The Oscars
CineStudy
* Javier Bardem in "Before Night Falls" (Fine Line)
* Russell Crowe in "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
* Tom Hanks in "Cast Away" (20th Century Fox and DreamWorks)
* Ed Harris in "Pollock" (Sony Pictures Classics)
* Geoffrey Rush in "Quills" (Fox Searchlight)
Performance by an actor in a supporting role
* Jeff Bridges in "The Contender" (DreamWorks and
Cinerenta/Cinecontender)
* Willem Dafoe in "Shadow of the Vampire" (Lions Gate)
* Benicio Del Toro in "Traffic" (USA Films)
* Albert Finney in "Erin Brockovich" (Universal and Columbia)
* Joaquin Phoenix in "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
Performance by an actress in a leading role
* Joan Allen in "The Contender" (DreamWorks and Cinerenta/Cinecontender)
* Juliette Binoche in "Chocolat" (Miramax)
* Ellen Burstyn in "Requiem for a Dream" (Artisan)
* Laura Linney in "You Can Count On Me" (Paramount Classics/Shooting
Gallery/Hart Sharp Entertainment in association with Cappa Productions)
* Julia Roberts in "Erin Brockovich" (Universal and Columbia)
Performance by an actress in a supporting role
* Judi Dench in "Chocolat" (Miramax)
* Marcia Gay Harden in "Pollock" (Sony Pictures Classics)
* Kate Hudson in "Almost Famous" (DreamWorks and Columbia)
* Frances McDormand in "Almost Famous" (DreamWorks and Columbia)
* Julie Walters in "Billy Elliot" (Universal Focus)
Achievement in art direction
* "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" (Sony Pictures Classics)
Art Direction: Tim Yip
* "Dr. Seuss' How the Grinch Stole Christmas" (Universal)
Art Direction: Michael Corenblith
Set Decoration: Merideth Boswell
* "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
Art Direction: Arthur Max
Set Decoration: Crispian Sallis
* "Quills" (Fox Searchlight)
Art Direction: Martin Childs
Set Decoration: Jill Quertier
* "Vatel" (Miramax)
Art Direction: Jean Rabasse
Set Decoration: Fran‡oise Benoit-Fresco
Achievement in cinematography
* "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" (Sony Pictures Classics)
Peter Pau
* "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
John Mathieson
* "Malèna" (Miramax)
Lajos Koltai
* "O Brother, Where Art Thou?" (Buena Vista)
Roger Deakins
* "The Patriot" (Sony Pictures Releasing)
Caleb Deschanel
Achievement in costume design
* "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" (Sony Pictures Classics)
Tim Yip
* "Dr. Seuss' How the Grinch Stole Christmas" (Universal)
Rita Ryack
* "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
Janty Yates
* "102 Dalmatians" (Buena Vista)
Anthony Powell
* "Quills" (Fox Searchlight)
Jacqueline West
Achievement in directing
* "Billy Elliot" (Universal Focus)
Stephen Daldry
* "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" (Sony Pictures Classics)
Ang Lee
* "Erin Brockovich" (Universal and Columbia)
Steven Soderbergh
* "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
Ridley Scott
* "Traffic" (USA Films)
Steven Soderbergh
Best documentary feature
* "Into the Arms of Strangers: Stories of the Kindertransport" (Warner
Bros.)
A Sabine Films Production
Mark Jonathan Harris and Deborah Oppenheimer
* "Legacy"
A Nomadic Pictures Production
Tod S. Lending
* "Long Night's Journey Into Day" (Seventh Art)
An Iris Films Production
Frances Reid and Deborah Hoffmann
* "Scottsboro: An American Tragedy"
A Social Media Production
Barak Goodman and Daniel Anker
* "Sound and Fury" (Artistic License Films)
A Production of Aronson Film Associates and Public Policy Productions
Josh Aronson and Roger Weisberg
Best documentary short subject
* "Big Mama"
A Birthmark Production
Tracy Seretean
* "Curtain Call"
An NJN/White Whale Production
Chuck Braverman and Steve Kalafer
* "Dolphins"
A MacGillivray Freeman Films Production
Greg MacGillivray and Alec Lorimore
* "The Man on Lincoln's Nose"
An Adama Films Production
Daniel Raim
* "On Tiptoe: Gentle Steps to Freedom"
An On Tip Toe Production
Eric Simonson and Leelai Demoz
Achievement in film editing
* "Almost Famous" (DreamWorks and Columbia)
Joe Hutshing and Saar Klein
* "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" (Sony Pictures Classics)
Tim Squyres
* "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
Pietro Scalia
* "Traffic" (USA Films)
Stephen Mirrione
* "Wonder Boys" (Paramount and Mutual Film Company)
Dede Allen
Best foreign language film of the year
* "Amores Perros"
An AltaVista Films Production
Mexico
* "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon"
A Zoom Hunt International Production
Taiwan
* "Divided We Fall"
A Total Helpart T.H.A./Czech Television Production
Czech Republic
* "Everybody Famous"
An Otomatic Production
Belgium
* "The Taste of Others"
A Telema/Les Films A4/France 2 Cinema Production
France
Achievement in makeup
* "The Cell" (New Line)
Michèle Burke and Edouard Henriques
* "Dr. Seuss' How the Grinch Stole Christmas" (Universal)
Rick Baker and Gail Ryan
* "Shadow of the Vampire" (Lions Gate)
Ann Buchanan and Amber Sibley
Achievement in music in connection with motion pictures (Original score)
* "Chocolat" (Miramax)
Rachel Portman
* "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" (Sony Pictures Classics)
Tan Dun
* "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
Hans Zimmer
* "Malèna" (Miramax)
Ennio Morricone
* "The Patriot" (Sony Pictures Releasing)
John Williams
Achievement in music in connection with motion pictures (Original song)
* "A Fool In Love" from "Meet the Parents"
(Universal and DreamWorks)
Music and Lyric by Randy Newman
* "I've Seen It All" from "Dancer in the Dark"
(Fine Line)
Music by Björk
Lyric by Lars von Trier and Sjon Sigurdsson
* "A Love Before Time" from "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon"
(Sony Pictures Classics)
Music by Jorge Calandrelli and Tan Dun
Lyric by James Schamus
* "My Funny Friend and Me" from "The Emperor's New Groove"
(Buena Vista)
Music by Sting and David Hartley
Lyric by Sting
* "Things Have Changed" from "Wonder Boys"
(Paramount and Mutual Film Company)
Music and Lyric by Bob Dylan
Best motion picture of the year
* "Chocolat" (Miramax)
A David Brown Production
David Brown, Kit Golden and Leslie Holleran, Producers
* "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" (Sony Pictures Classics)
A Zoom Hunt International Production
Bill Kong, Hsu Li Kong and Ang Lee, Producers
* "Erin Brockovich" (Universal and Columbia)
A Jersey Films Production
Danny DeVito, Michael Shamberg and Stacey Sher, Producers
* "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
A Douglas Wick in association with Scott Free Production
Douglas Wick, David Franzoni and Branko Lustig, Producers
* "Traffic" (USA Films)
A Bedford Falls/Laura Bickford Production
Edward Zwick, Marshall Herskovitz and Laura Bickford, Producers
Best animated short film
* "Father and Daughter"
A CinèTè Filmproductie bv/Cloudrunner Ltd. Production
Michael Dudok de Wit
* "The Periwig-Maker"
An Ideal Standard Film Production
Steffen Schäffler and Annette Schäffler
* "Rejected"
A Bitter Films Production
Don Hertzfeldt
Best live action short film
* "By Courier"
A Two Tequila Production
Peter Riegert and Ericka Frederick
* "One Day Crossing"
An Open Eyes Production
Joan Stein and Christina Lazaridi
* "Quiero Ser (I want to be...)"
A Mondragon Films Production
Florian Gallenberger
* "Seraglio"
A Seraglio Production
Gail Lerner and Colin Campbell
* "A Soccer Story (Una Historia de Futebol)"
A UM Filmes Production
Paulo Machline
Achievement in sound
* "Cast Away" (20th Century Fox and DreamWorks)
Randy Thom, Tom Johnson, Dennis Sands and William B. Kaplan
* "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
Scott Millan, Bob Beemer and Ken Weston
* "The Patriot" (Sony Pictures Releasing)
Kevin O'Connell, Greg P. Russell and Lee Orloff
* "The Perfect Storm" (Warner Bros.)
