The Beer Hunter Weighs in on Corona
Kyle
daring to call a spade a spade -- specifically for daring to say that
Corona was a bad beer. I'm apparently forbidden from judging a beer
-- by people who jump at the chance to judge me.
Michael "the Beer Hunter" Jackson probably knew more about beer than
anyone. He wrote the book on beer -- several of them, actually ("The
New World Guide to Beer," "Michael Jackson's Beer Companion," The
Great Beers of Belgium" and others, all classics). And here's what he
had to say about Corona in his New World Guide:
Corona beer, from Mexico, for a time enjoyed a cult following
north of the border, and challenged Heineken as the biggest import to
the United States. It did so initially with very little marketing
support, and its success was a phenomenon much studied in the business
pages.
Corona is a beer made as cheaply as possible, so that it can be
sold inexpensively to manual workers in Mexico. Every Mexican brewery
has at least one such product in its portfolio, among several more
interesting beers.
These modestly-paid bean-pickers get what they can pay for, and
their thirsts are quenched. Corona tastes like a beer made with a
very high percentage of corn adjunct and a short lagering time. It is
thin-bodied, with some apple notes. It is no worse, nor better, than
several similar products. That it should command a high price in the
United States reflects upon the judgement of the consumers.
The idealized Mexican worker, thirstily reaching for his Corona,
presented a macho model for the well-heeled kids of Texas and
California (and later New York). The plain glass bottle and
rudimentary, enameled label no doubt added to the inverted snobbery.
The beer was consumed from the bottle, with a slice of lime jammed in
the neck. The lime was an important part of the ritual, but it also
improved the taste. If Chuck, Chip, and Scooter really wanted to look
like macho working men, they could have affected the Pabst of an
unemployed steel-worker from Bethleham, PA., but that might have been
too close to home.
No one should begrudge Mexico the foreign exchange, but it is a
shame that Corona proved such a conspicuous success where better beers
had fared less well. Only after the success of Corona were Mexican
beers taken seriously in the United States. Before Corona, they had
suffered from the belief that they might be as well-made as the local
water.
In fact, Mexico has a long tradition of producing beer, and some
well-equipped breweries. It is said to have had the first commercial
brewery in the New World, in the 1500s, during the period of Cortes,
and has been making lager beer since the 1880s or 1890s.
The appeal of Corona has not encouraged Mexican brewers to
emphasize their more characterful products.
-- MJ, in his New World Guide to Beer
Mike Smith
>
> The idealized Mexican worker, thirstily reaching for his Corona,
> presented a macho model for the well-heeled kids of Texas and
> California (and later New York). The plain glass bottle and
> rudimentary, enameled label no doubt added to the inverted snobbery.
Plus you can pound a lot of 'em without being slowed down much -
important for boys' night out. "The one to have, when you're having
more than one" - which beer was that? I forget.
> The appeal of Corona has not encouraged Mexican brewers to
> emphasize their more characterful products.
Oh, I dunno - Negra Modelo's starting to become more popular around
these parts - not a super-duper-fantastic beer, mind you, but a halfway
decent Vienna-style lager.
--
Mike Smith
Kyle
Negra Modelo is my favorite Mexican beer. It's actually got some body
and some malt taste.
jeffe...@gmail.com
IAWTP
fecki...@gmail.com
Ged damn fucking google groups. Looks like I pulled a Geoff. Go ahead
and laugh at me.
DB (at least my name isn't spelled the faggy British way)
Max C. Webster III
Yeah, but . . . your alter-ego's not as cool as ICL.
- Max -
=======
Thought Jeff was in interloper.
As Americans we must always remember that we all
have a common enemy, an enemy that is dangerous,
powerful, and relentless. I refer, of course,
to the federal government. - Dave Barry
John Nichel
Okay, everybody look up his address and phone number!!!
--
You go to hell. You go to hell and you die.
fecki...@gmail.com
Which is my alter ego, though?
But yeah, nothing's as cool as inopportune nosebleeds.
Onion Knight at
I think DB and SG are gunning for a reality show.
--
OK
Geo
So, essentially what the author said was that corona is piss water
that people use a lime for to give it taste.
