Just before our hero leaves Domino's apartment on his way to the cafe,
he gets a call from his wife, and there is a copy of "Introducing
Sociology" prominently displayed, as he is talking to her. Surely
Robert Merton has a chapter of his own in this book.
Merton's theory on deviance stems from his 1938 analysis of the
relationship between culture, structure and anomie. Merton defines
culture as an "organized set of normative values governing behavior
which is common to members of a designated society or group." Social
structures are the "organized set of social relationships in which
members of the society or group are variously implicated." 
Anomie, state of normlessness, then occurs when there is "an acute
disjunction between the cultural norms and goals and the socially
structured capacities of members of the group to act in accord with
them."  In his theory, Merton links anomie with deviance and
argues that the discontinuity between culture and structure have the
dysfunctional consequence of leading to deviance within society .
The term anomie, derived from Émile Durkheim, for Merton means: a
discontinuity between cultural goals and the legitimate means
available for reaching them. Applied to the United States he sees
the American dream as an emphasis on the goal of monetary success but
without the corresponding emphasis on the legitimate avenues to march
toward this goal. In other words, Merton believes that all subscribe
to the American Dream, but the ways in which people go about obtaining
the Dream are not the same because not everyone has the same
opportunities and advantages as the next person. This leads to a
considerable amount of (the Parsonian term of) deviance. This theory
is commonly used in the study of criminology (specifically the strain
The following article refers on the book, but without making the
Interesting, though not unrealistic, that a "hooker" would have
textbooks in her library--not to mention "Shadows on the Mirror."
Merton is frequently mentioned in connection to Club of Rome and
Maybe he was at the ceremony, maybe he is Red Cloak, maybe that is
SK's secret message there.:)
I find no such connections anywhere online. Links?
There is another Robert Merton, an economist. The son...
an economist, he was connected with a hedge-fund scandal that some
call a financial scam, in the news during the filming of the movie.
"Together with Myron Scholes, Merton was among the board of directors
of Long-Term Capital Management (LTCM), a hedge fund that failed
spectacularly in 1998 after losing $4.6 billion in less than four
months. The Federal Reserve was so concerned about the potential
impact of LTCM's failure on the financial system that it arranged for
a group of 19 banks and other firms to provide sufficient liquidity
for the banking system to survive. Although these investors were
eventually paid off, the reputation of Merton and Scholes were
So, that would put the father, born in the lower middle class, in the
position defining the relationship of the elite to the rest of
society, and the son in the position of perhaps being one of those
elite. Just the kind of irony that Kubrick would appreciate, allowing
the economy of commenting on both sides at once.
Yes i know Robert K and Robert C are father son.
Robert K wrote a book with Umberto Ecco years back. Ecco wrote a
Forward for him. And book dedications Who of course wrote name of the
rose and those other secret society books
Before I realized what a crazy scam the Club of Rome and the
malthusian psychosis was, I was reading all that and Merton books were
cited alot. i don't remember the details. The whole idea of a "self-
fulfilling prophecy" is like the parnoid catastrophic expectation.
that worrying about the end of the world is a self fulfilling prophecy
and the principle can be used if you believe.
Robert C is all about globalization.
I don't have time atm to look further, but interesting .
Merton was a very influential person very much a darling of a certain
segment of social engineers,
Merton is listed in Club of Madrid also, another social engineering
You seem intent on implicating one or both of the Mertons in nefarious
activity. Too strongly stated?
Do you believe that social engineering of any kind is necessary today?
Do you believe that all members of the Club of Rome subscribe to the
same methods of social engineering?
Might Merton Sr. have been involved in the abovementioned groups
BECAUSE of a difference of philosophy in the implementation of social
Could those who use Merton's terms and data actually use his name to
advance social engineering agendas which differ from his own?
Think Nietzsche here...
Is it possible that Sr. and Jr. are radically different in their
philosophies and their attitudes?