John Reitz, Gregg Rudloff, David Campbell and Keith A. Wester
* "U-571" (Universal and Studio Canal)
Steve Maslow, Gregg Landaker, Rick Kline and Ivan Sharrock
Achievement in sound editing
* "Space Cowboys" (Warner Bros.) Alan Robert Murray and Bub Asman
* "U-571" (Universal and Studio Canal) Jon Johnson
Achievement in visual effects
* "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
John Nelson, Neil Corbould, Tim Burke and Rob Harvey
* "Hollow Man" (Sony Pictures Releasing)
Scott E. Anderson, Craig Hayes, Scott Stokdyk and Stan Parks
* "The Perfect Storm" (Warner Bros.)
Stefen Fangmeier, Habib Zargarpour, John Frazier and Walt Conti
Screenplay based on material previously produced or published
* "Chocolat" (Miramax)
Screenplay by Robert Nelson Jacobs
* "Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon" (Sony Pictures Classics)
Written by Wang Hui Ling and James Schamus and Tsai Kuo Jung
* "O Brother, Where Art Thou?" (Buena Vista)
Written by Ethan Coen & Joel Coen
* "Traffic" (USA Films)
Screenplay by Stephen Gaghan
* "Wonder Boys" (Paramount and Mutual Film Company)
Screenplay by Steve Kloves
Screenplay written directly for the screen
* "Almost Famous" (DreamWorks and Columbia)
Written by Cameron Crowe
* "Billy Elliot" (Universal Focus)
Written by Lee Hall
* "Erin Brockovich" (Universal and Columbia)
Written by Susannah Grant
* "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
Screenplay by David Franzoni and John Logan and William Nicholson
Story by David Franzoni
* "You Can Count On Me" (Paramount Classics/Shooting Gallery/Hart Sharp
Entertainment in association with Cappa Productions)
Written by Kenneth Lonergan
Chris Connelly
(the single WORST film I saw last year) winning Best Picture clearly
indicates the total uselessness of this entire sorry awards tradition.
Michael Cummins
Sorry but Gladiator was the grandest, soldiest movie in years. More
importanatly, it was the most competent historical/swashbuckler since
CinemaScope came in. To make a decent swashbuckler is now a lost art.
Gladiator shows Hollywood's ability.
--
M. Cummins
------------------------
"Ni raibh d'oidhreacht aige ach an geal- ghaire do bhronn Dia air, agus gur
chreid se na chroibhe go raibh an saghal mor ar mire"
--Scaramuis le Rafael Sabatini
CineStudy
have seen in years.
Rick
Michael Cummins
> Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon is a real swashbuckler unlike any other
that we
> have seen in years.
>
I thought it had magic/fantasy in it?
Frederica
Michael Cummins wrote:
> > I think the probability of Julia Roberts winning Best Actress and
> GLADIATOR
> > (the single WORST film I saw last year) winning Best Picture clearly
> > indicates the total uselessness of this entire sorry awards tradition.
>
> Sorry but Gladiator was the grandest, soldiest movie in years. More
> importanatly, it was the most competent historical/swashbuckler since
> CinemaScope came in. To make a decent swashbuckler is now a lost art.
> Gladiator shows Hollywood's ability.
This vamp enjoyed the heck out of Gladiator. Russell Crowe in a cocktail
length sheath? LAWUMBA.
Frederica
Chris Connelly
>This vamp enjoyed the heck out of Gladiator. Russell Crowe in a cocktail
>length sheath? LAWUMBA.
I don't dispute that Crowe is VERY pretty - but pretty does not an engaging
three-hour epic make.
I thought Gladiator was beautifully filmed and a crashing, crashing bore!
Give me Ramon and Bushman ANY day!
Chris Connelly
>length sheath? LAWUMBA.
For the record, let me add - "YUM!"
CineStudy
M. Cummins >>
It had it all!
Rick
Archie Waugh
Ridley Scott could take a classic genre concept and so thoroughly remove all of
the appealing elements thereof.
Archie Waugh
Archie Waugh
than the mattes in Quo Vadis, made 50 years earlier? And someone please stop
that man from pushing the "animated flocks of birds" button before he strikes
again!
Archie Waugh
P. S. - Did you somehow miss "Braveheart"?
Michael Cummins
> If it was so competent, how come every CG shot of the colliseum looked
phonier
> than the mattes in Quo Vadis, made 50 years earlier? And someone please
stop
> that man from pushing the "animated flocks of birds" button before he
strikes
> again!
Most impressive special effects since Disney's THE STORY OF ROBIN HOOD AND
HIS MERRIE MEN
>
> P. S. - Did you somehow miss "Braveheart"?
Bravehaert was the most unhistorical, tasteless, clueless piece of carp- as
bad as The Patriot.
Archie Waugh
AW
P.S. - "Piece of carp?"
Michael Cummins
I really have no agenda there.
Constance Kuriyama
> Frederica wrote in message <3A898423...@yahoo.com>...
>>This vamp enjoyed the heck out of Gladiator. Russell Crowe in a cocktail
>>length sheath? LAWUMBA.
>
> I don't dispute that Crowe is VERY pretty - but pretty does not an engaging
> three-hour epic make.
>
> I thought Gladiator was beautifully filmed and a crashing, crashing bore!
I don't see how anyone could find an evil emperor, a classic revenge story,
inventive hand-to-hand combat, and a fox like Russell Crowe for an avenger
boring. Were you on antihistimines when you saw it? ;-)
Connie K.
--
"Effortlessness takes preparation." --Russell Crowe
Nate
"Shadow of the Vampire"....
In article <20010213122143...@ng-fb1.aol.com>,
cine...@aol.com says...
> Performance by an actor in a supporting role
>
> * Jeff Bridges in "The Contender" (DreamWorks and
> Cinerenta/Cinecontender)
> * Willem Dafoe in "Shadow of the Vampire" (Lions Gate)
> * Benicio Del Toro in "Traffic" (USA Films)
> * Albert Finney in "Erin Brockovich" (Universal and Columbia)
> * Joaquin Phoenix in "Gladiator" (DreamWorks and Universal)
>
--
- nate
- na...@NOSPAMPLEASEdkitchen.com
- [remove "NOSPAMPLEASE" for legit address]
James Russell
<mlcu...@eircom.net> wrote:
>Bravehaert was the most unhistorical, tasteless, clueless piece of carp- as
>bad as The Patriot.
It was still more historically true than "Gladiator".
--
James R.
http://www.ans.com.au/~jgwr/
Celluloid Dreams http://www.2ser.com Monday 7-7.30pm AEST
James Russell
>Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon is a real swashbuckler unlike any other that we
>have seen in years.
"Crouching Tiger" is an excellent film, but if it's a swashbuckler,
then it's a swashbuckler unlike any other swashbuckler that's ever
been made.
Constance Kuriyama
>> P. S. - Did you somehow miss "Braveheart"?
>
> Bravehaert was the most unhistorical, tasteless, clueless piece of carp- as
> bad as The Patriot.
Amen. The only thing to recommend it was the mooning of the English
army. Rarely have I seen so many loooong, empty shots, ho hum battle
scenes, etc.
As for the process shot of the colliseum--I've seen better cgi, but
then there was all that *other* stuff.
I'm no doubt partial, but for me the simple fact that much of it was
shot in Malta was a mild charge. The ancient world still exists
in the middle of the Mediterranean.
Constance Kuriyama
> On Tue, 13 Feb 2001 23:40:22 -0000, "Michael Cummins"
> <mlcu...@eircom.net> wrote:
>
>>Bravehaert was the most unhistorical, tasteless, clueless piece of carp- as
>>bad as The Patriot.
>
> It was still more historically true than "Gladiator".
That's debatable. I hope you don't believe that Willie Wallace
impregnated Queen Isabel. Or that Edward I threw Gaveston out
a window. Pure fairy tale.
CineStudy
Rick
<< Subject: Re: The Oscars
From: jg...@yahoo.com (James Russell)
Date: Feb3 13120012000 9:43 PM
Message-id: <3a8a1ac5...@news.ans.com.au>
Archie Waugh
Archie Waugh
James Russell
Kuriyama) wrote:
>James Russell (jg...@yahoo.com) writes:
>> On Tue, 13 Feb 2001 23:40:22 -0000, "Michael Cummins"
>> <mlcu...@eircom.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Bravehaert was the most unhistorical, tasteless, clueless piece of carp- as
>>>bad as The Patriot.
>>
>> It was still more historically true than "Gladiator".
>
>That's debatable. I hope you don't believe that Willie Wallace
>impregnated Queen Isabel. Or that Edward I threw Gaveston out
>a window. Pure fairy tale.
