David Carradine - my take
Jim Beaver
appears to have played out.
I knew David slightly. We lived across the street from one another for a
time, though I never met him in all that time. I didn't actually meet him
until we did a film together.
Actually, I knew a few of the Carradine clan tangentially. I interviewed
Keith for an article I was doing on his father, years before Keith and I
worked together on DEADWOOD. Shortly after my interview with Keith, I was
able to interview his father John Carradine, a most gracious man.
Years later, I attended John's funeral and saw David up close for the first
time, despite the fact of our having been neighbors for several months.
David spoke at his father's memorial, and wept in doing so, and apologized
profusely to his father for "failing" him.
Some time later, I did a film with him in Mexico. I found him to be a
delight, a serious and dedicated actor, yet a friendly and charming and
outgoing man. We talked about his father, whom he idolized, and he was
happy to learn that I'd met him and seen him onstage. We talked about his
early years playing Hotspur and Malcolm and Tybalt, and how his dad had put
on a production of HAMLET with himself as Hamlet and David as Laertes simply
in order to give David a lesson in Shakespeare. We talked a lot about
acting. I reminded him that my best friend had accidentally busted him in
the nose during a fight scene in another film, and he smiled ruefully and
said he remembered it well. I had been a fan of David's since his SHANE TV
series, which ran while I was a teenager. But I never talked about that.
We just talked, actor to actor, and I enjoyed him very much.
One day, walking to lunch, I asked him if he was enjoying himself on this
film, an unremarkable but honorable little Western with James Caan and Brian
Dennehy also in the cast. David smiled and said, "This film is a sparkling
jewel in the platter of shit that is my career." For a man who'd won a
Theatre World award for ROYAL HUNT OF THE SUN on Broadway, a National Board
of Review Best Actor award for BOUND FOR GLORY, an Emmy nomination and four
Golden Globe nominations, this remark was a bit of insight into the modest
charm of a fine actor.
David ended his autobiography with a poem, part of which reads:
Yes! we made it to the top.
Grabbed up all that we could find.
We didn't know just when to stop.
We left ourselves somewhere behind.
If after all the toil and pain,
There's a spark that still remains,
The blood may wash out in the rain,
And maybe we can start again.
I'm really, really sorry about this news.
Jim Beaver
--
Life's That Way: A Memoir, by Jim Beaver
Amy Einhorn Books/G.P. Putnam's Sons
www.lifesthatway.com
Chef Juke
<jumb...@prodigy.spam> wrote:
<snip>
>Yes! we made it to the top.
>Grabbed up all that we could find.
>We didn't know just when to stop.
>We left ourselves somewhere behind.
>If after all the toil and pain,
>There's a spark that still remains,
>The blood may wash out in the rain,
>And maybe we can start again.
>
>I'm really, really sorry about this news.
>
>Jim Beaver
Thanks (once again) for the personal insight, Jim.
It is always a challenge for the outside observer to separate our
PERCEPTIONS of who we think a performe ris from their images on the
screen or stage, and the reality that lies somewhere underneath.
Sometimes we get a clue....but only just that..a clue.
I always appreciated the Carradines clan's work....especially that of
John, beginning with the first time I saw 'The Grapes of Wrath' as a
kid.
RIP David
-Chef Juke
"EVERYbody Eats when they come to MY house!"
http://www.chefjuke.com
Thriceshy
Thanks, Jim. When I read the news, I zipped over to IMDB to take a
look at the work he's been doing, found a gaggle of things in
production. My first thought? "But he was working!" That's not
really the only measure, is it?
My poor 11 year old is going to be very sad--he adores David in Wild
West Tech. And I'm going to be very sad because I was one of those
"Kung Fu Kids" who idolized David, was always thrilled to see him in
whatever.
K
Kris Baker
news:94SVl.8636$Lr6....@flpi143.ffdc.sbc.com...
Thank you, Jim
Indeed, David did some fine things -- but the business is
unfair to real actors, especially those who are not the
typical matinee idol types.
