Re: Some Explanation
aine
> On Jul 11, 11:44 am, "Mr. Joseph Littleshoes Esq." <jpsti...@isp.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Hope wrote:
> > > While this "Guardian" was harassing and threatening Wolfie, monica
> > > asked her to rid alt.native of another of those she calls
> > > "whitebutts,"
>
> > Which clearly shows this "Monica" is a fake, her style and use of
> > language is NOT Native, her choice of slander is standard urban ghetto
> > rhetoric.<
>
> Not really. I rented to "real" N/A's. Interacted with them and
> 'Tribal' members. Actually she is being quite tame in calling us
> "Whitebutts". I think it is funny because I call myself a whitebutt
> and I have been told there is N/A in my family.
>
> Beats what "whitebutts" called and did to N/A's. I mean some whites
> still are nasty to N/A's. When passion and anger gets aroused, people
> say all sorts of things.
> Pointing fingers suck, but certainly arw and usenet in general shows
> all sorts of refined classy "real" people of all races stoop to words
> like, moron, crack head etc..
>
> You can't make someone an example just because you do not agree with
> them or don't like them and excuse everyone else's behavior.
>
> > And given her preferred style of posting its obvious why she has to rely
> > to the internet to have anything that passes for human contact.
>
> > Reminds me of "The Baroness" in her naivety.<
>
> I plain do not get that person. I try but man, I thought I could be
> all over the place! Whew.. ya, and the name is so long it bugs my
> psyche..points off.
aine
> On Jul 11, 11:17 am, Hope <holleratwal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> You have to do what you have to do.
>
> Frankly, it appears all parties have been on Usenet a long time. I
> could be wrong.
>
> You cannot blame what is posted on Usenet for someones illness or
> death. Why stay for the abuse if you are that ill? If Usenet is the
> cause, is not the cure to leave?
>
> The victim card is being played here. Right or wrong, it is the way it
> is and you & many others here do to Sid what you claim this person is
> doing so...get the picture?
>
> What, so this one seems personal so it is not okay? That boggles me
> more then anything. If this person came in out of the blue stalking
> the other because of real life issues and never had been involved with
> them on Usenet , then ya I get it but this does not seem to be the
> case that I can see.
>
> Am I missing something?
aine
> suddenly showing up, there have been serious developments.
> "Guardian's" most recent quarry in her mission to "annihilate" what
> she termed "faux Indians" was NorahChristine Runningwolf. I posted
> about that here and asked for information and advice.
>
> While this "Guardian" was harassing and threatening Wolfie, monica
> asked her to rid alt.native of another of those she calls
> an Indian (which monica deems highly offensive.) In fact, monica told
> her that every white person there was claiming to be Indian in a
> desperate attempt to put Guardian on our trail too. Of course there
> was no evidence of that to be found. But that's beside the point now.
>
> Wolfie's husband Ray was very ill. When "Guardian" started posting
> his personal information online as part of her attack on Wolfie, he
> became very upset, for his own reasons. He was also depressed that he
> could not protect his wife from being stalked and threatened and
> accused of all kinds of weird stuff.
>
> According to Wolfie, this ugliness was the straw that broke the
> camel's back for a man already dealing with life-threatening illnesses
> and stress. She said it pushed him over the edge. He is now dead, by
> choice, and Wolfie is left to deal with the horror.
>
> Wolfie's friends, myself included, are angered and upset and
> disgusted. Guardian has not made an appearance since this happened,
> and that's a good thing. I made a decision to stop interacting with
> monica because I am not able to control my negative emotions and the
> toxicity is getting out of hand.
>
> That sent her into a tizzy and she is taking desperate measures to
> either draw me back in or do her own brand of "annihilating" an
> enemy. She has decided crossposting things here and to ard (though I
> have told her numerous times I don't hang out there) is a good way to
> "prove" that she is the good guy in all this. AFTER this happened she
> stated that only Indians are human beings. So I suppose there is no
> reason for her to feel anything about what happened, including
> compassion. No human beings were harmed, after all.
>
> monica is claiming I invited people from here to come to alt.native to
> ruin the site, and she is claiming that anyone from here MUST be part
> of some kind of "evil Wiccan coven" who try to cast "black spells" to
> harm her Tribe because of whaling issues. She will not hear anything
> different. The truth is that Wolfie's friends are coming from all
> over to show their support for her. That's what friends do.
>
> For my part in this, I am extremely sorry. I apologize that I brought
> it to arw by seeking advice about what to do about this Pagan
> determined to "annihilate" people. I knew before she showed up it was
> going to be bad, but I didn't see HOW bad. If I had known how this
> was going to turn out, I would have asked for any help available to
> prevent it, including taking myself out of it rather than trying to
> "protect" my friend. I made mistakes and those consequences are mine
> to own.
>
> It's all very convoluted and if you stick a toe in, you might find you
> are in quicksand. I don't like what my energy becomes when I let
> myself get sucked in. I will NOT respond to any of monica's posts here
> or anywhere else, so eventually she will probably cease and desist--
> especially if she can find a new source to keep her hate addiction
> fueled. Until then, block/ignore the posts or not as you see fit.
>
> I am going to be taking a break from arw in hopes that will speed the
> process. Besides, I need to get re-centered and do some work on
> myself instead of spending so much time and energy looking at who else
> needs work.
>
> I wish you all well on your journey. May the soles of your feet be
> firm on your path.
Because I do not believe in posting behind others back that they
cannot respond, object to or reply to..
Bad form Hope.
Monica
>
> - Show quoted text -
Thank you for posting this. Kim tries to present herself as honorable
and balanced and truthful. In actuality she is the most evil person I
have encountered.
Hope
>
> Because I do not believe in posting behind others back that they
> cannot respond, object to or reply to..
>
> Bad form Hope.
What the hell are you talking about? Who cannot respond? Whose back
am I posting behind? Are you playing the victim card for another of
your "underdogs"? monica chose to bring shit here about me.
For the second time, someone tried to hack my Google account, and
suddenly monica is posting my full name in forums that she has no
other interest in, as if it is some big prize to be displayed, some
big secret. Trust me, she's all over this. She cannot bring herself
to leave a word about me unread. She's reading the groups. *I* do
not like crossposting, and the folks in ard have requested that it not
be done regarding this issue. But of course you know best for them.
I am not in the market for a netiquette nanny, aine. Think what you
want, jump in and crosspost whatever you want. Impose your rules, Ms.
"There is no right or wrong." Fix it all up to suit aine.
Talk about bad form...
Monica
Don't look now but you're throwing a tantrum princess. LOL!
aine
>
>
>
> > Because I do not believe in posting behind others back that they
> > cannot respond, object to or reply to..
>
> > Bad form Hope.
>
> What the hell are you talking about? Who cannot respond? Whose back
> am I posting behind? Are you playing the victim card for another of
> your "underdogs"? monica chose to bring shit here about me.<
You brought this to arw.
Alt.Native people have been posting here and responding. They have a
right to read it when you are telling yet another view of them and
involving another group of peoples replies.
Then you write this apology, I am leaving note but take the
opportunity to again give your views and side of the story. Problem
is, you left off alt.native on the original post.
I did not catch it before I sent but I sure as hell am not going to
post about people or a situation without giving them a right to reply
back to me whether they agree or not after they have been so involved
past, the original "give me your thoughts" post you wrote.
s�r`ch�sm
> "aine" <aine_nicne...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Because I do not believe in posting behind others back that they
> > cannot respond, object to or reply to..
>
> > Bad form Hope.
>
>
> What the hell are you talking about? Who cannot respond? Whose back
> am I posting behind? Are you playing the victim card for another of
> your "underdogs"? monica chose to bring shit here about me.
>
> For the second time, someone tried to hack my Google account, and
> suddenly monica is posting my full name in forums that she has no
> other interest in, as if it is some big prize to be displayed, some
> big secret. Trust me, she's all over this. She cannot bring herself
> to leave a word about me unread. She's reading the groups. *I* do
> not like crossposting, and the folks in ard have requested that it not
> be done regarding this issue. But of course you know best for them.
>
> I am not in the market for a netiquette nanny, aine. Think what you
> want, jump in and crosspost whatever you want. Impose your rules, Ms.
> "There is no right or wrong." Fix it all up to suit aine.
>
> Talk about bad form...
>
>Don't look now but you're throwing a tantrum princess. LOL!
>
Seems to me that you've been throwing the tantrums ever since you rowed your
flame-canoe over, monica-martyr. What was that you were saying about whites
not being human again?
Hope
> On Jul 11, 1:44 pm, Hope <holleratwal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 11, 2:47 pm, aine <aine_nicne...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Because I do not believe in posting behind others back that they
> > > cannot respond, object to or reply to..
>
> > > Bad form Hope.
>
> > What the hell are you talking about? Who cannot respond? Whose back
> > am I posting behind? Are you playing the victim card for another of
> > your "underdogs"? monica chose to bring shit here about me.<
>
> You brought this to arw.
Yes. I posted about BETSY here. And I apologized for that. And YOU
chose to involve yourself in it, did you not?
>
> Alt.Native people have been posting here and responding. They have a
> right to read it when you are telling yet another view of them and
> involving another group of peoples replies.
Yes, and since, as you say, THEY ARE POSTING HERE AND RESPONDING, one
might assume they can read it for themselves here and decide whether
to respond, without a nanny carrying it to them in another forum and
deciding for the authors of posts where they WILL post.
>
> Then you write this apology, I am leaving note but take the
> opportunity to again give your views and side of the story. Problem
> is, you left off alt.native on the original post.
>
> I did not catch it before I sent but I sure as hell am not going to
> post about people or a situation without giving them a right to reply
> back to me whether they agree or not after they have been so involved
> past, the original "give me your thoughts" post you wrote.
Well, that's a real head scratcher of a sentence. The thing is, you
are not making the decision for YOURSELF. You are making it for ME.
I don't tell you where you have to post or who you have to respond
to.
The people posting here are adults. Who the hell are you to decide
where they can and can't post or where they HAVE to post? If I choose
to speak to one group of people only, what gives you the right to tell
me I can't? Do you do that for everyone, or are you being
"selective," as you accuse others of being when they don't take your
views?
The forums involved are open, public forums. Anyone can read. Anyone
can post. Anyone can respond. That is obvious from the posts showing
up.