Yes but at least Oor Wullie died his historically recorded death,
which was more than Commodus did in "Gladiator".
James Russell
wrote:
>Suprizing...no comments from this group to the Willem Dafoe nod for
>"Shadow of the Vampire"....
Nor the best make-up nod for the same film. Be nice to see "Shadow"
get either of those...
Michael Gebert
(Constance Kuriyama) wrote:
> James Russell (jg...@yahoo.com) writes:
> > On Tue, 13 Feb 2001 23:40:22 -0000, "Michael Cummins"
> > <mlcu...@eircom.net> wrote:
> >
> >>Bravehaert was the most unhistorical, tasteless, clueless piece of carp- as
> >>bad as The Patriot.
> >
> > It was still more historically true than "Gladiator".
>
> That's debatable. I hope you don't believe that Willie Wallace
> impregnated Queen Isabel. Or that Edward I threw Gaveston out
> a window. Pure fairy tale.
No, but I do believe that Wallace shouted out "Freedom!" in full voice,
and with a full Lockean understanding of that term as it is used by us
today, while his bowels spilled off the table in front of him.
___________________________________________________
Michael Gebert, Writer | www.michaelgebert.com
Amount in gifts the sleazy Clintons took just before leaving the
White House: $190,000
Amount in gifts the noble, dignity-restoring Bushes took in 1992:
$140,000
Chris Connelly
Constance Kuriyama wrote in message <96cqub$pca$1...@freenet9.carleton.ca>...
>I don't see how anyone could find an evil emperor, a classic revenge story,
>inventive hand-to-hand combat, and a fox like Russell Crowe for an avenger
>boring. Were you on antihistimines when you saw it? ;-)
No, I wasn't and sorry - but I did. And my partner, who suggested we see
the film looked at me when it was over and said "I am so sorry for making
you sit through that." He hated it too.
Maybe if Crowe had some nude scenes I might have found it entertaining. As
it was, I though the story could have been told effectively in half the
time. The set pieces were fine but the characters were cardboard and
uninteresting.
If it means anything to you - I though THE ENGLISH PATIENT was a colossal
bore too.
Chris Connelly
Michael Cummins wrote in message ...
>Bravehaert was the most unhistorical, tasteless, clueless piece of carp- as
>bad as The Patriot.
>
Gibson? Ghandi armed with an assault rifle? The nun from DEAD MAN WALKING
going postal and pulling a Columbine against the "bad capital punishers"?
MLK lynching the KKK?
Hans J. Wollstein
when Baker has made a movie.
Hans
James Russell <jg...@yahoo.com> skrev i en
nyhedsmeddelelse:3a8a7b11...@news.ans.com.au...
Hans J. Wollstein
though THE ENGLISH PATIENT was a colossal
> bore too.
>
Hans
CineStudy
got his award there was never a mores obnoxiuos rude un called for exceptance
speach. He basicly insulted not on the critics who gave him a award but he
insulted everybody who attended weither in the main stream of not. On that
basis alone i was more critical the maybe I should about Gladoiator, I wanted
for him a slower more painfull death he has made a lot of un neaseray
eniemies. I mea yes there were critics that night that may deserve a bashing
but not some like our belover Mr. Maltin. i read recently that he was giveing
advice at the Golden Globe party to the young actor from "Almost Famouse" He
said that his bodygards just sat around and do nothing untill somebody come up
to talk to him , when somebody does the come up and try to say something to him
or ask for a autograph his body gards come over and tell that person to move
on. I have been in public in recent years in public with Janet Leigh and
Charlton Heston who get a very large crowd that surrounds them when in public
and they acknowledge everybody and sign all the autographs requested. Ah the
old school.
Rick
Eric Grayson
video that I'd have puked for sure.
However, you guys are mentioning swashbuckler movies that Hollywood can't
make anymore and you've missed some of my favorites.
First off, has anyone seen The Mask of Zorro? OK, Banderas can't act his
way out of a wet sack, but Zeta Jones and Hopkins CAN, and it's a great
film all the way through. There's probably not enough gore in it for the
"deeeyude"-saying crowd, but I don't like those people anyway.
How about Rob Roy? Liam Neeson, Jessica Lange, beautiful photography, and
it all holds together. Plus we get to see Andrew Keir (from all those
Hammer films) toward the end of his life.
I'd even submit that The Ghost and the Darkness is nearly a swashbuckler.
Certainly a lot of adventure in it; great performance from Val Kilmer and
not bad from Michael Douglas. Too bad no one saw it.
Hell, for that matter, Cutthroat Island isn't too bad.
And for my money on this year's Oscars: Sean Connery should have gotten a
nomination for Finding Forrester. It's a great film, it's Connery's best
performance in years, and it's NOT Good Will Hunting again. If any of you
get a chance to see it, go do it. (But don't tell Mike S. I said so
because he'll think I like Sony pictures or something...)
Eric
Hans J. Wollstein
Eric Grayson wrote
> How about Rob Roy? Liam Neeson, Jessica Lange, beautiful photography, and
> it all holds together. Plus we get to see Andrew Keir (from all those
> Hammer films) toward the end of his life.
Great entertainment and so much better than BRAVEHEART, in which Mr.
Gibson's lace-front wig was just too distracting for words.
Hans
Chris Connelly
CineStudy wrote in message <20010214130248...@ng-fg1.aol.com>...
Somehow I'm not surprised - I know this is getting further OT - but are
there ANY actors today in $1M+/film club (Carey, Damon, Banderas, et al) who
actually behave like those of the old school?
Stephen Cooke
On Wed, 14 Feb 2001, James Russell wrote:
> On 13 Feb 2001 18:52:49 GMT, cine...@aol.com (CineStudy) wrote:
>
> >Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon is a real swashbuckler unlike any other that we
> >have seen in years.
>
> "Crouching Tiger" is an excellent film, but if it's a swashbuckler,
> then it's a swashbuckler unlike any other swashbuckler that's ever
> been made.
It's even more of a swashbuckler than Swashbuckler.
(And no acting noms? Michelle Yeoh said a lot more with her face than
Julia Roberts ever could with a whole wardrobe of push-up bras.)
And as for Zhang Ziyi....*sigh*
Stephen
Paula J. Vitaris
: advice at the Golden Globe party to the young actor from "Almost Famouse" He
Not disputing your account of Crowe's behavior at all... but wasn't Crowe
photographed talking to Jamie Bell from Billy Elliott at the GG's... I
don't think it was Patrick Fugit from Almost Famous.
Sorry to be so anal-retentive, that's just me. ;) Please correct me if
I'm wrong! Thanks.
-- Paula
Paula J. Vitaris
:
: How about Rob Roy? Liam Neeson, Jessica Lange,
Do NOT forget Tim Roth as one of the best movie villains of the 1990s!
: And for my money on this year's Oscars: Sean Connery should have gotten a
: nomination for Finding Forrester. It's a great film, it's Connery's best
: performance in years, and it's NOT Good Will Hunting again.
Um, well, I don't agree with any of that, except that it was Connery's
best performance in years -- although considering what he's been doing
lately, that isn't saying much -- but chacun a son gout!
(Sorry, Mike! If you're coming to Cinevent this year, please say hello to
me anyway... I'll be parked in the first row as usual!)
-- Paula
Michael Gebert
Connelly" <chris.c...@worldspan.com> wrote:
> Michael Cummins wrote in message ...
> >Bravehaert was the most unhistorical, tasteless, clueless piece of carp- as
> >bad as The Patriot.
> >
> I don't believe ANYTHING was worse than THE PATRIOT.
I agree, talk about a movie that was absolutely clueless about the actual
period it was in. I read an interview with Robert Rodat (screenwriter)
where he was dissing Kevin Phillips' The Cousins' War, admittedly an
extremely technical work but one whose basic premise (the two sides of the
English Civil War, mercantile Puritan versus landed gentry high Church,
became the two sides of the Revolutionary War and the two sides of the
American Civil War) shouldn't be beyond a Hollywood hack's understanding
of the sort of people and issues involved, and might have helped him draw
a clearer picture of the times, even if it didn't figure in it
explicitly.* But how much easier just to make the British into Nazis like
on the late late show! It's a wonder they didn't have bazookas and field
phones.
* Though I'd love to see a Billy the Kid movie that acknowledged the
research that suggests that Billy had a strong Irish Catholic identity and
the landowners an equally strong English Protestant one, and that the
range war was a continuation of Ulster conflicts out west.
