MEDICAL CONSEQUENCES OF WHAT HOMOSEXUALS DO (good article)
Dr. Min
This is a very sobering article. Certainly the most egregious
part is what's conspicuously missing from the list and that's
the spiritual dangers of such flagrantly immoral behavior. It
does no good to warn homosexuals about the consequences, when
they've already abandoned any semblance of virtue and dignity.
Bad enough they'll wear that homosexual "chip" on their shoul-
ders for the rest of their lives, while they catch and spread
all kinds of diseases, but worse still they are setting a bad
example for children. The heterosexual family unit is the ver-
itable core of our great nation. Homosexuals would destroy it.
Those who support such destructive immoral behavior, e.g. the
aclu (or really any such crooked and greedy defense attorney),
they're equally complicit in anti-American activities. Saddam,
bin Laden, you name em. Those working against the sovereignty
and well-being of the United States of America and her allies
are accomplices with the enemy whether they realize it or not.
Daniel Joseph Min
On 13 Dec 2003, tony...@aol.com (TonyZ2001) wrote:
>MEDICAL CONSEQUENCES OF WHAT HOMOSEXUALS DO
>By Paul Cameron, Ph.D.
>Dr. Cameron is Chariman of the Family Research Institute of Colorado Springs,
>Colorado USA. Click here for more information about this organization. You may
>contact him at: Family Research Institute, PO Box 62640, Colorado Springs, CO
>80962 USA. Phone number: (303) 681-3113.
>
>Throughout history, the major civilizations major religions condemned
>homosexuality.1 Until 1961 homosexual acts were illegal throughout America.
>
>Gays claim that the "prevailing attitude toward homosexuals in the U.S. and
>many other countries is revulsion and hostility....for acts and desires not
>harmful to anyone."3 The American Psychological Association and the American
>Public Health Association assured the U.S. Supreme Court in 1986 that "no
>significant data show that engaging in...oral and anal sex, results in mental
>or physical dysfunction."4
>
>What Homosexuals Do
>The major surveys on homosexual behavior are summarized below. Two things stand
>out 1) homosexuals behave similarly world-over, and 2) as Harvard Medical
>Professor, Dr. William Haseltine,33 noted in 1993, the "changes in sexual
>behavior that have been reported to have occurred in some groups have proved,
>for the most part, to be transient. For example, bath houses and sex clubs in
>many cities have either reopened or were never closed."
>
>Homosexual Activities (in %)
> US16 US13 US US18 Denmark20 US19 London27 Sydney/London26
> Canada25
>
> 1940s1977 83/84 1983 1984 1983 1985 1991
> ever ever ever in yr in yr in mo in mo last 6mo
>
>oral/penile 83 99 100/99 99 86 67
>anal/penile 68 91 93/98 95 92 95 100
>oral/anal 59 83 92/92 63 69 89 55/65
>urine sex 10 23 29/
>fisting/toys 22 41/47 34
>fecal sex-eating 4 8
>
>enemas 11 11
>torture sex 22 37 37
>public/orgy sex 61 76 88
>sex with minors 37 23 24/
>ORAL SEX Homosexuals fellate almost all of their sexual contacts (and ingest
>semen from about half of these). Semen contains many of the germs carried in
>the blood. Because of this, gays who practice oral sex verge on consuming raw
>human blood, with all its medical risks. Since the penis often has tiny lesions
>(and often will have been in unsanitary places such as a rectum), individuals
>so involved may become infected with hepatitis A or gonorrhea (and even HIV and
>hepatitis B). Since many contacts occur between strangers (70% of gays
>estimated that they had had sex only once with over half of their
>partners17,27), and gays average somewhere between 106 and 1105 different
>partners/year, the potential for infection is considerable.
>
>RECTAL SEX Surveys indicate that about 90% of gays have engaged in rectal
>intercourse, and about two-thirds do it regularly. In a 6-month long study of
>daily sexual diaries,3 gays averaged 110 sex partners and 68 rectal encounters
>a year.
>
>Rectal sex is dangerous. During rectal intercourse the rectum becomes a mixing
>bowl for 1) saliva and its germs and/or an artificial lubricant, 2) the
>recipient's own feces, 3) whatever germs, infections or substances the penis
>has on it, and 4) the seminal fluid of the inserter. Since sperm readily
>penetrate the rectal wall (which is only one cell thick) causing immunologic
>damage, and tearing or bruising of the anal wall is very common during
>anal/penile sex, these substances gain almost direct access to the blood
>stream. Unlike heterosexual intercourse (in which sperm cannot penetrate the
>multilayered vagina and no feces are present),7 rectal intercourse is probably
>the most sexually efficient way to spread hepatitis B, HIV syphilis and a host
>of other blood-borne diseases.
>
>Tearing or ripping of the anal wall is especially likely with "fisting," where
>the hand and arm is inserted into the rectum. It is also common when "toys" are
>employed (homosexual lingo for objects which are inserted into the
>rectum--bottles, carrots, even gerbils8). The risk of contamination and/or
>having to wear a colostomy bag from such "sport" is very real. Fisting was
>apparently so rare in Kinsey's time that he didn't think to talk about it. By
>1977, well over a third of gays admitted to doing it. The rectum was not
>designed to accommodate the fist, and those who do so can find themselves
>consigned to diapers for life.
>
>FECAL SEX About 80% of gays (see Table) admit to licking and/or inserting their
>tongues into the anus of partners and thus ingesting medically significant
>amounts of feces. Those who eat or wallow in it are probably at even greater
>risk. In the diary study,5 70% of the gays had engaged in this activity--half
>regularly over 6 months. Result? --the "annual incidence of hepatitis A
>in...homosexual men was 22 percent, whereas no heterosexual men acquired
>hepatitis A." In 1992,26 it was noted that the proportion of London gays
>engaging in oral/anal sex had not declined since 1984.
>
>While the body has defenses against fecal germs, exposure to the fecal
>discharge of dozens of strangers each year is extremely unhealthy. Ingestion of
>human waste is the major route of contracting hepatitis A and the enteric
>parasites collectively known as the Gay Bowel Syndrome. Consumption of feces
>has also been implicated in the transmission of typhoid fever,9 herpes, and
>cancer.27 About 10% of gays have eaten or played with [e.g., enemas, wallowing
>in feces]. The San Francisco Department of Public Health saw 75,000 patients
>per year, of whom 70 to 80 per cent are homosexual men....An average of 10 per
>cent of all patients and asymptomatic contacts reported...because of positive
>fecal samples or cultures for amoeba, giardia, and shigella infections were
>employed as food handlers in public establishments; almost 5 per cent of those
>with hepatitis A were similarly employed."10 In 1976, a rare airborne scarlet
>fever broke out among gays and just missed sweeping through San Francisco.10
>The U.S. Centers for Disease Control reported that 29% of the hepatitis A cases
>in Denver, 66% in New York, 50% in San Francisco, 56% in Toronto, 42% in
>Montreal and 26% in Melbourne in the first six months of 1991 were among
>gays.11 A 1982 study "suggested that some transmission from the homosexual
>group to the general population may have occurred."12
>
>URINE SEX About 10% of Kinsey's gays reported having engaged in "golden
>showers" [drinking or being splashed with urine]. In the largest survey of gays
>ever conducted,13 23% admitted to urine-sex. In the largest random survey of
>gays,6 29% reported urine-sex. In a San Francisco study of 655 gays,14 only 24%
>claimed to have been monogamous in the past year. Of these monogamous gays, 5%
>drank urine, 7% practiced "fisting," 33% ingested feces via anal/oral contact,
>53% swallowed semen, and 59% received semen in their rectum during the previous
>month.
>
>OTHER GAY SEX PRACTICES
>SADOMASOCHISM as the Table indicates, a large minority of gays engage in
>torture for sexual fun. Sex with minors 25% of white gays17 admitted to sex
>with boys 16 or younger as adults. In a 9-state study,30 33% of the 181 male,
>and 22% of the 18 female teachers caught molesting students did so homosexually
>(though less than 3% of men and 2% of women engage in homosexuality31).
>Depending on the study, the percent of gays reporting sex in public restrooms
>ranged from 14%16 to 41%13 to 66%,6 9%16, 60%13 and 67%5 reported sex in gay
>baths; 64%16 and 90%18 said that they used illegal drugs.
>
>Fear of AIDS may have reduced the volume of gay sex partners, but the numbers
>are prodigious by any standard. Morin15 reported that 824 gays had lowered
>their sex-rate from 70 different partners/yr. in 1982 to 50/yr. by 1984.
>McKusick14 reported declines from 76/yr. to 47/yr. in 1985. In Spain32 the
>average was 42/yr. in 1989.
>
>Medical Consequences of Homosexual Sex
>Death and disease accompany promiscuous and unsanitary sexual activity. 70%25
>to 78%x,13 of gays reported having had a sexually transmitted disease. The
>proportion with intestinal parasites (worms, flukes, amoeba) ranged from 25%18
>to 39%19 to 59%.20 As of 1992, 83% of U.S. AIDS in whites had occurred in
>gays.21 The Seattle sexual diary study3? reported that gays had, on a yearly
>average:
>
>fellated 108 men and swallowed semen from 48;
>exchanged saliva with 96;
>experienced 68 penile penetrations of the anus; and
>ingested fecal material from 19.
>No wonder 10% came down with hepatitis B and 7% contracted hepatitis A during
>the 6-month study.
>
>Effects on the Lifespan
>Smokers and drug addicts don't live as long as non-smokers or non-addicts, so
>we consider smoking and narcotics abuse harmful. The typical life-span of
>homosexuals suggests that their activities are more destructive than smoking nd
>as dangerous as drugs.
>
>Obituaries numbering 6,516 from 16 U.S. homosexual journals over the past 12
>years were compared to a large sample of obituaries from regular newspapers.23
>The obituaries from the regular newspapers were similar to U.S. averages for
>longevity; the medium age of death of married men was 75, and 80% of them died
>old (age 65 or older). For unmarried or divorced men the median age of death
>was 57, and 32% of them died old. Married women averaged age 79 at death; 85%
>died old. Unmarried and divorced women averaged age 71, and 60% of them died
>old.
>
>The median age of death for homosexuals, however, was virtually the same
>nationwide--and, overall, less than 2% survived to old age. If AIDS was the
>cause of death, the median age was 39. For the 829 gays who died of something
>other than AIDS, the median age of death was 42, and 9% died old. The 163
>lesbians had a median age of death of 44, and 20% died old.
>
>Two and eight-tenths percent (2.8%) of gays died violently. They were 116 times
>more apt to be murdered; 24 times more apt to commit suicide; and had a
>traffic-accident death-rate 18 times the rate of comparably-aged white males.
>Heart attacks, cancer and liver failure were exceptionally common. Twenty
>percent of lesbians died of murder, suicide, or accident--a rate 487 times
>higher than that of white females aged 25-44. The age distribution of samples
>of homosexuals in the scientific literature from 1989 to 1992 suggests a
>similarly shortened life-span.
>
>The Gay Legacy
>Homosexuals rode into the dawn of sexual freedom and returned with a plague
>that gives every indication of destroying most of them. Those who treat AIDS
>patients are at great risk, not only from HIV infection, which as of 1992
>involved over 100 health care workers,21 but also from TB and new strains of
>other diseases.24 Those who are housed with AIDS patients are also at risk.24
>Those who are housed with AIDS patients are also at risk.24 Dr. Max Essex,
>chair of the Harvard AIDS Institute, warned congress in 1992 that "AIDS has
>already led to other kinds of dangerous epidemics...If AIDS is not eliminated,
>other new lethal microbes will emerge, and neither safe sex nor drug free
>practices will prevent them."28 At least 8, and perhaps as many as 30 29
>patients had been infected with HIV by health care workers as of 1992.
>
>The Biological Swapmeet
>The typical sexual practices of homosexuals are a medical horror story
>--imagine exchanging saliva, feces, semen and/or blood with dozens of different
>men each year. Imagine drinking urine, ingesting feces and experiencing rectal
>trauma on a regular basis. Often these encounters occur while the participants
>are drunk, high, and/or in an orgy setting. Further, many of them occur in
>extremely unsanitary places (bathrooms, dirty peep shows), or, because
>homosexuals travel so frequently, in other parts of the world.
>
>Every year, a quarter or more of homosexuals visit another country.20 Fresh
>American germs get taken to Europe, Africa and Asia. And fresh pathogens from
>these continents come here. Foreign homosexuals regularly visit the U.S. and
>participate in this biological swapmeet.
>
>The Pattern of Infection
>Unfortunately the danger of these exchanges does not merely affect homosexuals.
>Travelers carried so many tropical diseases to New York City that it had to
>institute a tropical disease center, and gays carried HIV from New York City to
>the rest of the world.27 Most of the 6,349 Americans who got AIDS from
>contaminated blood as of 1992, received it from homosexuals and most of the
>women in California who got AIDS through heterosexual activity got it from men
>who engaged in homosexual behavior.23 The rare form of airborne scarlet fever
>that stalked San Francisco in 1976 also started among homosexuals.10
>
>Genuine Compassion
>Society is legitimately concerned with health risks-- they impact our taxes and
>everyone's chances of illness and injury. Because we care about them, smokers
>are discouraged from smoking by higher insurance premiums, taxes on cigarettes
>and bans against smoking in public. These social pressures cause many to quit.
>They likewise encourage non-smokers to stay non-smokers.
>
>Homosexuals are sexually troubled people engaging in dangerous activities.
>Because we care about them and those tempted to join them, it is important that
>we neither encourage nor legitimize such a destructive lifestyle.
>
>
>--------------------------------------------------------------------------
>------
>
>
>References
>1. Karlen A. SEXUALITY And HOMOSEXUALITY. NY Norton, 1971.
>
>2. Pines B. BACK TO BASICS. NY Morrow, 1982, p. 211.
>
>3. Weinberg G. SOCIETY AND THE HEALTHY HOMOSEXUAL. NY St. Martin's, 1972,
>preface.
>
>4. Amici curiae brief, in Bowers v. Hardwick, 1986.
>
>5. Corey L. & Holmes, K.K. Sexual transmission of Hepatitis A in homosexual
>men. "New England Journal of Medicine," 1980302435- 38.
>
>6. Cameron P et al Sexual orientation and sexually transmitted disease.
>"Nebraska Medical Journal," 198570292-99; Effect of homosexuality upon public
>health and social order "Psychological Reports," 1989, 64, 1167-79.
>
>7. Manligit, G.W. et al Chronic immune stimulation by sperm alloan- tigens.
>"Journal of the American Medical Association," 1984251 237-38.
>
>8. Cecil Adams, "The Straight Dope," THE READER (Chicago, 3/28/86) [Adams
>writes authoritatively on counter-culture material, his column is carried in
>many alternative newspapers across the U.S. and Canada].
>
>9. Dritz, S. & Braff. Sexually transmitted typhoid fever. "New England Journal
>of Medicine," 19772961359-60.
>
>10. Dritz, S. Medical aspects of homosexuality. "New England Journal of
>Medicine," 1980302463-4.
>
>11. CDC Hepatitis A among homosexual men --United States, Canada, and
>Australia. MMWR 199241155-64.
>
>12. Christenson B. et al. An epidemic outbreak of hepatitis A among homosexual
>men in Stockholm, "American Journal of Epidemiology," 1982115599-607.
>
>13. Jay, K. & Young, A. THE GAY REPORT. NY Summit, 1979.
>
>14. McKusick, L. et al AIDS and sexual behaviors reported by gay men in San
>Francisco, "American Journal of Public Health," 1985 75493- 96.
>
>15. USA Today 11/21/84.
>
>16. Gebhard, P. & Johnson, A. THE KINSEY DATA. NY Saunders, 1979.
>
>17. Bell, A. & Weinberg, M. HOMOSEXUALITIES. NY Simon & Schuster, 1978.
>
>18. Jaffee, H. et al. National case-control study of Kaposi's sarcoma. "Annals
>Of Internal Medicine," 198399145-51.
>
>19. Quinn, T. C. et al. The polymicrobial origin of intestinal infection in
>homosexual men. "New England Journal of Medicine," 1983309576-82.
>
>20. Biggar, R. J. Low T-lymphocyte ratios in homosexual men. "Journal Of The
>American Medical Association," 19842511441-46; "Wall Street Journal," 7/18/91,
>B1.
>
>21. CDC HIV/AIDS SURVEILLANCE, February 1993.
>
>22. Chu, S. et al. AIDS in bisexual men in the U.S. "American Journal Of Public
>Health," 199282220-24.
>
>23. Cameron, P., Playfair, W. & Wellum, S. The lifespan of homo- sexuals. Paper
>presented at Eastern Psychological Association Convention, April 17, 1993.
>
>24. Dooley, W.W. et al. Nosocomial transmission of tuberculosis in a hospital
>unit for HIV-invected patients. "Journal of the American Medical Association,"
>19922672632-35.
>
>25. Schechter, M.T. et al. Changes in sexual behavior and fear of AIDS.
>"Lancet," 198411293.
>
>26. Elford, J. et al. Kaposi's sarcoma and insertive rimming. "Lancet,"
>1992339938.
>
>27. Beral, V. et al. Risk of Kaposi's sarcoma and sexual practices associated
>with faecal contact in homosexual or bisexual men with AIDS. "Lancet,"
>1992339632-35.
>
>28. Testimony before House Health & Environment Subcommittee, 2/24/92.
