Dull Snare
--SS
mic everything and tune my snare drum to a "crisp" crack. (For any drummers
out there, I am using Ambassador heads). The toms as well as the bass drum
are fine. I am using compression on the snare and bass drum as well as
reverb (plate algorithm - somewhat following the guidelines in MD's
"Drummers Studio Survival Guide"). I am also using a Shure SM-57 for the
snare. I am thinking of doubling the snare with a digital delay (approx..
20ms) send the orig and delay signals to opposing channels. If anyone else
has any suggestion, I would appreciate the input so I don't have to
re-invent the wheel.
Regards,
--SS
Chris Gieseke
You could be getting some phase cancellation as well that is causing the
problem. Moving the snare mic around should reveal that problem though.
The SM-57 is a decent snare mic. I've gotten plenty of bright snappy
recordings with a SM-57 on snare. Have you experimented with different
mic positions. When drum micing, positioning the mic to where it sounds
good is very important. Just crank some close-ear headphones up and
move the mic, or have someone else move the mic while you monitor the
sound in another room. Just reading the recommended position in a
manual won't usually cut it, or it may not give you the best sound.
Alot of times though when you set up mics you get lucky and it doesn't
need to be moved much. But I think if you really experiment with the
snare mic's position, you should be able to get a fairly snappy snare.
Also be careful with the compression. Don't squash the hell out of it.
If you sqash it too much it will indeed sound dull with no snap to it
at all. You might want to back of the attack setting on that compressor
so that the attack comes through. If you are working with digital
though, and you're getting some peaks that cross the 0 db mark that
might not be an option though you could just lower the recording level
of the whole drum mix and then boost it during mixdown.
Oh and of coarse, you can always just eq the snare track so it's a
little snappier. Just get the best mic position you can get and try to
eq it into submission.
Finally, if all else fails...try another mic...maybe some kind of small
diaphram condenser mic. Play around with your overhead mic's position
as well.
Good luck!
Chris G.
Mark McQuilken
>
> I am not able to get a crisp sound out of my snare drum while recording. I
> mic everything and tune my snare drum to a "crisp" crack. (For any drummers
> out there, I am using Ambassador heads). The toms as well as the bass drum
> are fine. I am using compression on the snare and bass drum as well as
> reverb (plate algorithm - somewhat following the guidelines in MD's
> "Drummers Studio Survival Guide"). I am also using a Shure SM-57 for the
> snare. I am thinking of doubling the snare with a digital delay (approx..
> 20ms) send the orig and delay signals to opposing channels. If anyone else
> has any suggestion, I would appreciate the input so I don't have to
> re-invent the wheel.
>
> Regards,
> --SS
SS:
Don't compress the snare (or any other effect) until you've got the tone
you're after. Move the '57 so that it's pointing at the rim, not the
skin. Get the sound happening before applying band-aids...
McQ
--
Mark McQuilken
FMR Audio
http://www.fmraudio.com
(800) 343-9976 (US only)
(512) 280-6557 VC
(512) 280-8627 FAX
Chris Rossi
--SS wrote:
>
> I am not able to get a crisp sound out of my snare drum while recording. I
> mic everything and tune my snare drum to a "crisp" crack. (For any drummers
> out there, I am using Ambassador heads). The toms as well as the bass drum
> are fine. I am using compression on the snare and bass drum as well as
> reverb
>
Just as a lark, have you tried listening to it without compression and
reverb? Your compressor may be biting off the attack of the drum, the
source of that "crisp crack." Or not. If you find that it is, just try
backing off the attack on your compressor. There's also a possibility
that the reverb is washing it out a little bit, in which case try a
predelay.
