoped the US would intervene for human rights
> issues before these events. Special care has been taken with the
> meals being dropped so they do not violate the local beliefs: no
> enforced contact with unclean animal products, etc.
And, as a Muslim, I will CERTAINLY remember this, having lost
my wife and children in the bombing. I raise goats for a living.
Why are these people killing MY family?
> Hardly an attempt
> at proselytization.
The Roman church 'proselytized' the Albigensians by EXTERMINATING
them. (And this is how the Serbians recently 'proselytized' the Bosnian
Muslims.)
They could NOT respond to their arguments about the "resurrection of
the dead". The monks sent to 'correct' them in public debates were
regularly TROUNCED by the Albigensian religious leaders.
The only answer: EXTERMINATE them.
NEITHER can the Christian theologians deal effectively with
the Revelations in the Koran.
They NEED their weapons against those who believe those
Revelations, just like the Roman church needed its weapons
against the Albigensians.
>
>
> > Bin Laden has terrorists that follow his orders.
> >
> > Pat Robertson, Billy Graham, Jack Van Impe and
> > the Vatican, on the other hand, have the United
> > States military to follow their orders and probably
> > the British, the French and the Italians as well,
> > and maybe even the Germans...
> >
> > All Christian countries.
>
> There is a difference between calling oneself a Christian and actually
> being a representative of Christ,
Christians follow the doctrines of Paul, which led to the Holocaust
among other things like the Crusades and the witch-burnings and
the Inquisition.
The followers of Jesus believe the Truth about the "resurrection of
the dead"--like the Albigensians.
> just as one may falsely claim to be
> following any great avatar while acting contrary to their teachings.
> The Nazis preached that Jesus was great,
What am I supposed to say to this??
DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH????????????
OF COURSE Jesus was great to the Nazis--Jesus as interpreted by
PAUL.
> but Hitler greater...
>
> > All 'marketing' aside, these Christian organizations
> > MUST deny both the reason that Mohammed was
> > sent by God as well as the Revelations he received.
>
> If you know the truth, why do you care what they think?
Because they do 'not sit quietly in their room'--which, as
Descartes suggested, is the source of all problems in
this world.
They KILL people because of what they believe.
Why do you care what the Nazis think if you know the
truth?
>
> My Master says the blind will lead the blind into a pit -
> And that I will fall in too if I push them in!
And this is PRECISELY where this civilization is going:
to HELL because it has followed the doctrines of these
religious leaders.
And this is what the media publicizes.
>
>
> > They cannot HELP but define Islam as the "anti-
> > Christ".
>
> It is not up to them what the Antichrist prophecy manifests as: even
> in the Qiyamah only Hadrat Isa (Jesus) can slay him, just like in
> John's Revelations.
Truth consumes falsehood.
The Strategy of Allah is CERTAIN.
> Of course false prophets on both sides try to
> whip up the sin of bloodlust in the end-times: the caliber of our
> souls is being weighed and tested.
And this is occurring on BOTH sides of the conflict, aided and
abetted by the REFUSAL of the media to publicize the Truth.
> In fact, we have heard the exact
> opposite from the fundamentalists, who considered it an ideal
> opportunity to agree that US society is decadent enough to deserve
> such treatment - subsequent outrage prompted a retraction, however.
> There is a constant reassurance that the US respects the practice of
> Islam and all religions
SO WHAT????????????
They are LIARS.
Just like the THEOLOGIANS.
I DON'T CARE what the reassurances are.
My personal experience in this matter over 27 years is Reality.
What they say are merely words.
And the experiences of the Iraqis and the Palestinians are
REAL experiences.
OF COURSE Hussein and Arafat are to blame for this; but so
is the United States and Israel.
Experiences simply cannot be contradicted by mere words.
The religious officials have REASSURED us that we will go to HEAVEN
when we die if we believe in Jesus.
The politicians have REASSURED us of their ability to bring Peace
between Israelis and Palestinians...
And just LOOK at the results.
LOOK at them.
There is no REALITY to these reassurances.
They are PIPE dreams.
And MILLIONS of people are going to DIE because of these
pipe dreams.
> , except when they are defined and practiced
> genocidally (the same attitude would be held towards Christians, such
> as in Bosnia).
Then why the F8CK haven't Mladic and Karadzic been brought to justice
so many years later?
The Nazis were brought to justice for slaughtering Jews.
Why can't these Christians be brought to justice for slaughtering
Muslims?
> Many of the things done in that region have no
> religious basis:
Sure.
Tell that to the thousands of Muslim women who were raped.
See if it makes any DIFFERENCE to them.
NITWIT.
> those enveloping outfits for women came from Indian
> gentry circa 1850!
>
> Supporting people being executed wholesale simply because it is
> assumed they are predominantly Christian
But what is the Truth about these Christians?
That they are not followers of Jesus at all, but followers of
Paul.
And the media will NOT publicize this.
> rather than Islamic, one
> would think the title of anti-Christ would be readily assumed, by
> definition.
If the Christians are teaching a doctrine which CONTRADICTS
the Doctrine taught by Jesus, then these Christians are the
anti-Christ.
This is JUST my point.
> Whether or not you are affiliated with THE Antichrist may
> prove moot,
THE anti-Christ is the contradiction of the TRUTH.
Jewish, Christian AND Muslim religious officials fit this
definition...
Along with their witless FOLLOWERS.
> since his purpose may be to mislead a particular group who
> would have done right otherwise, with many others already doing the
> devil's bidding on their own.
>
> > Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran,
> > Column XVII of the "Scroll of the War of the Sons
> > of Light")
>
> The modern American public takes a dim view of public executions
> whether or not they are mandated
SURE they do. (sarcasm)
THEY WATCH THEM ON TELEVISION: CNN, for example.
The Gulf War attacks and now the attacks against Afghanistan.
These are not merely light shows.
People DIE when these bombs and missiles hit...
All brought to you by CNN--the Coliseum (or is it Crusader?)
News Network.
> in books that are assumed to be of
> divine origin, especially when it is their own surprise massive
> slaughter...
You don't have a CLUE what you are talking about.
>
>
> While NYC does conform to the great city of Babylon prophecy,
merely a fractal of the fall of the whore of Babylon.
Just watch.
> the
> attack on the twin towers was not a new divine retribution against
> more Towers of Babel: there simply is a city named Babylon on Long
> Island! When an act of God destroys people, it is Fate; when people
> destroy each other, it is Iniquity.
Well, there is a LOT of iniquity to make recompense for: the LIES of
the religious officials to BEGIN with.
> The Rhine no longer to flow past Cologne, all changed except the old
> language...
>
> Again, the US did not seek this crisis,
And this civilization does not CONSCIOUSLY desire its own exter-
mination EITHER.
But that is what it is accomplishing step by grinding step because
it REFUSES even to LISTEN to the Truth
> so it is disingenuous to be
> proclaiming the insidiousness of its intentions ---
Its intention is to preserve Judaeo-Christianity even to the
extermination of this ENTIRE civilization.
This is its intention.
And this will become more and more clear as the days go
on.
But it will NOT become clear enough in time to STOP this.
Hyperion Cloud
"(28SW2) Michael Cecil" <mj...@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:3BC580E5...@earthlink.net...
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
Hyperion Cloud wrote:
Mohammed received his visions from the archangel Gabriel. If he had indeed received the messages, he had not other way to validate the true identity of the "vision". Gabriel or Lucifer... who knows?
Precisely.
And EXACTLY the same thing can be said of Moses, Isaiah, Ezekiel,
Daniel and Jesus.
According to the Koran, one must NOT "distinguish between the
prophets" because they all received Revelations from God.
Those who deny the Revelations received by Mohammed are
simultaneously denying the Revelations received by Jesus and
Isaiah and Moses.
It is only when the human intellect and conditioning enter into
consideration that you get three separate religious created by
people motivated NOT by the love for Truth but by GREED and
the lust for POWER.
THIS is the source of the problem of violence and terrorism in
the Middle East.
Eagal
"(28SW2) Michael Cecil" <mj...@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:<3BC580E5...@earthlink.net>...
> Eagal wrote:
>
> > "(28SW2) Michael Cecil" <mj...@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:<3BC1B4EC...@earthlink.net>...
> > > Eagal wrote:
> > >
> > > > ROME'S NEW LEOPARD;
> > > > & A SIMPLER VERSION
> > > >
> > > > Since the US does not enforce
> > > > Christianity
> > >
> > > This is PRECISELY what the United States military is
> > > doing.
> >
> > I disagree.
>
> Of course you do.
Your insults will be ignored.
> > The religious overtones are completely one-sided, casting
> > the US as a demonic force
>
> Pat Robertson casts Islam as a demonic force.
>
> LISTEN to him.
Why should I listen to someone like him? I already said false
prophets on both sides would whip up the sin of bloodlust (perhaps
like yourself!)
> But this is the fundamental implication of Christian
> theology even among the 'moderate' Christians:
> that Mohammed was at LEAST a LIAR; and, thus,
> "in league with Satan".
At some point you have to define morality, which is where most
reasonable people would agree these "Students" failed: no music,
laughter, no technology - what would the penalty be for using a
computer? You would wind up in what the world hoped would be used as
a soccer stadium, just like the moderate Muslim world, if the
extremists excel in delivering wholesale death.
> The doctrines of Christianity--and the specific denial
> and rejection of the Revelations received by Mohammed--
> are an incitement to violence.
>
> Israel casts Palestinians as a demonic force.
I've already made my comments essentially declaring all messages
except those from Jesus Christ suspect - even though I use Nostradamus
my allegiance is with the One (NOT Saul of Tarsus, co-murderer of St.
Stephen!)
> > because of perceived oppression
>
> It is not merely perceived; it is quite real.
Of course it is: an endless cycle of violence that only the devil
wanted - neither side is "blessed" by this, but by the eventual true
peace alone.
> > and other
> > grievances,
>
> like maybe the slaughter of hundres of thousands of
> Iraqi civilians, acting in concert with Saddam Hussein?
Like I supported the Gulf War or this current military debacle, when
all I've done is attempt to give a voice to the dead seer the readers
here are supposed to be interested in. But it is so much easier to
spout venomous political rhetoric disguised as religious speech. I
would be the FIRST to want the US out of Saudi Arabia, and the LAST to
propose military responses with collateral damage of any kind. I have
no significant solutions or opinions, only allusions to prophecies I
did not write and possibly do not understand either.
> > appealing to a faction that, in the estimation of some
> > moderate Muslims, perverts their own sacred teachings.
>
> Sure.
Useless sarcasm.
> > It is obvious
> > the destruction of the WTC is being used precisely as the Frog
> > prophecy states: a sign to gather around as we've seen in the protests
> > abroad and the statements.
>
> But the international media is ACCOMPLISHING this.
>
> Can you not SEE this?
>
> HOW could there be this war without the international media
> publicizing the 'RATIONALE' for this war to get people
> MOTIVATED to SUPPORT this war? On BOTH sides.
You are stating this as if I had not. Is that logical?
> And the Christian religious officials and their accomplice sluts in
> the media are involved in this as well.
>
> Even the SECULAR media protects the economic interests of
> the whore of Babylon.
And of course people who make women illiterate and so blinded they get
hit by cars and beat them and shoot them and stone them have no stench
before God in your twisted estimation. A free culture is only
threatening to tyrants. People cannot reach heaven with hatred, rape,
oppression and murder, even if they insist it is promised, just like
the Israelites thought God promised them the land of Chanaan. Trying
to make that lie a truth was a mistake.
And what about being obedient to leaders? Is there anything like that
in the Islamic faith? What the leaders want does not matter to these
fringe groups: they want to overthrow, then fight amongst each other,
with the winner establishing a tyranny. I can understand the hatred
for the improper actions done by various US administrations, but what
if all these ostensibly religiously zealous people doom themselves by
applauding carnage of innocent people - "What profit it a man to gain
the whole world, but suffer the loss of his own immortal soul?"
> > The US does not even want to eliminate the
> > Taliban,
>
> Why not?
>
> For the same reason that it did not want to eliminate Saddam
> Hussein???????
There has to be a representative to arrange for peace, a formal
matter.
Hussein agreed to some things he has not always done, but I know
little about it. The subject here again is prophecy, not politics or
religion that is bereft of prophetic content.
> That it NEEDS a Muslim "anti-Christ" against which to project
> its evil and to demonstrate the comparative 'Truth' and 'Light'
> of Judaeo-Christianity?
I can assure you the Antichrist of Revelations is NOT Muslim, without
elaborating further. I also disputed the existence of
Judao-Christianity, since they are diametric opposites ideologically.
> > because they represent an important group which cannot be
> > ignored:
>
> So did the Nazis.
You seem to just enjoy being argumentative. The point is some remnant
of the Taliban must remain to facilitate stabilization when the
conflict ends.
> > but many have hoped the US would intervene for human rights
> > issues before these events. Special care has been taken with the
> > meals being dropped so they do not violate the local beliefs: no
> > enforced contact with unclean animal products, etc.
>
> And, as a Muslim, I will CERTAINLY remember this, having lost
> my wife and children in the bombing. I raise goats for a living.
> Why are these people killing MY family?
I cannot believe your story (since you would be killed for using such
a wicked piece of technology as a computer), but you do realize when
your country commits an act of war, even upon a hated superpower
through independent guests which provide financial support, the odds
of such a thing happening are quite high - this is thought to be a
disincentive towards sponsoring massacres from a strategic base, which
also happens to be home to civilians who for whatever reason chose to
remain despite fair warning. The military claim to do their best to
limit civilian casualties, but they would not have the orders to
attack if there had been no 11 September assault - and they don't
think the bombs are going to bring anybody to Jesus, either.
> > Hardly an attempt
> > at proselytization.
>
> The Roman church 'proselytized' the Albigensians by EXTERMINATING
> them. (And this is how the Serbians recently 'proselytized' the Bosnian
> Muslims.)
So the Pope is your next target? He's old, don't bother.
> They could NOT respond to their arguments about the "resurrection of
> the dead". The monks sent to 'correct' them in public debates were
> regularly TROUNCED by the Albigensian religious leaders.
>
> The only answer: EXTERMINATE them.
A lesson you seem to have learned in absence of all others, with your
intractable hostility and strident partyline pounding. Your
statements have nothing to do with recent events, so I will digress
too, more relevantly...
You know this western tune?- "I used to be cruel to my woman, I beat
her and kept her apart from the things that she loved: man, I was
mean..."
No decent American wanted any innocent person to suffer torture or
execution, and there is nothing we can do about it, because all some
people want to focus on is the negatives and how they were wronged,
rather than how they themselves are culpable and reject peaceful
overtures. Maybe they should have just dropped money with the food
instead, or beefed up security like other countries facing this
problem. The decision rested with one man, not myself.
> NEITHER can the Christian theologians deal effectively with
> the Revelations in the Koran.
You don't seem interested in discussing anybody's Revelations, only
your own biased political views based in theocratic history. Perhaps
they don't deal with them because haven't read the Koran, being
Christian.
> They NEED their weapons against those who believe those
> Revelations, just like the Roman church needed its weapons
> against the Albigensians.
Again with the Roman Church! Look, they probably assassinated John
Paul I, and you can see that in the verses, but your obsession is off
topic!
> > > Bin Laden has terrorists that follow his orders.
> > >
> > > Pat Robertson, Billy Graham, Jack Van Impe and
> > > the Vatican, on the other hand, have the United
> > > States military to follow their orders and probably
> > > the British, the French and the Italians as well,
> > > and maybe even the Germans...
> > >
> > > All Christian countries.
> >
> > There is a difference between calling oneself a Christian and actually
> > being a representative of Christ,
>
> Christians follow the doctrines of Paul, which led to the Holocaust
> among other things like the Crusades and the witch-burnings and
> the Inquisition.
I never said the people who call themselves Christians are the elect
of Christ: in fact the exact opposite was intimated - when separated
into wicked goats and faithful sheep EACH SIDE IS SURPRISED by the
Judgement. Many will say "Lord, Lord" and find Jesus saying He never
knew them: N. wrote of a renewal of the Christian Church, for what
that's worth to you.
> The followers of Jesus believe the Truth about the "resurrection of
> the dead"--like the Albigensians.
Believing in one tenet or another may cause schisms, with factions
splitting and accusations of heresy, but in the end there is only the
Truth of whether you as an individual have been Righteous or Wicked -
if you are following false instructions, you will be striving to be as
wicked as possible in order to please your false deity.
> > just as one may falsely claim to be
> > following any great avatar while acting contrary to their teachings.
> > The Nazis preached that Jesus was great,
>
> What am I supposed to say to this??
>
> DUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH????????????
So you think Hitler and Jesus are synonymous?!
It was a great lie that Hitler claimed his ruthless, depraved movement
would usher in the Millennial Reign of the Saints: they co-opted
Christianity to mobilize a fascist ideology that was as far removed
from Christ's teachings as conceivable, yet they had to use the name
of Jesus falsely to sell the nightmare. If they had been Islamic,
another name would be used.
> OF COURSE Jesus was great to the Nazis--Jesus as interpreted by
> PAUL.
The Nazis didn't follow any kind of Christianity: St. Paul wrote of
charity!
The Nazi idea of charity was giving the toys of slaughtered Jewish
children to German children!
> > but Hitler greater...
> >
> > > All 'marketing' aside, these Christian organizations
> > > MUST deny both the reason that Mohammed was
> > > sent by God as well as the Revelations he received.
> >
> > If you know the truth, why do you care what they think?
>
> Because they do 'not sit quietly in their room'--which, as
> Descartes suggested, is the source of all problems in
> this world.
>
> They KILL people because of what they believe.
So now you announce to the world that the KILLERS we must denounce are
the "Christian organizations" that are not preaching Islam (which
would include all of them I suppose)! While those girls are wondering
whether they will be executed for having an illustrated book of Bible
stories!! You should think about how long you would last as a
COMPUTER-USER!!
> Why do you care what the Nazis think if you know the
> truth?
>
> >
> > My Master says the blind will lead the blind into a pit -
> > And that I will fall in too if I push them in!
>
> And this is PRECISELY where this civilization is going:
> to HELL because it has followed the doctrines of these
> religious leaders.
Some people believe in bringing hell to earth to get to heaven, and it
doesn't work that way. You get back what you send out. Whatever you
did to other people is what you will experience forever. If you
support people being killed, it is as if you killed them karmically,
believe it or not. And what someone else does in your name does not
automatically transfer to you: you must own it, so there really are
innocent people among those you would widely condemn.
> And this is what the media publicizes.
>
> > > They cannot HELP but define Islam as the "anti-
> > > Christ".
> >
> > It is not up to them what the Antichrist prophecy manifests as: even
> > in the Qiyamah only Hadrat Isa (Jesus) can slay him, just like in
> > John's Revelations.
>
> Truth consumes falsehood.
>
> The Strategy of Allah is CERTAIN.
The "strategy" of spreading death by whatever means? That is the
devil's strategy come into all our lives, but you may follow it at
your eternal peril.
> > Of course false prophets on both sides try to
> > whip up the sin of bloodlust in the end-times: the caliber of our
> > souls is being weighed and tested.
>
> And this is occurring on BOTH sides of the conflict, aided and
> abetted by the REFUSAL of the media to publicize the Truth.
What Truth?! That when women show their hair at home men should be
beaten for not controlling them? There is no Truth amidst torture and
terror.
> > In fact, we have heard the exact
> > opposite from the fundamentalists, who considered it an ideal
> > opportunity to agree that US society is decadent enough to deserve
> > such treatment - subsequent outrage prompted a retraction, however.
> > There is a constant reassurance that the US respects the practice of
> > Islam and all religions
>
> SO WHAT????????????
>
> They are LIARS.
>
> Just like the THEOLOGIANS.
>
> I DON'T CARE what the reassurances are.
>
> My personal experience in this matter over 27 years is Reality.
>
> What they say are merely words.
Right, this is all a plan to Christianize the Muslim world: you're so
clever, you figured it out all by yourself. Western programs get
better ratings than the mosque prayers on Saudi TV, hypocrite!!
> And the experiences of the Iraqis and the Palestinians are
> REAL experiences.
Everyone else must be hallucinating then...
> OF COURSE Hussein and Arafat are to blame for this; but so
> is the United States and Israel.
If you can dole out blame, perhaps you know who is responsible...
> Experiences simply cannot be contradicted by mere words.
>
> The religious officials have REASSURED us that we will go to HEAVEN
> when we die if we believe in Jesus.
Well they lied, because they don't really KNOW anything about the next
world except by faith; but I can tell you plotting terrorist activity
for whatever reason is NOT the path of Light.
> The politicians have REASSURED us of their ability to bring Peace
> between Israelis and Palestinians...
How else can they justify their positions?
> And just LOOK at the results.
>
> LOOK at them.
(You needed an exclamation point there, hothead!)
> There is no REALITY to these reassurances.
>
> They are PIPE dreams.
Make a better reality. Stop blaming everybody else. Be positive.
Spread love, not hate. Forget religion if it brings hatred into your
heart. Remember Love.
> And MILLIONS of people are going to DIE because of these
> pipe dreams.
Physical death is horrible, but spiritual death is much worse and
forever.
> > , except when they are defined and practiced
> > genocidally (the same attitude would be held towards Christians, such
> > as in Bosnia).
>
> Then why the F8CK haven't Mladic and Karadzic been brought to justice
> so many years later?
The US would not be acting now were it not for the attack: they would
have allowed these people to torture and kill and fight each other,
because no one invited them to interfere - an act of war changed that.
If the US had stayed after helping them defeat the Russians, the
region would not have descended into anarchy and tyranny: when they
leave it is a mistake, when they act militarily it builds rancor. The
US is not the world's policeman: GWB campaigned as an isolationist,
and would have probably pulled forces back without this scenario
unfolding.
> The Nazis were brought to justice for slaughtering Jews.
>
> Why can't these Christians be brought to justice for slaughtering
> Muslims?
This is just venting; you ignore Bosnia to advance your point.
> > Many of the things done in that region have no
> > religious basis:
>
> Sure.
>
> Tell that to the thousands of Muslim women who were raped.
>
> See if it makes any DIFFERENCE to them.
>
> NITWIT.
The women have no rights according to the religious interpretation, so
no one cares whether they accept the justification. Tyrants do not
have to make scholarly arguments, just exert sufficient force. The
scripture is just used as an excuse for performing the evil within the
heart (like your insults display).
> > those enveloping outfits for women came from Indian
> > gentry circa 1850!
> >
> > Supporting people being executed wholesale simply because it is
> > assumed they are predominantly Christian
>
> But what is the Truth about these Christians?
They were at work, performing a function for society, then they knew
they would never see their homes and loved ones again, as they were
cooked alive, then crushed to death. Your lack of compassion is
chilling.
> That they are not followers of Jesus at all, but followers of
> Paul.
Who are you to say what they believed?! You never spoke to ANY of
them!!
> And the media will NOT publicize this.
Well their docket is so full, what with all the Anthrax outbreaks: the
"major story" of the religious persuasions of the corpses is left to
great journalists like yourself! (There's MY sarcasm!)
> > rather than Islamic, one
> > would think the title of anti-Christ would be readily assumed, by
> > definition.
>
> If the Christians are teaching a doctrine which CONTRADICTS
> the Doctrine taught by Jesus, then these Christians are the
> anti-Christ.
>
> This is JUST my point.
The Antichrist is the current incarnation of Judas Iscariot/ Cain -
that's all, folks... You latch onto one concept and run it into the
ground with your hateful ignorance. He institutes a blasphemy against
the Holy Spirit, but that is only to mislead the elect: the rest have
no salvation to steal away...
> > Whether or not you are affiliated with THE Antichrist may
> > prove moot,
>
> THE anti-Christ is the contradiction of the TRUTH.
Wrong. It's a specific prophecy, just like the Nostradamus quatrains
you obviously cannot deal with that accurately foretell our future as
shown.
> Jewish, Christian AND Muslim religious officials fit this
> definition...
>
> Along with their witless FOLLOWERS.
So you're just an equal opportunity faith-hater?
What a waste of time to respond to you!
> > since his purpose may be to mislead a particular group who
> > would have done right otherwise, with many others already doing the
> > devil's bidding on their own.
> >
> > > Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran,
> > > Column XVII of the "Scroll of the War of the Sons
> > > of Light")
> >
> > The modern American public takes a dim view of public executions
> > whether or not they are mandated
>
> SURE they do. (sarcasm)
Well they don't fill a soccer stadium every week...
> THEY WATCH THEM ON TELEVISION: CNN, for example.
Oh, people watch the news when there's war on! Stop the presses!!
> The Gulf War attacks and now the attacks against Afghanistan.
> These are not merely light shows.
>
> People DIE when these bombs and missiles hit...
And people die when terrorism and tyranny take root in hell on earth.
If you have a better solution, the world is waiting for your wisdom...
> All brought to you by CNN--the Coliseum (or is it Crusader?)
> News Network.
So you're not taking the job they offered you as correspondent?
> > in books that are assumed to be of
> > divine origin, especially when it is their own surprise massive
> > slaughter...
>
> You don't have a CLUE what you are talking about.
Do you have a clue what sanity is?
> > While NYC does conform to the great city of Babylon prophecy,
>
> merely a fractal of the fall of the whore of Babylon.
>
> Just watch.
Give us the date of what you're planning: with you here, we don't need
the prophecies!
> > the
> > attack on the twin towers was not a new divine retribution against
> > more Towers of Babel: there simply is a city named Babylon on Long
> > Island! When an act of God destroys people, it is Fate; when people
> > destroy each other, it is Iniquity.
>
> Well, there is a LOT of iniquity to make recompense for: the LIES of
> the religious officials to BEGIN with.
Yeah, you start on those, Einstein...
> > The Rhine no longer to flow past Cologne, all changed except the old
> > language...
> >
> > Again, the US did not seek this crisis,
>
> And this civilization does not CONSCIOUSLY desire its own exter-
> mination EITHER.
I have trouble believing you are legitimate...
Please do not read any of my further prognostications, since the
recent events have clearly left you dangerously unbalanced! (I'm not
kidding, either)
> But that is what it is accomplishing step by grinding step because
> it REFUSES even to LISTEN to the Truth
>
> > so it is disingenuous to be
> > proclaiming the insidiousness of its intentions ---
>
> Its intention is to preserve Judaeo-Christianity even to the
> extermination of this ENTIRE civilization.
>
> This is its intention.
>
> And this will become more and more clear as the days go
> on.
>
> But it will NOT become clear enough in time to STOP this.
>
> Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran, Column
> XVII of the "Scroll of the War of the Sons of Light")
I can understand your concerns, but please cease your intrusions on
this thread, which is intended to provide a public service for the
free world.
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
> Your insults will be ignored.
Hold it.
WHY is this an insult?
I was merely validating your statement.
>
>
> > > The religious overtones are completely one-sided, casting
> > > the US as a demonic force
> >
> > Pat Robertson casts Islam as a demonic force.
> >
> > LISTEN to him.
>
> Why should I listen to someone like him?
Because, apparently, you do not clearly see that the politicians
in the United States have developed a THEOLOGICAL des-
cription of this conflict rather than a political description.
And this theological description has been expropriated
from the reigning theological paradigm, which, in the United
States, is Christianity.
When the people in the United States say "God bless
America", they are talking about the CHRISTIAN God.
> I already said false
> prophets on both sides would whip up the sin of bloodlust (perhaps
> like yourself!)
What an unbelievably outrageous statement this is.
For more than 25 years I have attempted to DEFUSE this
now emergent conflict between Islamic civilization and
Judaeo-Christian civilization, and you have the audacity
to imply that violence is my goal here.
Just off scale, on-beyond-zebra BIZARRE.
> > But this is the fundamental implication of Christian
> > theology even among the 'moderate' Christians:
> > that Mohammed was at LEAST a LIAR; and, thus,
> > "in league with Satan".
>
> At some point you have to define morality,
Nah.
I think Moses did a good enough job.
Not going to 'reinvent the wheel' here.
It's not my job.
>
> > Israel casts Palestinians as a demonic force.
>
> I've already made my comments essentially declaring all messages
> except those from Jesus Christ suspect
And you don't see any problem with this?
I would reply that you don't even take the statements of
Jesus seriously.
> - even though I use Nostradamus
> my allegiance is with the One (NOT Saul of Tarsus, co-murderer of St.
> Stephen!)
>
> > > because of perceived oppression
> >
> > It is not merely perceived; it is quite real.
>
> Of course it is: an endless cycle of violence that only the devil
> wanted - neither side is "blessed" by this, but by the eventual true
> peace alone.
>
> > > and other
> > > grievances,
> >
> > like maybe the slaughter of hundres of thousands of
> > Iraqi civilians, acting in concert with Saddam Hussein?
>
> Like I supported the Gulf War or this current military debacle, when
> all I've done is attempt to give a voice to the dead seer the readers
> here are supposed to be interested in. But it is so much easier to
> spout venomous political rhetoric disguised as religious speech. I
> would be the FIRST to want the US out of Saudi Arabia, and the LAST to
> propose military responses with collateral damage of any kind.
Well, GOOD.
Then we are more in agreement than I had assumed.
> I have
> no significant solutions or opinions, only allusions to prophecies I
> did not write and possibly do not understand either.
Well, you are honest here.
>
> > > appealing to a faction that, in the estimation of some
> > > moderate Muslims, perverts their own sacred teachings.
> >
> > Sure.
>
> Useless sarcasm.
No it isn't.
I was merely acknowledging my agreement.
Maybe I should have said:
"Yes, I agree with this. This DOES pervert the Teachings
of Islam".
Is that better?
> > HOW could there be this war without the international media
> > publicizing the 'RATIONALE' for this war to get people
> > MOTIVATED to SUPPORT this war? On BOTH sides.
>
> You are stating this as if I had not. Is that logical?
>
> > And the Christian religious officials and their accomplice sluts in
> > the media are involved in this as well.
> >
> > Even the SECULAR media protects the economic interests of
> > the whore of Babylon.
>
> And of course people who make women illiterate and so blinded they get
> hit by cars and beat them and shoot them and stone them have no stench
> before God in your twisted estimation.
WHERE is the evidence that I would think any such thing?
WHERE?
WHERE have I run to the defense of the Muslim religious officials
for their PERVERSION of the Revelations in the Koran?
What they do to women is horrific.
A few years ago I wrote a note about what is euphemistically
called 'female circumcision'.
It is BUTCHERY.
> A free culture is only
> threatening to tyrants.
Which is WHY the media in the United State will not
ALLOW the Truth to be publicized or broadcast.
The Christian religious establishment is a blood-
thirsty TYRANNY in the United States.
When the Prophecies I have received are fulfilled,
people will begin to see just HOW blood-thirsty
it is.
Tyrannies DEPEND upon censorship.
Look at Saddam Hussein and Milosevic.
And Pat Roberston.
They could not SURVIVE the publishing of
the Truth.
> People cannot reach heaven with hatred, rape,
> oppression and murder, even if they insist it is promised, just like
> the Israelites thought God promised them the land of Chanaan. Trying
> to make that lie a truth was a mistake.
My agreement and disagreement with these statements would be
too lengthy to go into at this point.
> And what about being obedient to leaders? Is there anything like that
> in the Islamic faith? What the leaders want does not matter to these
> fringe groups: they want to overthrow, then fight amongst each other,
> with the winner establishing a tyranny. I can understand the hatred
> for the improper actions done by various US administrations, but what
> if all these ostensibly religiously zealous people doom themselves by
> applauding carnage of innocent people - "What profit it a man to gain
> the whole world, but suffer the loss of his own immortal soul?"
You seem to think that I am JUSTIFYING the actions of these evil
people.
I wonder WHERE you get the evidence for this.
>
>
> > > The US does not even want to eliminate the
> > > Taliban,
> >
> > Why not?
> >
> > For the same reason that it did not want to eliminate Saddam
> > Hussein???????
>
> There has to be a representative to arrange for peace, a formal
> matter.
> Hussein agreed to some things he has not always done, but I know
> little about it. The subject here again is prophecy, not politics or
> religion that is bereft of prophetic content.
>
> > That it NEEDS a Muslim "anti-Christ" against which to project
> > its evil and to demonstrate the comparative 'Truth' and 'Light'
> > of Judaeo-Christianity?
>
> I can assure you the Antichrist of Revelations is NOT Muslim
ANYONE who LIES about Revealed Truth is the anti-Christ.
And, in that sense, Islam is no less the anti-Christ than is
Judaeo-Christianity.
Because the Muslim religious officials LIE about their Revelations
to the same degree that the Jewish and Christian religious officials
LIE about their Revelations.
In any case, this is an analysis resulting from looking at American
foreign policy and its UNCONDITIONAL support of Israel.
America ACTS as if the anti-Christ is EXCLUSIVELY Muslim.
> , without
> elaborating further. I also disputed the existence of
> Judao-Christianity, since they are diametric opposites ideologically.
>
> > > because they represent an important group which cannot be
> > > ignored:
> >
> > So did the Nazis.
>
> You seem to just enjoy being argumentative.
I don't know HOW there could be compromise with people
as EVIL as the Taliban are.
This is all that I am saying.
There was no compromise with the Nazis in Europe
after the war.
The Taliban represent the same kind of evil if what is
reported about them is correct.
> The point is some remnant
> of the Taliban must remain to facilitate stabilization when the
> conflict ends.
Then they would have to be completely OTHER than the
Taliban in my estimation.
If you listen to these people they are NOT in a compromising
mood. Iran does not LIKE them. But they do not care about
what Iran likes or does not like. They are not exactly rational
people.
> > And, as a Muslim, I will CERTAINLY remember this, having lost
> > my wife and children in the bombing. I raise goats for a living.
> > Why are these people killing MY family?
>
> I cannot believe your story
I would surmise that it is factualy correct...
Although it happened to someone WITHOUT access to
the Internet.
>(since you would be killed for using such
> a wicked piece of technology as a computer)
I am merely trying to put this into a more human context.
It is reported that Bin Laden uses a computer.
HOW could this then be considered WICKED?
> , but you do realize when
> your country commits an act of war, even upon a hated superpower
> through independent guests which provide financial support, the odds
> of such a thing happening are quite high - this is thought to be a
> disincentive towards sponsoring massacres from a strategic base, which
> also happens to be home to civilians who for whatever reason chose to
> remain despite fair warning.
A genuinely incredible expression of 'newspeak'.
> The military claim to do their best to
> limit civilian casualties, but they would not have the orders to
> attack if there had been no 11 September assault - and they don't
> think the bombs are going to bring anybody to Jesus, either.
KILLING these people will NOT solve the problem.
The problem is at the level of Doctrinal Truth and
consciousness.
Unless the problem is solved at THAT level, all of
this bloodshed is completely USELESS.
>
> > > Hardly an attempt
> > > at proselytization.
> >
> > The Roman church 'proselytized' the Albigensians by EXTERMINATING
> > them. (And this is how the Serbians recently 'proselytized' the Bosnian
> > Muslims.)
>
> So the Pope is your next target? He's old, don't bother.
>
The DOCTRINES Christianity teaches are a target.
What GOOD would it do to kill ANYONE who is the purveyor
of a DOCTRINE?
The person may die, but the LIES of that doctrine will continue
and will result in MORE bloodshed years from now.
> A lesson you seem to have learned in absence of all others, with your
> intractable hostility and strident partyline pounding.
My hostility is for LIES and for those who teach LIES.
My goal is to exterminate LIES.
> No decent American wanted any innocent person to suffer torture or
> execution, and there is nothing we can do about it,
This is simply not the Truth.
Anyone can QUESTION what he is told by his religious leaders.
QUESTION whether it is the Truth or not.
One can QUESTION one's media about why it has CENSORED
and suppressed the Truth.
One can QUESTION one's political leaders about WHY they
disregard the theological foundation of this conflict.
> because all some
> people want to focus on is the negatives and how they were wronged,
> rather than how they themselves are culpable and reject peaceful
> overtures.
Then WHY do the religious officials reject the Truth when it is
told to them; and why do the media officials refuse to publish
the Truth when it is presented to them?
> You don't seem interested in discussing anybody's Revelations, only
> your own biased political views based in theocratic history. Perhaps
> they don't deal with them because haven't read the Koran, being
> Christian.
Then read the argument of Jesus about the "resurrection of the
dead" and his PROPHECY that Elijah would return...
Or read about his statement that John was Elijah 'raised from
the dead'.
This is the fundamental illusion of Christians...
That they actually have KNOWLEDGE of the Teaching of
Jesus.
FORGET the Koran if you want.
Just be LOYAL to what JESUS taught.
>
>
> > They NEED their weapons against those who believe those
> > Revelations, just like the Roman church needed its weapons
> > against the Albigensians.
>
> Again with the Roman Church! Look, they probably assassinated John
> Paul I, and you can see that in the verses, but your obsession is off
> topic!
WHY is it off topic?
Nostradamus is alleged to have described the CONSEQUENCES
of the LIES of the theologians.
I too am talking about consequences.
> > Christians follow the doctrines of Paul, which led to the Holocaust
> > among other things like the Crusades and the witch-burnings and
> > the Inquisition.
>
> I never said the people who call themselves Christians are the elect
> of Christ: in fact the exact opposite was intimated - when separated
> into wicked goats and faithful sheep EACH SIDE IS SURPRISED by the
> Judgement. Many will say "Lord, Lord" and find Jesus saying He never
> knew them: N. wrote of a renewal of the Christian Church, for what
> that's worth to you.
Well, GOOD.
If what is meant by that is that it will return to what Jesus originally
taught...
In which case it would recognize that Mohammed also taught a
similar Truth and fulfilled the Prophecy of Jesus that Elijah would
return.
>
>
> > The followers of Jesus believe the Truth about the "resurrection of
> > the dead"--like the Albigensians.
>
> Believing in one tenet or another may cause schisms, with factions
> splitting and accusations of heresy, but in the end there is only the
> Truth of whether you as an individual have been Righteous or Wicked -
> if you are following false instructions, you will be striving to be as
> wicked as possible in order to please your false deity.
Oh, I agree with this.
> So you think Hitler and Jesus are synonymous?
NO.
I am saying that the doctrines of Christiantiy taught people
not to be able to distinguish between Jesus and Hitler.
This was the fault of Paul.
>
> It was a great lie that Hitler claimed his ruthless, depraved movement
> would usher in the Millennial Reign of the Saints: they co-opted
> Christianity to mobilize a fascist ideology that was as far removed
> from Christ's teachings as conceivable
It was no more removed from the Teaching of Jesus than were the
teachings of Paul
> , yet they had to use the name
> of Jesus falsely to sell the nightmare.
I agree.
> If they had been Islamic,
> another name would be used.
Precisely.
And it IS being used.
> The Nazis didn't follow any kind of Christianity:
They followed the Christian practice of projecting EVIL upon the
JEWS.
After World War I, when people were looking around for a CAUSE
for their suffering, they naturally turned to the JEWS; who, previously,
had been blamed for the plague and economic catastrophes.
Once you define a people as EVIL--which is what Christianity did--
it is only a matter of TIME before they are accused of being respon-
sible for EVERYTHING evil that occurs in society.
> > They KILL people because of what they believe.
>
> So now you announce to the world that the KILLERS we must denounce are
> the "Christian organizations" that are not preaching Islam
I have said this before.
If these Christian organizations would merely say that they are
following the teaching of Paul RATHER than the Teaching of Jesus
I would have no problem with them.
But they CAN'T say that because they make their MONEY under the
pretense that they are teaching what Jesus taught.
If they would stick to the Teaching of Jesus I would also not have a
problem with them.
> (which
> would include all of them I suppose)! While those girls are wondering
> whether they will be executed for having an illustrated book of Bible
> stories!! You should think about how long you would last as a
> COMPUTER-USER!!
More misperceptions of what my knowledge and belief consist
of.
> > > My Master says the blind will lead the blind into a pit -
> > > And that I will fall in too if I push them in!
> >
> > And this is PRECISELY where this civilization is going:
> > to HELL because it has followed the doctrines of these
> > religious leaders.
>
>
> > Truth consumes falsehood.
> >
> > The Strategy of Allah is CERTAIN.
>
> The "strategy" of spreading death by whatever means?
*I* did not say that that was His Strategy.
His Strategy is a MUCH larger picture than this.
But let me introduce another consideration:
What if, by killing these 6,000 people in New York
City and Washington D.C. it were then made possible
to SAVE the lives of HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS
of Americans...
What would you say THEN?
What if, in fact, MILLIONS of lives could be saved by
people being FORCED to understand WHY this happened?
In other words, the media is INSISTING that this is
an EXCLUSIVELY *EVIL* occurrence; when, if it were
understood, it could be TRANSFORMED into something
better than it is.
But this appears to be the problem:
That people REFUSE to learn ANYTHING from this
except to project EVIL upon the 'other'.
> That is the
> devil's strategy come into all our lives, but you may follow it at
> your eternal peril.
Whatever.
You are not even talking to me.
You are talking to an image in your own mind.
> > And this is occurring on BOTH sides of the conflict, aided and
> > abetted by the REFUSAL of the media to publicize the Truth.
>
> What Truth?!
I have explained it on my web page.
Whether or not you can believe or understand it.
> That when women show their hair at home men should be
> beaten for not controlling them? There is no Truth amidst torture and
> terror.
I agree.
There is NO awareness of the Revelations in the Koran in such
a situation.
> Right, this is all a plan to Christianize the Muslim world:
Either Christianize or EXTERMINATE, yes.
Just like the Christians tried with the Jews of Europe.
> > And the experiences of the Iraqis and the Palestinians are
> > REAL experiences.
>
> Everyone else must be hallucinating then...
>
> > OF COURSE Hussein and Arafat are to blame for this; but so
> > is the United States and Israel.
>
> If you can dole out blame, perhaps you know who is responsible...
The religious officials and the media officials primarily.
Only then the politicians and diplomats.
>
> > Experiences simply cannot be contradicted by mere words.
> >
> > The religious officials have REASSURED us that we will go to HEAVEN
> > when we die if we believe in Jesus.
>
> Well they lied, because they don't really KNOW anything about the next
> world except by faith; but I can tell you plotting terrorist activity
> for whatever reason is NOT the path of Light.
I agree.
>
> > The politicians have REASSURED us of their ability to bring Peace
> > between Israelis and Palestinians...
>
> How else can they justify their positions?
>
> > And just LOOK at the results.
> >
> > LOOK at them.
>
> (You needed an exclamation point there, hothead!)
>
> > There is no REALITY to these reassurances.
> >
> > They are PIPE dreams.
>
> Make a better reality. Stop blaming everybody else. Be positive.
> Spread love, not hate.
I rather teach Truth than illusion.
This world is lacking in TRUTH.
In the absence of Truth, any "love" is a fairy tale.
> Forget religion if it brings hatred into your
> heart.
I agree.
> Remember Love.
Truth is more important.
It is prior to love.
>
> > And MILLIONS of people are going to DIE because of these
> > pipe dreams.
>
> Physical death is horrible, but spiritual death is much worse and
> forever.
And this is the consequence of the LIES of the theologians.
>
> > > , except when they are defined and practiced
> > > genocidally (the same attitude would be held towards Christians, such
> > > as in Bosnia).
> >
> > Then why the F8CK haven't Mladic and Karadzic been brought to justice
> > so many years later?
>
> > The Nazis were brought to justice for slaughtering Jews.
> >
> > Why can't these Christians be brought to justice for slaughtering
> > Muslims?
>
> This is just venting; you ignore Bosnia to advance your point.
HUHHHHHH???
>
> > > Many of the things done in that region have no
> > > religious basis:
> >
> > Sure.
> >
> > Tell that to the thousands of Muslim women who were raped.
> >
> > See if it makes any DIFFERENCE to them.
> >
> > NITWIT.
>
> The women have no rights according to the religious interpretation, so
> no one cares whether they accept the justification. Tyrants do not
> have to make scholarly arguments, just exert sufficient force.
JUST my point about Christianity...and the Taliban.
> The
> scripture is just used as an excuse for performing the evil within the
> heart (like your insults display).
Paranoid.
I agree with you much more than I disagree.
> > But what is the Truth about these Christians?
>
> They were at work, performing a function for society, then they knew
> they would never see their homes and loved ones again, as they were
> cooked alive, then crushed to death. Your lack of compassion is
> chilling.
I can understand why you might say this.
I was not attempting to JUSTIFY the treatment these people
were being subjected to.
My point is that there is an issue of Truth here, and that Truth
cannot simply be ignored.
When you say "Christian", EVERYONE assumes that you mean "a follower
of Jesus".
I am merely pointing out that it is THIS assumption which is the
source of much of the problem.
Christianity does NOT teach what Jesus taught.
If it DID, there would NOT be this conflict in the FIRST place.
> > And the media will NOT publicize this.
>
> Well their docket is so full, what with all the Anthrax outbreaks: the
> "major story" of the religious persuasions of the corpses is left to
> great journalists like yourself!
WHAT was their excuse in the 25 years PRIOR to September 11, 2001?
> (There's MY sarcasm!)
>
> The Antichrist is the current incarnation of Judas Iscariot/ Cain -
> that's all, folks...
This is YOUR interpretation.
> You latch onto one concept and run it into the
> ground with your hateful ignorance. He institutes a blasphemy against
> the Holy Spirit, but that is only to mislead the elect: the rest have
> no salvation to steal away...
>
> > > Whether or not you are affiliated with THE Antichrist may
> > > prove moot,
> >
> > THE anti-Christ is the contradiction of the TRUTH.
>
> Wrong.
Then I don't CARE about it.
The ONLY anti-Christ I am interested in is the contradiction of
Truth.
This is the source of much of the EVIL in this world.
> It's a specific prophecy, just like the Nostradamus quatrains
> you obviously cannot deal with that accurately foretell our future as
> shown.
>
> > Jewish, Christian AND Muslim religious officials fit this
> > definition...
> >
> > Along with their witless FOLLOWERS.
>
> So you're just an equal opportunity faith-hater?
Oh, ABSOLUTELY.
What I am interested in is the KNOWLEDGE of Truth.
> What a waste of time to respond to you!
Your call.
I see some benefit in this.
> > > The modern American public takes a dim view of public executions
> > > whether or not they are mandated
> >
> > SURE they do. (sarcasm)
>
> Well they don't fill a soccer stadium every week...
Whatever THAT means.
I don't watch television news and pay very little
attention to the news about the war itself.
>
> > THEY WATCH THEM ON TELEVISION: CNN, for example.
>
> Oh, people watch the news when there's war on! Stop the presses!!
>
> > The Gulf War attacks and now the attacks against Afghanistan.
> > These are not merely light shows.
> >
> > People DIE when these bombs and missiles hit...
>
> And people die when terrorism and tyranny take root in hell on earth.
> If you have a better solution, the world is waiting for your wisdom...
Look.
It is a NO BRAINER.
Turn to the Truth of the Revelations.
It is just that simple.
That is the starting point.
> Give us the date of what you're planning: with you here, we don't need
> the prophecies!
I'm not planning anything.
The fractal Prophecies will take care of that and they are independent
of time, time itself having a fractal presentation.
> > Well, there is a LOT of iniquity to make recompense for: the LIES of
> > the religious officials to BEGIN with.
>
> Yeah, you start on those, Einstein...
tsk tsk tsk
>
> > And this civilization does not CONSCIOUSLY desire its own exter-
> > mination EITHER.
>
> I have trouble believing you are legitimate...
Whatever THAT means.
> Please do not read any of my further prognostications, since the
> recent events have clearly left you dangerously unbalanced!
Glad you think so.
So much more you will be suprised at what happens.
> (I'm not
> kidding, either)
I realize this.
> I can understand your concerns,
Not precisely.
> but please cease your intrusions on
> this thread,
Just the WRONG thing to say to me.
> which is intended to provide a public service for the
> free world.
Sure.
And this is what the religious officials say, that they
are providing a service for people.
It's called "Sunday Services", after all.
I respond because it appears to me you are pursuing an
illusion.
Not only that, it is DISTRACTING people from the Truth.
And, in the present situation, ANYTHING which DISTRACTS
people from looking at the Truth is seriously threatening
to the very survival of human civilization itself.
Eagal
> America", they are talking about the CHRISTIAN God.
First, let me say that perhaps we both had lapses in clarity and
choice of words. What disturbs me is how the rumor is spreading in
the Muslim world that many Jews were not in the WTC because they were
really responsible, and the wrong scapegoat has been chosen: there is
much information about those hijackers who wanted flight instruction
without take-off and landing - they were ill-tempered, and apparently
did not associate well with Jews or women. I know that GWB has used
some inflammatory language, but you are making too much of the
mentions of God in the pledge, on money, in songs, etc. It is only an
attempt to avoid the accusation that the US is a heathen nation,
despite the fact that agnostics are welcome along with those of any
faith, to worship as they choose, so long as no one is harmed thereby.
It is our national hope that if there is a higher power, we may do
right by it collectively, nothing more insidious.
> > I already said false
> > prophets on both sides would whip up the sin of bloodlust (perhaps
> > like yourself!)
>
> What an unbelievably outrageous statement this is.
>
> For more than 25 years I have attempted to DEFUSE this
> now emergent conflict between Islamic civilization and
> Judaeo-Christian civilization, and you have the audacity
> to imply that violence is my goal here.
>
> Just off scale, on-beyond-zebra BIZARRE.
Well I'm glad you posted this response, because some of your
statements struck me as political code. Any efforts towards peace are
of course welcome.
> > > But this is the fundamental implication of Christian
> > > theology even among the 'moderate' Christians:
> > > that Mohammed was at LEAST a LIAR; and, thus,
> > > "in league with Satan".
> >
> > At some point you have to define morality,
>
> Nah.
>
> I think Moses did a good enough job.
>
> Not going to 'reinvent the wheel' here.
>
> It's not my job.
But it IS the job done in Revelations, and it shall be accomplished,
as declared by the prophets - "You shall be taught of God" - Jesus was
only the first phase in the Christian plan. I could tell you what
this entails, but prediction of certain events is a part of it;
another part is looking back and realizing what has actually been
happening in terms of the visionary symbolism. Without definitive
resolution, humanity will flounder in confusion and conflict: this can
only occur as divinely ordained: the problem is those who have not
properly utilized the teachings of the First Coming will be condemned
at the Second Coming of Christ. Why do you think VI.24 follows the
calamitous war with the anointing of a King who will pacify the world
a long time?
Whoever spoke to Moses refused to show his face, whereas Henoch saw
the face of God. I don't believe in the slaughter of the Lamb, but
Its Resurrection.
> > > Israel casts Palestinians as a demonic force.
> >
> > I've already made my comments essentially declaring all messages
> > except those from Jesus Christ suspect
>
> And you don't see any problem with this?
>
> I would reply that you don't even take the statements of
> Jesus seriously.
I don't see any problem with Jesus as my Master, and you can think
whatever you want about how I serve Him because your opinions are not
Truth.
Re-read your last comment: you are a hostile entity, and lie about it!
My purpose here is not to convert anyone, nor to reveal the terrible
secrets locked within those seemingly innocuous parables, which form
an unspoken subtext. I could elaborate, but I do not, and will not
explain why.
> > > And the Christian religious officials and their accomplice sluts in
> > > the media are involved in this as well.
> > >
> > > Even the SECULAR media protects the economic interests of
> > > the whore of Babylon.
> >
> > And of course people who make women illiterate and so blinded they get
> > hit by cars and beat them and shoot them and stone them have no stench
> > before God in your twisted estimation.
>
> WHERE is the evidence that I would think any such thing?
Your anger at the bombs which are taking out Taliban armaments, so
that the US forces will not suffer such great casualties when the
ground assault starts.
I asked you for a better solution: Jesus might drop cash on them, but
that would be a risky plan!
> WHERE have I run to the defense of the Muslim religious officials
> for their PERVERSION of the Revelations in the Koran?
>
> What they do to women is horrific.
>
> A few years ago I wrote a note about what is euphemistically
> called 'female circumcision'.
>
> It is BUTCHERY.
But for men it's okay because some faceless being told Abram so?
Think about it...
> The Christian religious establishment is a blood-
> thirsty TYRANNY in the United States.
I am no supporter of Christian fundamentalists (they usually denounce
Nostradamus, since they are ignorant of the meanings).
> When the Prophecies I have received are fulfilled,
> people will begin to see just HOW blood-thirsty
> it is.
Some horrible things seem to be around the corner, as I've posted: and
no one should feel secure that it will only be happening to their
enemy!
> Tyrannies DEPEND upon censorship.
> ANYONE who LIES about Revealed Truth is the anti-Christ.
>
> And, in that sense, Islam is no less the anti-Christ than is
> Judaeo-Christianity.
>
> Because the Muslim religious officials LIE about their Revelations
> to the same degree that the Jewish and Christian religious officials
> LIE about their Revelations.
>
> In any case, this is an analysis resulting from looking at American
> foreign policy and its UNCONDITIONAL support of Israel.
This is not a guaranteed situation; much can change very quickly.
But people have to be taught to hate each other, it is not natural
either.
> America ACTS as if the anti-Christ is EXCLUSIVELY Muslim.
America fears and is confused by Islam, and lately there have been
great efforts to learn more about it: of course there is no consensus
among experts, even on the crucial topic of suicidal massacre as
achieving martyrdom. The irony you might be able to accept in
Christian Revelations is that it concerns western culture entirely,
except for the intrusion of the frog-like demons who start the war:
the jets may've looked like leaping frogs in the vision. And somehow
the kings of the earth wind up later opposing the Messiah Himself, to
their own destruction. The woman called Babylon has a mystery written
on her forehead, which esoterically was revealed as identifying her
astrologically as Venus!
The Islamic Qiyamah predicts a fog lasting 40 days, then the Hajj
pilgrimage to Mecca, then the "Night of Three Nights"...
> I don't know HOW there could be compromise with people
> as EVIL as the Taliban are.
>
> This is all that I am saying.
>
> There was no compromise with the Nazis in Europe
> after the war.
>
> The Taliban represent the same kind of evil if what is
> reported about them is correct.
Now we're on the same page.
> > The point is some remnant
> > of the Taliban must remain to facilitate stabilization when the
> > conflict ends.
>
> Then they would have to be completely OTHER than the
> Taliban in my estimation.
>
> If you listen to these people they are NOT in a compromising
> mood. Iran does not LIKE them. But they do not care about
> what Iran likes or does not like. They are not exactly rational
> people.
I didn't say it was my plan: you know how the election was resolved,
giving us our commander-in-chief. But when I ask myself, "What would
Gore do?" the answer is about the same thing. Polls show the public
does not care what comes of the military response, and have resolved
to face the consequences. So the Taliban is diminished, demoralized,
disempowered: but the people seem to still want them, and no one knows
what should come next!
> It is reported that Bin Laden uses a computer.
>
> HOW could this then be considered WICKED?
That's some dark altar to worship at...
The leaders of the cult always enjoy privileges denied other members.
> > The military claim to do their best to
> > limit civilian casualties, but they would not have the orders to
> > attack if there had been no 11 September assault - and they don't
> > think the bombs are going to bring anybody to Jesus, either.
>
> KILLING these people will NOT solve the problem.
It was Phase One, removing as much of the military infrastructure as
possible with as few civilian casualties as possible. Phase Two
consists of engendering local support. Phase Three could be the
ground war. There is a methodology for war as well as eventual peace,
coordinating with the various factions. The troops cannot risk going
into an intact terrorist strategic base.
> The problem is at the level of Doctrinal Truth and
> consciousness.
>
> Unless the problem is solved at THAT level, all of
> this bloodshed is completely USELESS.
That is what we should be doing on a.p.n, providing verifiable Truth:
that is why I explore the prophetic fulfillments, because they provide
this clarity.
> The DOCTRINES Christianity teaches are a target.
>
> What GOOD would it do to kill ANYONE who is the purveyor
> of a DOCTRINE?
>
> The person may die, but the LIES of that doctrine will continue
> and will result in MORE bloodshed years from now.
Well, get ready for Cardinal Martini's papacy...
Many Catholics doubt the tenets which do not originate from Jesus
directly.
> My hostility is for LIES and for those who teach LIES.
>
> My goal is to exterminate LIES.
>
> > No decent American wanted any innocent person to suffer torture or
> > execution, and there is nothing we can do about it,
>
> This is simply not the Truth.
What, that individual Americans want foreign people to suffer, or they
can do something about it on their own?
> Anyone can QUESTION what he is told by his religious leaders.
But to oppose the Taliban is to invite death, albeit in a TRUE
martyrdom.
> QUESTION whether it is the Truth or not.
>
> One can QUESTION one's media about why it has CENSORED
> and suppressed the Truth.
I'm more interested in why Al-Jazeera would not show those 22 faces!
> One can QUESTION one's political leaders about WHY they
> disregard the theological foundation of this conflict.
>
> > because all some
> > people want to focus on is the negatives and how they were wronged,
> > rather than how they themselves are culpable and reject peaceful
> > overtures.
>
> Then WHY do the religious officials reject the Truth when it is
> told to them; and why do the media officials refuse to publish
> the Truth when it is presented to them?
Surprise, organized religions are about sustaining power over
behaviour, not attaining divine truth which could reveal their
presumptions are wrong!
> Then read the argument of Jesus about the "resurrection of the
> dead" and his PROPHECY that Elijah would return...
>
> Or read about his statement that John was Elijah 'raised from
> the dead'.
>
> This is the fundamental illusion of Christians...
>
> That they actually have KNOWLEDGE of the Teaching of
> Jesus.
I've maintained that the RCC's denial of reincarnation is proven false
by those passages: Jesus clearly insists Malachi's prediction that
deceased Elijah would return to make the way ready for the Messiah was
fulfilled by His cousin John the Baptist. The doctrine of a general
resurrection is more complicated...
> FORGET the Koran if you want.
>
> Just be LOYAL to what JESUS taught.
One can never attain His perfection, but we should all try.
> > Again with the Roman Church! Look, they probably assassinated John
> > Paul I, and you can see that in the verses, but your obsession is off
> > topic!
>
> WHY is it off topic?
Okay then. Look at III.65 - scarcely approved a pope poisoned; IV.11
maybe; and very likely X.12. (This was already on somebody's website.)
Elu en Pape, d'elu sera moque,
Subit soudain emu prompt et timide;
Par trop bon doux a mourir provoque,
Crainte eteinte la nuit de sa mort guide.
> Nostradamus is alleged to have described the CONSEQUENCES
> of the LIES of the theologians.
>
> I too am talking about consequences.
The only salvation that will occur will be by ACCIDENT: the scenario
unfolds in a manner one might term "subliminal" - correct responses to
the events of Revelations cannot be conscious, since the mysteries are
withheld.
> > > Christians follow the doctrines of Paul, which led to the Holocaust
> > > among other things like the Crusades and the witch-burnings and
> > > the Inquisition.
> >
> > I never said the people who call themselves Christians are the elect
> > of Christ: in fact the exact opposite was intimated - when separated
> > into wicked goats and faithful sheep EACH SIDE IS SURPRISED by the
> > Judgement. Many will say "Lord, Lord" and find Jesus saying He never
> > knew them: N. wrote of a renewal of the Christian Church, for what
> > that's worth to you.
>
> Well, GOOD.
>
> If what is meant by that is that it will return to what Jesus originally
> taught...
>
> In which case it would recognize that Mohammed also taught a
> similar Truth and fulfilled the Prophecy of Jesus that Elijah would
> return.
Mohammed does not have to be Elijah reincarnate to be a prophet.
Nostradamus seems to predict such an agreement between faiths in his
Epistle, wherein the resolution seems reached.
> I am saying that the doctrines of Christiantiy taught people
> not to be able to distinguish between Jesus and Hitler.
>
> This was the fault of Paul.
No, it was a calculated application of propaganda, including such
tactics as "The Big Lie" - something so outrageously absurd it had to
be taken for fact.
> > It was a great lie that Hitler claimed his ruthless, depraved movement
> > would usher in the Millennial Reign of the Saints: they co-opted
> > Christianity to mobilize a fascist ideology that was as far removed
> > from Christ's teachings as conceivable
>
> It was no more removed from the Teaching of Jesus than were the
> teachings of Paul
I have some problems with Paul, but most Christian scholars simply say
where he differs with Jesus, go with Christ.
