SOUND CURRENT MEDITATION
Greg White
the ringing sound in the ears?
Thanks.
Tad Davis
about meditating to the sound of ringing in the ears):
: I do, it' a natural form for me. There is a small literature on it in terms
: of meditation, and a clinical literature on form of the ringing that are due
: to hearing damage.
I'd be interested in learning more about this. I developed a moderate case
of tinnitus a little over a year ago. How I first noticed it was
interesting, from a meditation standpoint: I was trying to steady my
breathing and "focus on the silence," and after several days I realized
there WAS no silence for me, ever. (Audiology tests have confirmed a
slight loss of hearing. MRI is perfectly normal, so I'm not concerned,
just annoyed. I know there's a tinnitus support group out here, but so far
it's not bad enough for me to need that kind of help.)
I've often thought about trying to select the tone as a focus of
meditation, but it's a little too high-pitched to be comfortable for that.
I'm using breath as a focus, and have never yet had a session where the
tinnitus was so intrusive that I was unable to concentrate on my
breathing. Usually it fades into the background with everything else.
--
Tad Davis
dav...@umis.upenn.edu
Bennett Z. Kobb
organic origin or an origin outside the physical system. After 19
years of practice, I come down firmly on the side of "outside the
physical system". Among other reasons, the sound can transform into
orchestras that no neurological sound could match. But more than
that, this resource, properly used, energizes and enlightens.
Many systems teach sound current meditation: Sant Mat, Radhasoami,
Ruhani Satsang, Eckankar (though they don't call it "meditation"),
and others. A Westernized, non-devotional version is Elan Vital,
taught by mail and in local groups by the Eureka Society, PO Box
43916, Phoenix AZ 85080.
"The true essence of your being lives on an electrical type of
spiritual energy. This spiritual energy drives your consciousness
and provides the energy to hold your genetic structure in balance.
The energy is supplied to you through an umbilical cord arrangement,
and the ringing or buzzing sound we all hear, some more than others,
is the current flow in that power line."
- Bruce K. Avenell, Elan Vital founder
Bennett Kobb
bk...@newsignals.com
Greg White
: Many systems teach sound current meditation: Sant Mat, Radhasoami,
: Ruhani Satsang, Eckankar (though they don't call it "meditation"),
: and others. A Westernized, non-devotional version is Elan Vital,
: taught by mail and in local groups by the Eureka Society, PO Box
: 43916, Phoenix AZ 85080.
The Elan Vital version is one you could hardly call non-devotional. From
my personal experience with this organization, the followng became obvious:
1. The group requires Tithing (10% of your income) once the student
has progressed to what is called Lesson Three.
2. The group leader, Bruce Avenell, encourages strong devotion to him.
In order to receive lesson material, it is necessary to have one's
"comprehension" working properly. This requires beleif in a system in which
Bruce Avenell is one of the key beings in the cosmos, namely "Lord of
Light". His connection with "deity" is such that his is the final word
on interpretation of "divine information". Sounds more like the Pope.
Mr. Avenell also wants his students to beleive that in his past lives he
used to be George Washington (Im not making this up!), Baron von
Richtoven, amon Ra (did you see stargate?), Merlin, Sir Frances Drake,
Socrates and im sure there are more.
3. He refers to himself, in addition to a Sound Current Meditation
teacher, as a marriage counselor. From my 15 year association with Elan
Vital, i have seen him use this position to split apart couples in the
group in order to be able to sleep with some of the women. He usually
tells them its for a spiritual purpose. He sleeps with them, he says, in
order "to take them through the ONE LIGHT"
4, "The ONE LIGHT" is a place you can go which is one of the main goals
of the group. Strangely enough, out of approximately 1200 students who
have passed into (but mostly into and out of) Elan Vital, not one has
ever been able to get there (except when having sex with Bruce Avenell).
The group is full of a lot of wounded people who feel theres no
alternative way to have a spiritual existance.
5. Another major goal of Elan Vital is to "beam out" to some stars about
a billion light years away. This is necessary because according to Mr.
