VINTAGE SAXOPHONE VALUE GUIDE UPDATE
Hornsmasher
days. Here are the latest updates. Be sure to read the preface first!!
VINTAGE SAXOPHONE VALUE GUIDE
When I set out to prepare a reference guide for pricing vintage horns, I did
so with the clear understanding that it's not a perfect world, and that the
preparation of a perfect value guide would be impossible. I have based my
research on actual selling prices by recognized dealers. I did not consider
auction sales (such as E-Bay); private sales between individuals who are not
regular dealers; pawn shop or other irregular sources, or any anecdotal
stories. I have only addressed instruments for which there is a regular and
established market, so not every model is included. I am well aware that
some will question my figures and criticize my findings. I would encourage
those critics to do their own research and publish their own findings.
I have based my valuations upon the following assumptions: (1) the
instrument is in perfect playing condition and needs nothing in terms of
repair (2) the finish is original and completely intact (3) the original
case is intact (4) the instrument has not been altered or modified from its
original condition, having the correct style pads, springs, no neck pickups
etc. Deduct for needed repairs and/or restoration to original condition.
Relacquers are generally worth 25% less than 100% originals.
BUESCHER
TRUE TONE 5XXX - 254XXX
These are very common horns, which play rather nicely when set up properly.
The later examples have snap in pads and Norton springs. There's a real
oversupply of alto horns. Most of the examples you will find will be in a
satin silver finish. Add 20% for gold plate.
Sopranino $ 2100
Straight soprano $ 2000
Curved soprano $ 2200 deduct 20% if keyed to Eb only
C soprano $1000 MUST have original mouthpiece!!
C melody $ 800
Alto $ 900
Straight Alto $10,000
Tenor $1200
Baritone $ 2500
Bass $ 7000
NEW ARISTOCRAT 255XXX - 270XXX
There are only alto and tenor horns in this series. The other members of the
family still had the True Tone label. They're almost always seen in satin
silver. Add 20% for gold plating. Physical appearance is similar to the True
Tone, but the neck is different, the keyguards are more deluxe. They play
much better! They will always have snap in pads and Norton springs.
Alto $ 2100
Tenor $ 2300
ARISTOCRAT 270XXX - 290XXX
Tenors and alto horns only. The others were still basically True Tones.
These are really nice players, much sought after. You'll be unlikely to find
them in anything but lacquer. Add 20% for silver. I've never seen a gold
example. These horns are much more desirable than any of their ancestors.
Alto $ 1800
Tenor $ 2300
ARISTOCRAT 290XXX - 325XXX "BIG B"
The name comes from the bell engraving. These are the very best of the
Aristocrat series. Fat sound and great intonation. Some had sterling silver
necks (add 20%), very few were silver plated (add 20%), I've seen a gold
one, although I was not totally convinced it was original. The baritones are
particularly rich sounding. Brown rollers always, as well as snap in pads
and Norton springs.
Alto $1800
Tenor $ 2200
Baritone $2800
ARISTOCRAT 330XXX - 360XXX
I think these are often overlooked and underpriced. They play rather nicely.
Toward the high end of the serial number range you begin to see some
examples that look like 400 bells on Aristocrat bodies.
Alto $ 000
Tenor $1300
400 SERIES 291XXX - 381XXX
These are the Top Hat and Cane horns, the best of the Bueschers. They will
always have a raised silver logo on the bell; brown rollers; a silver
resonance ring under the bell rim; snap in pads and Norton springs, and an
underslung octave key. There are a few silver (add 20%) plated ones, and a
very few (add 30%) gold ones. I've seen some 400 baris, but none with top
hat and cane engraving or other distinctive features of this series. I think
these horns are undervalued.
Alto $ 2300
Tenor $ 3500
Baritone $2500
BUFFET
SUPER DYNACTION
This is the first Buffet horn you're likely to see. Very dark tone, great
workmanship. Some examples have screw in resonators. Later ones have
sculpted low Eb/C keys like the legendary S-1. These treasures should be
priced like Selmers from the same era, but they're not. Lucky you!
Alto $ 2000
Tenor $ 2400
Soprano $2000
Baritone $3400
S-1
If there was ever a near perfect design, I think this it. The Eb/C mechanism
is genius; the articulated low C#/Bb mechanism should be on all horns. The
soprano models usually have keywork to high G, and have "conventional" palm
key layout. These horns are bargains. The baritones are extremely rare and
fabulous!
Alto $ 2400
Tenor $ 3200
Soprano $2500
Baritone $ 3600
CONN
WONDER through 150XXX
Up until 75XXX, no rolled tone holes. Usually seen in silver. Add 20% for
gold and 40% for gold with "artist" engraving and mother of pearl key
touches. You sometimes see these in nickel plate.
Sopranino $ 2000
Straight soprano $1600
Curved soprano $ 2200 Deduct 20% if keyed to Eb only
C soprano $1000 MUST have original mouthpiece
C melody $ 800
Alto $1000
Tenor $1200
Baritone $1800
Bass $ 7500
NEW WONDER "CHU BERRY" 150XXX - 240XXX
Conn never called these horns "Chu Berry", but we're stuck with the name.
Improved keywork, "fingernail file" G# key; microtuner necks; and really
spectacular engraving on the Artist models (usually seen in gold plate,
often with mother of pearl key touches, add 40%). There is strong demand for
these fine instruments. Usually seen in silver, deduct 20% for lacquer, add
20% for gold non-artist examples. Prices may vary considerably depending
upon the amount and style of engraving. Pristine examples bring top dollar.
Straight soprano $2000
Curved soprano $2500
Alto $ 2100
Tenor $ 2800
Baritone $ 3000
Bass $ 7500
"TRANSITIONAL" 240XXX - 260XXX
You'll see these with different keywork styles, and almost always with
elaborate engraving. Most are in silver. Deduct 10% for lacquer, add 30% for
gold. These horns have a real cult following.
Alto $ 2400
Tenor $ 3000
Baritone $ 3100
M SERIES 260XXX - 834XXX
We're talking about REAL saxophones here! There's nothing on this Earth
quite like one of these at full song! The Conqueror series (26M and 30M)
have very elaborate adjustment mechanisms and solid silver key touches. The
Constellation 28M alto has three octave vents and the best feeling mechanism
around, along with a high tech (for the era) plastic key guard. It was
designed by my good friend and legend Santy Runyon. The 6M alto; 10M tenor;
and 12M baritone are the famous "naked lady" horns. They lost their rolled
tone holes after WWII.( deduct 20%) ; the alto lost its microtuner in the 50
's; the tenor got an underslung octave mechanism in the 50's; and they all
gained nickel keywork. These later examples play very well, but you should
deduct 50%.. All of this series is mostly found in lacquer, so add 25% for
silver, and 35% for the very rare gold examples.
