Alex Saunders: Head Witch of the UK
Jason Fifer
I have read that in the early days of Black Sabbath the band did
theatrics that looked like they came from a grimore that got Alex
Saunders the head wich of Englands attention. Saunders warned the band
they could be playing with powers they might not be able to control &
invited them to Stonehenge. The band all then had the same dream and
began to were crosses Ozzy's father a blacksmith had made them for
protection against curses. Tony Iommi can be seen mentioning Saunders in
the video The Black Sabbath story Pt. 1. If anybody knows more about
Saunders &/or the days when he used to hang out with Sabbath I would
love to hear about it. That would be very interesting.
" I that, beleive in, the stories of old, WOULD NEVER FIGHT IT!"
IronHorse
.....Saunders didnt "hang out" with Sabbath. You persistently play up the
satanist thing here. Sabbath toyed with all sorts in their youth. It was all
part of the beast they wanted to create.
.....this supposed link you have suggested between Saunders and Stonehenge
is laughable. Stonehenge was adopted by the druids centuries ago, but it is,
in fact a pre-historic site where the ancients buried their dead, so anyone
else adopting it as their own is sacrilageous to the ancients. Stonehenge
has absolutely no connection with EVIL whatsoever. It is THE biggest single
mecca for druids and followers of ancient pagan sects anywhere in the world.
To suggest a christian concept, such as Satan has anything to do with
Stonehenge, exposes your failure to grasp facts or reality.
.....It is not for me to judge people on their beliefs but let me say
this....I keep hearing this Satan thing here. I have read the Satanic
commandments and I admit to liking what I see. Having said that, it is
nothing at all like the crap I see espoused by people here. It is a simple
outlook on life that I actually agree with. True Satanists dont actually go
around shouting their mouth off about their belief. It is part of a true
Satanist's religion to, in fact, keep a low profile.
.....I suspect you are doing nothing more than "toying" with Satan. It adds
spice to your life, through the drama of it all. If you think about it, you
are creating a big myth for atmosphere.....JUST LIKE SABBATH DID AND NO MORE
!
Michael Hughes
Birmingham, England
Jason Fifer wrote in message
<6l8c08$t0m$1...@newsd-163.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...
jim.mo...@montego.com
In article <ihMf1.40$me4.1...@news-reader.bt.net>,
"IronHorse" <iron...@lineone.net> wrote:
>
> .....Saunders didnt "hang out" with Sabbath. You persistently play up the
> satanist thing here. Sabbath toyed with all sorts in their youth. It was all
> part of the beast they wanted to create.
> .....this supposed link you have suggested between Saunders and Stonehenge
> is laughable. Stonehenge was adopted by the druids centuries ago, but it is,
> in fact a pre-historic site where the ancients buried their dead, so anyone
> else adopting it as their own is sacrilageous to the ancients. Stonehenge
> has absolutely no connection with EVIL whatsoever. It is THE biggest single
> mecca for druids and followers of ancient pagan sects anywhere in the world.
> To suggest a christian concept, such as Satan has anything to do with
> Stonehenge, exposes your failure to grasp facts or reality.
> .....It is not for me to judge people on their beliefs but let me say
> this....I keep hearing this Satan thing here. I have read the Satanic
> commandments and I admit to liking what I see. Having said that, it is
> nothing at all like the crap I see espoused by people here. It is a simple
> outlook on life that I actually agree with. True Satanists dont actually go
> around shouting their mouth off about their belief. It is part of a true
> Satanist's religion to, in fact, keep a low profile.
> .....I suspect you are doing nothing more than "toying" with Satan. It adds
> spice to your life, through the drama of it all. If you think about it, you
> are creating a big myth for atmosphere.....JUST LIKE SABBATH DID AND NO MORE
> !
Well said.
There is a vast difference between religious Satanism, which is largely
atheistic, paganism/the occult which are NOT related to Satan but rather to
pagan gods and so forth (although there are offshoots which do worship the
Satanic elements of the Christian mythology, but these aren't that common),
and the teenage-type Satanism that most "heavy-metal" kids espouse (I know I
did!) which has nothing to do with paganism or the religious Satanism, and
typically consists of the "Satan rules! 666!!!" sort of phrases, instead of
a real meaningful religion.
It is false to assume that since Saunders is called the "head witch," that he
is associated with the medieval witchcraft fantasies of early Christians; it
is also false to assume that anyone with the name "head witch" is associated
in any way with Satanism, because that isn't true, either.
I hope that Jason Fifer hasn't confused anyone into thinking that Saunders is
a Satan-worshipper, that Stonehenge is for Satanists, that Sabbath was
imitiating Satanists in their stage shows, etc, etc.. Satan and Paganism are
worlds apart and they ought to be kept that way.
> Michael Hughes
> Birmingham, England
>
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
$eb
This Stonehenge story got my attention and I wanted to add some more of it.I
remember that Ozzy once told a story about some weird hooded men(druids?)
who were hanging out of some concert in the seventies.They surrounded Ozzy
and co. with candles in their hands and guess what happened?Black Sabbath
members started to sing Happy Birthday to these "druids" and then they blew
their candles out and told them to get the hell out of there! When I heard
about this story I just couldn`t do but laugh.So much for the satanic image.
The Really funny thing is that this satanic image is still haunting
them.Some of The Finnish religious groups are afraid of that some kids might
try to burn some churches after Black Sabbath and some other bands have
played their sets here in Finland(next sunday).
So if this happens I will tell you more in next week.
I also remember that there was this satanic band(true satanic band) called
Black Widow who had a song called:"Come To The Sabbath-Satan`s There".And
this band really played one gig in Stonehenge(damn,this is like Spinal Tap!)
many years ago.If anyone has more info about this band,please tell us more.
Midsummer`s eve top 3 songs:
1.Black Sabbath:Black Sabbath
2.Mercyful Fate:Melissa
3.Rainbow:Stargazer
>Sani
p.s.I hope the witches won`t kidnap my 2 cats in Midsummer`s eve!