> > , yet they had to use the name
> > of Jesus falsely to sell the nightmare.
>
> I agree.
>
> > If they had been Islamic,
> > another name would be used.
>
> Precisely.
>
> And it IS being used.
>
> > The Nazis didn't follow any kind of Christianity:
>
> They followed the Christian practice of projecting EVIL upon the
> JEWS.
That is not a "Christian practice": Jesus warned His generation about
its own evils, and some Jews would not accept His teachings, but
everything He preached suggests refraining from passing judgement on
those who do not accept His truth.
The big surprise may be that we cannot define ourselves as pious
members of some religious group: God instead sees how our souls
reflect our actions.
> After World War I, when people were looking around for a CAUSE
> for their suffering, they naturally turned to the JEWS; who, previously,
> had been blamed for the plague and economic catastrophes.
>
> Once you define a people as EVIL--which is what Christianity did--
> it is only a matter of TIME before they are accused of being respon-
> sible for EVERYTHING evil that occurs in society.
Yes, untermensch, underpeople, dehumanization and demonization
propaganda.
> If these Christian organizations would merely say that they are
> following the teaching of Paul RATHER than the Teaching of Jesus
> I would have no problem with them.
>
> But they CAN'T say that because they make their MONEY under the
> pretense that they are teaching what Jesus taught.
>
> If they would stick to the Teaching of Jesus I would also not have a
> problem with them.
The story of Paul is a wicked man being converted by the will of God:
he is more accessible than Jesus to some perhaps, and was a Roman
raised as a Jew, giving him a unique perspective on Christ. But Jesus
called Himself the Way, Truth and Life, and most remember that. Many
saints have written elaborate essays which have shaped the thinking of
the Church about various dogmas.
> What if, by killing these 6,000 people in New York
> City and Washington D.C. it were then made possible
> to SAVE the lives of HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS
> of Americans...
>
> What would you say THEN?
>
> What if, in fact, MILLIONS of lives could be saved by
> people being FORCED to understand WHY this happened?
I'd rather deal with the real than the hypothetical, since I've
already mapped out some of the future agenda...
> In other words, the media is INSISTING that this is
> an EXCLUSIVELY *EVIL* occurrence; when, if it were
> understood, it could be TRANSFORMED into something
> better than it is.
>
> But this appears to be the problem:
>
> That people REFUSE to learn ANYTHING from this
> except to project EVIL upon the 'other'.
The most monstrous act of terrorism in history is inherently evil.
Wickedness on this scale could only be accomplished via demonic
intervention.
Even Mark David Chapman admitted Satan possessed him before he could
murder John Lennon. There are evil entities: if you doubt this, dare
to use a Ouija board, but don't blame me if you need to exorcise the
house afterwards!
> Either Christianize or EXTERMINATE, yes.
If that is the course taken, it would not be a religious decision: it
would be thought of more like taking out a rabid dog before it runs
rampant, a civic action of the world community. No one in the US
really cares what box someone checks off on a questionnaire under
religion.
> I rather teach Truth than illusion.
>
> This world is lacking in TRUTH.
>
> In the absence of Truth, any "love" is a fairy tale.
We all crave God's love ultimately.
> > Forget religion if it brings hatred into your
> > heart.
>
> I agree.
>
> > Remember Love.
>
> Truth is more important.
>
> It is prior to love.
And the first casualty of war is truth.
> I was not attempting to JUSTIFY the treatment these people
> were being subjected to.
>
> My point is that there is an issue of Truth here, and that Truth
> cannot simply be ignored.
>
> When you say "Christian", EVERYONE assumes that you mean "a follower
> of Jesus".
>
> I am merely pointing out that it is THIS assumption which is the
> source of much of the problem.
>
> Christianity does NOT teach what Jesus taught.
>
> If it DID, there would NOT be this conflict in the FIRST place.
I think you expect too much of leaders generally. They are not
angels, but those humans select to invest with power: they are
popular, not divine.
> > The Antichrist is the current incarnation of Judas Iscariot/ Cain -
> > that's all, folks...
>
> This is YOUR interpretation.
An interpretation destined to be proven, like many things I've posted.
> > Well they don't fill a soccer stadium every week...
>
> Whatever THAT means.
The Taliban conducted weekly executions in a stadium built with
international money intended for soccer games; when confronted with
this irony, a spokesmen said if a place for executions would be
donated, they would then use the stadium for soccer games! Each show
had a packed house.
> I don't watch television news and pay very little
> attention to the news about the war itself.
It's become a national obsession, displacing the Levy-Condit story.
> And this is what the religious officials say, that they
> are providing a service for people.
>
> It's called "Sunday Services", after all.
>
> I respond because it appears to me you are pursuing an
> illusion.
So you're telling me the NYC explosion did not coincide with the
conjunction of Mercury and the Ascendant? That the Moon was not void
of course? That Juno and Mars were not the critical lunars? That
Mars was not reigning by the definition I'd discovered years ago on
this ng? I could have easily given the date and time beforehand, had
I chosen pursue my hunches further after determining such an event was
in the offing (23 July post). Your doubt may undo you; beware,
because the WAR is the real distraction! The demonic forces
instigated it at this time for a reason: the Saturnin theory has only
one day to prove itself, and I uncovered another fact about that day
saved for another post. Fighting a bloody war cannot bring the
clarity and resolution logic and meditation might.
> Not only that, it is DISTRACTING people from the Truth.
You might acquaint yourself with my track record, starting with the
Grand Cross prediction of massive death between August 15 and 23 1999
coincident with the Cassini fly-by that manifested in the Istanbul
quake; then a prediction of something unsettling in the waters off NYC
31 October 1999 between midnight and four am, which turned out to be
the EgyptAir 990 crash, then the Venezuelan flood pinpointed that
December, etc. I could go on and on, including both El Salvadorean
quakes this year, and many other incidents I have keyed into the
prophecies. Sometimes, like with my 13 July 1999 V.99 interpretation
involving a simultaneous attack on Washington DC and NYC, it takes a
couple years for the event to happen, because there are undeclared
temporal gaps. So prove your Truth, like I've proven mine!
> And, in the present situation, ANYTHING which DISTRACTS
> people from looking at the Truth is seriously threatening
> to the very survival of human civilization itself.
Everything is subjective: I can make many correct conjectures, and
someone like you can ignore it all and declare my efforts a
distraction, when it is a rare glimpse of what is genuinely important!
Some "Truth"!
> Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran, Column
> XVII of the "Scroll of the War of the Sons of Light")
I admit I misunderstood you before, but you still have a condescending
attitude: there are metaphysical truths, not simply political ones.
Eagal
INFECTION, NOT FAITH:
Au Roi l'Augur sur le chef la main mettre
Viendra prier pour la paix Italique;
A la main gauche viendra changer le sceptre,
De Roi viendra Empereur pacifique.
The Augure to place his hand upon the King's head
Will come to pray for Italian peace;
The scepter to change will come towards the left hand,
From King will come Emperor of Pacific Seas.
I've embellished this V.6 translation to conform with the discovery
that 10 June 2002 will be the first solar eclipse of that year,
annular and arcing across the Pacific Ocean: Indonesia at sunrise,
maximum 2600 miles north of Hawaii, visible at sunset in Puerto
Vallarta. [The King is again Francois 1er born 12 September 1494, the
great King of Angoumois, and successor to the duchy of Orleans -
emphasized because of the 11 September '01 events.] The sceptral
alignment precedes, when the Sun enters Gemini 21 May. This annular
eclipse should coincide with a "second butcher's bench" being made in
the western lands (VIII.54), more carnage on American soil (whether
from malfeasance or malevolence).
Au port Selin le tyran mis a mort,
La liberte non pourtant recouvree
At the Crescent port the tyrant put to death,
Notwithstanding liberty is not recovered
I.94 suggests a lunar eclipse, the next three are all penumbral in
2002: 26 May (visible for US except New England, and most of the rest
of the world except for Europe and Africa), 24 June, and 20 November.
Le Roi ruse entendra ses embuches,
De trois quartiers ennemis assailir;
Un nombre etrange larmes de coqueluches,
Viendra Lemprin du traducteur faillir.
The cunning King will anticipate his ambushes,
From three separate quarters enemies to assail;
An unknown number coughing with teary flushes,
Bright deductions by the translator will come to fail.
IX.81's ambush is probably the same one associated with Nancy and
Neptune. The image appears to be knowledge of the prophecies used to
forestall a combat situation otherwise unexpected in the first
portion; but the latter part regards some type of biological domestic
attack, perhaps a disastrously effective use of some dreaded airborne
infectious agent, with the final line implying even a great insight
will achieve nothing...
Au port de Agde trois fustes entreront,
Portant l'infect, non foi et pestilence;
Passant le pont mil milles embleront,
Et le pont rompre a tierce resistance.
At the port of Agde three foists will've arrived,
Not carrying faith, but infection and pestilence;
Passing the pent millions will be removed,
And the pent to break at third resistance.
VIII.21's three foists reminded me of the 3 destroying planes, but I
could not find any connection between 11 Sept and Agde. There is the
506 Council of Agde, wherein it was decided Catholics should receive
Communion on Easter, Pentecost and Christmas: but no useful date
arose. Alternately, there are three saints of Agde - Florence,
Modesto, and Tiberius - honored together on 10 November. The "pont"
should mean bridge, but with a change of letter suggests Pentagon,
which was broken by the third attack wave. So there could be a
pestilence which kills millions long before the Lion event annihilates
seven million next June, with the bloody carnage of the latter event
receiving greater attention because of its global destabilization.
The action may involve the Pentagon again, but crop dusting toxic
particles over that area seems unlikely, especially with three crafts:
but if Agde means 10 November 2001, the ominous prophecy could become
a hideous reality on schedule, whatever it portends.
Le sang du juste a Londres fera faute,
Brules par foudres de vingt trois le six
The blood of the just from London will commit an error,
Burnt by lightning from twenty-three the sixth
NYC York connection with London in II.51 (as VI.22), the mistake
likely being remaining at the critical time. The mystery of "23 the
6" could regard the 23 May Vesta-Venus conjunct, leading into the
critical sixth month (VI.52).
* * *
* * *
* * *
"When shall we three meet again?
In thunder, lightning, or in rain?"
"When the hurlyburly's done,
When the battle's lost, and won."
"That will be ere the set of sun."
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
> ...
> > When the people in the United States say "God bless
> > America", they are talking about the CHRISTIAN God.
>
> First, let me say that perhaps we both had lapses in clarity and
> choice of words. What disturbs me is how the rumor is spreading in
> the Muslim world that many Jews were not in the WTC because they were
> really responsible, and the wrong scapegoat has been chosen: there is
> much information about those hijackers who wanted flight instruction
> without take-off and landing - they were ill-tempered, and apparently
> did not associate well with Jews or women.,
They did not appear to have associated well with either the Moral
Law or Truth, either.
They were seen in strip bars and such--not exactly the actions of
a person who believes the Revelations in the Koran.
> I know that GWB has used
> some inflammatory language, but you are making too much of the
> mentions of God in the pledge, on money, in songs, etc.
I have not mentioned these things at all.
I am merely observing that, all excuses to the contrary, the slaughter
of Muslims satisfies the theological interests of Christianity, Inc.
There is, thereby, FEWER people to have to argue with.
> It is only an
> attempt to avoid the accusation that the US is a heathen nation,
Not a totally unreasonable assertion.
>
> despite the fact that agnostics are welcome along with those of any
> faith, to worship as they choose, so long as no one is harmed thereby.
> It is our national hope that if there is a higher power, we may do
> right by it collectively, nothing more insidious.
And yet this 'higher power' CANNOT contradict the LIES of the
Christian theologians. It can IGNORE those lies, but it CANNOT
contradict those lies.
This is what that program director at WSBT radio in South Bend,
Indiana said to me: "I am not going to put this on the air. It is
against Christianity!!"
>
>
> > > I already said false
> > > prophets on both sides would whip up the sin of bloodlust (perhaps
> > > like yourself!)
> >
> > What an unbelievably outrageous statement this is.
> >
> > For more than 25 years I have attempted to DEFUSE this
> > now emergent conflict between Islamic civilization and
> > Judaeo-Christian civilization, and you have the audacity
> > to imply that violence is my goal here.
> >
> > Just off scale, on-beyond-zebra BIZARRE.
>
> Well I'm glad you posted this response, because some of your
> statements struck me as political code.
Wow.
And I always thought I was speaking PLAINLY.
> Any efforts towards peace are
> of course welcome.
>
> > > > But this is the fundamental implication of Christian
> > > > theology even among the 'moderate' Christians:
> > > > that Mohammed was at LEAST a LIAR; and, thus,
> > > > "in league with Satan".
> > >
> > > At some point you have to define morality,
> >
> > Nah.
> >
> > I think Moses did a good enough job.
> >
> > Not going to 'reinvent the wheel' here.
> >
> > It's not my job.
>
> But it IS the job done in Revelations, and it shall be accomplished,
> as declared by the prophets - "You shall be taught of God" - Jesus was
> only the first phase in the Christian plan.
I demur when you talk about 'Christian' plan.
> I could tell you what
> this entails, but prediction of certain events is a part of it;
> another part is looking back and realizing what has actually been
> happening in terms of the visionary symbolism. Without definitive
> resolution, humanity will flounder in confusion and conflict:
Well, it will be MUCH worse than mere FLOUNDERING.
> this can
> only occur as divinely ordained: the problem is those who have not
> properly utilized the teachings of the First Coming will be condemned
> at the Second Coming of Christ.
I agree.
> Why do you think VI.24 follows the
> calamitous war with the anointing of a King who will pacify the world
> a long time?
NO idea.
> Whoever spoke to Moses refused to show his face, whereas Henoch saw
> the face of God.
Woops.
Never mind.
> I don't believe in the slaughter of the Lamb, but
> Its Resurrection.
>
> > > > Israel casts Palestinians as a demonic force.
> > >
> > > I've already made my comments essentially declaring all messages
> > > except those from Jesus Christ suspect
> >
> > And you don't see any problem with this?
> >
> > I would reply that you don't even take the statements of
> > Jesus seriously.
>
> I don't see any problem with Jesus as my Master, and you can think
> whatever you want about how I serve Him because your opinions are not
> Truth.
No one's opinions are the Truth.
That is what opinions ARE.
> Re-read your last comment: you are a hostile entity, and lie about it!
We'll see.
> My purpose here is not to convert anyone, nor to reveal the terrible
> secrets locked within those seemingly innocuous parables, which form
> an unspoken subtext. I could elaborate, but I do not, and will not
> explain why.
>
> > > > And the Christian religious officials and their accomplice sluts in
> > > > the media are involved in this as well.
> > > >
> > > > Even the SECULAR media protects the economic interests of
> > > > the whore of Babylon.
> > >
> > > And of course people who make women illiterate and so blinded they get
> > > hit by cars and beat them and shoot them and stone them have no stench
> > > before God in your twisted estimation.
> >
> > WHERE is the evidence that I would think any such thing?
>
> Your anger at the bombs which are taking out Taliban armaments,
It is misdirected.
Why not motivate those in the area to turn these people in volun-
tarily?
> so
> that the US forces will not suffer such great casualties when the
> ground assault starts.
Do you think carpet bombing of troop concentrations is a war
crime or not?
This is a serious question.
What did you think of the "Highway of Death" in Kuwait?
And what do you think of the Rule of war set out in the
"Art of War" which says "Do not attack a fleeing army?"...
Not because of the Moral Law, but because you will be
looked upon as a BUTCHER committing an act of
COWARDICE.
The United States is AFRAID of taking casualties.
This is why so many civilians are dying over there.
>
> I asked you for a better solution: Jesus might drop cash on them,
unlikely.
WHO would give JESUS money?
They would loan him a hundred dollar bill and tell him
to MULTIPLY it.
SERIOUSLY.
And, if he could not, he might very well STARVE to death
for having told them the Truth.
> but
> that would be a risky plan!
>
> > WHERE have I run to the defense of the Muslim religious officials
> > for their PERVERSION of the Revelations in the Koran?
> >
> > What they do to women is horrific.
> >
> > A few years ago I wrote a note about what is euphemistically
> > called 'female circumcision'.
> >
> > It is BUTCHERY.
>
> But for men it's okay because some faceless being told Abram so?
> Think about it...
Utterly OFF SCALE bizarre...
To equate such things.
>
>
> > The Christian religious establishment is a blood-
> > thirsty TYRANNY in the United States.
>
> I am no supporter of Christian fundamentalists (they usually denounce
> Nostradamus, since they are ignorant of the meanings).
>
> > When the Prophecies I have received are fulfilled,
> > people will begin to see just HOW blood-thirsty
> > it is.
>
> Some horrible things seem to be around the corner, as I've posted: and
> no one should feel secure that it will only be happening to their
> enemy!
>
> > Tyrannies DEPEND upon censorship.
>
> > ANYONE who LIES about Revealed Truth is the anti-Christ.
> >
> > And, in that sense, Islam is no less the anti-Christ than is
> > Judaeo-Christianity.
> >
> > Because the Muslim religious officials LIE about their Revelations
> > to the same degree that the Jewish and Christian religious officials
> > LIE about their Revelations.
> >
> > In any case, this is an analysis resulting from looking at American
> > foreign policy and its UNCONDITIONAL support of Israel.
>
> This is not a guaranteed situation;
Then I think you misread the situation.
"The sun will come up tomorrow; and Israel is incapable of
making a mistake."
These are, for all practical purposes, identically valued
statements to the politicians in the United States.
And ANYTHING said to the contrary is a LIE.
> much can change very quickly.
Right.
A leopard could change its spots, for example.
The SUN would stand and turned to GREEN CHEESE
before ANY goddamned Chief Rabbi of Israel could
admit that he is WRONG.
>
> But people have to be taught to hate each other, it is not natural
> either.
>
> > America ACTS as if the anti-Christ is EXCLUSIVELY Muslim.
>
> America fears and is confused by Islam,
And, for that reason, projects EVIL upon Islam.
But the media REFUSES to allow the Truth about Islam published
or broadcast in the media because THAT would threaten the
economic interests of Judaeo-Christianity, Inc.
> and lately there have been
> great efforts to learn more about it:
More TRIPE by the media itself in the attempt to cover
its ass for what it has done for more than 20 years now.
Nothing but PRETENSE.
> of course there is no consensus
> among experts, even on the crucial topic of suicidal massacre as
> achieving martyrdom. The irony you might be able to accept in
> Christian Revelations is that it concerns western culture entirely,
> except for the intrusion of the frog-like demons who start the war:
Not at all.
The 24 elders are the 12 sons of Jacob and the 12 sons of
Ishmael. The Muslim position of prayers is mentioned at least
twice as I recall. And Ishmael is the rider on the white horse--
see Genesis 21:20 I believe it is.
>
> the jets may've looked like leaping frogs in the vision.
Nonononononononono.
This is a symbol from archetypal psychology.
It has to do with something coming out of the 'unconscious'
which can also move on 'land'.
> And somehow
> the kings of the earth wind up later opposing the Messiah Himself, to
> their own destruction. The woman called Babylon has a mystery written
> on her forehead, which esoterically was revealed as identifying her
> astrologically as Venus!
>
> The Islamic Qiyamah predicts a fog lasting 40 days, then the Hajj
> pilgrimage to Mecca, then the "Night of Three Nights"...
>
> > I don't know HOW there could be compromise with people
> > as EVIL as the Taliban are.
> >
> > This is all that I am saying.
> >
> > There was no compromise with the Nazis in Europe
> > after the war.
> >
> > The Taliban represent the same kind of evil if what is
> > reported about them is correct.
>
> Now we're on the same page.
And yet the answer for this is for the Truth to be known.
>
>
> > KILLING these people will NOT solve the problem.
>
> It was Phase One, removing as much of the military infrastructure as
> possible with as few civilian casualties as possible.
As few casualties as possible on the United States side as well.
> Phase Two
> consists of engendering local support. Phase Three could be the
> ground war. There is a methodology for war as well as eventual peace,
> coordinating with the various factions. The troops cannot risk going
> into an intact terrorist strategic base.
So how many civilians are you prepared to KILL to keep down
American casualties?
What if 6,000 civilians are killed in Afghanistan?
Thus drawing a near equivalence to the 6,000 innocent
people who died in New York City and Washington, D.C.
THEN will you stop?
Having established a rough equivlance of violence?
Or must you kill ANOTHER 6,000 to get the ones responsible
for sending those terrorists?
Then how many would the OTHER side demand to re-establish
the equivalence of violence?
Do you see the problem here?
>
>
> > The problem is at the level of Doctrinal Truth and
> > consciousness.
> >
> > Unless the problem is solved at THAT level, all of
> > this bloodshed is completely USELESS.
>
> That is what we should be doing on a.p.n, providing verifiable Truth:
> that is why I explore the prophetic fulfillments, because they provide
> this clarity.
>
> > The DOCTRINES Christianity teaches are a target.
> >
> > What GOOD would it do to kill ANYONE who is the purveyor
> > of a DOCTRINE?
> >
> > The person may die, but the LIES of that doctrine will continue
> > and will result in MORE bloodshed years from now.
>
> Well, get ready for Cardinal Martini's papacy...
>
> Many Catholics doubt the tenets which do not originate from Jesus
> directly.
>
> > My hostility is for LIES and for those who teach LIES.
> >
> > My goal is to exterminate LIES.
> >
> > > No decent American wanted any innocent person to suffer torture or
> > > execution, and there is nothing we can do about it,
> >
> > This is simply not the Truth.
>
> What, that individual Americans want foreign people to suffer, or they
> can do something about it on their own?
It is not the Truth that they can do nothing.
> > Anyone can QUESTION what he is told by his religious leaders.
>
> But to oppose the Taliban is to invite death, albeit in a TRUE
> martyrdom.
>
> > QUESTION whether it is the Truth or not.
> >
> > One can QUESTION one's media about why it has CENSORED
> > and suppressed the Truth.
>
> I'm more interested in why Al-Jazeera would not show those 22 faces!
Because they would not make any MONEY by doing so.
The SAME reason that the media in the United States has NO
interest in the Truth about the "resurrection of the dead".
There is no PROFIT in it.
And they would OFFEND those who give them MONEY.
>
>
> > One can QUESTION one's political leaders about WHY they
> > disregard the theological foundation of this conflict.
> >
> > > because all some
> > > people want to focus on is the negatives and how they were wronged,
> > > rather than how they themselves are culpable and reject peaceful
> > > overtures.
> >
> > Then WHY do the religious officials reject the Truth when it is
> > told to them; and why do the media officials refuse to publish
> > the Truth when it is presented to them?
>
> Surprise, organized religions are about sustaining power over
> behaviour, not attaining divine truth which could reveal their
> presumptions are wrong!
Precisely.
This is the problem that I am focusing on.
>
>
> > Then read the argument of Jesus about the "resurrection of the
> > dead" and his PROPHECY that Elijah would return...
> >
> > Or read about his statement that John was Elijah 'raised from
> > the dead'.
> >
> > This is the fundamental illusion of Christians...
> >
> > That they actually have KNOWLEDGE of the Teaching of
> > Jesus.
>
> I've maintained that the RCC's denial of reincarnation is proven false
> by those passages: Jesus clearly insists Malachi's prediction that
> deceased Elijah would return to make the way ready for the Messiah was
> fulfilled by His cousin John the Baptist. The doctrine of a general
> resurrection is more complicated...
Not really.
Who said there was any such thing?
And WHY?
>
>
> > FORGET the Koran if you want.
> >
> > Just be LOYAL to what JESUS taught.
>
> One can never attain His perfection
THIS is where you do not take seriously the
words of Jesus himself.
You appear to treat him as equal to God, assuming
that he is perfect and even capitalizing his name.
This is not hostility.
Jesus would NOT agree with this blasphemy and
idolatry.
He even questioned why someone called him
*good*...
And you now say that 'H'e is PERFECT????
Evidence that you do not take him seriously.
Period.
> , but we should all try.
>
> > > Again with the Roman Church! Look, they probably assassinated John
> > > Paul I, and you can see that in the verses, but your obsession is off
> > > topic!
> >
> > WHY is it off topic?
>
> Okay then. Look at III.65 - scarcely approved a pope poisoned; IV.11
> maybe; and very likely X.12. (This was already on somebody's website.)
>
> Elu en Pape, d'elu sera moque,
> Subit soudain emu prompt et timide;
> Par trop bon doux a mourir provoque,
> Crainte eteinte la nuit de sa mort guide.
>
> > Nostradamus is alleged to have described the CONSEQUENCES
> > of the LIES of the theologians.
> >
> > I too am talking about consequences.
>
> The only salvation that will occur will be by ACCIDENT:
NONSENSE.
Allah's Strategy is CERTAIN.
These things do not happen by accident.
Neither would Jesus agree with this statement.
'Not a bird falls to the ground'...
the scenario
> unfolds in a manner one might term "subliminal" - correct responses to
> the events of Revelations cannot be conscious, since the mysteries are
> withheld.
>
> > > > Christians follow the doctrines of Paul, which led to the Holocaust
> > > > among other things like the Crusades and the witch-burnings and
> > > > the Inquisition.
> > >
> > > I never said the people who call themselves Christians are the elect
> > > of Christ: in fact the exact opposite was intimated - when separated
> > > into wicked goats and faithful sheep EACH SIDE IS SURPRISED by the
> > > Judgement. Many will say "Lord, Lord" and find Jesus saying He never
> > > knew them: N. wrote of a renewal of the Christian Church, for what
> > > that's worth to you.
> >
> > Well, GOOD.
> >
> > If what is meant by that is that it will return to what Jesus originally
> > taught...
> >
> > In which case it would recognize that Mohammed also taught a
> > similar Truth and fulfilled the Prophecy of Jesus that Elijah would
> > return.
>
> Mohammed does not have to be Elijah reincarnate to be a prophet.
I realize this.
But is is the Truth nevertheless.
Jesus did not have to be the 'M'essiah to be a prophet, either.
But it is the Truth nevertheless.
>
> Nostradamus seems to predict such an agreement between faiths in his
> Epistle, wherein the resolution seems reached.
>
> > I am saying that the doctrines of Christiantiy taught people
> > not to be able to distinguish between Jesus and Hitler.
> >
> > This was the fault of Paul.
>
> No, it was a calculated application of propaganda, including such
> tactics as "The Big Lie" - something so outrageously absurd it had to
> be taken for fact.
>
> > > It was a great lie that Hitler claimed his ruthless, depraved movement
> > > would usher in the Millennial Reign of the Saints: they co-opted
> > > Christianity to mobilize a fascist ideology that was as far removed
> > > from Christ's teachings as conceivable
> >
> > It was no more removed from the Teaching of Jesus than were the
> > teachings of Paul
>
> I have some problems with Paul, but most Christian scholars simply say
> where he differs with Jesus, go with Christ.
Hahahahahahahahaha.
"You will go down this road about two miles....and, when you come
to a fork in the road, TAKE it."
Same thing.
>
>
> > > , yet they had to use the name
> > > of Jesus falsely to sell the nightmare.
> >
> > I agree.
> >
> > > If they had been Islamic,
> > > another name would be used.
> >
> > Precisely.
> >
> > And it IS being used.
> >
> > > The Nazis didn't follow any kind of Christianity:
> >
> > They followed the Christian practice of projecting EVIL upon the
> > JEWS.
>
> That is not a "Christian practice":
YES.
That was CHRISTIAN PRACTICE in Europe during the
Middle Ages.
> Jesus warned His generation about
> its own evils, and some Jews would not accept His teachings, but
> everything He preached suggests refraining from passing judgement on
> those who do not accept His truth.
That was Jesus.
I am talking about PAUL.
>
>
> The big surprise may be that we cannot define ourselves as pious
> members of some religious group: God instead sees how our souls
> reflect our actions.
>
> > After World War I, when people were looking around for a CAUSE
> > for their suffering, they naturally turned to the JEWS; who, previously,
> > had been blamed for the plague and economic catastrophes.
> >
> > Once you define a people as EVIL--which is what Christianity did--
> > it is only a matter of TIME before they are accused of being respon-
> > sible for EVERYTHING evil that occurs in society.
>
> Yes, untermensch, underpeople, dehumanization and demonization
> propaganda.
>
> > If these Christian organizations would merely say that they are
> > following the teaching of Paul RATHER than the Teaching of Jesus
> > I would have no problem with them.
> >
> > But they CAN'T say that because they make their MONEY under the
> > pretense that they are teaching what Jesus taught.
> >
> > If they would stick to the Teaching of Jesus I would also not have a
> > problem with them.
>
> The story of Paul is a wicked man being converted by the will of God:
Converted into WHAT?
A professional LIAR and PERVERTER of the Truth.
A marketing agent in a PAGAN society.
>
> he is more accessible than Jesus
Sorry.
But a prostitute is more 'accessible' than a man's wife
on occasion.
This does not justify going to a prostitute.
> to some perhaps, and was a Roman
> raised as a Jew, giving him a unique perspective on Christ.
Sure.
The Pharisaic perspective.
Based upon the DISinterpretation of the "resurrection of the dead".
> But Jesus
> called Himself the Way, Truth and Life, and most remember that. Many
> saints have written elaborate essays which have shaped the thinking of
> the Church about various dogmas.
>
> > What if, by killing these 6,000 people in New York
> > City and Washington D.C. it were then made possible
> > to SAVE the lives of HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS
> > of Americans...
> >
> > What would you say THEN?
> >
> > What if, in fact, MILLIONS of lives could be saved by
> > people being FORCED to understand WHY this happened?
>
> I'd rather deal with the real than the hypothetical, since I've
> already mapped out some of the future agenda...
>
> > In other words, the media is INSISTING that this is
> > an EXCLUSIVELY *EVIL* occurrence; when, if it were
> > understood, it could be TRANSFORMED into something
> > better than it is.
> >
> > But this appears to be the problem:
> >
> > That people REFUSE to learn ANYTHING from this
> > except to project EVIL upon the 'other'.
>
> The most monstrous act of terrorism in history is inherently evil.
Sure.
But HOW do you understand that evil, if your FIRST movement
is the PROJECTION of that evil upon another?
In what way does this ASSIST in understanding the origin of
that evil?
Projection is a psychological reflex to a painful stimuli.
It is unconscious and completely WITLESS.
There is NO intelligence in it.
And, if evil is to be destroyed, it must be done with
INTELLIGENCE rather than reflex.
>
> Wickedness on this scale could only be accomplished via demonic
> intervention.
Unhelpful unless you SPECIFY what this means in terms of
both Doctrine and consciousness.
> Even Mark David Chapman admitted Satan possessed him before he could
> murder John Lennon. There are evil entities: if you doubt this, dare
> to use a Ouija board, but don't blame me if you need to exorcise the
> house afterwards!
Amorphous evil is of no help.
Evil must be perceived in its very STRUCTURE for it to be
destroyed.
>
>
> > Either Christianize or EXTERMINATE, yes.
>
> If that is the course taken, it would not be a religious decision: it
> would be thought of more like taking out a rabid dog before it runs
> rampant, a civic action of the world community.
Leaving intact the LIES which are the foundation of that violence...
In which case the loss of life was COMPLETELY useless.
It will happen again in ANOTHER ten or twenty years.
> No one in the US
> really cares what box someone checks off on a questionnaire under
> religion.
>
> > I rather teach Truth than illusion.
> >
> > This world is lacking in TRUTH.
> >
> > In the absence of Truth, any "love" is a fairy tale.
>
> We all crave God's love ultimately.
More accurately, His Righteousness.
>
>
> > > Forget religion if it brings hatred into your
> > > heart.
> >
> > I agree.
> >
> > > Remember Love.
> >
> > Truth is more important.
> >
> > It is prior to love.
>
> And the first casualty of war is truth.
This is not merely a trivial statement.
Truth IS prior to love.
This is what the sacrifice of Isaac was all about--the
ascendancy of Truth over the yearnings of the heart.
>
>
> > I was not attempting to JUSTIFY the treatment these people
> > were being subjected to.
> >
> > My point is that there is an issue of Truth here, and that Truth
> > cannot simply be ignored.
> >
> > When you say "Christian", EVERYONE assumes that you mean "a follower
> > of Jesus".
> >
> > I am merely pointing out that it is THIS assumption which is the
> > source of much of the problem.
> >
> > Christianity does NOT teach what Jesus taught.
> >
> > If it DID, there would NOT be this conflict in the FIRST place.
>
> I think you expect too much of leaders generally. They are not
> angels, but those humans select to invest with power: they are
> popular, not divine.
But they CLAIM to be Divine when they are willing to sacrifice
ANY number of human lives on the assumption that they are
not WRONG.
Why can't they ADMIT that they are human?
Why can't they ADMIT that they can make mistakes?
Why can't they ADMIT that they could be wrong about the
Doctrine of the "resurrection of the dead"?
>
>
> > > The Antichrist is the current incarnation of Judas Iscariot/ Cain -
> > > that's all, folks...
> >
> > This is YOUR interpretation.
>
> An interpretation destined to be proven
No.
It will not be 'proven'.
Proof is a very tentative thing.
> > I respond because it appears to me you are pursuing an
> > illusion.
>
> So you're telling me the NYC explosion did not coincide with the
> conjunction of Mercury and the Ascendant? That the Moon was not void
> of course? That Juno and Mars were not the critical lunars? That
> Mars was not reigning by the definition I'd discovered years ago on
> this ng? I could have easily given the date and time beforehand, had
The word here is "IF"...
By which you are introducing an illusion which did not manifest in
Reality.
There is NO way of determining what would have happened IF.
>
> I chosen pursue my hunches further after determining such an event was
> in the offing (23 July post).
Nonononononononononononono.
I don't have the time to investigate all of these things you have
said.
I will simply take your word that they are accurate.
You appear to imply CAUSATION in some of what you say.
This is the problem I have with this.
There are any number of probable manifestations of these
things. But only one of these waves will collapse onto this
space-time Reality
> Your doubt may undo you; beware,
> because the WAR is the real distraction!
Of course.
Which is why I pay so LITTLE attention to it.
> The demonic forces
> instigated it at this time for a reason: the Saturnin theory has only
> one day to prove itself, and I uncovered another fact about that day
> saved for another post. Fighting a bloody war cannot bring the
> clarity and resolution logic and meditation might.
You got THAT right.
>
>
> > Not only that, it is DISTRACTING people from the Truth.
>
> You might acquaint yourself with my track record, starting with the
> Grand Cross prediction of massive death between August 15 and 23 1999
> coincident with the Cassini fly-by that manifested in the Istanbul
> quake; then a prediction of something unsettling in the waters off NYC
> 31 October 1999 between midnight and four am, which turned out to be
> the EgyptAir 990 crash, then the Venezuelan flood pinpointed that
> December, etc. I could go on and on, including both El Salvadorean
> quakes this year, and many other incidents I have keyed into the
> prophecies. Sometimes, like with my 13 July 1999 V.99 interpretation
> involving a simultaneous attack on Washington DC and NYC, it takes a
> couple years for the event to happen, because there are undeclared
> temporal gaps. So prove your Truth, like I've proven mine!
I suggest you read Popper on "provability".
Your statements are quite impressive.
But they are in the category of what Jung called
"synchronicity"--an acausal connecting principle.
It is the perception of a particular pattern of
Reality.
My views on this are contained in my writings on
the fractal Prophecies in Daniel and the Revelation
of John.
I do not claim to PROVE these things.
I merely present the explanation and wonder if
other people SEE the same thing.
Some will see; some will not.
>
>
> > And, in the present situation, ANYTHING which DISTRACTS
> > people from looking at the Truth is seriously threatening
> > to the very survival of human civilization itself.
>
> Everything is subjective
Not correct.
The observing consciousness is not subjective...
Nor are its assessments of the structure of the normal
human consciousness...
One of things expressed in the fractal Prophecies in
the book of Daniel.
> : I can make many correct conjectures, and
> someone like you can ignore it all and declare my efforts a
> distraction, when it is a rare glimpse of what is genuinely important!
> Some "Truth"!
>
> > Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran, Column
> > XVII of the "Scroll of the War of the Sons of Light")
>
> I admit I misunderstood you before, but you still have a condescending
> attitude: there are metaphysical truths, not simply political ones.
Just my point.
Eagal
clarification may be of value to some readers, although I believe you
are projecting upon me a role which I do not perform, and many of your
redundant commentaries have been deleted. Since my original post was
for a.p.n exclusively, I wish you would concern yourself more with
Nostradamian prophecy in the future: many of my suppositions arose
from such study, and were not the product of idle opinion...
> I am merely observing that, all excuses to the contrary, the slaughter
> of Muslims satisfies the theological interests of Christianity, Inc.
>
> There is, thereby, FEWER people to have to argue with.
This is paranoia. If the US invaded Afghanistan without having been
attacked, offering the citizens Christian conversion or death, I would
have to agree that your fears are justified. But this is not what is
occurring. The enemy certainly wants to encourage the perception that
a Western Crusade is being waged, however.
> > It is only an
> > attempt to avoid the accusation that the US is a heathen nation,
>
> Not a totally unreasonable assertion.
Deciphering "Barbarian Empire" as code for the US was a sobering
discovery...
> > It is our national hope that if there is a higher power, we may do
> > right by it collectively, nothing more insidious.
>
> And yet this 'higher power' CANNOT contradict the LIES of the
> Christian theologians. It can IGNORE those lies, but it CANNOT
> contradict those lies.
> I demur when you talk about 'Christian' plan.
I do not mean the plan of Christians, but the divine plan for
manifesting the salvation the Christian story only promises and
foretells, i.e., the Apocalypse.
> > I could tell you what
> > this entails, but prediction of certain events is a part of it;
> > another part is looking back and realizing what has actually been
> > happening in terms of the visionary symbolism. Without definitive
> > resolution, humanity will flounder in confusion and conflict:
>
> Well, it will be MUCH worse than mere FLOUNDERING.
For some, certainly: St. John's Revelations has God promising to wipe
every tear from the eyes of the elect, while the Zoroastrian Bundahisn
explains that when the wicked are separated from the righteous, both
sides will cry - both groups lamenting the fate of the wicked.
Weeping and gnashing of teeth: but not because of Jesus, but in spite
of His sacrifice.
> No one's opinions are the Truth.
>
> That is what opinions ARE.
This is tantamount to saying everyone must always be wrong because all
opinions are wrong, or that there is no absolute truth, or that one
can never speak the truth: all of these notions are patently absurd.
> Why not motivate those in the area to turn these people in volun-
> tarily?
This is already happening: they showed Taliban members quietly
defecting to receive new orders and quickly return, since if they
leave for too long they will be killed - the hope is that the regime
will crumble from within. And it was encouraging to see a member of
the Northern Alliance calling a Taliban member no good Muslim over a
communications device (though Pakistan does not want them to overthrow
the Taliban). The best hope for political stability is bringing the
king back from Roman exile to coordinate the factions with new rules
on human rights and terrorism, I suppose.
> > so
> > that the US forces will not suffer such great casualties when the
> > ground assault starts.
>
> Do you think carpet bombing of troop concentrations is a war
> crime or not?
>
> This is a serious question.
I am not promoting war. I am not even saying what should be done.
All the prophecies enable me to do is to explain what has happened in
different terms (which could provide spiritual insight), and project
the nature and timing of future events which will inevitably follow.
To announce what people should do instead of what it is written they
will do would only confuse those testing the predictions. So my major
responsibility is to be faithful to my analysis of the prophecies,
which is admittedly unique and complex. It is not my intention to
discuss whether a "just war" is an oxymoron, or what constitutes a
"war crime" per se. People have often mused what if Hitler had won
the war because US pacifism prevented D-Day. The Hopi prophecy
suggests the US developed bad karma from the use of the A-bomb. Some
Muslim experts said their faith denounces even the killing of unarmed
men during war...
> What did you think of the "Highway of Death" in Kuwait?
> And what do you think of the Rule of war set out in the
> "Art of War" which says "Do not attack a fleeing army?"...
The Gulf War is not the issue, except that after Kuwait was liberated
the Arab people wondered why the US forces did not leave. Ruminating
on the problems with the Gulf War will not ameliorate the current
situation, but rather inflame it further.
> Not because of the Moral Law, but because you will be
> looked upon as a BUTCHER committing an act of
> COWARDICE.
>
> The United States is AFRAID of taking casualties.
>
> This is why so many civilians are dying over there.
The US leaders do value the lives of their soldiers (which may have
been mocked as weakness, speaking of many willing to die for their
cause), and they in turn look out for each other as a team. We are
being told that civilian deaths are all accidental, mistakes have been
admitted. Yes, the US army does not plan to be annihilated - big
surprise!
> > I asked you for a better solution: Jesus might drop cash on them,
>
> unlikely.
>
> WHO would give JESUS money?
>
> They would loan him a hundred dollar bill and tell him
> to MULTIPLY it.
>
> SERIOUSLY.
Seriously ridiculous. I was referring to Christ's advice to do good
to those who have done evil to yourself: that is His policy, and that
is one way it could be applied (the US already has PLENTY of money -
those bombs are very expensive, you know). But even the food being
dropped has been collected by private parties who in turn sell it
(this often occurs - charitable donations become government property
in some cases): and despite their anger at the bombs, the people want
more food. Food may be better than money, since it has a practical
value. But the cliche of biting the hand that feeds one comes to
mind...
> > > A few years ago I wrote a note about what is euphemistically
> > > called 'female circumcision'.
> > >
> > > It is BUTCHERY.
> >
> > But for men it's okay because some faceless being told Abram so?
> > Think about it...
>
> Utterly OFF SCALE bizarre...
>
> To equate such things.
Oh really? And what was Abraham told to do to Isaac by the same
source? It picked out a mountain where Abraham should kill Isaac, and
then an angel--which Abraham naively assumed was from the same
source--stopped the human sacrifice. Isaiah has God asking who wanted
the blood sacrifices (because He did not); Jesus repeats Hosea's
comment that God desires mercy instead of sacrifice. Abram was
seduced by the promise of Chanaan (same name cursed by Noah), and to
be the father of many nations: it is similar to the Satanic
temptations Jesus overcame, wherein He was offered a great kingdom.
Thus Christ told the Jews their father was not Abraham, but the devil
(Jn. 8:44); and in His spectral form Jesus revealed what was called
Judaism was actually the synagogue of Satan (Apoc. 2:9;3:9). Church
doctrine is that only Henoch and Elias, who had both ascended into
heaven, were not in hell when Jesus broke the gates. No eight-day-old
infant can consent to genital amputation (screaming does not count),
so the free will and faith of the subject are circumvented; and the
offering of the flesh of an innocent does not seem a worthy sacrifice.
The Muslim circumcision (at nine years) occurs because Mohammed was
born without an apparent foreskin. The US adopted the practice from
Victorian England, which itself later abandoned it; there have been
cases of mutilation, some so extreme there has been gender
reassignment. Jesus once defended His healing on Sabbath by comparing
it with the simultaneous circumcision being conducted in the Temple.
Accepting scriptural stories at face value presumes the writers had
perfect knowledge, while more in-depth analysis reveals they were
unaware of being embroiled in a secret spiritual conflict.
> "The sun will come up tomorrow; and Israel is incapable of
> making a mistake."
>
> These are, for all practical purposes, identically valued
> statements to the politicians in the United States.
>
> And ANYTHING said to the contrary is a LIE.
Israel is definitely an ally of the US, but if my conjecture about
this being the Apocalyptic period is correct, tremendous change is
imminent.
> > > America ACTS as if the anti-Christ is EXCLUSIVELY Muslim.
> >
> > America fears and is confused by Islam,
>
> And, for that reason, projects EVIL upon Islam.
>
> But the media REFUSES to allow the Truth about Islam published
> or broadcast in the media because THAT would threaten the
> economic interests of Judaeo-Christianity, Inc.
One expert says the Muslims equate the taking of one innocent life
with the destruction of the world, but another will point out the
mandate to destroy all enemies of Islam; one will say suicide is
forbidden, another will speak of "honor killing," again with the
virgins and rivers of wine as reward. One of the teachings is
supposedly that questioning the teachings is a sin. The Hebrew Bible
contains orders to kill people for various offenses, and apparently
shares this aspect with the Koran. You refer to the Truth, please
post which Truth you mean.
> > The irony you might be able to accept in
> > Christian Revelations is that it concerns western culture entirely,
> > except for the intrusion of the frog-like demons who start the war:
>
> Not at all.
>
> The 24 elders are the 12 sons of Jacob and the 12 sons of
> Ishmael. The Muslim position of prayers is mentioned at least
> twice as I recall. And Ishmael is the rider on the white horse--
> see Genesis 21:20 I believe it is.
There is nothing in Gen. 21:20 to relate to Apoc. 19:11, which is
clearly a Messianic passage - a reincarnation of Isaac (the nearly
sacrificed miraculously begotten son), not Ishmael. As to the 24
elders, I like your interpretation and might even use it later...
> > the jets may've looked like leaping frogs in the vision.
>
> Nonononononononono.
>
> This is a symbol from archetypal psychology.
>
> It has to do with something coming out of the 'unconscious'
> which can also move on 'land'.
I could explain much of the book in this way, so I really wasn't
"asking" if you agreed, it IS my solution, which Nostradamus appears
to confirm through his parallel use of the Frog concept with the
"three brothers" - this material has already been posted. Notice
those particular types of plane had only one engine per wing,
sustaining the impression of the Frogs' arms. Consider also the exact
wording: "three unclean spirits LIKE frogs... They are spirits of
demons" - St. John knew he was not being shown actual frogs, but
something resembling them, and besides saying they are unclean demons,
referring to them as "spirits" suggests the gliding nature of the
jets' flight. He was describing objects which reminded him of frogs
floating like spirits, but on an evil mission.
> > It was Phase One, removing as much of the military infrastructure as
> > possible with as few civilian casualties as possible.
>
> As few casualties as possible on the United States side as well.
>
> > Phase Two
> > consists of engendering local support. Phase Three could be the
> > ground war. There is a methodology for war as well as eventual peace,
> > coordinating with the various factions. The troops cannot risk going
> > into an intact terrorist strategic base.
>
> So how many civilians are you prepared to KILL to keep down
> American casualties?
Not my call. That's why we had an election last year.
> What if 6,000 civilians are killed in Afghanistan?
>
> Thus drawing a near equivalence to the 6,000 innocent
> people who died in New York City and Washington, D.C.
>
> THEN will you stop?
It obviously is not about tit-for-tat, but security. What will it
take for Americans to feel safe again? If they knew, they would
probably do it!
> Having established a rough equivlance of violence?
>
> Or must you kill ANOTHER 6,000 to get the ones responsible
> for sending those terrorists?
>
> Then how many would the OTHER side demand to re-establish
> the equivalence of violence?
>
> Do you see the problem here?
I already commented on an endless cycle of violence, so why ask this?
> > > > No decent American wanted any innocent person to suffer torture or
> > > > execution, and there is nothing we can do about it,
> > >
> > > This is simply not the Truth.
> >
> > What, that individual Americans want foreign people to suffer, or they
> > can do something about it on their own?
>
> It is not the Truth that they can do nothing.
Perhaps you are right: if the polls showed 99% wanted to just forget
the whole thing, GWB probably would - but this is not realistic.
Someone made a mess, and it will not simply be ignored, however the
world might want that - the prophecy was that the event would put the
entire world in trouble, remember?
> > One can never attain His perfection
>
> THIS is where you do not take seriously the
> words of Jesus himself.
>
> You appear to treat him as equal to God, assuming
> that he is perfect and even capitalizing his name.
>
> This is not hostility.
>
> Jesus would NOT agree with this blasphemy and
> idolatry.
>
> He even questioned why someone called him
> *good*...
>
> And you now say that 'H'e is PERFECT????
Actually, I stated He had a QUALITY of "perfection" I do not expect
anyone else to surpass: this is why the slain Lamb alone could break
the seven seals and open the scroll in Revelations; His destiny is to
share the throne with God. He meant to test when He asked, "Why do
you call ME good - ONLY GOD IS GOOD": He had been called "Good
Master," without acknowledging His divine nature (a leap of faith for
which Simon Peter was rewarded with the metaphoric "keys"). Jesus
could not deny being the Son of God, only able to remark, "You
yourselves say I am." Adam was promised the Redeemer in 5500 years,
which was supposed to be God incarnate: the arrival of Jesus neatly
coincides, with the promised offering of His blood.
> > The only salvation that will occur will be by ACCIDENT:
>
> NONSENSE.
>
> Allah's Strategy is CERTAIN.
>
> These things do not happen by accident.
>
> Neither would Jesus agree with this statement.
God has always known who would be saved and who damned: this is the
meaning of the Book of Life - if your name is in it you're saved, if
it is blotted out you are damned. Salvation is no accident from God's
perspective - perfect justice will be accomplished through the chosen
mechanisms; but a mortal cannot "learn" about salvation and achieve
it, like one can read an automotive manual and repair a car - it has
been arranged so that the crucial information which would allow one to
do so will not be available until it is to late to take advantage of
it. Otherwise, only crazy or stupid people would be going to hell:
those damned will be as numerous as the sand of the sea (sounds like
the promise made to Abraham - as numerous as the stars of the sky),
while those saved amount to merely 144,000 (thus making Hamlet's
remark that a good man is one out of ten thousand something of a
reality). God's excuse for allowing so many to be doomed is that they
were created from nothing; Adam and Eve were promised they could
return to Eden eventually with their "good seed."
> > > They followed the Christian practice of projecting EVIL upon the
> > > JEWS.
> >
> > That is not a "Christian practice":
>
> YES.
>
> That was CHRISTIAN PRACTICE in Europe during the
> Middle Ages.
You are playing semantics: I am talking about the teachings of Jesus,
you are countering with the failings of those using His name
improperly. I hope you can learn the difference one day.
> > The story of Paul is a wicked man being converted by the will of God:
>
> Converted into WHAT?
>
> A professional LIAR and PERVERTER of the Truth.
>
> A marketing agent in a PAGAN society.
Very strong feelings, without producing a single quote to point out
anything truly egregious.
> But HOW do you understand that evil, if your FIRST movement
> is the PROJECTION of that evil upon another?
Look at how you've projected evil onto St. Paul, for example...
> In what way does this ASSIST in understanding the origin of
> that evil?
>
> Projection is a psychological reflex to a painful stimuli.
>
> It is unconscious and completely WITLESS.
>
> There is NO intelligence in it.
>
> And, if evil is to be destroyed, it must be done with
> INTELLIGENCE rather than reflex.
> > Wickedness on this scale could only be accomplished via demonic
> > intervention.
>
> Unhelpful unless you SPECIFY what this means in terms of
> both Doctrine and consciousness.
No, it is much simpler than that. I believe the 10 June 2002 date
being revealed as the most critical event timeframe caused a reaction
within the demonic realm, manifesting in the execution of an act of
supreme evil with the purpose of activating seeds of hatred and
mistrust which had been planted long ago. The demons know their time
is short now, and have been allowed to assist in the fomenting of a
divisive, volatile conflict prior to the Seventh Bowl event, which
should come with a spiritual internal Warning: the plan is that when
the world communes with God (as the Garabandal visionaries predicted),
that we see ourselves with as many sins as possible.
> > I think you expect too much of leaders generally. They are not
> > angels, but those humans select to invest with power: they are
> > popular, not divine.
>
> But they CLAIM to be Divine when they are willing to sacrifice
> ANY number of human lives on the assumption that they are
> not WRONG.
GWB does NOT claim to be divine, nor has any US president to my
knowledge!
Kings used to do this, so secular leaders are called "president"
instead.
> > So you're telling me the NYC explosion did not coincide with the
> > conjunction of Mercury and the Ascendant? That the Moon was not void
> > of course? That Juno and Mars were not the critical lunars? That
> > Mars was not reigning by the definition I'd discovered years ago on
> > this ng? I could have easily given the date and time beforehand, had
>
> The word here is "IF"...
>
> By which you are introducing an illusion which did not manifest in
> Reality.
No, I've already explained that the prophecy was that the instructions
and conditions would be given for determining the exact time, without
the actual calculation being offered for this "Cupbearer falsifying"
event. I harped on those conditions relentlessly (including the
remark that 2001 would be the year Saturn and Mars equals combustion),
and it cannot be denied they all applied to this event, which is
amazing since the clues were in different verses. I also announced
the Conqueror would be vanquished with horse to eat the oats 23 July
2001 (about six weeks prior), using the 21 June solar eclipse and 23
June Peruvian quake with X.45 and VIII.72 - I knew the metaphor of the
horse eating the oats would become clear through an event happening
shortly thereafter, and I added that it might have to do with an
Orleans King and a "legitimate wall." On those counts, I was correct.
13 July 1999 using V.99 I surmised Washington DC and NYC would have
simultaneous problems following the Grand Cross. I always presumed
the great new city was NYC. Thus I could not guarantee NYC would be
safe after August 1999, so anyone remaining there was not taking my
advice seriously anyway. So your complaint is actually that I did not
utilize my method to its fullest capacity, which would have allowed
the precise pinpointing of the first plane striking the WTC, a
standard so high no prognosticator has yet been held to it. I gave a
six-week notice, the means to make the exact calculation, and a
general warning regarding NYC. Perhaps I had also remarked about Mars
entering a new sign 8 September after having retrograded, but the
significance of that esoteric information was overlooked because of my
prior misunderstanding of the three brothers prophecy (Mars played a
role in the 25 December '00 Chinese disco fire killing 300, and this
was incorrectly deemed to be the extent of its negative influence for
the relevant timeframe). One reason for posting my conjectures is for
intelligent feedback which can lead to further discoveries, but this
has seldom occurred: someone might confirm that Verrazano originally
named the NYC area Angouleme after the French Royal Angolmois house,
for example; and someone could have easily reminded me that Mars was
about to reign and requested temple calculations for that five-day
period, which would have left 11 September 8:43am EDT sticking out
like a sore thumb with dark [Juno / Mars].
> I don't have the time to investigate all of these things you have
> said.
>
> I will simply take your word that they are accurate.
>
> You appear to imply CAUSATION in some of what you say.
>
> This is the problem I have with this.
There are some instances where karmic effects are implied, and I feel
it is my responsibility to report these too, since they are there
whether I point them out or not, just like the events occur on
schedule whether I have figured them out beforehand or not.
The goal of having everyone enter heaven is predestined to fail, so I
do not expect everyone to understand the highly crptic Nostradamian
prophecies, which contain a level of detail that is quite astounding
when compared with the more generalistic nature of scriptural
prophecy.
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
Eagal wrote:
> I'm going to respond again to some of your statements, because further
> clarification may be of value to some readers
This I believe as well.
> , although I believe you
> are projecting upon me a role which I do not perform,
We'll see.
> and many of your
> redundant commentaries have been deleted.
Fine by me.
> Since my original post was
> for a.p.n exclusively, I wish you would concern yourself more with
> Nostradamian prophecy
Well, if these so-called Prophecies are in any way accurate,
they *must* be related in some way to the Prophecies of
Daniel and the Revelation of John.
As I understand it, Nostradamus did NOT write the Revelation
of John.
I'm not being snotty here.
I am merely pointing out that you are STRETCHING if you
think Nostradamus can be expected to be relevant to the
Revelations received by John.
I am going DIRECTLY to those Revelations, having received
the same Vision that John received.
> in the future: many of my suppositions arose
> from such study, and were not the product of idle opinion...
I have never accused you of this.
I have stated that some of the things you have said are quite
impressive.
>
>
> > I am merely observing that, all excuses to the contrary, the slaughter
> > of Muslims satisfies the theological interests of Christianity, Inc.
> >
> > There is, thereby, FEWER people to have to argue with.
>
> This is paranoia.
Look.
The Roman church no longer has to argue with Albigensians.
That is the truth
> If the US invaded Afghanistan without having been
> attacked, offering the citizens Christian conversion or death, I would
> have to agree that your fears are justified.
Fears?
Who said that I fear this?
I am pointing out what is occurring.
I think you would have to agree that there are MILLIONS
less Muslims in the world today than there were when
I first began writing 25 years ago.
Look at the Iran-Iraq war, and the Gulf War, and the first
and second intifadas, and Israel's war in Lebanon, and
Bosnia, and Afghanistan and Chechnya
This has been equivalent to a 'Holocaust' of the Arab and
Muslim peoples--much of it as a result of the actions of
these Arab and Muslim leaders themselves--over the past
25 years. But it is mostly IGNORED by the Western media.
And, when you say that this WTC terrorism was the "greatest
act of terror in history"...
Well, the mind boggles at this.
> But this is not what is
> occurring.
This is what is occurring.
It is not what the media will tell you; but it IS what is
occurring.
> The enemy certainly wants to encourage the perception that
> a Western Crusade is being waged, however.
And CNN and Reuters and Agence France Press and Al-Jazeera
and ABC News are ALL contributing to this perception.
Can't quite understand why you consistently ignore the role of
the media in contributing to this war.
>
>
> > > It is only an
> > > attempt to avoid the accusation that the US is a heathen nation,
> >
> > Not a totally unreasonable assertion.
>
> Deciphering "Barbarian Empire" as code for the US was a sobering
> discovery...
o k
>
>
> > > It is our national hope that if there is a higher power, we may do
> > > right by it collectively, nothing more insidious.
> >
> > And yet this 'higher power' CANNOT contradict the LIES of the
> > Christian theologians. It can IGNORE those lies, but it CANNOT
> > contradict those lies.
>
> > I demur when you talk about 'Christian' plan.
>
> I do not mean the plan of Christians, but the divine plan for
> manifesting the salvation the Christian story only promises and
> foretells, i.e., the Apocalypse.
But what is this story?
Are you talking about a 'Rapture'?
Because this is CERTAINLY not in Revelations.
CERTAINLY not.
>
>
> > > I could tell you what
> > > this entails, but prediction of certain events is a part of it;
> > > another part is looking back and realizing what has actually been
> > > happening in terms of the visionary symbolism. Without definitive
> > > resolution, humanity will flounder in confusion and conflict:
> >
> > Well, it will be MUCH worse than mere FLOUNDERING.
>
> For some, certainly: St. John's Revelations has God promising to wipe
> every tear from the eyes of the elect, while the Zoroastrian Bundahisn
> explains that when the wicked are separated from the righteous, both
> sides will cry - both groups lamenting the fate of the wicked.
> Weeping and gnashing of teeth: but not because of Jesus, but in spite
> of His
This is not merely a trivial matter.
First, you capitalize the pronoun for Jesus.
This is blasphemy and idolatry and a violation of the Revelations
received by ANY prophet.
Then, you agree with the doctrine of vicarious atonement which
is a vile, grotesque and perverse denial of the Righteousness of
God besides being one of those doctrines which led to the ex-
termination of the Jews.
You SAY that you have 'problems' with Paul.
But the PROBLEM with Paul is the doctrine of vicarious atonement
which is a REPLACEMENT for the real reason why Jesus had to
die: He taught a Doctrine which threatened the pride, the wealth
and the power of the Jewish religious officials.
And, in ANOTHER 2000 years, this will STILL be the reason why
Jesus had to die.
> sacrifice.
>
> > No one's opinions are the Truth.
> >
> > That is what opinions ARE.
>
> This is tantamount to saying everyone must always be wrong because all
> opinions are wrong,
No it is not.
Opinions originate in conditioning and memory and image and thought
and fear. They are ALL subjective.
But it is possible for a person to arrive at an objective truth by
observing
the structure of the normal human consciousness from the frame of
reference of the "observing consciousness".
This is what I am talking about.
What I am saying is that the knowledge that I have comes from that
'other' kind of consciousness---the "observing consciousness"--which
is beyond the realm of opinion.
s=1/2 at^2 is NOT Newton's OPINION of an occurrence in the
physical Reality.
There are similar things with regards to Revealed Truth.
> or that there is no absolute truth, or that one
> can never speak the truth: all of these notions are patently absurd.