>
>29. Ciesielski, C. et al. Transmission of human immunodeficiency virus in a
>dental practice. "Annals of Internal Medicine, 1992116 798-80; CDC Announcement
>Houston Post, 8/7/92.
>
>30. Rubin, S. "Sex Education Teachers Who Sexually Abuse Students." 24th
>International Congress on Psychology, Sydney, Australia, August 1988.
>
>31. Cameron, P. & Cameron, K. Prevalence of homosexuality. "Psychology
>Reports," 1993, in press; Melbye, M. & Biggar, R.J. Interactions between
>persons at risk for AIDS and the general population in Denmark. "American
>Journal of Epidemiology," 1992135593-602.
>
>32. Rodriguez-Pichardo, A. et al. Sexually transmitted diseases in homosexual
>males in Seville, Spain, "Geniourin Medicina," 1990 66;423-427.
>
>33. AIDS Prognosis, Washington Times, 2/13/93, C1.
*Min's Newsgroup-Archived Home Page On The World Wide Web:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=5YTK57VH3794...@Gilgamesh-frog.org
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Ward Stewart
<cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
>This is a very sobering article.
Indeed it is --- the sobering part is that there is ANYONE so
shameless as to post the maunderings of Paul Cameron. Bounced out of
his professional societies -- for dishonest use of other peoples
research, not his homophobic delusions -- also utterly discredited in
the courts as an "expert witness" in matters of human sexuality.
ward
------------------------------------------------
"Marital sex tends toward the boring end...
Generally, it doesn't deliver the kind of
sheer sexual pleasure that homosexual sex does.
-Paul Cameron
Rolling Stone, March 18, 1999
-----------------------------------------------------
"Dr. Paul Cameron...has himself made misrepresentations
to this Court" , , , "There has been no fraud or
misrepresentations except by Dr. Cameron."
Judge Buchmeyer of the U.S. District Court of Dallas
-----------------------------------------------------
Laura Bush - America's kid-killer
>
> Bad enough they'll wear that homosexual "chip" on their shoul-
> ders for the rest of their lives, while they catch and spread
> all kinds of diseases, but worse still they are setting a bad
> example for children.
That's true but there are many anti-social activities that people
do even though they may kill themselves or others or set a bad example
for the kiddies. Such as drinking and smoking and reckless driving.
The Nice Mean Man
> On 13 Dec 2003 17:07:41 +0100, Dr. Min
> <cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
>
> >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> >
> >This is a very sobering article.
>
> Indeed it is --- the sobering part is that there is ANYONE so
> shameless as to post the maunderings of Paul Cameron. Bounced out of
> his professional societies -- for dishonest use of other peoples
> research, not his homophobic delusions -- also utterly discredited in
> the courts as an "expert witness" in matters of human sexuality.
>
> ward
>
> ------------------------------------------------
> "Marital sex tends toward the boring end...
So what's not true about it? Everyone knows gays have a much higher
rate of hepatitis. The type of intercourse that they choose is riddled
with such risks. Don't condemn anyone's research just because you
don't like their politics, especially when every word of it is
obviously true. You are the one with the bias.
The Nice Mean Man
> <cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
>
> >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> >
> >This is a very sobering article.
>
> Indeed it is --- the sobering part is that there is ANYONE so
> shameless as to post the maunderings of Paul Cameron. Bounced out of
> his professional societies -- for dishonest use of other peoples
> research, not his homophobic delusions -- also utterly discredited in
> the courts as an "expert witness" in matters of human sexuality.
>
> ward
>
-On April 25, 2001, the CDC reported that "We are seeing substantial
increases in sexually transmitted diseases among men who have sex with men
in multiple locations across this country." (31, 32).
-Homosexuals are responsible for the "first sexually transmitted outbreak
of typhoid fever" in the history of the United States. This disease is
caused by ingesting human feces (32).
-More than 10% of homosexuals in major U.S. urban areas are infected with
HIV. To this day, they still make up more than 50% of reported AIDS cases
in the United States (30, 31).
-Homosexuals fellate almost 100% of their sexual contacts and ingest semen
from about half of those. Semen contains virtually every germ carried in
the blood stream, so this is about equivalent to ingesting raw human blood
(6).
-One study reports 70% of homosexuals admitting to having sex only one
time with over 50% of their partners (3).
-One study reports that the average homo has between 20 and 106 partners
per year (6). The average heterosexual has 8 partners in a lifetime.
-Sperm readily penetrates the anal wall (which is only one cell thick) and
gains direct access to the blood stream. This causes massive immunological
damage to the body's T- and B-cell defensive systems (14).
-50% of male syphilis is carried by homosexuals as a rectal infection and
can enter through the urethra of another fag during anal sex (7).
-Around 67-80% of homosexuals lick and/or insert their tongues into the
anuses of their partners (called "rimming", anilingus, fecal sex, etc.)
and ingest biologically significant amounts of feces (7), which is the
chief cause of hepatitis and parasitic infections among fags (8 ). This
practice is called the "prime taste treat in sex" in the bestseller The
Joy of Gay Sex.
-33% of homosexuals admit to fisting (inserting the hand, sometimes part
of the arm, into the rectum of his partner) (7).
-Urinating on each other ("golden showers") and torture has doubled among
homosexuals since the 1940s, and fisting has increased astronomically (7).
-17% of homosexuals eat and/or rub the feces of their partners on
themselves (4).
-12% of homosexuals give/receive enemas as part of sexual pleasure (4).
-In one study, the average homosexual fellated somewhere between 20 and
106 men, swallowed 50 seminal discharges, had 72 penile penetrations of
the anus, and ingested feces of 23 different men EVERY YEAR (6).
-Many homosexuals sexual encounters occur while drunk, high on drugs, or
in an orgy setting (7).
-Many homosexuals don't pay heed to warnings of their lifestyles:
"Knowledge of health guidelines was quite high, but this knowledge had no
relation to sexual behavior" (16).
-Activities of homosexuals involve rimming (anilingus), golden showers,
fisting, and using "toys" (21).
-Homosexuals got homosexuality removed from the list of mental illnesses
in the early 70s by storming the annual American Psychiatric Association
(APA) conference on successive years. "Guerrilla theater tactics and more
straight-forward shouting matches characterized their presence" (2). Since
homosexuality has been removed from the APA list of mental illnesses, so
has pedophilia (except when the adult feels "subjective distress") (27).
-Homosexuals account for 3-4% of all gonorrhea cases, 60% of all syphilis
cases, and 17% of all hospital admissions (other than for STDs) in the
United States (5). They make up only 1-2% of the population.
-Homosexuals live unhealthy lifestyles, and have historically accounted
for the bulk of syphilis, gonorrhea, Hepatitis B, the "gay bowel syndrome"
(which attacks the intestinal tract), tuberculosis and cytomegalovirus
(27).
73% of psychiatrists say homosexuals are less happy than the average
person, and of those psychiatrists, 70% say that the unhappiness is NOT
due to social stigmatization (13).
-25-33% of homosexuals and dykes are alcoholics (11).
-Of homosexuals questioned in one study, 43% admitted to 500 or more
partners in a lifetime, 28% admitted to 1000 or more in a lifetime, and of
these people, 79% said that half of those partners were total strangers,
and 70% of those sexual contacts were one night stands (or, as one
homosexual admits in the film "The Castro," one minute stands) (3). Also,
it is a favorite past-time of many homosexuals to go to "cruisy areas" and
have anonymous sex. See www.cruisingforsex.com (NOTE: this site may
contain pornographic images - please don't go to it if you are under age
or don't want to see this type of material. This site is referenced only
for illustrative purposes.)
-78% of homosexuals are affected by STDs (20).
-Judge John Martaugh, chief magistrate of the New York City Criminal Court
has said, "Homosexuals account for half the murders in large cities" (10).
-Captain William Riddle of the Los Angeles Police says, "30,000 sexually
abused children in Los Angeles were victims of homosexuals" (10).
-50% of suicides can be attributed to homosexuals (10).
-Dr. Daniel Capron, a practicing psychiatrist, says, "Homosexuality by
definition is not healthy and wholesome. The homosexual person, at best,
will be unhappier and more unfulfilled than the sexually normal person"
(10). For other psychiatrists who believe that homosexuality is wrong,
please see National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality.
-It takes approximately $300,000 to take care of each AIDS victim, so
thanks to the promiscuous lifestyle of homosexuals, medical insurance
rates have been skyrocketing for all of us (10).
-One study reports that 90% of homosexuals have engaged in anal sex, and
66% engage in anal sex regularly (6).
-Homosexuals were responsible for spreading AIDS in the United States, and
then raised up violent groups like Act Up and Ground Zero to complain
about it. Even today, homosexuals account for well over 50% of the AIDS
cases in the United States, which is quite a large number considering that
they account for only 1-2% of the population.
-Homosexuals account for a disproportionate number of hepatitis cases:
70-80% in San Francisco, 29% in Denver, 66% in New York City, 56% in
Toronto, 42% in Montreal, and 26% in Melbourne (8). 10% of homosexuals
admit to eating feces and/or drinking contaminated enema water (8).
-29% of homosexuals engage in urine sex ("golden showers") (8).
-37% of homosexuals engage in sadomasochism, which accounts for many
accidental deaths. In San Francisco, classes were held to teach
homosexuals how to not kill their partners during sadomasochism (8).
-In large cities, hospitals are often called on to remove objects from the
rectums of homosexuals. Sometimes, the homosexuals do so much damage that
they have to wear colostomy bags for the rest of their lives (8).
-41% of homosexuals say they have had sex with strangers in public
restrooms, 60% say they have had sex with strangers in bathhouses, and 64%
of these encounters have involved the use of illegal drugs (8).
-Depending on the city, 39-59% of homosexuals are infected with intestinal
parasites like worms, flukes and amoebae, which is common in filthy third
world countries (8).
-The median age of death of homosexuals is 42 (only 9% live past age 65).
This drops to 39 if the cause of death is AIDS. The median age of death of
a married heterosexual man is 75 (8).
-The median age of death of lesbians is 45 (only 24% live past age 65).
The median age of death of a married heterosexual woman is 79 (8).
-Homosexuals are 100 times more likely to be murdered (usually by another
homo) than the average person, 25 times more likely to commit suicide, and
19 times more likely to die in a traffic accident (8).
-21% of lesbians die of murder, suicide or traffic accident, which is at a
rate of 534 times higher than the number of white heterosexual females
aged 25-44 who die of these things (8).
-50% of the calls to a hotline to report "queer bashing" involved domestic
violence (i.e., fags beating up other homosexuals) (18).
-About 50% of the women on death row are lesbians (12).
Homosexuals prey on children.
-33% of homosexuals ADMIT to minor/adult sex (7).
-There is a notable homosexual group, consisting of thousands of members,
known as the North American Man and Boy Love Association ( NAMBLA). (Note:
this web site is sometimes down). This is a child molesting homo group
whose cry is "SEX BEFORE 8 BEFORE IT'S TOO LATE." This group can be seen
marching in most major gay parades across the United States.
-Homosexuals commit more than 33% of all reported child molestations in
the United States, which, assuming homosexuals make up 2% of the
population, means that 1 in 20 homosexuals is a child molestor, while 1 in
490 heterosexuals is a child molestor (19).
-73% of all homosexuals have had sex with boys under 19 years of age (9).
-Many homosexuals admit that they are pedophiles: "The love between men
and boys is at the foundation of homosexuality" (22).
-Because homosexuals can't reproduce naturally, they resort to recruiting
children. Homosexuals can be heard chanting "TEN PERCENT IS NOT ENOUGH,
RECRUIT, RECRUIT, RECRUIT" in their fag parades. A group called the
"Lesbian Avengers" prides itself on trying to recruit young girls. They
print "WE RECRUIT" on their literature. Some other homosexuals aren't as
overt about this, but rather try to infiltrate society and get into
positions where they will have access to the malleable minds of young
children (e.g., the clergy, teachers, Boy Scout leaders, etc.) (8 ).
The Homosexual Agenda
-The homosexual agenda includes desensitizing the public: "The first order
of business is desensitization of the American public concerning gays and
gay rights.....To desensitize the public is to help it view homosexuality
with indifference instead of with keen emotion. Ideally, we would have
straights register differences in sexual preferences the way they register
different tastes for ice cream or sports games....At least in the
beginning, we are seeking public desensitization and nothing more. We do
not need and cannot expect a full 'appreciation' or 'understanding' of
homosexuality from the average American. You can forget about trying to
persuade the masses that homosexuality is a good thing. But if only you
can get them to think that it is just another thing...then your battle for
legal and social rights is virtually won" (25).
-Part of the homosexual agenda is to get the public to affirm their filthy
lifestyle, as one homosexual admitted in the October 1987 homosexual rally
on Washington: "We are no longer seeking just a right to privacy and a
protection from wrong. We also have a right -- as heterosexual Americans
already have -- to see government and society affirm our lives" (27).
-Part of the homosexual agenda is to turn people from Christianity: "The
teaching that only male-female sexual activity within the bounds and
constraints of marriage is the only acceptable form should be reason
enough for any homosexual to denounce the Christian religion" (1).
-Homosexuals knowingly lied (and still lie) about the 10% figure (i.e.,
homosexuals make up 10% of the population). As Tom Stoddard (formerly of
the Lambda Legal Defense Fund) said, "We used that figure when most gay
people were entirely hidden to try to create an impression of our
numerousness" (17).
The true number of homosexuals
-The Kinsey study of 1948, which homosexuals often cite to say that 10% of
the population is homosexual, actually says that only 4% of the population
is EXCLUSIVELY homosexual. This study involved a disproportionate number
of people who had been in jail for sex crimes (hardly a random sample of
the population). Kinsey also did perverse studies involving young boys and
pedophiles.
-Current research shows that the true percentage of homosexuals is in the
1-2% range (15,23,26,28 ). Consider how small this number is when compared
to most of the numbers above.
Homosexuals aren't discriminated against in employment, so why should they
be a protected class?
-The average yearly income of a homosexual is $55,430.00 (most of which is
disposable because no children to take care of!). The average of the
general population is $32,144.00. The average of blacks is $12,166.00
(24).
-59.6% of homosexuals are college graduates. 18.0% of the general
population are college graduates (24). Too bad they aren't smart enough to
listen to good advice. "Professing themselves to be wise, they became
fools" (Romans 1:22).
-49.0% of homosexuals hold professional/managerial positions. 15.9% of the
general population hold such positions (24). Where's the job
discrimination?
REFERENCES
(1) Advocate, 1985.
(2) Bayer, R. Homosexuality and American Psychiatry.
(3) Bell, A. and Weinberg, M. Homosexualities: a Study of Diversity Among
Men and Women. New York: Simon & Schuster, 1978.
(4) Cameron et. al. ISIS National Random Sexuality Survey. Nebraska Med.
Journal, 1985, 70, pp. 292-299.
(5) "Changes in Sexual Behavior and Incidence of Gonorrhea." Lancet, April
25, 1987.
(6) Corey, L. and Holmes, K. "Sexual Transmission of Hepatitis A in
Homosexual Men." New England J. Med., 1980, pp. 435-38.
(7) Family Research Institute, Lincoln, NE.
(8 ) Fields, Dr. E. "Is Homosexual Activity Normal?" Marietta, GA.
(9) Jay and Young. The Gay Report. Summit Books, 1979, p. 275.
(10) Kaifetz, J. "Homosexual Rights Are Concern for Some," Post-Tribune,
18 December 1992.
(11) Kus, R. "Alcoholics Anonymous and Gay America." Medical Journal of
Homosexuality, 1987, 14(2), p. 254.
(12) Lesbian News, January 1994.
(13) Lief, H. Sexual Survey Number 4: Current Thinking on Homosexuality,
Medical Aspects of Human Sexuality, 1977, pp. 110-11.
(14) Manlight, G. et. al. "Chronic Immune Stimulation By Sperm
Alloantigens." J. American Med. Assn., 1984, 251(2), pp. 237-438.
(15) Morton-Hunt Study for Playboy
(16) MsKusick, L. et. al. "AIDS and Sexual Behavior Reported By Gay Men in
San Francisco." Am. J. Pub. Health, 1985, 75, pp. 493-96.
(17) Newsweek, February 1993.
(18 ) Newsweek, 4 October 1993.
(19) Psychological Reports, 1986, 58, pp. 327-37.
(20) Rueda, E. "The Homosexual Network." Old Greenwich, Conn., The Devin
Adair Company, 1982, p. 53.
(21) San Francisco AIDS Foundation, "Can We Talk."
(22) San Francisco Sentinel, 27 March 1992.
(23) Science Magazine, 18 July 1993, p. 322.
(24) Statistical Abstract of the U.S., 1990.
(25) "The Overhauling of Straight America." Guide Magazine. November,
1987.
(26) United States Census Bureau
(27) United States Congressional Record, June 29, 1989.
(28 ) University of Chicago's Nation Research Corp.
(29) Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders Fourth Edition,
American Psychiatric Association, 1994.
(30) Reuters, Feb. 5, 2001
(31) Center for Disease Control
(32) Associated Press, April 25, 2001
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Light Templar
<WILD BILL TAYLOR> wrote in message
news:c2b62a243f950bfc...@news.teranews.com...
> On Sat, 13 Dec 2003 23:57:54 GMT, Ward Stewart
> <wste...@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:
>
> >On 13 Dec 2003 17:07:41 +0100, Dr. Min
> ><cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
> >
> >>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> >>
> >>This is a very sobering article.
> >
> >Indeed it is --- the sobering part is that there is ANYONE so
> >shameless as to post the maunderings of Paul Cameron.
