CLUE OF THE NEW PIN (1929) and Hitchcock's BLACKMAIL
Ken Mogg
contributions on this topic - concerning the first British talkie
feature - back on 17 May and thereabouts. Since then, some assiduous
research in the UK, notably by Jeremy Jago, who originally gave a
paper on THE CLUE OF THE NEW PIN in Nottingham in 2001, has been
uncovered. It appears to show fairly conclusively that, despite an
announcement in 'The Bioscope' in January 1929, THE CLUE OF THE NEW
PIN (part-scripted by Edgar Wallace from his novel) was never released
with sound at all. That leaves Hitchcock's BLACKMAIL as pretty much
the obvious and rightful claimant to be the first genuine British
talkie feature.
Full detail, including a lot of interesting background material, about
all of the above, is currently posted in the "Editor's Day" feature
(entries for 22 June and 23 June) of the Hitchcock
Scholars/'MacGuffin' website's News & Comment page
(http://www.labyrinth.net.au/~muffin/news-home_c.html).
(The same feature is currently starting a thread on the influence on
Hitchcock of the Bulldog Drummond novels, play versions, and films.)
- Ken Mogg (Ed., 'The MacGuffin').
Website: http://www.labyrinth.net.au/~muffin
Max Nineteennineteen
> Again I thank Ed Hulse and Luke McKernan for their very helpful
> contributions on this topic - concerning the first British talkie
> feature - back on 17 May and thereabouts. Since then, some assiduous
> research in the UK, notably by Jeremy Jago, who originally gave a
> paper on THE CLUE OF THE NEW PIN in Nottingham in 2001, has been
> uncovered. It appears to show fairly conclusively that, despite an
> announcement in 'The Bioscope' in January 1929, THE CLUE OF THE NEW
> PIN (part-scripted by Edgar Wallace from his novel) was never released
> with sound at all. That leaves Hitchcock's BLACKMAIL as pretty much
> the obvious and rightful claimant to be the first genuine British
> talkie feature.
David Shipman in The Story of Cinema, however, says that a movie
called Kitty, directed by Victor Saville, beat Blackmail to being the
first silent partly refilmed to include (three reels of) sound, which
it seems to me is a fairer description of the state of Blackmail than
"first genuine British talkie feature"; he also mentions a Herbert
Wilcox production called Black Waters, shot in America however with
American stars, which seems to me to just make it possibly the first
Hollywood talkie produced by a Briton, and if that makes it a British
film then The Jazz Singer is Canada's first talkie (some at least of
the Warners having been born there); and then, in an aide, seems to
give the crown of first British movie filmed from beginning to end as
a talkie (The Lights of New York, so to speak) to something called
Taxi for Two, produced by Michael Balcon and lost. So how do all
those fit in?
Rich Wagner
> partly re-filmed to include (three reels of)
> sound, which it seems to me is a fairer
> description of the state of Blackmail than "first
> genuine British talkie feature";
If "The Jazz Singer" qualifies as the first "talkie" in America, and
it is much more than 50% a silent film with music and title cards, why
in the world wouldn't "Blackmail" be considered the film that introduced
synchronized voice (or the "Talkie") to Britain?
Judging from Hitchcock's interview in "Cinema Hollywood", even he
wasn't aware at the time of the significance of what he created when he
re-shot nearly the entire film over in sound.
Just imagine what it must have been like for theatre goers: The film
begins like many other films that included synchronized sound effects in
addition to simple music. This was no big surprise as most had
experienced this before. Then, voices are heard in the theatre, but
since the actors have their backs turned on the screen, this too is
something that they had seen before in films like "Piccadilly".
Then comes the big surprise. As Fred meets Alice White, the audience
for the first time sees the lips moving as they hear the words. The
film comes alive with sound like they have never seen before!
What they don't know (and this is even more unbelievable), the voice
that they hear coming so convincingly from Anny Ondra's lips belongs to
another actress talking into a off stage microphone while Anny mouths
the words.
