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Being Sentient: In Nothing Sacred?

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Doug Bashford

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Oct 11, 2009, 12:48:02 PM10/11/09
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www.colorado.edu/peacestudies/sustainable-economics/nondual-ecology/greater-disc/0001.html

Being Sentient: In Nothing Sacred?

Sun, 17 Nov 1996
Mark McCaffrey (mccaffrm csf.Colorado.EDU)

Where do we begin a discussion of Nondual Ecology?
At the beginning, of course.
In this particular instance we have an article by one John
McClellan-- an article one might add that sparked some heated discussion a
few years back after it appeared in TRICYCLE magazine.
And the article begins:

"Recognizing the inherent Buddhanature of rocks and
clouds is not that hard-- many now acknowledge this
idea in principle.....But recognizing this prized quality
of aliveness in technology, in human-machine social
behvaiors, and in the activity of abstract symoblic
systems is something else again" Indeed.

Now, the term "Buddhanature" may throw those unfamiliar
or even suspicious of the term. Redefining this notion in fresh,
experiential terms ought, perhaps,to be a key part of our
discussion here in the next week. For our purposes now
why don't we simply define it as the essential unity of
"everything that moves," every single iota of Being
.....and yet paradoxically (and wonderfully)
it is also the basic nothingness/emptiness
of this material/physical/phenomenal world.
(Perhaps some of our Buddhist friends involved in this
discussion can further unravel and refresh our
understanding of this term"Buddhanature".

Buddhanature is, if I understand it correctly,
like the lowest common denominator, so low,
so essential that it isn't any "thing" in particular,
but is in fact "nothing."
In our "thing" oriented world the idea of nothing
being sacred runs against the grain. We tend to think of the
sacred as something, someplace, someone special.

Many environmentalists-- and according to
John McClellan-- deep ecologists in particular have not
made this leap from "things" being sacred (be they
biological or technological) to "nothing" itself being purity.
Deep ecologists, he claims, fall into the age-old dichotomania
that comes from splitting "things" up into finer and finer
pieces without looking at or acknowledging the whole.
Much of his original article focuses on the
dueling dynamic that has occurred in environmental circle
that perpetuates the good guys/bad guys polarization,
particularly as it applies to technology.

(My hunch is that most people engaged in an on-line
electronic discussion will have made peace in some perhaps
ambiguous way with the benefits and perils of technology
(especially tv/computer/phone) in our personal environments;
those who are seriously anti=tech and regard "it" as a
cross between Frankenstein's Monster and Pandora's Box aren't
likely to subscribe to a seminar on line.)

It is refreshing to reread this article,
remembering why I originally enjoyed it so much.
It is humorous and sometimes outrageous, and perhaps
it uses on occasion some of the same dualistic dueling
that it proports to be critical of.
Yet there is also an attempt here at grand synthesis
through the lenses of ecology (of the deep rather than
shallow variety) and spirituality
(of the dharmic rather than moralistic flavor).

As we embark on discussing these ideas I'd like to see if we can from time
to time draw on our own fresh experience of these notions. I do have a
concern that we'll get bogged down in the theoretical and abstract here
rather than investigate whether these radical notions are in fact true.
Is there only Sentient Being, as John McClellan suggets? Have we been in
the trance of dueling dualism for so long that even our noble attempts to
"save the planet" are stunted if not doomed due to our inability to fully
embrace the "Primordial Purity" of everything/nothing?

I'd say: Yes. Yet I also recognize that on some core cerebral level this
duel and dance of dualism still churns along: the ongoing mediation
effforts between the right and left lobes, the currents of negative
and positive ionstreams drifting through the universe, the dance of male
and female hormones, night and day, darkness and light, life and death.
awake and asleep....

Yes, there are good guys and bad guys....and
environmentally and socially it sometimes does feel
like the bad guys are winning. Yes, there is a war
on the planet that is happening as natural resources
are harvested and consumed, as people and other
sentient beings are sacrificed for profits
and progress.
Yet there is an overarching peace that must also be
acknowledged and honored, the "integral principle"
if you will that can serve as the ultimate coordinant,
the beacon that puts everything else
into perspective.