>
> Psychiatric Association" (APA.)
[snip stupidity]
The same Paul Cameron that was booted from the APA for falsifying research,
and has
been proven to misrepresent data in two federal courts, and has been barred
from giving
expert testimony in those very same courts. Yeah, that lying sack of shit
Paul Cameron.
Bill "Call for a good time" Taylor
>Must suck to be an X-no-archive coward, Billy.
>Please forward all replies to:
>Bill Taylor
>5150 Balboa Drive
>New Berlin, WI 53151
>Check out the source of Billy's constant frustration at:
>http://www.absolutearts.com/portfolios/w/wilhelm
>To make further comments about Billy's mental health issues, please forward all memos to:
>and
>Executive PC, Inc.
>2105 S 170th
>New berlin, WI 53151 USA
>ALL INFORMATION ABOVE IS A MATTER OF PUBLIC RECORD AND IS AVAILABLE FROM
>NUMEROUS PUBLIC ON-LINE SOURCES
Dennis Smeth
Dr. Min wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
> This is a very sobering article. Certainly the most egregious
> part is what's conspicuously missing from the list and that's
> the spiritual dangers of such flagrantly immoral behavior. It
> does no good to warn homosexuals about the consequences, when
> they've already abandoned any semblance of virtue and dignity.
The same sex polyandrous marriage of David to Michal and Jonathan
NASB:
1 Samuel 18:
21 Saul thought, "I will give her to him that she may become
a snare to him, and that the hand of the Philistines may be
against him." Therefore Saul said to David, " For a second time
you may be my son-in-law today."
YLT
21 and Saul saith, `I give her to him, and she is to him
for a snare, and the hand of the Philistines is on him;'
and Saul saith unto David, `By the second thou dost become --
my son-in-law to-day.'
Darby
21 And Saul said, I will give him her, that she may be a
snare to him, and that the hand of the Philistines may be
upon him. And Saul said to David, Thou shalt this day be my
son-in-law a second time.
The Marriage contract of David and Jonathan
2 Samuel 21:
7 But the king spared Mephibosheth, the son of Jonathan the
son of Saul, because of the LORD'S oath that was between them,
between David and Jonathan the son of Saul.
Psa 133:
1 A Song of degrees of David. Behold, how good and how pleasant
it is for brethren to dwell together in unity!
Romans 1:
3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of
the seed of David according to the flesh;
Luke 1:
27 To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of
the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary.
Dennis Smeth
The Nice Mean Man wrote:
> Ward Stewart <wste...@hawaii.rr.com> wrote in message news:<cn9otvk2g5b2dr1bq...@4ax.com>...
> > On 13 Dec 2003 17:07:41 +0100, Dr. Min
> > <cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
> >
> > >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > >
> > >This is a very sobering article.
> >
> > Indeed it is --- the sobering part is that there is ANYONE so
> > shameless as to post the maunderings of Paul Cameron. Bounced out of
> > his professional societies -- for dishonest use of other peoples
> > research, not his homophobic delusions -- also utterly discredited in
> > the courts as an "expert witness" in matters of human sexuality.
> >
> > ward
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------
> > "Marital sex tends toward the boring end...
>
> So what's not true about it? Everyone knows gays have a much higher
> rate of hepatitis.
And this has what to do with the USA following its own laws
and to stop denying equal protection of the law, to stop giving
heterosexuals a special right to marry who they choose and
denying intersexuals the legal right to marry at all?
AIDS and hepatitis are diseases not a sexual orientation, blacks
experienced the same diseases and promiscuity when they were
not allowed to marry as well.
George Orwell
yo doc minski . i look in bible for against gay partss . where can i look ?
george
In article <B0U6HD4X37968.7127199074@Gilgamesh-Frog.org>,
Dr. Min
> yo doc minski . i look in bible for against gay partss .
> where can i look ?
>
>>part is what's conspicuously missing from the list and that's
>>the spiritual dangers of such flagrantly immoral behavior. It
>>does no good to warn homosexuals about the consequences, when
>>they've already abandoned any semblance of virtue and dignity.
>
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
There're actually 100s of passages which clearly denounce
homosexuality in both old & new testament portions of the
codified biblical canon. Below are some choice selections,
the last of which is an informative summation from 2Peter:
"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God
created he him; male and female created he them. And God
blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and
multiply...
"And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man
should be alone; I will make him an help meet for
him...
"And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam,
and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up
the flesh instead thereof; And the rib, which the LORD
God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her
unto the man. And Adam said This is now bone of my bones,
and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman because
she was taken out of Man. Therefore shall a man leave his
father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife:
and they shall be one flesh. And they were both naked,
the man and his wife, and were not ashamed."
--Genesis 1:27-28;2:18,21-25 AV
"Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind:
it is abomination. Neither shalt thou lie with any
beast to defile thyself therewith: neither shall
any woman stand before a beast to lie down thereto:
it is confusion. Defile not ye yourselves in any of
these things: for in all these the nations are de-
filed which I cast out before you: And the land is
defiled: therefore I do visit the iniquity thereof
upon it, and the land itself vomiteth out her inha-
bitants. Ye shall therefore keep my statutes and my
judgments, and shall not commit any of these abomi-
nations; neither any of your own nation, nor any
stranger that sojourneth among you: (For all these
abominations have the men of the land done, which
were before you, and the land is defiled;) That the
land spue not you out also when ye defile it, as it
spued out the nations that were before you. For who-
soever shall commit any of these abominations, even
the souls that commit them shall be cut off from
among their people. Therefore shall ye keep mine
ordinance, that ye commit not any one of these abo-
minable customs, which were committed before you,
and that ye defile not yourselves therein: I am
the LORD your God." --Levicus 18:22-30 AV
"Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about
them in like manner, giving themselves over to for-
nication, and going after strange flesh, are set
forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of
eternal fire." --Jude 1:7 AV
"Through which gave beside them the God in the
desires of the hearts of them into uncleanness
of the to be being dishonored the bodies of them
in them, who exchanged the truth of the God in the
lie, and they venerated and they rendered sacred
service to the creation beside the One having created,
who is blessed(one) into the ages; amen. Through this
gave beside them the God into passions of dishonor;
the and for females of them exchanged the natural use
into the(one) beside nature, likewise and *also* the
males having let go off the natural use of the female
were burned out in the lust of them into one another
males in males, the indecency working down and the
return reward which it was necessary of the error of
them in them receiving (back)from."--Romans 1:24-27
[*emphasis added, ref Westcott-Hort 1881, ITGS 1969]
"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being
alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I
have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and
I will shew thee my faith by my works. Thou believest
that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils
also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain
man, that faith without works is dead? Was not Abraham
our father justified by works, when he had offered
Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith
wrought with his works, and by works was faith made
perfect? And the scripture was fulfilled which saith,
Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for
righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
Ye see then how that by works a man is justified,
and not by faith only." --James 2:17-24 AV
"Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture
is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy
came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men
of God spake [as they were] moved by the Holy Ghost.
But there were false prophets also among the people,
even as there shall be false teachers among you, who
privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying
the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves
swift destruction. And many shall follow their perni-
cious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall
be evil spoken of. And through covetousness shall they
with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judg-
ment now of a long time lingereth not, and their dam-
nation slumbereth not. For if God spared not the angels
that sinned, but cast [them] down to hell and delivered
[them] into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto
judgment; And spared not the old world, but saved Noah
the eighth [person], a preacher of righteousness, brin-
ging in the flood upon the world of the ungodly; And
turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes
condemned [them] with an overthrow, making [them] an
ensample unto those that after should live ungodly; And
delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation
of the wicked: (For that righteous man dwelling among
them, in seeing and hearing, vexed [his] righteous soul
from day to day with [their] unlawful deeds;) The Lord
knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations,
and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to
be punished: But chiefly them that walk after the flesh
in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Pre-
sumptuous [are they], selfwilled, they are not afraid
to speak evil of dignities. Whereas angels, which are
greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation
against them before the Lord. But these, as natural brute
beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the
things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish
in their own corruption; And shall receive the reward of
unrighteousness, [as] they that count it pleasure to riot
in the day time. Spots [they are] and blemishes, sporting
themselves with their own deceivings while they feast
with you; Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot
cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they
have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray,
following the way of Balaam [the son] of Bosor, who loved
the wages of unrighteousness; But was rebuked for his ini-
quity: the dumb ass speaking with man's voice forbad the
madness of the prophet. These are wells without water,
clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist
of darkness is reserved for ever. For when they speak
great swelling [words] of vanity, they allure through
the lusts of the flesh, [through much] wantonness, those
that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the
servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome,
of the same is he brought in bondage. For if after they
have escaped the pollutions of the world through the
knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are
again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is
worse with them than the beginning. For it had been bet-
ter for them not to have known the way of righteousness,
than, after they have known [it], to turn from the holy
commandment delivered unto them. But it is happened unto
them according to the true proverb, The dog [is] turned
to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to
her wallowing in the mire." --2 Peter 1:20-2:22 AV
Daniel Joseph Min
*Min's Newsgroup-Archived Home Page On The World Wide Web:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=5YTK57VH3794...@Gilgamesh-frog.org
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No One
> There're actually 100s of passages which clearly denounce
> homosexuality in both old & new testament portions of the codified
> biblical canon. Below are some choice selections, the last of which
> is an informative summation from 2Peter:
> "And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he
> slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead
> thereof; And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he
> a woman, and brought her unto the man. And Adam said This is now
> bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman
> because she was taken out of Man. Therefore shall a man leave his
> father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they
> shall be one flesh. And they were both naked, the man and his wife,
> Joseph Min
It's been posted several times, but when you check an on-line Bible,
you'll find a footnote that says the word "Therefore" is used to mean
that the preceding text is the motivation for a human custom whose
description follows, and that what follows is not a command or
statement by a diety.
Also, the "creation of Eve" part where part of a man is turned into a
woman, together with the "deep sleep," suggests a cloning procedure
under general anesthetic followed by a sex-change operation. Eve was
quite obviously a transsexual!
Arnold Wolfcaste
Sodomy was outlawed due to health reasons and to control the spread of
diseases. Homosexuals behavior has helped spread a variety of
diseases and viruses on a global scale.
Ward Stewart
(Arnold Wolfcaste) wrote:
Homosexuality was "outlawed" in the first centuries of Xtian influence
on Roam -- those doing the influencing had not the remotest notion in
the world of any form of sexuality leading to any sort of diseased --
and "viruses? it is to laugh!
They believed that the function of the brain was to produce snot to
keep the imaginary phlogiston at bay. They went on to assert that the
source of thought and emotion was the bowels.
SUCH a nonsense you post -- it would be funny were your purposes in
such posting not so hideously malignant!
ward
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
"In August 1572 ... in Paris and elsewhere in France ... it was Christian
against Christian. The Roman Catholics, by previous concert, sprang a
surprise upon the unprepared and unsuspecting Protestants, and butchered
them by the thousands --- both sexes and all ages. This was the memorable
St. Bartholomew's Day.
At Rome the Pope and the Church gave public thanks to God when the
happy news came. During several centuries, hundreds of heretics were
burned at the stake every year because their religious opinions were not
satisfactory to the Roman Church ... "
Mark Twain, (Letters from the Earth pp 175-76)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Nice Mean Man
> The Nice Mean Man wrote:
>
> > Ward Stewart <wste...@hawaii.rr.com> wrote in message news:<cn9otvk2g5b2dr1bq...@4ax.com>...
> > > On 13 Dec 2003 17:07:41 +0100, Dr. Min
> > > <cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
> > >
> > > >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > > >
> > > >This is a very sobering article.
> > >
> > > Indeed it is --- the sobering part is that there is ANYONE so
> > > shameless as to post the maunderings of Paul Cameron. Bounced out of
> > > his professional societies -- for dishonest use of other peoples
> > > research, not his homophobic delusions -- also utterly discredited in
> > > the courts as an "expert witness" in matters of human sexuality.
> > >
> > > ward
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------------------
> > > "Marital sex tends toward the boring end...
> >
> > So what's not true about it? Everyone knows gays have a much higher
> > rate of hepatitis.
>
> And this has what to do with the USA following its own laws
> and to stop denying equal protection of the law, to stop giving
> heterosexuals a special right to marry who they choose and
> denying intersexuals the legal right to marry at all?
It has nothing to do with it. Never said it did. The reason faggots
are not allowed to marry here is because common sense dictates that
faggism as a basic perversion of normalacy, which it is. Marrage is
for men & women. Has been for centuries.
>
> AIDS and hepatitis are diseases not a sexual orientation, blacks
> experienced the same diseases and promiscuity when they were
> not allowed to marry as well.
>
>
Yeah...? Post your sources.
The Nice Mean Man
> On Sun, 14 Dec 2003, George Orwell <nob...@mixmaster.it> wrote:
> > yo doc minski . i look in bible for against gay partss .
> > where can i look ?
> >
> >>This is a very sobering article. Certainly the most egregious
> >>part is what's conspicuously missing from the list and that's
> >>the spiritual dangers of such flagrantly immoral behavior. It
> >>does no good to warn homosexuals about the consequences, when
> >>they've already abandoned any semblance of virtue and dignity.
> >><snipped for brevity>
> >
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
> There're actually 100s of passages which clearly denounce
> homosexuality in both old & new testament portions of the
> codified biblical canon. Below are some choice selections,
> the last of which is an informative summation from 2Peter:
<snip>
Don't forget this one...
Mark 10:6-9
"Jesus answered them saying "But God's Plan was seen from the
beginning of creation, for 'He made them Male and Female.' 'This
explains why a man leaves his father and mother and is joined to his
Wife, and the two are united into one."
The Nice Mean Man
Xtian. What is a Xtian, Ward?
Ward Stewart
Man) wrote:
And this has exactly what to do with the CIVIL code in our SECULAR
republic?
Brent Norman
> > On 13 Dec 2003 17:07:41 +0100, Dr. Min
> > <cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
> >
> > >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > >
> > >This is a very sobering article.
> >
> > Indeed it is --- the sobering part is that there is ANYONE so
> > shameless as to post the maunderings of Paul Cameron. Bounced out of
> > his professional societies -- for dishonest use of other peoples
> > research, not his homophobic delusions -- also utterly discredited in
> > the courts as an "expert witness" in matters of human sexuality.
> >
> > ward
> >
>
about 80-98% of this stuff posted below is a tired outdated tirade
against homosexuality, designed to appeal to the "eeew!" factor. It
has been dissected many times and found to be extremely suspect, in
terms of sources, methodologies, and political influences.
Brent Norman
"This EXPLAINS why A man..".. He never said EVERY man. Not only that,
but the context is missing.. Jesus was answering a question, which you
omitted.. the question was about divorce between a husband and a wife.
He wasn't being asked about same-sex relationships at all.
Brent Norman
Yup. Those two passages relate to 1) that sexuality is for
procreation (written about 500 BC. The context of the Old Testament
shows that need for children (to increase population), and Paul's
philosophy of stoicism both define sex as exclusively a procreative
act. 2) The second passage you referred to shows that sexuality also
serves the purpose of companionship, and to cure loneliness. One
could conclude that it serves both purposes for many, but not
necessarily.
>
> "Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind:
> it is abomination. Neither shalt thou lie with any
> beast to defile thyself therewith: neither shall
> any woman stand before a beast to lie down thereto:
> it is confusion. Defile not ye yourselves in any of
> these things: for in all these the nations are de-
> filed which I cast out before you: And the land is
> defiled: therefore I do visit the iniquity thereof
> upon it, and the land itself vomiteth out her inha-
> bitants. Ye shall therefore keep my statutes and my
> judgments, and shall not commit any of these abomi-
> nations; neither any of your own nation, nor any
> stranger that sojourneth among you: (For all these
> abominations have the men of the land done, which
> were before you, and the land is defiled;) That the
> land spue not you out also when ye defile it, as it
> spued out the nations that were before you. For who-
> soever shall commit any of these abominations, even
> the souls that commit them shall be cut off from
> among their people. Therefore shall ye keep mine
> ordinance, that ye commit not any one of these abo-
> minable customs, which were committed before you,
> and that ye defile not yourselves therein: I am
> the LORD your God." --Levicus 18:22-30 AV
>
The *literal* translation of the "famous" Lev 18:22 is:
"You must not sleep the sleep of a woman with a man; it is ritually
impure."
Additionally, the "condemnation" uses the hebrew word "toevah". The
Hebrews had special words to single out various misdeeds. If the
passage was referring to sexual misconduct, the writer would have used
"zimmah" instead of "toevah". "zimmah" was used to condemn immoral
acts like rape and prostitution, whereas "toevah" was used to condemn
idolatrous practices. Therefore, this passage is more likely related
to idolatry, as it could be an idiom of some sort whose true meaning
may never be known. Another reason that I believe that it is moreso
related to idolatry, is the context around it, relating to BAAL and
MOLECH, which is connected to idolatrous practices.
Wherever BAAL or the fertility goddess Ashtoreth are mentioned,
"toevah" is the word used in the Law to denounce these idolatrous
practices.
Then the new testament, where Jesus has said nothing that clearly
singles out homosexuality, even though homosexual relationships would
have been quite common in the greco-roman world, it is interesting to
note that if it were so detestable to God, that he wouldn't have
commented on them at all. And perhaps Paul commented on this, but
that is a whole other box.