Michael Hughes
I can tell you for a fact
not only have "Black Widow" never played Stonehenge, but NO band has ever
played Stonehenge
Stonehenge is owned by "National Heritage"...it is not freely accessed by
ANYONE !
Can we now finally cut the crap about Stonhenge ?
If you guys want to discover Satanism...stop toying with fire and go read
the Satanic commandments. Then either decide to join up with others or get
on with your life......
STONEHENGE IS NOT AN EVIL PLACE, NOR WAS IT EVER AN EVIL PLACE
$eb wrote in message <6lp42s$se7$1...@nntp.teliafi.net>...
S. Davies-Morris
Well, I was under the distinct impression that the 1991 Hawkwind CD:
*This Is Hawkwind, Do Not Panic* was recorded *Live At Stonehenge*.
Whether the band was setup in the stone circle (so to speak) is
another issue...
...Carl? Carl? Can you shed any light on this?
Are we done with *Satanism* yet? We should all know by now in ambs
that this topic has NOTHING to do with Black Sabbath...
--
Regards
Steven Davies-Morris
Please note my new email address sda...@mcione.com
=======================================================
Michael Hughes wrote in message ...
jim.mo...@montego.com
In article <6lp42s$se7$1...@nntp.teliafi.net>,
"$eb" <sani...@nettilinja.fi> wrote:
>
>
> This Stonehenge story got my attention and I wanted to add some more of it.I
> remember that Ozzy once told a story about some weird hooded men(druids?)
> who were hanging out of some concert in the seventies.They surrounded Ozzy
> and co. with candles in their hands and guess what happened?Black Sabbath
> members started to sing Happy Birthday to these "druids" and then they blew
> their candles out and told them to get the hell out of there! When I heard
> about this story I just couldn`t do but laugh.So much for the satanic image.
> The Really funny thing is that this satanic image is still haunting
> them.Some of The Finnish religious groups are afraid of that some kids might
> try to burn some churches after Black Sabbath and some other bands have
> played their sets here in Finland(next sunday).
> So if this happens I will tell you more in next week.
>
> I also remember that there was this satanic band(true satanic band) called
> Black Widow who had a song called:"Come To The Sabbath-Satan`s There".And
> this band really played one gig in Stonehenge(damn,this is like Spinal Tap!)
> many years ago.If anyone has more info about this band,please tell us more.
Actually, a friend of mine directed me to a Spinal Tap page a long while back
which had information about how an actual Sabbath stage decoration (I don't
remember when this was, but I am pretty sure it was post-Ozzy) of Stonehenge
was what prompted that scene in "This is Spinal Tap."
Anyone know anything about this?
There's a Black Widow page at http://hem2.passagen.se/blkwidow/ which gives a
brief history of the band and some of the lyrics and cover art for their
albums.
<snip>
jim.mo...@montego.com
In article <6lp42s$se7$1...@nntp.teliafi.net>,
"$eb" <sani...@nettilinja.fi> wrote:
>
>
> This Stonehenge story got my attention and I wanted to add some more of it.I
> remember that Ozzy once told a story about some weird hooded men(druids?)
> who were hanging out of some concert in the seventies.They surrounded Ozzy
> and co. with candles in their hands and guess what happened?Black Sabbath
> members started to sing Happy Birthday to these "druids" and then they blew
> their candles out and told them to get the hell out of there!
<Snip> Oops.. forgot to mention in my last post that I asked about this very
incident not too long ago, and someone else in the ng answered it. Tthat was
apparently what happened, although I don't know if those people were Druids
or Satanists, or whatever they were. Search the dejanews archive for the
previous post, it is fairly recent, so it should be in there somewhere.
Jonathan Cornick
>
>Actually, a friend of mine directed me to a Spinal Tap page a long while back
>which had information about how an actual Sabbath stage decoration (I don't
>remember when this was, but I am pretty sure it was post-Ozzy) of Stonehenge
>was what prompted that scene in "This is Spinal Tap."
>
>Anyone know anything about this?
It was the 'Born Again' tour. They had a Stonehenge set which was too big
to fit in some venues.
Jonathan
Jason Fifer
They must have been Druids because ones birthday is is the biggest &
most important holidays for Satanists.
Jason Fifer
There is not much between Pagans & Satanist. Some of the infernal names
(like Pan or the Celtic Bile) in the Satanic Bible are the same names
other Pagans use. Satanist just have more pride & don't beleive in
bullshit like karma and have their curses backfire on them.
SLEEPING VILLAGE
Excellent post $eb, I quite enjoyed it amid the Itcy and Scratchy show
thread here.
On Fri, 12 Jun 1998 11:03:47 +0300, "$eb" <sani...@nettilinja.fi>
wrote:
>This article is taken from the Chip Rowe`s Spinal Tap page.It is an
>interview with Ian Gillan himself.
>
>
>Steve Person (sc...@socsci.soton.ac.uk) kindly donated this rather
>interesting
>piece on Black Sabbath's
>Stonehenge (not a million miles away from the Spinal Tap experience).
>Hi there,
>Great Tap pages - I thought you might like to include this info on
>your pages - an excerpt from an interview with Ian Gillan on the
>inspiration for Stonehenge. It comes from the December 1994 edition
>of Mojo magazine.
>I was going to post this to alt.fan.spinal-tap but gave up trying to
>figure out how to post on my newsreader, so if you have access to
>usenet, it would be great if you could post it.
>Thanks
>Steve Pearson
>His Majesty of Rock - Interview with Ian Gillan
>Mojo: You briefly joined Black Sabbath in 1983, tell us about the
>infamous Born Again tour that provided such valuable inspiration
>for Spinal Tap?
>Gillan: We were up at a company called LSD - Light and Sound Design -
>in Birmingham, and the lighting engineer asked if anyone had any
>ideas for a stage set. Geezer Butler suggested Stonehenge.
>""How do you envisage it, Geezer?" asked the engineer.
>"Life size of course" replied Geezer.
>So they built a life-size Stonehenge. We hired the Birmingham NEC
>to rehearse in and they couldn't get these bloody things in
>there. We opened in Montreal and Don Arden had hired Maple Leaf
>ice hockey stadium for a week, so they shipped the set over there
>and could still only get a few of those damn stones up, one each
>side of the stage, one behind the drums and two cross-pieces.