Oh btw...I notice monica crossposted about my totally evil self. But
she conveniently LEFT ALT.NATIVE OFF. If you feel you need to
supervise everyone and make sure they play by your rules, I assume you
are going to do her the same courtesy you did me and POST IT THERE,
whether she likes it or not. I mean, since you are all about being
fair and giving everyone a chance to see and respond to everything and
give their views and all. And maybe I'll post your stuff wherever I
decide it belongs. There are so many groups that deserve to be made
aware of your ideas and hear about your life. And you have shown me
it is my right to decide that for you.
aine
> "Monica" <yano...@gmail.com> eggs on:
>
> - Show quoted text -
Possibly no worse then the canoe, casino and squinted eye remarks you
made which is an insult to all Native Americans including any
whitebutts that have some in them. Again, as it was with Betsy's post
in attempt to personally insult you show your racism against an entire
culture.
s�r`ch�sm
> "s�r`ch�sm" <s�r`ch�s...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> "Monica" <yano...@gmail.com> eggs on:
> > "aine" <aine_nicne...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Because I do not believe in posting behind others back that they
> > > cannot respond, object to or reply to..
>
> > > Bad form Hope.
>
> > Hope <holleratwal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > What the hell are you talking about? Who cannot respond? Whose back
> > am I posting behind? Are you playing the victim card for another of
> > your "underdogs"? monica chose to bring shit here about me.
> > to leave a word about me unread. She's reading the groups. *I* do
> > not like crossposting, and the folks in ard have requested that it not
> > be done regarding this issue. But of course you know best for them.
>
> > I am not in the market for a netiquette nanny, aine. Think what you
> > want, jump in and crosspost whatever you want. Impose your rules, Ms.
> > "There is no right or wrong." Fix it all up to suit aine.
>
> > Talk about bad form...
>
> >Don't look now but you're throwing a tantrum princess. LOL!
>
> Seems to me that you've been throwing the tantrums ever since you rowed
> your
> flame-canoe over, monica-martyr. What was that you were saying about
> whites not being human again?
>
>Possibly no worse then the canoe, casino and squinted eye remarks you
>made which is an insult to all Native Americans including any
>whitebutts that have some in them.
>
They could be taken as racist remarks, although that's more of a stretch
than "all whites are not human", which you had no snide comments about. The
"canoe" reference was an oblique one to her coming over to arw prior to any
crossposts - not a tribal slur. Would you've preferred motorboat, thus
likely implying a slur against nontraditional whaling methods? The
squinting eye was a reference to her blindspot about her own racism and the
casino comment referred to making money off of the whites she despises.
Having explained these matters to you, you'll no doubt still not "get it"
and support an anti-white racist who "happens" to be S'Kallam. There's no
pleasing you, which is why that's not the intent. Hypocrisy much?
>
>Again, as it was with Betsy's post
>in attempt to personally insult you show your racism against an entire
>culture.
>
You are welcome to see things as myopically as you wish to, it doesn't make
it so. Did I insult betsy-wetsy's neo-nazi pals in the S.S.peripherally?
That's a damn shame. My remarks were not directed, implicitly or explicitly
towards "entire cultures"; much as you and those you're backing would wish
they were. Claim it all you like; it's an unfounded opinion based upon your
faulty interpretations.
aine
> "aine" <aine_nicne...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> - Show quoted text -
Your beliefs change subject to who your friends are and no, that is
not what friends do. When they ask your opinion they want to believe
they are solid opinions, not changeable based on your feelings about
them as friends.
Nothing you say has validity because you have shown to do this,
therefore I can easily write your posts off because, geeze, if you
decide Hope is not your friend tomorrow, they could change. It is a
waste of time to discuss anything with you.
Carry on..as always this will be handled where it should be.
Monica
I left off our group because I was apologizing to the druids and
wiccans for crossposting. I hate it too. I want them to see how evil
you are to Indian People. They have seen. I assume you are ashamed why
you announced you were withdrawing from their sites.
Monica
> "aine" <aine_nicne...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> - Show quoted text -
No. It was intentionally racist.
s�r`ch�sm
>
> They could be taken as racist remarks, although that's more of a stretch
> than "all whites are not human", which you had no snide comments about.
> The
> "canoe" reference was an oblique one to her coming over to arw prior to
> any
> crossposts - not a tribal slur. Would you've preferred motorboat, thus
> likely implying a slur against nontraditional whaling methods? The
> squinting eye was a reference to her blindspot about her own racism and
> the
> casino comment referred to making money off of the whites she despises.
> Having explained these matters to you, you'll no doubt still not "get it"
> and support an anti-white racist who "happens" to be S'Kallam. There's no
> pleasing you, which is why that's not the intent. Hypocrisy much?
>
> towards "entire cultures"; much as you and those you're backing would wish
> they were. Claim it all you like; it's an unfounded opinion based upon
> your
> faulty interpretations.
>
>
>No. It was intentionally racist.
>
In your opinion, which does not make it so since you are unable to discern
my intent for me.
Monica
> "Monica" <yano...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> - Show quoted text -
But you seem capable of discerning my intent. You're wrong fizzled
flames.
s�r`ch�sm
>But you seem capable of discerning my intent.
>
No, I said you posted your opinion and you did. I further stated that you
are unable to discern my intent, and you aren't/
>
>You're wrong fizzled flames.
>
Because you say so? That's humorously untrue. Is your flame intended to
imply that I'm another poster you don't like, (and is therefore, by
'monica-default', a "racist"?).
Ren
> Thank you for posting this. Kim tries to present herself as honorable
> and balanced and truthful. In actuality she is the most evil person I
> have encountered.
That is the same trash that Betsy "Guardian" Ashby and Sidney
"Evergreen" Lambe post.
Monica, why don't you just shut your mouth before I shut it magickally
for you.
Ren
> I left off our group because I was apologizing to the druids and
> wiccans for crossposting. I hate it too. I want them to see how evil
> you are to Indian People. They have seen. I assume you are ashamed why
> you announced you were withdrawing from their sites.
So you thought to show how evil people are to Indians by insulting
whites and Wicca in the same racist and elitist way. Not smart at all,
are you.
Ren
> No. It was intentionally racist.
Two wrongs don't make a right. If you want to rage against racism,
don't be a racist yourself.
Evergreen
You couldn't make a bird fly with the useless theatrical woo-woo
you call 'magick', you pathetic clown.
Sid
--
Sidney Lambe
Wiccan Priest and Apprentice Magician
http://tinyurl.com/7vs9zb
usenet4444 (at) gmail (dot) com
aine
This is the same trash Hope and Sar write as well. Just depends on the
side of the fence you are on. Good luck with shutting her up
magickally or even having the right to do so.
I never got on well with Monica in the past but I have never fought
with her either past a brief discussion maybe. Doesn't mean I can't
see her side of it.
Ren
> This is the same trash Hope and Sar write as well. Just depends on the
> side of the fence you are on. Good luck with shutting her up
> magickally or even having the right to do so.
>
> I never got on well with Monica in the past but I have never fought
> with her either past a brief discussion maybe. Doesn't mean I can't
> see her side of it.
You can kiss my big ol'white butt, aine. Wait. This is aine I'm
talking to. I don't know about you but I am getting a big laugh out of
Sidney trying to get people to respond to him in this thread and being
completely ignored by everyone. It is as if he is a petulant child
trying to be noticed at an adult party.
aine
> On Jul 12, 7:14 pm, aine <aine_nicne...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > This is the same trash Hope and Sar write as well. Just depends on the
> > side of the fence you are on. Good luck with shutting her up
> > magickally or even having the right to do so.
>
> > I never got on well with Monica in the past but I have never fought
> > with her either past a brief discussion maybe. Doesn't mean I can't
> > see her side of it.
>
> You can kiss my big ol'white butt, aine. <
Been there, done that, will do again..forever and a day.
>Wait. This is aine I'm
> talking to. <
At least you talk rather then rolling over and snoring.
>I don't know about you but I am getting a big laugh out of
> Sidney trying to get people to respond to him in this thread and being
> completely ignored by everyone. It is as if he is a petulant child
> trying to be noticed at an adult party.<
You do not know the half of it. The adult party is Tent City!
Ren
>
> as this "Monica" uses indicates to me some one not very familiar
> with NA insults. More new age wannabe "Indian" than the real thing.
I'm not buying the whole "Monica" thing either. The real Monica
Charles is somewhat of a politician. She isn't dumb enough to attack
racism while at the same time calling people white Wiccan racists.
Is she?
I say we compare the email address and IP information. If they are too
different people, then the real Monica Charles can sue the impostor.
The Dark Monica could be brought up on criminal charges for out of
control harassment which contributed to a man's suicide.
zayton
Maybe we need to be "enrolled" as humans?
zayton
>
> I left off our group because I was apologizing to the druids and
> wiccans for crossposting. I hate it too. I want them to see how evil
> you are to Indian People. They have seen. I assume you are ashamed why
> you announced you were withdrawing from their sites.
If you hate crossposting, then why have you been persistantly doing it?
Evergreen
> On Jul 13, 6:49=A0am, "Mr. Joseph Littleshoes Esq." <jpsti...@isp.com
>>
>> as this "Monica" uses indicates to me some one not very familiar
>
> I'm not buying the whole "Monica" thing either. The real Monica
> Charles is somewhat of a politician. She isn't dumb enough to attack
> racism while at the same time calling people white Wiccan racists.
>
> Is she?
>
> I say we compare the email address and IP information. If they are too
> different people, then the real Monica Charles can sue the impostor.
> The Dark Monica could be brought up on criminal charges for out of
> control harassment which contributed to a man's suicide.
More threats from ren. And like all of his other threats they will
come to nothing and ren will go on assuming that we are so dumb
that we don't notice that none of his threats ever come to pass.
He wants people to believe that he has power and influence of many
kinds. The truth is that he has none. He's just a bag of hot air.
Lady Azure, Baroness of the North Pole
Why you just cited extensive argument why a Topic of Interest ACROSS GROUPS has
the Right to be Cross Posted to all Interested Parties.
�
> I want them to see how evil
> you are to Indian People.
I want the World to know how EVIL the SASSERS ARE.
They "ATTACK" Fellowship, telling people what they are allowed to think or
discuss, and insult everyone.
They are the "Virus PROBLEM" on the Net.
They do not engage in "Freedom of Speech" they wage WAR, and as a DESCENDANT of
the Chieftain's of the "Reds", they found a Barbarian Warrior, born of the LAW.
I am the Descendant of the 6, the Chieftains of the Ancients.
