Giving Advice To Prospective Riders: I GIVE UP!!!!
Beth
the chicks w/ the R6? never found out what happened as i'm staying away
from liquor joints (nyknyknyk).
so, i've got this other friend who wants a scooter for getting groceries
and other in town things. in town as in around downtown and university
area Austin, where all drivers are crazy and the roads have 23' deep
potholes.
scooter = not bad. actually, scooter = good. scooter get good mileage
and even though we pay 1.30 a gallon for the midrange stuff in parts of
A-town, it's still nice to get 60-120mpg, depending on the bike.
so, TYPE of scooter. Miss Thang doesn't want a "soulless" Japanese
scooter. she's "heard bad things" about the Vino, like it's under
powered and you can't take a passenger. ooookay, oh she who has never
ridden anything motorized with two wheels who is thinking about pillions
so early. she wants a new or old Vespa or a Stella. run Forest, run. i
mention Aprilia. yah. as in the Scabereo. good leetle scoot. has a tail
trunk and i've got friends in town (AF-1 Racing - plug plug) who know
them inside and out. the cabureted model is very upgradable for more
umph with a cylinder, piston, jetting and a different pipe. doesn't
sacrifice mileage as long as you're not too nuts on it. please. it's a
Scabby.
i take her to mentioned establishment where my friends, veteran
motorcycle and scooter formerly of Mototek mechanics and all around good
dudes, lay out the good and the bad about the new Vespa, the Stella the
'Prillah, etc. they point out that there are a lot of Scabbys from 2000,
2001, etc. sitting in back stock brand new she could get for a good
deal. they've got the connections to help her find a bike via their
network of Priller dealers. phone numbers are exchanged. all is good...
i give her 411 on rider training. she doesn't know how to ride a bicycle
well. oh yeah. time to get her in an MSF class with a teacher who will
be patient with her. John at TRIC is the man. i explain how it works and
why it'll be good for her and that it'll get her discounts on a helmet
and insurance, etc. okay, hunky dory... hell, i even offer to DRIVE HER
to the classes. i also CALLED TRIC up, as i know them thru the grapevine
and thru whittling off a ticket or two from taking the ERC, to make sure
they'd accept a prospective scooter rider in the class. A-OK.
we go to various dealerships and look at moto clothing. she has to sit
on a Duc Monster and ask about how much and financing. i quietly explain
to her that she's a grad student and this is a rich person's learner
bike, not that there's anything wrong w/ a Duc at all. great fun.
i show her the joe rocket phoenix and explain that it's a great summer
jacket and only $120. she freaks about a jacket being $120 (shock
horror! she should have seen the price tag on my Vansons!). i explain
that $120 will pay for about 1/1000 of a hospital visit if she gets
nailed by a car or truck and that this jacket will help a lot if she
tumbles. i also insist that she should think very carefully about always
wearing at least a jacket, jeans, strong boots, gloves and a full face
when riding the scooter, even if it's just down to the store. she's got
a good leather jacket for cooler conditions but, hey, this is Austin.
it's 90 in the shade today with 95% humidity. we're the same foot size.
i offer to give her an old pair of my riding boots that will do in a
pinch. she doesn't even bother trying them on and doesn't take them with
her. same with my old Teknic backup gloves that i offered to lend her.
i explain that even though she'll be traveling at ~35mph around town,
that she'll still be sharing the road with the rest of us heathens and
that many, many accidents happen within 5 miles of your house at under
25mph. i show her my bunged up glove from my last get-off at ~25mph from
hydroplaning. of course, the whole "bicyclists fall off of their bikes
all the time at 25mph" argument. with broken collar bones, dislocated
shoulders, broken legs and ROAD RASH, honey!
eyes cloud over. "but...but...but...it's only a scooter."