Well, but you misunderstood what I was saying.
>
> >
> > Do you think carpet bombing of troop concentrations is a war
> > crime or not?
> >
> > This is a serious question.
>
> I am not promoting war.
I am not absolutely certain of this.
You appear to be trying to justify one side over the other
> I am not even saying what should be done.
> All the prophecies enable me to do is to explain what has happened in
> different terms (which could provide spiritual insight), and project
> the nature and timing of future events which will inevitably follow.
> To announce what people should do instead of what it is written they
> will do would only confuse those testing the predictions.
Maybe this is where we differ.
I already KNOW the ultimate consequences of this sequence
of actions. I have SEEN the resultant loss of life.
Anyone with a heart that beats in his chest would do EVERY-
THING POSSIBLE to diminish this loss of life as much as
possible.
Clearly, it appears as though I will fail in these attempts to
a degree not yet determined. But, in any case, I will know
that I did EVERYTHING that I could
> So my major
> responsibility is to be faithful to my analysis
And what if your analysis is wrong?
Analysis is an activity of the intellect.
The origin of the intellect is in fear, desire, duality, image,
comparison and conflict--a 'weak reed' indeed.
> of the prophecies,
> which is admittedly unique and complex.
My major responsibility is, DESPITE the Prophecies--or,
more specifically, DESPITE the specific Visions I have
seen--to do EVERYTHING I can to reduce this loss of life
> > What did you think of the "Highway of Death" in Kuwait?
> > And what do you think of the Rule of war set out in the
> > "Art of War" which says "Do not attack a fleeing army?"...
>
> The Gulf War is not the issue,
Yes the Gulf War is the issue.
In the Revelation of John it is referred to as the "First Battle
of the End"; and, what is emerging is the Second Battle of
the End".
Esoterically, this battle signified the formation of the linear
consciousness against the chaos of the 'unconscious'.
The Second Battle of the End is, esoterically, the battle
of the linear consciousness against the "observing con-
sciousness" or Revealed Truth.
> except that after Kuwait was liberated
> the Arab people wondered why the US forces did not leave.
Many also wondered WHY, if Hussein was so EVIL, he was
allowed to remain in power...
Which also permitted the NATO countries to IGNORE the
slaughter of the Muslims of Bosnia: Islam had already been
identified as the 'anti-Christ'; and the Muslims of Bosnia were
simply assumed to be just as evil as Hussein...
Or, if not, the EFFECT was the same: The NATO countries
stood by and allowed them to be EXTERMINATED.
Maybe you should read the book "End Game" by Davie
Rohde on the massacre of the Muslims of Srebrenica.
By the way, appoximately *7,000* MUSLIMS of Srebrenica
were exterminated.
Was there an international "war against terrorism" because
of this?
HELL NO.
They were MUSLIMS.....NOT Americans.
> Ruminating
> on the problems with the Gulf War will not ameliorate the current
> situation, but rather inflame it further.
Well, the ORIGIN of a problem must be understood.
What if the United States does the SAME with the Taliban
that it did with Saddam Hussein?
Namely, LEAVE them in POWER...
In another 10 years there will be ANOTHER military
confrontation.
The MISTAKES of the Gulf War MUST be understood.
>
>
> > Not because of the Moral Law, but because you will be
> > looked upon as a BUTCHER committing an act of
> > COWARDICE.
> >
> > The United States is AFRAID of taking casualties.
> >
> > This is why so many civilians are dying over there.
>
> The US leaders do value the lives of their soldiers (which may have
> been mocked as weakness, speaking of many willing to die for their
> cause), and they in turn look out for each other as a team. We are
> being told that civilian deaths are all accidental,
Are these people any LESS dead because their deaths were
accidental?
> mistakes have been
> admitted. Yes, the US army does not plan to be annihilated - big
> surprise!
Some 7.5 MILLION Afghans are said to be in danger of
STARVATION if the food convoys are not resumed fairly
quickly into Afghanistan before the winter snows.
I suggest you read the "Art of War".
If the victor in a war is looked upon not as valiant but
as a BUTCHER, the war has been LOST.
The question always is "Did they DESERVE to win the
war?"
Do they represent a system with a higher set of
VALUES than the system that they conquered?
If they use their advanced technology to exterminate
10 or 20 enemy soldiers or civilians for every soldier
that they lose, they are looked upon as butchers.
Look at Israel.
She GENUINELY believes that she can go on KILLING
Palestinians at a greater ratio than the lives that she
loses and can thereby WIN this battle.
The battle may be won temporarily.
But the mechanism of victory engenders resentment
and hatred and eventual retaliation in those who have
been subjected to such cold-blooded viciousness
and heartlessness.
>
>
> > > I asked you for a better solution: Jesus might drop cash on them,
> >
> > unlikely.
> >
> > WHO would give JESUS money?
> >
> > They would loan him a hundred dollar bill and tell him
> > to MULTIPLY it.
> >
> > SERIOUSLY.
>
> Seriously ridiculous.
Then you simply do not perceive the VICIOUSNESS of those
who reject the Truth.
Maybe you should read "The Grand Inquisitor" by Dostoevsky.
> I was referring to Christ's advice to do good
> to those who have done evil to yourself: that is His
blasphemy and idolatry.
Why do you choose to follow only SOME of the
words of Jesus while rejecting those things that
do not conform with your idolatry?
>
>
> > > > A few years ago I wrote a note about what is euphemistically
> > > > called 'female circumcision'.
> > > >
> > > > It is BUTCHERY.
> > >
> > > But for men it's okay because some faceless being told Abram so?
> > > Think about it...
> >
> > Utterly OFF SCALE bizarre...
> >
> > To equate such things.
>
> Oh really?
Yes.
REALLY.
Maybe you need to read a book on female genital
MUTILATION.
Circumcision for a man is not even REMOTELY
similar in its effects upon sexual desire and sens-
itivity.
> And what was Abraham told to do to Isaac by the same
> source? It picked out a mountain where Abraham should kill Isaac, and
> then an angel--which Abraham naively assumed was from the same
> source--stopped the human sacrifice.
WELL, then, you choose not to believe the Torah EITHER.
NO WONDER you CAPITALIZE the pronoun referring to
Jesus.
> Isaiah has God asking who wanted
> the blood sacrifices (because He did not); Jesus repeats Hosea's
> comment that God desires mercy instead of sacrifice. Abram was
> seduced by the promise of Chanaan (same name cursed by Noah),
Wow......
> and to
> be the father of many nations: it is similar to the Satanic
> temptations Jesus overcame,
Wow.....
> wherein He was offered a great kingdom.
> Thus Christ told the Jews their father was not Abraham, but the devil
> (Jn. 8:44);
Because they would not submit to the Command of God.
They rejected the Truth because it was unpleasant to them.
It wounded their pride, for example.
> and in His spectral form Jesus revealed what was called
> Judaism was actually the synagogue of Satan (Apoc. 2:9;3:9).
Wow....
I am beginning to SEE why you do not disagree with Paul
as much as you claim to.
> Church
> doctrine
Sure.
And this whore of Babble-on and on and on and on
speaks with the Voice of God HIMSELF.
> is that only Henoch and Elias, who had both ascended into
> heaven, were not in hell when Jesus broke the gates.
Wow...
Swallowed the metaphysical duality as well.
Theological Naziism...not that *that* would stop you.
> > "The sun will come up tomorrow; and Israel is incapable of
> > making a mistake."
> >
> > These are, for all practical purposes, identically valued
> > statements to the politicians in the United States.
> >
> > And ANYTHING said to the contrary is a LIE.
>
> Israel is definitely an ally of the US, but if my conjecture about
> this being the Apocalyptic period is correct, tremendous change is
> imminent.
>
> > > > America ACTS as if the anti-Christ is EXCLUSIVELY Muslim.
> > >
> > > America fears and is confused by Islam,
> >
> > And, for that reason, projects EVIL upon Islam.
> >
> > But the media REFUSES to allow the Truth about Islam published
> > or broadcast in the media because THAT would threaten the
> > economic interests of Judaeo-Christianity, Inc.
>
> You refer to the Truth, please
> post which Truth you mean.
Mohammed was sent for the purpose of correcting the
errors of both the rabbis AND the Christian theologians
on specifically TWO Doctrinal issues:
1) The Doctrine of the "resurrection of the dead"; and
2) the identity of Jesus.
And, since you still worship Jesus as God, you would
STILL be opposed to what Islam teaches...
Islam would STILL be the anti-Christ to you because
it does not worship Jesus as GOD.
Which is the FUNDAMENTAL reason why Christian
civilization WATCHED while the Muslims were exter-
minate in Srebrenica and why Hussein was NOT
removed from power after the Gulf War.
Christians simply do NOT want to hear what Islam
is about...
Especially that Christianity LIES about both Jesus
and his Teaching.
>
>
> > > The irony you might be able to accept in
> > > Christian Revelations is that it concerns western culture entirely,
> > > except for the intrusion of the frog-like demons who start the war:
> >
> > Not at all.
> >
> > The 24 elders are the 12 sons of Jacob and the 12 sons of
> > Ishmael. The Muslim position of prayers is mentioned at least
> > twice as I recall. And Ishmael is the rider on the white horse--
> > see Genesis 21:20 I believe it is.
>
> There is nothing in Gen. 21:20 to relate to Apoc. 19:11,
Nor is there anything in Genesis 21:20 to relate to the
New York City phone book.
The rider on the white horse--the First Seal of the Revelation
of John--is an ARCHER.
Ishmael was an ARCHER.
It is a combined symbol of scientific truth and Revealed Truth.
> which is
> clearly a Messianic passage - a reincarnation of Isaac
You have no Knowledge of this.
> (the nearly
> sacrificed miraculously begotten son), not Ishmael. As to the 24
> elders, I like your interpretation and might even use it later...
>
Interesting.
Will you make any MONEY on it?
I have lost track of the number of times I have read what
I have thought of in the books of others afer having written
them long and detailed letters concerning my research.
I think it is called plagiarism.
But, of course, I could never PROVE this.
People trying to write Ph.D. theses sometimes compliment
me and thank me for helping them in their research.
I have YET to see my comments ATTRIBUTED to me.
I doubt that you will either.
And I hope you make a LOT of money at this.
>
> > > the jets may've looked like leaping frogs in the vision.
> >
> > Nonononononononono.
> >
> > This is a symbol from archetypal psychology.
> >
> > It has to do with something coming out of the 'unconscious'
> > which can also move on 'land'.
>
> I could explain much of the book in this way, so I really wasn't
> "asking" if you agreed, it IS my solution, which Nostradamus appears
> to confirm through his parallel use of the Frog concept with the
> "three brothers" - this material has already been posted.
I know.
And it is utterly BONKERS.
> Notice
> those particular types of plane had only one engine per wing,
> sustaining the impression of the Frogs' arms. Consider also the exact
> wording: "three unclean spirits LIKE frogs... They are spirits of
> demons"
And, WITHOUT reading Nostradamus, just TRY to explain to me
HOW an airplane could be looked upon as "LIKE" a frog...
Just ONE characteristic in common would help.
Just ONE.
Name ONE characteristic by which a person would mistake
a FROG for an AIRPLANE.
I mean how STUPID do you think John WAS?
A BIRD, perhaps....
But a FROG??????????
You've GOT to be KIDDING here.
> - St. John knew he was not being shown actual frogs, but
> something resembling them, and besides saying they are unclean demons,
> referring to them as "spirits" suggests the gliding nature of the
> jets' flight. He was describing objects which reminded him of frogs
> floating like spirits, but on an evil mission.
And this is where you COMPLETELY lose it.
You have no direct experience of the "observing con-
sciousness" which is that consciousness which ac-
companies the Vision of the "Son of man".
In this consciousness, the word "saw" does NOT mean
what it typically means.
John did not 'see' any vision of airplanes.
This is an esoteric description of mechanisms of the
normal human consciousness first and foremost.
I explain this in my writings on fractal Prophecies...
As well as the manner in which these symbols can be
extrapolated to the space-time Reality.
>
>
> > Thus drawing a near equivalence to the 6,000 innocent
> > people who died in New York City and Washington, D.C.
> >
> > THEN will you stop?
>
> It obviously is not about tit-for-tat, but security.
Do you think you can be secure while not understanding
the CAUSE of this terrorism?
It is only by intelligence rather than reflex that you can
begin to feel secure again.
> What will it
> take for Americans to feel safe again? If they knew, they would
> probably do it!
Including genocide?
This is a serious question.
Will genocide solve the problem of not feeling secure?
>
>
> > Having established a rough equivlance of violence?
> >
> > Or must you kill ANOTHER 6,000 to get the ones responsible
> > for sending those terrorists?
> >
> > Then how many would the OTHER side demand to re-establish
> > the equivalence of violence?
> >
> > Do you see the problem here?
>
> I already commented on an endless cycle of violence, so why ask this?
You do not appear to be fully aware of the consequences of your own
line of reasoning.
>
> > It is not the Truth that they can do nothing.
>
> Perhaps you are right: if the polls showed 99% wanted to just forget
> the whole thing, GWB probably would - but this is not realistic.
> Someone made a mess,
And I think figuring out WHO that someone IS would be important
to helping resolve this mess.
I suggest that the 'someones' who made this mess are the LYING
religious officials and their accomplices in the media.
> and it will not simply be ignored, however the
> world might want that - the prophecy was that the event would put the
> entire world in trouble, remember?
>
> > > One can never attain His perfection
> >
> > THIS is where you do not take seriously the
> > words of Jesus himself.
> >
> > You appear to treat him as equal to God, assuming
> > that he is perfect and even capitalizing his name.
> >
> > This is not hostility.
> >
> > Jesus would NOT agree with this blasphemy and
> > idolatry.
> >
> > He even questioned why someone called him
> > *good*...
> >
> > And you now say that 'H'e is PERFECT????
>
> Actually, I stated He
blasphemy and idolatry.
You ignore the words of Jesus and then claim that
he is your authority for saying what you say.
> had a QUALITY of "perfection" I do not expect
> anyone else to surpass
Well, this is certainly your opinion of the situation.
> : this is why the slain Lamb alone could break
> the seven seals and open the scroll in Revelations
except for you.
You think a frog is a goddamned AIRPLANE
.
> ; His destiny is to
> share the throne with God.
More blasphemy.
You arrogate unto yourself an ability to understand the Revelation
of John DESPITE the fact that you have NOT received the same
Vision that John received.
> He meant to test when He asked, "Why do
> you call ME good - ONLY GOD IS GOOD": He had been called "Good
> Master," without acknowledging His divine nature (a leap of faith for
> which Simon Peter was rewarded with the metaphoric "keys").
Wrong AGAIN.
But you're on a ROLL here.
Don't let ME stop you.
> Jesus
> could not deny being the Son of God,
The meaning of which you do not understand, of course.
It does NOT mean, for example, that he is similar to the
Creator.
ONE of the things it means is that he had a specific *Memory*
of having been Created by God.
> only able to remark, "You
> yourselves say I am." Adam was promised the Redeemer in 5500 years,
> which was supposed to be God incarnate:
This is your opinion.
And you know what opinions are like....
EVERYBODY has one.
> the arrival of Jesus neatly
> coincides, with the promised offering of His blood.
More blasphemy and idolatry and following the
teaching of Paul.
>
>
> > > The only salvation that will occur will be by ACCIDENT:
> >
> > NONSENSE.
> >
> > Allah's Strategy is CERTAIN.
> >
> > These things do not happen by accident.
> >
> > Neither would Jesus agree with this statement.
>
> God has always known who would be saved and who damned: this is the
> meaning of the Book of Life - if your name is in it you're saved, if
> it is blotted out you are damned.
Then WHY did you say the above statement?
> Salvation is no accident from God's
> perspective - perfect justice will be accomplished through the chosen
> mechanisms; but a mortal cannot "learn" about salvation and achieve
> it, like one can read an automotive manual and repair a car - it has
> been arranged so that the crucial information which would allow one to
> do so will not be available until it is to late to take advantage of
> it. Otherwise, only crazy or stupid people would be going to hell:
> those damned will be as numerous as the sand of the sea (sounds like
> the promise made to Abraham - as numerous as the stars of the sky),
> while those saved amount to merely 144,000
Do you KNOW this?
> (thus making Hamlet's
> remark that a good man is one out of ten thousand something of a
> reality). God's excuse for allowing so many to be doomed is that they
> were created from nothing;
You're on a ROLL here.
Don't let ME stop you.
>
> > YES.
> >
> > That was CHRISTIAN PRACTICE in Europe during the
> > Middle Ages.
>
> You are playing semantics: I am talking about the teachings of Jesus,
NO.
You are talking about Christians--the followers of Paul
>
> you are countering with the failings of those using His name
> improperly.
YOU use his name improperly when you claim that he is GOD.
There is NO more PERVERSE a distortion of the Teaching of
Jesus than this.
> I hope you can learn the difference one day.
You will die first.
Truth consumes falsehood and Knowledge consumes belief.
>
>
> > > The story of Paul is a wicked man being converted by the will of God:
> >
> > Converted into WHAT?
> >
> > A professional LIAR and PERVERTER of the Truth.
> >
> > A marketing agent in a PAGAN society.
>
> Very strong feelings,
Not feelings at all.
This is the description of what happened.
> without producing a single quote to point out
> anything truly egregious.
I see....
The Holocaust was NOT "egregious" ENOUGH
for you.
You need a quotation here and there.
>
>
> > But HOW do you understand that evil, if your FIRST movement
> > is the PROJECTION of that evil upon another?
>
> Look at how you've projected evil onto St. Paul, for example...
Nah.
This has been demonstrated in the history of Christianity.
Maybe you should read "Massacre at Montsegur" about
the Albigensian Crusade.
>
>
> > In what way does this ASSIST in understanding the origin of
> > that evil?
> >
> > Projection is a psychological reflex to a painful stimuli.
> >
> > It is unconscious and completely WITLESS.
> >
> > There is NO intelligence in it.
> >
> > And, if evil is to be destroyed, it must be done with
> > INTELLIGENCE rather than reflex.
>
> > > Wickedness on this scale could only be accomplished via demonic
> > > intervention.
> >
> > Unhelpful unless you SPECIFY what this means in terms of
> > both Doctrine and consciousness.
>
> No, it is much simpler than that. I believe the 10 June 2002 date
> being revealed as the most critical event timeframe caused a reaction
> within the demonic realm,
This is ALMOST as convincing as your "FROG=AIRPLANE"
explanation.
September 11 is the date of the incident that brought about
this situation...
NOT something that COULD happen on 10 June 2002.
> manifesting in the execution of an act of
> supreme evil with the purpose of activating seeds of hatred and
> mistrust which had been planted long ago. The demons know their time
> is short now, and have been allowed to assist in the fomenting of a
> divisive, volatile conflict prior to the Seventh Bowl event, which
> should come with a spiritual internal Warning: the plan is that when
> the world communes with God
Note to self:
Idolatry ALWAYS leads to BONKERISM.
> (as the Garabandal visionaries predicted),
> that we see ourselves with as many sins as possible.
>
> > > I think you expect too much of leaders generally. They are not
> > > angels, but those humans select to invest with power: they are
> > > popular, not divine.
> >
> > But they CLAIM to be Divine when they are willing to sacrifice
> > ANY number of human lives on the assumption that they are
> > not WRONG.
>
> GWB does NOT claim to be divine, nor has any US president to my
> knowledge!
How LITTLE attention I pay to these political leaders.
When you said leaders my first thought was the RELIGIOUS
leaders and the MEDIA officials.
The religious leaders DO claim to be GOD.
The way they SAY this is in the assertion that they have NEVER
made a serious mistake in terms of Doctrine.
Don't have any complaints with you at all except for your idolatrization
of Jesus and distortion of his Teaching.
> is actually that I did not
> utilize my method to its fullest capacity, which would have allowed
> the precise pinpointing of the first plane striking the WTC, a
> standard so high no prognosticator has yet been held to it.
Surely I did not expect this of you.
NONE of these kinds of things can be established with certainty
prior to the event at such a fine level of structure.
Sure.
But the causation problem is not TRIVIAL.
Especially with your regards to the information about 10 June
2002.
You appear to imply backwards causation.
Says you on what basis?
Is this not the GOAL of Creation?
That EVERYONE have the Knowledge of Truth?
> so I
> do not expect everyone to understand the highly crptic Nostradamian
> prophecies,
And you have to understand these to get into HEAVEN?
Sounds like what theologians say about what THEY write.
> which contain a level of detail that is quite astounding
> when compared with the more generalistic nature of scriptural
> prophecy.
Sure.
But this level of detail is perceived AFTER the fact just as
the fulfillment of certain Prophecies of Daniel and the Rev-
elation of John.
Eagal
> > > What they do to women is horrific.
> > >
> > > A few years ago I wrote a note about what is euphemistically
> > > called 'female circumcision'.
> > >
> > > It is BUTCHERY.
> >
> > But for men it's okay because some faceless being told Abram so?
> > Think about it...
>
> Utterly OFF SCALE bizarre...
>
> To equate such things.
More on this topic (there is an ng BTW) -
If Henoch was taken into heaven before circumcision was instituted,
how does this make sense? Henoch had a vision of the entire history
of the world played out by groups of various animals: in his own era
they were long-lived cows - and a black cow killing a red one was
recognized as Cain killing Abel. Notice the primary Hebrew sacrifice
is of a red heifer, essentially re-enacting the first murder. The
vision continues through the Deluge (brought about to destroy monsters
spawned): "All the cows...were drowned...and destroyed in water. But
the ship floated above it." Thereafter, "A white cow was born in the
midst of them [Abram]. And they began to bite each other
[circumcision metaphor] when the white cow, which was born in the
midst of them, brought forth a wild ass and a white cow at the same
time [Ishmael and Isaac] and thereafter many wild asses [children by
Keturah]. Then a white cow, which was born [Isaac again], brought
forth a black wild sow and a white sheep [Esau and Jacob]. That wild
sow also brought forth many swine; and that sheep brought forth twelve
sheep. When those twelve sheep grew up, they delivered one of them
[Joseph] to the asses [Ishmaelites - I guess X.31 has a hidden meaning
after all!]. Again those asses delivered that sheep to the wolves;
and he grew up in the midst of them..." And so it continues, relating
the past through the distant future in this dreamlike visionary
fashion. Moses' revelation on Mount Sinai is described with a lone
sheep ascending a lofty rock (once the flock has departed from the
wolves): "I perceived their Lord standing before them, with an aspect
terrific and severe. And when they all beheld him, they were
frightened at his countenance. All of them were alarmed, and
trembled. They cried out after that sheep...saying, 'We are not able
to stand before our Lord, nor to look upon him.'" When some become
blind and wander from the path the sheep representing Moses "went to
those which had wandered, and afterwards began to kill them. They
were terrified at his countenance" (horned with light, strong aura).
Henoch's vision is how the prophets of the day knew Elijah was to
ascend soon. Jesus appears as calling seventy shepherds: but He had
72 - and the seventy are given watch over the remainder of history,
taking turns in groups of various number, wherein the extra two count
out - (25)+12+23+12 - but two are omitted from the summation after the
third phase. Notice Moses had seventy-two elders who were to
prophesy, and two were separated and prophesied left behind; also
Jesus after His Resurrection appeared to two disciples before the
Apostles.
As for Noah, he was told the eternal sign of the covenant was a
rainbow, an image appearing around the throne in Revelations; so it is
strange that Abram should later be told the sign is circumcision.
Noah cursed his grandson Chanaan because Cham actually castrated Noah,
so he would not have any more sons to further divide the world among:
Chanaan was Cham's fourth son, and Noah only had three. Then the
Tower of Babel scene ensues, wherein the "gods" decide to confound the
language of humanity for the affront of aspiring towards heaven with
altitude rather than virtue: and the repercussions of this may have
been more than sudden lack of mutual comprehension - the awareness of
the conflict between the heavenly and demonic forces thereafter seems
confused, lacking the definitive clarity from earlier texts where
Satan was exposed in various guises to Adam and Eve and subsequent
generations. Notice in 2 Samuel 24 David is told to take a census
(raising an army like in Numbers) by the Lord "aroused against
Israel," then his heart condemns him (David decides a sin within
himself), and he is offered a choice of punishing slaughters; but in 1
Chronicles 21 Satan is the one who inspires David to take the census,
then "God was displeased with this thing; therefore He struck Israel.
So David said to God, 'I have sinned greatly...'" It is the same
story with a different spin.
After Abraham instituted circumcision, he had three visitors he
perceived as the Lord and two angels: this Lord also tells him Sara
will bear Isaac (as if no one else had said so), and reads the
laughter in her mind, and might even give a date. Then as the two
angels go ahead to Sodom, the Lord stays behind and says that given
the arrangement Abraham has made perhaps he should not disclose that
he is planning to destroy the city, and Abraham pleads with him not to
unless there are very few righteous people there. But the angels as
guests of Lot are besieged, blind people somehow, and lead Lot's
family out. The implication is the Lord went into the city, and
offered himself to be consumed by God's fire from heaven (which Elijah
also summoned): thereafter, Isaac is born to Sara, as predicted - the
visit had been a Dalai Lama turn, going to the next place he would be
born. This Messianic entity was so advanced because he counseled with
the angels: the mysterious explosive annihilation might have also been
an expression of anger - the devil had prepared a punishment for his
next lives, and he wanted this "father of many nations," Abraham (the
Adamic entity), to be aware of the event without comprehending any
ominous import.
There are many other related discussions. Moses did not circumcise
his son, then some murderous angel threatened to kill his wife so she
did it. There was no circumcision during the forty years in the
wilderness, until a voice told Joshua to restart it; then an angel
appeared with a drawn sword. The early Christians concluded they
should trust their own experience of Pentecost, the promised baptism
with the Holy Spirit and fire, wherein both circumcised and
uncircumcised were collectively seen with tongues of flame over their
heads.
Anyone who understands human biology knows both genders begin in the
same form, with complementary variations developing during gestation,
so that each body part of one sex has an analogous feature on the
other. It is therefore intellectually indefensible to promote such a
destructive elective procedure routinely for healthy infants of one
gender, will disparaging it for the other: there are similar hygenic
concerns in both cases, as well. The circumcision of females is
usually more extensive by analogy, and men are conditioned to avoid
thinking about personal issues, but there is no reason genital
trimming should be good or bad depending on the gender. If it is so
wonderful, try to persuade an uncircumcised adult male to undergo that
little change: the majority of them report they would have rather been
killed. Believing that an improvement can be wrought by severing
nerves, veins, skin, etc. is one of those horrible things that I meant
when I wrote of religion gone awry. They study the human genome and
marvel at the instructions for producing the mechanism to smell, for
instance, but decide all men were designed with too much skin. I
doubt the practice was prevalent in Nostradamus' time, even in his
recently Christianized family, and this issue could be why he uses the
term Barbarian, meaning embracing a barbaric practice.
Le Royal sceptre sera contraint de prendre
Ce que ses predecesseurs avaient engage,
Puisque l'anneau on fera mal entendre,
Lorsqu'on viendra le palais saccager.
The Royal sceptre will be obliged to take
That which his predecessors set into motion,
Since of the ring ignorance they'll fake,
When the palace will come to be sacked by a faction.
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
> THE OLD DOUBLE STANDARD
Uhhhhhhhhh.......
A little friendly advice:
Stick with the FROG=AIRPLANE argument.
You would be MUCH more successful convincing me that
two FROGS with hundreds of thousands of pounds of jet
fuel in their BLADDERS flew into the World Trade Center
than you would be convincing me that female 'circum-
cision' (clitoridectomy is the more accurate word) is no
different than male circumcision.
Here is, perhaps, the ONE issue on which these Muslim
countries can justiably be HATED for what they are doing...
This unbelievable CRUELTY that is being inflicted on these
women...
And then some nitwit tries to argue that this is 'really no
different' than male circumcision.
What a MONSTER.
>
>
> > > > What they do to women is horrific.
> > > >
> > > > A few years ago I wrote a note about what is euphemistically
> > > > called 'female circumcision'.
> > > >
> > > > It is BUTCHERY.
> > >
> > > But for men it's okay because some faceless being told Abram so?
> > > Think about it...
> >
> > Utterly OFF SCALE bizarre...
> >
> > To equate such things.
>
> More on this topic (there is an ng BTW) -
>
> If Henoch was taken into heaven before circumcision was instituted,
> how does this make sense?
For the SAME goddamned reason that a FROG = a goddamned
AIRPLANE, nitwit.
What relationship could POSSIBLY exist between Enoch going to
'heaven' and this grotesque surgical procedure?
Oh, THAT'S right...
The SAME relationship that exists between a frog and an....
AIRPLANE.
And, as long as we are talking about TERRORISM, why not
address this issue of sexual TERRORISM against women in
even so called 'moderate' Muslim countries like Egypt?
Will Colin Powell be talking about THAT?
HELL NO.
> Henoch had a vision of the entire history
> of the world played out by groups of various animals: in his own era
> they were long-lived cows - and a black cow killing a red one was
> recognized as Cain killing Abel. Notice the primary Hebrew sacrifice
> is of a red heifer, essentially re-enacting the first murder. The
> vision continues through the Deluge (brought about to destroy monsters
> spawned): "All the cows...were drowned...and destroyed in water. But
> the ship floated above it." Thereafter, "A white cow was born in the
> midst of them [Abram]. And they began to bite each other
> [circumcision metaphor]
I rest my case.
Are you a card-carrying Nazi....?
Or did you just lose your card?
First you worship Jesus as God in specific contradiction of
the Teaching of Jesus.
Then you acknowledge both the doctrine of vicarious atonement
and the existence of a metaphysical heaven and hell...
All fundamentally anti-Semitic doctrines in their manifestation.
Then you develop an 'alternative' explanation for the assertions
and Doctrines of the Torah.
And THEN you try to apply all of this to the Revelation of John
through the looking glass of astrology and the ramblings of
Nostradamus.
Why not come right out and SAY that you are a Nazi and that
what you are trying to do is contradict point by point EVERY-
THING conveyed as Revealed Truth?
At least you would be more HONEST...
Rather than masquerading as a follower of Jesus.
Eagal
MASTERING THE GRENADE:
De la Felice Arabie contrade
Naitra puissant de loi Mahometique,
Vexer l'Espagne, conquester la Grenade,
Et plus par mer a la gent Ligustique.
In the country where Arabia Felix laid
Will be born one forceful for Mahometan decree,
To vex the Western land, to master the Grenade,
And more for the Ligurian people by sea.
V.55 (note, each digit one off 666) concerns someone born in Arabia,
near Yemen and the Aden Protectorate, who accomplishes some explosive
act in a western nation - the Ligurian (Genoan) label is figurative,
with more expected by sea for the same vexed location. Mahomet arises
again in I.18 -
Par le discorde negligence Gauloise,
Sera passage a Mahomet ouvert:
De sang trempe la terre et mer Senoise,
Le port Phocen de voiles et nefs couvert.
Through Gallic neglect the discord -
By Mahomet a passage will be opened:
The land and sea of Siena soaked in blood,
Port of Marseilles by sails and ships covered.
Perhaps not used as an ideology, but a first name; the finding of open
places by Ishmaelites from IX.31 seems related. Siena (in Tuscany)
again probably a metaphor for the same place, with a similar theme of
land, then sea being disturbed. Marseilles could represent a busy
harbor, but the Mars inference could be astrological of Sept 8 to 13
'01.
Si France passes outre mer lygustique,
Tu te verras en iles et mers enclos:
Mahommet contraire, plus mer Hadriatique,
Chevaux et anes tu rongeras les os.
If France passes beyond the Ligurian Sea,
You will see yourself enclosed within isles and oceans:
Mahomet contrary, moreso the Adriatic Sea,
Horses and asses, you will gnaw the bones.
III.23's Ligurian Sea event appears to be a second Deluge (France
could simply mean in his own prophecies); the Adriatic (of Venice, on
the other side of Italy) also being contrary confirms an extensive
disruption of waters. The "horse eating oats" of VIII.72 turned out
to be terrorist tactic of flying planes into targets; "asses" are
related to the later cataclysm in IX.31 (equated with Ishmaelites, as
per the vision of Henoch) and VI.17 ("ass-drivers," more precisely).
Again, the darkly cloaked mule wounding the Night-King in VI.36 has
its parallel in II.60 -
Quand le mulet la faim sera repue,
Classe espargie, sang et corps nageront
When the hunger of the mule will be satiated,
Fleet sprinkles, blood and bodies will swim
Similar to the horse-eating-oats metaphor, a satisfied mule. The
fleet may have been the one sprinkling bombs in retaliation; the
lethal water event still remains in the future.
Loin d'Ibere au Royaume de Grenade,
Croix repousses par gens Mahometiques
Far from Iberia at the Kingdom of the Grenade,
Crosses beaten back by Mahometan people
III.20 (these are lines 2 & 3) reveals there is a Kingdom of the
Grenade far from the Western land vexed in V.55, likely confirming
this distant location as the setting for the ambush of V.22, X.7,
IX.43,81 etc.
Pau, Verone, Vicence, Sarragousse,
De glaives loin terroirs de sang humides,
Peste si grande viendra a la grande gousse,
Proche secours, et bien loin les remedes.
Pau, Verona, Vicenza, Saragossa,
Lands moist with blood from swords brandished afar,
A very great plague will come with the great Gauss,
Rescue near, and the remedies very far.
III.75 line 1 suggests 18 to 22 January using saint feastdays (notably
St. Vincent Saragossa), probably for the total lunar eclipse of 2000.
Line 2 should refer to the WTC destruction, massive slaughter through
a foreign influence. But the plague in line 3 does not seem to
arrive 10 November 2001, since Ceres (the "gousse" celestial body)
appears to fulfill that when it usurps Vesta's reign in early 2002:
the final line seems to concern unavailable treatments for some sudden
epidemic, though perhaps this plague is not medical, but of divine
origin (i.e., "seven angels having the seven last plagues, for in them
the wrath of God is complete," Apoc. 15:1) - physical rescue may be
possible, but no easy remedy for the greatest, final plague of the
seven.
Elaborating on the previous post:
Au Roi l'Augur sur le chef la main mettre
Viendra prier pour la paix Italique;
A la main gauche viendra changer le sceptre,
De Roi viendra Empereur pacifique.
The Augure to place his hand upon the King's head
Will come to pray for Italian peace;
The scepter to change will come towards the left hand,
From King will come Emperor of Pacific Seas.
I've embellished this V.6 translation to conform with the discovery
that 10 June 2002 will be the first solar eclipse of that year,
annular and arcing across the Pacific Ocean: Indonesia at sunrise,
maximum 2600 miles north of Hawaii, visible at sunset in Puerto
Vallarta. [The King is again Francois 1er born 12 September 1494, the
great King of Angoumois {X.72}, and successor to the duchy of Orleans
{V.3, X.45} - emphasized because of the 11 September '01 events.] The
sceptral alignment precedes, when the Sun enters Gemini 21 May. This
annular eclipse should coincide with a "second butcher's bench" being
made in the western lands (VIII.54), more carnage on American soil
(whether from malfeasance or malevolence).
Les Dieux feront aux humains apparence
Ce qu'ils seront auteurs de grand conflict:
Avant ciel vu serein epee et lance,
Que vers main gauche sera plus grand afflict.
The Gods for the mortals will make it appear
That they themselves will author a great conflict:
Before heaven viewed serene lance and rapier,
While towards the left hand will be a greater afflict.
In I.91 again the left hand holds the greater affliction coming at the
time when war is waged in the sight of a serene heaven, whose powers
are shaken later via the "scepter for change" - planetary alignment
completed under the Sun (V.24, 53) signalling the time for divine
wrath.
Le Royal sceptre sera contraint de prendre
Ce que ses predecesseurs avaient engage,
Puisque l'anneau on fera mal entendre,
Lorsqu'on viendra le palais saccager.
The Royal sceptre will be obliged to take
That which its predecessors had set into motion,
Since of the ring ignorance they will fake,
When the palace will come to be sacked by a faction.
VII.23 links the destroyed palace (WTC complex) with the appearance of
a Royal sceptre (alignment completed by the Sun 21 May 2002), which
was preceded by the Taurean alignment "under Venus" from May 2000.
The ring should be the circular RHIC.
Le Roi ruse entendra ses embuches,
De trois quartiers ennemis assailir;
Un nombre etrange larmes de coqueluches,
Viendra Lemprin du traducteur faillir.
The cunning King will anticipate his ambushes,
From three separate quarters enemies to assail;
An unknown number coughing with teary flushes,
Bright deductions by the translator will come to fail.
IX.81's ambush is probably the same one associated with Nancy and
Neptune. The image appears to be knowledge of the prophecies used to
forestall a combat situation otherwise unexpected in the first
portion; but the latter part regards some type of biological domestic
attack, perhaps a disastrously effective use of some dreaded airborne
infectious agent, with the final line implying even a great insight
will achieve nothing...
En ce temps la sera frustree Cypres
De son secours de ceux de mer Egee:
Vieux trucides, mais par mesles et lyphres;
Seduit leur Roi, Reine plus outragee.
In those times Cyprus will be frustrated
Of its rescue from those of Aegean water:
By measles and leprosy old ones oddly decimated,
Their King seduced, Queen outraged further.
III.89 could predict a flooding of the island of Cyprus (an attack by
waves). "Measles and leprosy" may describe a smallpox outbreak,
however it should not affect only the elderly; one documented case of
an extensive airborne anthrax exposure indicated no fatalities for
people under 24. Because we have experienced the event associated
with King Francois 1er, and now look forward to Vesta's fury after her
upcoming brief reign, it is reasonable to assume this quatrain is to
be fulfilled soon.
Au port de Agde trois fustes entreront,
Portant l'infect, non foi et pestilence;
Passant le pont mil milles embleront,
Et le pont rompre a tierce resistance.
At the port of Agde three foists will've arrived,
Not carrying faith, but infection and pestilence;
Passing the pent millions will be removed,
And the pent to break at third resistance.
VIII.21's three foists reminded me of the 3 destroying planes, but I
could not find any connection between 11 Sept and Agde. There is the
506 Council of Agde, wherein it was decided Catholics should receive
Communion on Easter, Pentecost and Christmas: but no useful date
arose. Alternately, there are three saints of Agde - Florence,
Modesto, and Tiberius - honored together on 10 November. The "pont"
should mean bridge, but with a change of letter suggests Pentagon,
which was broken by the third attack wave. So there could be a
pestilence which kills millions way before the Lion event annihilates
seven million in June, with the bloody carnage of the latter event
receiving greater attention because of its global destabilization.
The action may involve the Pentagon again, but crop dusting toxic
particles over that area seems unlikely, especially with three crafts:
but if Agde means 10 November 2001, the ominous prophecy could become
a hideous reality on schedule.
Agde is synonymous with Agatha, as in IV.94 -
Narbon, Blyterre, d'Agath contaminees
Scar, Beziers, by Agatha contaminated
The Scar being the WTC ruin site, and Beziers for its bishop St.
Gerald (died 1123) November 5 (as used during the election for 5 Nov
'00 in IX.25). The 2001 Beziers may be a subject of III.56 -
Montaubant, Nismes, Auignon, et Besier,
Peste, tonnerre et grele a fin de Mars
De Paris, pont, Lyon mur, Montpellier,
Depuis six cents et sept vingts trois pars.
Mount-Windfall, Nemesis, Avignon and Beziers,
Plague, thunder and hail in the wake of Mars
For Paris, pent, Lion wall, Mount-Peeler,
Between six hundred and seven twenty-three pairs.
The mountainous WTC towers falling with a rush of wind, Nemesis
meaning not only the goddess of divine retribution but also a
formidable opponent inflicting his own punishment; Avignon is the RCC
version of Babylon because of papal "captivity" away from Rome. Mars,
already in Aquarius, will conjunct Neptune 5 Nov '01: the plague of 10
Nov may follow (involving the pent-Pentagon?-as in VIII.21), but there
could be the predicted weather in Paris on the 5th. The Lion wall
probably breaks with the Mountain-Peeler to produce the major
catastrophe. The cryptic final line could be regarding the scientists
at the Brookhaven RHIC, between 600 and 700 humans at the time,
defined biologically as possessing 23 paired chromosomes each.
Quintin, Arras recouvres au voyage
Quentin, Arras recovered in the voyage
Line 3 of VIII.54 should concern 31 October as St. Quentin's day: and
for Arras, the most likely candidate is St. Saturnina of Arras 4 June,
delineating the majority of the interval between 11 Sept '01 and 10
June '01. The "Saturnin" name is ominous: this saint is a young
German virgin (date unknown) killed by her suitor after fleeing him to
Arras. The prior day, Queen St. Clotilda of France (474-545) is
honored, who was a widow...
Des innocents le sang de veuve et vierge
The blood of innocents from widow and virgin
VIII.80 line 1 could indicate another massive loss of innocent lives
shortly after the feastdays honoring widow (3 June) and virgin (4
June).
Le veuve sainte entendant les nouvelles,
De ses rameaux mis en perplex et trouble
The saintly widow hearing the news,
Of her branches put in perplexity and trouble
VI.29 could be an attempt to notify the Corinth-Ephesus perplexity of
III.3 (Mercury-Ascendant and Neptune-Midheaven simultaneous conjuncts
occuring 9 June, thus mounted on courier and pike a la V.1) which is
the sign of impending trouble is preceded by the feastday of a saintly
widow (like Clotilda of 3 June).
* * * * * * *
* *
Lors que serpents viendront circuir l'are,
Le sang Troyen vexe par les Espaignes;
Par eux grand nombre en sera faite tare,
Chef fuit, cache aux mares dans les saignes.
When the serpents will come to encompass the altar,
The Trojan blood vexed for the Western camp;
By waters a great number will be made to falter,
Chief flees, hidden by the marsh within the swamp.
[I.19]
"Et depuis le temps de l'humaine Redemption jusqu'a la seduction...ont
ete six cent vingt et un an"
"Moi en cet endroit je ne m'attribue nullement tel titre, ja a Dieu ne
plaise"
Now I, John, saw and heard these things. And when I heard and saw, I
fell down to worship before the feet of the angel who showed me these
things. Then he said to me,
"See that you do NOT do that. For I am your fellow servant, and of
your brethren the prophets, and of those who keep the words of this
book. Worship God."
[Apoc. 22:8,9]
God said unto Adam, "All this misery that thou hast been made to take
upon thee because of thy transgression will not free thee from the
hand of Satan, and will not save thee. But I will. When I shall come
down from heaven, and shall become flesh of thy seed, and take upon Me
the infirmity from which thou sufferest..." [IA&E 14:3,4]
Then our father Adam blessed them all, and said..."The Word of God,
made man shall come, when kings shall take them, and shall offer to
Him, gold in token of His being King, incense, in token of His being
God of heaven and earth, and myrrh, in token of His passion..."
[IIA&E 8:18]
The angel Gabriel told Mary
That she would bear a child,
And Mary answered that could not happen,
Because she was a virgin;
Then he said to her,
"Though you are still a virgin,
You'll be conceiving
In the shadow
Of the Holy Divine Spirit."
Born from a virgin,
And wrapped up in swaddling cloth,
Jesus grew to the age of two,
Then they were found
By three kings of Persia and Media who are called -
Magi!
MAGI!
Who were astrologers, and knew they had to follow a star
To reach Him,
And they brought Him gifts:
One of them brought GOLD;
One myrrh;
And frankincense!
Lamb and Star:
He WAS the perfect Christ:
I fail to see
The Hebrews' controversy...
"It has been said, 'You shall not tempt the Lord your God!'" [To
Satan, Luke 14:12, Deut. 6:16]
Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your law, 'I said, "You are
gods"'? [Psalm 82:6] If He called them gods, to whom the word of God
came...do you say of Him whom the Father sanctified and sent into the
world, 'You are blaspheming,' because I said, 'I am the Son of God'?"
[John 10:34,35]
He said to them, "But who do you say that I am?"
Simon Peter answered and said, "You are the Christ, the Son of the
living God."
Jesus answered and said to him, "Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for
flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in
heaven." [Matthew 16:15-17]
Pilate then calling Jesus said, "Thou hast heard what they testify
against thee, and makest no answer?"
Jesus replied, "If they had not power of speaking, they could not have
spoke: but because everyone has the command of his own tongue, to
speak both good and bad, let him look to it"...
Jesus saith to him, "Moses and the prophets have prophesied concerning
my suffering and resurrection."
The Jews hearing this were provoked, and said to Pilate, "Why wilt
thou any longer hear the blasphemy of that man?"...
Pilate saith to them, "It is not fit that he should be crucified: let
him only be whipped and sent away."
But when the governor looked upon the people that were present and the
Jews, he saw many of the Jews in tears, and said to the chief priests
of the Jews, "All the people do not desire his death."
The elders of the Jews answered to Pilate, "We and all the people came
hither for this very purpose, that he should die."
Pilate saith to them, "Why should he die?"
They said to him, "Because he declares himself to be the Son of God,
and a King"...
And another Jew stood forth, and said, "I saw Jesus in the synagogue
at Capernaum, and there was in the synagogue a certain man who had a
devil, and he cried out, saying, 'Let me alone; What have we to do
with thee, Jesus of Nazareth? Art thou come to destroy us? I know
that thou art the Holy One of God.' And Jesus rebuked him, saying,
'Hold thy peace, unclean spirit, and come out of the man,' and
presently he came out of him, and did not hurt him at all"...
The following things were also said by a Pharisee: "I saw that a great
company came to Jesus from Galilee and Judea...I heard the unclean
spirits crying out, and saying, 'Thou art the Son of God.' And Jesus
strictly charged them, that they should not make him known"...
Besides these, also many others of the Jews, both men and women, cried
out and said, "He is truly the Son of God, who cures all diseases only
by his word, and to whom the devils altogether are subject." Some of
them farther said, "This power can proceed from none but God"...
But others said to Pilate that he had raised Lazarus from the dead,
after he had been four days in his grave. The governor hearing this,
trembling said to the multitude of the Jews, "What will it profit you
to shed innocent blood?" [Nicodemus
2:4,5;4:11,12,17-21;5:30,33,41,42,45,46]
"Whence comes it, O thou Jesus Christ,
That thou art a man so powerful and glorious in majesty,
So bright as to have no spot,
And so pure as to have no crime?"
[Asked by demons as Christ broke the gates of Hades, reported by
spirits risen after the Crucifixion, as recorded in Nicodemus 17:10]
Then there was a great voice, as of the sound of thunder, saying,
"Lift up your gates, O princes; and be ye lifted up, ye gates of hell,
and the King of Glory will enter in."
But I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are
its temple...
And he showed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal,
proceeding from the throne of God and of the Lamb. [Apoc. 21:22;22:1]
Now Belchira accused Isaiah and the prophets who were with him with
these words... "Isaiah himself has said, 'I see more than the prophet
Moses.' Now Moses said, 'There is no man who can see God and live,'
but Isaiah has said, 'I have seen God, and behold I live.' Know
therefore, O king, that he is a liar"...For Beliar harboured great
wrath against Isaiah on account of the vision and of the exposure with
which he had exposed Sammael [Satan], and because through him the
coming forth of the Beloved from the seventh heaven had been revealed,
and his transformation, his descent and the likeness into which he was
to be transformed, namely, the likeness of a man, and the persecution
which he was to suffer, and the tortures with which the children of
Israel were to afflict him, and the coming of the twelve disciples and
the instruction, and that he should before the Sabbath be crucified on
the tree, and that he was to be crucified together with criminals, and
that he would be buried in a sepulchre...and that the angel of the
Holy Spirit and Michael, the chief of the holy angels, would open his
grave on the third day... "And afterwards, when he is at hand, his
disciples will forsake the teaching of the twelve apostles and their
faith, their love and their purity, and there will arise much
contention about his coming...many elders will be lawless and violent
shepherds to their sheep and will become ravagers of the sheep, since
they have no holy shepherds. And many will exchange their glory of
the garment of the saints for the garment of the covetous... Great
discord will arise among them, between shepherds and elders, for great
jealousy will prevail in the last days, for each will say what seems
pleasing in his own eyes. And they will set aside the prophecies of
the prophets which were before me and also pay no attention to these
my visions, in order to speak forth from the torrent of their heart."
...And Belchira spoke thus to Isaiah: "Say what I say to thee and I
will alter their purpose, and I will prevail upon Manasseh and the
princes of Judah and the people and all Jerusalem to reverence thee
upon their knees." And Isaiah answered and said, "So far as I am
concerned, so to speak, damned and cursed be thou, all thy powers and
thy whole house, for thou canst take no more than the skin of my
flesh."" So they seized and sawed asunder Isaiah the son of Amoz, with
a saw.
[The Ascension of Isaiah]
"Then the fifth angel poured out his bowl on the throne of the beast,
and his kingdom became full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues
because of the pain."
An earthquake in Turkey!
During the Grand Fixed Cross...
Bound for Saturn...
Bound for Saturn,
The spacecraft Cassini will come,
And LEAVE the rod bloody in Byzantium...
Bound for Saturn...
Bound for Saturn,
The spacecraft will-
Deliver darkness to-
Deliver darkness to
CONSTANTINOPLE!
(When The Sun Sets)
Eagal
> Eagal wrote:
>
> > THE OLD DOUBLE STANDARD
>
> Uhhhhhhhhh.......
>
> A little friendly advice:
>
> Stick with the FROG=AIRPLANE argument.
It's out of character for you to be friendly. Don't strain yourself.
> You would be MUCH more successful convincing me that
> two FROGS with hundreds of thousands of pounds of jet
> fuel in their BLADDERS flew into the World Trade Center
> than you would be convincing me that female 'circum-
> cision' (clitoridectomy is the more accurate word) is no
> different than male circumcision.
You of course deleted the passage where I stated it IS different, the
female version being more extensive. But you love an argument, don't
you?
> Here is, perhaps, the ONE issue on which these Muslim
> countries can justiably be HATED for what they are doing...
>
> This unbelievable CRUELTY that is being inflicted on these
> women...
>
> And then some nitwit tries to argue that this is 'really no
> different' than male circumcision.
>
> What a MONSTER.
If you think you're going to eliminate female circumcision while you
defend routine circumcision of male infants, you are deluded. You are
sending a mixed message that will achieve no change whatsoever,
because you do not even realize what the central issue is: it is the
theft of body parts, and you cannot hypocritically choose which is
fair and which isn't, since that is entirely arbitrary and you will
have no credibility. If people think circumcision is mandated by God,
who are you to say women shouldn't participate also?
> > > > > What they do to women is horrific.
> > > > >
> > > > > A few years ago I wrote a note about what is euphemistically
> > > > > called 'female circumcision'.
> > > > >
> > > > > It is BUTCHERY.
> > > >
> > > > But for men it's okay because some faceless being told Abram so?
> > > > Think about it...
> > >
> > > Utterly OFF SCALE bizarre...
> > >
> > > To equate such things.
I already stated with the female it is usually more extensive, with
clitoral amputation the equivalent of chopping off the male glans.
But you are so anxious for an argument you had to delete that part, of
course...
> > More on this topic (there is an ng BTW) -
> >
> > If Henoch was taken into heaven before circumcision was instituted,
> > how does this make sense?
>
> For the SAME goddamned reason that a FROG = a goddamned
> AIRPLANE, nitwit.
>
> What relationship could POSSIBLY exist between Enoch going to
> 'heaven' and this grotesque surgical procedure?
BECAUSE IF HENOCH ASCENDED INTO HEAVEN UNCIRCUMCISED HE WAS WORTHY,
WHILE ABRAM WAS BASICALLY TOLD NO ONE WAS WORTHY WITHOUT BEING
CIRCUMCISED!!!
Read Acts 15: the early Christians observed during the Pentecost
miracle that even the uncircumcised men had a tongue of fire over
their head, which destroyed their THEORY that circumcision afforded
them some spiritual benefit. They concluded the act was "strangled
and from blood," with Saint Peter remarking it was a yoke neither they
nor their fathers were able to bear. In the Gospel of Thomas the
question was posed in Saying 53:
"His disciples said to Him, 'Is circumcision useful or not?'
He said to them, 'If it were useful, a father would produce children
already circumcised from their mother. Rather, the true, spiritual
circumcision is useful in every respect.'"
Jesus was speaking metaphorically of resigning to God's will, which
was the motivation Abram had: the act was bad, but his intention was
good - just like it would have been had he followed the later command
and killed Isaac, to be obedient to the entity he believed was God.
But this entity asked for things God never would, and never claimed to
have created them (but It would be THEIR God). Part of the bargain
was Abram agreed his descendants should be in slavery for 400 years!
Then after accomplishing the Exodus through slaughtering a Lamb at
twilight to kill the Egyptian children, they were told they would not
get to the Promised Land for 40 years. But Chanaan was not really
Promised, it was cursed by Noah, and this was how his curse
manifested. Adam was promised a Redeemer in 5500, Abram was way too
soon for this: and Jesus arrived at the appointed time, trying His
best to undo a lot of theological damage. The pre-Deluge documents
which illuminate Genesis 4 & 5 have Satanic deception as the central
theme, which becomes conspicuously absent after the Tower of Babel
only because Satan seems to have succeeded in supplanting the
intercession of God, so that when the real angels were dispatched (as
the one who stopped the sacrifice of Isaac), their actions were
perceived in the context created by the other entity. You can point
at Apoc. 2:9 and say Jesus, St. John and anyone reading the book must
all be Nazis, but that is because you are not seeking: you believe you
have found Truth, and only want to defend it.
> Oh, THAT'S right...
>
> The SAME relationship that exists between a frog and an....
> AIRPLANE.
Now you know why I don't explain the REST of Revelations: but you're
in the midst of it, and have been for some time. It all makes about
as much sense, and is as difficult to "prove": just like much of
Nostradamus' predictions. The media announces that Nostradamus never
wrote of "twin towers," while omitting the fact that there are
numerous potential predictions of the WTC disaster.
> And, as long as we are talking about TERRORISM, why not
> address this issue of sexual TERRORISM against women in
> even so called 'moderate' Muslim countries like Egypt?
>
> Will Colin Powell be talking about THAT?
>
> HELL NO.
Like that's his job! For someone who claims to want peace, you make
quite an effort to inflame situations...
> > Henoch had a vision of the entire history
> > of the world played out by groups of various animals: in his own era
> > they were long-lived cows - and a black cow killing a red one was
> > recognized as Cain killing Abel. Notice the primary Hebrew sacrifice
> > is of a red heifer, essentially re-enacting the first murder. The
> > vision continues through the Deluge (brought about to destroy monsters
> > spawned): "All the cows...were drowned...and destroyed in water. But
> > the ship floated above it." Thereafter, "A white cow was born in the
> > midst of them [Abram]. And they began to bite each other
> > [circumcision metaphor]
>
> I rest my case.
You made no case. You do not have any other explanation for this
"biting" being instituted at the time of the birth of Ishmael and
Isaac; this is probably the first time you have ever been exposed to
the document.
> Are you a card-carrying Nazi....?
No, but you could have taught them a few things about propaganda!
> First you worship Jesus as God in specific contradiction of
> the Teaching of Jesus.
To Christians Jesus is not only the Son of God, but a man, and a king:
this was the symbolism of the three gifts of the Magi, very basic.
Jesus said everyone has divinity in John 10:34-36, so you are writing
from ignorance. Even the demons He exorcised called Him the Son of
God. Jesus said he was giving Peter the "keys to the kingdom of
heaven" because he called Him "the Son of the living God." But facts
do not matter to someone holding onto their own "Truth."
> Then you acknowledge both the doctrine of vicarious atonement
> and the existence of a metaphysical heaven and hell...
Why don't you accede to my request and stop reading my posts? My
commenaries are intended for intelligent, emotionally balanced people,
of which you are obviously not one - you are a powder keg trying to
explode! Please go away!
> All fundamentally anti-Semitic doctrines in their manifestation.
So you expect Hebrew doctrines from submissions to a ng for a
Christian seer? The Jews have shoel, what they call hell. You
pretend to restate my beliefs, but essentially write your own only to
denounce them! What I said was that if someone inadvertently followed
the instructions hidden in the crypticism of the parables they would
be saved: this is not "a doctrine of vicarious atonement," which is
the fundamentalist belief that Jesus did something for believers by
being killed.
> Then you develop an 'alternative' explanation for the assertions
> and Doctrines of the Torah.
>
> And THEN you try to apply all of this to the Revelation of John
> through the looking glass of astrology and the ramblings of
> Nostradamus.
Then YOU try to figure out what I do, and fail, as above.
> Why not come right out and SAY that you are a Nazi and that
> what you are trying to do is contradict point by point EVERY-
> THING conveyed as Revealed Truth?
What you THINK is Truth has not been proven; and your attempt to
equate early Christian ideologies with Nazism is pathetic. To adhere
to the entire OT Law would create a society as odious as the Taliban
has become: Jesus stopped a woman from being stoned for the "Truth";
He cleansed the Temple of the those selling animals to be sacrificed
for the "Truth"; He was attacked for healing on Sabbath because of the
"Truth." Jesus said NO to "an eye for an eye," the concept of
uncleanness by association, etc., because He was addressing problems
with the Law, not endorsing the current interpretations and customs.
The Nazis were not just Christians, they were authoritarian heretics
who believed they could turn earth into Paradise through genocide, an
idea they did NOT get from the NT, which promises no murderer has
eternal life. Now what if you're a murderer and don't like that
teaching? You would probably just criticize people who repeat it,
like you have about Truths I've revealed...
> At least you would be more HONEST...
>
> Rather than masquerading as a follower of Jesus.
You are very judgemental, but without Christianity I guess you
wouldn't see what's wrong with that, either.
> Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran, Column
> XVII of the "Scroll of the War of the Sons of Light")
And you might want to take a look at Nostradamus' Epistle, paragraph
10!
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
> "(28SW2) Michael Cecil" <mj...@earthlink.net> wrote in message news:<3BCF4892...@earthlink.net>...
> > Eagal wrote:
> >
> > > THE OLD DOUBLE STANDARD
> >
> > Uhhhhhhhhh.......
> >
> > A little friendly advice:
> >
> > Stick with the FROG=AIRPLANE argument.
>
> It's out of character for you to be friendly.
Maybe to you.
> Don't strain yourself.
Being sarcastic.
>
>
> > You would be MUCH more successful convincing me that
> > two FROGS with hundreds of thousands of pounds of jet
> > fuel in their BLADDERS flew into the World Trade Center
> > than you would be convincing me that female 'circum-
> > cision' (clitoridectomy is the more accurate word) is no
> > different than male circumcision.
>
> You of course deleted the passage where I stated it IS different, the
> female version being more extensive. But you love an argument, don't
> you?
>
> > Here is, perhaps, the ONE issue on which these Muslim
> > countries can justiably be HATED for what they are doing...
> >
> > This unbelievable CRUELTY that is being inflicted on these
> > women...
> >
> > And then some nitwit tries to argue that this is 'really no
> > different' than male circumcision.
> >
> > What a MONSTER.
>
> If you think you're going to eliminate female circumcision while you
> defend routine circumcision of male infants, you are deluded.
This is where you equate them AGAIN.
The argument against male circumcision is not even CLOSE to
what the argument is against female clitoridectomy.
By the way, WHERE have I DEFENDED male circumcision?
WHERE?
And WHY would I defend male circumcision?
I don't care one way or the other what people do.
> You are
> sending a mixed message that will achieve no change whatsoever,
> because you do not even realize what the central issue is: it is the
> theft of body parts,
Do you REALLY think that this is what the issue is?
No, I mean SERIOUSLY.
What about getting a HAIR CUT or clipping your
FINGER NAILS or having an inflamed APPENDIX
removed?
This too is THEFT OF BODY PARTS.
So I suppose your argument is that a clitoridectomy is
no different than clipping your FINGER NAILS.
> and you cannot hypocritically choose which is
> fair and which isn't,
Yes I can.
I will say that getting a hair cut and permanent for a woman
is NOT as 'unfair' as having a clitoridectomy.
I WILL say that.
You are asserting an equivalance between these 'procedures'.
I don't care HOW you try to DANCE around it.