I am the Mountain brought forth from the Ocean.
Born of the Hind or the Great ELK.
Descendant of the Red Bull, the Stagg or Bison.
I am a Blood of the Yellow Witch, SHE who is the Bheare/Protectorate of the
Cave of the North Wind, House of the Si Pan or Divine Wind.
I am Descended from Set, the Ass of a Man, he who BRED the HORSE.
My Family as such� "Had the Cart, before the Horse"!
I am the Storm Gaete, born of 2 Gods, the House Zeus and Odin, the Heir of
Apollo and Thor.
I am, The Blue Kachina of� THUNDER, WALKING.
�
�
�
�
Lady Azure, Baroness of the North Pole
He and Tom, the Socks of some� rather Dirty Feet.
�
s�r`ch�sm
> "s�r`ch�sm" wrote:
>> "Monica" <yan...@gmail.com> eggs on:
>>> "aine" <aine_nicne...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Because I do not believe in posting behind others back that they
>>>> cannot respond, object to or reply to..
>>>
>>>> Bad form Hope.
>>>
>>> Hope <holleratwal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> What the hell are you talking about? Who cannot respond? Whose back
>>> am I posting behind? Are you playing the victim card for another of
>>> your "underdogs"? monica chose to bring shit here about me.
>>>
>>> For the second time, someone tried to hack my Google account, and
>>> suddenly monica is posting my full name in forums that she has no
>>> other interest in, as if it is some big prize to be displayed, some
>>> big secret. Trust me, she's all over this. She cannot bring herself
>>> to leave a word about me unread. She's reading the groups. *I* do
>>> not like crossposting, and the folks in ard have requested that it
>>> not be done regarding this issue. But of course you know best for
>>> them. I am not in the market for a netiquette nanny, aine. Think what
>>> you
>>> want, jump in and crosspost whatever you want. Impose your rules, Ms.
>>> "There is no right or wrong." Fix it all up to suit aine.
>>>
>>> Talk about bad form...
>>
>>
>>> Don't look now but you're throwing a tantrum princess. LOL!
>>>
>>
>> Seems to me that you've been throwing the tantrums ever since you
>> rowed your flame-canoe over, monica-martyr. What was that you were
>> saying about whites not being human again?
>
> Maybe we need to be "enrolled" as humans?
We already are. Monica-martyr doesn't get to decide which humans are human
according to the color of their skin and which ones aren't because of her
belief in the false premise that nonwhites cannot be racist. There is no
valid rationale underlying such a premise since holding racist views, (as
defined by the meaning of the word, not postmodernistically as a
rationalization for being a racist), are not dependent upon the color of the
racist's skin. The meaning of the term, "racist", does not contain any
reference to the color of the racist's skin, therefore, monica-martyr's use
of a sophist rationalization to justify her anti-white racism of claiming
that whites aren't human is null and void.
aine
> sâr`châsm wrote:
> > "Monica" <yano...@gmail.com> eggs on:
>
> - Show quoted text -
I think she used the word 'human' as an insult like many use, drunk,
slut, crack head, fat etc. There was a time we whites did not act
human or treat N/A as human. There were times the English were not
acting human or treating the Scots as human. We don't rape, pillage
and vigilante' anymore instead we created Usenet.
Hope
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> I think she used the word 'human' as an insult like many use, drunk,
> slut, crack head, fat etc.
You might think being called fat because you're carrying too much
weight on your frame is on the same level with being called an inhuman
maggot because your skin is white, but I don't think most people would
react quite the same to those two insults.
> There was a time we whites did not act
> human or treat N/A as human. There were times the English were not
> acting human or treating the Scots as human.
Those are over-generalizations. Not all blondes are airheads and not
all Blacks are drug dealers. There is no question that Caucasians have
wrought untold havoc on the world. But not ALL whites in the "we
whites" have behaved inhumanly. If that were the case, we would
probably still have slavery. Or considering that there is always
race, nationality, political beliefs, and religion to fight about, we
would probably have just warred our way to extinction. I guess we
still have time for that.
> We don't rape, pillage
> and vigilante' anymore
We don't? When did that stop? Someone should alert the presses.
> instead we created Usenet.
How dramatic. I think rape victims would choose Usenet every time.
They can, as you pointed out, say "No!" to Usenet at any time.
s�r`ch�sm
> "aine" <aine_nicne...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> I think she used the word 'human' as an insult like many use, drunk,
> slut, crack head, fat etc.
>You might think being called fat because you're carrying too much
>weight on your frame is on the same level with being called an inhuman
>maggot because your skin is white, but I don't think most people would
>react quite the same to those two insults.
>
Indeed; the "drunk/slut/crackhead/fat" epitaphs do not fall under the same
heading as the racial slur of being called an "inhuman maggot" because one's
skin is light-toned.
>
> There was a time we whites did not act
> human or treat N/A as human. There were times the English were not
> acting human or treating the Scots as human.
>
>Those are over-generalizations. Not all blondes are airheads and not
>all Blacks are drug dealers.
>
What would happen if a black female called an "indian" a "squaw"? According
to monica-martyr, that wouldn't be a racist remark, since "only whites" can
be racists. Would her hypocrisy-circuits overload?
>
>There is no question that Caucasians have wrought untold havoc on the
>world.
>
Not only is there some question as to that, (given the ambigious
classification used), but it neglects to mention that most of the world's
population is nonwhite and would seem to bear much of the responsibility for
it's condition as whichever group as broad economic dominance does.
>
>But not ALL whites in the "we whites" have behaved inhumanly.
>
True, over-generalizations tend to lead to false conclusions, (which may or,
may not b an ironic statement).
>
>If that were the case, we would probably still have slavery.
>
Not only "we";
"Point No Point Treaty of 1855: ARTICLE 12. The said tribes and bands agree
to free all slaves now held by them, and not to purchase or acquire others
hereafter.
-Signed by Chits-a-mah-han, the Duke of York, Chief of the S'klallams, his x
mark."
>
>Or considering that there is always
>race, nationality, political beliefs, and religion to fight about, we
>would probably have just warred our way to extinction. I guess we
>still have time for that.
>
There's as much time for creation as there is for destruction, though it may
not seem subjectively so.
>
> We don't rape, pillage and vigilante' anymore
>
>We don't? When did that stop? Someone should alert the presses.
>
Bloody vikings, argh!
zayton
I think she is actually playing with the linguistic fact that at least one
American Indian tribe used for themselves a term which can be translated
into English as "the people", or "The human ones".
She intends to bait us with the insult that whites are not "human"; then
retreat to an interpretation that all she is saying is that they are not of
her tribe.
The problems with that dodge is that first, there is a difference between
being not of _the_ people and not being people; between not being of _The_
humans and not being human; and second, she has given no indication that
this terminology was characteristic of her particular native group to begin
with.
Her use of the phrase remains racist.
(and incompetently deceptive)
aine
> aine wrote:
> I think she is actually playing with the linguistic fact that at least one
> American Indian tribe used for themselves a term which can be translated
> into English as "the people", or "The human ones".<
Interesting I will have to search that out and read up. Pleiades and
the serpent is on todays agenda. The Mayan and N/A prophecies.
Probably but a skip away from finding the Tribe.
>
> She intends to bait us with the insult that whites are not "human"; then
> retreat to an interpretation that all she is saying is that they are not of
> her tribe.<
IMHO, there is baiting on both sides. Horrible but anger based insults
on both sides. On Usenet, it is difficult to tell if one side has a
true claim to injury.
> The problems with that dodge is that first, there is a difference between
> being not of _the_ people and not being people; between not being of _The_
> humans and not being human; and second, she has given no indication that
> this terminology was characteristic of her particular native group to begin
> with.
>
> Her use of the phrase remains racist.<
Unless she refuses to sit with whites, engage with whites in her life,
treats them inferior in life just because they are White, I really
believe she is a culturist. :) My opinions as I am a whitebutt and she
has yet not to engage in a decent discussion with me. Even if she does
not agree I have not seen her attack me. Possibly it is all in the way
some present their arguement or reply.
>
> (and incompetently deceptive)- Hide quoted text -
zayton
According to her:
(if you are white)
1. You are not human.
2. You are solely responsible (your race: but you are
held individually accountable) for all pollution.
(Not much: not most: ALL)
3. You are solely responsible (your race: but you are
held individually accountable) for all destruction of
animal habitat. (again; Not much: not most: all)
4. You want to kill all Indians, but have so far failed.
And according to her no non-white person has ever contributed to any of the
bad things of which all whites are guilty.
Her accusations (according to her) cannot be racist because she isn't white
and only whites can, by definition, be racist.
aine
I am white and have been accussed of not being human. Since we all
know all races are actually human and it is indisputable, I write
comments like this off to ones like crackhead, blackheart..etc.
I take it as a compliment though. Humans suck.
> 2. You are solely responsible (your race: but you are
> held individually accountable) for all pollution.<
Most of it is.
I have seen the but you use a car thing to counter that
but..seriously.. the world is no longer set up to be sustainable
without many modern convienences.
"Solely" is probably not the best choice word but based on the fact of
who started the major problems to begin with..it does not seem far
fetched.
There are alot of humans of all races/cultures who are trying to clean
it up and fight it, but, damn those whitebutt corp. big wigs are
hardheaded!
> (Not much: not most: ALL)
Considering that most 3rd world nations still have to walk to get
clean water and live in mud shacks. Considering who and where modern
civilizations were invented and who we taught it too? Does this seem
out of line? Not to me, but, I am a realist.
> 3. You are solely responsible (your race: but you are
> held individually accountable) for all destruction of
> animal habitat. (again; Not much: not most: all)..
What other race is destroying theirs that was not taught initially by
Whites or given the technology to before knowing how it would affect
our planet?
> 4. You want to kill all Indians, but have so far failed.<
You or all Whites? That one I would have to disagree with but I have
not yet try to hold a discussion with her on it. If and when we do I
hope it could be over a friendly cup of coffee or tea. She may bring
her food tester with her without hurting my feelings. I have some
things left by the Lummi Tribe family we rented to. Maybe I could give
them to her to handle with sacredness.
>
> And according to her no non-white person has ever contributed to any of the
> bad things of which all whites are guilty.<
Thats a really big menu. Was it in context to something in
particuliar? I can't really comment on that without knowing.