What a great film "Blackmail" is. Beginning as a traditional modern
synchronized sound silent and then progressing to a full fledged talkie,
the film is a bigger masterpiece than Hitchcock ever imagined. At least
that's my opinion.
Rich Wagner
WWW
> If "The Jazz Singer" qualifies as the first "talkie" in America, and
> it is much more than 50% a silent film with music and title cards, why
> in the world wouldn't "Blackmail" be considered the film that introduced
> synchronized voice (or the "Talkie") to Britain?
>
>This was no big surprise as most had
> experienced this before. Then, voices are heard in the theatre, but
> since the actors have their backs turned on the screen, this too is
> something that they had seen before in films like "Piccadilly".
> Then comes the big surprise. As Fred meets Alice White, the audience
> for the first time sees the lips moving as they hear the words. The
> film comes alive with sound like they have never seen before!
I know these were not exactly features, but sound may not have been
quite such a surprise to some British audiences as might be now thought.
Sound film in Britain was being shown fairly regularly to music hall
audiences from 1900. Obviously these did not have the same marketable
value as The Jazz Singer, but it was synchronized sound none the less.
The first system used was Walter Gibbons Phono-Bio-Tableaux, these
little sound films were very popular with audiences and performers
alike, Vesta Tilley and the immensely popular Mr. Chirgwin were amongst
the first to be seen and heard on the screen and in 1905 many artists
were using Gaumont's Chronophone to showcase songs. Perhaps by 1927
people had forgotten these or perhaps not been born when they were
popular, then they would I am sure been most surprised when people
opened their mouths and words came out!
I wrote a bit about this in an article I was asked to do on early
British comedy for the British Cinema Resource. The whole thing, if
anyone's interested, is on
http://www.zenbullets.com/britfilm/article.php?art=history the index
page is http://www.britishfilm.org.uk
As a side note, the Piccadilli Theatre in London was the first cinema
specifically built for sound in the UK, when I worked their in the 70's
they were still using the power supply, switches and rectifiers
originally used for the projectors for the carbon arc follow spots - and
jolly scary it was too, Frankenstein's lab had nothing on it!
> What a great film "Blackmail" is. Beginning as a traditional modern
> synchronized sound silent and then progressing to a full fledged talkie,
> the film is a bigger masterpiece than Hitchcock ever imagined. At least
> that's my opinion.
>
> Rich Wagner
It is one of my favourite films.
WWW
Luke McKernan
> it is much more than 50% a silent film with music and title cards, why
> in the world wouldn't "Blackmail" be considered the film that introduced
> synchronized voice (or the "Talkie") to Britain?
>
The only lesson to be drawn from this saga is never EVER say that any film
is a 'first' of some sort. It's a logical absurdity.
Luke
**********************************************************
Who's Who of Victorian Cinema
http://www.victorian-cinema.net
Charles Urban, Motion Picture Pioneer
http://website.lineone.net/~luke.mckernan/Urban.htm
Luke McKernan
> little sound films were very popular with audiences and performers
> alike, Vesta Tilley and the immensely popular Mr. Chirgwin were amongst
> the first to be seen and heard on the screen and in 1905 many artists
> were using Gaumont's Chronophone to showcase songs. Perhaps by 1927
> people had forgotten these or perhaps not been born when they were
> popular, then they would I am sure been most surprised when people
> opened their mouths and words came out!
>
> I wrote a bit about this in an article I was asked to do on early
> British comedy for the British Cinema Resource. The whole thing, if
> anyone's interested, is on
> http://www.zenbullets.com/britfilm/article.php?art=history the index
> page is http://www.britishfilm.org.uk
>
I couldn't find any mention of early sound films in your piece on British
film (which unfortunately has a number of errors in it). It's probably a
little misleading to imply that primitive sound sytems such as Gibbons'
Bio-Tableaux were synchronised to the degree that audiences encountered in
the late 1920s. The various 'synchronised' sound systems of the 1900s - the
Cinephone, the Cinematophone, the Vivaphone etc - were haphazard in the
degree of synchronicity they could offer, with only Hepworth's Vivaphone
standing up to much scrutiny. Also on the British scene you have to
acknowledge Eugene Lauste pre-WWI sound-on-film experiments, the Grindell
Matthews system of the early 20s, and of course the successful De Forest
Phonofilm system, which put many sound-on-film short subjects before the
public from the mid-20s.