"let me tell you about a guy named Mike Hardcore..."
suddenly, she's whinging about the color choices and how she really
wants a classic scooter (although she doesn't know a piston from a
penis) and how AF-1 hasn't called them back on finding a bike and how
"she didn't get a good feeling from them and "you treat them like gods"
and "where is the logic in all this." she wants to know if it's ok to
ride in her strappy sandles that are "pretty sturdy, right?"
<Dr. Evil>
Riiiiiiight.
</Dr. Evil>
"Let me tell you about my Bavarian Nightmare...the 1973 BMW 2002. Looked
cool. Needed maintenance 2x a month, including filing points, timing and
general inspection."
"Yahbut Yahbut!"
Floating down the river of Denial.
she sends me this long email about how she just wants logical reasons as
to why i'm saying all the things i'm saying about safety and training
and why this isn't going to be as convenient as she thought. um...
hmmmmm... errr... are you questioning my Ah-thor-ah-tay!?!?!?!?
i give up. i fucking give up. i am NEVER, EVER going to help out a
casual friend on a moto purchase EVER again. NEVER. forget it. buy an
unreliable bike w/o a good parts and dealer network. ride in your
skivvies. don't take the MSF. DO NOT call me for a pickup truck lift
when your stupid vintage eye-talian scooter has gone kablooie on 33rd
and Speedway and you don't know what to do. don't ask me to visit your
stupid ass at Seton as you sit in traction with a broken femur and head
trauma. I GIVE UP!!!!
-Beth
Phyloe
"Beth" > wrote in message
that many, many accidents happen within 5 miles of your house at under
> 25mph.
Yup Ron was within a mile of his house when he hit the deer but he was
going a little faster
> eyes cloud over. "but...but...but...it's only a scooter."
"OH MOM! Will you lighten up! I'm a big girl!" Heh heh ( I know it was
not your daughter)
she wants to know if it's ok to
> ride in her strappy sandles that are "pretty sturdy, right?"
"Pretty sturdy, right?" but cute too?
Saw a guy this morning on his Wing, helmet, sleeveless Tee-shirt, shorts,
WHITE socks and sandals! I am not the epitome of safety but Puleeeze > White
socks and sandals? There is NEVER an occasion where that foot wear is
acceptable EVER! Folks never wear socks with sandals! OK? Black knee socks
with shorts while mowing the lawn is fine though.
Good report, we feel your frustration.
Phyloe
Sunny
news:3F0C76F1...@large.org...
> i give up. i fucking give up. i am NEVER, EVER going to help out a
> casual friend on a moto purchase EVER again. NEVER. forget it. buy an
> unreliable bike w/o a good parts and dealer network. ride in your
> skivvies. don't take the MSF. DO NOT call me for a pickup truck lift
> when your stupid vintage eye-talian scooter has gone kablooie on 33rd
> and Speedway and you don't know what to do. don't ask me to visit your
> stupid ass at Seton as you sit in traction with a broken femur and head
> trauma. I GIVE UP!!!!
>
> -Beth
>
enough to try.
Sunny
Steve 65
>
> "Beth" wrote:
> >
> > i give up. i fucking give up. i am NEVER, EVER going to help out a
> > casual friend on a moto purchase EVER again. NEVER. forget it. buy an
> > unreliable bike w/o a good parts and dealer network. ride in your
> > skivvies. don't take the MSF. DO NOT call me for a pickup truck lift
> > when your stupid vintage eye-talian scooter has gone kablooie on 33rd
> > and Speedway and you don't know what to do. don't ask me to visit your
> > stupid ass at Seton as you sit in traction with a broken femur and head
> > trauma. I GIVE UP!!!!
> >
> enough to try.
IME, the vast majority of casual acquaintances who ask me
for advice on buying motor vehicles do not want advice. They
want someone perceived as an "authority" to validate or
rationalize their emotional choice for them.
S65~
Peckham
I don't believe that Mike has fully recovered yet. Haven't heard much. Last
time I talked to Billy he sort of mentioned that Mike was not doing so well.
Was a while ago.