> since that is entirely arbitrary and you will
> have no credibility. If people think circumcision is mandated by God,
> who are you
Don't HAVE to be anybody except a person capable of READING
that it was not mandated by God for WOMEN.
Only takes maybe TWO active brain cells to see this.
> to say women shouldn't participate also?
>
> > > > > > What they do to women is horrific.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > A few years ago I wrote a note about what is euphemistically
> > > > > > called 'female circumcision'.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It is BUTCHERY.
> > > > >
> > > > > But for men it's okay because some faceless being told Abram so?
> > > > > Think about it...
> > > >
> > > > Utterly OFF SCALE bizarre...
> > > >
> > > > To equate such things.
>
> I already stated with the female it is usually more extensive, with
> clitoral amputation the equivalent of chopping off the male glans.
> But you are so anxious for an argument you had to delete that part, of
> course...
>
> > > More on this topic (there is an ng BTW) -
> > >
> > > If Henoch was taken into heaven before circumcision was instituted,
> > > how does this make sense?
> >
> > For the SAME goddamned reason that a FROG = a goddamned
> > AIRPLANE, nitwit.
> >
> > What relationship could POSSIBLY exist between Enoch going to
> > 'heaven' and this grotesque surgical procedure?
>
> BECAUSE IF HENOCH ASCENDED INTO HEAVEN UNCIRCUMCISED HE WAS WORTHY,
Maybe it would be better to go back to frogs with thousands of gallons
of
jet fuel in their bladders...
Seriously.
>
> WHILE ABRAM WAS BASICALLY TOLD NO ONE WAS WORTHY WITHOUT BEING
> CIRCUMCISED!!!
You are taking this issue MUCH too seriously.
Do you know what 'circumcision of the heart' means in Isaiah?
It refers to the annihilation of the images created by the heart,
one of the consequences of which is the Revelation of the
"resurrection of the dead" which is received in the heart.
A 'circumcision of the intellect', by the way, would refer to the
annihilation of conceptual images.
The Vision of the "Son of man" CANNOT occur without this.
It occurs at the Seventh Church, whereas the circumcision
of the heart occurs at the Fourth Church.
So your misunderstanding of this is due to a lack of Knowledge
as to what precisely is involved.
>
>
> Read Acts 15:
No thanks.
And I won't read "Mein Kampf" to get my theology either.
> the early Christians observed during the Pentecost
> miracle that even the uncircumcised men had a tongue of fire over
> their head,
BINGO.
But meaning WHAT?
Do you know that this is a symbol for the Vision of the "Son of man",
as is the reference to the "wind"?
> which destroyed their THEORY that circumcision afforded
> them some spiritual benefit.
Fine by me.
Could not care LESS.
> They concluded the act was "strangled
> and from blood," with Saint Peter remarking it was a yoke neither they
> nor their fathers were able to bear. In the Gospel of Thomas the
> question was posed in Saying 53:
>
> "His disciples said to Him, 'Is circumcision useful or not?'
> He said to them, 'If it were useful, a father would produce children
> already circumcised from their mother. Rather, the true, spiritual
> circumcision is useful in every respect.'"
And you think I would ARGUE with this?
Why?
> Jesus was speaking metaphorically of resigning to God's will, which
> was the motivation Abram had: the act was bad,
Says who?
> but his intention was
> good - just like it would have been had he followed the later command
> and killed Isaac, to be obedient to the entity he believed was God.
> But this entity asked for things God never would,
This was the issue: the annihilation of all conceptual and images of
the heart concerning what God would Demand of a person.
This is PRECISELY the issue.
> and never claimed to
> have created them (but It would be THEIR God). Part of the bargain
> was Abram agreed his descendants should be in slavery for 400 years!
And?
>
> Then after accomplishing
Huh?????
> the Exodus through slaughtering a Lamb at
> twilight to kill the Egyptian children,
Huhhhh??????????
> they were told they would not
> get to the Promised Land for 40 years. But Chanaan was not really
> Promised, it was cursed by Noah, and this was how his curse
> manifested.
Yeah, right.
Whatever.
> Adam was promised a Redeemer in 5500, Abram was way too
> soon for this: and Jesus arrived at the appointed time, trying His
> best to undo a lot of theological damage. The pre-Deluge documents
> which illuminate Genesis 4 & 5 have Satanic deception as the central
> theme, which becomes conspicuously absent after the Tower of Babel
> only because Satan seems to have succeeded in supplanting the
> intercession of God, so that when the real angels were dispatched (as
> the one who stopped the sacrifice of Isaac), their actions were
> perceived in the context created by the other entity.
Wow. Wow. And wow.
What religion IS this you have concocted?
Are you a Jedi Knight or something?
> You can point
> at Apoc. 2:9 and say Jesus, St. John and anyone reading the book must
> all be Nazis,
Not even close.
It is the way this is interpreted.
> but that is because you are not seeking: you believe you
> have found Truth, and only want to defend it.
>
> > Oh, THAT'S right...
> >
> > The SAME relationship that exists between a frog and an....
> > AIRPLANE.
>
> Now you know why I don't explain the REST of Revelations:
(What do you mean "REST"? You have not explained anything
about it YET.)
First, because you CAN'T.
You have not received the Vision of the "Son of man".
That is the one simple Truth that applies here.
> but you're
> in the midst of it, and have been for some time. It all makes about
> as much sense, and is as difficult to "prove": just like much of
> Nostradamus' predictions. The media announces that Nostradamus never
> wrote of "twin towers," while omitting the fact that there are
> numerous potential predictions of the WTC disaster.
>
> > And, as long as we are talking about TERRORISM, why not
> > address this issue of sexual TERRORISM against women in
> > even so called 'moderate' Muslim countries like Egypt?
> >
> > Will Colin Powell be talking about THAT?
> >
> > HELL NO.
>
> Like that's his job!
SURPRISE!!!!!!.
People have DIFFERENT ideas of what TERRORISM is.
For the Bosnian Muslim women it was the RAPE camps.
For many women in Muslim countries it is clitoridectomy.
We need only a MALE definition of TERRORISM????????
> For someone who claims to want peace, you make
> quite an effort to inflame situations...
I am merely pointing out another form of terrorism and
violence.
But that complicates your very 'neat' definitions.
>
> > > Henoch had a vision of the entire history
> > > of the world played out by groups of various animals: in his own era
> > > they were long-lived cows - and a black cow killing a red one was
> > > recognized as Cain killing Abel. Notice the primary Hebrew sacrifice
> > > is of a red heifer, essentially re-enacting the first murder. The
> > > vision continues through the Deluge (brought about to destroy monsters
> > > spawned): "All the cows...were drowned...and destroyed in water. But
> > > the ship floated above it." Thereafter, "A white cow was born in the
> > > midst of them [Abram]. And they began to bite each other
> > > [circumcision metaphor]
> >
> > I rest my case.
>
> You made no case. You do not have any other explanation for this
> "biting"
SURE I DO.
The red and the white are parallel to the First and Second Seals
of the Revelation of John. They pertain to the consciousness
of the Knowledge of Truth and the origin of the linear consciousness
in desire and lust.
It is the same symbol as Esau and Jacob fighting while in the
womb.
> being instituted at the time of the birth of Ishmael
Ishmael would be a symbol for scientific truth.
and
> Isaac;
Isaac would be a symbol for Revealed Truth.
> this is probably the first time you have ever been exposed to
> the document.
Sure.
Whatever you say.
There are MANY different versions of Enoch.
I prefer 1 Enoch rather than Enoch 3, I think it is.
>
> > Are you a card-carrying Nazi....?
>
> No, but you could have taught them a few things about propaganda!
>
> > First you worship Jesus as God in specific contradiction of
> > the Teaching of Jesus.
>
> To Christians Jesus is not only the Son of God, but a man,
The pronoun for a man is not CAPITALIZED.
The pronoun for God IS capitalized.
You capitalize the pronoun for Jesus.
This is idolatry.
And your understanding of the term "son of God" is completely
in error. It refers to anyone who has received the Revelation
of the Memory of Creation. As Jesus says in his reply to the
Sadducees:"...being children of the resurrection they are SONS
of God."
This does NOT mean in any way associated with God or as
being like God or Divine in any way.
> and a king:
> this was the symbolism of the three gifts of the Magi, very basic.
> Jesus said everyone has divinity in John 10:34-36
Thereby completey destroying the suggestion that any ONE
person could be Divine in ANY sense.
> , so you are writing
> from ignorance.
You have NOT received the Revelation of the Memory of
Creation.
You have no Knowledge here...
Merely the speculations you have read and heard concocted
by someone trying to sell books or justify his salary.
> Even the demons He exorcised called Him the Son of
> God.
So what?
How did Jesus refer to HIMSELF?
As the "Son of man".
I think this term occurs 17 times or more in
the Gospel of Matthew.
And you drag out a statement where ONCE or TWICE
the DEMONS refer to Jesus as the "Son of God" and
you quote what the DEMONS say about Jesus rather
than what Jesus says about HIMSELF......
Do you see anything WRONG with this picture?
This was not a title of Divinity.
> Jesus said he was giving Peter the "keys to the kingdom of
> heaven" because he called Him "the Son of the living God."
So what?
This is not a title of Divinity.
It is the recognition of the Knowledge Jesus had of being
Created by God.
Mohammed and Moses both had similar Knowledge.
So did David, as suggested in Psalm 2.
> But facts
> do not matter to someone holding onto their own "Truth."
>
> > Then you acknowledge both the doctrine of vicarious atonement
> > and the existence of a metaphysical heaven and hell...
>
> Why don't you accede to my request and stop reading my posts?
Because you are lying and drawing people away from the Truth.
> My
> commenaries are intended for intelligent, emotionally balanced people,
or lemmings, take your pick
>
> of which you are obviously not one
Flattery will get you nowhere.
> - you are a powder keg trying to
> explode!
Really?
Why does no one in real life get this impression of
me?
I am really quite DOCILE in person.
> Please go away!
Wow.
>
> > All fundamentally anti-Semitic doctrines in their manifestation.
>
> So you expect Hebrew doctrines from submissions to a ng for a
> Christian seer?
Not at all.
They are not much better...
Well, maybe just a LITTLE.
> The Jews have shoel, what they call hell. You
> pretend to restate my beliefs, but essentially write your own only to
> denounce them! What I said was that if someone inadvertently followed
> the instructions hidden in the crypticism of the parables they would
> be saved:
What do you mean by "saved"?
This is the whole issue.
> this is not "a doctrine of vicarious atonement," which is
> the fundamentalist belief that Jesus did something for believers by
> being killed.
>
> > Then you develop an 'alternative' explanation for the assertions
> > and Doctrines of the Torah.
> >
> > And THEN you try to apply all of this to the Revelation of John
> > through the looking glass of astrology and the ramblings of
> > Nostradamus.
>
> Then YOU try to figure out what I do, and fail, as above.
>
> > Why not come right out and SAY that you are a Nazi and that
> > what you are trying to do is contradict point by point EVERY-
> > THING conveyed as Revealed Truth?
>
> What you THINK is Truth has not been proven
Truth is NEVER 'proven'.
It may be recognized as the Truth, but it cannot be
PROVEN.
You cannot even PROVE your own existence, and that
you have not DREAMED yourself into existence.
In fact, the doctrine of a localized consciousness is
the fundamental illusion.
So how could ANYTHING be proven to an entity which
cannot even prove its OWN existence?
> ; and your attempt to
> equate early Christian ideologies with Nazism is pathetic.
Paul set the foundation for Naziism.
It could NOT have happened WITHOUT him.
> To adhere
> to the entire OT Law would create a society as odious as the Taliban
> has become: Jesus stopped a woman from being stoned for the "Truth";
> He cleansed the Temple of the those selling animals to be sacrificed
> for the "Truth"; He was attacked for healing on Sabbath because of the
> "Truth." Jesus said NO to "an eye for an eye," the concept of
> uncleanness by association, etc., because He was addressing problems
> with the Law, not endorsing the current interpretations and customs.
>
> The Nazis were not just Christians,
They took advantage of the fact that the Jews had been identified as
the 'evil one' by Christian theology.
They used this for political gain.
They put into PRACTICE this fundamental doctrine of Christianity,
which consisted in blaming catastrophes on the Jews.
THEN came WWI and the chaos that followed in Germany.
And it was a marriage made in HELL.
With Paul as the minister.
> they were authoritarian heretics
> who believed they could turn earth into Paradise through genocide, an
> idea they did NOT get from the NT, which promises no murderer has
> eternal life. Now what if you're a murderer and don't like that
> teaching? You would probably just criticize people who repeat it,
> like you have about Truths I've revealed...
>
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
You have "revealed" Truths, now?
Give me a BREAK here.
>
> > At least you would be more HONEST...
> >
> > Rather than masquerading as a follower of Jesus.
>
> You are very judgemental,
This is a judgement of the facts of the matter.
You do NOT follow what Jesus taught.
That is the FACT of the matter.
> but without Christianity I guess you
> wouldn't see what's wrong with that, either.
>
> > Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran, Column
> > XVII of the "Scroll of the War of the Sons of Light")
>
> And you might want to take a look at Nostradamus' Epistle, paragraph
> 10!
I doubt it.
Eagal
TO GOLGOTHA...
"Present your case," says the Lord.
"Bring forth strong reasons," says the King of Jacob.
"Let them bring forth and show us what will happen;
Let them show the former things, what they were,
That we may consider them,
And know the latter end of them;
Or declare to us things to come.
Show the things that are to come hereafter,
That we may know that you are gods;
Yes, do good or evil,
That we may be dismayed and see it together."
[Isaiah 41:21-23]
"You are wearied in the multitudes of your counsels;
Let now the astrologers, the stargazers,
And the monthly prognosticators
Stand up and save you
From what shall come upon you.
Behold, they shall be as stubble,
The fire shall burn them;
They shall not deliver themselves
From the power of the flame -
It is not a coal to be warmed by,
Nor a fire to sit before!"
[Isaiah 47:13,14]
I have put every man's work in writing and none born on earth can
remain hidden nor his works remain concealed. I see all things. Now
therefore, my children, in patience and meekness spend the number of
your days, that you inherit endless life. Endure for the sake of the
Lord every wound, every injury, every evil word and attack. If
ill-requitals befall you, return them not either to neighbour or
enemy, because the Lord will return them for you and be your avenger
on the day of great judgement, that there be no avenging here among
men.
-- II Henoch L.1-5
Then the merciful God, good and lover of men, looked upon Adam and
Eve, and upon their blood, which they had held up an as offering unto
Him, without an order from Him for so doing. But He wondered at them;
and accepted their offerings. And God sent from His presence a bright
fire, that consumed their offering. He smelt the sweet savour of
their offering, and showed them mercy. Then came the Word of God to
Adam, and said unto him, "O Adam, as thou hast shed thy blood, so will
I shed My own blood when I become flesh of thy seed; and as thou didst
die, O Adam, so also will I die. And as thou didst build an altar, so
also will I make for thee an altar on the earth; and as thou didst
offer thy blood upon it, so also will I offer My blood upon an altar
on the earth. And as thou didst sue for forgiveness through that
blood, so also will I make My blood forgiveness of sins, and blot out
transgressions in it. And now, behold, I have accepted thy offering,
O Adam, but the days of the covenant, wherein I have bound thee, are
not fulfilled."
[I A&E 24:1-6]
Then God sent His Word unto Adam, saying, "O Adam, that figure is the
one who promised thee the Godhead, and majesty: he is not favourably
disposed towards thee, but shows himself to thee at one time in the
form of a woman; another moment, in the likeness of an angel; on
another occasions, in the similtude of a serpent; and at another time,
in the semblance of a god - but he does all that only to destroy thy
soul. Now therefore, O Adam, understanding thy heart, I have
delivered thee many a time from his hands, in order to show thee that
I am a merciful God, and that I wish thy good, and that I do not wish
thy ruin."
Then God ordered Satan to show himself to Adam plainly, in his own
hideous form. But when Adam saw him, he feared, and trembled at the
sight of him. And God said to Adam, "Look at this devil, and at his
hideous look, and know that he it is who made thee fall from
brightness into darkness, from peace and rest to toil and misery. And
look, O Adam, at him, who said of himself that he is God!...See then,
O Adam, and behold him bound in thy presence, in the air unable to
flee away! Therefore, I say unto thee, be not afraid of him;
henceforth take care, and beware of him, in whatever he may do to
thee."
[II A&E 3:15,16;4:1-5]
"O my son, hereafter shall a flood come and overwhelm all creatures,
and leave out only eight souls. But, O my son, let those whom it will
leave out from among your children at that time, take my body with
them out of this cave; and when they have taken it with them, let the
oldest one command his children to lay my body in a ship until the
flood has been assuaged, and they come out of the ship. Then they
shall take my body and lay it in the middle of the earth, shortly
after they have been saved from the waters of the flood. For the
place where my body shall be laid, is the middle of the earth: God
shall come from thence and shall save all our kindred. But now, O
Seth, my son, place thyself at the head of thy people..."
[II A&E 8:10-14]
Now this is the genealogy of the sons of Noah: Shem, Ham and Japeth.
And sons were born to them after the flood...The sons of Ham were
Cush, Mizraim, Put, and Canaan...Now Chus begot Nemrod: he began to be
a mighty one on the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the Lord:
therefore it is said, "Like Nemrod the mighty hunter before the Lord."
And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, Erech, Accad, and Calneh,
in the land of Shinar.
[Genesis 10]
{** Dying Adam said to his son Seth: "Now I die for my sin, but bury
me not till God shows you the place where I will sleep till the 'Seed
of the woman,' who will crush the serpent's head will come." They
embalmed the body, patriarchs passed it down, Noe had the skull in the
ark, and before he died, 350 years after the flood, he gave it to Sem
his eldest son, telling him the tradition. There was born of Ham's
family his grandson Nemrod, "Valiant," or "The Rebel," who comes down
among heathen nations as Baal, Bel, the god Jupiter, Hercules, Thor,
etc. "He was the grandson of Ham, a bold man of great strength of
hand. He persuaded them not to ascribe it to God, as it were through
His means they were happy, but to believe it was their own courage,
which procured them that happiness. He also changed the government
into a tyranny, seeing no other way of turning men from the fear of
God, and to bring them into a constant dependence on his power. He
also said he would be revenged on God, if he should have a mind to
drown the world again. For that he would build a tower too high for
the waters to reach, and he would be revenged on God for destroying
their forefathers." This Nemrod turned mankind away from Adam's
religion, taught that the sky was a crystal ceiling, that their
forefathers, the patriarchs, went to heaven and became the planets,
that the natural forces were gods, and thus he founded Paganism.
Guided by him, the seventy-two families, born of Noe's grandsons,
built the Tower they called Bab Il, "Gate of God," in the Babylonian
tongue, which the Hebrews later changed to Babel, "Confusion," whence
they called the nearby city Babylon, "City of the Gate of God."
Infidelity, the worship of their father-patriarchs, the degradation of
women, immorality, irreligion were spreading through the people
tyrannized over by this wicked Nemrod. But before the Tower of Babel
was finished, God changed their language so each family spoke a
different tongue, and they could not understand the other families, so
they had to separate. Japeth's children migrated to the southern
shores of the Caspian Sea; Sem's sons remained in his father's house,
Asia, because he was the eldest; Ham's dark tribes went to Africa,
except the tribes which had rebelled against Sem over the division of
the continents. They remained in the rich plains between the Tigris
and Euphrates, where they founded the Babylonian empire, of which
Nemrod was the first king. From these seventy-two families or tribes
came the great nations of antiquity. Sem, father of numerous tribes,
eldest son and heir of Noe's civil and priestly power, was stripped of
all authority in this revolt. Left alone in his old age, his children
gone, an angel told him to come, and he would show him where to bury
Adam's skull. For full many a day they went west, till they came to a
little hill, whereon he entombed our first father's relic, and called
it Golgotha, a Babylonian word meaning "The Place of the Skull."
Greeks later rendered it Cranion, and Romans Calvaria - Calvary.**}
And when they had come to a place called Golgotha, that is to say,
Place of a Skull, they gave him sour wine mingled with gall to drink.
But when He had tasted it, He would not drink. They they crucified
Him, and divided his garments, casting lots...
[Matthew 27:33-35]
The great day of the Lord is near;
It is near and hastens quickly.
The noise of the day of the Lord is bitter:
There the mighty men shall cry out.
That day is a day of wrath,
A day of trouble and distress,
A day of devastation and desolation,
A day of darkness and gloominess,
A day of clouds and thick darkness,
A day of trumpet and alarm
Against the fortified cities
And against the high towers.
[Zephaniah 1:14-16]
{** 10 June 2002 Annular Solar Eclipse:
No bright corona for Pacific Emperor **}
* * * * * * *
* *
And behold, a woman of Canaan came from that region and cried out to
Him, saying,
"Have mercy on me, O Lord, Son of David!
My daughter is severely demon-possessed!"
But He answered her not a word.
And His disciples came and urged Him, saying,
"Send her away, for she cries out after us."
But He answered and said,
"I was not sent except to the lost sheep of the house of Israel."
Then she came and worshipped Him, saying,
"Lord, help me!"
But He answered and said,
"It is not just to take the children's bread,
And cast it to the little dogs."
And she said,
"Yes, Lord,
Since even the little dogs
Eat the crumbs
Which fall from their master's table."
Then Jesus answered and said to her,
"O woman,
Great is your faith!
Let it be to you as you desire."
And her daughter was healed from that very hour.
[Matthew 15:22-28]
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
Eagal wrote:
> FROM BABYLON
> TO GOLGOTHA...
>
> "Present your case," says the Lord.
> "Bring forth strong reasons," says the King of Jacob.
Precisely.
The religious officials have YET to bring forth strong reasons against
my argument concerning the Revelation and Doctrine of the "resur-
rection of the dead".
They have NOTHING to say.
As is stated in 1QH: "The lips of the wicked will be without a reply."
>
> "Let them bring forth and show us what will happen;
> Let them show the former things, what they were,
> That we may consider them,
> And know the latter end of them;
> Or declare to us things to come.
> Show the things that are to come hereafter,
> That we may know that you are gods;
> Yes, do good or evil,
> That we may be dismayed and see it together."
> [Isaiah 41:21-23]
>
> "You are wearied in the multitudes of your counsels;
> Let now the astrologers, the stargazers,
> And the monthly prognosticators
> Stand up and save you
Just my point.
The Prophecies of Daniel and the Revelation of John are
fractal Prophecies. This is as close as the human perception
can come to these without a SPECIFIC Revelation...
Revelations which, by the way, are NOT received by the
Christian religious officials.
>
> From what shall come upon you.
> Behold, they shall be as stubble,
> The fire shall burn them;
> They shall not deliver themselves
> From the power of the flame -
> It is not a coal to be warmed by,
> Nor a fire to sit before!"
> [Isaiah 47:13,14]
Precisely.
>
>
> I have put every man's work in writing and none born on earth can
> remain hidden nor his works remain concealed. I see all things. Now
> therefore, my children, in patience and meekness spend the number of
> your days, that you inherit endless life. Endure for the sake of the
> Lord every wound, every injury, every evil word and attack. If
> ill-requitals befall you, return them not either to neighbour or
> enemy, because the Lord will return them for you and be your avenger
> on the day of great judgement, that there be no avenging here among
> men.
> -- II Henoch L.1-5
I MUCH prefer 1 Enoch.
Maybe 12 years ago I read a very short little book entitled:
"Did Jesus Write This Book?"
The argument is quite persuasive.
It suggests that Jesus was the author of 1 Enoch.
But this book has been given very little attention.
The Christian religious officials don't know HOW to
respond to it.
In any case, 1 Enoch appears to have been written by someone who
experienced the Vision of the "Son of man" (it is referred to as the
"vision of wisdom" in 1 Enoch) and the Revelation of the "resurrection
of the dead".
And, in this, it is similar to 1QH of the Dead Sea Scrolls--the "Thanks-
viving Hymns".
Of course, my research demonstrating that it is just short of a
certainty that Jesus wrote 1QH CANNOT be published (for example,
it has been C-14 radio-carbon dated to between about 25 B.C.E
and about 55 C.E. as reported in the Nov/Dec issue of the "Biblical
Archaeology Review")
> And when they had come to a place called Golgotha, that is to say,
> Place of a Skull
This, of course, is to be understood as ALSO symbolic of the
three currents of kundalini yoga which are said to come together
in the skull.
'Between two thieves' refers to the sushumna current which is
between the ida and pingala.
> , they gave him sour wine mingled with gall to drink.
> But when He had tasted it, He would not drink. They they crucified
> Him, and divided his garments, casting lots...
> [Matthew 27:33-35]
>
> The great day of the Lord is near;
> It is near and hastens quickly.
> The noise of the day of the Lord is bitter:
> There the mighty men shall cry out.
> That day is a day of wrath,
> A day of trouble and distress,
> A day of devastation and desolation,
> A day of darkness and gloominess,
> A day of clouds and thick darkness,
> A day of trumpet and alarm
> Against the fortified cities
> And against the high towers.
> [Zephaniah 1:14-16]
>
> {** 10 June 2002 Annular Solar Eclipse:
> No bright corona for Pacific Emperor **}
My general impression is that this is going to be a MAJOR
failure in terms of attempting to prognosticate the future.
I seriously DOUBT that there can be such a LONG period of
time until the large-scale fulfillment of the Prophecies.
And this has to do with the Prophecies of Daniel and
the Revelation of John.
Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran, Column
Eagal
LIGHT OF SEVENTH HEAVEN...
Par le cinquieme et un grand Hercules
Viendront le temple ouvrir de main bellique;
Un Clement, Iule et Ascans recules,
L'epee, clef, aigle, n'eurent onc si grand pique.
For the fifth and a great Herculean champ
They will come to activate the temple by warring hand;
One Clement, Jiulio and Ascanius retreated camp,
The sword, key, eagle, such a struggle never was on land.
X.27's fifth, like II.88, regarding the fifth bowl; Hercules the US as
in IX.93.
Line 3 is about an occasion when Pope Clement VII (1523-1534), born
Giulio de'Medici, retreated to the Castle of Sant'Angelo: either 20
September 1526 when the Colonna attacked Rome (possibly referenced in
X.64's final line, "When the Colonna will be exchanged at Rome"); or
the 5 May 1527 sacking of Rome attributed to the Lutherans - this
latter is the more significant event, especially ironic since Clement
paid Charles V 100,000 ducats for an eight-month truce after the
Colonna plunder, and had virtually no guards on watch confident in
that agreement. May Fifth could refer back to the Taurean alignment
of 2000 (X.67 - strong trembling following a May with the correct
planets named in Taurus "boeuf"), since the linearity was maximized
that date, with Mars in Gemini (VI.24's Mars and the sceptre
conjoined): the sceptre then formed under Venus (V.24,53) may be
deposed by that of the Sun, arriving 21 May 2002. That "Solar
Sceptre" may be the one of Cordova which betrays the country in line 4
of III.20, St. Secundinus of Cordova feastday 21 May; Nostradamus may
even suggest the Venusian alignment being superceded constitutes some
type of debasement, as in X.28 line 4 (Rapport with false Venus will
render depression), and X.64 line 3 (the Holy See to change as it
advances upon Venus [Venice]).
My analysis of the ambush scenario was probably only partially
correct, but as a strategic point further elaboration in this forum
will be withheld, although a more refined theory has been developed.
Perhaps I.34 suggests some "French preparation" before conflict will
be held as beneficial augury by the meek faction, and some will think
it is good, but there is also the "ambigue sinistre," so suffice to
say subtle variations in that foregoing battle analysis should come to
pass.
Avant l'assaut l'oraison prononcee,
Milan pris d'Aigle par embuches decus;
Muraille antique par canons enfoncee,
Par feu et sang a merci peu recus.
Before the assault the oration delivered,
Milan taken by the Eagle for deceptive ambushes;
Ancient mural by cannons completely battered,
Through fire mercy rendered to few blood gushes.
III.37's speech or oration could be the discussions of the predictions
the assault apparently fulfilled...
Line 3 may depict the Taliban explosive demolition of an ancient Hindu
relief statue carved into the side of a mountain months before the
attack on the US: there were protests over this destruction of a
religious monument because it was under the jurisdiction of the
intolerant theocracy - and here may be a prophetic link, insinuating
those responsible also cause the fiery massacre in line 4!
Au chef Anglois a Nimes trop sejour,
Devers l'Espagne au secours Aenobarbe;
Plusieurs mourront par Mars ouvert ce jour,
Quand en Artois faillir etoile en barbe.
To the Nemesis the English chief had too long a stay,
Towards the Western land, "Rescue, help! Bronzebeard!"
Many people will die by Mars activating that day,
When into Taoris will fall a star with beard.
V.59 line 1's stay is the US in Saudi Arabia, the Nemesis' message
also manifesting in the suicide bombing of the Cole (VI.91). Line 3
switches back to another event where Mars played a significant role,
the 1999 Istanbul quake, which coincided with Comet Lee reaching
Taurus (Taoris anagram from Artois).
The seventh heaven reference in the Ascension of Isaiah as the
spiritual source of the Messiah recalls ten heavens in Henochian
texts: each was not an increasingly pleasant level of paradise.
Escorted by angels through apparent astral projections, Henoch
perceived on the first heaven "a very great Sea, greater than the
earthly sea." On the second heaven, demons were hanging as prisoners,
tormented in darkness "greater than earthly darkness": weeping they
asked Henoch to pray for them, but he replied, "Who am I, a mortal
man, that I should pray for angels?" Henoch was told their prince was
"fastened on the fifth heaven." The third heaven included the Tree of
Life, and therefore the human Paradise "prepared for the righteous,
who endure all manner of offense from those that exasperate their
souls"; yet on the Northern side was "a very terrible place...cruel
darkness and unillumined gloom...murky fire constantly flameth aloft,
and there is a river coming forth, and that whole place is everywhere
fire, and everywhere there is frost and ice, thirst and shivering,
while the bonds are very cruel, and the angels frightful and
merciless, bearing angry weapons, merciless torture" - and Henoch's
guides informed him this place was "prepared for those who dishonour
God...who boast of their wicked deeds, stealing, lies...envy,
rancour...murder, and who, accursed, steal the souls of men." So
within the third heaven was both human heaven and hell. At the fourth
heaven the motions of the Sun and Moon dominated, with some
inscrutable astronomical references. And Satan is not seen on the
fifth heaven, but instead his host, gigantic soldier-demons called
Grigori, with withered faces, and mouths in perpetual silence since no
service was offered to God - "with their prince Satanail rejected the
Lord of light, and after them those who are held in great darkness on
the second heaven, and three of them went down on to earth...and broke
through their vows on the hill Ermon, and saw the daughters of men how
good they are, and took to themselves wives, and befouled the earth."
Thus three demons (note similarity with demonic trio in Apoc. 16:13)
were indicated as being responsible for conceiving the abomination of
interbreeding with humans referred to in parallel texts, spawning a
mutant race of vicious giants the Deluge was probably intended to
destroy. Henoch told the Grigori about their colleagues on the second
heaven, "The Lord has condemned them to be under the earth till heaven
and earth shall end for ever"; and he urged them to make some services
"before the Lord's face, lest you anger your Lord utterly" - and they
responded - "four trumpets trumpeted together with great voice, and
the Grigori broke into song with one voice, and their voice went up
before the Lord pitifully and affectingly."" On the sixth heaven were
bright and glorious bands of archangels. The seventh heaven was
dominated by "a very great light," attended by fiery troops of
archangels; Henoch became terrified, and his guides showed him God
Almighty seated on His throne far above in the tenth heaven, then
departed, leaving Henoch to be further led by Gabriel. The eighth
heaven contained "the twelve signs of the zodiac"; the ninth had "the
heavenly homes of the twelve signs of the zodiac" (the astrological
houses concept). On the tenth heaven, Henoch "saw the appearance of
the Lord's face, like iron made to glow in fire, and brought out,
emitting sparks, and it burns...the Lord's face is ineffable,
marvellous and very awful." Thereupon God relates to Henoch the story
of the Creation which corresponds with the first part of Genesis.
More from Henochian texts:
* * * * * * *
On the day of the great judgement every weight, every measure and
every makeweight will be as in the market, that is to say they are
hung on scales and stand in the market, and everyone shall learn his
own measure, and according to his measure shall take his reward.
(44:3)
If one man make himself appear good to another by deceit of tongue,
but have evil in his heart, then will not the other understand the
treachery of his heart, and himself be condemned, since his untruth
was plain to all? And when the Lord shall send a great light, then
there will be judgement for the just and the unjust, and there no one
shall escape notice. (46:3,4)
Those who understand not the Lord, who fear not God, who accept not,
but reject, who do not receive them, a terrible judgement awaits
these. Blessed is the man who shall bear the yoke and shall drag them
along, for he shall be released on the day of the great judgement.
(48:7,8)
Even to each one there is a place prepared for the repose of the soul,
and a measure fixed how much it is intended that a man be tried in
this world. Yea, children, deceive not yourselves, for there has
previously been prepared a place for every soul of man. (49:4,5)
Cursed is he who looks to and is eager for the destruction of what is
not his.
Blessed is he who implants peace and love.
Cursed is he who disturbs those that love their neighbours.
For all these things will be laid bare in the weighing-scales and in
the books, on the day of the great judgement. (52:8,11,12,15)
And now, my children, do not say, "Our Father is standing before God,
and is praying for our sins": for there is no helper of any man who
has sinned. (53:1)
He who works the killing of a man's soul, kills his own soul, and
kills his own body, and there is no cure for him for all time. He who
puts a man in any snare, shall stick in it himself, and there is no
cure for him for all time. (60:1,2)
And now, my children, keep your hearts from every injustice, which the
Lord hates. Just as a man asks for his own soul from God, ao let him
do to every living soul, because I know all things, how in the great
time are many mansions prepared for men, good for the good, and bad
for the bad, without number many. Blessed are those who enter the
good houses, for in the bad there is no peace nor return. (61:1,2)
There will be one aeon, and all the righteous who shall escape the
Lord's great judgement, shall be collected in the great aeon, for the
righteous the great aeon will begin, and they will live eternally, and
then too there will be amongst them neither labour, nor sickness, nor
humiliation, nor anxiety, nor need, nor violence, nor night, nor
darkness, but great light. And they shall have a great indestructible
wall, and a paradise bright and incorruptible, for all corruptible
things shall pass away, and there will be eternal life. (65:6,7)
Blessed are the just who shall escape the great judgement, for they
shall shine forth more than the sun sevenfold, for in this world the
seventh part is taken off from all. (66:8)
To men of note in their generation the paths of oppression and death
are revealed, but they keep far from them, and do not follow them.
Now, too, let me exhort you who are righteous, not to walk in the
paths of evil and oppression, nor in the paths of death. Approach
them not, that you may not perish; but covet, and choose for
yourselves, righteousness, and a good life. Walk in the paths of
peace, that you may live, and be found worthy. Retain my words in
your inmost thoughts, and obliterate them not from your hearts: for I
know that sinners counsel men to commit crime craftily. They are not
found in every place, nor does every counsel possess a little of them.
(93:2-5)
Who has permitted you to hate and transgress? Judgement shall
overtake you, ye sinners. The righteous shall not fear the wicked,
because God will again bring them into your power, that you may avenge
yourselves of them according to your pleasure... Woe to you, ye false
witnesses, you who aggravate iniquity, for you shall suddenly perish.
Woe to you, ye sinners, for you reject the righteous, for you receive
or reject at pleasure those who commit iniquity, and their yoke shall
prevail over you. Wait in hope, ye righteous, for suddenly shall
sinners perish from before you, and you shall exercise dominion over
them, according to your will. (94,5)
* * * * * * *
We all knew the blessed Simeon, the high-priest, who took Jesus when
an infant into his arms in the temple. This same Simeon had two sons
of his own, and we were all present at their death and funeral. Go
therefore and see their tombs, for these are open, and they are risen:
and behold, they are in the city of Arimathaea... Some, indeed, have
heard the sound of their voices in prayer, but they will not discourse
with anyone... If we can bring them to swear, perhaps they will tell
us some of the mysteries of their resurrection... Then Annas and
Caiaphas, Nicodemus, Joseph, and Gamaliel, went to Arimathaea, but did
not find them in their graves; but walking about the city, they found
them on their bended knees at their devotions... They brought them to
the synagogue at Jerusalem, and having shut the gates, they took the
book of the law of the Lord, and putting it in their hands, swore them
by the God Adonai, and the God of Israel...saying, "If ye believe him
who raised you from the dead to be Jesus, tell us what ye have seen,
and how ye were raised from the dead." Charinus and Lenthius, the two
sons of Simeon, trembled when they heard these things, and were
disturbed, and groaned; and at the same time looking up to heaven,
they made the sign of the cross with their fingers on their tongues,
and immediately they spake, and said, "Give each of us some paper, and
we will write down for you all those things which we have seen..."
Then Seth, coming near to the patriarchs and prophets, said, "I Seth,
when I was praying to God at the gates of Paradise, beheld the angel
of the Lord, Michael appeared unto me saying...'I tell thee Seth, do
not pray to God in tears, and entreat him for the oil of the tree of
mercy wherewith to anoint thy father Adam for his head-ache, because
thou canst not by any means obtain it till the last day and times,
namely, till five thousand and five hundred years be past. Then will
Christ, the most merciful Son of God, come on earth to raise again the
human body of Adam, and at the same time to raise the bodies of the
dead, and when he cometh he will be baptized in Jordan; then with the
oil of his mercy he will anoint all those who believe on him, and the
oil of his mercy will continue on to future generations, for those who
shall be born of the water and the Holy Ghost unto eternal life.' And
when at that time the most merciful Son of God, Christ Jesus, shall
come down on earth, he will introduce our father Adam into Paradise,
to the tree of mercy." When all the patriarchs and prophets heard all
these things from Seth, they rejoiced more...
"O Satan, prince of evil, author of death, and source of all pride,
thou shouldest have first inquired into the evil crimes of Jesus of
Nazareth, and then thou wouldest have found that he was guilty of no
fault worthy of death. Why didst thou venture, without reason or
justice, to crucify him, and hast brought down to our regions a person
innocent and righteous, and thereby hast lost all the sinners, impious
and unrighteous persons in the whole world?" While the prince of hell
was thus speaking to Satan, the King of Glory said to Beelzebub, the
prince of hell, "Satan, the prince shall be subject to thy dominion
forever, in the room of Adam and his righteous sons, who are mine."
Then the Lord stretching forth his hand, made the sign of the cross
upon Adam, and upon all his saints. And taking Adam by his right
hand, he ascended from hell, and all the saints of God followed him.
These are the divine and sacred mysteries which we saw and heard. I,
Charinus and Lenthius are not allowed to declare the other mysteries
of God, as the archangel Michael ordered us, saying... "Ye shall not
talk to any man, but sit as dumb persons till the time come when the
Lord will allow you to relate the mysteries of his divinity"... For we
have only three days allowed us from the dead...and we have been
baptized in the holy river of Jordan... Give ye therefore praise and
honour to him, and repent, and he will have mercy on you. Peace be to
you from the Lord God Jesus Christ, and the Saviour of us all.
Charinus gave what he wrote into the hands of Annas, and Caiaphas, and
Gamaliel. Lenthius likewise gave what he wrote into the hands of
Nicodemus and Joseph; and imediately they were changed into exceeding
white forms and were seen no more. But what they had wrote was found
perfectly to agree, the one not containing one letter more or less
than the other.
After these things Pilate went to the temple of the Jews, and called
together all the rulers and scribes, and doctors of the law...and
commanding that all the gates be shut, said to them, "I have heard
that ye have a certain large book in this temple: I desire you
therefore, that it may be brought before me." And when the great
book, carried by four ministers of the temple, and adorned with gold
and precious stones, was brought, Pilate said to them, "I adjure you
by the God of your Fathers, who made and commanded this temple to be
built, that ye conceal not the truth from me. Ye know all the things
which are written in that book: tell me therefore now, if ye in the
Scriptures have found anything of that Jesus whom ye crucified, and at
what time of the world he ought to have come: shew it me." Then
having sworn Annas and Caiaphas, they commanded all the rest who were
with them to go out of the chapel. And they shut the gates of the
temple and of the chapel, and said to Pilate, "Thou hast made us to
swear, O judge, by the building of this temple, to declare to thee
that which is true and right. After we had crucifed Jesus, not
knowing that he was the Son of God, but supposing he wrought his
miracles by some magical arts, we summoned a large assembly in this
temple...we found many witnesses of our own country, who declared that
they had seen him alive after his death...and we saw two witnesses,
whose bodies Jesus raised from the dead, who told us of many strange
things which Jesus did among the dead, of which we have a written
account in our hands. And it is our custom annually to open this holy
book before an assembly, and to search there for the counsel of God.
And we found in the first of the seventy books, where Michael the
archangel is speaking to the third son of Adam the first man, an
account that after five thousand five hundred years, Christ the most
beloved Son of God was come on earth. And we further considered, that
perhaps he was the very God of Israel who spoke to Moses, 'Thou shalt
make the ark of the testimony: two cubits and a half shall be the
length thereof, and a cubit and a half the breadth thereof, and a
cubit and a half the height thereof.' By these five cubits and a half
for the building of the ark of the Old Testament, we perceived and
knew that in five thousand years and a half years, Jesus Christ was to
come in the ark or tabernacle of a body: and so our scriptures testify
that he is the Son of God, and the Lord and King of Israel... We
opened that book to search all the generations down to the generation
of Joseph and Mary the mother of Jesus, supposing him to be of the
seed of David..."
[Gospel of Nicodemus]
* * * * * * *
There were present at that season some who told Him about the
Galileans whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices. And
Jesus answered and said to them, "Do you suppose that these Galileans
were worse sinners than all other Galileans, because they suffered
such things? I tell you, no: but unless you repent you will all
likewise perish. Or those eighteen on whom the tower in Siloam fell
and killed them, do you think that they were worse sinners than all
other men who dwelt in Jerusalem? I tell you, no: but unless you
repent you will all likewise perish." (Luke 13:1-5)
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
> PATHS TO PREPARED PLACES;
> LIGHT OF SEVENTH HEAVEN...
>
> The seventh heaven reference in the Ascension of Isaiah as the
> spiritual source of the Messiah
References to the number seven are, typically, 'code' for the Vision
of the "Son of man". This is the esoteric significance of the term
'messiah'--that is, someone who has received the Vision of the "Son
of man".
> recalls ten heavens
Depending upon context, the number ten can be a reference to the ten
principal phonetic tones which, however, have specific meanings with
regards to the normal consciousness, the 'unconscious', and the con-
sciousness of the Knowledge of Truth--a symbolism which also occurs
in Daniel Chapter 7 (not surprisingly).
> in Henochian
> texts: each was not an increasingly pleasant level of paradise.
> Escorted by angels through apparent astral projections,
This is a speculation by someone who has no direct Knowledge of the
Vision. Instead, this is figurative language referring to the observa-
tion/memory of different experiences of consciousness.
> Henoch
> perceived on the first heaven "a very great Sea, greater than the
> earthly sea."
This typically indicates the initial movement away from the normal
waking or linear consciousness.
The 'unconscious' is typically referred to as the 'sea'. There is a
"beast from the sea" in the Revelation of John. And, after pursuing
a determined doubting of beliefs, Descartes writes in his "Second
Meditation" that he 'feels as though he were suddenly thrown into
deep water'.
This is an initial result of the breakdown of the structures of
the normal 'ego' consciousness.
> On the second heaven,
Merely the description of another aspect of the consciousness which
emerges with the destruction of the normal waking consciousness.
> demons were hanging as prisoners,
> tormented in darkness "greater than earthly darkness": weeping they
> asked Henoch to pray for them, but he replied, "Who am I, a mortal
> man, that I should pray for angels?" Henoch was told their prince was
> "fastened on the fifth heaven."
The emotion associated with the Fifth Church in the Revelation of John
is sorrow.
> The third heaven included the Tree of
> Life, and therefore the human Paradise "prepared for the righteous,
> who endure all manner of offense from those that exasperate their
> souls";
A duality occurs at the level of the Third Church, the church of fear/
pleasure (i.e., Satan) and, on the other hand, the fear of God, which
is the beginning of wisdom. This conflict is the conflict between Truth
and intellectual pleasure.
> yet on the Northern side was "a very terrible place...cruel
> darkness and unillumined gloom...murky fire constantly flameth aloft,
> and there is a river coming forth, and that whole place is everywhere
> fire, and everywhere there is frost and ice, thirst and shivering,
> while the bonds are very cruel, and the angels frightful and
> merciless, bearing angry weapons, merciless torture" - and Henoch's
> guides informed him this place was "prepared for those who dishonour
> God...who boast of their wicked deeds, stealing, lies...envy,
> rancour...murder, and who, accursed, steal the souls of men."
The "king of the North" in Daniel 11 is to be understood esoterically
as a consciousness which is the opposite of the order and structure of
the normal waking or 'ego' consciousness symbolized by the "king of the
South". Thus, the victory of the "king of the North" over the "king of
the South" in Daniel 11:45 signifies the total psychotic breakdown of
the linear consciousness into, typically, paranoid schizophrenic psy-
chosis.
This is also the esoteric significance of the kingdoms of the "far
north" in Ezekiel 38:14.
> within the third heaven was both human heaven and hell.
The Third Seal of the Revelation of John pertains to the Third Church.
The rider on the black horse carries a pair of scales in his hands for
the weighing out of pleasure and pain. This is an echo of the two-edged
sword carried by the rider on the red horse; but, in this case, it re-
fers to pleasure and pain in relation to thought rather than sensation.
> At the fourth
> heaven
The Fourth Church is the heart chakra--the place for the Revelation of
the "resurrection of the dead".
> the motions of the Sun and Moon dominated, with some
> inscrutable astronomical references. And Satan is not seen on the
> fifth heaven,
The Fifth Church is, of course, the throat chakra and the origin of
speech.
> but instead his host, gigantic soldier-demons called
> Grigori, with withered faces,
in sorrow, perhaps
> and mouths in perpetual silence since no
> service was offered to God - "with their prince Satanail rejected the
> Lord of light, and after them those who are held in great darkness on
> the second heaven, and three of them went down on to earth...and broke
> through their vows on the hill Ermon, and saw the daughters of men how
> good they are, and took to themselves wives, and befouled the earth."
> Thus three demons (note similarity with demonic trio in Apoc. 16:13)
In context, of no particular significance.
> were indicated as being responsible for conceiving the abomination of
> interbreeding with humans referred to in parallel texts, spawning a
> mutant race of vicious giants the Deluge was probably intended to
> destroy. Henoch told the Grigori about their colleagues on the second
> heaven, "The Lord has condemned them to be under the earth till heaven
> and earth shall end for ever";
They emerge with the destruction of the linear consciousness, the 'beast
of the earth', or the "monster that shall speak to them" (Sura 27:82 of
the Koran).
> and he urged them to make some services
> "before the Lord's face, lest you anger your Lord utterly" - and they
> responded - "four trumpets trumpeted together with great voice,
And ONE voice.
> and
> the Grigori broke into song with one voice,
Of critical significance--one voice signifying the loss of duality.
> and their voice went up
> before the Lord pitifully and affectingly."
The number four pertaining to the heart chakra, the four trumpets would
refer to the experiences surrounding the Revelation of the "resurrection
of the dead", including the revelation of the memories of previous
lives. This Revelation does NOT occur except in the presence of extreme
sorrow--which is why the Koran states on a number of occasions: "And
Peace be upon him when he is raised from the dead."
> On the sixth heaven were
> bright and glorious bands of archangels.
The Sixth Church is the crown chakra and a reference to things intel-
lectual. In a positive sense, this would be a reference to the Doc-
trinal Knowledge Revealed through the Vision of the "Son of man".
> The seventh heaven was
> dominated by "a very great light,"
A reference to the Vision of the "Son of man" and the consciousness of
the Knowledge of Truth.
> attended by fiery troops of
> archangels; Henoch became terrified, and his guides showed him God
> Almighty seated on His throne far above in the tenth heaven,
None of this being understood in any literal sense.
> then
> departed, leaving Henoch to be further led by Gabriel. The eighth
> heaven contained "the twelve signs of the zodiac";
Symbolic of the infinite structure of the physical space-time Reality.
> the ninth had "the
> heavenly homes of the twelve signs of the zodiac" (the astrological
> houses concept).
Symbolic of the spiritual significance of the infinite structure of the
physical space-time Reality.
> On the tenth heaven, Henoch "saw the appearance of
> the Lord's face, like iron made to glow in fire, and brought out,
> emitting sparks, and it burns...the Lord's face is ineffable,
> marvellous and very awful."
The tenth phonetic tone signifies a certain Knowledge with regards to
the fine structure of human consciousness; the origin and loss of the
consciousness of the Knowledge of Truth; the destruction of the illus-
ory consciousness; and the emergence of this Knowledge over historical
time.
> Thereupon God relates to Henoch the story
> of the Creation which corresponds with the first part of Genesis.
Which, similarly, was Revealed through the Vision of the "Son of
man".
> More from Henochian texts:
>
> * * * * * * *
>
> On the day of the great judgement every weight, every measure and
> every makeweight will be as in the market, that is to say they are
> hung on scales and stand in the market, and everyone shall learn his
> own measure, and according to his measure shall take his reward.
> (44:3)
The "observing consciousness" perceives the very origin of all emotion,
thought and behavior experienced and performed by the normal human con-
sciousness.
On the other hand, the Third Seal in the Revelation of John--with the
rider carrying the scales--is also symbolic of the fact that the nor-
mal human consciousness arrogates unto itself the ability to judge
good and evil on the basis of the normal human intellect. This, in
fact, is a capacity only of the "observing consciousness".
See also the documents found at Nag Hammadi, Egypt--especially, "The
Tripartite Tractate", "The Hypostasis of the Archons", and "On the
Origin of the World".
> and all the righteous who shall escape
This is not precisely accurate.
> the
> Lord's great judgement, shall be collected in the great aeon, for the
> righteous the great aeon will begin, and they will live eternally, and
> then too there will be amongst them neither labour, nor sickness, nor
> humiliation, nor anxiety, nor need, nor violence, nor night, nor
> darkness, but great light. And they shall have a great indestructible
> wall, and a paradise bright and incorruptible, for all corruptible
> things shall pass away, and there will be eternal life. (65:6,7)
>
> Blessed are the just who shall escape the great judgement,
Technically, there is NO escape from the Judgement.
The Koran states that, basically, *everyone* experiences hell, but
that it is the righteous who are then *released* from hell.
> for they
> shall shine forth more than the sun sevenfold, for in this world the
> seventh part is taken off from all. (66:8)
>
> To men of note in their generation the paths of oppression and death
> are revealed, but they keep far from them, and do not follow them.
> Now, too, let me exhort you who are righteous, not to walk in the
> paths of evil and oppression, nor in the paths of death. Approach
> them not, that you may not perish; but covet, and choose for
> yourselves, righteousness, and a good life. Walk in the paths of
> peace, that you may live, and be found worthy. Retain my words in
> your inmost thoughts, and obliterate them not from your hearts: for I
> know that sinners counsel men to commit crime craftily. They are not
> found in every place, nor does every counsel possess a little of them.
> (93:2-5)
>
> Who has permitted you to hate and transgress? Judgement shall
> overtake you, ye sinners. The righteous shall not fear the wicked,
> because God will again bring them into your power, that you may avenge
> yourselves of them according to your pleasure... Woe to you, ye false
> witnesses, you who aggravate iniquity, for you shall suddenly perish.
> Woe to you, ye sinners, for you reject the righteous, for you receive
> or reject at pleasure those who commit iniquity, and their yoke shall
> prevail over you. Wait in hope, ye righteous, for suddenly shall
> sinners perish from before you, and you shall exercise dominion over
> them, according to your will. (94,5)
>
<Writings of doubtful authenticity snipped>
> There were present at that season some who told Him
The capitalization of the pronoun in referenced to Jesus is both blas-
phemous and ioldatrous.
> about the
> Galileans whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices. And
> Jesus answered and said to them, "Do you suppose that these Galileans
> were worse sinners than all other Galileans, because they suffered
> such things? I tell you, no: but unless you repent you will all
> likewise perish. Or those eighteen
The number 18 is, of course, 6+6+6--the number of the linear conscious-
ness.
> on whom the tower in Siloam fell
> and killed them, do you think that they were worse sinners than all
> other men who dwelt in Jerusalem? I tell you, no: but unless you
> repent you will all likewise perish." (Luke 13:1-5)
The linear consciousness is the 'number of the beast' or the 'number
of a man' in the Revelation of John.
It is this consciousness which is a result of "the Fall" and the loss
of the consciousness of the Knowledge of Truth.
And it is this consciousness which is consumed in the "second death".
Eagal
BROKEN AT
BEZIERS?
The prior discussion of VIII.21 and III.56 wherein "pont" was
translated as "pent" for Pentagon as code for the 11 September '01
attack, instead of the typical "bridge," should be revisited in
consideration of the recent warning involving rumors of the
destruction of a bridge on the US West Coast, especially since the
time window of 2-7 November includes the Beziers date of 5 Nov (Guy
Fawkes Day in England). Such a bridge disaster could provide
VIII.21's "tertiary resistance," with the hijacked plane assault as
primary, and anthrax mailings as secondary; and the infectious
pestilence spread by three carriers ultimately killing millions should
then follow on 10 Nov's Agde (Veteran's Day Holiday).
Four Californian bridges have been identified as likely targets, and
there are numerous parallel references to a bridge cataclysm whereby
information may be gleaned: however, the presumption these regard the
same event dictates various interpretational twists. Only the first
line of I.33 seems relevant, with the rest of the quatrain about the
further Lion event:
Pres d'un grand pont de plaine spacieuse,
Le grand Lion par forces Cesarees...
Near a great bridge of spacious plain,
The great Lion by Imperial forces...
This could merely be describing the critical bridge as being like a
spacious plain (i.e., an expansive modern highway structure), rather
than offering any locational information...
Three consecutive verses--V.29,30,31--all mention a bridge in a
potentially germane context.
La liberte ne sera recouvree,
L'occupera noir, fier, vilain, inique,
Quand la matiere du pont sera ouvree:
D'Hister, Venise fachee la republique.
Liberty will not be recovered,
It will be occupied by the iniquity of the dark proud villain,
When the matter of the bridge will be discovered:
Like Hitler, Venus vexed the republic nation.
V.29 line 1 is very similar to I.94 line 2, with identical themes
regarding a wicked tyrant initiating a movement damaging liberty.
Line 3 may have predicted current warnings of a bridge attack: so even
if Hister in line 4 was meant to imply Hitler, any reference to WWII
may be entirely tangential - oddly the Venusian Sceptre period,
commencing around the 5 May 2000 Taurean Alignment and concluding when
the Solar Sceptre arrives with 21 May 2002's Cordoba, appears blamed
for comparable malevolence.
V.30's final line declares "Upon the bridge great pillage will be
accomplished," but the preceding lines do not seem related, concerning
soldiers lodged throughout fields and towns around the great city (if
these are the "sleeper agents" who would carry out the sabotage, the
relation is obvious however). Paris giving the assault could regard
10 June 2002, due to St. Landericus (or Landry), bishop of Paris circa
650, also associated with hospitals (for Mallods, or Malades,
swallowing raw nuclei in IX.24). Rome incited could be another subtle
reference to the 5 May 1527 sack of Rome, due to the 5 May 2000
Alignment as a prerequisite for fulfillment.
Par terre Attique chef de la sapience,
Qui de present est la rose du monde,
Pont ruine, et sa grande preeminence
Sera subdite et naufrage des ondes.
For the Attic land of sagacity the source,
Which is the rose of the world in those future days,
Bridge ruined, and its great pre-eminence
Will be subdued into wreckage amidst the waves.
V.31's Attic land is not necessarily Greek, meaning simple, pure,
refined. This bridge here apparently collapses into the oceanic
depths it had traversed.
De l'aqueduc d'Vticense Gardoing,
Par la foret et mont inaccessible,
Emmy du pont sera tranche au poing,
Le chef nemans qui tant sera terrible.
At the aqueduct for Vicente's Guarding,
Through the forest and mountain inaccessible,
Middle of the bridge will be cut by fist pounding,
The nemesis chief who will be very terrible.
V.58 line 1 may provide the name of the endangered bridge via anagram:
the Vincent-Thomas bridge at San Pedro appears indicated. While the
surrounding terrain may not comply with line 2's inaccessible
mountains and forest, this could regard the distance between NYC and
the bridge, which includes the Rocky Mountains, etc. The nemesis
chief has already been deciphered as the mastermind of the 11 Sept
attack. The traditional approach to this verse is applying it to the
Roman aqueduct from Uzes (Castrum Uceciense) to Nimes which runs over
the Gard, but it is probable the aqueduct form is being used to
symbolize the bridge itself.
* * * * * * *
He made the Pleiades and Orion;
He turns the shadow of death into morning
And makes the day dark as night;
He calls for the waters of the sea
And pours them out on the face of the earth;
The Lord is His name.
(Amos 5:8)
And suddenly a great tempest arose on the sea, so that the boat was
covered with waves. But He was asleep. Then His disciples came to
Him and awoke Him, saying, "Lord, save us! We are perishing!"
But He said to them, "Why are you fearful, O you of little faith?"
Then He arose and rebuked the winds and the sea, and there was a great
calm.
So the men marveled, saying, "Who can this be, that even the winds and
the sea obey Him?"
(Matthew 8:24-27)
It shall come to pass in that day
That there will be no light;
The lights will diminish.
It shall be one day
Which is known to the Lord-
Neither day nor night.
But at evening time it shall happen
That it will be light.
(Zechariah 14:6,7)
Now when he was crucified darkness came over all the world; the sun
was altogether hidden, and the sky appeared dark while it was yet day,
so that the stars were seen, though still they had their lustre
obscured, wherefore, I suppose your excellency is not unaware that in
all the world they lighted their lamps from the sixth hour until
evening. And the moon, which was like blood, did not shine all night
long, although it was at the full, and the stars and Orion made
lamentation over the Jews, because of the transgression committed by
them. And on the first day of the week, about the third hour of the
night, the sun appeared as it never shone before, and the whole heaven
became bright...
(Pontius Pilate's Report to Tiberius Caesar)
And they, being angered at him, commanded that his legs should not be
broken, that he might die in torment. And it was noon, and darkness
came over all Judea: and they were troubled and distressed, lest the
sun had set, whilst he was yet alive: it is written for them, that the
sun set not on him that hath been put to death. And one of them said,
"Give him to drink gall with vinegar." And they mixed and gave him to
drink, and fulfilled all things, and accomplished their sins against
their own head. And many went about with lamps, supposing that it was
night, and fell down. And the Lord cried out, saying, "My power, my
power, thou hast forsaken me." And when he had said it he was taken
up. And in that hour the veil of the temple of Jerusalem was rent in
twain. And then they drew out the nails from the hands of the Lord,
and laid him upon the earth, and the whole earth quaked, and great
fear arose. Then the sun shone, and it was found the ninth hour: and
the Jews rejoiced, and gave his body to Joseph that he might bury
it...
(Peter's "Lost Gospel")
Eagal
attaching your comments to mine, with this cross-posting. Stand on
your own.
> > in Henochian
> > texts: each was not an increasingly pleasant level of paradise.
> > Escorted by angels through apparent astral projections,
>
> This is a speculation by someone who has no direct Knowledge of the
> Vision. Instead, this is figurative language referring to the observa-
> tion/memory of different experiences of consciousness.
And I suppose when St. John writes, "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's
Day," we can conclude, using your "DIRECT Knowledge," this is simply a
MEMORY of another state of consciousness!
Your Anti-Christian heresies are really tiresome!
> The 'unconscious' is typically referred to as the 'sea'. There is a
> "beast from the sea" in the Revelation of John. And, after pursuing
> a determined doubting of beliefs, Descartes writes in his "Second
> Meditation" that he 'feels as though he were suddenly thrown into
> deep water'.
