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David Jansen
Oct 18, 2018, 9:19:53 AM10/18/18
to
Hey cable gurus!
I found these zero-loss splitters on Amazon and wondered if they could
be used to distribute my Comcast TV and internet service?
https://www.amazon.com/CESS-F-Type-Connector-Splitter-Adapter/dp/B01G0Q4HF6/
I found these zero-loss splitters on Amazon and wondered if they could
be used to distribute my Comcast TV and internet service?
https://www.amazon.com/CESS-F-Type-Connector-Splitter-Adapter/dp/B01G0Q4HF6/
Adam H. Kerman
Oct 18, 2018, 1:07:48 PM10/18/18
to
that's even possible.
I don't understand what you're thinking of doing. Typically, you'd have
a female F connector on a device like a cable modem, as devices
typically have jacks and not plugs. You're much better off doing the
typical short run of coax between the device and the first splitter with
male connectors (plugs) on both ends. The point is to avoid too much
stress on the jack in the device.
You're better off hooking things up in the usual manner using balanced
or unbalanced splitters, depending on how many branches you're feeding,
and doing everything you can to minimize the number of branches.
And make life easier for yourself by terminating all coax runs with
plugs, not jacks. Then you don't need specialty splitters like the one
in the picture.
VanguardLH
Oct 18, 2018, 2:06:58 PM10/18/18
to
amplifies the signal would be the only way to compensate for the
attenuation incumbent with every connection along with /splitting/ the
one signal and its strength among multiple outputs. Each connection
incurs some signal loss. Each output of a passive splitter only gets a
part of the input signal.
Not sure where you would use a 1 male 2 female splitter since all the
cables will have male F-type connectors on both ends. Perhaps it would
use the male connector to connect to a female connector on another
splitter; i.e., you'd be splitting in half the signal output from one of
the outputs of a prior splitter. If you need more outputs from a
splitter, don't cascade them by screwing them together. Each connection
results in signal loss and weak mechanical integrity. Instead get a
splitter with more outputs. That is, try to run lengths of unbroken
cabling to the devices rather than keep splitting them at physical
locations where it is convenient to you to use shorter cables. If you
notice what a cable TV installer does, they install a splitter from the
main line to your house and run solid (unbroken, non-slit) cables from
that one splitter to each device location. They don't keep adding more
and more splitters that are inline or in series while also adding more
and more connections with shorter cables.
For unused outputs on splitters, some users just leave them unused.
Other than laziness or ignorance, not sure why anyone would leave
unterminated a splitter output or even the end of a cable, like at a
wall plate. Each splitter output, each dangling end of a cable, every
wall plate coax connector that are unused should be terminated (e.g.,
https://preview.tinyurl.com/y77fkqa6). I've been using termination caps
for decades. Just seems obvious they are needed since cables are
themselves antennae. Termination caps aren't just for outside splitters
to protect the splitter from rain. They are also eliminate ringing and
RF noise; see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6S_YaRvlAic.
To what will you be connecting the screw-on male connector of that
splitter? The cables have male F-type connectors at both ends. You
want a splitter that has 3 females: 1 in, 2 or more out. Examples:
https://preview.tinyurl.com/ydzxeelb
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a1/5c/d1/a15cd15e9297b84a3abb19227f384004.jpg
The more splits, the more attenuation per output since a passive
splitter must distribute the same input signal to all outputs. However,
multiple splitters in series will perform the same attenuation per
output, so your choice is to split immediately and run cables directly
to each device or split as you go. Just remember that every connection
incurs some attenuation in and of itself. No idea what you plan for
your cable routing.
https://www.tselectronic.com/tech_notes/digital_splitters.php
Are you going to use fixed lengths of bought cable with the male F-type
connectors already crimped onto the ends? Or are you going to cut the
cable to length from [main] splitter (best to only use one) to the
device end (cable goes to directly to device or to a wall plate)? If
you're going to cut your own lengths of cable, get the right tools for
the job. The cheapies that just have you flare out the braided shield
and get compressed with a screw-on barrel don't have good grounding
connections due to oxidation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_9H3dW9C6k
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAiCdkwhguI
Although there are tools to cut the outside sheathing without damaging
the braided shielding, you can use a utility knife as shown in the first
video. However, don't cut through the sheathing. Just score it. There
should still be sheathing under your cut. Then you twist off the
sheathing which tears at the score mark. With fixed-length store-bought
cable, the ends are already on it but you'll end up having to buy
lengths longer than needed which means having to coil it up somewhere.