As to the rest of your story, I sympathize. OTOH, I think it is useful to
give the lecture and if they don't accept it, fuck 'em.
People get all emotional over an idea such as buying a scooter or bike.
Can't reason with that mindset. Hell, I just sold my CB360 to a young woman
who wants to ride again -- no evidence to support the fact she ever rode
before either. She, in haste, and being naive, purchased a CL360 off of
some bloke on eBay. What a piece of crap. I wouldn't have paid 50 cents for
it. She paid $400 and it didn't even have a title. I sympathized with her
situation and sold her my creampuff 360, with slashcuts, and chrome polished
by Girl Wonder, for $250. I bought it for $50 and sunk a whopping $50 into
it. I would have traded it for a couple cases of good beer.
She took it for a ride down the alley where my shop is located. I quickly
turned into a nervous mother as she lurched and jerked her way 50 feet to
the North and then 50 feet to the south. I was sure she'd dump it, stall
it, and brand her leg on the turn-around -- but somehow she made it. I
couldn't hold back yelping, "the cutch, the clutch, don't forget about the
clutch." Clearly a case for MSF class, but I didn't mention it. I bit my
lip, figured she lose interest in motorcycling before she killed herself.
Beth
> "Beth" <bef...@large.org> wrote in message
> news:3F0C76F1...@large.org...
>
>>"let me tell you about a guy named Mike Hardcore..."
>
> I don't believe that Mike has fully recovered yet. Haven't heard much. Last
> time I talked to Billy he sort of mentioned that Mike was not doing so well.
> Was a while ago.
it was a pretty bad accident. i hope he's still getting better. = /
> As to the rest of your story, I sympathize. OTOH, I think it is useful to
> give the lecture and if they don't accept it, fuck 'em.
yup. at least i got my oh-2 in there. that's all i can do.
-Beth
High Plains Thumper
<SNIP>
> so, i've got this other friend who wants a scooter for getting
> groceries and other in town things. in town as in around downtown
> and university area Austin, where all drivers are crazy and the
> roads have 23' deep potholes.
<SNIP>
> so, TYPE of scooter. Miss Thang doesn't want a "soulless" Japanese
> scooter. she's "heard bad things" about the Vino, like it's under
<SNIP>
> we go to various dealerships and look at moto clothing. she has to
> sit on a Duc Monster and ask about how much and financing. i
> quietly explain to her that she's a grad student and this is a
> rich person's learner bike, not that there's anything wrong w/ a
> Duc at all. great fun.
>
> i show her the joe rocket phoenix and explain that it's a great
> summer jacket and only $120. she freaks about a jacket being $120
> (shock horror! she should have seen the price tag on my Vansons!).
> i explain that $120 will pay for about 1/1000 of a hospital visit
<SNIP>
> i explain that even though she'll be traveling at ~35mph around
> town, that she'll still be sharing the road with the rest of us
> heathens and that many, many accidents happen within 5 miles of
> your house at under 25mph. i show her my bunged up glove from my
<SNIP>
> eyes cloud over. "but...but...but...it's only a scooter."
<SNIP>
> suddenly, she's whinging about the color choices and how she
> really wants a classic scooter (although she doesn't know a piston
> from a penis) and how AF-1 hasn't called them back on finding a
> bike and how "she didn't get a good feeling from them and "you
> treat them like gods" and "where is the logic in all this." she
> wants to know if it's ok to ride in her strappy sandles that are
> "pretty sturdy, right?"
<SNIP>
> she sends me this long email about how she just wants logical
> reasons as to why i'm saying all the things i'm saying about
> safety and training and why this isn't going to be as convenient
> as she thought. um... hmmmmm... errr... are you questioning my
> Ah-thor-ah-tay!?!?!?!?