Tonight I saw a film entitled "Synthetic Pleasures"
which focused on all the high-tech attempts to further
"control" nature and create an electrically based
alternative environment that is both a substitute and
also a theoretical improvement over what are considered to
be the limitations and wildness of the natural world.
The movie was a fascinating exploration of how we seek to
create and control our own reality. Many of the images
in the film were stunning (though none as stunning as
watching the sun set behind the Flatirons) and some of the
people talked about very interesting things:
the notion of in some way
"loosing" or transcending the "mind" through technology.

I wonder if part of the fear many have of technology is simply an updated
version of the fear people have felt towards the "natural" world for so
many years prior to now. We have used technology as a means of gaining
some sense/illusion of control over nature's wildness, but now technology
has taken on a life of its own and-- like a proverbial wildfire-- can't be
stopped.

* Next message: Steve Kurtz: "Re: Some Deep Ecology thoughts ..."
* Previous message: Don Roper: "Welcome to the NonDual Ecology Seminar"

- If you scratch a cynic,
- you'll find a defeated idealist.

Doug Bashford

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Oct 11, 2009, 1:29:57 PM10/11/09
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Doug Bashford said about:
Being Sentient: In Nothing Sacred?


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> from:
> www.colorado.edu/peacestudies/sustainable-economics/nondual-ecology/greater-disc/0001.html

If anybody's interested here's the index for that discussion:

www.colorado.edu/peacestudies/sustainable-economics/nondual-ecology/greater-disc/index.html