> "Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about
> them in like manner, giving themselves over to for-
> nication, and going after strange flesh, are set
> forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of
> eternal fire." --Jude 1:7 AV
>
The sin of Sodom and Gomorrah had nothing to do with homosexuality.
"strange flesh" is translated from the Greek "heteros sarx", which
literally translates as "differenty flesh". If this was meant to
condemn homosexual acts, the accurate term would have been "homos
sarx" ("same flesh"). It is much more likely that the writer was
referring to idolatrous prostitution and violent mistreatment of other
people.
In Matthew 10:14-15, Jesus was giving his disciples proper responses
to inhospitable acts committed toward them, saying, "if anyone will
not welcome you or listen to your words, shake off the dust of your
feet when you leave that home or town. I tell you the truth, it will
be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than
for that town.", which shows that S&G were destroyed because of
inhospitable treatment of visitors.
> "Through which gave beside them the God in the
> desires of the hearts of them into uncleanness
> of the to be being dishonored the bodies of them
> in them, who exchanged the truth of the God in the
> lie, and they venerated and they rendered sacred
> service to the creation beside the One having created,
> who is blessed(one) into the ages; amen. Through this
> gave beside them the God into passions of dishonor;
> the and for females of them exchanged the natural use
> into the(one) beside nature, likewise and *also* the
> males having let go off the natural use of the female
> were burned out in the lust of them into one another
> males in males, the indecency working down and the
> return reward which it was necessary of the error of
> them in them receiving (back)from."--Romans 1:24-27
> [*emphasis added, ref Westcott-Hort 1881, ITGS 1969]
>
You are missing the sentences that precede this passage. It is
showing homosexual acts as a result of other practices, and has
nothing to do with faithful, real homosexuals. This is referring
towards pagan rituals that involved homosexual acts, things like
temple cult orgies having to do with fertility worship. The
participants were generally not homosexuals, but heterosexuals
participating in homosexual acts, exchanging their own , "natural"
(hetero)sexuality for "unnatural".
The passage you refer to describes the people who engaged in such acts
in a very specific fashion. 1) rejecting the knowledge of God. 2)Not
glorifying God or acknowledge his provision for them, making their
hearts and minds "darkened", 3) exchanging the glory of God for
idolatry 4)degrading one another through promiscuous sexual acts 5)
believing lies, serving "created things' and not the Creator 6)
exchanging their "natural" sexuality, 7) unbridled lawlessness.
The word that is typically translated as "natural" is from the greek
"phusikos", which means "intrinsic" - something that is born or
inherrent, something intrinsic to the individual. Intrinsics are
usually individual, and are not necessarily universal.
This is certainly not the description of homosexuals in general, and
especially homosexuals of strong faith despite the people that try to
condemn them.
[snipped]
George Orwell
your right min . this sicko idiot is got sick homosex agenda .
definetly kill file this sorry sod (omite).
"Brent Norman" blathered:
>
George Orwell
George Orwell
Matthew Alexander
Man) wrote:
Can we condemn someone's research for committing fraud, falsification
of data, and blatantly invalid methodology?
I would recommend you read some facts about the author, like
[http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/facts_cameron.html]
for example, before you decide who is and isn't biased.
I should also mention that the original "Medical Consequences" article
includes a large number of quotations from "The Truth At Last", a
White Supremacist newsletter published in Georgia.
Brent Norman
> your right min . this sicko idiot is got sick homosex agenda .
>
If you disagree with my analysis, then take it point for point and
refute with logical arguments. Otherwise, I'll have to accuse you of
being in the "sick anti-homo agenda". If you have a reasonable
argument, then post it. Ad hominem attacks don't count.
Brent Norman
> your right min . this sicko idiot is got sick homosex agenda .
>
> definetly kill file this sorry sod (omite).
>
You obviously cannot support your anti-homo standpoint, so you've
resorted to personal attack. How telling.
Matthew Alexander
wrote:
It's also interesting to consider than many early Jewish texts
describe pre-Eve Adam as a hermaphrodite, having both male and female
parts (sometimes even depicted with two faces and 8 limbs) who was
then literally split into two people. I think this other half was most
often identified as "Lillith", being Adam's wife before the whole rib
thing.
Of course, interesting does not equal relevant. It really, really
should go without saying (and yet sadly never does) that religious
beliefs about man's origin or whatever have nothing to do with factual
debates about medicine or politics.
Fundamentalist Christian beliefs about sex are about as relevant to
this conversation as Orthodox Judaism is to the USDA's pork farming
policies.
Ward Stewart
Likewise I'm sure, Mr. Orwell -- it seems a little odd that one of the
profoundly anti-fascist left wing writers should be posting here out
from under a black shirt.
But then, this is the 21st century.
One must wonder if this pathetic want-wit has actually read any of
Orwell. Seeing the odd and polemical movie of "Animal Farm" does not
count.
ward
-----------------------------------------------------------------
"Goddamn New York City - - - it is filled with Jews and Catholics
and blacks and Puerto Ricans --- there is a law of the jungle
where some things don't survive, maybe it should go through a
cycle of destruction,"
Richard Nixon
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Dennis Smeth
Bigots don't change they just change the group the hate, and in the
case of Strom Thurmond and Trent Lott, they changed to the
"right" group, too bad Robert Byrd and Lieberman didn't. Marriage
has only been between a man and a woman in the last century
only, period.
"If Negroes can marry whites we might have living in Tennessee the
father living with daughter, the son with the mother, the brother with
his sister, in lawful wedlock, because they had formed such relations
in a state or country where they were not prohibited. The Turk or the
Mohammedan, with his numerous wives, may establish his harem at
the doors of the capital, and we are without remedy. Yet none of
these are more revolting, more to be avoided, or more unnatural than
the case before us." Of Negroes marrying whites. (A Tennessee judge in
1872, ruling against a racially mixed couple who had moved to the state.)
The Nice Mean Man
No, no, no azzhole.... He is refering to men in general. Otherwise, He
would have said... 'This is why certain men' or 'many men' or 'most
men'.
I will say that this is the most original attempt to twist this
scripture that I've yet come across.
Remember, azzhole... "that's one small step for man... one giant leap
for anyone who would listen to satan speak thru the likes of you"
The Nice Mean Man
Look, you stupid fool. I don't have time for this shit. You aren't
even fooling yourself let alone anyone else. It's COMMON SENSE that if
you EAT SHIT, you're going to GET SICK. It's COMMON SENSE that if you
engage in abrasive sex within an area of the human body where the
blood vessels are closer to the surface, you're going to run a much
higher risk of catching a blood/semen-born disease. It is not only
vile behavior morally ... it is also risky behavior physically.
Mentally too. Look how fucked up it made YOU.
Get AIDS and die, you dickless twirp. And make it soon...
Roger
news:19f5d6de.03121...@posting.google.com...
Christian love, for all to see.
Ward Stewart
A lamp unto our feet!
ward
----------------------------------------------------
It is ironic that in the early part of the nineteenth
century my New England family was engaged in the theft
of property and the smuggling of this property into
Canada. When the property was delivered it was
discovered that the property was human beings, Canada
recognized this humanity and set them free.
Now, a century and a half later, George and I are forced
to travel to Canada where we too are recognized as
full human beings and permitted to marry. It is a
sadness that the country we love, the country of our
birth refuses to recognize that we are human beings
and citizens and entitled to the human rights and civil
rights supposedly our birthright. That despite our
calling ourselves "The Land of the Free" and despite
the many promises in the founding documents offering
EQUALITY for ALL.
ward
----------------------------------------------------
Roger
Just like Joan of Arc.
>
> ward
Brent Norman
"This explains why A MAN..."
it doesn't say "This explains why ALL MEN..." , no 'twisting' there?
The twisting is in the people who listen to satan speak through the
likes of you, in an attempt to substantiate/support their dislike of
certain members of society, etc etc etc..
Not only that, but again, he wasn't even answering a question on
homosexuality, he was answering a question on divorce -- that's the
part that comes right before "But God's plan..."
If he were referring to all men, let's say he was referring to all
straight men, well then it would be a lie, because not all straight
men leave their mothers/fathers to take a wife, do they?
Clay Colwell
> > On 13 Dec 2003 17:07:41 +0100, Dr. Min
> > <cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
> >
> > >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > >
> >
> > shameless as to post the maunderings of Paul Cameron. Bounced out of
> > his professional societies -- for dishonest use of other peoples
> > research, not his homophobic delusions -- also utterly discredited in
> > the courts as an "expert witness" in matters of human sexuality.
> >
> > ward
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------
> > "Marital sex tends toward the boring end...
>
>
> So what's not true about it? Everyone knows gays have a much higher
> rate of hepatitis. The type of intercourse that they choose is riddled
> with such risks. Don't condemn anyone's research just because you
> don't like their politics, especially when every word of it is
Dude, you know and I know (and just about every other regular and
semi-regular in a.p.h knows) that this article gets trotted out every
few months or so. It gets some minor variation, but the same badly-
compiled claims remain, essentially, the same.
And every time it has to be pointed out (goodness knows why, but some
people are just willfully ignorant that way) that this laundry list
is a mix of misrepresentation, misinterpretation, bad science, and
just plain bald-faced lies, from the conflicting statistics to fallacious
extrapolation from a highly selective and limited population to the
universal group of homosexuals to just making shit up. Check out the
base reports: many of these so-called sources are legitimate studies,
but the conclusions made are bunkum; polling gay men *who went to an
STD clinic* and claiming that the whole population of gay men is
utterly diseased is as deranged and stupid as going to an old folks'
home, asking some questions, and claiming that people tend to die within
2 years after taking a poll.
You know this for a fact. And yet you blithely claim that this article
is being rebutted/trashed/criticized because of *politics*. That, dude,
is just plain dishonest.
Brent Norman
incredible...
Dr. Min
In plain English, homosexuals try to "justify" their filthy
and abominable sexual perversions any way they can, because
the reality is that homosexual activity is just plain wrong,
just like adultery is wrong, like thievery is wrong, murder
is wrong, lying is wrong, etc. Homosexuals do their best to
deny that their sexual activities promote terrible diseases,
as the articles which started these threads briefly outline:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=B0U6HD4X3796...@Gilgamesh-Frog.org
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=926a066f19ae16bc...@news.teranews.com
Most homosexuals claim that they "were born that way" which
is difficult to argue, given that we ordinary heterosexuals
can't even imagine what would motivate any adult to jump in
bed with another adult of the same sex. But how a person is
born doesn't justify that person's behavior. It's one thing
to fantasize about committing an immoral act but it's quite
another to actually go out and do it. The mere potential of
someone to commit a crime is not a violation of the law but
only when that person actually goes out and commits the act
does it rise to the level of a crime. Remember David Wester-
field? Had he merely fantasized about kidnapping and raping
and murdering that little seven-year old girl, Danielle Van
Dam, she'd most likely still be alive and well today. Since
Westerfield turned his morbid fantasy into reality, however,
then we see that actions speak far louder than words indeed.
Just because homosexuals are "born" to fantasize about some-
one of the same sex, that's a long way from committing some
filthy act of homosexual decadence--much less doing it over
and over again with the same or different partners like the
world was going to end tomorrow or something! Homos are not
judged nearly so much for their obscene fantasies, than for
their scurrilous words or worse, their active participation
in committing filthy homosexual acts with other homosexuals.
If any of you sexually-active homosexuals out there want to
suck the excrement out of a perfect stranger's stinky hairy
asshole, or stick your emaciated shit-stained penis in some-
body's rectum then that's probably what you are going to do.
It doesn't matter if you're male or female. Homo is as homo
does. Don't expect ordinary heterosexuals to approve of you
and your reprobate partners engaging in disgusting behavior.
Homosexuals are an abomination to all that is good and true,
and all of your lame excuses are transparently indefensible.
Daniel Joseph Min
*Min's Newsgroup-Archived Home Page On The World Wide Web:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=5YTK57VH3794...@Gilgamesh-frog.org
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Matthew Alexander
Man) wrote:
You mean facts and rationality? It doesn't appear you do.
>You aren't
>even fooling yourself let alone anyone else. It's COMMON SENSE that if
>you EAT SHIT, you're going to GET SICK.
And exactly how many gay people do you personally know who eat shit?
That's a serious question, because nobody I know seems to be into it.
Jesus Almighty. I can't tell you how staggering it is to think that a
person like you can live in the modern world and not realize your
beliefs are constructed from pure bullshit. You're just like one of
those 17th century Calvinists who believed that Jewish people drank
the blood of children and had horns. I'm sure if Paul Cameron told you
that queers were building landing strips for the Martian Invasion, you
wouldn't pause a moment before swallowing that too.
And to think you called Ward biased. Your ignorance is unbelievable.
Ward Stewart
Alexander) wrote:
Aloha Matthew --
I expect that I am biased, in favor of freedom, liberty, love kindness
and decency --
ward
PS If you would e-mail me at uncl...@hotmail.com I would be pleased
to pester you with observations and news
w
Letao
Dr. Min <cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
> In plain English, homosexuals try to "justify" their filthy
> and abominable sexual perversions any way they can
What makes you think you're important enough for anyone to need to
justify anything to you?
Neither myself or any other gay person needs to justify themselves,
their lives, their sexuality, or anything else to you.
Feel better?
Now fuck off.
Dr. Min
"He that is unjust, let him be unjust still:
and he which is filthy, let him be filthy
still...Blessed are they that do his command-
ments, that they may have right to the tree
of life, and may enter in through the gates
into the city. For without are dogs, and sor-
cerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and
idolaters and whosoever loveth & maketh a lie.
--Rev 22:11,14-15 AV
Better luck next time, you filthy animal.
"Letao" barked rabidly for mercy, alas, he was put down:
>
>In article <F5C47XU437971.8033333333@Gilgamesh-Frog.org>,
> Dr. Min <cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
>> In plain English, homosexuals try to "justify" their filthy
>> and abominable sexual perversions any way they can
>
>What makes anyone need to justify anything to God?
In his Discourse to the Greeks concerning Hades,
Book 1 Chap 1, historian Flavius Josephus wrote
the following, which puts things in perspective:
"1. NOW as to Hades, wherein the souls of the of the
good things they see, and rejoice in the righteous
and unrighteous are detained, it is necessary to
speak of it. Hades is a place in the world not
regularly finished; a subterraneous region, wherein
the light of this world does not shine; from which
circumstance, that in this region the light does not
shine, it cannot be but there must be in it perpetual
darkness. This region is allotted as a place of
custody for souls, ill which angels are appointed as
guardians to them, who distribute to them temporary
punishments, agreeable to every one's behavior and
manners.
"2. In this region there is a certain place set apart,
as a lake of unquenchable fire, whereinto we suppose
no one hath hitherto been cast; but it is prepared
for a day afore-determined by God, in which one
righteous sentence shall deservedly be passed upon
all men; when the unjust, and those that have been
disobedient to God, and have given honor to such
idols as have been the vain operations of the hands
of men as to God himself, shall be adjudged to this
everlasting punishment, as having been the causes of
defilement; while the just shall obtain an
incorruptible and never-fading kingdom. These are now
indeed confined in Hades, but not in the same place
wherein the unjust are confined.
"3. For there is one descent into this region, at
whose gate we believe there stands an archangel with
an host; which gate when those pass through that are
conducted down by the angels appointed over souls,
they do not go the same way; but the just are guided
to the right hand, and are led with hymns, sung by
the angels appointed over that place, unto a region
of light, in which the just have dwelt from the
beginning of the world; not constrained by necessity,
but ever enjoying the prospect of the good things
they see, and rejoic in the expectation of those new
enjoyments which will be peculiar to every one of
them, and esteeming those things beyond what we have
here; with whom there is no place of toil, no burning
heat, no piercing cold, nor are any briers there; but
the countenance of the and of the just, which they
see, always smiles them, while they wait for that
rest and eternal new life in heaven, which is to
succeed this region. This place we call The Bosom of
Abraham.
"4. But as to the unjust, they are dragged by force to
the left hand by the angels allotted for punishment,
no longer going with a good-will, but as prisoners
driven by violence; to whom are sent the angels
appointed over them to reproach them and threaten
them with their terrible looks, and to thrust them
still downwards. Now those angels that are set over
these souls drag them into the neighborhood of hell
itself; who, when they are hard by it, continually
hear the noise of it, and do not stand clear of the
hot vapor itself; but when they have a near view of
this spectacle, as of a terrible and exceeding great
prospect of fire, they are struck with a fearful
expectation of a future judgment, and in effect
punished thereby: and not only so, but where they see
the place [or choir] of the fathers and of the just,
even hereby are they punished; for a chaos deep and
large is fixed between them; insomuch that a just man
that hath compassion upon them cannot be admitted,
nor can one that is unjust, if he were bold enough to
attempt it, pass over it.