With custom length cables, you don't have any excess coiled up somewhere
but you'll need the tools and crimp-on connectors to put your own on the
end of the cable.
Adam H. Kerman
Oct 18, 2018, 3:04:11 PM10/18/18
to
VanguardLH <V...@nguard.LH> wrote:
>. . .
>For unused outputs on splitters, some users just leave them unused.
>Other than laziness or ignorance, not sure why anyone would leave
>unterminated a splitter output or even the end of a cable, like at a
>wall plate.
On rare occassions, the signal is too strong. This was the case where I
lived 10 years ago. There were a couple of locations in which I had to
threw in a splitter to reduce signal. This was particularly the case as
I installed a dual run of coax into the living room, where I was going
to have multiple DVRs and a cable modem. I had to reduce the signal to
the cable modem. The unused port was handy for making a quick connection
to something else without changing anything else, anyway.
>Each splitter output, each dangling end of a cable, every
>wall plate coax connector that are unused should be terminated (e.g.,
>https://preview.tinyurl.com/y77fkqa6). I've been using termination caps
>for decades.
That's a good idea. I did that on CAT 5e for telephone in locations that
I didn't immediately install a jack, but never bothered for coax. I
should remember to do that in future.
>. . .
>Are you going to use fixed lengths of bought cable with the male F-type
>connectors already crimped onto the ends?
Ouch! Don't crimp. It's much more difficult, outside of a factory, to
crimp. Yeah, the tool is cheaper. You'll get a superior result with the
compression tool and plugs and jacks meant to be installed with that
tool.
>. . .
>. . .
>For unused outputs on splitters, some users just leave them unused.
>Other than laziness or ignorance, not sure why anyone would leave
>unterminated a splitter output or even the end of a cable, like at a
>wall plate.
lived 10 years ago. There were a couple of locations in which I had to
threw in a splitter to reduce signal. This was particularly the case as
I installed a dual run of coax into the living room, where I was going
to have multiple DVRs and a cable modem. I had to reduce the signal to
the cable modem. The unused port was handy for making a quick connection
to something else without changing anything else, anyway.
>Each splitter output, each dangling end of a cable, every
>wall plate coax connector that are unused should be terminated (e.g.,
>https://preview.tinyurl.com/y77fkqa6). I've been using termination caps
>for decades.
I didn't immediately install a jack, but never bothered for coax. I
should remember to do that in future.
>. . .
>Are you going to use fixed lengths of bought cable with the male F-type
>connectors already crimped onto the ends?
crimp. Yeah, the tool is cheaper. You'll get a superior result with the
compression tool and plugs and jacks meant to be installed with that
tool.
>. . .
Frank
Oct 18, 2018, 6:16:37 PM10/18/18
to
powered. When ever I get a tech in the house I often have them look
over these things.
I have a powered ether-net splitter and find no speed reduction.
Ned Nemsheffer
Oct 18, 2018, 7:26:09 PM10/18/18
to
On 10/18/2018 2:06 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
> Not sure where you would use a 1 male 2 female splitter since all the
> cables will have male F-type connectors on both ends.
You could screw the male into the modem port.
> cables will have male F-type connectors on both ends.
Cable from street to female port 1
Cable out from female port 2 to next device.
I'm no expert but I think the whole thing is moot because I doubt the "splitter" shown has the proper components to split/isolate ports.
VanguardLH
Oct 19, 2018, 1:28:33 AM10/19/18
to
Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> VanguardLH wrote:
>
>> Are you going to use fixed lengths of bought cable with the male
>> F-type connectors already crimped onto the ends?
>
> Ouch! Don't crimp. It's much more difficult, outside of a factory, to
> crimp. Yeah, the tool is cheaper. You'll get a superior result with the
> compression tool and plugs and jacks meant to be installed with that
> tool.
