Vix with Dicks.. Whats up with that?!

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Raccoon

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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Of all aspects of Furry, from Art to Zoophila.. There is no fur-fetish
that is more puzzling to me than that of Vixens with Dicks-On.
Who came up with it, why did it start.. And why is it the most popular
topic of art in Furry today?

I personally find it disgusting, and it really turns me off.
I've been downloading binaries from fur.art.erotica for some time now,
and over 30% of it contained pictures of female vulps stroking, spewing
or fucking eachother.. beating the 25% of male fucking male. and the 16%
of male masturbation.
I just don't get it. If someone likes dick, and wishes to draw dick..
Where do the breasts come in? I thought that the whole idea of
homosexuality was based around titaphobia, the fear of tits.
Another striking conclusion that comes to mind, is that in no species of
animal are there females with dicks. So, this must be some form of
original fetish. Where did it come from? Why is it so big?

Personally, I'd like to see some more good 'natural' erotic art of high
quality put out there. But it seems that those who really know Photoshop
the best, are not straight. (Not to say I have any grudge with gays,
it's just that I know there are alot more straight people than gay, so
where are they?)
The only thing that I can think of is that those who draw really good
'straight' erotic art are either too embarrassed to post it, or those who
draw 'other' art are posting way to often.

Anyway, Vix with Dicks.. am I the only one disgusted here?
- Raccoon
alt [dot] raccoon [at] usa [dot] net

--
Random site: (Rocket Raccoon Comic Covers)
http://members.tripod.com/~raccoonsite/comics/rocketcovers.html

D. Jean Cooper

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
to Raccoon

Raccoon, I'm afraid you've hit the wrong group. This is
alt.lifestyle.furry, *not* alt.fan.furry. Unless your post has something
that means something *to you* about -being- furry, then please take posts
like this back over to AFF. Or if you're deliberatly trying to start a
flaming, you've got a good start. We've just finished having
roastRichChandler and didn't enjoy the taste at all. Way too dry and
stringy. <G> Please read the FAQ and charter before you reply. Thanx.
-Walk in Balance

Ambergold Wolfeyes (a leeettle hair-trigger about art posts in the
lifestyle group)
SCA: Lady Aelfreda O'Llyn Ewig
--
D.Jean Cooper
dcooperatinavdotnet

Akai

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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Raccoon wrote:

> > Another striking conclusion that comes to mind, is that in no species of
> animal are there females with dicks. So, this must be some form of
> original fetish. Where did it come from? Why is it so big?

I do believe that female hyenas have pseudo-phallic appendages. Saw that
on a documentary on the Discovery Channel...the overall theme was the
eternal conflict between lions and hyenas. Hyenas are in general pretty
messed-up critters.


-Akai

"Behold the power of cheese!"

mtmoleda

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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Akai (ak...@teleport.com) wrote:

: I do believe that female hyenas have pseudo-phallic appendages. Saw that


: on a documentary on the Discovery Channel...the overall theme was the
: eternal conflict between lions and hyenas. Hyenas are in general pretty
: messed-up critters.

"I think Akai called us messed-up critters. Did YOU hear Akai call us
messed-up critters?"

"You know, I think I did? Did YOU hear Akai call us messed-up critters?"

"I think I did!"

[they turn and look at the third one with strange, bulging eyes who has
been silent]

"Ed?" "Ed?"

"Hahahahahahahahahahahaha!"

Tim Gadd

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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newsm...@207.0.0.1 (Raccoon) wrote:

> I personally find it disgusting,

In the interests of non judgementalism, we discourage people airing
their views on what disgusts them. From the FAQ:

>statements such as "I
>find that completely disgusting!" are not acceptable.

Still, with a bit of tweaking, the topic does relate to furry
sexuality, which is on-topic.

>I just don't get it. If someone likes dick, and wishes to draw dick..
>Where do the breasts come in? I thought that the whole idea of
>homosexuality was based around titaphobia, the fear of tits.

You're kidding, right? This brings to mind that sequence from
'Everything you always wanted to know about sex', where Woody Allen
gets chased across the countryside by a giant breast. There is a
gynaephobia<sp>(with which Salvador Dali and HP Lovecraft are supposed
to have been afflicted) , but 'titophobia' is certainly a new one on
me. In fact this is possibly the silliest alleged 'cause' of
homosexuality I've heard of since Robert Grave's declaration that it
was 'caused' by excess consumption of milk. Mind you, he was
shell-shocked in the first world war. Maybe bizarre theories about
lactation and homosexuality are caused by shell-shock. In any case a
female with a strap-on dick obviously isn't a simple homosexual image.

--
Tim Gadd
Hobart, Tasmania

Lupercal .com
@wolf-web

Homepage: http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Coffeehouse/1161/

"I am not a human being, I am an animal!"

The Man Elephant.


Akai

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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Oh sh*t!

*wolf runs runs runs like hell*

--

Akai

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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D. Jean Cooper wrote:

We've just finished having
> roastRichChandler and didn't enjoy the taste at all. Way too dry and
> stringy. <G>

And the smell the leftovers left in the tupperware! Don't think I be
able to use that set for anything edible again.

> -Walk in Balance


> Ambergold Wolfeyes (a leeettle hair-trigger about art posts in the
> lifestyle group)
> SCA: Lady Aelfreda O'Llyn Ewig
> --
> D.Jean Cooper
> dcooperatinavdotnet

--

Kimba W. Lion

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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newsm...@207.0.0.1 (Raccoon) wrote:

>But it seems that those who really know Photoshop
>the best, are not straight.

There must be a good comment to be made here, but I sure can't think
of it! :)

>am I the only one disgusted here?

Considering that I am ignorant of the non-phenomenon you describe
(fur.art.erotica is not the only source of furry art, by far, and so
I seriously doubt that it is the most popular type of furry art
today), I have to say I am not disgusted.

If you don't want to bring this art subject up in alt.fan.furry,
there's also alt.arts.anthro (which is just about unused, so should
be ready for a discussion) or alt.culture.anthropomorphics (which I
don't know much about).

Kimba

Tim Gadd

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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Kimba...@aol.com (Kimba W. Lion) wrote:


>If you don't want to bring this art subject up in alt.fan.furry,
>there's also alt.arts.anthro (which is just about unused, so should
>be ready for a discussion) or alt.culture.anthropomorphics (which I
>don't know much about).

It may be off-topic in a.c.a., as, if I remember, the charter
prohibits discussion of furry fandom.

khr...@my-dejanews.com

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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newsm...@207.0.0.1 (Raccoon) wrote:
> Of all aspects of Furry, from Art to Zoophila.. There is no fur-fetish
> that is more puzzling to me than that of Vixens with Dicks-On.
> Who came up with it, why did it start.. And why is it the most popular
> topic of art in Furry today?