"5. This is the discourse concerning Hades, wherein
the souls of all men are confined until a proper
season, which God hath determined, when he will make
a resurrection of all men from the dead, not
procuring a transmigration of souls from one body to
another, but raising again those very bodies, which
you Greeks, seeing to be dissolved, do not believe
[their resurrection]. But learn not to disbelieve it;
for while you believe that the soul is created, and
yet is made immortal by God, according to the
doctrine of Plato, and this in time, be not
incredulous; but believe that God is able, when he
hath raised to life that body which was made as a
compound of the same elements, to make it immortal;
for it must never be said of God, that he is able to
do some things, and unable to do others. We have
therefore believed that the body will be raised
again; for although it be dissolved, it is not
perished; for the earth receives its remains, and
preserves them; and while they are like seed, and are
mixed among the more fruitful soil, they flourish,
and what is sown is indeed sown bare grain, but at
the mighty sound of God the Creator, it will sprout
up, and be raised in a clothed and glorious
condition, though not before it has been dissolved,
and mixed [with the earth]. So that we have not
rashly believed the resurrection of the body; for
although it be dissolved for a time on account of the
original transgression, it exists still, and is cast
into the earth as into a potter's furnace, in order
to be formed again, not in order to rise again such
as it was before, but in a state of purity, and so as
never to he destroyed any more. And to every body
shall its own soul be restored. And when it hath
clothed itself with that body, it will not be subject
to misery, but, being itself pure, it will continue
with its pure body, and rejoice with it, with which
it having walked righteously now in this world, and
never having had it as a snare, it will receive it
again with great gladness. But as for the unjust,
they will receive their bodies not changed, not freed
from diseases or distempers, nor made glorious, but
with the same diseases wherein they died; and such as
they were in their unbelief, the same shall they be
when they shall be faithfully judged.
"6. For all men, the just as well as the unjust, shall
be brought before God the word: for to him hath the
Father committed all judgment : and he, in order to
fulfill the will of his Father, shall come as Judge,
whom we call Christ. For Minos and Rhadamanthus are
not the judges, as you Greeks do suppose, but he whom
God and the Father hath glorified: CONCERNING WHOM WE
HAVE ELSEWHERE GIVEN A MORE PARTICULAR ACCOUNT, FOR
THE SAKE OF THOSE WHO SEEK AFTER TRUTH. This person,
exercising the righteous judgment of the Father
towards all men, hath prepared a just sentence for
every one, according to his works; at whose
judgment-seat when all men, and angels, and demons
shall stand, they will send forth one voice, and say,
JUST IS THY JUDGMENT; the rejoinder to which will
bring a just sentence upon both parties, by giving
justly to those that have done well an everlasting
fruition; but allotting to the lovers of wicked works
eternal punishment. To these belong the unquenchable
fire, and that without end, and a certain fiery worm,
never dying, and not destroying the body, but
continuing its eruption out of the body with
never-ceasing grief: neither will sleep give ease to
these men, nor will the night afford them comfort;
death will not free them from their punishment, nor
will the interceding prayers of their kindred profit
them; for the just are no longer seen by them, nor
are they thought worthy of remembrance. But the just
shall remember only their righteous actions, whereby
they have attained the heavenly kingdom, in which
there is no sleep, no sorrow, no corruption, no care,
no night, no day measured by time, no sun driven in
his course along the circle of heaven by necessity,
and measuring out the bounds and conversions of the
seasons, for the better illumination of the life of
men; no moon decreasing and increasing, or
introducing a variety of seasons, nor will she then
moisten the earth; no burning sun, no Bear turning
round [the pole], no Orion to rise, no wandering of
innumerable stars. The earth will not then be
difficult to be passed over, nor will it he hard to
find out the court of paradise, nor will there be any
fearful roaring of the sea, forbidding the passengers
to walk on it; even that will be made easily passable
to the just, though it will not be void of moisture.
Heaven will not then be uninhabitable by men, and it
will not be impossible to discover the way of
ascending thither. The earth will not be
uncultivated, nor require too much labor of men, but
will bring forth its fruits of its own accord, and
will be well adorned with them. There will be no more
generations of wild beasts, nor will the substance of
the rest of the animals shoot out any more; for it
will not produce men, but the number of the righteous
will continue, and never fail, together with
righteous angels, and spirits [of God], and with his
word, as a choir of righteous men and women that
never grow old, and continue in an incorruptible
state, singing hymns to God, who hath advanced them
to that happiness, by the means of a regular
institution of life; with whom the whole creation
also will lift up a perpetual hymn from corruption,
to incorruption, as glorified by a splendid and pure
spirit. It will not then be restrained by a bond of
necessity, but with a lively freedom shall offer up a
voluntary hymn, and shall praise him that made them,
together with the angels, and spirits, and men now
freed from all bondage.
"7. And now, if you Gentiles will be persuaded by
these motives, and leave your vain imaginations about
your pedigrees, and gaining of riches, and
philosophy, and will not spend your time about
subtleties of words, and thereby lead your minds into
error, and if you will apply your ears to the hearing
of the inspired prophets, the interpreters both of
God and of his word, and will believe in God, you
shall both be partakers of these things, and obtain
the good things that are to come; you shall see the
ascent unto the immense heaven plainly, and that
kingdom which is there. For what God hath now
concealed in silence [will be then made manifest,]
what neither eye hath seen, nor ear hath heard, nor
hath it entered into the heart of man, the things
that God hath prepared for them that love him.
"8. In whatsoever ways I shall find you, in them shall
I judge you entirely: so cries the END of all things.
And he who hath at first lived a virtuous lift, but
towards the latter end falls into vice, these labors
by him before endured shall be altogether vain and
unprofitable, even as in a play, brought to an ill
catastrophe. Whosoever shall have lived wickedly and
luxuriously may repent; however, there will be need
of much time to conquer an evil habit, and even after
repentance his whole life must be guarded with great
care and diligence, after the manner of a body,
which, after it hath been a long time afflicted with
a distemper, requires a stricter diet and method of
living; for though it may be possible, perhaps, to
break off the chain of our irregular affections at
once, yet our amendment cannot be secured without the
grace of God, the prayers of good men, the help of
the brethren, and our own sincere repentance and
constant care. It is a good thing not to sin at all;
it is also good, having sinned, to repent; as it is
best to have health always, but it is a good thing to
recover from a distemper. To God be glory and
dominion for ever and ever Amen."
[end quote]
http://bible.crosswalk.com/History/BC/FlaviusJosephus/
*Min's Newsgroup-Archived Home Page On The World Wide Web:
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=5YTK57VH3794...@Gilgamesh-frog.org
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Brent Norman
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
> In plain English, homosexuals try to "justify" their filthy
> and abominable sexual perversions any way they can, because
> the reality is that homosexual activity is just plain wrong,
it is just plain wrong for heterosexuals.
> just like adultery is wrong, like thievery is wrong, murder
> is wrong, lying is wrong, etc.
These are all crimes against an unwilling participant. If I give you
my car to use, it is entirely voluntary, and you are not stealing it.
But if I do not give you permission to use my car and you take it,
than that is theft, and it affects me in a negative fashion. Two
homosexuals that love each other and spend their lives together have
nothing in common with what you described above.
> Homosexuals do their best to
> deny that their sexual activities promote terrible diseases,
> as the articles which started these threads briefly outline:
>
Here's what I will not deny. Elevated levels of promiscuity in male
homosexual populations are what spreads disease. In heterosexual
populations, the males' desire to engage in sexual activity is more
controlled due to lack of readily available and willing partners. In
homosexual male populations, this is not an issue. Couple that with
the homosexual males that are subjected to tirades like your own,
promoted into self-loathing and denial, that subvert their natural
homosexuality in favour of "pretend" heterosexuality. Some live
double-lives, possibly abusing drugs and engaging in high risk
behaviours. Self loathing people do not really care about their
lives, they feel it is hopeless, which allows them to subject
themselves to risks that well adjusted homosexuals would not.
I know that this will happen less and less as homosexuality becomes
more acceptable in society, and these "denial" cases will be able to
live their natural lives as they were meant to, rather than cloak it
under a "presumed" heterosexuality that isn't there.
> http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=B0U6HD4X3796...@Gilgamesh-Frog.org
> http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=926a066f19ae16bc...@news.teranews.com
>
Some of the cites you referenced are well known, and some are wanting
for credibility.
> Most homosexuals claim that they "were born that way" which
> is difficult to argue, given that we ordinary heterosexuals
> can't even imagine what would motivate any adult to jump in
> bed with another adult of the same sex.
It is the exact same for homosexuals. They can't even imagine what
would motivate any adult to jump in bed with another adult of
different sex. The same feelings of "eew" would result. At the same
time however, it begs the question.. what is the motivation? How does
one become romantically attracted to someone? These are ages-old
questions that no one has truly come up with an answer for.
You are also debasing homosexuality down to a sex act. Like
heterosexuality, there is a lot more to it than that. If you are
married, do you look at your wife and just see her as a pair of
breasts and a vagina? I don't think so.. At least I hope not..
Presumably, you see her as a person, with all her faults and
qualities. The sexual component is a part of it, but it does not
DEFINE your relationship. Similarly, genitals alone do not define a
homosexual relationship.
> But how a person is
> born doesn't justify that person's behavior. It's one thing
> to fantasize about committing an immoral act but it's quite
> another to actually go out and do it.
There is nothing immoral about homosexuality in itself. It is other
behaviours, like promiscuity, or abuse, that are inherently immoral,
because they do harm to others in an emotional, and physical in some
cases.
> The mere potential of
> someone to commit a crime is not a violation of the law but
> only when that person actually goes out and commits the act
> does it rise to the level of a crime. Remember David Wester-
> field? Had he merely fantasized about kidnapping and raping
> and murdering that little seven-year old girl, Danielle Van
> Dam, she'd most likely still be alive and well today. Since
> Westerfield turned his morbid fantasy into reality, however,
> then we see that actions speak far louder than words indeed.
>
True. Kidnapping and murdering (or fantasizing about it) is the
diametric opposite to entering into a stable and loving relationship
with another person who happens to be the same sex as you. There is
no comparison.
> Just because homosexuals are "born" to fantasize about some-
> one of the same sex, that's a long way from committing some
> filthy act of homosexual decadence--much less doing it over
> and over again with the same or different partners like the
> world was going to end tomorrow or something!
For some reason you have been conditioned to believe that homosexuals
are just having sex and that's it. That is not the case. I took an
informal poll of my homosexual friends. In a typical week, which has
168 hours, they tended to be having sex on average for about 2 and a
half hours as a sum for the week. Now some have more and some have
less depending on the individual. That is 1.4 %
of total time spent involved in sexual activity. The other 98% of
the time is spend doing important things, like time spent at work,
meals, cooking,cleaning,child care,commuting,sports,computer games,etc
etc, which make up for a much larger percentage of total time spent.
Now, many of these things they do spend doing together with their
significant other, (except perhaps work, they all work at different
places!), but there are many non-sexual activities that homosexual
couples participate in. (read: activites that have NOTHING to do with
SEX), and those activities consume a lot more time than the sexual
act. Much similar to a heterosexual couple, whom we don't define
immediately as to how they rub their genitals together behind closed
doors, nor do most people care to. I certainly don't picture a hetero
couple having sex when I meet them - the farthest thing from my mind.
I appreciate them as PEOPLE.. PEOPLE ARE MUCH MORE THAN THE THEIR
GENITALS.
> Homos are not
> judged nearly so much for their obscene fantasies, than for
> their scurrilous words or worse, their active participation
> in committing filthy homosexual acts with other homosexuals.
>
> If any of you sexually-active homosexuals out there want to
> suck the excrement out of a perfect stranger's stinky hairy
> asshole, or stick your emaciated shit-stained penis in some-
> body's rectum then that's probably what you are going to do.
> It doesn't matter if you're male or female. Homo is as homo
> does. Don't expect ordinary heterosexuals to approve of you
> and your reprobate partners engaging in disgusting behavior.
> Homosexuals are an abomination to all that is good and true,
> and all of your lame excuses are transparently indefensible.
>
Your personal issues with homosexuality are flagrantly apparent from
those last two paragraphs, and far from objective. Colourfully
disgusting language shows your contemptuous and unreasonable argument,
which is based on the "eew" factor, how typical.
It is interesting to note how you tried to associate penises as part
of lesbian sexual behaviour. "homo is as homo does?" I think not.
Spuriousness at its best.
L. Neff
Dr. Min wrote:
> "He that is unjust, let him be unjust still:
> and he which is filthy, let him be filthy
> still...Blessed are they that do his command-
> ments,
[big snip]
Do YOU YOURSELF live by EVERY ONE of "his commandments"? (Hint: there
are more than 600 of them in the old testament, then there are those
annoying additions in the new testament about loving thy neighbor and
judging not lest ye be judged...)
I didn't think so.
But thanks for playing.
Clay Colwell
[complete and total NONrebuttal of my post]
Wow, dude, you have that ignoring thing down pat. Pity it
won't score you points in the debate column.
Brent Norman
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
> "He that is unjust, let him be unjust still:
> and he which is filthy, let him be filthy
> still...Blessed are they that do his command-
> ments, that they may have right to the tree
> of life, and may enter in through the gates
> into the city. For without are dogs, and sor-
> cerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and
> idolaters and whosoever loveth & maketh a lie.
> --Rev 22:11,14-15 AV
>
> Better luck next time, you filthy animal.
>
I try very hard not to get frustrated when I read some of the
degrading stuff I see on here, I think this sums it up:
"He that is slow to anger is better than the mighty; and he that
ruleth his spirit than he that taketh a city."
-- Proverbs 16:32
You, on the other hand seem to evoke Luke 18:11-12
"The Pharisee stood and prayed within himself in this way: God, I
thank You that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust,
adulterers, or even like this tax-collector. (12) I fast twice on
the Sabbath, I give tithes of all that I possess."
or perhaps Proverbs 21:24:
"Proud, haughty scorner is his name, he who deals in proud wrath"
The Nice Mean Man
Homosexuality was punishable by death when Jesus made His remarks. I
seriously doubt He had anything else on His mind but God's one and
only plan. But you know what...? I don't give a ratz azz what you
think. Go ahead and take your faggot husband of wife or whatever you
want, and take it up your dirty streched-out azzhole and then get AIDS
and die like the rest. And don't forget to pass it on to your
'husband', and as many of your 'friends' as you can while you're at
it. I couldn't care less. As a matter of fact, I hope none of you ever
get saved. That would be cheating God out of His revenge, and we can't
have that. Roast forever in the deepest darkest depths of hell, you
demented faggot bastard. I got better things to do than to argue with
someone so bound and determined to place his dick where it obviously
don't belong. You can have at it.
The Nice Mean Man
Homosexuality was punishable by death when Jesus made His remarks. I
seriously doubt He had anything else on His mind but God's one and
only plan. But you know what...? I don't give a ratz azz what you
think. Go ahead and take your faggot husband or wife or whatever you
want to call each other, and take it up your dirty streched-out
The Nice Mean Man
I hope you're a male sodomite... Being a promiscuous whore, you'll
soon be coming down with all those funny little tumors all over your
ugly body. The white crud on your tongue and the telltale sniffles of
that rare pneumonia.
AIDS upon you, and a slow demise thereof, you vile filthy ugly deviant
incorrigible tapeworm. You and your KIND sink up the whole human race.
Crawl off under the subfloor of humanity and croak in the slowest
manner possible. The world will be immensely better off. And I mean
right away.
Brent Norman
Look at this display of a person consumed with anger to the point of
burning. You have failed to address the issue, and as a result back
away in a blaze. Why don't you address the points instead of
name-calling?
It is not GOD that has a problem with faithful homosexuals (male AND
female), it is YOU.
Look at your burning anger, wishing disease on people. That's just
plain evil. FYI You can't get AIDS if none of the parties is infected.
It HAS to come from someone who already has it! Two monogamously
coupled homosexuals that have seronegative status, will not all of a
sudden become positive, as much as you would seem to wish.
"He that is slow to anger is better than the mighty; and he that
ruleth his spirit than he that taketh a city."
-- Proverbs 16:32
"The Pharisee stood and prayed within himself in this way: God, I
thank You that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust,
adulterers, or even like this tax-collector. (12) I fast twice on
the Sabbath, I give tithes of all that I possess."
-- Luke 18:11-12
"Proud, haughty scorner is his name, he who deals in proud wrath"
-- Proverbs 21:24
Your statements are vile and disturbing. I'll be glad to see you
leave, at least until you've overcome your affliction.
Brent Norman
The point is, 1) he was not discussing homosexuality here, as much as
your lot twist it to meet their bias. 2) He could not possibly say
"ALL" men, since not all men get married. Analyze that.
> But you know what...? I don't give a ratz azz what you
> think.
I guess that's where it's at. You dont give a "ratz azz" what I
think, and I don't really care for what you think, at least until you
can express your thoughts in rational terms.
> Go ahead and take your faggot husband or wife or whatever you
> want to call each other, and take it up your dirty streched-out
> azzhole and then get AIDS and die like the rest. And don't forget to
> pass it on to your 'husband', and as many of your 'friends' as you can
> while you're at it. I couldn't care less. As a matter of fact, I hope
> none of you ever get saved.
That looks like evil to me, cloaked in God.
>That would be cheating God out of His
> revenge, and we can't have that. Roast forever in the deepest darkest
> depths of hell, you demented faggot bastard. I got better things to do
> than to argue with someone so bound and determined to place his dick
> where it obviously don't belong. You can have at it.
I discussed sex earlier. Most homos spend very little time actually
having sex, that is but one part of the relationship. I am not "bound
and determined to place my dick where it obviously doesn't belong", in
fact that is the farthest thing from my mind. Contrary to what you
may think, there is a lot more to life than sexual acts!
Brent Norman
I can't believe how quickly you have degraded yourself this way.
On a side note, the word "sodomite" has a very interesting history.
The word only shows up 4 times in the Bible, as the word "kawdashe"
(male temple cult prostitutes) or its counterpart "kedayshaw" (female
temple cult prostitute).
Neither is used to denote a homosexual as is commonly known.
Your lot use the word to slam homosexuals in a negative light. In the
story of S&G it is not even used.