> Her accusations (according to her) cannot be racist because she isn't white
> and only whites can, by definition, be racist.<
I do not agree with that statement but I do know from the White people
on Usenet the term racist is way over used and nit picked on. It also
is used selectively because 90% of people who post insults are really
using them in a racist manner. I have plenty of stones to throw but,
they have spirits to me and I hate to use them for immature, pouting,
whining, arrogant, I am right, I am gonna take you down with insults
because I do not agree with you....whew...violence.
They are my "precious".. I hate humans..what can I say!
>
> Possibly it is all in the way
I think alot of it comes from
Hope
> aine wrote:
> > On Jul 12, 6:46 pm, "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
It would be difficult for her to backpedal enough to prove she did not
really mean whites aren't as human as Indians, since on the same day
(June 26) she also said "White women aren't daughters of Mother Earth.
Just Indians." and "Have you heard other Tribes creation stories that
the white man was a mistake? An African Tribe ahs a story like that
too."
There are lots of other examples. White women in particular are at
the bottom of the non-human pile. We have been told that we are white
maggots--and not just once, in the heat of anger.
If such statements are not racist, then what *are* they? What other
word could be used to describe judging people of a different skin
color or blood to be non-human?
s�r`ch�sm
"Prejudice: noun:
1..
1.. An adverse judgment or opinion formed beforehand or without
knowledge or examination of the facts.
2.. A preconceived preference or idea.
2.. The act or state of holding unreasonable preconceived judgments or
convictions. See Synonyms at predilection.
3.. Irrational suspicion or hatred of a particular group, race, or
religion."
Evergreen
[delete]
>
> I take it as a compliment though. Humans suck.
That explains a lot.
Beliefs are spells.
And by maintaining that spell you are condemning
yourself to a hellish life.
Because YOU are a human being and you are a part
of the human race.
All existence is blessed, and any apparent Evil
is only ignorance.
It's okay to be learning; becoming; evolving.
This doesn't mean that all behaviors are to
be sanctioned. It just means that healing is
called for rather than punishment.
Especially of yourself...
[delete]
aine
> aine <aine_nicne...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> [delete]
>
>
>
> > I take it as a compliment though. Humans suck.
>
> That explains a lot.<
Just seeing if anyone would jump me for being a human racist. Terms
and words are used alot in here that stem from Urban Dictionary words
& phrases. Generalizations. What one person gets away with, another
will not based on popularity of either the person or the subject.
Kind of like generalising the word "stupid" Sid. :)
> Beliefs are spells.<
Thoughts are too, for me at least!
>
> And by maintaining that spell you are condemning
> yourself to a hellish life.
>
> Because YOU are a human being and you are a part
> of the human race.<
Nope. I am not pure earthly human. Alot of people are not. Some people
are filled with spirit even if they are earthly humans. My life is far
from Hellish so I guess it is true what you say about yourself. Not
psychic. Ya, there are a few things that if I hell bent on marriage
being romance novel based I could have been bummed about but those
things I have corrected. It was comfortable enough at the time to
accomplish the Oaths I had taken so..no regrets.
> All existence is blessed, and any apparent Evil
> is only ignorance.<
Evil is as Evil does.
> It's okay to be learning; becoming; evolving.
>
> This doesn't mean that all behaviors are to
> be sanctioned. It just means that healing is
> called for rather than punishment.<
Keep trying!..
>
> Especially of yourself<
I would worry yourself with words about me Sid. I have top notch
advisors.
aine
Oops *wouldn't* .Rice cake fluff in keyboard. What sucky human made
them crumb so bad?
zayton
> Oops *wouldn't* .Rice cake fluff in keyboard. What sucky human made
> them crumb so bad?
Aha!
I knew there was ricism about somewhere.
Hope
*LMAO* Extra points to you.
aine
Ya, I put this one in for you! :)
Lady Azure, Baroness of the North Pole
> On Jul 13, 2:10 pm, "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
> > aine wrote:
>
> > I think she is actually playing with the linguistic fact that at least one
> > American Indian tribe used for themselves a term which can be translated
> > into English as "the people", or "The human ones".<
>
> Interesting I will have to search that out and read up. Pleiades and
> the serpent is on todays agenda. The Mayan and N/A prophecies.
> Probably but a skip away from finding the Tribe.
Which "TRIBE", the People of SHEBA, the Woman who was listed as a "SON OF
ABRAHAM"?
The Tribes of the 6?
The Tribe of the Dyke!
Maya as in Maia.
Maia as in Ackhinaton and Neffertti's HandMade who was a Surrogate Mother.
The Prey Karnac chased across the world?
�
Lady Azure, Baroness of the North Pole
> aine <aine_n...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> [delete]
> >
> > I take it as a compliment though. Humans suck.
>
> That explains a lot.
>
> Beliefs are spells.
>
> And by maintaining that spell you are condemning
> yourself to a hellish life.
There another Churcher Bigot LIE, from a Witch Hunter trying to break
Fellowship.
Hel is the "Covenant of Abraham, FOOL.
The Cave he bought to bury Sarah.
Teiresias is "The Shining One" the Blind Guy, who guides people through
the darkness along the path to the Citadel.
Read the Greek Legends some time, cause Ptolemy II wrote the Old
Testament, the 12 Tribes are the Achaean League, and were Led by Isaiah,
following the Sacred Teachings of the ORACLE.
Jesus as such is a revamped story of Apollo, Zeus' Son.
The Original "Universal Church" is Mahayana, which is based on� the
Study of All Religions.
Rome fed the Jacobites to the Lions, then stole their teachings.
Lady Azure, Baroness of the North Pole
> On Jul 13, 4:37 pm, Evergreen <sidneyla...@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> > aine <aine_nicne...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > [delete]
> >
> >
> >
> > > I take it as a compliment though. Humans suck.
> >
> > That explains a lot.<
>
> Just seeing if anyone would jump me for being a human racist.
No, many agree, especially in the Metaphysicals.
Gia'n are the WORST, to them Mankind is a Pox on the World.
�
rare breed
> ABRAHAM"?
No thanks, I'll keep my foreskin, thank you very much.
> The Tribes of the 6?
???
> The Tribe of the Dyke!
Likes women, so maybe.
Is a man, so maybe not.
> Maya as in Maia.
> Maia as in Ackhinaton and Neffertti's HandMade who was a Surrogate Mother.
> The Prey Karnac chased across the world?
Wow, now you're just being random.
Maya (the Hindu concept of illusion) describes your posts
very well.
Monica
> "Hope" <holleratwal...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
> > > "aine" wrote:
> > > > "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
>
> - Show quoted text -
You're so funny. Do you listen to yourself. Do you really think that
whites are discriminated against? You should dye your hair black,
darken your skin and come into Port Angeles. Then you'd see real
discrimination.
Sizzle Flambé
> Wow, now you're just being random.
>
> Maya (the Hindu concept of illusion)
> describes your posts very well.
Lady Azure is a very challenging dance partner in conversation:
goes from waltz mid-stride to tango to steeplechase, and you'll
find yourself jumping from rooftop to rooftop to keep up.
But these sparkling gems keep flying off as she dances, and it
is sometimes impossible not to watch, out of sheer amazement.
oldwifetale
>
> - Show quoted text -
Why do *that* when she can be racially discriminated against right
here by you?
And by the same token, you have not lived with the skin and hair color
of a white woman, so you are in no better position to determine what
the 'effects' of racism are upon white people than white people are in
a position to determine the effects of racism upon you.
If a black woman came here and began to post on alt.native, would you
display the same kind of behavior toward her as you have used toward
white women even while she is not *native*, but black? Would you
*constantly* and repeatedly over time use racial slurs to prohibit her
from speaking openly and freely on a public forum because it is
alt.NATIVE? Would you target her with belittling threads about her
skin color or her butt or her hair? Would you tell her she wasn't a
human being because she was black? Would you call her race *idiots*
and all black women 'loonies'? Would you insult her upbringing and
culture? Would you label her racist against Indians if she objected?
Would you dismiss every thoughtful post she writes with the words,
"You're BLACK!"
It is not a matter of whether you feel 'justified' in being racist, or
whether *you* think white people can't be damaged by it (which is not
even close to true). What matters is that 'white people' believe that
when we are fighting against racism, we are fighting 'for'
nondiscrimination. So it is irrelevant what you (or Wise) think about
the 'effects'. You are not in a position to *know*. Not even a 'mixed
blood' will not experience *the same* effects as a 'white person'. But
by trivializing racism against one targeted race, you are not really
being anti-racist at all, you are being racist. And by claiming that
white people can't speak out against racial abuse directed against
them whether physical or verbal, you are being racist.
You don't have to be a genius to know that thought preceeds action.
Once it becomes acceptable to hate a 'select group' of people, it is
only a matter of time before it is also acceptable to act on that
hate.
Of all people, you should know this. So i think you do know it, and
are doing it deliberately to cause harm/damage.
Listen to *yourself*, monica.
Sizzle Flambé
[...]
> by trivializing racism against one targeted race, you are not really
> being anti-racist at all, you are being racist. And by claiming that
> white people can't speak out against racial abuse directed against
> them whether physical or verbal, you are being racist.
>
> You don't have to be a genius to know that thought preceeds action.
> Once it becomes acceptable to hate a 'select group' of people, it is
> only a matter of time before it is also acceptable to act on that
> hate.
*And*... if it is declared acceptable to hate *one* race, then that
acceptability *spreads*. "Indians are HUMAN BEINGS, whites are not",
but what about those Tibetans? Uhh, they're not Indians, so GET 'EM!
Chinese, Japanese, Mongols, Siberians, Indians from India? GET 'EM!
What in that declaration admits *any* NON-Indian is a Human Being?
> Of all people, you should know this. So i think you do know it, and
> are doing it deliberately to cause harm/damage.
>
> Listen to *yourself*, monica.
Indians versus the Untermenschen! Ve Seek Lebensraum!
To-DAY Tur-tle ISLAND! To-MORROW ze VORRRLLLD!
Monica
>
> - Show quoted text -
You are beyond laughable. A pure white supremacist if there ever was
one.
Monica
Only the white man thinks like that!
oldwifetale
> You are beyond laughable. A pure white supremacist if there ever was
>
> - Show quoted text -
In what way precisely, monica? Forget the name-calling for once.
Forget your cut 'n' paste 'back-up'. Be specific. Think for yourself!
Tell my *why* i should accept ABUSE in any way, shape or form without
any objection on my part... merely because i am white. Tell me *how*
objecting to being abused, harrassed or belittled for my 'race' makes
me a white 'supremacist'.