Michael Gebert
<wolf...@indy.net> wrote:
> I'd even submit that The Ghost and the Darkness is nearly a swashbuckler.
> Certainly a lot of adventure in it; great performance from Val Kilmer and
> not bad from Michael Douglas. Too bad no one saw it.
Any of you Hollywood types able to back up what I suspected when I saw it:
that the original cut had a lot of animatronic lion footage in it, and
when all that didn't work, it was up to the editor to save it by
practically cutting the lions out entirely and doing it Val Lewton style
with sound effects and shots of rippling grass?
Rodney Sauer
> I haven't seen Gladiator. The CGI shots looked to be bad enough even on
> video that I'd have puked for sure.
>
> However, you guys are mentioning swashbuckler movies that Hollywood can't
> make anymore and you've missed some of my favorites.
>
> First off, has anyone seen The Mask of Zorro? OK, Banderas can't act his
> way out of a wet sack, but Zeta Jones and Hopkins CAN, and it's a great
> film all the way through. There's probably not enough gore in it for the
> "deeeyude"-saying crowd, but I don't like those people anyway.
I generally liked it, but I thought it was ridiculous to have a fuse burning
to threaten hundreds of innocent workers, and only Zeta Jones did anything
about it. Zorro and nemesis were so embroiled in their personal vendetta that
their duel was more important than saving lives. I think Fairbanks (or even
Flynn) would have taken care of business in the proper order. -- Rodney
Constance Kuriyama
> On 14 Feb 2001 06:08:02 GMT, do...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Constance
> Kuriyama) wrote:
>
>>James Russell (jg...@yahoo.com) writes:
>>> On Tue, 13 Feb 2001 23:40:22 -0000, "Michael Cummins"
>>> <mlcu...@eircom.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Bravehaert was the most unhistorical, tasteless, clueless piece of carp- as
>>>>bad as The Patriot.
>>>
>>> It was still more historically true than "Gladiator".
>>
>>That's debatable. I hope you don't believe that Willie Wallace
>>impregnated Queen Isabel. Or that Edward I threw Gaveston out
>>a window. Pure fairy tale.
>
> Yes but at least Oor Wullie died his historically recorded death,
> which was more than Commodus did in "Gladiator".
True, but then the entire historical situation in _Gladiator_, as
in _Fall of the Roman Empire_ (yuck) is heavily fictionalized.
The Commodus of _Gladiator_ is a toxic mixture of Commodus, Nero,
and Caligula. I take it as fable rather than fact.
It would have been accurate for Commodus to be poisoned by his
mistress, but it would have spoiled the formulatic confrontation
of good and evil at the end.
Speaking of applauding films, the second audience I saw _G_ with
applauded vigorously at the end, which I've rarely seen a regular
movie crowd do. Either these people were all idiots, or the film
has *something* going for it.
Archie Waugh
it. Unfortunately, since he didn't have the body to carry it off, nobody else
got to be nude or near-nude either, making this the most heavily-over-costumed
gladiator spectacle in the history of movies. Thus, to my mind, rendering the
whole affair pointless! (besides, so much of the plot is a shameless rip-off of
Braveheart anyway, without the emotional content to back up the spectacle.)
As to the set pieces being interesting, well, they were, if you like chaotic
camerawork and incoherent editing. Heck, you could never even tell who was
killing who! And the total lack of action in the last third of the film didn't
help.
What a bore.
Archie Waugh
Constance Kuriyama
Actually it was Chris who said that. I liked _English Patient_, and
actually watched it twice and liked it even better the second time.
So the moral is?
A movie is not only what's on the screen, but what the viewer brings to it.
And I'm not assuming anything about the value of what each of us brings to
the experience. This is in general a sophisticated group, and we have
diametrically opposed views of the same films.
Archie Waugh
Archie Waugh
Constance Kuriyama
> When i was at the L.A Film Critics Awards last year Crowe was there. When he
> got his award there was never a mores obnoxiuos rude un called for exceptance
> speach. He basicly insulted not on the critics who gave him a award but he
> insulted everybody who attended weither in the main stream of not. On that
> basis alone i was more critical the maybe I should about Gladoiator, I wanted
> for him a slower more painfull death he has made a lot of un neaseray
> eniemies.
Crowe's a cantankerous original, and works a bit too hard at it. Still,
he gets enthusiastic praise from many people who have worked with him,
so he must have a lovable side.
I don't let the personal behavoir of artists bother me. If I did, I'd
have a lot less to enjoy.
Constance Kuriyama
> First off, has anyone seen The Mask of Zorro? OK, Banderas can't act his
> way out of a wet sack, but Zeta Jones and Hopkins CAN, and it's a great
> film all the way through. There's probably not enough gore in it for the
> "deeeyude"-saying crowd, but I don't like those people anyway.
Entertaining, but the plot was pretty threadbare.
> How about Rob Roy? Liam Neeson, Jessica Lange, beautiful photography, and
> it all holds together. Plus we get to see Andrew Keir (from all those
> Hammer films) toward the end of his life.
That one I thought was underrated. I liked it better than _Braveheart_.
Tim Roth was deliciously nasty.
Constance Kuriyama
> CineStudy wrote in message <20010214130248...@ng-fg1.aol.com>...
>>When i was at the L.A Film Critics Awards last year Crowe was there. When
> he
>>got his award there was never a mores obnoxiuos rude un called for
> exceptance
>>speach.
He was probably joking. He has an odd sense of humor. Uh . . . maybe
that's stretching it. He's just odd. ;-)
> Somehow I'm not surprised - I know this is getting further OT - but are
> there ANY actors today in $1M+/film club (Carey, Damon, Banderas, et al) who
> actually behave like those of the old school?
How about George Clooney? He's the one I can't endure. Crowe just amuses
me.
Early film stars had a sense of noblesse oblige, I think. Since everyone's
just another scuzzbucket these days, why feel any sense of obligation?
Frederica
> Speaking of applauding films, the second audience I saw _G_ with
> applauded vigorously at the end, which I've rarely seen a regular
> movie crowd do. Either these people were all idiots, or the film
> has *something* going for it.
(shrug) As I said, I enjoyed the heck out of it. I don't care if it was
historically accurate or not. It also didn't have a decent cookie recipe.
This again proves my point--what entertains me may not entertain others and it
doesn't have to. If you liked Gladiator, fine; if you didn't, that's fine too.
EVERYBODY has made the correct choice.
Frederica
Christopher Jacobs
Constance Kuriyama <do...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA> wrote in message
news:96f1p3$7n1$1...@freenet9.carleton.ca...
>
> Speaking of applauding films, the second audience I saw _G_ with
> applauded vigorously at the end, which I've rarely seen a regular
> movie crowd do. Either these people were all idiots, or the film
> has *something* going for it.
>
I enjoyed GLADIATOR--despite all of its historical inaccuracy regarding
actual people and dates, it is reasonably accurate as movies go in
recreating the feel of the historical period. As a movie, it's pure,
old-fashioned Hollywood spectacle the way it hasn't been done since the 50s
and 60s.
There was a smattering of applause at the end of HANNIBAL the other night.
This also happened at some other movie in the past year, but I forget which
one. Every so often a movie seems to get people involved enough with the
characters that they clap when it's over as if it were a live stage
performance. Of course, they always clap after silent movies, but to
applaud the accompanist more than the film.
--cpj
Michael Gebert
rod...@rddconsultants.com wrote:
> I generally liked it, but I thought it was ridiculous to have a fuse burning
> to threaten hundreds of innocent workers, and only Zeta Jones did anything
> about it. Zorro and nemesis were so embroiled in their personal vendetta that
> their duel was more important than saving lives. I think Fairbanks (or even
> Flynn) would have taken care of business in the proper order. -- Rodney
No worse than The Phantom Mess, when the "good" Jedi abandon the cause of
the people to go settle a private score with the goth guy they didn't get
along with at Jedi High, incidentally proving how fair Jedi fight by
ganging up on him two to one in a duel.
What I liked about The Mask of Zorro was that it wasn't created in the
editing room-- when somebody jumped up on a table or tumbled out of
sword's reach, they did it in one shot. A real rarity these days.
Constance Kuriyama
> Have you SEEN Russell Crowe's body? It's no thrill.
Have you? Mind telling us where? ;-)
But since it changes shape from one role to the next, this would seem to be
a risky call at best.
We were better off without
> it. Unfortunately, since he didn't have the body to carry it off, nobody else
> got to be nude or near-nude either, making this the most heavily-over-costumed
> gladiator spectacle in the history of movies.