Yes too strongly stated, through the imagined EWS filter, but I
watched some youtube videos with Robert C and Paul Samuelson were
talking to refresh my memory as to where he was at, and notice how
often he used the word "global"
I'm not into globalization at all. I used to think that way years
ago, then realized that is idiotic, idealistic and naive.
Robert K had some brilliant ideas and was very central to Socialogy
and Social Engineering theory. Is that nefarious?
It is if they are manipulating people IMO. Social engineering to me
is repugnant and unnecessary and by it's very nature includes the
Last night I watched the new Richard Kelly film "THE BOX" It had bad
reviews so I expected to be disappointed, but it was a pretty trippy
film. Not to give anything away to those who havent seen it,
conspiracy is involved and a diabolical social engineering going on.
> Do you believe that social engineering of any kind is necessary today?
Only laws arrived at through correct Constitutional process not
progressivism or ideology.
> Do you believe that all members of the Club of Rome subscribe to the
> same methods of social engineering?
No, but I think there is a general atttitude which at one time I
> Might Merton Sr. have been involved in the abovementioned groups
> BECAUSE of a difference of philosophy in the implementation of social
> engineering methods?
I just know that even brilliant people can go through long periods of
naivite and blind spots in their thinking--best example of that I use
is HG Wells.
> Could those who use Merton's terms and data actually use his name to
> advance social engineering agendas which differ from his own?
Yes. Very possibly. That would be worth researching further--if for
no other reason then to interpret Kubrick and what messges really are
being imparted. Also it would be very funny to uncover more meaning
like that from EWS, beyond just a book that happened to be on the set
and had no special meaning---fat chance with Kubrick.
> Think Nietzsche here...
> Is it possible that Sr. and Jr. are radically different in their
> philosophies and their attitudes?- Hide quoted text -
I don't get that impression but I do get the impression that he had
his wealth handed to him on a silver platter. He doesn't strike me as
being the giant brain his dad was.
Until you mentioned it i didn;t think too much about it, taking it
more as a commonly read book that would be owned by a college
student. Perhaps the only meaning was SK making it clear she had been
or was a College Student with a baby---there is that baby carriage
outside the door.
Correction: stroller not carriage
Could be Sally's stroller.
Unrelated I'm sure but there is also that chance that Domino told
Sally to say she had AIDS out of guilt knowing he was married-----
suggesting she was more then just a cheap hooker ---maybe hooking to
take care of her baby---that would also help explain the question as
to why Sally seemed to assume they had had sex. Would Domino lie to
Sally that she had sex with him?
Perhaps there's some sociology at work there too.
So a mother, trying to follow society's goals but there is a
disconnect with her goal and ability to reach it, causing her to hook
after having a baby. That would also mean she wasn't the kind to have
an abortion, implying high standards. Bill's visit knocked her into
reality and she felt guilty, decided to quit hooking but when he
returned she hid telling Sally to "tell him I have aids!"
Yes, fat chance that Kubrick would pass up the opportunity to enrich
Have you read "Shadows on the Mirror"? I think it also adds a lot.
Professional woman/"pro"/elite/murder/class/anomie/deviance etc...
Author Frances Fyfield's bio is interesting also.
If Kubrick is implicating the Mertons as sympathetic to the elite,
whoever they are, it adds to the poignancy, don't you think, given
Merton Sr. characterization of the elite, and the American Dream.
No I haven't read it. Looks interesting. I'll check it out and read
> Professional woman/"pro"/elite/murder/class/anomie/deviance etc...
> Author Frances Fyfield's bio is interesting also.
> If Kubrick is implicating the Mertons as sympathetic to the elite,
> whoever they are, it adds to the poignancy, don't you think, given
> Merton Sr. characterization of the elite, and the American Dream.
I'll have to think about that ("the Poignancy) a while.
The elite have this ability to co-opt others. Wine and Dine them,
romance them and even put them on pedestals. I'd be interested to
find out more to see if there is any real reason to think he became
one of the elite. Sometimes brilliant minds have blind spots when
Be funny if Merton became a leader and not just a theoretician used by
a secret cabal.