Avenell, armageddon is supposed to take place in the year 2012. They've
been trying lots of ways of leaving this planet in order to do this and
havent gotten to mass suicide yet.
Yes, i started this thread because i used to be in a group who taught me
sound current techniques. I quit 5 years ago because of what i see as a
lot of useless baggage that came along with what i wanted to learn.
since then ive been continuing to meditate without a group and decided to
try to find out if there are other people out there who are doing
anything similar.
I very much welcome any discussion and insights on the topic of Sound
Current.
I strongly beleive after spending a lot of time in the above cult that
its very important for an individual looking for a meditation school to
do some thorough consumer research. Each group has a certain amount of
good in it, but one has to look beneath whatever PR material the
organization uses to present itself.
Bennett Z. Kobb
Well, your points raise what has always been an interesting question
to me.
That is, is it necessary to join a group to learn these practices?
Although there are a lot of books on the subject, most are from
groups that want you to join (Sant Mat and the others I listed, and
some more I forgot to list). They don't really instruct the reader in
techniques.
Having done a lot of searching, I've found only one that really does:
Survival Into the 21st Century by Victoras Kulvinskas. This perennial
book on sprouting, Yoga etc. with the cover art by Peter Max, does
have a short section on sound current meditation. The book is usually
found in health food and New Age bookstores.
I have heard that Roy Eugene Davis' books also teach but I'm not sure
if his thing is a group or not.
Redheaded Goddess
Bennett Kobb quotes Bruce Avenell:
"The ringing or buzzing sound we all hear, some more than others
is the current flow..."
Every now and then I hear the buzzing. Once I asked my friend,
who is a very gifted trance channeler, what he though this meant.
If I remember correctly, he said something to the effect that
it means to "pay attention" [I guess to what is given/heard..or
be open to the guidance that is coming from "On High"]
I remember reading much of this type of thing as people meditated
and did TM. I believe Yogananda discusses the OM and Sound Current
also, in his book: "Autobiography of a Yogi" [an excellent read].
Kathy
ka...@xnet.com
@}-->---
"...nature is an objectification of AUM, the Primal Sound or
Vibratory Word." --Yogananda, p. 182
"Patanjali speaks of God as the actual Cosmic Sound of AUM
that is heard in meditation " [Yogananda, quoting from Yoga
Sutras], p. 277 [Autobiography of a Yogi]
kha...@wimsey.com
>Date: 23 Dec 1994 19:34:19 GMT
>From: Lorin...@earthspirit.org (Lorin Roche)
>Subject: Re: SOUND CURRENT MEDITATION
>Does anyone have any experience with meditation techniques based on
>the ringing sound in the ears?
>I do, it' a natural form for me. There is a small literature on it in terms
>of meditation, and a clinical literature on form of the ringing that are due
>to hearing damage.
>Lorin
It would be interesting if you could elaborate further on your meditation
technique (for lack of a better word). Also, the medical definition for
ringing in the ears is called "Tinitus" which is caused by inner ear damage or
nerve damage to the c7-c8 vertibrae.
chow for now
kh
Dean Isensee
Regarding meditation on the Sound Current, there are as stated numerous groups
that teach meditation on the Sound Current. To my knowledge, and I speak from
experience, the one group that currently offers the original meditation
techniques that fall into the lineage of the Radha Soami school that goes back
to Swami Shivdayal Singh is The Science of Spirituality. The organization is
headed by Sant Rajinder Singh. They have a major centre in Naperville,
Illinois and centers in some 500 locations throughout the world. The teachings
are free to all who desire them. There is never any charge for any service and
Maharaji, as Master Rajinder is referred to by his followers, makes himself
available to answer directly any questions that new and old seekers may have.
The meditation involves an initiation by Maharaji or one of his
representatives. An experience of the inner light and sound are given at the
time of initiation. I have been practicing this form of meditation for the
past 15 years. It has given my life meaning and strength when there was no
reason for hope.
