Pachelbel Canon?
tur...@my-dejanews.com
classical music, and the info that I read on the CDs that I sometimes buy
doesn't seem to have anything to do with anything other than who's done the
latest remake of the particular piece.
Thanks.
————————————————————————
Turin • http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/lair/129/
————————————————————————
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
dcle...@my-dejanews.com
tur...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> Does anyone happen to know who composed Pachelbel Canon? I'm no expert on
> classical music, and the info that I read on the CDs that I sometimes buy
> doesn't seem to have anything to do with anything other than who's done the
> latest remake of the particular piece.
>
> Thanks.
>
This question is a little like "Who is buried in Grant's tomb?". Pachelbel is
credited with writing the canon, which looks a chaconne to me. I believe the
basso ostinato used in this work was not original. However, I don't know a
potential source. Maybe someone with more expertise in early music could
elucidate us.
Regards,
Darryl
John Nolte
before Bach, who knew his work well. Wrote lots of good stuff. Around here
the canon is so over used for weddings, choral music, and other arrangements
it's being called the Taco Bell Canon.
John
tur...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message <7bk9g8$qcs$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>Does anyone happen to know who composed Pachelbel Canon? I'm no expert on
>classical music, and the info that I read on the CDs that I sometimes buy
>doesn't seem to have anything to do with anything other than who's done the
>latest remake of the particular piece.
>
>Thanks.
>
>
>
>Turin • http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/lair/129/
>————————————————————————
Paul Goldstein
composed by one Pachelbel. Or else maybe Pachelbel only composed the bass
line or chord sequence. Whatever.
--
Paul Goldstein
http://www.jtcb.com/profile/profiles/pgoldstein/pgoldstein.html
Matthew B. Tepper
pondered what I'm pondering as follows...
>
>By analogy to "Who is buried in Grant's Tomb," the "Pachelbel Canon"
>was composed by one Pachelbel. Or else maybe Pachelbel only composed
>the bass line or chord sequence. Whatever.
"Who is buried in Grant's Tomb?" IS a trick question. Nobody is buried
there. The remains of President Ulysses S. Grant, his wife, and their
children are ENTOMBED there. But not buried!
But back to the subject matter, the only recording I have is that by
Arthur Fiedler and his Sinfonietta, and only because the same CD
contains several pieces of historic Fiedleriana I wouldn't be without,
Hindemith's "Der Schwanendreher" with the composer as soloist, and the
Mozart C Minor wind serenade.
Fortunately, Fiedler's reading of the subject work is so fast it's over
with almost in no time. I hate, loathe, and despise this piece.
--
Matthew B. Tepper: WWW, science fiction, classical music, ducks!
My personal home page -- http://www.deltanet.com/~ducky/index.htm
My main music page --- http://www.deltanet.com/~ducky/berlioz.htm
And my science fiction club's home page --- http://www.lasfs.org/
Sacqueboutier
>
> In article <7bk9g8$qcs$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
> tur...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > classical music, and the info that I read on the CDs that I sometimes buy
> > doesn't seem to have anything to do with anything other than who's done the
> > latest remake of the particular piece.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
>
> credited with writing the canon, which looks a chaconne to me.
It's a canon built on a repeating bass line thus it comes across as
a chaconne or passacaglia. However, the three intricately woven
melodic lines are indeed exactly canonic.
Well, maybe it's a canon AND a chaconne. It's two...two...two
forms in one.
Don Patterson
* DCP Music Printing
* Professional Computer Music Typeset
* Music Arrangements
* don...@erols.com
* Asst. Principal Trombonist
* "The President's Own"
* United States Marine Band
http://www.marineband.hqmc.usmc.mil
The views expressed are my own and in no way
reflect those of "The President's Own" United
States Marine Band or the United States Marine Corps.
Thomas Ruedas
Pachelbel (1653-1706), a south german baroque composer. On the kind of
CDs you seem to buy usually only the Canon is played.
--
--------------------------------------------
Thomas Ruedas
Institute of Meteorology and Geophysics,
J.W. Goethe University Frankfurt/Main
Feldbergstrasse 47 D-60323 Frankfurt/Main, Germany
Phone:+49-(0)69-798-24949 Fax:+49-(0)69-798-23280
e-mail: rue...@geophysik.uni-frankfurt.de
http://www.geophysik.uni-frankfurt.de/~ruedas/
--------------------------------------------
John E. Prussing
>Johann Pachelbel, 1653-1706. Most famous south German organist/composer
>before Bach, who knew his work well. Wrote lots of good stuff. Around here
>the canon is so over used for weddings, choral music, and other arrangements
>it's being called the Taco Bell Canon.
>John
As I recall, Pachelbel's hometown was Nuremberg and he studied for a
time in Italy with Frescobaldi. I agree his Canon is overused. But it's
a piece that is easily understood.