Stephen Cooke
On Wed, 30 Jun 2004, Luke McKernan wrote:
> The only lesson to be drawn from this saga is never EVER say that any film
> is a 'first' of some sort. It's a logical absurdity.
I believe Manos: The Hands of Fate is the first El Paso fertilizer
magnate-produced horror film.
swac
WWW
> I couldn't find any mention of early sound films in your piece on British
> film
I'm presuming it is in there somewhere, I wrote on the subjects I was
asked to, sent them to the web master who divided everything into small
sections and re-edited as he saw fit then scattered them around the
site. I have not tried to navigate it much so I am not sure what links
to what!
(which unfortunately has a number of errors in it).
If you have the time I would appreciate it if you would email any
corrections so I can pass them on to the web master. My sources were
primarily old encyclopedias, film and period theatre articles and the
London Science Museum for that section.
It's probably a
> little misleading to imply that primitive sound sytems such as Gibbons'
> Bio-Tableaux were synchronised to the degree that audiences encountered in
> the late 1920s.
I wasn't so much pointing out that the quality and accuracy were the
same as the later '20's formats but more that people had experienced
sound film with the performer's face visible rather than the back of
their head or music and sound effects. Mind you, I've seen much more
recent films run so much out of sync that even the earliest attempts of
synchronization would have looked perfect!
WWW
Max Nineteennineteen
That's what you think now. Wait till my research is done.
Seriously, that was the point of my original post (as in that whole
"last silent film" thread some months back)-- the only way you arrive
at an answer is by making a series of definitions.
For me, personally, Blackmail is the last great British silent film,
not the first talkie. (Possibly also the only great British silent
film, but I'm waiting for Hindle Wakes!)
Mile Films
first talkie. (Possibly also the only great British silent film, but I'm
waiting for Hindle Wakes!) >>
Actually 1927-1929 was an amazing time for British silents with Hindle Wakes,
Dupont's Moulin Rouge and Piccadilly, the Asquith films, Grierson's docs,
Hitchcock's Lodger and Blackmail (though I prefer the sound version myself),
and some other great and near-great features that ANY national cinema would
have been proud of making during a three-year period. (And don't say that some
of these films' qualities were due to foreign directors because then you have
to remove Murnau, Seastrom, Lubitsch and all those from the history of American
cinema!)
They had a series at the BFI's National Film Theatre this year that I'm truly
sorry to have missed. You can see some clips and read the schedule at
http://www.bfi.org.uk/showing/nft/featurearchive/20s/index.html
I don't think the series was seen by enough people to dispel film writers from
starting every damned British film history with "Although British silent cinema
was terminally boring, such and such a film was a masterpiece," but it really
should have!
Dennis Doros
Milestone Film & Video
website: www.milestonefilms.com
Ken Mogg
> David Shipman in The Story of Cinema [...] says that a movie
> called Kitty, directed by Victor Saville, beat Blackmail to being the
> first silent partly refilmed to include (three reels of) sound, which
> it seems to me is a fairer description of the state of Blackmail than
I think Shipman may be mistaken, or anyway is misleading.
In Victor Saville's autobiography (which my friend Tony Williams
looked up for me tonight), he mentions that KITTY was finished after
General Electric had worked out its sound system - indicating that the
film was (initially, or essentially) released silent.
Also, as I've already passed on to Luke McKernan - and this seems to
clarify the matter - Brian McFarlane emailed me in May to say that
he was in touch with the son, Jonathan Croall, of John Stuart (one of
the stars of KITTY), who told Brian recently: 'It was, mercifully, a
silent film. I think, though I'm not sure, that BLACKMAIL was the
first
all-talkie. Dialogue was added to the end of KITTY ...'
