abhi Ghazal jawaan hai [3]
Vasmi Abidi
"abhi Ghazal jawaan hai", jise log pyaar se aGjh bhi kahte haiN, kee
qist #3 haazir hai. is baar ‘Conductor’ ka kaam mujhko mil gayaa hai.
aur aap sabko yeh batataate huwe Khushee ho rahee hai k ‘Judge’ hoNge
Sarwar Raz saahib. in dinoN Sarwar saahib ka internet access kaafi
mehdood hai, phir bhi unhone hamaaree darKhwaast manzoor kar liyaa. ye
hamaaree Khush-qismatee hai, aur ham unko shukriya adaa karte haiN.
Note keejiyega k sirf is qist ke liye ‘deadline’ baRhaa dee jaayegee.
aap sabhee Khawaateen-o-hazraat se guzaarish hai ki aGjh3 meN bharpoor
hissa leN. raahe suKhanwaree meN bahut lutf.e.safar miltaa hai!
To reiterate, please take advantage of this opportunity to hone your
poetic skills.
So let’s start:
A) tarah
Here's the proposed matla of the Ghazal that we (or rather, you)
will compose:
"banke hamdard mire, roz sataate kyoN haiN?
duniyaa vaale mujhe deevaanaa banaate kyoN haiN?"
(If a better matla comes along, we'll replace this one)
The 'radeef' is "kyoN haiN"
The qavaafee words are: sataate, banaate, lagaate, etc.
Examples of words that DO NOT work as qaafiyaa here: samjhaate,
farmaate, sitaare, zamaane
B) behr:
The behr we’ll use this time is a very popular one, and you find many
examples of its use. Here are some well-known examples:
“aah ko chaahiye ik umr asar hone tak
kaun jeetaa hai tire zulf ke sar hone tak” (Ghalib)
“uzr aane bhi hai aur bulaate bhi naheeN
baa’is.e.tarq.e.mulaaqaat bataate bhi naheeN” (Daagh)
“mujh se pahlee si muhabbat mire mahboob na maaNg” (Faiz)
“kabhi Khud pe kabhi haalaat pe ronaa aaya
baat niklee to har ik baat pe ronaa aaya” (Sahir)
“mujh ko is raat ki tanhaaii meN aawaaz na do
jis ki aawaaz rulaa de mujhe vo saaz na do” (Shamim
Jaipuri) (Mukesh song)
taqtee:
faa-i-laa-tun fa-i-laa-tun fa-i-laa-tun fa’-lun
that is,
2122 1122 1122 22
Bonus question: What is the full name of this behr?
Hint: look at article “nikaat.e.sukhan #4”
C) Deadline:
Last date for entry is October 31, 2002.
D) A note from the Judge:
"arz.e.Raz
abhee Ghazal javaan hai: kee teesree qist ke liye
Khaaksaar ko :judge: kee Khidmaat soNpee gayee haiN.
iss silsile kee do qistoN ke dauraan tareeq.e.kaar tae
ho chukaa hai aur aap logoN kee pur.josh shirkat ne
iss meiN chaar chaaNd lagaa diye haiN. naye sho'raa
kee aisee meHnat aur dilchaspee na sirf iss silsile ke
liye bal.k Khud Ghazal ke liye Khush.aayind hai. aap
sab shukriye ke mustaHiq haiN.
chooN.k aaj kal internet per meree rasaaee bohat
meHdood hai maiN chand baateN arz karnee chaahtaa hooN
jin se shaayad yeh ahem kaam behtar taur se ho sakegaa
aur ham sab vaqt aur meHnat ke ziyaa' se bach sakeN
ge.
(1) she'r meHnat.o.fikr se kahiye aur uss per baar
baar nazar keejiye. Khayaal kaisaa hai? alfaaz uss ko
adaa kar rahe haiN k naheeN? jab aap she'r se mutma'in
ho jaayeN to uss ko aik :level: aur ooNchaa le jaane
kee koshish kareN. jaldee se kuChh keh kar post karne
se gurez kareN. aap dekheN ge k nazar.e.saanee per aap
Khud she'r per mazeed meHnat karnee chaaheN ge.
(2) she'r ke vazn aur beHr ko Theek karne ke liye uss
ko aahista, aahista magar ba.aavaaz, saHeeH talaffuz
aur adaa'ee ke saath paRhiye. kaheeN zabaan aTaktee to
naheeN hai? she'r ravaaN hai? taraHee misre ke saath
uss ko duhraa'iye: vazn aur beHr meiN pooraa hai?
alfaaz ko bejaa toRnaa to naheeN paRtaa hai? jahaaN
kaheeN zabaan aTke aur tabee'yat angusht.numaa'ee
kare, ruk jaa'iye aur sochiye! alfaaz kee heraa.pheree
keejiye aur bandish ko behtar keejiye.
(3) she'r ko vazn aur beHr per parakhne ke liye uss ko
kabhee bhee gaa kar yaa gungunaa kar na paRhiye! gaane
aur gungunaane meiN alfaaz ko kheeNch.taan kar beHR
meiN khapaanaa aasaan hai. aap ne dekhaa hogaa ka
aChhe aChhe Ghazal gaane vaale (Mehdi Hasan, Ghulam
Ali) bevazn ash'aar gaa jaate haiN. gungunaane kaa
amal kaafee tajribe ke ba'd hee iss manzil meiN kaam
aataa hai!
(4) maiN ne apne aik mazmoon meiN Ghazal kehne ke
aasaan tareeqe per izhaar.e.Khayaal kiyaa thaa. uss ko
aik baar phir dekh leN to behtar hogaa.
in baatoN kaa Khayaal rakheN ge to aap kee aur meree
mushkil aasaan ho jaaye gee aur kam vaqt meiN ziyaada
kaam ho sakegaa.
shukriya!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
"
Sarwar Alam Raz
> aadaab arz.
>
> "abhi Ghazal jawaan hai", jise log pyaar se aGjh bhi kahte haiN, kee
> aur aap sabko yeh batataate huwe Khushee ho rahee hai k 遷udge' hoNge
> Sarwar Raz saahib. in dinoN Sarwar saahib ka internet access kaafi
> mehdood hai, phir bhi unhone hamaaree darKhwaast manzoor kar liyaa. ye
> hamaaree Khush-qismatee hai, aur ham unko shukriya adaa karte haiN.
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
dosto: tasleemaat!
maiN aap kaa shukr.guzaar hooN k na sirf aap ne mujh ko apnee Khidmat
ke qaabil samjhaa bal.k meree darKhwaast per iss qist kee :deadline:
bhee baRhaa dee. maiN aaj kal :dast ba dast.e.deegre, paa ba
dast.e.deegre: kaa misdaaq banaa huaa hooN. Khair, to aa'iye ham mil
kar Vasme saaheb ke iss misre kee :Khabar leN:!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
ravi
i have been quite fascinated by this series "abhi ghazal jawaan hai".
i have been trying to learn the finer skills of understanding a
couplet or writing one by reading the various posts on this forum.
have picked up a few things and haven't picked up a few others.
ultimately came to the conclusion that will not understand till i do
it as confucius once said. I know the cognoscenti might be offended by
the attempt. but one has to start somewhere. i am also impressed by
the high quality feedback offered by the members of this group and
would really look forward to it. to take this ghazal forward here is
my contribution:
jo khayaal merii neend uRaa jaate hai.N
vo khayaal mere khwaab mein aate kyoN hai.N
jinsey rakhnaa chaahte hain taa-umr rishtaa
vo log humse door chaley jaatey kyoN hai.N
please give your valuable feedback.
regards
ravi
Amit Malhotra
aGjh [2] mein hamari entry bahut der se hui aur vaqt kam mila sh'er ko
sudhaarne mein.. to hamne socha, is baar "early-entry" 'maarte' hain, aur
sh'er ko acchii tarah sudhaarne ka vaqt bhi mil jaayega.. so here it is..
i actually wrote a few ash'aar with the similar idea, so perhaps i'll
compile them all together and write my own "musalsal ghazal" but till i do
that, i can atleast make one of them a gem with the help of our revered
Judge sahib. so here it is:
"gar tira aur mira ek hi waahid yaawar!
to mazaahib hame.N aapas me.N la.Raate kyuu.N hai.N ?? "
here the word "waahid" is used to denote "God"
mazaahib of course is the plural of the word "mazhab"
the sh'er is very straight forward with no hidden meanings. Sarwar sahib,
hope you can help me present my idea (which should be very clear with these
words) in a more refined manner :-)
Best Regards,
Amit Malhotra
p.s. I'll give it a shot for the bonus question, tell me if i'm right
conductur sahib:
behr-e-ramal, musamman, maKhbooN, meHzoof-maqtoo'
Sarwar Alam Raz
> will compose:
>
> "banke hamdard mire, roz sataate kyoN haiN?
> duniyaa vaale mujhe deevaanaa banaate kyoN haiN?"
Vasmi saaheb: aadaab!
vaah! vaah! aap ne matla' Khoob kahaa hai. na sirf she'r vazn aur beHr
kee taraazoo meiN pooraa utartaa hai bal.k ma'navee taur per bhee
dilkash hai. duniyaa vaaloN kaa jhooTee hamdardee kee aaR meiN sataa
sataa kar deevaana banaanaa bohat aChhaa Khayaal hai jis ko aap ne
bohat saleeqe se adaa bhee kiyaa hai. aik tajveez zehn meiN aayee hai,
sun leN. :duniyaa vaale: bilkul Theek hai, albatta iss fiqre ko aik
doosre do-lafzee fiqre se badal kar dekh leN jo ziyaada ravaaN aur
faseeH hai lekin bilkul :duniyaa vaale: kaa ham.ma'nee hai! kyaa
Khayaal hai k aik koshish kar dekheN?
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
UVR
"*ahl-e-duniyaa* mujhe diiwaana banaate kyoN haiN?"
-UVR.