--
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
John E. Prussing
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
tur...@my-dejanews.com
dcle...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> In article <7bk9g8$qcs$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
> tur...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > Does anyone happen to know who composed Pachelbel Canon? I'm no expert on
> > classical music, and the info that I read on the CDs that I sometimes buy
> > doesn't seem to have anything to do with anything other than who's done the
> > latest remake of the particular piece.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
>
> This question is a little like "Who is buried in Grant's tomb?". Pachelbel is
> basso ostinato used in this work was not original. However, I don't know a
> potential source. Maybe someone with more expertise in early music could
> elucidate us.
>
> Regards,
> Darryl
>
> http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
>
Really? Hahaha...oh man. You know, I never thought of that when I wrote the
post. I presumed that this would be some kind of thematic title based on
some classical play or something. Thanks for letting me know. BTW, *Are*
classical pieces always titled after the composers?
tur...@my-dejanews.com
"John Nolte" <j.n...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
> Johann Pachelbel, 1653-1706. Most famous south German organist/composer
> before Bach, who knew his work well. Wrote lots of good stuff. Around here
> the canon is so over used for weddings, choral music, and other arrangements
> it's being called the Taco Bell Canon.
> John
Hahaha...looks like i have good taste in Mexican music then...
> tur...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message <7bk9g8$qcs$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
> >Does anyone happen to know who composed Pachelbel Canon? I'm no expert on
> >classical music, and the info that I read on the CDs that I sometimes buy
> >doesn't seem to have anything to do with anything other than who's done the
> >latest remake of the particular piece.
> >
> >Thanks.
> >
> >
> >
ambassade des pays bas
<paulgo...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>By analogy to "Who is buried in Grant's Tomb," the "Pachelbel Canon" was
>composed by one Pachelbel. Or else maybe Pachelbel only composed the bass
>line or chord sequence. Whatever.
>
>--
>Paul Goldstein
>
>http://www.jtcb.com/profile/profiles/pgoldstein/pgoldstein.html
>
>
>tur...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message <7bk9g8$qcs$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>>Does anyone happen to know who composed Pachelbel Canon? I'm no expert on
>>classical music, and the info that I read on the CDs that I sometimes buy
>>doesn't seem to have anything to do with anything other than who's done the
>>latest remake of the particular piece.
>>
>>Thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>>————————————————————————
>>Turin • http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/lair/129/
>>————————————————————————
>>
>>-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
>>http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
>
>
How about the Toy Symphony by Joseph Haydn, composed
by Leopold Mozart and/or Michael Haydn?!
David Samuel Barr
>
> Really? Hahaha...oh man. You know, I never thought of that when I
> wrote the post. I presumed that this would be some kind of thematic
> title based on some classical play or something. Thanks for letting
> me know. BTW, *Are* classical pieces always titled after the
> composers?
No, actually they never are. The name of the piece is not "Pachelbel
Canon", it is "Canon in D Major for 3 Violins and Basso Continuo".
However, it is a common shorthand for pieces to be identified by their
composer, especially when there are numerous other works with the same
title (since most titles are just descriptive of the form of piece, not
programmatic). For example, "Beethoven's Fifth" is a shorthand
reference to "Symphony No. 5 in C Minor, Opus 67" by Ludwig van
Beethoven, but it's not the actual name of the piece. There are a great
many "Symphony No. 5"s; calling the piece "Beethoven's Fifth [Symphony]"
simply makes it easier to identify the work being discussed. Likewise,
there are hundreds if not thousands of canons, written by many different
composers throughout the last five centuries. "Pachelbel's Canon" is
just the currently popular reference for the above-named piece.
Lord Blaa
<dsb...@mindspring.com> writes:
> "Canon in D Major for 3 Violins and Basso Continuo"
actually it's
"Canon and Gigue in D Major for 3 Violins and Basso Continuo"
Lord Blaa
>Does anyone happen to know who composed Pachelbel Canon? I'm no expert on
>classical music, and the info that I read on the CDs that I sometimes buy
>doesn't seem to have anything to do with anything other than who's done the
>latest remake of the particular piece.
>
>Thanks.
>
Pachelbel maybe?
tur...@my-dejanews.com
And when you read Natalie Imbroglia on the CD featuring "Torn" then that means
that she wrote the song too, Right? Thanks for teaching me how to use my head
with such minimal effort....
tur...@my-dejanews.com
Thanks for explaining that to me, Dave. Classical music is an almost
completely foreign subject to me, and I occasionally try to figure out some
of the technicalities in referring to pieces. As you can see, I've hardly
scratched the surface.
Ko Ko Puff
Mark Mushet
>Does anybody know his first name?
"Biff". Makes sense now doesn't it?
Carlo Gerelli
>Does anybody know his first name?
Pachelbel's first name , I presume.
It is Johann.
--
----------------------------------------
carlo gerelli : sof...@pccom.it
----------------------------------------
Some are born to sweet delight,
some are born to endless night.
(William Blake)
Penning
Interest "newsgroup-fight" you started here, hahaha!
>.....and the info that I read on the CDs that I sometimes buy......
Ah! That's the problem with these so-called "Popular Baroque" or "Classical
Music for Lovers" type of CD's. Random combinations of musical pieces ripped
out of context and no information.....
I will "eat my shoe" if that CD doesn't also contain Bach's Air. In fact
Bach's Air is the second movement of Orchestral Suite No. 3 in D major
(BWV1068), if you really want to know.