The Greater Discussion by thread


Starting: Sun 17 Nov 1996 -
Ending: Sun 24 Nov 1996 -
Messages: 170

* Welcome to the NonDual Ecology Seminar Don Roper
* Being Sentient: In Nothing Sacred? Mark McCaffrey
* Re: Some Deep Ecology thoughts ... Steve Kurtz
* Hello from the heartland Ed Lehner
* nondual Rich Coon
* Re: Technology is human behavior, not "new life" Tracy McCallum
* Re: Technology is human behavior, not "new life" Alan McGowen
* Re: Technology is human behavior, not "new life" Paul Grignon
* Re: Author Replies to Naess' Deep View MoCt...@aol.com
* Re: Author Replies to Naess' Deep View Alan McGowen
* Re: Author's Operning Statement-Nondual Ecology Bruce Nygren
* Perfection!/? Mark McCaffrey
* Non-Dual Eugene F. Monaco
* Buddhist Social Ecology, and the Greens J. Hughes
* Clarification Mark McCaffrey
* technology/seminar/ecology Betty J. Foster
* NDE Seminar Zachary Martin
* Re; Author's Opening Statement Cheryl Foltos
* Future Dharma Lawyer speaks... No...@aol.com
* Re: Author's Operning Statement-Nondual Ecology Philip M. Bunch
* Re: some thoughts Mark Wilding
* Such Beauty Mark McCaffrey
* THOUGHT EXPERIMENT: THE DEEPEST ECOLOGY mcclellan john
* Re:Splitter & Lumpers Mark Wilding
* Re: On Arne Naess"s Deep Ecology Platform -Reply Alan McGowen
* Re: Thought Experiment: THE DEEPEST ECOLOGY Sall...@aol.com
* Rest in the heart of movement Cheryl Foltos
o Re: Rest in the heart of movement Betsy Barnum
* MISSING THE POINT OF NON-DUAL THINKING MoCt...@aol.com
* (no subject) Malcolm Hollick
* Perfection and reality Robin Faichney
o Re: Perfection and reality Bruce Nygren
* RE: technology/seminar/ecology Robin Faichney
* Chilling out Robin Faichney
o Re: Chilling out Bruce Nygren
* Morning Offering Cheryl Foltos
* Non-Dual Taking Action Philip M. Bunch
* On what do we depend? Richard Todd
o re: On what do we depend? John Clifford
* Sacred? Profane? Stephen Evans
* Non Dual Ecology HOGAN TIM M
* un-lurking Jennifer Henderson
* Re: if buy premise, then buy bit Rich Coon
* Re: Author Replies to Naess' Deep View John McClellan
* We? Stephen Evans
* RE: The Evening News C...@bear.com
* Re: The Evening News Alan McGowen
* Re: On Arne Naess"s Deep Ecology Platform -Reply Claudia Robinson
* All That Is, and particular beings Sall...@aol.com
o Re: All That Is, and particular beings Bruce Nygren
* maybe you could use a chuckle John McClellan
* Re: More on Bowing, Civilization & Technology Rich Coon
* Re: Learning to Cry & Bow At Same Time Stephen Evans
* (no subject) Koerner, Darrell
* Re: More on Bowing, Civilization & Technology Doug Dunn
* (no subject) Bruce Nygren
* Author Answers His Mail !?! John McClellan
* Overcast skies Steve French
* Overcast skies Bruce R. McFarling
* Devotional aspects of commitment John Clifford
* bravery; following your gut; whatever Betty J. Foster
* On Life as a part time lurker... mat...@shakti.CS.Gsu.EDU
o Re: On Life as a part time lurker... J2Ca...@aol.com
* Sutra for Environmental Activists Mark Wilding
* (no subject) Michael Zimmerman
o Re: (no subject) Bruce Nygren
* Re: bowing and giving thanks Rich Coon
* The Path Student-Travis Smith
* Re: Technology is human behavior, not "new life" c...@bear.com
* Re: Why i have prefs. for bio. Rich Coon
* General Address to the Discussion, at Halftime John McClellan
* Re: On What Do We Depend? Alan McGowen
o Re: On What Do We Depend? Alan McGowen
* Nature intervenes... No...@aol.com
* Re: The Path Stephen Evans
* Re: Sutra for Environmental Activists -Reply Stephen Evans
* Re: Sutra for Environmental Activists -Reply Stephen Evans
* Re: More on Bowing, Civilization & Technology c...@bear.com
* Re: On What Do We Depend? John McClellan
* Re: On What Do We Depend? Rich Coon
* Re: Deep Ecology Writing Rich Coon
* Re: More on Bowing, Civilization & Technology Claudia Robinson
* Re: Ultra-pessimist Bruce R. McFarling
* Re: More on Bowing, Civilization & Technology Bruce R. McFarling
* So How Do We LIVE? John McClellan
o Re: So How Do We LIVE? David Martin/Bonnie Jakobsen
o Re: So How Do We LIVE? J2Ca...@aol.com
