Easter Baptisms (Padraic)
Emma
Padraic, I think you made some reference to the Easter baptisms
within the Catholic church, but I can't seem to find
the relevant post.
Anyway, did you hear that the Pope baptized a famous Italian
Muslim! I was personally delighted about that. Delighted
because a well known Muslim has converted, and delighted because
the Pope chose to make it so high profile.
What did you think?
Of course the obligatory death threats have been posted
on the internet. Ho-hum.
This Pope does seem to be keen to confront the extremist
elements within Islam.
--
~~~EMMA~~~
http://www.britsattheirbest.com/
http://uk.alpha.org/
~~~~~~~~~~
Padraic Brown
>
>Padraic, I think you made some reference to the Easter baptisms
>within the Catholic church, but I can't seem to find
>the relevant post.
You mean in general or specific ones from this last Sunday?
>Anyway, did you hear that the Pope baptized a famous Italian
>Muslim!
Yeah. Apparently, it was rather hush-hush until Sunday, as I'm sure it
would come as no surprise that death threats would follow such a high
profile conversion. As I recall, the person in question had special
guards to ensure safety.
>I was personally delighted about that. Delighted
>because a well known Muslim has converted, and delighted because
>the Pope chose to make it so high profile.
>What did you think?
Kind of ambivalent. I suppose one could read it as a bit of a "snub
your nose at Islam" moment. If this person has found a religion that
offers them the satisfaction of Truth they need, then I'm happy for
them. I think the person in question is a writer or reporter or
something like that -- hopefully that person can use the process as a
springboard for broadly educating both Westerners and Moslems about
the issues.
>Of course the obligatory death threats have been posted
>on the internet. Ho-hum.
Yeah. Big surprise there! Just goes to show how immature and worse,
spiritually insecure, Islam is.
Hopefully, though, this conversion can be used to remind us of all the
Moslems who quietly convert, and some who suffer needlessly because of
it. And worse, remind us of those Moslems who have converted in their
hearts, but are AFRAID to say or do anything because their families
and clerics can "rightfully" call for their deaths. How sad is that?
>This Pope does seem to be keen to confront the extremist
>elements within Islam.
That's a good thing. Though he'll have to be extra careful -- Popes
are already targets by definition. This one has made a special point
of it, but apparently, that's not going to stop him.
Hereabouts, everyone is in Papal Mass ticket mode. One of the stadiums
downtown is going to host the big Mass on I think the 17th of April.
Parishioners of the archdiocese can sign on to some kind of lottery to
obtain available tickets. Washington will be a zoo that day! I think
you have to arrive at the stadium by 7am or something like that. Mass
is at 10. The Metro will be running extra trains and you can bet that
rush hour will be simply crazy!
Padraic
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
Emma
>
>On 26 Mar 2008 09:54:54 -0700, Emma <em...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>Padraic, I think you made some reference to the Easter baptisms
>>within the Catholic church, but I can't seem to find
>>the relevant post.
>
>You mean in general or specific ones from this last Sunday?
>
>>Anyway, did you hear that the Pope baptized a famous Italian
>>Muslim!
>
>Yeah. Apparently, it was rather hush-hush until Sunday, as I'm sure it
>would come as no surprise that death threats would follow such a high
>profile conversion. As I recall, the person in question had special
>guards to ensure safety.
Yes, but apparently he's been under police protection
for some time because he's criticized Islam in the past.
>
>>Of course the obligatory death threats have been posted
>>on the internet. Ho-hum.
>
>Yeah. Big surprise there! Just goes to show how immature and worse,
>spiritually insecure, Islam is.
>
>Hopefully, though, this conversion can be used to remind us of all the
>Moslems who quietly convert, and some who suffer needlessly because of
>it. And worse, remind us of those Moslems who have converted in their
>hearts, but are AFRAID to say or do anything because their families
>and clerics can "rightfully" call for their deaths. How sad is that?
Yes, and why aren't the imams excommunicating the
extremists?
What's excommunication called in Islam, a fatwa?
Anyway, there must be some sort of excommunication.
Why isn't Bin Laden under some sort of fatwa?
That's what I'd like to know.
>>This Pope does seem to be keen to confront the extremist
>>elements within Islam.