You obviously haven't seen _Fall of the Roman Empire_. But doesn't Joaquin
Phoenix have a fencing scene in which he's pretty well stripped down?
(besides, so much of the plot is a shameless rip-off of
> Braveheart anyway
Fortunately, any resemblance escaped me. "Good guy fights tyranny"
is not the exclusive preserve of _Braveheart_. And I was glad to be
spared a saccharine liaison with a noblewoman--though actually the plot
was the weakest part of the film.
Philip
>
>Somehow I'm not surprised - I know this is getting further OT - but are
>there ANY actors today in $1M+/film club (Carey, Damon, Banderas, et al) who
>actually behave like those of the old school?
I suspect you'd find that most are pretty decent. I've heard numerous
anecdotes about Mick Jagger's thoroughly decent behavior, for instance
(okay, he's not an actor, I admit). I ran across a book not too long
back that was guide to seeking autographs. The guy who wrote the book
had hundreds, if not thousands, of autographs that he had gotten first
hand. He rated the stars on their politeness. Most of them came off
quite well. As I recall the only truel asshole of the bunch was Billy
Crystal, which corresponds with other things I have heard about him.
- Philip
Archie Waugh
Constance Kuriyama wrote:
> Archie Waugh (glam...@gte.net) writes:
> > Have you SEEN Russell Crowe's body? It's no thrill.
>
> Have you? Mind telling us where? ;-)
There is one brief scene in Gladiator, when he is first enslaved, he's lined up with
several other prospects...he's mostly back-lit, but what you can see is none too
impressive. About as blah physically as Costner.
> You obviously haven't seen _Fall of the Roman Empire_.
Yeah...they had too many clothes on in that one too!
> But doesn't Joaquin
> Phoenix have a fencing scene in which he's pretty well stripped down?
If it was there, it flew by...I surely would have noticed him stripped down.
> (besides, so much of the plot is a shameless rip-off of
> > Braveheart anyway
>
> Fortunately, any resemblance escaped me.
It was more structural than literal, but a lame (to me) attempt to push many of the
same buttons, especially when wife is slain, etc., to build up sympathy for the main
character. It might have worked with an actor with more charisma (like, say, Mel
Gibson) but it left me flat.
AW
Jeremy Bond Shepherd
<cine...@aol.com> wrote:
> Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon is a real swashbuckler unlike any other that we
> have seen in years.
To my eyes it was like every other of the dozens of Chinese "flying
people" movies I've seen on KTSF.
-Jeremy
Michael Gebert
<jb...@eskimo.com> wrote:
> I really liked Citizen Kane.
Ah, it was just like The Power and the Glory.
Lloyd Fonvielle
> "Good guy fights tyranny"
> is not the exclusive preserve of _Braveheart_. And I was glad to be
> spared a saccharine liaison with a noblewoman--though actually the plot
> was the weakest part of the film.
The story of "Gladiator" is very unusual. The male and female leads, both
exceedingly attractive people, never disrobe -- though the milieu of ancient Rome
would offer plenty of excuses for same -- and never make love. They bond over an
ideal and through their feelings for their children. An example of full frontal
decency -- still shocking to many.
Paula J. Vitaris
:
: You obviously haven't seen _Fall of the Roman Empire_. But doesn't Joaquin
: Phoenix have a fencing scene in which he's pretty well stripped down?
He was stripped down in a brief scene where we saw him practicing his
swordsmanship with members of (I think) the Praetorian Guard. (I don't
think they actually did fencing in those days -- they didn't have the thin
foils then, did they?) The scene was there to let us know that Commodus
was a formidable swordsman, i.e., foreshadowing of inevitable fight with
Maximus. But not so formidable he wasn't ready to cheat by inflicting a
wound on Maximus first, of course. ;)
: Fortunately, any resemblance escaped me. "Good guy fights tyranny"
: is not the exclusive preserve of _Braveheart_.
I think the idea is that both are about warriors who have lost beloved
wives (and in Gladiator's case, a son too) and thus, "this time it's
personal." Gibson played that gambit again in The Patriot, which is far
worse than either Braveheart or Gladiator.
And since this is the silent newsgroup, I'd just like to note that Crowe
doesn't have any dialogue in the entire sequence from his "The frost,
sometimes it makes the blade stick" in the German forest execution scene
to when he finally yells at the arena crowd in Zucchabar, "Are you not
entertained?!" He does some wonderful acting with facial and body
expression alone.
-- Paula
James Russell
<christoph...@und.nodak.edu> wrote:
>Every so often a movie seems to get people involved enough with the
>characters that they clap when it's over as if it were a live stage
>performance. Of course, they always clap after silent movies, but to
>applaud the accompanist more than the film.
At the recent screening of "Sunrise" I attended, the audience
applauded very enthusiastically, and that was without an accompanist.
--
James R.
http://www.ans.com.au/~jgwr/
Celluloid Dreams http://www.2ser.com Monday 7-7.30pm AEST
Constance Kuriyama
In fact, it isn't even clear how Max feels about the woman, though she obviously
is still interested in him. Emotionally he's damaged goods, but he can still
try to save her and her son. You're right, it's very unusual in that respect--
and totally unlike _Braveheart_.
CineStudy
Rick
CineStudy
have all agreed. Even those I know that have worked with him have called him by
a name that I refuse to repeat on this board.
Rick
ChaneyFan
(the single WORST film I saw last year) winning Best Picture clearly
indicates the total uselessness of this entire sorry awards tradition.
I have to strongly disagree. GLADIATOR was a fine picture (not a classic, but
better than many best Best Picture winners) and should easily won the prize.
Likewise Julia Roberts was sensational in EB and should walk away with the
Oscar for it.
===============================
Jon Mirsalis
e-mail: Chan...@aol.com
Lon Chaney Home Page: http://members.aol.com/ChaneyFan
Jon's Film Sites: http://members.aol.com/ChaneyFan/jonfilm.htm
James Russell
I'm faintly ashamed to admit I went to the same school as he did. Not
in the same year, though (he finished there the year after I was
born).
Steven Rowe
<christoph...@und.nodak.edu> writes:
>There was a smattering of applause at the end of HANNIBAL the other night.
and much to my surprise a smattering of applause at "Oh Brother, Where Art
Thou", which I joined in...
///First time, I ever saw a movie where folks applauded (except for silent
films)
Steven Rowe
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------
Don't forget to Delete "Unspam" if you wish to e- mail me.
join the FelixTheCat list at www.egroups.com
.
Michael Gebert
(Paula J. Vitaris) wrote:
> I think the idea is that both are about warriors who have lost beloved
> wives (and in Gladiator's case, a son too) and thus, "this time it's
> personal." Gibson played that gambit again in The Patriot, which is far
> worse than either Braveheart or Gladiator.
The bigger recycling is:
there's practically become such a thing as a Dreamworks ending.
SPOILER ALERT
A Dreamworks ending is one in which the main character dies, but doesn't
die, because we get just a glimpse of a cinematographically blissful
heaven or eternity and them passing into it, usually reunited with a loved
one.
Admittedly, this comes from Titanic, which is not a Dreamworks movie (and
where, in my mind, it was just the right ending, even if it did somewhat
suggest The Shining with everyone on the boat going through their paces
for all eternity).
But since then it has turned up in at least three Dreamworks releases:
American Beauty, the not-very-good Neil Jordan horror film In Dreams (in
which it is rather awkwardly merged with the more standard
imitation-Carrie horror movie ending), and Gladiator.
In other words, it's become a hack's sentimental way out of dealing with
the fact that a movie pretty much needs to end with death, but that'd be a
downer and hurt test scores in Pomona, so we'll end with Not-Really-Death
and make everybody happy.
Stephen Cooke
They called him Al Detlaff?
Stephen
Rodney Sauer
> Of course, they always clap after silent movies, but to
> applaud the accompanist more than the film.
>
> --cpj
I find that people applaud more after certain films regardless of how well or
poorly we play. We get more applause for FOUR HORSEMEN OF THE APOCALYPSE than
just about anything. THE BLACK PIRATE does pretty well too.
Rodney Sauer
rod...@mont-alto.com
The Mont Alto Ragtime and Tango Orchestra
and the Mont Alto Motion Picture Orchestra
http://www.mont-alto.com
Eric Grayson
>Likewise Julia Roberts was sensational in EB and should walk away with the
>Oscar for it.