Sarwar Alam Raz
> jo khayaal merii neend uRaa jaate hai.N
> vo khayaal mere khwaab mein aate kyoN hai.N
> ravi
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Ravi saaheb namaste!
aap ko iss meHfil meiN dekh kar bohat Khushee huee. issee taraH aate
rahiye. meHnat aur shauq se aap apnee koshishoN meiN kaamyaab ho
jaayeN ge. aap kee shuroo'aat hai iss liye maiN aap ke doosre she'r ko
ChhoRtaa hooN aur sirf pehle per aap ko raa'e detaa hooN. Vasmi saaheb
ke she'r ko aahista aahista aur aavaaz se paRhiye aur phir apnaa she'r
paRhiye to ma'loom hogaa k aap ke donoN misroN meiN aik :syllable: kee
kamee hai, ya'nee agar donoN meiN aik aik aavaaz baRhaa dee jaaye to
she'r mozooN ho jaayegaa.
ab :hint: ke taur se maiN aap se kahooN gaa k lafz :Khayaal: per
sochiye. agar aap iss ko zaraa se muKhtalif andaaz meiN likheN taa.k
matalb yehee rahe lekin aik :syllable: baRh jaaye to she'r Theek ho
jaayegaa. koshish keejiye aur phir likhiye taa.k maiN dekh sakooN.
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> aGjh ke munsif mohtaram aur 'Conductur' mohtaram ko hamara namaste,
> compile them all together and write my own "musalsal ghazal" but till i do
> that, i can atleast make one of them a gem with the help of our revered
> Judge sahib. so here it is:
>
> "gar tira aur mira ek hi waahid yaawar!
> to mazaahib hame.N aapas me.N la.Raate kyuu.N hai.N ?? "
>
> here the word "waahid" is used to denote "God"
> mazaahib of course is the plural of the word "mazhab"
>
> the sh'er is very straight forward with no hidden meanings. Sarwar sahib,
> hope you can help me present my idea (which should be very clear with these
> words) in a more refined manner :-)
> Best Regards,
>
> Amit Malhotra
Amit saaheb: namaste!
:The early bird gets the worm: per amal ho rahaa hai kyaa? LOL!!! aap
ke donoN misre beHr ke liHaaz se durust haiN lekin matlab kee adaa'ee
meiN pehla misra kamzor reh gayaa hai. uss kee bunat (construct) se
chand savaalaat uThte haiN:
:tiraa: kaa muKhaatib kaun hai? :vaahid yaavar: kaa kyaa matlab hai?
yeh to Theek hai k Islamic terminology meiN :vaahid: Khudaa kaa aik
naam hai lekin aam taur se yeh lafz iss ma'nee meiN istaimaal naheeN
hota hai aur aap kaa paRhne vaalaa aap kaa matlab samajh naheeN saktaa
hai. she'r kaa matlab seedhaa saada hai k :agar ham sab kaa
parvardigaar aik hee hai to phir yeh mazaahib kaa jhagRaa kaisaa hai?:
meree raa'e meiN pehlaa misra dobaara kehne kee zaroorat hai taa.k
matlab saaf adaa ho sake. iss misre meiN :hee: ke saath :hai: kee
zaroorat bhee ma'loom hotee hai. neez yeh k doosre misre meiN :to: kee
jagah ko'ee aur ziyaada mozooN lafz laane kee koshish keejiye. thoRee
see meHnat se aap kaa she'r voh sab adaa kar sakegaa jo aap kehnaa
chaahte haiN. mujh ko yeh ma'loom hai k aap yeh kar sakte haiN!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Vasmi Abidi
Ravi Saahib,
beshak aapko Judge saahib se maahiraana raaye (=expert advice)
milegee. lekin, "from one nau-mashq to another", maine socha chand baateN
mai bhi bataa dooN.
ravi wrote:
> hi all
>
> i have been quite fascinated by this series "abhi ghazal jawaan hai".
> i have been trying to learn the finer skills of understanding a
> couplet or writing one by reading the various posts on this forum.
> have picked up a few things and haven't picked up a few others.
> ultimately came to the conclusion that will not understand till i do
> it as confucius once said.
ye aapne (ya janaab confucius ne) bahut pate kee baat kahee hai. ab
dekhiye, maiN kitne barsoN se Pete Sampras ko TV par tennis khelte dekh
rahaa hooN, magar ek din himmat kar ke Khud court par gayaa, to ball ko
net ke paar pahuNchaanaa bhi dushvaar ho gayaa!
So, yes, there's no substitute for taking the plunge.
> I know the cognoscenti might be offended by
> the attempt. but one has to start somewhere. i am also impressed by
> the high quality feedback offered by the members of this group and
> would really look forward to it. to take this ghazal forward here is
> my contribution:
>
> jo khayaal merii neend uRaa jaate hai.N
> vo khayaal mere khwaab mein aate kyoN hai.N
>
dekhiye, aap ko apne misre kee gaRee "faa-i-laa-tun, fa-i-laa-tun,
fa-i-laa-tun, faa-lun" kee paTree par chalaanee hai.
"jo Khayaal" ke baad behr TooT rahee hai.
shuru meN "2122" vazan kee zaroorat hai, magar "jo Khayaal" ka vazan ho
gayaa "2121", because "jo"(2),
"Kha"(1) "yaa"(2) "l"(1)
To get on-track, kuchh to karnaa hogaa. Let's consider the plural form
of "Khayaal", which is "Khayaalaat". If you said "jo Khayaalaat", the
vazan would be "2122 1". That's cool, and we're on-track so far.
you can scan the rest of the misra to verify if it stays on track.
>
> jinsey rakhnaa chaahte hain taa-umr rishtaa
> vo log humse door chaley jaatey kyoN hai.N
>
pahle misre meN "jinse rakhnaa" has vazan "21 22" which is on track.
But that must be followed by two short sounds, to match "11" (or fa-i) in
the behr.
so "chaahte" won't do.
If instead you had something like "jinse rakhnaa hai hameN ....", then,
behr-wise, you'd be ok.
doosra misra dekheN.
"vo" has the vazan "2". so far so good.
But "log" has the vazan "21". not good! we've jumped off the tracks.
the misra ends smoothly, and back on track, with "chale jaate kyoN haiN",
but it's too late, we've already fallen into the abyss of
"Khaarij-az-behr"!
As an example, if the misra started started "vo mujhe door...", it would
be compliant to the behr, so far.
>
> please give your valuable feedback.
>
so that's my feedback, though I wonder if it's valuable.
good poets have a built-in (or intuitive) "behr-detector", and perhaps
some day, so shall we.
But till then, we'll need to do explicit pattern matching to verify our
misra's are in behr.
good luck on your next attempt.
Vasmi
>
> regards
>
> ravi
Vasmi Abidi
Amit Saahib,
namaste.
'bonus question' ka javaab dene ka shukriyaa.
ye savaal maine is liye poochha tha k: (1) jinko behr se dichaspee ho, unkee
mashq ho jaaye, aur (2) mujhe Khud bhi iska sahee naam poore yaqeen se naheeN
pataa!
Amit Malhotra wrote:
>
> p.s. I'll give it a shot for the bonus question, tell me if i'm right
> conductur sahib:
> behr-e-ramal, musamman, maKhbooN, meHzoof-maqtoo'
>
behr-e-ramal: jee haaN. is meN faa-i-laa-tun aur uske zihaafaat ka istemaal
hai.
musamman: beshak, chooNke she'r meN aaTh arkaan haiN
maKhboon: Theek hai, fa-i-laa-tun ki vajah se.
mehzoof: ye mujhe sahee naheeN lag rahaa hai.
maqtoo: jee haaN, fa'-lun istemaal hua hai.
Vasmi
Vasmi Abidi
she'r pasand farmaane ka shukriya!
"duniyaa vaale" kee badal ke liye, zaroor aapka ishaara "ahl.e.duniyaa" kee taraf tha!
jaisa UVR saahib ne farmaaya hai.
Vasmi
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Sarwar Saahib, aadaab.
> she'r pasand farmaane ka shukriya!
>
> "duniyaa vaale" kee badal ke liye, zaroor aapka ishaara "ahl.e.duniyaa" kee taraf tha!
> jaisa UVR saahib ne farmaaya hai.
>
> Vasmi
Vasmi saaheb aur UVR saahebaan: aadaab arz hai!
saaheb agar taraqqee kaa yehee aalam rahaa to aap logoN ko kal se hee
:nau.mashqoN: kee fehrist se nikaal denaa hogaa! subHaan.Allah!
jee haaN, meraa ishaara :ahl.e.duniyaa: kee jaanib hee thaa. liHaaza
Vasmi saaheb kaa yeh matla' qubool huaa aur daaKhil.e.daftar Thehraa!
Vasmi saaheb kaa doosre logoN per mufassil tabsara pasand aayaa. aise
hee log aik doosre se baat karte raheN ge to Yogesh saaheb ko jald hee
ko'ee aur project lenaa hogaa! inshaa.Allah!! Vasmi saaheb aur UVR
saaheb, bohat Khoob aur marHabaa!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Dilnavaaz
> aadaab arz.
>
> "abhi Ghazal jawaan hai", jise log pyaar se aGjh bhi kahte haiN, kee
> aur aap sabko yeh batataate huwe Khushee ho rahee hai k 遷udge' hoNge
> Sarwar Raz saahib. in dinoN Sarwar saahib ka internet access kaafi
> mehdood hai, phir bhi unhone hamaaree darKhwaast manzoor kar liyaa. ye
> hamaaree Khush-qismatee hai, aur ham unko shukriya adaa karte haiN.
>
>
> aap sabhee Khawaateen-o-hazraat se guzaarish hai ki aGjh3 meN bharpoor
> hissa leN. raahe suKhanwaree meN bahut lutf.e.safar miltaa hai!
>
> To reiterate, please take advantage of this opportunity to hone your
> poetic skills.
>
> So let's start:
>
> A) tarah
>
> Here's the proposed matla of the Ghazal that we (or rather, you)
> will compose:
>
> "banke hamdard mire, roz sataate kyoN haiN?