Good luck with your intrepid adventures into the endless world of classical
music. Be sure to start of on the right foot, though.....
JP
hhg
Laura
please remove both -z- for replies
>I've heard Pa-KELL-bell and PA-kuhl-bell. Which is correct?
>Laura
Pa-CHEL-bel - he was German, so you've got to pronounce that CH like the
Spanish "j" (as in Juan).
Regards,
Timo
Archer070
>I've heard Pa-KELL-bell and PA-kuhl-bell. Which is correct?
>Laura
>
Pronunciation similar to well-known Mexican fast food chain.
Keith Edgerley
>
> hhg <h...@flash.net> wrote on Sat, 06 Mar 1999 16:19:15 GMT:
>
> >Laura
>
> Spanish "j" (as in Juan).
> Regards,
> Timo
Yes, but the question was about which syllable is stressed. If it isn't
the first, can someone tell us why?
--
Keith
Sapere aude
jerry and judy
>"Ko Ko Puff" <kk...@cornell.edu> wrote:
>
>>Does anybody know his first name?
>
>"Biff". Makes sense now doesn't it?
>Reb Ruster wrote:
>
>> Johann Pachebel (1653-1706) was a composer and organist, which
>> accounts for the fact that Canon is more adaptable to keyboard than
>> instrumental. There have been literally hundreds of variations on the
>> theme, most of then bad.
>
>
>I have heard more versions of the canon I like than versions I don't
>like, so I cannot really agree with you. I admit that I don't have
>hundreds of versions heard or even in my head (there are, lets say, a
>dozen or so that I know), so most of the existing versions may be bad,
>who knows, but the ones I heard I mostly enjoyed for one reason or
>another. I also think Pachelbel's canon adapts especially well to
>instrumental arrangement.
> On Thu, 05 Jun 1997 17:51:22 +0800 MG <ma...@rocketmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Did Pachelbel ever compose anything else worth listening to?
> >I mean, you just say 'THE Pachelbel' and anybody knows you mean
> >Canon in D.
> >Great tune, but did his talent stretch to anything else?
The Dover offering of the Fugues on the Magnificat (Canticle of the
Virgin) is a real treasure for the amateur pianist because they are so
readily playable and they bounce! without requiring much technical
ability. Pachelbel (1653-1706) wrote them c.1696. When I first got
interested in fugues at the piano I wished that I could find a few simple
fugues to practice voicings with. Most of what I found that was
specifically written for the piano student was uninteresting.
There are 95 works here and as I play through them I remember that wish,
because it's all here!
Jerry
Stephen McElroy
jerb...@zianet.com (jerry and judy) wrote:
<other folk snipped>
> The Dover offering of the Fugues on the Magnificat (Canticle of the
> Virgin) is a real treasure for the amateur pianist because they are so
> readily playable and they bounce! without requiring much technical
> ability. Pachelbel (1653-1706) wrote them c.1696. When I first got
> interested in fugues at the piano I wished that I could find a few simple
> fugues to practice voicings with. Most of what I found that was
> specifically written for the piano student was uninteresting.
>
> There are 95 works here and as I play through them I remember that wish,
> because it's all here!
>
> Jerry
Here's a second the recommendation for the fugues, a few of which are a
bit more demanding than the above description implies. Most of them are
just as described. Definitely a church organist's friend!
I also like the Hexachordum Apollinis, a set of six themes with variations
for keyboard. There's a recording on chamber organ by John Butt that you
might like, too, unless chamber organs remind you of calliopes.
A Japanese student told me that he used to go to a tea bar that played
nothing but the Kanon on the store sound system. Then there's the Eno
deconstruction that eliminates linearity using tape collage methods. The
effect is actually relaxing.
Wall to wall Pachelbel,
Stephen
--
"The best thing about the future is that it comes only one day at a time.'' 耍braham Lincoln
Russell E. Davis
second syllables. I'd be interested to know myself, because I've also heard
it accented both ways, regardless of the ch sound which most Americans
simply can't negotiate.
Russ
John E. Prussing
>please remove both -z- for replies wrote:
>>
>> hhg <h...@flash.net> wrote on Sat, 06 Mar 1999 16:19:15 GMT:
>>
>> >I've heard Pa-KELL-bell and PA-kuhl-bell. Which is correct?
>> >Laura
>>
>> Pa-CHEL-bel - he was German, so you've got to pronounce that CH like the
>> Spanish "j" (as in Juan).
>> Regards,
>> Timo
>Yes, but the question was about which syllable is stressed. If it isn't
>the first, can someone tell us why?
Re the Subject, the word is not "pronounciation", but "pronunciation". Go
figure.
The first syllable is stressed. Also, the CH is pronounced, not
surprisingly, the same as in Bach. It's not the same as the Spanish j
sound. It's a gutteral sound in German and a k sound in English.
Mark Zedaker
> The Dover offering of the Fugues on the Magnificat (Canticle of the
> Virgin) is a real treasure for the amateur pianist because they are so
> readily playable and they bounce! without requiring much technical
> ability.