Don Bruder
<ec6e4f9e-7c5c-4f85...@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com>,
Geo <taxpa...@hotmail.com> wrote:
Pretty good summary :)
--
Don Bruder - dak...@sonic.net - If your "From:" address isn't on my whitelist,
or the subject of the message doesn't contain the exact text "PopperAndShadow"
somewhere, any message sent to this address will go in the garbage without my
ever knowing it arrived. Sorry... <http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd> for more info
Some Guy
You couldn't handle my reality! Well, you might be able to handle the
liquor and whores, but the rest would torque your soul.
John Nichel
Yet what kyle still can't comprehend is that something like beer is an
individual taste. It doesn't matter how much he thinks he is a 'beer
expert', people will like what they like, regardless of his 'expertise'.
Michael Jackson understood this. I met the man once before he died
(courtesy of where I work), and while I was being razzed by some of the
beer geeks here for not liking Flying Bison's Christmas Ale (I think
that's what it was), Mr. Jackson made it a point to say that something
along the lines of, what is undrinkable to one can be sweet nectar to
another and vice-a-versa.
--
When a naked man is chasing a woman through an alley with a butcher's
knife and a hard-on, I figure he isn't out collecting for the Red Cross.
John Nichel
Soul's are so 1956.
--
I'm looking California and feeling Minnesota.
Some Guy
Exactly. I couldn't give a shit what the Beer Snob thinks. If it's a
good price and tastes OK, I'll drink it. I buy Lakeport Honey, and
while it gets shit upon by other beer snobs, it's a buck a beer and
not too bad.
Some Guy
I know, but I have to make the odd reference to souls or I won't get
elected.
norborder
Running for queen, eh?
--
I am looking forward to an orderly election tomorrow, which will eliminate
the need for a violent bloodbath.
Some Guy
wrote:
>"Some Guy" sayed:
>
>> On Tue, 09 Sep 2008 15:37:32 -0400, John Nichel
>> <jnichel@no_spamby-tor.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Some Guy wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 9 Sep 2008 13:51:29 -0400, "Onion Knight"
>>>> <dioneo(at)hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> "John Nichel" <jnichel@no_spamby-tor.com> wrote:
>>>>>> fecki...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sep 9, 12:15 pm, jeffell...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> IAWTP
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ged damn fucking google groups. Looks like I pulled a Geoff. Go ahead
>>>>>>> and laugh at me.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> DB (at least my name isn't spelled the faggy British way)
>>>>>> Okay, everybody look up his address and phone number!!!
>>>>> I think DB and SG are gunning for a reality show.
>>>>
>>>> You couldn't handle my reality! Well, you might be able to handle the
>>>> liquor and whores, but the rest would torque your soul.
>>>
>>>Soul's are so 1956.
>>
>>
>> I know, but I have to make the odd reference to souls or I won't get
>> elected.
>
>Running for queen, eh?
Nope. President of Reporters Without Norborders.
BaldiePete
"John Nichel" <jnichel@no_spamby-tor.com> wrote in message
news:Hv-dnUx_rrrOLlvV...@posted.choiceonecommunications...
Already found his blog although I don't know if its already known in here.
BaldiePete (feels like some kind of stalker for looking that up)
--
Insert Witty Comment Here
The Family Chauffeur
> better beers had fared less well.
The same could be said for Budweiser.
> In fact, Mexico has a long tradition of producing beer
I'm a Dos Equis XXX fan myself.
Matthew D. Sullivan
> Okay, last month a certain trio of 'tards herded up against me for
> daring to call a spade a spade -- specifically for daring to say that
> Corona was a bad beer. I'm apparently forbidden from judging a beer
> -- by people who jump at the chance to judge me.
I call bullshit. You didn't get called out for calling Corona bad beer.
You got called out for being a pretentious douchebag.
-Matt S.
Mike
Heh, it's weird looking at AMRs actual thoughts rather than AMR
rantings.
The two don't always match up.......
John Nichel
Matt gets it.
--
You can put a cat in an oven, but that don't make it a biscuit.
Typhoon Longwang
>
> Negra Modelo is my favorite Mexican beer. It's actually got some body
> and some malt taste.
It was my favorite, too, until I had this one:
http://www.ratebeer.com/beer/cucapa-chupacabras-pale-ale/79870/
TL
--
Freedom of choice is what you've got.
Freedom from choice is what you want.
Kyle
Beer is a beverage, not a taste. What you don't seem to be able to
grasp is that there are objective standards to judging beer;
that some beers are better than others; and that some palates are
better trained at making these distinctions.
Anyone who *really* believed an absurdity such as "beer is subjective"
or "one person's assessment of a beer is equal to the next" would not
have any sort of problem with my deeming Corona a bad beer, would he?
