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The reasons behind the avoidance of charging Jan. 6th rioters with sedition
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docufo
Nov 20, 2021, 8:26:56 PM11/20/21
to
It makes much sense to me as a legal strategy to ensure more of the
violators will not escape serious sentencing. Insurrection or sedition
charges don't have a greater chance of sticking, and thus breaking it
down into specific acts of violation is more fruitful for prosecutors.
And since the many specific acts include "obstruction of an official
proceeding", it's very difficult for the defense to argue rationally
against it.
The purpose is to help ensure more violators will be punished as they
all should be for doing such a gross violent act against our national
seat of government.
I quote:
Jun 24
Some Biden administration officials believe using the sedition charge
could politicize the Justice Department's prosecution of the Capitol
attackers, about 500 of whom are already facing charges.
The department says nearly 200 of those 500 defendants have been charged
with obstructing the congressional proceedings on January 6 to count the
electoral votes and finalize President Joe Biden's victory. That felony
charge has a maximum sentence of 20 years -- the same punishment as the
sedition charge but more tailored to the situation of blocking Congress'
certification of the Electoral College result.
In fact, three rioters who have already pleaded guilty have pleaded to
this obstruction charge, with one admitting that he had taken part in an
extensive conspiracy among the Oath Keepers extremist group intended to
thwart Congress on January 6.
Current and former Justice officials say there aren't many prosecutors
who have even brought sedition-related cases. Instead, they say, the FBI
and prosecutors are better off building conspiracy cases, where the law
is clearer, and using cooperators to build the complex prosecutions in
order to have better chances of success.
And that's exactly what they've done, especially against members of
right-wing extremist groups like the Proud Boys, Oath Keepers and Three
Percenters.
The marquee January 6 conspiracy case has ensnarled 16 people with ties
to the Oath Keepers, an anti-government group that recruits veterans and
former law enforcement members. Prosecutors secured their first guilty
plea and cooperation deal from a defendant in that case on Wednesday,
which could give a boost to their efforts to get under the hood of the
organization and win convictions later on against members who are
accused of planning to disrupt Congress' electoral vote count.
Prosecutors have also zeroed in on the extremist Proud Boys. Leaders of
Proud Boys chapters in North Carolina, Philadelphia, Florida and Seattle
have been charged in a conspiracy indictment, and several others from
across the country with ties to the group are also charged.
Investigators are examining their group chats and other communications.
Sedition cases are quite rare, adding to the challenge of using the law
for January 6 attackers.
In 2010, prosecutors charged members of a Christian militant group
called the Hutaree with seditious conspiracy before a judge dismissed
the charges. Federal prosecutors were successful in using the law
against Puerto Rican separatists in the 1930s.
The view on sedition reflects the cautious, some say risk-averse, era at
the Justice Department under Garland. Officials say he is methodical in
making decisions, careful to read memos from prosecutors and peppering
them with questions.
"And do we have the evidence for that?" is among the questions he often
asks in meetings with officials, who have learned to come prepared for
follow-up questions.
Garland refused to say on Tuesday whether sedition charges are still on
the table. "We follow the facts, where they go, and then we apply the
law. And we will do that in each case as it happens, and when we're
ready, we'll do what's appropriate," he told reporters when pressed on
the issue. "All I can say is we have a panoply of federal laws that
cover behavior. And we're going to pick the ones that are appropriate
for the facts."
The seditious conspiracy law makes it a federal crime to conspire to use
force to overthrow the US government or to try to prevent the execution
of a federal law. Some legal experts say a hurdle for prosecutors would
be showing that some of the activity by defendants isn't protected by
the First Amendment.
Similar hurdles grounded an effort last summer by then-Attorney General
William Barr, who urged federal prosecutors to use the sedition law to
prosecute violent protesters in the wake of the police killing of George
Floyd.
Many of the January 6 defendants are charged with felonies for
assaulting police, taking weapons to the Capitol, destroying property or
-- if they went into protected areas of the building -- obstructing the
official proceeding for Congress to certify the Electoral College vote.
Prosecutors so far appear unwilling to wipe away that level of charge.
Nearly six months into one of the most sprawling federal criminal
investigations, with a manhunt for suspects in states from coast to
coast, the FBI says it is still pursuing hundreds of leads and seeking
dozens of people.
In addition, a person seen on video leaving pipe bombs blocks from the
Capitol remains at large.
Prosecutors have charged defendants almost every day since the attack
and recently indicated in court filings that they continue to pursue as
many as 100 more.
The cases, taken together, have provided more insight into the pro-Trump
rioters' political inclinations, and the Justice Department has noted
the threat of right-wing rhetoric pushing ideas of election fraud and
reclaiming the presidency from Biden hasn't subsided.
Prosecutors have also said they are working to expand conspiracy charges
against far-right extremist groups that they allege coordinated and
planned to disrupt Congress' certification of the presidential vote.
More than 50 defendants have been linked to far-right extremist groups,
and at least two groups of alleged conspirators are accused of finding
contacts online, then discussing how they'd travel cross-country with
firearms for the event.
The conspiracy cases, as is typical, are likely to take longer to build
and to move through the courts.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/us-capitol-riots-why-garland-and-doj-haven-t-charged-anyone-with-sedition/ar-AALofSk
violators will not escape serious sentencing. Insurrection or sedition
charges don't have a greater chance of sticking, and thus breaking it
down into specific acts of violation is more fruitful for prosecutors.
And since the many specific acts include "obstruction of an official
proceeding", it's very difficult for the defense to argue rationally
against it.
The purpose is to help ensure more violators will be punished as they
all should be for doing such a gross violent act against our national
seat of government.
I quote:
Jun 24
Some Biden administration officials believe using the sedition charge
could politicize the Justice Department's prosecution of the Capitol
attackers, about 500 of whom are already facing charges.
The department says nearly 200 of those 500 defendants have been charged
with obstructing the congressional proceedings on January 6 to count the
electoral votes and finalize President Joe Biden's victory. That felony
charge has a maximum sentence of 20 years -- the same punishment as the
sedition charge but more tailored to the situation of blocking Congress'
certification of the Electoral College result.
In fact, three rioters who have already pleaded guilty have pleaded to
this obstruction charge, with one admitting that he had taken part in an
extensive conspiracy among the Oath Keepers extremist group intended to
thwart Congress on January 6.
Current and former Justice officials say there aren't many prosecutors
who have even brought sedition-related cases. Instead, they say, the FBI
and prosecutors are better off building conspiracy cases, where the law
is clearer, and using cooperators to build the complex prosecutions in
order to have better chances of success.
And that's exactly what they've done, especially against members of
right-wing extremist groups like the Proud Boys, Oath Keepers and Three
Percenters.
The marquee January 6 conspiracy case has ensnarled 16 people with ties
to the Oath Keepers, an anti-government group that recruits veterans and
former law enforcement members. Prosecutors secured their first guilty
plea and cooperation deal from a defendant in that case on Wednesday,
which could give a boost to their efforts to get under the hood of the
organization and win convictions later on against members who are
accused of planning to disrupt Congress' electoral vote count.
Prosecutors have also zeroed in on the extremist Proud Boys. Leaders of
Proud Boys chapters in North Carolina, Philadelphia, Florida and Seattle
have been charged in a conspiracy indictment, and several others from
across the country with ties to the group are also charged.
Investigators are examining their group chats and other communications.
Sedition cases are quite rare, adding to the challenge of using the law
for January 6 attackers.
In 2010, prosecutors charged members of a Christian militant group
called the Hutaree with seditious conspiracy before a judge dismissed
the charges. Federal prosecutors were successful in using the law
against Puerto Rican separatists in the 1930s.
The view on sedition reflects the cautious, some say risk-averse, era at
the Justice Department under Garland. Officials say he is methodical in
making decisions, careful to read memos from prosecutors and peppering
them with questions.
"And do we have the evidence for that?" is among the questions he often
asks in meetings with officials, who have learned to come prepared for
follow-up questions.
Garland refused to say on Tuesday whether sedition charges are still on
the table. "We follow the facts, where they go, and then we apply the
law. And we will do that in each case as it happens, and when we're
ready, we'll do what's appropriate," he told reporters when pressed on
the issue. "All I can say is we have a panoply of federal laws that
cover behavior. And we're going to pick the ones that are appropriate
for the facts."
The seditious conspiracy law makes it a federal crime to conspire to use
force to overthrow the US government or to try to prevent the execution
of a federal law. Some legal experts say a hurdle for prosecutors would
be showing that some of the activity by defendants isn't protected by
the First Amendment.
Similar hurdles grounded an effort last summer by then-Attorney General
William Barr, who urged federal prosecutors to use the sedition law to
prosecute violent protesters in the wake of the police killing of George
Floyd.
Many of the January 6 defendants are charged with felonies for
assaulting police, taking weapons to the Capitol, destroying property or
-- if they went into protected areas of the building -- obstructing the
official proceeding for Congress to certify the Electoral College vote.
Prosecutors so far appear unwilling to wipe away that level of charge.
Nearly six months into one of the most sprawling federal criminal
investigations, with a manhunt for suspects in states from coast to
coast, the FBI says it is still pursuing hundreds of leads and seeking
dozens of people.
In addition, a person seen on video leaving pipe bombs blocks from the
Capitol remains at large.
Prosecutors have charged defendants almost every day since the attack
and recently indicated in court filings that they continue to pursue as
many as 100 more.
The cases, taken together, have provided more insight into the pro-Trump
rioters' political inclinations, and the Justice Department has noted
the threat of right-wing rhetoric pushing ideas of election fraud and
reclaiming the presidency from Biden hasn't subsided.