I own that edition for study, actually, although I've never tried to
*play* them -- I have near-zero skill on the keyboard. Now that I know
they're easy <grin> I might actually try to play one of them. Heh.
--
Mark Zedaker 'Act like a dumbshit
ch...@home.com and they'll treat you like an equal.'
Kip & Cathy
Pachelbel fugues. I'll try and get that one! Thanks, Jerry! I already play a
ciaconna with variations by him that's in one of the Schirmer early music
volumes, and I like it better than 'the' canon.
--Kip Williams
James Goodzeit
Kip & Cathy wrote in message <15mE2.787$qc3.2...@firenze.visi.net>...
beautiful of all organ works and included on practically every recording
containg Pachelbel organ works. It would probably have the same popularity
as the canon in D were it for strings and not organ. For some strange reason
it is not included in the Dover edition of Pachelbel Organ Works.
James
Lord Blaa
<keith.e...@bluewin.ch> writes:
>> Pa-CHEL-bel - he was German, so you've got to pronounce that CH like the
>> Spanish "j" (as in Juan).
yeah, that's what i meant.
Lord Blaa
>I've heard Pa-KELL-bell and PA-kuhl-bell. Which is correct?
>Laura
PA-kuhl-bell
Lord Blaa
<kk...@cornell.edu> writes:
>Does anybody know his first name?
>
johann
Clavichord
> Spanish "j" (as in Juan).
>
preceding vowel: after "a", "o", and "u" it is the hard guttural sound like the
Spanish "j", after "e" and "i" it is a soft, slightly hissing sound. At the
beginning of a word, "ch" is pronounced as "k", i.e. "China", "Cholera".
Michael
Michael Zapf (Germany) - clavi...@aol.com
Andrej Kluge
Pronounciation - Was Re: Pachelbel Canon?:
> The first syllable is stressed. Also, the CH is pronounced, not
> surprisingly, the same as in Bach. It's not the same as the Spanish j
> sound. It's a gutteral sound in German and a k sound in English.
I don't see a vast diffenrence (or a small one, for that matter) between
the pronunciation of the J in Juan and the ch in Bach. Since I am
German, I suppose I must have pronounced "Juan" wrongly all the time
(although I speak a little Spanish, too)? Or do you mean that you
American pronounce Juan gutturally as is should be, but a "ch" in German
words as a "k"? Why this inconsistency?
Ciao
A.
Kip & Cathy
was an organ work, unless for organ without pedals. It has a bass line that
is slightly reminiscent of the canon, and I think there's 13 variations. I'd
simply go get the music and look, but I have to be out of the house very
soon.
BTW, Jerry, have you ever run across the "original organ version" of the
Canon? Karl "Sometimes I make things up" Haas has said over and over that it
started that way, and the music certainly looks like it could have, but I've
never found it in that form, so who knows?
--Kip Williams
Kip & Cathy
brand of Spanish we hear most often in the US, the J is almost silent. In
other dialects, there is more of a blow-out on the J. Hence Tom Lehrer's
burlesqued performance in "In Old Mexico,"
"When it's fiesta time / In GuadalaJJJJJJJJJJJJJara..."
(repeated later as "When it's fiesta time / in Akron, OHHHHHHHHHHio...")
One size doesn't fit all.
--Kip Williams
Archer070
>From: wi...@TMB.in-berlin.de (Andrej Kluge)
>Date: 3/7/99 4:07 AM Eastern Standard Time
>Message-id: <7CQeg...@pe027395.tmb.in-berlin.de>
Follow my kids' lead--from age 3 and 7, they pronounced it the "Taco Bell
Cannon," which they thought was a piece of artillery that fired burritos.
Steve Plant
Unless one knows already that Pachelbel was a composer and that
Goldberg and Diabelli were not, it is unclear that "Pachelbel Canon"
does not follow the same pattern as "Goldberg Variations"
(by J. S. Bach) or Diabelli Variations (by Beethoven).
Furthermore, how is a classical-music newbie to know that
Shubert, not Dizzy Trout, wrote the Trout Quintet, or that
Enrique Eroica made his name in the olive oil business and
not from a symphony?
Steve Plant
Thomas Deas
Steve Plant wrote in message <36E2CE...@worldnet.att.net>...
>Your question was more reasonable than people are making it seem.
>Unless one knows already that Pachelbel was a composer and that
>Goldberg and Diabelli were not
So who wrote the theme for the Diabelli variations?
Rick Janowski
Or Diabelli had the idea, to which Beethoven added the inspiration.
Rick J
Thomas Deas <tho...@deas.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in article
<7bum2a$gog$1...@news8.svr.pol.co.uk>...
Thomas Deas
Rick Janowski wrote in message <01be68ed$8f3b0420$491017d4@zagloba>...
>Diabelli wrote them theme
I like it! Yeah, I know, I was quibbling with Steve.
David Samuel Barr
>
> Steve Plant wrote in message <36E2CE...@worldnet.att.net>...
> >Your question was more reasonable than people are making it seem.
> >Unless one knows already that Pachelbel was a composer and that
> >Goldberg and Diabelli were not
>
> So who wrote the theme for the Diabelli variations?