Elizabeth Flanagan
>"...nature is an objectification of AUM, the Primal Sound or
>Vibratory Word." --Yogananda, p. 182
>
>"Patanjali speaks of God as the actual Cosmic Sound of AUM
>that is heard in meditation " [Yogananda, quoting from Yoga
>Sutras], p. 277 [Autobiography of a Yogi]
shows these quotes on pages 156 and 237, respectively, in case
anyone else might be looking for them.
Yogananda gives additional clues as to the nature of this sound:
"Through the divine eye in the forehead... the yogi sails his
consciousness into omnipresence, hearing the Word or Aum,
divine sound of 'many waters': the vibrations of light that
constitute the sole reality of creation." (p. 266)
So this sound is the divine omnipresence and is heard by yogis.
But as seen below, not necessarily only by advanced yogis:
"Aum is the Creative Word, the whir of the Vibratory Motor,
the witness of Divine Presence. Even the beginner in yoga may
soon hear the wondrous sound of Aum. Through this blissful
spiritual encouragement, he becomes convinced that he is in
communion with supernal realms." (p. 237)
A reminder of God's compassion. So, what is it that would
attract this experience? Yogananda quotes Psalms 46:10 --
"Be still, and know that I am God" -- saying "Never flaunting
His omnipresence, the Lord is heard only in the immaculate
silences." (p. 476) The footnote says that "The goal of the
science of yoga is to obtain that necessary inner stillness by
which one may truly 'know God.'" (p. 476)
So it seems that Yogananda is saying that the practice is
to be still, the desired result is to know God, and hearing
the inner sound is a confirmation that one is aligned with the
goal.
--
-Elizabeth
chu...@bga.com
Bija1
Here is a little more from Yogananda on the Sound Yoga meditation:
...from Yogananda, Metaphysical Meditations, 1964, pp.35-36.
"Listen to the cosmic sound of Aum, a great hum of countless atoms, in the
sensitive right side of your head. This is the voice of God. Feel the
sound spreading through the brain. Hear its continuous pounding roar.
Now hear and feel it surging into the spine, bursting open the doors of
the heart. Feel it resounding through every tissue, every feeling, every
cord of your nerves. Every blood cell, every thought is dancing on the sea
of roaring vibration.
Observe the spreading volume of the cosmic sound. It sweeps through the
body and mind into the earth and the surrounding atmosphere. You are
moving with it, into the airless ether, and into millions of universes of
matter.
Meditate on the marching spread of the cosmic sound. It has passed
through the physical universes to the subtle shining veins of rays that
hold all matter in manifestation.
The cosmic sound is commingling with millions of multicolored rays. The
cosmic sound has entered the realm of cosmic rays. Listen to, behold, and
feel the embrace of the cosmic sound and the eternal light. The cosmic
sound now pierces through the heartfires of cosmic energy and they both
melt within the ocean of cosmic consciousness and cosmic joy. The body
melts into the universe. The universe melts into the soundless voice. The
sound melts into the all-shining light. And the light enters the bosom of
infinite joy."
-bija
Paul
Mage
>
>ka...@xnet.com quotes Yogananda's Autobiography of a Yogi:
>
>>"...nature is an objectification of AUM, the Primal Sound or
>>Vibratory Word." --Yogananda, p. 182
>>
>>"Patanjali speaks of God as the actual Cosmic Sound of AUM
>>that is heard in meditation " [Yogananda, quoting from Yoga
>>Sutras], p. 277 [Autobiography of a Yogi]
>
>"Through the divine eye in the forehead... the yogi sails his
>consciousness into omnipresence, hearing the Word or Aum,
>divine sound of 'many waters': the vibrations of light that
>constitute the sole reality of creation." (p. 266)
>
>So this sound is the divine omnipresence and is heard by yogis.
>But as seen below, not necessarily only by advanced yogis:
>
>"Aum is the Creative Word, the whir of the Vibratory Motor,
>the witness of Divine Presence. Even the beginner in yoga may
>soon hear the wondrous sound of Aum. Through this blissful
>spiritual encouragement, he becomes convinced that he is in
>communion with supernal realms." (p. 237)
>
>to be still, the desired result is to know God, and hearing
>the inner sound is a confirmation that one is aligned with the
>goal.
