Kittens & Alligators...
there's a lot of innocent people being crucified
cruelty for trying to feed a kitten to an alligator (the kitten survived).
Now I just love cats, but I can't see what would be illegal about this,
or what is particularly "cruel" about it. I have a pet gopher snake and
every week or two he gets a meal of 6 or so live adult mice. Why is it
okay to feed live mice but not live cats to reptiles?
Similarly, my state legislature was recently busy trying to draft laws
that would ban slaughtering horses for human consumption. I like
horses just fine, but don't see what the difference is between a horse
and a cow that horses should be protected from being eaten. Keep in
mind that there was never any attempt to ban slaughtering horses for
ANIMAL consumption (e.g. dog food), it was the fact that PEOPLE were
eating them that made the act of slaughtering them "cruel." Just the
other day the newspaper was reporting how a bunch of animal rights
nazis were opposing a plan to send old horses to slaughterhouses,
the activists argued that the horses should be "humanely" euthanized
and given proper burials (!) - apparently that isn't cruel but
eating the flesh of that same dead horse is cruel. Oh, and the U.S.
Congress just proposed a bill that would prohibit federal
inspection of horse meat, essentially making the meat unsellable
in the U.S. market even if the actual slaughter of horses remains
legal.
My question is whether an animal's protected status is based on any
criteria other than its cuteness. Kittens are cuter than mice,
therefore they can't be food for hungry reptiles, while mice aren't
quite so cute so therefore you can feed as many of them as you want
to reptiles.
GreyWyvern
alt.pets.cats,rec.pets.herp,alt.pets.mice:
> Just the
> other day the newspaper was reporting how a bunch of animal rights
> nazis were opposing a plan to send old horses to slaughterhouses,
> the activists argued that the horses should be "humanely" euthanized
> and given proper burials (!)
You know who should be euthanized? PETA, that's who. My parents
immigrated to Canada from the Netherlands, and as such I'm used to many
Dutch foods. One of them is horse meat. There is no difference between
horses and other food animals besides the fact that we ride some of them,
and bet on them at the race track.
But most of us westerners have the prejudice, if you really think about
it. Would you eat dog meat? Would you allow dog meat to become a
federally regulated meat source for human consumption? Other cultures
allow it, why not western cultures? Is it because they're relatively
intelligent compared to other animals? If so, studies have shown that
many breeds of pigs are even smarter than dogs, yet we still eat bacon
each morning...
> My question is whether an animal's protected status is based on any
> criteria other than its cuteness.
You're wording is wrong here. There's a difference between "protected
status" and "harvestable status". If a species is granted "protected
status", it's usually because their numbers have dropped dangerously low.
In this case, cuteness is only a factor in getting the existing protection
known by the public.
OTOH, "harvestable" is based pretty much entirely on "cuteness" and
cultural prejudices. "Harvestable" can have several meanings: for food,
as food for other animals, for resources, etc. However, if a species is
cute, you'll hear the outcry.
For instance, up north seals are a plague on fisheries, especially Native
American fisheries which don't have the equipment the big boys do. Seals
are by no means endangered, they're actually over plentiful, having very
few natural predators. As well, full grown seals aren't very attractive:
big tubs of blubber ungainly hauling themselves across the ice.
Unfortunately, their young are outrageously cute "li'l white furballs",
and just a few videos of fishermen clubbing them is all it takes to pull
at heartstrings everywhere.
In some prairie states in the US, it's legal to hunt gophers for sport
because they multiply so quickly and are a danger to crops and livestock.
It's a seasonal thing, usually starting in the spring, IIRC. Every year,
there's also the regular outcry of people who have only just heard of the
practice... and those gophers are cute!
<http://www.pestworldforkids.org/images/gopher.jpg> OMG, how could you
shoot them??? :P
The same sort of thing goes on in Australia AFAIK. Just ask any
Austrailian about rabbits.
Grey
--
The technical axiom that nothing is impossible sinisterly implies the
pitfall corollary that nothing is ridiculous.
- http://www.greywyvern.com/ringmaker - Orca Ringmaker: Host a web ring
from your website!
Ulrik Smed
> But most of us westerners have the prejudice, if you really
> think about it. Would you eat dog meat? Would you allow dog
> meat to become a federally regulated meat source for human
> consumption?
I wouldn't like it. Hurts peoples' feelings too much.
--
Ulrik Smed
Aarhus, Denmark
Jason and Holly Harper
came across an alligator, but it sure doesn't seem like it should be legal
to feed gators period. As for the live mice that you feed your snake, I'm a
rat owner, and I do understand the food chain, but I do prefer people to
feed pre-killed rodents. Safer for the snake. In fact I believe it's
illegal in some places to feed live rodents. Now for me, it would be a
personal preference I'd rather see a snake eat a dead mouse than a live one.
It would just bother me too much. But that's another discussion I suppose.
;-) FWIW, I don't think slaughtering horses for meat is cruel either. Do I
support it and would I eat it? No. But if it's done humanely then what
would be cruel about it?
Holly
"there's a lot of innocent people being crucified" <squ...@family.org>
wrote in message
news:qNhue.10085$VK4....@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
JohnnyMrNinja
I think mice are far cuter than kittens, and stay cute their whole
lives. And baby cows compared to baby horses? No contest!
If you had to feed gators, domestic chickens have been bred to the
point of retardation. A "chicken with it's head cut off" will still
run around because the body doesn't use the brain all that much. This
would be a far better idea than a kitten.
Personally, I don't think murder of any kind is justifiable for the
sake of food preference, horse, cow, kitten whatever. So, yeah, ban all
the animals they can.
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
news:81mue.905$S17.1...@monger.newsread.com...
> Well now I could see if maybe a kitten was just wandering around a swamp
and
> came across an alligator, but it sure doesn't seem like it should be legal
> to feed gators period. As for the live mice that you feed your snake, I'm
a
> rat owner, and I do understand the food chain, but I do prefer people to
> feed pre-killed rodents. Safer for the snake. In fact I believe it's
> illegal in some places to feed live rodents. Now for me, it would be a
> personal preference I'd rather see a snake eat a dead mouse than a live
one.
> It would just bother me too much. But that's another discussion I
suppose.
> ;-) FWIW, I don't think slaughtering horses for meat is cruel either. Do
I
> support it and would I eat it? No. But if it's done humanely then what
> would be cruel about it?
>
> Holly
It is NOT done humanely.
http://www.sharkonline.org/horseslaughter.mv (Go to bottom and watch each
video... if you can)
http://www.slaughterhallofshame.com/shame/modules.php?name=Surveys&op=results&pollID=2
<--- :o))))
--
·.·´¨ ¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
Laurie
((¸¸.·´ ..·´
-:¦:- ((¸¸ ·.·
*~*LiveLoveLaugh*~* Aloha!!!!!
"There is no remedy for love but to love more"...
~~Henry David Thoreau
GreyWyvern
alt.pets.cats,rec.pets.herp,alt.pets.mice:
> It is NOT done humanely.
>
> [snip incendiary propaganda]
Ho ho ho. You can't just toss around a few websites and videos and by
that accuse the entire industry. Certainly there are "rogue"
slaughterhouses out there which do the same to cows, pigs, etc. All of
this is under regulation and they *will* be charged, no matter *what*
animal they do this sort of thing to.