Assuming that this is a serious post and not a troll, I will make some
suggestions here:


> I personally find it disgusting, and it really turns me off.
> I've been downloading binaries from fur.art.erotica for some time now,
> and over 30% of it contained pictures of female vulps stroking, spewing
> or fucking eachother.. beating the 25% of male fucking male. and the 16%
> of male masturbation.

Statement #1: Any newsgroup, and I do mean ANY newsgroup, is NOT
REPRESENTATIVE of the whole of that interest. I am a furry artist, I have a
lot of friends who are furry artists, and I don't know a single one who POSTS
binaries on a newsgroup. Therefore, all of furry fandom's art interests
cannot be derived from looking at one small newsgroup.

Heck, I can't even GET to the fur.* groups.

You want a better 'representation' of what people in furry fandom like
drawing, you're better off going through FurNation or Velan Central Archive
or Yiffco (whenever it comes back) and see 800-flipping-artists and the stuff
they chose to post online. Even that isn't completely representative since
most of us keep the _good_ stuff offline for selling as prints.

> I just don't get it. If someone likes dick, and wishes to draw dick..

Then they'll draw a dick. Pure and simple.

> Where do the breasts come in? I thought that the whole idea of

How about they like breasts too? Did that occur to you?

> homosexuality was based around titaphobia, the fear of tits.

WTFO? Where did *that* idea come from?? I have a lot of gay male friends who
have tit-ENVY, not fear. Sheesh!

Gay men did not become gay by being scared off of women. While _you_ may
thing the dominant sexual characteristic of women is tits, there's a reason
why it's called a _secondary_ sexual characteristic. The dominant sexual
characteristic of women is the genitals, just like on a guy. Gay men just
have a preference for male genitals rather than female genitals -- and even
that isn't the whole of being gay, but that's another subject of discussion.

> Another striking conclusion that comes to mind, is that in no species of
> animal are there females with dicks. So, this must be some form of

Wrong. Hyena females have an elongated clitoris called a psuedo-penis that is
actually used for enforcing social hierarchy and pack dominance.

> original fetish. Where did it come from? Why is it so big?

It ISN'T! Hermaphroditism is a popular sub-genre of furry fandom, but it's a
popular sub-genre of human sexuality without the furry aspect, too! I know of
far too many She-male mags to believe this is solely a furry-pervert thing.

> Personally, I'd like to see some more good 'natural' erotic art of high
> quality put out there. But it seems that those who really know Photoshop
> the best, are not straight. (Not to say I have any grudge with gays,

Wrong again... the good Photoshop artists don't put their best work ONLINE.

> it's just that I know there are alot more straight people than gay, so
> where are they?)

You do, eh? Can you give me a report stating that?

Personally, I believe there are more bisexuals than _either_ homo or hetero
sexuals, but I have a limited sampling of humanity to base my judgement on.
Kinsey did a far better job and actually partially-validates my belief. Can
you quote me a reference about how many more Straight men there are in furry
fandom than Gay men... or even Bi men?

> The only thing that I can think of is that those who draw really good
> 'straight' erotic art are either too embarrassed to post it, or those who
> draw 'other' art are posting way to often.

Embarrassed? Not a chance... anyone who looks at my FTP site can see that. I
just refuse to post to binaries. I think you are putting far too much weight
on this tiny binaries group being representative of the whole and that's just
plain lunacy.

> Anyway, Vix with Dicks.. am I the only one disgusted here?

Considering you're talking to Alt.LIFESTYLE.furry, I'd say if you aren't,
you're certainly in a minority. There are people who may not _prefer_ them,
but they're also not up to bashing the artists who do. It's up to the
individual. You have the right to NOT LOOK AT IT. You want to see more het
art on the binaries group? Commission an artist and ask permission to post it
there. Simple.

Gee, why am I suddenly inspired to draw a leather-bitch vixen with a harness
doing rude things, now?

-- ermine
==================================
home email: KhromatAtInOrbitDotCom

-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own

khr...@my-dejanews.com

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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Kimba...@aol.com wrote:

> newsm...@207.0.0.1 (Raccoon) wrote:
>
> >But it seems that those who really know Photoshop
> >the best, are not straight.
>
> There must be a good comment to be made here, but I sure can't think
> of it! :)
>
> >am I the only one disgusted here?
>
> Considering that I am ignorant of the non-phenomenon you describe
> (fur.art.erotica is not the only source of furry art, by far, and so
> I seriously doubt that it is the most popular type of furry art
> today), I have to say I am not disgusted.
>
> If you don't want to bring this art subject up in alt.fan.furry,
> there's also alt.arts.anthro (which is just about unused, so should
> be ready for a discussion) or alt.culture.anthropomorphics (which I
> don't know much about).

Sure, we'll field it at a.c.a. even if it's not exactly topical there either.
:3

a.c.a. is one of two things at this time:

1) Discussions of furry-races cultures (you know, like how a tail affects
furniture, color-vision and lack thereof affects fashion....) and how people
have used the furriness of their created races to emphasize a point....

2) Discussions of the FURRY CULTURE, the components of both enjoying furry
stuff and feeling furry and how that creates a subculture.

I suppose this little question fits under heading #2, although I'm still
convinced that it's a non-issue.

khr...@my-dejanews.com

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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In article <71s97f$o5q$1...@crucigera.fysh.org>,

add...@in.sig wrote:
> Kimba...@aol.com (Kimba W. Lion) wrote:
>
> >If you don't want to bring this art subject up in alt.fan.furry,
> >there's also alt.arts.anthro (which is just about unused, so should
> >be ready for a discussion) or alt.culture.anthropomorphics (which I
> >don't know much about).
>
> It may be off-topic in a.c.a., as, if I remember, the charter
> prohibits discussion of furry fandom.

*blink?* We gotta CHARTER?? I never saw no postings about a charter... and
I've been lurking for _months_ before I usurped it! :3

Anyone out there got a copy of this a.c.a. charter I can look at?

Boomer The Dog

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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W O O F!

Kimba W. Lion

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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add...@in.sig (Tim Gadd) wrote:

>It may be off-topic in a.c.a., as, if I remember, the charter
>prohibits discussion of furry fandom.

I knew I shouldn't have mentioned a group I wasn't familiar with. I just
subscribed to have a look around, now...

Kimba

Tim Gadd

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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khr...@my-dejanews.com wrote:

> Can
>you quote me a reference about how many more Straight men there are in furry
>fandom than Gay men... or even Bi men?

I remember once going through a mental list of all my male furry
friends, and couldn't think of a _single one_ who was straight.
(there is one, actually, but only one, from memory.) Of the 10 males
I've had the most correspondance with, 4 are gay, 5 are bi, and one is
straight, as far as I know. As I'm more or less straight myself, this
certainly isn't due to any sampling error due to my own proclivities.