Prosecutors have also said they are working to expand conspiracy charges
against far-right extremist groups that they allege coordinated and
planned to disrupt Congress' certification of the presidential vote.
More than 50 defendants have been linked to far-right extremist groups,
and at least two groups of alleged conspirators are accused of finding
contacts online, then discussing how they'd travel cross-country with
firearms for the event.
The conspiracy cases, as is typical, are likely to take longer to build
and to move through the courts.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/us-capitol-riots-why-garland-and-doj-haven-t-charged-anyone-with-sedition/ar-AALofSk
JTEM is Magic
Nov 21, 2021, 12:13:17 AM11/21/21
to
docufo wrote:
> It makes much sense to me as a legal strategy to ensure
Hmm. You do know that the capital was open to the public, right?
> It makes much sense to me as a legal strategy to ensure
This was the Reichstag Fire all over again. It worked the first time, too.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/668269425555898368
Steven Douglas
Nov 21, 2021, 6:13:46 PM11/21/21
to
On Saturday, November 20, 2021 at 5:26:56 PM UTC-8, docufo wrote:
>
> It makes much sense to me as a legal strategy to ensure more of the
> violators will not escape serious sentencing. Insurrection or sedition
> charges don't have a greater chance of sticking,
Is that because it wasn't the "insurrection" that lying leftists
>
> It makes much sense to me as a legal strategy to ensure more of the
> violators will not escape serious sentencing. Insurrection or sedition
> charges don't have a greater chance of sticking,
are trying to make it out to be?
>
> and thus breaking it
> down into specific acts of violation is more fruitful for prosecutors.
> And since the many specific acts include "obstruction of an official
> proceeding",
Headline: "Judge raises doubts about obstruction charges in Jan. 6 cases"
> and thus breaking it
> down into specific acts of violation is more fruitful for prosecutors.
> And since the many specific acts include "obstruction of an official
> proceeding",
https://www.politico.com/news/2021/11/19/jan-6-judge-obstruction-charge-doubt-523057
Now what?
docufo
Nov 22, 2021, 1:20:26 AM11/22/21
to
On 11/20/2021 9:13 PM, JTEM is Magic wrote:
> docufo wrote:
>
>> It makes much sense to me as a legal strategy to ensure
>
> Hmm. You do know that the capital was open to the public, right?
No, it was not open to the public that day.
> docufo wrote:
>
>> It makes much sense to me as a legal strategy to ensure
>
> Hmm. You do know that the capital was open to the public, right?
https://www.justice.gov/usao-dc/press-release/file/1355996/download
JTEM is Magic
Nov 22, 2021, 1:45:01 AM11/22/21
to
docufo wrote:
[...]
Ironically, one of the so called "Insurrectionists" who identified themselves as
present says that she called, asked for their hours before going to the capital.
The narrative you present also completely contradicts your claim that the
capital was not secured, that Trump refused security. How could it be both
locked down AND completely open?
What of the video footage showing entertained security just standing their
as a man pleads for them to do something?
Seems like you're not just ready but eager to believe ANYTHING without
question, so long as it jives with your pre conceived notions.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/668526074119995392
[...]
Ironically, one of the so called "Insurrectionists" who identified themselves as
present says that she called, asked for their hours before going to the capital.
The narrative you present also completely contradicts your claim that the
capital was not secured, that Trump refused security. How could it be both
locked down AND completely open?
What of the video footage showing entertained security just standing their
as a man pleads for them to do something?
Seems like you're not just ready but eager to believe ANYTHING without
question, so long as it jives with your pre conceived notions.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/668526074119995392
docufo
Nov 22, 2021, 8:56:27 PM11/22/21
to
normal for the Capitol to be closed during demonstrations.
27,000 Trumpers rallied at the Ellipse and then were instructed by
Donald to march up to the Capitol steps to have a "peaceful" protest
against the EC vote certification going on that day.
The Capitol was not properly secured by Capitol police as it normally
would for such public demonstrations. The march was to include Donnie
who said he'd be there with them. He was, instead, at his office
watching the rioting on TV.
Investigations should eventually unravel the reasons behind the severe
lack of security, which included a delayed response from the DCNG.
If there is good evidence Trump or his cohorts were directly involved in
reducing the security so as to make it easier for insurrectionists to
enter the Capitol by force, those suspects will be likely heading for
severe penalties.
If it's found that it was a rare series of coincidental errors that day,
then so be it. It'd be sort of a relief, in fact. But, it's very unlikely.
It is highly unlikely, too, that credible evidence of any leftists,
Democrats, communists, socialists, witches or satanists set it up will
be found in any official investigations.
For that to happen, you'd need to depend on Brietbart or Fox News.
Or Donnie. Or even Steven Douglas. Or your own perfect self.
@!@
u
JTEM is Magic
Nov 23, 2021, 1:08:29 AM11/23/21
to
docufo wrote:
> The Capitol - all of it - was closed to the public that day.
What does that mean? Because we both saw the video where the
> The Capitol - all of it - was closed to the public that day.
bemused guards stand idle as a man pleads with them to stop
the crowd.
And like I said, one of the people identified as actually present
called the capital first, to get their hours.
And how do you balance your present claims with your insistence
that Trump did nothing, castrated security attempts?
January 6 was a Wednesday. The capital *Is* or at least was open
on Wednesdays...
Like I said, you will believe anything, regardless of your own
contradictions, so long as it tells you that you're right. Which is
ironic because the massive contradictions mean that you are not.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/145906356871
docufo
Nov 23, 2021, 2:45:37 AM11/23/21
to
JTEM is Magic
Nov 23, 2021, 3:05:58 AM11/23/21
to
docufo wrote:
> https://www.justice.gov
Okay you have a press release from some people covering their ass. This press
release contradicts everything you've said about Trump on the subject. It
contradicts video that we have both watched. It contradicts the statements of
people there. But for this one moment, and only for this one case here, you
reject anything -- INCLUDING YOUR OWN POSITION -- in order to pretend that
your "Cite" means you are right.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com
> https://www.justice.gov
Okay you have a press release from some people covering their ass. This press
release contradicts everything you've said about Trump on the subject. It
contradicts video that we have both watched. It contradicts the statements of
people there. But for this one moment, and only for this one case here, you
reject anything -- INCLUDING YOUR OWN POSITION -- in order to pretend that
your "Cite" means you are right.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com
docufo
Nov 23, 2021, 3:29:20 AM11/23/21
to
Why not?
Easily needs proof he was there to disregard laws, endanger people and
property and impose his or someone's domination on people with new rules
for citizens.
Many accuse him of being a vigilante.
But, realistically, why bother when the violation is potentially a
double murder done without self-defense?
Take the kid to court for that specific violation attempt? Nah. It'd
been thrown out for lack of evidence of vigilantism. But many believe he
was engaged in vigilantism, right?
Interpretation along legally defining lines of "insurrectionist" makes
that prosecution shaky. Yet, it is an act that qualifies for the legal
definition, yet difficult to nail down with actual evidence it was a
planned violent act rioters hoped would disrupt the proceedings.
They did get that done.
And that is "obstruction of an official proceeding" that is sticking to
violators' asses, sending them off to the Big House.
LOL! And all those "obstructions" amount to an "insurrection" any way.
You can look at scores of viral videos and security cam footage of that
day in and outside the Capitol and anyone with no partisan bias, good
eyesight and average intelligence, can easily see this was a planned
assault on our seat of government.
It was a chaotically arranged assault but people like the Oathkeepers
were determined to channel that angry mob to do what they planned.
Overall, a rather inept attempt was made, but we're not grading the
assault on levels of organization, rationality and maturity, are we? Or
can we keep arguing endlessly what is plainly obvious in so many videos
and testimonies?
Or is the real problem here a growing hysteria that has totally blinded
you and 75 million cultists to even seeing a real-life shameful horror
scene but think it's another script of a Netflix movie or an elaborate
shadowy scheme of evil leftists?
Conspiracies are a perfect alternative to being socially responsible
during severe times requiring some sacrifice and compromise, thereby
relieving the self-concerned, the phony, paranoid, antisocial,
delusional, selfish and immature denizens of our broken society of
anything that annoys or inconveniences their insular mindsets.
Broken by capitalists and their sycophants dedicated to narcissism and
even nihilism.
@)=
o
JTEM is Magic
Nov 23, 2021, 3:39:05 AM11/23/21
to
docufo wrote:
> Was Kyle Rottenmouse charged with "vigilantism"?
How many people were charged with looting? Arson?
> Was Kyle Rottenmouse charged with "vigilantism"?
The guy who was breaking the law with the concealed weapon, who was
caught on camera trying to execute Rittenhouse with a head shot... what
crimes was he charged with? How many?
I'm willing to bet that if you stop any ten random people who aren't too
terrified to answer honestly, and actually think for themselves, they
would rather that the Kyle Rittenhouse types be left alone and everyone
concentrate on throwing the vandals, the arsonists and the looters in
prison.
There were COUNTLESS people on BOTH SIDES running around openly
carrying guns -- because it's legal there -- and the only people shot were
the ones who attacked a short, young kid.
Amazing, huh?
The only people who got shot on either side of the law were the rioters
who attacked a man holding a rifle.
That's not a coincidence.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com
docufo
Nov 23, 2021, 3:44:20 AM11/23/21
to
foolish notion the Capitol was open to the public that day AS YOU SAID
IT WAS.