>--
>-Elizabeth
>chu...@bga.com
Here's a quote from the book "My Submission" by Huzur
Maharaj Sawan Singh Ji, pp 126:
"The Scriptures tell us that the Sound Current is
constantly resounding within all human beings. That is why it
has been called the unceasing 'kirtan' (singing of hymns within,
which really means listening to the Shabd or Sound Current within).
It is for this reason that Saints do not approve of the outer or
physical singing of hymns or playing of musical instruments. Muslim
Fakirs have also emphasized listening to the Sound within, and have
said:
"'It is unfortunate that you are fettered by the pleasures of
the senses and do not listen to the pure Voice of the Merciful Lord.'
"Listening to and merging in the Sound of Nam or Shabd is the
only means of attaining Godhood, and this Sound is constantly reverberating
within the forehead. It can be heard only through the company of Saints
and by following their instructions. That alone can give us peace of mind
and eternal happiness. The Key to the treasure of Nam with all its
attendant benefits has been placed in the hands of the Saints. Whoever
abides by their instructions and accepts their guidance as the Way of
Truth, discovers this Treasure.
"Although the Sound reverberates in every human being, it cannot
be heard by everyone. In order to be able to hear it, one has first to be
initiated by a Master and then has to practise listening within, according
to the Master's instructions. The real Sound within is the monopoly of
Gurmukhs (those who follow the Guru's instructions) alone, and it bestows
many benefits on them."
One such Master who is empowered to transmit the Light and Sound
Method through initiation is known as the Supreme Master Ching Hai. Her
teachings, like all great Masters of the past are offered free of charge
to all sincere seekers irrespective of religion or race. For more information,
look up "alt.meditation.quanyin" or better still, http to
"http://futures.phys.cmu.edu" for a photo of the Master and description of
how to obtain this method...
Star Gazer ***
Jerry Deal
I AM POSTING THIS FOR A WOMAN IN THE EUREKA SOCIETY:
'In reponse to Greg White's treatise on Bruce Avenell and Elan Vital
(12/27/94), I feel compelled to inform people who may be encountering
Bruce's name of The Eureka Society for the first time that the
allegations in Mr. White's "dissertation" are extremely skewed, false, or
uninformed, constituting a serious defamation of character. It is
unfortunate that the Internet would be used for such a display. I would
like to provide additional information about Mr. Avenell and The Eureka
Society to help ease the shock or pain Mr. White is causing others. The
world does not need another warped "spiritual leader", even if it only
exists in someone's imagination. In this case, Bruce is not only one of
the kindest and dearest souls on the planet, but he is an excellent sound
current meditation teacher who has worked relentlessly over 30 years to
research and provide a thorough and methodical approach to sound current
meditation which an individual can do on their own. The people who do
this system are typically well-educated professional people who are well-
respected by others and enjoy the challenge of such an advanced path as
well as the fruits of a wonderful (and well-earned) spiritual life.
I've been doing The Eureka Society's Audinometry program for 25
years and probably know Bruce better than anyone. His program is one of
the "cleanest" I've ever run into. These are the mainstays of his
teachings and he follows them consistently: (1) You must be center stage
in your own life in order to develop spiritually. Therefore, Mr. Avenell
assumes the role of coach, friend, and at most, mentor to his students;
(2) You must think for yourself in learning the lessons life has to teach
you. He stresses the use of critical thinking and analysis as well as
cultivated spiritual talents to guide oneself on the inner journey; (3)
It is not necessary to believe what it is possible to know first hand,
and what is taught is how to have spiritual experience first hand. He
also emphasizes it is not necessary to know him in order to do the
program. How can the program be a "cult" when it is a home-study course
which is practiced by the individual with the Society having only two
national retreats that are optional? We do enjoy other means of
communication such as a newsletter, local discussion and meditation
groups, and occasional lectures. Beginning students have the option of a
coach/mentor, which is most often not Bruce. This is how I and most
people have approaced it, and we have had great success with the program.
