Stealing BLAINE!
lab...@earthlink.net
Glad the David Blaine special is causing a ruckus in this news group.
It should...but how about focusing on the RIGHT things.
DON'T STEAL HIS TRICKS - Stop right now talking about doing his
levitation; (if you have to ask, you wouldn't understand!) Every time
someone does something good on TV other people aren't doing, all the
magicians run to the postgroups to see what it was and then try to buy it.
Don't run out and buy cigarette through quarters, folding quarters, etc.,
etc. Doing the same tricks won't get you a special too...they were the
least important part of this show's success.
DON'T RAG ON DAVID BLAINE - I can't believe the fucking idiots who are
trying to dismiss David by calling his tricks "storebought" and saying his
only talent is "writing a check at the magic shop". This explains why
they are writing articles for magic magazines and David Blaine is doing a
primetime special. It makes me sick that magicians feel they have to tear
each other down, especially when they're doing something so clearly
different. Be happy for him instead of spewing shit...he is going to help
magic more than any ABC-Stars-Doing-Magic-Isn't-It-Easy Special.
DON'T STEAL DAVID BLAINE'S PERSONALITY - This would seem obvious, but
obviously it's not. I'm speaking directly to all you Michael Ammar-Daryl-
David Williamson-Guy Hollingsworth clones....yes, I've seen you and you
make me ill. Everyone was putting Blaine's personality down last week on
these news groups - don't try to be him now that you've seen it work. It
will never work for you and you will look like an idiot.
Learn the IMPORTANT things about this special - what makes David Blaine
DIFFERENT. Stop this fucking insanity of "Let's Rag On The TV Performer,
Discuss How His Tricks Work and Where Can I buy It, So I Can Go Out And Be
Just Like Him." He DID deserve this special and he worked his ass off to
make it different and great.
Applaud him and LEARN.
Or, shut the fuck up!
RUDY COBY
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
Mark Trowbridge
Rudy.....
Couldn't have said it better myself.
Mark
In article <8641405...@dejanews.com>, lab...@earthlink.net says...
Gabriel3
Good for you Rudy.
Kenneth G. Hensley
Rudy,
Your argument has merit, except for one thing: None of those effects were
original! Almost everyone goes back to the early works of magic (some as
far as Tarbell, others Vernon, some that are Harris and even a few Daryl
for good measure). The one thing I agree with you on is: Don't steal his
presentation!! While the effects may be ones easily found in print, his
personality and style is certainly new and refreshing. Please do not call
it :stealing his tricks" but coping his style.
lab...@earthlink.net wrote in article <8641405...@dejanews.com>...
Walter and/or Annie
s words
Jesus, Try some de-caf.
lab...@earthlink.net
Wrong Kenneth...everybody uses the excuse "it's an old trick" when they
steal. If magicians start doing the "Biting A Quarter", "Balducci
Levitation", etc., in droves - they're doing it because they saw David
use it effectively on TV monday night, not divine inspiration. How many
idiots are going to be doing his force and talking in monotone in the
next week. Rule of thumb, people: if you see something on TV, don't do
it. This doesn't apply to those doing invisible deck, cigarette thu
quarter, etc., in their regular repetoires - just those who
"mysteriously" started doing those tricks again starting Tuesday.
But, your letter was at least intelligently written...unlike the
DB-bashers on this newsgroup.
All best,
RC
In article <5ltlhr$dps$1...@news2.gte.net>,
"Kenneth G. Hensley" <grey...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Rudy,
>
> Your argument has merit, except for one thing: None of those effects were
> original! Almost everyone goes back to the early works of magic (some as
> far as Tarbell, others Vernon, some that are Harris and even a few Daryl
> for good measure). The one thing I agree with you on is: Don't steal his
> presentation!! While the effects may be ones easily found in print, his
> personality and style is certainly new and refreshing. Please do not call
> it :stealing his tricks" but coping his style.
>
> lab...@earthlink.net wrote in article <8641405...@dejanews.com>...