So, let's have some more of your sickening big egotism and maybe hear
you refer to yourself again in the third person like Donnie does as you
keep avoiding you're a far right-wing media whore who believes the
Capitol was closed.
Look up why those that use the third person are regarded as terminal
egotists. And then look up what egotism does to the human consciousness.
You could watch 100 videos of the Capitol insurrection and even have
courts and committees rule it was an insurrection, and you'd dismiss
them all as propaganda, conspiracies, fake stuff.
You are the mass media's farty Frankenstein monster given life every
time you get bored or annoyed, hypocritically chastising me and others
of being what you've been for decades, or at least since 1992:
A mental and emotional basket case that habitually humps his garden
gnomes and flashes his Play-Doh sculptured ass at twink passersby. And
then you run inside your trailer and rape your latex sex dolls.
@y@
V
docufo
Nov 23, 2021, 4:02:43 AM11/23/21
to
savior of a city that certainly didn't ask for his saving, nor do most
people like anything about vigilantism.
Had he not been playing amateur cop or paramilitary protector that
night, two people would still be alive today.
And what kind of judge would not be socially responsible enough to
reprimand him for being there that night with an AR15 in a very violent
area of the city playing protector?
No criticism from that old fart. And so another red flag has turned into
a green light for more youthful hooliganism mislabeled as public
protectors.
Kids that think they will have the judges and juries on their side.
Don't be surprised Kyle will be regenerated by youthful fascists as
heroic, anointing the pudgy psychopath as a Saint...Heil Kyle!! LOL!
But some good must've occurred. I don't think Kyle will be openly
lugging his AR15 around in any city after cleaning up his dress pants of
piss and shit after the verdict came in.
Exonerated of all charges yet guilty of being reckless, delusional and
very stupid.
@y@
O
>
Steven Douglas
Nov 23, 2021, 4:20:30 PM11/23/21
to
On Tuesday, November 23, 2021 at 1:02:43 AM UTC-8, docufo wrote:
>
> And that "man" - actually a boy in high school - should be regarded as a
> savior of a city that certainly didn't ask for his saving,
It's clear you did not watch the trial, and you have a distorted view
>
> And that "man" - actually a boy in high school - should be regarded as a
> savior of a city that certainly didn't ask for his saving,
of what happened that night and at the trial.
From CNN:
[excerpt] During his testimony, defendant Kyle Rittenhouse said
that on the day of the shooting, he was contacted by Nicholas Smith,
who was employed at the Car Source dealership, and asked if he
wanted help "watch over" the car dealership. [end excerpt]
https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/kyle-rittenhouse-trial-11-10-21/h_5a2225dbf498ab7c08c5f34bbece9132
From Kenosha News:
[excerpt] On Tuesday, Smith took the stand. He said that the owners
of Car Source had asked him and others to defend Car Source, in line
with what had been said by Black on the stand the week prior and what
has been said by Rittenhouse’s representatives since Aug. 25. [end excerpt]
https://www.kenoshanews.com/did-car-source-ask-for-armed-help-during-kenosha-unrest-witness-testimony-differs/article_d0d31293-6736-53f4-9dcc-f448f37b2952.html
>
> nor do most people like anything about vigilantism.
Rittenhouse was trying to run away from the first guy who attacked
> nor do most people like anything about vigilantism.
him. Why is the "vigiliante" the guy who was running away from the
guy who did the attacking? Please explain this point, Doc. You seem
to think you know all about what happened, and about the trial, so I'd
like to see your intellectual explanation for why the guy running away
from the other guy is the vigilante.
>
> Had he not been playing amateur cop or paramilitary protector that
> night, two people would still be alive today.
Had the two people who attacked him not attacked him, they would
> Had he not been playing amateur cop or paramilitary protector that
> night, two people would still be alive today.
be alive today. Had the third not attacked him, he'd still have use of
his arm today.
>
> And what kind of judge would not be socially responsible enough to
> reprimand him for being there that night with an AR15 in a very violent
> area of the city playing protector?
Because the verdicts were not guilty. I realize you have no idea
> And what kind of judge would not be socially responsible enough to
> reprimand him for being there that night with an AR15 in a very violent
> area of the city playing protector?
how our justice system works, but once a person is found not
guilty, that's it. The trial is over, the person is no longer on trial,
and the judge would be out of line to make any comments that
would indicate some remaining guilt. Sheesh, this is just common
sense.
>
> No criticism from that old fart.
Absolutely amazing that you think it was the judge's place to do
> No criticism from that old fart.
that after not guilty verdicts. Just absolutely incredible.
>
> And so another red flag has turned into
> a green light for more youthful hooliganism mislabeled as public
> protectors.
The hooligans were the people who attacked Rittenhouse, but
> And so another red flag has turned into
> a green light for more youthful hooliganism mislabeled as public
> protectors.
then you've never seemed to have a clear grasp of the concepts
of right and wrong -- or self-defense in a criminal trial.
>
> Kids that think they will have the judges and juries on their side.
> Don't be surprised Kyle will be regenerated by youthful fascists as
> heroic, anointing the pudgy psychopath as a Saint...Heil Kyle!!
I can't wait for the lawsuits he's going to file against all the
> Kids that think they will have the judges and juries on their side.
> Don't be surprised Kyle will be regenerated by youthful fascists as
> heroic, anointing the pudgy psychopath as a Saint...Heil Kyle!!
wrongful attacks on his character.
>
> But some good must've occurred. I don't think Kyle will be openly
> lugging his AR15 around in any city
It wasn't his AR15 (which is yet another fact you have wrong,
> But some good must've occurred. I don't think Kyle will be openly
> lugging his AR15 around in any city
as you probably believe the media lies about him taking that
gun across "state lines" don't you?).
>
> after cleaning up his dress pants of
> piss and shit after the verdict came in.
More likely, that's what you did when you heard those not
> after cleaning up his dress pants of
> piss and shit after the verdict came in.
guilty verdicts. Because you were left totally unprepared
by the lying media that you watch.
>
> Exonerated of all charges yet guilty of being reckless, delusional and
> very stupid.
We don't put people in prison for the rest of their lives for
> Exonerated of all charges yet guilty of being reckless, delusional and
> very stupid.
being any of those things. But then I really do realize that
you have no idea how our justice system works.
JTEM is Magic
Nov 23, 2021, 6:12:32 PM11/23/21
to
docufo wrote:
> You haven't bothered carefully reading it. It refutes
It refutes you. It refutes everything you have ever claimed up to the very
> You haven't bothered carefully reading it. It refutes
moment you found the cite. It is refuted by the video which we both
watched. It is refuted by the statements of people present.
You just cloned yourself, metaphorically speaking, then stuck your face
really close to your own and burped real loud... in your own face.
Metaphorically speaking.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/668596133330894848
docufo
Nov 25, 2021, 12:32:16 AM11/25/21
to
military roles without official sanction. The Kenosha Police never
requested any civilian assistance. The Mayor never asked for it.
Kyle is now predictably making the interview rounds on conservative
media forums.
For a teenager that a few weeks ago shot and killed two and wounded
another, he's amazingly composed talking about his experience, with a
slightly smiley face and cheerful disposition!
Taking human life seems to have little effect on him. He immediately
accepts interviews with the media.
Zimmerman and Riddlemouse should shack up.
@y-
V
JTEM is Magic
Nov 25, 2021, 9:52:21 PM11/25/21
to
docufo wrote:
> Vigilantism is defined as
"Punch a fascist."
Or what about burning & looting cus you decided that "White People"
are evil?
Deciding to lynch Kyle Rittenhouse.
Know what isn't vigilantism? Self defense. It is nothing even remotely
similar to vigilantism.
And neither was the Reichstag Fire. It's a staged event. It's a media
event. And in one swift move millions even tens of millions of people
flipped from pro riot to calling on the police to shoot rioters and the
FBI to hunt down protesters.
It worked. It worked great. Hats off to the reptilian overlords! They won
again.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/668803116618137600
> Vigilantism is defined as
"Punch a fascist."
Or what about burning & looting cus you decided that "White People"
are evil?
Deciding to lynch Kyle Rittenhouse.
Know what isn't vigilantism? Self defense. It is nothing even remotely
similar to vigilantism.
And neither was the Reichstag Fire. It's a staged event. It's a media
event. And in one swift move millions even tens of millions of people
flipped from pro riot to calling on the police to shoot rioters and the
FBI to hunt down protesters.
It worked. It worked great. Hats off to the reptilian overlords! They won
again.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/668803116618137600
docufo
Nov 26, 2021, 6:10:44 PM11/26/21
to
On 11/25/2021 6:52 PM, JTEM is Magic wrote:
> docufo wrote:
>
>> Vigilantism is defined as
>
> "Punch a fascist."
>
> Or what about burning & looting cus you decided that "White People"
> are evil?
>
> Deciding to lynch Kyle Rittenhouse.
>
> Know what isn't vigilantism? Self defense. It is nothing even remotely
> similar to vigilantism.
Self defense in Kyle's case wouldn't have manifested at all had the
> docufo wrote:
>
>> Vigilantism is defined as
>
> "Punch a fascist."
>
> Or what about burning & looting cus you decided that "White People"
> are evil?
>
> Deciding to lynch Kyle Rittenhouse.
>
> Know what isn't vigilantism? Self defense. It is nothing even remotely
> similar to vigilantism.
dopey teenager understood what most adults easily accept as preferable
reactions to a riot in a distant city - leave the protection to the cops
and guardsmen.
Nothing that occurred in Kenosha violently in the streets hasn't
happened in countless cities and towns across America for decades. And
in the hottest of the 60s revolution, many similar (and far worse)
situations occurred in support of civil rights, equal justice, an
illegal draft and a costly foolish war in Vietnam.