>
> i give up. i fucking give up. i am NEVER, EVER going to help out a
> casual friend on a moto purchase EVER again. NEVER. forget it. buy
> an unreliable bike w/o a good parts and dealer network. ride in
> your skivvies. don't take the MSF. DO NOT call me for a pickup
<SNIP>
Beth, for a leetle advice you gave she seems a leetle stoopid. Your
advice is good, sensible and practical. Unfortunately, she cannot take
good advice and only wants you to support her way. She acts as though
she doesn't know what she really wants, and caters to fashion
statements (there's nothing wrong with Japanese scooters and wants nice
shoes to show off her ankles).
Can we call her a squidette?
bob prohaska
Please don't give up, your stories provide immense amusement!
If, perchance, somebody harks to reason, the rest of us have hope.
bob
Reassembler
"Steve 65" <steve6...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:3F0CA560...@yahoo.com...
> IME, the vast majority of casual acquaintances who ask me
> for advice on buying motor vehicles do not want advice. They
> want someone perceived as an "authority" to validate or
> rationalize their emotional choice for them.
>
going to go to a MSF course, I tell the kids to go, but I never went. Who
knows, I might learn something, and I'll get to ride the weedwackers.
Reassembler
StephG
news:3F0C76F1...@large.org:
> give up. i fucking give up. i am NEVER, EVER going to help out a
> casual friend on a moto purchase EVER again. NEVER. forget it.
You should have learned a long time ago that "No good deed goes unpunished".
If they're a friend, the hard part is to not say "I told you so" if you turn
out to be right and they turn out to be profoundly wrong.
--
~---(_) StephG
(>/ "That which does not kill you,
)/ makes for a good story."
(_)
StephG
news:3F0C76F1...@large.org:
> and "where is the logic in all this." she wants to know if it's ok to
> ride in her strappy sandles that are "pretty sturdy, right?"
Oh yea, local long time scenemaker here in SoCal named Gypsy (who writes for
Thunder Press), who you would just see everywhere and who's been riding
forever, had himself a crash. He was wearing his trademark shorts and
sandals. Lost part of one foot, including the big toe.
I just have to ask. Is your friend blonde?
George Mealer
news:bei8da$rck$1...@nntp3.u.washington.edu:
> I don't believe that Mike has fully recovered yet. Haven't heard much.
> Last time I talked to Billy he sort of mentioned that Mike was not
> doing so well. Was a while ago.
He's fine. Up, around, and you'd barely know he was in an accident. I
think he lost some function in one of his arms, but not so you'd
casually notice. He just can't lift anything super-heavy on that side.
Nowadays, he's on his chopped Monster 900, a relatively stock Duc 999, and
a pimped (neon, stereo, and subwoofer) BMW 1x00RT. I think he's staying
away from scooters. ;)
Geo
--
George Mealer | DoD 2170 | '00 Suzuki GSX1300R
geo*AT*snarksoft*DOT*com
"Alright, it's Saturday night...I have no date, a two-liter bottle
of Shasta, and my all-Rush mix tape. Let's rock!" -- Philip J. Fry
Sunny
news:Xns93B451C...@130.133.1.4...
>
> I just have to ask. Is your friend blonde?
>
Hey now! I resemble that remark!
8-P
Sunny
NZMSC
> i give up. i fucking give up. i am NEVER, EVER going to help out a
> casual friend on a moto purchase EVER again. NEVER. forget it. buy an
> unreliable bike w/o a good parts and dealer network. ride in your
> skivvies. don't take the MSF. DO NOT call me for a pickup truck lift
> when your stupid vintage eye-talian scooter has gone kablooie on 33rd
> and Speedway and you don't know what to do. don't ask me to visit your
> stupid ass at Seton as you sit in traction with a broken femur and head
> trauma. I GIVE UP!!!!
Been there, done that for the past 30 years, Beth.
Some people you just can't help. They have no perception of risk and go like
lambs to the slaughter.
The worst part is they get into trouble and it's the BIKE that gets
blamed...