Jim Finger
lab...@earthlink.net wrote:
>
> Wrong Kenneth...everybody uses the excuse "it's an old trick" when they
> steal. If magicians start doing the "Biting A Quarter", "Balducci
> Levitation", etc., in droves - they're doing it because they saw David
> use it effectively on TV monday night, not divine inspiration. How many
> idiots are going to be doing his force and talking in monotone in the
> next week. Rule of thumb, people: if you see something on TV, don't do
> it. This doesn't apply to those doing invisible deck, cigarette thu
> quarter, etc., in their regular repetoires - just those who
> "mysteriously" started doing those tricks again starting Tuesday.
>
> But, your letter was at least intelligently written...unlike the
> DB-bashers on this newsgroup.
>
> All best,
>
> RC
Amen,
I hear that "old stuff" line everytime someone tries to rip off my
stuff, and it really gets old. If it was so old, why didn't everyone
else start doing it before they saw me using it effectively. I was
doing fire eating with an antenna throwaway here in Houston since 1984,
and once the local hacks saw me doing it, and some other signature
pieces, they started justifying the ripoffs with "it's old, it's old..."
I had never seen it anywhere else. What is this attitude based on? Is
it based on these guys just being obnoxious know-it-alls, or is it just
to justify their tendency to hack everyone else's material?
Jim
Jim Finger, get my free book,"Finger Magic" at
http://members.tripod.com/~imagique/index.html
GalloPitch
>Don't run out and buy cigarette through quarters, folding quarters, etc.,
>etc.
Damn, and I finally saved enough money to buy those coins! Damn, damn,
damn!
Mike
Gerald Wincklhofer
I honestly believe that it is impossible for normal human beings to steal my act or
anyone elses act with the exception of identical twins. I do know that those who
copy are always pale imatations of the real thing. Blaine's facade does not break
down, the apist will.
Although the technical effects done by Blaine for the most part are know he does
bring a certain mystery, adventure, no..magic to them. Do run to that magic drawer
and pull out the quarter, You know the one. It's under the plume you purchased
just after you saw Doug Henning use a plume on J. Carson or any of the other talk
shows that year. Know something, you'll have aas much success doint it today as you
did then. The measure of your success is that it is in your drawer, not in your
close up case.
I enjoy watching him, but I do my own magic.
Remember a pro does one trick a thousand time, others do a thousand tricks once.
Gerry
Voodoo
lab...@earthlink.net wrote:
>
> Wrong Kenneth...everybody uses the excuse "it's an old trick" when they
> steal. If magicians start doing the "Biting A Quarter", "Balducci
> Levitation", etc., in droves - they're doing it because they saw David
> use it effectively on TV monday night, not divine inspiration. How many
> idiots are going to be doing his force and talking in monotone in the
> next week. Rule of thumb, people: if you see something on TV, don't do
> it. This doesn't apply to those doing invisible deck, cigarette thu
> quarter, etc., in their regular repetoires - just those who
> "mysteriously" started doing those tricks again starting Tuesday.
>
> But, your letter was at least intelligently written...unlike the
> DB-bashers on this newsgroup.
>
> All best,
>
> RC
>
> "Kenneth G. Hensley" <grey...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Rudy,
> >
> > Your argument has merit, except for one thing: None of those effects were
> > original! Almost everyone goes back to the early works of magic (some as
> > far as Tarbell, others Vernon, some that are Harris and even a few Daryl
> > for good measure). The one thing I agree with you on is: Don't steal his
> > presentation!! While the effects may be ones easily found in print, his
> > personality and style is certainly new and refreshing. Please do not call
> > it :stealing his tricks" but coping his style.
> >
> > lab...@earthlink.net wrote in article <8641405...@dejanews.com>...
> > > Glad the David Blaine special is causing a ruckus in this news group.
> > >
> > > It should...but how about focusing on the RIGHT things.
> > >
> > > DON'T STEAL HIS TRICKS - Stop right now talking about doing his
> > > levitation; (if you have to ask, you wouldn't understand!) Every time
> > > someone does something good on TV other people aren't doing, all the
> > > magicians run to the postgroups to see what it was and then try to buy
> > it.