The "bought cable" means you are NOT customizing its length and adding
your own connectors. You buy the cable already made to a specific
length and the connectors are already crimped onto the cable ends. Rare
would be a bought cable in the available lengths would exactly match
your runs from the splitter at the service entry point to each device or
wall jack, so you end up with extra cable coiled up in the walls or
stuffed behind furniture.
The crimp-on F-type connectors where you slide into a ferrel and "crimp"
by the tool forcing in a plastic plug into the ferrule to lock the cable
inside the connector are easy but can sometimes be too long. I've got
the older style which was an actual crimper. It is the same tool that
I've seen professional installers use with a hexagonal crimping jaw. It
is ratcheted which means it won't release until the barrel has been
sufficiently crimped around the cable and ferrule. Obviously you use
different connector types for crimping, but the job looks just like a
factory did it.
Instead of the compression styles shown in the following pic:
https://cdn.instructables.com/FZ9/WLSQ/FCZE7R8M/FZ9WLSQFCZE7R8M.LARGE.jpg
or one looking like that shown at:
https://www.summitsource.com/Assets/ProductImages/COSQ10.jpg
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/HImTA1ge_RQ/maxresdefault.jpg
Since the center solid wire is the center connector, there's no problem
of a flaky connection to it. What you want is a secure connection of
the grounding exterior of the connector to the shielding in the cable
and the cable securely fastened to the connector.
While I have seen round barrels on connectors which require using a
ratcheting crimper that has round dies, I don't remember seeing those
for F-type connectors, only BNC connectors.
> VanguardLH wrote:
>
>> Are you going to use fixed lengths of bought cable with the male
>> F-type connectors already crimped onto the ends?
>
> Ouch! Don't crimp. It's much more difficult, outside of a factory, to
> crimp. Yeah, the tool is cheaper. You'll get a superior result with the
> compression tool and plugs and jacks meant to be installed with that
> tool.
your own connectors. You buy the cable already made to a specific
length and the connectors are already crimped onto the cable ends. Rare
would be a bought cable in the available lengths would exactly match
your runs from the splitter at the service entry point to each device or
wall jack, so you end up with extra cable coiled up in the walls or
stuffed behind furniture.
The crimp-on F-type connectors where you slide into a ferrel and "crimp"
by the tool forcing in a plastic plug into the ferrule to lock the cable
inside the connector are easy but can sometimes be too long. I've got
the older style which was an actual crimper. It is the same tool that
I've seen professional installers use with a hexagonal crimping jaw. It
is ratcheted which means it won't release until the barrel has been
sufficiently crimped around the cable and ferrule. Obviously you use
different connector types for crimping, but the job looks just like a
factory did it.
Instead of the compression styles shown in the following pic:
https://cdn.instructables.com/FZ9/WLSQ/FCZE7R8M/FZ9WLSQFCZE7R8M.LARGE.jpg
or one looking like that shown at:
https://www.summitsource.com/Assets/ProductImages/COSQ10.jpg
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/HImTA1ge_RQ/maxresdefault.jpg
Since the center solid wire is the center connector, there's no problem
of a flaky connection to it. What you want is a secure connection of
the grounding exterior of the connector to the shielding in the cable
and the cable securely fastened to the connector.
While I have seen round barrels on connectors which require using a
ratcheting crimper that has round dies, I don't remember seeing those
for F-type connectors, only BNC connectors.
David Jansen
Oct 19, 2018, 7:47:09 AM10/19/18
to
Frank
Oct 19, 2018, 9:15:31 AM10/19/18
to
On 10/18/2018 8:17 PM, Bill wrote:
> Coax splitters can be passive (unpowered) or active (powered), but
> there's no such thing as an Ethernet splitter. The closest would
> probably be an Ethernet switch.
>
> Also, contrary to what seems to be a common myth, Internet speed isn't
> related to signal strength unless the strength is right at the ragged
> edge of being either too high or too low (usually around +-17dbM or so).
> There's a wide middle ground where changes in signal strength have no
> effect on speed.
>
I would not call it a switch. I just plugged it in and forgot it and
can use either computer. Download speed where computers are located is
about 3X wifi. It's 180 Mbps right now.