Maybe. Wining and dining is more appropriate for celebrities. I think
a more persuasive approach for intellectuals is the intellectual
The scenario goes something like this...
Show them what is just beyond the umbra of their profession.
Political, military, biochemical, psychosocial 'truths' of which they
may not be aware.
The way the Clintons and Obama were sold on the program?
Looking over her books and quick bio she looks interesting.
I guess that is the first book of a big series. i could get into that
if it's good.
One thing about EWS I like to ber able to look at it with the
conspiratorial POV as if we have to start with the premise that EWS is
a message about a REAL:life conspiracy Kubrick was privy too and he is
acting as a whistleblower, rather then it just being him playing with
conspiracy theory for fun and creative mindgames. I find the most
entertainment value in that POV.
If the above premise is true then Sk would somewhere plant clues as to
the identity of these elite.
I never considered the Merton connection that way.
Who is Red Cloak and who is Sandor? in the conspiracy
My Sandor theory
Wine and Dine=Flumux them and dazzle
> The way the Clintons and Obama were sold on the program?
And then perhaps the fear of what would happen were they to blab.:)
Some Hillary expression during the campaign had a dear in the
headlights look on it and then suddenly she basically gave up
campaign, even though she was winning with the popular vote. the
mysterious day trip she and Obama made lving bus loads of journalists
waiting with PR spokesmen on an unscheduled meeting somewhere.
How so many keep getting these mild heart attacks or sudden
hospitalizations .......... from Svensmark the solar scientist AGW
denier, (youtube search svensmark heart attack) whose pacemaker
apparently freaked out in Copenhagen, to Clinton and Limbaugh, Glenn
Beck, Dole and Cheney.
:) IN EWS mode.
Apropos of nothing in particular...
Have you read 'Eyes Wide Open'? Eye opening.
In particular, there is an exchange between the author and Kubrick
about 'two kinds of Jews'.
re: Domino... She asks Dollar Bill for the time as part of sizing him
up. To see what kind of watch he had to go with his suit. "Want to
come inside with me." I love that.
Nevertheless, in my opinion, if she were a typical hooker she would
not have turned down his money. That she did distances her from the
In my opinion, she is not a pro, but more like the protagonist in
'Shadows on the Mirror'-- or in the tradition of the Oscar-laden
hookers with a golden heart... rather than the sexually abused and
neglected painted ladies who typically walk the streets.
In my opinion, she did not have HIV. In keeping with the tone of the
book, because he had no need of Domino's services, Sally lied on her
behalf so he would go home to his family.
In a way, Domino is like many of Kubrick's heroines, and in this case,
she is at the moral center of the story. With the singer serenading
soldiers in the enemy tongue. The defiled daughter marrying the
innocent young man who needs her. The Vietnamese sniper fighting for
freedom. The slave girl winning the heart of a gladiator.
Bill is another story.
There is also the comedic heroine in the novel Candy by Terry
Southern. It has an aspect of self-sacrifice and innocense when Candy
gives herself to others.
> In my opinion, she did not have HIV. In keeping with the tone of the
> book, because he had no need of Domino's services, Sally lied on her
> behalf so he would go home to his family.
> In a way, Domino is like many of Kubrick's heroines, and in this case,
> she is at the moral center of the story. With the singer serenading
> soldiers in the enemy tongue. The defiled daughter marrying the
> innocent young man who needs her. The Vietnamese sniper fighting for
> freedom. The slave girl winning the heart of a gladiator.
> Bill is another story.
Some of Bill may have been Tom Cruise and I wonder what part of Bill
was really SK himself.
Yes I read Eyes Wide Open, but it hit my circular file after the last
The door is opened for him.
He passes the first test in the bathroom at the Ziegler's.
The second test is at the Nathanson's. Result inconclusive. Did you
notice the clumsy greeting between Marion and her fiance? An arranged
But Bill is Bill to the extent that he puts his family in peril
repeatedly, despite being warned, with his indiscretions.
He consents to indiscriminate sex with a woman who may, as far he
knows, have HIV.