Monica
You know I think for myself daisy mae. I don't like you. You're an
asshole. You force yourself into conversations and want us to talk
about your butt. You are a racist white woman. That's it! Too bad
you're to egotistical to accept that fact that not everyone likes you.
Most people in the world don't like whites. With good reason.
oldwifetale
Are you kidding me???
Who *cares* who doesn't like who personally? This isn't about 'not
liking' someone, and no amount of trivialization on your part will
make it so. This also isn't about 'forcing' myself into a discussion
that is open to public commentary. This is about race hate. This is
about racist discrimination. In this case it is about anti-white
racist discrimination and hate. Not "reverse racism" which implies
something entirely different. And i'm not addressing "most people in
the world"; i am addressing *you* specifically about a problem that is
bigger than you, but which you are very liberally partaking in. If you
*do* think for yourself, then where's your own explanation for how it
is "okay" to target white people for racist abuse and discrimination?
Where is your 'authority' to determine the effects of *your* racist
behavior on *me* or any other white person you have abused? Where's
the whole spiel about racial 'equality' and nondiscrimination being
the supposed 'goal'?
And how can you even CONCEIVABLY post an article using the words
'honkey' or 'cracker' (which have no profound impact) as an
appropriate example of real 'racism' against white people, and think
it can compare with the words that *you* have used here against white
people who are posting?
Since you have nothing to offer but racist slurs, i am left to my own
conclusions. Apparently you think that being abused is a good excuse
for an abuser to fall back on when he or she goes on to abuse others.
Take that any way you like.
aine
>
> - Show quoted text -
True, we are not discriminated for our color and in that sense will
never know the hardships.
We do as a "white" race have levels of how we are treated or what
benefits we can get in hard times or even good time based on income,
gender and status. Single males & females being the most difficult
position to receive help when needed.
Possibly the discrimination term gets jumbled into that by some people
who discuss it and they are similiar but different?
Monica
like white because they committed genocide on my people. That's not the same
as being killed because you are not white. You will never understand that
horror.
"aine" <aine_n...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:cc1ef3c9-6472-4a10...@r33g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > "Hope" <holleratwal...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
> > > > "aine" wrote:
> > > > > "zayton" <zay...@newwavecomm.net> wrote:
s�r`ch�sm
"s�r`ch�sm" <s�r`ch�s...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> "Hope" <holleratwal...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> It would be difficult for her to backpedal enough to prove she did not
> really mean whites aren't as human as Indians, since on the same day
> (June 26) she also said "White women aren't daughters of Mother Earth.
> Just Indians." and "Have you heard other Tribes creation stories that
> the white man was a mistake? An African Tribe ahs a story like that
> too."
>
> There are lots of other examples. White women in particular are at
> the bottom of the non-human pile. We have been told that we are white
> maggots--and not just once, in the heat of anger.
>
> If such statements are not racist, then what *are* they? What other
> word could be used to describe judging people of a different skin
> color or blood to be non-human?
>
>
> "Prejudice: noun:
> 1..
> 1.. An adverse judgment or opinion formed beforehand or without
> knowledge or examination of the facts.
> 2.. A preconceived preference or idea.
> 2.. The act or state of holding unreasonable preconceived judgments or
> convictions. See Synonyms at predilection.
> 3.. Irrational suspicion or hatred of a particular group, race, or
> religion."
>
>
>You're so funny.
>
Your racism isn't so funny.
>
>Do you listen to yourself.
>
Very often, although sometimes, not as often as I should.
>
>Do you really think that whites are discriminated against?
>
They sometimes are, as in instances of Affirmative Action, however, this is
more about your anti-white racism than AA. Racism is racism, no matter what
color the racist's skin is.
>
>You should dye your hair black,
>darken your skin and come into Port Angeles. Then you'd see real
>discrimination.
>
Discrimination against one group doesn't justify or excuse counter-racism,
that just swings the pendelum of prejudice to the other extreme.
s�r`ch�sm
> "Monica" <yano...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> You're so funny. Do you listen to yourself. Do you really think that
> whites are discriminated against? You should dye your hair black,
> darken your skin and come into Port Angeles. Then you'd see real
> discrimination.
>
>Why do *that* when she can be racially discriminated against right
>here by you?
>
Good point, (as an aside "she" is a he, not that this has any bearing on
what's said).
>
>And by the same token, you have not lived with the skin and hair color
>of a white woman, so you are in no better position to determine what
>the 'effects' of racism are upon white people than white people are in
>a position to determine the effects of racism upon you.
>
That's another valid point you've raised. While it is possible to see the
negative effects of racism without sharing the specific instances of those
effects, that's not the same as experiencing them. In many cases, such
experiences have long-lasting and stronger emotional impact upon those who
do experience other forms of racism personally. It is such emotional
scarring which is evident in monica's posts and make her hatred of "whties"
understandable but, not justifiable - they still manifest as racist views,
no matter what the 'reasons' for holding them are.
>
>If a black woman came here and began to post on alt.native, would you
>display the same kind of behavior toward her as you have used toward
>white women even while she is not *native*, but black? Would you
>*constantly* and repeatedly over time use racial slurs to prohibit her
>from speaking openly and freely on a public forum because it is
>alt.NATIVE? Would you target her with belittling threads about her
>skin color or her butt or her hair? Would you tell her she wasn't a
>human being because she was black? Would you call her race *idiots*
>and all black women 'loonies'? Would you insult her upbringing and
>culture? Would you label her racist against Indians if she objected?
>Would you dismiss every thoughtful post she writes with the words,
>"You're BLACK!"
>
Good questions, albeit rhetorical ones for monica, given her "a pure white
supremacist if there ever was one" dodged response.
>
>It is not a matter of whether you feel 'justified' in being racist, or
>whether *you* think white people can't be damaged by it (which is not
>even close to true). What matters is that 'white people' believe that
>when we are fighting against racism, we are fighting 'for'
>nondiscrimination.
>
I'd add that there are many "nonwhite" people working for general
nondiscrimination and against racism toward Anyone; regardless of the color
of their skin, (i.e., not just for their own "race").
>
>So it is irrelevant what you (or Wise) think about
>the 'effects'. You are not in a position to *know*. Not even a 'mixed
>blood' will not experience *the same* effects as a 'white person'. But
>by trivializing racism against one targeted race, you are not really
>being anti-racist at all, you are being racist. And by claiming that
>white people can't speak out against racial abuse directed against
>them whether physical or verbal, you are being racist.
>
Exactly. Monica's own words, (not those of others), paint her as a racist.
The S'Klallam treaty of 1855 prohibited them from owning slaves, not from
owning their own words. Monica's racist sentiments are her shadow that
walks with her, eats with her, sleeps with her and goes with her wherever
she goes - no matter how much she tries to distance herself from herself.
>
>You don't have to be a genius to know that thought preceeds action.
>Once it becomes acceptable to hate a 'select group' of people, it is
>only a matter of time before it is also acceptable to act on that hate.
>
That is indeed, the slippery slope of dehumanization which monica promotes.
Such a stance does not promote the creation of a balance nor, any solution
to the problem of racism, (unless monica is implying some sort of "whtie
Final Solution").
>
>Of all people, you should know this. So i think you do know it, and
>are doing it deliberately to cause harm/damage.
>Listen to *yourself*, monica.
>
If she listened to herself, she'd hear her own voice seductively and
irresistably whispering, "martyr".
s�r`ch�sm
> "oldwifetale" <oldwifet...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > "Monica" <yan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > You are beyond laughable. A pure white supremacist if there ever was
> > one.
>
>
> Forget your cut 'n' paste 'back-up'. Be specific. Think for yourself!
> Tell my *why* i should accept ABUSE in any way, shape or form without
> any objection on my part... merely because i am white. Tell me *how*
> objecting to being abused, harrassed or belittled for my 'race' makes
> me a white 'supremacist'.
>
>You know I think for myself daisy mae. I don't like you. You're an asshole.
>
So, you cannot answer her questions or, just refuse to do so because you
don't like? That's a rationalized dodge. Do you always dodge backing up
your baseless opinions or, is this a rhetorical question for you to dodge?
>
>You force yourself into conversations and want us to talk
>about your butt.
>
Are you upset that no one wants to be forced to talk about your butt,
monica?
>
>You are a racist white woman. That's it!
>
Why, because you say so, without any foundation, as if your opinion were a
fact? That's humorously egotistical of you, monica-martyr.
>
>Too bad you're to egotistical to accept that fact that not everyone likes
>you.
>
What's that opinion got to do with the demonstrated, (by you), fact that
you're an anti-white racist? Is being liked important to your fragile ego,
monica-martyr?
>
>Most people in the world don't like whites. With good reason.
>
There is no "good reason" for racism; only self-justifying excuses for being
as racist as the racists being hated. That attitude just perpetuates racism
and seems counterproductive to helping to rid societies of it. So, you
choose to be part of the problem, rather than the solution. That's your
choice, monica but, it won't heal your emotional scars.
s�r`ch�sm
americans are because of monica's anti-white racism. I refuse to paint them
all wih the same racist brush as monica does because that's neither the
rational nor smart thing to do.
"Monica" <yan...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Have you been refused service in Port Angeles because you are white? I
> don't like white because they committed genocide on my people. That's not
> the same as being killed because you are not white. You will never
> understand that horror.
>>
>> > "Prejudice: noun:
s�r`ch�sm
> "oldwifetale" <oldwifet...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> [...]
>
> > by trivializing racism against one targeted race, you are not really
> > being anti-racist at all, you are being racist. And by claiming that
> > white people can't speak out against racial abuse directed against
> > them whether physical or verbal, you are being racist.
>
> > You don't have to be a genius to know that thought preceeds action.
> > Once it becomes acceptable to hate a 'select group' of people, it is
> > only a matter of time before it is also acceptable to act on that
> > hate.
>
> > are doing it deliberately to cause harm/damage.
>
> > Listen to *yourself*, monica.
>
>Only the white man thinks like that!
>
Apparently not. It's a good thing that your hate speech isn't
representative of your "race", monica-martyr. It merely reflects upon your
own character, that of a bigot, (sans any racial connotations you wish were
inherent in pointing out your rabid anti-white bigotry).
Ren
> You're so funny. Do you listen to yourself. Do you really think that
> whites are discriminated against? You should dye your hair black,
> darken your skin and come into Port Angeles. Then you'd see real
> discrimination.