It doesn't matter how much he thinks he is a 'beer
> expert', people will like what they like, regardless of his 'expertise'.
>
> Michael Jackson understood this. I met the man once before he died
> (courtesy of where I work), and while I was being razzed by some of the
> beer geeks here for not liking Flying Bison's Christmas Ale (I think
> that's what it was), Mr. Jackson made it a point to say that something
> along the lines of, what is undrinkable to one can be sweet nectar to
> another and vice-a-versa.
It doesn't follow that Jackson was a beer-relativist, which as his
comments on Corona (and all of his writings) make clear he was not.
Jackson knew that some people preferred the bland, cheaply made
stuff. Once he wrote that perhaps hops were too adult a taste for
palates accustomed to Coca-cola and donuts.
Kyle
wrote:
Really? What did I say that was pretentious? Be specific please.
Kyle
wrote:
I've never tried it, but it sounds good. The same company makes an
imperial stout. An IS from Mexico? Not long ago it would have been
difficult to believe!
Kyle
wrote:
> > but it is a shame that Corona proved such a conspicuous success where
> > better beers had fared less well.
>
> The same could be said for Budweiser.
Or any of the mass-market pseudo-pilsners, though Corona is a
particularly egregious example of it.
I'd say Stella Artois is the Corona of today. It has the foreign
sounding name and is ridiculously overpriced, so people think they're
being sophisticated and/or bold when they drink it. What little
flavor it has is of adjuncts, cheap malt substitutes.
norborder
"Kyle" sayed:
<SNIP the continual horse beating>
> It doesn't follow that Jackson was a beer-relativist, which as his
> comments on Corona (and all of his writings) make clear he was not.
> Jackson knew that some people preferred the bland, cheaply made
> stuff. Once he wrote that perhaps hops were too adult a taste for
> palates accustomed to Coca-cola and donuts.
Yeah OK, Kyle. Corona sucks. The horse is unbelievably dead.
Kyle
wrote:
Okay, I've reviewed the "Froofy Beers" thread. I find it very telling
indeed that the person to whom I first criticized Corona and used the
phrase "infantilism of the palate" never got hostile with me. We
remained on perfectly civil terms. He took my Corona-bashing in
stride and simply explained, plausibly enough, that he preferred
wine. There was no nastiness whatsoever.
In fact, *no one* in that thread made a serious attempt at defending
Corona or at intelligently criticizing anything I said
(e.g., my statements that beer qualities varied, or my statement that
there were degrees of expertise when it came to beer). What I got
from a couple of people [1] was some extremely juvenile name-
calling.
[1] I also find it extremely telling that most of this name-calling
emanated from a pair of individuals (Barf and Nichel) who had fared
very poorly in exchanges with me in the past and who have been
predisposed towards nastiness towards me ever since. They're a pair
of wounded little children who look for excuses to gang up on me. I
welcome such attempts and wish them better luck in the future.
norborder
"Kyle" sayed:
> On Sep 9, 6:40 pm, "Matthew D. Sullivan" <mdsulli...@rogers.comPOST>
> wrote:
>> Kyle wrote:
>> > Okay, last month a certain trio of 'tards herded up against me for
>> > daring to call a spade a spade -- specifically for daring to say that
>> > Corona was a bad beer. I'm apparently forbidden from judging a beer
>> > -- by people who jump at the chance to judge me.
>>
>> I call bullshit. You didn't get called out for calling Corona bad beer.
>> You got called out for being a pretentious douchebag.
>>
>> -Matt S.
>
> Okay, I've reviewed the "Froofy Beers" thread. I find it very telling
> indeed that the person to whom I first criticized Corona and used the
> phrase "infantilism of the palate" never got hostile with me. We
> remained on perfectly civil terms. He took my Corona-bashing in
> stride and simply explained, plausibly enough, that he preferred
> wine. There was no nastiness whatsoever.
He prefers wine because he's a fruitcake. There was no nastiness because
he's a wimp. Now, to *whom* exactly are we referring? I can't remember. ;)
> In fact, *no one* in that thread made a serious attempt at defending
> Corona or at intelligently criticizing anything I said
> (e.g., my statements that beer qualities varied, or my statement that
> there were degrees of expertise when it came to beer). What I got
> from a couple of people [1] was some extremely juvenile name-
> calling.