In nearly all of those many street clashes, between the Left and Right,
between both extremist groups and authorities, there was no need to have
any vigilantes help governmental law enforcement to protect citizens.
And there were few incidents that had vigilantes involved, and those
that did, were just as unneeded and unwanted as thrill seeker Rottenlouse.
Vigilantes are never to be encouraged let alone be hailed as heroes when
they pack open military heavy weapons around in the midst of a hotbed of
racially-motivated demonstrations and riots, the latter being the only
aspect important to right-wingers to help distract from the other
extremist action - armed civilians assuming law enforcement roles, many
with little or no experience handling angry crowds.
YOU are one of the greatest fools Boston has to be ashamed of, but don't
feel so bad.
Fools have plenty of company these days from top to bottom.
@y@
V
JTEM is Magic
Nov 27, 2021, 12:48:26 AM11/27/21
to
docufo wrote:
> Self defense in Kyle's case wouldn't have manifested at all had the
It's a Stand Your Ground state.
> Self defense in Kyle's case wouldn't have manifested at all had the
In a court of law, all that matters is what the law states. What you
believe it should state or would in a perfect world is irrelevant.
> Nothing that occurred in Kenosha violently in the streets hasn't
> happened in countless cities and towns across America for decades.
> any vigilantes
I'm not sure why idiots attacking an innocent boy for imaginary crimes
is not vigilanteism but, it is a fact that self defense is not.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/668901452127797248
docufo
Nov 28, 2021, 4:15:10 PM11/28/21
to
On 11/26/2021 9:48 PM, JTEM is Magic wrote:
> docufo wrote:
>
>> Self defense in Kyle's case wouldn't have manifested at all had the
>
> It's a Stand Your Ground state.
You mean in Illinois where KrazyKyle lives? If I was to protect my
> docufo wrote:
>
>> Self defense in Kyle's case wouldn't have manifested at all had the
>
> It's a Stand Your Ground state.
"ground" I'd limit it to my location and leave Kenoshans to protect theirs.
And there is no evidence whatsoever that heavily armed civilian teens
and twenties were ever needed or requested by authorities. A great
majority of Americans in past polls on the usefulness of vigilantes do
not want anything to do with amateur cops or paramilitary.
Kyle and his deluded pals weren't in Kenosha to "stand their ground" but
to satisfy themselves and their great desire to be admired and popular,
while getting off on the temporary authority over those they hate and
fear - the Left.
When the extreme Left's militias and vigilantes get into an ongoing
guerilla warfare, and the body counts and damage really pile up fast,
try to recall how the insanity all started:
One of the biggest and potentially most destructive lies ever told by a
President - that the electoral system was rigged.
It won't be a shining page or two in the history books, no, not at all,
but likely a beginning of a long series of ideologically fanatical,
violent encounters at all levels and everywhere imaginable, rocking
Americans with the sheer hatefulness, destructiveness and brutality
it'll produce.
There is no perfect world and the best humans can do to get anywhere
near it is to follow the law of our nation, the Constitution, and beyond
that it's family values and individuals' commitment to moral principles,
overall.
It's the best humanity has to muster at this stage of its evolution. If
vigilantes have a better concept we've not seen any evidence of it in
our past replete with periods of heightened vigilante action that more
often resulted in Kangaroo courts, murder, rape and beatings.
What I and most Americans know is that freedoms carry a social and
personal responsibility that is most often learned growing up, from
parents, relatives and friends.
The moral, social values they impart to the young matters as much as the
law, and no ideological devotion alone will ever get us a bit closer to
a "perfect world."
A perfect world is realistically defined as a subjective consideration
of what an individual or group think "should" be "perfect" human
behavior, government, etc.
Most Americans have for decades rejected reverting to tribalism and
anarchy as a preferable way to live their lives, and in the same breath
reject its key component - rule by unauthorized armed civilians, as
either self-styled cops or fascistic leaders.
It is a Pandora's Box that Donnie opened up when he created his own
police force directed by him to usurp states' and cities' rights to
autonomy under the Constitution to use their guardsmen, state, county
and city police as they see fit.
Two lawsuits by Portland and Oregon will likely be lost by Donnie's
legal team because he interjected illegally his "no ID" forces into
Portland's protests and riots without official sanction.
It is the first time a President has created his own police force under
his command - 65,000 storm troopers Hitler would've applauded with glee.
@y=
V
JTEM is Magic
Nov 28, 2021, 4:56:55 PM11/28/21
to
Lives to say mean things to JTEM, docufo brutishly wrote:
> JTEM is Magic wrote:
> > It's a Stand Your Ground state.
> You mean in Illinois where KrazyKyle lives?
crime, and no federal crimes were identified and certainly none
charged, charges are brought by "The State."
If you stab any orphans, and I admit that there's a good chance that's
something you have never done but, for the sake of argument, IF you
stabbed any orphans the case wouldn't be "Stabbed Orphan vs Crazed
UFO Nutter."
No.
The case would be "The State vs Crazed UFO Nutter."
The state we are speaking of is Wisconsin.
And this is very important, because sometimes things can be a crime in
one state but not a crime in another. So WHERE an act is committed
matters. Because if it happens in a state where it's legal some other state
can't press charges against you. They don't have jurisdiction.
> If I was to protect my
> "ground" I'd limit it to my location and leave Kenoshans to protect theirs.
pretty certain of this, the "Founding Fathers" would not have had a problem
with concerned citizens taking up arms against wilding mobs who were
committing against of violence, vandalism, arson & looting. If we want to
talk "Original Intent," I can't imagine any scenario where the men who
created our (sometimes abused, often denied) gun rights would have seen
a problem with Rosenbaum being gunned down when he set that
dumpster fire.
They or at least he set a dumpster on fire and was attempting to push it
into a gas station. Yeah, this idea that he hadn't ALREADY earned a bullet
long before he instigated the whole Kyle Rittenhouse thing is pretty new.
It's really unconscionable that Rittenhouse was even charged with a crime,
given that his entire ordeal was captured on camera, the people attacking
him were out of control animals and you have to be worthy of a Darwin
Award just for attacking someone holding a rifle in the first place...
Why was he charged?
It was a show trial. From beginning to end, it was all a goddamn show
trial.
> And there is no evidence whatsoever that heavily armed civilian teens
> and twenties were ever needed or requested by authorities.
to pretend that you're not seeking a negative response then the best we
could grant you is that you're spewing rationalization. Because there's ZERO
relevance. NOBODY requested the riots. The police didn't ask anyone to
commit arson and go looting. It never happened.
> A great
> majority of Americans in past polls on the usefulness of vigilantes
whole place stinks, aren't you?
Self Defense has nothing approaching, nothing similar to vigilanteism.
> Two lawsuits by Portland and Oregon will likely be lost by Donnie's
> legal team because he interjected illegally his "no ID" forces into
> Portland's protests and riots without official sanction.
> It is the first time a President has created his own police force under
> his command - 65,000 storm troopers Hitler would've applauded with glee.
Hitler not only approved of but employed violence, looting & arson as a
tactic.
And the Reichstag Fire that worked so well last January...
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/669133117028745216
docufo
Nov 28, 2021, 5:46:07 PM11/28/21
to
unauthorized armed civilians pretending to be protectors which a great
majority of Americans have always rejected as "vigilantism". And present
one group of armed dangerous civilians against another in an emotionally
charged environment of hatred, fear and violence.
It was not "self defense" that motivated dozens of vigilantes to the
streets of Kenosha. Regular police didn't need them at all, despite one
unidentified Kenosha cop's appreciation of KrazyKyle and his pals. He
was simply irresponsible and didn't speak for Kenosha's residents nor
its leadership.
It was, however, "self defense" that resulted in Kyle's murder of two
people and a wounding of a third which would still be alive today had
Rittenhouse stayed home to defend his own ground. And there was no
reason to even do that.
All delusional young dumb fuckers living a heroic fantasy that was
nothing more than recklessness and immaturity the young are so well
known for, especially.
It'd be a lot more civil, sane and responsible society if all people
adhere to the law and have governmental law enforcement handle the
monkey business of self-created "protectors" AND extremists in the
streets, both Left and Right.
Nothing that our founding fathers wrote as national law has any
allowance for usurping constitutionally approved law enforcement for the
sake of "standing one's ground." Standing for law and order by letting
police and guardsmen do their jobs, as they've done mostly capably for
crowd control for decades.
And if "violence looting and arson" are of such concern to you or any
American, you'd appreciate the long history of vigilantism in this
nation, often racially motivated or other wise by prejudices and
unreasonable fears, that has only rarely been beneficial, usually when
authorized forces are insufficient in number or capability to handle
civil disturbances.
Selling out to the wildness of vigilantism and its dark history is to
invite another form of Hitlerism into a society supposedly dedicated to
equality, fair justice and mutual respect for the law.
@y@
O
JTEM is Magic
Nov 28, 2021, 7:09:52 PM11/28/21
to
docufo wrote:
> > Self Defense has nothing approaching, nothing similar to vigilanteism.
> LoL! It is when it's used as an excuse to occupy public streets
I'm glad we're talking about a riot here so that none of the irony was lost.
> > Self Defense has nothing approaching, nothing similar to vigilanteism.
> LoL! It is when it's used as an excuse to occupy public streets
> with unauthorized armed civilians
Okay so you're a fascist. 100% of your ire is reserved for the people who
were obeying the law. They lawfully carried weapons in the open,
they did not shoot anyone rioting, not the arsonists or looters, and you
have yet to express a problem with the people who were there with
malicious, unlawful intent.