"...platter of shit that is my career." I don't know about
others, but I know lots of people who feel that way. But
I doubt Carradine would have changed his career choice,
even when young with the knowledge that he'd be doing
an ad for yellowbook.com
A question, Jim.
Many romanticize him as his role in Kung Fu. (I always
thought he may have been embarrassed about it, because
I'd seen his other work).
I hope I'm not correct, and that he enjoyed it.
Thanks, Jim
Kris
Jim Beaver
>
> A question, Jim.
>
> Many romanticize him as his role in Kung Fu. (I always
> thought he may have been embarrassed about it, because
> I'd seen his other work).
>
> I hope I'm not correct, and that he enjoyed it.
I have no idea. We never talked about KUNG FU. I wasn't terribly familiar
with it, anyway. I think, from things I've read, that he was seriously
interested in the Eastern philosophy aspect of the show, but didn't take the
show itself particularly seriously. One has to remember, too, that MAKING a
show like KUNG FU, or any of the other shows that gain fans deeply attached
to the spirit or philosophy of the show, is a far different thing from
believing in it. Even a show like KUNG FU, for all its spirituality, is a
job of work requiring tedium, mechanical tasks, and much that is mundane.
I've been working on SUPERNATURAL for four years now. People ask me all the
time if spooky things ever happen on the set, or if I ever get caught up in
the spirit world we deal with. I tell 'em that we're just making widgets.
My widget is a show called SUPERNATURAL. Spiritual/spooky/occult notions
are in the perception of the viewer. They don't have much place in the
manufacture.
In his autobiography, David talks about loving KUNG FU at first, being
influenced into an interest in Eastern philosophy and martial arts as a
result of it, and about being disappointed in its decline. So it seems to
me he enjoyed it while it was good.
Jim Beaver
Kris Baker
Thank you. That's a better response than I gave to the
person who took life lessons from the show.
I watched it a few times, in different years. It seemed
to wither a bit quicker than most, maybe because there
weren't too many plotlines available (without getting into
silly season).
I guess the people who want to believe the fantasies,
are the most loyal. We skeptics aren't as much fun.
Kris
If you get work, that's good.
If you enjoy the work, that's better.
If you can leave it behind, you're lucky.
La N
>
> David ended his autobiography with a poem, part of which reads:
>
> Yes! we made it to the top.
> Grabbed up all that we could find.
> We didn't know just when to stop.
> We left ourselves somewhere behind.
> If after all the toil and pain,
> There's a spark that still remains,
> The blood may wash out in the rain,
> And maybe we can start again.
>
I'm wracking my brain trying to remember the predominant issues that brought
him and his wife to appear on the show of a psychic (was it John Edward?).
I was channel surfing a couple or so years ago, and there he was sitting
next to his fairly recent (and latest) wife, and they were speaking to/about
this psychic about how this medium was able to help them get some closure.
I recall thinking at the time, wow ... he seems so troubled ....
- nilita, who wishes this is a time that brain fog melted away ...
Radioacti...@hotmail.com
fascinating details.
Existentially,
BRYAN STYBLE/somewhere
Kris Baker
news:iPTVl.30592$PH1.2968@edtnps82...
Yes. It was a (reported) 2004 episode of "Crossing Over with
John Edward" - which seems odd because he and that wife didn't
marry until Dec 26th, 2004 or 2005. (The series began in 1999.)
I thought maybe it was on YouTube or info on the web, but I
see nothing.
I see comments online saying that he (or/or his latest wife
Anne Biermann) were Scientologists; there's images of him
performing at the Celebrity Center.
Kris
Apairateef
Nice write up Jim...
Seems like he was internally a very sad man...
S
Thriceshy
> "Jim Beaver" <jumble...@prodigy.spam> wrote in message
>
> - Show quoted text -
I was lucky--I was young enough that Kung Fu fit in with my Bonanza,
Big Valley, and Bewitched-themed play quite well. While I never took
a "life philosophy" from Kung Fu, I did take a fondness for Mr.
Carradine which has continued through the years.
