I Need Some Advice From the Pro's
Snoopy
I'm running a PI RPG sim called "Mindshadow". One of the plots I'm
working on is a case involving a child abduction. What would be the
motivation for a PI agency to take such a case? A bit of background to help
you out. A young girl is kidnapped in Northern California by a stranger and
the case is four years old. The FBI has given up on the case but they refer
the family to Mindshadow Investigations, who takes the case. What would be
the motivation for a PI agency to take the case?
Thank you.
Bill Fason
$$$
I hope this doesn't sound crass, but a big retainer is the motivation.
I'm running a business here. I'm not here to be a do-gooder. Everyone
one of my clients has problems. I'm here to do a service and get paid.
Every once in awhile I might be able to do a small pro bono case, but
I'm here to scratch out a living. And that's an honest motivation.
--Bill
Nightblue
Cash on the nail is the only reason an average PI would take the case. Unless
the fictional agency is independently wealthy and can afford to take cases
based solely on conscience, look no further than the rent's due date against
the current bank balance, so long as the case is legal.
Afterall, Sears doesn't give away TV's for free because of a sob story...I
know, I've tried...
RLan538885
>the motivation for a PI agency to take the case?
>
Same answer as the others who responded. It costs money to conduct
investigations. "Pro bono" usually means it is costing the investigator time
*and* money.
Michael Edge, President
>
> Hello,
>
> I'm running a PI RPG sim called "Mindshadow". One of the plots I'm
> working on is a case involving a child abduction. What would be the
> motivation for a PI agency to take such a case? A bit of background to help
> you out. A young girl is kidnapped in Northern California by a stranger and
> the case is four years old. The FBI has given up on the case but they refer
> the motivation for a PI agency to take the case?
>
Even though we take a couple of cases each year for nothing, most cases
such as the one you describe would have to present the necessary
resources(translated--enough money), to provide the possiblility of
success. Such a case provides an interesting challenge, BUT, my three
kids don't appreciate it much when I take on a time consuming case and
have no money for them at it's conclusion.
ME
--
Michael Edge, President
Confidential Detective & Legal Support Inc.
P.O. Box 1016
Conyers, Georgia 30012
Office 770-760-0202
Fax 770-918-8172
Toll Free Voice or Fax
1-888-633-0364
Georgia Lic # 001411
http://www.swiftsite.com/cdsg
SelectInv
committments and try to only take the ones (A) Where we feel we can make a
difference (B) After we verify the need is real & urgent (C) Only if all of us
agree to take the case. We worked a case 3 years ago and put over 400 hours
into it as well a bunch of money for expenses (renting an airplane) and
research. We made the case and our client won and we all felt good about it,
but feeling good does not pay the mortgage or feed the family or keep us in
business so the next time we are around to do it again........
Dale Pleasant
Select Investigations, Inc
Charlotte, NC
John M. Hansen
Making it inactive perhaps, but some young agent is going to be sitting with
the file in his lap until it is eventually closed.
Secondly, If any federal agent ever is caught referring anyone to any
private corporation for anything they can get their as in a big sling. In
the federal services you always have friends. The corollary of this is that
you always have enemies. One can turn into another in a matter of moments,
depending in their individual agenda. Making this kind of a referral will
get out, and the enemies you have made will be certain that your supervisors
learn about it. This is guaranteed to burn your butt. The guy who refers
the family of the missing child to a private agency must be shown to to be
in his first year at work, and get his ass kicked out of the agency as a
result of his action.
He than then get a job as a security guard supervisor for Acme Rent a
Cop, and spend the rest of his life patrolling K Mart stores.
It's a great line on a resume, 'Worked for the FBI for two and a half
years, discharged for cause." Almost as good as 'Applied to the CIA and
DIA, rejected as a risk to the national security of the nation.'
Happy Holidays,
John M Hansen
Snoopy
agency to refer somebody to a private agency? Secondly, could a former agent
or other party refer an individual?
John M. Hansen wrote in message <75ufl8$hcj$1...@winter.news.rcn.net>...
SelectInv
open crimminal case to a PI by an FBI agent would be rare unless it required a
special expertise that the PI had......If that were the case, the FBI would
probably retain the PI themselves and retain control of the information and
events in the case.....
Dale Pleasant
Select Investiagaions, Inc
Charlotte, NC
John M Hansen
Right on!
The reason that federal agents are not allowed to refer to private
agencies is that it becomes a conflict of interest. Secondly, the very idea
that the FBI 'cant solve a case' and need help from outside is repugnant to
them.