I will say this about sound current meditation, which I understand
was the original question: It IS a wonderful way to connect with the
divine in oneself, providing rapid and quality growth experiences for the
person who can be responsible, self-disciplined and positive. If you
don't have these qualities, you might be better off trying a less steep
path. One fine personal note on Bruce -- He was married (faithfully) for
18 years and had 5 children who care about him greatly. I have been in
sole partnership with him for the last 15 years and know well what kind
of quality individual he is. Contrary to Greg's statement, most of the
students (including the men) have had very substantial and high spiritual
experiences and/or personal development progressions. All of these were
without being close to Bruce. I hope this is the end of sniping and the
beginning of qualitative discussion about the true nature of one of the
greatest spiritual gifts available to man...sound current meditation.'
Diane Rabinowitz
IN response to conversation about sound current meditation, you
wrote:
>
>There are a lot of books on the Sant Mat. I don't think the sound meditation
>of Sant Mat is related in any way to hearing damage. Meditation does not
>cause hearing damage, unless one has the habit of meditating on a bar stool.
>
I would be interested in books that mention this practice.
Currently I have been reading The Yoga of Delight Wonder and
Astonishment, over 100 sutras, 112 of them about specific
meditation techniques through which the aspirant can realize the
Divine Self. One of those mentions the inner sound, Verse 38
says:
(translated by Jaideva Singh)
"One who is deeply versed and deeply bathed or steeped in Nada
which is Brahman in the form of sound, which is vibrating inside
without any impact, which can be heard only by the ear that
becomes competent by yoga, which goes on sounding uninterruptedly
and which is rushing headlong like a river attains to Brahman."
I've also heard that the last chapter of Zen Flesh, Zen Bones
contains a translation of these 112 aphorisms.
ANd I think Deepak Chopra mentions in one of his books "toning"
leading to bliss.
Anyone have information about this?
With gratitude,
Diane
Seetoh Wai Keong
: In article <135233526...@esbbs.earthspirit.org> Lorin...@earthspirit.org (Lorin Roche) writes:
: >Date: 23 Dec 1994 19:34:19 GMT
: >From: Lorin...@earthspirit.org (Lorin Roche)
: >Subject: Re: SOUND CURRENT MEDITATION
: >Does anyone have any experience with meditation techniques based on
: >the ringing sound in the ears?
: >I do, it' a natural form for me. There is a small literature on it in terms
: >of meditation, and a clinical literature on form of the ringing that are due
: >to hearing damage.
: It would be interesting if you could elaborate further on your meditation
: technique (for lack of a better word). Also, the medical definition for
: ringing in the ears is called "Tinitus" which is caused by inner ear damage or
: nerve damage to the c7-c8 vertibrae.
There are a lot of books on the Sant Mat. I don't think the sound meditation
of Sant Mat is related in any way to hearing damage. Meditation does not
cause hearing damage, unless one has the habit of meditating on a bar stool.
seetoh.
Steven M. Stoltz
On this point you are VERY wrong. Saints have always song the praises
of God outwardly in the form of music as well as with the inner light and
sound. Jesus said, "You should love God with your WHOLE mind, with ALL
of your strength, .... etc. etc." ..... Supposedly, the archangel Narada
used to praise God with the flute .... , and while I do not claim to be
a follower of the Hare Krishna movement, it is stated in the Srimad
Bhagavantam that men of this age of kali must include devotional chanting
of the Holy names of God as a means of attaining enlightenment .... the
reason being that men of the kali yuga have such a short lifespan (in
comparison with the higher astrological ages) that meditation alone is
not enough to enlighten them. That is why the Hare Krishnas (the
international society for Krishna consciousness) always chant, HARE KRISHNA
HARE KRISHNA KRISHNA KRISHNA HARE HARE.
No-one that I know of is "too-good" to sing the praises of God ........
>Muslim
>Fakirs have also emphasized listening to the Sound within, and have
>said:
> "'It is unfortunate that you are fettered by the pleasures of
>the senses and do not listen to the pure Voice of the Merciful Lord.'
> "Listening to and merging in the Sound of Nam or Shabd is the
>only means of attaining Godhood, and this Sound is constantly reverberating
While I agree with the importance of being at oneness with the Holy Spirit
(i.e. the sound current), don't forget also that the highest aspects of God,
i.e the Sat - consciousness don't even exist within vibratory creation.