> > > least important part of this show's success.
> > >
> > > DON'T RAG ON DAVID BLAINE - I can't believe the fucking idiots who are
> > > trying to dismiss David by calling his tricks "storebought" and saying
> > his
> > > only talent is "writing a check at the magic shop". This explains why
> > > they are writing articles for magic magazines and David Blaine is doing a
> > > primetime special. It makes me sick that magicians feel they have to
> > tear
> > > each other down, especially when they're doing something so clearly
> > > different. Be happy for him instead of spewing shit...he is going to
> > help
> > > magic more than any ABC-Stars-Doing-Magic-Isn't-It-Easy Special.
> > >
> > > DON'T STEAL DAVID BLAINE'S PERSONALITY - This would seem obvious, but
I think the problem with everyone in here is that they see Blaine on TV
doing these "old, anyone can do" tricks. Blain didn't just start doing
magic, he has been doing if for quiet a while. He didn't give away any
secrets, and made everything entertaining to watch. In the pick a
number trick, I chose 39. He has just as much right to do his tricks as
anyone on here. I liked his style, because he is a regular guy. No top
hats, or doves, etc.
Blaine didn't steal anything. If by using an old trick is stealing,
then everyone of you out there stole your ideas from someone. Those
books didn't just write themselves.
BJE
Kenneth G. Hensley
Ahhh...Jim, if it is just a "old stuff" line then you must admit that Mr.
Blaine ripped off someone else to get his effect. Then the progression
follows that everyone is stealing everything. Perhaps you should re-read
what I wrote: Most of the tricks are fair game, the PERSONALITY and
PRESENTATION is the original.
Bruce Barnett
"Kenneth G. Hensley" <grey...@hotmail.com> writes:
> Ahhh...Jim, if it is just a "old stuff" line then you must admit that Mr.
> Blaine ripped off someone else to get his effect. Then the progression
> follows that everyone is stealing everything. Perhaps you should re-read
> what I wrote: Most of the tricks are fair game, the PERSONALITY and
> PRESENTATION is the original.
Not quite what most magicians consider to be proper ethics.
If David purchased the books the routines came from, then
he certainly did not rip-off any magician. He has a right to perform
the material, like any other.
If you copy the routine from a performance, without buying the
material, then you are indeed ripping off someone - the inventor.
Beginning magicians assume that because they see someone performing a
effect, this gives them permission to perform the same effect.
Not so. Anything done in a performance is off-limits, ethics wise.
You must purchase the knowledge legitimately, to perform it.
Or else you must invent it yourself.
Naturally, many will argue with me, but those that do will find
themselves shunned by many magicians.
Put yourself in the same situation as a real inventor of magic.
As soon as you show others your new idea, people feel it is
now OKAY to rip off the idea, and deny the inventor any recognition.
--
Bruce <bar...@grymoire.crd.ge.com>
DAlex421
"Stealing" Blaine....ah huh!
Let's see, I was performing The Hindu Thread before Blaine was
born...learned it from Orlando Bagley who did it for 60 years, well before
it was explained in Greater Magic.
The Raven is a commercial effect, available to anyone with the
money...mmmm.
I know the angles for the LePaul's Bluff Pass (as described in
Tarbell), evidently better than Blaine, since he allowed a camera on the
wrong side.
I know enough not to repeat material for the same audience.
I have the requisite skill to hide the necessary moves so I don't have
to resort to clever editing to remove those moves to make myself look
better than I am.
I know how to smile at an audience so they like me.
His "levitation" is a scam, so I can continue doing the Balducci
whenever I feel like it.
Why would anyone want to copy his performing "persona?" It's flat and
uninteresting. In the several decades I've been in magic and show
business, I've found that audiences - sophisticated, educated,
intelligent audiences, that is - enjoy being entertained by someone like
themselves. Without the camera and sound guys accompanying him, Blaine
would just be someone doing "thug" magic and would be run off by the cops.