Did you know that pigs slaughtered under stress ruin the taste of the
meat? It's true, adrenal-like activators released into their bloodstream
make them taste horrible. And most certainly mechanical damage such as
bruising or injury can easily become the difference between a porterhouse
steak and stewing meat. Here's something to get through that thickened
PETA clouded skull of yours:
It is to a distributor's *benefit* that animals are slaughtered as
painlessly and stress-lessly as possible. Bruising during falls, damage
via injury, or chemical change via stress-related hormones *decrease* the
quality of any meat they may acquire from the carcass. Decreased quality
translates to decreased profit margin.
But you have fun showing everyone your videos. Sadly, most people will
believe this sort of thing happens everywhere. I do have one question for
you though... have *you* ever visited a commercial slaughterhouse? I mean
you *personally*, not something you heard from a "friend" or watched on a
documentary. Until you have, I can honestly say you know *less* than
nothing about the industry.
JohnnyMrNinja
So, at the humane ones, they don't kill the animals? Good to know!
At the less humane ones, what criteria is used to judge the animal
worthy of death? Are these murderous cows? Criminally insane? Or
perhaps they volunteer?
Given that you believe animals should be murdered so that you don't
have to eat soy products (not a judgement, tofu sure is gross), do you
believe that you are above this? What gives you this power of death? Is
it that you can type (very well by the way!)? If someone slaughtered
you in a very humane way and sold your anus to McDonalds would this be
within your scheme of things?
If you have any footage of these humane slaughterhouses (pigs signing
waivers, etc.) then please post them up! Until then might I suggest
http://www.PETATV.com ?
And have fun eating those dogs!
David J. Grimshaw
"I figured if humonoids ate chicken, then obviously they eat other
humonoids. Otherwise they're just picking on the chickens." Kryten, Red
Dwarf
GreyWyvern
alt.pets.cats,rec.pets.herp,alt.pets.mice:
> Given that you believe animals should be murdered so that you don't
> have to eat soy products (not a judgement, tofu sure is gross), do you
> believe that you are above this? What gives you this power of death? Is
> it that you can type (very well by the way!)? If someone slaughtered
> you in a very humane way and sold your anus to McDonalds would this be
> within your scheme of things?
There is a difference between simply arguing over whether or not animals
are slaughtered (terribly *loaded* word BTW) humanely and taking it to the
next philosophical level and asking if what separates humans from animals
is justification for whatever use we put them to.
Frankly, I don't want to get into the latter, because then it's just a big
question of ethics and whose moral high-horse is higher than whose.
Suffice it to say, in a modern slaughterhouse (if you've ever visited one)
care *is* taken to prevent injury and stress before death - unlike what
every sensationalist PETA video would have you believe. Sure, we still
*kill* them; are we "morally" right to do so? That's not the question I'm
trying to answer.
Thanks for the props though.
JohnnyMrNinja
Well played, GreyWyvern, well played.
I think it's understandable that
> You know who should be euthanized? PETA, that's who.
and
> Here's something to get through that thickened PETA clouded skull of yours:
have an air of "What? You gonna *bring* it, boy?" But you've steered it
back and that is commendable. Now, for an actual discussion:
I think there's a good chance of privately-owned slaughterhouses being
very humane, for the reasons you mention, and as the fewer animals and
people involved is more humanizing.
But I doubt there is any large-scale meat-producing facility that isn't
cruel on a regular basis. The people who don't care about Porterhouse
and are aiming for "100% beef", at reasonable prices. Did you know that
McDonalds is the #1 buyer of cow eyes in the country? Still beef. The
average customer on the average day doesn't care about quality, just
convinience.
All this in addition to the fact that America is being taken over by
consolidation, huge companies push little producers out of business,
and killing gets a lot less humane.
I certainly do not deny that large companies may exist that actually
care about the animal's stress (if only for quality), I just sincerly
doubt this is the norm.
And, so that you realize that I am acting mature now, I'd like to point
out:
> Frankly, I don't want to get into the latter, because then it's just a big
> question of ethics and whose moral high-horse is higher than whose.
In the current conversation, maybe not the best choice of words, and
that's all I'll say.
David J. Grimshaw
"If a tree falls in the forest, look out!"
GreyWyvern
alt.pets.cats,rec.pets.herp,alt.pets.mice:
> But I doubt there is any large-scale meat-producing facility that isn't
> cruel on a regular basis. The people who don't care about Porterhouse
> and are aiming for "100% beef", at reasonable prices. Did you know that
> McDonalds is the #1 buyer of cow eyes in the country? Still beef. The
> average customer on the average day doesn't care about quality, just
> convinience.
You should visit an actual commercial slaughterhouse sometime. Most of
them actually give tours if you ask, mainly because they are eager to
dispel the PETA paradigm. It might actually be an... eye-opener *wink*
*wink*.
BTW, just because McDonalds buys cow eyes (and I'm just going on your
say-so that they *do*), doesn't mean the cows were slaughtered in an
inhumane fashion. Personally, meat is meat to me, as long as it came from
a clean and humanely processed source. What's your "beef" with cow eyes
anyway? Haven't you ever watched Fear Factor? :D
> All this in addition to the fact that America is being taken over by
> consolidation, huge companies push little producers out of business,
> and killing gets a lot less humane.
I fail to see how the former automatically causes the latter just because
you say it does.
> I certainly do not deny that large companies may exist that actually
> care about the animal's stress (if only for quality), I just sincerly
> doubt this is the norm.
Once again, if in doubt, visit your local slaughterhouse and be
enlightened.
> And, so that you realize that I am acting mature now, I'd like to point
> out:
>> Frankly, I don't want to get into the latter, because then it's just a
>> big
>> question of ethics and whose moral high-horse is higher than whose.
>
> In the current conversation, maybe not the best choice of words, and
> that's all I'll say.
What else can I say? Even *I* didn't catch that as I typed. LOL :)
Grey
JohnnyMrNinja
> BTW, just because McDonalds buys cow eyes (and I'm just going on your
> say-so that they *do*), doesn't mean the cows were slaughtered in an
> inhumane fashion. Personally, meat is meat to me, as long as it came from
> a clean and humanely processed source. What's your "beef" with cow eyes
> anyway? Haven't you ever watched Fear Factor? :D
My sister worked at In & Out Burger, and she was filled with all sorts
of disturbing McDonalds facts (they're very big on qulity there, to the
point where nothing tastes good). This was direct reference to the idea
that a stress-free death improves quality, I'm just assuming that
suppliers of Grade D beef don't care too much about the quality.
But I don't disagree with the eye thing, it's meat that would otherwise
not be used (or at least not for people).
> > All this in addition to the fact that America is being taken over by
> > consolidation, huge companies push little producers out of business,
> > and killing gets a lot less humane.
>
> I fail to see how the former automatically causes the latter just because
> you say it does.
www.petatv.com has culprits like Tyson and KFC. Again, not known for
quality. And again an assumption, that the further away a CEO gets from
the actual killing the less he's going to care about how humane it is.
> > I certainly do not deny that large companies may exist that actually
> > care about the animal's stress (if only for quality), I just sincerly
> > doubt this is the norm.
>
> Once again, if in doubt, visit your local slaughterhouse and be
> enlightened.
But certainly a local slaughterhouse isn't where the majority of beef
is produced? Like I've said, a local slaughterhouse is likely to be far
more humane than one in Texas back-country, or one in an illegally
deforested area of Brasil.