>The album was called Born Again and had the most vile cover I've
>ever seen, a new-born baby painted red with yellow finger nails
>and two little yellow horns sticking out of his head.
>Now, I've not been able to remember a single word of any of the
>Sabbath songs, I don't know why but they won't go into my head.
>So I did myself a prompt book and wrote out the first lines of
>each song. I don't normally use monitors but I had two wedges put
>at the front of the stage just to hide my book, and I'd practices
>turning the pages with my foot at home in the kitchen. No
>problem.
>On the last day of the rehearsal we're wondering what this dwarf
>is doing hanging around backstage. When we do the dress rehearsal
>the dwarf emerges in a red leotard, long yellow finger nails and
>little yellow horns. He's going to be the baby.
>Then we hear this horrendous screaming sound - they've recorded
>a baby's scream and flanged it - and suddenly; we see this dwarf
>crawling across the top of Stonehenge, then he stands up as the
>baby's scream fades away and falls backwards off this 30 foot
>fibreglass replica of Stonehenge onto a big pile of mattresses.
>Then dong, dong - bells start toiling and all the roadies come
>across the front of the stage in monk's cowls, at which point War
>Pigs starts up. By now we can see the kids are either in stitches
>or wincing in horror.
>After spending 40 grand a day to achieve all this, someone had
>economised by not actually trying out the dry ice in the
>afternoon run through. So as I stride confidently towards my
>prompt book, not even knowing the first word of the song, I'm
>suddenly shocked to see a chest-high cloud of dry ice is berating
>me to the front of the stage. So there I am after this big
>opening, kneeling down, swatting the air and trying to read me
>line, popping my head above this cloud every now and then.
>Someone shouted "It's Ronnie Dio!"
>
>
>
>I hope you enjoyed this interview as much as i did.(greetings Steven!)
>"Have a good time,all the time."
>>Sani
>
>
>
Bill Montbleau
: Actually, a friend of mine directed me to a Spinal Tap page a long while back
: which had information about how an actual Sabbath stage decoration (I don't
: remember when this was, but I am pretty sure it was post-Ozzy) of Stonehenge
: was what prompted that scene in "This is Spinal Tap."
:
: Anyone know anything about this?
It's the stage set for the "Born Again" tour. You can see a picture of it
in the Castle remastered "Born Again" CD. the rear of the stage had 3
huge Stonehenge looking pieces. And they were huge- they looked almost
twice the size of actual Stonehenge pillars.
So I guess Spinal Tap decided to parody that and end up with stonehenge
pieces that were too _small_.
--
Bill M. 8)- | "Join the congregation, everybody's got to get
gee...@wpi.edu | in line, we never justify, the choir sings a
T H I N K !| never ending lie." - BLACK SABBATH
----ZetaPsi----|----------http://www.wpi.edu/~geezer/----------|
ASL1930-97RIP | BS'97, MS'98 WPI Mathematical Sciences Dept.
S. Davies-Morris
Ian Gillan describes it hysterically in his autobiography. I especially
loved the bit about the dwarf falling off the *Stonehenge*...
...after his padded mad had been removed.
End of *Stonehenge* to Gillan's delight!
--
Regards
Steven Davies-Morris
Please note my new email address sda...@mcione.com
=======================================================
Jonathan Cornick wrote in message ...
>
>>
>>Actually, a friend of mine directed me to a Spinal Tap page a long while
back
>>which had information about how an actual Sabbath stage decoration (I
don't
>>remember when this was, but I am pretty sure it was post-Ozzy) of
Stonehenge
>>was what prompted that scene in "This is Spinal Tap."
>>
>>Anyone know anything about this?
>
IronHorse
There is a world of difference between Paganism and Satanism.
Satanism is as similar to Hinduism as it is to Paganism.
Where you are getting confused is similarity of words.
Satan is christian concept. He was a God created Angel that went "bad".
Paganism has absolutely no correlation to christianity whatsoever.
Where the similarity comes in is the fact that the christians stole just
about everything they could from the Pagans.
Christmas day falling on the 25th december....A Pagan festival, robbed by
the Christians. Easter too.
Pagans do not worship a supernatural God. They worhsip GodS, from a point of
view of Earth being mother and the different GodS bringing differnet
blessings or curses.
I am absolutely astounded at your lack of knowledge on a subject that you
claim to know all about. The Pagan culture is extremely strong here in
England and Im quite sure that they would be appalled at your quite
ridiculously uneducated outbursts. The Pagans are a beautiful people. Dont
trash them with the same garbage as some kid stuck in a bedroom pulling grim
faces in the mirror thinking he's a demon or some disciple.
I'm quite sure my MCC friends who are Pagan would find great difficulty
seeing eye to eye with a nubile who wants to sacrifice his pet gerbil in the
belief that this somehow gives him membership to a mythical club !
"Satanist just have more pride ".......my son....you are a buffoon. Plain
and simple. you are no more satanist than the pope !
If you love Sabbath, you are very welcome here. You are however, hijacking
every mail with the childish claim that you are satanist. Trust me when I
say I am very close to satanists and you are NOT one. You would KNOW why if
you knew about them truly !
Michael Hughes
Birmingham, England
Jason Fifer wrote in message
<6lq2tb$lq6$1...@newsd-162.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...
IronHorse
Hiya Bill
Stonehenge has been a mystery to us in England for centuries. It has many
legends attached to it. Putting the stones onstage would have been part of
an atmosphere. All the elements are of no relative to each other, but in
showbusiness, they add to a feel, rather than make any statement.
I thought the Spinal Tap spoof was brilliant !
Michael Hughes
Birmingham, England
Bill Montbleau wrote in message <6lptn3$2le$8...@bigboote.WPI.EDU>...
>: Actually, a friend of mine directed me to a Spinal Tap page a long while
back
>: which had information about how an actual Sabbath stage decoration (I
don't
>: remember when this was, but I am pretty sure it was post-Ozzy) of
Stonehenge
>: was what prompted that scene in "This is Spinal Tap."