You have no respect for the original context: every mention of the sea
is not correlative. You are attempting to achieve insight through
blindness.
> This is an initial result of the breakdown of the structures of
> the normal 'ego' consciousness.
>
> > On the second heaven,
>
> Merely the description of another aspect of the consciousness which
> emerges with the destruction of the normal waking consciousness.
>
> > demons were hanging as prisoners,
> > tormented in darkness "greater than earthly darkness": weeping they
> > asked Henoch to pray for them, but he replied, "Who am I, a mortal
> > man, that I should pray for angels?" Henoch was told their prince was
> > "fastened on the fifth heaven."
>
> The emotion associated with the Fifth Church in the Revelation of John
> is sorrow.
The heavenly levels, which proceed to ten, have absolutely nothing to
do with the seven churches or the seven chakras. Your baseless
confidence is a display of ignorance.
> > The third heaven included the Tree of
> > Life, and therefore the human Paradise "prepared for the righteous,
> > who endure all manner of offense from those that exasperate their
> > souls";
>
> A duality occurs at the level of the Third Church, the church of fear/
> pleasure (i.e., Satan) and, on the other hand, the fear of God, which
> is the beginning of wisdom. This conflict is the conflict between Truth
> and intellectual pleasure.
>
> > yet on the Northern side was "a very terrible place...cruel
> > darkness and unillumined gloom...murky fire constantly flameth aloft,
> > and there is a river coming forth, and that whole place is everywhere
> > fire, and everywhere there is frost and ice, thirst and shivering,
> > while the bonds are very cruel, and the angels frightful and
> > merciless, bearing angry weapons, merciless torture" - and Henoch's
> > guides informed him this place was "prepared for those who dishonour
> > God...who boast of their wicked deeds, stealing, lies...envy,
> > rancour...murder, and who, accursed, steal the souls of men."
>
> The "king of the North" in Daniel 11 is to be understood esoterically
> as a consciousness which is the opposite of the order and structure of
> the normal waking or 'ego' consciousness symbolized by the "king of the
> South". Thus, the victory of the "king of the North" over the "king of
> the South" in Daniel 11:45 signifies the total psychotic breakdown of
> the linear consciousness into, typically, paranoid schizophrenic psy-
> chosis.
And the Western land was flooded by the Deluge, which is also
irrelevant: the only point I was making, by reproducing portions of
the texts as translated by others, is that Henoch's Ten Heavens were
very specific astral dimensions.
> This is also the esoteric significance of the kingdoms of the "far
> north" in Ezekiel 38:14.
>
> > within the third heaven was both human heaven and hell.
>
> The Third Seal of the Revelation of John pertains to the Third Church.
> The rider on the black horse carries a pair of scales in his hands for
> the weighing out of pleasure and pain. This is an echo of the two-edged
> sword carried by the rider on the red horse; but, in this case, it re-
> fers to pleasure and pain in relation to thought rather than sensation.
As stated before, many of the details you are parsing over have been
conclusively solved in the same manner as the Nostradamian quatrains,
but are being withheld: so I will not engage in this discussion other
than to reiterate that you are incorrect on many points. The scales
are not "an echo" of the sword (and the two-edged quality is reserved
for the sword of Christ's tongue), it is a separate symbol arising for
a different reason. But what can I expect from someone who ignores
the Seven Trumpet theme and wants the Rider of the White Horse to be
Ishmael, when it is obviously JOSHUA, whose name is nearly identical
to Jesus!
> > At the fourth
> > heaven
>
> The Fourth Church is the heart chakra--the place for the Revelation of
> the "resurrection of the dead".
>
> > the motions of the Sun and Moon dominated, with some
> > inscrutable astronomical references. And Satan is not seen on the
> > fifth heaven,
>
> The Fifth Church is, of course, the throat chakra and the origin of
> speech.
>
> > but instead his host, gigantic soldier-demons called
> > Grigori, with withered faces,
>
> in sorrow, perhaps
>
> > and mouths in perpetual silence since no
> > service was offered to God - "with their prince Satanail rejected the
> > Lord of light, and after them those who are held in great darkness on
> > the second heaven, and three of them went down on to earth...and broke
> > through their vows on the hill Ermon, and saw the daughters of men how
> > good they are, and took to themselves wives, and befouled the earth."
> > Thus three demons (note similarity with demonic trio in Apoc. 16:13)
>
> In context, of no particular significance.
The significance is central, so of course you propagandize to downplay
it: those three demons used humans to initiate a process which
resulted in cataclysm; the three demons of Revelations instigate a war
(through humans) which probably coincides with a similar global
catastrophe.
> > were indicated as being responsible for conceiving the abomination of
> > interbreeding with humans referred to in parallel texts, spawning a
> > mutant race of vicious giants the Deluge was probably intended to
> > destroy. Henoch told the Grigori about their colleagues on the second
> > heaven, "The Lord has condemned them to be under the earth till heaven
> > and earth shall end for ever";
>
> They emerge with the destruction of the linear consciousness, the 'beast
> of the earth', or the "monster that shall speak to them" (Sura 27:82 of
> the Koran).
>
> > and he urged them to make some services
> > "before the Lord's face, lest you anger your Lord utterly" - and they
> > responded - "four trumpets trumpeted together with great voice,
>
> And ONE voice.
Proving this is an astral plane, because telepathy is the norm!
> > and
> > the Grigori broke into song with one voice,
>
> Of critical significance--one voice signifying the loss of duality.
>
> > and their voice went up
> > before the Lord pitifully and affectingly."
>
> The number four pertaining to the heart chakra, the four trumpets would
> refer to the experiences surrounding the Revelation of the "resurrection
> of the dead", including the revelation of the memories of previous
> lives. This Revelation does NOT occur except in the presence of extreme
> sorrow--which is why the Koran states on a number of occasions: "And
> Peace be upon him when he is raised from the dead."
>
> > On the sixth heaven were
> > bright and glorious bands of archangels.
>
> The Sixth Church is the crown chakra and a reference to things intel-
> lectual. In a positive sense, this would be a reference to the Doc-
> trinal Knowledge Revealed through the Vision of the "Son of man".
>
> > The seventh heaven was
> > dominated by "a very great light,"
>
> A reference to the Vision of the "Son of man" and the consciousness of
> the Knowledge of Truth.
>
> > attended by fiery troops of
> > archangels; Henoch became terrified, and his guides showed him God
> > Almighty seated on His throne far above in the tenth heaven,
>
> None of this being understood in any literal sense.
Many details were omitted, but the paraphrasing is accurate...
> > then
> > departed, leaving Henoch to be further led by Gabriel. The eighth
> > heaven contained "the twelve signs of the zodiac";
>
> Symbolic of the infinite structure of the physical space-time Reality.
>
> > the ninth had "the
> > heavenly homes of the twelve signs of the zodiac" (the astrological
> > houses concept).
>
> Symbolic of the spiritual significance of the infinite structure of the
> physical space-time Reality.
>
> > On the tenth heaven, Henoch "saw the appearance of
> > the Lord's face, like iron made to glow in fire, and brought out,
> > emitting sparks, and it burns...the Lord's face is ineffable,
> > marvellous and very awful."
>
> The tenth phonetic tone signifies a certain Knowledge with regards to
> the fine structure of human consciousness; the origin and loss of the
> consciousness of the Knowledge of Truth; the destruction of the illus-
> ory consciousness; and the emergence of this Knowledge over historical
> time.
Whatever. My question is, why does Henoch see God's face, while
Moses' request to see the face of whoever spoke to him was met with
evasion in Exodus 33? In fact, the entity communicating with Moses
was quite concerned that no one approach it unawares...
But the righteous escape the judgement of guilt which would make them
liable to receive the eternal punishments, so you are playing
semantics...
Capitalization can merely be a sign of respect or emphasis of
importance: by stating that nothing relating to Jesus should be
capitalized, you are renouncing the concept of Christ's divinity,
which is a regrettable heresy. But Christ HIMSELF said you can say
whatever you like about HIM, but when you commit your blasphemies
against the Holy Spirit, it will never be forgiven. Because I have
demonstrated that in scripture Jesus was predicted as the Son of God,
and His entire ministry revolved around His assuming that role
publicly, you are declaring that all Christians are idolaters, a
charge which falls flat in the face of my correct usage of prophetic
texts. Maybe you've been told all Christians worship Jesus as a false
god, but Christians have a lot of trouble understanding the spiritual
logic of many things done in other religions too, so try to learn some
tolerance. Another passage from a text you're bound to hold as
dubious (until it happens):
"Other men and women thrust themselves down from a high place and
return again and run, and demons drive them...And this they do
continually and are tormented for ever. These are they who have cut
their flesh as apostles of a man, and the women who were with them..."
(Apocalypse of St. Peter, Ethiopic version)
> > about the
> > Galileans whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices. And
> > Jesus answered and said to them, "Do you suppose that these Galileans
> > were worse sinners than all other Galileans, because they suffered
> > such things? I tell you, no: but unless you repent you will all
> > likewise perish. Or those eighteen
>
> The number 18 is, of course, 6+6+6--the number of the linear conscious-
> ness.
Just because 18 people died you want to infer Apocalyptic symbolism?
I was only intending to show that Jesus rejected the common perception
that horrible things always befall people to punish them for their
actions: this was to dispel the issue you had appeared to raise, that
the victims of the WTC disaster were inadequate Christians or some
such nonsense (hundreds were Muslim, by the way).
Dizisignal
simple.
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
> Since our disagreements are not misunderstandings, please desist from
> attaching your comments to mine, with this cross-posting.
You do not understand the seriousness of what you are doing.
You have no Knowledge of the things which you claim to have Knowledge
of.
You are merely guessing or speculating. You are manufacturing illusions
as if they are the Truth and you are recommending that people should
follow your illusions.
The word for this is "idolatry".
You are distracting people from the Truth who might otherwise be
inclined
to believe the Truth rather than the nonsense that you offer.
Substituting illusion for Truth is at the root of violence.
As Jesus said: "Satan is the father of lies." And illusions are lies.
This is what the paid religious officials are doing. And you should be
able to see the consequences of this
> Stand on
> your own.
I have written enough notes on my own to these groups to establish
my ability to 'stand on my own'.
In responding to you I am contradicting error, lies, and illusion.
And I intend to continue this, Insh'allah, until you desist.
> > > in Henochian
> > > texts: each was not an increasingly pleasant level of paradise.
> > > Escorted by angels through apparent astral projections,
> >
> > This is a speculation by someone who has no direct Knowledge of the
> > Vision. Instead, this is figurative language referring to the observa-
> > tion/memory of different experiences of consciousness.
>
> And I suppose
It appears that almost everything you say is a supposition.
> when St. John writes, "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's
> Day," we can conclude, using your "DIRECT Knowledge," this is simply a
> MEMORY of another state of consciousness!
It is a description of the experience of the Vision, yes.
>
> Your Anti-Christian heresies are really tiresome!
Well, I am talking about the Teaching of Jesus, for which, of
course, your intellect is too "tired" to understand.
In other words, words of Truth are not *pleasurable* for the
intellect. So it is no wonder that you are 'tired'.
> > The 'unconscious' is typically referred to as the 'sea'. There is a
> > "beast from the sea" in the Revelation of John. And, after pursuing
> > a determined doubting of beliefs, Descartes writes in his "Second
> > Meditation" that he 'feels as though he were suddenly thrown into
> > deep water'.
>
> You have no respect for the original context:
What I have no respect for is people who talk as if they have
Knowledge, as if they are an authority, when they have NO
knowledge.
This is what the theologians do.
They have NO knowledge; but MILLIONS think that they do...
Which is why there is this conflict in the Middle East.
> every mention of the sea
> is not correlative. You are attempting to achieve
I don't have to 'attempt to achieve' anything.
> insight through
> blindness.
The Vision conveys Knowledge of the structure of consciousness.
This Knowledge would be there even had the Revelation of John
not been written.
> > This is an initial result of the breakdown of the structures of
> > the normal 'ego' consciousness.
> >
> > > On the second heaven,
> >
> > Merely the description of another aspect of the consciousness which
> > emerges with the destruction of the normal waking consciousness.
> >
> > > demons were hanging as prisoners,
> > > tormented in darkness "greater than earthly darkness": weeping they
> > > asked Henoch to pray for them, but he replied, "Who am I, a mortal
> > > man, that I should pray for angels?" Henoch was told their prince was
> > > "fastened on the fifth heaven."
> >
> > The emotion associated with the Fifth Church in the Revelation of John
> > is sorrow.
>
> The heavenly levels, which proceed to ten, have absolutely nothing to
> do with the seven churches or the seven chakras.
Says you.
You have no Knowledge of the phonetic tones; or, apparently, of Merkavah
mysticism and the "Tree of Life" which also consists of ten "sephirot".
> Your baseless
> confidence
Is confidence required to describe a tree?
Or to notice that someone who cannot even count the branches
of that tree is incapable of seeing it?
This is all very matter-of-fact.
Nothing so complicated as 'confidence' is involved.
Why would this be irrelevant?
West is metaphorical of the intellect; flood is metaphorical of the
'unconscious'. Did you not know that?
Do you have any knowledge of the left and right hemispheres of
the brain?
The left being sequential, time based thought and the right being
the image-forming area...
> the only point I was making, by reproducing portions of
> the texts as translated by others, is that Henoch's Ten Heavens were
> very specific astral dimensions.
What does the term "astral dimension" MEAN?
You nowhere define what we are supposed to understand by this
term. I am suggesting that it refers to dimensions of consciousness.
This was the language necessary prior to Freud and Jung for the
description of such characteristics or experiences of consciousness.
>
>
> > This is also the esoteric significance of the kingdoms of the "far
> > north" in Ezekiel 38:14.
> >
> > > within the third heaven was both human heaven and hell.
> >
> > The Third Seal of the Revelation of John pertains to the Third Church.
> > The rider on the black horse carries a pair of scales in his hands for
> > the weighing out of pleasure and pain. This is an echo of the two-edged
> > sword carried by the rider on the red horse; but, in this case, it re-
> > fers to pleasure and pain in relation to thought rather than sensation.
>
> As stated before, many of the details you are parsing
In your dreams.
These things are not "parsed".
I am presenting the framework of Knowledge from within which
they can be understood.
> over have been
> conclusively solved in the same manner as the Nostradamian quatrains,
> but are being withheld
Sort of reminds me of "Mystery, Babylon the Great, the Mother of Harlots
and all the Abominations on the Earth."
Prophecies of the space-time Reality can, on occasion, be withheld for
a variety of reasons. Knowledge is sometimes withheld from a student
because they are not able to understand it yet. But your attempts to
mimic these situations are juvenile and unconvincing.
> : so I will not engage in this discussion other
> than to reiterate that you are incorrect on many points.
Poor little baby.
Always misunderstood.
Nobody loves him.
(You get the picture.......maybe.)
> The scales
> are not "an echo" of the sword (and the two-edged quality is reserved
> for the sword of Christ's tongue)
But it is a symbol of the demonic parallel to the sword of Truth
> , it is a separate symbol arising for
> a different reason.
Nah.
It is a fractal.
These things iterate from the same fundamental source.
> But what can I expect from someone who ignores
> the Seven Trumpet
Not ignored at all...
As will soon be seen when, Insh'allah, I go live with my new web
page with a "Commentary on the Revelation of John".
> theme and wants the Rider of the White Horse to be
> Ishmael,
Makes NO difference what I 'want'.
The symbol does not fit.
Ishmael was a BOWMAN--like the protagonist in "2001".
Read Genesis.
> when it is obviously JOSHUA, whose name is nearly identical
> to Jesus!
Competely irrelevant to the context.
Does the Bible say that Joshua was a BOWMAN?
I remember a sword and a javelin; but a BOW?
>
>
> > > At the fourth
> > > heaven
> >
> > The Fourth Church is the heart chakra--the place for the Revelation of
> > the "resurrection of the dead".
> >
> > > the motions of the Sun and Moon dominated, with some
> > > inscrutable astronomical references. And Satan is not seen on the
> > > fifth heaven,
> >
> > The Fifth Church is, of course, the throat chakra and the origin of
> > speech.
> >
> > > but instead his host, gigantic soldier-demons called
> > > Grigori, with withered faces,
> >
> > in sorrow, perhaps
> >
> > > and mouths in perpetual silence since no
> > > service was offered to God - "with their prince Satanail rejected the
> > > Lord of light, and after them those who are held in great darkness on
> > > the second heaven, and three of them went down on to earth...and broke
> > > through their vows on the hill Ermon, and saw the daughters of men how
> > > good they are, and took to themselves wives, and befouled the earth."
> > > Thus three demons (note similarity with demonic trio in Apoc. 16:13)
> >
> > In context, of no particular significance.
>
> The significance is central,
If so, I would guess that you would explain it in detial...
Which you do not.
> so of course you propagandize
What does this mean?
> to downplay
> it: those three demons used humans to initiate a process which
> resulted in cataclysm; the three demons of Revelations instigate a war
> (through humans) which probably coincides with a similar global
> catastrophe.
Fine.
Then explain what precisely they are in context.
If you could have done this already, you probably would have.
But you can't.
>
>
> > > were indicated as being responsible for conceiving the abomination of
> > > interbreeding with humans referred to in parallel texts, spawning a
> > > mutant race of vicious giants the Deluge was probably intended to
> > > destroy. Henoch told the Grigori about their colleagues on the second
> > > heaven, "The Lord has condemned them to be under the earth till heaven
> > > and earth shall end for ever";
> >
> > They emerge with the destruction of the linear consciousness, the 'beast
> > of the earth', or the "monster that shall speak to them" (Sura 27:82 of
> > the Koran).
> >
> > > and he urged them to make some services
> > > "before the Lord's face, lest you anger your Lord utterly" - and they
> > > responded - "four trumpets trumpeted together with great voice,
> >
> > And ONE voice.
>
> Proving this is an astral plane, because telepathy is the norm!
Telepathy implies communication between two separate consciousnesses
in space.
Knowledge is structured in Reality by means of fractals over time.
This is certainly not the same thing.
O K
>
>
> > > then
> > > departed, leaving Henoch to be further led by Gabriel. The eighth
> > > heaven contained "the twelve signs of the zodiac";
> >
> > Symbolic of the infinite structure of the physical space-time Reality.
> >
> > > the ninth had "the
> > > heavenly homes of the twelve signs of the zodiac" (the astrological
> > > houses concept).
> >
> > Symbolic of the spiritual significance of the infinite structure of the
> > physical space-time Reality.
> >
> > > On the tenth heaven, Henoch "saw the appearance of
> > > the Lord's face, like iron made to glow in fire, and brought out,
> > > emitting sparks, and it burns...the Lord's face is ineffable,
> > > marvellous and very awful."
> >
> > The tenth phonetic tone signifies a certain Knowledge with regards to
> > the fine structure of human consciousness; the origin and loss of the
> > consciousness of the Knowledge of Truth; the destruction of the illus-
> > ory consciousness; and the emergence of this Knowledge over historical
> > time.
>
> Whatever.
Not merely "whatever".
This is the manner in which Reality is structured.
You have no Knowledge of this and so can only trivialize it as being
of no significance.
Not only can you not perceive it, even when it is brought to your
attention you cannot understand it.
> My question is, why does Henoch see God's face, while
> Moses' request to see the face of whoever spoke to him was met with
> evasion in Exodus 33?
Why did you learn to count to ten in first grade, but when you went
to high school you were taught algebra, instead?
> In fact, the entity communicating with Moses
> was quite concerned that no one approach it unawares...
It has to do with the Teaching.
The very words you use to describe it convey its significance.
Wanna make a bet?
The righteous are PERPETUALLY accused of evil by those under
the influence of the "dragon".
This is not a trivial matter...
Because it is the Creator Who allows this.
> which would make them
> liable to receive the eternal punishments,
What does it mean when time STOPS?
And Freud said that "time" is a creation of the 'ego
consciousness...
At about the same 'time' that Einstein was understanding
that there were certain flaws in the concept as well.
> so you are playing
> semantics...
It must seem to be so for someone who has no Knowledge.
The thought is not the thing.
Something which, apparently, you have not yet mastered.
Don't lie to me.
This is not what you mean by this, and you know it.
> by stating that nothing relating to Jesus should be
> capitalized,
Correct.
> you are renouncing the concept of Christ's divinity,
BINGO.
You FOX.
>
> which is a regrettable heresy.
Idolatry is worse than heresy, nitwit idolator.
> But Christ HIMSELF said you can say
> whatever you like about HIM, but when you commit your blasphemies
> against the Holy Spirit, it will never be forgiven.
You said it.
You have locked yourself in the trap and thrown away the key.
It is not MY fault.
You chose this all by yourself.
> Because I have
> demonstrated that in scripture Jesus was predicted as the Son of God,
So what?
>
> and His
idolatry
> entire ministry revolved around His
idolatry
> assuming that role
> publicly,
So what?
> you are declaring that all Christians are idolaters,
BINGO...if they believe that Jesus was God.
> a
> charge which falls flat in the face of my correct
in your deep delusions
> usage of prophetic
> texts.
Except for the Koran, interestingly enough.
> Maybe you've been told all Christians worship Jesus as a false
> god, but Christians have a lot of trouble understanding the spiritual
> logic of many things done in other religions too, so try to learn some
> tolerance.
I do not 'tolerate' the 'justification' for GENOCIDE.
Which is what the deification of Jesus was to the Holocaust.
Perhaps you should try not to think that you, like Jesus, are GOD.
(Why is it that those people who believe that Jesus is God ultimately
end up claiming instead that THEY are God? That is, they claim that
their understanding of the words of Jesus is OMNISCIENT.)
> Another passage from a text you're bound to hold as
> dubious (until it happens):
>
> "Other men and women thrust themselves down from a high place and
> return again and run, and demons drive them...And this they do
> continually and are tormented for ever. These are they who have cut
> their flesh as apostles of a man, and the women who were with them..."
> (Apocalypse of St. Peter, Ethiopic version)
Insufficient to determine what is being talked about.
>
> > > about the
> > > Galileans whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices. And
> > > Jesus answered and said to them, "Do you suppose that these Galileans
> > > were worse sinners than all other Galileans, because they suffered
> > > such things? I tell you, no: but unless you repent you will all
> > > likewise perish. Or those eighteen
> >
> > The number 18 is, of course, 6+6+6--the number of the linear conscious-
> > ness.
>
> Just because 18 people died you want to infer Apocalyptic symbolism?
Nah.
Just having a little "fun" here.
Just pointing out a fact.
Do facts OFFEND you?
(According to the Koran, by the way, the number of the angels guarding
hell is 19--the same number as the terrorists involved in the 9-11
acts of terrorism. A 20th hijacker apparently missed the flight or
something.....Ever wonder WHY?)
> I was only intending to show that Jesus rejected the common perception
> that horrible things always befall people to punish them for their
> actions: this was to dispel the issue you had appeared
It seems that a LOT of things "appear" to you that have no basis in
Reality.
> to raise, that
> the victims of the WTC disaster were inadequate Christians
HUHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH???????????
Wow. Wow. And wow.
Just can't IMAGINE the delusional mechanisms that resulted in
this conclusion.
You have some genuinely incredible pictures on the walls of the
prison you have created to protect you from Reality...
Well, you have to do SOMETHING for entertainment.
Dizisignal
> attaching your comments to mine, with this cross-posting.
Eagal
> Can't you see People read these things then try to act them out. It's that
> simple.
That does not explain the recent chain of events, which involve
fulfillments of prophecies that were not understood beforehand, such
as the Osprey crash occurring around the time of the Seville Good
Friday procession being disrupted for VI.19. Also, I refrained from
making the correct calculation to pinpoint the 11 Sept attack although
I had written about the conditions without knowing what event would
take place specifically: and if I had given a precise warning for 11
Sept '01 8:43am EDT, it would have been quite difficult for anyone to
have perpetrated such a complex endeavour, years in the planning, upon
such an exact timetable - and there was no such incentive, since it
would only have had the effect of increasing faith in a Christian
prophet, while these terrorists were unmistakeably Muslim!
The fact is that these prophecies are being fulfilled whether or not
anyone becomes aware of it. It is also part of the Christian faith to
"watch" events using scripture and divinely inspired prophecy, lest
one be caught unawares and therefore unworthy. There are many
Apocalyptic fulfillments I have witnessed along with the rest of the
world, but have refrained from explaining in those terms: the
cataclysmic events are a major focus for Nostradamus, whose writings
become more useful as the incidents shift into a higher gear where it
becomes apparent to the average unenlightened person that this could
be the Revelations period.
Some people want the information, and are upset more was not done to
pinpoint the nature and timing of the 11 Sept attack; you on the other
hand feel that the application of prophecy is an incitement to
manifest whatever conjectures are proposed, as if everything people
have said about Nostradamian quatrains has been made true by artifice.
The fact is very few comments made by some people have any relation
to actual events, while other people appear to have a good track
record using prophecy: this does not suggest that lunatics pick their
favorite prognosticator and make their beliefs seem real even if that
goes against their own agenda, but that some people are better than
others at figuring out what Nostradamus meant.
If you recall how my participation on a.p.n began, I found a potential
link with the Cassini spacecraft fly-by as coinciding with destruction
at a port city, the solar eclipse crossing the Black Sea, and the
Grand Fixed Cross: I proposed Cassini would strike NYC - it did not,
but an earthquake struck Istanbul, just as V.54 stated, though I
misunderstood prior. Cassini might have precipitated the quake, but
my hypothesis had nothing to do with it: the prophecies informed me of
some danger, and were correct beyond any human tampering.
About this latest bit regarding the bridge, I was willing to misread
bridge to have it be about the past Pentagon damage. But the
quatrains offer data in small, disjointed bits and I am really not
trying to water down or sanitize the messages. So when I had the
bridge remarks I could not explain, and the Beziers date of 5
November, then the bridge warning coincidently came out, I simply
looked for other mentions of a bridge event which also contained
potential references to this timeframe. The terrorists do not need
anyone to give them prophetic permission to perform their atrocities;
they have spread anthrax through the mail without a specific
prediction about that. But if I did not use my abilities to warn
readers about something which would kill them, I would feel somewhat
responsible: it is for that reason that I regret not having pinpointed
the 11 Sept time, despite complaints like yours.
I have employed editorial restraint in not posting my revised analysis
of the ambush prophecy, for strategic considerations. But I do not
see how encouraging people to avoid a bridge which is already under
threat and heavy guard could be perceived as giving anyone ideas
useful for evil. The news reports I heard said it is very difficult
to demolish a bridge, and that information is what the terrorists
would need, rather than simply a place and date; then they would have
to perform their murderous deed under watchful eyes. And for Islamic
terrorists to be reading my posts then trying to make me correct would
be defeating their professed purpose, by engendering more faith in
Jesus.
V.66 has come up frequently, wherein a "ruined aqueduct" is mentioned,
and if the aqueduct in V.58 is really a bridge, the ends seem neatly
tied. I am certain that if you traveled on that bridge you would like
to know whether there is a prediction it would be destroyed during
this sudden wartime. And your supposition that simply BECAUSE I've
written about something, it will occur as hypothesized, has been
disproven on many occasions, including this one. Even if someone
wanted to manipulate reality to conform with my theories, I am not
giving information on how to do anything evil (though these things are
often available on the internet), and have renounced such actions in
no uncertain terms (outlining the eternal punishments seen in St.
Peter's obscure vision).
If this is the Armageddon War, shunning the spiritual insight the
prophecies offer because exposition of their truth is mistaken for
self-fulfilling prophecy seems a foolish reaction. The important
events will be found to have been documented prophetically, whether or
not the human race is up to the challenge of both understanding this
and dealing with it in a mature and appropriate manner.
Eagal
DIVINITY OF JESUS
The Gospel passage which has been taken as Jesus repudiating divinity
(Matthew 19:16-17) differs significantly between Greek and Egyptian
translations: though both possess the same core meaning, the
variations and their interpretational repercussions do not impinge
upon the predominance of statements affirming Christ as the Son of
God, using both the Bible and Apocryphal texts; the two versions
regard a rich young man who seeks instruction on good works to attain
eternal life, and is ultimately told that beyond following the Ten
Commandments he should forsake all his worldly goods, something he was
not prepared to do. As in the story of the Canaanite woman seeking to
exorcise a demon from her daughter, in which Jesus first ignored her,
then argued about jurisdiction, then spoke of children's bread being
cast to little dogs, the purpose was to elicit a faithful response:
much like Socrates taught by asking questions, Jesus used the riddles
of parables, and presented difficult situations to make points.
The Greek version reads:
Now, behold, one came and said to Him, "Good Teacher, what good thing
shall I do that I may have eternal life?"
So He said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One,
that is, God. But if you want to enter into life..."
As stated, this is not tantamount to saying "I am not God because I am
not good": Jesus when arrested asked for which of His good works
punishment was arriving, and spoke of how what He did always pleased
the Father. Within the full context of the relevant scriptural
continuum, it appears an invitation to ascribe divinity to Him by
virtue of His intrinsic goodness, rather than a warning never to call
a *mere mortal* such as Himself (who healed lepers and others, raised
the dead, etc.) good. But there is also the translation derived from
Egyptian sources:
And behold, a certain man came to him and said, "Master, what good
work shall I do to have eternal life?"
He said to him, "Why do you ask me about what is good? There is One
who is good. But if you want to enter into life..."
So in that version, Jesus' question concerns the good work, not the
salutation as Good Master, especially since the "Good" qualifier is
omitted: so this is an especially troublesome passage, even
questionable whether it was stated the One who is good is God (an
obvious fact which could be an author's simple embellishment). An
interesting occasion where Jesus might have subtly equated Himself
with God is in Matthew 23:29-35:
"Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! Because you build the
tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous, and
say, 'If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have
been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.' Therefore,
you are witnesses against yourselves that you are the sons of those
who murdered the prophets. Fill up, then, the measure of your
fathers' guilt. Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the
condemnation of hell? THEREFORE, INDEED, *I* SEND YOU PROPHETS, WISE
MEN, AND SCRIBES: some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of
them you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from city to
city, that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth,
from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, son of
Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar."
Who else but God Himself would claim to have "sent the prophets"?
Yet there is something unexpected about this passage which actually
undercuts the case for Christ's divinity, to some extent, due to
historical confusion: the events of 2 Chronicles 24:21 appear
recounted, wherein Zechariah the son of *Jehoiada* was stoned "with
stones in the court of the house of the Lord" at the behest of King
Joash - but in Isaias 8:2 there is mention of "Zechariah the son of
Jeberechiah," and the prophet Zechariah identifies himself as the son
of Berechiah (1:1). Isaiah prophesied in Jerusalem from 734 to 668
BCE; prophet Zechariah dates from the second year of King Darius'
reign, circa 520 BCE: therefore, someone made a mistake, given the
available facts. There is the unlikely possiblility of deliberate
error, or something akin to poetic license, equating the three
righteous Zechariahs to slyly infer the murder of one (who publicly
renounced sanctioned idolatry) might as well have been the slaughter
of the other two as well.
"And if I cast out demons by Beelzebub, by whom do your sons cast them
out? Therefore they will be your judges. But if I cast out demons
with the finger of God, surely the kingdom of God has come upon you."
In Luke 11:19,20 Christ definitely associates Himself with the power
of God, a theme also arising when Jesus spoke about John the Baptist
in Matthew 11:9 -
"But what did you go out to see? A prophet? Yes, I say to you, and
more than a prophet. For this is he of whom it is written, 'Behold, I
will send My messenger before Your face, who will prepare Your way
before You'" -
Paraphrasing Malachai 3:1,
"Behold, I will send My messenger,
And he will prepare the way before Me,"
It is clear Jesus was explaining John the Baptist was the messenger,
and Himself the God incarnate.
Again in Luke 16:16 Jesus indicates a theological shift enacted
through John the Baptist:
"The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the
kingdom of God has been preached..."
Some of the statements Jesus made infuriated people as blasphemous,
though they would not be so if He were the Son of God, such as John
8:54-59:
"Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was
glad."
Then the Jews said to Him, "You are not yet fifty years old, and have
You seen Abraham?"
Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was,
I AM."
Then they took up stones to throw at Him...
My impression is that when Jesus spoke of His "Day," while He used
past tense it was actually a prophecy of Abraham's reaction to the
Second Coming. Christ confessing to have existed prior to Abraham
speaks at least of reincarnation, if not divinity through being
conscious enough to recall that far back. Jesus often amazed His
interrogators, as in Matthew 22/ Mark 12/ Luke 20, where the Sadducees
attempted to debunk resurrection by asking Jesus to which of seven
brothers a woman would be married if each one died in succession,
passing her down according to law -
Jesus answered and said to them, "Is this not why you err - because
you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God? The sons of
this age marry and are given in marriage. But those who are counted
worthy to attain that age, and the resurrection from the dead, neither
marry nor are given in marriage, nor can they die anymore, for they
are equal to the angels and are sons of God, being sons of the
resurrection. But even Moses showed in the burning bush passage that
the dead are raised when he called the Lord 'the God of Abraham, the
God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.' For He is not the God of the
dead but of the living, for all live to Him. You are therefore
greatly mistaken."
The response seemed to satisfy many, although perhaps on a surface
level: the entity identifying itself as the God of three deceased men
only raises their names, so the connection to resurrection is so
tenuous as to suggest sarcasm; it is also interesting to note that the
entity could probably not make a claim to being the God to any human
prior to Abraham, such as Adam or Noah, since It became the God of the
Iraelites through the bargain entered into by Abram alone.
"Also I say to you, whoever acknowledges Me before men, him the Son of
Man also will acknowledge before the angels of God. But he who denies
Me before men will be denied before the angels of God."
Because Jesus blessed Peter with the "keys to the kingdom of heaven"
when he acknowledged Jesus was the Son of the living God, this is
probably the confession regarded in Luke 12:8-9 required to be
welcomed by the angels; by corollary, denial of Christ's divinity
could cut one off from the possibility of attaining heaven.
While Jesus was in the Davidic line, a potential King if Israel were
not under Roman occupation, after feeding the multitudes He escaped a
movement to enthrone Him (John 6:15), the same way He often slipped
away from those wishing to stone Him:
Therefore when Jesus perceived that they were about to come and take
Him by force to make Him king, He departed again to the mountain by
Himself alone.
In Mark 12:28-34, Jesus reduces the Ten Commandments down to Two, then
when a scribe agreed those Two superceded "all the whole burnt
offerings and sacrifices," He replied, "You are not far from the
kingdom of God." Presumptuous for a prophet perhaps, but quite
fitting for a Messiah.
"No disciple is above his teacher; but when perfected, everyone will
be like his teacher" (Luke 6:40)
Some would think
They could be
Ignoring the Saviour's Sermon:
He told the Parable of the Sower
To show they were wrong
...He got into a boat and sat; and the whole multitude stood on the
shore. Then He spoke many things to them in parables, saying: "Behold
a sower went out to sow. And as he sowed, some seed fell by the
wayside, and the birds came and devoured them. Some fell on stony
places, where they did not have much earth, and they immediately
sprang up because they had no depth of earth. But when the sun was up
they were scorched, and because they had no root they withered away.
And some fell among thorns, and the thorns sprang up and choked them.
But others fell on good dirt and yielded a crop: some a hundredfold,
some sixty, some thirty...
"Therefore hear the parable of the sower: When anyone hears the word
of the kingdom, and does not understand it, then the wicked one comes
and snatches away what was sown in his heart. This is he who received
seed by the wayside. But he who received seed on the stony places,
this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy;
yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when
tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he
stumbles. Now he who received seed among the thorns is he who hears
the word, and the cares of this world and the deceitfulness of riches
choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful. But he who received seed
on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who
indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some
thirty."
...Then Jesus sent away the multitude and went into the house. And
His disciples came to Him, saying, "Explain to us the parable of the
weeds in the field."
He answered and said to them, "He who sows the good seed is the Son of
Man. The field is the world, the good seeds are the sons of the
kingdom, but the weeds are the sons of the wicked one. The enemy who
sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the
reapers are the angels. Therefore as the weeds are gathered and
burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of this age. The Son of
Man will send out HIS angels, and they will gather out of His kingdom
all things that offend, and those who work iniquity, and will cast
them into the furnace of fire. There will be wailing and the gnashing
of teeth. Then will the righteous shine forth as the sun in the
kingdom of their Father." (Matthew 13)
"For herein is the proverb true, 'One sows, another reaps':
I have sent you to reap that on which you have not labored.
Others have labored, and you have entered into their labors."
(John 4:37,38)
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
> dizis...@aol.com (Dizisignal) wrote in message news:<20011102112935...@mb-fq.aol.com>...
> > Can't you see People read these things then try to act them out. It's that
> > simple.
>
> That does not explain the recent chain of events, which involve
> fulfillments of prophecies that were not understood beforehand, such
> as the Osprey crash occurring around the time of the Seville Good
> Friday procession being disrupted for VI.19. Also, I refrained from
> making the correct calculation to pinpoint the 11 Sept attack although
> I had written about the conditions without knowing what event would
> take place specifically: and if I had given a precise warning for 11
> Sept '01 8:43am EDT, it would have been quite difficult for anyone to
> have perpetrated such a complex endeavour, years in the planning, upon
> such an exact timetable
Precisely.
But these people are looking for the most simplistic explanation
possible...
Rather than believing in the absolute POWER of the Creator over
His creation.
> - and there was no such incentive, since it
> would only have had the effect of increasing faith in a Christian
> prophet, while these terrorists were unmistakeably Muslim!
Perhaps they were unmistakably Muslim.
But they were also--just as unmistakably--NOT acting in accordance
with the Teaching of Mohammed or the Revelations in the Koran.
>
>
> The fact is that these prophecies are being fulfilled whether or not
> anyone becomes aware of it.
Certainly an interesting comment.
And it pertains to the fractal Prophecies of Daniel 11:45--
12:1 as well.
> It is also part of the Christian faith to
> "watch" events using scripture and divinely inspired prophecy, lest
> one be caught unawares and therefore unworthy. There are many
> Apocalyptic fulfillments I have witnessed along with the rest of the
> world, but have refrained from explaining in those terms: the
> cataclysmic events are a major focus for Nostradamus, whose writings
> become more useful as the incidents shift into a higher gear where it
> becomes apparent to the average unenlightened person that this could
> be the Revelations period.
>
> Some people want the information, and are upset more was not done to
> pinpoint the nature and timing of the 11 Sept attack; you on the other
> hand feel that the application of prophecy is an incitement to
> manifest whatever conjectures are proposed,
This is one of those situations in which those who have Knowledge
or knowledge are "damned if they do, damed if they don't".
They are ALWAYS accused by the dragon-based consciousness of
the normal human personality.
> as if everything people
> have said about Nostradamian quatrains has been made true by artifice.
> The fact is very few comments made by some people have any relation
> to actual events, while other people appear to have a good track
> record using prophecy: this does not suggest that lunatics pick their
> favorite prognosticator and make their beliefs seem real even if that
> goes against their own agenda, but that some people are better than
> others at figuring out what Nostradamus meant.
>
> If you recall how my participation on a.p.n began, I found a potential
> link with the Cassini spacecraft fly-by as coinciding with destruction
> at a port city, the solar eclipse crossing the Black Sea, and the
> Grand Fixed Cross: I proposed Cassini would strike NYC - it did not,
> but an earthquake struck Istanbul, just as V.54 stated, though I
> misunderstood prior. Cassini might have precipitated the quake,
THIS is where I disagree with you.
You are attributing CAUSATION to these things rather than merely
noting the synchronicity of these events as part of a much larger
demonstration of the fine-structure of the space-time Reality.
And when you imply that a teensy-weensy space-craft flying
by can CAUSE a huge earthquake like in Turkey, the scientific
mentality RIDICULES such an assertion--and justifiably so.
This is simply going beyond the FACTS of the matter, which are
the expression of a specific structure.
> but
> my hypothesis had nothing to do with it: the prophecies informed me of
> some danger, and were correct beyond any human tampering.
>
> About this latest bit regarding the bridge, I was willing to misread
> bridge to have it be about the past Pentagon damage. But the
> quatrains offer data in small, disjointed bits and I am really not
> trying to water down or sanitize the messages. So when I had the
> bridge remarks I could not explain, and the Beziers date of 5
> November, then the bridge warning coincidently came out, I simply
> looked for other mentions of a bridge event which also contained
> potential references to this timeframe. The terrorists do not need
> anyone to give them prophetic permission to perform their atrocities;
> they have spread anthrax through the mail without a specific
> prediction about that. But if I did not use my abilities to warn
> readers about something which would kill them, I would feel somewhat
> responsible:
Have you never stopped to think that maybe the reason why you
were not given more specific information is that this civilization is
so PERVERSE that it does not DESERVE to be told this infor-
mation?
This is certainly something that I have HAD to consider over the past
25 years.
Correct.
> The important
> events will be found to have been documented prophetically, whether or
> not the human race is up to the challenge of both understanding this
> and dealing with it in a mature and appropriate manner.
Precisely.
On this we are in agreement.
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
> CONCERNING THE
> DIVINITY OF JESUS
>
> The Gospel passage which has been taken as Jesus repudiating divinity
> (Matthew 19:16-17) differs significantly between Greek and Egyptian
> translations: though both possess the same core meaning, the
> variations and their interpretational repercussions do not impinge
> upon the predominance of statements affirming Christ as the Son of
> God,
There is a difference between the term "son of God" and the assertion
that Jesus IS God.
These are two COMPLETELY different things.
> using both the Bible and Apocryphal texts; the two versions
> regard a rich young man who seeks instruction on good works to attain
> eternal life, and is ultimately told that beyond following the Ten
> Commandments he should forsake all his worldly goods, something he was
> not prepared to do. As in the story of the Canaanite woman seeking to
> exorcise a demon from her daughter, in which Jesus first ignored her,
> then argued about jurisdiction, then spoke of children's bread being
> cast to little dogs, the purpose was to elicit a faithful response:
> much like Socrates taught by asking questions, Jesus used the riddles
> of parables, and presented difficult situations to make points.
>
> The Greek version reads:
>
> Now, behold, one came and said to Him, "Good Teacher, what good thing
> shall I do that I may have eternal life?"
> So He
blasphemy.
> said to him, "Why do you call Me
blasphemy
> good? No one is good but One,
> that is, God. But if you want to enter into life..."
>
> As stated, this is not tantamount to saying "I am not God
I agree.
It is not even on the RADAR screen that there is a possibility of
a man being God.
Jesus would not have to specifically deny that he was God because
NO such possibility even existed in the first place.
> because I am
> not good": Jesus when arrested asked for which of His
blasphemy
> good works
> punishment was arriving, and spoke of how what He
blasphemy.
> did always pleased
> the Father. Within the full context of the relevant scriptural
> continuum, it appears an invitation to ascribe divinity to Him
blasphemy
> by
> virtue of His
blasphemy.
> intrinsic goodness,
Just INCREDIBLE.
Here we have a bald-faced CONTRADICTION of the SPECIFIC
words of Jesus by someone who, NEVERTHELESS , thinks
that he is a follower of Jesus.
> rather than a warning never to call
> a *mere mortal* such as Himself
The consciousness of Jesus is DIFFERENT than the consciousness
of the normal human personality.
These things are SHARPLY different.
But this is NOT to say that Jesus is God.
I have argued that there is a non-spatial/non-temporal
consciousness beyond the linear consciousness of the
normal human personality...
Which prompted a philosopher who read my argument
that this consciousness beyond the normal consciousness
is GOD.
This is simply not the Truth.
There is an "observing consciousness" or consciousness
of the Knowledge of Truth.
God is something COMPLETELY different than that consciousness.
This is something that needs to be explained.
> (who healed lepers and others, raised
> the dead, etc.) good. But there is also the translation derived from
> Egyptian sources:
>
> And behold, a certain man came to him and said, "Master, what good
> work shall I do to have eternal life?"
> He said to him, "Why do you ask me about what is good? There is One
> who is good. But if you want to enter into life..."
>
> So in that version, Jesus' question concerns the good work, not the
> salutation as Good Master, especially since the "Good" qualifier is
> omitted: so this is an especially troublesome passage, even
> questionable whether it was stated the One who is good is God (an
> obvious fact which could be an author's simple embellishment). An
> interesting occasion where Jesus might have subtly equated Himself
blasphemy
>
> with God is in Matthew 23:29-35:
>
> "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! Because you build the
> tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous, and
> say, 'If we had lived in the days of our fathers, we would not have
> been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.' Therefore,
> you are witnesses against yourselves that you are the sons of those
> who murdered the prophets. Fill up, then, the measure of your
> fathers' guilt. Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the
> condemnation of hell? THEREFORE, INDEED, *I* SEND YOU PROPHETS, WISE
> MEN, AND SCRIBES: some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of
> them you will scourge in your synagogues and persecute from city to
> city, that on you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth,
> from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, son of
> Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar."
>
> Who else but God Himself would claim to have "sent the prophets"?
UTTER NONSENSE.
Isaiah uses the same kind of terminology.
Jesus is speaking on behalf of the Creator in this instance.
Speaking on behalf of the Creator--speaking the Revelations one
has received--does NOT mean establishing an equivalence with
the Creator.
>
> Yet there is something unexpected about this passage which actually
> undercuts the case for Christ's divinity, to some extent, due to
> historical confusion: the events of 2 Chronicles 24:21 appear
> recounted, wherein Zechariah the son of *Jehoiada* was stoned "with
> stones in the court of the house of the Lord" at the behest of King
> Joash - but in Isaias 8:2 there is mention of "Zechariah the son of
> Jeberechiah," and the prophet Zechariah identifies himself as the son
> of Berechiah (1:1). Isaiah prophesied in Jerusalem from 734 to 668
> BCE; prophet Zechariah dates from the second year of King Darius'
> reign, circa 520 BCE: therefore, someone made a mistake, given the
> available facts. There is the unlikely possiblility of deliberate
> error, or something akin to poetic license, equating the three
> righteous Zechariahs to slyly infer the murder of one (who publicly
> renounced sanctioned idolatry) might as well have been the slaughter
> of the other two as well.
>
> "And if I cast out demons by Beelzebub, by whom do your sons cast them
> out? Therefore they will be your judges. But if I cast out demons
> with the finger of God, surely the kingdom of God has come upon you."
>
> In Luke 11:19,20 Christ definitely associates Himself
blasphemy
> with the power
> of God,
So did Moses.
But the rabbis do NOT say that Moses was God.
This is just OFF SCALE nonsense.
> a theme also arising when Jesus spoke about John the Baptist
> in Matthew 11:9 -
>
> "But what did you go out to see? A prophet? Yes, I say to you, and
> more than a prophet. For this is he of whom it is written, 'Behold, I
> will send My messenger before Your face, who will prepare Your way
> before You'" -
>
> Paraphrasing Malachai 3:1,
>
> "Behold, I will send My messenger,
> And he will prepare the way before Me,"
>
> It is clear Jesus was explaining John the Baptist was the messenger,
> and Himself the God incarnate.
The consequences of this lie were hundreds of years of anti-
Semitism and the Holocaust.
There are two SPECIFIC reasons why Mohammed was sent:
To correct the errors of BOTH Jewish AND Christian theology
concerning 1) the Revelation and Doctrine of the "resurrection
of the dead" and 2) the identity of Jesus. (Jews deny that Jesus
was the 'M'essiah, while the Christians claim that Jesus was
GOD. BOTH the Jews and the Christians are in error in this
regard.)
>
> Again in Luke 16:16 Jesus indicates a theological shift enacted
> through John the Baptist:
>
> "The law and the prophets were until John. Since that time the
> kingdom of God has been preached..."
>
> Some of the statements Jesus made infuriated people as blasphemous,
> though they would not be so if He were the Son of God, such as John
> 8:54-59:
>
> "Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was
> glad."
> Then the Jews said to Him, "You are not yet fifty years old, and have
> You seen Abraham?"
> Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was,
> I AM."
You would have to read Krishnamurti, perhaps, to understand the
consciousness which is beyond time and space.
This knowledge is lacking because the religious officials would lose
too much money were this information to be made known.
The linear consciousness is such that the ONLY conclusion it can
come to--based upon its fundamental duality--is that someone who
says what Jesus said is either psychotic or God.
BOTH of these conclusions are in error.
Jesus was merely expressing the same kind of consciousness that
Krishnamurti talks about.
>
> Then they took up stones to throw at Him...
>
> My impression is that when Jesus spoke of His "Day,"
WRONG. WRONG. AND WRONG.
This has to do with the resolution of the fundamental conflicts
of the linear consciousness under the force of the consciousness
of the Knowledge of Truth
> while He used
> past tense it was actually a prophecy of Abraham's reaction to the
> Second Coming.
NONONONONONONONONO.
Abraham had the same quality of consciousness that Jesus
had.
> Christ confessing to have existed prior to Abraham
> speaks at least of reincarnation, if not divinity through being
> conscious enough to recall that far back.
The Revelation of the "resurrection of the dead" consists of
the Revelation of the Memory of Creation--something which
Moses experienced (see Genesis 2:7)--and the revelation
of the memories of previous lives.
This does NOT mean that the person who receives this
Revelation of the Memory of Creation is God.
In fact, the Knowledge Revealed through this Memory
establishes with CERTAINTY that NO such possibility
exists.
In other words, there are few people in the world who have
known with such absolute CERTAINTY that he is NOT God
than Moses, Jesus and Mohammed.
Yet Jesus is accused of being precisely the OPPOSITE
of the Knowledge he received through Revelation.
> Jesus often amazed His
> interrogators, as in Matthew 22/ Mark 12/ Luke 20, where the Sadducees
> attempted to debunk resurrection by asking Jesus to which of seven
> brothers a woman would be married if each one died in succession,
> passing her down according to law -
>
> Jesus answered and said to them, "Is this not why you err - because
> you know neither the Scriptures nor the power of God? The sons of
> this age marry and are given in marriage. But those who are counted
> worthy to attain that age, and the resurrection from the dead, neither
> marry nor are given in marriage, nor can they die anymore, for they
> are equal to the angels and are sons of God,
"SONS OF GOD".
Anyone who receives the Revelation of the Memory of Creation is
this "son of God".
Mohammed, having received this Revelation, was WELL-AWARE
of the inherent difficulties in conveying such Knowledge to illiterate
and unsophisticated people.
It is STILL a problem, judging on the basis of the responses I
have received on these newsgroups.
> being sons of the
> resurrection. But even Moses showed in the burning bush passage that
> the dead are raised when he called the Lord 'the God of Abraham, the
> God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.' For He is not the God of the
> dead but of the living, for all live to Him. You are therefore
> greatly mistaken."
>
> The response seemed to satisfy many,
Not REALLY.
It made a great impression on those who understood what the
answer signified.
The majority were absolutely CLUELESS of what was even being
talked about.
> although perhaps on a surface
> level: the entity identifying itself as the God of three deceased men
> only raises their names, so the connection to resurrection is so
> tenuous as to suggest sarcasm; it is also interesting to note that the
> entity could probably not make a claim to being the God to any human
> prior to Abraham, such as Adam or Noah, since It became the God of the
> Iraelites through the bargain entered into by Abram alone.
Weird. Bizarre.
>
>
> "Also I say to you, whoever acknowledges Me
blasphemy
> before men, him the Son of
> Man also will acknowledge before the angels of God. But he who denies
> Me
blasphemy.
> before men will be denied before the angels of God."
And claiming that Jesus is God is, in fact, a DENIAL of the identity
of Jesus as the "Son of man".
>
>
> Because Jesus blessed Peter with the "keys to the kingdom of heaven"
> when he acknowledged Jesus was the Son of the living God, this is
> probably the confession regarded in Luke 12:8-9 required to be
> welcomed by the angels; by corollary, denial of Christ's divinity
> could cut one off from the possibility of attaining heaven.
Precisely the OPPOSITE is the case....
Thus demonstrating why Mohammed had to be sent to correct
these errors and why this current warfare is a RELIGIOUS
warfare between Judaeo-Christian civilization and Islamic
civilization.
The greedy Christian religious officials and their WITLESS,
idolatrous followers will NOT acknowledge that Jesus is
not GOD until this civilization has been brough to the
very brink of ANNIHILATION.
NO argument can convince them.
NONE.
Not the argument of Mohammed or Moses or Isaiah or
Daniel.
Not even the words of Jesus himself are capable of
STOPPING the TONGUES of the blood-thirsty
Christian theologians.
And you have not yet BEGUN to see the consequences
of this...
Although the Holocaust was a preview.
>
> While Jesus was in the Davidic line, a potential King if Israel were
> not under Roman occupation, after feeding the multitudes He escaped a
> movement to enthrone Him (John 6:15), the same way He often slipped
> away from those wishing to stone Him:
>
> Therefore when Jesus perceived that they were about to come and take
> Him by force to make Him king, He departed again to the mountain by
> Himself alone.
>
> In Mark 12:28-34, Jesus reduces
WHAT???????????????????
Maybe you should read the Gospels at least ONCE before you
say this.
> the Ten Commandments down to Two, then
> when a scribe agreed those Two superceded "all the whole burnt
> offerings and sacrifices," He replied, "You are not far from the
> kingdom of God." Presumptuous for a prophet perhaps, but quite
> fitting for a Messiah.
'M'essiah, fine.
But only the Creator is the Messiah.
Read Jeremiah...
And FORGET what you have been told by the Christian
theologians.
> "No disciple is above his teacher; but when perfected, everyone will
> be like his teacher" (Luke 6:40)
>
> Some would think
> They could be
> Ignoring the Saviour's Sermon:
> He told the Parable of the Sower
> To show they were wrong
>
> ...He got into a boat and sat; and the whole multitude stood on the
> shore. Then He
blasphemy
> spoke many things to them in parables, saying: "Behold
> a sower went out to sow. And as he sowed, some seed fell by the
> wayside, and the birds came and devoured them. Some fell on stony
> places, where they did not have much earth, and they immediately
> sprang up because they had no depth of earth. But when the sun was up
> they were scorched, and because they had no root they withered away.
> And some fell among thorns, and the thorns sprang up and choked them.
> But others fell on good dirt and yielded a crop: some a hundredfold,
> some sixty, some thirty...
>
> "Therefore hear the parable of the sower: When anyone hears the word
> of the kingdom, and does not understand it, then the wicked one comes
> and snatches away what was sown in his heart. This is he who received
> seed by the wayside. But he who received seed on the stony places,
> this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy;
> yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when
> tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he
> stumbles. Now he who received seed among the thorns is he who hears
> the word, and the cares of this world and the deceitfulness of riches
> choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful. But he who received seed
> on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who
> indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some
> thirty."
>
> ...Then Jesus sent away the multitude and went into the house. And
> His
blasphemy
> disciples came to Him
blasphemy
> , saying, "Explain to us the parable of the
> weeds in the field."
> He answered and said to them, "He who sows the good seed is the Son of
> Man.
Sure.
The Vision of the "Son of man" conveys the consciousness of the
Knowledge of Truth.
This was received by Moses, Isaiah, Jesus and Mohammed,
among others.
> The field is the world, the good seeds are the sons of the
> kingdom, but the weeds are the sons of the wicked one. The enemy who
> sowed them is the devil, the harvest is the end of the age, and the
> reapers are the angels. Therefore as the weeds are gathered and
> burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of this age. The Son of
> Man will send out HIS angels,
This is a description of the experiences surrounding the Vision.
It is the Creator who Conveys the Vision to the person.
> and they will gather out of His kingdom
> all things that offend, and those who work iniquity, and will cast
> them into the furnace of fire. There will be wailing and the gnashing
> of teeth. Then will the righteous shine forth as the sun in the
> kingdom of their Father." (Matthew 13)
>
> "For herein is the proverb true, 'One sows, another reaps':
> I have sent you to reap that on which you have not labored.
> Others have labored, and you have entered into their labors."
> (John 4:37,38)
I suggest you desist speaking of things of which you have NO
Knowledge.
This is the source of violence and conflict and bloodshed in
this civilization.
Perhaps you think you are CERTAIN of this belief that you
have.
But belief is not KNOWLEDGE.
And this civilization will be up to its NECK in BLOODSHED
before this is understood.
Eagal
THE END OF MARS
The fact that no Californian bridge collapsed on the Beziers date of 5
November proves once again there is no effort by any faction to
manifest my theories as self-fulfilling prophecy: the reason there was
no event can be attributed solely to an error in deriving the
chronology. To repeat what was stated in a previous post, there were
too many temporal variables in the 11 September assault (where
overthrows of commercial planes were committed) to assume the
terrorists had the first plane strike the WTC according to the
astrological conditions discovered beforehand, namely, at the conjunct
of Mercury and the Ascendant, with the Moon void of course between
lunars with Juno and Mars (though this last parameter was only
discussed as a possibility using VI.10, along with Jupiter-Mars): I
had not made the calculation for that day in advance, and there is no
reason to believe anyone else did either (also mine is only a lone
voice on a.p.n, with no media interest); while the perpetrators might
have chosen the date because of its being the anniversary of the Camp
David accord (nothing to do with the great Orleans King of Angoumois),
they could not have been assured of a precise timetable, nor did they
appear to have any motivation to make the Christian seer Nostradamus
(definitely not a Muslim) seem like a genuine prophet.
The purpose of prophecy is ultimately to glorify God and illuminate
His will. The faithless doubt the existence of prophecy; and the
deluded feel that it could be an instrument of evil. Perhaps there
can be some advantage in selective disclosure of certain insights, but
the predictions involving sudden massive fatalities appear designed
for the preservation of life in those cases where enough information
may be gleaned to sufficiently prepare. Examination of the relevant
prophecies should be approached with the same reverence one would hold
for any divinely inspired scripture, and the endeavour respected as an
exercise of a religious practice.
There has been some dispute about whether the bridge warning was
legitimate, with Governor Davis insisting his concern for the welfare
of citizens justified the public announcement. My analysis actually
limited the danger from four bridges down to one, since only one seems
to be destroyed, and that one identifed through various means to
further decrease anxiety. While V.66 is expected to regard the 10
June 2002 annular solar eclipse, it mentions a ruined aqueduct, which
could be that of V.58, equated with the damaged bridge: the aqueduct
damage should precede the ancient vestal edifices (Vestal reign 14 May
2002 superceded by Ceres) which in turn comes before the Sun-Moon
glittering metal fiery cataclysm. The public warning of 2-7 November
included Beziers' 5 Nov, but there is no written connection between
Beziers and the bridge event: so the message could be partially
correct - a bridge to be attacked but the wrong time-window given. If
what was already posted is carefully reviewed, the most likely
chronological key is III.56, wherein between "Beziers" and "bridge"
there is "Plague, thunder and hail at the end of Mars for Paris,"
which should be two events (plague somewhere before this "end of
Mars," then the described weather in Paris for that latter Martian
period).
The Agde date of 10 November from VIII.21 apparently could coincide
with the plague prediction, since three foists carrying infection and
pestilence are said to arrive at Agde's port (3 saints of that city
have their feastday, but the 3 foists bear no faith); then "passing
the bridge," i.e., thereafter the bridge event occurs, as the
biological warfare takes effect killing millions - and the bridge
destruction itself appears as tertiary (the third wave of) resistance.
The anthrax mailings (which began before the 7 October retaliatory
strikes on Afghanistan) do not seem to figure into the predictions at
all, so that the Agde contamination should constitute the secondary
resistance, after the primary 11 Sept attack.
III.56's "end of Mars" should be the period between the Mars-Uranus
conjunct 26 November and its actual end in the current sign as it
enters Pisces 8 December 2001 at 1:37pm PST: the bridge event should
not happen until after this "end for Mars," which is accompanied by an
imperfect Grand Trine in air signs between the Moon, Ceres, and Vesta.
The probability the bridge event will occur would greatly increase if
the Agde prophecy manifests on schedule, and the emphasis on Mars'
transition into Pisces makes that time most critical. The Grand Trine
recalls "Trinacrie" from VIII.84, the poetic term for Sicily, where
the March 2000 eruption of Mt. Etna may have activated this verse (and
II.17), with Paterne as St. Paternus of 15 April or some paternal
(Fatherly) remark (perhaps related to III.29, VI.89)...