David J. Grimshaw
"Making the world safe for hypocrisy"
GreyWyvern
alt.pets.cats,rec.pets.herp,alt.pets.mice:
> GreyWyvern wrote:
>
>> Once again, if in doubt, visit your local slaughterhouse and be
>> enlightened.
>
> But certainly a local slaughterhouse isn't where the majority of beef
> is produced? Like I've said, a local slaughterhouse is likely to be far
> more humane than one in Texas back-country
The distribution of meat products in North America is a highly regulated
industry. Don't go making it sound like some terrible black-market
secret. If you slaughter and sell meat, your business and what it
produces is going to be federally inspected, like it or not.
But about being "local"... true, that's my pre-suppositions talking. I
live right near Toronto, in Canada, so all the "local" slaughterhouses are
*big* ones. ;) Mostly it's pigs around here though, as opposed to beef.
> or one in an illegally
> deforested area of Brasil.
Now there's a grey area. Although I'm *quite* sure that any imported beef
must also be federally inspected, the same as domestic. Got any stories
to back that claim up?
Grey
BTW, this thread is making me hungry :(
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
news:1119550696.5...@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
> >
> > --
> > The technical axiom that nothing is impossible sinisterly implies the
> > pitfall corollary that nothing is ridiculous.
> > - http://www.greywyvern.com/ringmaker - Orca Ringmaker: Host a web ring
> > from your website!
>
> So, at the humane ones, they don't kill the animals? Good to know!
>
> At the less humane ones, what criteria is used to judge the animal
> worthy of death? Are these murderous cows? Criminally insane? Or
> perhaps they volunteer?
>
> Given that you believe animals should be murdered so that you don't
> have to eat soy products (not a judgement, tofu sure is gross), do you
> believe that you are above this? What gives you this power of death? Is
> it that you can type (very well by the way!)? If someone slaughtered
> you in a very humane way and sold your anus to McDonalds would this be
> within your scheme of things?
>
> If you have any footage of these humane slaughterhouses (pigs signing
> waivers, etc.) then please post them up! Until then might I suggest
> http://www.PETATV.com ?
>
> And have fun eating those dogs!
Replying to internet ninnies is such a waste of time. Am I a PETA person?
Well, yes and no. I detest inhumane of any creature, but I eat beef, pork,
chicken, fish, etc. Would I *try* horse in another country? No f*cking
way. And I don't "try" veal either. (No lamb!)
As far as the reality of what happens to cows and pigs, I know humane from
inhumane. I went to a slaughterhouse on a field trip for science in the 4th
grade. (The teacher must've been really messed up to have done this).
However, when I lived in Washington state, I worked at a beef slaughterhouse
(in the cafeteria, taking money for lunch). Did I like it? Hell no, but I
bought a corvette when I was 18 and had to make ends meet as I was living on
my own by then. So Grey-Cluelessfuck, put that in your not-so-intelligent
pipe and smoke it.
And no, I wouldn't bash in a monkey's brain because it's an expensive
delicatessen in some countries. For God's sake, that is really f*cked up.
Watch a live mouse be eaten by a snake? No way in hell. Eat snake? Ewww!!
No!!
--
·.·´¨ ¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
Laurie
((¸¸.·´ ..·´
-:¦:- ((¸¸ ·.·
*~*LiveLoveLaugh*~* Aloha!!!!!
"There is no remedy for love but to love more"...
~~Henry David Thoreau
>
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
news:op.ssubh...@news.nas.net...
> And lo, JohnnyMrNinja didst speak in
> alt.pets.cats,rec.pets.herp,alt.pets.mice:
>
> > GreyWyvern wrote:
> >
> >> Once again, if in doubt, visit your local slaughterhouse and be
> >> enlightened.
> >
> > But certainly a local slaughterhouse isn't where the majority of beef
> > is produced? Like I've said, a local slaughterhouse is likely to be far
> > more humane than one in Texas back-country
>
> The distribution of meat products in North America is a highly regulated
> industry. Don't go making it sound like some terrible black-market
> secret. If you slaughter and sell meat, your business and what it
> produces is going to be federally inspected, like it or not.
>
> But about being "local"... true, that's my pre-suppositions talking. I
> live right near Toronto, in Canada, so all the "local" slaughterhouses are
> *big* ones. ;) Mostly it's pigs around here though, as opposed to beef.
>
> > or one in an illegally
> > deforested area of Brasil.
>
> Now there's a grey area. Although I'm *quite* sure that any imported beef
> must also be federally inspected, the same as domestic. Got any stories
> to back that claim up?
>
> Grey
>
> BTW, this thread is making me hungry :(
It is rather comical at this point. Agree to disagree or type all night.
What's so funny? Burgers are done... gotta go eat.
(And I live on a street that has the color Grey in it.) If you weren't such
a wanker, I'd actually like you for the co-inky-dink of things.
--
·.·´¨ ¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
me
GreyWyvern
I really don't know what you're smoking, but... lots of luck.
Grey
GreyWyvern
<Nob...@myjunkaddy.com> wrote:
> It is rather comical at this point. Agree to disagree or type all night.
> What's so funny? Burgers are done... gotta go eat.
> (And I live on a street that has the color Grey in it.) If you weren't
> such
> a wanker, I'd actually like you for the co-inky-dink of things.
Not like me? For not being all up-in-arms about the supposed inhumane
treatment of animals in slaughterhouses? Don't be so droll.
Enjoy that burger.
Grey
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
I just did!! <sigh> I never get a whole one w/two doggies that happen to
life beef too. (Or maybe it's just the way hubby cooks them?)
Time to do dishes.....................
--
·.·´¨ ¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
Laurie
((¸¸.·´ ..·´
-:¦:- ((¸¸ ·.·
*~*LiveLoveLaugh*~* Aloha!!!!!
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
LOL... I just quit four verrrRRRyyyy loooOOOooong days ago:
Quit meter says:
I have been a quitter for 4 Days, 20 hours, 22 minutes and 27 seconds (4
days). I have saved $18.41 by not smoking 67 cigarettes. I have saved 5
hours and 35 minutes of my life. My Quit Date: 6/18/2005 11:15 PM.
Hence the grumpiness that can come and go in .0000002 seconds.
--
Me... smoke free!!
athos76
I've been to a slaughterhouse...it was interesting. I didn't hear a
single cow complain of the living conditions.
So we eat meat in order to not eat soy products... well, I eat both.
Soy and tofu aren't my top choice, but my roommate seems to keep
cooking them and I won't turn down a home cooked meal even if it does
have that crap in it.
Cows have been raised for food ever since man realized cow tastes
good. Back in the day, there probably were no vegetarians (not 100%
sure...) Meat is good. At least my entire family thinks so...
I tried being a vegetarian for about a year... I snuck in some fish
and turkey once in a while, then a 24oz Porterhouse did me in at New
Years dinner...It literally had my name branded on it as a joke...so
yummy.
Like I've said before, I have eaten many animals...and there are
still more I want to try...
Heres a list for you (just to tick ya off): Dog, snake, rabbit, cow,
pig, mealworms, crickets, ants, earthworms, goldfish, kangaroo,
squirrel, alligator, deer, bear, bison, buffalo, grubs, iguana, rat
(long story), emu, possum, armadilla, ostrich, chicken, turkey, various
fish, octopus, squid, crab, lobster, shrimp, conch, clam, oyster,
mussels, shark, tarantula, boar, turtle, and probably a few others.