>:
>: Anyone know anything about this?
>
$eb
Jason Fifer
Lucifer, was Venus the Roman god: the bearer of light in mythology way
before the Jews & later in Christianity. The names are not similiar &
I'm not confused. They are the same. I hate to break it to ya man but
there was no Christians when people came up with the Pagan god Satan,
there was duality of Baal who later became Bohemoth & Belzebub later
every seven years who was the symbol of fertility who battled Mot the
god of famine. Pagans don't worship gods they become the god by saying
the name while using the Magik. My spells work for me just fine & I know
enough by getting my hands on some very interesting books educating
myself in the occult. One of the Rules of the Earth in Satanism is only
kill animals for food & I don't eat gerbils. You lack perception on
Satanist so you can't be that close to them. You don't know me & I'm a
Satanist. My spells work just fine. 666% Hail SaTan! Lets all have a
Black Sabbath & curse Cardinal O'Conner & his buddy Jef Fenholt.
Jason Fifer
Tony Iommi said himself that Saunders hung out with the band & I think
its cool that Ozzy said he wanted a black cathedral or chapel in his
backyard complete with a Magik circle & that he tore up the holy bible!
I curse the rotton Jef Fenholt & Cardinal OConner!
"The pins & Needlesprick the SkiN of little Dolls!" 666% Hail SaTan!
Norman O'Brien
Reply To : Re: Alex Saunders: Head Witch of the UK
Sent By : Jason Fifer, ahr...@webtv.net
On : Fri, 12 Jun 1998 02:32:53 -0700
Hey Jason.. I would have thought that Michael's post had put you
straight, but you're obviously far more deluded than I gave you credit
for.
Firstly this is w-a-y off-topic, if you want to babble on about Satan,
go find a newsgroup that cares. Sabbath isn't a religion, it's a
rock'n'roll band.. nothing more, nothing less. It's all about having
fun.
If you think listening to Black Sabbath makes you 'Evil' then you
really are a very sad & confused individual.
> You don't know me & I'm a
> Satanist. My spells work just fine. 666% Hail SaTan! Lets all have a
Haha! you're about as satanic as Barney the Purple Dinosaur!
Hey.. why not curse me??
Go on.. let's see how 'powerful' you are! ;-)
Ya Fuckin' dork.
--
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Norman O'Brien aka Nobby on iRc
dan...@enterprise.net
http://homepages.enterprise.net/danzig/
ICQ 13759190
jim.mo...@montego.com
In article <6lqsk5$ma1$1...@newsd-163.iap.bryant.webtv.net>,
ahr...@webtv.net (Jason Fifer) wrote:
>
> Lucifer, was Venus the Roman god: the bearer of light in mythology way
> before the Jews & later in Christianity. The names are not similiar &
> I'm not confused. They are the same. I hate to break it to ya man but
> there was no Christians when people came up with the Pagan god Satan,
> there was duality of Baal who later became Bohemoth & Belzebub later
> every seven years who was the symbol of fertility who battled Mot the
> god of famine.
<snip>
>
Yes and no. The "morning star" mentioned in Jewish texts (such as the
infamous Isaiah passage of, "How you have fallen, O morning star!") is indeed
similar to Venus, but the light-bearer god is not Venus, but Prometheus.
Furthermore, the Biblical reference makes it clear that it is a human being
Isaiah is referring to, and not a spiritual Satan, which came years later.
Also, there were no Christians who came up with 'Satan' but there were Jews,
and the 'satan' was one of their words, which meant advesary. But the whole
"arch-enemy of God" stuff came much later, when the Christians (who believed
in God's complete goodness) needed someone/something to pin the blame on.
Also, Baal has little to do with Beelzebub, etc.. except for the name, which
the Jews demonized in order to justify their monotheism. And as far as I
know, Behomoth has little to do with Baal; he was derived from a similar
large monster in Caananite mythology.
IronHorse Birmingham
You make many foolish assumptions dear boy
....and you know twat all about this subject
Jason Fifer wrote in message
<6lqsk5$ma1$1...@newsd-163.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...
Lucifer, was Venus the Roman god: the bearer of light in mythology way
before the Jews & later in Christianity. The names are not similiar &
I'm not confused. They are the same. I hate to break it to ya man but
there was no Christians when people came up with the Pagan god Satan,
there was duality of Baal who later became Bohemoth & Belzebub later
every seven years who was the symbol of fertility who battled Mot the
god of famine. Pagans don't worship gods they become the god by saying
the name while using the Magik. My spells work for me just fine & I know
enough by getting my hands on some very interesting books educating
myself in the occult. One of the Rules of the Earth in Satanism is only
kill animals for food & I don't eat gerbils. You lack perception on
Satanist so you can't be that close to them. You don't know me & I'm a
Satanist. My spells work just fine. 666% Hail SaTan! Lets all have a
IronHorse Birmingham
If you are a satanist, my boy,then squirrels have ten inch cocks !
GRKelly
Bill Montbleau wrote in message <6lptn3$2le$8...@bigboote.WPI.EDU>...
>: Actually, a friend of mine directed me to a Spinal Tap page a long
while back
>: which had information about how an actual Sabbath stage decoration (I
don't
>: remember when this was, but I am pretty sure it was post-Ozzy) of
Stonehenge
>: was what prompted that scene in "This is Spinal Tap."
>:
>: Anyone know anything about this?
>
>It's the stage set for the "Born Again" tour. You can see a picture of
it
>in the Castle remastered "Born Again" CD. the rear of the stage had 3
>huge Stonehenge looking pieces. And they were huge- they looked almost
>twice the size of actual Stonehenge pillars.
>
>So I guess Spinal Tap decided to parody that and end up with stonehenge
>pieces that were too _small_.
Ackshuleeeee, I think those scenes were already filmed before the "Born
Again" tour. Feel free to set me straight.
Gaz (_*_) blac...@hotmail.com
http://www.geocities.com/WestHollywood/Village/1408
S. Davies-Morris
Would somebody make sure this lad gets his Prozac on a regular
basis? It's time for him to permanently go into the kill filter IMO...