Alto 6M $ 2000 horns stamped viii seem to play best
Alto 26M $ 2800
Alto 28M $ 4000 plastic keyguard must be intact
Tenor 10M $ 3400
Tenor 30M $ 4000 The best vintage tenor, IMHO
Baritone 12M $ 3600
H. COUF
From 1965 until 1988, these fine German horns (manufactured by J. Keilworth)
were distributed at various times by W. T. Armstrong and Conn. They have
quite a cult following today, and with good reason. The Superba I has rolled
tone holes, the Superba II does not. I've never seen them in anything but
lacquer.
SUPERBA I
Alto $ 2200
Tenor $ 2800
Baritone $3300
SUPERBA II
Alto $1800
Tenor $2200
Baritone $3000
KEILWERTH
Before the current model lineup evolved, Keilworth imported some nice horns
stamped "The New King" with rolled tone holes and plastic key guards (must
be intact) that have a small following. Mostly in lacquer, add 10% for
silver.
Alto $1000
Tenor $1200
KING
Except for the Saxello, I can't find anybody expressing much interest in the
Kings made before the Zephyr. I find their intonation to be sketchy at best.
The engraving is beautiful, but they just don't play very well. The Zephyr
is a killer! The Zephyr Special had a solid silver neck and mother of pearl
key touches. I understand there were a few made with sterling silver bells.
After the mid 1950's, the Zephyr became an intermediate model, so deduct
30%. The Zephyr baritone remained essentially unchanged throughout the
production run and sound great. Most of the Zephyr series was in lacquer,
add 15% for silver. 20% for gold. Around number 272XXX, the Super 20 was
introduced. The first examples had mother of pearl key touches; sunburst
engraving on the bell keys; socket necks; and optional sterling silver necks
(add 15%) and sterling silver bells (add 30%). Around 430XXX, the Super 20
was cheapened considerably: the neck changed to a conventional style; the
bell key engraving eventually went away; the mother of pearl inlay was long
since gone. Deduct 25% for horns after this number. There are a few examples
with gold inlay on the silver bell (add 15%), a few rare silver plated horns
(I own one, add 20%); and a very few gold plated ones (add 25%). There are,
of course, a very few Super 20 baritones, some with silver necks (add 15%)
and I have seen one with a silver bell. I think the Kings have strong upside
appreciation potential.
Saxello soprano $ 3200 add 15% for gold plate
Alto Zephyr $1800
Alto Zephyr Spcl. $2400 add 15% for silver neck
Alto Super 20 $2600 see above commentary for adjustments
Tenor Zephyr $ 2400
Tenor Zephyr Spcl $ 3000 add 15% for silver neck
Tenor Super 20 $ 3400 see above commentary for adjustments
Baritone Zephyr $ 2900
Baritone Super 20 $ 4000
MARTIN
These horns are under appreciated . They are undervalued. Play one in good
adjustment and you'll see what I mean. I've used a The Martin baritone for
years. They are the best of the vintage baritones. All of the Martin horns
have a sweet sound, and a very lush lower end. The horns from 1933
(Handcraft Committee) through the early 60's (the Magna) can hold their own
with anything ever made. There are lots of variations on the Martin theme,
and below are the ones that I think you should consider. The early ones are
mostly seen in silver, add 15% for gold plate. From the Committee on, they
are almost always lacquer. Add 15% for silver, 25% for gold. .I've seen a
couple of Committee models with sterling silver necks. Add $15% for this
feature.
MARTIN HORNS THROUGH 1933
Soprano straight $1000
Soprano curved $1800
Alto $ 800
Alto "Typewriter" $ 1600
C soprano $1000
C melody $ 800
Tenor $ 800
Tenor "Typewriter" $ 2400
Baritone $ 2200
Baritone "Typewriter" $ 3500
Bass $ 7000
COMMITTEE AND COMMITTEE II THROUGH 1945
Alto $ 1800
Tenor $ 2900
Baritone $ 3100
THE MARTIN, MUSIC MAN, AND MAGNA
Alto $ 2000
Alto Magna $ 2300
Tenor $ 3000
Tenor Music Man $2800 very rare, but fabulous!
Tenor Magna $ 3200
Baritone $ 3400 has no chromatic F#
Baritone Magna $ 3600
SELMER
The name alone inspires reverence. It's generally agreed that Selmer made
some of the very best horns of all time. Some models certainly command the
highest prices. Selmer has the only legitimate claim to be the direct
successor of Adolphe Sax. I believe that the models before the Balanced
Action are overpriced. You can buy two wonderful old Conns for what some
people are asking for Selmers of the same era. I have found that most of the
action in pre-Balanced Action horns is just talk. There seem to be very few
people (outside of a few collectors) buying these horns.
MODELE 22 750 - 4450
The earliest examples are stamped Serie 22. and have a unique side Bb
mechanism. Add 20% for these. Add 15% for silver, 25% for gold plate.
Soprano $1500
Alto $1200
Tenor $1400
Baritone $1800
MODELE 26 4451 - 11950
Basically the same horn as the 22. Similar adjustments for finish.
Soprano $1500
Alto $ 1200
Tenor $1400
Baritone $1800
SUPER 11951 - 18700
These come in three flavors: New Largebore (11951 -13000); Cigar Cutter
(13,000 - 17,000), and Super (17,000 - 18,700). These are the first horns
that really sound like Selmers. The differences in the variations are pretty
minor, mostly in mechanism. Much better horns than the 22's and 26's. Some
of these are beautifully engraved (add 10%). Silver is not uncommon (add
15%), gold a little more scarce (add 20%)..
Soprano $1500
Alto $ 2000
Tenor $ 2400
Baritone $ 2800
RADIO IMPROVED 18701 - 21750
This is essentially a renamed Super with different engraving. I've seen a
couple of people pay some really stupid prices for these. They do play
rather nicely, and you sometimes see them in silver (add 20%) and I've heard
there were some gold ones.
Alto $ 2400
Tenor $ 2900
BALANCED ACTION 21751 - 35800
There is a very good reason that demand (and prices) for these horns is so
high: although not without their quirks, these are wonderful instruments.