Paterne ouira de la Sicile cri,
Tous les aprests du gouffre de Trieste,
Qui s'entendra jusqu'a la Trinacrie,
De tant de voiles fui, fui l'horrible peste.
Paternus will hear from Sicily the cry,
All the preparations for the gulf of Gloom,
Which will make itself known as far as Trinacrie,
With as many sails fled, fled the plague of doom.
Eagal
Which YOU apparently profess to do by accusing people of blasphemy for
explaining Christian doctrine, talking nebulously about obscure
documents you never post quotations from, while denying the validity
of other published texts that are posted with attribution. You seem
as religiously intolerant as the Taliban itself!
You should be picketing the Vatican, not debating me!
I cannot renounce the concept of Christ's divinity, because to me that
is apostasy, but you see fit to continue prosecuting the opposing
view!
You obviously do not know the SCIENTIFIC REASON for the fly-by, which
was to achieve an increase in acceleration by SLOWING THE WORLD DOWN
BY AN INFINITESSIMAL DEGREE: this is the astrophysical phenomenon the
scientists were employing, without concern for its effect upon a
particular region with some shoddy construction practices, because
only a seer could have known!
The speed of Cassini exceeded some comets, and it passed by within a
very short distance to Earth relatively: as speed increases, the
accelerated mass attains a different type of power (Einstein explained
this in his theory of relativity). A similar event occurred when the
Stardust fly-by precipitated the 13 January 2001 El Salvadorean quake,
a date I had alluded to prior as being critical. The Istanbul quake
happened 20.5 hours before Cassini's actual fly-over: this is probably
the time the Earth's rotation began to be significantly affected.
> > but
> > my hypothesis had nothing to do with it: the prophecies informed me of
> > some danger, and were correct beyond any human tampering.
> >
> > About this latest bit regarding the bridge, I was willing to misread
> > bridge to have it be about the past Pentagon damage. But the
> > quatrains offer data in small, disjointed bits and I am really not
> > trying to water down or sanitize the messages. So when I had the
> > bridge remarks I could not explain, and the Beziers date of 5
> > November, then the bridge warning coincidently came out, I simply
> > looked for other mentions of a bridge event which also contained
> > potential references to this timeframe. The terrorists do not need
> > anyone to give them prophetic permission to perform their atrocities;
> > they have spread anthrax through the mail without a specific
> > prediction about that. But if I did not use my abilities to warn
> > readers about something which would kill them, I would feel somewhat
> > responsible:
>
> Have you never stopped to think that maybe the reason why you
> were not given more specific information is that this civilization is
> so PERVERSE that it does not DESERVE to be told this infor-
> mation?
>
> This is certainly something that I have HAD to consider over the past
> 25 years.
I did not have to be "given" anything we do not all already have.
I simply "dropped the ball," not looking at Mars after its retrograde,
or trying to solve the enigma of the Orleans King.
This was my personal failing, and I realize that.
But I can also see it is all part of a greater plan, which will
ultimately lead to a period of peace and unity at least for the
worthy; it is not my province to judge who is worthy - but people
demonstrate that through their own actions, with or without the
availability of prophetic resources.
Then he said to me, "Write: 'Blessed are those who are called to the
marriage supper of the Lamb!'"
And he said to me, "These are the true sayings of God."
And I fell at his feet to worship him.
But he said to me, "See that you do not do that! I am your fellow
servant, and of your brethren who have the testimony of Jesus.
Worship God! FOR THE TESTIMONY OF JESUS IS THE SPIRIT OF PROPHECY."
(Revelations 19:9,10)
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
Look.
The Koran assesses that Christian theology is blasphemy.
And it is no wonder: Mohammed, like Jesus and Moses and Isaiah
before him, received the Vision of the "Son of man" and the
Revelation of the "resurrection of the dead"
Moses, Isaiah, Jesus and Mohammed ALL contradict Christian doctrine.
But you TWIST their words with the teaching of Paul.
Don't blame ME for the idolatry of Christianity.
> talking nebulously about obscure
> documents you never post quotations from, while denying the validity
> of other published texts that are posted with attribution. You seem
> as religiously intolerant as the Taliban itself!
Yours is a dualistic consciousness.
ANYTHING which threatens the structure of your normal human con-
sciousness you immediately and reflexively reject as EVIL.
Anyone who does not agree with the blasphemy and idolatry of
Christian theology--anyone who does not worship Jesus as GOD--
in in your eyes the manifestation of EVIL.
This was the source of the Holocaust and the 'deicide' charge;
and this is the source of this "Operation Infinite Justice"
Crusade against Islam (and JUDAISM...just WAIT.)
And NO amount of marketing by public relations agencies or
movie stars and movie studios will change this fact.
You are PISSED that Jews and Muslims do not worship YOUR god.
And there will be HELL to pay until they DO:
Your only solution to this is that Jews AND Muslims
be EXTERMINATED...
Which, of course, will be the ULTIMATE consequence of this
"Operation Infinite Justice".
(Do you actually think that the Muslim countries will not
retaliate against ISRAEL for what the United States is doing?
Thus, "Operation Infinite Justice" is ALSO a cover for anti-
SEMITISM as well....
But you don't want to HEAR that, do you?)
>
> You should be picketing the Vatican, not debating me!
> I cannot
Wanna make a bet?
"Cannot" is a VERY strong word.
> renounce the concept of Christ's divinity, because to me that
> is apostasy,
Sure.
Paul word turn over in his grave.
Besides, you might wind up in your metaphysical fantasyland
called "hell".
You NEED to believe this FAIRY-TALE to get into this never-never
land you call "heaven".
(Oh, by the way, Muslim Fundamentalists slaughter INNOCENT
people for precisely the SAME reason...they want to get into the
Muslim equivalent of your never-never land...
In other words, you do not disagree with these Muslim Funda-
mentalists NEARLY as much as you THINK you do.)
And I suppose you will insist that you are 'free' to choose whether
or not to believe that Jesus is God...
When the reward for this is "heaven" and the punishment for
disbelief is "hell".
> but you see fit to continue prosecuting the opposing
> view!
As would Jesus and Isaiah and Moses and Mohammed.
You and Paul and Hitler and Bin Laden are compatriots.
>
> > > The fact is that these prophecies are being fulfilled whether or not
> > > anyone becomes aware of it.
> >
> > Certainly an interesting comment.
> >
> > And it pertains to the fractal Prophecies of Daniel 11:45--
> > 12:1 as well.
REMEMBER THIS.
You don't have to BELIEVE that I am the Michael Prophesied by
Daniel...
The Prophecies will be fulfilled ANYWAY.
Just keep your eyes open...
And your mouth SHUT for once.
You might learn something.
Oh shut up.
> for the fly-by, which
> was to achieve an increase in acceleration by SLOWING THE WORLD DOWN
> BY AN INFINITESSIMAL DEGREE:
Sure.
"...And a bee flew around my car, thus pulling me into an adjacent
lane...THAT is what happened, officer. I SWEAR it. It was all
PHYSICS."
> this is the astrophysical phenomenon the
> scientists were employing, without concern for its effect upon a
> particular region with some shoddy construction practices, because
> only a seer could have known!
> The speed of Cassini exceeded some comets, and it passed by within a
> very short distance to Earth relatively: as speed increases, the
> accelerated mass attains a different type of power (Einstein explained
> this in his theory of relativity).
Oh, WOW. And WOW again.
Work out the mathematics, DUMBASS.
(Cassini was flying at a SIGNIFICANT fraction of the velocity of
LIGHT or something? What a MORON you must be.)
The mass of the earth times its acceleration vs. the mass of this
spacecraft times its acceleration...and then the interaction between
these two magnitudes...
Think it might come out to 10^-3200 dynes or something like that.
Just a guess.
> A similar event occurred when the
> Stardust fly-by precipitated the 13 January 2001 El Salvadorean quake,
> a date I had alluded to prior as being critical. The Istanbul quake
> happened 20.5 hours before
BEFORE???????????
> Cassini's actual fly-over:
Certainly this causes you problems.
By the time it actually flew over, it's a goddamned wonder the earth
didn't stop rotating ALTOGETHER.
> this is probably
> the time the Earth's rotation began to be significantly affected.
Yeah, RIGHT.
Here's a RABBIT'S foot.
Put it around your goddamned neck if you get ANTHRAX, NITWIT.
>
>
> > > but
> > > my hypothesis had nothing to do with it: the prophecies informed me of
> > > some danger, and were correct beyond any human tampering.
> > >
> > > About this latest bit regarding the bridge, I was willing to misread
> > > bridge to have it be about the past Pentagon damage. But the
> > > quatrains offer data in small, disjointed bits and I am really not
> > > trying to water down or sanitize the messages. So when I had the
> > > bridge remarks I could not explain, and the Beziers date of 5
> > > November, then the bridge warning coincidently came out, I simply
> > > looked for other mentions of a bridge event which also contained
> > > potential references to this timeframe. The terrorists do not need
> > > anyone to give them prophetic permission to perform their atrocities;
> > > they have spread anthrax through the mail without a specific
> > > prediction about that. But if I did not use my abilities to warn
> > > readers about something which would kill them, I would feel somewhat
> > > responsible:
> >
> > Have you never stopped to think that maybe the reason why you
> > were not given more specific information is that this civilization is
> > so PERVERSE that it does not DESERVE to be told this infor-
> > mation?
> >
> > This is certainly something that I have HAD to consider over the past
> > 25 years.
>
> I did not have to be "given" anything we do not all already have.
Oh, so you are Omniscient AFTER ALL.
>
> I simply "dropped the ball,"
Must have just FORGOTTEN that you are God, huh?
And you are trying your godDAMNEDEST to be one of those who are
called...
You poor BASTARD.
>
> And he said to me, "These are the true sayings of God."
> And I fell at his feet to worship him.
> But he said to me, "See that you do not do that! I am your fellow
> servant, and of your brethren who have the testimony of Jesus.
> Worship God! FOR THE TESTIMONY OF JESUS IS THE SPIRIT OF PROPHECY."
Well, no WONDER you are so obsessed with this.
But you do not define Prophecy.
Prophecy is not MERELY the prediction of events in the space-time
Reality.
It also includes Knowledge of the structure of the normal human
consciousness and its relationship and interaction to and with
Revealed Truth and the consciousness of the Knowledge of Truth...
Something with which you have NO acquaintance.
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
ization's "Operation Infinite Justice" Crusade against Islam is being
intensified...
Which, of course, is in SPECIFIC fulfillment of the fractal Prophecy
of Daniel 11:45:
The "king of the South" being a symbol for both the United States and
the normal 'ego' consciousness; and the "king of the North" being ap-
plied, in this case, to Afghanistan, and symbolizing the 'unconscious'.
(And, as I have said before, the conduct of this war is beginning to
look more and more like a full-blown psychosis on the part of the gov-
ernment of the United States.)
And, according to the Western media, there is NO alternative to this:
The ONLY way of combatting the terrorism originating in the Middle
East is through MILITARY means, cutting off their finances, or through
the application of diplomatic and financial PRESSURE.
The Truth of the matter, of course, is that this 'war against terror-
ism' will NEVER succeed unless there is at least a DIALOGUE between
Judaeo-Christian civilization and Islamic civilization--or, even
BETTER, a TRIALOGUE between Judaeo-Christian civilization, Islamic
civilization, and Eastern civilization.
To be successful, however, such a dialogue or trialogue CANNOT or-
iginate in the dualistic consciousness.
On the contrary, the basis for any genuine Peace on this planet can
only originate in--for Judaeo-Christian-Islamic civilization--a return
to the fundamental Doctrines of the Torah, the Prophets, the Gospels
and the Koran; and--for Eastern civilization--a turning toward the
Teaching of the Buddha and other esoteric traditions stressing the
role of the "observing consciousness" in escaping the fundamental
dualities, conflicts and violence inherent to the normal 'ego' con-
sciousness.
There is, however, a problem:
The media officials, the politicians, and the religious officials--
precisely like the HAL 9000 computer in "2001--A Space Odyssey"--
are fuly prepared to sacrifice human civilzation ITSELF in the
DESPERATE attempt to preserve the 'intelligence' (and consciousness)
of the normal human personality as the Highest Intelligence in the
universe...
Which, of course, is in FLAGRANT contradiction of not only ALL of
the Revelations received by Moses, Jesus and Mohammed; but also the
Teachings of the Eastern religions.
The choice that human civilization must now make is clear:
PURSUE this warfare between Judaeo-Christian civilization and Islamic
civilization resulting in the near-annihilation of this ENTIRE civil-
ization...
OR pursue a path of sincere and serious dialogue leading to genuine
Peace on the basis of the fundamental Truths Revealed to prophets,
teachers, and seers of EVERY culture and people (and most religions)
on this planet since the very origin of this civilization.
As Moses would say: "Choose LIFE so that you and your children will
LIVE..."
See my web page for a detailed description of the Knowledge that has
been rejected and the Teaching that has been forgotten by the Jewish,
Christian and Muslim religious officials in fulfillment of Hosea 4:
4-6 and Daniel 12:9-10.
Michael Cecil (Daniel 12:1, Sura 2:98 of the Koran, Column XVII of the
"Scroll of the War of the Sons of Light")
Sarai/Sarah-->Mohammed-->Elizabeth Cecil (Daniel 12:9)
Web page on Suppressed Dead Sea Scrolls and Nag Hammadi Codices
Research at:
JS
Seek medication.
"(28SW2) Michael Cecil" <mj...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:3BEB8644...@earthlink.net...
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
JS wrote:
> Oh my god, would you SHUT YOUR CRAZY TRAP!
>
> Seek medication.
Copied.
Eagal
COULD BE BOLOGNA...
While V.66 is expected to regard the 10 June 2002 annular solar
eclipse, it mentions a ruined aqueduct, which could be that of V.58,
equated with the damaged bridge: the aqueduct damage should precede
the ancient vestal edifices (Vestal reign 14 May 2002 superceded by
Ceres) which in turn comes before the Sun-Moon glittering metal fiery
cataclysm. The public warning of 2-7 November included Beziers' 5
Nov, but there is no written connection between Beziers and the bridge
event: so the message could be partially correct - a bridge to be
attacked but the wrong time-window given. If what was already posted
is carefully reviewed, the most likely chronological key is III.56,
wherein between "Beziers" and "bridge" there is "Plague, thunder and
hail at the end of Mars for Paris," which should be two events (plague
somewhere before this "end of Mars," then the described weather in
Paris for that latter Martian period).
The Agde date of 10 November from VIII.21 apparently could coincide
with the plague prediction, since three foists carrying infection and
pestilence are said to arrive at Agde's port (3 saints of that city
have their feastday, but the 3 foists bear no faith); then "passing
the bridge," i.e., thereafter the bridge event occurs, as the
biological warfare takes effect killing millions - and the bridge
destruction itself appears as tertiary (the third wave of) resistance.
The anthrax mailings (which began before the 7 October retaliatory
strikes on Afghanistan) may not figure into the predictions at all, so
that the contamination from Agde should constitute the secondary
resistance, after the primary 11 Sept attack.
No manifestation of any new contagion or epidemic onset in the US 10
November again demonstrates that imperfect interpretations will be
proven incorrect rather than artificially fulfilled in response to the
theory being publicized. Even if the Agde date is valid, it is
probably another marker: VIII.21 does not say Agde but "the port from
Agde," implying some astrological principle must be applied to acquire
the critical date itself; and IV.94 likewise has contamination "from"
Agatha. While Venus and Mercury are post-conjunct 10 Nov, Pallas and
Chiron are pre-conjunct (about a degree apart), which takes place 14
November 2pm EST @ 27,12' Sagittarius; so examining possible saintly
references, it is feastday for St. Jucundus, bishop of Bologna (died
circa 485). There are no less than 16 days on which Bologna saints
are honored, yet only one usage in the verses, in IX.13, whose last
two lines are -
Deux de Modene truculent de Bologne,
Mis decouverts par feu de Burancois
Two like Modena cruel for Bologna,
Set discovered towards fire in Whirlwind
The Modena comment may not regard the city at all: two other saints
are associated with 14 Nov, whose names somewhat resemble the word -
these are Sts. Modanic (bishop of Aberdeen, 8th century) and Montan
(hermit of Lorraine); perhaps this is how that particular Bologna date
is distinguished. Another astrological component is that the Moon
will have joined the Sun, Venus and Mercury in Scorpio.
III.56's "end of Mars" should be the period between the Mars-Uranus
conjunct 26 November and its actual end in the current sign as it
enters Pisces 8 December 2001 at 1:37pm PST: the bridge event should
not happen until after this "end for Mars," which is accompanied by an
imperfect Grand Trine in air signs between the Moon, Ceres, and Vesta.
The probability the bridge event will occur would greatly increase if
the Agde prophecy manifests on schedule, and the emphasis on Mars'
transition into Pisces makes that time most critical. The Grand Trine
recalls "Trinacrie" from VIII.84, the poetic term for Sicily, where
March 2000 eruption of Mt. Etna may have activated this verse (and
II.17), with Paterne as St. Paternus of 15 April or some paternal
(Fatherly) remark (perhaps related to III.29, VI.89).
Paterne ouira de la Sicile cri,
Tous les aprests du gouffre de Trieste,
Qui s'entendra jusqu'a la Trinacrie,
De tant de voiles fui, fui l'horrible peste.
Paternus will hear from Sicily the cry,
All the preparations for the gulf of Gloom,
Which will make itself known as far as Trinacrie,
With as many sails fled, fled the plague of doom.
Line 1 appears to continue a theme from VIII.81, lines 3 & 4 -
De la Sicile viendra l'emotion,
Troubler l'emprise a Philip tributaire
From Sicily will come the disturbance,
To trouble the enterprise tributary to Philip.
There were two dramatic eruptions of Sicily's Mt. Etna 22 and 24 March
2000; this can be verified at
http://www.geo.mtu.edu/~boris/ETNA_news.html
Then 31 March 2000 Mt. Usu on Japan, which can be considered tributary
to the Philippines, erupted for the first time in 22 years, as if it
had been awakened by Etna. Then there was St. Paternus' feastday of
15 April, followed by Etna erupting again on the 16th, fulfilling line
1 of VIII.84 - moreover, Usu erupted again on 17 April 2000, the day
after!
The final line about sails fled could reflect the fact that 8 December
2001 is the first time since 14 November 2001 that there will be three
celestial bodies advanced into new signs up to about a degree: Vesta
will be retrograding in the Grand Trine, so it does not count; but the
new Pisces Mars, Moon @ 0,59' Libra, and Ceres @ 1,07' Aquarius
qualify as the three fled sails. Thus the gulf of VIII.84 and
probably also V.84 should refer to the bridge event.
V.99 line 4 explains its predictions occur "When Rome will have the
old British chief," which could refer to the 5 May 2000 alignment
being on the anniversary of the 1527 sack of Rome; and conversely, the
similar fourth line of VI.20, "Then a new Leopard will have Rome,"
might hint at the Solar (Leo-oriented) sceptre arriving 21 May 2002.
So the latter line may be about more than a papal change, conveying
danger to the city of Rome just as a strong English presence was
threatened during the previous period.
* * * * * * *
Regarding ancient chronologies, the elaborate apocryphal text covering
the first ten generations provides a few compellingly presented
numerical details which call into question the condensed version
offered in Genesis, which consists mainly of this data. While both
texts agree Adam died at 930, the apocryphal version adds that the
patriarchal line at the time extended to Mahalaleel, who was then 100:
using Genesis, one would be certain Mahalaleel was 535 when Adam died.
The two sources again agree that Seth died at 912 (though only
Genesis has him born when Adam is 130), but the more complete (and
obscure) text indicates at that time the line extended to Henoch, who
was then 20 years old: Genesis would have one believing Henoch would
have then been 420, 55 years past his ascension into heaven at 365.
The apocryphal version has Enos dying at 985 instead of Genesis' 905.
Another discrepancy with Jared's death: at 989 apocryphal versus 962
in Genesis; then Noah is revealed to be 360 - ironically, using the
Genesis version alone one would have Noah 366 years old when Jared
dies, but over 400 years earlier than using the apocryphal numbers.
The apocryphal summation would have Adam living from 0-930, Seth from
130-1042, exact timing for Enos and Cainan impossible (265 Genesis
years for 700, or 160 Genesis years for 595 if Seth begetting Enos at
105 is accepted), Mahalaleel from 830-1725, Jared perhaps from
895-1884 (using both texts - and Jared begetting Henoch at 162 appears
to have been transposed from 126), Henoch from 1022-1387 (ascended,
not died), Mathuselah and Lamech again indeterminable with precision
(with 434 Genesis years during a 502-year gap), and Noah born in 1524
(and begat his three sons at 500). This would make the Deluge circa
2125.
God's promise to Adam of sending His Word in the flesh after five
thousand five hundred years have passed could be demonstrated to equal
Christ's time through a combination of the final portion of Nicodemus'
apocryphal gospel, and Nostradamus' Epistle paragraph 10:
"And we found the account of creation, and at what time He made the
heaven and the earth and the first man Adam, and that from thence to
the flood, were two thousand, two hundred and twelve years. And from
the flood to Abraham, nine hundred and twelve..."
"Abraham...lequel a ete souverain Astrologue selon aucuns, il inventa
premier les lettres Chaldaiques: apres vint Moyse environ cinq cent
quinze ou seize ans..."
"Abraham...who according to some had been a first-rate Astrologer and
invented the Chaldean alphabet: Moses came about 515 or 516 years
later..."
"And from Moses to David the king, five hundred and ten."
"Puis apres entre le temps de David, et le temps de notre Sauveur et
Redempteur Iesus-Christ, ne de l'unique Vierge, ont ete (selon aucuns
Chronographes) mille trois cent cinquante ans..."
"From the time of David to that of our Saviour and Redeemer, Jesus
Christ, born of the unique Virgin, there were (according to some
chronographs) 1,350 years..."
2212 + 912 + 516 + 510 + 1350 = 5500
"God said to Adam, 'I have ordained on this earth days and years, and
thou and thy seed shall dwell and walk in it, until the days and years
are fulfilled, when I shall send the Word that created thee, and
against which thou hast transgressed, the Word that made thee come out
of the garden, and that raised thee when thou wast fallen. Yea, the
Word that will again save thee when the five days and a half are
fulfilled.' But when Adam heard these words from God, and of the
great five days and a half, he did not understand the meaning of them.
For Adam was thinking that there would be but five days and a half
for him, to the end of the world. And Adam wept, and prayed to God to
explain it to him. Then God in His mercy for Adam who was made after
His own image and similitude, explained to him, that these were 5,000
and 500 years, and how One would then come and save him and his seed."
"Then the Word of God came to Adam, and said to him... 'As regards the
Water of Life thou seekest, it will not be granted thee this day, but
on the day that I shall shed My blood upon thy head in the land of
Golgotha. For My blood shall be the Water of Life unto thee, at that
time, and not to thee alone, but unto all those of thy seed who shall
believe in Me, that it be unto them for rest for ever.'"
[Adam & Eve 3, 42]
* * * * * * *
Then the angel went from Adam, and seized Satan at the opening of the
cave, and stripped him of the feint he had assumed, and brought him in
his own hideous form to Adam and Eve, who were afraid of him when they
saw him. And the angel said to Adam, "This hideous form has been his
ever since God made him fall from heaven. He could not have come near
you in it: therefore did he transform himself into an angel of light."
Satan said unto Adam, "Thinkest thou, that when I have spoken to one
about anything, I shall ever bring it to him or fulfill my word? Not
so. For I myself have never even thought of obtaining what I asked.
Therefore did I fall, and did I make you fall by that for which I
myself fell; and with you also, whoever accepts my counsel, falls
thereby. But now, O Adam, by reason of thy fall thou art under my
rule, and I am king over thee; because thou hast hearkened to me, and
hast transgressed against thy God. Neither will there be any
deliverance from my hands until the day promised thee by thy God...
Inasmuch as we do not know the day agreed upon with thee by thy God,
nor the hour in which thou shalt be delivered, for that reason we will
multiply war and murder upon thee and thy seed after thee. This is
our will and our good pleasure, that we may not leave one of the sons
of men to inherit our orders in heaven. For as to our abode, O Adam,
it is in burning fire; and we will not cease our evil doing, no, not
one day nor one hour..."
[Adam & Eve 27, 57]
Again I looked with my eyes, while sleeping, and surveyed heaven
above. And beheld a single star fell from heaven, which being raised
up, ate and fed among those cows. After that, I perceived other large
and black cows, and beheld all of them changed their stalls and
pastures, while their young began to lament one with another. Again I
looked in my vision and surveyed heaven, when behold I saw many stars
which descended, and projected themselves from heaven to where the
first star was, into the midst of those young ones, while the cows
were with them, feeding in the midst of them. I looked at and
observed them, when behold, they all protruded their parts of shame
like horses, and began to ascend the young cows, all of whom became
pregnant, and brought forth elephants, camels, and asses. At these
all the cows were alarmed and terrified, when they began biting with
their teeth, swallowing and striking with their horns. They began
also to devour the cows, and behold all the children of the earth
trembled, shook with terror at them, and suddenly fled away.
Again I perceived them, when they began to strike and to swallow each
other, and the earth cried out. Then I raised my eyes to heaven, and
saw in a vision, that, behold, there came forth from heaven as it were
the likeness of white men. One came forth from thence, and three with
him. Those three, who came forth last, seized me up from the
generations of the earth, elevated me to a high station. Then they
shewed me a lofty tower on the earth, while every hill became
diminished. And they said: "Remain here, until thou perceivest what
shall come upon those elephants, camels, and asses, upon the stars,
and upon all the cows."
Then I looked at that one of the four white men, who came forth first.
He seized the first star which fell down from heaven. And, binding
it hand and foor, he cast it into a valley, a valley narrow, deep,
stupendous, and gloomy. Then one of them drew his sword, and gave it
to the elephants, camels, and asses, who began to strike each other.
And the whole earth shook on account of them. And when I looked in
the vision, behold, one of those four angels, who came forth, hurled
from heaven, collected together, and took all the great stars, whose
parts of shame resembled those of horses, and binding them all hand
and foot, cast them into the cavities of the earth. Then one of those
four went to the white cows, and taught them a mystery. While the cow
was trembling, it was born, and became a man, and fabricated for
himself a large ship. In this he dwelt, and three cows dwelt with him
in that ship, which covered them.
Again I lifted my eyes up towards heaven, and saw a lofty roof. Above
it were seven cataracts, which poured forth on a certain village much
water. Again I looked, and behold there were mountains open on the
earth in that large village. The water began to boil up, and rose
over the earth, so that the village was not to be seen, while its
whole soil was covered with water. Much water was over it, darkness,
and clouds. Then I surveyed the height of the water, and it was
elevated above the village. It flowed over the village, and stood
higher than the earth. Then all the cows which were collected there,
while I looked upon them, were drowned, swallowed up, and destroyed in
the water. But the ship floated above it. All the cows, elephants,
the camels, and the asses, were drowned on the earth, and all cattle.
Nor could I perceive them. Neither were they able to get out, but
perished, and sunk into the deep.
[Henoch 85-88]
On the sixth day I commanded My wisdom to create man from seven
consistencies: one, his flesh from the earth; two, his blood from the
dew; three, his eyes from the sun; four, his bones from stone; five,
his intelligence from the swiftness of the angels and from cloud; six,
his veins and his hair from the grass of the earth; seven, his soul
from My breath and from the wind... I called his name Adam, and showed
him the two ways, the light and the darkness, and I told him: "This is
good, and that bad," that I should learn whether he has love towards
Me, or hatred, that it be clear which in his race love Me. For I have
seen his nature, but he has not seen his own nature, therefore through
not seeing he will sin worse, and I said, "After sin what is there but
death?" And I put sleep into him and he fell asleep. And I took from
hima rib, and created him a wife, that death should come to him by his
wife, and I took his last word and called her name mother, that is to
say, Eva.
Adam has life on earth, and I created a garden in Eden in the east,
that he should observe the testament and keep the command. I made the
heavens open to him, that he should see the angels singing the song of
victory, and the gloomless light. And he was continually in paradise,
and the devil understood that I wanted to create another world,
because Adam was lord on earth, to rule and control it... I said to
him: "Earth thou art, and into the earth whence I took thee thou shalt
go, and I will not ruin thee, but send thee whence I took thee. Then
I can again take thee at My second coming." And I blessed all My
creatures visible and invisible. And Adam was five and a half hours
in paradise. And I blessed the seventh day, which is Sabbath, on
which he rested from all his works. And I appointed the eighth day
also, that the eighth day should be the first-created after my work...
[God revealing secrets of Creation, Henoch 30-33]
* * *
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word
was God. He was in the beginning with God... And the Word became
flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the
only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth.
* * *
He came to a city of Samaria which is called Sychar, near the plot of
ground that Jacob gave to his son Joseph. Now Jacob's well was there.
Jesus therefore, being wearied from His journey, sat thus by the
well. It was about the sixth hour. A woman of Samaria came to draw
water. Jesus said to her, "Give me a drink." For His disciples had
gone away into the city to buy food. Then the woman of Samaria said
to Him, "How is it that you, being a Jew, ask a drink from me, a
Samaritan woman?" For the Jews have no dealings with Samaritans.
Jesus answered and said to her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who
it is who says to you, 'Give Me a drink,' you would have asked Him,
and He would have given you living water."
The woman said to Him, "Sir, you have nothing to draw with, and the
well is deep. Where then do you get that 'living water'? Are you
greater than our father Jacob, who gave us the well, and drank from it
himself, as well as his sons and his livestock?" Jesus answered and
said to her, "Whoever drinks of this water will thirst again, but
whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will never thirst.
But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of
water springing up into everlasting life." The woman said to him,
"Sir, give me this water, that I may not thirst, nor come here to
draw." Jesus said to her, "Go, call your husband, and come here."
The woman answered and said, "I have no husband." Jesus said to her,
"You have well said, 'I have no husband,' for you have had five
husbands, and the one whom you now have is not your husband; in that
you spoke truly."
The woman said to him, "Sir, I perceive that you are a prophet. Our
fathers worshiped on this mountain, and you Jews say that in Jerusalem
is the place where one ought to worship." Jesus said to her, "Woman,
believe me, the hour is coming when you will neither on this mountain,
nor in Jerusalem, worship the Father. You worship what you do not
know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews. But the
hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the
Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship
Him. God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit
and truth." The woman said to Him, "I know that Messiah is coming,
who is called Christ. When He comes, He will tell us all things."
Jesus said to her, "I who speak to you am He."
And at this point His disciples came, and they marveled that He talked
with a woman; yet no one said, "What do You seek?" or, "Why are You
talking with her?" The woman then left her waterpot, went her way
into the city, and said to the men, "Come, see a man who told me all
things that I ever did. Could this be the Christ?"
* * *
"...You have sent to John, and he has borne witness to the truth...
He was the burning and shining lamp, and you were willing for a time
to rejoice in his light. But I have a greater witness than John's:
for the works which the Father has given Me to finish - the very works
that I do - bear witness of Me, that the Father has sent Me... You
search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life;
and these are they which testify of Me. But you are not willing to
come to Me that you may have life."
* * *
Then Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, Moses did not
give you the bread from heaven, but My Father gives you the true bread
from heaven. For the bread of God is He who comes down from heaven
and gives life to the world." Then they said to him, "Lord, give us
this bread always." And Jesus said to them, "I am the bread of life.
He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall
never thirst... For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own
will, but the will of Him who sent Me."
* * *
"...My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. And
I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish... My Father,
who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to
snatch them out of My Father's hand. I and the Father ARE ONE."
Then the Jews took us stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered,
"Many good works I have shown you from My Father. For which of these
works do you stone Me?"
The Jews answered Him, saying, "For a good work we do not stone you,
but for blasphemy, and because you, being a man, make yourself God!"
Jesus answered them, "Is it not written in your law, 'I said, "You are
gods"'?..."
[Gospel of John 1:1,2,14; 4:5-29; 5:33-40; 6:32-38; 10:27-34]
But the elders of the Jews answered, and said to Jesus, "What shall we
look to? In the first place, we know this concerning thee, that thou
wast born through fornication; secondly, that upon the account of thy
birth the infants were slain in Bethlehem; thirdly, that thy father
and mother fled into Egypt, because they could not trust their own
people."
Some of the Jews who stood by spake more favourably, "We cannot say
that he was born through fornication; but we know that his mother Mary
was betrothed to Joseph, and so he was not born through fornication."
Then Pilate said to the Jews who affirmed him to be born through
fornication, "This you account is not true, seeing there was a
betrothment, as they testify who are of your own nation."
Annas and Caiaphas spake to Pilate, "All this multitude of people is
to be regarded, who cry out, that he was born through fornication, and
is a conjuror; but they who deny him to be born through fornication,
are his proselytes and disciples"... Then replied Eleazer, and
Asterius, and Antonius, and James, Caras and Samuel, Isaac and
Phinees, Crispus and Agrippa, Annas and Judas, "We are not proselytes,
but children of Jews, and speak the truth, and were present when Mary
was betrothed"... Then said Annas and Caiaphas to Pilate, "Those
twelve men will not believe that we know him to be basely born, and to
be a conjuror, although he pretends that he is the son of God, and a
king: which we are so far from believing, that we tremble to hear."
Then Pilate commanded every one to go out except the twelve men who
said he was not born through fornication, and Jesus to withdraw at a
distance, and said to them, "Why have the Jews a mind to kill Jesus?"
They answered him, "They are angry because he wrought cures on the
Sabbath day." Pilate said, "Will they kill him for a good work?"
They say unto him, "Yes, Sir."
[Gospel of Nicodemus]
Peter Lemesurier
>THE PORT FROM AGDE
>COULD BE BOLOGNA...
>
>
>While V.66 is expected to regard the 10 June 2002 annular solar
>eclipse, it mentions a ruined aqueduct, which could be that of V.58,
>equated with the damaged bridge: the aqueduct damage should precede
>the ancient vestal edifices...
If you email Mario he'll send you a facsimile of an account of the
catastrophic September 1557 flooding in Nimes on which IX.9, X.6 and
various other verses are fairly obviously based. V.66, first published
in September 1557, seems too late for that -- so it presumably has to
be based on the similar floods of 1399 or 1403...
You'll be astonished at the almost exact correspondences.
V.58 is clearly based on a historical incident on the ancient Roman
Pont du Gard, a little way to the north.
But who knows what future events they might apply to?
Meanwhile, care to tell us which bit of this long spiel you actually
want us to read? Wouldn't it be better to feed it to us a bit at a
time? ;)
--
Peter
Eagal
ON THE WAY TO PARIS
The crash of American Airlines Flight 587 on 12 November not having
been foreseen, as well as the air disasters of 4 and 8 October not
having been discerned through the verses, prompted a closer look, more
research, and further postulations. But after providing this
information, other matters involving the near future will also be
presented...
Siberian Airlines Flight SB 1812 crashed into the Black Sea near Sochi
4 October, with 78 dead, flying from Tel Aviv to Novosibirsk; the
Tupolev-154 turns out to have been accidentally struck by a wayward
S200 rocket fired during a Ukrainian military exercise. Despite
initial denials any missiles had gone astray, shrapnel remnants of
the rocket were discovered, and Ukrainian President Leonid Kuchma
finally accepted the missile theory propounded by Russia, admitting
fault but adding, "Bigger mistakes have been made."
There was a dense fog at Milan's Linate Airport 8 October, and ground
radar was inoperable; as a Scandinavian Airlines Systems plane taxied
for take-off, a MD-87 Cessna failed to circle as instructed and
instead crossed the runway into the path of the large jet which was
traveling around 200 mph. The airliner ran into a hangar, collapsing
a pillar and roof, after its collision with the smaller plane. 118
died during this event, which was attributed to human error.
The 4 and 8 October crashes arriving around the 7 October retaliatory
air strikes upon Afghanistan might be the subject of VI.31:
Roi trouvera ce qu'il desirait tant,
Quand le Prelat sera repris a tort;
Reponse au Duc le rendra malcontent,
Qui dans Milan mettra plusieurs a mort.
The King will find that which he sorely craved,
While the Prelate will be repairing the mistake;
Response to the Duke will render him depraved,
Who within Milan several lives will take.
The King would be Francois 1er for the 11 September attack. But the
Prelate should be the Ukrainian president, apologizing for the 4
October missile error with an admission of fault. Line 3 recalls
VI.46 line 3, wherein the response to the 11 Sept events, which was
the 7 October bombing, causes an unpleasant reaction. Line 4 should
thus regard the literal Milan in Italy as the site of the 8 October
runway collision; if a precise chart is done, Mercury (as the Duke)
should figure prominently. The Milan in line 1 of X.64 could be used
to similar effect, in reverse chronology with Lucca for the poor Luck
(adverse Fortune) of 11 Sept, then Florence for 13 Feb (St. Catherine
de Ricci, El Salvadorean quake coincidence).
Another Black Sea event 4 October could continue the fulfillments of
VI.55, whose third line appears to cryptically encode three events in
2000. "Tripolis" should not mean Libya's Tripoli, but Turkey's
Tirebolu: yet the fufillment may have been the 23 August '00 plane
crash at Bahrain, in the Persian Gulf, since it occurred on the
*third* (i.e., "Tripley") landing attempt (lines 1 & 2 put the
timeframe past 12 June '00 through esoteric means). "Chios" in the
Aegean could predict the ferry sinking at Pharos island 26 September
'00. And "those from Trebizond" could suggest the 25 October Russian
military plane crash at nearby Batumi, on the coast of the Black Sea.
The final line has the Duke taken, probably regarding the fateful
Mercury-Ascendant conjunct of 11 Sept '01, then "Black Sea," perhaps
for the 4 October '01 missile mishap, and lastly, "the city a desert,"
probably intending catastrophe for the great city.
The A-300 Airbus having been inspected 11 November, AA Flight 587
nonetheless inexplicably tore apart mid-air immediately after its
take-off the following day from JFK Airport in NYC, headed for the
Dominican Republic. Three minutes into its ill-fated trip, both
engines and the tail rudder had fallen off, fuel had dropped into
Jamaica Bay, and the plane banked, spiralled, and nosedived into a
residential area of the Rockaway Beach section of Queens, damaging 12
homes. All 260 aboard were killed, along with some on the ground; had
the angle of descent been different, the devastation could have been
much worse. Using the precise time of 9:17am EST, the chart showed
the Moon very close to a Midheaven conjunct (9:21am EST, four minutes
later): moreover, there was a Grand Trine of the Moon, Mars, and
Saturn at the time. 12 November would most likely be encoded as
"Avignon" itself, being the feastday for the city's first bishop, St.
Rufus (died circa 200). I had glossed over the Avignon mention in
line 1 of III.56 - it is obvious in retrospect that Beziers being 5
November for St. Gerald was precisely a week prior: thus the part
written "Avignon and Beziers" is apparently deliberately out of
sequence. But the clearest prediction of this tragedy may be found in
III.93:
Dans Auignon tout le chef de l'empire
Fera arret pour Paris desole:
Tricast tiendra l'Annibalique ire;
Lyon par change sera mal console.
In Avignon the head of the whole empire
Will make a stop on the way to Paris desolation:
Tricast will hold the Hannibalistic ire;
Lion for change will be a poor consolation.
The comment about the chief's attention may reflect the issue of
possible terrorism. Paris again should regard 10 June (2002), St.
Landericus' day. "Tricast," like VIII.84's Trinacrie, is a potential
Great Trine reference (this time referring to Moon-Mars-Saturn for 12
November). And there is the probable encoding of next year's 10 June
event as the "Lion for change," not intended to be very consoling.
Fury like Hannibal's could simply describe the unexpected inferno,
unless further cross-references uncover a connection with something
more tangible. Line 1 of IX.41 could use Avignon in the same sense
(i.e., to represent 12 November 2001), reinforcing the concept that
Chiron seizing something (conjuncting with Pallas 14 Nov) from this
point is critical.
The speculative scenario derived from an application of VIII.21
appears to have manifested in a "dry-run" form at least: on Sunday 11
Nov there were numerous reports from boats on the Mississippi and Ohio
Rivers, from Crystal City, Missouri (about 30 miles south of St.
Louis) to Cairo, Illinois seventy miles southward (at the juncture of
the two rivers), of three extremely small planes (pilot-only,
built-from-a-kit variety) flying very low and dispersing gray smoke.
The pilots are being sought, but no residue was detected on the boats
that were flown over -
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/20011112/us/attacks_planes_sought_3.html
Contre Modene secret, cave disant
Against Modena secret, empty speaking
[VI.73]
And I saw in the right hand of Him who sat on the throne a scroll
written inside and on the back, sealed with seven seals. Then I saw a
strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, "Who is worthy to open the
scroll and loose its seals?" And no one in heaven or on the earth was
able to open the scroll, or to look at it. So I wept much, because no
one was found worthy to open and read the scroll, or to look at it.
But one of the elders said to me, "Do not weep. Behold, the Lion of
the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has prevailed to open the
scroll and to loose its seven seals." And I looked, and behold, in
the midst of the throne and of the four living creatures, and in the
midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as though it had been slain, having
seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven spirits of God sent
out into all the earth. Then He came and took the scroll out of the
right hand of Him who sat on the throne.
Now when He had taken the scroll, the four living creatues and the
twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each having a harp, and
golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints.
And they sang a new song, saying, "You are worthy to take the scroll,
and to open its seals: For You were slain, and have redeemed us to God
by Your blood, out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation,
and have made us kings and priests to our God; And we shall reign on
the earth."
Then I looked, and I heard the voice of many angels around the throne,
the living creatures, and the elders; and the number of them was ten
thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands, saying with a
loud voice: "Worthy is the Lamb who was slain to receive power and
riches and wisdom, and strength and honor and glory and blessing!"
And every creature which is in heaven and on the earth and under the
earth and such as are under the sea, and all that are in them, I heard
saying: "Blessing and honor and glory and power be to Him who sits on
the throne, and to the Lamb, forever and ever!"
Then the four living creatures said, "Amen!" And the twenty-four
elders fell down and worshiped Him who lives forever and ever.
-- The Book of Revelations, Chapter 5
Eagal
TWO RIVERS INTO ONE
The process I have employed is a systematic interrelative dynamic
analysis of Nostradamian prophecies using potentially revelant
information about historical events, astrological conditions, and
other esoteric data. Perhaps there is some intuition involved, and
certainly must be filtered through my own biases: I would like any
apparent successes to not only demonstrate the seer was genuine, but
also to serve as proof the Christian faith bears a great Truth.
Passages from Scripture, both Biblical and Apocryphal, some of which I
have posted, have led me to the conclusion that Jesus was not
presenting an extension of the Judaic traditions, so much as a revival
of the first religion, which was lost in the confusion of Nemrod's
Babel, and supplanted by something else. A God of mercy, peace, and
healing was replaced by one commanding blood offerings the Prophets
would oppose, ordering dark rituals, and raising ruthless armies bent
upon utter annihilation for the sake of conquest alone. The people
were not only being led, but tyrannized, and endured it because they
were frightened by some power, convinced by some information about the
future, and unable to conceive of such an entity being intrinsically
evil. When the angel told Abraham not to harm Isaac, although the
voice he perceived as God was quite specific about which mountain upon
which to sacrifice the child, Abraham did not respond that he was
going to continue killing Isaac anyway, since God told him to do it,
and this angel must be a demon in disguise: Abraham trusted both
visitations, presuming the voice had been God testing him, sending the
angel to end the test - neither did he make the logical leap that the
voice had told him to do something evil, and should no longer be
thought of as God. The motives of Satan were clearly delineated: he
wants the entire human race to fail, erring by his faulty counsel and
other infernal intrusions, so that no human will be found worthy of
the heavenly orders denied him due to his own pride. So simply
telling people to do things does not seem enough: the purpose in
instituting any action is to set a dangerously unjust precedent, often
based on a grain of truth, perversely twisted. Thus Moses was
instructed to stone dissenters with the rationalization, "Dying, let
them die," rendering physical death in response to presumed spiritual
death by not agreeing: Jesus would restate this as allowing the
spiritually blind to lead each other into the pit. Likewise
executions were staged "to remove the evil from your midst": but Jesus
explained that the evil which should be purged is within the self,
urging introspective self-purification rather than violent pogroms.
Touching something unclean tainted one until sunset or some folkloric
cure in the old law, but Jesus rejected this notion, declaring the
wicked thoughts within emerge in words that make one unclean: so He
did not see people as vulnerable to spiritual contamination from
without by physical means - instead wicked thoughts are as bad as the
deeds, and good thoughts are only good if they are carried out. And
people were not essentially pure, but destined to be lost without
following the cryptical instructions of His parables, whether
deciphered or not. Jesus, the condemned outcast, knew that His life
would become the cornerstone for a future movement comprehending the
mysteries, and this is probably what Nostradamus means by a renewal of
the Christian Church. All religion began with Adam attempting to
appease God for his transgression, so that he might re-enter Eden: but
God persisted that whatever oblations were made, the plan of
Redemption was for Himself (i.e., the Word of God) to incarnate, then
offer the ultimate sacrifice, shedding divine blood upon the skull of
long-dead Adam. There could not have been a solar eclipse on the day
of the Crucifixion: Hebrew life was dictated by the lunar cycle, and
that was the time of a Full Moon, when only a lunar eclipse was
possible. The Gospels continually reference various instances when
they noticed prophetic fulfillment by events in Christ's life; many
involved His execution, which was apparently (from the content of
available texts) the onset of spiritual upheaval in the astral
dimension, some of which manifested in our physical realm as the dead
rising, etc. The Second Coming is another Messianic incarnation in
the latter age, which is recognized to be such through the scenarios
outlined in Revelations; but there was a case when many people
supposed a reincarnation of Christ had lived during the Renaissance -
this was when the artist Raphael (nicknamed "The Divine") died on Good
Friday amidst earthquakes, having nearly completed his painting "The
Transfiguration," carried still wet at the front of his funeral
procession.
Since nothing more of the three small planes transpired 14 November,
another look at the chart yielded something interesting: Chiron and
Pallas are in rough opposition to the lunar Node (Dragon's Head).
IX.41 line 1 has Chiron "itself to seize" something from Avignon (St.
Rufus 12 November, III.93, Flight 587), but this does not require it
to be Pallas: the Chiron-Node opposition becomes precise @ 28,17'
Sagittarius 25 November 8:29am CST - Central time is being used for
Cairo, Illinois. This is Sunday of Thanksgiving weekend, feastday of
St. Alanus, Abbot of Gascony from the 7th century.
Le grand Prelat un jour apres son songe,
Interprete au rebours de son sens;
De la Gascogne lui surviendra un monge,
Qui fera elire le grand prelat de Sens.
The great Prelate one day after his dream,
Interpreted opposite to its real sense;
A monk from Gascony will supervene,
Who'll make elected the great prelate of Sense.
St. Alanus qualifies for the Gascony monk of VI.86 line 3. The first
two lines recall an event during the Persian Gulf War, wherein Saddam
Hussein reported having had a dream of a mystical personage telling
him his missiles were pointed in the wrong direction: Benjamin Creme
has been saying this was really Maitreya attempting to send a message
of peace to Hussein which was misinterpreted! The fourth line may
not regard a political election, although it seems so. And while
IX.13 has Bologna with two like Modena set discovered (acknowledging
the Chiron-Pallas conjunct 14 November), VI.73 predicts empty speaking
against that Modena secret, hinting that it is a false marker: but the
Gascony monk produces some real reaction, implying the event
manifests.
The juncture of the Mississippi and Ohio Rivers seems more like II.35
line 3 than the Hudson and East Rivers in NYC, and with this revised
timing something else becomes noticeable...
Dans deux logis de nuit le feu prendra;
Plusieurs dedans etouffes et rotis;
Pres de deux fleuves pour seul il aviendra:
Sol, L'Arq, et Caper tous seront amortis.
The fire will take hold in two lodgings by night;
Several within suffocated and made to roast;
Near two rivers as one it will have advent flight;
Sun, Archer, and Capricorn all will be reduced.
I posted the likely fulfillment of line 1 around the time it occurred:
the Glendale and Ojai fires which ignited 22 December 1999, as the Sun
entered Capricorn; I tried to relate line 2 to a concurrent plane
crash in London, wherein a fire aboard could have provided the
suffocation constraint by smoke. But the scope appears to be larger,
another annual prophecy like IX.83 might be, for 1999 to 2001, linked
by the astrological key in the final line with a theme of reduction.
When the Sun was slightly into Capricorn in 2000, there was the
Chinese disco fire killing 300, suitably ghastly to fulfill line 2.
So one might expect line 3 to manifest when the Sun is in a similar
position in 2001: on 25 November 8:29am CST the Sun will be @ 3,23'
Sagittarius, and the massive reduction then could apply to deaths by
plague of some kind.
* * * * * * *
"I cursed not man, nor the earth, nor other creatures, but man's evil
fruit, and his works...
And I blessed all My creatures visible and invisible. And Adam was
five and a half hours in paradise.
And I blessed the seventh day, which is the Sabbath, on which he
[Adam] rested from all his works.
And I appointed the EIGHTH DAY also, that the eighth day should be the
first-created after My work, and that the first seven revolve in the
form of the seventh thousand, and that at the beginning of the eighth
thousand there should be a time of not-counting, endless, with neither
years nor months nor weeks nor days nor hours."
[God, as transcribed by Henoch]
"The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.
Therefore the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath."
[Mark 2:27-8]
"It is lawful to do good on the Sabbath."
[Matthew 12:12]
Jesus said, "I took my stand in the middle of the world, and in the
flesh I appeared to people.
I found them all drunk, and I did not find any of them thirsty.
My soul ached for these human children, because they are blind of
heart, and do not see that they came into the world empty, and they
also seek to depart from the world empty.
But now they are drunk. When they become sober, then they will
repent."
His disciples said, "Twenty-four prophets have spoken in Israel, and
they all spoke of you."
He said to them, "You have ignored the Living One who is with you, and
have spoken only of the dead."
Jesus said, "When you see a likeness of yourself, you are happy.
But when you see your images that came into being before you, and that
neither die nor become visible, how much you will be able to
tolerate!"
They said to him, "Come, let us pray today, and fast."
Jesus said, "What sin have I committed, or how have I failed?
Rather, when the bridegroom leaves the wedding chamber, then let
people fast and pray."
[Gospel of Thomas, Sayings 28,52,82,102)
(28SW2) Michael Cecil
> THE GASCONY MONK;
> TWO RIVERS INTO ONE
>
> The process I have employed is a systematic interrelative dynamic
> analysis of Nostradamian prophecies using potentially revelant
> information about historical events, astrological conditions, and
> other esoteric data. Perhaps there is some intuition involved, and
> certainly must be filtered through my own biases:
Sure.
Well, this COULD be a problem.
> I would like any
> apparent successes to not only demonstrate the seer was genuine, but
> also to serve as proof the Christian faith bears a great Truth.
This is certainly a difficult proposition.
If the doctrines of Christianity cannot stand on their own as having
been originally taught by Jesus--and the vast majority of what the
Christian theologians say CANNOT be found in the Teaching of Jesus--
then 'signs and wonders' about the predictions of Nostradamus cannot
be Christianity's salvation.
>
> Passages from Scripture, both Biblical and Apocryphal, some of which I
> have posted, have led me to the conclusion that Jesus was not
> presenting an extension of the Judaic traditions,
Perhaps not the Judaic *traditions*...
But certainly the *Revelations* received by Moses, Isaiah, David and
Ezekiel, for example.
> so much as a revival
> of the first religion, which was lost in the confusion of Nemrod's
> Babel, and supplanted by something else.
Surely an 'interesting' view.
> A God of mercy, peace, and
> healing was replaced by one commanding blood offerings the Prophets
> would oppose, ordering dark rituals, and raising ruthless armies bent
> upon utter annihilation for the sake of conquest alone.
Certainly your interpretation of what occurred.
Not sure that I am prepared to accept this as being more accurate than
the statements of those living at the time who received Revelations,
however.
> The people
> were not only being led, but tyrannized, and endured it because they
> were frightened by some power, convinced by some information about the
> future, and unable to conceive of such an entity being intrinsically
> evil. When the angel told Abraham not to harm Isaac, although the
> voice he perceived as God was quite specific about which mountain upon
> which to sacrifice the child, Abraham did not respond that he was
> going to continue killing Isaac anyway, since God told him to do it,
> and this angel must be a demon in disguise: Abraham trusted both
> visitations, presuming the voice had been God testing him,
And you, of course, know this BETTER than Abraham did?
> sending the
> angel to end the test - neither did he make the logical leap that the
> voice had told him to do something evil, and should no longer be
> thought of as God.
Tell you what.
I think I will trust what *Abraham's* understanding of the situation was
rather than someone who did not receive these Commands from God and
lives a few thousand years later in a completely different world and
culture than the one that Abraham lived in.
I hope it does not 'offend' you that I do NOT consider you closer to the
Truth than Abraham was....
> The motives of Satan were clearly delineated: he
> wants the entire human race to fail, erring by his faulty counsel and
> other infernal intrusions,
like metaphysical philosophy, perhaps?
like worshipping Jesus as IF he were God, perhaps?
> so that no human will be found worthy of
> the heavenly orders denied him due to his own pride. So simply
> telling people to do things does not seem enough: the purpose in
> instituting any action is to set a dangerously unjust precedent,
Perhaps a paranoid view of Reality.
> often
> based on a grain of truth, perversely twisted. Thus Moses was
> instructed to stone dissenters with the rationalization, "Dying, let
> them die," rendering physical death in response to presumed spiritual
> death by not agreeing: Jesus would restate this as allowing the
> spiritually blind to lead each other into the pit.
Have you ever read the Revelation of John, where it refers to the song
of Moses and the Lamb?
This refers to the Moral Law conveyed by Moses as well as the esoteric
dimension of Truth focused upon by Jesus and other prophets.
> Likewise
> executions were staged "to remove the evil from your midst":
Do you not think that the terrorists should be killed who are
responsible for the attacks of September 11, 2001?
> but Jesus
> explained that the evil which should be purged is within the self,
Well, of course.
The origin of evil is in the very structures of the normal human
consciousness; in other words, that consciousness which originated
with the loss of the consciousness of the Knowledge of Truth; that
is, the consciousness that is Revealed through the Vision of the
"Son of man" and the Revelation of the Memory of Creation.
>
> urging introspective self-purification rather than violent pogroms.
> Touching something unclean tainted one until sunset or some folkloric
> cure in the old law, but Jesus rejected this notion,
Certainly a strong word, inasmuch as Jesus himself said that he came
'not to destroy the Law but to fulfill the Law".
> declaring the
> wicked thoughts within emerge in words that make one unclean: so He
> did not see people as vulnerable to spiritual contamination from
> without by physical means - instead wicked thoughts are as bad as the
> deeds, and good thoughts are only good if they are carried out. And
> people were not essentially pure, but destined to be lost without
> following the cryptical instructions of His
blasphemy
> parables, whether
> deciphered or not.
It is not a question of "good" and "evil" as much as it is a question
of Knowledge and lack of Knowledge. This is why those who were most
loyal to the Teaching of Jesus were referred to as the "Gnostics";
that is, they had a direct Knowledge of Revealed Truth. And they
focused on how his Knowledge could be brought to others rather than
upon the idolatrization of Jesus as God.
This is why they were hated and persecuted by the followers of Paul
who became institutional Christianity.
> Jesus, the condemned outcast, knew that His
blasphemy
> life
> would become the cornerstone for a future movement comprehending the
> mysteries,
Well, the Knowledge that was Revealed to Jesus is the same Knowledge
that was also Revealed to Moses and Isaiah, and was subsequently
Revealed to Mohammed. But there is NO understanding of this Knowledge
on the part of the Christian theologians.
> and this is probably what Nostradamus means by a renewal of
> the Christian Church.
The Christian Church was founded by Paul in contradiction of the Teach-
ing of Jesus. It can neither be reformed nor renewed. It can only be
replaced by those having a Knowledge of Truth or believing the Truth of
the original Teaching of Jesus.
> All religion began with Adam attempting to
> appease God for his transgression, so that he might re-enter Eden:
Certainly a 'classical' interpretation of the story of the loss of the
consciousness of the Knowledge of Truth.
Buddhism also begins with the belief that the normal consciousness
is trapped in illusion and that 'enlightenment' is necessary.
> but
> God persisted that whatever oblations were made, the plan of
> Redemption was for Himself (i.e., the Word of God) to incarnate,
A vicious contradiction of Revealed Truth; but that does not appear
to be of any real concern to you.
> then
> offer the ultimate sacrifice, shedding divine blood
blasphemy
> upon the skull of
> long-dead Adam.
Not merely blasphemy; perverse blood-thirsty paganism.
But you miss the other crucial symbolism: the three crosses at the
"place of the skull" symbolizing the three currents of 'kundalini' in
the Eastern esoteric tradition; as is also symbolized in the caduceus,
which is now a universal symbol for the medical profession.
> There could not have been a solar eclipse on the day
> of the Crucifixion:
O.............K.............
Tell you what.
I think I will believe what those who were alive at the time said,
if you don't mind.
> Hebrew life was dictated by the lunar cycle, and
> that was the time of a Full Moon, when only a lunar eclipse was
> possible. The Gospels continually reference various instances when
> they noticed prophetic fulfillment by events in Christ's life; many
> involved His
blasphemy
> execution, which was apparently (from the content of
> available texts) the onset of spiritual upheaval in the astral
> dimension,
Uh huh.....Sure....OK....
And you know this HOW?
> some of which manifested in our physical realm as the dead
> rising, etc.
Unless you have COMPLETELY misunderstood the metaphorical words used
to describe the revelation of the memories of previous lives, that is.
> The Second Coming is another Messianic incarnation in
> the latter age, which is recognized to be such through the scenarios
> outlined in Revelations; but there was a case when many people
> supposed a reincarnation
Well, there are certain deficiencies in this doctrine, as explained
in more detail on my web page.
> of Christ had lived during the Renaissance -
> this was when the artist Raphael (nicknamed "The Divine") died on Good
> Friday amidst earthquakes, having nearly completed his painting "The
> Transfiguration," carried still wet at the front of his funeral
> procession.
Certainly an 'interesting' occurrence, if true.
<trivialities snipped>
> * * * * * * *
>
> "I cursed not man, nor the earth, nor other creatures, but man's evil
> fruit, and his works...
> And I blessed all My creatures visible and invisible. And Adam was
> five and a half hours in paradise.
> And I blessed the seventh day, which is the Sabbath, on which he
> [Adam] rested from all his works.
> And I appointed the EIGHTH DAY also, that the eighth day should be the
> first-created after My work, and that the first seven revolve in the
> form of the seventh thousand, and that at the beginning of the eighth
> thousand there should be a time of not-counting, endless, with neither
> years nor months nor weeks nor days nor hours."
> [God, as transcribed by Henoch]
Interesting.
Very interesting.
>
>
> "The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.
> Therefore the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath."
> [Mark 2:27-8]
>
> "It is lawful to do good on the Sabbath."
> [Matthew 12:12]
>
> Jesus said, "I took my stand in the middle of the world, and in the
> flesh I appeared to people.
> I found them all drunk,
Caught in the illusions of the linear consciousness based upon fear and
desire and memory and conditioning.
> and I did not find any of them thirsty.
Thirsty for the Truth.
>
> My soul ached for these human children, because they are blind of
> heart, and do not see that they came into the world empty, and they
> also seek to depart from the world empty.
Because they have no Knowledge....merely intellectual and psychological
pleasure which they have PAID the religious officials to convey to them.
>
> But now they are drunk. When they become sober,
When their illusions are destroyed.
> then they will
> repent."
>
> His disciples said, "Twenty-four prophets have spoken in Israel, and
> they all spoke of you."
> He said to them, "You have ignored the Living One who is with you, and
> have spoken only of the dead."
>
> Jesus said, "When you see a likeness of yourself, you are happy.