He blended in so well with the tattooed biker-types and the moronic
Compton homeboys - was there a room temperature IQ in either of those
groups? Presumably those were the best shots from those areas. I can only
imagine what the others were like.
The levitation is a hoax that I've detailed elsewhere on this NG.
By contrast, Copperfield took a series of specials and turned them into
a career that earns him millions. Will anyone pay good money to see a guy
in a t-shirt do dull presentations of standard tricks for peasants? I
rather doubt it.
Blaine was neither original nor particularly interesting.
Ironically, one of his credited advisors is far more skillful and
successful as a performing personality: Michael Weber.
David Alexander
lab...@earthlink.net
Rudy Coby here...
David Alexander wrote the following to my post about David Blaine.
All I can say in reply to this small-minded nonsense is:
"Uh....David Alexander WHO?!?"
Your response below exactly makes my point. You know a lot about magic
moves, but you know NOTHING about the Real World. Why don't you trot off
down to the magic club and discuss your opinions with people that care?
I'm sure there's a lot more fellas down there who think they're clever
just like you.
P.S. - Woah! David Alex....what was your name again? Never mind. I'm
SO impressed you know the proper angle for a Bluff Pass...you're gettin'
me hard!
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
ninja god
In article <01bc6628$d8611fa0$756d1cce@default>, hour...@softdisk.com says...
>
>
> >The one thing I agree with you on is: Don't steal his
>> presentation!! While the effects may be ones easily found in print, his
>> personality and style is certainly new and refreshing. Please do not call
>
>monotone voice and very few smiles and perhaps an air of aloffness -- damn,
its
>a new trend!!!! ;-) btw, its copying....not coping*...although i did have 2
>cope with his style ;-)
>
>> > DON'T STEAL HIS TRICKS - blah, blah, blah...
>> > Don't run out and buy cigarette through quarters, folding quarters, etc.,
>
>
>> > DON'T RAG ON DAVID BLAINE - I can't believe the fucking idiots who are
>> > trying to dismiss David by calling his tricks "storebought" and saying
>
>
>> > DON'T STEAL DAVID BLAINE'S PERSONALITY - This would seem obvious, but
>> Ammar-Daryl-
>> > David Williamson-Guy Hollingsworth clones....yes, I've seen you and you
>> > make me ill. Everyone was putting Blaine's personality down last week on
>> > these news groups - don't try to be him now that you've seen it work. It
>> > will never work for you and you will look like an idiot.
>
>
>> > Learn the IMPORTANT things about this special - what makes David Blaine
>> > DIFFERENT. Stop this fucking insanity of "Let's Rag On The TV Performer,
>> > Discuss How His Tricks Work and Where Can I buy It, So I Can Go Out And
>> Be Just Like Him." He DID deserve this special and he worked his ass off to
>> > make it different and great.
>
>the hell we please as i am on u. :-)
>
>> > Or, shut the fuck up!
>
>
>the dawn
>
>
Well Mr. Dawn im not a magician...so im sure i will really piss you off but..
If you guys would get the fuck off the internet and practice instead of
whining so fucking much you might get good enough to get a chance...
DAlex421
My thanks to Mark for the kind comments, but you won't see any flames
here against Rudy Coby. I find his work interesting and well-considered.
Besides, I don't think this is the real Rudy Coby, the Rudy Coby who has
created a unique performance persona and obviously knows show business. I
respect his work and accomplishments and believe he uses a great deal of
showmanship in his performances, getting the most from each effect. I
don't think there is any question that Rudy Coby is a pro.
That is why I find it difficult to believe that the previous postings
with "Rudy Coby" on them are from the real Rudy Coby. I don't believe a
professional of Rudy's experience would react like a self-indulgent
tweleve-year old, dismissing my observations and comments simply because
he hadn't heard of me and end with a sexual innuendo on the level of a
junior high school-age amateur. Just because I haven't had my own magic
special doesn't mean I don't know what I'm talking about, as the real Rudy
Coby doubtless knows. Perhaps it's the same chap that posted for David
Blaine... the wonders of technology.