Since the work is properly titled, "Variations on a waltz by Diabelli",
guess what?? The composer was Anton Diabelli, a Viennese composer and
music publisher. In 1820, as a promotional gimmick to launch his
new publishing venture, he wrote a little waltz and asked 51 composers
then living or working in Vienna to write a variation, with the idea
that he would publish the results in a collection. As it turned out,
Beethoven didn't write just one variation, but 33 of them, which became
the first volume of what ended up as a two-volume set.
I have an LP from Musical Heritage Society (MHS 1396 -- current CD
status, Mark?) which features pianist Hans Kann playing the second
volume containing the contributions of the other 50 composers. Most of
these names are totally forgotten now, although a few familiar names
stick out, such as Czerny, Hummel, Listz, Moscheles, and Schubert.
(Douglas Townsend's liner notes give brief biographical blurbs on about
half of them.)
John Nolte
a music forum in 1979. He was quite sure that in the 17th century the name
was pronounced Pach-EL-bel. I found the notes from that forum, but nothing
more on the name. So I'll enlighten, bore or entertain you with some
excerpts:
Biographical sketch. Johann Pachelbel was born in Nuremberg, baptized on 1
Sep 1653. Early music training under Heinrich Schwemmer in basic rudiments,
and G.C. Wecker in composition and performance.
In June 1669 entered the university at Altdorf, where he was organist at the
local Lorenzkirche. Probably limited financial resources caused him to
leave in less than a year. In 1670 enrolled in the Gymnasium Poeticum at
Regensberg. Began lifelong friendship with Johannes Baehr, later renowned
concertmaster at Weissenfels court. Studied outside the Gymnasium under
Kaspar Prentz, a student of J. K. Kerll.
In 1673, he became deputy organist at St. Stephen's, Vienna. In 1677, court
organist at Eisenach, and on 19 June 1678 became organist of the Lutheran
Predigerkirche, Erfurt. (If you keep reading, I'll quote from his contract
later) First wife and baby son died in a plague in 1683. Second wife
Judith Drommer (Trummert) bore him five sons and two daughters. In 1690, he
became organist at the Wurttemberg court in Stuttgart from where he fled
before a French invasion in autumn of 1692. Spent some time in Nuremberg
before he became town organist at Gotha in Thuringia in November. He
declined offers to Oxford University and to return to Stuttgart. In 1695,
he returned to Nuremberg to assume the most desirable organist's post at St.
Sebaldskirche, where he remained until his death in 1706 (buried 9 March).
Excerpts from his organ contract in Erfurt: " He shall not only faithfully
take care of and diligently supervise the organ work in the congregation,
but also according to his best understanding, use education and learning, on
festival and Sunday mornings and afternoons as well as completed novenas, no
less on all Saturday evenings and at whatever time the usual vespers are
held, likewise on those preaching days of the week, on which the service, to
accompany the hymns, which he , as is the practice among today's
distinguished organists, diligently applied himself to introduce with a
thematic prelude, and spare no effort nor let anything interfere in doing
this, and also particularly without urgent need neglect no day or hour of
service, or appoint anyone else in his place, but every time do and perform
faithfully his office in person, so that to the glory of the divine majesty
and the honor of the congregation at all times a pleasant harmony may sound
forth."
"He shall maintain the Regal organ and gallery instrument in good
intonation. And if something happens to either organ, if he cannot repair
it himself, he should bring it to the attention of the trustees, so that, if
possible, they can have it repaired by one of our own people. Furthermore
he should be very careful that no stranger fool around with the organ and do
damage to it."
"He shall annually on the festival of St. John the Baptist, June 24, after
the completed afternoon service, in remembrance of his admission as
organist, for one-half hour play a recital using all the registers of the
organ in a pleasing and melodious harmony, and thus at the same time for the
entire congregation demonstrate anew how he has improved himself throughout
his year of office."
Regards,
John
John Nolte
Kip & Cathy wrote in message ...
>BTW, Jerry, have you ever run across the "original organ version" of the
>Canon? Karl "Sometimes I make things up" Haas has said over and over that
it
>started that way, and the music certainly looks like it could have, but
I've
>never found it in that form, so who knows?
Back in the 1970's, the Musical Heritage Society used the J.-F. Paillard
Chamber Orchestra recording of the Canon as its introductory record (MHS
1060). The jacket notes read: "The CANON IN D MAJOR (published together
with a Gigue in the same key) in the edition of Max Seiffert is based on a
copy (H.8332) in the Library of the State Academy for Church and School
Music in Berlin-Charlottenburg. Written for three violins and continuo, the
work is well known for its nobility, its long breath, its simplicity, purity
and introspection."
I have a listing of modern editions of Pachelbel's instrumental music which
includes only Canon in D. Arranged for string orchestra by H. May. Schott
Edition 5869 (Concertino series no. 111) and Kanon und Gigue: fur drei
Violinen mit Generalbass. Organum III/24.
Did Pachelbel every play it on the organ? As much as he had to play, it
wouldn't be surprising.