In other words, you create an image of Truth based upon the image of the
"self". This is the fundamental mechanism of the linear consciousness.
> But when you see your images that came into being before you,
These are the destructive archetypes which exist in what Western psy-
chology would call the 'unconscious'.
> and that
> neither die nor become visible, how much you will be able to
> tolerate!"
Sure.
The annihilation of all of the images of Truth created by the intellect
on the basis of fear and desire; referred to in the Revelation of John
as the "second death".
> They said to him, "Come, let us pray today, and fast."
> Jesus said, "What sin have I committed, or how have I failed?
> Rather, when the bridegroom leaves the wedding chamber, then let
> people fast and pray."
>
> [Gospel of Thomas, Sayings 28,52,82,102)
Guess I will just have to add a "Commentary on the Gospel of Thomas"
to my web page at:
http://www.deadseanaghammadiresearch.com
Eagal
WITH AN EASTERNER
And behold there was another habitation more spacious than the former,
every entrance to which was open before me, erected in the midst of a
vibrating flame... Its floor was on fire; above were lightnings and
agitated stars, while its roof exhibited a blazing fire. Attentively
I surveyed it, and saw that it contained an exalted throne, the
appearance of which was like that of frost, while its circumference
resembled the orb of the brilliant sun, and there was the voice of the
cherubim. From underneath this mighty throne rivers of flaming fire
issued. To look upon it was impossible. One great in glory sat upon
it, whose robe was brighter than the sun, and whiter than snow... A
fire also of great extent continued to rise up before Him, so that not
one of those who surrounded Him was capable of approaching Him, among
the myriads of myriads who were before Him. And He required not holy
counsel... Then the Lord with His own mouth called me, saying,
"Approach hither, Henoch, at My holy word." And He raised me up,
making me near even to the entrance. My eye was directed to the
ground. Then addressing me, He spoke and said: "Hear, neither be
afraid, O Henoch, O righeous man, and scribe of righteousness... Go,
say to the Watchers of heaven [demons], who have sent thee to pray for
them, 'You ought to pray for men, and not men for you. Wherefore you
have forsaken the lofty and holy heaven, which endures forever, and
have lain with women, have defiled yourselves with the daughters of
men, have taken to yourselves wives, have acted like the sons of the
earth, and have begotten giants? ...You from the beginning were made
spiritual, living a life which is eternal, and not subject to death...
Now the giants, who have been born of spirit and of flesh, shall call
upon earth evil spirits... Evil spirits shall they be upon earth, and
the spirits of the wicked shall they be called... The spirits of the
giants shall be like clouds, which shall oppress, corrupt, fall,
contend, and bruise upon earth. They shall cause lamentation. No
food shall they eat, and they shall be thirsty; they shall be
concealed, and those spirits shall rise up against the sons of men,
and against women, for they come forth during the days of slaughter
and destruction.' ...Say: 'In heaven have you been: secret things
however have not been manifested to you, yet you have known a
reprobated mystery. And this you have related to women in the
hardness of your heart, and by that mystery have women and mankind
multiplied evils upon the earth.' Say: 'Never therefore shall you
obtain peace.'" ...
Uriel said: "Here the angels, who cohabited with women, appointed
their leaders, and being numerous in appearance made men profane, and
caused them to err, so that they sacrificed to devils as to gods." ...
Then I inquired of Raphael, an angel who was with me, and said: "Whose
spirit is that, the voice of which reaches to heaven, and accuses?"
He answered, saying: "This is the spirit of Abel, who was slain by
Cain his brother: and he will accuse him, until his seed be destroyed
from the face of the earth; until his seed perish from the seed of the
human race." ...
I beheld the Ancient of days, whose head was white like wool, and with
Him another, whose countenance resembled that of man. His countenance
was full of grace, like that of one of the holy angels. Then I
inquired of one of the angels, who went with me, and who shewed me
every secret thing, concerning this Son of Man, who He was, and why He
accompanied the Ancient of days. He answered and said to me: "This is
the Son of Man, to whom righteousness belongs, with whom righteousness
has dwelt, and who will reveal all the treasures of that which is
concealed, for the Lord of Spirits has chosen Him, and His portion has
surpassed all before the Lord of Spirits in everlasting uprightness.
The Son of Man, whom thou beholdest, shall raise up kings and the
mighty from their couches, and the powerful from their thrones, shall
loosen the bridles of the powerful, and break in pieces the teeth of
sinners. He shall hurl kings from their thrones and their dominions,
because they will not exalt and praise Him, nor humble themselves
before Him, by whom their kingdoms were granted to them. The
countenance likewise of the mighty shall He cast down, filling them
with confusion. Darkness shall be their habitation, and worms shall
be their bed; nor from that their beds shall they hope to be raised
again, because they exalted not the name of the Lord of Spirits. They
shall condemn the stars of heaven, shall lift up their hands against
the Most High, shall tread upon and inhabit the earth, exhibiting all
their works of iniquity, even their works of iniquity. Their strength
shall be in their riches, and their faith in gods whom they have
formed with their own hands. They shall deny the name of the Lord of
Spirits, and shall expel Him from the temples, in which they
assemble." ...
In the day of trouble evil shall be heaped up upon sinners, but the
righteous shall triumph in the name of the Lord of Spirits. Others
shall be made to see that they must repent, and forsake the works of
their hands... He who repents not before Him shall perish.
"Henceforward I will not have mercy on them," saith the Lord of
Spirits...
He shall sow the congregation of the saints, and of the elect, and all
the elect shall stand before him in that day. All the kings, the
princes, the exalted, and those who rule over earth, shall fall down
on their faces before Him, and shall worship Him. They shall fix
their hopes on this Son of Man, shall pray to Him, and petition Him
for mercy. Then shall the Lord of Spirits hasten to expel them from
His presence. Their faces shall be full of confusion, and darkness
shall be added to their faces. The angels shall take them to
punishment, that vengeance may be inflicted on those who have
oppressed His children and His elect... Then the sword of the Lord of
Spirits shall be drunk from them, but the saints and elect shall be
safe in that day... In those days the kings who possess the earth
shall be punished by the angels of punishment, wheresoever they shall
be delivered up... They also shall say: "...Now small is the rest we
desire, but we do not find it... Light has passed away from before us,
and darkness has covered our thrones for ever. For we have not
confessed before Him, we have not glorifed the name of the Lord of
kings, we have not glorified the Lord in all His works, but we have
trusted in the scepter of our dominion and of our glory... All our
sins are truly without number." Then shall they say to themselves:
"Our souls are satiated with the instruments of crime, but that
prevents us not from descending to the flaming womb of hell." ...
You have committed blasphemy and iniquity, and are destined to the day
of the effusion of blood, to the day of darkness, and to the day of
the great judgement...
Woe to you, ye sinners, for with the words of your mouths, and with
the work of your hands, have you acted impiously: in the flame of a
blazing fire shall you be burnt. And now know ye, that the angels
shall inquire into your conduct in heaven: of the sun, the moon, and
the stars shall they inquire respecting your sins - for upon earth you
exercise jurisdiction over the righteous. Every cloud shall bear
witness against you, the snow, the dew, and the rain; for all of them
shall be withholden from you, that they may not descend upon you, nor
become subservient to your crimes...
And now, fear not, ye righteous, when you see sinners strong and
worthy in their ways. Be not associates with them, but keep
yourselves at a distance from their oppression: be you associated with
the host of heaven. You, ye sinners, say: "All our transgressions
shall not be taken account of, and be recorded." But all your
transgressions shall be recorded daily.
[Henoch 14-16, 19, 22, 46, 49, 61-62, 93, 99, 104]
I noticed a discrepancy between the Beziers date used in 2000, which
was 5 December, and this year's which was given as 5 November: the
error was traced to two research sources both attributing the day to
St. Gerald - however, they appeared to be contemporaries, one dying in
1109 and the other in 1123; moreover, the one from 5 November was
associated with Beziers, and the Gerald of 5 December with Moissac
(figuring in VII.12 with Cahors). Yet the relevant information seems
to defy the later close observation, since 5 December 2000 was
obviously the Beziers in IX.25, being the date Judge Sander Sauls
rejected the appeal for the Florida manual recount (after having
trucked in the ballots, and not looked at a single one), thus bringing
the "chase enterprise" of the contested presidential election a step
closer to "breaking" through its resolution, as posted prior. So
"Avignon and Beziers, plague..." of III.56, with Avignon through St.
Rufus meaning the 12 November crash of Flight 587 prophesied in
III.93, should not be a reversed weekly warning about 5 November, but
instead place the plague around 5 December. IX.41 line 1 could subtly
indicate Chiron seizing the Tail of the Dragon (opposing the Dragon's
Head lunar Node) to obtain the VI.86 connection with the Gascony monk
St. Alanus of 25 November (guided along with the Modena-Bologna
remarks for the Chiron-Pallas conjunct 14 November). This also means
the very great plague of III.75, with (perhaps only prophetic) help
near, and the remedies very far, would fit in with Ceres being the
great "gousse," since that asteroid will enter Aquarius 10:21am CST 5
December. Presumably this will affect the area around the Mississippi
and Ohio Rivers juncture, via the three small planes reported 11 Nov.
The most likely contagion is anthrax, with the scenario of VIII.21,
wherein an infection is dispersed, a bridge is destroyed elsewhere,
then millions die as the illnesses become fatal; so the timetable
coincides plausibly with the projected bridge attack 8 December. Thus
the thunder and hail in Paris from III.56 should be 6 or 7 December;
Ceres beginning its reign becomes the first of the three "fled sails"
from VIII.84, with the Moon's shift into Libra 8 December counting
second (skipping the Virgo phase which may coincide with the Parisian
hailstorm), closely followed by Mars changing signs the same day. The
chart for Ceres entry from the relevant location shows Saturn in
Gemini roughly opposing a triple conjunct of Sun-Mercury-Pluto in
Sagittarius, trined by the Leo Moon, recalling I.16:
Faux a l'etang joint vers le Sagittaire
En son haut AUGE de l'exaltation:
Peste, famine, mort de main militaire;
Le siecle approche de renovation.
Scythe at the pool joined towards the Sagittarean
In the highest AUGMENT of its exaltation:
Plague, famine, death by military hand;
The cycle approaches its renovation.
Apparently Gemini is the "pond" joined to Sagittarius by opposition,
with the grouping of three celestial bodies around 13 to 15 degrees
(the midway region) in the Archer sign the emphasized "augment" of
line 2. The cycle being renovated may be that of the "sceptre"
change, from the Taurean alignment of May 2000 to the Gemini grouping
of May 2002.
Evil coming to the juncture of the Rhone and Saone (at Lyons) in IX.68
line 2 could be analogous to the union of two American rivers at
Cairo, Illinois; and the horrible throne in line 4 parallels the Mars
throne of VIII.46 which correlated with the 11 Sept attack. The
chronology is uncertain, so while Lucy's day in line 3 is obviously 13
December, the year could have been 2000, the day after the Electoral
College was chosen, and the day before Gore's official concession - so
it may not be literally about soldiers hidden in the woods, but the
manner of the Bush victory. Likewise, line 1 about the obscuring of
Mount Aymar (related to blood) could be the horrific incident
postulated for 10 June 2002.
IX.30 could shed more light on the bridge event, using the "gulf"
codeword:
Au port de Puola et de sainct Nicolas,
Perir Normande au gouffre phanatique;
Cap. de Bisance rues crier helas,
Secours de Gaddes et du grand Philippique.
At the port of Paulo and saint Nicholas,
Norman to perish through the gulf fanatic;
Capital of Byzantium streets to cry alas,
Help from the Goddess and the great Philippic.
"Puola" seems a simple anagram for Blessed William de Paulo (abbot
born in Catania, died 1423), applying to 30 November, which will be
the day of a Full Moon; the feastday for St. Nicholas (died circa 350)
is 6 December (not Christmas Day), probably merely marking the
crucial timeframe. "Norman" means "Northmathr," for astrological
north-math, meaning something notably conjuncts with the Ascendant at
the critical moment: the Grand Trine 8 December of Moon-Vesta-Ceres as
VIII.84's "Trinacrie" lasts only a few hours, and the Vestal point of
this phenomenon conjuncts with the Ascendant at 4pm PST (the attack on
the bridge is supposedly scheduled for afternoon rush hour). Given
the current situation, it would be absurd to translate this gulf
"phanatique" as the Gulf of Quarnero (Sinus Flanaticus) instead of a
reference to a fanatical terrorist. Line 3 recalls the Istanbul quake
of 1999, having been a capital city of antiquity: from thence the
helpful goddess appears Vesta, whose conjunct with Mercury 23 Nov '99
may have played into IV.28 and I.52; the "great Phillipic" could be
Japan's Mount Usu, through VIII.81 line 4 for the March and April 2000
eruptions.
In early 2002 Ceres usurping a reign of Vesta fits II.87 better than
III.75 anyway: "The lady [Vesta] serves, her time no longer adored" -
thus she serves in the temple 10 June 2002, not reigning. When a
reigning planet appears in the temple (lunar conjuncts before and
after Mercury-Ascendant conjunct using NYC coordinates), it becomes a
dark temple. This was the probable theme of V.42, indicating a Mars
reign for "les Allobrox" as the Los Alamos fire in 4 May 2000 (when
Mars left the Taurean grouping for maximum astronomical alignment 5
May), associated with the Lombard Pope Pius V (30 April): the
prediction of terror from "those of the Eagle included under the
Balance" may have been a reference to the solar sign of this Eagle
(born under Libra), the terrifying ones being the dark temple pair of
VI.16, one of which was reigning Mars 11 September 2001 (the other
being Juno, decoded prior from the "jeune" of V.19, through which war
is opened).
The annular solar eclipse of 10 June 2002 appears to be not only the
Pacific Emperor of V.6, but also the Easterner of II.29, originating
in the Far East and manifesting ever eastward across the Pacific
Ocean.
L'Oriental sortira de son siege,
Passer les monts Apennins voir la Gaule;
Transpercera le ciel, les eaux et niege,
Et un chacun frappera de sa gaule.
The Easterner will project from his perch,
Passing the Apennine mountains to see Gaul;
Sky, waters and snow he will transpierce,
And through his rod he will strike all.
The perch or seat is the first place the eclipse would be visible,
i.e., Indonesia; line 2 could give the location as beyond the
Apennines, very far perhaps - and the Gaul could mean "gall," a bitter
catastrophe as in IX.38 line 3. Line 3 notably has the sky, water and
snow transpierced, perhaps since this eclipse should be visible mainly
in the uninhabited Pacific Ocean. And the final line suggests the
astronomical event accompanies a global cataclysm. Again NYC should
be affected, justifying IX.74's declaration that the Vulcan corpses
(from 11 Sept, using IV.29, V.77) are buried by the dead, and IX.38
line 4, wherein the Scar (ground zero WTC ruin site) relief is
deceived by maintenance (not "beguiled by conversation").
De feu volant la machination
Viendra troubler un grand chef assiege
The machination of flying fire
Will come to trouble a great besieged chief
VI.34 apparently also concerns the 11 Sept attack, though its last two
lines could be about a future event, or explain the source as internal
sedition which resulted in the victims being abandoned in despair.
While it is noted Benjamin Creme's story of Maitreya inducing Saddam
Hussein's Persian Gulf War dream coincides well with the first two
lines of VI.86, there is no effort on my part to indicate this
Maitreya is "The Christ," yet the complex spiritual explanation
offered for Christ's mission and power arriving through Maitreya as
John the Baptist (in my understanding) is intriguing and not in
conflict with my own eschatalogical beliefs.
VI.10 also being fulfilled confirms the gag order imposed on planned
parenthood services internationally as one of GWB's first actions was
the coloring of the marriage pact by the besieged mentioned in its
first line as "the colors" by incorporating VIII.54 [beginning, "Under
color of the marriage treaty," and speaking of a second instance of
carnage in a western land], VII.18 ["The besieged will color their
pacts"] line 1 (before the cruel issue of seven days), VI.73
["Betrayed for acting under color of espousals"] line 4 (after Modena
secret line). It seems as if, along with the sacristy made lame by
its senate in II.76 for Pope John Paul II's decision to stop the Mass
being celebrated in the Holy Land 22 Nov '99, the GWB gag order
decision (following his father's identical action) is being offered as
cause for cosmic retribution. Perhaps not offering the abortion
option will have some worse effect in the foreign lands being served,
resulting in such evils as mass starvation from overpopulation,
eliminating recourse for local abuses, infanctide, and other serious
concerns. Certainly abortion is one of the sins for which St. Peter
saw specific punishments (which would be disturbing to relate) in his
apocryphal Apocalypse; it would be disingenuous to adopt the OT view
that inducing a miscarriage is not equivalent to murder (payment for
damage versus stoning to death), even with the reasonable argument
that life begins with breath rather than at conception. Tampering
with DNA (and the human nervous system) is serious business: demons
interbreeding with humans wrought gigantic monsters which the Deluge
purged from the planet; and while we can imagine Mary providing the
egg for Jesus, there is only archangel Gabriel's presence to explain
from whence arrived the other half of the gentic sequencing, for it is
clear Joseph did not participate in that conception.
The promontory set up in I.77 is probably that of the great Ishmael
from IX.60.
Entre deux mers dressera promontoire
Que puis mourra par le mors du cheval;
Le sien Neptune pliera voile noire,
Par Calpre et classe aupres de Rocheval.
He will erect a promontory between two seas
Who for the bite of the horse will then die assailed;
His own Neptune will fold a black sail with ease,
For the Culprit and the fleet near Rocky-vale.
Afghanistan is land-locked, with the Arabian Sea below and the Aral
Sea above. The horse-bite was the tactic utilized 11 September of
using planes as bombs to strike targets, a metaphor already discussed,
first via VIII.72 line 4. The Neptune remark likely concerns the
ambush scenario, in which early February appears quite inauspicious
for a major assault using ground forces, though it seems the person
targeted as the mastermind of the slaughters is ultimately killed.
* * *
When all creation visible and invisible, as the Lord created it, shall
end, then every man goes to the great judgement, and then all time
shall perish, and the years, and thenceforward there will be neither
months nor days nor hours: they will be stuck together, and will not
be counted.
Walk, my children, in long-suffering, in meekness, honesty, in
provocation, in grief, in faith and in truth, in reliance on promises,
in illness, in abuse, in wounds, in temptation, in nakedness, in
privation, loving one another, till you go out from this age of ills,
that you become inheritors of endless time.
When Henoch had talked to the people, the Lord sent out darkness on to
the earth, and there was darkness, and it covered those men standing
with Henoch, and they took Henoch up on to the highest heaven, where
the Lord is; and He received him, and placed him before His face, and
the darkness went off from the earth, and light came again. And the
people saw, and understood not how Henoch had been taken, and
glorified God...
[2 Henoch 65:5; 66:7; 67:1,2]
As our starting point, then, let us adopt the Godhead. Of this
Godhead, in itself, he alone is not imbecile, he alone is not impious,
who propounds - nothing. "Nous ne connaissons rien," says the Baron
de Bielfeld - "Nous ne connaissons rien de la nature ou de l'essence
de Dieu: pour savoir ce qu'il est, il faut etre Dieu meme." - "We know
absolutely nothing of the nature or essence of God: in order to
comprehend what He is, we should have to be God ourselves."
"We should have to be God ourselves!" - With a phrase so startling as
this yet ringing in my ears, I nevertheless venture to demand if this
our present ignorance of Deity is an ignorance to which the soul is
everlastingly condemned.
--"Eureka," E.A.P. [19 January, 1809 - 7 October, 1849]
Eagal
AS GEORGE HARRISON DIED
The announcement was withheld until after midnight, but George
Harrison died in Los Angeles 29 November 2001 at 1:30 pm PST, after
battling throat, lung and brain cancer, and trying to recover from a
nearly fatal knife attack near the end of 1999.
In this time period, Chiron had been expected to prove significant, as
from this excerpt from my previous installment to this thread:
> IX.41 line 1 could subtly
> indicate Chiron seizing the Tail of the Dragon (opposing the Dragon's
> Head lunar Node) [from 12 November as St. Rufus' Avignon]
> to obtain the VI.86 connection with the Gascony monk
> St. Alanus of 25 November (guided along with the Modena-Bologna
> remarks for the Chiron-Pallas conjunct 14 November).
Chiron and the Node remain in rough opposition, with Chiron "seizing"
the Tenth House cusp (i.e., Midheaven, Medium Coeli, upper prime
vertical) around 1:28 pm PST. There was no hint that George
Harrison's death was involved in the verses, so although he was known
to be receiving medical care in Los Angeles, the postulations required
to derive an accurate prediction were not made prior.
There seems to have been a focus on the Chiron-Node opposition, which
was easily confirmed, and plays a notable role in the death-chart,
rather than an attempt to make the event known beforehand through more
specific means.
The 1999 incident in which Harrison was nearly murdered occurred
synchronous with a Pluto-Chiron conjunct which was considered ominous
prior, due to the utilization of VIII.29, wherein the astrological
union appeared as the "found urn." A more graphic depiction of the
knife attack could be in II.98; and the esoteric "urn" key of Pluto
and Chiron has been employed extensively since, explaining several
lines whose meaning would otherwise have been entirely cryptic.
Le grand CHYREN se saisir d'Auignon,
De Rome lettres en miel plein d'amertume;
Lettre ambassade partir de Chanignon,
Carpentras pris par duc noir rouge plume.
The great CHIRON itself to seize from Avignon,
For Rome letters in honey full of bitter doom;
Letter embassy to depart for Chanignon,
Carpentras taken by black duke red plume.
* * * * * * *
They did such a crime to God:
Is eternity about time enough?
Christ bled so...
Heavy loss of blood,
Enough to faint:
PINTS OF BLOOD!
(They teased Him with a crown)
JESUS BLED!
(Teased to a scarlet robe)
They hurt Jesus by whipping the Lord,
He was hurt by whipping:
The Lord Christ bled so...
Jesus bled plenty,
Enough to faint!
*
Jesus
Christ
Lost pints of
Blood!
*
...And there was by this idol a priest ministering to it, who, as
often as Satan spoke out of that idol, related the things he said to
the inhabitants of Egpyt... Near to that idol was the inn of the city,
into which when Joseph and St. Mary were come, and had turned into
that inn, all the inhabitants of the city were astonished. And all
the magistrates and priests of the idols assembled before that idol,
and made inquiry there, saying, "What means all this consternation,
and dread, which has fallen upon all our country?"
The idol answered them, "The unknown God is come hither, who is truly
God; nor is there any one besides Him, who is worthy of divine
worship: for He is truly the Son of God. At the fame of Him this
country trembled, and at His coming it is under the present commotion
and consternation; and we ourselves are affrighted by the greatness of
His power." And at the same instant this idol fell down, and at his
fall all the inhabitants of Egypt, besides others, ran together.
* * *
In the month Adar Jesus gathered together the boys, and ranked them as
though He had been a king. For they spread their garments on the
ground for Him to sit on; and having made a crown of flowers, put it
upon His head, and stood on his right and left as the guards of a
king. And if anyone happened to pass by, they took him by force, and
said,
"Come hither, and worship the King, that you may have a prosperous
journey."
--First Gospel of the Infancy of Jesus Christ, IV:7-13; XVIII:1-3
Eagal
ARCHER'S HIGHEST AUGMENT
Holy, Holy,
The Ruler, God All-Mighty:
Who was before;
And who is in the present;
And will be henceforth!
Another set of possible interpretative applications extend the
warnings of potential further domestic terrorism using the verses
already discussed. III.56's end of Mars could mean its reign (rather
than time in a sign): although Vesta's retrogression attains the top
position, Chiron starts its reign 11 December, coincident with a
Mars-Ceres adjacency @ 2,11' by which Ceres supercedes Mars.
Moreover, the condition described in I.16 should exist 10 December,
since Venus, Pluto, Sun, Mercury and Chiron will all be in Sagittarius
with Saturn retrograding to precisely oppose the highest ranking of
the group (the advancing Venus). Also, the "Agath" in IV.94 could
mean St. Agatha of 12 December; VIII.21's Agde may still mean 10
November, although the names should be interchangeable. The sails of
VIII.84 which flee the plague, and may be three due to the Trinacrie
hint, should represent the three foists of VIII.21; and another Grand
Trine (for the decoded Trinacrie itself) has been discovered, 11
December, between the Moon, Jupiter and Lilith, which aligns with the
Ascendant during the triple trine at noon PST (slightly before Chiron
enters Capricorn, 2pm PST). Since the period when Chiron is reigning
and the penumbral lunar eclipse occurs seems to have been predicted as
beneficial, both the plague and bridge events seem to emerge as a
double attack, separated by only a few hours and some distance. A
concurrent Parisian hailstorm is a third event which should
demonstrate the prophecies being fulfilled.
Le grand Chyren otera du longin
Tous les captifs par Seline banniere
The great Chiron will remove by a great length
All the captives for the Crescent banner
Fait magnanime par grand Chyren selin
Magnanimous deed through great Chiron crescent
* * *
The first woe has been;
Two have yet to be...
Eagal
& KING CHIRON:
(plus Trinacrie Woods)
[first portion post attempted December 1:]
Closer examination of the verses in tandem with the astrological
conditions they suggest opens a new line of reasoning in regards to
the prophesied execution of the tyrant at the Crescent port in I.94.
I overlooked the 30 December 2001 penumbral lunar eclipse in my
original analysis, and this now seems more likely than the subsequent
similar astronomical event 26 May 2002.
The vanquishing of Guise in VII.29 was previously explained as the
Xenia (meaning "Guest"), Ohio cyclone of 20 September 2000, with the
monument to be erected that for World War II, planned from 21 Sept
'00: but the final line states the captive is led before the
completion of the monument. Likewise, IV.34 has a great one led
captive to foreign land, chained by gold offered to King CHYREN
(asteroid Chiron). I.94 has the tyrant put to death, implying an
execution rather than a military killing; so an extradition is
plausible. Chiron will reign (i.e., period of kingship) roughly from
11 December 2001 (moving into Capricorn 3am local to Afghanistan 12
Dec) to 4 January 2002 (when Mercury usurps the throne), which
includes the 30 December date. Vesta will retrograde into quincunx
with Chiron 17 December, then further backing into Taurus 20 December;
the Sun will advance to conjunct with Chiron @ 1,11' Capricorn 23
December 3:45am (Afghan time). It is very likely the solar conjunct
is the "gold offered to King Chiron" which will chain the captive so
that he may be led away (no inference of golden shackles).
The great Ishmael of IX.60 is probably the tryant of I.94 and the one
led captive in IV.34 and VII.29. Thus he may be captured 23 December,
extradited quickly, then executed 30 December. While the "Aemathien"
of various verses means Macedonian but is close to an anagram for
"Anathema," the overt writing of "Macedon" such as in IX.35 could
indicate the same character.
Et Ferdinand blonde sera descorte,
Quitter le fleur, suivre le Macedon:
Au grand besoin defaillira sa route,
Et marchera contre le Myrmidon.
And Ferdinand blinde will soon detach,
To abandon the flower, the Macedonian to follow:
His course will fail in the great pinch,
And it will march against the Ant-like flow.
The Seattle pergola dislodged 15 January 2001, a saintly Ferdinand's
day, used as an omen for their 6.8 quake which struck Ash Wednesday
(28 February); the identity of the Macedonian was then unknown, but
making him the current Anathema provides the information he fails when
the pressure is on. The final line summons the image of a heavily
populated metropolis such as NYC, with people described as ants, again
appearing to look toward the 10 June 2002 event (another annular solar
eclipse will occur prior, 14 December, yet without the required
ominous conditions).
V.14 bears the hint of "Saturn and Mars" for 11 September's Martian
reign (delayed by retrogression) after Saturn began its cycle, "Malte"
for the Meltdown of the WTC towers (not Malta), and "Herodde" taken
alive. This last word has been taken for Rhodes, Herod, and my own
former theory of some oddity: but if the "r"s are doubled instead of
the "d"s, it is almost English for "Her rod," which could mean the
upcoming Gemini alignment (May 2002) being associated with Vesta's
offspring (as in Apoc. 12). That it is "taken alive" may mean
acknowledged before actualization: and the final line may confirm this
notion, by speaking of the Roman sceptre (struck through the Rooster),
possibly relating to the Taurean alignment of May 2000, reaching
maximum linearity 5 May, an anniversary of the 1527 sack of Rome.
* * * * * * *
"...The sleeping and the dead are but as pictures:
'Tis the eye of childhood that fears a painted devil.
If he do bleed, I'll gild the faces of the grooms withal,
For it must seem their guilt." ...
"Here's the smell of the blood still:
All the perfumes of Arabia
Will not sweeten this little hand."
--Lady M: Act II, Sc. I; Act V, Sc. I
[second portion post attempted 11 December:]
EMERGING FROM THE WOODS;
TRINACRIE USES THE VERTEX:
Regarding the timing I.16 portends, although Chiron progresses to
reign beyond Sagittarius, its time within could have manifested the
"exaltation," from which comes the highest AUGMENT, when the
Sagittarean Moon comes into opposition with retrograding Saturn 13 Dec
4:30pm CST. Notable at that time also is a brief "imaginary" Grand
Trine of Jupiter, Lilith, and the Vertex (mathematically calculated
point relatively new to the astrological chart). This Grand Trine
appears at different times relative to location during the period when
Jupiter and Lilith are in near-trine status. Another interesting
feature is that the Sun is then at the Descendant (i.e., sunset) close
to the Grand Trine that day, perhaps potentially fulfilling the
condition of the Norman (north-math codeword) perishing in IX.30 and
the Trinacrie of VIII.84. The Grand Trine with Solar Descendancy
occurs 5pm PST precisely 13 Dec.
So IX.68's warning about soldiers emerging from the woods on St.
Lucy's day (13 Dec) could be the actual critical date, confirming the
French river juncture is analogous. While the Ceres reign coinciding
with the 5 December Beziers date was a major indicator (like Saturn's
reign in April before Mars in September was for the 9-11 attack),
IX.68 makes Mars again critical by recalling its horrible prior
throne: for 13 December this could mean Mars-Ascendant conjunct
11:19am CST (1:19pm PST), since Mars-Immun Coeli conjunct precedes
dawn. So there does appear to be some indirect inference of tragedy
connected with the 14 December annular solar eclipse after all, the
New Moon ending the current lunar month...
Holy, holy,
The Ruler, God All-Powerful:
Who was pre-eminent;
And who exists in the present;
And will be henceforth!
* * *
And I looked, and I heard an eagle flying through the midst of heaven,
saying with a loud voice,
"Woe, woe, woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the
remaining trumpet blasts of the three angels who are about to sound!"
Then the fifth angel sounded...
One woe is past. Behold still two more woes are coming after these
things.
Then the sixth angel sounded...
...prepared for the hour and day and month and year...
The second woe is past!
Behold, the third woe is coming quickly!
Seven thunders speak
To a man:
"YOU WILL BURN
FOREVER
IF YOU WORSHIP-"
"Seal
What you heard
From the voice
Of thunders..."
"The ten horns which you saw are ten ten kings who have received no
kingdom as yet..."
Prompt assaillis de dix galeres elites
And the angel whom I saw standing on the sea and on the land raised up
his right hand to heaven and swore by Him who lives forever and ever,
who created heaven and the things that are in it, and the earth and
the things that are in it, and the sea and the things that are in it,
that there should be delay no longer, but in the days of the sounding
of the seventh angel, when he is about to sound, the mystery of God
would be finished, as He declared to His servants the prophets.
Eagal
FOR MOUNT AYMAR
-or-
FROM LUCY: IN THE
SKY WITH DEMONS...
Du mont Aymar sera noble obscurcie,
Le mal viendra au joint de Saone et Rosne;
Dans bois caches soldats jour de Lucie
Qui ne fut onc si horrible trone.
For Mount Aymar will be noble obscurity,
The evil will come at the juncture of the Saone and Rhone;
Within the woods soldiers hidden day of Lucy,
For whom there never was so horrible a throne.
The soldiers of IX.68 apparently remain hidden during the day of St.
Lucy, 13 December, which in 2001 precedes the annular solar eclipse of
the 14th: the line of annularity crosses Costa Rica, and the southern
limit for this phenomenon will be beyond Peru, which with Bolivia is
associated with the term "Aymar." So the day of the annular solar
eclipse seems indicated itself. The angle at which the Saone joins
the Rhone is analogous to the Mississippi River (as the north-south
Saone) meeting the Ohio River (like the northeast-southwest Rhone).
Again, the final line suggests Mars (using VIII.46 relating to the 11
September attack) at the Ascendant, which for Cairo, Illinois 14
December 2001 will be at 11:17am CST (9:17am PST, correcting the time
zone error from my previous post).
Presuming the west coast bridge event occurs the same day (while
VIII.21 has it third, this seems to be planned as a two-pronged
assault), the Grand Trine of Jupiter-Lilith-Vertex is maximized at
4:57pm PST, with the Sun at the Descendant the next minute (4:58pm PST
for IX.30's perishing Norman).
* * *
You say it's your religion,
But let's call it your sin:
Pride in self, race and nation;
Still Lord Jesus will win.
With all the things you've tried,
Using your course of time,
Could you prepare those who died
By just reading a rhyme?
Marking out time by moons,
Ignoring what the stars say;
Break out from the pack of loons -
Learn the games the angels play.
Look within to see the truth
That's too far-fetched for the news.
Martyrs clung to life forsooth,
Murderers have diff'rent views.
Eagal
JOHNNY WALKER?
La garde etrange trahira forteresse,
Espoir et ombre de plus haut mariage;
Garde decue, fort prise dans la presse,
Loire, Saone, Rosne, Gar. a mort outrage.
The foreign guard will betray the fortress,
Hope and shadow in highest marriage;
Guard cut down, fort taken in the press,
Loire, Saone, Rhone, Garonne at death outrage.
The only other combined mention of Saone and Rhone besides IX.68 may
be found in II.25, which appears to recount the story of the American
fighting for the Taliban, John Walker, as the "foreign guard" who
proves traitorous to the fortress (possibly the Pentagon). The 14
December annular solar eclipse seems to be the shadow of line 2: its
being married with hope does not hint towards any further critical
period.
The guard could be deceived in line 3, but the Latin for cut down
could be implied. The fort is probably not the fortress of line 1,
but the prison fort at Mazar-e-sharif which was seized despite a riot;
the "press" fits the advance of the anti-Taliban forces across
Afghanistan.
Explanations for the Loire and Garonne may present themselves,
obviously having little to do with the actual French rivers. Loire
could transmute to "L'ire," or "The anger," for instance, as
widespread emotional response to the transcribed videotape recently
released. That "Gar." is an abbreviation could prove consequential,
potentially even reduceable to "Gare," an interjection meaning
"Beware!" or "Look out!" "Garenne" is a warren or preserve, which
does not suit the final phrase about mortal outrage as well...
Eagal
OF TWO-THIRDS TRINE
La garde etrange trahira forteresse,
Espoir et ombre de plus haut mariage;
Garde decue, fort prise dans la presse,
Loire, Saone, Rosne, Gar. a mort outrage.
The foreign guard will betray the fortress,
Hope and shadow of higher marriage;
Guard cut down, fort taken in the press,
The ire, Saone, Rhone, Beware of death outrage.
> The only other combined mention of Saone and Rhone besides IX.68 may
> be found in II.25, which appears to recount the story of the American
> fighting for the Taliban, John Walker, as the "foreign guard" who
> proves traitorous to the fortress (possibly the Pentagon). The 14
> December annular solar eclipse seems to be the shadow of line 2: its
> being married with hope does not hint towards any further critical
> period.
However, the alternate translation could suggest an astrological
conjunction in line 2 which is significant as a timing key. A major
conjunct per se is lacking in this timeframe, being subjugated to the
fact that (retrograde) Jupiter and Lilith achieve perfect trine 15
December 3:52am CST @ 12,50'. Thus there is the day of the shadow,
followed by the day of this "higher marriage," then presumably the day
requiring hope. Sunday 16 December should coincide closely with the
end of Ramadhan, consistent with Walker's warning. Mars-Ascendant
conjunct 11:13am CST for Cairo, Illinois. And for the bridge event,
the Sun opposing the Ascendant 4:58pm PST during the
Jupiter-Lilith-Vertex trine.
> The guard could be deceived in line 3, but the Latin for cut down
> could be implied.
This seems to represent the CIA agent at the prison who was killed; so
the "foreign guard" seems to be another character, just as the
fortress is not also the fort...
The fort is probably not the fortress of line 1,
> but the prison fort at Mazar-e-sharif which was seized despite a riot;
> the "press" fits the advance of the anti-Taliban forces across
> Afghanistan.
>
> Explanations for the Loire and Garonne may present themselves,
> obviously having little to do with the actual French rivers. Loire
> could transmute to "L'ire," or "The anger," for instance, as
> widespread emotional response to the transcribed videotape recently
> released. That "Gar." is an abbreviation could prove consequential,
> potentially even reduceable to "Gare," an interjection meaning
> "Beware!" or "Look out!" "Garenne" is a warren or preserve, which
> does not suit the final phrase about mortal outrage as well...
Hence the change in preposition to reflect a simple cautionary
message.
Should the schedule outlined above fail, II.35 still makes the Sun's
upcoming entry into Capricorn ominous...
"For as lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west,
So also will the coming of the Son of Man be.
For wherever the carcass is,
There will the eagles be gathered together."
(Gospel of Matthew 24:28)
Eagal
ONE DISMISSED BY THOSE BENEATH HIM
The failure of the three-day theory for line 2 of II.25 leaves a final
interpretation: that there is one higher marriage for the shadow, and
another associated with the hope (or hopelessness) concept...
While Ceres and Neptune will conjunct until 25 December, Midnight CST
18 December places the Moon between these two very close celestial
bodies in astrological terms, which could provide the other "higher
marriage."
18 December two saints could apply to other prophetic verses:
St. Auxentius could transmute into Auxerre (thereby not representing
the city of a saint as usual, but an alteration of the name) in IV.84
- I had previously perceived line 4 as potentially fulfilled 21 June
2001...
Un grand d'Auxerre mourra bien miserable,
Chasse de ceux qui sous lui ont ete;
Serre en chaines, apres d'un rude cable
En l'an que Mars, Venus et Sol mis en ete.
A great like Auxerre will die quite miserable,
Driven out by those who had been beneath him;
Locked in chains, behind a strong cable
From the year that Mars, Venus and Sun in summer join.
St. Auxentius was a ranked highly in the guard of Emperor Augustus
Licinus, but was dismissed from his post {possible relation to line 2}
due to his refusal to participate in the pagan forms of worship his
Christian faith deemed to be idolatrous. He became a priest, and
bishop of Mopsuetia in Cilicia [note similarity with Sicily-Trinacrie
of VIII.84]; he did not sign the canons of the 314 Council of Arles, a
document which advised excommunication for soldiers errant from their
military duties. Auxentius died circa 321.
The locked in chains portion of line 3 could involve the great Ishmael
led in chains scenario from IV.34, VII.29, etc. And the strong cable
from 2001 could be a prophetic chain of events exposed as fulfilled.
Also for 18 December, St. Gatian of Tours, founder of the diocese and
its first bishop, died 337; the relevant verse may be the first
portion of IV.46 -
Bien defendu le fait par excellence,
Garde-toi Tours de ta proche ruine
The fact well-defended through excellence,
Garde yourself Tours from your approaching ruin
* * * * *
And then shall all the saints give thanks, and live until they have
begotten a thousand children, while the whole period of their youth,
and their sabbaths shall be complete in peace...
The earth shall be cleansed from all corruption, from every crime,
from all punishment, and from all suffering...
[Henoch 10:23,27]
Eagal
USING SEPARATION OF DAYS
> The failure of the three-day theory for line 2 of II.25 leaves a final
> interpretation: that there is one higher marriage for the shadow, and
> another associated with the hope (or hopelessness) concept...
And retaining the fulfilled format from II.25 of the shadow 14 Dec,
and its Jupiter-Lilith trine the next day, it may be presumed 18 Dec
is hope's Ceres-Moon-Neptune grouping arriving the day prior,
rendering 19 December critical with Languedoc, for Blessed Pope Urban
V, born in that region (at Grisac).
While the Languedoc of VII.31 apparently related to the death of ten
in the Alps wanting to repass a mile in late 2000, using Guienne for
Philip IV's deathdate as 29 November as the other temporal guidepost,
IX.85 seems to be for 2001:
Passer Guienne, Languedoc et la Rosne,
D'Agen tenant Marmande et la Roole;
D'ouvrir par foi parroy, Phocen tiendra son trone,
Conflit aupres sainct Pol de Mauseole.
To pass Guienne, Languedoc and the Rhone,
For Agen holding Mar-mandate and the Rule;
In opening by faith parry, Mars, say, will hold its throne,
Conflict near Saint Paul of My soul.
Guienne as 29 Nov is the date of George Harrison's death ("Second et
tiers qui font prime musique/ Sera par Roi en honneur sublimee"?),
Languedoc as 19 Dec also identifies the region where the Saone and
Rhone have joined into the Rhone alone. Agen should represent 9 June
2002 (ominous St. Vincent's day); line 3 appears to look back to 11
Sept 2001, the opening of the war during a delayed reign of Mars (with
Phocen as Marseilles in what may be an English pun). And line 4 could
regress still further, St. Stephen's feastday (the first Christian
martyr, in whose death Saul participated, afterwards being
miraculously converted into St. Paul), around which was the Chinese
disco fire in 2000 (during another reign of Mars).
> > La garde etrange trahira forteresse,
> > Espoir et ombre de plus haut mariage;
> > Garde decue, fort prise dans la presse,
> > Loire, Saone, Rosne, Gar. a mort outrage.
> >
> > The foreign guard will betray the fortress,
> > Hope and shadow of higher marriage;
> > Guard cut down, fort taken in the press,
> > The ire, Saone, Rhone, Beware of death outrage.
Presuming the bridge event occurs the same day requires an
interpretation of III.56's "fin de Mars" as the aim or purpose of Mars
hinted in IX.68 line 4.
19 December Mars-Ascendant conjunct 11:06am CST, and
Jupiter-Lilith-Vertex Grand Trine maximum 4:37pm PST
> 18 December two saints could apply to other prophetic verses:
>
> St. Auxentius could transmute into Auxerre (thereby not representing
> the city of a saint as usual, but an alteration of the name) in IV.84
> - I had previously perceived line 4 as potentially fulfilled 21 June
> 2000...
>
> Un grand d'Auxerre mourra bien miserable,
> Chasse de ceux qui sous lui ont ete;
> Serre en chaines, apres d'un rude cable
> En l'an que Mars, Venus et Sol mis en ete.
>
> A great like Auxerre will die quite miserable,
> Driven out by those who had been beneath him;
> Locked in chains, behind a strong cable
> From the year that Mars, Venus and Sun in summer join.
>
> St. Auxentius was a ranked highly in the guard of Emperor Augustus
> Licinus, but was dismissed from his post {possible relation to line 2}
> due to his refusal to participate in the pagan forms of worship his
> Christian faith deemed to be idolatrous. He became a priest, and
> bishop of Mopsuetia in Cilicia [note similarity with Sicily-Trinacrie
> of VIII.84]; he did not sign the canons of the 314 Council of Arles, a
> document which advised excommunication for soldiers errant from their
> military duties. Auxentius died circa 321.
>
> The locked in chains portion of line 3 could involve the great Ishmael
> led in chains scenario from IV.34, VII.29, etc. And the strong cable
> from 2000 could be a prophetic chain of events exposed as fulfilled.
>
> Also for 18 December, St. Gatian of Tours, founder of the diocese and
> its first bishop, died 337; the relevant verse may be the first
> portion of IV.46 -
>
> Bien defendu le fait par excellence,
> Garde-toi Tours de ta proche ruine
>
> The fact well-defended through excellence,
> Garde yourself Tours from your approaching ruin
* * *
Then God said,
"Let Us make man in Our image,
According to Our likeness..."
[Genesis 1:26]
"It is like a man going to a far country, who left his house and gave
authority to his servants, and to each his work, and commanded the
doorkeeper to watch. Watch therefore, for you do not know when the
master of the house is coming--in the evening, at midnight, at the
crowing of the rooster, or in the morning--lest coming suddenly, he
find you sleeping. And what I say to you, I say to all: Watch!"
[Gospel of Mark 13:34-37]
"Immediately after the tribulation of those days
The sun will be darkened,
And the moon will not give her light..."
[Gospel of Matthew 24:29]
Jean Guernon
Eagal a écrit :
Unfortunately no, Garonne and Loire and Saone are all locations in
France. And those verse you quote all seem to concern France, as most of
the quatrains do.
I will stick to discussing this (2,25) one since it is the one you are
elaborating on. I doubt that the Seer spoke about Walker anywhere.
Certainly not in a quatrain where he speaks of France's rivers. If
anything this quatrains is about Napoleon, the first verse, the
betrayal, about General Malet (but yes, there is indeed a betrayal), who
personified the emperor and was shot in 1812, the second, a reference to
the Emperor who married since 1810 as a second marriage to Anne
d'Autriche, in order to get offspring's, which by then didn't please
anyone (shadow), neither the bride, nor Austria, nor France. The two
last verse concern his defeat and the coalition invasion routes in
1814...
J.
>
> Par terre Attique chef de la sapience,
> Qui de present est la rose du monde,
> Pont ruine, et sa grande preeminence
> Sera subdite et naufrage des ondes.
Why is this (5,31) here?
Eagal
RHONE PESTILENCE
IX.85 reveals Languedoc and the Rhone may be two different times,
shattering the assumption that the 15 December Jupiter-Lilith trine
constituted a higher marriage for the 14 December annular solar
eclipse shadow; however the Sun-Moon conjunct immediately followed a
14 Dec Venus-Pluto conjunct 10:45am CST - this renders the meaning of
II.25 line 2 that hope will follow another conjunction. This could be
the Sun-Chiron conjunct 22 Dec 5:04pm CST already associated with the
capture of the major perpetrator of the WTC-Pentagon attack, thus
offering no timing for further domestic terrorism possibly foretold
elsewhere.
Dec conjuncts CST
23 Mercury-Pallas 3:30am CST
25 Ceres-Neptune Noon CST
28 Mars-Lilith 4:33am CST
The 28 December Mars-Lilith conjunct could be the goal of Mars in
III.56; moreover, if II.35 is taken as a mathematical test, presenting
22 Dec '99, 25 Dec '00, the next in sequence would be 28 Dec '01.
This is the feastday for the Holy Innocents, children massacred by
Herod's soldiers in an attempt to slaughter Jesus as a toddler: VI.19
may apply, with Vesta retrograding out of its false reign early 20 Dec
- as "the lady who would put the Innocents to the fire."
De Sens, d'Autun viendront jusqu'au Rosne
Pour passer outre les monts Pyrenees
For Sens, from Autumn they come as far as the Rhone
To pass beyond the Pyrenees mountains
The first part of II.74 could reflect efforts of Middle Easterners to
impress their opinions on the US via terrorist acts, although Sens
(here and VI.86's prelate) appears not like *Sense*, but another
saintly reference, most likely 7 January for St. Anastasius,
Archbishop from 968 to his death in 977, who began the building of
their first cathedral: 7 Jan 2002 has a Sun-Venus-Pallas convergence.
Flambeau ardent au ciel soir sera vu,
Pres de la fin et principe du Rosne
Burning torch in the sky will be seen at night,
Near the aim and principle of the Rhone
II.96 begins with the fiery incident still ahead, making it near
(arriving soon after) the Rhone manifestation, described in terms
similar to the Mars activity in III.56.
D'Arras et Bourges, de Brodes grands enseignes,
Un plus grand nombre de Gascons battre a pied:
Ceux long du Rosne saigneront les Espaignes
Proche du mont ou Sagonte s'assied.
IV.3 could also be related, the Prodded ones with great standards,
those along the Rhone bleeding those of the western land; the Gascons
battling on foot as anti-Taliban forces native to the Afghan region;
and the mountain where Sagonte sits somehow IX.68's Aymar...
Les Nibobriges par ceux de Perigort
Seront vexes, tenant jusqu'au Rosne;
L'associe de Gascons et Begorne
Trahir le temple, le pretre etant au prone.
IV.76's Nibobriges relate to 9 June 2002's Agen; Perigort is an
ancient county (including Perigeux) which connotes a Paleolithic
culture, like the cave dwellers at Lascaux - these vex the recipients
of the future event. I maintain Bigorre is an American codeword, so
its union with Gascons is predicted to lead to a betrayal of the
celestial temple (the 10 June 2002 condition); the last part about the
priest sermonizing could be figurative or saintly.
Dedans le Rosne par murs fera baigner
Jusqu'a cinq le dernier pres de Nolle
These lines ending VIII.38 were previously associated with the 29 Nov
'00 Indian cyclone as a "bathing by walls," the literal translation,
explaining Rhone esoterically as a Saturn-Lilith dark temple,
something not possible in the current timeframe. But if "murs" were
"mers," it would mean bathed by seas, which could be prophetic of a
bridge disaster. If the last line means, "As many as five the last
near Noel," it could regard propounded theories for the Rhone event
(the one preceding 25 Dec but looking past it may need no further
recalculation).
Lorsqu'on verra expiler le saint temple,
Plus grand du Rhosne leurs sacres profaner,
Par eux naitra pestilence si ample,
Roi fait injuste ne fera condamner.
VIII.62 links the Rhone and pestilence, profaning sacred things, after
the despoiling of the temple (by hand of war) which the 11 Sept attack
represented. The pestilence may be spread by waters (eaux)...
Every mention of the Rhone does not seem to involve this event, but
many appear to, and only careful examination can discern what each
usage really means. The various devices employed are so perplexing
many things should not be certain even after precise fulfillment: for
instance, II.70's "stone in the tree" could indicate the first plane
in the WTC tower by retrospective context, but not to someone
resolutely expecting to perceive a literal stone in an actual tree;
the horse eating oats or satiated mule is a metaphor, and by nature
these are only compelling through repeated confirmation.
The concept of a Grand Trine involving the Vertex is also
questionable: Saturn will be in trine with Ceres/Neptune, forming
their Grand Trine with the Vertex 28 Dec around 12:30pm PST; and the
Jupiter - Mars/Lilith - Vertex Grand Trine that day around 4pm PST.
For IX.30's perishing Norman, the Moon will be at the Ascendant 3:44pm
PST (and the lunar Node at 4:17pm PST).
The notion of Mars-Ascendant conjunct (towards 11am CST) being
critical to the "two rivers" event is probably eliminated by the
Lilith-Mars theory.
* * *
Deux gros de Mende, de Roudes et Milhau
Cahours, Limoges, Castres malo sepmano
De nuech l'intrado, de Bourdeaux un cailhau
Par Perigort au toc de la campano.
[IV.44]
PEACE
FOR A
DAY!
Eve made Adam eat an
Apple from Eden!
The perfect Christ -
Will be shedding blood!
Drives out the demon!
Our Master, Lord of Nazareth,
Plus the Master over Lucifer,
Devil army and Beelzebub,
Was better than "real good"!
* * *
But Jesus said to them,
"I ask you, is it lawful on the Sabbath
To do good,
Or to do evil?
To save a life,
Or to destroy it?"
[Gospel of Luke 6:9]
Eagal
The rivers are located in France, like most of the cities mentioned in
the verses, which will do nothing to solve the riddle of the quatrains
without deciphering these locations. The cities are usually feastdays
for saints to obtain calendric dates in tandem with astrological and
other indicators; obviously there are no saints associated with
rivers, so a different device is being used. I am aware that these
rivers appear in other verses which do not lend themselves to the
context explored here, and this was simply an attempt to find another
instance linking the Saone and Rhone besides IX.68, and discern
whether it could be concurrent. "Garonne" is NOT written in its
entirety (you cannot explain every deviation from your literal
theories as simply poetic alterations), and there is no overt mention
of flooding or overflowing, but instead "mortal outrage," not at all
fitting your purely geographic notion.
> I will stick to discussing this (2,25) one since it is the one you are
> elaborating on. I doubt that the Seer spoke about Walker anywhere.
He would certainly not have named him. John Walker Lynn was acting as
a guard in a foreign army, thus "foreign guard" fits whether you like
it or not. Immediately after Walker was questioned by CIA agent Mike
Spann, the latter was killed by other inmates (first US war casualty)
in the riot: thus Spann fits the guard cut down in line 3. This
occurred at a prison fort during the overtaking of a nation, and the
"foreign guard" is being spoken of as a traitor. I will not retract
my comments, but your objections are noted.
> Certainly not in a quatrain where he speaks of France's rivers.
You have not demonstrated any penetration of the meaning of the
rivers: your claim of "coalition invasion routes" seems conveniently
vague and suspect.
> If
> anything this quatrains is about Napoleon, the first verse, the
> betrayal, about General Malet (but yes, there is indeed a betrayal), who
> personified the emperor and was shot in 1812, the second, a reference to
> the Emperor who married since 1810 as a second marriage to Anne
> d'Autriche, in order to get offspring's, which by then didn't please
> anyone (shadow), neither the bride, nor Austria, nor France. The two
> last verse concern his defeat and the coalition invasion routes in
> 1814...
>
> J.
There are several quatrains deemed to be about Napoleon, but this is
not among them. From Edgar Leoni:
"The guard here probably refers to foreign mercenaries, such as the
Swiss or Albanians. 'Higher marriage' suggests more pay in the
service of a ruler for whose benefit their treachery would be. But
then, in the 20th-century lingo, the traitors are double-crossed.
Since the use of mercenaries came to an end in France (the probable
scene) in 1792, this verse would have to have been fulfilled by then."
I rejected this opinion before I wrote, and I also reject yours now.
I am not saying you cannot weave your interpretation around the lines,
but that it would be more your artifice than the intended meaning as I
see it. Your analysis is even more far-fetched than mine, relying on
a very obscure execution of a NON-FOREIGN (!) impostor not even
outlined (and apparently not cross-referenced anywhere else for
clarity); and the shadow as widespread displeasure with a second
marriage defies the obvious astronomcal eclipse reference (so long as
you are aware you are doing that). I cannot seriously consider the
Battle of Waterloo as "the fort taken in the press."
If Nostradamus had wanted to indicate a famous personage like
Napoleon, he could have utilized more specific clues to enhance
clarity at fulfillment: these guards are non-descript, pawns in a
larger military drama, not generals and emperors. Here is how
Nostradamus spoke of Napoleon:
Un Empereur naitra pres d'Italie,
Qui a l'Empire sera vendu bien cher:
Diront avec quels gens il se rallie
Qu'on trouvera moins prince que boucher.
An Emperor will be born near Italy, [the isle of Corsica]
Who will cost the Empire a high price:
They will say with the sort who surround him
That one will find him less prince than butcher.
[I.60]
Do you notice the difference?
Quite a demotion from Emperor to merely being called a guard: with
such inconsistency, identifying key players would be impossible, so it
could be your wanting to view more quatrains as Napoleonic. The past
is safer, isn't it?
> > Par terre Attique chef de la sapience,
> > Qui de present est la rose du monde,
> > Pont ruine, et sa grande preeminence
> > Sera subdite et naufrage des ondes.
>
> Why is this (5,31) here?
That particular postscript, a repost of a verse quite pivotal to the
discussion of further domestic terrorism in the US, was made for a
specific reason which I decline to explain. But the verse was fully
discussed previously, and that commentary is far more important than
my rationale for composing enigmatic addenda. Suffice to say this is
one of a series of inter-related verses whose manifestation appears
imminent. But you can go on expecting the world to come crashing down
onto France one day, while the prophecies continue to transpire before
your obdurate eyes locked into tunnel-vision.
Jean Guernon
Eagal a écrit :
Gar. with a dot has to be the river like the rest is. Biw if you want to
see something else, suit yourself. I stick with my interpretation.
Look at how the coallition invaded France.
It is suspect only if you don't know the history of the defeat of
France.
"fort prise" is not a fort, which would read "fort pris" masculine, but
fort here is the adverb strongly
The guard-> the national guards
fort prise-> strongly taken
dans la presse -> in the stranglehold
Why? ...because they came by the three waterways.
>
> If Nostradamus had wanted to indicate a famous personage like
> Napoleon, he could have utilized more specific clues to enhance
> clarity at fulfillment: these guards are non-descript, pawns in a
> larger military drama, not generals and emperors. Here is how
> Nostradamus spoke of Napoleon:
>
> Un Empereur naitra pres d'Italie,
> Qui a l'Empire sera vendu bien cher:
> Diront avec quels gens il se rallie
> Qu'on trouvera moins prince que boucher.
>
> An Emperor will be born near Italy, [the isle of Corsica]
> Who will cost the Empire a high price:
> They will say with the sort who surround him
> That one will find him less prince than butcher.
>
> [I.60]
>
> Do you notice the difference?
> Quite a demotion from Emperor to merely being called a guard: with
> such inconsistency, identifying key players would be impossible, so it
> could be your wanting to view more quatrains as Napoleonic. The past
> is safer, isn't it?
I am sorry but there are numerous quatrains about Napoleaon and France
and not all consider him nicely, here it is the defeat of France,
harldly a glorious day for him.
The world will see one day most of the quatrains have come to pass, and
I can assure you that what they will see in this quatrain is an event
about France.
>
> > > Par terre Attique chef de la sapience,
> > > Qui de present est la rose du monde,
> > > Pont ruine, et sa grande preeminence
> > > Sera subdite et naufrage des ondes.
> >
> > Why is this (5,31) here?
>
> That particular postscript, a repost of a verse quite pivotal to the
> discussion of further domestic terrorism in the US, was made for a
> specific reason which I decline to explain. But the verse was fully
> discussed previously, and that commentary is far more important than
> my rationale for composing enigmatic addenda. Suffice to say this is
> one of a series of inter-related verses whose manifestation appears
> imminent. But you can go on expecting the world to come crashing down
> onto France one day, while the prophecies continue to transpire before
> your obdurate eyes locked into tunnel-vision.
Sorry I tried to set you straight!!! Keep wearing your blinkers!!! Jeez.
J.
Eagal
> Eagal a écrit :
THE DORMOUSE
> > La garde etrange trahira forteresse,
> > Espoir et ombre de plus haut mariage;
> > Garde decue, fort prise dans la presse,
> > Loire, Saone, Rosne, Gar. a mort outrage.
The foreign guard will betray the fortress,
Hope and shadow from higher marriage;
Guard cut down, fort taken in the press,
Dormouse, Saone, Rhone, Beware of death outrage.
In the latest translation, wherein Saone represents the Mississippi
River, and Rhone the Ohio River, both only in the region north of
Cairo, Illinois, which becomes analogous to Lyon because the usage is
allegorical.
> > The only other combined mention of Saone and Rhone besides IX.68 may
> > be found in II.25, which appears to recount the story of the American
> > fighting for the Taliban, John Walker, as the "foreign guard" who
> > proves traitorous to the fortress (possibly the Pentagon). The 14
> > December annular solar eclipse seems to be the shadow of line 2: its
> > being married with hope does not hint towards any further critical
> > period.
> >
> > The guard could be deceived in line 3, but the Latin for cut down
> > could be implied. The fort is probably not the fortress of line 1,
> > but the prison fort at Mazar-e Sharif which was seized despite a riot;
> > the "press" fits the advance of the anti-Taliban forces across
> > Afghanistan.
> >
> > Explanations for the Loire and Garonne may present themselves,
> > obviously having little to do with the actual French rivers. Loire
> > could transmute to "L'ire," or "The anger," for instance, as
> > widespread emotional response to the transcribed videotape recently
> > released. That "Gar." is an abbreviation could prove consequential,
> > potentially even reduceable to "Gare," an interjection meaning
> > "Beware!" or "Look out!" "Garenne" is a warren or preserve, which
> > does not suit the final phrase about mortal outrage as well...
>
>
> Unfortunately no, Garonne and Loire and Saone are all locations in
> France. And those verse you quote all seem to concern France, as most of
> the quatrains do.