>===============================
>Jon Mirsalis
Thanks! Someone agrees with me! Erin is one of the most accurate movies
I've ever seen depicting the legal industry. They got nearly all of the
details right. Since I deal with it all the time, I see these things go
on.
Finney is every bit as good as Roberts, and I hope he walks off with an
Oscar, too.
ccon...@mindspring.com
Constance Kuriyama wrote in message <96f1p3$7n1$1...@freenet9.carleton.ca>...
>Speaking of applauding films, the second audience I saw _G_ with
>applauded vigorously at the end, which I've rarely seen a regular
>movie crowd do. Either these people were all idiots, or the film
>has *something* going for it.
SECOND audience?
Constance Kuriyama
> Constance Kuriyama (do...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA) wrote:
> :
> : You obviously haven't seen _Fall of the Roman Empire_. But doesn't Joaquin
> : Phoenix have a fencing scene in which he's pretty well stripped down?
> :
>
> He was stripped down in a brief scene where we saw him practicing his
> swordsmanship with members of (I think) the Praetorian Guard. (I don't
> think they actually did fencing in those days -- they didn't have the thin
> foils then, did they?)
No, but I'll bet they practiced swordplay. All weapons require technique.
Aren't there scenes of the training of gladiators in _Spartacus_?
> The scene was there to let us know that Commodus
> was a formidable swordsman, i.e., foreshadowing of inevitable fight with
> Maximus. But not so formidable he wasn't ready to cheat by inflicting a
> wound on Maximus first, of course. ;)
>
> : Fortunately, any resemblance escaped me. "Good guy fights tyranny"
> : is not the exclusive preserve of _Braveheart_.
>
> I think the idea is that both are about warriors who have lost beloved
> wives (and in Gladiator's case, a son too) and thus, "this time it's
> personal." Gibson played that gambit again in The Patriot, which is far
> worse than either Braveheart or Gladiator.
>
> And since this is the silent newsgroup, I'd just like to note that Crowe
> doesn't have any dialogue in the entire sequence from his "The frost,
> sometimes it makes the blade stick" in the German forest execution scene
> to when he finally yells at the arena crowd in Zucchabar, "Are you not
> entertained?!" He does some wonderful acting with facial and body
> expression alone.
I knew there was a reason why I liked him so much! (The fact that he's
a fox doesn't count. Foxes without talent get nowhere with me.)
And he does remind me of some of the best silent actors. Great
presence and subtlety.
Constance Kuriyama
I didn't read either the ending of _Titanic_ or the ending of _Gladiator_ that
way.
Old Rose isn't dead at the end of _Titanic_--just enjoying a pleasant dream
of reconciliation with a dead world. Rather original, I thought.
Max is definitely dead, and drifting off into a fantasy of Elysium, which
is mentioned in a speech he makes before the battle scene. It would never
have occurred to me that he wasn't really, *really* dead--but then I don't
believe in Elysium.
Constance Kuriyama
You read right. With my husband both times. ;-)
We also saw _Castaway_ with two audiences, but that was only because the
sound system went haywire in the first theater and they had to give
us our money back.
Tom Hanks was very good in _Castaway_, but the whale was better.
Archie Waugh
dead at the end, and have slowly realized that most everyone I discuss it with
thinks she's dead. It simply never occurred to me; I perceived the scene exactly
as you did.
Archie Waugh
ChaneyFan
I've ever seen depicting the legal industry. They got nearly all of the
details right. Since I deal with it all the time, I see these things go on.
Well, I can go one better than you. I was an expert toxicologist in a minor
role in the case portrayed in ERIN B *and* the case described in A CIVIL
ACTION. Both movies got the facts more or less correct, although as you might
expect from Hollywood, both stories were heavily sensationalized and biased
towards the side of the plaintiffs. Still, I enjoyed both films and thought EB
was excellent.
Michael Gebert
She's 134, she's unburdened herself of everything, she lays down, she is
welcomed into the company of the dead...
...and we're not supposed to think she just passed away?
There was something definitely Shining-like about it all, though,
especially if you've seen other Titanic movies and are familiar with so
many of the events depicted. Just as Jack Torrance is able to walk among
the ghosts of the 20s and 30s in his modern clothes without being noticed
as out of place, the two modern-seeming teens walk among the figures of an
historical event as they repeat their paces over and over-- the captain
seeing the ice too late, the ship's designer waiting for death in the
salon, Ismay leaping into the lifeboat at the last minute, Molly Brown
urging the others fruitlessly to return...
___________________________________________________
Michael Gebert, Writer | www.michaelgebert.com
One Reagan foreign policy initiative almost no one tries to defend is
trading weapons for hostages in Iran-Contra... But the question history
must decide is: Was it better or worse than oral sex with an intern? It
seems to me that subverting the Constitution on an important policy
matter is worse than embarrassing everybody with your private squalor...
the mantra of the Lewinsky scandal was that the lying, not the original
transgression, is what counts. If so, Reagan's sins are at least equal to
Clinton's. He never testified under oath until he was out of office and his
claims not to remember things had become sadly believable. But at the
height of the scandal Reagan lied to us on television just as spectacularly
as Clinton did, with that little shake of the head, rather than a Clintonian
bite of the lower lip, as his signature gesture of phony sincerity.
--Michael Kinsley
Paula J. Vitaris
:
: No, but I'll bet they practiced swordplay.
Um, yeah, I think that's what I said. :) Commodus was practicing his
swordsmanship.
: Aren't there scenes of the training of gladiators in _Spartacus_?
:
I believe so.
: I knew there was a reason why I liked him so much! (The fact that he's
: a fox doesn't count. Foxes without talent get nowhere with me.)
:
: And he does remind me of some of the best silent actors. Great
: presence and subtlety.
:
Oh, I'm sure Crowe would have been tremendous in silent film. My favorite
non-verbal moment in "Gladiator" takes place when Maximus is scraping off
his tattoo (OUCH), Juba asks him, "Won't the gods be angry?" and Maximus
shoots him this sardonic smile under which a look of momentary insanity
lurks.
-- Paula
Archie Waugh
the sinking!)...she was as I recall 102 or 103.
Archie Waugh
Michael Gebert
> She was not 134 (where did you get that figure? That would have made
her about 40 at the time of
> the sinking!)...she was as I recall 102 or 103.
> Archie Waugh
That was a joke. Still, I got the definite sense that the rest of the
people at the Overlook, er, on the Titanic were waiting for her to finally
arrive and complete the passenger list.
Did you see, BTW, that a Titanic passenger died last week? A guy who was
a kid but, if I recall, old enough to remember it.
"World's Largest Metaphor Hits Iceberg"
Precode
Hi, all, I'm still here. Sort of.
I've tried several of these servers, and ain't none of 'em easy. This one, for
example, has no next-message button, only a next-in-thread button, so I hafta
keep hitting the "back" button to read things in order, and I'm going backwards
to boot. Sigh. Anyway, I'm going to try and twist IS' arms to give me direct
UseNet access next week, so keep your fingers crossed.
Anyway, here's a great Russell Crowe story, albeit second-hand. A female
producer acquaintance of mine, who weighs about 60 pounds dripping wet, was at
last year's Miramax Oscar party, and needed to pee. After threading her way
through the tables, she finally found herself facing the back of you-know-who.
She politely tapped him on the shoulder and asked if she could get by. He
immediately whirled around and unleashed a torrent of abuse--mostly f-words and
c-words--along with a how-dare-you-don't-you-see-who-I'm-with (he was holding
Jodie Foster's hand), and moved as if he were going to strike her. She fled in
horror--her need to pee having rather quickly been solved--and went immediately
home. Now there's a classy guy.
BTW, I too was appalled at the 12 nominations for GLADIATOR. Was there WORSE
photography, editing and production design last year? (And this had the dubious
distinction of being the last picture I saw in my beloved Cinerama Dome before
they went on hiatus.) The performances were dreadful, except for Reed and
Harris, and their British accents stuck out like an albino in Compton. And when
Crowe muttered, "My name is Maximus. You killed my wife. You killed my family.
And I will have my revenge," or however that line went, all I could think was,
"Mandy Patinkin did this so much better."
It will, of course, sweep the Oscars, as all undeserving pictures do.
Mike S.
(still miffed that GODZILLA 2000 got skunked)
Precode
>
>"Hans J. Wollstein" (hwoll...@get2net.dk) writes:
>>> Constance Kuriyama wrote in message > If it means anything to you - I
>> though THE ENGLISH PATIENT was a colossal
>>> bore too.
>>>
>>> Amen!