John
neilw...@my-dejanews.com
prus...@staff.uiuc.edu (John E. Prussing) wrote:
> Keith Edgerley <keith.e...@bluewin.ch> writes:
>
> >please remove both -z- for replies wrote:
> >>
> >> hhg <h...@flash.net> wrote on Sat, 06 Mar 1999 16:19:15 GMT:
> >>
> >> >Laura
> >>
> >> Spanish "j" (as in Juan).
> >> Timo
>
> >Yes, but the question was about which syllable is stressed. If it isn't
> >the first, can someone tell us why?
>
> Re the Subject, the word is not "pronounciation", but "pronunciation". Go
> figure.
>
> surprisingly, the same as in Bach. It's not the same as the Spanish j
> sound. It's a gutteral sound in German and a k sound in English.
> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
> John E. Prussing
> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>
As my daughter is a member of a string quartet which is frequently requested
to play the "Canon" at weddings, consultation with her reveals the
pronunciation to be of the order, pa--kel-bel. However as an Australian
(orstralian) the inflection may be distorted and not really answer your
question.
The important thing is that the cello is not too fast or too slow.
Regards Neil
please remove both -z- for replies
22:10:03 +0100:
>> Pa-CHEL-bel - he was German, so you've got to pronounce that CH like the
>> Spanish "j" (as in Juan).
>> Regards,
>> Timo
>
>Yes, but the question was about which syllable is stressed. If it isn't
>the first, can someone tell us why?
I've checked with a (reliable German) encylopedia and it says both
pronounciations are correct (PA-chelbel and Pa-CHEL-bel), but it seems to
attribute a more "official" character to the first alternative. For my sense
of the language (I'm a native German) the second one sounds more natural,
though.
Hanns KREHBIEL
>
> It looks like Laura means to ask whether the accent is on the first or
> second syllables. I'd be interested to know myself, because I've also heard
> it accented both ways, regardless of the ch sound which most Americans
> simply can't negotiate.
>
> Russ
>
>
> > hhg <h...@flash.net> wrote on Sat, 06 Mar 1999 16:19:15 GMT:
> >
> > >I've heard Pa-KELL-bell and PA-kuhl-bell. Which is correct?
> > >Laura
> >
> > Spanish "j" (as in Juan).
In Germany I never heard his name pronounced otherwise that with the accent on
the second syllable. My suggestion for a transliteration is
PaKHELLbel.
The problem seems to be with the ch sound. In the international phonetic alphabet it
is rendered by an X, maybe because the X resembles a Greek Chi. The Spanish J has been
suggested as an example, but selfsame consonant (which I call for the moment the X sound),
was written by the Spanish in earlier times also with an X, causing all sorts of
linguistic confusions. (Remember how "Mexico" is pronounced the Spanish way? And there
was once a Spanish colony named Las Texas, the tiles.)
The Scotchmen have the X-sound too, as in Loch Ness; the Dutch have it (twice in Van
Gogh [Xox]), and the Russians (Rachmaninoff), who write it also with an X-like character.
Afaik Kh is its scientific transliteration, which I choose above.
krehbiel
Kip & Cathy
transcribed (uh, in the 18th cent, methinks) into the continuo-and-violins
version. It seems plausible, and he's been consistent on the story, unlike
the "Haydn-or-is-it-Hoffmeister-Serenade." It's just that, as in your most
recent entry, there is no evidence for such a thing other than what Haas
says, and you can trust that to a certain extent, but "just this much," as
the man says.
I suppose it would have been nice to believe the piece was written for
keyboard, but I may have to drop the possibility. Thanks for your info.
--Kip Williams
Kip & Cathy
every now and then to declare that the Pachelbel is not a canon. I wrote in
on another matter, and added a postscript that the Canon was a canon. I got
no reply, but a while later, the reviewer (Zagorsky, perhaps?) put into one
of his regular reviews an irrelevant side note that the Pachelbel most
bloody well was not a canon. I thought of sending him a score to examine,
but life was too short.
--Kip Williams
Russell E. Davis
prus...@staff.uiuc.edu schrub am 07.03.99
saying it's PAchelbel,
> The first syllable is stressed.
and Hanns Krehbiel saying it's PaCHELbel
>In Germany I never heard his name pronounced otherwise that with the accent on
>the second syllable.
So I wonder which is it? Anyone have a German musicological dictionary?
Russ Davis
Stephen McElroy
<tout snipped>
Great post! Thank you,
Stephen
--
"The best thing about the future is that it comes only one day at a time.'' 耍braham Lincoln
Lord Blaa
<j.n...@worldnet.att.net> writes:
Are there any pictures of Pachelbel?
Zachary Uram
to pronounce a composer's name. Perhaps you should start a
rec.classical.how-to-prounce-Pachelbel. Is it of such critical importance
to pronounce the name as Pachelbel would have? Will your performance of
his music be somehow enhanced by having this knowledge? *big grin* ;)
hehe. Let's remember this is alt.music.J-S-BACH :)
regards
Zach
________________________________________________________
ur...@cmu.edu
"Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have faith." - John 20:29
John Nolte
Lord Blaa wrote in message <19990308115141...@ngol07.aol.com>...