David Alexander
Michael A. Solinas
lab...@earthlink.net wrote:
>Glad the David Blaine special is causing a ruckus in this news group.
>It should...but how about focusing on the RIGHT things.
>DON'T STEAL HIS TRICKS - Stop right now talking about doing his
>levitation;
It isn't his. By your logic, Blaine shouldn't have done it either.
>DON'T STEAL DAVID BLAINE'S PERSONALITY - This would seem obvious, but
>obviously it's not.
Someone beat me to it.
--
Michael A. Solinas (mi...@solinas.com)
WWW: http://www.solinas.com/
ftp: ftp.solinas.com
ICQ UIN: 489952
Brian Johnson
Gee Dave!
I sure loved "your" T.V. special.....<G> Get a grip.....
DAlex421 <dale...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19970523163...@ladder01.news.aol.com>...
> "Stealing" Blaine....ah huh!
Bob K
On Mon, 26 May 1997 15:36:11 GMT, mcdu...@netcom.com (David McDuffee)
wrote:
>In article <19970526034...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,<clip>
>
>I agree with you on this point. Rudy Coby would be "labman" rather than
>"labguy". This imposter is some kind of troll, lecturing about "stealing"
>while attempting to masquerade as a real magician. I hope the real Rudy
>Coby sues his ass off for defamation...
Actually, I believe that is Rudy's correct email address. Check the
article he wrote for for All Magic at
<http://www.uelectric.com/magicshow/rudycoby/rcoby01.html>
He refers to the post that you're talking about and he did make it.
David Montgomery
On Tue, 20 May 1997 15:05:05 -0500, kp2...@mindspring.com (Kevin
Presley) wrote:
>In article <8641405...@dejanews.com>, lab...@earthlink.net wrote:
> Hey Rudy, your a real man using that filthy language. How can you expect
>anyone to respect your opinions when you use that vulgar gutter talk.How
>vapid you must be to have to resort to immature curse words. Your little
>sermon from the ivory tower is not appreciated either. No one likes a
>condescending attitude coming from a person with little substance behind
>his words. Your no man Rudy, just a boy.
>
>
Wow, Kevin. You're a stud. It's easy to throw insults and complain
about a post someone made, without actually stating why you disagree
with what they said isn't it? Here, I'll illustrate:
Hey Kevin, you're a jerk. You post like an idiot. No one respects
you because all you do is insult people. You're no boy rudy, just a
waste of air.
See what I mean? If I disagreed with what Rudy said, I would have
stated specific examples of what I disagreed with, then my opinions on
why I felt differently. But no, Kevin, you throw crap around because
you don't know how to discuss something intelligently. All you can do
is throw kindergarten insults with high school words.
I feel that Rudy's post was on target. Yes, David Blaine had a TV
special, and sure some magicians know how many if not all tricks were
done. But how many have done a special on television? Rudy has, and
I'm sure he knows what it's like to work hard to actually get on tv.
Just look at how many people who watched the special have come to this
newsgroup and are showing interest in Blaine, and even moreso magic.
These people have no idea how these tricks were done. Yet so many
people here would rather kill the effect his show had on the public in
general by slamming Blaine because they think they could have done
better. I'd be very curious to see them put together a video tape,
and try and sell it to a major network.
I can understand why Rudy's so pissed.
David Montgomery
mo...@southeast.net
Patrick Bell
>lab...@earthlink.net wrote:
>
>>Glad the David Blaine special is causing a ruckus in this news group.
>>It should...but how about focusing on the RIGHT things.
>>DON'T STEAL HIS TRICKS - Stop right now talking about doing his
>>levitation;
>
>It isn't his. By your logic, Blaine shouldn't have done it either.
Why is it that nobody gets it?
I've been doing Fechter's trick, "Be honest, what is it?" for a few
years now. I did NOT do it because I saw it on TV and decided to
steal it.
There is a difference.
If you did the levitation before, then there's no reason to stop using
it. But to take it just because you saw it on TV is wrong.
-- Patrick Bell
<pb...@ucla.edu>