Now for those that don't eat meat...the classic question... if you
were stranded on an island/mountain/cave/another planet, with no veggie
food source and the only way to survive would be eat another
human...would you?
If not, I've got dips on yer rump....heard its the best spot...and it
tastes like chicken according to cannibals.
(feel free to pick at this message as you see fit, in makes no
nevermind to me)
Plenty of animals were harmed in the making of this message.
GreyWyvern
<Nob...@myjunkaddy.com> wrote:
> I have been a quitter for 4 Days, 20 hours, 22 minutes and 27 seconds (4
> days). I have saved $18.41 by not smoking 67 cigarettes. I have saved 5
> hours and 35 minutes of my life. My Quit Date: 6/18/2005 11:15 PM.
Hey! Honestly, that's great! Congratulations :) Keep at it!
> Hence the grumpiness that can come and go in .0000002 seconds.
I have three older siblings and one younger who all smoked, so I hate it
with a passion. I watched two of them quit, so I have a good idea about
how hard it is :/
Good luck there,
Grey
Linda Terrell
LT
JohnnyMrNinja
> Ya know... I'll eat anything that makes noise while its alive...
I'd reccomend against those that make noise afterwards.
> Now for those that don't eat meat...the classic question... if you
> were stranded on an island/mountain/cave/another planet, with no veggie
> food source and the only way to survive would be eat another
> human...would you?
> If not, I've got dips on yer rump....heard its the best spot...and it
> tastes like chicken according to cannibals.
To be honest, it would depend on the person. While there are some
people I would refuse to kill, there are some people I couldn't stomach
eating. And there are some people that I would eat even if there was
another food source - for example, if I was stuck on another planet
with the band Nickelback.
Ulrik Smed
> I eat vegetarians regularly...
Reminds me of this hit, LOL!
http://www.80smusiclyrics.com/artists/totocoelo.htm
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
Thanks, Grey. Today is sit by the pool day. That's always a good place for
an ashtray and lotsa smokes while gabbing w/my girlfriend. But, all I can
think about is wanting to have a good day, so I'll give my cravings a piece
of my mind if need be.
Take care... happy Friday!
I have been a quitter for 5 Days, 11 hours, 58 minutes and 2 seconds (5
days). I have saved $20.88 by not smoking 76 cigarettes. I have saved 6
hours and 20 minutes of my life. My Quit Date: 6/18/2005 11:15 PM!!!!
there's a lot of innocent people being crucified
> Well now I could see if maybe a kitten was just wandering around a swamp and
> came across an alligator, but it sure doesn't seem like it should be legal
> to feed gators period. As for the live mice that you feed your snake, I'm a
> rat owner, and I do understand the food chain, but I do prefer people to
> feed pre-killed rodents. Safer for the snake. In fact I believe it's
> illegal in some places to feed live rodents. Now for me, it would be a
> personal preference I'd rather see a snake eat a dead mouse than a live one.
> It would just bother me too much. But that's another discussion I suppose.
> ;-) FWIW, I don't think slaughtering horses for meat is cruel either. Do I
> support it and would I eat it? No. But if it's done humanely then what
> would be cruel about it?
Now I've fed my snake dead mice a few times when live ones were out of stock,
but I see no reason to stop feeding him live mice. That is what snakes eat
in the wild, I don't think we have any right to attempt to adjust their
diet to what we find politically correct at the moment. Snakes eat mice in
the wild, they do not humanely euthanize them before eating them, they
strangle them instead. Also, PETA objects to ANY killing of animals, not
only for human food but also animal food, suggesting that carnivorous
pets can be sustained with a diet of tofu, bean sprouts, and soy flakes. I
do not see any reason my snake should be subjected to such nonsense, I
have no problem feeding him live mice as he would eat in the wild. And
where would we stop, would PETA also demand humanely euthanizing crickets
that are sold as lizard food?
Grainne Gillespie
stock,
> but I see no reason to stop feeding him live mice.
How about the fact that live mice have sharp teeth and can seriously injure
your snake?
Does anyone have the URL to the pic of that poor chewed up ball python?
Cindy
>
> Quit meter says:
>
> I have been a quitter for 4 Days, 20 hours, 22 minutes and 27 seconds
> (4 days). I have saved $18.41 by not smoking 67 cigarettes. I have
> saved 5 hours and 35 minutes of my life. My Quit Date: 6/18/2005
> 11:15 PM.
Oh, congratulations, and good luck! Take a lot of deeeeeep breaths and make
your stomach relax when the stress hits.
Cindy
Ulrik Smed
I found it here, but it's not the original URL I think.
http://igroups.dk/gfx/igroups/2451/albums/3173/020409b.jpg
It's really nasty, but I'm quite sure it was a rat that did it, not a mouse.
There still is a risk with live mice though.
BTW, I think we should be a bit careful using nature as a standard for
what's 'right'. Take wild dogs for example, the way the kill their prey
causes a lot of suffering. That doesn't mean it's OK for us to kill that
way, or let our dogs do so, IMO. A lot of things happening in the wild would
be considered severe animal abuse by most people, if we did it.
Jason and Holly Harper
However, live rats have been known to injure and/or kill snakes. It's not
just a matter of my preference to not see a live animal killed, it just
seems safer for the snake to get food that's not going to hurt it.
Just my .02
Holly
"there's a lot of innocent people being crucified" <squ...@family.org>
wrote in message
news:P44ve.11144$pa3....@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
L Sternn
being crucified" <squ...@family.org> wrote:
>I read a newspaper story the other day about a man charged with animal
>cruelty for trying to feed a kitten to an alligator (the kitten survived).
You don't read very well, do you?
http://www.newsnet5.com/news/4589274/detail.html
(slideshow available - no pics of the gator or the cage tho')
Read it again and see if you can tell us why he was charged.
Here's a clue:
<excerpt>
Humane society officers said Wright picked the kitten up by neck,
shaking it violently as they ordered him to put it down. Instead, they
said he threw Ally the kitten more than 10 feet off the front porch.
"I'm like, I cannot believe he did that in front of me," Detillion
said.
"He didn't just toss her. He threw her as hard as he could. And she
hit the concrete and bounced off."
</excerpt>
there's a lot of innocent people being crucified
> Well now I could see if maybe a kitten was just wandering around a swamp and
> came across an alligator, but it sure doesn't seem like it should be legal
> to feed gators period. As for the live mice that you feed your snake, I'm a
> rat owner, and I do understand the food chain, but I do prefer people to
> feed pre-killed rodents. Safer for the snake. In fact I believe it's
> illegal in some places to feed live rodents. Now for me, it would be a
> personal preference I'd rather see a snake eat a dead mouse than a live one.
> It would just bother me too much. But that's another discussion I suppose.
> ;-) FWIW, I don't think slaughtering horses for meat is cruel either. Do I
> support it and would I eat it? No. But if it's done humanely then what
> would be cruel about it?
I don't think it's right to impose current notions of political correctness on
wild animals. Yes, I've heard all the arguments in favor of pre-killed mice
and have fed him dead mice on occassion, but it seems to me he gets something
out of the act of killing them. I was once criticized for anthropomorphism
for saying I thought he "enjoyed" killing them, but he really does get excited
when I toss the mice in and he goes for the kill. Those who would mandate
pre-killed meals are probably the same lunatics who feed their cats tofu
instead of meat.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Here at the PETA compound we co-exist in peace with the animals, and we
intermarry. The outside world looks down on a man marrying a llama, but
our love knows no boundaries!"