That's it. I'm buying a six-pack of Corona tonight and am gonna drink it
*all* gone, you smarmy little twit. I'll let you know how it was.
> [1] I also find it extremely telling that most of this name-calling
> emanated from a pair of individuals (Barf and Nichel) who had fared
> very poorly in exchanges with me in the past and who have been
> predisposed towards nastiness towards me ever since. They're a pair
> of wounded little children who look for excuses to gang up on me. I
> welcome such attempts and wish them better luck in the future.
That did it. You *are* weirder than CPD, and by a frighteningly large
margin.
(No offense to you of course, CPD. ;p )
John Nichel
>
>> [1] I also find it extremely telling that most of this name-calling
>> emanated from a pair of individuals (Barf and Nichel) who had fared
>> very poorly in exchanges with me in the past and who have been
>> predisposed towards nastiness towards me ever since. They're a pair
>> of wounded little children who look for excuses to gang up on me. I
>> welcome such attempts and wish them better luck in the future.
>
Hey Barf, did you hear that, we're infatuated with Kimmy.
Geez, it must be tough being perfect.
I'll keep it short and sweet ya pansy, and I won't even ask for Barf's
help. You cry like a little bitch. Go borrow a tampon from your mother
and stuff it in that bleeding pussy you call a mouth.
--
Now, with the rest of you either plonk the fairy, or at least not reply
to him?
Matthew D. Sullivan
That Chilean Guy
"Pretentious? MOI?"
John Nichel
I can't count how many times that has popped into my head today.
catpandaddy
"norborder" <norb...@bite.me> wrote in message
news:p6udnbjfpd9L01XV...@comcast.com...
Hm? Someone just say something?
--
CPD
One cool thing about interning at a hospital is access to all sorts of
specialists. I was referred to someone for an outpatient "Add-A-Pairtomy".
It took. So not much bugs me anymore. Um... this paragraph's not making me
look any less weird, is it. ;-)
Barf
<jnichel@no_spamby-tor.com> wrote:
>> "Kyle" sayed:
>>
>>> [1] I also find it extremely telling that most of this name-calling
>>> emanated from a pair of individuals (Barf and Nichel) who had fared
>>> very poorly in exchanges with me in the past and who have been
>>> predisposed towards nastiness towards me ever since. They're a pair
>>> of wounded little children who look for excuses to gang up on me. I
>>> welcome such attempts and wish them better luck in the future.
>>
>
>Hey Barf, did you hear that, we're infatuated with Kimmy.
>
>Geez, it must be tough being perfect.
>
>I'll keep it short and sweet ya pansy, and I won't even ask for Barf's
>help. You cry like a little bitch. Go borrow a tampon from your mother
>and stuff it in that bleeding pussy you call a mouth.
Kyle is an arrogant prick. If he had any fucking sense, he'd go drink
his beer and enjoy it instead of trying to convince everyone else what
they should want to drink.
And if people would quit replying to his stupid ass, I wouldn't see
his posts.
Barfolomew "I'm half man, and half dog. I'm my own best friend!"
"Now I'd like to introduce the band. Geddy, Neil. Neil, Geddy." Big Al
norborder
"Barf" sayed:
> On Wed, 10 Sep 2008 19:15:33 -0400, John Nichel
> <jnichel@no_spamby-tor.com> wrote:
>
>>> "Kyle" sayed:
>>>
>>>> [1] I also find it extremely telling that most of this name-calling
>>>> emanated from a pair of individuals (Barf and Nichel) who had fared
>>>> very poorly in exchanges with me in the past and who have been
>>>> predisposed towards nastiness towards me ever since. They're a pair
>>>> of wounded little children who look for excuses to gang up on me. I
>>>> welcome such attempts and wish them better luck in the future.
>>>
>>
>>Hey Barf, did you hear that, we're infatuated with Kimmy.
>>
>>Geez, it must be tough being perfect.
>>
>>I'll keep it short and sweet ya pansy, and I won't even ask for Barf's
>>help. You cry like a little bitch. Go borrow a tampon from your mother
>>and stuff it in that bleeding pussy you call a mouth.
>
> Kyle is an arrogant prick. If he had any fucking sense, he'd go drink
> his beer and enjoy it instead of trying to convince everyone else what
> they should want to drink.
>
> And if people would quit replying to his stupid ass, I wouldn't see
> his posts.
That's it - now I'm gonna reply to *all* his posts. ;)
John Nichel
Careful, or you'll be lumped into the infatuated with Kyle group.