Tim Gadd

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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SPAMbi...@webtv.net (Boomer The Dog) wrote:


>Well, it's a part of Human erotica too...

>I can think of several reasons:

>The hermaphrodite image with the reproductive organs of both sexes.

>Like some Furries want tails and muzzles; the idea of cross species is
>entertained, why not cross sexuality?

>Transformation, taking on a new form, or a facination with transgender
>ideas...

Actually the idea of cross-gender images is completely consistent with
the whole cross-species thing of furry. Both are about blurring
boundaries.

Tim Gadd

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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khr...@my-dejanews.com wrote:


>*blink?* We gotta CHARTER?? I never saw no postings about a charter... and
>I've been lurking for _months_ before I usurped it! :3

>Anyone out there got a copy of this a.c.a. charter I can look at?

Apologies. It turns out I was thinking of alt.arts.anthro. - a newer
group.

khr...@my-dejanews.com

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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SPAMbi...@webtv.net (Boomer The Dog) wrote:
Raccoon pondered:
> >Photoshop the best, are not straight. (Not to say I have any grudge
> >with gays, it's just that I know there are alot more straight people

> >than gay, so where are they?)
>
> If you mean "straight" as in 'never have same sex thoughts', you might
> be..... wrong! Kinsey found that "straight" as an absolute is rare. What
> I'm getting at, is there might be broad interest in homoerotic art, but
> most think it's a narrow specialty because of the 'cultural brainwash'
> we constantly get. Face it, the sexual part of our culture is based on
> female/male coupling, with (I_think) disproportionate representation of
> other possible relations.

I think Reed Waller said it best: EVERYONE has had a sexual encounter with the
same sex. It's called masturbation. So take good care of yourself, as you're
the best partner you've got. :3

Rael

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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Tim Gadd wrote in message <71sgvm$phb$2...@crucigera.fysh.org>...

>SPAMbi...@webtv.net (Boomer The Dog) wrote:
>>Transformation, taking on a new form, or a facination with transgender
>>ideas...
>
>Actually the idea of cross-gender images is completely consistent with
>the whole cross-species thing of furry. Both are about blurring
>boundaries.


Boundaries deep-rooted in the core foundation of modern society. People
have lived forever with many different "givens"...two of which being:
1. The belief that the sexes are meant to be separate and defined in "black
and white" terms. While there is a "natural" basis for some of it, much is
simply the age-old designation of specific gender roles and
responsibilities.
2. The belief that humans are the highest forms of life on the Earth..and in
some people's minds, in the universe.

Yet, as the years go by, these boundaries and beliefs break down, and views
tend to broaden. Women's movements, the search for life on other planets,
men staying home to tend to children while wives go to work, studies to
decipher the language of dolphins....slowly but surely people start to move
beyond the things they were taught.
So...I think it's to be expected that you'll see this growing diversity of
tastes and interests within the things they find attractive or desirable.
As Tim said above, just as furs have both an external and personal interest
in cross-species "states of being", some also posess some attraction to
cross-gender states.
Now, just like with species, it can be something one desires in a
mate/friend, or something one wants for themselves. For myself, it's a
little of both..and includes both species and gender. I really like the
idea of possessing numerous physical traits and abilities outside my normal
ones. Some traits express themselves naturally, while most physical bits
need a little "push" to be apparent :)
It's the same thing with my gender. I am rather comfortable with my "in
between" gender status, and find that it suits me, as an individual, quite
well. Where there once was a need to "do right" and work towards becoming
what the world expects of a female, there is now the greater need to express
what I want for myself...the state of being that I find most fascinating.
Sure...that leaves me in a somewhat awkward position, depending on
circumstances, but being "80/20" isn't all that bad *smile*
My tastes, as such, do sometimes include others of familiar situation. It
all simply depends on my mood, but nevertheless it all still comes down to
the person at hand, so whatever they are is second to that anyway.

OTOH you have those individuals attracted to cross-gender mates/friends.
While the so-called reasoning for it is endless, ranging from the "too
scared to admit to being gay" concept to the " hetero male transposing his
penis-fixation to his sexual desires" rubbish, I think it's simply just a
matter of desiring a little more variety. You have to admit, for someone
with broad needs and desires, a strictly-defined partner would tend to get
sexually boring rather quickly. So...hence the invention of the type of
fur/person that fills in those needs for the "in between". There's more to
a person than what's in their undies, yes, but when attention turns
specifically to what's there...some people like to be surprised :)

Yet, by all means I'm not saying you have to like this sort of thing. As
far as "being" goes...the grass isn't really any greener on the other
side...just a different variety of grass :) As for wanting...everyone has
specific desires that are all their own, and I should think no-one expects
you to conform to their ideas of what is and is not attractive (no-one here,
anyway). Yet, you must realize that, in a "public" forum with a broad range
of "appropriate material", it should be expected that people will
express/cater to all different types of interests. So, whatever doesn't
suit you is simply best left ignored, IMO...

Rael
Yes I changed the subject a little..I don't care for *that* word too much.
It's my reply, so :P *giggle*

http://www.toast.net/~srh/
ICQ #: 2471130
"Someday soon we'll stop to ponder, what on earth's this spell we're under.
We've made the grade and still we wonder who the hell we are...."
--D. DeYoung

vu...@erols.com

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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In article <71sq2f$sfh$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,

khr...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > If you mean "straight" as in 'never have same sex thoughts', you might
> > be..... wrong! Kinsey found that "straight" as an absolute is rare. What
> > I'm getting at, is there might be broad interest in homoerotic art, but
> > most think it's a narrow specialty because of the 'cultural brainwash'
> > we constantly get. Face it, the sexual part of our culture is based on
> > female/male coupling, with (I_think) disproportionate representation of
> > other possible relations.
>
> I think Reed Waller said it best: EVERYONE has had a sexual encounter with the
> same sex. It's called masturbation. So take good care of yourself, as you're
> the best partner you've got. :3

Or, for some of us, the only partner we've got. :)

Reminds me of a bit of dialog from a story I read by a friend of mine:

"I feel so low after masturbating." "Oh? Why?" "It just hits me that the only
person with low enough standards to have sex with me, is me." :)

> -- ermine

Andrian
<Who's feeling a bit punchy as the day wears on.> :)
--
Andrija Popovic
vu...@erols.com

khr...@my-dejanews.com

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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add...@in.sig wrote:

> khr...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > Can
> >you quote me a reference about how many more Straight men there are in furry
> >fandom than Gay men... or even Bi men?
>
> I remember once going through a mental list of all my male furry
> friends, and couldn't think of a _single one_ who was straight.
> (there is one, actually, but only one, from memory.) Of the 10 males
> I've had the most correspondance with, 4 are gay, 5 are bi, and one is
> straight, as far as I know. As I'm more or less straight myself, this
> certainly isn't due to any sampling error due to my own proclivities.