> there's no such thing as an Ethernet splitter. The closest would
> probably be an Ethernet switch.
>
> Also, contrary to what seems to be a common myth, Internet speed isn't
> related to signal strength unless the strength is right at the ragged
> edge of being either too high or too low (usually around +-17dbM or so).
> There's a wide middle ground where changes in signal strength have no
> effect on speed.
>
I would not call it a switch. I just plugged it in and forgot it and
can use either computer. Download speed where computers are located is
about 3X wifi. It's 180 Mbps right now.
Frank
Oct 19, 2018, 11:58:14 AM10/19/18
to
On 10/19/2018 9:36 AM, Bill wrote:
> I guess you're clumsily describing an Ethernet hub. I was hesitant to go
> there because they all but disappeared over 30 years ago. I haven't
> actually seen one in at least that long.
>
> Curious, what stops you from saying what it is?
>
Too old to crawl under the desk and see what it says.
> there because they all but disappeared over 30 years ago. I haven't
> actually seen one in at least that long.
>
> Curious, what stops you from saying what it is?
>
Too old to crawl under the desk and see what it says.
Curley Bush
Oct 19, 2018, 12:03:57 PM10/19/18
to
On 10/18/2018 8:17 PM, Bill wrote:
> Coax splitters can be passive (unpowered) or active (powered), but
> there's no such thing as an Ethernet splitter. The closest would
> probably be an Ethernet switch.
https://eastmanreference.com/the-difference-between-an-ethernet-splitter-a-switch-and-a-hub
> Coax splitters can be passive (unpowered) or active (powered), but
> there's no such thing as an Ethernet splitter. The closest would
> probably be an Ethernet switch.
Adam H. Kerman
Oct 19, 2018, 12:26:09 PM10/19/18
to
VanguardLH <V...@nguard.LH> wrote:
>Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>VanguardLH wrote:
>>>Are you going to use fixed lengths of bought cable with the male
>>>F-type connectors already crimped onto the ends?
>>Ouch! Don't crimp. It's much more difficult, outside of a factory, to
>>crimp. Yeah, the tool is cheaper. You'll get a superior result with the
>>compression tool and plugs and jacks meant to be installed with that
>>tool. . . .
>Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>VanguardLH wrote:
>>>Are you going to use fixed lengths of bought cable with the male
>>>F-type connectors already crimped onto the ends?
>>Ouch! Don't crimp. It's much more difficult, outside of a factory, to
>>crimp. Yeah, the tool is cheaper. You'll get a superior result with the
>>compression tool and plugs and jacks meant to be installed with that
>The "bought cable" means you are NOT customizing its length and adding
>your own connectors.
tools and in favor of compression tools.
Thanks for the comments.
VanguardLH
Oct 19, 2018, 1:08:05 PM10/19/18
to
Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> VanguardLH wrote:
>
> VanguardLH wrote:
>
>> Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>
>>> Ouch! Don't crimp. It's much more difficult, outside of a factory,
>>> to crimp. Yeah, the tool is cheaper. You'll get a superior result
>>> with the compression tool and plugs and jacks meant to be installed
>>> with that tool. . . .
>>
>> The "bought cable" means you are NOT customizing its length and
>> adding your own connectors.
>
> You're right. I'm just offering my general objection here to crimping
> tools and in favor of compression tools.
Since the installers still use crimp-style connectors, why do you think
>>
>>> Ouch! Don't crimp. It's much more difficult, outside of a factory,
>>> to crimp. Yeah, the tool is cheaper. You'll get a superior result
>>> with the compression tool and plugs and jacks meant to be installed
>>> with that tool. . . .
>>
>> The "bought cable" means you are NOT customizing its length and
>> adding your own connectors.
>
> You're right. I'm just offering my general objection here to crimping
> tools and in favor of compression tools.
they're less quality or less secure than compression-style connectors?
Both use friction as the mechanical hold on the cable's sheath. Both
are actually compression type connectors. Newer (compression) doesn't
necessitate better (crimp). The only advantage that I see for
compression is they are more watertight (only from the cable end) - but
the OP didn't say he was routing his cables outside his house. Anyone
doing any type wiring (outside or even inside within the walls) should
know there should be a dip or hanging loop (aka drip loop) in the wire
just before the connection or box to ensure water drips off the loop
instead of hitting the connection.
