Tim Buckley/Springsteen?
Mystic
came across this amazing picture of Tim taken in the very early 70's.
Amazing resemblence to 77-78 Springsteen in my opinion.
http://www.timbuckley.net/images/mojotim6.gif
If your not aquainted with Tim's work by all means check out his
discogarphy, each album a gem in its own right................
And yes..........he is Jeff Buckley's father.....
-Mystic-
Song To The Siren
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Long afloat on shipless oceans
I did all my best to smile
'Til your singing eyes and fingers
Drew me loving to your isle
And you sang
Sail to me
Sail to me
Let me enfold you
Here I am
Here I am
Waiting to hold you
Did I dream you dreamed about me?
Were you hare when I was fox?
Now my foolish boat is leaning
Broken lovelorn on your rocks,
For you sing, "Touch me not, touch me not, come back tomorrow:
O my heart, O my heart shies from the sorrow"
I am puzzled as the newborn child
I am troubled at the tide:
Should I stand amid the breakers?
Should I lie with Death my bride?
Hear me sing, "Swim to me, Swim to me, Let me enfold you:
Here I am, Here I am, Waiting to hold you"
Written by Tim Buckley and Larry Beckett
Lyrics c.1968 Third Story Music Inc., [BMI]
SnowSkyandPine
from a tim buckley album cover.
<< Subject: Tim Buckley/Springsteen?
From: Mystic mys...@bellsouth.net
Date: Thu, Mar 11, 2004 8:11 PM
Message-id: <l17250lfuc01o5q3i...@4ax.com>
http://www.timbuckley.net/images/mojotim6.gif
-Mystic-
>><BR><BR>
Burt Busk
SnowSkyandPine <snowsky...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040311234129...@mb-m19.aol.com...
> related aside: bruce's "greetings from asbury park" album cover borrows
greatly
> from a tim buckley album cover.
I disagree. Bruce's album cover is like an old vacation resort postcard, in
fact it may be taken directly from a real postcard. Buckley's cover is a
cynical parody of those same "Greetings From ...." postcards, with the L.A.
smog in the photo. I doubt if Bruce's cover borrowed from Buckley's at all.
Burt
jessk...@yeehaa.com
> SnowSkyandPine <snowsky...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20040311234129...@mb-m19.aol.com...
>
>>related aside: bruce's "greetings from asbury park" album cover borrows
>
> greatly
>
>>from a tim buckley album cover.
>
>
> I disagree. Bruce's album cover is like an old vacation resort postcard, in
> fact it may be taken directly from a real postcard.
The fact that the album credits "Front cover photograph courtesy of
Ticknor Bros., Inc, Boston 02130" suggests that it WAS a real postcard,
since Ticknor was one of the most famous publisher of postcards from
that era, including the famous "linen" cards like GFAP.
Do a search for "Ticknor Bros" and you'll hit tons of postcard dealers.
Here are some Ticknor Asbury Park cards, which seem to pre-date Bruce's era.
http://216.247.8.124/pixfiles/2708.jpg
http://home.att.net/~giacopassic/asbury_park_640x398.jpg
Buckley's cover is a
> cynical parody of those same "Greetings From ...." postcards, with the L.A.
> smog in the photo. I doubt if Bruce's cover borrowed from Buckley's at all.
Still, I don't know if there is a connection between the two covers, but
simply because one is "straight" (altho' I think there was some irony in
Bruce's choice) and one was "parody" doesn't negate the possibility. If
there was no connection, it was quite an coincidence.
Burt Busk
<jessk...@yeehaa.com> wrote in message
news:tqj4c.7247$Sp2.8...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
> Burt Busk wrote:
> Buckley's cover is a
> > cynical parody of those same "Greetings From ...." postcards, with the
L.A.
> > smog in the photo. I doubt if Bruce's cover borrowed from Buckley's at
all.
>
>
> Still, I don't know if there is a connection between the two covers, but
> simply because one is "straight" (altho' I think there was some irony in
> Bruce's choice) and one was "parody" doesn't negate the possibility. If
> there was no connection, it was quite an coincidence.