> "vigilantism".
There's that word you crapped out, the one you keep smearing on everything,
trying to stink up the place... the earth.
There were riots all over. Arson. Looting. People terrorized and hurt. And
the police did nothing. Nothing at all. Every politician should be out of
office -- thrown out, impeached, indicted. Everyone who made those
decisions should be
> It was not "self defense" that motivated
What did they want? Be specific. We all know they'd claim they wanted a
perfect world with sunshine, rainbows and puppies... lots of puppies. But
what SPECIFIC changes -- what legislation, what allocation of resources
-- were they asking for?
Because one side wanted people to not loot, commit arson & destroy a
community. I know what they wanted. They certainly didn't want to be
in the streets. They wanted the police to enforce the law, keep the peace.
So what did the side you endorse want? Specifically?
> It was, however, "self defense" that resulted in Kyle's murder
/Trolling/
Trolling
/Trolling/
Trolling down the riv-er (of shit)
> Nothing that our founding fathers wrote as national law has any
> allowance for usurping constitutionally approved law enforcement
they would have all been arrested for trying to lynch a boy. Or looting. Or
arson. Or whatever else they were doing there, because it certainly wasn't
for prayers & quiet contemplation.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/669133117028745216
docufo
Nov 29, 2021, 3:30:14 AM11/29/21
to
On 11/28/2021 4:09 PM, JTEM is Magic wrote:
> docufo wrote:
>
>>> Self Defense has nothing approaching, nothing similar to vigilanteism.
>
>> LoL! It is when it's used as an excuse to occupy public streets
>
> I'm glad we're talking about a riot here so that none of the irony was lost.
LOL! The real "irony" is that the defenders of Kenosha - the police -
> docufo wrote:
>
>>> Self Defense has nothing approaching, nothing similar to vigilanteism.
>
>> LoL! It is when it's used as an excuse to occupy public streets
>
> I'm glad we're talking about a riot here so that none of the irony was lost.
were more than capable of handling the small number of rioters and that
any civilian volunteers were there for their lust for egoistic and
anarchic psychodrama that's well embedded in a culture of growing
narcissism and paranoia, racism and vigilantism. Promulgated by the
violent video game fantasies and big gun-oriented streaming dramas,
thrillers, etc.
And the Kenosha riots were historically unremarkable, simply like so
many others where governmental police historically have been more than
adequate to quell riots of much more dimension than Kenosha. And then
there's always at the ready - the states' guardsmen.
>
>> with unauthorized armed civilians
>
> Okay so you're a fascist.
control - which they were not - Kyle and his pals become more threat
than protection.
100% of your ire is reserved for the people who
> were obeying the law. They lawfully carried weapons in the open,
> they did not shoot anyone rioting, not the arsonists or looters, and you
> have yet to express a problem with the people who were there with
> malicious, unlawful intent.
only gun injury was the third person that took a nice load in his arm.
And what were the places at that area of the town he and his pals were
so vitally needed to protect?
LOL! One small auto dealer and its parking lot.
While some members of his extended family lives in Kenosha, they had
nothing to do with the business - Car Source - he claimed he and his
pals were there to protect that night of the shooting.
And it was found in court testimony that the owners of that business had
not asked for vigilantes to protect them. He was not there to "stand his
ground" but was unwanted and unneeded for protection of a business. An
unknown Kenosha cop praised him and his pals for their work. It was
minutes later Kyle sent deadly slugs into three people, protecting a
business and parking lot his family didn't own and whose real owners
claim they hadn't asked for vigilante protection.
@y@
V
Quote:
Did Rittenhouse’s Grandparents Own Gas Station in Kenosha?
Kyle Rittenhouse was acquitted on all charges in November 2021 in the
case of a deadly protest.
Dan Evon
Published 22 November 2021
Updated 22 November 2021
Claim
Kyle Rittenhouse was defending a gas station owned by his grandparents
when he shot three people during a night of civil unrest in Kenosha,
Wisconsin.
Rating
False
Context
Rittenhouse was acquitted on all charges in November 2021. A viral
social media post claiming that he was defending a gas station owned by
his grandparents, however, is false.
Origin
In November 2021, shortly after Kyle Rittenhouse was acquitted of all
charges in the killing of two people during a night of civil unrest in
Kenosha, Wisconsin, a social media post went viral that embellished some
aspects of the case. The post claimed, for example, that Rittenhouse was
defending a gas station that belonged to his grandparents during the
deadly altercation. The post begins:
If you only watched or learned about the Rittenhouse trial via ABC, CBS,
CNN, MSNBC, or NBC, you will not know:
The gas station, where they initially attacked Rittenhouse, is owned by
his grandparents. They came on to his family’s property to attack him.
Rittenhouse put out a dumpster fire being rolled towards that same gas
station, meant to burn it down and possibly cause an explosion.
[…]
I didn’t know that someone knocked Rittenhouse down twice and then
attempted to kick him with lethal force to the head.
I didn’t know that Huber had hit him in the head 2x with a skateboard.
This post is false or misleading in several ways. For one, Rittenhouse’s
grandparents did not own the gas station involved in the altercation.
And second, many of the items mentioned in this post — for example,
Rittenhouse testified that Anthony Huber, one of the men who was killed,
had hit him with a skateboard — received coverage from mainstream
outlets such as CNN.
We have found no evidence to support the claim about Rittenhouse’s
grandparents. Rittenhouse’s defense team did not make this claim during
the trial, nor did we find any reports from credible news outlets
reporting this to be the case.
Rittenhouse testified that he traveled to Kenosha in order to protect a
car dealership (not a gas station) called Car Source, which had been
damaged a few days prior during a night of unrest following the shooting
of Jacob Blake. Rittenhouse said that the owners of the dealership had
asked him to help protect the business. Members of the family who own
Car Source (who are not related to Rittenhouse) disputed this claim
during their testimony:
After the shootings, the sons of the owner of Car Source told multiple
media outlets they never asked for armed help. The sons are Sahil “Sal
Khindri” Khindri and Anmol “Sam Khindri” Khindri. They said their father
speaks little English. On the stand Friday, both Sal Khindri and Sam
Khindri said they never asked anyone for armed help.
While there is some dispute over whether this dealership asked for help
(an employee later said it did), this dealership clearly is not owned by
Rittenhouse’s grandparents.
Rittenhouse did visit a gas station near Car Source during the night of
the fatal shootings, but there’s no evidence to suggest that his
grandparents owned the gas station. Here’s what Rittenhouse said about
this gas station during his testimony (full transcript at Rev.com here):
Attorney 1: Did you continue on your way down Sheridan Road without
[Ryan] Balch?
Kyle Rittenhouse: No. I actually went to go look for Mr. Balch in the
Ultimate gas station parking lot.
Attorney 1: When you went to the Ultimate gas station parking lot,
describe what was going on there.
Kyle Rittenhouse: There were a lot of people there. I don’t really know
what was going on, I was just focused on trying to find Mr. Balch. As I
was looking for him, couldn’t find him. I said, okay, no problem. I’ll
just go back to the Car Source lot Car Source number too.
Rittenhouse was also asked about his grandparents during his testimony.
While Rittenhouse said that his grandmother (as well as an aunt, uncle,
and cousins) lived in Kenosha, he did not claim that they owned a gas
station nor that he was trying to protect their property during the
fatal shooting. Here’s another excerpt from Rittenhouse’s testimony:
Attorney 1: Do you have any other family that’s from Kenosha?
Kyle Rittenhouse: Yes.
Attorney 1: What?
Kyle Rittenhouse: My grandmother, my aunt, my uncle and cousins all live
in the city of Kenosha.
The viral post falsely claims that mainstream media outlets failed to
report Rittenhouse’s grandparents owned the gas station — they didn’t
report this because it isn’t true. That said, we also searched for this
tidbit on more conservative-leaning news outlets such as Fox News and
The Daily Caller. Neither of these outlets have reported that
Rittenhouse’s grandparents owned a gas station in Kenosha.
Here’s an excerpt from a Fox News article reporting on how Rittenhouse
ended up in Kenosha:
Black testified that he, his brother and Rittenhouse traveled to Kenosha
the morning of Aug. 25, 2020 to see the aftermath of the riots during
two nights prior. They then left, and returned to the city at around 5
p.m., after one of Black’s friends said they should help protect a local
business, Car Source.
[…]
Rittenhouse and Black met with other armed individuals in Kenosha on the
night of the shootings. Rittenhouse testified that he headed there to
help patrol the streets, protect businesses and provide first aid, which
he came prepared for with a medical bag.
Two members of the family that owns Car Source, however, denied setting
up plans for Rittenhouse or anyone else to protect the business.
Prosecutor Thomas Binger also showed screenshots of text messages
Rittenhouse sent Anmol Khindri, a member of the family that owns Car Source.
[…]
Before the shootings, Rittenhouse was a police explorer for the
Grayslake Police Department and a cadet with the Antioch Fire
Department. He lived in Antioch with his single mother, Wendy
Rittenhouse, and his two sisters. Antioch borders the Wisconsin state
line and is about 20 miles, or roughly a 30-minute drive, from Kenosha,
where his father, grandmother, aunt, uncle and cousin live.
In addition to falsely stating that Rittenhouse was protecting a gas
station owned by his grandparents, the general thrust of the viral post
is to misleadingly insinuate that people following Rittenhouse’s trial
would be misinformed if they got their news from mainstream media
outlets. Many of the listed items in this post, however, were actually
covered by outlets such as MSNBC and CNN.