By By Jason...have a nice long nap...come back to ambs when you
have something other than gibberish to discuss...
--
Regards
Steven Davies-Morris sda...@mcione.com
=======================================================
Jonathan Cornick
In article <41eg1.853$i35.838684@pm01nn>, "S. Davies-Morris"
<sda...@mcione.com> wrote:
> Would somebody make sure this lad gets his Prozac on a regular
> basis? It's time for him to permanently go into the kill filter IMO...
>
> By By Jason...have a nice long nap...come back to ambs when you
> have something other than gibberish to discuss...
Hypothetically, if we suppose that magic/magick/majick actually works, then
presumably spells should be performed with a very precise and
skilful use of language to avoid terrible mistakes. I'm kind of worried that
Jason is going to turn himself into a frog.
Jonathan
'
>I can tell you for a fact
>
>not only have "Black Widow" never played Stonehenge, but NO band has ever
>played Stonehenge
>
>Stonehenge is owned by "National Heritage"...it is not freely accessed by
>ANYONE !
>
>Can we now finally cut the crap about Stonhenge ?
>
>
>If you guys want to discover Satanism...stop toying with fire and go read
>the Satanic commandments. Then either decide to join up with others or get
>on with your life......
>
>
>STONEHENGE IS NOT AN EVIL PLACE, NOR WAS IT EVER AN EVIL PLACE
Geez I don't think anybody is suggesting that at all. Its just an
interesting piece of history is all, stonehenge is just some piled up
rocks it has no meaning whatsoever. Those who made it might have
ascribed some meaning to it but today it is just a monument to ancient
mans abilities. The making of stonehenge is much more interesting then
whatever bizarro religions have laid claim to it.
I really doubt that any rationally thinking Sabbath fan believes in
evil anyway, thats not a real concept, its just fear in disguise. Who
actually thinks that certain things are actually "evil"??
'
On Fri, 12 Jun 1998 03:38:34 -0700, ahr...@webtv.net (Jason Fifer)
wrote:
Wasn't that Marylin Manson? hehehehe
This is such a rediculous thread.
moonflower
S. Davies-Morris wrote:
>
> Would somebody make sure this lad gets his Prozac on a regular
> basis? It's time for him to permanently go into the kill filter IMO...
>
> By By Jason...have a nice long nap...come back to ambs when you
> have something other than gibberish to discuss...
Sorry Steven I disagree. Jason comes soemtimes with very interesting
topics. The one you quoted is a good example of this. Maybe he should
send it to alt.satanism or alt.archaeology (very good group), but still
very valid to read, anywhere.
Medusa
> =======================================================
>
> Jason Fifer wrote in message
> <6lqsk5$ma1$1...@newsd-163.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...
> Lucifer, was Venus the Roman god: the bearer of light in mythology way
> before the Jews & later in Christianity. The names are not similiar &
> I'm not confused. They are the same. I hate to break it to ya man but
> there was no Christians when people came up with the Pagan god Satan,
> there was duality of Baal who later became Bohemoth & Belzebub later
> every seven years who was the symbol of fertility who battled Mot the
> god of famine. Pagans don't worship gods they become the god by saying
> the name while using the Magik. My spells work for me just fine & I know
> enough by getting my hands on some very interesting books educating
> myself in the occult. One of the Rules of the Earth in Satanism is only
> kill animals for food & I don't eat gerbils. You lack perception on
> Satanist so you can't be that close to them. You don't know me & I'm a
> Satanist. My spells work just fine. 666% Hail SaTan! Lets all have a
> Black Sabbath & curse Cardinal O'Conner & his buddy Jef Fenholt.
--
ÐÏ à¡± á
Jason Fifer
I don't even know you & you seem to love Black Sabbath & Ozzy so why
would I waste my time on you? There is many other people who try to ban
& censor Ozzy! I don't even know you.
"I like Loud, I Like iT MeaN I GoT tHe ThunDer in my machine!"
MMyers666X
>Who<BR>
>actually thinks that certain things are actually "evil"??
Do you have a better word for Rape,murder,torture,etc? Ive read many books on
victims giving their accounts of rtiualistic abuse,torture and things that
couldent be described with a better word than evil. Read Satans underground,a
great book written by a victim of ritualistic sexual child abuse,mental abuse
and physical abuse.
"The World Is Full Of Kings And Queens,Who Blind Your Eyes Then Steal Your
Dreams,It's Heaven And Hell!"
jim.mo...@montego.com
In article <358177e5....@news.earthlink.net>,
= wrote:
<snip>
> >
> >
> >STONEHENGE IS NOT AN EVIL PLACE, NOR WAS IT EVER AN EVIL PLACE
*sigh!* Now I can't get that goofy Spinal Tap song out of my head. ;)
> Geez I don't think anybody is suggesting that at all. Its just an
> interesting piece of history is all, stonehenge is just some piled up
> rocks it has no meaning whatsoever. Those who made it might have
> ascribed some meaning to it but today it is just a monument to ancient
> mans abilities. The making of stonehenge is much more interesting then
> whatever bizarro religions have laid claim to it.
>
> I really doubt that any rationally thinking Sabbath fan believes in
> evil anyway, thats not a real concept, its just fear in disguise. Who
> actually thinks that certain things are actually "evil"??
Of course certain things are evil. Murdering anything without good cause
(self defense, some forms of revenge, etc..) is evil, as an example. Sabbath
believed in evil. Look at "Wicked World." They're not taking a neutral
stance on these issues, nor are they saying that they're just "OK." They're
calling a spade a spade - it's wicked.
Jason Fifer
All that is Mike, is Christian Propaganda to give Satanism a bad name.
Charles Manson said he was Jesus dose that make him a Christian? They
call him a Satanist though. Those people do not follow the Rules of the
Earth & Evil is just what you don't like. They are not true Satanist.
The people who do call Manson a Satanist are the same people who make
Rock N Roll or Heavy Metal the scapegoat like Satan and try to
censor,ban & buy concert tickets so fans can't go.
Vladimir Milovidov
Greetings, Jason Fifer!