Compression connectors cost about $1 apiece (much less if bought in a
100 pack but I doubt the OP needs 50 custom length cables). Crimp-on
connectors are half the cost. Even gold-plated crimp-on connecters are
cheaper than standard compression connectors. For the OP's one-time
job, the cost difference would be small. In addition, if the connector
is exposed to the elements (i.e., outside) then you should be using a
connector designed for that exposure. There are watertight crimp-on
connectors, too. As I recall, they use an o-ring for the seal. A
compression connector is only watertight around the sheathing, not
inside the connector itself.
Adam H. Kerman
Oct 19, 2018, 5:24:03 PM10/19/18
to
VanguardLH <V...@nguard.LH> wrote:
>Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>VanguardLH wrote:
>>>Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>>>Ouch! Don't crimp. It's much more difficult, outside of a factory,
>>>>to crimp. Yeah, the tool is cheaper. You'll get a superior result
>>>>with the compression tool and plugs and jacks meant to be installed
>>>>with that tool. . . .
>>>The "bought cable" means you are NOT customizing its length and
>>>adding your own connectors.
>>You're right. I'm just offering my general objection here to crimping
>>tools and in favor of compression tools.
>Since the installers still use crimp-style connectors, why do you think
>they're less quality or less secure than compression-style connectors?
Huh? Comcast installers around here use compression connectors and are
>Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>VanguardLH wrote:
>>>Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>>>Ouch! Don't crimp. It's much more difficult, outside of a factory,
>>>>to crimp. Yeah, the tool is cheaper. You'll get a superior result
>>>>with the compression tool and plugs and jacks meant to be installed
>>>>with that tool. . . .
>>>The "bought cable" means you are NOT customizing its length and
>>>adding your own connectors.
>>You're right. I'm just offering my general objection here to crimping
>>tools and in favor of compression tools.
>Since the installers still use crimp-style connectors, why do you think
>they're less quality or less secure than compression-style connectors?
required to replace any crimped-on connector with a compression connection,
unless the cord's connector was obviously attached during manufacture.
>Both use friction as the mechanical hold on the cable's sheath. Both
>are actually compression type connectors. Newer (compression) doesn't
>necessitate better (crimp).
to get it right the first try.
>. . .
VanguardLH
Oct 19, 2018, 8:57:38 PM10/19/18
to
Adam H. Kerman wrote:
> A skilled installer can master crimping. With compression, one is able
> to get it right the first try.
Both require the proper tools to do the job right. You don't use a
> A skilled installer can master crimping. With compression, one is able
> to get it right the first try.
slip-jaw pliers to push in the compression plug and you don't use one
for crimping, either. With cripming, you get a ratcheting crimper that
manages by just how much to crimp and in a uniform manner. With
compression, you still need a tool to push in the compression plug.
I've done both. Neither is easier nor harder than the other. Stripping
and prepping the cable is same with either connector type, and there's
even a tool to make that easy. Oh, and yes, you can screw up a
compression connector by not pushing the cable in so the center
insulator seats against the internal shoulder of the compression
connector, and you can make the same mistake with a crimp connector.
About the only difference is the amount of force needed to apply to the
jaws of a compression tool versus the force to crank down on a crimper.
Sorry, but I don't see a 93-old granny crawling around a house to route
cabling. Anyone that can't open a jar of pickles has no business doing
cabling.
Adam H. Kerman
Oct 20, 2018, 12:12:57 AM10/20/18
to
VanguardLH <V...@nguard.LH> wrote:
>Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>A skilled installer can master crimping. With compression, one is able
>>to get it right the first try.
>Both require the proper tools to do the job right.
Yes, that's a given.
>Adam H. Kerman wrote:
>>A skilled installer can master crimping. With compression, one is able
>>to get it right the first try.
>Both require the proper tools to do the job right.
>You don't use a
>slip-jaw pliers to push in the compression plug and you don't use one
>for crimping, either. With cripming, you get a ratcheting crimper that
>manages by just how much to crimp and in a uniform manner. With
>compression, you still need a tool to push in the compression plug.
Fine.
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