YOUR happily-used word "SODOMITE", originated in the KING JAMES
VERSION of the Bible, only in reference to temple cult prostitutes,
which are not homosexuals. Couple that with the perceived reasoning
that homosexuality caused the destruction of S&G, and you have a lot
of people believing what is a lie.
The people of Sodom and Gomorrah, with all their abundance and wealth,
were inhospitable toward visitors that were less fortunate. There is
strong biblical evidence that this is why God destroyed them.
Ezekial 16:49-50:
"Now this is the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were
arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and
needy. They were haughty and did detestable things before me.
Therefore I did away with them as you have seen."
Ward Stewart
Norman) wrote:
It is not unlike rubbing two boy scouts together to start a fire.
Quite simply, not the way things work.
ward
>
>"He that is slow to anger is better than the mighty; and he that
>ruleth his spirit than he that taketh a city."
>-- Proverbs 16:32
>
>"The Pharisee stood and prayed within himself in this way: God, I
>thank You that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust,
>adulterers, or even like this tax-collector. (12) I fast twice on
>the Sabbath, I give tithes of all that I possess."
>-- Luke 18:11-12
>
>"Proud, haughty scorner is his name, he who deals in proud wrath"
>-- Proverbs 21:24
>
>Your statements are vile and disturbing. I'll be glad to see you
>leave, at least until you've overcome your affliction.
-----------------------------------------------------
"I always sleep much better in a new hotel room after
I have ripped the anti-gay passage Leviticus 18:22
from the Gideon Bible!"
Sir Ian McKellen
-----------------------------------------------------
Ward Stewart
Norman) wrote:
What can one say -- veritable Republicans hocking at the supports for
the poor and infirm.
ward
The Nice Mean Man
I don't get suckered into dancing upon the head of a pin with ANYBODY.
Especially a dirty ugly sodomite who's nothing more than a servent of
the devil. The Word is clear. Take heed of it or live forever in
eternal death. Christ too is quite clear... "Get thee behind Me,
satan"
>
> It is not GOD that has a problem with faithful homosexuals (male AND
> female), it is YOU.
>
> Look at your burning anger, wishing disease on people. That's just
> plain evil. FYI You can't get AIDS if none of the parties is infected.
> It HAS to come from someone who already has it! Two monogamously
> coupled homosexuals that have seronegative status, will not all of a
> sudden become positive, as much as you would seem to wish.
>
> "He that is slow to anger is better than the mighty; and he that
> ruleth his spirit than he that taketh a city."
> -- Proverbs 16:32
>
> "The Pharisee stood and prayed within himself in this way: God, I
> thank You that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust,
> adulterers, or even like this tax-collector. (12) I fast twice on
> the Sabbath, I give tithes of all that I possess."
> -- Luke 18:11-12
>
> "Proud, haughty scorner is his name, he who deals in proud wrath"
> -- Proverbs 21:24
>
> Your statements are vile and disturbing. I'll be glad to see you
> leave, at least until you've overcome your affliction.
The last person to make that statement had the pleasure of my company
in there group for THREE YEARS. If you knew what was good for you,
you'd quit while you were ahead.
The Nice Mean Man
Newsgroups: alt.politics.homosexuality,alt.religion.christian,alt.politics.bush,alt.archaeology,alt.apocalypse
Subject: Re: MEDICAL CONSEQUENCES OF WHAT HOMOSEXUALS DO (good
article)
References: <20031213090232...@mb-m15.aol.com>
<B0U6HD4X37968.7127199074@Gilgamesh-Frog.org>
<dd0f640713da2e76...@mixmaster.it>
<I1WAGKG037969.8722685185@Gilgamesh-Frog.org>
<19f5d6de.0312...@posting.google.com>
<a7ad4b4f.03121...@posting.google.com>
<19f5d6de.03121...@posting.google.com>
<a7ad4b4f.03121...@posting.google.com>
<19f5d6de.03121...@posting.google.com>
<a7ad4b4f.03121...@posting.google.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 152.163.252.163
Message-ID: <19f5d6de.03121...@posting.google.com>
I don't get suckered into dancing upon the head of a pin with ANYBODY.
Especially a dirty ugly sodomite who's nothing more than a servent of
the devil. The Word is clear. Take heed of it or live forever in
eternal death. Christ too is quite clear... "Get thee behind Me,
satan"
>
> It is not GOD that has a problem with faithful homosexuals (male AND
> female), it is YOU.
>
> Look at your burning anger, wishing disease on people. That's just
> plain evil. FYI You can't get AIDS if none of the parties is infected.
> It HAS to come from someone who already has it! Two monogamously
> coupled homosexuals that have seronegative status, will not all of a
> sudden become positive, as much as you would seem to wish.
>
> "He that is slow to anger is better than the mighty; and he that
> ruleth his spirit than he that taketh a city."
> -- Proverbs 16:32
>
> "The Pharisee stood and prayed within himself in this way: God, I
> thank You that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust,
> adulterers, or even like this tax-collector. (12) I fast twice on
> the Sabbath, I give tithes of all that I possess."
> -- Luke 18:11-12
>
> "Proud, haughty scorner is his name, he who deals in proud wrath"
> -- Proverbs 21:24
>
> Your statements are vile and disturbing. I'll be glad to see you
> leave, at least until you've overcome your affliction.
The last person to make that statement had the pleasure of my company
in their group for THREE YEARS. If you knew what was good for you,
The Nice Mean Man
You forgot this one, Brent
Jude 1:7
Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner,
giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh,
are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
Lizzie
would a woman. this is hatful sin."
seems pretty clear in that passage that god doesn't like sexually active
homosexuals
"Ward Stewart" <wste...@hawaii.rr.com> wrote in message
news:3es1uv8ouvitss1e5...@4ax.com...
Roger
"Lizzie" <liz_br...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message
news:gIcEb.2217$tQ6....@wards.force9.net...
The Nice Mean Man
He was generalizing the concept of God's original intentions for the
human family when being questioned on the subject of divorce. And He
reached back into scripture just like He always did. Just like He
commands Me to do...
Genesis 2:18-25
And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I
will make him a help meet for him. 19 And out of the ground the LORD
God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and
brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever
Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof. 20 And
Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to
every beast of the field; but for Adam there was not found a help meet
for him.
21 And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he
slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead
thereof; 22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made
he a woman, and brought her unto the man. 23 And Adam said, This is
now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called
Woman, because she was taken out of Man. 24 Therefore shall a man
leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and
they shall be one flesh. 25 And they were both naked, the man and his
wife, and were not ashamed.
As anyone can see here, God's original intentions for normal mating
were between a male and a female. Jesus confirms this in His diolog on
divorce. Whether that union produces children or not is irrelevant to
His plan and to my point. Eat your partners feces and croak of
hepatitis, sodomite scum.
> > But you know what...? I don't give a ratz azz what you
> > think.
>
> I guess that's where it's at. You dont give a "ratz azz" what I
> think, and I don't really care for what you think, at least until you
> can express your thoughts in rational terms.
>
>
> > Go ahead and take your faggot husband or wife or whatever you
> > want to call each other, and take it up your dirty streched-out
> > azzhole and then get AIDS and die like the rest. And don't forget to
> > pass it on to your 'husband', and as many of your 'friends' as you can
> > while you're at it. I couldn't care less. As a matter of fact, I hope
> > none of you ever get saved.
>
> That looks like evil to me, cloaked in God.
>
> >That would be cheating God out of His
> > revenge, and we can't have that. Roast forever in the deepest darkest
> > depths of hell, you demented faggot bastard. I got better things to do
> > than to argue with someone so bound and determined to place his dick
> > where it obviously don't belong. You can have at it.
>
> I discussed sex earlier. Most homos spend very little time actually
> having sex, that is but one part of the relationship. I am not "bound
> and determined to place my dick where it obviously doesn't belong", in
> fact that is the farthest thing from my mind. Contrary to what you
> may think, there is a lot more to life than sexual acts!
The perversion of the normal sex act by homosexuals is merely an
outward manifestation of an inward corruption ripe to bursting. The
REAL sin is what goes on in your dark and twisted minds.... Like when
you "fall in love" with each other! A real delve into the total
perversion of God's holy plan! And like, how can one MALE sodomite
find another MALE sodomite's hairy azzhole attractive? Only women
find men attractive!
No... you all got damaged somewhere back in life, and most likely it
was from one or both of your parents. You're mentally ill... there is
no doubt of this in my mind. But by all means, keep degrading
yourselves. Keep sinning unto your own bodies, and let it make you
more blind day-by-day. They world will be loads better off with all
you people gone. One by one, your lifestyle will come and claim you
sooner or later. And I say the sooner the better. I resent breathing
the same air as you, you filthy queer. Catch your funny little fever,
cough up your rare pneumonia and leave this place. You never belonged
with the rest of us anyway.
"There is a way that seems right unto a man that ends in death"
maf 1029
<liz_br...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>Try Leviticus 18:22 - "You must not have sexual relations with a man as you
>would a woman. this is hatful sin."
>
>seems pretty clear in that passage that god doesn't like sexually active
>homosexuals
Swell. Another liar for Jeebus.
Brent Norman
You seem not to know what love is. Have you ever experienced true
love? Were you in love with her BODY PARTS, or were you in love with
HER, the PERSON? I'm sure she'd love to know.
> A real delve into the total
> perversion of God's holy plan! And like, how can one MALE sodomite
> find another MALE sodomite's hairy azzhole attractive?
When you fall in love with a woman, do you just see here as a a pair
of breasts and a vagina? I REALLY hope you don't, because that is
what you are implying, that falling in love is purely a physical
thing, having nothing to do with the person. In your twisted world,
there are no feelings, no emotions, just body parts.
A "hairy azzhole" has nothing to do with homosexual attraction to a
male (although, there may be a fringe minority that has a fixation on
a body part!), just like a hairy vagina has nothing with how you
become attracted to a woman. (although there may be a fringe minority
that has a fixation on a body part!).
> Only women
> find men attractive!
> No... you all got damaged somewhere back in life, and most likely it
> was from one or both of your parents.
No. How do you explain the fact that many homosexuals, male and
female who have siblings who grew up in the same house with the same
parents, that end up being heterosexual? You are the one that seems
damaged and hurt somehow. What happened to you?
> You're mentally ill... there is
> no doubt of this in my mind. But by all means, keep degrading
> yourselves. Keep sinning unto your own bodies, and let it make you
> more blind day-by-day. They world will be loads better off with all
> you people gone. One by one, your lifestyle will come and claim you
> sooner or later.
> And I say the sooner the better. I resent breathing
> the same air as you, you filthy queer. Catch your funny little fever,
> cough up your rare pneumonia and leave this place. You never belonged
> with the rest of us anyway.
>
There is no reasoning in the above.. You have a personal issue with
homosexuality, it is quite clear, it works you into an incoherent
vitriolic frenzy, something must have happened to you.
Your lifestyle will kill you too. You may get a rare pneumonia, or
have an aneurism, or a heart attack, or a car accident. Everyone's
going to die, sorry to tell you, but they will, regardless of their
"lifestyle", it is just a matter of when. If all homosexuals died
tomorrow, there would be more within a generation, there is a natural
occurence of this in nature.
> "There is a way that seems right unto a man that ends in death"
Actually, EVERY way unto a man ends in death. We _all_ die, and it
doesn't matter whether you did this or that. Heterosexuals are not
immune to this, and neither are homosexuals, cats, dogs, fish.
Brent Norman
You have been taken into believing the lies perpetrated since around
the 14th-17th Century, regarding homosexuality as sin.
The reason you don't get suckered into addressing the points, is that
you seem not to be able to. Even your use of the word "sodomite" is
the result of the lies in biblical interpretation. The Word is clear,
only in its original incarnation and culture. Modern language and
culture are at the root of the lies that you take as truth. Servant
of the devil indeed.
> >
> > It is not GOD that has a problem with faithful homosexuals (male AND
> > female), it is YOU.
> >
> > Look at your burning anger, wishing disease on people. That's just
> > plain evil. FYI You can't get AIDS if none of the parties is infected.
> > It HAS to come from someone who already has it! Two monogamously
> > coupled homosexuals that have seronegative status, will not all of a
> > sudden become positive, as much as you would seem to wish.
> >
> > "He that is slow to anger is better than the mighty; and he that
> > ruleth his spirit than he that taketh a city."
> > -- Proverbs 16:32
> >
> > "The Pharisee stood and prayed within himself in this way: God, I
> > thank You that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust,
> > adulterers, or even like this tax-collector. (12) I fast twice on
> > the Sabbath, I give tithes of all that I possess."
> > -- Luke 18:11-12
> >
> > "Proud, haughty scorner is his name, he who deals in proud wrath"
> > -- Proverbs 21:24
> >
> > Your statements are vile and disturbing. I'll be glad to see you
> > leave, at least until you've overcome your affliction.
>
>
> The last person to make that statement had the pleasure of my company
> in their group for THREE YEARS. If you knew what was good for you,
> you'd quit while you were ahead.
It is still interesting to see someone with such a *burning* attitude
that started out rationally, so I guess it can go on, at least until
you resort to only ad-hominem replies, which is at about 90% now.
Brent Norman
> would a woman. this is hatful sin."
>
> seems pretty clear in that passage that god doesn't like sexually active
> homosexuals
>
The translation that you are so happy to employ is a lie.
The *literal* translation of the "famous" Lev 18:22 is:
"You must not sleep the sleep of a woman with a man; it is ritually
impure."
Additionally, the "condemnation" uses the hebrew word "toevah". The
Hebrews had special words to single out various misdeeds. If the
passage was referring to sexual misconduct, the writer would have used
"zimmah" instead of "toevah". "zimmah" was used to condemn immoral
acts like rape and prostitution, whereas "toevah" was used to condemn
ritual idolatrous practices. Therefore, this passage is more likely related
to idolatry, as it could be an idiom of some sort whose true meaning
may never be known. Another reason that I believe that it is moreso
related to idolatry, is the context around it, relating to BAAL and
MOLECH, which is connected to idolatrous practices.
Wherever BAAL or the fertility goddess Ashtoreth are mentioned,
"toevah" is the word used in the Law to denounce these idolatrous
practices.
Then the new testament, where Jesus has said nothing that clearly
singles out homosexuality, even though homosexual relationships would
have been quite common in the greco-roman world, it is interesting to
note that if it were so detestable to God, that he wouldn't have
commented on them at all. And perhaps Paul commented on this, but
that is a whole other box.
Ninure Saunders
<liz_br...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
-Try Leviticus 18:22 - "You must not have sexual relations with a man as you
-would a woman. this is hatful sin."
-
-seems pretty clear in that passage that god doesn't like sexually active
-homosexuals
-
In the same Book, "God" makes it pretty clear that God doesn't likr
proplr eho eat pork, wear clothes made of mixed fabrics and many other
things that I am wuite sure you ignore.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
That verse is from a section of the Bible referred to as "The Holiness
Code". That code comprises Leviticus 17:1-26:46.
Two things are clear about the code:
1) The code was directed towards the Israelites,
2) It pertains to the land of Israel.
Chapter 17 opens by giving guidelines for the sacrifice of animals. Verse
10-16 is a prohibition against eating blood.
Chapters 21-22 outline the qualification for a priest. One qualification is
that the priest be free of blemishes.
Chapter 23 gives a list of festivals, which includes: The Feast of
Unleavened Bread, The Feast of Weeks, The Day of Atonement and The Feast of
Booths.
Chapter 24 is a grouping of miscellaneous Laws which deals with such items
as using pure oil for the lamp in the temple.
Chapter 25 gives instructions on the sabbatical year. The sabbatical year
is the seventh year and applies to allowing the farmland to rest, and to
forgiving all debts.
Chapter 26 opens by forbidding the making of idols and images. The rest of
it is a blessing to those who keep the commands, and a curse to those who
break the commands.
I have not mentioned chapters 18, 19 and 20 yet, but did you notice
something about the chapters which I had mentioned?
Those chapters are ignored by almost all Christians!
Chapters 18-20 form a unit. Some of the laws referred to here includes:
18:19
Also thou shalt not approach unto a woman to uncover
her nakedness, as long as she is put apart for her
uncleanness
19:19
Thou shalt not let thy cattle gender with a diverse kind:
thou shalt not sow thy field with mingled seed: neither
shall a garment mingled of linen and woolen come
upon thee.
19:27
Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither
shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.
20:9
For every one that curseth his father or his mother shall be
surely put to death: he hath cursed his father or his mother;
his blood shall be upon him.
Again, these are all laws which no mainstream Christian Church accepts.
Taking your argument against homosexuality from a code which is greatly
ignored by Christianity only shows the weakness of your position.
At best one can only say that you are simply ignortant and are simply
parroting what you have been told with no serious and loving study pn
your own, or what is more likely, you simplu are a willing and cheerul
hypoctiy engaging in the usual method of a bigot.
Ninure Saunders aka Rainbow Christian
http://Rainbow-Christian.tk
The Lord is my Shepherd and He knows I'm Gay
http://Ninure-Saunders.tk
My Yahoo Group
http://Ninure.tk
My Online Diary
http://www.ninure.deardiary.net
-
Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches
http://www.MCCchurch.org
To send e-mail, remove nohate from address
Brent Norman
> nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > Hither...@msn.com (The Nice Mean Man) wrote in message news:<19f5d6de.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > > Letao <le...@fire.and.fishing.net> wrote in message news:<letao-0487C9....@netnews.attbi.com>...