On Fri, 12 Jun 1998 02:32:53 -0700, ahr...@webtv.net (Jason Fifer) wrote:
> Lucifer, was Venus the Roman god: the bearer of light in mythology way
Venus (Roman) is same as Aphrodite (Greek) - goddess, not god. Goddess of love
and beauty. Where you're taking your knowledges, Jason??? Looks like you can't
really trust them... For your safety, you'd better worship Morgoth. :-)))
Vlad, webmaster of Lucifer's Friend and other John Lawton-related pages, which
hasn't any satanic relations BTW.
O-) O---------------------------------O
Cheers, | Russian Uriah Heep | The Official John Lawton page: |
Vladimir. | maniacs' headquater: V http://www.aha.ru/~uheep/lawton |
<uh...@aha.ru>| http://www.aha.ru/~uheep V
--------------O \- rock links in russian, Nazareth...
... Can't we try let the past go by
With it's lessons firmly settled in our minds... (c) UH, 1975.
moonflower
Vladimir Milovidov wrote:
>
> Greetings, Jason Fifer!
>
> On Fri, 12 Jun 1998 02:32:53 -0700, ahr...@webtv.net (Jason Fifer) wrote:
>
> > Lucifer, was Venus the Roman god: the bearer of light in mythology way
>
> Venus (Roman) is same as Aphrodite (Greek) - goddess, not god. Goddess of love
> and beauty. Where you're taking your knowledges, Jason??? Looks like you can't
> really trust them... For your safety, you'd better worship Morgoth. :-)))
Vladimir, I know that Aphrodite and Venus are the same Goddess. However,
I think I read somewhere that it is possible that there was a time Venus
wasn't regarded as a female deity, but as the male god of destruction
and misery, resposible of a catastrophy of global proportions, taken
place long before the Sumerian Flood around 4000 BC Others are sure if
was a global thing, that happened around 9000 BC, and took care of for
example the disappearance of Atlantis. Venus would have been a comet in
that time, before she became a planet, and was known in that time as the
Lightbringer, Lucifer - of course the name was different. I don't know
for sure, but there are maybe some Sumerian claytablets where such a
thing is mentioned. Well a comet that bombs our planet could in later
times easily be seen as The Devil.
This doesn't mean I think something like Satan or The Devil exists, or
even god.
There is also a theory which suggests that the planet Lucifer exploded
and became the asteroïds circle between Mars and Jupiter.
Well, I have to examine this Venus = Lucifer thing thoroughly before I
can confirm or deny it.
Medusa
Jason Fifer
I have many sources of Satanism. One of my best is a 1962 book called
Satan's Disciples; A modern history of Satanism and Wichcraft from the
Middle Ages to present day by Robert Goldston.It has a very impressive
Bibliography of sources. Check your local library for it & curse Jef
Fenholt with Satan Magik. It will set you free. Rock & Rebel! Hail SaTan
666%
"Evil Power hanging over you.."
IronHorse
Jason
Ok my friend...you worship Satan. Free world. However this site is about a
band called Black Sabbath. Do ytou really have to hijack every mail with
your own vested childishness and act like you have a brain the size of a
Weasel's wedding tackle ?
Come on and lets talk about Sabbath together......the very topic we can
agree to enjoy eh ?
Michael (Ironhorse) Hughes
Birmingham, England
Jason Fifer wrote in message
<6lr0fa$md2$1...@newsd-163.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...
IronHorse
I disagree...music can inspire evil......
every time I here those mono-syllabic kretins in lycra known as the Spice
Girls I want to rush out and shove the point of a garden gnomes hat up their
producers rectum !
Am I possessed ?
Michael (Ironhorse) Hughes
Birmingham, England
''' wrote in message <358177e5....@news.earthlink.net>...
>On Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:55:01 GMT, "Michael Hughes"
><iron...@lineone.net> wrote:
>
>>I can tell you for a fact
>>
>>not only have "Black Widow" never played Stonehenge, but NO band has ever
>>played Stonehenge
>>
>>Stonehenge is owned by "National Heritage"...it is not freely accessed by
>>ANYONE !
>>
>>Can we now finally cut the crap about Stonhenge ?
>>
>>
>>If you guys want to discover Satanism...stop toying with fire and go read
>>the Satanic commandments. Then either decide to join up with others or get
>>on with your life......
>>
>>
>>STONEHENGE IS NOT AN EVIL PLACE, NOR WAS IT EVER AN EVIL PLACE
>
IronHorse
"Just as
no matter what heinous acts have been committed at Stonehenge its not
more evil then Berlin is.
"
...WHAT EVIL ACTS.?..christ almighty you people make up stories then argue
over them .....STONEHENGE IS A PLACE OF PAGAN WORSHIP NOT EVIL
....I need a drink....some of you lot do my head in !
Michael (Ironhorse) Hughes
Birmingham, England
''' wrote in message <3586f7c9....@news.earthlink.net>...
>On Tue, 16 Jun 1998 21:30:01 GMT, jim.mo...@montego.com wrote:
>
>>In article <35869efa....@news.earthlink.net>,
>> = wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Evil and wrong are not the same in my book. There is no such thing as
>>> "good" or "evil" its all how humans look at it. But there is no force
>>> in this universe which is "evil" and acts on people.
>>>
>>
>>I don't think that evil is force which acts on people. Evil is deeds that
>>are evil.
>>
>>Murdering someone in cold blood for no reason except for the thrill is
evil.
>>Our society deems drug abuse to be "wrong," but I do not think it is evil.
>>Wrong and evil are different things, of course, but I still believe there
are
>>certain things which are inheriently evil. I don't mean that there are
>>demons tempting people to sin or whatnot, just that there are some acts
for
>>which there is no justification.
>
>OK, I'll agree to that, evil deeds and evil doins are one thing. But
>evil places and things, I don't believe in that. A gun isn't evil, but
>a cold blooded killer who uses one is. Doesn't change the gun. Just as
>no matter what heinous acts have been committed at Stonehenge its not
>more evil then Berlin is.
>
IronHorse
Satanists do NOT agree with child abuse...read their commandments !