So, "Godhood" as you say doesn't even have an existence within vibration.
>within the forehead. It can be heard only through the company of Saints
>and by following their instructions.
No Saint has ANY claim of ownership over the Holy Spirit. Even though
many have experiences with light and sound via keeping good companionship
with the Saints, this is NOT a prerequisite ............. and I speak from
my OWN experience on this issue .........
>That alone can give us peace of mind
>and eternal happiness. The Key to the treasure of Nam with all its
>attendant benefits has been placed in the hands of the Saints. Whoever
>abides by their instructions and accepts their guidance as the Way of
>Truth, discovers this Treasure.
> "Although the Sound reverberates in every human being, it cannot
>be heard by everyone. In order to be able to hear it, one has first to be
>initiated by a Master and then has to practise listening within, according
>to the Master's instructions. The real Sound within is the monopoly of
>Gurmukhs (those who follow the Guru's instructions) alone, and it bestows
>many benefits on them."
As I said above, God is not a business venture ..... no one has a "monopoly
on it" ..... the ONLY thing (if anything) that can BUY God's love is pure
devotion devoid of ego ........
> One such Master who is empowered to transmit the Light and Sound
>Method through initiation is known as the Supreme Master Ching Hai. Her
>teachings, like all great Masters of the past are offered free of charge
>to all sincere seekers irrespective of religion or race. For more information,
>look up "alt.meditation.quanyin" or better still, http to
>"http://futures.phys.cmu.edu" for a photo of the Master and description of
>how to obtain this method...
>Star Gazer ***
OM Kriya Babaji Nama Aum !!!!
Steve
Greg White
> : SUBJECT: Re: SOUND CURRENT MEDITATION
> (12/27/94), I feel compelled to inform people who may be encountering
> Bruce's name of The Eureka Society for the first time that the
> allegations in Mr. White's "dissertation" are extremely skewed, false, or
> uninformed, constituting a serious defamation of character.
What was it in my post you disagreed with?
My information is based on first hand experience as a group member
for 15 years and as a board member of the Eureka Society for 7 years.
> It is
> unfortunate that the Internet would be used for such a display.
I beleive its ok to disagree with the Eureka Society.
> I would
> like to provide additional information about Mr. Avenell and The Eureka
> Society to help ease the shock or pain Mr. White is causing others. The
> world does not need another warped "spiritual leader", even if it only
> exists in someone's imagination.
I stand by everything I said in my earlier post despite the fact that it
may not present the Eureka Society or Elan Vital in a flattering way.
When you are involved in an organization such as this it looks like
the only positive thing there is. Everything outside the group looks
negative. In such an environment there is no tolerance for
dissenting opinions.
> The people who do
> this system are typically well-educated professional people who are well-
> respected by others and enjoy the challenge of such an advanced path as
> well as the fruits of a wonderful (and well-earned) spiritual life.
Many of these professionals, according to Bruce Avenell are kept in
the group mainly because they are tithing 10% of their salaries to
him. He has spoken at various times of how he'd like to get rid of
so-and-so but would lose money if he did.
> I've been doing The Eureka Society's Audinometry program for 25
> years and probably know Bruce better than anyone. His program is one of
> the "cleanest" I've ever run into.
What does that mean? What other schools have you used as a
comparison?
> These are the mainstays of his
> teachings and he follows them consistently: (1) You must be center stage
> in your own life in order to develop spiritually.
Not to be nitpicking, but one problem I have with his approach is the
"do as I say, not as I do" attitude in which he asserts its ok for
him to NOT practice what he preaches. I think this is a rather
fundamental catch.
> (2) You must think for yourself in learning the lessons life has to teach
> you. He stresses the use of critical thinking and analysis as well as
> cultivated spiritual talents to guide oneself on the inner journey;
A worthy goal, however there are strict limits to how much its ok to
vary from a certain line of thought within the group. It is common
for members to be told to ostracize (sp?) other
members who have had opinions that were held by Bruce to be
unacceptable ones. The effect on group dynamics is predictable. The
school has an extremely large turnover. Those who leave are called
"posessed" or "out of alignment" or "negative", etc. Group members
are, in large, discouraged to have further contact with them unless
theres a chance of getting them back.