CNN, for example, reported that Joseph Rosenbaum, one of the men killed
by Rittenhouse, had been previously convicted of sexual conduct with a
minor. It should also be noted that some of the listed items in this
viral post didn’t emerge until the trial. For example, Gaige Grosskreutz
testified that he pointed his gun at Rittenhouse before being shot,
something that bolstered the defense’s claim of self-defense. When this
testimony occurred, it was reported on by mainstream media outlets,
including Snopes.
The New York Times reported:
As Mr. Grosskreutz described the seconds before Mr. Rittenhouse shot
him, he was shown photos that captured him pointing his gun at Mr.
Rittenhouse.
“So when you were standing three to five feet from him with your arms up
in the air, he never fired, right?” Corey Chirafisi, a defense lawyer,
asked.
“Correct,” Mr. Grosskreutz answered.
“It wasn’t until you pointed your gun at him, advanced on him with your
gun — now your hands down, pointed at him — that he fired, right?” Mr.
Chirafisi said.
“Correct,” he said.
Sources:
Bosman, Julie. “Man Shot by Kyle Rittenhouse Describes the Encounter on
a Kenosha Street.” The New York Times, 8 Nov. 2021. NYTimes.com,
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/11/08/us/kyle-rittenhouse-gaige-grosskreutz-testimony.html.
Colton, Emma. “How Kyle Rittenhouse Ended up in Kenosha Armed with an
AR-15.” Fox News, 15 Nov. 2021,
https://www.foxnews.com/us/kyle-rittenhouse-days-leading-up-to-shooting.
Gregory, Lemos. “Kyle Rittenhouse Says He Used Stimulus Money to Buy the
Gun He Allegedly Used to Kill Two during Wisconsin Protest, Washington
Post Reports.” CNN,
https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/19/us/kyle-rittenhouse-gun-kenosha/index.html.
Accessed 22 Nov. 2021.
Maxouris, Christina. “Kyle Rittenhouse Was Acquitted on All Charges.
Here’s What We Know about the 3 Men He Shot.” CNN,
https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/01/us/kyle-rittenhouse-shooting-victims-trial/index.html.
Accessed 22 Nov. 2021.
Rogan, Adam. “Did Car Source Ask for Armed Help during Kenosha Unrest?
Witness Testimony Differs.” Journal Times,
https://journaltimes.com/news/local/did-car-source-ask-for-armed-help-during-kenosha-unrest-witness-testimony-differs/article_acf1e897-4ade-5504-9a3f-f76c00a545c7.html.
Accessed 22 Nov. 2021.
Sanford, Claire. “Kyle Rittenhouse Testimony Transcript Homicide Trial
November 10.” Rev, 10 Nov. 2021,
https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts/kyle-rittenhouse-testimony-during-homicide-trial-transcript-november-10.
Barbaro, Michael, et al. “The Acquittal of Kyle Rittenhouse.” The New
York Times, 22 Nov. 2021. NYTimes.com,
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/11/22/podcasts/the-daily/kyle-rittenhouse-verdict.html.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/rittenhouse-grandparents-gas/
Vigilantes that weren't needed or wanted but providing protection isn't
the main reason they journeyed to a violent area of Kenosha.
It was just for kicks. His creepy half-smile and calmness indicate he's
morally numb to taking peoples' lives in reckless situations he had no
business being involved in.
Kyle's now being groomed for a far right-hero status and it initially
appears he's more than willing to keep the spotlight on himself.
@y=
O
Steven Douglas
Nov 29, 2021, 7:04:02 PM11/29/21
to
the vigilantes that night.
JTEM is Magic
Nov 29, 2021, 10:20:19 PM11/29/21
to
docufo wrote:
> LOL! The real "irony" is that the defenders of Kenosha - the police -
> were more than capable of handling the small number of rioters
They didn't.
> LOL! The real "irony" is that the defenders of Kenosha - the police -
> were more than capable of handling the small number of rioters
There were 40 buildings destroyed, another 10 damaged. If they had
handled it, like you claim, that total would have been zero. If they
just about handled it, maybe cut that number in HALF?
They didn't handle it at all.
> And the Kenosha riots were historically unremarkable
Riots come big & small. None of them are small when it's happening
to you.
But if they were so small, why couldn't the police handle it?
> And then
> there's always at the ready - the states' guardsmen.
and not the defenders out of fear of the rioters. You want the police
to not crack down because you're afraid of inciting the rioters. Well,
your job, your whole career isn't on the line. The politicians are far
bigger cowards than you. They know if they call out the Guard and
there's a body count, they will never get elected to anything ever
again. They don't give a shit about you, your hope, the community or
even the economy. All they want to is avoid being connected to any
Kent State like affair.
This is why containment is such an attractive option. You seal off
the area, don't let people in or out, cut off all power, water, gas,
cable, WiFi... cut off cellphone service. Lock them up and let the
dogs tear each other apart. Then all the worthless politician did was
"Contain the riot." That's all. All the other suffering came at the hands
of rioters. They did it to each other.
Leave them in there for a month of two.
The fucking worthless shits in office escape responsibility, the rioters
decide that they never ever want to be a part of anything like that
again, that all their fellow rioters are psychopaths, thieves, bullies and
rapists...
> If they're not trained and equipped for all the many demands of crowd
> control
> The only two murders
There were no murders. It was all caught on video. There was only an
attempted murder (or four) but the one unambiguous attempt to
execute Rittenhouse was stopped by the quick reflexes of Kyle
Rittenhouse... who shot the bastard.
> And it was found in court testimony that the owners of that business had
> not asked
One was already burnt to a crisp.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/669120844966002688
docufo
Nov 30, 2021, 6:42:45 PM11/30/21
to
year. Conflation! Exploitation!
Trying to prove "aforethought" in charging a person with "murder" can be
the uneasy factor that often relinquishes the killing to manslaughter.
No one could prove or disprove Rittenhouse's mindset prior to, or
during, the riotous mess in Kenosha August 2020. So, it'll always be an
argument that malice toward or murder of leftists (protesting Jacob
Blake's paralysis caused by being shot multiple times in the back by a
white cop) was or was not in Kyle's 17-year-old brain when he joined
other vigilantes. It is, however, very evident from social media posts
by that ad hoc group, the "Kenosha Guard," that some members had
murderous thoughts about protestors.
It's not hardly mentioned that Kyle Rittenhouse had attended a Trump
rally in January of 2020. It was Trump that often warned he'd clean up
the "scum" on the streets, anywhere, with his own special police force
because he claimed Dem mayor and governors were too soft on
protestors/rioters. It was also Donnie's stance that Rittenhouse was
right in protecting himself from what he termed an almost certain death,
while not criticizing him or his pals for carrying assault rifles, or
joining vigilantes.
Governor Evers (D) did what most governors do when riotous conditions
occur - send in guardsmen ASAP in the numbers asked by the commanders
after their on-location assessment of the street situation. As the
situation was fluid, as most riots are, the Guard's commander asked for
more troops as it devolved that day/night. 125, doubled to 250, 500,
then finally 770 guardsmen were deployed, along with scores of state
police.
Trump in a very ugly election year (and plague) was asked for additional
troops by Evers, which were mostly not deployed, but readied for action.
Donald introduced his troops into Portland's riots without
constitutional authority, resulting in even more violence. He's being
sued by the governor and Portland mayor.
Officials usually call on a rapid deployment unit - small Guard force
(as was sent on Jan. 6th to the Capitol), initially - with the NG
commander assessing what is additionally needed for crowd control. Evers
and the mayor are not to be criticized for being "soft" on rioters. They
did their job capably.
No official can quell a riot of that size quickly without assessing the
situation. The daytime situation was mostly peaceful while the cover of
nightfall led to bands of roving rioters striking businesses over
roughly a 35-block area. It is likely not more than 300 rioters were
involved - although significant number for a small town. My town is
about the same size/population.
Kenosha has only 211 officers in its department. There were likely less
than a few hundred rioters involved but too much for their small force.
175 arrests were made, most of them not residing in Kenosha.
Some Kenosha cops are being accused by the survivor of Kyle's "self
defense" of siding with far right-wing white militia, as was evident
that fateful night when Kyle got kudos from an unseen cop in an armored
car. That loudspeaker praise likely was heard by some protestors, but no
one has even mentioned it. It might've agitated protestors to hear some
Kenosha cop was licking vigilante's asses that night.
There apparently is some evidence that Kenosha "civilian guards" had
murderous intentions that night via their social posts.
I quote:
Oct 15 (Reuters) - A man shot by U.S. teenager Kyle Rittenhouse during
racial justice protests in Wisconsin last year has filed a lawsuit
against local law enforcement he accuses of deputizing a "roving
militia" of white nationalists.
Gaige Grosskreutz filed the lawsuit in federal court on Thursday. He was
one of three people shot by Rittenhouse, two of whom died. Rittenhouse
faces trial on homicide and attempted homicide charges next month in the
August 2020 shooting in Kenosha.
"It was not a mistake that Kyle Rittenhouse would kill two people and
maim a third on that evening," Grosskreutz's lawsuit said. "It was a
natural consequence of the actions of the Kenosha Police Department and
Kenosha Sheriff's office in deputizing a roving militia to 'protect
property' and 'assist in maintaining order.'"
Sam Hall, an attorney representing Kenosha County and Sheriff David
Beth, said in an emailed statement that the allegations in the lawsuit
were false and that he would seek to have the complaint dismissed.