Michael (Ironhorse) Hughes
Birmingham, England
MMyers666X wrote in message
<199806130341...@ladder03.news.aol.com>...
>>Who<BR>
>>actually thinks that certain things are actually "evil"??
>
>
>
REPD
"IronHorse" <iron...@lineone.net> wrote:
>I disagree...music can inspire evil......
>
>
>every time I here those mono-syllabic kretins in lycra known as the Spice
>Girls I want to rush out and shove the point of a garden gnomes hat up their
>producers rectum !
>
>
>Am I possessed ?
No - I often feel the same way meself. Mind you, I'd rather ram
something else up Posh Spice's rectum :) (sorry)
REPD
--
Robert Edward Peter Dunford
http://www.repd.demon.co.uk/index.html
WIMBLEDON FC BELONG IN MERTON
Jason Fifer
SATANIST ARE PAGANS & EVIL IS JUST WHAT YOU DON'T LIKE! What did Alex
Saunders do at Stonhenge Satanic PAGAN Magik! What did Ozzy want in his
BACKYARD? A Black Cathedral or Chapel complete with a Magik Cirle! What
did he do? Tear up the Holy Bible Chop of all the doors to his
house,dragged Thelma buy the hair & built a Satanic Alter, went fukin
nuts and drove his car in cirlces on his front yard and there is not a
slight chance that the man has never used Tarrot Cards or a Ouja Board?
HMMMM? The fith member is not Dio. Can you guess who it is? Think Denis
Wheatly & your getting LOL (fun pun) warmer. AGH HA! Prince John Rules!
OzzM...@webtv.net
jim.mo...@montego.com wrote:
.."And Ozzy admitted to using tarot cards himself. In the liner notes
to Ozzman Cometh he says that there was a pack of Crowley- designed
tarot cards lying around the recording studio that prompted him to write
the classic "Mr. Crowley".
Interesting.. indeed, if you watch the Big Screen during "Mr.Crowley"
you will view many candid scenes including Aleister moving around as if
in a trance or possessed in a flaming pentagram, rapidly moving images
involving symbols which were inherently meaningful to Mr. Crowley, and
flashes of artistic imagery from the Thoth deck (particularly the Wands,
or Fire Suit...)
~Suzanne : >}~
\\\\Shades of Damiana\\\\
Jason Fifer
I have that Crowley Deck of Cards. I read peoples fortunes all the time.
They nail the situation all the God damn time. The paintings of these
would be fantastic.
jim.mo...@montego.com
In article <DTUh1.146$be3.4...@news-reader.bt.net>,
"IronHorse" <iron...@lineone.net> wrote:
>
> Satanists do NOT agree with child abuse...read their commandments !
Atheistic religious Satanists of the Church of Satan don't believe in child
abuse; but there are lone religious wackos who literally worship an evil
spirit known as Satan and who do do this. It isn't nearly as widespread as
some religious tracts will tell you, but it has happened.
> Michael (Ironhorse) Hughes
> Birmingham, England
>
IronHorse Birmingham
Jimmy boy....the myth is distorted...Druids are an ancient monastic cult and
have NO bearing on evil whatsoever.
If what you say happened, really did happen, then youve got the wrong end of
the stick. The druids are a peaceful lot and Sabbath (if they in fact did
blow out their candles) would have been mocking
good not evil !
Michael(Ironhorse)Hughes
Birmingham, England
jim.mo...@montego.com wrote in message
<6lpq17$379$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>In article <6lp42s$se7$1...@nntp.teliafi.net>,
> "$eb" <sani...@nettilinja.fi> wrote:
>>
>>
>> This Stonehenge story got my attention and I wanted to add some more of
it.I
>> remember that Ozzy once told a story about some weird hooded men(druids?)
>> who were hanging out of some concert in the seventies.They surrounded
Ozzy
>> and co. with candles in their hands and guess what happened?Black Sabbath
>> members started to sing Happy Birthday to these "druids" and then they
blew
>> their candles out and told them to get the hell out of there! When I
heard
>> about this story I just couldn`t do but laugh.So much for the satanic
image.
>> The Really funny thing is that this satanic image is still haunting
>> them.Some of The Finnish religious groups are afraid of that some kids
might
>> try to burn some churches after Black Sabbath and some other bands have
>> played their sets here in Finland(next sunday).
>> So if this happens I will tell you more in next week.
>>
>> I also remember that there was this satanic band(true satanic band)
called
>> Black Widow who had a song called:"Come To The Sabbath-Satan`s There".And
>> this band really played one gig in Stonehenge(damn,this is like Spinal
Tap!)
>> many years ago.If anyone has more info about this band,please tell us
more.
>
>Actually, a friend of mine directed me to a Spinal Tap page a long while
back
>which had information about how an actual Sabbath stage decoration (I don't
>remember when this was, but I am pretty sure it was post-Ozzy) of
Stonehenge
>was what prompted that scene in "This is Spinal Tap."
>
>Anyone know anything about this?
>
>There's a Black Widow page at http://hem2.passagen.se/blkwidow/ which gives
a
>brief history of the band and some of the lyrics and cover art for their
>albums.
>
><snip>
OzzM...@webtv.net
OK, sorry to any who may feel inconvienced in an off-topic kinda way
(wuuut????) but Anyway (dammit, I fuckin' forgot what i was gonna
say...!) the Crowley deck is Beautiful and it holds back Nothing!!!!!
Kisses,
~Suzanne
Jason Fifer
The Celtic God of Hell who the Satanist invokes in the infernal names is
Bile. There is no White Magik it's all for selfish reasons. Evil like I
said is just what you don't like. The crosses are only for their
protection. Stan's Disciples teaches us Always keep a cross & bible
handy: It's the sorcerer's life preserver. I guess they would have to
make due with just a cross though since Ozzy used to tear up the holy
bible in all his hotel rooms. Ozzy Rules! Hail SaTan 666% lets all have
a Black Sabbath & curse Glen Hughs for sucking so bad on Seventh Star!
Not mutch better than Jef Fenholt!