> duniyaa vaale mujhe deevaanaa banaate kyoN haiN?"
ahl.e.mehfil kii Khidmat meiN aadaab!
mujh ko yeh laRii beHad pasand aa'yii hai. aur maiN bhii shirkat kii
himmat kar rahii huuN. aik sher pesh hai. Sarwar Saahib se darKhwaast
hai k uss ko dekh leN. inaayat hogii.
roz mar mar ke bhalaa yuuN jiye jaate kyuuN haiN?
zindigii! ham tiraa iHsaan uThaate kyuuN haiN?
Dilnavaaz :Haya:
UVR
> Sarwar Saahib, aadaab.
> she'r pasand farmaane ka shukriya!
>
> "duniyaa vaale" kee badal ke liye, zaroor aapka ishaara "ahl.e.duniyaa"
> kee taraf tha! jaisa UVR saahib ne farmaaya hai.
yaqeen maaniye, Vasmi saahib, k maiN dar-asl aisaa kuchh bhii
"farmaanaa" naheeN chaahtaa thaa. I hope you did not misconstrue
it as some ill-intentioned 'guidance' from me to you [which I am
well aware, BTW, that you do not need.] By way of an apology for
that interjection, I would like to state that my previous post
referring to "ahl-e-duniyaa" was NOT meant to appear on ALUP at
all: it was intended for a different audience; unfortunately, by
some unfathomable quirk of luck, my mouse decided to click on the
"send" button before I had the chance to edit the headers of said
message, causing me not only much embarrassment, but also creating
the need to grovel before you and Sarwar saahib.
Sincerely,
UVR.
Yashowanto Ghosh
: Vasmi Abidi <vab...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<3D79238A...@yahoo.com>...
: > aadaab arz.
: >
: > "abhi Ghazal jawaan hai", jise log pyaar se aGjh bhi kahte haiN, kee
: > aur aap sabko yeh batataate huwe Khushee ho rahee hai k ‘Judge' hoNge
: > Sarwar Raz saahib. in dinoN Sarwar saahib ka internet access kaafi
: > mehdood hai, phir bhi unhone hamaaree darKhwaast manzoor kar liyaa. ye
: > hamaaree Khush-qismatee hai, aur ham unko shukriya adaa karte haiN.
: >
Yashowanto Ghosh
: aadaab arz.
: "abhi Ghazal jawaan hai", jise log pyaar se aGjh bhi kahte haiN, kee
: qist #3 haazir hai. is baar ‘Conductor’ ka kaam mujhko mil gayaa hai.
: aur aap sabko yeh batataate huwe Khushee ho rahee hai k ‘Judge’ hoNge
: Sarwar Raz saahib. in dinoN Sarwar saahib ka internet access kaafi
: mehdood hai, phir bhi unhone hamaaree darKhwaast manzoor kar liyaa. ye
: hamaaree Khush-qismatee hai, aur ham unko shukriya adaa karte haiN.
<snip>
: A) tarah
: Here's the proposed matla of the Ghazal that we (or rather, you)
: will compose:
: "banke hamdard mire, roz sataate kyoN haiN?
: duniyaa vaale mujhe deevaanaa banaate kyoN haiN?"
<snip>
dostaan-e-a.l.u.p., aadaab! is qist meN merii koshish haazir hai:
ho faqat naam tira sab ki zabaaN par, to ho
lafz-e-ulfat ko tire zikr meN laate kyoN haiN?
Sarwar saahab, maiNne aapki baatoN ko Ghaur se paRha aur, aapke kehne ke
mutaabiq, misroN ko alfaaz ke radd-o-badal se behtar karne kii koshish
bhi kii. yaqeenan inke shakl-o-maanee meN abhi aur izaafa kii gunjaish
hai---ab thoRi sii madad aap se mil jaaye to in par aur mehnat karoonga.
ahl-e-a.l.u.p. se aik aur guzaarish hai: dostoN, is martaba maiNne himmat
kar ke yeh Khat Urdu meN likhne ki koshish kii---aur, beshaq, kaii
GhalatiyaaN bhi kar gaya hoga. agar ho sake to, in meN se jo aap ko
nazar aaye unke baare meN mujhe bata deejiye---taa ki maiN unhe sudhaarne
kii koshish kar sakuuN.
shukriya,
Jasho.
Raj Kumar
> >
> > "duniyaa vaale" kee badal ke liye, zaroor aapka ishaara "ahl.e.duniyaa"
> > kee taraf tha! jaisa UVR saahib ne farmaaya hai.
>
> yaqeen maaniye, Vasmi saahib, k maiN dar-asl aisaa kuchh bhii
> "farmaanaa" naheeN chaahtaa thaa. I hope you did not misconstrue
> it as some ill-intentioned 'guidance' from me to you [which I am
> well aware, BTW, that you do not need.] By way of an apology for
> that interjection, I would like to state that my previous post
> referring to "ahl-e-duniyaa" was NOT meant to appear on ALUP at
> all: it was intended for a different audience;
huzoor, voh kaun si "audience" thi jis ke liye aap ka yeh aalimaana
farmaan maqsood tha?
ba-Khudaa, kuchh ham bhi to suneN! :-))
R.K.
Yogesh Sethi
>
> ... aise hee log aik doosre se baat karte raheN ge to Yogesh saaheb ko
> jald hee ko'ee aur project lenaa hogaa! ...
>
> Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Sahib, aadaab:
This project has succeeded far beyond my expectations and nothing will
be more pleasing than to see an outcome the way you envision it.
Sarwar Sahib, it was your own article on the Urdu meter that formed
the basis of my inspiration. I ruminated at length on how to make
practical use of the wonderful guidance afforded by the
‘nikaat-e-sukhan' series. An occasional critique of our work did not
appear to fill the gap that existed between theory and practice of
Urdu poetry. To watch fellow Alupers struggle alongside me and then
being assessed by the experts as to the nuances of meter and
‘ba.ndish' is an experience that is uniquely rewarding. It also helps
propel our understanding forward by leaps and bounds.
My deep thanks to you and all the other experts who are helping us
with this project and making the entire endeavor worthwhile.
Whoever wrote: ‘Gazab kii banii hai ye mahfil yahaa.n par',
was not kidding. :)
Warm regards,
Yogesh
saif
meri taraf se yeh koshish hai
raah-e-vafaa maiN jo aable mile haiN mujhko, bahut hai
khwaab maiN aa aa ke mujhe jagaate kyoN haiN !
thanks
saif ahmed
Vasmi Abidi <vab...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<3D79238A...@yahoo.com>...
> aadaab arz.
>
> "abhi Ghazal jawaan hai", jise log pyaar se aGjh bhi kahte haiN, kee
> qist #3 haazir hai. is baar ?Conductor? ka kaam mujhko mil gayaa hai.
> aur aap sabko yeh batataate huwe Khushee ho rahee hai k ?Judge? hoNge
> Sarwar Raz saahib. in dinoN Sarwar saahib ka internet access kaafi
> mehdood hai, phir bhi unhone hamaaree darKhwaast manzoor kar liyaa. ye
> hamaaree Khush-qismatee hai, aur ham unko shukriya adaa karte haiN.
>
> Note keejiyega k sirf is qist ke liye ?deadline? baRhaa dee jaayegee.
>
> aap sabhee Khawaateen-o-hazraat se guzaarish hai ki aGjh3 meN bharpoor
> hissa leN. raahe suKhanwaree meN bahut lutf.e.safar miltaa hai!
>
> To reiterate, please take advantage of this opportunity to hone your
> poetic skills.
>
> So let?s start:
>
> A) tarah
>
> Here's the proposed matla of the Ghazal that we (or rather, you)
> will compose:
>
> "banke hamdard mire, roz sataate kyoN haiN?
> duniyaa vaale mujhe deevaanaa banaate kyoN haiN?"
>
> (If a better matla comes along, we'll replace this one)
>
> The 'radeef' is "kyoN haiN"
> The qavaafee words are: sataate, banaate, lagaate, etc.
>
> Examples of words that DO NOT work as qaafiyaa here: samjhaate,
> farmaate, sitaare, zamaane
>
>
> B) behr:
> The behr we?ll use this time is a very popular one, and you find many
> examples of its use. Here are some well-known examples:
>
> ?aah ko chaahiye ik umr asar hone tak
> kaun jeetaa hai tire zulf ke sar hone tak? (Ghalib)
>
> ?uzr aane bhi hai aur bulaate bhi naheeN
> baa?is.e.tarq.e.mulaaqaat bataate bhi naheeN? (Daagh)
>
> ?mujh se pahlee si muhabbat mire mahboob na maaNg? (Faiz)
>
> ?kabhi Khud pe kabhi haalaat pe ronaa aaya
> baat niklee to har ik baat pe ronaa aaya? (Sahir)
>
> ?mujh ko is raat ki tanhaaii meN aawaaz na do
> jis ki aawaaz rulaa de mujhe vo saaz na do? (Shamim
> Jaipuri) (Mukesh song)
>
>
> taqtee:
>
> faa-i-laa-tun fa-i-laa-tun fa-i-laa-tun fa?-lun
>
> that is,
>
> 2122 1122 1122 22
>
> Bonus question: What is the full name of this behr?
> Hint: look at article ?nikaat.e.sukhan #4?
Sarwar Alam Raz
> ahl.e.mehfil kii Khidmat meiN aadaab!
>
> mujh ko yeh laRii beHad pasand aa'yii hai. aur maiN bhii shirkat kii
> himmat kar rahii huuN. aik sher pesh hai. Sarwar Saahib se darKhwaast
> hai k uss ko dekh leN. inaayat hogii.
>
> roz mar mar ke bhalaa yuuN jiye jaate kyuuN haiN?
> zindigii! ham tiraa iHsaan uThaate kyuuN haiN?