-- South Park; "Douche and Turd" (2004 election episode)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
there's a lot of innocent people being crucified
Except that I monitor the feeding, I watch until the mouse is thoroughly
strangled then I slowly leave the area as he gets distracted by any
motion. I can quickly stop any mouse attack and in the 6 years I've
been feeding him he's never been bitten once.
But none of this changes the fact that live mice but not live kittens
are okay to feed to reptiles, and even dead kittens would not be
permitted. Animal shelters around the country euthanize thousands
of cats and kittens daily and cremate them or toss them in landfills,
but an animal or even a human eating those same cats and kittens is
horribly cruel.
there's a lot of innocent people being crucified
Ha! My brother is a tobacco addict and tried to quit several times
before he decided it was his destiny to be a chain-smoking fool.
The first time he quit we were on vacation and by afternoon he was
starting to go mad. A few hours later he had some sort of temper
tantrum, smashed his walkman, and rushed outside to smoke half a
cigarette. The next few days didn't go any better, the occassional
partial cigarettes to fight withdrawal quickly led to resuming his
regular 3 carton per day habit.
-----------------------------
"Your world is an ashtray..."
-- Marilyn Manson
-----------------------------
Grainne Gillespie
> before he decided it was his destiny to be a chain-smoking fool.
> The first time he quit we were on vacation and by afternoon he was
> starting to go mad. A few hours later he had some sort of temper
> tantrum, smashed his walkman, and rushed outside to smoke half a
> cigarette. The next few days didn't go any better, the occassional
> partial cigarettes to fight withdrawal quickly led to resuming his
> regular 3 carton per day habit.
>
> -----------------------------
> "Your world is an ashtray..."
> -- Marilyn Manson
> -----------------------------
Has he tried using gum or patches? Some airlines hand out patches to smokers
to substitute for the fags/ciggies/whatever slang used to refer to
cigarettes in your neck of the woods that they're not allowed to smoke on
the plane
Grainne Gillespie
> strangled then I slowly leave the area as he gets distracted by any
> motion. I can quickly stop any mouse attack and in the 6 years I've
> been feeding him he's never been bitten once.
Barbara Horwitz once mentioned a guy who always fed live to his snakes. He
always supervised the feedings until one day he had to leave the room. He
never fed live again and Barbara eventually became the owner of his now
one-eyed snake
L Sternn
<jhha...@tm.net> wrote:
>Yes, my personal preference would be to see a dead mouse/rat fed to a snake.
>However, live rats have been known to injure and/or kill snakes. It's not
>just a matter of my preference to not see a live animal killed, it just
>seems safer for the snake to get food that's not going to hurt it.
>
>Just my .02
>
>Holly
When I was in school, we used to bring cockroaches in to feed the
tarantula in the biology lab.
Think of the diseases the tarantula could have gotten and all the
suffering those cockroaches went through.
Of course, the tarantula wasn't interested in dead bugs, especially
ones that had been stomped on or smothered in Raid.
Grainne Gillespie
>for saying I thought he "enjoyed" killing them, but he really does get
>excited
>when I toss the mice in and he goes for the kill.
It's probably the smell of the the live mouse that gets him all excited, the
scent of its warm body and the smell of the mouse pee on its fur
My royal (aka Ball) python, Jasper, used to get really excited when I
jiggled and danced his "heated with a hair dryer so he thinks its alive"
defrosted mouse, then suddenly he even lost interest in that. I think he's
too lazy to fall for it any more and he realised that the mouse was dead and
it was much easier to simply glide lazily up to the dead mouse and commence
swallowing, none of that squeezing the dead mouse for ten minutes to make
sure its really dead for him anymore!
As for the morons who whinge about anthropomorphism, you'd think they'd have
more important things to whinge about
>Those who would mandate
>pre-killed meals are probably the same lunatics who feed their cats >tofu
>instead of meat.
No, those lunatics wouldn't be mandating pre-killed mice for snakes, they'd
be trying to persuade us that tofu is the natural food for all animals
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> "Here at the PETA compound we co-exist in peace with the animals, and we
> intermarry. The outside world looks down on a man marrying a llama, but
> our love knows no boundaries!"
> -- South Park; "Douche and Turd" (2004 election episode)
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
Haven't seen that ep yet, sounds like fun though. I really have to see it
and the one titled "Russell Crowe fighting around the world"
L Sternn
<Nob...@myjunkaddy.com> wrote:
>Replying to internet ninnies is such a waste of time.
Yeah, but I'm gonna do it anyway.
> Am I a PETA person?
>Well, yes and no.
No, you either are or you aren't. PETA is so extremist and in many
instances hypocritical that only a raving lunatic would even consider
being associated with them.
>I detest inhumane of any creature, but I eat beef, pork,
>chicken, fish, etc. Would I *try* horse in another country? No f*cking
>way. And I don't "try" veal either. (No lamb!)
Veal isn't lamb. You could learn something from South Park. Veal
is "little tortured baby cow".
And if you won't eat lamb, you have no idea what you're missing.
What about ducks? Will you eat them?
http://tinyurl.com/b3mmq
(picture of little baby ducks with their mother)
They're so cute, aren't they?
They're quite tasty too.
>
>As far as the reality of what happens to cows and pigs, I know humane from
>inhumane. I went to a slaughterhouse on a field trip for science in the 4th
>grade. (The teacher must've been really messed up to have done this).
>However, when I lived in Washington state, I worked at a beef slaughterhouse
>(in the cafeteria, taking money for lunch). Did I like it? Hell no, but I
>bought a corvette when I was 18 and had to make ends meet as I was living on
>my own by then. So Grey-Cluelessfuck, put that in your not-so-intelligent
>pipe and smoke it.
>
>And no, I wouldn't bash in a monkey's brain because it's an expensive
>delicatessen in some countries. For God's sake, that is really f*cked up.
>
>Watch a live mouse be eaten by a snake? No way in hell. Eat snake? Ewww!!
>No!!
Why not? I hear snake is excellent.
L Sternn
<lin...@mindspring.com> wrote:
>I eat vegetarians regularly...
>
I tried them, but I didn't like them. Meat-eaters taste much better
>LT
L Sternn
>Ya know... I'll eat anything that makes noise while its alive...
> I've been to a slaughterhouse...it was interesting. I didn't hear a
>single cow complain of the living conditions.
> So we eat meat in order to not eat soy products... well, I eat both.
>Soy and tofu aren't my top choice, but my roommate seems to keep
>cooking them and I won't turn down a home cooked meal even if it does
>have that crap in it.
> Cows have been raised for food ever since man realized cow tastes
>good. Back in the day, there probably were no vegetarians (not 100%
>sure...) Meat is good. At least my entire family thinks so...
> I tried being a vegetarian for about a year... I snuck in some fish
>and turkey once in a while, then a 24oz Porterhouse did me in at New
>Years dinner...It literally had my name branded on it as a joke...so
>yummy.
> Like I've said before, I have eaten many animals...and there are
>still more I want to try...