As all cases are either 'open or closed' (Closed means Solved and turned
over for prosecution) all cases, no matter how old, are still considered to
be open. (As an example, the case of the identity of John Wilkes Booth was
'reopened' in the 1960's.) It is my understanding that after a hundred
years cases are 'presumed to be closed by the death of the participants.'
Other federal agencies have much the same rules and all federal agencies
have 'predecessor agencies' from which they inherited files and both open
and closed cases. J. Edgar Hoover, when he took over the FBI counted all of
the cases that he inherited closed, shocking a lot of people in the
business. It helped his statistics however.
Regards, and Merry Christmas
John M Hansen
Max565
>have 'predecessor agencies' from which they inherited files and both open
>and closed cases. J. Edgar Hoover, when he took over the FBI counted all of
>the cases that he inherited closed, shocking a lot of people in the
>business.
With all due respect, John, I seem to remember it a bit differently,
at least from the history as I understand it. I don't think J. Edgar "took
over" the Federal Bureau of Investigation from anyone or anything. As I
understand the history, he was the inaugeral director, and served until his
death in the early 1970s. If I misunderstand the history, please give me the
correct detail as to how take over occurred.
And, during the '70s and 80s, it may have been true that FBI agents
didn't, as a matter of course, make referrals to the private sector for a
variety of reasons, some which you have so elequently pointed out; however, I
believe that today, they deal with such a broad range of criminal matters, and
have religated authority in such traditionally exclusive matters as Bank
Robbery to local authority, they now routinely refer the families of victims of
non-custodial parent kidnapping to both local authority and private sector
investigators on a routine basis. I'm not saying that they make referrals to
specific investigators or specific agencies, (but I know for a fact that it
happens when those agencies are owned and operated by former FBI agents), but
that they make generic recommendations to those victims' families, by telling
them the facts concerning the closure rates, then they ask that they be
notified when the recovery is made, so that they can close out their case logs
and file the proper UCR stuff. They still get the glory and someone like us
makes the money.
Good Luck and God Bless,
Dan Larsen
Evidence, Inc. (Serving all of NE and IA since 1988)
PO Box 873
Council Bluffs, IA 51502-0873
Phone: 712-328-0358
Fax: 712-328-1063
WebSite: http://www.evidence-inc.com
E-Mail: Max...@evidence-inc.com
John M. Hansen
J Edgar Hoover was the first director of the FBI. He took over the
files from the 'Johnson Agency,' - the former Secret Service- which got into
deep shit as a result of the 'Red Raids' in the 1920's. This was a rather
turbulent time, and the FBI was organized as a result. Hoover was the
administrative assistant to Johnson (Or Johnston, my memory fides a bit on
this.) He was never an investigator, or a LEO until he became the head of
the FBI.
All agencies have predecessor agencies. The OSS, our WW2 intelligence
organization took over from the state department intelligence service headed
by a man named 'TEX.' I do not remember what his full name was (If I ever
knew it) but I do remember reading a file in which he had appended a brief
handwritten note saying only 'DAMMIT DO IT - TEX'.
As far as referrals go, generic referrals are probably OK in most cases,
but specific referrals, to specific agencies are not. Agencies headed by
former FBI men are probably referred to by FBI men by having the former man
in the room contributing information of some kind while the agent tells the
parents to consider hiring a private investigator. I have seen something
similar happen in referrals made by another agency to a member of the
corporate world who needed some work done and went to a government agency
for help.
Another infrequent poster to the group might be more enlightening on
this score.
Regards,
Best Wishes for happy holidays to all,
John
NECKIDJOHN
Snoopy
NECKIDJOHN wrote in message <19981226045225...@ng04.aol.com>...
char...@my-dejanews.com
Charlotte M. Blasier, Chief Investigator 11810
372 Florin Rd., Suite 290, Sacramento, CA. 95831
(916)427-1609 FAX(916)427-3600
E-mail= secre...@aol.com & sec...@calweb.com
12-26-98
Dear Snoopy, To begin with, it's far and few between when the F.B.I. refers
anyone to a particular private investigator. And, on those rare
circumstances it is almost always done 'back door', without others in their
area knowing. It is pretty much a given that anyone working in law
enforcement is not to refer citizens to any particular private investigation
agency. I've been an investigator in this field for more years than I choose
to admit. I have a proven record of live recoveries locally, nationally, and
abroad. And, while I have had law enforcement including F.B.I. agents refer
people directly to me, it is rare and generally done back door. The reasons
for not referring citizens is generally for one or more of the following
reasons: Most people in law enforcement dislike P.I.'s. Most people in law
enforcement do not think any P.I. can possibly solve one of their unsolvable
cases. They do not want to be placed in the position of being made liable in
case something goes wrong. Law enforcement overall feels that it is improper
to refer citizens to any particular lawyer, bail bondsman, investigator, et
cetera. In my case I have been blessed with my skills and some in law
enforcement who get personally involved in cases and want the families to
find their missing child or solve a particular case, care enough to provide
the family with my phone number. As to the motivations/reasons that a
private investigator would opt to take on a cold case of a missing child, I
can only think of two answers. 1. The P.I. is an expert in missing persons
and wants to help the family. 2. The P.I. is a greedy rat who wants to
exploit the family in their hours of need. While it's true that most P.I.