'
On Wed, 17 Jun 1998 19:38:30 GMT, "IronHorse" <iron...@lineone.net>
wrote:
>"Just as
>no matter what heinous acts have been committed at Stonehenge its not
>more evil then Berlin is.
>"
>...WHAT EVIL ACTS.?..christ almighty you people make up stories then argue
>over them .....STONEHENGE IS A PLACE OF PAGAN WORSHIP NOT EVIL
>
>....I need a drink....some of you lot do my head in !
I simply said "no matter what heinous acts" in a theoretical sense. I
don't know shit about Stonehenge and am not claiming any stories of
anything committed at Stonehenge. Its just a monument to me. But I bet
you people have been murdered there at many times in history,
religious or not. Just like any other place on earth.
You are taking this defending Stonehenge and Pagans thing way too
seriously IMHO. I was simply describing my view of evil and exactly
WHY stonehenge couldn't BE evil.
IronHorse
Atheistic religious Satanists
a contradiction in terms ?...atheistic means " without a deity"...but Satan
is a deity
God and Satan go hand in hand...to believe in one you have to believe in the
other.
Its called crap !(whichever way you look at it)
Satanists of the Church of Satan don't believe in child
>abuse; but there are lone religious wackos who literally worship an evil
>spirit known as Satan and who do do this
Not in my country they dont....but I also happen to know that youre right,
so I cant argue
Michael(Ironhorse)Hughes
Birmingham, England
jim.mo...@montego.com wrote in message
<6m9s3d$cug$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>In article <DTUh1.146$be3.4...@news-reader.bt.net>,
> "IronHorse" <iron...@lineone.net> wrote:
>>
>> Satanists do NOT agree with child abuse...read their commandments !
>
>Atheistic religious Satanists of the Church of Satan don't believe in child
>abuse; but there are lone religious wackos who literally worship an evil
>spirit known as Satan and who do do this. It isn't nearly as widespread as
>some religious tracts will tell you, but it has happened.
>
>> Michael (Ironhorse) Hughes
>> Birmingham, England
>>
>
>
IronHorse
Ive played with Tarots cards...but I still cant make a rocket of of 'em...am
I a satanist ?
*yawns loudly *
jim.mo...@montego.com wrote in message
<6m9u5f$g6n$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
>In article <6m9agp$anr$1...@newsd-164.iap.bryant.webtv.net>,
>Satanists who attend the church of Satan are typically atheists. Satanists
>who literally worship the Satan of Christianity are Christian heretics, not
>Pagans.
>
>And Ozzy has admitted to using tarot cards himself. In the liner notes to
>Ozzman Cometh he says that there was a pack of Crowley-designed tarot cards
>lying around the recording studio that prompted him to write the classic
"Mr.
>Crowley."
>
jim.mo...@montego.com
In article <JZhi1.185$Ng4.5...@news-reader.bt.net>,
"IronHorse" <iron...@lineone.net> wrote:
>
> Atheistic religious Satanists
>
> a contradiction in terms ?...atheistic means " without a deity"...but Satan
> is a deity
>
> God and Satan go hand in hand...to believe in one you have to believe in the
> other.
>
> Its called crap !(whichever way you look at it)
I'm not disagreeing with that, but there are atheistic Satanists who regard
Satan as a sort of "icon" for human liberty. In fact, there is probably
quite a bit of information about them on the internet. They don't see Satan
as a real entity, but as a symbol, of sorts. Some of them perform rituals
but they don't believe they'll do anything - they merely wish to express some
form of spiritualism without actually believing in a God or deity.
I suppose it's no different from certain pagans who see the gods and
goddesses as symbols or archetypes of certain things without literally
believing in their existence.
Jason Fifer
Satanist are not actually atheist though they just see god for what it
is:a reason not to beleive in Magik. as a balance factor thought by man
& the of knowledge of what one is capable of doing through Magik which
is the ability to change a situation with ones own will. It's a popular
mistake but still a mistake.
GRKelly
IronHorse wrote in message ...
>I disagree...music can inspire evil......
>
>every time I here those mono-syllabic kretins in lycra known as the
Spice
>Girls I want to rush out and shove the point of a garden gnomes hat up
their
>producers rectum !
"2 Become 1" & "Say You'll Be There" sounded OK actually. If the Girls
hadn't been singing all that together-forever bumf on top, I'd probably
have liked them. But then if your Auntie had been your Uncle she'd
probably have a pair of bollocks.
Gaz (_*_) blac...@hotmail.com
http://www.geocities.com/WestHollywood/Village/1408
GRKelly
IronHorse wrote in message ...
>Satanists do NOT agree with child abuse...read their commandments !
Why is it that the press never refer to the crimes of people like Father
Brendan Smyth (who had been molesting children for some 50 years) as
"Catholic child abuse"?
Jason Fifer
Michael Hughes aka Ironhorse,
You said Satanism is nothing like Hindu? I found this amusing to say
the Least When after all Kali & Shiva are bolth Hindu & in the Infernal
Names of the Satanic Bible.
"I don't really give a damn you take me just the way I am! Only I have
the answers!"
jim.mo...@montego.com
In article <6ml5l1$pos$1...@newsd-164.iap.bryant.webtv.net>,
ahr...@webtv.net (Jason Fifer) wrote:
>
> Michael Hughes aka Ironhorse,
> You said Satanism is nothing like Hindu? I found this amusing to say
> the Least When after all Kali & Shiva are bolth Hindu & in the Infernal
> Names of the Satanic Bible.
So what? I could make a list of "Infernal Names" and put all sorts of names
down, but that doesn't mean that those gods have anything to do with my
religion. All it means is that I spent some time, looked up the names of
some gods and goddesses from mythology, and put them into my list to make it
look more credible.
> "I don't really give a damn you take me just the way I am! Only I have
> the answers!"
>
Jason Fifer
I think it is more credible that Satanism has elements of Hindu Magik.
These words from Mythology work for me. It is good to indulge in such
pride. Hail SaTan 666% Ozzy Rocks! Lets All curse Cardinal O'Conner &
Tipper Gore!
"Writhing & Screaming the pain just won't go he'l show No Mercy!"