> Heres a list for you (just to tick ya off): Dog, snake, rabbit, cow,
>pig, mealworms, crickets, ants, earthworms, goldfish, kangaroo,
>squirrel, alligator, deer, bear, bison, buffalo, grubs, iguana, rat
>(long story), emu, possum, armadilla, ostrich, chicken, turkey, various
>fish, octopus, squid, crab, lobster, shrimp, conch, clam, oyster,
>mussels, shark, tarantula, boar, turtle, and probably a few others.
eel, frog, mudbugs.
Eel is excellent, frog was sort of like chicken, but there wasn't much
meat there, mudbugs are excellent too.
L Sternn
<demo...@eircom.net> wrote:
>> Ha! My brother is a tobacco addict and tried to quit several times
>> before he decided it was his destiny to be a chain-smoking fool.
>> The first time he quit we were on vacation and by afternoon he was
>> starting to go mad. A few hours later he had some sort of temper
>> tantrum, smashed his walkman, and rushed outside to smoke half a
>> cigarette. The next few days didn't go any better, the occassional
>> partial cigarettes to fight withdrawal quickly led to resuming his
>> regular 3 carton per day habit.
>>
>> -----------------------------
>> "Your world is an ashtray..."
>> -- Marilyn Manson
>> -----------------------------
>
>Has he tried using gum or patches?
I've tried them both.
The patch didn't do enough and the gum was too hard to regulate the
amount you were getting from it.
> Some airlines hand out patches to smokers
>to substitute for the fags/ciggies/whatever slang used to refer to
>cigarettes in your neck of the woods that they're not allowed to smoke on
>the plane
>
Really? That would be nice. I carry snuff on airplanes now, but I
don't really like it.
I've found that I can stave off cravings in airplanes fairly well as
long as I don't drink any alcohol. It's like my body knows it's not
going to get a smoke until we land.
The last plane trip I took, I really didn't crave at all until a few
minutes before we were supposed to land and the pilot announced that
instead of landing, we'd be circling the airport for the next 30
minutes or so.
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
news:uod0c1dodi29bb733...@4ax.com...
Smoked eel at the sushi bar is divine!! And I love all sorts of sushi..
just not sea urchin. But eating bugs would have to be a dare/challenge with
lots of money involved!!!
--
·.·´¨ ¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
Laurie
((¸¸.·´ ..·´
-:¦:- ((¸¸ ·.·
*~*LiveLoveLaugh*~* Aloha!!!!!
"There is no remedy for love but to love more"...
~~Henry David Thoreau
>
L Sternn
mudbugs are just little freshwater lobsters
http://www.zoeicaimages.com/assets/images/Mudbugs.jpg
And they've got exoskeletons just like bugs.
Is there really any biological difference between crustaceans and
bugs?
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
> On Thu, 23 Jun 2005 23:10:42 GMT, "~*LiveLoveLaugh*~"
> <Nob...@myjunkaddy.com> wrote:
>
> >Replying to internet ninnies is such a waste of time.
>
> Yeah, but I'm gonna do it anyway.
Me 2!! Mmmmmeeeeetoooo11!
>
> > Am I a PETA person?
> >Well, yes and no.
>
> No, you either are or you aren't. PETA is so extremist and in many
> instances hypocritical that only a raving lunatic would even consider
> being associated with them.
Okay, so I'm not. I'm just an animal lover at heart.
>
> >I detest inhumane of any creature, but I eat beef, pork,
> >chicken, fish, etc. Would I *try* horse in another country? No f*cking
> >way. And I don't "try" veal either. (No lamb!)
>
> Veal isn't lamb.
Duh.
> You could learn something from South Park. Veal
> is "little tortured baby cow".
And do you call your BM's "Mr. Hanky Poo"? ;) (`Love that show)!!
>
> And if you won't eat lamb, you have no idea what you're missing.
Oh yes I do. I've tasted it. Too gamey for me, and I think the idea of
eating it w/mint green jelly is really gross. Hubby and in-laws have it
when we're at the lake house... and I have a good ole' boyger.
>
> What about ducks? Will you eat them?
Tried duck... `didn't like it.
> http://tinyurl.com/b3mmq
> (picture of little baby ducks with their mother)
>
> They're so cute, aren't they?
>
> They're quite tasty too.
Depends on your palette. Mine says 'yuck'. But then again, I like raw
quail eggs at the sushi bar, so it's tit for tat I suppose.
> >As far as the reality of what happens to cows and pigs, I know humane
from
> >inhumane. I went to a slaughterhouse on a field trip for science in the
4th
> >grade. (The teacher must've been really messed up to have done this).
> >However, when I lived in Washington state, I worked at a beef
slaughterhouse
> >(in the cafeteria, taking money for lunch). Did I like it? Hell no, but
I
> >bought a corvette when I was 18 and had to make ends meet as I was living
on
> >my own by then. So Grey-Cluelessfuck, put that in your
not-so-intelligent
> >pipe and smoke it.
> >
> >And no, I wouldn't bash in a monkey's brain because it's an expensive
> >delicatessen in some countries. For God's sake, that is really f*cked
up.
> >
> >Watch a live mouse be eaten by a snake? No way in hell. Eat snake?
Ewww!!
> >No!!
>
> Why not? I hear snake is excellent.
I hear it tastes like chicken. But I'll wait until I'm stranded in the
desert before I have to try rattle snake as a main dish. Now gator tail is
quite good. Ever tried that? It's fun to go to a spot on the creek in Jax,
FL (`can't recall the dang name of it... it's on Julington Creek in
Mandarin)... anyway, it's quite fun to eat the gator tail, and also feed
the gators the same meat. Then, you pop right back into the boat and ski in
that same water!!
Some would say that's awfully scary. But, we never thought twice about it!
--
LLL
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
I'd like to say yes... there is a huge difference.
Where ya from, L. Sternn? Those are called crawdads down here... or
crawfish, or crayfish. `Used to love to eat them by the buckets after they
were boiled in beer at a nice place on the water called Craw Daddy's.
Gloria Carr
news:tmMve.12789$VK4....@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> But none of this changes the fact that live mice but not live kittens
> are okay to feed to reptiles, and even dead kittens would not be
> permitted. Animal shelters around the country euthanize thousands
> of cats and kittens daily and cremate them or toss them in landfills,
> but an animal or even a human eating those same cats and kittens is
> horribly cruel.
Not cruel per se, but...
I remember one time when I volunteering at my local zoo's birds of prey
program. Usually we got lots of dead mice, day old chicks, and the
occasional hamster or rabbit for the birds. I think at the time most of the
rodents came from a place that bred animals for labs, and we got the
rejects. I remember that the mice sometimes had tumors and were occasionally
hairless. One time they sent us a dead puppy as well. :( It had apparently
been still born. It was upsetting and one of the staff went and yelled at
the kitchen for sending it to us. Not long after they changed their source
of rodents.
Gloria
athos76
all live rats and mice... and as cruel as it may be, I knock the rat
over the head first so it is dazed when my snakes eat.
My turtles on the other hand could be in the same category as some
murderers in our prisons.. One has on multiple occasions, grabbed the
mouse by the tail and held its head less than an inch under the water
and waited for it to drown, then proceeded to eat it.
The other one repeatedly dismembers her mice with her claws, then
thouroughly eats all the pieces.... I'll post video somehow...
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
news:auCwe.944$aY6...@newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> "L Sternn" <linc...@hm.net> wrote...
> > No, you either are or you aren't. PETA is so extremist and in many
> > instances hypocritical that only a raving lunatic would even consider
> > being associated with them.