cannot afford to take on a case pro-bono, there are those who will and then
attempt to get the family to sign over the rights for tabloids, book, and/or
film rights. I know a few of those unspeakable P.I.'s. What an
embarrassment to the already sad profession. Lastly, if a P.I. doesn't work
on each and every missing person case as though it is their missing child or
relative, that P.I. should never work in that field.
And the angel said to the child in the womb
"What will you most need to flourish?"
And the child thought in silence and then replied
"Only safety .......... Please."
Sincerely,
Charlotte M. Blasier
In article <36818...@news3.uswest.net>,
"Snoopy" <snoop...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I'm running a PI RPG sim called "Mindshadow". One of the plots I'm
> working on is a case involving a child abduction. What would be the
> motivation for a PI agency to take such a case? A bit of background to help
> you out. A young girl is kidnapped in Northern California by a stranger and
> the case is four years old. The FBI has given up on the case but they refer
> the family to Mindshadow Investigations, who takes the case. What would be
> the motivation for a PI agency to take the case?
>
> Thank you.
>
>
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
char...@my-dejanews.com
372 Florin Rd., Suite 290, Sacramento, CA. 95831
(916)427-1609 FAX(916)427-3600
E-mail= secre...@aol.com & sec...@calweb.com
12-27-98
Dear Snoopy, There are times when it behooves a good law enforcement officer
to direct a parent(s) of a missing child to each and every proven source
available. If it were your child who was missing you would want and demand
to be pointed and/or hand delivered to each and every source available. We
should expect and demand nothing less. It is so unfortunate that so many
agencies, ie. police, sheriff, state & federal, still do not share
information. Such a sad state of affairs when a few hold onto info and don't
take that extra measure to investigate and share with others. I won't bore
you with how many cases I've seen wherein the recovery would have been
faster, safer, and the child suffer less, had one or two people taken more of
a vested interest in doing their job. I don't mean to be sending the message
that I'm anti law enforcement. I'm not. I'm one of their biggest crusaders.
The ones who do their job are always overworked and underpaid. Where else
can you find such dedicated and selfless individuals who at any given moment
is more than ready to put their life on the line for a total stranger? Law
enforcement and firemen are major hero's every single day. My son-in-law is
a fireman. He's been injured on the job many times. I have friends who were
forced to retire from law enforcement due to on the job injuries. These two
fields offer many rewards, but the downside is that they also offer many
dangers. Bless the parents, husbands, wives and children of these wonderful
creatures. Their families often go without them during the holidays and
special family events. I'm sorry if I'm rambling. Been a very long day and
night. If you notice I made the major mistake of typing in your E-mail
address earlier tonight when I sent a letter to someone who posted in another
area. Sincerely, Charlotte
In article <3683c...@news2.uswest.net>,
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
m...@inetarena.com
private investigator - for very good reasons, as a rule - I've had good luck
finding P.I.'s in areas where I don't have contacts by calling up the local
D.A.'s Office and asking the Chief Investigator. D.A.'s investigators tend
to spend a lot more time around courts and trials than other LEOs, so tend to
meet more P.I.s, and over a period of time they get to know who's to be
trusted and who's not. When I was a D.A.'s Investigator we had a particular
P.I. we trusted and to whom we sent several private cases over the years.
Max
Max Whittington Investigations
Portland, Oregon
http://www.inetarena.com/~mwi
Edward Fischer
The missing child may be the obvious but the underlying matter may be of a much
more serious nature. If a provider of information is interested in certain
intelligence to support the current needs of a client, domestic or foreign, in
their R&D of Bio-Tech or Med-Tech, missile technology, etc., they may retain the
child without contacting the parent until the trail is cold. The government does
not actively investigate beyond a certain level. To utilize a private specialist
in this type of investigation permits government to establish deniability but
still retain a certain amount of control by interfacing with the parents.
Just a thought in response to your question.
Sincerely,
Edward G. J. Fischer, CPP
Security Risk International, Inc.
sri-...@nwrain.com
www.sri-incorp.com