--
Allan Kirk
New Zealand Motorcycle Safety Consultants
(Saving motorcyclists' lives since 1972)
www.megarider.com
Charles Soto
> Beth wrote:
>
> > i give up. i fucking give up. i am NEVER, EVER going to help out a
> > casual friend on a moto purchase EVER again. NEVER. forget it. buy an
> > unreliable bike w/o a good parts and dealer network. ride in your
> > skivvies. don't take the MSF. DO NOT call me for a pickup truck lift
> > when your stupid vintage eye-talian scooter has gone kablooie on 33rd
> > and Speedway and you don't know what to do. don't ask me to visit your
> > stupid ass at Seton as you sit in traction with a broken femur and head
> > trauma. I GIVE UP!!!!
>
> Been there, done that for the past 30 years, Beth.
>
> Some people you just can't help. They have no perception of risk and go like
> lambs to the slaughter.
>
> The worst part is they get into trouble and it's the BIKE that gets
> blamed...
Or Saddam!
Charles
:)
--
Charles Soto - Austin, TX *** 1979 KZ650, 1999 GSF1200S, DoD No. "uno"
("Meepmeep" is "rr," as in "roadrunner.")
Charles Soto
> On 09 Jul 2003, Beth <bef...@large.org> smacked the keyboard and out came
> news:3F0C76F1...@large.org:
>
> > give up. i fucking give up. i am NEVER, EVER going to help out a
> > casual friend on a moto purchase EVER again. NEVER. forget it.
>
> You should have learned a long time ago that "No good deed goes unpunished".
>
> If they're a friend, the hard part is to not say "I told you so" if you turn
> out to be right and they turn out to be profoundly wrong.
It's okay to do the Nelson voice, though...
"HA HA"
Charles
StephG
keyboard and out came
news:csoto-0129EA....@newsr4.texas.rr.com:
> StephG <Frankeneatshi...@lycos.com> wrote:
>
>> On 09 Jul 2003, Beth <bef...@large.org> smacked the keyboard and out
>> came news:3F0C76F1...@large.org:
>>
>> > give up. i fucking give up. i am NEVER, EVER going to help out a
>> > casual friend on a moto purchase EVER again. NEVER. forget it.
>>
>> You should have learned a long time ago that "No good deed goes
>> unpunished".
>>
>> If they're a friend, the hard part is to not say "I told you so" if you
>> turn out to be right and they turn out to be profoundly wrong.
>
> It's okay to do the Nelson voice, though...
>
> "HA HA"
I'll admit it, I've been known to do that ;)
Smør
> WHITE socks and sandals! I am not the epitome of safety but Puleeeze > White
> socks and sandals? There is NEVER an occasion where that foot wear is
> acceptable EVER! Folks never wear socks with sandals! OK? Black knee socks
> with shorts while mowing the lawn is fine though.
>
> Good report, we feel your frustration.
>
> Phyloe
Black socks and sandals are retro wear for the classic bike
enthusiast. They go well with the Ambassador (see
http://www.studiohair.net/mall/moustaches-beards.asp).
Smør
> i give up. i fucking give up. i am NEVER, EVER going to help out a
> casual friend on a moto purchase EVER again. NEVER. forget it. buy an
> unreliable bike w/o a good parts and dealer network. ride in your
> skivvies. don't take the MSF. DO NOT call me for a pickup truck lift
> when your stupid vintage eye-talian scooter has gone kablooie on 33rd
> and Speedway and you don't know what to do. don't ask me to visit your
> stupid ass at Seton as you sit in traction with a broken femur and head
> trauma. I GIVE UP!!!!
>
> -Beth
You'd have to try hard to kill yourself on a scooter (after MSF of
course). It sounds like you're trying to force your advice on her when
she's just seeking validation to buy a scoot. Dispense your advice
once and let her do what she wants. She's obviously got the capacity
to figure out what's in her best interests if she made it to grad
school.