>> Hans
>
>Actually it was Chris who said that. I liked _English Patient_, and
>actually watched it twice and liked it even better the second time.
>
>So the moral is?
>
>A movie is not only what's on the screen, but what the viewer brings to it.
>And I'm not assuming anything about the value of what each of us brings to
>the experience. This is in general a sophisticated group, and we have
>diametrically opposed views of the same films.
>
>Connie K.
>--
None of which alters the fact that THE ENGLISH PATIENT is a colossal bore. :-)
Mike S.
"And who's gonna save ya? The English Patient there?"--Dabney Coleman,
indicating the full-body-cast Matthew Broderick in INSPECTOR GADGET (half as
long and almost as funny)
Precode
>
>Archie Waugh (glam...@gte.net) writes:
>> Have you SEEN Russell Crowe's body? It's no thrill.
>
>Have you? Mind telling us where? ;-)
>
>But since it changes shape from one role to the next, this would seem to be
>a risky call at best.
>
> We were better off without
>> it. Unfortunately, since he didn't have the body to carry it off, nobody else
>> got to be nude or near-nude either, making this the most heavily-over-costumed
>> gladiator spectacle in the history of movies.
>
>You obviously haven't seen _Fall of the Roman Empire_. But doesn't Joaquin
>Phoenix have a fencing scene in which he's pretty well stripped down?
>
>> Braveheart anyway
>
>Fortunately, any resemblance escaped me. "Good guy fights tyranny"
>spared a saccharine liaison with a noblewoman--though actually the plot
>was the weakest part of the film.
>
>--
Actually, DreamWorks bought the remake rights to FALL OF THE ROMAN EMPIRE for
this epic...which renders the "Best Original Screenplay" nomination even more of
a joke.
Mike S.
"It's not a lie. It's a gift for fiction."--David Paymer in STATE AND MAIN
(which should've gotten that nomination instead)
Precode
>
>In article <20010213135249...@ng-ft1.aol.com>, CineStudy
><cine...@aol.com> wrote:
>
>> Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon is a real swashbuckler unlike any other that we
>> have seen in years.
>
>To my eyes it was like every other of the dozens of Chinese "flying
>people" movies I've seen on KTSF.
>
>-Jeremy
Amen, brother. The only person who seems to be aware that it's a rip-off is Ang
Lee himself, recreating the King Hu movies of his youth.
Mike S.
"Who's the director?"
"Yes."
"No, I wanna know the director's name."
"The director's name is Hu."
"That's what I'm asking you."
"Hu is the director."
"Why can't you tell me who the director is."
"I'm tellin' ya--Hu is the director."
"Now, look--I got a script, and I wanna get it to the director, who do I address
it to?"
"Yes."
"I address it to Yes?"
"No, you address it to Hu."
"That's what I'm asking you!"
..repeat ad infinitum
Precode
says...
>
>
>CineStudy wrote in message <20010214130248...@ng-fg1.aol.com>...
>>When i was at the L.A Film Critics Awards last year Crowe was there. When
>he
>>got his award there was never a mores obnoxiuos rude un called for
>exceptance
>>speach. He basicly insulted not on the critics who gave him a award but he
>>insulted everybody who attended weither in the main stream of not. On that
>>basis alone i was more critical the maybe I should about Gladoiator, I
>wanted
>>for him a slower more painfull death he has made a lot of un neaseray
>>eniemies. I mea yes there were critics that night that may deserve a
>bashing
>>but not some like our belover Mr. Maltin. i read recently that he was
>giveing
>>advice at the Golden Globe party to the young actor from "Almost Famouse"
>He
>>said that his bodygards just sat around and do nothing untill somebody come
>up
>>to talk to him , when somebody does the come up and try to say something to
>him
>>or ask for a autograph his body gards come over and tell that person to
>move
>>on. I have been in public in recent years in public with Janet Leigh and
>>Charlton Heston who get a very large crowd that surrounds them when in
>public
>>and they acknowledge everybody and sign all the autographs requested. Ah
>the
>>old school.
>
>Somehow I'm not surprised - I know this is getting further OT - but are
>there ANY actors today in $1M+/film club (Carey, Damon, Banderas, et al) who
>actually behave like those of the old school?
>
$1 million? Hell, Paul Reiser and Helen Hunt were making that PER EPISODE in the
last year of MAD ABOUT YOU.
Anyway, to answer your question, there are. Tom Hanks is the obvious first
choice, followed by George Clooney. Most people give Mel Gibson, Harrison Ford,
Tom Cruise, Julia Roberts, Robin Williams and, yes, Adam Sandler and Drew
Barrymore pretty high marks on the nice scale (which is not to say they won't
throw their weight around when they have to). Val Kilmer used to top the Most
Obnoxious list, but Crowe seems to be gaining on him; many of the ex-SNLers,
notably Chevy Chase and Bill Murray, are also royal pains. (And I can personally
confirm that Billy Crystal is nowhere nearly as charming in person as he is on
stage.) I believe that Ashley Judd, Helen Hunt and Lucy Liu are among those
who've recently turned into divas, while some, such as Shelley Long, are going
the reform route (as have Willis and Stallone).
Probably more than you needed to know...
Mike S.
(who's bigger than Calvin Coolidge--put together!)
CineStudy
Ditto.
Best,
Rick
Michael Gebert
<Precode...@newsranger.com> wrote:
> In article <140220011802415518%jb...@eskimo.com>, Jeremy Bond Shepherd says...
> >
> >In article <20010213135249...@ng-ft1.aol.com>, CineStudy
> ><cine...@aol.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon is a real swashbuckler unlike any
other that we
> >> have seen in years.
> >
> >To my eyes it was like every other of the dozens of Chinese "flying
> >people" movies I've seen on KTSF.
> >
> >-Jeremy
>
> Amen, brother. The only person who seems to be aware that it's a rip-off
is Ang
> Lee himself, recreating the King Hu movies of his youth.
I knew that, but I don't regard it as a ripoff at all, unless you regard
The Roaring Twenties as a ripoff of earlier gangster movies, or The
Searchers a ripoff of earlier westerns... why shouldn't he work in a
genre? Why shouldn't he bring enough Merchant-Ivory taste and
respectability to one that a pretty good example of the genre is a big hit
among people incapable of watching something like Peking Opera Blues
without mocking the dubbing and the rapid-fire switching between
seriousness and comedy?
R H Draney
>
> In article <140220011802415518%jb...@eskimo.com>, Jeremy Bond Shepherd says...
> >
> >In article <20010213135249...@ng-ft1.aol.com>, CineStudy
> ><cine...@aol.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon is a real swashbuckler unlike any other that we
> >> have seen in years.
> >
> >To my eyes it was like every other of the dozens of Chinese "flying
> >people" movies I've seen on KTSF.
>
> Lee himself, recreating the King Hu movies of his youth.
Even the characters seem to be aware that they're doing things that are
impossible...witness the first thing the monk says when he corners the
bandit (not giving away the identity here) in the courtyard: "Had enough
flying for today?"....
It's a stylistic convention, nothing more or less, and if you're
immersed in the culture you just accept it...like any fight scene (in a
talkie) where punches are so heavily Foley'd that you'd think they'd
bring down a warehouse...or the hero runs across the entire city at top
speed to follow the kidnapper's instructions and is neither sweating nor
out of breath when he picks up the next payphone....r
--
"Police do have flirtations with other breeds but there is nothing to
equal
the German shepherd if properly bred."
Stephen Cooke
On Sat, 17 Feb 2001, Precode wrote:
> Anyway, to answer your question, there are. Tom Hanks is the obvious first
> choice, followed by George Clooney. Most people give Mel Gibson, Harrison Ford,
> Tom Cruise, Julia Roberts, Robin Williams and, yes, Adam Sandler and Drew
> Barrymore pretty high marks on the nice scale (which is not to say they won't
> throw their weight around when they have to). Val Kilmer used to top the Most
> Obnoxious list, but Crowe seems to be gaining on him; many of the ex-SNLers,
> notably Chevy Chase and Bill Murray, are also royal pains. (And I can personally
> confirm that Billy Crystal is nowhere nearly as charming in person as he is on
> stage.) I believe that Ashley Judd, Helen Hunt and Lucy Liu are among those
> who've recently turned into divas, while some, such as Shelley Long, are going
> the reform route (as have Willis and Stallone).
>
> Probably more than you needed to know...
Hmmm...well, I once did a phoner with Mel Gibson, and he was most
gracious, even when talking about some of the hubbub behind the scenes on
Payback, and even let the interview go a bit long. Ashley Judd, on the
other hand, stood me up for an interview on the set of Simon Birch. So,
there ya go.