>Are there any pictures of Pachelbel?
I don't have any. I do have a photocopy of the title page from Hexachordum
Apollinis, 1699, and notes explaining Johannes Baehr's Kabbala on the page
before the first aria. He took the name Johannes Pachelbelius Organista
Noriberghensium, and assigned a numerical value to each letter of the
alphabet, a=1, b=2, etc. i and j are both 9, k=10, l=20, ... T=100, u and v
are both 200. When you add all the numerical values, it comes out to 1699,
the year of publication. Amazing what people did for entertainment before
TV.
John Nolte
John
Zachary Uram wrote in message ...
Michael Subotin
>
> Steve Plant wrote in message <36E2CE...@worldnet.att.net>...
> >Your question was more reasonable than people are making it seem.
> >Unless one knows already that Pachelbel was a composer and that
> >Goldberg and Diabelli were not
>
> So who wrote the theme for the Diabelli variations?
...and the gigue for the C major sonata BWV 1037. :-)
Michael
--
E-mail: mvsst3+@pitt{DOT}edu Replace {DOT} with a dot
Kip & Cathy
>...And there was once a Spanish colony named Las Texas, the tiles...
I knew that "Techa" is a tile, but I had thought (and I believe this is what
they teach in Texas) that the place got its name from "Texas" or "Tejas"
meaning "welcome."
Interesting.
--Kip Williams
Zachary Uram
IMHO between the B and the P :-) b is for brilliance, p is for
pedestrian. just kidding! hehe. Pachelbel is nice but he aint no Bach.
Well no one is or ever will be for that matter :)
regards,
Zach
Lord Blaa
(Clavichord) writes:
>beginning of a word, "ch" is pronounced as "k", i.e. "China", "Cholera".
Exactly or roughly? i have a suspicion that it is more like a "K(ch)". (if
you want a can give a detailed explanation...) but i may be wrong.
Lord Blaa
>t's not the same as the Spanish j
>sound. It's a gutteral sound in German and a k sound in English.
BTW I'm a bit of a linguist, and I'll tell you there both velar fricatives, and
exactly the same.
Lord Blaa
John E. Prussing
If one of your languages were English, you would say "I'll tell you they're
both ...". "they're" is called a contraction.
A velar fricative sounds painful, but I'll take your word(s) for it.
>Lord Blaa
aj_...@my-dejanews.com
wi...@TMB.in-berlin.de (Andrej Kluge) wrote:
>
> I don't see a vast diffenrence (or a small one, for that matter) between
> the pronunciation of the J in Juan and the ch in Bach. Since I am
> German, I suppose I must have pronounced "Juan" wrongly all the time
> (although I speak a little Spanish, too)? Or do you mean that you
> American pronounce Juan gutturally as is should be, but a "ch" in German
> words as a "k"? Why this inconsistency?
Don't forget that many Americans also say "Baak" (K) instead of "Bach". The
absence of a sound makes such stuff. As we, Russians, do not have english
"th", "ng" etc. :)
Neverhteless, I could not understand what is correct - which syllable is
stressed. As to me I always thought and heared (from germans) that he's Pa -
CHEL- bel (second stressed). Though, the answer(from a German) might be in
the thread, and I was not attentive.....
Alexei Z.,
* * * * * *
Wir muessen wissen.
Wir werden wissen.
- D. Hilbert -
aj_...@my-dejanews.com
"John Nolte" <j.n...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
> If we just call him Pach, can we get away with it here?
Well there is a published document of that time saying that there were "three
great B's" - Buxtehude, Bachelbel and Bach. There was a great difference in
writing names, so Pachelbel is registered as "Bachelbel".
Also in Muhlhausen or somewhere there ("early Bach") in the documents JSB was
titled as "organist Pach of this Church". Also, there is a copy of Bruhns
work, where he is titled as "Pruhnth".
Also Haendel was Hendel, Hendall, Hendler etc. in many documents, Buxtehude
was titled as "Buxdhue" or something like this when registered in a city
guard book after etrance to Copenhagen.
So, there are a lot of variations.
Andrej Kluge
> Neverhteless, I could not understand what is correct - which syllable
> is stressed. As to me I always thought and heared (from germans) that
> he's Pa - CHEL- bel (second stressed). Though, the answer(from a
> German) might be in the thread, and I was not attentive.....
I am a German myself and I don't know how it's being pronounced
correctly, for me both variants sound okay (stressing the 1st and 2nd
syllable alternatively) -- even the guys on the local radio stations
spell it differently each time. To be honest, I don't care about it that
much... :)
Ciao
Andrej
Fröhlicher Landmann
>Also in Muhlhausen or somewhere there ("early Bach") in the documents JSB
was
>titled as "organist Pach of this Church". Also, there is a copy of Bruhns
>work, where he is titled as "Pruhnth".
>
>Also Haendel was Hendel, Hendall, Hendler etc. in many documents, Buxtehude
>was titled as "Buxdhue" or something like this when registered in a city
>guard book after etrance to Copenhagen.
>
>So, there are a lot of variations.