>
>That's a good thing. Though he'll have to be extra careful -- Popes
>are already targets by definition. This one has made a special point
>of it, but apparently, that's not going to stop him.
He's very different to the last Pope. He seems to
be provoking Islam and deliberately drawing out the worst
elements to show it in its worst light. The last Pope was
more concerned with interfaith, but I think he was
too much of an optimist. He belonged to a different
era though.
Personally, I think Islam is incapable of interfaith
now. Times are changing and we've moved beyond
dialogue IMO.
>Hereabouts, everyone is in Papal Mass ticket mode. One of the stadiums
>downtown is going to host the big Mass on I think the 17th of April.
>Parishioners of the archdiocese can sign on to some kind of lottery to
>obtain available tickets. Washington will be a zoo that day! I think
>you have to arrive at the stadium by 7am or something like that. Mass
>is at 10. The Metro will be running extra trains and you can bet that
>rush hour will be simply crazy!
>
Is the Pope going to America? I didn't know that.
That must be exciting for you all!
Are you going, Padraic?
Padraic Brown
>In article <ml3lu35mutrkmng15...@4ax.com>, Padraic Brown says...
>>
>>On 26 Mar 2008 09:54:54 -0700, Emma <em...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>Padraic, I think you made some reference to the Easter baptisms
>>>within the Catholic church, but I can't seem to find
>>>the relevant post.
>>
>>You mean in general or specific ones from this last Sunday?
>>
>>>Anyway, did you hear that the Pope baptized a famous Italian
>>>Muslim!
>>
>>Yeah. Apparently, it was rather hush-hush until Sunday, as I'm sure it
>>would come as no surprise that death threats would follow such a high
>>profile conversion. As I recall, the person in question had special
>>guards to ensure safety.
>
>Yes, but apparently he's been under police protection
>for some time because he's criticized Islam in the past.
Big surprise there! Now, *anyone* can criticise the Catholic Church,
and not need any kind of protection at all. Just goes to show how sad
the situation in Moslemania really is, when their first and most
natural reaction seems to be to issue death threats.
>>>Of course the obligatory death threats have been posted
>>>on the internet. Ho-hum.
>>
>>Yeah. Big surprise there! Just goes to show how immature and worse,
>>spiritually insecure, Islam is.
>>
>>Hopefully, though, this conversion can be used to remind us of all the
>>Moslems who quietly convert, and some who suffer needlessly because of
>>it. And worse, remind us of those Moslems who have converted in their
>>hearts, but are AFRAID to say or do anything because their families
>>and clerics can "rightfully" call for their deaths. How sad is that?
>
>Yes, and why aren't the imams excommunicating the
>extremists?
Pot-kettle-black. Too many of those imams are busy scrabbling to be
the first to issue a death fatwa!
>What's excommunication called in Islam, a fatwa?
Death. I think by heheading. ;)
>Anyway, there must be some sort of excommunication.
>
>Why isn't Bin Laden under some sort of fatwa?
>That's what I'd like to know.
Is this a serious question? It's cos he hates America, and the West in
general, and was the leader of the merry band that destroyed the WTC
-- basically, he's part of a religion that not only celebrates evil,
but preaches it all too successfully and all too often.
>>>This Pope does seem to be keen to confront the extremist
>>>elements within Islam.
>>
>>That's a good thing. Though he'll have to be extra careful -- Popes
>>are already targets by definition. This one has made a special point
>>of it, but apparently, that's not going to stop him.
>
>He's very different to the last Pope. He seems to
>be provoking Islam and deliberately drawing out the worst
>elements to show it in its worst light. The last Pope was
>more concerned with interfaith, but I think he was
>too much of an optimist. He belonged to a different
>era though.
Yeah. He came through the horrors of Warsaw in the early 40s. *There*
was a pleasant time in old Poland!
>Personally, I think Islam is incapable of interfaith
>now. Times are changing and we've moved beyond
>dialogue IMO.
I'd still like to believe that more moderate Moslems can yet rise up
and wrest their own religion out of the hands of the extreme parties.
Make it something respectable.
>>Hereabouts, everyone is in Papal Mass ticket mode. One of the stadiums
>>downtown is going to host the big Mass on I think the 17th of April.