Are you white? No? Then you wouldn't know if whites are discriminated
against. I'll tell you right now. You are discriminating against me (a
white person) when you say we are incapable of being discriminated
against. When you call me a 'white butt', you are discriminating
against me. I could sue you.
Ren
> Only the white man thinks like that!
Shut up, you racist. You're also sexist. Do you have issues against
men as well?
Ren
> True, we are not discriminated for our color and in that sense will
> never know the hardships.
> We do as a "white" race have levels of how we are treated or what
> benefits we can get in hard times or even good time based on income,
> gender and status. Single males & females being the most difficult
> position to receive help when needed.
>
> Possibly the discrimination term gets jumbled into that by some people
> who discuss it and they are similiar but different?
Not true, aine. You don't know your history very well. There are
numerous cases where whites have been discriminated against by non-
whites.
How about when the Moors occupied Spain.
aine
There is lots in the past. I was speaking about the present which I
was "assuming" (?) she was as well.
aine
The Court would make you pull your pants down and she would win on a
technicality. hehehe Actually it is the same feeling I have that Oprah
makes us all say African American then talks non stop about Whites. A--
rooo?
The real pisser is that being 2nd generation Scottish...the English
have yet to compensate me and mine for taking our land and treating
the Scots as Barbarians. Doesnt mean I do not get alot of what she
writes about though.
Really, life does not have to be about automatically hating those who
oppose you. Insulting, those who insult you automatically. I mean she
makes valid points. Whites tend to be dicriminated within levels but
not automatically because they are white.
aine
She might not but I know women suck and some men do as well. :) Sexual
desire aside.. many people have issues with genders.
aine
>
> > True, we are not discriminated for our color and in that sense will
> > never know the hardships.
> > We do as a "white" race have levels of how we are treated or what
> > benefits we can get in hard times or even good time based on income,
> > gender and status. Single males & females being the most difficult
> > position to receive help when needed.
>
> > Possibly the discrimination term gets jumbled into that by some people
> > who discuss it and they are similiar but different?
>
> Not true, aine. You don't know your history very well. <
99% of the people who want to appear like they know it all...Google
before they reply. Ya..fact. I have spoken to many in IM and they are
never near as intelligent as when they post and Google. In fact, they
usually say, well, I just Googled this and...lol!
Give me points for going natural. What I don't know, you will correct
me on. Difference being I don't mind not knowing everything.
Evergreen
Do you know what hypocrisy is, ren?
How dare you criticize her for racism when you run around
accusing people of being pedophiles (and other kinds of criminals)
without having a scrap of evidence to support the charge?
Ren accuses me of being a spammer:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/72f45c1057e0d8dd
Ren accuses me of being a pedophile:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/ab524939c7e3eaac
Ren accuses me of being a dangerous stalker (my post):
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/dd5189f03c3b1b34p
Ren the pathological liar:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.religion.wicca/msg/e71094ef5f99c2fc
And I am by no means the only person he's used this despiccable
tactic on.
Give me a racist over a scumbag who bears false witness against
his neighbor any day.
It's the lesser of two evils.
And she probably isn't even a racist. This fact would obviously
not stop ren from accusing her of being one.
Sid
--
Sidney Lambe
Wiccan Priest and Apprentice Magician
http://tinyurl.com/7vs9zb
usenet4444 (at) gmail (dot) com
aine
> Ren <ren1...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Knock Knock....
Whose there?
aine
> usenet4444 (at) gmail (dot) com
Knock Knock
whose there?
Banana..
Banana who?
Mr. Joseph Littleshoes Esq.
> On Jul 15, 5:49ÔøΩpm, Ren wrote:
Anybody who would make an argument that their particualr form of
suffering (espicaly of the "mans inhumanity to many" variety) is a sole
or root cause of all other suffering, who wold make an exclusivness of
their suffering and use it to inflict suffering on others, is, to my way
of thinking, either an idiot or a very brutalized & sick person. Every
body suffers, has suffered, even the oppresors get opressed by thier
opresion (uneasy lies the ehad that wears the crown) power brings its
own problems, till theres a revolution and we trade one set of opressors
for anohter. In that respect the human species dont seem too bright.
Raceism is just a small part of the bigger problem of the human animals
viscious pride. I have seen this, exclusivity of suffering, happen in a
'racism' context, but just as much in a feminist, sexist context.
Some women belive men are inherantly inferior because they cant give
birth, the pain and suffering of giving birth transcends all others. Add
that to "Womean is the Nigger of the world" and you dont get an any more
afflicted group. Woman has suffered more than Man.
If your not a woman who has given birth you cant have a valid idea of it.
Even with my recent comments of an excretory nature, no man can possibly
imagine the agony that child birth can be. And becasue of that are
inherantly never going to experiance the life changeing force of it.
Which thereby cheapens men in their eyes. Mere genetic resivoires they
could, theoreticaly do without:)
Any one who would make such an exclusive argument, who would go so far
as to use their suffering to inflict suffering on others has to be, to
me, either an idiot or a terribly brutalized and sick individual.
Funny thing about the sexist argument though (we can dismiss racism for
the moment as its really only a small part of the problem) while it has
been statisticaly determined that women are not as efficient killers as
men are, the argument is still unresolved as to whether this is genetic
or social conditioning.
Generaly speaking the female is the more viscious of the species, as the
male is the more beautiful. And we all now just how viscious a female
can be:)
Yet "they" have tested both men and women with killing machines, jet
fighter air craft with lasers and such. And while women are better
hunters, they can hunt, find and track in their head more targets than
the male, they hesitate a microsecond before fireing.
Perhaps with the right sort of encouragment females could become as good
a killer as males are:) and then there would be no, even merely,
statistical inferiority of the female to men.
--
Mr. Joseph Littleshoes Esq.
Domine, dirige nos.
Let the games begin!
http://fredeeky.typepad.com/fredeeky/files/sf_anthem.mp3
Lady Azure, Baroness of the North Pole
> On Jul 13, 3:38 pm, "s�r`ch�sm" <s�r`ch�s...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > "Hope" <holleratwal...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > It would be difficult for her to backpedal enough to prove she did not
> > really mean whites aren't as human as Indians, since on the same day
> > (June 26) she also said "White women aren't daughters of Mother Earth.
> > Just Indians." and "Have you heard other Tribes creation stories that
> > the white man was a mistake? An African Tribe ahs a story like that
> > too."
> >
> > There are lots of other examples.� White women in particular are at
> > the bottom of the non-human pile.� We have been told that we are white
> > maggots--and not just once, in the heat of anger.
> >
> > If such statements are not racist, then what *are* they?� What other
> > word could be used to describe judging people of a different skin
> > color or blood to be non-human?
Human Beings, are in Ancient Terms a RACE, not everyone is a Human Being.
Not all American Aboriginals are Human Beings, and Not all Human Beings are
American Aboriginals.
Lady Azure, Baroness of the North Pole
> rare breed <basenji...@yahoo.com> told Lady Azure:
>
> > Wow, now you're just being random.
> >
> > Maya (the Hindu concept of illusion)
> > describes your posts very well.
Sorry, not one word of that post is mine.
> �
>
> Lady Azure is a very challenging dance partner in conversation:
To Chaos flingers like you, who Lie there Ass of to Insult the world.
�
Lady Azure, Baroness of the North Pole
> On Jul 15, 12:56 pm, oldwifetale <oldwifet...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> [...]
> > by trivializing racism against one targeted race, you are not really
> > being anti-racist at all, you are being racist. And by claiming that
> > white people can't speak out against racial abuse directed against
> > them whether physical or verbal, you are being racist.
> >
> > You don't have to be a genius to know that thought preceeds action.
> > Once it becomes acceptable to hate a 'select group' of people, it is
> > only a matter of time before it is also acceptable to act on that
> > hate.
>
> *And*... if it is declared acceptable to hate *one* race, then that
> acceptability *spreads*. "Indians are HUMAN BEINGS, whites are not",
> but what about those Tibetans? Uhh, they're not Indians, so GET 'EM!
> Chinese, Japanese, Mongols, Siberians, Indians from India? GET 'EM!
> What in that declaration admits *any* NON-Indian is a Human Being?
>
> > Of all people, you should know this. So i think you do know it, and
> > are doing it deliberately to cause harm/damage.
> >
> > Listen to *yourself*, monica.
>
> Indians versus the Untermenschen! Ve Seek Lebensraum!
> To-DAY Tur-tle ISLAND! To-MORROW ze VORRRLLLD!
You should know you are a serious Neo Nazi!
Altering Posts to make lies so you can spread Chaos.
�
Mr. Joseph Littleshoes Esq.
> Sizzle FlambÔøΩ wrote:
>
>
> >On Jul 15, 12:56 pm, oldwifetale wrote:
> >[...]
> >
> >>by trivializing racism
Madam:
What do you expect us to do?
Be saints?
Some how that 'male' is just supposed to turn into over night some vague
benign hunter - gather?
Hunh?
> ÔøΩ
Guardian
> And by the same token, you have not lived with the skin and hair color
> of a white woman,
I have, and yes, there is a VERY distinct advantage to having white
skin in America.
A few days ago, I exchanged a two week old defective fan at Walmart
for a new one. It was not my fan, it belonged to a friend who asked
me if I would exchange it for her... because my skin is white and
her's is brown. You see at the Walmart in Murphy NC you need a receipt
to exchange an item if you are white, but not if you are brown.
Despite their "receipt required for all exchanges" official policy...
I can just stroll up to the Service Counter, invoke my White
Privilege, and get a replacement without any documentation at all.
I know this sounds like a petty, rare injustice to the Anglo's reading
this forum, but to people of Color here in the South, it is an all too
common occurrence of personal degradation they have been FORCED to
adapt to.
I have been exchanging defective merchandise at Walmart for friends of
Color for many years now, but it never gets any easier to swallow.
The errand itself is no bother, and something I would gladly do for my
Anglo friends too as a matter of convenience when going to town (the
closest Walmart is about an hour away) It is the reason I am often
asked to exchange something by an Indian or Mexican friend that makes
me feel angry and ill at the same time. I am shown this common
courtesy by a major retailer, and my Brown friends are not, simply
because of the difference in the color of our skin.
I will NEVER forget the first time an Indian friend asked me to
exchange an article of clothing for a larger size for her. The sweat
shirt still had all its tags and stickers intact, and clearly had not
been worn, but she had lost the receipt. We were out shopping
together, and both going into Walmart when she said "would you mind
exchanging this for an extra large?" I said "sure" but I must have
had a confused look on my face because she went on to explain "They
won't let me do it because I don't have the receipt, but they'll give
it to you because you're white" ...at which point I said "WHAT???"