Not really. True, it doesn't negate the possibility, but the "Greetings from
...." postcard was very common. As was the GFAP cover style postcard, with
the different scenes inside each block letter. Here is an example:
http://montereybay.org/gallery/view_photo.php?set_albumName=scpostcards&id=s
antacruz_ll
musicaner
on the LA SMOG! the EARLY PRESSINS had
A REMOVABLE POSTCARD!!
besides GREETING FROM LA probably SOLD 10 COPIES and i doubt BRUCE was even
familiar with it!!
"Burt Busk" <burt...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:5Yj4c.16767$YG.166125@attbi_s01...
Mystic
>the BUCKLEY got NOTHIN TO DO with THE BRUCE! the BUCKLEY was DONE AS A SPOOF
>on the LA SMOG! the EARLY PRESSINS had
>A REMOVABLE POSTCARD!!
Hummm......................Let's see. Buckley's record was released
in November of 1972:
http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&uid=UIDSUB020403121121301355&sql=Ansrn287c056a
Springsteen's "Greetings" came out on Jan 5, 1973:
http://www.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&uid=UIDSUB020403121121301355&sql=Abif4zfjheh8k
Ya think perhaps someone at CBS picked up a copy of Buckley's album
and planted seeds? Or coincidence in the first degree?
>besides GREETING FROM LA probably SOLD 10 COPIES and i doubt BRUCE was even
>familiar with it!!
Most likely Springsteen didn't become aware of Buckley as an artists
until much later in time...............................
Sadly you are most correct with Buckley's sales figures for Greetings
as most of his audience, after the advent of "Starsailor" and "Lorca"
were lost to other much more commercially viable artists.
-Mystic-
musicaner
met! they may have even been ON THE SAME GIG!!
GREETINS FROM LA was BUCKLEY DESPERATE
attempt to GO COMMERCIAL and sell records the
RESULT BEIN HE SOLD FEWER THAN EVER
BEFORE!!
but MUSICALLY- prior to GREETINS FROM LA-
BRUCE MUSIC was TOTALLY OPPOSITE
from BUCKLEY!!! STARSAILOR and BRUCE
MUSIC like OIL and WATER!!!!!
GREEIN from LA was released IF I REMEMBER
CORRECTLY on the ZAPPA-HERBIE COHEN label
STRAIGHT!! distributed (POORLY) by WB!!!!
if it sold a HANDFUL IT WAS TOO MANY!!
not my favorite of his records but got a few CUTS
the ONE WITH CLYDIE KING ON IT IS NICE!
"Mystic" <mys...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:j42450p9lemd5543v...@4ax.com...
colonialacres
"musicaner" <musi...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:Dlo4c.458$zP2...@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
> im ALMOST certain that BUCKLEY and BRUCE
> met! they may have even been ON THE SAME GIG!!
> GREETINS FROM LA was BUCKLEY DESPERATE
> attempt to GO COMMERCIAL and sell records the
> RESULT BEIN HE SOLD FEWER THAN EVER
> BEFORE!!
>
> but MUSICALLY- prior to GREETINS FROM LA-
> BRUCE MUSIC was TOTALLY OPPOSITE
> from BUCKLEY!!! STARSAILOR and BRUCE
> MUSIC like OIL and WATER!!!!!
> GREEIN from LA was released IF I REMEMBER
> CORRECTLY on the ZAPPA-HERBIE COHEN label
> STRAIGHT!! distributed (POORLY) by WB!!!!
> if it sold a HANDFUL IT WAS TOO MANY!!
>
> not my favorite of his records but got a few CUTS
> the ONE WITH CLYDIE KING ON IT IS NICE!
They used to play a couple good tracks off that on the radio quite a
bit --- "Get On Top" and "Sweet Surrender". I haven't heard them in ages
.....
musicaner
BUCKLEY tryin TO BE FUNKY and wearin
PLATFORM SHOES!!!! those 2 are good and
the ONE ABOUT CHINA !!! actually A PRETTY
GOOD RECORD!!! but to ME BUCKLEY WAS
HAPPY/SAD!!!! that MY FAVORITE OF HIS!!!