--
Millions of sperm and you were the fastest?
Barf
<jnichel@no_spamby-tor.com> wrote:
I like how we "fared very poorly" in exchanges - Kyle has been in my
killfile for years. And I could give a rat's ass about his opinions on
anything.
I doubt he actually likes Rush - they serve non-froofy beers at the
concerts.
John Nichel
Yeah. It makes sense to say that *you* fared very poorly, but me??
(prior to this exchange, I don't ever remember talking to the douche bag)
> I doubt he actually likes Rush - they serve non-froofy beers at the
> concerts.
>
Neil flicks boogers at him.
--
Chuck Norris puts the fun in funerals.
Giovanni
Not to mention they like Tool. And Neil's gay. And Geddies wooden leg,
affectionately called Stinkstump by Alex...
Kyle
> On Wed, 10 Sep 2008 19:15:33 -0400, John Nichel
>
>
>
>
>
> <jnichel@no_spamby-tor.com> wrote:
> >> "Kyle" sayed:
>
> >>> [1] I also find it extremely telling that most of this name-calling
> >>> emanated from a pair of individuals (Barf and Nichel) who had fared
> >>> very poorly in exchanges with me in the past and who have been
> >>> predisposed towards nastiness towards me ever since. �They're a pair
> >>> of wounded little children who look for excuses to gang up on me. �I
> >>> welcome such attempts and wish them better luck in the future.
>
> >Hey Barf, did you hear that, we're infatuated with Kimmy.
>
> >Geez, it must be tough being perfect.
>
> >I'll keep it short and sweet ya pansy, and I won't even ask for Barf's
> >help. �You cry like a little bitch. �Go borrow a tampon from your mother
> >and stuff it in that bleeding pussy you call a mouth.
>
> Kyle is an arrogant prick. If he had any fucking sense, he'd go drink
> his beer and enjoy it instead of trying to convince everyone else what
> they should want to drink.
You are an utter 'tard. I've never tried to convince "everyone else
what they should want to drink." Never.
> And if people would quit replying to his stupid ass, I wouldn't see
> his posts.
Trying to tell people who they should reply to, you whiny confused
little hypocrite?
Kyle
Yes, but you just can't stop talking about me, can you?
Kyle
>
> -Matt S.
Um, what part of that post (specifically, again) do you allege is
pretentious?
Kyle
How dumb.
BTW, the exchange of ours which you now claim not to recall concerned
Geddy and Jaco.
mung
"Kyle" <kyle...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:0676feb0-14a9-4fd1...@d1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>Yes, but you just can't stop talking about me, can you?
Get a room, you's three.
Mike
"Not to be rude, but if you're good with Corona, your palate is
infantilized. Corona is nasty, cheaply made, adjunct-filled crap."
Kyle
This has been a remarkable and revealing thread. Not so much for the
number of replies I've received from people who *say* they killfiled
me, or for the mud (or, in Nichel's case, the tampons) that has been
thrown, or even for the straw men that have been concocted. No;
what's most interesting is that the assertions I've made which have
allegedly been so offensive (that there are good and bad beers; that
Corona is a bad beer; that some people are more qualified beer critics
than others) have gone so totally unchallenged. It's enough to make
me wonder if anyone *really* disagrees with me.
But I'd like to ask my main antagonists a question or two
apiece. And whether they reply intelligently or with juvenile insults
is their choice.
John, you've stated that beer is subjective. Do you still
believe that, and, if so, on what basis do you object to my critique
of Corona?
Barf (perfect handle, BTW), you say I tell people what beers to
drink. But I've never done that. What compels you to lie like that?
Kyle
>
> - Show quoted text -
Did you see the quotation from Jackson at the beginning of this
thread? What I said about Corona -- terribly un-PC and blunt as it
was -- has actually panned out pretty well.
Mike
Did you see the quotation from Matt?
That has panned out VERY well.
Mike Smith
And Kyle is unbelievably pretentious about his precious opinions on beer
and the people who drink it.
--
Mike Smith
Mike Smith
Uh, dude, you're really not helping your cause with regard to the whole
"pretentiousness" thing.