He takes a taxi to Somerton. High comedy.
He refuses to take his clothes off at an orgy!
He goes to Nightingale's hotel.
He returns to Somerton and stands expectantly at the gate.
He goes to the hospital to see 'Amanda'.
Did I miss anything?
He drinks beer.
Not exactly a viable candidate.
The door is closed behind him. On his way out.
Have you ever noticed the parallels between EWS and 'The Ninth Gate'?
Submit to the test.
Poor Bill My dad used to say "he'd starve to death with a loaf of
bread under his arm" I think that applies to Bill----i can relate to
that naive state living in Sonambulence and striving for normalness
even when theoretically one has it all figured out.
> Have you ever noticed the parallels between EWS and 'The Ninth Gate'?
Yes in a general sense and no in the specific.
Depp's character is smarter and an action character, not like dull
Bill. Corso was more of a serious Indiana Jones type with only
begrudged ethics or morals.
The woman of course -----But
What parallels do you see?
I am kicking around the idea of going to see Ghost Writer tomorrow
Polanski attracted his disasters. Or should I say "summoned."
So, not recognizing the Bardos................one fails. Selling ones
soul and failing to beat the devil one fails.
This AMK thread I was fooling around with EWS and the Tibetan Book of
the dead and color
'I look at my own childhood in a different way now. I look at it
through the prism of my children and I imagine how my parents
perceived the problems that occurred at the time, which I didn't know
before. My life is the best now it ever was. I had a very happy period
in London too, but that's the past.'
What's he going to do next? 'I wish I knew,' he says. 'Or do I really?
I used to talk on the phone to Stanley Kubrick. These were
conversations which would last sometimes for a long, long time. I
liked him very much. He was brilliant and bright and it was always so
exciting to talk to him because he knew so much about everything. And
he said, 'Don't you hate that interim period when you don't know what
you are going to do next? Why is it from film to film more difficult
to decide what you want to do?'
'And I remember I said 'yes, yes, yes' but I didn't know what he was
talking about. Because in those times it was so easy for me to choose
my next film. But now I know what he meant. One is much more exigeant
- what is this? Demanding? Because you know it takes so much of your
time and energy. It's like taking a dive. You hesitate before you
Odd as it may seem I think that EWS and 'The Ninth Gate' are
deliberate extensions of one another, were made with each other in
part of a Millennial revelation trilogy...
Perhaps Polanski never passed the test--is still taking the test.
I wrote this once:
"I was the young long-haired, buddhist holy. hippie kid hitchhiking
(car was broken) up Benedict Canyon (where my girl friend lived),
getting picked up by an incredible blond in a black Mercedes,
only a lace white sheer top and High Heels. Stoned out of her mind.
wanting me to come up to her new house. Why oh why was I already in
love? How in the world did I turn that down? Guess I was protected.
"I don't know how well I could stand up under torture"
I passed the test or maybe just evaded it for a while.
hmmm, well I love both films although I think Polanski and Frank
Langella blew the ending--such a poorly executed ceremony---then the
image of the girl saved it somewhat.
Whats the third film in that trilogy?
I find it funny how Kubricks work is now all interpreted from so many
conspiratorial angles. SK purists used to poo poo the overly
conspiratorial --but with kubrick you have to think of everything.
Did you read 'The Club Dumas'?
No but i've wanted to, just never got around to it, I've heard its a
There is much more to 'The Ninth Gate' that can only be understood by
reading the book.
While that is true of many adaptations it is central to 'The Ninth
In particular, at 86:33, the scene in the library, Corso is staring at
a picture--the wrong picture. Why is that?
As it turns out, NO ONE in the world (on the Internet anyway) has made
mention of this--even as a continuity error.
Must have been disheartening to Roman and his associates to draw so
little scrutiny at the most important moment in the film.
Although I suggest that there is a subculture quietly aware of the
meaning of that scene.
Again 86:33 in the library... nothing is happening, right? Just enough
time to go to the loo before the music starts up again.
I'll check that out right now see if I had noticed anything previously