"colonialacres" <coloni...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:Uip4c.17944$Gm5.52276@attbi_s04...
colonialacres
check that one out!
"musicaner" <musi...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:_hp4c.674$zP2...@bignews5.bellsouth.net...
musicaner
a TIME BY HERBIE COHEN!!!! BUCKLEY used
to COVER FN songs all the time and ADMIRED HIM!!
HAPPY/SAD has that FOLK/JAZZ VIBE!!!!
"colonialacres" <coloni...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:ozp4c.18322$YG.208108@attbi_s01...
musicaner
AT?
i gotta READ!!
"Jeff Bullingham" <jeffbul...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:2os4c.9458$ra2....@newssvr27.news.prodigy.com...
>
> "musicaner" <musi...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:lqq4c.81305$rB4....@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
> > BUCKLEY and NEIL were both MANAGED for
> > a TIME BY HERBIE COHEN!!!! BUCKLEY used
> > to COVER FN songs all the time and ADMIRED HIM!!
> > HAPPY/SAD has that FOLK/JAZZ VIBE!!!!
>
> Mr Musicaner, did you read, "remind me of the ###/musicaner threads"??!!!
> All but vows to off you or anyone associated with you when she's on the
> receiving end of a comment or two, but up in arms why anyone else
responds.
> That takes the prize. Frankly, at least ### admitted he sent the
> embarassing "deep doo doo" email, whereas as she would have claimed it was
> the family cat.
>
>
burt...@attbi.com
> BUCKLEY and NEIL were both MANAGED for
> a TIME BY HERBIE COHEN!!!! BUCKLEY used
> to COVER FN songs all the time and ADMIRED HIM!!
> HAPPY/SAD has that FOLK/JAZZ VIBE!!!!
I'm learning that lots of great, great musicians have covered Fred
songs. Seems like darn near every album from any American band in the
late 60's had a FN song on it.
Herb Cohen sounds like an interesting character, managing Zappa ("no
commercial potential") and these two legendary guys; what do you know
about him?
burt...@attbi.com
"musicaner" <musi...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<GLs4c.29568$xL3....@bignews1.bellsouth.net>...
musicaner
with HC SUED HIM!!
<burt...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:9447f4c8.04031...@posting.google.com...
musicaner
>
DONT KNOW IF THEY MATCH UP GOOD except
POLITICALLY!!! i think PATRICK while A GOOD
POSTER lacks the POETIC FINESSE OF ###('you stepped on the DEEP DOO DOO,
what a FUNNYMAN ### he musta been JESSKIDDEN!!!- KIDDEN!!! thats one of em
MAYLFLOWE TYPE
NAMES!!!!!!!!!!! HERB and JESS KIDDEN)!! .
Mystic
>Herb Cohen sounds like an interesting character, managing Zappa ("no
>commercial potential") and these two legendary guys; what do you know
>about him?
Two individuals whom I always found mysterious and interesting were
Herb Cohen and Tom Wilson.
Lee Underwood in his book about Tim Buckley (Blue Melody) briefly
touches on some of Herb's traits and ideaology.
-Mystic-
Burt Busk
herb cohen
Herb Cohen was the manager of Frank Zappa and the Mothers Of Invention. He
co-owned the DiscReet record label with Zappa.
Herb Cohen contributed cash register noises to:
the mothers of invention: absolutely free (2)
(1967, lp,usa, verve)
the mothers of invention: mothermania (6)
(1969, lp, usa, verve)
random notes
Herb Cohen worked With: Screamin' Jay Hawkins, George Duke, Alice Cooper,
Tim Buckley, Lenny Bruce, Theodore Bikel.