The later examples have better intonation in the upper end than the earlier
examples. They are often beautifully engraved. Silver examples bring about a
20% premium; gold plate about 30% more.
Alto $ 3400
Tenor $ 5000
Baritone $ 4500
SUPER BALANCED ACTION 35801- 53200
Almost perfection ! Better feel and intonation than the Balanced.. The
engraving is usually not too elaborate.
Alto $4600
Tenor $5500
Baritone $6500 There are a few low A baritones.
I have a customer who owns one
MARK VI 53201 - 236000
Of course, this is The Big Daddy Rabbit With the Fuzzy Tongue. Nothing else
is quite like it. Longest production run in Selmer history. Lots of minor
variations along the line: necks; engraving; side key attachment etc., but
even the worst of them is not bad. I've always thought that horns without
the optional high F# key played a little better. There seems to be more
demand for the "five digit" horns, and some snobs reject the higher numbered
examples. More than with any other model, condition is everything. Silver
plate commands a 20% premium; gold a 30% premium. It's important that the
serial numbers on the neck match the body. Sopranino, soprano, baritone, and
bass Mk VI's were made until the introduction of the Super 80 series. Horns
made for the European market are often unengraved, and lacquered examples
may have silver plated keywork.
Sopranino $3000
Soprano $3000
Alto $ 6100
Alto Low A $ 5000
Tenor $ 7000
Baritone Bb $7000
Baritone low A $7200
MARK VII 236000 - 315000
The Mark VI was an impossible act to follow. The VII was rejected by the
Selmer faithful. I think the ones below around 275000 are good horns, and
that you should be careful above that number. Silver plated ones bring 20%
more, I've never seen a gold plated one. Engraving is uncommon above 275000.
These horns can be a real bargain when you find a good one!
Alto $2000
Tenor $2700
SML
This small company made around 25000 horns between 1937 and 1982 and have a
fanatical following. I'm one of those fanatics. They're great! There are
many variations, but later examples tend to have rolled tone holes,
adjusting screws for the stack keys, beautiful engraving, and a sound that's
hard to beat. You see them in lacquer, silver (add 15%), gold (add 20%) and
I've seen one nickel plated alto.
Soprano $ 2200
Alto $ 2800
Tenor $ 3600
--
Remember, kids: Strangers always have the BEST candy!
Ralph Barthine
-rb
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004, Hornsmasher wrote:
> MARK VI 53201 - 236000
|
Hornsmasher
Alex
> ARISTOCRAT 330XXX - 360XXX
> I think these are often overlooked and underpriced. They play rather
nicely.
> Toward the high end of the serial number range you begin to see some
> examples that look like 400 bells on Aristocrat bodies.
>
> Alto $ 000
>
> Tenor $1300
>
ok, ok I know mistype, just kidding!
Thanks for your value guide!
Kind Regards,
Alex
Hornsmasher
1000.
bigbopper
Mark Bushaw, and ask him if it is really in your best interest to
continue baiting me.
I am not even joking a little bit.
Write him and ask him.
And then come back here and keep pushing me.
Mark Bushaw
You send me a 'do not disclose' email with an attached audio file of
someone I never heard of asking "...Right, why is that? Why can't Steve
make a horn play?" (and that's the total file.)
I send in response
"So, am I supposed to send you a file from a satisfied customer (I play
with a couple, and know several more)?"
Aren't you baiting me???? I've accepted your experience and feelings as
valid. Why do you refuse to accept mine????
Mark
bigbopper
You send me a 'do not disclose' email with an attached audio file of
someone I never heard of asking "...Right, why is that? Why can't
Steve
make a horn play?" (and that's the total file.)
Mark, the accusation of baiting was not addressed to you. I did not
think you were baiting me, here or elsewhere.
Read the rest of the thread and you will see that even this thread is
another of Goodson's attempts to "play General" with myself and
others.
Hornsmasher
This thread is about the Vintage Saxophone Value Guide, nothing else. May I
cordially invite you to "get a life"?
bigbopper
This thread is about the Vintage Saxophone Value Guide, nothing else.
May I
cordially invite you to "get a life"?
That is funny, because I thought it was a transparent, cheap attempt
on your part to portray yourself as in some sense knowledgeable and
expert, in order to lure unsuspecting rubes into your tent, in keeping
with the apparent original intent of your entire website.
In all seriousness remember this.
I gave you the chance to STFU and you could not resist trying for the
last word.
I will give you the illusion of having it here.
Enjoy. :)
Mark Bushaw
Although that makes your post rather confusing....
Why would I tell Goodson to not bait you? I know nothing that couldn't
be disclosed on an open forum.
Mark Bushaw
Hornsmasher
Foster, for some reason. Maybe it's the Reagan thing.....), but if you guys
have a problem with me with regard to some direct dealings we've ever had,
feel free to contact me at ste...@saxgourmet.com or call my business phone
during business hours (504)895-6859. Email is better, because I'm often not
available to the telephone.
I think most of the people here in this group wish to discuss saxophones,
not me. It seems that there are lots of posts from only two people (Grumps
and Bigbopper) who say they have a problem. The rest of the posts in this
group over the last couple of months have nothing to do with me, they're
about saxophones.
You guys have your own little troll site which you regularly invite people
from this group and others to visit, so why don't you bitch about me, Tim
Price, Paul Coats, Steve Weinert, Curt Altarac, Harri Rautiniman, and others
there to your little hearts content? Invite the world to come over and hear
you out there , but let the people who wish to discuss saxophones here do
what they came here to do. When you issue your invitation to your troll
site, feel free to tell them it's about me (and anyone else you wish to
disparage), and that you have information not available elsewhere. Post an
announcement weekly in all the discussion groups. Buy an ad on Google. I
don't care.
I don't know anyone who goes by the name "bigbopper", so I don't know what
problem exists, if any really does. I know for a fact that I have never done
any business of any form or fashion with Grumps and that I have never even
spoken to him, so I can only surmise that his problem is some sort of thing
that is beyond my understanding. If I can help you resolve any problems you
have with me, I'm just not that hard to find. If your problems are real,
(please be VERY specific) and there's something reaonable that I can do to
resolve them, just let me know and I'll see what I can do. If your problems
are imaginary or ficticious, or are not really your direct problems, please
don't waste my time.
Now, please, back to the discussion of the Vintage Saxophone Value Guide....
--
The more you run over a possum, the flatter it gets!
bigbopper
Posture around this.