K
Kris Baker
news:7c0b0724-8383-4e88...@l28g2000vba.googlegroups.com...
K
-------------------------------------
Maybe I was just too old for Kung Fu (it first came on after
we were married)....although my husband did take life lessons
from Bewitched, he being a major fan of Ms Montgomery.
Kris
Kris Baker
news:prose1235-7F719...@newsclstr02.news.prodigy.com...
> Carradine...." Who would have thought Carradine could avoid the "Kung Fu
> star" obit tag?
It was obviously written by someone born after 1977, someone
entirely mystified by the yellowbook.com ad ;)
Kris
Del
"Kris Baker" <paralle...@gmail.com> wrote >
> A question, Jim.
>
> Many romanticize him as his role in Kung Fu. (I always
> thought he may have been embarrassed about it, because
> I'd seen his other work).
>
> I hope I'm not correct, and that he enjoyed it.
>
> Thanks, Jim
>
> Kris
I know the Q is directed to Jim (Beaver), but let
me put in my 2 cents worth.
I don't think he felt embarrassed by the role. And if
he did, it was short lived. The TV series ran 1972-75.
In 1978 he played a similar role in "Circle of Iron."
Like the TV series it combined martial arts
with Eastern philosophy, Zen, etc. The story was
conceived by Bruce Lee, James Coburn and Stirling Silliphant,
circa 1968. Under Lee, the story was titled "The Silent Flute."
Lee died before the project was completed. If Carradine
felt embarrassed, or type cast by the earlier TV role I
doubt that he would have accepted this role.
On a personal note, I wasn't that impressed with the film.
It was a good story, and it LOOKED good, but in the
end it was just silly; and not nearly as clever as it thought
it was. It had an all-star cast, but unfortunately the guy in the lead
role would have been better cast on TV's BayWatch. This
guy ruined it for me.
Though I don't think DC felt embarrassed over his work
on the TV series there is one caveat (though not on his work).
My memory is somewhat shaky here, but I seem to recall that
The TV series was also a Bruce Lee project. Lee was to play
in the starring role (Caine). The producers of the show didn't
want an Asian playing an Asian----even if it was the lead role.
I believe that's how Carradine got the part. Again, I'm not certain
however, if things went down exactly this way. I enjoyed the
TV series. He makes a better Asian than John Wayne's
Genghis Khan I must add!
I do a lot of hiking in the Southwest and West---
Big Bend, Arches, and Canyon Lands NPs are my
favorites. I always carry my trusty "Caine staff" on my trips.
Caine was quite an influence. In "Pulp Fiction" when
hit man extradionaire Samuel Jackson sees the light
of God and converts, he says he will "be like Caine
on Kung-Fu and walk the earth."
So there Kris, although you weren't impressed with his
TV work, I see nothing to indicate that he was ever embarrassed
by the show.
Del
La N
"Kris Baker" <paralle...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:78r6dtF...@mid.individual.net...
> > Maybe I was just too old for Kung Fu (it first came on after
> we were married)....although my husband did take life lessons
> from Bewitched, he being a major fan of Ms Montgomery.
>
I got my life lessons from the Beast, as played by Ron Perlman, in TVs
Beauty and the Beast. He was so wise and gentle and sexy ... in a way ...;p
- nilita
Aje RavenStar
"Terry del Fuego" <t_del...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:8pog251hqghsr0b6c...@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 4 Jun 2009 12:30:06 -0500, "Kris Baker"
> <paralle...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>I watched it a few times, in different years. It seemed
>>to wither a bit quicker than most, maybe because there
>>weren't too many plotlines available (without getting into
>>silly season).
>
> up with at some point in the 1980s (long enough ago that the station
> was showing it from film) and found that I really enjoyed it. Not
> sure what I'd make of it now, but I've had a soft spot for Mr.
> Carradine since then. I'm sorry he's gone and would like to join
> those thanking Jim Beaver for his post.
As would I. Splendid job, Jim. May have to print that out and tuck it into
my copy of Life's That Way.