>
> Dilnavaaz :Haya:
Haya saaheba: aadaab arz hai!
aap ne yeh matla' bhej kar mujh ko aik baRee mushkil meiN gariftaar
kar diyaa hai, ya'nee :kisey looN, kisey na looN?: maiN shuroo' hee se
aap kaa kalaam alup per dekh rahaa hooN aur, agar gustaaKhee muaaf ho
to arz karooN k, mujhe aap ko :nau.mashq: maan.ne meiN ta'ammul hai!
aap kaa kalaam na sirf mozooN aur dilkash hotaa hai bal.k iss meiN
puKhtagee bhee nazar aatee hai jo aik arse ke tajribe ke ba'd hee
pedaa hotee hai.
ab yeh matla' hee leejiye:
roz mar mar ke bhalaa yooN jiye jaate kyoN haiN?
zindegee! ham tiraa iHsaaN uThaate kyoN haiN?
mazmoon, bandish, alfaaz kaa intiKhaab sab ba.aavaaz.e.balaNd keh rahe
haiN k yeh kalaam kisee nau.mashq kaa naheeN hai. lekin aap ko :zid:
(iss lafz se Ghalat matlab na nikaaliye gaa!) hai k aap ko iss fehrist
meiN hee rakhaa jaaye to majbooree hai!
she'r meiN :mar mar ke jiye jaanaa, bhalaa yooN, zindigee!: kee
ma'naviyyat bohat dilkash hai aur maiN aap ke bayaan aur taKhaiyyul
kee ta'reef kiye baGhair reh naheeN saktaa. mujh ko she'r meiN
:islaaH: kee gunjaa'ish nazar naheeN aayee. chunaanche iss ko jooN kaa
tooN muntaKhib kar rahaa hooN. Vasmi saaheb ke matle' ke saath iss kaa
Khoob hee to joR ban rahaa hai! in donoN meiN se aik iss Ghazal kaa
matla' hogaa aur aik matla'.e.saanee. marHabaa!
iraadat.kesh
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Vasmi Abidi
Sarwar Alam Raz wrote:
> dilna...@yahoo.com (Dilnavaaz) wrote in message news:<c55b015e.02090...@posting.google.com>...
> > ahl.e.mehfil kii Khidmat meiN aadaab!
> >
> > mujh ko yeh laRii beHad pasand aa'yii hai. aur maiN bhii shirkat kii
> > himmat kar rahii huuN. aik sher pesh hai. Sarwar Saahib se darKhwaast
> > hai k uss ko dekh leN. inaayat hogii.
> >
> > roz mar mar ke bhalaa yuuN jiye jaate kyuuN haiN?
> > zindigii! ham tiraa iHsaan uThaate kyuuN haiN?
> >
> > Dilnavaaz :Haya:
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Haya saaheba: aadaab arz hai!
>
> aap ne yeh matla' bhej kar mujh ko aik baRee mushkil meiN gariftaar
> kar diyaa hai, ya'nee :kisey looN, kisey na looN?: maiN shuroo' hee se
> aap kaa kalaam alup per dekh rahaa hooN aur, agar gustaaKhee muaaf ho
> to arz karooN k, mujhe aap ko :nau.mashq: maan.ne meiN ta'ammul hai!
Sarwar Saahib,
aadaab.
Haya saaheba ka she'r to bahut hi umdaah hai, aur jab maine ise pahle paRha to bas "WOW" kahna paRa.
gustaaKhee muaaf ho, to aapse ye poochhna chaahta hoo k isme mushkil kyaa hai agar 'non-naumashq' shora bhi
aGjh meN apna ek she'r pesh kareN? unkee shirkat se hamaaree Ghazal behtareen bhi hogee, aur shaayad ye "aGjh
ke usooloN" ke Khilaaf bhi naheeN hai?
Yogesh Saahib ne apni "rules" vaali post me likhaa tha ki:
"Participants: Every one is eligible to post one couplet for each
episode. In addition he/she may comment and suggest alternate lines on
any posted couplet. However, experienced poets are requested to
refrain from suggesting alternate words or lines. Experienced poets
would be expected to contribute a suitable 'matlaa' or a
'matlaa-e-saanii'. But they may also write a 'sher', if they so
desire. ... "
aapka kyaa Khayaal hai?
niyaaz-mand,
Vasmi
Vasmi Abidi
Jasho Saahib,
aapne Khat to bahut achhaa likha hai!
phir bhi, chooN ki aapne Khwaahish zaahir kee hai ki Khat meN GhaltiyaaN
DhooNDhee jaayeN, to maiN koshish kartaa hooN. haaN, ye yaad dilaate huwe k -
"ham kahaaN ke daanaa (ya UrdudaaN) haiN" ...
ahl-e-a.l.u.p. se aik aur guzaarish hai: dostoN, is martaba maiNne himmat
"dosto, mera Khat dekhiye"
"dostoN ne meraa Khat dekha"
> kar ke yeh Khat Urdu meN likhne ki koshish kii---aur, beshaq,
beshaq --> beshak
yaad rakhiye ki:
shaq == 7'1'' tall Lakers' Center
shak == doubt
:)
"shaq" is also an Urdu word, but means something different. You want to
say "shak" here.
> kaii
> GhalatiyaaN bhi kar gaya hoga.
hoga --> hooNgaa (first person)
> agar ho sake to, in meN se jo aap ko
> nazar aaye
aaye --> aayeN (plural)
> unke baare meN mujhe bata deejiye---taa ki maiN unhe
unhe -->unheN
UVR
> u...@usa.net (UVR) wrote in message news:<9c085b63.02090...@posting.google.com>...
>
>>> "duniyaa vaale" kee badal ke liye, zaroor aapka ishaara "ahl.e.duniyaa"
>>> kee taraf tha! jaisa UVR saahib ne farmaaya hai.
>>
>>yaqeen maaniye, Vasmi saahib, k maiN dar-asl aisaa kuchh bhii
>>all: it was intended for a different audience;
>
>
> huzoor, voh kaun si "audience" thi jis ke liye aap ka yeh aalimaana
> farmaan maqsood tha?
> ba-Khudaa, kuchh ham bhi to suneN! :-))
>
> R.K.
RK saahib:
is sawaal kaa to muKhtasar saa jawaab hai -- ba-qaul-e-shaa'ir
yahii hai aik jhijhak haal-e-dil sunaane meN
*kisii kaa* naam bhi aataa hai is fasaane meN :-)) LOL
-UVR.
log har baat kaa afsaana banaate kyoN haiN? ;)
p k swami
aadaab.
i have made a feeble attempt. pesh hai.
ummed hai aap sab ki guidance par mujh
ghareeb par inaayat hogee.
khauf.e ruswaai hai to ishq jataate kyoN haiN
apne lab par wo meraa naam hi late kyoN haiN
apne pehloo meiN meri yaad basaate kyoN haiN
ho meraa zikr to wo aaNsoo bahaate kyoN haiN
jab naheeN mujhse muhabbat to shikaayat kaisee
meri har baat ko wo dil se lagaate kyoN haiN
Til ki qismat hai jo rukhsaar pe aa baiTha hai
apne aariz ko wo zulfoN se chipaate kyoN haiN
jab bhi kartaa hooN adaa apni muhabbat ki namaaz
apnee aNgdaai se mehraab banaate kyoN haiN
luft.e sahbaa bhi huaa unhii se kyoN vabastaa
peene baithoN to mere saamne aate kyoN haiN
saaNp kaa kaam to dasnaa hi hai pk swami
ye samajh kar bhi usse doodh pilaate kyoN haiN
mujhe yaqeen hai k aap meri ghalateeyoN ki nishaandsehi karke
behtaree ki raah suhjaaenge. likhane ki koshish sirf aap ke bharose
par shuroo ki hai aur aap ki mehfil meiN maine dekhaa hai k:
koi is baagh se mehroom naheeN jataa hai
phool lene koi aataa hai to phal pataa hai.
khaaksaar
pk swami
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Sarwar Saahib,
> aadaab.
>
> Haya saaheba ka she'r to bahut hi umdaah hai, aur jab maine ise pahle paRha to bas "WOW" kahna paRa.
>
> gustaaKhee muaaf ho, to aapse ye poochhna chaahta hoo k isme mushkil kyaa hai agar 'non-naumashq' shora bhi
> aGjh meN apna ek she'r pesh kareN? unkee shirkat se hamaaree Ghazal behtareen bhi hogee, aur shaayad ye "aGjh
> ke usooloN" ke Khilaaf bhi naheeN hai?
> Yogesh Saahib ne apni "rules" vaali post me likhaa tha ki:
>
> "Participants: Every one is eligible to post one couplet for each
> episode. In addition he/she may comment and suggest alternate lines on
> any posted couplet. However, experienced poets are requested to
> refrain from suggesting alternate words or lines. Experienced poets
> would be expected to contribute a suitable 'matlaa' or a
> 'matlaa-e-saanii'. But they may also write a 'sher', if they so
> desire. ... "
>
> aapka kyaa Khayaal hai?
>
> niyaaz-mand,
> Vasmi
Vasmi saaheb: aadaab!
mujh ko iss tareeq.e.kaar meiN sirf yeh diqqat nazar aatee hai k aik
to :judge: iss silsile meiN kuChh naheeN keh sakegaa. zaahir hai k
maiN Qais saaheb per kyaa tabsara kar saktaa hooN? doosre yeh k iss se
alup Ghazal meiN aik naa.hamvaaree kee kaifiyyat pedaa hotee hai k
kuChh she'r mubtadiyoN ke hoN ge aur kuChh kohna.mashq logoN ke. usool
kee paabaNdee sab ke liye zarooree hai iss liye maiN Haya saaheba kaa
she'r looN gaa. sochiye k aik aur alup Ghazal agar tajribe.kaar
sho'raa kee ho jaaye to kaisaa rahe. maiN Yogesh saaheb ke usooloN kee
pooree paabaNde karooN gaa, aap mutam'in raheN. dekhiye Qais, Abid,
Haya aur :jugnoo: iss mas'ale per kyaa kehte haiN!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar;
Sarwar Alam Raz
> dostaan-e-a.l.u.p., aadaab! is qist meN merii koshish haazir hai:
>
> ho faqat naam tira sab ki zabaaN par, to ho
> lafz-e-ulfat ko tire zikr meN laate kyoN haiN?