If you want this to end, you have only to learn to behave yourself,
and dispense with your repetitive political maneuvering on this board.
I see today you are even using Ray Charles's death as an excuse to
posture and attempt to garner sympathy for yourself. You seem to be a
person completely without a shred of class or decency.
For direct and indirect testimonials to Steve Goodson's fine customer
service, expertise, and personal integrity, see:
One of my personal favorites:
http://saxontheweb.myforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=3545&highlight=goodson
Everybody's first point of reference, in dealing with any unknown
business:
http://www.neworleans.bbb.org/commonreport.html?bureau=norl&compid=10001527&code=
An oldie but a goodie:
http://web.archive.org/web/20020206161228/http://myweb.accessone.com:80/~khenson/goodsonbeware.html
A sterling repair review:
http://saxontheweb.myforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=12883&highlight=goodson
********************************
Mysteriously, Roger Aldridge's famous cry for help on SOTW has
disappeared. Along with a few hundred other posts having anything to
do with Steve Goodson, and innumerable candid disclosures about him.
For Roger's case history, it is necessary to refer to Steve Goodson's
beloved benefactors, the "trolls":
http://www.saxtrolls.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=292&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=35
http://www.saxtrolls.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=346&highlight=roger+aldridge
http://www.saxtrolls.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=318&highlight=roger+aldridge
For more:
http://www.saxtrolls.net/forum/search.php?mode=results
**********************************
The list goes on...and on...and on:
http://saxontheweb.myforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=7600&highlight=goodson
http://saxontheweb.myforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=14231&highlight=goodson
http://saxontheweb.myforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=10121&highlight=goodson
This one apparently has Goodson shilling for himself again, a familiar
sight, using a fake name:
http://saxontheweb.myforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=4992&highlight=goodson
http://saxontheweb.myforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=1379&highlight=goodson
http://saxontheweb.myforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=14438&highlight=goodson
http://saxontheweb.myforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=9411&highlight=goodson
http://saxontheweb.myforums.net/viewtopic.php?t=6262&highlight=goodson
*****************************
For those who, like me, were at first baffled by "the trolls," my
favorite troll thread, that site's "Genesis":
http://www.saxtrolls.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3&highlight=telephoned+death+threats
*****************************
What a fun and funloving guy, huh? And he has such lovely friends.
Who could fail to love, respect and admire such a man?
Grumps
>It seems that there are lots of posts from only two people (Grumps
>and .....
>with Grumps.....
Hey, keep me out of this one.
I like the value guide.
P. Tung
Now that everybody knows who you are, I am going to take this opportunity to
try and put this ongoing saga to rest.
I'm going to ask you, respectfully, to drop for the moment the pretense that
your "value guide" is the core subject of this thread for you. The core
subject of this thread is your viability on this newsgroup, as it has been
since you came back as Hornsmasher, in order to attempt an attack on me,
while attempting to paint yourself as a victim that just wants to
contribute.
Others can corroborate that I am bringing up a valid issue by visiting this
thread:
"Hornsmasher" <hornsma...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:jL6yc.23607$LC3....@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
P. Tung
complete the posting.
"P. Tung" <pt...@nobspaam.justsaxes.com> wrote in message
news:DHayc.3511$Kd5...@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
P. Tung
Now that everybody knows who you are, I am going to take this opportunity to
try and put this ongoing saga to rest.
I'm going to ask you, respectfully, to drop for the moment the pretense that
your "value guide" is the core subject of this thread for you. The core
subject of this thread is your viability on this newsgroup, as it has been
since you came back as Hornsmasher, in order to attempt an attack on me,
while attempting to paint yourself as a victim that just wants to
contribute.
Others can corroborate that I am bringing up a valid issue by visiting this
thread, where you and a person who is apparently an associate of yours
attack me after trolling me specifically:
I do not bring that up in order to charge you with being a jerk, a troll,
whatever. I merely wish to establish that there is an ongoing disagreement
between you and I, and that you have attacked me specifically by name in the
past, so that others will understand that it is not out of line for me to
address you directly here, while you are having a disagreement with others.
As long as the flames are glowing hot, maybe you and I can come to some form
of genuine, functional truce, so that we can both use this board in peace.
I think you would be surprised to discover that not only I but other users
of the "saxtrolls" board would have no objection to you participating under
your real name, if only certain sorts of phenomena could be avoided.
I think you can understand why others on this board would be offended and
have been by "Harvey"/"Arne" and your posts on the other thread. Perhaps we
can skip the accusations and denials and just agree that you are intelligent
enough to understand others' point of view, even if you vehemently disagree
with it.
I think you already know what the list of grievances are, in truth. It has
all been hashed out either "here" or "there" over the past few years. The
reality is simply that you disagree with the validity of others caring about
the things they care about, or with their being offended by the things that
offend them (about you).
What I am trying to get to finally, is this: sure: you have made alot of
steadfast enemies, and some of them hate you personally. Both you and the
people that despise you agree on at least this point.
BUT:
Speaking for myself, I can say that if you were to participate in this
newsgroup without the specific forms of collusion and deceit that others
have charged in the past (for example, staging conversations for promotional
purposes, and then terrorizing any one that dares to call you on it, whether
that terror is in the form of anonymous threats or direct threats), you
would hear no complaints, not even a hint of hostility from my corner.
I am going to guess the same is true of your other perceived "enemies,"
although that may be difficult to accept.
All of that said, I want to ask you this directly, and I am asking it
publicly because I think there is greater possibility of resolution through
the public gesture than would occur privately:
What in your mind has to happen in order to put all this to rest? If not
between you and others then just between you and me? Realistically
speaking, how can we come to an understanding, you and I specifically, where
we can coexist in peace on this board? How can we manage to post here
normally without either actions on my part or your part existing always in a
kind of tiresome and endless dance of subtextual hostility?
Please do not just answer me with a heated one-liner, or quick "who me"
pose. I am genuinely trying to talk turkey with you, here, with complete
candor, and to take something bad and come up with some sort of effective
antidote.
I don't have to like you, or respect you, in order to respect a form of
agreement that is held to in good faith by both parties. I have had my life
threatened by phone, twice, and I know from your silences that you do not in
any way deny the reality of this, that in fact it occured. More, I have
been threatened on this board by your friend "Ezekiel." I think it shows
remarkable good faith that I speak to you with candor now, at all, having
had those experiences.