By contrast to KITTY - as someone else has indicated here in a
splendid post - BLACKMAIL has sound all the way through, though of
course the first reel is music and effects only - leading to the
thrilling moment when Anny Ondra's lips first speak words that are
visibly and demonstrably hers (except, of course, that they're not -
they're Joan Barry's!!!).
- Ken Mogg.
Lloyd Fonvielle
> Actually 1927-1929 was an amazing time for British silents with Hindle Wakes,
> Dupont's Moulin Rouge and Piccadilly, the Asquith films, Grierson's docs,
> Hitchcock's Lodger and Blackmail (though I prefer the sound version myself),
> and some other great and near-great features that ANY national cinema would
> have been proud of making during a three-year period.
Throw in Hitchcock's "The Farmer's Wife", too -- a first-rate film by
any standard.
Some comments on it here:
http://home.earthlink.net/~fabulousnowhere/id37.html
Precode
> > If "The Jazz Singer" qualifies as the first "talkie" in America, and
> > it is much more than 50% a silent film with music and title cards, why
> > in the world wouldn't "Blackmail" be considered the film that introduced
> > synchronized voice (or the "Talkie") to Britain?
> >
>
>
> The only lesson to be drawn from this saga is never EVER say that any film
> is a 'first' of some sort. It's a logical absurdity.
>
> Luke
GODZILLA 2000 is the first Godzilla movie to include a line in Yiddish.
Mike S.
(Oy! A monster already!)
Rich Wagner
"Blackmail". It's officially regarded as Hitchcock's last silent film.
But now we're getting off the subject.
It may be all silent, but this film positively screams at the end as the
villagers watch Philip and Kate take the baby away from poor Pete.
Rodney Sauer
> << For me, personally, Blackmail is the last great British silent film, not the
> first talkie. (Possibly also the only great British silent film, but I'm
> waiting for Hindle Wakes!) >>
>
> Actually 1927-1929 was an amazing time for British silents with Hindle Wakes,
> Dupont's Moulin Rouge and Piccadilly, the Asquith films, Grierson's docs,
> Hitchcock's Lodger and Blackmail (though I prefer the sound version myself),
> and some other great and near-great features that ANY national cinema would
> have been proud of making during a three-year period.
And if you're in Colorado, please come see our presentation of NELL
GWYNN (1926) with live music on Wednesday, July 14. While the imported
Dorothy Gish is the best part of the picture, she's in almost every
scene, and I find that with a live audience the film really comes
alive. And it has probably the most positive and unVictorian attitude
about having sex with a guy you aren't married to of any silent film
I've ever seen. Probably because (a) you can't get away from Nell
being a mistress, that's the whole reason for her fame, and (b) Nell
is still seen as a heroine in English history.
Rodney Sauer
Mont Alto Motion Picture Orchestra
www.mont-alto.com
Ken Mogg
> Mile Films wrote:
[snip]
> Throw in Hitchcock's "The Farmer's Wife", too -- a first-rate film by
> any standard.
>
> Some comments on it here:
>
> http://home.earthlink.net/~fabulousnowhere/id37.html
Thanks hugely for that URL, Lloyd. Though I think that I may have
enjoyed Gordon Harker's 'rusticated' antics more than the reviewer in
question, I can only agree about the excellence of THE FARMER'S WIFE
overall.
Actually, some ramblings by yours truly (originally in my "Editor's
Day" column) went up on a separate page of the Hitchcock
Scholars/'MacGuffin' website recently, extolling (and also
part-explicating) THE FARMER'S WIFE.
The URL is:
http://www.labyrinth.net.au/~muffin/hitchcock_films_c.html
Cheers - Ken Mogg.