Well, that's my point. I know a heck of a lot more than 10 men and even the
ones with steady girlfriends or wives are predominantly bisexual. The sad
fact is that among my 300+ friends, maybe 20% are female (that number is
boosted by my non-furry Faire/SCA/LASFS friends). Of the remaining men, I
think I can count a sum total of 5 genuine heteros. The rest are either bi
with a female preference, bi with a male preference, bi with no preference,
genuine homosexuals, and a couple of "To be determined" (kinda hard to find
out your sexual preferences when you've never had sex).

That's not to say that there aren't hardwired hets in this community, but
that I just find them the exception rather than the rule. :3

-- ermine (I don't mind monosexualism, I just don't understand it.)

Sidhain

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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>*blink?* We gotta CHARTER?? I never saw no postings about a charter... and
>I've been lurking for _months_ before I usurped it! :3
>
>Anyone out there got a copy of this a.c.a. charter I can look at?
>

>-- ermine


>==================================
>home email: KhromatAtInOrbitDotCom
>
>-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
>http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own

Yep and i have been here since August? September and even I have seen the
charter....

its been mentioned many times.

Shows ya what lurking does.....

All ye can see is peoples feet...

Charlie Luce

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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In article <71sts6$2am$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, khr...@my-dejanews.com writes...
[...]

>That's not to say that there aren't hardwired hets in this community, but
>that I just find them the exception rather than the rule. :3
>
>-- ermine (I don't mind monosexualism, I just don't understand it.)

I keep saying straight guys are a put-upon minority in furdom, but will anyone
listen? Nooooo... :}

_I_ keep thinking of Dr. Seuss style plays on the subject line:

"This Vix has some double-Ds,
That Vix has _two_ ways to please,
Say! What a lot of Vix he sees!"

"I do not like them on a page
I do not like them in a cage
I do not like them on my screen
I do not like these Vix I've seen."


Flicker

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
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Lucas wrote:
>
> Oh no! You mean that you've been keeping that stuff around? Quick get
> rid of it! ...
>
> Or vacuum packing, that might work, freeze drying might be good too. But
> if you want to maintain it's volatile properties, then you should probably
> stick to standard freezing. If any updates on the stuff filter down to me
> from the Lab, I'll be sure to forward them to you. :)

Perhaps we could launch it into the sun until we want it again...

-Flicker, Mad Coyote

Richard Chandler - WA Resident

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Nov 5, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/5/98
to
In article <MPG.10ab0ed03...@news.yiff.net>, newsm...@207.0.0.1
(Raccoon) writes:
> I just don't get it. If someone likes dick, and wishes to draw dick..
> Where do the breasts come in? I thought that the whole idea
> of homosexuality was based around titaphobia, the fear of tits.

Actually, I think it's a fear of vaginas. Consider the nightmare scenario in
Wicked City of a vagina with teeth.

> Another striking conclusion that comes to mind, is that in no species
> of animal are there females with dicks. So, this must be some form

> of original fetish. Where did it come from? Why is it so big?

Haven't seen the followups yet, but I wager someone's going to mention the
female hynea. (Forgetting that it's only one subspecies of hyena, and not all
of them).

Yes, men are afraid of vaginas with teeth.....

... and women are afraid of cavities. :-)


--
The greatest tragedy is that the same species that achieved space flight,
a cure for polio, and the transistor, is also featured nightly on COPS.
-- Richard Chandler
Spammer Warning: Washington State Law now provides civil penalties for UCE.


Doodles

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
On Thu, 05 Nov 1998 14:38:43 GMT, khr...@my-dejanews.com wrote:

> newsm...@207.0.0.1 (Raccoon) wrote:

>> original fetish. Where did it come from? Why is it so big?
>
>It ISN'T! Hermaphroditism is a popular sub-genre of furry fandom, but it's a
>popular sub-genre of human sexuality without the furry aspect, too! I know of
>far too many She-male mags to believe this is solely a furry-pervert thing.

Just check out www.isna.org for any questions you folks out there
reading this might have reguarding real herms....

>Gee, why am I suddenly inspired to draw a leather-bitch vixen with a harness
>doing rude things, now?

You draw it, I'll buy it. =};-3

Unca Spooge, having to living up to his name on occasion...

Lucas

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
Akai <ak...@teleport.com> wrote in article <364170...@teleport.com>...

> We've just finished having
> > roastRichChandler and didn't enjoy the taste at all. Way too dry and
> > stringy. <G>
> And the smell the leftovers left in the tupperware! Don't think I be
> able to use that set for anything edible again.

Oh no! You mean that you've been keeping that stuff around? Quick get
rid of it! I have a suspicion, mind you the second set of experiments is
still being conducted in the Hazardous Substances lab, but I have reason to
believe that if that stuff is left around, it may begin to divide and
regrow if allowed access to any other semi food substance!

If you want to keep it around, possibly as a base material for making
incendiary bombs, then maybe we should make sure that it's put into the
deep freeze until it's called for. I mean, I know that it was roast, but
any pieces that were taken off while the roast was still rare (and I know
that some furs like things REALLY rare...) so maybe we should just do the
freezing bit as an added precaution.

Tim Gadd

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
khr...@my-dejanews.com wrote:

>Well, that's my point.

Yep, I was agreeing with you on purpose, not accidentally ;)

Duncan da Husky

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
Ermine wrote:
>> homosexuality was based around titaphobia, the fear of tits.
>WTFO? Where did *that* idea come from?? I have a lot of gay male friends who
>have tit-ENVY, not fear. Sheesh!

I'd respond to this, but I think everything that needs to be said has been, so
I'll just retire to my corner and continue giggling at this idea. It does put
me in mind of a quote (from the other direction, though) by the fabulous
lesbian comedian Lea Delaria: "People think lesbians don't like penises. This
is not true. We like penises, just not attached to men." <grin>

-Duncan da Husky, still chortling at "titaphobia"

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tom Brady dun...@uncia.com http://www.technomancer.com/~duncan
Furry: Duncan da Husky SCA: Duncan MacKinnon of Tobermory
"There are lots of things I'd like to be someday, but 'normal'
is definitely not one of them." - Nelson Minar

Akai

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
Lucas wrote:
>
> Akai <ak...@teleport.com> wrote in article <364170...@teleport.com>...
> > We've just finished having
> > > roastRichChandler and didn't enjoy the taste at all. Way too dry and
> > > stringy. <G>
> > And the smell the leftovers left in the tupperware! Don't think I be
> > able to use that set for anything edible again.
>
> Oh no! You mean that you've been keeping that stuff around? Quick get
> rid of it! I have a suspicion, mind you the second set of experiments is
> still being conducted in the Hazardous Substances lab, but I have reason to
> believe that if that stuff is left around, it may begin to divide and
> regrow if allowed access to any other semi food substance!