"They can not do that ...that is discrimination!" She said, "Well
they do" I guess I looked incredulous, because she just said "Ok,
watch"
I stood back as she went to Customer Service and sure enough, I
watched as my chocolate brown skinned friend was turned away,
allegedly because she did not have a receipt. I also observed the
Clerk's condescending body language and the way she treated my friend
(who is older than I) almost like a child. We did our shopping,
loaded our stuff in the car, and then she said "You try now" Still
lacking a receipt, I took the same shirt, to the same Customer Service
Clerk barely 45 minutes later. She took the item, gave it a quick
examination, and promptly said, "Yes Mame, just go get the size you
want and bring it back to the Service Desk." I did so, and she
graciously allowed the exchange without any further discussion.
I was LIVID by the time I got to the car. I wanted to go back in and
ream out the Manager, call the Media, file a Civil Rights Violation
complaint, etc....I wanted to DO SOMETHING. My friend just said "let
me drive, you drive too fast when you're mad" So she drove while I
ranted for about 30 minutes. Then she told me, "You can do all that,
but it won't help. They'll just say the Clerk made a mistake and won't
let you exchange stuff without a receipt anymore. That's what they do
if a white person kicks up a fuss"
Still boiling mad, I responded with "I don't care what they do" and
continued to spew righteous indignation as only a Caucasian can for
another 30 minutes or so. Knowing that I was too angry to do anything
else, my friend drove us down to one of our favorite spots by the
river to eat our snacks. I started to calm down and examine my
options realistically. I was determined to make Walmart answer for
this gross injustice being perpetrated against people I love. When I
finally got to the point where I needed to inhale, I asked my friend,
"What do you think I should do?" She said "Keep your mouth shut so
we've got somebody in the family who can exchange stuff. Bob (name
changed) can't do it anymore because he got mad like you did and
threatened the Manager" Needless to say, the surviving Indians in the
South are very pragmatic.
"White Privilege" manifests itself in MANY MANY ways, and is
completely taken for granted by Anglos, many of whom do not even
realize it exists.
"White Privilege" is a clerk looking out a window, waving and turning
the gas pump on for you, when your Indian and/or Mexican friends get a
brief glance, then have to go inside and prepay. I had been stopping
at that station regularly for only a few weeks when the staff started
to recognize me and show me this courtesy. Some of my Indian friends
have been buying their gas there for 15 YEARS and they still have to
pay before pumping.
"White Privilege" is when you are a woman alone and break down late at
night in 20 deg. weather, on a remote mountain highway with your car
sticking half way out into the road ....and your first thought is "I
need a Policeman." At the push of 3 buttons, a State Trooper arrives
within minutes. He positions his vehicle so as to protect yours from
being struck and immediately cleans a large pile of stuff off his
front passenger seat so you can sit in his toasty warm police car to
wait for the tow truck. You call your friends and tell them why you
are going to be late while he tries to catch up on his paperwork. You
feel safe and secure ...because you are.
"White Privilege" is getting a call asking "Can you go to County Court
with us next week? So and so got arrested for whatever, and they'll
treat him better if there are a bunch of white people watching. We're
calling around and {insert names of various light skinned people} said
they'd come too... we're trying to get as many (white concerned faces)
as we can" They are doing this for a loved one because they know a
court room full of brown concerned faces does not count for squat,
whereas white witnesses to the proceedings could make a difference.
"White Privilege" is being awakened from a snooze with "Betsy, can you
drive now, we're almost to Macon (GA)" ...because Brown people can be
pulled over, drug from their cars, beaten and jailed for the same
burnt out tail light that would get me a polite warning, or at most a
$20.00 ticket, from Deputy Bubba Steroid. My friends are in fear of
their lives, while all I have to worry about is that he might ask me
out on a date.
"White Privilege" is watching your Brown friend's demeanor COMPLETELY
change if you are pulled over. While you dig out your license in a
mildly annoyed fashion, you can see them sink into their seats and try
to become invisible out of the corner of your eye, and you can smell
the fear suddenly coming off people you love. You know that at worst,
the Officer is going to give you a ticket, and he better do so with
good cause, and politely, or you can seriously damage his career by
invoking your white privilege. Your Indian friends know, at a very
core level, that the Officer could take any one of them into the
bushes and do anything he wanted with them...up to and including,
commit MURDER ...and he would most likely get away with it.
I am NOT saying that the average Police Officer WOULD ...only that he
COULD...and that ever present POSSIBILITY is what they live with and
we don't.
Yes, the color of our skin DOES matter in America. I wish it did not
with all my heart and soul...but it DOES!!! Acknowledging this sad
fact of life does not make me a racist, it makes me a realist.
"White Privilege" manifests itself in EVERY aspect of Anglo-American
culture. It was created thousands of years ago, and it is being
perpetuated by people who deny its very existence.
Guardian
> When you call me a 'white butt', you are discriminating
> against me. I could sue you.
Well, "Truth" being the defense in any such case, I would REALLY like
to be there when the Judge tells you to drop your drawers ;-)
oldwifetale
> "White Privilege" is being awakened from a snooze with "Betsy, can you
> drive now, we're almost to Macon (GA)" ...because Brown people can be
> pulled over, drug from their cars, beaten and jailed for the same
> burnt out tail light that would get me a polite warning, or at most a
> $20.00 ticket, from Deputy Bubba Steroid. My friends are in fear of
> their lives, while all I have to worry about is that he might ask me
> out on a date.
Betsy, for heaven's sake, keep your missionary jargon to yourself! Is
it not ENOUGH for you to go out "anhilating" people who say they
aren't *all white* when you are convinced they are??? You have much to
answer for, Betsy!!!!
On *this* topic - i am not arguing about whether white people have
been 'privileged' in the sense of being treated better by other white
people. That is such a white-guilt diversion of the actual ISSUE here,
i can't even believe you wrote it. That is a knife that cuts both
ways. If you want to perceive Indian people as eternal victims,
keeping 'white people' in the role of eternal abusers, that's your
deal. I consider all other people and myself to be 'equals' in terms
of race discrimination, and act accordingly. No one is a 'supreme'
race.
All my life, i stood up against racist hate and bigotry in any form
and against any 'race' or people and by any 'race' or people. If you
think i am somehow 'blind' to racism, let me tell you i have lived in
some of the most racist towns and cities in this country, throughout
every state west, south, midwest, north and have spent 'time' in the
east (try googling Vidor, Texas sometime in connection to 'sundown
towns'). I do not need a lecture on the fact that there is sill white
racism - i am *well* aware. But unlike you and monica, i am not trying
to justify racist hate coming from *anyone*.
In the archives of alt.native, you will see that i have argued against
racism 'by' white people (and others) for nearly a decade. Up to now,
it has always been in regard to racism that is displayed toward other
races and ethnicities. Up to a few years ago, i had not been on the
'receiving end' of a long-term, on-going program of blatant anti-white
racist hate and discrimination. I am not talking about some stupid
exchange at Walmart, i am talking about openly displayed anti-white
racist hate.
And since you're so into relating your own personal experience
regarding *white privilege*, i seriously doubt that *you* with your
big beefy body and your "well-muscled buttocks" (aka 'hardass'), and
your 20+ years handling Security at SciFiCom, ComCon, etc., your
concealed gun permits, etc. you have never felt the least bit
intimidated as a 'white woman', nor *targeted* for hate and aggression
based on the color of your skin.
So no, Betsy... you really *don't* know.
I liken this to a sexually abused child who goes to his or her mother,
and gets the response, "That could not have happened."
Or even worse, "You brought this on yourself."
People keep referring to anti-white racism as 'reverse racism' -
implying that only 'white people' are racist and inherently so, and
that counter-racism can't exist because how can you be racist against
a racist?
The entire 'logic' is f_ked up.
Meanwhile, some old woman gets beat up *specifically* because she is
white (witnesses hear), but in the media, the courts, and among the
population, there is no acknowledgement that it was anti-white racism
or even a hate crime. What racism? I didn't see any racism. Did you
see any racism?
The denial is that prevalent.
Ren
You get the name of the Walmart customer service person who allowed
you to exchange the fan without a receipt in violation of Walmart's
policy. Then that person will be fired. You're such a champion against
racism, Betsy. Why didn't you do this? It is because you are a
hypocrite. You complain that this racism happens at Walmart, yet you
do nothing.
> I know this sounds like a petty, rare injustice to the Anglo's reading
> this forum, but to people of Color here in the South, it is an all too
YOU are an Anglo, Betsy. Stop posting as if you are apart from your
own race.
> common occurrence of personal degradation they have been FORCED to
> adapt to.
Yet you did nothing to address this racism at Walmart. You did not
complain when the person allowed you to exchange an item without a
receipt because you are white.
> I have been exchanging defective merchandise at Walmart for friends of
> Color for many years now, but it never gets any easier to swallow.
You have allowed these customer service people at Walmart to practice
this racism for years without doing anything about it other than
exchanging items for friends of color. Ineffective action.
> I was LIVID by the time I got to the car. I wanted to go back in and
> ream out the Manager, call the Media, file a Civil Rights Violation
> complaint, etc....I wanted to DO SOMETHING. My friend just said "let
Yet you did nothing because you are convinced that it won't help to
fight racism where you find it.
> Still boiling mad, I responded with "I don't care what they do" and
> continued to spew righteous indignation as only a Caucasian can for
> another 30 minutes or so. Knowing that I was too angry to do anything
You're racist against your own race. How is it that only Caucasians
can spew righteous indignation and people of color can not? This is
your ignorance.
> Yes, the color of our skin DOES matter in America. I wish it did not
> with all my heart and soul...but it DOES!!! Acknowledging this sad
> fact of life does not make me a racist, it makes me a realist.
> "White Privilege" manifests itself in EVERY aspect of Anglo-American
> culture. It was created thousands of years ago, and it is being
> perpetuated by people who deny its very existence.
No. It makes you a damn lazy coward for giving up the fight against
racism. You are perpetrating the racism with statements such as only
Caucasians do certain things where others do not.
Ren
> Well, "Truth" being the defense in any such case, I would REALLY like
> to be there when the Judge tells you to drop your drawers ;-)
When was the last time you were able to see your own crusty ass,
Betsy?