Gniewko
So scooters now come with a force field that protects you from morons
in cages? That's a nifty feature... At the beginning of the year,
Ronnie Smith from Performance Bikes magazine died in a scooter
accident. And he was an experienced rider. The summer before he did a
>120mph lap at the Isle of Man TT. Shit happens, and riding a scooter
doesn't make you immune.
-Gniewko
Mike Hardcore
>"Beth" <bef...@large.org> wrote in message
>news:3F0C76F1...@large.org...
>> "let me tell you about a guy named Mike Hardcore..."
>
>I don't believe that Mike has fully recovered yet. Haven't heard much. Last
>time I talked to Billy he sort of mentioned that Mike was not doing so well.
>Was a while ago.
Yeah, rumors of my death... Greatly fucking exaggerated.
Lots of big changes in my life in the last few months.
But I'm still hanging and banging with the best of them.
No matter how dire the situation, much like a cat,
I always land on my feet.
http://www.squick.net/irc-moto/trip9-RT-chop.JPG
http://www.squick.net/irc-moto/trip-9-plate.jpg
And I've got this watching over and protecting me while
I'm banging those mile-long one footed wheelies down
Highway 1 these days...
http://www.squick.net/tattoo/finished-tat.htm
Seems to work well so far.
Anyone who wants to contact me can just drop me e-mail,
I don't read rec.moto much at all anymore.
-Mike-
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Mike Hardcore is: Biker ~ Slacker ~ Iconoclast ~ Eclectic Thinker
Squidly's ~ www.squidlys.com - SC Vampires S&MC ~ www.santacruzvampires.com
Ducati.vs Women - One's a sexy thing that you've just got to ride, even if
it breaks down a lot, costs a lot of money, and will probably try to kill
you... The other is a brand of Italian motorcycle.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Steve 65
>
> http://www.squick.net/irc-moto/trip9-RT-chop.JPG
Hmmmn. Nice stable. Does this pic mean you were finally
able to get a garage built, or did you just borrow a
neighbor's driveway?
S65~
StephG
out came news:vgr4jmf...@corp.supernews.com:
There's always dye ;)
Mike Hardcore
I sold my house and moved down to Santa Cruz proper.
Got a nice place with a 2.5 car garage all of 1.8
miles from Pergolesi.
Smør
> in cages? That's a nifty feature... At the beginning of the year,
> Ronnie Smith from Performance Bikes magazine died in a scooter
> accident. And he was an experienced rider. The summer before he did a
> >120mph lap at the Isle of Man TT. Shit happens, and riding a scooter
> doesn't make you immune.
> -Gniewko
I didn't say anything about being immune on a scooter. Come on now. If
you notice, I said 'kill yourself' (i.e. running your scooter into a
wall at 30mph). This isn't the same as being run over by someone in a
car, which can happen to anyone on two wheels.
Gniewko
Fair point, but you could also "kill yourself" on a scooter by being
stupid and creating a situation that gets you run over. Actually, it
would be interesting to find out what percentage of fatal motorcycle
accidents are single-vehicle accidents (the rider "killing himself" by
hitting some immobile object), and in what percentage other vehicles
are involved. My guess would be that the second category of accidents
is much more frequent, and for that reason scooters aren't really much
safer than motorcycles.
-Gniewko
Steve 65
>
> Steve 65 wrote:
>
> >Mike Hardcore wrote:
> >>
> >> http://www.squick.net/irc-moto/trip9-RT-chop.JPG
> >
> > Hmmmn. Nice stable. Does this pic mean you were finally
> >able to get a garage built, or did you just borrow a
> >neighbor's driveway?
>
> I sold my house and moved down to Santa Cruz proper.
> Got a nice place with a 2.5 car garage all of 1.8
> miles from Pergolesi.
Well, I guess -I'm- out of touch. Anybody putting on any
rides on this side of the hills?
S65~
Mike Hardcore
(snip)
> Well, I guess -I'm- out of touch. Anybody putting on any
>rides on this side of the hills?
>
> S65~
Depends on what your 'side' of the hill is.