o Re: So How Do We LIVE? Claudia Robinson
* Gus DiZerega's Letter, Some Problems with McClellan's etc John
McClellan
o Re: Gus DiZerega's Letter, Some Problems with McClellan's etc
Gu...@aol.com
* Re: Deep Ecology Writing Gu...@aol.com
* Another Day Cheryl Foltos
* EcoRealities and veggies John Clifford
* Once Born - a poem Sall...@aol.com
* Indigenous Voices Cathleen A. McGuire
* Smells Like Money Mark McCaffrey
* DEEPEST ECOLOGY John Clifford
* Technobia John Wall
* Re: On What Do We Depend? Alan McGowen
* RE: McClellan's view is dangerous (Was: vegie thread John Wall
* Nondual ecology : Online seminar John McClellan
* Re: McClellan's view is dangerous (Was: vegie thread Gu...@aol.com
* Re: Deep Ecology Writing Ed Lehner
* Last midwest greetings Ed Lehner
* Re: From the Book NONDUAL ECOLOGY: Economics of Ecology, and the Ed
Lehner
* Re: From the Book NONDUAL ECOLOGY: Economics of Ecology, and the Rich
Coon
* Re: From the Book NONDUAL ECOLOGY: Economics of Ecology, and the Rich
Coon
* RESONANCE OF PONDERANCE ch...@health.state.ny.us
* Re: Zel send this on to non-ecology Roselma L. Quinn
* Re: Some Deep Ecology thoughts ... gailnnadia
* Re: More on Bowing, Civilization & Technology -Reply Susan Ross
* thinking ecology Chris Francovich
* Re: Zel send this on to non-ecology Alan McGowen
* deep ecology writing Betsy Barnum
* Trouble in Paradise:SyzthemmmKraschzctds%##!??+==... John McClellan
* Re: So How DO We Live? Stephen Evans
* Re: More on Bowing, Civilization & Technology Bruce Nygren
* PERFECTION MoCt...@aol.com
* Re: SOME PROBLEMS TO ADDRES Joseph Milne
* Re: rainmaking and boat house fires Joseph Milne
* A Short Comment Maurice George
* Language and Half the World Cheryl Foltos
* Re: Responsibility for technology Rich Coon
* Re: So How DO We Live? Jocelyn J. Paquette Bob Ewing
* On Communication John McClellan
* Dancing with the earth Connie Baranowski
* Re: Lurkers Come Out, Tired Subbers Go Free! Yvonne Garcia
* Re: AUTHOR'S CLOSING STATEMENT John McClellan
* Sorcerer's Apprentice and Ox Herder Philip M. Bunch
o Re: Sorcerer's Apprentice and Ox Herder Rich Coon
* OPENING & CLOSING STATEMENTS RClark
* One lurker's view The Perry - Chute Household
* Re: precision and language David Lachapelle
* Re: On What Do We Depend? Philip M. Bunch
* Re: SOME PROBLEMS TO ADDRES Gu...@aol.com
* Re: SOME PROBLEMS TO ADDRES paula willoquet
* Re: AUTHOR'S CLOSING STATEMENT UPDATED Betsy Barnum
* Staying in Touch Don Roper
o Re: Staying in Touch J2Ca...@aol.com
* Redwood Trees Appear Cheryl Foltos
* Resonance Sall...@aol.com
* Re:Resonance Cheryl Foltos
* Re: SOME PROBLEMS TO ADDRES Bruce Nygren
* On Horses, Tractors, Planning & Thanks Ray Lanier
* A Poet Speaks John McClellan
* Re: AUTHOR'S CLOSING STATEMENT UPDATED John McClellan
* Re: AUTHOR'S CLOSING STATEMENT (fwd) John McClellan
* LAST CALL FOR LURKERS!! John McClellan
o Re: LAST CALL FOR LURKERS!! David Fuller
* What a Relief! Mark McCaffrey
* ending thoughts el...@winternet.com
* Ishmael John Wish
* Sunday Afternoon John McClellan
* River, truck, graffiti, ice, moon Betsy Barnum
* Re: THE DEEPEST ECOLOGY:" LOVE" Rich Coon
* buddhism, materialsim, etc. Koerner, Darrell
* Re: SOME PROBLEMS TO ADDRES Stephen Evans
* Re: THE DEEPEST ECOLOGY:" LOVE" Betsy Barnum
* Re: THE DEEPEST ECOLOGY:" LOVE" John McClellan
* Looking up Stephen Evans
* PARTING THOUGHT/THANKS MoCt...@aol.com
* The Buddha's remarks to the Kalamas Philip M. Bunch
* Re: SOME PROBLEMS TO ADDRES Joseph Milne
* Re: THE DEEPEST ECOLOGY:" LOVE" Gu...@aol.com
* Thank you Gail Stewart
* May Our Work Continue to Florish John McClellan
* Re: THE DEEPEST ECOLOGY:" LOVE" Betsy Barnum
* Re: Looking Out John McClellan
* Virtual Meta-mind John McClellan
* Our Host, Don Roper John McClellan

Last message date: Sun 24 Nov 1996 - 00:00:-7487 MST
Archived on: Mon Dec 09 1996 - 16:49:08 MST


> Being Sentient: In Nothing Sacred?
>
> Sun, 17 Nov 1996
> Mark McCaffrey (mccaffrm csf.Colorado.EDU)
>

- If you scratch a cynic,

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