Website: http://www.labyrinth.net.au/~muffin
(an outstanding full-time online resource for scholars and others)
Igenlode Wordsmith
>
> Actually 1927-1929 was an amazing time for British silents
[snip]
> They had a series at the BFI's National Film Theatre this year that I'm truly
> sorry to have missed. You can see some clips and read the schedule at
>
> http://www.bfi.org.uk/showing/nft/featurearchive/20s/index.html
>
Oh, I saw those!
The Barbican jazz "Piccadilly", "The Fox Farm", "The Only Way", the
three films of the "Rat" series, "Shooting Stars" (mmm), "Underground",
"The Vagabond Queen" and the 'Barrel of Laughs' compilation - I wish
now I'd seen more of them, but when I started I'd no idea I was going
to get the bug. So you have one convert at least :-)
--
Igenlode Wordsmith <Igenl...@nym.alias.net>
See my film reviews at http://comments.imdb.com/user/ur1448185/comments
Luke McKernan
special on British silent cinema, by Matthew Sweet. It's on at 5.30, but
should be accessible online after that for a week via the website
(www.bbc.co.uk/radio4).
Luke
**********************************************************
Who's Who of Victorian Cinema
http://www.victorian-cinema.net
Charles Urban, Motion Picture Pioneer
http://website.lineone.net/~luke.mckernan/Urban.htm
"Igenlode Wordsmith" <Use-Author-Address-Header@[127.1]> wrote in message
news:2004070303214...@riot.eu.org...
Richard Roberts
Luke McKernan wrote:
>
> There is a radio programme on BBC Radio 4 today, 'Back Row', which has a
> special on British silent cinema, by Matthew Sweet. It's on at 5.30, but
> should be accessible online after that for a week via the website
> (www.bbc.co.uk/radio4).
>
> Luke
>
A radio show on silent cimena? The clips will look fantastic!
RICHARD M ROBERTS (who once actually did readers theatre for the deaf)
Luke McKernan
news:40E6F557...@earthlink.net...
>
>
> A radio show on silent cimena? The clips will look fantastic!
>
>
The pictures aren't great, but you do get Neil Brand and an interview with
Britain's oldest living film actress, Joan Morgan.
The full URL for the programme recording is
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/arts/backrow/backrow.shtml
Ken Mogg
[snip]
> What a great film "Blackmail" is. Beginning as a traditional modern
> synchronized sound silent and then progressing to a full fledged talkie,
> the film is a bigger masterpiece than Hitchcock ever imagined. At least
> that's my opinion.
I certainly meant what I wrote here the other day about Rich's
splendid post. (Btw, I notice that he is also a poster to the
<alt.movies.hitchcock> site. It figures!) So much so, that I did a
little item about it tonight, July 5, on the Hitchcock
Scholars/'MacGuffin' site, including reference to a couple of small
differences (of many) between the silent and sound versions of
BLACKMAIL. Anyone interested can go to:
http://www.labyrinth.net.au/~muffin/news-home_c.html
- Ken Mogg.
Dr. Giraud
From: Richard Roberts repro...@earthlink.net
Date: Sat, Jul 3, 2004 2:03 PM
Message-id: <40E6F557...@earthlink.net>
Luke McKernan wrote:
>
> There is a radio programme on BBC Radio 4 today, 'Back Row', which has a
> special on British silent cinema, by Matthew Sweet. It's on at 5.30, but
> should be accessible online after that for a week via the website
> (www.bbc.co.uk/radio4).
>
> Luke
>
A radio show on silent cimena? The clips will look fantastic! >>
There's a NY TIMES story from 1924, that ran on the review pages & is included
in their published anthology of reviews, describing a NYC screening of
Rin-Tin-Tin's LIGHTHOUSE BY THE SEA for a blind audience. Someone read the
titles and descibed the action, while the organist played. The audience was
reported to have loved it, and were yelling and cheering.
Shawn Stone
"Editors have a tendency to put themselves on a pedestal above their readers."
"If I sat on a cigar box, I'd be above ours."
--Oscar Apfel & Edward G. Robinson in FIVE STAR FINAL