So, I ask you:
Can you come up with a reasonable understanding by which you might
participate here without engaging in some of the activities you KNOW to be
guaranteed to cause trouble, while requesting something reasonable in return
from "the trolls?"
Let me state clearly so there is no misunderstanding that I have NO personal
stake in "saxtrolls.net" -- I was not a founding member, have no
administrative or moderating influence there. I am and have been merely a
board user, there. More importantly, and you know this about me, I have
never spoken there a word I did not believe to be 100% true. I mention this
because I am going to guess that ideally, for a real peace to happen, you
would like something to happen at that site, but I have no control or
influence over any of that. In truth, I am the least of your enemies, and
have done less damage to you than others. I am going to guess you don't see
it this way, because I am the one among your perceived enemies that people
innately tend to trust, and because people grant me a measure of authority
to speak based on the quality of my work.
Whatever perceptions may be, I am the one among your "enemies" who would
like to find a genuine solution to these ongoing and unnecessary hassles.
There has to be some give and take here, on both sides, but I am going to
guess this can be put to rest in the way that a bottle can be put down: one
day at a time, with some respect for oneself and an awareness one's own
compulsions.
Basically, behind the lines in the sand, you know the complaints that others
have with you.
Where is the middle ground?
Please, answer honestly. Further politicking here, when I'm being this
candid with you, cannot possibly bring any positive outcome. I have no
doubt I speak for others as well, though I have not discussed the content of
this posting with any one, other than the few who saw my intial accidental
posting.
Realistically, what can happen here, today, or tonight, to make tomorrow
less acrid and irritating than what came before?
I am never going to like or respect you, after my past experiences with and
of you. I think you know that. BUT, again, that doesn't mean I can't
respect an agreement between us, if you can respect it as well, and act in
_real_, mutual good faith.
If you want to answer privately, answer privately. You know how to get in
touch with me, as well.
Neal
wrote:
> Steve,
>
> Now that everybody knows who you are
Am I the only one who's really, really tired of this round-and-round?
Apologies, I should just ignore or killfile, but I really hate seeing new
messages and most are about this truly silly nonsense.
P. Tung
post. You'll see that it is trying to accomplish exactly what you are
requesting.
"Neal" <nea...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:opr9e03n...@news.individual.net...
> On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 00:33:19 -0500, P. Tung <pt...@nobspaam.justsaxes.com>
Peter Berlau
"Hornsmasher" <hornsma...@yahoo.com> schrieb im
Newsbeitrag
news:LLZxc.5333$JF6....@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
> It's not up on my site (www.saxgourmet.com) yet, but will
be in the next few
> days. Here are the latest updates. Be sure to read the
preface first!!
>
...
> MARK VI 53201 - 236000
...
> Tenor $ 7000
...
I have some questions about prices, around here You can get
the most value on
Mark VI < 60.000, than <100.000 and the horns > 200.000
are not of interest...
Is this splitting "voodoo"? Or are quality differences
between that serial numbered
horns?
difference
sax < 60.000 $ 6.000 - $ 8.000
< 100.000 $ 5.000 - $ 6.000
> 200.000 $ 4.500 or less
Also I miss the serial-numbers at the neck...
The not engraved saxes from Selmer Paris are here often
called
the lower quality horns, however...
Thanks for listing the values
kindly regards
Peter
Zenin
> I'm going to ask you, respectfully, to drop for the moment the pretense
> that your "value guide" is the core subject of this thread for you. The
> core subject of this thread is your viability on this newsgroup, as it has
> been since you came back as Hornsmasher, in order to attempt an attack on
> me, while attempting to paint yourself as a victim that just wants to
> contribute.
Excuse me, but how exactly is this value guide an attack on you
personally, or anyone for that matter?
>snip<
> What in your mind has to happen in order to put all this to rest? If not
> between you and others then just between you and me?
I can't speek for Steve, but I'd have to imagine that if the other side
stopped attacking Steve for patently stupid reasons, Steve would
probably stop responding to them. In my own (short) time here and from
what I've read in the many threads his enemies like you have linked to
(including the one you just linked), the attacks without fail are
started against Steve...not the other way around. A perfect example are
the two ridiculous attacks made against Steve for his follow up to the
repair kit thread and his value guide thread.
In short, if you want to stop fighting maybe you should stop picking
fights... I don't know, 'tis just a thought.
> Can you come up with a reasonable understanding by which you might
> participate here without engaging in some of the activities you KNOW to be
> guaranteed to cause trouble, while requesting something reasonable in
> return from "the trolls?"
So far it seems that the only thing the "trolls" ala Grumps et al will
accept is Steve's complete disappearance now and forever. Grumps'
constant attacks against Steve for simply posting (the content of the
post doesn't matter to Grumps apparently, all that's needed is "From:
Steve" to set him off).
Again the two most recent examples are perfect:
Steve recommends a product of another vender, "the trolls" go postal.
Steve posts his well known "value guide", the trolls go postal.
What's next, "Steve says goodbye for ever", and the trolls go postal?
If you have a point, make it in your own thread; please stop hijacking
*actual* saxophone discussions to further your own hateful agenda. I
honestly don't care at this point if it has any validity or not, only
that the methods being used to "fight the fight" aren't tolerable. You
have no right whatsoever to shutdown all discussions in the group until
we all "get a clue" and hate Steve with you. I don't like Steve (I
don't know Steve), but I *do* dislike "the trolls" and can clearly see
why you people have been given the title.
Grow up, sheesh
-Zenin
Zenin
Heh, I would have thought you'd believe Steve posts his guide only to
try and raise the going prices of horns he has to sell or some other
nonsense. Perhaps there is hope for you yet.
-Zenin
P. Tung
you sure spend alot of time on this newsgroup actively trying to stir it up,
"Zenin"
<ze...@rhps.org>.
I am going to put you on "ignore" in the future. When I do not respond to
you in the future, it will be because I have not seen your postings.
To Goodson: I will be checking this board at intervals today, and you can
reach me by phone or email.
If you are genuinely interested in putting this tired episode in both our
lives to rest, I am listening.
In order to maximize the opportunity for a resolution to this ongoing saga,
I will not respond again on this thread, whether to supporting or
disparaging posts "from the peanut gallery," unless to a post by my
original's intended audience.
Those who are upset or disapproving of me for bothering to attempt what I am
attempting can have this satisfaction: I am pretty much done with this
messageboard, an internet chat about saxophones - or anything, lol - for
good. Or so I am at this moment convinced and resolved.
(To the potshotters, such as Zenin, lurking: lol, yes, that is both a
threat and a promise.)