From: Patrick Neve (sp...@darkwing.uoregon.edu)
OK, so Herb's early involvement with the Mothers is pretty well documented
in the various books about Frank. But what seems to be missing, or maybe I
just missed it, is exactly what were the particulars of the lawsuit between
Frank and Herb? It was around '75, was it not? I thought it involved
ownership of masters? Which album? Bat Chain Puller? Who sued who? Who
won? I've heard it described as "ugly", but beyond that I know nothing.
More importantly, what's Herb been up to since then? I've got a Lowell
George & The Factory CD produced by him in 1993, for Bizarre/ Straight
records, no less, so he seems to be musically active to some degree. The
1989 CD of Capt. Beefhearts (magnum opus) Lick My Decals Off, Baby was also
a Bizarre/ Straight production, distributed by Rhino. So what's the deal
with Herb, those of you in the know?
RE: why the breakup?
From: Andy Hollinden (ahol...@iupui.edu)
As I understand it, it all came down to money and how it was used.
Howard Kaylan told me (I got to spend an afternoon with him last fall) that
what started it all was that Frank found out that Herbie was "double
dipping." It seems that his contract with Frank stated that he got a
percentage of Frank's earnings, which is perfectly normal. Now, in addition
to being Frank's manager, Herbie was also his partner in DiscReet Records.
Frank was pissed when he found that Herb was taking the same percentage of
his earnings that came into DiscReet, not just the live performance
earnings. So, in essence, Herb was skimming the top off of Frank's earnings
in the business where they were co-owners. Technically, I gather that Herb
was not doing anything illegal here; his contract did say he was entitled to
a percentage of Frank's earnings. It just should have been rewritten when
they became partners in the label.
Frank eventually charged that Herb and his lawyer brother, Mutt
Cohen, were delinquent in paying to him his DiscReet earnings and using the
money to pay for the production of Captain Beefheart's Bat Chain Puller
album. That album in its original version has never seen the light of day.
Frank also claimed that Cohen was using DiscReet money to take vacations,
hence "Mo 'n Herb's Vacation." Herb claimed that DiscReet had paid Zappa all
the money due to him. Herb was pissed when Zappa took the Zoot Allures album
directly to Warner Bros, bypassing DiscReet entirely (that album came out
ont he Warner Bros. label). Herb, I believe, sued Zappa and Warner Bros. for
this.
I don't know the details of their lawsuit; whether or not it went to
court or was settled in whatever manner. Like I said, when I called him, he
just shut me down saying, "Why bother? It's a waste of my time" and shit
like that. Totally unwilling to tell his side.
Herb Cohen is still managing George Duke.
From: Patrick Neve (sp...@darkwing.uoregon.edu)
There is another Herb Cohen, who is one of the worlds' leading negotiators.
He's talked terrorists out of their hostages, and has since taken up the
safer profession of writing books and doing seminars. Here is whom I believe
to be the "other" Herb Cohen:
http://www.leadingauthorities.com/search/biography.cfm/s/3159.htm
As closely linked to terrorist negotiations as artist management is, it
would appear to be an unrelated practicioner. Though with a book title like
"You Can Negotiate Anything", it could certainly follow that it was the
autobiography of a rock & roll manager.
From: TFaulconer (tfaul...@aol.com)
The Cohens are now involved with a new label - Manifesto Records. As a
matter of fact, if you check out their web site: http://www.manifesto.com/
you'll find their catalog and a short history of the label that begins:
"Our label began as Bizarre Records (and its companion label, Straight
Records) in 1968, as a partnership between rock manager Herb Cohen and Frank
Zappa. Over the next several years, Bizarre signed artists such as Alice
Cooper, Tim Buckley, Captain Beefheart, Ted Nugent, Wild Man Fischer, The
GTOs, Ruben & The Jets, and others. Later, a third label, Discreet, was
added, and the labels released albums until 1975, mainly through Warner
Bros. Records distribution."
Also, if you check out their catalog, you'll find that several releases
originally released on Bizarre/Straight/DiscReet back in the 70's and
recently in the early '90's are now available on their Manifesto label (Tim
Buckley and Tom Waits, for example...)