>
> who would order pepperoni or other meat-topped pizza, then pay me
> with a customized check with something like "protect the animals" or
> whatever and a PETA logo printed on it. Nevermind that the meat and
> even the cheese on those pizzas violated PETA's hardcore militant
> veginazi position.
http://www.totallytom.com/MadCow.html :)~
And... thank you. I now know what I want for deener tonight. (No meat tho'
on my pizza. Cheese and cheese and `maters please).
--
·.·´¨ ¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
Laurie
((¸¸.·´ ..·´
-:¦:- ((¸¸ ·.·
*~*LiveLoveLaugh*~* Aloha!!!!!
"There is no remedy for love but to love more"...
~~Henry David Thoreau
>
> >>Watch a live mouse be eaten by a snake? No way in hell. Eat snake?
Ewww!!
> >>No!!
> >
> > Why not? I hear snake is excellent.
>
> I've never tried snake, and though I love my pet snake I don't think I
> would be adverse to at least trying a piece of snake meat just so I
> could tell people about it. I did eat alligator on a visit to New
Orleans,
> actually alligator nuggets and it took me a few minutes to work up the
> courage to eat one, it really wasn't so bad. Like they always say, it
> did taste like chicken, but the texture was much tougher. As for cats,
> I don't think I would eat one, but I have no moral objection to cultures
> (like Koreans) who eat them. In fact, there was a thread on this group
> or maybe another about a hysteria in some American city where the animal
> shelter was accused of adopting out cats to Korean-Americans who were
> then accused of cooking and serving them in the their restaurants. It
> made no difference that the cats would have been gassed to death and
> cremated 5 minutes later had they not been adopted, the fact that people
> were EATING them (and thus giving some purpose to the poor cats' sad
> lives) was just cruel, inhumane, and utterly intolerable. And same for
> dogs; in fact I read the most excellent book "Aztec" by Gary Jennings
> and apparently back in those days they had small dogs they took with them
> on cross-country journeys and along the way the dogs would go off-trail
> and catch rabbits and whatever to eat, then when supplied ran low after
> a week or so the troupe would begin eating the dogs.
>
~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
news:op.ssuzb...@greywyvern.belkin...
> On Thu, 23 Jun 2005 19:39:38 -0400, ~*LiveLoveLaugh*~
> <Nob...@myjunkaddy.com> wrote:
>
> > days). I have saved $18.41 by not smoking 67 cigarettes. I have saved 5
> > hours and 35 minutes of my life. My Quit Date: 6/18/2005 11:15 PM.
>
>
> > Hence the grumpiness that can come and go in .0000002 seconds.
>
> I have three older siblings and one younger who all smoked, so I hate it
> with a passion. I watched two of them quit, so I have a good idea about
> how hard it is :/
>
> Good luck there,
> Grey
Checking in witchoo. How are you? I'm up 55 bux:
I have been a quitter for 1 Week, 3 Days, 16 hours, 23 minutes and 55
seconds (10 days). I have saved $55.81 by not smoking 202 cigarettes. I have
saved 16 hours and 50 minutes of my life. My Quit Date: 6/18/2005 11:15 PM!!
202 ciggies!! That makes me sick now!! (But I crave it, like a snake
craves a little white, fuzzy, cutie-patootie mousie).
GreyWyvern
alt.pets.cats,rec.pets.herp,alt.pets.mice:
> Checking in witchoo. How are you? I'm up 55 bux:
:rolleyes:
You should try to stop thinking about it, or at least, stop thinking about
the you-know-whats. How about taking the 55 bucks and buying something
that you'll end up seeing everyday. Like a lamp, or a painting. Then
everytime you see that, you'll think: "y'know... if I hadn't quit, I
wouldn't have this." etc. Stuff like that, reinforcing the "good", but
taking your mind off the bad (you know... the you-know-whats). :P
I hear it gets tougher and tougher to "quit again" each time you
surrender, so stay with it! :D
Grey
El Chapo
> No, you either are or you aren't. PETA is so extremist and in many
> instances hypocritical that only a raving lunatic would even consider
> being associated with them.
A long time I ago I was a pizzaboy and remember one regular customer
who would order pepperoni or other meat-topped pizza, then pay me
with a customized check with something like "protect the animals" or
whatever and a PETA logo printed on it. Nevermind that the meat and
even the cheese on those pizzas violated PETA's hardcore militant
veginazi position.
>>Watch a live mouse be eaten by a snake? No way in hell. Eat snake? Ewww!!
>>No!!
>
> Why not? I hear snake is excellent.
I've never tried snake, and though I love my pet snake I don't think I
El Chapo
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> "Here at the PETA compound we co-exist in peace with the animals, and we
>> intermarry. The outside world looks down on a man marrying a llama, but
>> our love knows no boundaries!"
>> -- South Park; "Douche and Turd" (2004 election episode)
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Haven't seen that ep yet, sounds like fun though. I really have to see it
> and the one titled "Russell Crowe fighting around the world"
It was the 2004 election parody, only in the show the kids were voting on a
new school mascot because PETA terrorists had invaded their pep rally and
declared the South Park Cows cow mascot (actually a person in a cow suit) to
be exploitation of defenseless animals and proceed to throw paint on
everyone. The kids are given a list of possible new mascots to vote on
including Redskins, Chiefs, Indians, etc. (because PETA doesn't care about
people), but as a joke the kids write in "Giant Douche" and "Turd Sandwich"
and those wind up being the top two finalists who the kids must vote on.
Stan gets in trouble because he refuses to vote because he doesn't see what
the difference is between a douche and a turd, that if that's the only
choice he has then there's no point in voting.
MD 20/20
>
> You know who should be euthanized? PETA, that's who. My parents
> immigrated to Canada from the Netherlands, and as such I'm used to many
> Dutch foods. One of them is horse meat. There is no difference between
> horses and other food animals besides the fact that we ride some of them,
> and bet on them at the race track.
>
How does the taste of horsemeat differ from beef?
Just curious
warrigal
the wrong food items if it's being fed whole pups. They need to at
least take it's head off.
clem
stock,
eat.
In the wild yes,
But thats very different, the snake is normaly hidden and the mouse as no
idea it's about to die.
what you are doing is putting a mouse in with a snake thats not always
waiting for prey, the mouse on the other hand knows whats about to happed
and can get the better of the snake, they are not completely stupid (fight
or flight) they can't run away so they fight for their lives.
maybe only one will win from time to time, thats all it would take to kill
your snake. one lucky mouse!
Clem
Buslady
athos76 wrote:
> Ya know... I'll eat anything that makes noise while its alive...
> *snipped*
> Heres a list for you (just to tick ya off): Dog, snake, rabbit, cow,
> pig, mealworms, crickets, ants, earthworms, goldfish, kangaroo,
> squirrel, alligator, deer, bear, bison, buffalo, grubs, iguana, rat
> (long story), emu, possum, armadilla, ostrich, chicken, turkey, various
> fish, octopus, squid, crab, lobster, shrimp, conch, clam, oyster,
> mussels, shark, tarantula, boar, turtle, and probably a few others.
> Now for those that don't eat meat...the classic question... if you
> were stranded on an island/mountain/cave/another planet, with no veggie
> food source and the only way to survive would be eat another
> human...would you?
> If not, I've got dips on yer rump....heard its the best spot...and it
> tastes like chicken according to cannibals.