I was keeping it for mold culture experiments. Strangely enough nothing
would grow on it...it seems there is enough residual bitchiness in the
remains that even the hardiest microorganisms find it an unsuitable
habitat.



> If you want to keep it around, possibly as a base material for making
> incendiary bombs, then maybe we should make sure that it's put into the
> deep freeze until it's called for. I mean, I know that it was roast, but
> any pieces that were taken off while the roast was still rare (and I know
> that some furs like things REALLY rare...) so maybe we should just do the
> freezing bit as an added precaution.

Maybe I'll keep it in the cellar with the AKIRA samples...



> Or vacuum packing, that might work, freeze drying might be good too. But
> if you want to maintain it's volatile properties, then you should probably
> stick to standard freezing. If any updates on the stuff filter down to me
> from the Lab, I'll be sure to forward them to you. :)

It could be a cure for gingivitis, athlete's foot, halitosis, yeast
infections...or it could be the perfect contraceptive....or just a
horrible biological weapon that will wreak untold devastation upon the
world. Ain't biology fun?

Akai

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
Flicker wrote:

>
> Lucas wrote:
> >
> > Oh no! You mean that you've been keeping that stuff around? Quick get
> > rid of it! ...

> >
> > Or vacuum packing, that might work, freeze drying might be good too. But
> > if you want to maintain it's volatile properties, then you should probably
> > stick to standard freezing. If any updates on the stuff filter down to me
> > from the Lab, I'll be sure to forward them to you. :)
>
> Perhaps we could launch it into the sun until we want it again...
>
> -Flicker, Mad Coyote

Hardly a better place for a flamer....

Raccoon

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
In article <981105233...@mauser.at.gte.net>, mau...@kendra.com
(Richard Chandler - WA Resident) says...

>Actually, I think it's a fear of vaginas. Consider the nightmare scenario in
>Wicked City of a vagina with teeth.
>
>Haven't seen the followups yet, but I wager someone's going to mention the
>female hynea. (Forgetting that it's only one subspecies of hyena, and not all
>of them).

Yes actually, there are quite a few mentionings.
But thats about as significant as the fact that raccoons have a penis
bone.

>
>Yes, men are afraid of vaginas with teeth.....
>
>... and women are afraid of cavities. :-)
>

> -- Richard Chandler

Would you recommend VaginalB or a Reach Brand tooth brush? :)

- Raccoon
alt [dot] raccoon [at] usa [dot] net

Raccoon

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
In article <364160FF...@inav.net>, dco...@inav.net (D. Jean
Cooper) says...

>Raccoon wrote:
>>
>> Of all aspects of Furry, from Art to Zoophila.. There is no fur-fetish
>> that is more puzzling to me than that of Vixens with Dicks-On.
>> Who came up with it, why did it start.. And why is it the most popular
>> topic of art in Furry today?
>>
>> I personally find it disgusting, and it really turns me off.
>> I've been downloading binaries from fur.art.erotica for some time now,
>> and over 30% of it contained pictures of female vulps stroking, spewing
>> or fucking eachother.. beating the 25% of male fucking male. and the 16%
>> of male masturbation.
>> I just don't get it. If someone likes dick, and wishes to draw dick..
>> Where do the breasts come in? I thought that the whole idea of
>> homosexuality was based around titaphobia, the fear of tits.
>> Another striking conclusion that comes to mind, is that in no species of
>> animal are there females with dicks. So, this must be some form of
>> original fetish. Where did it come from? Why is it so big?
>>
>> Personally, I'd like to see some more good 'natural' erotic art of high
>> quality put out there. But it seems that those who really know Photoshop

>> the best, are not straight. (Not to say I have any grudge with gays,
>> it's just that I know there are alot more straight people than gay, so
>> where are they?)
>> The only thing that I can think of is that those who draw really good
>> 'straight' erotic art are either too embarrassed to post it, or those who
>> draw 'other' art are posting way to often.
>>
>> Anyway, Vix with Dicks.. am I the only one disgusted here?

>> - Raccoon
>> alt [dot] raccoon [at] usa [dot] net
>>

>Raccoon, I'm afraid you've hit the wrong group. This is
>alt.lifestyle.furry, *not* alt.fan.furry. Unless your post has something
>that means something *to you* about -being- furry, then please take posts
>like this back over to AFF. Or if you're deliberatly trying to start a
>flaming, you've got a good start. We've just finished having


>roastRichChandler and didn't enjoy the taste at all. Way too dry and

>stringy. <G> Please read the FAQ and charter before you reply. Thanx.
>-Walk in Balance
>
>Ambergold Wolfeyes (a leeettle hair-trigger about art posts in the
>lifestyle group)
>SCA: Lady Aelfreda O'Llyn Ewig
>--
>D.Jean Cooper
>dcooperatinavdotnet
>

Ok, I apologize.
I took my post a bit farther than I originally intended to.
About my remarks about being disgusted.. I was actually referring to the
fact that this is all the art that I am finding at the binaries group,
not saying that I'm disgusted at the artists or viewers of such art.
Anyone that has read any of my posts at alt.fan.furry regarding 'Death of
Furry' and 'Burned Fur' know that I am open minded to the opinions others
express in their interests. "I can't change what other people like"
And the reason I'm posting to this group, is because to my knowledge
a.f.f is a general audience group while this is considered the adult
discussion group.

It's just that since I've joined Furry a couple years ago, I've noticed
many changes.. and one of those changes are that I'm seeing less and less
of what society accepts as being 'normal', and I'm really starting to
wonder where everyone went that I knew 2 years ago.

There was a time (In my fur experience) when the majority of interest was
heterosexual just as my interests are. But now that seems to have
changed, and I'm looking for a reason.. When, How and Why?

Another thing that I'd like to mention. Most seem to think I'm referring
to females with strapped on genitalia, or men with breasts. Well, I'm
talking about females with a built in male organ.
So how does this relate to homosexuality unless we're talking about
lesbians? Wouldn't a gay be attracted to someone with male facial and or
physical attributes? Where does a female with a dick come in? Are they
really male furs in drag, taking hormones and still awaiting their
surgery?

What did I miss? What do I call it? Is it as popular as I think it is?