From: Zootorific (zooto...@aol.com)
Evan is Herb's nephew.
From: "A.Adriaanse" (an...@cidanka.nl)
Oh, and Herb Cohen is still managing George Duke (at least, July 10 1999 he
still was.) Co de Kloet talked to him at North Sea Jazz. And to George.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
Discography:
1967 Mothers of Invention- Absolutely Free (cash register on "America Drinks
& Goes Home")
1967 Sandy Hurvitz- Sandy's Album Is Here At Last! (Production Supervisor)
1968 Wild Man Fischer- An Evening With Wild Man Fischer (Business
Production)
1969 Jeff Simmons- Lucille Has Messed My Mind Up
1969 Jerry Yester/Judy Henske- Farewell Aldebaran (executive producer)
1969 Alice Cooper- Live at the Whisky, 1969 (Producer)
1970 Alice Cooper- Easy Action (Executive Producer)
1970 Lord Buckley- A Most Immaculately Hip Aristocrat (Excecutive Producer)
1973 Ruben and the Jets- For Real! (Business, Burritos)
1989 Lenny Bruce- Berkeley Concert (Producer)
1991 Screamin' Jay Hawkins- Black Music for White People (Executive
Producer)
1993 Screamin' Jay Hawkins- Stone Crazy (Executive Producer)
1993 George Duke- Muir Woods Suite (Producer)
1993 Lowell George & The Factory- Lightning Rod Man
1994 Tim Buckley- Live at the Troubadour 1969 (Producer)
2000 Little Feat- Hotcakes & Outtakes: 30 Years Of Little Feat
musicaner
runnin guns for rebels in VARIOUS LOCATIONS ETC
ETC!! the RICHARD FARINA THING!! mostly ALL
BOGUS!! HERBIE on of the first to wear A EARRING
BACK in the day, HE was the AL GROSSMAN
of the WEST COAST startin OFF OPERATIN
COFFEHOUSES(the UNICORN i think) and then
MOVIN INTO MANAGIN FOLKIES(JUDY HENSKE was one of his first!, later the
STONE PONEYS i think! the GREAT JUDY HENSKE)!! he later hooked up with zappa
who
was also west coast!! he was BIG ON THE PUBLISHIN!! most of his artists
covered each
others songs since he had a piece of all
their publishin!!!!!
he later managed tom waits, and hes supposed
to be on the cover of one of his recrods!!! MUTT
PASSED away a few years ago.... i suspect
HERB makes a good livin from the publishin
he owns and the TIM BUCKLEY reissues
hes put out.
"Burt Busk" <burt...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:4g_4c.6129$KO3.32240@attbi_s02...
Mystic
>.... i suspect
>HERB makes a good livin from the publishin
>he owns and the TIM BUCKLEY reissues
>hes put out.
Yea but he's a shmuck for not re-releasing "Blue Afternoon" and
"Starsalior"..........................
-Mystic-
musicaner
on ebay you cain get for about 100 dollars.
however i wouldnt be surprised if they come out
again soon.
"Mystic" <mys...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:l1h9509r61o71duj6...@4ax.com...
Burt Busk
musicaner <musi...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:V325c.90190$rB4....@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
musicaner
YOU GOTTA DO!!!! if you NOBODY you
GOTTA DO WHAT YOU GOTTA DO TO
CATCH A BREAK!!! thats the REASON
for the PHENOMENA!!!
after you break BIG you BREAK with the
GUY BOUGHT THE BREAK FOR YOU
SETTLE and MOVE ON!!
of course TODAY its PROBABLY WORSE THAN
EVER as they GOT NO TALENT AT ALL!!
"Burt Busk" <burt...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:R7j5c.16669$_w.340772@attbi_s53...
Burt Busk
comfortably, I suppose .... Money supercedes a conscience, I guess.
musicaner <musi...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:wTj5c.42670$p77....@bignews3.bellsouth.net...
musicaner
"Burt Busk" <burt...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:ptk5c.14421$SR1.27292@attbi_s04...