>
>
Hey you lied...lots of those animals dont make noise when it's alive!
squid, turtles, lobsters....
*runs & hides*
Buslady
only for human food but also animal food, suggesting that carnivorous
pets can be sustained with a diet of tofu, bean sprouts, and soy
flakes.
Yeah that's hilarious. There was a lady on Animal Cops who fed her cats
nothing but a vegetarian diet. Well, they were skinny and many
BLIND!!!! Why? Cause they didnt get MEAT! Cats and Dogs are
carnivores...Me thinks someone out to teach PETA what CARNIVORE means.
I used to feed my ball python LIVE. Always. It's natural and that's
what they like, let's them excercise their squeezing muscles.
I dont condone horse killing. I like horses. But it's gonna happen.
I'm passionate about turtle killing, it should never happen. So many
are being taken there won't be any in the next 10-20 years. Esp. the
sea turtles, all of them.
But damn gimme an angus filet, yum. Cattle are considered the dumbest
animal, yeah they are. But it doesn't mean they should be treated
poorly prior to giving up their lives to feed humans. I live around
dairies, they are gross. I feel sorry for the poor dumb cows who have
to walk in hock high poop and mud when it rains. And the stench...I'm
glad they're moving out.
Chickens are pretty stupid, again they dont need to be thrown into
cages really hard and hurt before taken off. I think KFC should take a
look at it.
McDs is looking into humane killing using nitrogen so they go to sleep.
It wont make me wanna eat their crap though.
The only hamburger I trust is In N Out, I wont eat McDs, Carl's, or any
of the popular fast food junk shops...only In N Out.
No animal should suffer prior to death.
Grainne Gillespie
> squid, turtles, lobsters....
>
>
> *runs & hides*
I beg to differ, my turtle hisses quite a lot
Grainne Gillespie
> what they like, let's them excercise their squeezing muscles.
I feed by ball python frozen/thawed. He still gets to exercise his squeezing
muscles because he wraps himself around the dead mouse and gives it a good
few minutes squeeze to make sure its really dead. He also gets to exercise
his squeezing muscles on my wrist when he pretends he's a pretty bracelet
while I'm typing on my computer
Cindy
Lobsters scream when you put them in the boiling water.
Grainne Gillespie
I heard that's just air escaping from their shells
griffin
"Buslady" <bus...@buslady.com> wrote in message
news:1121800707.3...@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> But damn gimme an angus filet, yum. Cattle are considered the dumbest
> animal, yeah they are.
I beg to differ. I think there are much dumber animals out there than cattle.
In fact, I might place horses higher on the Stupid List than cattle. How about
sheep... oh I think sheep are wayyyy dumber than cattle. And poultry are
definately dumber! I've spent years around all of these critters, and have
been surprised over the years at how not-dumb alot of cattle are.
> The only hamburger I trust is In N Out, I wont eat McDs, Carl's, or any
> of the popular fast food junk shops...only In N Out.
Mmmmmm, In n Out. YUM
griffin
Ulrik Smed
> Yeah that's hilarious. There was a lady on Animal Cops who fed
> her cats nothing but a vegetarian diet. Well, they were skinny
> and many BLIND!!!! Why? Cause they didnt get MEAT! Cats and
> Dogs are carnivores...Me thinks someone out to teach PETA what
> CARNIVORE means.
Cats need taurine for their eyes and other things. If the lady intend to
continue using vegetarian catfood, tell her to use some with added taurine.
For example from here:
http://www.vegancats.com/
The taurine is synthetic and they even claim that synthetic taurine is added
to many meat-based foods too, because the natural tautine is partially lost
in production.
--
Ulrik Smed
Aarhus, Denmark
Daniel Morrow
"JohnnyMrNinja" <Johnny...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1119519957.3...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> there's a lot of innocent people being crucified wrote:
> > I read a newspaper story the other day about a man charged with animal
> > cruelty for trying to feed a kitten to an alligator (the kitten
survived).
> > Now I just love cats, but I can't see what would be illegal about this,
> > or what is particularly "cruel" about it. I have a pet gopher snake and
> > every week or two he gets a meal of 6 or so live adult mice. Why is it
> > okay to feed live mice but not live cats to reptiles?
> >
> > Similarly, my state legislature was recently busy trying to draft laws
> > that would ban slaughtering horses for human consumption. I like
> > horses just fine, but don't see what the difference is between a horse
> > and a cow that horses should be protected from being eaten. Keep in
> > mind that there was never any attempt to ban slaughtering horses for
> > ANIMAL consumption (e.g. dog food), it was the fact that PEOPLE were
> > eating them that made the act of slaughtering them "cruel." Just the
> > other day the newspaper was reporting how a bunch of animal rights
> > nazis were opposing a plan to send old horses to slaughterhouses,
> > the activists argued that the horses should be "humanely" euthanized
> > and given proper burials (!) - apparently that isn't cruel but
> > eating the flesh of that same dead horse is cruel. Oh, and the U.S.
> > Congress just proposed a bill that would prohibit federal
> > inspection of horse meat, essentially making the meat unsellable
> > in the U.S. market even if the actual slaughter of horses remains
> > legal.
> >
I view peta as being the same as anti-marijuana activists - them all being
people trying to rid the world of something they find politically
unacceptable. I have never smoked any marijuana myself but all of my large
assortment of friends do and I fully support them. They even all do it
legally (at least as far as the state is concerned here in oregon). I plan
to never abuse meat but will always at the very least have some in my diet,
it will be a long time in the future before mankind is able to exactly copy
animal meat be it what ever it is (horse/cow/chicken/fish etc.), and even
then that copy might just as well be the "real" thing because it is such an
exact copy, I love fish myself (to eat) but even have a lot as pets. Later
all!
> > My question is whether an animal's protected status is based on any
> > criteria other than its cuteness. Kittens are cuter than mice,
> > therefore they can't be food for hungry reptiles, while mice aren't
> > quite so cute so therefore you can feed as many of them as you want
> > to reptiles.
>
> I think mice are far cuter than kittens, and stay cute their whole
> lives. And baby cows compared to baby horses? No contest!
>
> If you had to feed gators, domestic chickens have been bred to the
> point of retardation. A "chicken with it's head cut off" will still
> run around because the body doesn't use the brain all that much. This
> would be a far better idea than a kitten.
>
> Personally, I don't think murder of any kind is justifiable for the
> sake of food preference, horse, cow, kitten whatever. So, yeah, ban all
> the animals they can.
>
phy
news:op.sssbw...@news.nas.net:
> You know who should be euthanized? PETA, that's who. My parents
> immigrated to Canada from the Netherlands, and as such I'm used to
> many Dutch foods. One of them is horse meat. There is no difference
> between horses and other food animals besides the fact that we ride
> some of them, and bet on them at the race track.
>
> But most of us westerners have the prejudice,
I think the answer to part of the attachment to horses might lie in
history. For years horses were the most efficient mode of transportation.
How could someone not own, ride and depend on a horse for years and not
come emotionally attached. Then also, horses were more valued as beasts of
burden and not traditional food animals. Most people around here when they
want meat, they think about cows, pigs, chicken and McDonalds. So I think
it is a cultural thing. Also people who support PETA are stupid and should
be laughed at and ridiculed.
-phy
Richard Casady
My snapper Boltcutter bangs his head on the side of the tank when he
sees me coming.
Casady