> Mike S.
> (who's bigger than Calvin Coolidge--put together!)
Stephen
If I could be Mackenzie King for a day...
Constance Kuriyama
> Constance Kuriyama wrote:
>
>> Archie Waugh (glam...@gte.net) writes:
>> > Have you SEEN Russell Crowe's body? It's no thrill.
>>
>> Have you? Mind telling us where? ;-)
>
> several other prospects...he's mostly back-lit, but what you can see is none too
> impressive. About as blah physically as Costner.
He supposedly has a nude scene in one of his Australian films--I've never
seen it, of course.
>> You obviously haven't seen _Fall of the Roman Empire_.
>
> Yeah...they had too many clothes on in that one too!
>
>> But doesn't Joaquin
>> Phoenix have a fencing scene in which he's pretty well stripped down?
>
> If it was there, it flew by...I surely would have noticed him stripped down.
He was in the background, but there was one.
>> (besides, so much of the plot is a shameless rip-off of
>> > Braveheart anyway
>>
>> Fortunately, any resemblance escaped me.
>
> It was more structural than literal, but a lame (to me) attempt to push many of the
> same buttons, especially when wife is slain, etc., to build up sympathy for the main
> character. It might have worked with an actor with more charisma (like, say, Mel
> Gibson) but it left me flat.
Funny thing is that it didn't work for me when it was Gibson, so I conclude
this is all subjective on *both* our parts. But it's probably a good
thing that everyone doesn't have the same taste. :-)
Constance Kuriyama
> Thank you, Connie! I can't tell you how amazed I was that ANYONE thought she was
> dead at the end, and have slowly realized that most everyone I discuss it with
> thinks she's dead. It simply never occurred to me; I perceived the scene exactly
> as you did.
>
>
>> Old Rose isn't dead at the end of _Titanic_--just enjoying a pleasant dream
>> of reconciliation with a dead world. Rather original, I thought.
I'm not sure why anyone would think she was dead. Probably because she
imagines herself back with Jack, but why on an unsunken ship, and why with
everyone's approval?
It's a dream.
Constance Kuriyama
> In article <3A8CE0CB...@gte.net>, Archie Waugh <glam...@gte.net> wrote:
>
>> Thank you, Connie! I can't tell you how amazed I was that ANYONE
> thought she was
>> dead at the end, and have slowly realized that most everyone I discuss it with
>> thinks she's dead. It simply never occurred to me; I perceived the
> scene exactly
>> as you did.
>> Archie Waugh
>>
>> Constance Kuriyama wrote:
>>
>> > Old Rose isn't dead at the end of _Titanic_--just enjoying a pleasant dream
>> > of reconciliation with a dead world. Rather original, I thought.
>> >
>
> She's 134, she's unburdened herself of everything, she lays down, she is
> welcomed into the company of the dead...
>
> ...and we're not supposed to think she just passed away?
She's lying there surrounded by her pictures, smiling happily, and imagining a
world better than the one she knew. Why should I think she *is* dead?
Besides she's got that goldfish to take care of. (Loved the goldfish.)
Constance Kuriyama
> non-verbal moment in "Gladiator" takes place when Maximus is scraping off
> his tattoo (OUCH), Juba asks him, "Won't the gods be angry?" and Maximus
> shoots him this sardonic smile under which a look of momentary insanity
> lurks.
I think we'd find that if the relatively few lines he does speak were
transcribed, they'd lose all their impact. In itself the dialogue of the
film is not exceptional.
I also give Ridley Scott credit for recognizing Crowe's ability and keeping
out of his way. Not all directors have that much discretion.
Constance Kuriyama
> Actually, DreamWorks bought the remake rights to FALL OF THE ROMAN EMPIRE for
> this epic...which renders the "Best Original Screenplay" nomination even more of
> a joke.
The resemblance to _Fall_ is only partial at best. But it doesn't deserve
a nomination for screenplay. For one thing, there isn't much of a script,
and what script there is isn't what makes the film work for people who like it.
Constance Kuriyama
> In article <96ek07$k95$1...@sshuraaa-i-1.production.compuserve.com>, Chris Connelly
> s
>>there ANY actors today in $1M+/film club (Carey, Damon, Banderas, et al) who
>>actually behave like those of the old school?
>>
>
> $1 million? Hell, Paul Reiser and Helen Hunt were making that PER EPISODE in the
> last year of MAD ABOUT YOU.
>
> Anyway, to answer your question, there are. Tom Hanks is the obvious first
> choice, followed by George Clooney.
Niceness, like preferences in films, seems to be a matter of perception.
Clooney reminds me of every crude male I've ever detested.
> (And I can personally confirm that Billy Crystal is nowhere nearly as
> charming in person as he is on stage.)
God, he *must* be dreadful. Just the sight of him offends me.
James Russell
Kuriyama) wrote:
>I also give Ridley Scott credit for recognizing Crowe's ability and keeping
>out of his way. Not all directors have that much discretion.
After seeing "Hannibal" yesterday, I would think twice about using the
word "discretion" in relation to Ridley Scott.
--
James R.
http://www.ans.com.au/~jgwr/
Celluloid Dreams http://www.2ser.com Monday 7-7.30pm AEST
Fred Tepper
who died in the sinking and she was now joining them. Anyway, if you look
at it storywise, her life had come to an end; returning the diamond was the
last thing she needed to do to complete her life. Plus, I happen to *know*
from direct word of mouth that she died. You might also notice the lack of
breathing before it dissolves to the sunken ship.
It's a similar ending to that of "Somewhere In Time" although in that one he
doesn't die, but rather wills himself (as she did) into some kind of limbo
state. It's not the first time Cameron has looked to that film-- The
Terminator is basically a "Somewhere In Time" remake (guy from future sees
picture of woman from past, then travels back in time to meet her and they
fall in love, and it turns out that she was actually thinking of him when
the picture was taken).
--
-=Fred=-
(Remove the x in the e-mail address if replying privately)
"Constance Kuriyama" <do...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA> wrote in message
news:96l363$jfu$1...@freenet9.carleton.ca...
Stephen Cooke
On 17 Feb 2001, Constance Kuriyama wrote:
> Archie Waugh (glam...@gte.net) writes:
> > Constance Kuriyama wrote:
> >
> >> Archie Waugh (glam...@gte.net) writes:
> >> > Have you SEEN Russell Crowe's body? It's no thrill.
> >>
> >> Have you? Mind telling us where? ;-)
> >
> > There is one brief scene in Gladiator, when he is first enslaved, he's lined up with
> > several other prospects...he's mostly back-lit, but what you can see is none too
> > impressive. About as blah physically as Costner.
>
> He supposedly has a nude scene in one of his Australian films--I've never
> seen it, of course.
You could always check out Virtuosity...there's a fair amount of Crowe on
display in that one.
Stephen
But he gets killed in the end...a murder of Crowe.
Stephen Cooke
On 17 Feb 2001, Constance Kuriyama wrote:
Does this mean he's as nasty as his mime caterer in Spinal Tap (it might
be in the outtakes...clearly he hasn't perfected his "likeable schlemiel"
screen persona).
Stephen
Stephen Cooke
On Sat, 17 Feb 2001, James Russell wrote:
> On 17 Feb 2001 06:12:45 GMT, do...@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Constance
> Kuriyama) wrote:
>
> >I also give Ridley Scott credit for recognizing Crowe's ability and keeping
> >out of his way. Not all directors have that much discretion.
>
> After seeing "Hannibal" yesterday, I would think twice about using the
> word "discretion" in relation to Ridley Scott.
BIG SPOILER AHEAD...
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
After the final scene had unspooled, all I could think of was "The brain
entree stays mainly on the plane."
I figure Mike S.'s return has something to do with it...
Stephen
Michael Gebert
(Constance Kuriyama) wrote:
Sez you.
She's verrrrry old, she's unburdened herself of both her story and her
cursed jewel, she lays down to sleep and we see her joined with all the
other dead people as the camera pans over the mementoes of a full life.
She's dead.
I am as surprised that people didn't take it that way as people evidently
are that I did.
Archie Waugh
the pudding as to what's on screen, and what's on screen is obviously wide open
to personal interpretation.
From where I stand, it's a dream.
Archie Waugh
Archie Waugh
"Dreaming!"
"Dead!"
"Dreaming!"
"Dead!"
"Dreaming!"
Nope, I don't see a resolution here.
:-)
AW