>
> Sarwar saahab, maiNne aapki baatoN ko Ghaur se paRha aur, aapke kehne ke
> mutaabiq, misroN ko alfaaz ke radd-o-badal se behtar karne kii koshish
> bhi kii. yaqeenan inke shakl-o-maanee meN abhi aur izaafa kii gunjaish
> hai---ab thoRi sii madad aap se mil jaaye to in par aur mehnat karoonga.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jasho saaheb: namashkaar!
aap ko bazm meiN dekh kar bohat hee Khushee huee. Ghazal se aap kee
muHabbat uss kee aa'inda zindigee aur shaadaabee kee zaamin hai!
shukriya! aap ke she'r per chand Khayaalaat likh rahaa hooN. in se aap
ko madad mile gee:
(1) aap ka she'r vazn aur beHr meiN pooraa utartaa hai! ma'loom huaa k
aap ne meHnat kee hai aur aap ko Ghazal ke :rhythm: kaa :innate sense:
hai, jo baRee baat hai! mubaarakbaad!
(2) she'r ke ma'nee yooN to saaf haiN lekin aik savaal uThtaa hai:
meHboob ke naam ke saath uss kee ulfat ke zikr meiN kyaa buraa'ee hai?
agar bad.naamee kaa Dar hai to voh to logoN ke baar baar naam lene se
ho hee jaayegee:!
(3) aam taur se :lafz.e.muHabbat, lafz.e.shikaayat: vaGhaira kee
bajaa'e :Harf.e.muHabbat, Harf.e.shikaayat: kehte haiN kyoN k in se
:literal sense: kee bajaa'e :poetic sense: pedaa ho jaataa hai. issee
taraH :faqat: ko ziyaada ravaaN aur aam lafz se badalnaa behtar ho
saktaa hai.
ab kyaa kiyaa jaaye? do soorateN haiN jo zehn meiN aatee haiN:
(1) alfaaz kee heraa.pheree/tabdeelee se koshish kee jaaye k Khayaal
saaf, saHeeH aur behtar adaa ho jaaye.
(2) Khayaal ko zaraa saa ooNchaa kiyaa jaaye ya'nee :agar meHboob kaa
naam sirf aap kee zabaan per be.iKhtiyaaree meiN aaye to uss se aap
kee muHabbat kaa izhaar hogaa. aur aap jaante hee haiN k log aisee
zaraa see baat kee bhee kahaanee banaa dete haiN!:
meree raa'e hai k aap doosree soorat per socheN. yooN aap ko iKhtiyaar
hai. maiN muntazir rahooN gaa.
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Yashowanto Ghosh
Vasmi Abidi (vab...@yahoo.com) wrote:
: Jasho Saahib,
: aapne Khat to bahut achhaa likha hai!
shukriya!---
: phir bhi, chooN ki aapne Khwaahish zaahir kee hai ki Khat meN GhaltiyaaN
: DhooNDhee jaayeN, to maiN koshish kartaa hooN. haaN, ye yaad dilaate huwe k -
---in particular, mujhe in GhalatiyoN ke baare meN bataane ke liye!
Jasho.
Amitabha Bagchi
aGjh [3] jaisa sunehra mauka phir mujh jaise nausikhiye ko nahin
milega, is baat ko madd-e-nazar rakhte hue himmat kar raha hoon:
bas ye rukhsaar tera, soz-e-singaar kya faiz
yun hi jal jayeinge hum, sham'ma jalaate kyon hain?
Amitabha
Nausheen
Abhi Ghazal Jawan hai ki kadi meiN ek koshis maiN bhi kar leti
hooN....asateza.ikraam se guzarish hai ke islaah farmadeiN aur dekheiN
ke kya yeh koshish kisi qabil hai ?
ek hi sher ki do surteiN soojhi haiN..
mujhko deewana banane ko woh aate kyoN haiN
aur aate haiN to phir baad meiN jaate kyoN haiN
mujhko deewana banane ko woh aate kyoN haiN
baad meiN ghar se diwaane ke woh jaate kyoN haiN
faQt-
Nausheen
p k swami
aadaab.
khaaksaar
pk swami
i am repeating it because it looks that this post has wrongly been posted
under a different reference earlier.
UVR
> ja...@expert.ics.purdue.edu (Yashowanto Ghosh) wrote in message news:<alitcm$clc$2...@mozo.cc.purdue.edu>...
>
>>dostaan-e-a.l.u.p., aadaab! is qist meN merii koshish haazir hai:
>>
>> ho faqat naam tira sab ki zabaaN par, to ho
>> lafz-e-ulfat ko tire zikr meN laate kyoN haiN?
> Jasho saaheb: namashkaar!
>
> aap ko bazm meiN dekh kar bohat hee Khushee huee. Ghazal se aap kee
> muHabbat uss kee aa'inda zindigee aur shaadaabee kee zaamin hai!
> shukriya! aap ke she'r per chand Khayaalaat likh rahaa hooN. in se aap
> ko madad mile gee:
[*snip*]
> (2) Khayaal ko zaraa saa ooNchaa kiyaa jaaye ya'nee :agar meHboob kaa
> naam sirf aap kee zabaan per be.iKhtiyaaree meiN aaye to uss se aap
> kee muHabbat kaa izhaar hogaa. aur aap jaante hee haiN k log aisee
> zaraa see baat kee bhee kahaanee banaa dete haiN!:
>
> meree raa'e hai k aap doosree soorat per socheN. yooN aap ko iKhtiyaar
> hai. maiN muntazir rahooN gaa.
Sarwar saahib: aadaab!
I am astonished beyond words or belief!
ab IS *tavaarud* ko kyaa kahiyegaa?! aap kii is post se *Theek*
2 ghaNTe qabl maiN ne Raj Kumar-ji ko Khat likhte hue, apne sig-
nature meiN woh misr'a likh chhoRaa thaa, k jise maiN Khud apni
AGJH-3 kii entry meN ist'emaal karnaa chaahtaa thaa --
aur dekhtaa kyaa hooN k aap kii mandarjah baalaa tahreef Ghosh-babu
se ain usii [qism ke] misr'e kii jaanib rujuu' karvaa rahe haiN!
What a pleasant coincidence! mujhe ma'aloom hai k Ghosh-babu ko
yeh Khat likhne se pehle aap ne merii naheeN dekhi thi (kyooN-k
Google par kisii bhi post ko "numaayaaN" hone meN 3-9 ghaNTe lag
jaate haiN) ...
Khuloos-kesh,
-UVR.
UVR
> ja...@expert.ics.purdue.edu (Yashowanto Ghosh) wrote in message
news:<alitcm$clc$2...@mozo.cc.purdue.edu>...
>
>>dostaan-e-a.l.u.p., aadaab! is qist meN merii koshish haazir hai:
>>
>> ho faqat naam tira sab ki zabaaN par, to ho
>> lafz-e-ulfat ko tire zikr meN laate kyoN haiN?
> Jasho saaheb: namashkaar!
>
> aap ko bazm meiN dekh kar bohat hee Khushee huee. Ghazal se aap kee
> muHabbat uss kee aa'inda zindigee aur shaadaabee kee zaamin hai!
> shukriya! aap ke she'r per chand Khayaalaat likh rahaa hooN. in se aap
> ko madad mile gee:
[*snip*]
> (2) Khayaal ko zaraa saa ooNchaa kiyaa jaaye ya'nee :agar meHboob kaa
> naam sirf aap kee zabaan per be.iKhtiyaaree meiN aaye to uss se aap
> kee muHabbat kaa izhaar hogaa. aur aap jaante hee haiN k log aisee
> zaraa see baat kee bhee kahaanee banaa dete haiN!:
>
> meree raa'e hai k aap doosree soorat per socheN. yooN aap ko iKhtiyaar
> hai. maiN muntazir rahooN gaa.
Sarwar saahib: aadaab!
UVR
> ja...@expert.ics.purdue.edu (Yashowanto Ghosh) wrote in message news:<alitcm$clc$2...@mozo.cc.purdue.edu>...
>
>>dostaan-e-a.l.u.p., aadaab! is qist meN merii koshish haazir hai:
>>
>> ho faqat naam tira sab ki zabaaN par, to ho
>> lafz-e-ulfat ko tire zikr meN laate kyoN haiN?
> Jasho saaheb: namashkaar!
>
> aap ko bazm meiN dekh kar bohat hee Khushee huee. Ghazal se aap kee
> muHabbat uss kee aa'inda zindigee aur shaadaabee kee zaamin hai!
> shukriya! aap ke she'r per chand Khayaalaat likh rahaa hooN. in se aap
> ko madad mile gee:
[*snip*]
> (2) Khayaal ko zaraa saa ooNchaa kiyaa jaaye ya'nee :agar meHboob kaa
> naam sirf aap kee zabaan per be.iKhtiyaaree meiN aaye to uss se aap
> kee muHabbat kaa izhaar hogaa. aur aap jaante hee haiN k log aisee
> zaraa see baat kee bhee kahaanee banaa dete haiN!:
>
> meree raa'e hai k aap doosree soorat per socheN. yooN aap ko iKhtiyaar
> hai. maiN muntazir rahooN gaa.
Sarwar saahib: aadaab!
I am astonished beyond words or belief!
ab IS *tavaarud* ko kyaa kahiyegaa?! aap kii is post se *Theek*
2 ghaNTe qabl maiN ne Raj Kumar-ji ko Khat likhte hue, apne sig-
nature meiN woh misr'a likh chhoRaa thaa, k jise maiN Khud apni
AGJH-3 kii entry meN ist'emaal karnaa chaahtaa thaa --
*log har baat kaa afsaanah banaate kyoN haiN!*
aur dekhtaa kyaa hooN k aap kii mandarjah baalaa tahreer Ghosh-
babu se ain usii [qism ke] misr'e kii jaanib rujuu' karvaa rahi
hai!
mujhe ma'aloom hai k Ghosh-babu ko jawaab dete waqt aap ne merii
dekhi naheeN hogi (kyooN-k Google par kisii bhi post ko "numaayaaN"
hone meN 3-9 ghaNTe lag jaate haiN -- aur aapki-meri posts ke
darmiyaan maihz 2-2.5hrs kaa faasila thaa)!