- Raccoon
alt [dot] raccoon [at] usa [dot] net

--
Random site: (Rocket Raccoon Comic Covers)
http://members.tripod.com/~raccoonsite/comics/rocketcovers.html

CmdrKainS

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to

In article <MPG.10acb2457...@news.yiff.net>, newsm...@207.0.0.1
(Raccoon) writes:

>Ok, I apologize.
>I took my post a bit farther than I originally intended to.
>About my remarks about being disgusted.. I was actually referring to the
>fact that this is all the art that I am finding at the binaries group,
>not saying that I'm disgusted at the artists or viewers of such art.
>Anyone that has read any of my posts at alt.fan.furry regarding 'Death of
>Furry' and 'Burned Fur' know that I am open minded to the opinions others
>express in their interests. "I can't change what other people like"
>And the reason I'm posting to this group, is because to my knowledge
>a.f.f is a general audience group while this is considered the adult
>discussion group.

Well, I've been around on Furry in it's various online guises and found that
very few furry artists will *ever* post their works in the Binaries. Most furry
art is found either:
On a webpage archive.
On an FTP archive.
Only IRL and from the artist.
So just looking at Binaries, you *will* see a very narrow view of furry art.
Try checking out www.furnation.com or any of the other furry art archives, I'm
sure you'll find something more to your tastes...
As for ALF being adult audience, yes and no. Yes in that we do discuss adult
topics, but no if you're looking for a place to discuss adult furry art.
Like has been said allready, ALF is only for discussions that affect *you* IRL
that deal with furry or being furry.
No offense intended, but you're definately looking in the wrong places for
furrotica or furrotica discussion. Sorry.

>It's just that since I've joined Furry a couple years ago, I've noticed
>many changes.. and one of those changes are that I'm seeing less and less
>of what society accepts as being 'normal', and I'm really starting to
>wonder where everyone went that I knew 2 years ago.

I think I can answer that. At least or myself and a few friends. See below...

>There was a time (In my fur experience) when the majority of interest was
>heterosexual just as my interests are. But now that seems to have
>changed, and I'm looking for a reason.. When, How and Why?

This is due to the fact that human society is startiing to become more
accustomed to 'alternate' lifestyles (IE Gays, Bi's, Lesbians, Zoos, etc...)
and now the furries who have previously hid these tendancies are becoming more
open about it.
Keep in mind this is my personal opinion and I'm not even sure how acurate it
is anyways. <grin>
When? Don't know. How? Dunno either. Why? Why, now there's a good question. I
don't think *anyone* can explain *why* such-and-such person is, or isn't,
gay/etc...Because the 'reasons' for their orientation are as diverse as the
amount of people themselves. I myself am just a *very* affectionate fur, who
believes that sex and pleasure should be shared equally and freely. Something
that unfortantely isn't likely to happen due to STD's and human hangups about
sex. As for *why* I am this way? I can't tell you, cause I don't know myself, I
just am.
There aren't any real answers to what you're asking. So you only have three
options:
A. Leave.
B. Tolerate us, even if you don't agree.
C. Get to know us, and maybe even get to know more about yourself.
I as a fur will allways hope that people in your situation will choose path C,
but it's your life. Let us live ours as well?

>Another thing that I'd like to mention. Most seem to think I'm referring
>to females with strapped on genitalia, or men with breasts. Well, I'm
>talking about females with a built in male organ.
>So how does this relate to homosexuality unless we're talking about
>lesbians? Wouldn't a gay be attracted to someone with male facial and or
>physical attributes? Where does a female with a dick come in? Are they
>really male furs in drag, taking hormones and still awaiting their
>surgery?

This is called a hermaphrodite, a herm for short, a being with the sexual
genitalia of both male and female sexes.
I'll try to answer each of your questions as best I can. Again, I'm not an
expert, and also think that noone *can* be one. Thses are just my thoughts.
First off, I know several gay men who would be quite happy to be able to have
sex with a true herm. This is because Herms are usually portrayed as being both
male and female, not only in genitalia, but also in personality. Those same gay
men I know would be attracted to such a person.
I happen to be Bisexual, so i can say that not all gay men are *only*, or at
all, attracted to the male body. Many are attracted to the male personality and
mindset. At least I am. I personally don't care, much, if the person I'm with
is male, female, herm, or other, just so long as I enjoy their mind and
personality, then their body is attractive to me as well. This is also how I am
attracted to non-humans (animals, plushies, real furs, etc...) as well. I look
at the mind, then the body.
Plus there's an added bonus, sometimes, from being gay and being with a herm.
It is *possible*, however usually difficult, for both partners to take and be
taken. Personally if I could try this, I would. But that's me. <grin>
Herms are neither male or female, but instead *both*! They are neither males in
drag with hormone treatments, nor females with abnormal growth. They are a
sex/gender apart. Unfortunately the human genetic code causes true herms IRL to
be unstable and sterile. Cause personally I'd find a true IRL herm to be quite
attractive
On a side note, who else shares my feelings about herms, weather furry or non?.

>What did I miss? What do I call it? Is it as popular as I think it is?

Not sure what you thought you missed, but like I said about art, maybe you
were/are looking in the wrong places to feel comfortable. If you don't feel
comfortable enough to stay here and discuss furry lifestyles with us, then may
I politely suggest you find somewhere else? For all our sakes?
What do you call it, a herm/hermaph/hermaphrodite are all acceptable terms.
As for popular, it depends on how popular you think it is. Once again, ALF is
only a small percentage of the whole fandom. Try looking at other Furry areas
and see what they are up to. You might find that Furry Fandom is as varied as
human society, to an extent of course. <grin>

Trace Kern
Trac...@juno.com
Cmdr...@aol.com

Tim Gadd

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
cmdr...@aol.com (CmdrKainS) wrote:

>As for ALF being adult audience, yes and no. Yes in that we do discuss adult
>topics, but no if you're looking for a place to discuss adult furry art.
>Like has been said allready, ALF is only for discussions that affect *you* IRL
>that deal with furry or being furry.
>No offense intended, but you're definately looking in the wrong places for
>furrotica or furrotica discussion. Sorry.

Unless the furotica discussion was more than just a discussion of the
artwork, and had some general or personal content related to being
furry.

khr...@my-dejanews.com

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
add...@in.sig wrote:
> khr...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>
> >Well, that's my point.
>
> Yep, I was agreeing with you on purpose, not accidentally ;)

*giggle!*

khr...@my-dejanews.com

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
newsm...@207.0.0.1 (Raccoon) wrote:
> In article <981105233...@mauser.at.gte.net>, mau...@kendra.com
> (Richard Chandler - WA Resident) says...
> >Actually, I think it's a fear of vaginas. Consider the nightmare scenario in
> >Wicked City of a vagina with teeth.
> >
> >Haven't seen the followups yet, but I wager someone's going to mention the
> >female hynea. (Forgetting that it's only one subspecies of hyena, and not
> >all of them).
>
> Yes actually, there are quite a few mentionings.
> But thats about as significant as the fact that raccoons have a penis
> bone.

