Chinte kata
David O'Daniel
If from the 2nd Two-finger--strike with the right hand, your left hand
maybe has the opponent's right arm trapped, that then the stepping 90°
to the back with the same front/right leg & doing a right
heel-palm-strike, seems to be a throw, pulling them by their right arm &
pushing on their head, neck or torso with your right hand to trip across
your right-leg.
However; then the left hand does a similar heel-palm-strike & then both
hands do side hammer-fists between horizontal & down-block level out to
both sides.
Question; what is the left heel-palm doing if anything more than an
actual simple strike & what are the 2 hammer-fists? Can the opponent's
right/trapped arm be brought up by your left hand to exchange arm for
head & visa versa & then pull their locked arm across your hips with
their back to you (left arm then pulling their head further around &
your right hand pulling their right arm across to an arm-bar across in
front of you)? Just: "can such an exchange work or would the bunkai be
something different)?
I assume that the kata is on youtube (that I can't access from my webtv
here at home) but I've no partner to try out the techniques. Thus why
I'm asking here? Of course if anyone experiments with it with a partner,
be sure not to do any actual harm to your partner. ;-)
Thanks for any help.
Bo
Mentore Siesto
wrote:
Hi Bo,
this is just my $0.02...
As for the two palm heel strikes, I'm for seeing those two as simply
two palm heel strikes. So, you can see the entire sequence
differently: I actually see the first sequence (two fingers strike)
separated from the second (palm heel strike rotating 90 degrees left,
then another palm heel strike) .
I don't see any throw in these two techniques: differently, I tend to
see the two palm heel strikes as a block/deviation of enemy's attack
(first strike), then (hidden) grabbing his arm and striking with the
second palm heel strike with the left hand (second strike): the
sequence ends IMV by separating hands and hitting the attacker with
the head (the movements immediately following before rotating and
double punch 180 degrees backwards).
I think it's possible to see those movements as an "arm exchange", but
personally I prefer not to elaborate too much these views.
Hope I've been useful somehow, see ya
Oss
Maestro Mentore Siesto
WTKA International Italia
David O'Daniel
"Hi Bo,
this is just my $0.02...
As for the two palm heel strikes, I'm for seeing those two as simply two
palm heel strikes. So, you can see the entire sequence differently: I
actually see the first sequence (two fingers strike) separated from the
second (palm heel strike rotating 90 degrees left, then another palm
heel strike) .
I don't see any throw in these two techniques: differently, I tend to
see the two palm heel strikes as a block/deviation of enemy's attack
(first strike), then (hidden) grabbing his arm and striking with the
second palm heel strike with the left hand (second strike): the sequence
ends IMV by separating hands and hitting the attacker with the head (the
movements immediately following before rotating and double punch 180
degrees backwards).
I think it's possible to see those movements as an "arm exchange", but
personally I prefer not to elaborate too much these views.
Hope I've been useful somehow, see ya
Oss
Maestro Mentore Siesto
WTKA International Italia"
Thanks, Mentore Siestro, One can actually make kata even more
strike-oriented though. I'm just exploring the numerous variations. Such
as with Taikyoku Shodan; besides the basic bunkai/applications given, of
blocking a kick, punches, and turning only to face a new attacker, it
can be done with the down-blocks interpreted as low hammer-fists and
perhaps even the turns as sweeps or low hook kicks to attack opponent's
legs. Like a well-worn path through the woods, keeping sight of the
original path, one might go to either side though to explore. I had done
the "all-attacking" idea back in the spring or earlier. Currently, I'm
on the other side of the standard basic applications "path", if you
will; trying to view potential grappling applications. Karate had came
out of being influenced by Chin Na, and I've read somewhere that
especially Chinte was said to be more heavily derived or influenced by
Chin Na & thus should be easier or more appropriate to reverse-engineer,
(again, as it were), the techniques back into grappling bunkai.
The 180° turn to the 2 punches was labelled scissor punches, implying
crossing. However, they are done as 2 inward hook-punches, not crossing,
in the version we have today. I had noticed in visualizing the
opponents, that "if" an opponent were trapped low, with their head
hooked in the bend of 1 elbow or at least that hand grabbing the head
or hair, and maybe an arm hooked in the bend of the other elbow or held
(maybe at the wrist) by the other hand, then it could be a follow-up
finishing move on an opponent, who would then fall to the ground. Thus,
being on the ground by either being thrown down, or with the punches
actually crossing (forcing their head/neck & arm together into a
choke-out) then that body would be next stepped over in Chinte's next 2
steps out and THEN explain the hopping back to "hop" over the body. ;-)
The getting of that opponent low to choke out, break neck or otherwise
throw by the motions of the 2 punches, it seems that that opponent would
have had to have been pulled around f rom the back 180°. So from the
2-finger strike, stepping 90° to the back (counter-clockwise), the
opponent could be pulled across the right leg that was stepped with,
then while off balance, maybe spun around so as to have their back to
you & keep control of them safely "if" somehow the hand change can work.
Continuing the spinning or dragging them around counter-clockwise to the
front 180° to that scissors punch choke/neck-break/throw.
On another "path", besides exploring kata applications with 1 or minimum
opponents, the same kata could be interpreted for 2, 3 AND maximum
opponents, at least 1 new opponent for every technique. Again, all just
exploring Alternative Variations of bunkai. :-)
Kind of like different styles of calligraphy, writing the same letters
in different variations to further explore the writing or anything done
repeatedly that one might gain new insight in rather than drawing the
letter "A" the exact same way 500,000 times & the 500,000s A should be
drawn with more skill than the 1st ever correctly drawn A, with a deeper
understanding of the standard version by awareness of what other
possibilities exist. Even if it is the awareness of the other
possibilities that would make one more aware of when their standard
version is starting to stray off the basic version path. It is debatable
though which is the better approach; to have more variation
understanding of unwavering repetition of just 1 interpretation & thus
not be distracted from that one & only way.
Ok, that's my rant for today. Have a good week, all.
Bo
OSU!