--
Mike Smith
Mike Smith
> This has been a remarkable and revealing thread. Not so much for the
> number of replies I've received from people who *say* they killfiled
> me, or for the mud (or, in Nichel's case, the tampons) that has been
> thrown, or even for the straw men that have been concocted. No;
> what's most interesting is that the assertions I've made which have
> allegedly been so offensive (that there are good and bad beers; that
> Corona is a bad beer; that some people are more qualified beer critics
> than others) have gone so totally unchallenged. It's enough to make
> me wonder if anyone *really* disagrees with me.
It's not a question of what anyone involved thinks about this or that
beer. It's a question of why you feel the need to be such a jackass
about it.
--
Mike Smith
That Chilean Guy
> This has been a remarkable and revealing thread. Not so much for the
> number of replies I've received from people who *say* they killfiled
> me, or for the mud (or, in Nichel's case, the tampons) that has been
> thrown, or even for the straw men that have been concocted. No;
> what's most interesting is that the assertions I've made which have
> allegedly been so offensive (that there are good and bad beers; that
> Corona is a bad beer; that some people are more qualified beer critics
> than others)
you forgot to include "if you're good with Corona, *your palate is
infantilized*".
But you do not come across as pretentious or condescending. Not at all.
Kyle
>
>
>
> <jnichel@no_spamby-tor.com> wrote:
> >norborder wrote:
> >> "Barf" sayed:
>
> >>> On Wed, 10 Sep 2008 19:15:33 -0400, John Nichel
> >>> <jnichel@no_spamby-tor.com> wrote:
>
> >>>>> "Kyle" sayed:
>
> >>>>>> [1] I also find it extremely telling that most of this name-calling
> >>>>>> emanated from a pair of individuals (Barf and Nichel) who had fared
> >>>>>> very poorly in exchanges with me in the past and who have been
> >>>>>> predisposed towards nastiness towards me ever since. They're a pair
> >>>>>> of wounded little children who look for excuses to gang up on me. I
> >>>>>> welcome such attempts and wish them better luck in the future.
> >>>> Hey Barf, did you hear that, we're infatuated with Kimmy.
>
> >>>> Geez, it must be tough being perfect.
>
> >>>> I'll keep it short and sweet ya pansy, and I won't even ask for Barf's
> >>>> help. You cry like a little bitch. Go borrow a tampon from your mother
> >>>> and stuff it in that bleeding pussy you call a mouth.
> >>> his beer and enjoy it instead of trying to convince everyone else what
> >>> they should want to drink.
>
> >>> And if people would quit replying to his stupid ass, I wouldn't see
> >>> his posts.
>
> >> That's it - now I'm gonna reply to *all* his posts. ;)
>
> >Careful, or you'll be lumped into the infatuated withKylegroup.
>
> killfile for years. And I could give a rat's ass about his opinions on
> anything.
>
> concerts.
You doubt I like Rush because non-froofy beers are served at their
concerts? That's the sort of impeccable reasoning I've come to expect
from you, Barf.
You're right, my friend, I don't like Rush. But I *used* to. Hell, I
used to buy each album the day it came out, read every article, and
attend every tour. Until Power Windows came out, that is. That
changed everything.
I mean, I liked the first *half* of Power Windows. I liked the busy
basslines and layered vocals of "The Big Money." I loved the abstract
Lifeson solo and Neil-Geddy unison in "Grand Designs." Also that
tasty little solo near the end of "Manhattan Project." And of course
the funky verses of "Marathon."
But then "Territories" came on. And I liked it, too -- musically I
still think it's great -- until that dreaded, diabolical stanza:
"We see so many tribes overrun and undermined
While their invaders dream of lands they left behind
Better people, better food, and better beer..."
Better beer? WTF?!? "Better people" and "better food," sure; there
are standards for judging them. But better BEER? Was Neil, my
beloved Rush drummer-lyricist Neil, implying that some beers are
better than others? That was more than even I -- previously a dyed-in-
the-wool Rush devotee -- could stand for. Neil crossed the line
there!
I'll never forget the physical and intellectual revulsion that swept
over me. I felt my cheeks turn red and my spit glands go into
overdrive. My jaw clenched; various veins began to visibly throb.
I started to spew profanity like a Tourette's Syndrome sufferer.
I began writing Neil daily notes telling him, "Beer is subjective" --
thus revealing my perfect grasp of the distinction between the
objective and the subjective -- AND, no doubt, contributing to Neil's
sanguine assessment of Rush fans.
I began to wish I had Usenet access, so that I could killfile
newsgroup members -- and then reply to those same members fifty times
a day.