It is significant in the fact that you made the statement "There are no
animals where the females have penises", therefore mentioning that species of
Hyena is appropriate to counter your assumption.

And Raccoons aren't the only animal with a penal bone. Most all the mustelid
family have them, and I believe that part of the sheath of most mammalians is
a boney structure, seeing that I recall some paper on the Aquatic Ape theory
mentioning the a point of argument: the human penis not having a bone to
limit the retraction and to streamline the body makes sense if he had to live
in a watery environment.

> >
> >Yes, men are afraid of vaginas with teeth.....

Only because your penis can't bite back. ;3

Try using scale-mail condoms next time. OOoh, that texture! :9

> >... and women are afraid of cavities. :-)

...and impacted wisdom teeth. *ouwwww*

> Would you recommend VaginalB or a Reach Brand tooth brush? :)

Personaly, I'd use a waterpik. Good hygene and fun at the same time!


-- ermine (yes, I can wallow in the gutter with the best of 'em)

Farlo

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
Raccoon did speaketh thus:

>the reason I'm posting to this group, is because to my knowledge
>a.f.f is a general audience group while this is considered the adult
>discussion group.

Oops.

Well, we *do* hold adult discussions here, but generally art and
comics is a topic for AFF. ALF really isn't "the mature version of
AFF", as comics and pictures are usually off-topic here.

Check the FAQ =)

>But now that seems to have
>changed, and I'm looking for a reason.. When, How and Why?

Larger numbers mean a less homogenous group. Also, the environment of
tolerance and acceptance encourages people to "be themselves", which
means that you see a more honest range of sexual interests.

-------------------
Farlo m>*_*<m
Urban Fey Dragon

Standard XXXX
@abac.com XXXX
-------------------

Tim Gadd

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
khr...@my-dejanews.com wrote:

>It is significant in the fact that you made the statement "There are no
>animals where the females have penises"

The animals were scared away, or what? :)

MegaDog the Nettweiler

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
In article <MPG.10aca942c...@news.yiff.net>, Raccoon
<newsm...@207.0.0.1> writes

>In article <981105233...@mauser.at.gte.net>, mau...@kendra.com
>(Richard Chandler - WA Resident) says...
>>Haven't seen the followups yet, but I wager someone's going to mention the
>>female hynea. (Forgetting that it's only one subspecies of hyena, and not all
>>of them).
>
>Yes actually, there are quite a few mentionings.
>But thats about as significant as the fact that raccoons have a penis
>bone.

Ah, yes... check out http://www.luckymojo.com/RaccoonPenis.html
for evidence of what can be done with the bones once their
original owners have finished with them...
--
!Raised Tails! -:MegaDog:-
http://www.canismajor.demon.co.uk/index.html
"I wish i was in Tijuana, eating barbecued Iguana" -Wall of Voodoo

khr...@my-dejanews.com

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Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
newsm...@207.0.0.1 (Raccoon) wrote:
> dco...@inav.net (D. Jean > Cooper) says...
> >Raccoon wrote:
> >> Of all aspects of Furry, from Art to Zoophila.. There is no fur-fetish
> >> that is more puzzling to me than that of Vixens with Dicks-On.
> >> Who came up with it, why did it start.. And why is it the most popular
> >> topic of art in Furry today?
*snippy*

> >Raccoon, I'm afraid you've hit the wrong group. This is
> >alt.lifestyle.furry, *not* alt.fan.furry. Unless your post has something
> >that means something *to you* about -being- furry, then please take posts
> >like this back over to AFF. Or if you're deliberatly trying to start a
> >flaming, you've got a good start. We've just finished having
> >roastRichChandler and didn't enjoy the taste at all. Way too dry and
> >stringy. <G> Please read the FAQ and charter before you reply. Thanx.

> Ok, I apologize.


> I took my post a bit farther than I originally intended to.
> About my remarks about being disgusted.. I was actually referring to the
> fact that this is all the art that I am finding at the binaries group,

If you haven't read my previous post yet, please do. I point out that the
binaries groups are not representative of the whole of furry art interest
because of the simple fact that most of us artists don't _post_ there. Many
more don't have their artwork anywhere on the Internet. You cannot judge the
animal from the feather -- it might be an eagle, or it might be a griffon.

> not saying that I'm disgusted at the artists or viewers of such art.
> Anyone that has read any of my posts at alt.fan.furry regarding 'Death of
> Furry' and 'Burned Fur' know that I am open minded to the opinions others
> express in their interests. "I can't change what other people like"

> And the reason I'm posting to this group, is because to my knowledge


> a.f.f is a general audience group while this is considered the adult
> discussion group.

I'm sorry, but that's not quite correct. We talk about adult (ie MATURE)
subjects here, but you are allowed the same on AFF as well. The groups are
separate for other reasons, not ratings of content.

Although, admittedly, some people on AFF demonstrate rather immature
attitudes, but that's not to say that ALF is the "R" group and AFF is the
"PG-13" group. AFF is for talking about furry fandom, ALF is for talking
about how furry relates to you as an individual. Your topic (translated to be
"Why does Fandom appear to like Hermaphrodite Sex?) is a _fandom_ subject,
not a lifestyle subject. If you were to ask "Would you ever like to be a
furry Hermaphrodite? How would it feel to be one?" Then those are topical
here. See the difference?

> It's just that since I've joined Furry a couple years ago, I've noticed
> many changes.. and one of those changes are that I'm seeing less and less
> of what society accepts as being 'normal', and I'm really starting to
> wonder where everyone went that I knew 2 years ago.

I dunno about who you knew, but I've been here since the beginning. ;3
("I have always been here...")

In the 15 years I have participated and observed the cultural evolution of
furry fandom, I can make the following factual statements:

1) Society in the US as a whole has become more perverted over time. When I
say 'perverted' I am referring to the fact that there is both a greater
freedom of expression and deviancy at the same time there is greater
oppression using laws and a stronger 'noisy' attitude to interfere with the
personal rights of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. A deviant does
something considered wrong by the social norm but he personally doesn't
believe it is wrong; a pervert is someone who does something wrong and
_believes_ that it is wrong while he is doing it.

2) Furry Fandom has _always_ drawn the fringe interests. We were the misfits
of the misfits: too fantastic for SF fandom, too adult for the Cartoon
fandom, too practical for the Fantasy fandom, etc. Furry Fandom, in spite the
battle and arguements otherwise, was _organized_ by people who were (on the
whole) sexually open, alternative, and creative in their expressions of their
interests.

3) When you combine the two factors, it is natural and logical to assume that
furry fandom has been getting more open in the fantasy fetishes and curious
sexual attractions as a side effect of what the Society at large tolerates. I
mean, homosexuals are almost blase' in 'perversion' now -- ask anyone who
remembered the 50's and how open a gay man could've been back then. Furry
couldn't have started much before the time it did because of the social mores'
of the time.