What a pleasant coincidence! aap hukm kareN to maiN apna misr'a
Ghosh-babu ki nazr kar dooN? -- ba_sharte, of course, k unheN bhi
manzoor ho: kyoN-k ek hi misr'a kisii bhi Ghazal ke do alahidah-
alahidah ash'aar meN to aa naheeN saktaa!
Khuloos-kesh,
-UVR.
Sarwar Alam Raz
> ahl-e-alup ko salaam
>
> meri taraf se yeh koshish hai
>
>
> raah-e-vafaa maiN jo aable mile haiN mujhko, bahut hai
> khwaab maiN aa aa ke mujhe jagaate kyoN haiN !
>
> thanks
>
> saif ahmed
Saif saaheb: aadaab!
meHfil meiN aane ke liye shukr.guzaar hooN. iss qist ko manzil se
lagaane ke liye mujhe Hukm huaa hai. aap ke she'r ke baare meiN
muKhtasar likhtaa hooN.
she'r do arkaan se mil kar bantaa hai: Khayaal aur bayaan (=munaasib
alfaaz). iss ke ilaava yeh shart bhee hai k donoN misre aik hee vazn
aur beHr (=meter=lambaa'ee)meiN hoN aur donoN misre mil kar aik hee
Khayaal ko adaa kareN. umooman doosra misra pehle ko munaasib taur se
Khatm kar ke shaa'ir kaa Khayaal mukammal kartaa hai. in baatoN kee
raushnee meiN yeh arz hai k:
(1) aap ke donoN misre beHr se baahar haiN aur iss kee tasdeeq aap
Khud Vasmi saaheb ke mujavviza misre ko dekh kar kar sakte haiN.
doosraa misra bohat aasaanee se alfaaaz kee heraa.pheree/kamee.beshee
se beHr meiN :fit: kiyaa jaa saktaa hai. lekin pehlaa misra kuChh
ziyaada hee :paTree se utar gayaa hai:.
(2) pehle misre meiN :raah.e.vafaa: iss qist kee beHr meiN baaNdhnaa
mumkin naheeN hai. iss ko :rah.e.vafaa: yaa :raah.e.ulfat: se badal
deN to kaam chal jaayegaa. mujh ko yeh :point: bataanaa naheeN
chaahiye lekin aap ko iss se aage kee baateN samajhne meiN madad mil
jaayegee. iss misre meiN aik baRee kharaabee yeh hai k iss kaa mazmoon
doosre misre se bilkul judaa hai aur aapas meiN in misroN kaa ko'ee
ta'alluq nazar naheeN aataa hai k aap kyaa kehnaa chaahte haiN. iss ko
door karnaa zarooree hai.
(3) pehle misre meiN hee aap ne :mile haiN: aur :bohat hai: likhaa
hai. yaa to :singular: istaimaal keejiye yaa :plural:; aik hee cheez
ke liye aik hee she'r meiN donoN naheeN likh sakte haiN. vaise maiN
samajh rahaa hooN k aap jab kehte haiN k :bohat hai: to uss takleef
kee jaanib shaayad ishaara hai jo aabloN se hotee hai.
(4) mazmoon dekheN :raah.e.vafaa meiN peroN meiN jo aable paR gaye
haiN vohee mere liye bohat haiN phir (?) mujh ko Khwaab meiN aakar
kyoN jagaate haiN?: ab sochiye k kyaa ko'ee baat banee? javaab hogaa k
bilkul naheeN! kon jagaataa hai aur uss kaa aabloN se kyaa ta'alluq
hai?
savaal yeh hai k ab kyaa kiyaa jaaye? sab se pehle doosra misra beHr
meiN laa'iye aur Khayaal vohee rakhiye jo aap ne likhaa hai. ab vaapas
jaa'iye aur pehlaa misra beHr meiN aisaa kahiye jo doosre ko :support:
kare. vaqt lage gaa lekin meHnat se kaam ho jaaye gaa. good luck!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
Amitabha saaheb: namaste!
bazm meiN aane kaa shukriya! dekhiye Yogesh saaheb kee iss meHfil ne
kyaa gul khiaaye haiN k log jauq.dar.jauq shirkat ko chale aa rahe
haiN!
aap ke she'r kaa doosra misra' bohat aChhaa hai aur apne andar kitne
hee imkaanaat rakhtaa hai. lekin pehla misra' na sirf yeh ko doosre
kaa saath naheeN de paa rahaa hai bal.k voh beHr se bhee Khaarij hai.
meree naa.cheez samajh meiN aap ke pehle misre' kaa matlab bilkul hee
naheeN aayaa k aap kyaa kehnaa chaahte haiN. phir sochiye k pehlaa
misra yooN kahaa jaaye k voh doosre se mil kar aik hee Khoobsoorat
Khayaal adaa kare. maiN ne iss silsile meiN Saif saaheb ko jo likhaa
hai uss ko bhee dekh leejiye. shukriya.
aik baat aur: aap ne :soz.e.singaar: likhaa hai. aik to aap ne Farsi
aur Hindi ke alfaaz se yeh tarkeeb banaayee hai jo Ghalat hai doosre
:singaar meiN soz naheeN hotaa hai: pehlaa misraa kehte hue dhyaan
meiN rakhiye k baa.ma'nee alfaaz aur tarkeebeN istaimaal hoN. aap kee
doosree koshish kaa intizaar rahegaa.
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Yashowanto Ghosh
Sarwar Alam Raz (sarw...@yahoo.com) wrote:
: (1) aap ka she'r vazn aur beHr meiN pooraa utartaa hai! ma'loom huaa k
: aap ne meHnat kee hai aur aap ko Ghazal ke :rhythm: kaa :innate sense:
: hai, jo baRee baat hai! mubaarakbaad!
shukriya!
: (2) she'r ke ma'nee yooN to saaf haiN lekin aik savaal uThtaa hai:
: meHboob ke naam ke saath uss kee ulfat ke zikr meiN kyaa buraa'ee hai?
: agar bad.naamee kaa Dar hai to voh to logoN ke baar baar naam lene se
: ho hee jaayegee:!
Saahab, saHeeH kaha aapne...vaise aapne she'r meHnat-o-fikr se kehne ka
salaah diya tha---maiNne kuchh meHnat to kiya, lekin zaahir hai ke fikr
kuchh kam tha...
: (3) aam taur se :lafz.e.muHabbat, lafz.e.shikaayat: vaGhaira kee
: bajaa'e :Harf.e.muHabbat, Harf.e.shikaayat: kehte haiN kyoN k in se
: :literal sense: kee bajaa'e :poetic sense: pedaa ho jaataa hai. issee
: taraH :faqat: ko ziyaada ravaaN aur aam lafz se badalnaa behtar ho
: saktaa hai.
shukriya---mujhe umeed hai kki isii tarah, aisii baatoN kii jaankaarii
se, dheere-dheere merii zabaan meiN behtarii aayegii.
: ab kyaa kiyaa jaaye? do soorateN haiN jo zehn meiN aatee haiN:
: (1) alfaaz kee heraa.pheree/tabdeelee se koshish kee jaaye k Khayaal
: saaf, saHeeH aur behtar adaa ho jaaye.
: (2) Khayaal ko zaraa saa ooNchaa kiyaa jaaye ya'nee :agar meHboob kaa
: naam sirf aap kee zabaan per be.iKhtiyaaree meiN aaye to uss se aap
: kee muHabbat kaa izhaar hogaa. aur aap jaante hee haiN k log aisee
: zaraa see baat kee bhee kahaanee banaa dete haiN!:
: meree raa'e hai k aap doosree soorat per socheN. yooN aap ko iKhtiyaar
: hai. maiN muntazir rahooN gaa.
maiN is doosree soorat par soch raha hooN---iska jo shakl pehle zehn meiN
aaya, uske doosre misre se bil-kul milta-julta aik misra UVR saahab ne post
kiya hai ("log har baat ka afsaana banaate kyoN haiN?")---is liye maiNne
is baat ko kisii doosree tarah se kehne kii koshish kii:
aa gayaa aaj tiraa naam Ghazal meiN shaayad---
ahl-e-mehfil ye miraa saaz uThaate kyoN haiN?
lekin, awwal to, mujhe yeh naheeN maaloom ki lafz "saaz" ka yeh istaimaal
saHeeH hai ya naheeN, aur doyam, jo shakl aapke zehn meiN hai, uske
muqaabile meiN yeh misre yaqeenan kuchh sust hoNge.
aapke islaah ka intezaar rahegaa---
Jasho.
kaamraan
> RK saahib:
>
> is sawaal kaa to muKhtasar saa jawaab hai -- ba-qaul-e-shaa'ir
>
> yahii hai aik jhijhak haal-e-dil sunaane meN
> *kisii kaa* naam bhi aataa hai is fasaane meN :-)) LOL
>
> -UVR.
> log har baat kaa afsaana banaate kyoN haiN? ;)
Reminds me of Seemaab Akabarabadi's (?)
lOg har baat ka afsaana banaa lete haiN
sab kO haalaat ki ruudaad sunaaya naa karo
Am not sure about the shaayar.
kaamraan
UVR
>
> A) tarah
>
> Here's the proposed matla of the Ghazal that we (or rather, you)
> will compose:
>
> "banke hamdard mire, roz sataate kyoN haiN?
> duniyaa vaale mujhe deevaanaa banaate kyoN haiN?"
mohtaram janaab-e-Sarwar Raz aur Vasmi saahib:
is qist ke liye Khaaksaar kii bhi naacheez "entry" haazir hai --
duzd-e-dil aap naheeN haiN? to mujhe dekhte hii
baGhleN kyoN jhaaNkte haiN? aaNkh churaate kyoN haiN?