> > > > In article <F5C47XU437971.8033333333@Gilgamesh-Frog.org>,
> > > > Dr. Min <cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote:
What we call "strange flesh" came from the Greek "heteros sarx", which
literally translated means "different flesh". In referring to
homosexuality, the term would be "homos sarx", meaning "same flesh".
"Strange flesh" relates to things that are not of human flesh,
otherworldy, such as angels, and false idols.
How about Jesus' comment to his disciples:
"if anyone will not welcome you or listen to your words, shake off the
dust of your feet when you leave that home or town. I tell you the
truth, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of
judgment than for that town."
The Apocrypha (Old Testament Pseudopigrapha), seems to frame a much
different interpretation, alluding to wicked angels.
Ward Stewart
A deludo for the deity -- a twit for the trinity -
ward
------------------------------------------------
"In our democratic republic the default MUST BE
that the citizen is free to live his life in any
harmless way that he chooses."
Ward Stewart
-------------------------------------------------
Crowfoot
> You forgot this one, Brent
>
> Jude 1:7
> Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner,
> giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh,
> are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
Woah, "strange flesh?" That sounds like space aliens, or maybe girls
from the next valley over (given the scale of life in Biblical times),
or maybe even, um, goats. Why conclude that "strange flesh" = people of
the same sex as the people involved? Is it elucidated thus elsewhere in
the text? For that matter, "going after strange flesh" could mean
hunting peculiar animals, or maybe other people. "Fornication" is
pretty clear, but "going after strange flesh" is not a very specific
description. Anybody have a more accurate translation to cite?
C.
--
Crow
Matthew Alexander
Man) wrote:
> He was generalizing the concept of God's original intentions for the
>human family when being questioned on the subject of divorce. And He
>reached back into scripture just like He always did. Just like He
>commands Me to do...
God also commanded you to love your enemies. We can all see how well
that's working out...
The Nice Mean Man
Well, the men of Sodom tried to rape God's very own angles. Angles in
male form. You figure it out, nimrod.
The Nice Mean Man
Watch the devil twist the truth! Twist it, baby... Twist it until it
fits around your own personal little sin that you're so in love with.
The only problem is, Now, you'll have to get God to buy it.
It will be a pleasure to watch you roast in hell, evil sodomite. A
wonderful granted pleasure. For we WILL see the reward of the
wicked...
"The Lord rebuke you, satan"
The Nice Mean Man
Keep picking and choosing which definition fits your cause, liar.
Original Word Word Origin
eéterov of uncertain affinity
Transliterated Word Phonetic Spelling
Heteros het'-er-os
Parts of Speech TDNT
Adjective 2:702,265
Definition
the other, another, other
to number
to number as opposed to some former person or thing
the other of two
to quality
another: i.e. one not of the same nature, form, class, kind, different
A man screwing another man is certainly what we'd call 'different' and
'not of the same nature' as that of normal folk. Especially back in
Paul's day. They definitely did not tolerate queers back then. But by
all means, deny that too.
Nobody believes you, strange flesh craver.
Original Word Word Origin
sa/rc probably from the base of (4563)
Transliterated Word Phonetic Spelling
Sarx sarx
Parts of Speech TDNT
Noun Feminine 7:98,1000
Definition
flesh (the soft substance of the living body, which covers the bones
and is permeated with blood) of both man and beasts
the body
the body of a man
used of natural or physical origin, generation or relationship
born of natural generation
the sensuous nature of man, "the animal nature"
without any suggestion of depravity
the animal nature with cravings which incite to sin
the physical nature of man as subject to suffering
a living creature (because possessed of a body of flesh) whether man
or beast
the flesh, denotes mere human nature, the earthly nature of man apart
from divine influence, and therefore prone to sin and opposed to God
source:
http://www.studylight.org/desk/?l=en&query=strange+flesh§ion=2&translation=kjv&oq=&sr=1
God made them MALE & FEMALE. Figure it out, Einstein. That dick that
you place up the crud-covered rectum of your boyfriend really belongs
within the vagina of the women. I mean, just look at it! A more
perfect example of divine design I have never seen!
You, on the other hand, are a perfect example of the end-result of
total immersion into the bondage of lasciviousness. Burn in torment at
the feet of the Lamb forever, faggot. Burn.
No One
> nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.0312...@posting.google.com>...
> > The *literal* translation of the "famous" Lev 18:22 is:
> >
> > "You must not sleep the sleep of a woman with a man; it is ritually
> > impure."
> >
<snip>
>
> Watch the devil twist the truth! Twist it, baby... Twist it until it
> fits around your own personal little sin that you're so in love with.
> The only problem is, Now, you'll have to get God to buy it.
Do you think God is more likely to buy what was written 4000
years ago or an English translation possibly distorted by cultural
prejudices? And who do you think represents the devil?
1. Bigots promulgating hatred.
2. "Godless liberals" saying that all men are created equal.
Chose the best answer if you think both may apply.
The Nice Mean Man
There is a point where "loving your enemies" and "turning the other
cheek" crosses over into "Cast not your pearls before the swine lest
they turn and attack you" territory. The problem with most
simple-simon blank-eyed fools like you is that you don't know the
limits of that distinction. Pray about it. Ask God for wisdom of
discernment. He will give it to you if you ask. Do it soon before
these people ruin the world for you.
Let me guess... you're one of.... 'these people'.
The Nice Mean Man
> Hither...@msn.com (The Nice Mean Man) writes:
>
> > nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.0312...@posting.google.com>...
>
> > > The *literal* translation of the "famous" Lev 18:22 is:
> > >
> > > "You must not sleep the sleep of a woman with a man; it is ritually
> > > impure."
> > >
> <snip>
> >
> > Watch the devil twist the truth! Twist it, baby... Twist it until it
> > fits around your own personal little sin that you're so in love with.
> > The only problem is, Now, you'll have to get God to buy it.
>
> Do you think God is more likely to buy what was written 4000
> years ago or an English translation possibly distorted by cultural
> prejudices?
Start picking and choosing and you won't know where to stop. God wrote
the whole Bible. That's all I need to know. That's all you need to
know.
> And who do you think represents the devil?
>
> 1. Bigots promulgating hatred.
>
> 2. "Godless liberals" saying that all men are created equal.
What a fool! First off, When the authors of that which you wish to
emulate wrote it, do you think they were referring to everyone? They
had slaves, did they not? All men created equal... What a joke! No two
things are created equal. Pick another comparison.
>
> Chose the best answer if you think both may apply.
Homosexuality is nothing new. The only difference between now and 4000
years ago is that they followed God's law concerning the violator back
then. Sodomites were routinely stoned to death. And as anyone can see
by the moral cesspool that we live in today, it was a practice that we
never should have let up on. And we have you "Godless liberals" to
thank for that. Now, we have a Godless society and all that comes with
that soulless demented condition.
You are the devil.
maf 1029
<wste...@hawaii.rr.com> wrote:
>On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 11:23:51 GMT, maf 1029
><m...@spammetillitfallsoff.organ> wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 18 Dec 2003 07:28:49 -0000, "Lizzie"
>><liz_br...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>Try Leviticus 18:22 - "You must not have sexual relations with a man as you
>>>would a woman. this is hatful sin."
>>>
>>>seems pretty clear in that passage that god doesn't like sexually active
>>>homosexuals
>>
>>Swell. Another liar for Jeebus.
>>
>A deludo for the deity -- a twit for the trinity -
Sounds like mascots for a badminton team.
Clay Colwell
> male form. You figure it out, nimrod.
Were they acute or obtuse? The world needs to know.
Brent Norman
AHEM, "strange flesh", i.e. not of humans.
THe City of Sodom was already condemned long before the ANGELS
arrived.
Why in Ezekiel 16:48-49 did Jesus and the five Jewish prohpets detail
all of the sins that the city was guilty of, and none of them uttered
homosexuality, none at all? It is people of YOUR contention that are
doing the twisting, to make it fit their personal hatred for
homosexuals.
Sodomites in this world are straight and gay. They are obesssed with
the accumulation of wealth and possessions, without regard for those
less fortunate, having plenty, to the point of waste, and not sharing
at all with those who are in need. THAT is the real sin of Sodom.
The attempted "rape" of that you so like to associate with
homosexuality actually has nothing to do with it!
In those times it was not uncommon for soldiers, or bullies of a
victorious army to rape their conquered enemy to degrade and
dehumanize them, which has nothing to do with commitment or love, nor
homosexuality. Rape is certainly not acceptable, gay or straight.
Brent Norman
> > "Lizzie" <liz_br...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message news:<gIcEb.2217$tQ6....@wards.force9.net>...
> fits around your own personal little sin that you're so in love with.
> The only problem is, Now, you'll have to get God to buy it.
> It will be a pleasure to watch you roast in hell, evil sodomite. A
> wonderful granted pleasure. For we WILL see the reward of the
> wicked...
>
> "The Lord rebuke you, satan"
Likewise to you. It is the homo-haters that have twisted the truth.
Twisted it until it fits around your own personal disgusting hatred
that you're so in love with. The only problem is, Now, YOU'LL have to
get God to buy it.
It won't be a pleasure for me to watch you roast in hell, evil liar.
A terrible thing. For I DON'T want to see the reward that is waiting
for the wicked, unlike you.
"The Lord rebuke you, satan"
""...when you judge others, you have no excuse, WHOEVER YOU ARE, when
you judge others; for in passing judgement on another, you condemn
yourself..."
Brent Norman
See you are twisting it to form a justification for your hatred.
Plain and simple. The exact thing that you are accusing ME of, you
are doing. Lies that have been passed down through generations since
at least the 17th Century.
"Queers" WERE tolerated back then. They did not have an understanding
of homosexuality as we understand it today. In fact the word didn't
even exist back then either. What God hates is when people turn from
him in pursuit of only self-satisfaction. People are not intended to
be ruled by pleasure, passion and sex alone. They are to be full
human beings.
There you are, standing on your high horse of judgement. That is what
some people will burn in torment for. Judgement is God's business,
not yours.
Bondage of lasciviousness? Come on. Again you think that homosexuals
are automotons that just live for sex. That is totally incorrect, a
dangerous lie. I think you would say something here like "Go on
believe your false idol of hatred, continue to worship deception."
Brent Norman
> nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > Hither...@msn.com (The Nice Mean Man) wrote in message news:<19f5d6de.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > > nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > > > Hither...@msn.com (The Nice Mean Man) wrote in message news:<19f5d6de.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > > > > nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > > > > > Hither...@msn.com (The Nice Mean Man) wrote in message news:<19f5d6de.0312...@posting.google.com>...
> > > > > > > Dr. Min <cosmic.con...@zero.point.energy> wrote in message news:<I1WAGKG037969.8722685185@Gilgamesh-Frog.org>...
> > > > > > > > On Sun, 14 Dec 2003, George Orwell <nob...@mixmaster.it> wrote:
You still never answered my question from yesterday.. I will expand on
it a little. WHEN YOU FALL IN LOVE WITH A WOMAN, are you in love with
her FLESH ("do you see her simply as a receptacle for your penis?")
OR, do you see her as a human being, with many qualities that you
admire.
When you see her, do you think of how many different ways you can
penetrate her,
OR, of how you relate to her, and enjoy her company, and spend time
with her.
If something bad were to happen to her, do you have genuine concern
for her well-being; would you put yourself in danger to ensure her
safety, do you value her life as much or more than you value your own?
Brent Norman
You are trying to make the definitions work for you, with limited
success.
> Original Word Word Origin
> eéterov of uncertain affinity
> Transliterated Word Phonetic Spelling
> Heteros het'-er-os
> Parts of Speech TDNT
> Adjective 2:702,265
> Definition
>
> the other, another, other
> to number
> to number as opposed to some former person or thing
> the other of two
> to quality
>
> another: i.e. one not of the same nature, form, class, kind, different
>
EXACTLY.
If a man were craving "same" flesh, then he is craving another man
If a man were craving "different" flesh, he is craving "flesh" that is
different from his own.
curtsybear
> It will be a pleasure to watch you roast in hell, evil sodomite. A
> wonderful granted pleasure.
Hmm. Is this that Christian piety and love which I keep hearing about?
--
Curtis at Sieber dot Com
"I have mastered all my impulses. They don't make me do nothing."
-- Lurlean Tucker admits to the fact that she's continually stuck
in "warp drive".
No One
> No One <no...@nospam.pacbell.net> wrote in message news:<m3y8t91...@nospam.pacbell.net>...
> > Hither...@msn.com (The Nice Mean Man) writes:
> Start picking and choosing and you won't know where to stop. God wrote
> the whole Bible. That's all I need to know. That's all you need to
> know.
You mean you subscribe to the doctrine of "translator infallibility"
to justify your bigotry?
> > And who do you think represents the devil?
> >
> > 1. Bigots promulgating hatred.
> >
> > 2. "Godless liberals" saying that all men are created equal.
>
> What a fool! First off, When the authors of that which you wish to
> emulate wrote it, do you think they were referring to everyone? They
> had slaves, did they not? All men created equal... What a joke! No two
> things are created equal. Pick another comparison.
Oh, so you religious bigots think the words Thomas Jefferson wrote
in the Declaration of Independence are a joke (and he had slaves too,
BTW.) I always have suspected Nazi tendencies, and you are doing a
good job of confirming it.
> > Chose the best answer if you think both may apply.
>
> Homosexuality is nothing new.
You didn't answer the question.
> You are the devil.
Well, at least I won't have to worry about burning in Hell since,
last I heard, the devil stokes the fires and doesn't burn himself!
Or something like that! :-)
Clay Colwell
> > Hither...@msn.com (The Nice Mean Man) writes:
> >
> > > nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.0312...@posting.google.com>...
>
> > > > The *literal* translation of the "famous" Lev 18:22 is:
> > > >
> > > > "You must not sleep the sleep of a woman with a man; it is ritually
> > > > impure."
> > > >
> <snip>
> > >
> > > Watch the devil twist the truth! Twist it, baby... Twist it until it
> > > fits around your own personal little sin that you're so in love with.
> > > The only problem is, Now, you'll have to get God to buy it.
> >
> > Do you think God is more likely to buy what was written 4000
> > years ago or an English translation possibly distorted by cultural
> > prejudices?
>
> Start picking and choosing and you won't know where to stop.
Wow! How kosher do *you* live?
> God wrote the whole Bible. That's all I need to know.
Oh, there's that willful ignorance thing again.
> That's all you need to know.
What, I owe It royalties?
> > And who do you think represents the devil?
> >
> > 1. Bigots promulgating hatred.
> >
> > 2. "Godless liberals" saying that all men are created equal.
>
> What a fool! First off, When the authors of that which you wish to
> emulate wrote it, do you think they were referring to everyone? They
> had slaves, did they not? All men created equal... What a joke! No two
> things are created equal. Pick another comparison.
!!
One of the reasons I wouldn't want you on any jury, or having any
authority on determining the destiny of any other human being.
> > Chose the best answer if you think both may apply.
>
> Homosexuality is nothing new. The only difference between now and 4000
> years ago is that they followed God's law concerning the violator back
> then. Sodomites were routinely stoned to death. And as anyone can see
> by the moral cesspool that we live in today, it was a practice that we
> never should have let up on.
Thank you for making your hatred so painfully plain to see. I can
already imagine the goon squads you'd happily unleash.
> And we have you "Godless liberals" to
> thank for that. Now, we have a Godless society and all that comes with
> that soulless demented condition.
Thank God.
> You are the devil.
Projection becomes you.
Matthew Alexander
Man) wrote:
>ma...@see.sig.for.email.com (Matthew Alexander) wrote in message news:<3fe54696...@news.concentric.net>...
>> On 18 Dec 2003 00:01:24 -0800, Hither...@msn.com (The Nice Mean
>> Man) wrote:
>>
>> > He was generalizing the concept of God's original intentions for the
>> >human family when being questioned on the subject of divorce. And He
>> >reached back into scripture just like He always did. Just like He
>> >commands Me to do...
>>
>> God also commanded you to love your enemies. We can all see how well
>> that's working out...
>
>There is a point where "loving your enemies" and "turning the other
>cheek" crosses over into "Cast not your pearls before the swine lest
>they turn and attack you" territory.
And exactly which category does wishing pain and damnation on those
who disagree with you count as?
>The problem with most
>simple-simon blank-eyed fools like you is that you don't know the
>limits of that distinction. Pray about it. Ask God for wisdom of
>discernment. He will give it to you if you ask.
Oh, trust me, I have. For many years I strugged with reconciling an
all-loving and all-redeeming God with the brutally medieval stupidity
of those who most loudly claim to speak for Him. And what I learned is
this: Religion and it's trappings are like a finger that points to the
divine. Fundimentalists are those who are willing to fight, kill and
die arguing over the specific color and characteristics of that
finger.
> Do it soon before
>these people ruin the world for you.
> Let me guess... you're one of.... 'these people'.
I really do pity you.
Crowfoot
> > > Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner,
> > > giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh,
> > > are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal
> > > fire.
> >
> > Woah, "strange flesh?" That sounds like space aliens, or maybe girls
> > from the next valley over (given the scale of life in Biblical times),
> > or maybe even, um, goats. Why conclude that "strange flesh" = people
> > of
> > the same sex as the people involved? Is it elucidated thus elsewhere
> > in
> > the text? For that matter, "going after strange flesh" could mean
> > hunting peculiar animals, or maybe other people. "Fornication" is
> > pretty clear, but "going after strange flesh" is not a very specific
> > description. Anybody have a more accurate translation to cite?
> >
> > C.