I began to refer with disgust to female sexual organs and to the
female reproductive process. (Ponder that one for a minute.)
What gave Neil, that ARROGANT, PRETENTIOUS POSEUR, the right to judge
a beer?
I can judge Neil, god damn it, but he has NO RIGHT to judge a beer!
I've passionately hated Rush ever since.
Norbert K
> Geo wrote:
> >> Okay, last month a certain trio of 'tards herded up against me for
> >> daring to call a spade a spade -- specifically for daring to say that
> >> Corona was a bad beer. I'm apparently forbidden from judging a beer
> >> -- by people who jump at the chance to judge me.
> >>
> >> anyone. He wrote the book on beer -- several of them, actually ("The
> >> New World Guide to Beer," "Michael Jackson's Beer Companion," The
> >> Great Beers of Belgium" and others, all classics). And here's what he
> >> had to say about Corona in his New World Guide:
> >>
> >> Corona beer, from Mexico, for a time enjoyed a cult following
> >> north of the border, and challenged Heineken as the biggest import to
> >> the United States. It did so initially with very little marketing
> >> support, and its success was a phenomenon much studied in the business
> >> pages.
> >>
> >> Corona is a beer made as cheaply as possible, so that it can be
> >> sold inexpensively to manual workers in Mexico. Every Mexican brewery
> >> has at least one such product in its portfolio, among several more
> >> interesting beers.
> >>
> >> These modestly-paid bean-pickers get what they can pay for, and
> >> their thirsts are quenched. Corona tastes like a beer made with a
> >> very high percentage of corn adjunct and a short lagering time. It is
> >> thin-bodied, with some apple notes. It is no worse, nor better, than
> >> several similar products. That it should command a high price in the
> >> United States reflects upon the judgement of the consumers.
> >>
> >> The idealized Mexican worker, thirstily reaching for his Corona,
> >> presented a macho model for the well-heeled kids of Texas and
> >> California (and later New York). The plain glass bottle and
> >> rudimentary, enameled label no doubt added to the inverted snobbery.
> >> The beer was consumed from the bottle, with a slice of lime jammed in
> >> the neck. The lime was an important part of the ritual, but it also
> >> improved the taste. If Chuck, Chip, and Scooter really wanted to look
> >> like macho working men, they could have affected the Pabst of an
> >> unemployed steel-worker from Bethleham, PA., but that might have been
> >> too close to home.
> >>
> >> No one should begrudge Mexico the foreign exchange, but it is a
> >> shame that Corona proved such a conspicuous success where better beers
> >> had fared less well. Only after the success of Corona were Mexican
> >> beers taken seriously in the United States. Before Corona, they had
> >> suffered from the belief that they might be as well-made as the local
> >> water.
> >>
> >> In fact, Mexico has a long tradition of producing beer, and some
> >> well-equipped breweries. It is said to have had the first commercial
> >> brewery in the New World, in the 1500s, during the period of Cortes,
> >> and has been making lager beer since the 1880s or 1890s.
> >>
> >> The appeal of Corona has not encouraged Mexican brewers to
> >> emphasize their more characterful products.
> >>
> >> -- MJ, in his New World Guide to Beer
> >
> > So, essentially what the author said was that corona is piss water
> > that people use a lime for to give it taste.
> Yet what kyle still can't comprehend is that something like beer is an
> individual taste. It doesn't matter how much he thinks he is a 'beer
> expert', people will like what they like, regardless of his 'expertise'.
> Michael Jackson understood this. I met the man once before he died
> (courtesy of where I work), and while I was being razzed by some of the
> beer geeks here for not liking Flying Bison's Christmas Ale (I think
> that's what it was), Mr. Jackson made it a point to say that something
> along the lines of, what is undrinkable to one can be sweet nectar to
> another and vice-a-versa.
> --
> When a naked man is chasing a woman through an alley with a butcher's
> knife and a hard-on, I figure he isn't out collecting for the Red Cross.
I'm coming late to this (beer) party, but I've got something worthwhile to contribute.
So the debate seems to be over whether beers' quality is objective or subjective. If it were completely a matter of opinion, then there would be no such thing as expertise. Yet everyone seems to agree that Michael "the Beer Hunter" Jackson was an (or maybe even the) expert on the subject.
Michael Jackson appeared on Conan O'Brien's show once. It might even be on Youtube. At one point, O'Brien asked Jackson what his least favorite beer was.
Jackson's answer?
Corona.