>>Parishioners of the archdiocese can sign on to some kind of lottery to
>>obtain available tickets. Washington will be a zoo that day! I think
>>you have to arrive at the stadium by 7am or something like that. Mass
>>is at 10. The Metro will be running extra trains and you can bet that
>>rush hour will be simply crazy!
>>
>
>Is the Pope going to America? I didn't know that.
>That must be exciting for you all!
>Are you going, Padraic?
Are you kidding? You have to be there hours early and stand in
security queues for hours once there. It'll be on tele anyway!
We went when the last Pope came to town. They had an outdoor mass in
the Mall -- but that was a different time, as you say. No real
security woes or concerns, and the Pope could stand literally in the
open in the middle of Washington DC.
Emma
>
>On 27 Mar 2008 03:37:03 -0700, Emma <em...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>
>>What's excommunication called in Islam, a fatwa?
>
>Death. I think by heheading. ;)
>
>>Anyway, there must be some sort of excommunication.
>>
>>Why isn't Bin Laden under some sort of fatwa?
>>That's what I'd like to know.
>
>Is this a serious question? It's cos he hates America, and the West in
>general, and was the leader of the merry band that destroyed the WTC
>-- basically, he's part of a religion that not only celebrates evil,
>but preaches it all too successfully and all too often.
But surely moderate Muslims can give fatwas?
I mean, the Pope can excommunicate Catholics.
So why can't a moderate imam somewhere put a
fatwa on Bin Laden? Or are there no
moderate Muslim leaders with that sort of power?
What I'm saying is, there doesn't seem to be any
sort of official voice among moderate muslims.
Nobody announcing to the world that Bin Laden is
evil and has therefore been thrown out of Islam.
I don't personally know of any Muslim leader who
I would describe as, well, "a nice man".
There must be some "nice men" out there somewhere,
but they don't have any sort of public profile.
I mean someone who actually condemns suicide
bombers and terrorists, who talks about love and
reconciliation rather than revenge and death.
That sort of thing.
If I was Muslim, I would be so ashamed of the religion,
I would have to convert away from it immediately.
cactus
practice their faith while distancing themselves from their extremist
co-religionists. You need to distinguish between the religion and its
practioners.
Padraic Brown
>In article <4s2ou3pbboh0fgvrk...@4ax.com>, Padraic Brown says...
>>
>>On 27 Mar 2008 03:37:03 -0700, Emma <em...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>>
>>>What's excommunication called in Islam, a fatwa?
>>
>>Death. I think by heheading. ;)
>>
>>>Anyway, there must be some sort of excommunication.
>>>
>>>Why isn't Bin Laden under some sort of fatwa?
>>>That's what I'd like to know.
>>
>>Is this a serious question? It's cos he hates America, and the West in
>>general, and was the leader of the merry band that destroyed the WTC
>>-- basically, he's part of a religion that not only celebrates evil,
>>but preaches it all too successfully and all too often.
>
>But surely moderate Muslims can give fatwas?
>I mean, the Pope can excommunicate Catholics.
The Pope of Rome can't call for your death if you draw a cartoon of
Jesus portrayed as a fishmonger. Such a thought would be simply
unconscionable to every Catholic and I would hazard to 99.5% of all
Protestants as well.
>So why can't a moderate imam somewhere put a
>fatwa on Bin Laden? Or are there no
>moderate Muslim leaders with that sort of power?
I suppose one could. Says rather a lot that none have.
>What I'm saying is, there doesn't seem to be any
>sort of official voice among moderate muslims.
Indeed not. They've had several principle denominations since the
earliest times, so have never really had a period of unity of any
sort.
>Nobody announcing to the world that Bin Laden is
>evil and has therefore been thrown out of Islam.
>
>I don't personally know of any Muslim leader who
>I would describe as, well, "a nice man".
>There must be some "nice men" out there somewhere,
>but they don't have any sort of public profile.
>I mean someone who actually condemns suicide
>bombers and terrorists, who talks about love and
>reconciliation rather than revenge and death.
>That sort of thing.
Maybe they've all been fatwaed to death? ;)
>If I was Muslim, I would be so ashamed of the religion,
>I would have to convert away from it immediately.
As would I, honestly.