Honestly, my search in life & on earth is for escape from the darker,
cheaper, and more base/basic aspects of human existence, or a proof that
there is on earth any escape from them at all. It has taken me a
surprisingly long time to finally concede that internet chat spaces are the
last places in the universe one is apt to find such relief, or conversation
that does not ultimately further increase the need of it, lol.
The shame of it is how much time I have wasted, truly, in the process. I
doubt I am the only one of whom that can be fairly said.
"Zenin" <ze...@rhps.org> wrote in message
news:10ck1dj...@news.supernews.com...
P. Tung
know that this branch of the original thread is thankfully resolved, at
least between Steve and myself.
Hornsmasher
understanding that we both can live with for the betterment of the saxophone
community.
Jack Metcalf
And I wish to thank Palo for "extending the olive branch" and reaching
an understanding that we both can live with for the betterment of the
saxophone community.
Well fine and dandy. Time for the rest of the problems to be resolved
then I take it? Have you returned the soprano saxophone you stole
from Roger Aldridge as well, Steve? How about making good on the
Unison horns you took deposits on two years ago? It's all been taken
care of? If so, all is well.
If not, you still have a lot to answer for.
BIG DADDY
He's a crook and a con artist, that's why he changes his name, trys to hide
etc.
This is not a stand up character.
I have no hidden agenda here, hell I don't even know the guy other than to
lock horns with him over his cryrogenics crap, but I have benn on this group
for over 4 years and he just continues his dishonesty and people are taken
in by him, blows me away!
BD
"Jack Metcalf" <jax...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:b2f2ebbb.04061...@posting.google.com...
keith A. henson
it's a mindblower to read that steve goodson is still out there doing
it to others as he did to me. when I saw his picture in downbeat I
almost shit...
here are my current websites
http://home.att.net/~khenson/
http://home.att.net/~khenson/goodsonbeware.html
still practicing and playing in the pacific nortthwest
keith henson
joshnosh
Hi
Have you ever heard of a Huller saxophone got a sticker and eagle on
it 1936 i think.
On Thu, 10 Jun 2004 09:03:21 -0500, "Hornsmasher"
<hornsma...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>It's not up on my site (www.saxgourmet.com) yet, but will be in the next few
>days. Here are the latest updates. Be sure to read the preface first!!
>
>
>VINTAGE SAXOPHONE VALUE GUIDE
>
>
>
>When I set out to prepare a reference guide for pricing vintage horns, I did
>so with the clear understanding that it's not a perfect world, and that the
>preparation of a perfect value guide would be impossible. I have based my
>research on actual selling prices by recognized dealers. I did not consider
>auction sales (such as E-Bay); private sales between individuals who are not
>regular dealers; pawn shop or other irregular sources, or any anecdotal
>stories. I have only addressed instruments for which there is a regular and
>established market, so not every model is included. I am well aware that
>some will question my figures and criticize my findings. I would encourage
>those critics to do their own research and publish their own findings.
>
>I have based my valuations upon the following assumptions: (1) the
>instrument is in perfect playing condition and needs nothing in terms of
>repair (2) the finish is original and completely intact (3) the original
>case is intact (4) the instrument has not been altered or modified from its
>original condition, having the correct style pads, springs, no neck pickups
>etc. Deduct for needed repairs and/or restoration to original condition.
>Relacquers are generally worth 25% less than 100% originals.
>
>
>
>BUESCHER
>
>TRUE TONE 5XXX - 254XXX
>
>These are very common horns, which play rather nicely when set up properly.
>The later examples have snap in pads and Norton springs. There's a real
>oversupply of alto horns. Most of the examples you will find will be in a
>satin silver finish. Add 20% for gold plate.
>
>Sopranino $ 2100
>
>Straight soprano $ 2000
>
>Curved soprano $ 2200 deduct 20% if keyed to Eb only
>
>C soprano $1000 MUST have original mouthpiece!!
>
>C melody $ 800
>
>Alto $ 900
>
>Straight Alto $10,000
>
>Tenor $1200
>
>Baritone $ 2500
>
>Bass $ 7000
>
>NEW ARISTOCRAT 255XXX - 270XXX
>
>There are only alto and tenor horns in this series. The other members of the
>family still had the True Tone label. They're almost always seen in satin
>silver. Add 20% for gold plating. Physical appearance is similar to the True
>Tone, but the neck is different, the keyguards are more deluxe. They play
>much better! They will always have snap in pads and Norton springs.
>
>Alto $ 2100
>
>Tenor $ 2300
>
>ARISTOCRAT 270XXX - 290XXX
>
>Tenors and alto horns only. The others were still basically True Tones.
>These are really nice players, much sought after. You'll be unlikely to find
>them in anything but lacquer. Add 20% for silver. I've never seen a gold
>example. These horns are much more desirable than any of their ancestors.
>
>Alto $ 1800
>
>Tenor $ 2300
>
>
>
>ARISTOCRAT 290XXX - 325XXX "BIG B"
>
>The name comes from the bell engraving. These are the very best of the
>Aristocrat series. Fat sound and great intonation. Some had sterling silver
>necks (add 20%), very few were silver plated (add 20%), I've seen a gold
>one, although I was not totally convinced it was original. The baritones are
>particularly rich sounding. Brown rollers always, as well as snap in pads
>and Norton springs.
>
>Alto $1800
>
>Tenor $ 2200
>
>Baritone $2800
>
>ARISTOCRAT 330XXX - 360XXX
>
>I think these are often overlooked and underpriced. They play rather nicely.
>Toward the high end of the serial number range you begin to see some
>examples that look like 400 bells on Aristocrat bodies.
>
>Alto $ 000
>
>Tenor $1300
>
>400 SERIES 291XXX - 381XXX
>
>These are the Top Hat and Cane horns, the best of the Bueschers. They will
>always have a raised silver logo on the bell; brown rollers; a silver
>resonance ring under the bell rim; snap in pads and Norton springs, and an
>underslung octave key. There are a few silver (add 20%) plated ones, and a
>very few (add 30%) gold ones. I've seen some 400 baris, but none with top
>hat and cane engraving or other distinctive features of this series. I think
>these horns are undervalued.
>
>Alto $ 2300
>
>Tenor $ 3500
>
>Baritone $2500
>
>BUFFET
>
>
>
>SUPER DYNACTION
>
>This is the first Buffet horn you're likely to see. Very dark tone, great
>workmanship. Some examples have screw in resonators. Later ones have
>sculpted low Eb/C keys like the legendary S-1. These treasures should be
>priced like Selmers from the same era, but they're not. Lucky you!