[duzd = thief, chor]
is sh'er ke ta'alluq meN ek 'wazaahat' post karnaa zaroorii
samajhtaa hooN -- k filhaal to maiN ise apne hii naam se post/
submit kar rahaa hooN, lekin mujhe shak hai k kaheeN na kaheeN
maiN ne isii se miltaa-jultaa koii sh'er esaatizaa ke davaveen
meN paRh rakhaa hai ... even right down to "duzd-e-dil" and
"aaNkh churaanaa"! magar sad_afsos! k mujhe yeh yaad naheeN
k maiN ne woh Khuda-e-suKhan Meer Taqi 'Meer' ke "haaN paRhaa
thaa, yaa ustaad-ush-sh'uraa 'DaaGh' Dehlvi ke. guzishtah 2-3
din deewaan-e-'meer' kii chhaan-been meN sarf kiye, magar koii
suraaGh na milaa :( sochaa, ALUP par hi post kar ke dekh liyaa
jaaye -- ho saktaa hai, Sarwar-o-Vasmi saahebaan, aap ko yaa
kisii aur ALUPer ko is sh'er kaa 'ilm ho (RK saahib? Zaf-ji?)
aur agar 'ilm hai, to bataaiyega zaroor! -- peshgi shukriya!
faqat
-UVR.
UVR
>
>>-UVR.
>> log har baat kaa afsaana banaate kyoN haiN? ;)
>
> Reminds me of Seemaab Akabarabadi's (?)
>
> lOg har baat ka afsaana banaa lete haiN
> sab kO haalaat ki ruudaad sunaaya naa karo
>
> Am not sure about the shaayar.
Ah! Thanks, Kaamraan saahib! So *that* why this line (in
my .sig) came to me ;)
The poet, BTW, of the sh'er you posted is Mohsin Naqvi.
The maqta of this Ghazal appears to be the following:
shahr-e-eHsaas meN pathraao bahut haiN, "mohsin"
dil ko sheeshe ke jharokhoN meN sajaayaa na karo
And now Roshan saahib will undoubtedly ask: "pathrA`O?
Why is the poet extending invitations to people to throw
stones at things arranged in glass windows?" ... ROTFL
[Ju......ust kidding!]
-UVR.
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Sarwar saahib: aadaab!
>
> I am astonished beyond words or belief!
>
> ab IS *tavaarud* ko kyaa kahiyegaa?! aap kii is post se *Theek*
> 2 ghaNTe qabl maiN ne Raj Kumar-ji ko Khat likhte hue, apne sig-
> nature meiN woh misr'a likh chhoRaa thaa, k jise maiN Khud apni
> AGJH-3 kii entry meN ist'emaal karnaa chaahtaa thaa --
>
> *log har baat kaa afsaanah banaate kyoN haiN!*
>
> aur dekhtaa kyaa hooN k aap kii mandarjah baalaa tahreer Ghosh-
> babu se ain usii [qism ke] misr'e kii jaanib rujuu' karvaa rahi
> hai!
> -UVR.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Ravindra saaheb: aadaab!
teen baar payaam bhejne kee zaroorat naheeN thee, bha'i! maiN booRhaa
hooN lekin aisaa :Thus.damaaGh: naheeN k aik martaba meiN baat na
samjhooN! :))
Hazzat! yeh tavaarud naheeN hai :ilhaam: hai! LOL. jab aap meree umr
ko aa'yeN ge to aap ko bhee hone lage gaa!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> maiN is doosree soorat par soch raha hooN---iska jo shakl pehle zehn meiN
> aaya, uske doosre misre se bil-kul milta-julta aik misra UVR saahab ne post
> kiya hai ("log har baat ka afsaana banaate kyoN haiN?")---is liye maiNne
> is baat ko kisii doosree tarah se kehne kii koshish kii:
>
> aa gayaa aaj tiraa naam Ghazal meiN shaayad---
> ahl-e-mehfil ye miraa saaz uThaate kyoN haiN?
>
> lekin, awwal to, mujhe yeh naheeN maaloom ki lafz "saaz" ka yeh istaimaal
> saHeeH hai ya naheeN, aur doyam, jo shakl aapke zehn meiN hai, uske
> muqaabile meiN yeh misre yaqeenan kuchh sust hoNge.
>
> aapke islaah ka intezaar rahegaa---
>
> Jasho.
Jasho jee: namashkaar!
yeh UVR saaheb :DaNDee maar gaye:! Khudaa in se samjhe! :))
aap kaa pehlaa misra' Khoob hai. pasand aayaa. lekin iss ke saath
:saaz uThhaanaa: jaNch naheeN rahaa hai. haaN agar aavaaz se aavaaz
milaayee jaaye to kyaa hee aChhaa ho! kareN aik aur koshish?
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Bazm ki Khidmat meiN meraa Salaam !
>
> Abhi Ghazal Jawan hai ki kadi meiN ek koshis maiN bhi kar leti
> hooN....asateza.ikraam se guzarish hai ke islaah farmadeiN aur dekheiN
> ke kya yeh koshish kisi qabil hai ?
>
> ek hi sher ki do surteiN soojhi haiN..
>
> mujhko deewana banane ko woh aate kyoN haiN
> aur aate haiN to phir baad meiN jaate kyoN haiN
>
> Nausheen
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nausheen saaheba: tasleemaat!
Khush.aamadeed! mujh ko yaad naheeN k aap yahaaN iss se qabl kabhee
tashreef laa'ee haiN k naheeN. ab aa'ee haiN to aatee rahiye!
aap ne matla' bhej kar mere naa.tavaan kaNdhoN kaa bojh kuChh aur
baRhaa diyaa kyoN.k 2 matle' to pehle se hee the.:))-
lekin yeh dekh kar Khushee huee k aap ko vazn aur beHr kaa ilm hai.
maiN ne aap kaa pehlaa she'r liyaa hai kyoN.k yeh doosre se yaqeenan
behtar hai.
yeh she'r yooN to durust hai lekin iss meiN mazmoon kee Kharaabee
hai. voh yooN k agar :voh: aap ko aakar deevaana banaa dete haiN to un
ke jaane kaa ilm yaa iHsaas aap ko ho naheeN saktaa kyoN.k deevaane ko
kisee cheez kaa ilm naheeN hotaa! aur agar kisee taraH, bil.farz
ilm.o.iHsaas ho bhee jaaye to aap ko kyoN fikr hai? deevaanee to aap
ho hee chukee haiN aur uss kaa deevaana honaa hee ishq kaa maqsad hai!
meraa Khayaal hai k aap doosre misre per iss tabsare kee raushnee meiN
Ghaur keejiye aur do.baara kahiye. shukriya!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Roshan Kamath
>
> And now Roshan saahib will undoubtedly ask: "pathrA`O?
> Why is the poet extending invitations to people to throw
> stones at things arranged in glass windows?" ... ROTFL
>
> [Ju......ust kidding!]
!! I know! I am still wondering who this :patHrA: chappie is, whom the
poet is addressing in almost subdued dimunitive tones. And, what
exactly *is* the deal with having so many Mohsin's in one city!???
"Shaehr-e aehsAs me.n, [patHrA_o], bahut haE.n mohsin"
(- with due apologies to Mohsin Sahib.)
No, all seriousness aside!, and using L for long and S for short, I
read/spell it as :patHrAv: [vazn: LLS] just as I do for partav [LL],
gA.nv [LS] etc. I've, somewhat adamantly, always insisted that these
words are more correctly read as ending in v (or w as some others
insist) rather than a O :) My issue with using an O is that it gives
the perchance incorrect impression that an alternative vazn LLL exists
for patHrAv ...
I've rambled senselessly long enough ... my lunch is staring at me!
rosh
kaamraan
(snip)
Here is my 'koshish'
jabke maujuud hai tuu ziist ke har pehluu meiN
dair-O-kaabe meiN tujhe DhooNDte jaate kyuN haiN
Sarwar sahib, what I want to say is ...
"when HE is manifested in every aspect of our lives, why do we
go to temples looking for HIM'
kaamraan
Sarwar Alam Raz
> khauf.e ruswaai hai to ishq jataate kyoN haiN
> apne lab par wo meraa naam hi late kyoN haiN
>
> apne pehloo meiN meri yaad basaate kyoN haiN
> ho meraa zikr to wo aaNsoo bahaate kyoN haiN
>
> jab naheeN mujhse muhabbat to shikaayat kaisee
> meri har baat ko wo dil se lagaate kyoN haiN
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Swami jee: aadaab!
iss bazm meiN shirkat kaa shukriya! aap kee Ghazal dekhee aur iss se
andaaza huaa k aap meiN suKhan.saNjee kee kitnee aChhee salaaHiyyat
hai. chooN.k pooree Ghazal ko dekhne kaa yeh moqa' naheeN hai maiN aap
kee Ghazal ke pehle teen ash'aar le rahaa hooN aur aap se yeh
guzaarish kartaa hooN k in meiN se aap do misre muntaKhib kar ke aik
Khoobsoorat she'r tashkeel keejiye jo iss qist meiN dekhaa aur parkhaa
jaa sake. meraa Khayaal hai k aap in 6 misroN meiN se aise 2 aasaanee
se le sakte haiN jo iss manzil meiN kaam aayeN ge. aap kee koshish kaa
Nausheen
aap ki zarra nawazi hai ke apane mere post ko is qaabil samjha ke iska
jawaab diyaa.Yeh meri yahaN par pehli post thi,aur jawaab milne par
behad masarrat hui.
mai aapke mazameen aur Ghazliyaat paRhti rehti hoon aur us se bohot
faida bhi uthaya hai.
aapne sher meiN jis khaami ka zikr kiya hai, maine us zaave se soNcha
hi nahiN tha. Khair zaroor koshish karooNgi ke kuch accha soojhe to
pesh karuNgi.