Ren
to that store. I complain directly to Head Quarters.
Betsy, you better believe that Walmart HQ will be hearing about
allowing whites to exchange items without receipts at the Walmart in
Murphy, North Carolina.
Wal-Mart Ethics 1-800-WM-ETHIC Questions regarding Wal-Mart Ethics
Media Relations 1-800-331-0085 Members of the news media may call
with questions (radio, TV, newspaper)
Sizzle Flambé
> [...] You see at the Walmart in Murphy NC you need a receipt
> to exchange an item if you are white, but not if you are brown.
> Despite their "receipt required for all exchanges" official policy...
So... you... needed your "brown" friend to exchange the item for you?
Evergreen
> On Jul 15, 1:56=A0pm, oldwifetale <oldwifet...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> And by the same token, you have not lived with the skin and hair color
>> of a white woman,
>
> I have, and yes, there is a VERY distinct advantage to having white
> skin in America.
Of course there is. This country is owned by White Anglo-Saxon
Protestants and they believe that they are God's Chosen People.
All other races and cultures are inferior and tainted with Evil
in their eyes.
The reasons everyone freaks out about 'White Supremacists' is that
they are violating the code: They are saying out loud what most of
the WASPs, 'conservative' or 'progressive' really believe.
There is a revolution brewing in America right now, spearheaded by
people like Rush Limbaugh: The non-'progressive' WASPs are _furious_
over having a Black man in the office of the President who has an
African name and is the product of miscegenation involving a Black
male and a White woman.
These are the people who actually get things done: They do the farming
and ranching and mining and logging and trucking and railroading and
roadbuilding and construction and manufacturing and energy production
and so on.
The 'progressive', urban/suburban WASPS who have a slight majority in terms
of numbers are completely dependent on the 'conservative' WASPS who
really hate them. They are a bunch of talkers and paper-pushers.
[delete]
Noinden
> There is lots in the past. I was speaking about the present which I
> was "assuming" (?) she was as well.
Present day would probably include a lot of African nations. Zimbabwe
being perhaps the worst? Japan also has a strange relationship with
people of other “races”.
It is LESS prevalent in the mainstream media. But it happens. But it’s
balanced by the rednecks who like white sheets, segregation, and the
“natives” and “none whites” nice and docile!
aine
Exactly. Thank-you.
There is a difference in discussing the past and present 'racism'.
To say I do not know my history well is to say I do not know about
apples when we are discussing oranges. Yet those who are trying hard
to "win" start throwing in "fruit" as their reasoning. No different
then Politics.
Nothing can be learned or changed if the focus keeps getting broader
and broader. It is a poor tactic. I think very sad tactic that people
go off focus to win points.
Even sadder are those who create sides of right/wrong. If you are for
you must be against. Most of these people voted for Obama because he
was different in this way. He can see both sides and knows we must
compromise, yet, these same voters are not like that themselves.
Weird.
aine
>
> Of course there is. This country is owned by White Anglo-Saxon
> Protestants and they believe that they are God's Chosen People.
>
> All other races and cultures are inferior and tainted with Evil
> in their eyes.<
I am hoping Obama will open the door to change on that but, I think we
have a really long way to go.
> The reasons everyone freaks out about 'White Supremacists' is that
> they are violating the code: They are saying out loud what most of
> the WASPs, 'conservative' or 'progressive' really believe.<
Very true. More conversations then not with people off the Internet..I
hear, "I am not racists but..." whic goes into a problem they have
with a particuliar race. Whites included but it will be broken down
into classes..white trash being spoken about mainly.
I think they freak too because of the tie to violence from 'White
Supremacists" as if that goes along with the territory. That violence
is at least something that can legally be delt with verses the
everyday stares, glares or "Walmart" instances like Betsy speaks
about. People are real smooth about finding ways to show disdaine.
> There is a revolution brewing in America right now, spearheaded by
> people like Rush Limbaugh: The non-'progressive' WASPs are _furious_
> over having a Black man in the office of the President who has an
> African name and is the product of miscegenation involving a Black
> male and a White woman.<
Is there? I do not listen to programs like that. I was under the
impression things were going very smoothly in that area. Yet as I
said, I am limited by what is around me. That is disturbing to learn.
> These are the people who actually get things done: They do the farming
> and ranching and mining and logging and trucking and railroading and
> roadbuilding and construction and manufacturing and energy production
> and so on.<
Who are 'the' people? You mean African Americans? If so they are also
Lawyers, Doctors..Presidents.
Mr. Joseph Littleshoes Esq.
> On Jul 16, 10:11ÔøΩam, Evergreen wrote:
>
>
> >Of course there is. This country is owned by White Anglo-Saxon
> >Protestants and they believe that they are God's Chosen People.
> >
> >All other races and cultures are inferior and tainted with Evil
> >in their eyes.<
>
>
> I am hoping Obama will open the door to change on that but, I think we
> have a really long way to go.
I wish i could remember the name of the Black woman comedian on t.v. a
few weeks ago saying, "we cant complain about
'the man' when we are "The Man" same comedian whos deffiniton of "Thug"
is some one who can shoot a lawyer in the face and get the victem to
apologize for being in the way."
According to the NYTimes Cheny may be investigated not for toruture that
he authorized but because he lied about authorizing it.
>
>
>
> >The reasons everyone freaks out about 'White Supremacists' is that
> >they are violating the code: They are saying out loud what most of
> >the WASPs, 'conservative' or 'progressive' really believe.<
>
>
> Very true. More conversations then not with people off the Internet..I
> hear, "I am not racists but..." whic goes into a problem they have
> with a particuliar race. Whites included but it will be broken down
> into classes..white trash being spoken about mainly.
>
> I think they freak too because of the tie to violence from 'White
> Supremacists" as if that goes along with the territory. That violence
> is at least something that can legally be delt with verses the
> everyday stares, glares or "Walmart" instances like Betsy speaks
> about. People are real smooth about finding ways to show disdaine.
>
>
>
> >There is a revolution brewing in America right now, spearheaded by
> >people like Rush Limbaugh: The non-'progressive' WASPs ÔøΩare _furious_
> >over having a Black man in the office of the President who has an
> >African name and is the product of miscegenation involving a Black
> >male and a White woman.<
>
>
> Is there? I do not listen to programs like that. I was under the
> impression things were going very smoothly in that area. Yet as I
> said, I am limited by what is around me. That is disturbing to learn.
>
>
> >These are the people who actually get things done: They do the farming
> >and ranching and mining and logging and trucking and railroading and
> >roadbuilding and construction and manufacturing and energy production
> >and so on.<
>
>
> Who are 'the' people? You mean African Americans? If so they are also
> Lawyers, Doctors..Presidents.
>
>
>
>
Sizzle Flambé
> On Jul 15, 11:20 am, Sizzle Flambé <sizzle.fla...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Jul 15, 12:56 pm, oldwifetale <oldwifet...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > [...]
>
> > > by trivializing racism against one targeted race, you are not really
> > > being anti-racist at all, you are being racist. And by claiming that
> > > white people can't speak out against racial abuse directed against
> > > them whether physical or verbal, you are being racist.
>
> > > You don't have to be a genius to know that thought preceeds action.
> > > Once it becomes acceptable to hate a 'select group' of people, it is
> > > only a matter of time before it is also acceptable to act on that
> > > hate.
>
> > *And*... if it is declared acceptable to hate *one* race, then that
> > acceptability *spreads*. "Indians are HUMAN BEINGS, whites are not",
> > but what about those Tibetans? Uhh, they're not Indians, so GET 'EM!
> > Chinese, Japanese, Mongols, Siberians, Indians from India? GET 'EM!
> > What in that declaration admits *any* NON-Indian is a Human Being?
>
> > > Of all people, you should know this. So i think you do know it, and
> > > are doing it deliberately to cause harm/damage.
>
> > > Listen to *yourself*, monica.
>
> > Indians versus the Untermenschen! Ve Seek Lebensraum!
> > To-DAY Tur-tle ISLAND! To-MORROW ze VORRRLLLD!
>
The white man and... <http://tinyurl.com/monica-charles-1>
The Undertaker
wrote:
>If I see any racism at a major chain store, I never complain directly
>to that store. I complain directly to Head Quarters.
>
>Betsy, you better believe that Walmart HQ will be hearing about
>allowing whites to exchange items without receipts at the Walmart in
>Murphy, North Carolina.
>
>Wal-Mart Ethics 1-800-WM-ETHIC Questions regarding Wal-Mart Ethics
Oh my Gawd, Wal-mart has an ethics department? Who knew?
>Media Relations 1-800-331-0085 Members of the news media may call
>with questions (radio, TV, newspaper)
So does Faux news have a direclty line to the management of Wal-mart?
aine
Sorry, I think I posted this was "Betsy" who had a Wal Mart example
earlier. If I locate it I will correct that.
Because you mentioned "Walmart" it will more likely stray from your
point into down on Walmart and no one should shop there..etc..
I would just like to add I have seen this kind of treatment in other
stores. Class of store was not a factor in the treatment. The store
itself is not the problem it is individual clerks.
Yet, it has happened to me when I did not dress up, put make up on or
ran into a store half painted and grubby from working my land and
painting homes/sheds. I have seen it happen to the elderly, disabled
and even those just ticked off and abrupt because they had to make
another trip in to correct a problem.
I am sure race is a factor in many cases but I am also sure it happens
to "White _classes_ of people.
Evergreen
[delete]
> Oh my Gawd, Wal-mart has an ethics department? Who new?
Wal-Mart isn't fundamentally different from most of the
big businesses in this country.
You are fooling yourself if you think they are.
And they thrive because most Americans patronize
them.
They want good jobs and cheap goods and services
and you can't have both.
zayton
I wondered in anyone else caught that.
Hope
>
> > I have been exchanging defective merchandise at Walmart for friends of
> > Color for many years now, but it never gets any easier to swallow.
Neither does her faux-superhero story
>
> You have allowed these customer service people at Walmart to practice
> this racism for years without doing anything about it other than
> exchanging items for friends of color. Ineffective action.
But you see, if she actually did something to STOP the discrimination,
rather than just faux-rant about it for years, she would lose her
"white savior" gig. It's much more of a power trip to have her brown
friends have to ask her repeatedly for help against the bad people.
Getting the discriminators fired or getting some human relations
training instituted would only be fun once. Kinda like that
spontaneous combustion thing. ;-)
Ren
I let it pass because I figured Betsy meant the opposite.