This creates a pathetic situation where many individuals within the
group stay in because they're afraid to leave. Many of them don't
even realize that themselves.
> (3)
> It is not necessary to believe what it is possible to know first hand,
> and what is taught is how to have spiritual experience first hand. He
> also emphasizes it is not necessary to know him in order to do the
> program.
People who have been involved with the group will tell you there is a
rather formidable belief system in place. The school taught me
many things for which I am grateful to have learned. I reached a
point where it cost me too much spiritually to be in the group
anymore.
> How can the program be a "cult" when it is a home-study course
> which is practiced by the individual with the Society having only two
> national retreats that are optional?
A group doesn't have to be big or successful to be a cult. The
home-study idea is for the introductory Lesson 1. Most of the
learning is from personal interaction.
Actually, there are a variety of definitions of "destructive cult"
and it depends on whom you ask. I think the group started out with
the best of intentions. Bruce had learned sound current meditation
from Kirpal Singh but left because of the highly devotional nature of
the group. Many sound current schools insist on focus on the leader
as a way of getting someplace spiritually. Bruce had the idea to
start a school free of these confining old ways, instead teaching
techniques leading to a positive place. Unfortunately, after a few
years Bruce himself got caught in a lot of the traps
that catch many spiritual leaders. Apparently there was more to it
than he had originally thought. A lot of brighter students left the
group (what does that say about me?) and for a few years
it went into a downward spiral that groups go through. It began
exhibiting the symptoms of a cult: paranoia of the outside world
(reality is black & white), discrediting of former members, a belief
that if you leave the group your life will be hell, chaperoning of
members' sex lives, dishonest recruitment practices, lots more....
It went downhill from there... Eventually tithing became manditory
instead of voluntary: one of the main purposes of the group was
income for Bruce Avenell.
> I will say this about sound current meditation, which I understand
> was the original question: It IS a wonderful way to connect with the
> divine in oneself, providing rapid and quality growth experiences for the
> person who can be responsible, self-disciplined and positive.
Yes I think sound current meditation is teriffic. I've been
practicing it for 20 years myself.
> Contrary to Greg's statement, most of the
> students (including the men) have had very substantial and high spiritual
> experiences and/or personal development progressions.
I don't doubt that many students have had great spiritual experiences
with the sound current. Its just my feeling that its because of the
sound current and not 'cuz of Bruce Avenell. A lot of the
experiences were related to the Mt. Shasta annual retreat in
California. Its a great place to have very high spiritual journeys.
> I hope this is the end of sniping and the
> beginning of qualitative discussion about the true nature of one of the
> greatest spiritual gifts available to man...sound current meditation.'
Apparently, Susan, you see any differences of opinion with yours as
sniping or negativity. My view is that when a group such as Elan
Vital or the Eureka Society advertises on the Internet, it has the
right to do so, however the Internet is an open forum in which all
sides have the right to be heard. The tone of discrediting former
members continues to be prevalent within the group.
Sound current meditation is not a gift from Bruce Avenell. Everybody
has access to it. Heck, there are several sound current teachers who
read/post this newsgroup.
In the "qualitative discussions" department:
There has been a lot of press in the past 3 months about spiritual
leaders getting "busted" for improprieties. There are many
situations in which accepting a spriritual teacher as an authority
winds up messing up one's connection to one's own deity, often
substituting that of the teacher. Its necessary to have teachers,
tho.... this sets up a paradox: what gets you out of the woods is
also what gets you back into the woods.
To me, there are definately things which work and things
which don't within the Eureka Society. In the EV group most of the new
ideas evolve from its members. It would be good to envision an
organization open to, lets call it "spiritual research", but with a group
structure which is "flat" instead of heirarchical, in which each
person has autonomy, but is able to pool the resources of the group.
This certainly involves a certain level of group awareness beyond the
norm.