Grosskreutz's lawsuit names Kenosha county and city, along with the
police and sheriff's department and individual officers. The Kenosha
city and police department did not immediately respond to requests for
comment.
Rittenhouse is awaiting trial in November on charges of first-degree
intentional homicide and first-degree reckless homicide in the killings
of Anthony Huber and Joseph Rosenbaum, and attempted first degree
intentional homicide and use of a dangerous weapon in Grosskreutz's
shooting. Rittenhouse also is charged with weapons violations and other
crimes during the protest.
In August, Huber's family filed a lawsuit similar to Grosskreutz's,
which claims local law enforcement officers "and white nationalist
militia persons discussed and coordinated strategy."
Grosskreutz's lawsuit said that members of a militia called the Kenosha
Guard and others arrived at the protest at the invitation via Facebook
of Kevin Mathewson, a former Kenosha City Council member. It said they
were openly brandishing weapons and threatening those taking part in
demonstrations protesting the shooting of Jacob Blake in Kenosha.
The lawsuit said unnamed militia members intended to kill protesters
they said were rioting and looting.
It also cites an email Mathewson sent to the police chief, which
according to the lawsuit said, "as you know, I am the commander of the
Kenosha Guard, a local militia" and that "we are mobilizing tonight and
have about 3,000 RSVP's."
Mathewson, who works as a private investigator, told Reuters that the
Kenosha Guard was actually an "ad hoc" group of ordinary citizens,
including Black and Latino members, who had never met before the night
of the Rittenhouse shooting, and never carried out any training.
Mathewson said the group organized to protect their neighborhoods after
racial justice protests held a few months before the Rittenhouse
shooting resulted in some local businesses being burned and looted. He
rejected any notion that the Kenosha Guard was a white nationalist militia.
"It's just not true, it's a silly assertion," he said.
The lawsuit said the social media posts made clear that the militia
members were not at the protest to protect local businesses or
contracted for security by any local stores.
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/white-nationalists-deputized-by-kenosha-police-led-deadly-shooting-lawsuit-2021-10-16/
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/after-the-riots-kenosha-police-claim-theyve-been-unfairly-villainized/ar-BB1gsPoS
https://www.foxnews.com/us/national-guard-kenosha-after-sunday-rioting
https://golocal.solari.com/mapping-the-kenosha-wisconsin-riot-damage/
Evening of Sunday August 23rd:
------------------
Quote:
Jacob Blake was shot in the back multiple times by Kenosha police
officer Rusten Sheskey. The shooting was captured on video by a
bystander and shared widely on social media that evening Citizen unrest
followed.
The county declared an emergency curfew starting at 10:15 p.m. City
police requested the support of the Kenosha County Sheriff’s Department
and the Wisconsin State Patrol, who responded to clear the scene. Most
protesters dispersed after law enforcement shot rubber bullets and tear
gas into the crowds.
Monday August 24th:
3:00 am: Kenosha County Emergency Management alerted Mayor John
Antaramian and County Executive Jim Kreuser to the unrest at
approximately 3:00 am on August 24th, just hours after the shooting.
They were told additional help would be necessary to quell the unrest.
Gov. Evers was contacted immediately afterward and he ordered the
National Guard response to Kenosha. National Guard troops cannot be
ordered unless authorized by the Governor.
Maj. Gen. Paul Knapp, the Adjutant General of the Wisconsin National
Guard, activated the Guard’s Quick Response Force in the pre-dawn hours
of Monday, August 24th.
The Guard’s Quick Response Force arrived in Kenosha on the 24th, less
than 24 hours after the police shooting.
The 125 soldiers in the Quick Reaction Force are part of a larger
National Guard Reaction Force of 500 members who must respond within 12
hours of being ordered up. Each state has a National Guard Reaction
Force to respond to civil unrest and emergencies such as filling
sandbags and health and welfare checks during flooding.
In Wisconsin, the reaction force rotates among National Guard units
every few years with specialized training to handle urban protests.
Once the Guard has been authorized, it became Maj. General Knapp's
decision to determine how many troops to deploy throughout the duration
of the unrest. His decision can be informed by the local law
enforcement, in conjunction with the input from the emergency manager as
to the seriousness of the situation.
Maj. General Knapp can only send in as many troops as are available and
who have the relevant skills and training for the mission. Even though
there are over 7700 National Guard troops in Wisconsin, there is only 1
battalion (equivalent to three companies) of troops who are trained for
riot support. Those troops operated under the direction of local law
enforcement.
Around 2 p.m. on Tuesday, Evers made his public announcement that he had
authorized the Guard to support local law enforcement in Kenosha, with a
focus on protecting critical infrastructure and maintaining public
safety during the protests.
In addition to the National Guard, state troopers, DNR agents, and other
local law enforcement agencies in Wisconsin passed along resources and
personnel, some sending up to one third of their personnel.
Fires and clashes with law enforcement continued late into the night
after the city’s 8 pm curfew, leaving extensive damage to the city.
Tuesday August 25th
After being informed by Maj. General Knapp of the need for additional
help, Gov. Evers requested troops from neighboring states. His request
was granted. He also issued a public statement denouncing the “damage
and destruction. “There remains a line between peaceful assembly and
what we saw last night that put individuals, families, and businesses in
danger,”
In addition, Gov. Evers also declared a State of Emergency with
Executive Order #86 following protests in communities across Wisconsin.
Executive Order #86 proclaimed a state of emergency in Wisconsin,
directed state agencies to continue assisting the state response, and
calls to state active duty additional elements of the Wisconsin National
Guard to support first responders and protect critical infrastructure
and cultural institutions.
Governor Evers spoke with President Trump on the afternoon of August
25th. President Trump offered U.S. Marshalls, ATF agents, and FBI agents
to assist in Kenosha, which Gov. Evers accepted. Trump also offered
Homeland Security troops which Gov. Evers declined as additional
National Guard troops from other states were already arranged. Those
National Guard troops also operated under the command of Maj. General Knapp.
Gov. Evers also cited the ongoing protests in Portland for declining
Homeland Security troops. These agents were filmed in unmarked uniforms
grabbing citizens off the street and putting them into unmarked vans.
Their presence and actions were cited as one of the reasons the protests
in Portland escalated. When questioned about turning down Homeland
Security during a Milwaukee Press Club discussion on September 9th,
Evers responded “we saw how poorly that played out in Portland.”
None of the National Guard troops in Wisconsin were federalized, meaning
under control of the federal government. They all were under the control
of Maj. General Knapp for the duration of their stay.
The National Guard troops in Kenosha did not have policing authority.
They provided crowd control to support law enforcement agents, who
handled arrests.
Donald Trump posted on Twitter on the night of August 25th that Gov.
Evers should call in the National Guard.
White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows also appeared on Fox News that
night and said Evers had turned down an offer from the federal
government for support, although Evers had accepted all support except
Homeland Security for the above mentioned reasons.
Meadows adviser Ben Williamson also said on Twitter that local law
enforcement had told the White House they needed at least 750 National
Guard soldiers.
Adj. Major Knapp responded to these false statements: “I don’t worry
about the president’s tweets.”
17-year-old Kyle Rittenhouse shoots and kills Joseph Rosenbaum, Anthony
Huber and injures Gaige Grosskreutz.
Wednesday, August 26
By Wednesday, most of the violence was over. The National Guard presence
continued to expand in Kenosha.
Members of the Kenosha County Board sent a letter to Gov. Evers
requesting additional National Guard troops.
Republican Congressman Bryan Steil and Senator Ron Johnson issued a
statement demanding Gov. Evers accept federal aid, to which Republican
Kenosha County Sheriff David Beth responded federal agents had already
been onsite “since day one.”
Close to 2,000 National Guard troops were in Kenosha by the end of the
week at the request of Maj. General Knapp.
Thursday, August 27
Arizona, Michigan, and Alabama agreed to send soldiers and resources to
Kenosha through the Emergency Management Assistance Compact — a mutual
agreement that allows states to send each other aid in times of
emergency. Adj. Major Knapp stated the out-of-state Guard members would
be “active state duty,” meaning directed by Wisconsin leadership and not
federal orders.
Thursday September 10
The National Guard withdrew from Kenosha.
Kenosha leaders praised Gov. Evers’ response:
Republican Kenosha County Sheriff David Beth stated:
“The state has been fantastic as far as sending resources, from the very
first minute that we asked them. They have sent everything that we’ve
asked for.”
Democratic Kenosha County Executive Jim Kreuser said:
“Do we all wish this would have all gone faster, that thousands of
troops could have arrived immediately to prevent the fatalities,
injuries and damage to property caused by the rioting? Of course. But
you can’t push an “easy” button and have the National Guard float down
from the sky. That’s not how it works. In fact, the system worked
exactly how it’s designed to function, and Evers answered every call and
did everything he could within his powers to assist Kenosha County in
its time of greatest need.”
https://kenoshacountydems.org/kcdp-blog/timeline-gov-evers-response-kenosha-rioting-following-jacob-blake-shooting/
Reality vs. myth. Rightwingers attempted to provide a (false)
justification for Kyle and his pals to patrol with big guns, as actual
trial minutes clearly show.
And then they tried to demonize the people he shot! LOL! As though it's
perfectly fine to blow away anyone threatening you that has a criminal
background! Well, as it were, "self defense" served Kyle's legal team
just fine, and the Judge Schroeder's absence of criticism of Kyle's
reckless, agitating presence helped put the cherry on top of it.
And attempts were made, of course, to lay it all on the backs of Dem
leaders for not doing enough to cleanse the hallowed streets of America
of "radical Democrats, socialists and communists" hell bent on "taking
over."