>
>Alto $ 2000
>
>Tenor $ 2400
>
>Soprano $2000
>
>Baritone $3400
>
>
>
>S-1
>
>If there was ever a near perfect design, I think this it. The Eb/C mechanism
>is genius; the articulated low C#/Bb mechanism should be on all horns. The
>soprano models usually have keywork to high G, and have "conventional" palm
>key layout. These horns are bargains. The baritones are extremely rare and
>fabulous!
>
>Alto $ 2400
>
>Tenor $ 3200
>
>Soprano $2500
>
>Baritone $ 3600
>
>CONN
>
>WONDER through 150XXX
>
>Up until 75XXX, no rolled tone holes. Usually seen in silver. Add 20% for
>gold and 40% for gold with "artist" engraving and mother of pearl key
>touches. You sometimes see these in nickel plate.
>
>Sopranino $ 2000
>
>Straight soprano $1600
>
>Curved soprano $ 2200 Deduct 20% if keyed to Eb only
>
>C soprano $1000 MUST have original mouthpiece
>
>C melody $ 800
>
>Alto $1000
>
>Tenor $1200
>
>Baritone $1800
>
>Bass $ 7500
>
>
>
>
>
>NEW WONDER "CHU BERRY" 150XXX - 240XXX
>
>Conn never called these horns "Chu Berry", but we're stuck with the name.
>Improved keywork, "fingernail file" G# key; microtuner necks; and really
>spectacular engraving on the Artist models (usually seen in gold plate,
>often with mother of pearl key touches, add 40%). There is strong demand for
>these fine instruments. Usually seen in silver, deduct 20% for lacquer, add
>20% for gold non-artist examples. Prices may vary considerably depending
>upon the amount and style of engraving. Pristine examples bring top dollar.
>
>Straight soprano $2000
>
>Curved soprano $2500
>
>Alto $ 2100
>
>Tenor $ 2800
>
>Baritone $ 3000
>
>Bass $ 7500
>
>
>
>"TRANSITIONAL" 240XXX - 260XXX
>
>You'll see these with different keywork styles, and almost always with
>elaborate engraving. Most are in silver. Deduct 10% for lacquer, add 30% for
>gold. These horns have a real cult following.
>
>Alto $ 2400
>
>Tenor $ 3000
>
>Baritone $ 3100
>
>
>
>M SERIES 260XXX - 834XXX
>
>We're talking about REAL saxophones here! There's nothing on this Earth
>quite like one of these at full song! The Conqueror series (26M and 30M)
>have very elaborate adjustment mechanisms and solid silver key touches. The
>Constellation 28M alto has three octave vents and the best feeling mechanism
>around, along with a high tech (for the era) plastic key guard. It was
>designed by my good friend and legend Santy Runyon. The 6M alto; 10M tenor;
>and 12M baritone are the famous "naked lady" horns. They lost their rolled
>tone holes after WWII.( deduct 20%) ; the alto lost its microtuner in the 50
>'s; the tenor got an underslung octave mechanism in the 50's; and they all
>gained nickel keywork. These later examples play very well, but you should
>deduct 50%.. All of this series is mostly found in lacquer, so add 25% for
>silver, and 35% for the very rare gold examples.
>
>Alto 6M $ 2000 horns stamped viii seem to play best
>
>Alto 26M $ 2800
>
>Alto 28M $ 4000 plastic keyguard must be intact
>
>Tenor 10M $ 3400
>
>Tenor 30M $ 4000 The best vintage tenor, IMHO
>
>Baritone 12M $ 3600
>
>
>
>H. COUF
>
>From 1965 until 1988, these fine German horns (manufactured by J. Keilworth)
>were distributed at various times by W. T. Armstrong and Conn. They have
>quite a cult following today, and with good reason. The Superba I has rolled
>tone holes, the Superba II does not. I've never seen them in anything but
>lacquer.
>
>SUPERBA I
>
>Alto $ 2200
>
>Tenor $ 2800
>
>Baritone $3300
>
>SUPERBA II
>
>Alto $1800
>
>Tenor $2200
>
>Baritone $3000
>
>
>
>KEILWERTH
>
>Before the current model lineup evolved, Keilworth imported some nice horns
>stamped "The New King" with rolled tone holes and plastic key guards (must
>be intact) that have a small following. Mostly in lacquer, add 10% for
>silver.
>
>Alto $1000
>
>Tenor $1200
>
>KING
>
>Except for the Saxello, I can't find anybody expressing much interest in the
>Kings made before the Zephyr. I find their intonation to be sketchy at best.
>The engraving is beautiful, but they just don't play very well. The Zephyr
>is a killer! The Zephyr Special had a solid silver neck and mother of pearl
>key touches. I understand there were a few made with sterling silver bells.
>After the mid 1950's, the Zephyr became an intermediate model, so deduct
>30%. The Zephyr baritone remained essentially unchanged throughout the
>production run and sound great. Most of the Zephyr series was in lacquer,
>add 15% for silver. 20% for gold. Around number 272XXX, the Super 20 was
>introduced. The first examples had mother of pearl key touches; sunburst
>engraving on the bell keys; socket necks; and optional sterling silver necks
>(add 15%) and sterling silver bells (add 30%). Around 430XXX, the Super 20
>was cheapened considerably: the neck changed to a conventional style; the
>bell key engraving eventually went away; the mother of pearl inlay was long
>since gone. Deduct 25% for horns after this number. There are a few examples
>with gold inlay on the silver bell (add 15%), a few rare silver plated horns
>(I own one, add 20%); and a very few gold plated ones (add 25%). There are,
>of course, a very few Super 20 baritones, some with silver necks (add 15%)
>and I have seen one with a silver bell. I think the Kings have strong upside
>appreciation potential.