Or a lot of _misstaickes_ ;-)
Clavichord
<The_Happ...@yahoo.com> schreibt:
>Or a lot of _misstaickes_ ;-)
The Salzburg court calendar for 1775 lists the following members of the
Hofkapelle: Wolfgang Motzart and Michael Hayden....
(source: New Grove)
Michael
Michael Zapf (Germany) - clavi...@aol.com
Grant Hicks
>
>Re the Subject, the word is not "pronounciation", but "pronunciation". Go
>figure.
>
>The first syllable is stressed. Also, the CH is pronounced, not
>sound. It's a gutteral sound in German and a k sound in English.
Re "gutteral", the word is "guttural", from the Latin word for throat,
"guttur". (When I see "gutteral" I imagine all sorts of filthy language.
Entertaining, I suppose, but not apposite.) "Pronunciation" comes almost
directly from the Latin word "pronuntiatio", with a typical late-Latin
substitution of "ci" for "ti". Like "pronunciation", "pronounce" started
out being Latin, but it only arrived in English after being mangled for a
while by the French.
Ah, the advantages of a classical education.
Grant Hicks
ghic...@sprynet.com
Turin
Steve Plant <steveplant_...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
> Your question was more reasonable than people are making it seem.
> Unless one knows already that Pachelbel was a composer and that
> does not follow the same pattern as "Goldberg Variations"
> (by J. S. Bach) or Diabelli Variations (by Beethoven).
> Furthermore, how is a classical-music newbie to know that
> Shubert, not Dizzy Trout, wrote the Trout Quintet, or that
> Enrique Eroica made his name in the olive oil business and
> not from a symphony?
>
> Steve Plant
Thanks, Steve. I sensed that those kinds of situations could be possibilities
in a complex field like classical music where orchestras sometimes perform
another person's work, and thought it was kind of obvious, myself, but I
realized that I didn't know much at all about classical music.
> tur...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> >
> > In article <36DE37...@mindspring.com>,
> > dsb...@mindspring.com wrote:
> > > tur...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Really? Hahaha...oh man. You know, I never thought of that when I
> > > > wrote the post. I presumed that this would be some kind of thematic
> > > > title based on some classical play or something. Thanks for letting
> > > > me know. BTW, *Are* classical pieces always titled after the
> > > > composers?
> > >
> > > No, actually they never are. The name of the piece is not "Pachelbel
> > > Canon", it is "Canon in D Major for 3 Violins and Basso Continuo".
> > > However, it is a common shorthand for pieces to be identified by their
> > > composer, especially when there are numerous other works with the same
> > > title (since most titles are just descriptive of the form of piece, not
> > > programmatic). For example, "Beethoven's Fifth" is a shorthand
> > > reference to "Symphony No. 5 in C Minor, Opus 67" by Ludwig van
> > > Beethoven, but it's not the actual name of the piece. There are a great
> > > many "Symphony No. 5"s; calling the piece "Beethoven's Fifth [Symphony]"
> > > simply makes it easier to identify the work being discussed. Likewise,
> > > there are hundreds if not thousands of canons, written by many different
> > > composers throughout the last five centuries. "Pachelbel's Canon" is
> > > just the currently popular reference for the above-named piece.
> > >
> >
> > Thanks for explaining that to me, Dave. Classical music is an almost
> > completely foreign subject to me, and I occasionally try to figure out some
> > of the technicalities in referring to pieces. As you can see, I've hardly
> > scratched the surface.
> >
> > ————————————————————————
> > Turin • http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/lair/129/
> > ————————————————————————
> >
> > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
> > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
>
————————————————————————
Turin • http://www.fortunecity.com/rivendell/lair/129/
————————————————————————
Turin
dsb...@mindspring.com wrote:
> Thomas Deas wrote:
> >
> > Steve Plant wrote in message <36E2CE...@worldnet.att.net>...
> > >Unless one knows already that Pachelbel was a composer and that
> >
> > So who wrote the theme for the Diabelli variations?
>
Yes, but my original point was that you can't always depend on a
commercialized reproduction of a work to employ proper art terminology in
it's marketing approaches, and so we will often be subjected to the more
titillating titles and banners that will attract the bigger sale when the
imitating artist in question chooses to insert her or his own name more
prominently than the original composer, (if not completely).
> guess what?? The composer was Anton Diabelli, a Viennese composer and
> music publisher. In 1820, as a promotional gimmick to launch his
> new publishing venture, he wrote a little waltz and asked 51 composers
> then living or working in Vienna to write a variation, with the idea
> that he would publish the results in a collection. As it turned out,
> Beethoven didn't write just one variation, but 33 of them, which became
> the first volume of what ended up as a two-volume set.
>
> I have an LP from Musical Heritage Society (MHS 1396 -- current CD
> status, Mark?) which features pianist Hans Kann playing the second
> volume containing the contributions of the other 50 composers. Most of
> these names are totally forgotten now, although a few familiar names
> stick out, such as Czerny, Hummel, Listz, Moscheles, and Schubert.
> (Douglas Townsend's liner notes give brief biographical blurbs on about
> half of them.)