Something about this situation just doesn't smell right, though.
Carradine's situation just doesn't fit or jibe with what happened to him.
Brad Ferguson
> On Thu, 4 Jun 2009 12:30:06 -0500, "Kris Baker"
> <paralle...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >I watched it a few times, in different years. It seemed
> >to wither a bit quicker than most, maybe because there
> >weren't too many plotlines available (without getting into
> >silly season).
>
> Other than the pilot, I never saw it when it was new. Finally caught
> up with at some point in the 1980s (long enough ago that the station
> was showing it from film) and found that I really enjoyed it. Not
> sure what I'd make of it now, but I've had a soft spot for Mr.
> Carradine since then. I'm sorry he's gone and would like to join
> those thanking Jim Beaver for his post.
I worked at ABC for a few months toward the end of 1974. The guy who
got me in there was part of the purposeful killing of the Kung Fu
series. There was a U.S. senator named John Pastore who was chairman
of the communications subcommitee. This bunch had a lot to do with
federal policy regarding the TV networks, and Pastore was not exactly a
shy boy when it came to grabbing headlines. If there was even a hint
of sex or violence in a TV program, Pastore was on it like a maggot on
meat. Pastore was in full cry in the early 1970s, and so ABC decided
to toss him a public-relations bone: To divert Pastore's criticism of
all the sex and violence then being shown on ABC, the network would get
rid of Kung Fu, one of the most popular and least offensive programs on
the air. (The problem was that ABC did not understand *why* Kung Fu was
popular. Broadcasting executives hate that kind of thing, and so the
show had to go.) ABC changed Kung Fu's time slot three times during the
fall of 1974 and pre-empted it at will. The audience soon lost track
of the series, and it was cancelled the following spring.
Kris Baker
My mother-in-law had SUCH a crush on Ron Perlman. I asked
her if she'd seen him without the B&TB makeup. She hadn't.
Kris
Kris Baker
news:h0a212$jin$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
His ex-wife had charged him with some odd stuff during
the divorce. If you want to read it, it's on alt.gossip.celebrities.
I read it, but won't repeat it.
I'm feeling dirty as I read the gossip, but I still do.
it's sad to think he'll be remembered as much for this,
as his career (at least among the Kill Bill crowd).
Kris
Aje RavenStar
Yeah, well, having two ex's, I take that sort of thing with a grain of salt.
I'm just kinda surprised no one's invoked Bob Crane yet.
Brigid Nelson
I always thought Vincent was a creepy stalker. My crush is Ron Perlman
as Hellboy.
b
R H Draney
>
>Kris Baker wrote:
>> "La N" <nilita20...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:KU%Vl.30653$PH1.19516@edtnps82...
>>>
>>> Beauty and the Beast. He was so wise and gentle and sexy ... in a way
>>> ...;p
>>
>> her if she'd seen him without the B&TB makeup. She hadn't.
>
>I always thought Vincent was a creepy stalker. My crush is Ron Perlman
>as Hellboy.
You people are deranged...I suppose you thought he was teh hottness in "The Name
of the Rose" and "Quest for Fire" too....r
--
A pessimist sees the glass as half empty.
An optometrist asks whether you see the glass
more full like this?...or like this?
Brigid Nelson
> Brigid Nelson filted:
>> Kris Baker wrote:
>>> "La N" <nilita20...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>>> news:KU%Vl.30653$PH1.19516@edtnps82...
>>>> I got my life lessons from the Beast, as played by Ron Perlman, in TVs
>>>> Beauty and the Beast. He was so wise and gentle and sexy ... in a way
>>>> ...;p
>>> My mother-in-law had SUCH a crush on Ron Perlman. I asked
>>> her if she'd seen him without the B&TB makeup. She hadn't.
>> I always thought Vincent was a creepy stalker. My crush is Ron Perlman
>> as Hellboy.
>
> You people are deranged...I suppose you thought he was teh hottness in "The Name
> of the Rose" and "Quest for Fire" too....r
>
"radiateur" bit in City of Lost Children ;)
b