Okay, I will change one element of my analysis regarding the rivers:
Loire should not mean "L'ire" for "The ire," as reaction to a
videotape being televised. "Loir" (merely removing the "e") in both
French and English means a Dormouse, which derives from 'dormant
mouse,' since the rodent exhibits seasonal torpidity. Perhaps it is a
twist on the 'sleeping giant' concept, with the mouse indicating
meekness, whatever that portends.
But again your Napoleonic interpretation is unacceptable, not because
I am avoiding your incredibly astute historical perception, but
because you have not presented arguments which would persuade me this
was fulfilled circa 1814. The assertion that those four rivers were
instrumental enough in the demise of Napoleon to warrant line 4 would
be the weakest part of your thesis, were it not for the French
impostor general cast as *foreign* guard ("etrange" can mean little
else in the context used). Even if it could be demonstrated that you
are miraculously correct and we can ascertain that Napoleon elsewhere
called Emperor is suddenly a mere guard cut down, your nay-saying
profits you nothing, since a more conclusive manifestation in a later
period is hardly implausible given everything the author wrote as
guidelines. And he never stated that if a particular place is named
its significance must be exclusively geographical, a premise upon
which much of your suppositions are based.
Instead of only doing complex post-mortems to show how modern events
could have been predicted, I am also reversing the process to
extrapolate into the future those events which may be anticipated as
arriving soon enough to effectively use the prophecies. While the
events themselves may be graphically described, their timing was the
factor most obscured, which regards precision as well as sequencing.
You do not seem to have read all the messages on this thread to obtain
an overall view of what is being postulated: the entire picture is not
in a single posting. There was an interpretation wherein Paris
remained the literal French city, for which thunder and hail was
predicted between two other events elsewhere. So it is a subjective
matter based on intuition and hopefully enlightened guesswork. As the
critical date shifts, the event itself of course remains the same.
Three prophesied events may happen that day (now figured at 28
December), the least momentous of which is a Parisian hailstorm. The
last line of IX.55 also seems for actual France, predicting blood and
fire (astrological conditions possibly occurring 26 September 2004);
but that is after many other references to Paris, Gaul and other
unmistakeably French locations had been reduced to some other types of
information by various means.
____
The Dormouse slowly opened his eyes. 'I wasn't asleep,' he said in a
hoarse, feeble voice: 'I heard every word you fellows were saying.'
--"Alice's Adventures in Wonderland," L.C.
Eagal
> > You have not demonstrated any penetration of the meaning of the
> > rivers: your claim of "coalition invasion routes" seems conveniently
> > vague and suspect.
>
> Look at how the coallition invaded France.
>
> It is suspect only if you don't know the history of the defeat of
> France.
You have been invited to print any historical records to back up your
claim, and instead have chosen to simply repeat your uncorroborated
assertion, insinuating that only my ignorance prevents me from
accepting your version. I know that Prussia, Sweden, and Spain allied
themselves with Great Britain and Russia (only the Spanish would have
been required to cross one of those rivers, the Garonne); Napoleon was
defeated at the "Battle of the Nations" in Leipzig (in what was
recently East Germany) October 1813. By March 1814 the Duke of
Wellington was advancing on Paris from the south (which could involve
only crossing the Loire). Napoleon abdicated 11 April, 1814, and
became ruler of Elba island (off the Italian coast); he escaped this
exile in February 1815, began a march to Paris March 1st. Upon his
reaching Paris, the reinstated Bourbon King Louis XVIII fled. 12
June, 1815, Napoleon left Paris to join his army; Wellington and
Marshal Gebhard Blucher moved against him with their separate armies.
Napoleon, wishing to attack them before they joined, defeated Blucher
at Ligny 16 June; Marshal Ney went against Wellington's British forces
at Quatre Bras, causing the fall back to Waterloo, Belgium (far from
any of those four rivers). After the 18 June historical Battle of
Waterloo, Napoleon fled to Paris, abdicated again, but failed to
escape France, being forced to surrender to the captain of a British
man-of-war vessel. After being taken to England as a prisoner,
Napoleon was exiled to the island of Saint Helena (off the western
coast of Africa). He died of cancer 5 May, 1821, and was buried on
the island, but in 1840 the remains were unearthed and taken to Paris.
Nowhere in this scenario do I see the Loire, Saone, Rhone and Garonne
as playing an essential role, but if you have some obscure facts to
contradict this information, please provide them rather than merely
alluding to the ignorance of people who disagree with you.
> "fort prise" is not a fort, which would read "fort pris" masculine, but
> fort here is the adverb strongly
>
> The guard-> the national guards
> fort prise-> strongly taken
"Fort" m.: strong point; center; fortress (a word also appearing in
the quatrain, in a different form for distinction from each other).
It can ALSO be an adjective or adverb, used thusly: "au plus fort du
combat," in the thick of the fight - but there must be a noun
somewhere, and what you have done is convert the noun into an adverb
so the meaning is so vague your interpretation seems potentially
plausible, which does not make it correct.
> dans la presse -> in the stranglehold
And you wouldn't call the overtaking of Afghanistan a strangehold on
the influence of the Taliban?
> Why? ...because they came by the three waterways.
You have been promoting the idea that all FOUR rivers were pivotal,
now you say three, and are not forthcoming about which, when and
why...
> > Quite a demotion from Emperor to merely being called a guard: with
> > such inconsistency, identifying key players would be impossible, so it
> > could be your wanting to view more quatrains as Napoleonic. The past
> > is safer, isn't it?
>
> I am sorry but there are numerous quatrains about Napoleaon and France
> and not all consider him nicely, here it is the defeat of France,
> harldly a glorious day for him.
This is convenient for you, but not a satisfying explanation. You
seem to be taking advantage of the inherent vaguery to force a famous
war scenario into the little box of II.25, which to me economically
encapsulates a critical moment in the current War on Terrorism without
much mangling.
> The world will see one day most of the quatrains have come to pass, and
> I can assure you that what they will see in this quatrain is an event
> about France.
It is unlikely that a majority will ever come to a consensus about
many quatrains written by Nostradamus, probably never about this
obscure verse, which has only an ancillary purpose as you see it.
Prophecy is supposed to have some surprising impact on human life, but
your efforts have been to limit it both regionally and temporally
through your condescending pseudo-history lesson, to reduce the
intended effect as much as possible, and eliminate proper usage at the
critical time. I have already shown there was a "higher marriage,"
via the conjunction of Venus and Pluto (10:33am to 10:52am CST 14 Dec
'01) about four hours before the Sun-Moon conjunct bringing the shadow
of the annular solar eclipse the same day (about 2:45pm CST). And
using IV.34, VII.29, IV.84, etc., the upcoming Sun-Chiron conjunct
will supposedly be linked with "Hope" by heralding the capture of the
11 Sept attacks' perpetrator. But I can assume even if this comes to
pass as hypothesized, you will hold to your opinion, proving you are
obstinately detached from reality.
Regarding Loire as a loir, this "Dormouse" appears to represent the
terrorist cell which may become active, but is now in a state of
dormancy: take the mouse for its cowardly connotation, or the closely
related rodent the rat as sneaky and despicable.
> Sorry I tried to set you straight!!! Keep wearing your blinkers!!! Jeez.
>
> J.
"And why do you look at the speck in your brother's eye, but do not
consider the plank in your own eye? Or how can you say to your
brother, 'Let me remove the speck from your eye'; and look, a plank is
in your own eye? Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own
eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your
brother's eye."
[Gospel of Matthew 7:3-5]
Eagal
> "fort prise" is not a fort, which would read "fort pris" masculine, but
> fort here is the adverb strongly
>
> The guard-> the national guards
> fort prise-> strongly taken
So you still read "prise" as the past participle of "prendre," but
deny that it could relate to a physical fort since that is a masculine
noun? You should also realize "prise" could be a feminine noun
itself, meaning prize, capture or seizure, rendering the translation
as, "fort seizure within the stranglehold," not "strongly taken." I
wonder why you avoided noticing this, unless it were your desire to
obscure that fact that there is a fort as well as a fortress...
Eagal
THE GLORIOUS MOMENT
(Historical overview of Napoleonic demise & Beethoven, from G. Grove:)
Prussia, Sweden, and Spain allied themselves with Great Britain and
Russia (only the Spanish could have used or crossed one of those
rivers, the Garonne); Napoleon was defeated at the "Battle of the
Nations" in Leipzig (in what was recently East Germany) October 1813.
"...Napoleon's star was rapidly sinking. We are in 1813. The spring
months brought to Vienna the news of Moscow and the destruction of the
immense army in retreat from Russia; the health of the Emperor had
never been better, but 300,000 French soldiers had perished. The War
of Liberation had begun in Germany, and, notwithstanding the defeats
in Lutzen and Bautzen (May 2nd and 21st), the spirit of the German
people was fast rising. On July 13 the battle of Vittoria (fought
June 21) was known in Vienna, and by the beginning of November the
decisive rout of Leipzig and the gallant triumph of the Austrian and
Bavarian troops to cut off the French retreat at Hanau on October 30
were also known. Over this news Vienna was in a state of great
excitement. Beethoven was not behind his fellow-citizens...he was
induced to set to music a programme of a musical piece representing
the battle of Vittoria...It occupied him from August to October, 1813,
and an occasion for its production was found at the Hall of the
University, and on the 8th December in that year, in addition, the
Seventh Symphony, for the first time, and two marches for Maelzel's
automaton trumpeter. The Symphony was well received, but the
battle-piece took the fancy of the public to an extraordinary degree,
and the concert was repeated four days later, on the 12th. The piece,
entitled 'Wellington Sieg, oder die Schlact bei Vittoria' (Op. 91), is
in two divisions: 1st, the Schlact or Battle, founded on 'Rule,
Britannia,' and 'Marlbrouk'; and 2nd, the Sieges-Symphonie or
Victory."
By March 1814 the Duke of Wellington was advancing on Paris from the
south (which could involve only crossing the Loire). Napoleon
abdicated 11 April, 1814, and became ruler of Elba island (off the
Italian coast)...
"In April, 1814, Napoleon was banished to Elba, and by the end of
September the representatives of various allied states had assembled
in Vienna, though they did not go to business till November. This was
the famous 'Congress of Vienna,' an immense collection of royalties
and other celebrities. It was, in fact, the first breathing time of
Europe after its dozens of years of slavery and apprehension under
Napoleon's domination. No wonder the plenipotentiaries could not at
once settle to work! Notwithstanding the presence of Wellington and
Castlereagh progress was so slow and the festivities so gay as to give
rise to the well known remark, 'Le congres ne marche pas, il danse.'
Beethoven seized the opportunity of performing some music specially
appropriate to so great an occasion. For this he chose a cantata,
entitled 'The glorious moment' - 'Der glorreiche Augenblick'
[republished in other words in 1836 as 'Preis der Tonkunst' - 'Praise
of music'] - written by Weissenbach; he began its composition for
solos, chorus and orchestra in September, and the first performance
was given on November 29, in the Redouten-Saal, which had been placed
at his disposal for the prupose by the Government. Beethoven was
permitted to issue the invitations in his own name - a remarkable
tribute to his position in Vienna. The concert was for his benefit;
it was announced for the 26th, but postponed to the 29th. The
programme contained the Seventh Symphony, the Cantata, and the Battle
Symphony. The large room of the establishment was crowded with an
audience of 6,000 persons, and in a letter to the Archduke Rudolph,
Beethoven describes himself as 'exhausted with fatigue, vexation,
satisfaction, and delight.'
"The program was repeated on Friday, December 2nd, but with a
comparitively poor result. A third performance was intended, but was
given up. One of the fetes provided for the Congress was a Tournament
or Carrousel, in the Riding School, on November 23rd, and it would
appear from another letter of Beethoven's to the Archduke that he was
composing music for it, which he promises shall arrive 'at full
gallop' (mit dem schnellsten Galopp), though nothing of it has yet
been discovered."
Eagal
WATERLOO:4,75
By March 1814 the Duke of Wellington was advancing on Paris from the
south (which could involve only crossing the Loire). Napoleon
abdicated 11 April, 1814, and became ruler of Elba island (off the
Italian coast); he escaped this exile in February 1815, began a march
to Paris March 1st. The period is known as his Hundred Days. Upon
his reaching Paris, the reinstated Bourbon King Louis XVIII (brother
of Louis XVI, Louis VII being the Dauphin thought to have died in
prison) fled. 12 June, 1815, Napoleon left Paris to join his army;
Wellington and Marshal Gebhard Blucher moved against him with their
separate armies. Napoleon, wishing to attack them before they joined,
defeated Blucher at Ligny 16 June; Marshal Ney went against
Wellington's British forces at Quatre Bras, causing the fall back to
Waterloo, Belgium (far from any of those four rivers). After the 18
June historical Battle of Waterloo, Napoleon fled to Paris, abdicated
again, but failed to escape France, being forced to surrender to the
captain of a British man-of-war vessel. After being taken to England
as a prisoner, Napoleon was exiled to the island of Saint Helena (off
the western coast of Africa). He died of cancer 5 May, 1821...
Napoleon seized power in 1799, first as Consul, then as Emperor; he
attained the largest empire since Charlemagne's time, with conquests
beyond Europe. The turning point was the 1812-13 Russian campaign,
where his troops, like those of Hitler 1942-43, were unprepared for
the severe winter.
Pret a combattre fera defection,
Chef adversaire obtiendra la victoire:
L'arriere-garde fera defension,
Les defaillants morts au blanc territoire.
Ready for combat one will affect desertion,
Chief adversary will obtain the victory:
The rear guard will attempt protection,
The faltering ones dead in the white territory.
The deserter of the first line is given as Emmanuel, Marquis de
Grouchy.
The chief adversary in line two, Arthur, Duke of Wellington, at
Waterloo.
By rear guard, Imperial Guard is inferred for the third line.
And those dead soldiers in the Russian snow for the final line.
IV.75 seems like a much more fitting prophecy of the demise of
Napoleon at Waterloo than II.25. One would hope this would be
satisfactory for anyone without a vested interest in the topic.
Jean Guernon
Eagal a écrit :
>
> Jean Guernon <jgue...@globetrotter.net> wrote in message news:<3C22E680...@globetrotter.net>...
>
> > > You have not demonstrated any penetration of the meaning of the
> > > rivers: your claim of "coalition invasion routes" seems conveniently
> > > vague and suspect.
> >
> > Look at how the coallition invaded France.
> >
> > It is suspect only if you don't know the history of the defeat of
> > France.
>
> You have been invited to print any historical records to back up your
> claim, and instead have chosen to simply repeat your uncorroborated
> assertion, insinuating that only my ignorance prevents me from
> accepting your version. I know that Prussia, Sweden, and Spain allied
> themselves with Great Britain and Russia (only the Spanish would have
> been required to cross one of those rivers, the Garonne); Napoleon was
> defeated at the "Battle of the Nations" in Leipzig (in what was
> recently East Germany) October 1813. By March 1814 the Duke of
> Wellington was advancing on Paris from the south (which could involve
> only crossing the Loire).
You said it. all this is it. Here:
http://gallica.bnf.fr/scripts/ConsultationTout.exe?O=22619&T=0&E=0&D=0&P1=81425271&P2=0
you have the defeat of napoleon troop in Spain and in Italy they had
invested all on attack and nothing in defense, so these coalition troops
come through Spain into France, through the Garonne, through Italy into
France through the Rhosne the Soane and the Loire. Of course the battles
will occur further North and other coallitin forces from germany will
join in, bu the fact is that France was taken off guard from the south
becasue it had anticipated nothing therefor defense, only attack. This
quatrain is about that. Many other also cove otehr angles of Napoleon's
battle, see on my site. But the point of this quatrain here is
satisfied.
If you are interested in history and love a ood anrration, read the
first chapters of book 51:
Détresse de nos troupes en Italie et en Espagne. - Opérations du prince
Eugène dans le Frioul pendant l'automne de 1813, et sa retraite sur
l'Adige. - Opérations du maréchal Soult en Navarre, et ses efforts
infructueux pour sauver Saint-Sébastien et Pampelune. - Retraite de ce
maréchal sur la Nive et l'Adour. - Retraite du maréchal Suchet sur la
Catalogne. - Déplorable situation de la France, où tout avait été
disposé pour la conquête et rien pour la défense. -
> Napoleon abdicated 11 April, 1814, and
> became ruler of Elba island (off the Italian coast); he escaped this
> exile in February 1815, began a march to Paris March 1st. Upon his
> reaching Paris, the reinstated Bourbon King Louis XVIII fled. 12
> June, 1815, Napoleon left Paris to join his army; Wellington and
> Marshal Gebhard Blucher moved against him with their separate armies.
> Napoleon, wishing to attack them before they joined, defeated Blucher
> at Ligny 16 June; Marshal Ney went against Wellington's British forces
> at Quatre Bras, causing the fall back to Waterloo, Belgium (far from
> any of those four rivers). After the 18 June historical Battle of
> Waterloo, Napoleon fled to Paris, abdicated again, but failed to
> escape France, being forced to surrender to the captain of a British
> man-of-war vessel. After being taken to England as a prisoner,
> Napoleon was exiled to the island of Saint Helena (off the western
> coast of Africa). He died of cancer 5 May, 1821, and was buried on
> the island, but in 1840 the remains were unearthed and taken to Paris.
> Nowhere in this scenario do I see the Loire, Saone, Rhone and Garonne
> as playing an essential role, but if you have some obscure facts to
> contradict this information, please provide them rather than merely
> alluding to the ignorance of people who disagree with you.
If you can't see but your own take (becasue you won't look), it is not
my problem.
>
> > "fort prise" is not a fort, which would read "fort pris" masculine, but
> > fort here is the adverb strongly
> >
> > The guard-> the national guards
> > fort prise-> strongly taken
>
> "Fort" m.: strong point; center; fortress (a word also appearing in
> the quatrain, in a different form for distinction from each other).
> It can ALSO be an adjective or adverb, used thusly: "au plus fort du
> combat," in the thick of the fight - but there must be a noun
> somewhere, and what you have done is convert the noun into an adverb
> so the meaning is so vague your interpretation seems potentially
> plausible, which does not make it correct.
>
> > dans la presse -> in the stranglehold
>
> And you wouldn't call the overtaking of Afghanistan a strangehold on
> the influence of the Taliban?
Jeez...
>
> > Why? ...because they came by the three waterways.
>
> You have been promoting the idea that all FOUR rivers were pivotal,
> now you say three, and are not forthcoming about which, when and
> why...
Right 4 rivers... I was saying that from the top of my head.
>
> > > Quite a demotion from Emperor to merely being called a guard: with
> > > such inconsistency, identifying key players would be impossible, so it
> > > could be your wanting to view more quatrains as Napoleonic. The past
> > > is safer, isn't it?
> >
> > I am sorry but there are numerous quatrains about Napoleon and France
> > and not all consider him nicely, here it is the defeat of France,
> > harldly a glorious day for him.
>
> This is convenient for you, but not a satisfying explanation. You
> seem to be taking advantage of the inherent vaguery to force a famous
> war scenario into the little box of II.25, which to me economically
> encapsulates a critical moment in the current War on Terrorism without
> much mangling.
>
I can guatrantee you that the name of these rivers can allude only to an
event in France.
> > The world will see one day most of the quatrains have come to pass, and
> > I can assure you that what they will see in this quatrain is an event
> > about France.
>
> It is unlikely that a majority will ever come to a consensus about
> many quatrains written by Nostradamus, probably never about this
Yes there will be. Nostradamus said it. I know so.
> obscure verse, which has only an ancillary purpose as you see it.
> Prophecy is supposed to have some surprising impact on human life, but
> your efforts have been to limit it both regionally and temporally
> through your condescending pseudo-history lesson, to reduce the
> intended effect as much as possible, and eliminate proper usage at the
> critical time. I have already shown there was a "higher marriage,"
> via the conjunction of Venus and Pluto (10:33am to 10:52am CST 14 Dec
> '01) about four hours before the Sun-Moon conjunct bringing the shadow
> of the annular solar eclipse the same day (about 2:45pm CST). And
No way.
> using IV.34, VII.29, IV.84, etc., the upcoming Sun-Chiron conjunct
> will supposedly be linked with "Hope" by heralding the capture of the
> 11 Sept attacks' perpetrator. But I can assume even if this comes to
> pass as hypothesized, you will hold to your opinion, proving you are
> obstinately detached from reality.
Hahaha this is a probability that has nothing to do with this quatrain.
>
> Regarding Loire as a loir, this "Dormouse" appears to represent the
> terrorist cell which may become active, but is now in a state of
> dormancy: take the mouse for its cowardly connotation, or the closely
> related rodent the rat as sneaky and despicable.
LOL
>
> > Sorry I tried to set you straight!!! Keep wearing your blinkers!!! Jeez.
> >
> > J.
>
> "And why do you look at the speck in your brother's eye, but do not
> consider the plank in your own eye? Or how can you say to your
> brother, 'Let me remove the speck from your eye'; and look, a plank is
> in your own eye? Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own
> eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your
> brother's eye."
>
> [Gospel of Matthew 7:3-5]
Except I wear spectacles, not speck.
Maybe you too could use some?
J.
Jean Guernon
Eagal a écrit :
What fort in France? Come on.
J.
Jean Guernon
Eagal a écrit :
Oh but this is indeed also about Napoleon.
Both are.
J.
Eagal
MOON MAKES 3
IV.34 line 2 still suggests asteroid Chiron as reigning celestial body
conjuncting the golden Sun in relation to some historical capture and
extradition, an astrological event which is quite rare, making the 22
December 2001 condition worthy of further consideration. IV.84
follows locked in chains with "behind a rude cable," which could be
applied to the sequence of conjunctions following Sun-Chiron, which
are also sequential in the alignment formed.
Dec conjunct positions
22 Sun-Chiron 1,11' Capricorn
23 Mercury-Pallas 12,00' Capricorn
25 Ceres-Neptune 7,14' Aquarius
The presence of Uranus around 22,11' Aquarius (between Ceres-Neptune
and Mars-Lilith) seems to then break the linear chain of conjunctions,
which nonetheless appears to continue with Mars-Lilith 28 December @
14,17' Pisces.
10:45pm CST 24 December will be the maximization time of a Grand Trine
involving the Moon, Juno, and Venus (which will be in rough opposition
with the lunar Node). This is more likely for VIII.84's Trinacrie
codeword than a Grand Trine involving the Vertex, though the
gulf/bridge event should not precede the other two events using the
chronology of III.56.
The Crescent port of I.94 need not be 30 Dec '01's penumbral lunar
eclipse: for another explanation of IV.84's Auxerre there is St.
Henry, whose feastday in 2002 will be accompanied by the 24 June
similar astronomical phenomenon.
* * *
"...et sont perpetuelles vaticinations, pour d'ici a l'annee 3797..."
L'an mil neuf cent nonante neuf sept mois...
Eagal
http://gallica.bnf.fr/scripts/ConsultationTout.exe?O=22619&T=0&E=0&D=0&P1=81425271&P2=0
> you have the defeat of napoleon troop in Spain and in Italy they had
> invested all on attack and nothing in defense, so these coalition troops
> come through Spain into France, through the Garonne, through Italy into
> France through the Rhosne the Soane and the Loire.
And why not the same quatrain for WWII, with Hitler as one guard or
the other, and overtaking France including its rivers? There has to
be a precision that makes fulfillment not only "likely" but absolutely
decisive. You have not made that case:
Of course the battles
> will occur further North and other coallitin forces from germany will
> join in,
And it is the BATTLES that occupy this seer, who appears obsessed with
following the bloodshed! If the rivers were only used for entry,
there was no "death outrage" as is written about them. And it absurd
to presume that everything MUST involve France as you do, when these
prophecies are given with the warning that various devices have been
employed to obscure their true meanings: even when a wide list of
places was named, he added that was where MOST of the events would
transpire!
> bu the fact is that France was taken off guard from the south
> becasue it had anticipated nothing therefor defense, only attack. This
> quatrain is about that.
You are extremely conceited to make a statement like that. I only
indicate where there is a strong likelihood of fulfillment; you
present yourself as the ultimate last word on the subject. You would
have us believe Nostradamus only predicted as far as, what, 1815? He
wrote it was "to the year 3797," and I'm only following up on what
began with the 1999 mention in X.72! Some may like to think this
timetable does not exist, but that does not make it go away.
> Many other also cove otehr angles of Napoleon's
> battle, see on my site. But the point of this quatrain here is
> satisfied.
>
> If you are interested in history and love a ood anrration, read the
> first chapters of book 51:
>
> Détresse de nos troupes en Italie et en Espagne. - Opérations du prince
> Eugène dans le Frioul pendant l'automne de 1813, et sa retraite sur
> l'Adige. - Opérations du maréchal Soult en Navarre, et ses efforts
> infructueux pour sauver Saint-Sébastien et Pampelune. - Retraite de ce
> maréchal sur la Nive et l'Adour. - Retraite du maréchal Suchet sur la
> Catalogne. - Déplorable situation de la France, où tout avait été
> disposé pour la conquête et rien pour la défense. -
> If you can't see but your own take (becasue you won't look), it is not
> my problem.
If what you were saying was compelling, I would acknowledge it, but to
force your ill-fitting opinion on some generic "guard" is not
impressive. If you really believe all these astrological cues were
missed from centuries ago, shouldn't you be demonstrating that instead
of seeing Napoleon everywhere?
> > > Why? ...because they came by the three waterways.
> >
> > You have been promoting the idea that all FOUR rivers were pivotal,
> > now you say three, and are not forthcoming about which, when and
> > why...
>
> Right 4 rivers... I was saying that from the top of my head.
My point is that much of what you say is off the top of your head, and
requires no research or accuracy since all roads apparently lead to
Napoleon with you.
> I can guatrantee you that the name of these rivers can allude only to an
> event in France.
You may not be interested in all the instances in which my
applications of the prophecies have been proven potentially correct in
short-term, immediate future, since it does not further your
interests, but I am assuming you have no such similar track-record, so
your opinion means very little to me. Your notion of issuing a
guarantee is just grandstanding; only Nostradamus knew why those
rivers were named, and withheld any actual explanation, leaving us
only with the names themeselves, their etymological meanings,
geographic factors, cross-referenceable usages in various contexts,
etc. It is a riddle, not simply a map: it must be solved, and your
solution fails because the scenario you have chosen does not involve
those four rivers in a manner to justify the way it is written. Even
if you could get past that, there are the other problems with your
theory, despite your relentless protests.
> > > The world will see one day most of the quatrains have come to pass, and
> > > I can assure you that what they will see in this quatrain is an event
> > > about France.
> >
> > It is unlikely that a majority will ever come to a consensus about
> > many quatrains written by Nostradamus, probably never about this
>
>
> Yes there will be. Nostradamus said it. I know so.
What he wrote was that many of the quatrains would never be
understood!
Reprinting my comments and appending them with denials is not a
debate, unless you're a five-year-old!
You still did not explain why you went against your obvious knowledge
of the French language to see "fort prise dans la presse" as "strongly
taken in the press" rather than the more LOGICAL "fort seizure within
the press." Where the fort is (in terms of translation) is
irrelevant: one should assume these are news headlines, carrying
maximum information for the words - you choose to diminish meaning so
that your prosaic theories will seem more plausible, i.e.,
disinforming the public, which is already confused enough.
And in accepting IV.75, you cannot so easily claim II.25 for the same
event, since the "rear guard" was for there unnamed Emperor Napoleon,
who still does not seem consistent with being called a guard himself.
IV.75 is probably about the Battle of Waterloo, and II.25 is almost
definitely not. Maybe you should check out history AFTER 1815, maybe
EVEN after 1999!
Jean Guernon
Eagal a écrit :
>
> Jean Guernon <jgue...@globetrotter.net> wrote in message news:<3C240985...@globetrotter.net>...
> http://gallica.bnf.fr/scripts/ConsultationTout.exe?O=22619&T=0&E=0&D=0&P1=81425271&P2=0
> > you have the defeat of napoleon troop in Spain and in Italy they had
> > invested all on attack and nothing in defense, so these coalition troops
> > come through Spain into France, through the Garonne, through Italy into
> > France through the Rhosne the Soane and the Loire.
>
> And why not the same quatrain for WWII, with Hitler as one guard or
> the other, and overtaking France including its rivers? There has to
> be a precision that makes fulfillment not only "likely" but absolutely
> decisive. You have not made that case:
Because there was the maginot line, there was a history.
>
> Of course the battles
> > will occur further North and other coallitin forces from germany will
> > join in,
>
> And it is the BATTLES that occupy this seer, who appears obsessed with
> following the bloodshed! If the rivers were only used for entry,
> there was no "death outrage" as is written about them. And it absurd
> to presume that everything MUST involve France as you do, when these
> prophecies are given with the warning that various devices have been
> employed to obscure their true meanings: even when a wide list of
> places was named, he added that was where MOST of the events would
> transpire!
What occupies the seer is to relate an event. The invasion occurred by
those streams and then the battles occurred a few kilometers from there,
but he speaks of their penetration in this last line here, not their
point of clash.
Who are you to decide what the seer can or cannot say?
>
> > bu the fact is that France was taken off guard from the south
> > becasue it had anticipated nothing there for defense, only attack. This
> > quatrain is about that.
>
> You are extremely conceited to make a statement like that. I only
I am not conceit, I give you the link, and this is what history says,
not me.
> indicate where there is a strong likelihood of fulfillment; you
> present yourself as the ultimate last word on the subject. You would
> have us believe Nostradamus only predicted as far as, what, 1815? He
What? I don't know why you say that. I speak of this quatrain here, what
are you talking about?
I show history about it. Period. You are way too paranoid it seems to
grasp my interpretation.
> wrote it was "to the year 3797," and I'm only following up on what
> began with the 1999 mention in X.72! Some may like to think this
> timetable does not exist, but that does not make it go away.
Absolutely, 3797. I don't, get your pretense that I would mean to stop
in 1815. Where do you read that? What is your problem?
This is in our published books bud, They requires well over ten years
full time of 16 hours a day of research.
I don't have all totally that stored in memory. When I make a point with
you I may just speak casually, doesn't, change the fact hat it is
documented.
But hey, if you don't like it stop losing time with me then and stop
losing my time.
>
> > I can guatrantee you that the name of these rivers can allude only to an
> > event in France.
>
> You may not be interested in all the instances in which my
> applications of the prophecies have been proven potentially correct in
> short-term, immediate future, since it does not further your
> interests, but I am assuming you have no such similar track-record, so
> your opinion means very little to me.
I only am on of two people (the other is deceased) that are part of the
collection of volumes that has the best record in the world in term of
Nostradamus prophecy.
> Your notion of issuing a
> guarantee is just grandstanding; only Nostradamus knew why those
> rivers were named, and withheld any actual explanation, leaving us
> only with the names themeselves, their etymological meanings,
> geographic factors, cross-referenceable usages in various contexts,
> etc. It is a riddle, not simply a map: it must be solved, and your
> solution fails because the scenario you have chosen does not involve
> those four rivers in a manner to justify the way it is written. Even
> if you could get past that, there are the other problems with your
> theory, despite your relentless protests.
Absolutely, and it is what we have done here. Not you.
>
> > > > The world will see one day most of the quatrains have come to pass, and
> > > > I can assure you that what they will see in this quatrain is an event
> > > > about France.
> > >
> > > It is unlikely that a majority will ever come to a consensus about
> > > many quatrains written by Nostradamus, probably never about this
> >
> >
> > Yes there will be. Nostradamus said it. I know so.
>
> What he wrote was that many of the quatrains would never be
> understood!
>
He never wrote that.
> Reprinting my comments and appending them with denials is not a
> debate, unless you're a five-year-old!
It is called dialog, but you seem unfamiliar with it.
>
> You still did not explain why you went against your obvious knowledge
> of the French language to see "fort prise dans la presse" as "strongly
> taken in the press" rather than the more LOGICAL "fort seizure within
> the press." Where the fort is (in terms of translation) is
> irrelevant:
Hahaha yeah right.
> one should assume these are news headlines, carrying
> maximum information for the words - you choose to diminish meaning so
> that your prosaic theories will seem more plausible, i.e.,
> disinforming the public, which is already confused enough.
It seems you are the one that is totally misinformed here bud.
J.
Eagal
NO MOON...
Since VIII.21 puts the bridge event as third resistance after some
bio-warfare attack as secondary, and the III.56 timing also has the
bridge after Mars reaches its goal (presumably the same from the 5 Dec
Beziers date, i.e., the 28 December Mars-Lilith conjunct), the
associated Trinacrie from VIII.84 should not be prior or concurrent,
but following some time later. While Trinacrie is a poetic synonym
for Sicily, it connotes a Grand Trine, which could involve any
celestial bodies from the astrological pantheon, as well as such
calculated points as the Node and Vertex. An examination of the
planetary motions for 2002 reveals an excellent candidate for such a
coded time-window: this is a Grand Trine of Mars-Pluto-Juno from 11
February '02 10:20am PST [Mars-Pluto trine @ 17,15'] until 16 February
'02 12:06am PST [Mars-Juno trine @ 20,32']. Not relying on the Moon,
this will be a sustained phenomenon, utilizing actual celestial bodies
and not imaginary plotted points. IX.30's perishing Norman could
indicate the Juno point of the Grand Trine conjuncting the Ascendant
at the critical time: this shifts from 5:39pm PST (11 Feb) to 5:18pm
PST (15 Feb) - perhaps 13 Feb '02 5:29pm PST in the middle of the
period is most ominous (this will be Ash Wednesday, around the start
of Chinese New Year and Lincoln's Birthday). Of course this
application is only warranted if the other precursor incidents have
manifested beforehand...
* * *
On the way to Saturn!
During the planet Cross...
Eagal
Once again I will respond, but your entire attack is being conducted
without any acknowledgement of the fact that I was saying something
horrible would happen in NYC soon according to the prophecies from
1999 onward, while self-proclaimed experts like yourself were
insisting that no such thing was predicted by Nostradamus. Beyond
merely giving the appropriate general warnings six weeks earlier,
which bore the key of the Angoumois-Orleans King Francois 1er's
birthday 12 September, the metaphor of the oat-eating horse was
revealed, relating to the assault tactic. And I also derived war
opened through a Juno lunar aspect (V.19), when the Moon would be void
of course (III.97), at the conjunct of Mercury and the Ascendant
(IV.28, VI.97), all of which conditions applied to the timing of the
first plane striking the WTC. And this has not been an isolated
occurrence: since the Cassini-Istanbul incident there was my Halloween
1999 theory coinciding with the EgyptAir 990 crash, my prediction of a
massively fatal flood for the period when the Venzuelan flood
happened, and many other correct suppositions since. It was very
obvious the 2000 US election could play a significant role in some of
the prophecies, so your insistence only France is involved is
unconvincing.
> Eagal a écrit :
> >
> > Jean Guernon <jgue...@globetrotter.net> wrote in message news:<3C240985...@globetrotter.net>...
> > http://gallica.bnf.fr/scripts/ConsultationTout.exe?O=22619&T=0&E=0&D=0&P1=81425271&P2=0
> > > you have the defeat of napoleon troop in Spain and in Italy they had
> > > invested all on attack and nothing in defense, so these coalition troops
> > > come through Spain into France, through the Garonne, through Italy into
> > > France through the Rhosne the Soane and the Loire.
> >
> > And why not the same quatrain for WWII, with Hitler as one guard or
> > the other, and overtaking France including its rivers? There has to
> > be a precision that makes fulfillment not only "likely" but absolutely
> > decisive. You have not made that case:
>
> Because there was the maginot line, there was a history.
But you want us to believe Nostradamus saw the coalition force
destined to break Napoleon's dictatorial strangehold on Europe as a
"death outrage," so you can play fast and loose with the facts.
Napoleon grabbed the crown from the Pope to coronate himself, with the
implication there was no power above his own, even that of God. This
was an evil leader, and you think Nostradamus at one point calls him
more butcher than prince, and elsewhere condemns his comeuppance: you
may have problems with consistency, but I doubt Nostradamus does.
> > Of course the battles
> > > will occur further North and other coallitin forces from germany will
> > > join in,
> >
> > And it is the BATTLES that occupy this seer, who appears obsessed with
> > following the bloodshed! If the rivers were only used for entry,
> > there was no "death outrage" as is written about them. And it absurd
> > to presume that everything MUST involve France as you do, when these
> > prophecies are given with the warning that various devices have been
> > employed to obscure their true meanings: even when a wide list of
> > places was named, he added that was where MOST of the events would
> > transpire!
>
>
> What occupies the seer is to relate an event. The invasion occurred by
> those streams and then the battles occurred a few kilometers from there,
> but he speaks of their penetration in this last line here, not their
> point of clash.
>
> Who are you to decide what the seer can or cannot say?
Just my complaint with your current attacks on my usage of the
writings.
Neither of us can make the absolute claims you boast of, so why not
leave me to my exploration, which I would not be continuing if I
thought it would be fruitless. You have easily forgotten the
WTC-Pentagon attack, but I cannot: and I realize the tie-in with the 3
brothers prophecy of VIII.46 (suicidal destruction by three during
reign of Mars, as 8 to 13 Sept '01), which leads to IX.68 (another
mention of the horrible throne), which cross-references with II.35
(juncture of two rivers critical) AND II.25 (only other quatrain from
IX.68 also combining Saone and Rhone). I have already explained the
chain of logic. If my opinion were the same as someone else's, I
would not feel compelled to share it. If we agreed on everything, and
were all focusing on the same verses at the same times, I would
probably quit posting. You would have that IX.68 simply leads to the
dead end of awaiting something to befall the city of Lyon (where the
actual Saone and Rhone meet), while the attention I am giving to IX.68
originated from an esoteric rather than such a literal application.
> > > bu the fact is that France was taken off guard from the south
> > > becasue it had anticipated nothing there for defense, only attack. This
> > > quatrain is about that.
> >
> > You are extremely conceited to make a statement like that. I only
>
> I am not conceit, I give you the link, and this is what history says,
> not me.
The extent to which the history fits the verse is debatable, although
it cannot go much further than, "I don't see it that way." As I said,
II.25 is not how I see anything Napoleonic being predicted, BECAUSE of
the facts, not in spite of them!
> > indicate where there is a strong likelihood of fulfillment; you
> > present yourself as the ultimate last word on the subject. You would
> > have us believe Nostradamus only predicted as far as, what, 1815? He
>
> What? I don't know why you say that. I speak of this quatrain here, what
> are you talking about?
>
> I show history about it. Period. You are way too paranoid it seems to
> grasp my interpretation.
No I am not, but I underwent a lengthy discussion with Peter L., who
discards the 3797 date altogether, as well as the comment about each
line having a single sense and meaning, in favour of a theory of
endlessly repeating predictions based on the use of the word
"perpetuelles." I thought perhaps you had the corollary type of view
(the opposite heresy, if you will), that the extent was much less far
than 3797, because you said we would see many of the quatrains already
came true. N. wrote the interest in his work would increase over
time, and I can only assume this is because the predictions will be
found useful in the future for those times, not as a history lesson.
> > wrote it was "to the year 3797," and I'm only following up on what
> > began with the 1999 mention in X.72! Some may like to think this
> > timetable does not exist, but that does not make it go away.
>
> Absolutely, 3797.
Okay, I agree. It's a definite date, though it seems far away (like
1999 must have seemed when the prophecies first appeared).
Here's your comment seeming to the contrary:
> > > > > The world will see one day most of the quatrains have come to pass, and
> > > > > I can assure you that what they will see in this quatrain is an event
> > > > > about France.
> > > >
> > > > It is unlikely that a majority will ever come to a consensus about
> > > > many quatrains written by Nostradamus, probably never about this
> > >
> > >
> > > Yes there will be. Nostradamus said it. I know so.
> >
> > What he wrote was that many of the quatrains would never be
> > understood!
> >
>
> He never wrote that.
"...par abstruses at perplexes sentences les causes futures...et le
tout ecrit sous figure nubileuse, plus que du tout prophetique..."
[Presage par. 6]
"...mais plutot sous obnubilee obscurite par une naturelle infusion
approchant a la sentence d'un des mille et deux Prophetes..." [Epistle
par. 11]
"Et parce, Sire, que par ce discours je mets presque confusement ces
predictions, et quand ce pourra etre et l'avenement d'iceux..."
[Epistle par. 39]
Crypticism, nebulous obscurity, deliberate confusion, yet in Preface
par. 33 he writes though they are written under a cloud, when the time
comes for ignorance to be removed (after some sort of breakthrough
wherein current events are seen to have been predicted infallibly),
some things will be cleared up gradually. But in Epistle par. 4 he
wrote what was the source of my remark, that while the rhythm of the
poetry is as easy as the sense of them is difficult, "most of the
prophetic quatrains are so ticklish that there is no making way
through them, nor is there any interpreting of them":
"...le rythme etre autant facile, comme l'intelligence du sens est
difficile...la plupart des quatrains prophetiques sont tellement
scabreux, que l'on n'y saurait donner voie ni moins aucuns
interpreter..."
Jean Guernon
When it points to locations in France, it concerns locations in France.
> > > > bu the fact is that France was taken off guard from the south
> > > > becasue it had anticipated nothing there for defense, only attack. This
> > > > quatrain is about that.
> > >
> > > You are extremely conceited to make a statement like that. I only
> >
> > I am not conceit, I give you the link, and this is what history says,
> > not me.
>
> The extent to which the history fits the verse is debatable, although
> it cannot go much further than, "I don't see it that way." As I said,
> II.25 is not how I see anything Napoleonic being predicted, BECAUSE of
> the facts, not in spite of them!
Whatever. I won't argue with you. It is no use.
>
> > > indicate where there is a strong likelihood of fulfillment; you
> > > present yourself as the ultimate last word on the subject. You would
> > > have us believe Nostradamus only predicted as far as, what, 1815? He
> >
> > What? I don't know why you say that. I speak of this quatrain here, what
> > are you talking about?
> >
> > I show history about it. Period. You are way too paranoid it seems to
> > grasp my interpretation.
>
> No I am not, but I underwent a lengthy discussion with Peter L., who
> discards the 3797 date altogether, as well as the comment about each
> line having a single sense and meaning, in favour of a theory of
> endlessly repeating predictions based on the use of the word
> "perpetuelles." I thought perhaps you had the corollary type of view
> (the opposite heresy, if you will), that the extent was much less far
> than 3797, because you said we would see many of the quatrains already
> came true. N. wrote the interest in his work would increase over
> time, and I can only assume this is because the predictions will be
> found useful in the future for those times, not as a history lesson.
I don't, share Peter's view of trivializing what the seer said in the
Centuries and accompanying letters.
>
> > > wrote it was "to the year 3797," and I'm only following up on what
> > > began with the 1999 mention in X.72! Some may like to think this
> > > timetable does not exist, but that does not make it go away.
> >
> > Absolutely, 3797.
>
> Okay, I agree. It's a definite date, though it seems far away (like
> 1999 must have seemed when the prophecies first appeared).
>
> Here's your comment seeming to the contrary:
>
> > > > > > The world will see one day most of the quatrains have come to pass, and
> > > > > > I can assure you that what they will see in this quatrain is an event
> > > > > > about France.
"Most" mean 50% +, and 2/3 rd have already come to pass. This is because
the future includes a 1000 years of peace which is covered by very few
(a handful of) quatrains. Still the world waking up remains to be seen.
It can be imminent as it can take a while. We shall see.
In all these he says it is hard to grasp, *nowhere* that it will *never*
be understood, but if this is what you mean, indeed that *not all* will
understand. This is obvious.
But we will, one day, nothing will remain obscure.
J.
Eagal
NEW REIGN OF CERES:
Again using the timing clues of III.56, while 5 December 2001 began
Ceres' time in Aquarius, the subsequent plague could be "a la grande
gousse" (likely Ceres code from III.75) referring to the following
transit of Ceres through Pisces, beginning 22 February 2002 9am CST.
The Grand Trine of Mars-Pluto-Juno 11 to 16 Feb '02 could not only be
VIII.84's Trinacrie, but also key into III.56's "end of Mars,"
potentially implying its trining two lesser celestial bodies. VIII.21
makes it clear the plague onset precedes the bridge event shortly
enough for the fatalities by illness to follow the explosive
destruction. So it again seems a double attack is possibly predicted
for a specific day, although deriving exact timing using this
application is not simple. Supposing again that IX.68's final line
indicates a Mars-Ascendant conjunct on 16 February 2002 this will be
9:02am CST; Juno-Ascendant conjunct that day 5:14pm PST. 16 Feb '02
has a Ceres-Sun conjunct @ 27,35' Aquarius 4:45am CST, and a Mars-Moon
conjunct @ 21,07' Aries 10:07pm CST, as well as the Mars-Juno trine
2:06am CST wherein Mars exceeds the Grand Trine range delineated by
Juno and Pluto. There is a connection with the Sicilian references
in VIII.84, since 16 February is the feastday for Blessed Bernard
Scammacca, born in Catania, Sicily (d. 1486)...
* * *
"I'LL -
Pour the fifth bowl
On the throne:
The beast,
And the kingdom's darker...
POUR -
Your bowl on the river
Euphrates,
So it can dry up!"
Eagal
PUT TO A FIRE:
As I posted 20 December:
> The 28 December Mars-Lilith conjunct could be the goal of Mars in
> III.56; moreover, if II.35 is taken as a mathematical test, presenting
> 22 Dec '99, 25 Dec '00, the next in sequence would be 28 Dec '01.
> This is the feastday for the Holy Innocents, children massacred by
> Herod's soldiers in an attempt to slaughter Jesus as a toddler: VI.19
> may apply, with Vesta retrograding out of its false reign early 20 Dec
> - as "the lady who would put the Innocents to the fire."
The fire in downtown Lima, Peru, which apparently began when fireworks
ignited uncontrollably 29 December 2001 7:30pm local (5 hours off
GMT), has a death toll expected to exceed 300. Regarding II.35, both
the Californian brush fires of 1999 and the Chinese disco fire of 2000
were blazes, so supposing the subject of line 3 was the spread of a
plague seemed incongruous: line 4 indeed renders the early part of the
Sun's transit through Capricorn as critical, yet it now seems line 3
merely indicates the "river juncture" event is imminent ("it,"
probably meaning another fire, will happen "near" the two rivers for
one incident) in late 2001 (not that it occurs in solar Capricorn,
like the fires).
While my recalling VI.19's fire for 28 December 2001 could have been
another inadvertently correct postulation, my reasoning that Vesta's
retrograde was involved is dubious: however, the Moon conjuncted Vesta
27 December 2001 at 7:35am (Peruvian time) @ 28,52' Taurus. Of course
the Moon went on to also conjunct Saturn before Lima's
fireworks-inferno, yet VI.19 warns about a lady, which Saturn could
not represent. [A similar comment may be made regarding the lunar
Node: Saturn-Moon conjunct 28 Dec '01 2:54am; Node-Moon conjunct 29
Dec '01 8:36am (both Lima time).]
This latest tragedy thus oddly serves to reinforce the theory that the
engulfing of the "lady" Vesta in the "true flame" which VI.19 speaks
of is entirely likely for the pre-determined schedule in spring 2002.
La vraie flamme engloutira la dame
Qui voudra mettre les Innocents a feu
The true flame will engulf the lady
Who would put the Innocents to fire
Pres de deux fleuves pour seul il aviendra
Sol, L'Arq, et Caper tous seront amortis
Near two rivers for one it will happen
Sun, Archer, and Capricorn all will be reduced
Eagal
THEN A SUNSET
In an effort to more precisely time the three major events associated
with the upcoming Grand Trine of Mars-Juno-Pluto, interpretations have
been re-examined and reapplied to future astrological conditions.
III.56 is of no help in separating Beziers (5 December, Ceres' entry
into a new sign) from the plague temporally, although one may expect
something more timely with Ceres given III.75. IX.68 cross reference
with VIII.46 to indicate Mars could mean only the Grand Trine.
VIII.84 puts the Gulf incident as far as Trinacrie (perhaps the Grand
Trine), with as many (i.e., three) sails fled the plague, coinciding
with VIII.21's three foists spreading infection not faith. But III.56
interposes a Parisian hailstorm at the end (of the Grand Trine) by
(the transit of) Mars, which would be the Juno-Mars trine, between the
plague and bridge. And VIII.21 informs us the infection precedes the
bridge event (as a third type of assault), with the fatalities
following: given the suspected contagion, the gap between the plague
and bridge should only be a scant few days. So the plague onset may
be during the Grand Trine, but the bridge event could be any time
between the Mars-Juno trine and whatever III.56's "Lyon wall"
portends.
Thus the lines should contain the key for exact timing of both events,
the Parisian hail presumed for the Mars-Juno trine itself. If III.75
is used to infer lunar conjunct with Ceres, that is 12 February 2002
6:58am CST @ 26,03' Aquarius, under the circumstances of two
celestial bodies nearby in the same sign: Sun @ 23,38' (shortly after
New Moon marking Chinese New Year) and Uranus @ 24,45'. Venus also
close @ 0,37' Pisces, but leading asteroid then Vesta @ 0,24' Gemini.
For the date of the bridge event, VIII.84's limit of Trinacrie
suggests the same day of the Mars-Juno trine, shortly thereafter.
IX.30's perishing Norman could indicate the second of Mars' trines
forming the Grand, Juno, being at the Ascendant, which 16 February
2002 will be around 5:12pm PST. The date is confirmed by a saintly
Sicilian connection to satisfy VIII.84.
As usual, accessing information on saints for particular days may
support the conjectures by offering explanations for other verses.
Since the Grand Trine begins on February 11, this was given attention
as well as the 12th and 16th. For 11 Feb, St. Benedict of Aniane was
born in Languedoc in 750, which recalls IX.85's pairing with the Rhone
- also, he died in 821, which matches the numeration of the quatrain
with the ominous scenario at hand! Also St. Ardanus of Tournus (d.
1058, after enduring a famine 1030-33), associated with Autun diocese
(II.74 possibility, "from Autun they will come as far as the
Rhone")...
Au fort Vigilanne et Resuiers
Sera serre le puine de Nancy;
Dedans Turin seront ards les premiers
Lorsque de deuil Lyon sera transi.
At the fort of Vigilance and Resource
The puny will be confined at Nancy;
Within Turin Ard's will be the first.
When grief will strike Lyon's fancy.
The first portion seems to regard the capture of the perpetrator of
the 11 Sept attacks (puine can mean cadet, but it might also mean
someone physically weakened or emaciated), Nancy has been given as 1
February. Line 3 could be about some first group being burned during
a Taurus lunar: but taking "ards" as implying those with St. Ardanus,
they are of the first day of the Grand Trine. Lyon is the city where
the Rhone and Saone meet, as IX.68 directs, probably figuratively;
line 4 should mean the targeted area is "numbed by grief." Obviously
Turin would not mean Taurus 12 February, with Sun and Moon in
Aquarius: but that is the feastday of St. Goscelinus of Turin (d.
1153), second abbot of San Solutore...
Timing for the major event is less ambiguous, keyed into the Saturnin
theory, coinciding with the first solar eclipse of the New Year, the
annular one which may be V.6's Pacific Emperor, and II.29's Easterner.
The Vestal appearance in the conceptual lunar temple should pinpoint
the precise timing, the way it would have for the WTC attack's dark
[Juno / Mars] temple.
* * *
"Woe to you, Scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!
For you traverse sea and land to make one convert;
And when he has become one,
You make him twofold more a son of hell
Than yourselves."
[Gospel of Matthew 23:15]
Eagal
A DELEGATION AT SENS
While the fireworks gone awry in downtown Lima, Peru, 29 December 2001
coming the day after that for the Holy Innocents could apply to part
of VI.19 (as previously explained), the beginning of nearby VI.17 may
suggest Lima -
Apres les limes brules les asiniers,
Contraints seront changer d'habits divers;
Les Saturnins brules par les meuniers,
Hors la plupart qui ne sera couverte.
"Limes" should mean "files," yet with the Saturnin condition described
in plain language and cryptic verse arriving 9 June 2002, it may be
prudent to translate line 1 as "After Lima's burned, the ass-drivers":
the Peruvian inferno (estimated at 1100 degrees Fahrenheit) would then
be a precursor for the ass-driver incident, which is the probable
topic of the rest of the quatrain. The millers of line 3 appear to be
the ass-drivers; the asses also wanting Carmany of X.31 seem related.
Of course there are numerous usages of the word "Lemans," typically
interpreted only as the Lake of Geneva: concurrent reference to a lake
is frequent, which *could* be one of fire to obscure prophecy of the
recent incendiary tragedy. Applying some cases to test contexts:
Du lac Leman les sermons facheront [I.47 line 1]
The sermons about the Liman lake will vex
III.12 line 2 links the ponds of "Leman et Aretin" - Liman (?) and
that of Aretium (Arezzo)...
Du lac Leman et ceux de Brannonices [IV.74 line 1]
Brannovices should be inhabitants of Macon, but it is dubious whether
this is *active*...
IV.94's "sang Leman d'Alemagne" (line 3) may not so easily suit the
Concorde crash 25 July 2000 although the victims were German, since it
occurred in Paris: had the locale been Swiss, there would remain the
previous unfulfilled part, "Sea to redden, Rhone," although the final
line starting with the Narbon-Scar (WTC ruin) could already be in
progress. So chronology is problematic: Liman blood could be
referred to out of sequence, "from" or "with" German. The Concorde
disaster was also related to VIII.47 -
Lac Trasmenien portera temoignage,
Des conjures serres dedans Perouse;
Un despolle contrefera le sage,
Tuant Tedesque sterne et minuse.
Peruvian lake will bear witness,
The conspirators locked up within Peru's;
A despoil will counterfeit the sage,
Killing German overthrown and cut to bits.
The possibility that "Perouse" is used to imply "Peru's" rather than
Perugia has been explored: so it could be that what IV.94 means by the
link between Liman and German blood is the scenario presented by
VIII.47 itself, wherein the two events are intertwined. The
extradition of suspected terrorists occurring at the time of posting
could explain line 2. For line 3, I had calculated the date of 25
July 2000 for something ominous because of a Chiron-Ceres aspect, but
had abandoned that theory prior (though I noted the connection after
the Concorde crash). And to finish up this topic,
Aupres du lac Leman sera conduite,
Par garse etrange cite voulant trahir
It will be conducted near the Liman lake,
By the maiden wishing to betray the foreign city
The first two lines of V.12 could parallel the premise of VI.19,
wherein a lady would put the Innocents to the fire - asteroid virginal
Vesta could be the secret identity of the female character in both
verses, regarding her lunar conjunct 27 December 2001: VI.19 speaks of
her (later) being engulfed by the true flame; and V.12 may clarify
this authentic inferno as affecting a foreign city relatively shortly
after the Liman lake (of fire) event.
Returning to VI.86, which begins with faulty dream interpretation
probably during the Persian Gulf War, line 3's potential suggestion of
25 November (2001) via St. Alanus of Gascony, day of the Chiron-Node
opposition, may confirm my defense of II.25 as a prediction of the
prison fort riot at Mazar-e Sharif, since that was its exact date.
Not only CIA agent Spann died then, but also dozens of prisoners. For
the final line about this causing the election of the great prelate of
Sens, the date of 7 January (2002) was deduced for St. Anastasius,
Archbishop of Sens from 968 to 977: and a delegation of nine US
senators (including past presidential election hopefuls Senators
McCain and Lieberman) chose 7 January 2002 to meet with interim leader
Hamid Karzai at the Bagram airbase near Kabul, Afghanistan. "Elire"
can mean a literal election, or any choosing or selection, possibly
even a political endorsement such as that visit. So the latter part
of VI.86 seems to consider how unstable the Afghan situation proved to
be 25 Nov '01, necessitating the endorsement of a leader capable of
bringing further stability. 8 January 2002 Karzai initiated his first
official act, banning weapons in public.
The Beziers date deciphered as 5 December (2001) through St. Gerald
has previously been associated only with the change in sign of
asteroid Ceres: yet it was also the day of a "friendly fire" accident
resulting in the death of three.
* * *
"So fair and foul a day I have not seen."
The next day, as they went on their journey and drew near the city,
Peter went up on the housetop to pray, about the sixth hour. Then he
became very hungry and wanted to eat; but while they made ready, he
fell into a trance and saw heaven opened and an object like a great
sheet bound at the four corners, descending to him and let down to the
earth. In it were all kinds of four-footed animals of the earth, wild
beasts, creeping things, and birds of the air.
And a voice came to him, "Rise, Peter; kill and eat."
But Peter said, "Not so, Lord!
For I have never eaten anything common or unclean."
And a voice spoke to him a second time,
"What God has cleansed you must not call common."
This was done three times.
And the object was taken up into heaven again.
[Acts of the Apostles 10:9-16]
"We've poured basically all the trouble to the Sun.
And that's by the fourth bowl -
For scorching Mankind
With the Sun's solar heat:
The temperature's going to go up to a level way too hotter -
Woe to them,
Burning with heat, as if from the Sun..."
Eagal
LOWER?
The mention of the Loire river in line 4 of II.25, which has been
interpreted as a precursor to the Saone-Rhone juncture allegorical
event (expected for the Mars-Juno-Pluto G.T.), connoting the dormouse
(loir) concept of a dormant rodent, could mainly rely on an English
phonetic pun, being pronounced like "Lower." The obvious incident for
which the word "Lower" would be ironically prophetic in this timeframe
is the 5 January 2002 flight into a Tampa, Florida skyscraper by the
youth surnamed Bishop, apparently altered concealing Arabic descent:
while classmates having discussed 11 September recalled no support for
the terrorism on his behalf, a note found in the wreckage was reported
to state otherwise. It could be that this troubling case of suicidal
mayhem as homage has been predicted via usage of a waterway familiar
to the seer, to deftly indicate this tragedy was intended to be
similar to the WTC tower strike, but occurred on a "Lower" level...
More has emerged about John Walker Lindh's time in Yemen circa 1999,
alleging causing a disturbance by giving too much money to beggars,
zealousness all should pray on time, despondency over women being
taught, rejection of Sunni for Shiite sect but tendency towards
extreme fundamentalism, and affecting a phoney Arabic accent. He
could easily be the "foreign guard" ("garde etrange") of II.25.
Line 2 of II.25 could regard the 14 December 2001 annular solar
eclipse (shadow) occurring 4 hours after a Venus-Pluto conjunct, and
IV.34 linking the capture of a long-sought foreign prisoner (hope)
with the rare Sun-Chiron conjunct when Chiron is reigning 23 December
2001 (as the second "higher marriage"). But that unusual astrological
condition may serve to merely activate VIII.3, which dates the
confinement using Nancy, another saintly city reference. These
unique timely interpretations are inter-related with certain other
verses through the complex manner previously postulated.
* * *
La garde etrange trahira forteresse,
Espoir et ombre de plus haut mariage;
Garde decue, fort prise dans la presse,
Loire, Saone, Rhone, Gar. a mort outrage.
The foreign guard will betray the fortress,
Hope and shadow from higher marriage;
Guard cut down, fort seizure in the press,
Lower, Saone, Rhone, Guard from death outrage.
* * *
Jesus said,
"The kingdom of the Father is like
A woman who was carrying a jar full of flour.
While she was walking on a road far from home,
The handle of the jar broke
And the flour spilled behind her on the road.
She did not know it; she had not noticed the problem.
When she reached her house, she put the jar down
And discovered that it was empty."
[Gospel of Thomas, Saying 95]
* * *
"I'll -
Pour the third
On waters that are fresh:
For -
All the righteous
Whose blood spilled,
They'll be deserving
Blood to be served,
Everywhere..."
Peter Lemesurier
>LOIRE:
>LOWER?
>
>
>The mention of the Loire river in line 4 of II.25, which has been
>interpreted as a precursor to the Saone-Rhone juncture allegorical
>event (expected for the Mars-Juno-Pluto G.T.), connoting the dormouse
>(loir) concept of a dormant rodent, could mainly rely on an English
>phonetic pun, being pronounced like "Lower."
"I am holding the prophecies hostage and torturing them until they say
what I want them to say."
--
D Luzhenzov Granjur