> There was a time (In my fur experience) when the majority of interest was

> heterosexual just as my interests are. But now that seems to have


> changed, and I'm looking for a reason.. When, How and Why?

Nope, you're wrong. Not in furry fandom. See arguements above.

There was a time where the predominant form of art was of females in
cheesecake poses, yes. It's still a major motif among furry artists if you
bother to look somewhere outside of the binaries group. Heck, most of my
friends and favorite artists draw females a lot, as do I. And het sex? You
can find it all over the place, if you look for it. I'm still pretty unknown
to the internet-only crowd, but most of my commissions have in fact been
sexual couplings, het and otherwise. I don't *post* them, so you may not
think I draw them, and that's not necessarily true, certainly untrue in my
case.

What _you_ personally were seeing before was one subgroup of people. Now you
are seeing another. Try expanding your search before making a judgement call
on all of us based on two small segments of the group.

You want het-sex art? Jim Hardiman does great stuff, Ken Sample has an online
printshop, Jeremy Kidd does commissions, _I_ do commissions, and you can find
a lot of other artists will cater to requests.

You want girls? There are artists like Shon Howell, Leia Graf, Terrie Smith,
Michelle Light, Daphnie Lage, Brian O'Connell, Caribou, Melissa Drake, Amy
Provonost, Genesis Cook, Stephanie Stone, Kese, Amara (the other one), Conrad
Wong, Doug Winger, Freddy Anderson, Baron Engel, Kishma Danielle, Diana Vick,
Tanamin, Eric Schwartz, Timbawulf, John Barrett, Jay Shell... sheesh, I could
fill a page with just the artists I _personally_ know who draw girls!

Now, how many of those names have you seen on fur.art.erotica? Hmm? How many
names up there are girls (and therefore less likely to draw gay-guy art for
themselves)? A large number of the list above have only a sketchy presence on
the internet, others (like me) have FTP sites with some of their artwork
available for downloading.

Please, please, PLEASE get away from the binaries group for a day and go
looking for webpages of the _rest_ of furry fandom's artists! I can count
maybe 10 of the artists listed above that I know draw hermaphrodites and
_none_ of them draws herms exclusively.

> Another thing that I'd like to mention. Most seem to think I'm referring
> to females with strapped on genitalia, or men with breasts. Well, I'm
> talking about females with a built in male organ.

So was I. It's called HERMAPHRODITES. :3

(Useless trivia: The term Hermaphrodite comes from a greek legend of a youth
called hermaphroditus who was a child of Venus and he possessed the attributes
of both man and woman.)

> So how does this relate to homosexuality unless we're talking about
> lesbians?

But we're _not_ talking about homosexuality here. Your original question was
asking why there are lots of drawings of herm vixens on fur.art.erotica....
and that somehow you've jumped to a assumed subject of why gays would like
them? Have you polled the gay population recently? I don't think they really
care that much about the herms!

And a lesbian may not like a herm anymore than a gay man would. It all depends
on how 'monosexual' the individual is.

Wouldn't a gay be attracted to someone with male facial and or
> physical attributes?

How do you explain effeminate "fairy" gay males, then? They're not very
masculine and yet they're involved in relationships with other men. How about
the transvestite gay men? Heck, how about the transvestite _hetero_ men? You
seem to be laboring under a contrained set of definitions, in my opinion.

>Where does a female with a dick come in?

They get to wear the pants in the house? :3 How about they can take on the
dominant male role so that the man can be submissive and still get his daily
dose of dick? How about herms are more interesting to bisexuals? How about
girls with masculine attributes may fantasize about having a dick without
losing all their femininity? How about you keep missing the female population
of fandom?

> Are they really male furs in drag, taking hormones and still awaiting their
> surgery?

Not always. The advantage of _furry_ herms is that the duality can be a
natural atribute of the race. You don't have to wonder if the being was once
single-gendered. :3

> What did I miss?

A lot.

> What do I call it?

Ignorance or naivete ... and Knowledge will set you free.

>Is it as popular as I think it is?

No, but that doesn't mean it's _unpopular_, either. You're just blowing this
way out of proportion.

-- ermine (femfur artist since 1982)

khr...@my-dejanews.com

unread,
Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
doo...@cheezies.primenet.com (Doodles) wrote:
> On Thu, 05 Nov 1998 14:38:43 GMT, khr...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > newsm...@207.0.0.1 (Raccoon) wrote:
> >> original fetish. Where did it come from? Why is it so big?
> >
> >It ISN'T! Hermaphroditism is a popular sub-genre of furry fandom, but it's a
> >popular sub-genre of human sexuality without the furry aspect, too! I know of
> >far too many She-male mags to believe this is solely a furry-pervert thing.
>
> Just check out www.isna.org for any questions you folks out there
> reading this might have reguarding real herms....

I don't lurk there as often as I should... then again, I'm afraid they might
not understand me being an psychic hermaph. :3

> >Gee, why am I suddenly inspired to draw a leather-bitch vixen with a harness
> >doing rude things, now?
> You draw it, I'll buy it. =};-3

Hmmmm.... a portfolio called Hardcore Hermvixens? I can think of a few people
would would snatch it in an instant....

But first I'll need to be able to draw it. *sigh*

-- ermine

khr...@my-dejanews.com

unread,
Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
add...@in.sig wrote:

> khr...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> >*blink?* We gotta CHARTER?? I never saw no postings about a charter... and
> >I've been lurking for _months_ before I usurped it! :3
>
> >Anyone out there got a copy of this a.c.a. charter I can look at?
>
> Apologies. It turns out I was thinking of alt.arts.anthro. - a newer
> group.

*Ahhhhhh!*

Okay! Apology accepted... I didn't _think_ there was a charter or anything
like that seeing that I hadn't heard of it prior to this. :3

khr...@my-dejanews.com

unread,
Nov 6, 1998, 3:00:00 AM11/6/98
to
In article <71t1cg$c9m$1...@holly.prod.itd.earthlink.net>,

"Sidhain" <sid...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> >*blink?* We gotta CHARTER?? I never saw no postings about a charter... and
> >I've been lurking for _months_ before I usurped it! :3
> >
> >Anyone out there got a copy of this a.c.a. charter I can look at?

> Yep and i have been here since August? September and even I have seen the
> charter....

There has been no mention of a charter on ACA in the 7 months or more I have
been there. No frequent postings of anykind, unless you count me. :3

> its been mentioned many times.

The charter for ALF has, yes... not ACA, which is the newsgroup I was
referring to.

> Shows ya what lurking does.....

Ahm... I don't lurk here. I'm an active ermine. :D

> All ye can see is peoples feet...

That's all I tend to see anyways.... except for my own, of course. We ermines
are small critters. :3