>
>Saxello soprano $ 3200 add 15% for gold plate
>
>Alto Zephyr $1800
>
>Alto Zephyr Spcl. $2400 add 15% for silver neck
>
>Alto Super 20 $2600 see above commentary for adjustments
>
>Tenor Zephyr $ 2400
>
>Tenor Zephyr Spcl $ 3000 add 15% for silver neck
>
>Tenor Super 20 $ 3400 see above commentary for adjustments
>
>Baritone Zephyr $ 2900
>
>Baritone Super 20 $ 4000
>
>
>
>MARTIN
>
>These horns are under appreciated . They are undervalued. Play one in good
>adjustment and you'll see what I mean. I've used a The Martin baritone for
>years. They are the best of the vintage baritones. All of the Martin horns
>have a sweet sound, and a very lush lower end. The horns from 1933
>(Handcraft Committee) through the early 60's (the Magna) can hold their own
>with anything ever made. There are lots of variations on the Martin theme,
>and below are the ones that I think you should consider. The early ones are
>mostly seen in silver, add 15% for gold plate. From the Committee on, they
>are almost always lacquer. Add 15% for silver, 25% for gold. .I've seen a
>couple of Committee models with sterling silver necks. Add $15% for this
>feature.
>
>MARTIN HORNS THROUGH 1933
>
>Soprano straight $1000
>
>Soprano curved $1800
>
>Alto $ 800
>
>Alto "Typewriter" $ 1600
>
>C soprano $1000
>
>C melody $ 800
>
>Tenor $ 800
>
>Tenor "Typewriter" $ 2400
>
>Baritone $ 2200
>
>Baritone "Typewriter" $ 3500
>
>Bass $ 7000
>
>COMMITTEE AND COMMITTEE II THROUGH 1945
>
>Alto $ 1800
>
>Tenor $ 2900
>
>Baritone $ 3100
>
>THE MARTIN, MUSIC MAN, AND MAGNA
>
>Alto $ 2000
>
>Alto Magna $ 2300
>
>Tenor $ 3000
>
>Tenor Music Man $2800 very rare, but fabulous!
>
>Tenor Magna $ 3200
>
>Baritone $ 3400 has no chromatic F#
>
>Baritone Magna $ 3600
>
>
>
>SELMER
>
>The name alone inspires reverence. It's generally agreed that Selmer made
>some of the very best horns of all time. Some models certainly command the
>highest prices. Selmer has the only legitimate claim to be the direct
>successor of Adolphe Sax. I believe that the models before the Balanced
>Action are overpriced. You can buy two wonderful old Conns for what some
>people are asking for Selmers of the same era. I have found that most of the
>action in pre-Balanced Action horns is just talk. There seem to be very few
>people (outside of a few collectors) buying these horns.
>
>MODELE 22 750 - 4450
>
>The earliest examples are stamped Serie 22. and have a unique side Bb
>mechanism. Add 20% for these. Add 15% for silver, 25% for gold plate.
>
>Soprano $1500
>
>Alto $1200
>
>Tenor $1400
>
>Baritone $1800
>
>
>
>MODELE 26 4451 - 11950
>
>Basically the same horn as the 22. Similar adjustments for finish.
>
>Soprano $1500
>
>Alto $ 1200
>
>Tenor $1400
>
>Baritone $1800
>
>
>
>SUPER 11951 - 18700
>
>These come in three flavors: New Largebore (11951 -13000); Cigar Cutter
>(13,000 - 17,000), and Super (17,000 - 18,700). These are the first horns
>that really sound like Selmers. The differences in the variations are pretty
>minor, mostly in mechanism. Much better horns than the 22's and 26's. Some
>of these are beautifully engraved (add 10%). Silver is not uncommon (add
>15%), gold a little more scarce (add 20%)..
>
>Soprano $1500
>
>Alto $ 2000
>
>Tenor $ 2400
>
>Baritone $ 2800
>
>
>
>RADIO IMPROVED 18701 - 21750
>
>This is essentially a renamed Super with different engraving. I've seen a
>couple of people pay some really stupid prices for these. They do play
>rather nicely, and you sometimes see them in silver (add 20%) and I've heard
>there were some gold ones.
>
>Alto $ 2400
>
>Tenor $ 2900
>
>
>
>BALANCED ACTION 21751 - 35800
>
>There is a very good reason that demand (and prices) for these horns is so
>high: although not without their quirks, these are wonderful instruments.
>The later examples have better intonation in the upper end than the earlier
>examples. They are often beautifully engraved. Silver examples bring about a
>20% premium; gold plate about 30% more.
>
>Alto $ 3400
>
>Tenor $ 5000
>
>Baritone $ 4500
>
>
>
>SUPER BALANCED ACTION 35801- 53200
>
>Almost perfection ! Better feel and intonation than the Balanced.. The
>engraving is usually not too elaborate.
>
>Alto $4600
>
>Tenor $5500
>
>Baritone $6500 There are a few low A baritones.
>
>I have a customer who owns one
>
>
>
>MARK VI 53201 - 236000
>
>Of course, this is The Big Daddy Rabbit With the Fuzzy Tongue. Nothing else
>is quite like it. Longest production run in Selmer history. Lots of minor
>variations along the line: necks; engraving; side key attachment etc., but
>even the worst of them is not bad. I've always thought that horns without
>the optional high F# key played a little better. There seems to be more
>demand for the "five digit" horns, and some snobs reject the higher numbered
>examples. More than with any other model, condition is everything. Silver
>plate commands a 20% premium; gold a 30% premium. It's important that the
>serial numbers on the neck match the body. Sopranino, soprano, baritone, and
>bass Mk VI's were made until the introduction of the Super 80 series. Horns
>made for the European market are often unengraved, and lacquered examples
>may have silver plated keywork.
>
>Sopranino $3000
>
>Soprano $3000
>
>Alto $ 6100
>
>Alto Low A $ 5000
>
>Tenor $ 7000
>
>Baritone Bb $7000
>
>Baritone low A $7200
>
>
>
>MARK VII 236000 - 315000
>
>The Mark VI was an impossible act to follow. The VII was rejected by the
>Selmer faithful. I think the ones below around 275000 are good horns, and
>that you should be careful above that number. Silver plated ones bring 20%
>more, I've never seen a gold plated one. Engraving is uncommon above 275000.
>These horns can be a real bargain when you find a good one!
>
>Alto $2000
>
>Tenor $2700
>
>SML
>
>This small company made around 25000 horns between 1937 and 1982 and have a
>fanatical following. I'm one of those fanatics. They're great! There are
>many variations, but later examples tend to have rolled tone holes,
>adjusting screws for the stack keys, beautiful engraving, and a sound that's
>hard to beat. You see them in lacquer, silver (add 15%), gold (add 20%) and
>I've seen one nickel plated alto.
>
>Soprano $ 2200
>
>Alto $ 2800
>
>Tenor $ 3600
Hornsmasher
much demand for anything else.
--
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"joshnosh" <m...@u.com> wrote in message
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