LOLol! Capitalists, fanatical rightists, and social and news medias took
over, linked with cultists supporting swindler Donnie and crew, revising
current and historical events to their liking. Jan. 6th insurrection?
Nah, they claim, it was all played out of proportion by leftist media
scum! And it's part of a massive conspiracy to establish a dictatorial
leftist government and even kick Christianity out!
Egads!! What will they lie about and hallucinate next?
@y=
v
docufo
Nov 30, 2021, 7:16:23 PM11/30/21
to
didn't make that (spurious) claim.
Neither rioters (not protestors, which far outnumber them) nor
vigilantes are lthe vicious extremes most people don't support.
But, it's almost always the rioters the medias and partisan parrots
focus on to make their case against those that riot, either side.
I was caught up in three riots that broke out during large peaceful
protests. The most notable was the "Seattle Six" trial at the federal
courthouse (Seattle). About 3000 protestors had shown up with about 250
cops in riot gear protecting the courthouse and surrounding businesses.
All hell broke loose one hour into the rally when an anarchic group,
numbering probably less than 100, mixed into the protest, started
throwing bottles and cans at cops.
I have a white T-shirt with tiny droplets of blood (now blackened) from
that day in 1970, but it was not my blood. It came from cops striking
rioters behind me (as I and many pushed to get away from them), or from
punches thrown and/or sign sticks used as clubs. A keepsake from a much
earlier time that isn't much different from the mayhem now.
@y@
V
docufo
Nov 30, 2021, 7:27:09 PM11/30/21
to
On 11/29/2021 4:04 PM, Steven Douglas wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 24, 2021 at 9:32:16 PM UTC-8, docufo wrote:
>> On 11/23/2021 1:20 PM, Steven Douglas wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, November 23, 2021 at 1:02:43 AM UTC-8, docufo wrote:
>>>>
>>>> And that "man" - actually a boy in high school - should be regarded as a
>>>> savior of a city that certainly didn't ask for his saving,
>>>
>>> It's clear you did not watch the trial, and you have a distorted view
>>> of what happened that night and at the trial.
>>>
>>> From CNN:
>>> [excerpt] During his testimony, defendant Kyle Rittenhouse said
>>> that on the day of the shooting, he was contacted by Nicholas Smith,
>>> who was employed at the Car Source dealership, and asked if he
>>> wanted help "watch over" the car dealership. [end excerpt]
>>>
>>> https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/kyle-rittenhouse-trial-11-10-21/h_5a2225dbf498ab7c08c5f34bbece9132
That was an employee's claim. The two owners said they never asked for
> On Wednesday, November 24, 2021 at 9:32:16 PM UTC-8, docufo wrote:
>> On 11/23/2021 1:20 PM, Steven Douglas wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, November 23, 2021 at 1:02:43 AM UTC-8, docufo wrote:
>>>>
>>>> And that "man" - actually a boy in high school - should be regarded as a
>>>> savior of a city that certainly didn't ask for his saving,
>>>
>>> It's clear you did not watch the trial, and you have a distorted view
>>> of what happened that night and at the trial.
>>>
>>> From CNN:
>>> [excerpt] During his testimony, defendant Kyle Rittenhouse said
>>> that on the day of the shooting, he was contacted by Nicholas Smith,
>>> who was employed at the Car Source dealership, and asked if he
>>> wanted help "watch over" the car dealership. [end excerpt]
>>>
>>> https://www.cnn.com/us/live-news/kyle-rittenhouse-trial-11-10-21/h_5a2225dbf498ab7c08c5f34bbece9132
any armed civilian protection. Similarly, one unidentified cop in an
armored cop praised Kyle and his armed pals at that Car Source location.
It's all on video, with Kyle being tossed two water bottles after he
requested H20.
The Kenosha police officials never asked for vigilantes and certainly
the mayor didn't, either.
They appeared, junior, in a period before the guard and state cops
arrived in large numbers. And it's pretty clear they exploited that
period of the guards' absence by imposing themselves on a business to
help justify their armed patrol's presence.
All they needed was one employee (likely on the same wavelength) to say
they were needed, and away lil' Kyle goes a-running to be an amateur cop!
Bang bang! And Kyle's now a far right hero.
@y=
v
JTEM is Magic
Nov 30, 2021, 11:07:13 PM11/30/21
to
docufo wrote:
> No, there was not one citizen "burnt to a crisp" in Kenosha's riots last
> year.
Car lot. One of the three car lots was already charcoal before Rittenhouse
> No, there was not one citizen "burnt to a crisp" in Kenosha's riots last
> year.
answered the call, you Mao wannabe...
> Trying to prove "aforethought" in charging a person with "murder" can be
> the uneasy factor that often relinquishes the killing to manslaughter.
It was self defense. If there was one time when the video proved a
defendant's innocence, this is it.
> No one could prove or disprove Rittenhouse's mindset prior to, or
> during, the riotous mess in Kenosha August 2020.
behind bars for the rest of his life. We can't prove he intended to execute
Rittenhouse when he chased him down, drew a gun & pointed it at his
head. We know he was attempting to murder Rittenhouse, the video rules
out anything but an attempt to murder the kid, yet we still can't read his
thoughts.
> So, it'll always be an
> argument that malice toward or murder of leftists (protesting Jacob
> Blake's paralysis caused by being shot multiple times in the back by a
> white cop)
will draw and fire again. They had no choice. He had a knife. He was
attempting to flee in a car that wasn't his with children he did not have
custody of. This was AFTER he resisted all attempts to arrest him.
They even tried to tase him!
So, yes, exact same circumstances on a different day, in a different city
and with different cops: Same results.
THAT is the problem here, THAT is the crime: People are being misinformed
to the extant of deception. They are being deceived. The media incited violence.
The solution is to activate a secret Pentagon squad and take out the boardrooms
of that small handful of corporations that control 90% or more of all the so called
"Information" you receive. Stop the people who are trying to incite unrest, you
stop the unrest.
Allowing violent criminals who resisted arrest and are trying to escape WITH A
KNIFE in a car that isn't his and kids he doesn't have custody of in the back?
Not a solution.
Think of all the people who'd be alive. Think of all the property that never would
have been destroyed, the monuments never ripped down if a crack Pentagon
team had taken out that handful of boardrooms...
Let's do a cost benefit analysis, shall we?
> It's not hardly mentioned that Kyle Rittenhouse had attended a Trump
> rally
"I like to pretend that I disagree with his politics, despite my laboring to
put Trump into the Whitehouse for a year, so he should be locked in prison."
> Governor Evers (D) did what most governors do when riotous conditions
> occur - send in guardsmen ASAP in the numbers asked by
going to be trouble...
> Trump
So it's Trump's fault, that's why you got him elected, because Trump over
reacted and didn't react or not enough plus he said things that aren't true
or are true, depending on which way the wind is blowing and what the media
needs you to believe too make you freak out.
> Some Kenosha cops are being accused by the survivor of Kyle's "self
> defense" of siding with far right-wing white militia
seen on video trying to murder Kyle in cold blood, but was never charged
with any crime, not even purgatory even though NOBODY thought he wasn't
lying on the stand...
So Kyle was so racist that he only shot white guys, and the police were so
pro right wing that they refused to charge a proven criminal for even the
crimes that were caught on video...
> There apparently is some evidence that Kenosha "civilian guards" had
> murderous intentions that night via their social posts.
he was never charged.
The state is going red, thanks to the Governor...
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/669255436558581760
Steven Douglas
Dec 1, 2021, 12:58:18 PM12/1/21
to
under the false impression that Rittenhouse was an "active shooter",
and they were trying to disarm him. The guy who was shot in the arm
was trying to shoot Rittenhouse. That would make those people the
vigilantes, in that they were trying to stop what they mistakenly thought
was an "active shooter".
It's all very tragic, and it began with the first guy who chased Rittenhouse
in an attempt to attack him. After Rittenhouse DEFENDED himself from
that attacker, he was chased by others who became vigilantes. Will you
be able to grasp this point, or will you ignore it and plod along with your
false narrative that the media has given you?
JTEM is Magic
Dec 1, 2021, 3:27:38 PM12/1/21
to
Steven Douglas wrote:
> The people who were chasing Rittenhouse after the first shooting were
> under the false impression that Rittenhouse was an "active shooter",
> and they were trying to disarm him. The guy who was shot in the arm
> was trying to shoot Rittenhouse. That would make those people the
> vigilantes, in that they were trying to stop what they mistakenly thought
> was an "active shooter".
Multiple people were already chasing Rittenhouse BEFORE he fired. In one
> The people who were chasing Rittenhouse after the first shooting were
> under the false impression that Rittenhouse was an "active shooter",
> and they were trying to disarm him. The guy who was shot in the arm
> was trying to shoot Rittenhouse. That would make those people the
> vigilantes, in that they were trying to stop what they mistakenly thought
> was an "active shooter".
video a black kid is relating that the "antifa" is telling people "no video,"
which strongly implies (to say the least) that they intended to do something
to Rittenhouse that they did not want video proof of. The guy who tried to
execute Rittenhouse witnessed him being attacked and firing in defense.
He drew his illegally concealed weapon, Rittenhouse pointed his gun at him
and the guy backed off... only to try to murder Rittenhouse the moment that
he lowered the rifle.
This wasn't "Oh I think he's a madman gunning down innocent protestors."
This was clearly a case where a wilding mob was going after someone "on
the other side."
> It's all very tragic
It ruined a life. Kyle's life. That is the tragedy.
-- --
https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/669065777369989120
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