I'm assuming it sounds the way you want it to in real life and the
problem is just getting it to tape? Also if you have some other mics
you might give a small condenser, like the CM-700, a shot, although you
may need a pad.
chris rossi
Fred Hamrick
> mic everything and tune my snare drum to a "crisp" crack. (For any drummers
> out there, I am using Ambassador heads). The toms as well as the bass drum
> are fine. I am using compression on the snare and bass drum as well as
> "Drummers Studio Survival Guide"). I am also using a Shure SM-57 for the
> snare. I am thinking of doubling the snare with a digital delay (approx..
> 20ms) send the orig and delay signals to opposing channels. If anyone else
> has any suggestion, I would appreciate the input so I don't have to
> re-invent the wheel.
>
> Regards,
> --SS
>
>
>
below the snare facing the snare wires. This will give you the crisp-
ness that comes from the wires. Balance this new found crispness with
the smack found from the top head at your mixer. You may have to
switch the phase of the bottom mic. Whitchever position that yields
more depth is correct. Use compression to compensate for the players
dynamics will recording. Heavier compression at mixdown to taste.
W.B.
>
> I am not able to get a crisp sound out of my snare drum while recording. I
> mic everything and tune my snare drum to a "crisp" crack. (For any drummers
> out there, I am using Ambassador heads). The toms as well as the bass drum
> are fine. I am using compression on the snare and bass drum as well as
> reverb (plate algorithm - somewhat following the guidelines in MD's
> "Drummers Studio Survival Guide"). I am also using a Shure SM-57 for the
> snare. I am thinking of doubling the snare with a digital delay (approx..
> 20ms) send the orig and delay signals to opposing channels. If anyone else
> has any suggestion, I would appreciate the input so I don't have to
> re-invent the wheel.
>
> Regards,
> --SS
Are you micing botht the top and bottom of the snare? also, how far
are the mics away? The SM57 should work well in micing a snare. I have
found that if you don't mic both the top and pottom of the snare, you
get a dull lifeless sound unless you have unusually tight bright heads.
Also, is your snare wood frame or metal? That makes a huge difference.
Ok, expirement with not only the distance from the snare, but the angle
of the mic. As you angle the SM57, the frequency curve will change. By
this I mean if you send a sound straight at the mic, it will sound
different then the same sound comming at it from a 45 deg angle. If you
mic too close with too much compression, you will loose dynamic range
and that crispness due to the overloading of the mic's mechanics. This
is very a very common problem when recording loud percussive sounds. The
sound pressure level overwhelms the mic. But, if you move too far away,
you will tend to pick up a lot more of the other pieces in the drum set
then you might want to. This is especially a problem if you want to put
the snare on it's own track since many times one likes to add reverb and
delay to only the snare while leaving the tomtoms and especially the
bass drum relatively dry in comparison.
Anyway, give this a try..
Bill B.
Yoshka1
Just as an experiment record your snare without compression and listen to the
results. You might be suprised to find your missing attack. Using 2 mics will
add more sizzle to your snare but the 57 alone should not sound dull if
recorded properly. As a starting point for compressor settings try an attack
of 10ms, a release of 200ms, a ratio of 5:1 and a threshold of -10. As your
attack time approaches 0 you will hear the snare getting noticably duller. The
trick is to set the attack just low enough to squash the drum while still
letting enough of the initial crack through. Also don't set the threshold too
low. If you are getting more than 6-8db gain reduction you're probably
overcompressing. Try going with less reverb as this also tends to muddy up the
sound.
Joe(Yos...@aol.com)
"Most people wouldn't know music if it bit them on the ass"
-Frank Zappa-
SK8zxvm
"the massacre" for the first time the other day and they vocals had the living
shit compressed out of them and it really took away from the effect. when
wattie talked, sang, and yelled, it all sounded the same, no dunamic range. so
there is a moral to be learned here: dont compress the living hell out of your
vocals, snare drum, or anything else for that matter
-eric
EMAIL AT CHEAPSKAT...@YAHOO.COM
>cheapo recording for cheapo bands<
http://hometown.aol.com/sk8zxvm/cheapskate.html