>
> Well, the men of Sodom tried to rape God's very own angles. Angles in
> male form. You figure it out, nimrod.
I'm waiting to hear from someone with some knowledge about the original
terms and the translation, thanks. Got qualifications?
C.
--
Crow
Sister Lurlean Tucker
> In alt.politics.homosexuality The Nice Mean Man <Hither...@msn.com> wrote:
> > It will be a pleasure to watch you roast in hell, evil sodomite. A
> > wonderful granted pleasure.
You musta rubbed him the wrong way HUH Curt? How do you all know who
to target for recruitment? My mama told me once that most homo men
get their teeth knocked out eventually on account of they always try
to proposition some straight man that ain't interested.
> Hmm. Is this that Christian piety and love which I keep hearing about?
Hey - I pray for you all the time and what do you do but make fun of
me and post my preaching on your filthy threads completely out of
context and with sarcastic little comments too. At least you're more
creative than Bull Spreader. He's always a taking my plain truth and
a calling it a lie. I think the Bible covers my position pretty
carefully in Romans 1:9 "I say the truth in Christ, I lie not!"
And as far as Christians a being all pious and loving, we are! But
you got to realize that evil people is always a persecuting us and
making life hard for us. Just look how you persecute me and my
husband. What did either of us ever do to you? We wanna RESCUE you
from that wicked fairy go round you've been a riding on with your old
boy friend for God only knows how long. Ain't you all a getting DIZZY
yet from all that spinning around and around in SIN all the time? I
think it would give me vertigo and just plain make me puke to be in
your position. And didn't you say your butt was sore a lot? I guess
that makes you the bottom boy HUH? Oh I'm just a standing here a
reeling in shame to think of the vile ABOMINATIONS you all commit.
Why can't you all just stop with the sodomy and the gomorramy and just
LAY OFF? Why are your dirty sex urges so important to you? They
can't possibly bring you that much pleasure? Come out of him Satan -
COME OUT OF HIM and LET HIM BE! Come out of his BUTT Satan and stop
afflicting his prostrate gland with WEIRD sensations. I bind you in
the name of Christ now - Amen!
I'm a gonna go to church now and pray for a deliverance for you Curt.
You have been blinded by the devil and can't see how much good us true
Christians is a doing for you all the time.
In Jesus' Name,
Sister Lurlean TRUTH
God's Little Guitar Playing Preacher Girl
Bill Baker
Tucker) lied in message
news:<7908c278.03121...@posting.google.com>:
> curtsybear <Cur...@Sieber.com> wrote in message
> news:<brv4to$7qn98$2...@ID-75234.news.uni-berlin.de>...
>
>> In alt.politics.homosexuality The Nice Mean Man <Hither...@msn.com>
>> wrote:
>
>> > It will be a pleasure to watch you roast in hell, evil sodomite. A
>> > wonderful granted pleasure.
>
> You musta rubbed him the wrong way HUH Curt?
That was Brent Norman that he was saying that to.
> How do you all know who to target for recruitment?
Easy. Just look for people who are already gay.
> My mama told me once that most homo men get their teeth knocked out
> eventually on account of they always try to proposition some straight
> man that ain't interested.
Your mama was lying. ALL gay men that I know have all of their teeth.
>> Hmm. Is this that Christian piety and love which I keep hearing about?
>
> Hey - I pray for you all the time and what do you do but make fun of me
> and post my preaching on your filthy threads completely out of context
> and with sarcastic little comments too.
Just like you deserve.
> At least you're more creative than Bull Spreader.
You must be talking about yourself, here. You certainly spread a lot of
bull.
> He's always a taking my plain truth and a calling it a lie.
Because it is.
> I think the Bible covers my position pretty carefully in Romans 1:9 "I
> say the truth in Christ, I lie not!"
Quote the Bible until your blue in the face, toots. You're just
convincing me even more that you're a hateful liar.
> And as far as Christians a being all pious and loving, we are!
In case you couldn't tell, curtsybear was being sarcastic. I know you
have a real problem telling when someone is being sarcastic, but do try to
keep up.
> But you got to realize that evil people is always a persecuting us and
> making life hard for us.
You make life hard for yourself. You have only yourself to blame.
> Just look how you persecute me and my husband.
Just look how the persecutor loves to play victim by calling herself
persecuted when the people she persecutes defend themselves.
> What did either of us ever do to you?
If you really don't know, you really are stupid.
> We wanna RESCUE you from that wicked fairy go round you've been a riding
> on with your old boy friend for God only knows how long. Ain't you all
> a getting DIZZY yet from all that spinning around and around in SIN all
> the time? I think it would give me vertigo and just plain make me puke
> to be in your position. And didn't you say your butt was sore a lot? I
> guess that makes you the bottom boy HUH? Oh I'm just a standing here a
> reeling in shame to think of the vile ABOMINATIONS you all commit.
So don't think about them.
> Why can't you all just stop with the sodomy and the gomorramy and just
> LAY OFF? Why are your dirty sex urges so important to you?
Why do you think anyone but you thinks they're so important? Is it
because they're so important to you? Or is it because you can't stand to
see people having fun?
> They can't possibly bring you that much pleasure?
And how would you know this?
> Come out of him Satan - COME OUT OF HIM and LET HIM BE! Come out of his
> BUTT Satan and stop afflicting his prostrate gland with WEIRD
> sensations. I bind you in the name of Christ now - Amen!
LOL! You and your delusions!
> I'm a gonna go to church now and pray for a deliverance for you Curt.
I've never seen the movie, myself, but maybe he'll enjoy it.
> You have been blinded by the devil and can't see how much good us true
> Christians is a doing for you all the time.
>
> In Jesus' Name,
>
>
> Sister Lurlean TRUTH
Right at home with big guys named Tiny and fat guys named Slim.
> God's Little Guitar Playing Preacher Girl
--
Lurlean Lie #5:
He goes to orgy's with five other men all the time and after they get thru
screwing around they sit around in their hot tub talking about ways to hurt me.
news:7908c278.03101...@posting.google.com
The Nice Mean Man
You judge yourselves with your wicked perversion of the gospel. You
bend every scripture that speaks of homosexuality to your use, but you
cannot produce ONE that speaks positively of it. Now, if you have to
bend and twist I don't know how many scriptures to make your lifestyle
seem acceptable, there's something wrong with this picture. One or
two, maybe. Maybe you'd have a point that the rest of the WHOLE ENTIRE
FUCKIN' WORLD is missing. But I can think of at least ten that you
have to wrap into a slimy curve. I mean, really! I thought the
Jehovah's Witnesses were bad!
But speaking of passing judgment, you claim to be part of the body.
Therefore we CAN judge you by your actions. In fact, Paul commands the
congregation of one of his churches to cast a member out who was
openly sinning. Out to let satan deal with him until he saw the error
of his ways. We cannot judge THE WORLD. But because you say you
believe, we can and will judge YOU.
Dig that, dick-suckin' daddy.
The Nice Mean Man
"He created them MALE and FEMALE", the Good book says. I guess I
MISUNDERSTOOD this one, right? I was thinking totally physical, male
and female speaking. But what God really must have meant was something
else. Like maybe male and female in heart and soul only?? Are you the
feminine type of gay-boy or the masculine one..?!
Does everything fit better now...? Thanks for straightening me out on
the meaning of that one, Brent
The Nice Mean Man
You're looking at it all wrong. Something is only strange when it
deviates from the norm. Like it did in your case. God created men and
women to be together, Brent. Therefore, heterosexuality is of the same
nature, form, class, kind... the same. This is the way of nature,
Brent. I didn't design the world.. God did. "And He created them Male
& Female". That is normal. That is good. This is 'same-flesh'. You
just see it inside out because you live your entire life inside out,
Brent! Heterosexuality is the way of the world. There is no such thing
as 'strange flesh' between a man and a woman. If it were true, you
wouldn't be here!
And why would Jude feel the need to even mention 'strange' to start
with? Heterosexuality was and is the norm. Do you think he did it to
tell us that these people were wrong to go after members of the
opposite sex? Why would he go out of his way to say that, Bent...?
Why?
The Nice Mean Man
deviates from the norm. Like it did in your case. God created men and
women to be together, Brent. Therefore, heterosexuality is of the same
nature, form, class, kind... the same. This is the way of nature,
Brent. I didn't design the world.. God did. "And He created them Male
just see it inside out because you live your entire life inside out,
Brent! Heterosexuality is the way of the world. There is no such thing
as 'strange flesh' between a man and a woman. If it were true, you
wouldn't be here!
And why would Jude feel the need to even mention 'strange' to start
Do you think he did it to tell us that these people were wrong to go
most-likely be doing anyway? Why would he go out of his way to say
that, Bent...? Why?
The Nice Mean Man
Read the Word, idiot. It's all right there. You can't dig it because
you just don't want to know. Might up-set your apple cart.
Brent Norman
> nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > Hither...@msn.com (The Nice Mean Man) wrote in message news:<19f5d6de.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > > nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.0312...@posting.google.com>...
> > > > "Lizzie" <liz_br...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message news:<gIcEb.2217$tQ6....@wards.force9.net>...
>
> > > Watch the devil twist the truth! Twist it, baby... Twist it until it
> > > fits around your own personal little sin that you're so in love with.
> > > The only problem is, Now, you'll have to get God to buy it.
> > > It will be a pleasure to watch you roast in hell, evil sodomite. A
> > > wonderful granted pleasure. For we WILL see the reward of the
> > > wicked...
> > >
> > > "The Lord rebuke you, satan"
> >
> >
> > Likewise to you. It is the homo-haters that have twisted the truth.
> > Twisted it until it fits around your own personal disgusting hatred
> > that you're so in love with. The only problem is, Now, YOU'LL have to
> > get God to buy it.
> >
> > It won't be a pleasure for me to watch you roast in hell, evil liar.
> > A terrible thing. For I DON'T want to see the reward that is waiting
> > for the wicked, unlike you.
> >
> > "The Lord rebuke you, satan"
> >
> > ""...when you judge others, you have no excuse, WHOEVER YOU ARE, when
> > you judge others; for in passing judgement on another, you condemn
> > yourself..."
>
> You judge yourselves with your wicked perversion of the gospel. You
> bend every scripture that speaks of homosexuality to your use,
You judge homosexuals on your wicked perversion of gospel. You bend
every scripture that could possibly be interpreted as homosexuality to
your own use.
> but you
> cannot produce ONE that speaks positively of it. Now, if you have to
> bend and twist I don't know how many scriptures to make your lifestyle
> seem acceptable, there's something wrong with this picture. One or
> two, maybe. Maybe you'd have a point that the rest of the WHOLE ENTIRE
> FUCKIN' WORLD is missing.
By reading the Bible with hatred in your heart, you become a victim of
simplistic interpretations, based on inaccurate vocabulary, and use it
to suit your own use.
> But I can think of at least ten that you
> have to wrap into a slimy curve. I mean, really! I thought the
> Jehovah's Witnesses were bad!
>
Go on, I'd like to see how well they hold up to scrutiny. Most of
your arguments are covered in a veneer of logic, but upon closer
scrutiny, they fall apart like an onion.
>
> But speaking of passing judgment, you claim to be part of the body.
> Therefore we CAN judge you by your actions. In fact, Paul commands the
> congregation of one of his churches to cast a member out who was
> openly sinning. Out to let satan deal with him until he saw the error
> of his ways. We cannot judge THE WORLD. But because you say you
> believe, we can and will judge YOU.
No.
> Dig that, dick-suckin' daddy.
Wouldn't you like to know, but I won't give you the satisfaction of
that...
Brent Norman
> nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > Hither...@msn.com (The Nice Mean Man) wrote in message news:<19f5d6de.03121...@posting.google.com>...
> > > nellig...@hotmail.com (Brent Norman) wrote in message news:<a7ad4b4f.0312...@posting.google.com>...
> > > > "Lizzie" <liz_br...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote in message news:<gIcEb.2217$tQ6....@wards.force9.net>...
>
> > > Watch the devil twist the truth! Twist it, baby... Twist it until it
> > > fits around your own personal little sin that you're so in love with.
> > > The only problem is, Now, you'll have to get God to buy it.
> > > It will be a pleasure to watch you roast in hell, evil sodomite. A
> > > wonderful granted pleasure. For we WILL see the reward of the
> > > wicked...
> > >
> > > "The Lord rebuke you, satan"
> >
> >
> > Likewise to you. It is the homo-haters that have twisted the truth.
> > Twisted it until it fits around your own personal disgusting hatred
> > that you're so in love with. The only problem is, Now, YOU'LL have to
> > get God to buy it.
> >
> > It won't be a pleasure for me to watch you roast in hell, evil liar.
> > A terrible thing. For I DON'T want to see the reward that is waiting
> > for the wicked, unlike you.
> >
> > "The Lord rebuke you, satan"
> >
> > ""...when you judge others, you have no excuse, WHOEVER YOU ARE, when
> > you judge others; for in passing judgement on another, you condemn
> > yourself..."
>
> You judge yourselves with your wicked perversion of the gospel. You
> bend every scripture that speaks of homosexuality to your use,
You judge homosexuals on your wicked perversion of gospel. You bend
every scripture that could possibly be interpreted as homosexuality to
your own use.
> but you
> cannot produce ONE that speaks positively of it. Now, if you have to
> bend and twist I don't know how many scriptures to make your lifestyle
> seem acceptable, there's something wrong with this picture. One or
> two, maybe. Maybe you'd have a point that the rest of the WHOLE ENTIRE
> FUCKIN' WORLD is missing.
By reading the Bible with hatred in your heart, you become a victim of
simplistic interpretations, based on inaccurate vocabulary, and use it
to suit your own use.
> But I can think of at least ten that you
> have to wrap into a slimy curve. I mean, really! I thought the
> Jehovah's Witnesses were bad!
>
Go on, I'd like to see how well they hold up to scrutiny. Most of
your arguments are covered in a veneer of logic, but upon closer
scrutiny, they fall apart like an onion.
>
> But speaking of passing judgment, you claim to be part of the body.
> Therefore we CAN judge you by your actions. In fact, Paul commands the
> congregation of one of his churches to cast a member out who was
> openly sinning. Out to let satan deal with him until he saw the error
> of his ways. We cannot judge THE WORLD. But because you say you
> believe, we can and will judge YOU.
No.
Brent Norman
He did create male and female. But at the same time, while He holds
up the mainstream example there, the absence of mentioning other
possibilities does not negate their validity or existence. It would
be like saying that "traffic lights control the flow of traffic,
that's what they do".. But that doesn't mean that stop signs, yield
signs or traffic cops are not valid.
No one alive today can truly know what was the intent, especially when
not referring to source, only take educated guesses based on
inferences, culture and context.
Brent Norman
"Different" was translated as "strange".
> Like it did in your case. God created men and
> women to be together, Brent. Therefore, heterosexuality is of the same
> nature, form, class, kind... the same.
> This is the way of nature,
> Brent. I didn't design the world.. God did. "And He created them Male
> & Female". That is normal. That is good. That is 'same-flesh'. You
> just see it inside out because you live your entire life inside out,
> Brent! Heterosexuality is the way of the world. There is no such thing
> as 'strange flesh' between a man and a woman.
Wouldn't "same flesh" imply "human flesh", Flesh that is the same as
his own.
"different flesh" would imply something that is not of humans.
> If it were true, you
> wouldn't be here!
> And why would Jude feel the need to even mention 'strange' to start
> with if your version is correct?
> Heterosexuality was and is the norm.
No one denies that. Most people are heterosexual. If your definition
of normal means "majority", then I wholeheartedly agree with you.
I believe that "normal" is not an absolute term. Norma is differnt
things to different people. For a heterosexual to engage in
homosexual behaviour would be abnormal. For someone who is a
vegetarian, eating meat would be abnormal.
Romantic and sexual attraction to the same sex is a normal orientation
for homosexuals. Plain and simple.
> Do you think he did it to tell us that these people were wrong to go
> after members of the opposite sex... when that's what they would
> most-likely be doing anyway? Why would he go out of his way to say
> that, Bent...? Why?
No, they are going after "different" flesh. What that means exactly
in today's terms is largely lost, but most certainly related to
idolatry.
Brent Norman
"Different" was translated as "strange".
> Like it did in your case. God created men and
> women to be together, Brent. Therefore, heterosexuality is of the same
> nature, form, class, kind... the same.
> This is the way of nature,
> Brent. I didn't design the world.. God did. "And He created them Male
> & Female". That is normal. That is good. That is 'same-flesh'. You
> just see it inside out because you live your entire life inside out,
> Brent! Heterosexuality is the way of the world. There is no such thing
> as 'strange flesh' between a man and a woman.
Wouldn't "same flesh" imply "human flesh", Flesh that is the same as
his own.
"different flesh" would imply something that is not of humans.
> If it were true, you
> wouldn't be here!
> And why would Jude feel the need to even mention 'strange' to start
> with if your version is correct?
> Heterosexuality was and is the norm.
No one denies that. Most people are heterosexual. If your definition
of normal means "majority", then I wholeheartedly agree with you.
I believe that "normal" is not an absolute term. Norma is differnt
things to different people. For a heterosexual to engage in
homosexual behaviour would be abnormal. For someone who is a
vegetarian, eating meat would be abnormal.
Romantic and sexual attraction to the same sex is a normal orientation
for homosexuals. Plain and simple.
> Do you think he did it to tell us that these people were wrong to go
> after members of the opposite sex... when that's what they would
> most-likely be doing anyway? Why would he go out of his way to say
> that, Bent...? Why?