Behr aur wazan sirf andaaze se karti hooN mujhe khud sher ki takhti
karne mey mushkil hoti hai.
aapke natawaaN kaandhouN ke liye kuch mazeed bojH le aayi hoon, apni
aara se zaroor nawaziyegaa.
neend se vasl ke lamhouN ko ghataate kyuN hai
merii jaagi huwi qismat ko sulaate kyuN hai
-- aapki fan
Nausheen
Yashowanto Ghosh
Sarwar Alam Raz (sarw...@yahoo.com) wrote:
: >
: > aa gayaa aaj tiraa naam Ghazal meiN shaayad---
: > ahl-e-mehfil ye miraa saaz uThaate kyoN haiN?
: >
: ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
: Jasho jee: namashkaar!
: yeh UVR saaheb :DaNDee maar gaye:! Khudaa in se samjhe! :))
: aap kaa pehlaa misra' Khoob hai. pasand aayaa.
shukriya!
lekin iss ke saath
: :saaz uThhaanaa: jaNch naheeN rahaa hai.
mujhe bhi yeh shak tha---vaise, maiN to yeh bhi tai naheeN kar saka
tha k "saaz" Ghazal kahne-vaale ka bhi uThaaya ja sakta hai, ya sirf
Ghazal ka?
haaN agar aavaaz se aavaaz
: milaayee jaaye to kyaa hee aChhaa ho! kareN aik aur koshish?
aapka ishaara shaayad kuchh is taraf hai:
aa gayaa aaj tiraa naam Ghazal meiN shaayad---
log aavaaz se aavaaz milaate kyoN haiN?
agar yehii aapne socha hai to is se mera aik aur mushkil bhi hal ho gayaa:
pichhle shakl ke doosre misre meiN lafz "ye" ko maiNne sirf behr ko poora
karne ke liye laaya tha, aur yeh baat mujhe kuchh achchhii naheeN lag rahii
thii---is shakl meiN vaisa kuchh naheeN hai.
aur agar aapne kuchh aur hii socha hai to mujhe bas itna bataaiye ki
"javaab Ghalat hai"---maiN aik baar aur koshish karooNga---
yeh aapne doosree baar mujhe islaah dene kii mehrbaanii kii hai---maiN aap
ka shukr-guzaar hooN. aap ke javaab ka muntazir rahooNga---
Jasho.
Sarwar Alam Raz
> aapka ishaara shaayad kuchh is taraf hai:
>
> aa gayaa aaj tiraa naam Ghazal meiN shaayad---
> log aavaaz se aavaaz milaate kyoN haiN?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jasho jee: namashkaar!
vaah! vaah! alup per aakar aur logoN kee tezee aur meHnat dekh kar
kaun kaafir Khush na hogaa? maiN bilkul vohee soch rahaa thaa jo aap
ne likhaa hai. Vasmi saaheb iss she'r ko :daaKhil.e.daftar: kar leN!
shukriya!!
Jasho saaheb aap ko iss kaamyaab koshish per badhaa'ee!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> aara se zaroor nawaziyegaa.
>
> neend se vasl ke lamhouN ko ghataate kyuN hai
> merii jaagi huwi qismat ko sulaate kyuN hai
> -- aapki fan
> Nausheen
Nausheen saaheba! aadaab!
aap kee zarra.navaazee kaa shukriya to zarooree hai lekin ab bataa'iye
k maiN iss mas'ale ko kyoN.kar Hal karooN k aap ne aik adad matla' aur
inaayat kar diyaa! kyaa hee aChhaa ho k aap aik she'r aur aik Khayaal
ko le kar chaleN aur uss ko behtar se behtar banaayeN. yehee iss bazm
kaa maqsad bhee hai k log apne kalaam ko Khud hee durust kareN. aap in
do ash'aar meiN se aik leN yaa ko'ee aur kaheN, lekin sirf usee per
tavajjuh rakheN to mushkil aasaan ho jaayegee. vaise maiN yeh arz kar
dooN k ooper ke matle' kaa doosraa misra' apne andar baRe imkaanaat
rakhtaa hai aur Khoobsoorat hai. kyaa maiN ummeed rakhooN k aap meree
ma'roozaat per Ghaur farmaa'eN gee?
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
>
> duzd-e-dil aap naheeN haiN? to mujhe dekhte hii
> baGhleN kyoN jhaaNkte haiN? aaNkh churaate kyoN haiN?
Ravindra saaheb: aadaab arz hai!
maiN ne iss she'r se miltaa jultaa she'r kaheeN dekhaa to hai lekin ab
yaad naheeN k kahaaN dekhaa thaa. lekin yeh to hotaa hee rehtaa hai!
to ab kyaa ho? maiN iss mafrooze per k yeh she'r aap kaa hee hai sirf
yeh arz karooN gaa k vazn aur beHr meiN to Khair se aap maahir haiN
aur yeh to kabhee mas'ala rahaa hee naheeN hai. haaN mazmoon meiN agar
aap ko nazar.e.saanee manzoor ho to :baGhleN jhaaNkne: kee bajaa'e
ko'ee aur shaGhl iKhtiyaar kar leN!
yeh tajveez ik bilkul :subjective: baat hai. meree chashm.e.tasavvur
jab meHboob ko apnee :baGhal: jhaaNkte dekhtee hai to tabee'at kuChh
mukaddar see ho jaatee hai! agar tanzan aik fiqra yahaaN :baGhleN kyoN
jhaaNkte haiN: kee jagah lagaa diyaa jaaye to she'r kaa raNg badal
saktaa hai. agar aap ko yeh tabdeelee manzoor naheeN hai to bhee
az.raah.e.tafannun.e.taba' yeh sochne meiN kyaa harj hai k maiN kiss
fiqre kee jaanib ishaara kar rahaa hooN? yeh maiN jaantaa hooN k aap
iss :imtiHaan: meiN :fail: hargiz naheeN hoN ge!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Here is my 'koshish'
>
> jabke maujuud hai tuu ziist ke har pehluu meiN
> dair-O-kaabe meiN tujhe DhooNDte jaate kyuN haiN
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kaamraan saaheb: aadaab aur Khush.aamadeed!
yeh to aap ko ilm hee hai k aap ke she'r kaa Khayaal bohat aam hai aur
kitne he tareeqoN se kahaa jaa chukaa hai. Ghalib ne iss ko apne
andaaz meiN yooN kahaa hai k:
jab k tujh bin naheeN ko'ee maujood
phir yeh haNgaama ae Khudaa kyaa hai?
aap ke iss she'r ke baare meiN chand baateN arz hai:
(1) :zeest ke pehloo: Theek hai lekin iss se behtar fiqre kee zaroorat
hai taa.k misre' meiN zor pedaa ho jaaye aur :sapaaT-pan: door ho
jaaye. iss per sochiye.
(2) doosre misre' meiN yeh naheeN saaf hai k :kaun: DhhooNd rahaa hai?
(3) yahaaN :DhhooNdte: kaa maqaam naheeN hai bal.k iss lafz ko badalne
kee zaroorat hai.
aik raa'e aur hai k agar mumkin ho to aik she'r aur kahiye jo iss
she'r ke aam matlab se alag matlab rakhtaa ho aur iss taraH aap ko'ee
nayee baat kehne kee koshish kar sakeN ge.
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Yogesh Sethi
> aadaab arz.
>
> "abhi Ghazal jawaan hai", jise log pyaar se aGjh bhi kahte haiN, kee
> qist #3 haazir hai...
Vasmi saahib, aadaab. bahut Khuubii se pesh kii hai aap ne ye qist -
mubaark ho aap ko - aaj mauqaa milaa hai to sochaa ab apnii mehnat
bhii Sarwar saahib ke aalimaanaa tasriih ke liye pesh kar dii jaye -
mulaahizaa farmaa_e.n :
vo na aaye, shab-e-aaKhir hai muqaabil mere,
ab ye maGluub Khayaalaat Daraate kyuu.n hai.n
aap kaa shukrguzaar,
Yogesh
Zoya
aadaab,
chaliye, ek sher merii jaanib se bhii sun liijiiye, as usual Khayaal
visual aur vaaqiaatii hai( attn: pbj Z Sahib!):
vaqt-e-ruKhsat koii hasrat, koii aaNsuu, na ehad
duur jaa kar mujhe phir paas bulaate kyoN haiN?!
Sarwar Sahib, koii vazn meiN ghalati ho to zaruur nishaan_dehii
kiijiiyegaa, and of course feel free to make any other improvements
too.
______________Zoya
p k swami
Sarwar Sahib
aaddab.
ghazal dekhne ka shukriya.
iss series meiN shirkat karne ka hausla is liye kiya tha
ki yahaaN nauvaarid ki koshish ko sudharne ka mashvira amlee
misaal ke saath samjhayaa jataa hai. jahaN tak ban paRa,
maine apnee koshish meiN kamee naheeN rakhee hai.phir bhi,apnee
na.ahliyat ke madde.nazar mujhe iss baat ka afsos hai aur
eitraaf bhi ki ghazal meiN ek bhi sher aisaa naheeN ban paRa
jo iss qist meiN dekha aur parkha jaa sake.
main aapka mamnoon hooNgaa agar ap Un kameeyooN ki nishaandehi
kareN jiskee vajah se mere likhne me koi khususiyat paidaa na
ho payee.mujhe yaqeen hai aap munaasib waqt par apne mashvire
meiN fan ki vo girah kholeNge jiskee samajh mashq mein chaar chaaNd
paidaa kartee hai.
aapke hauslaa-afzaa lafzooN ne meri mayoosi ko qasb kiyaa hai.
aapke hukm ki taameel meraa farz.e avval hai.hidaayat ke daaire
me paaband sher ki shakl kuchh yooN hai-
khauf.e ruswaai hai to ishq jataate kyoN haiN
apne pehloo meiN meri yaad basaate kyoN haiN.
aapne farmayaa k poree ghazal dekhne kaa ye moqa naheen hai.
to phir main kis moqe ki talaash karooN k aap kaa faiz haasil ho!
freshers ki mashq ko tarbiyat dene kaa isse achha aur kon saa moqaa
hogaa jo iss silsile ke ailaania maqsad ko nibhataa ho.phir bhi aap se
guzaarish hai k-
tere dar par na sahee to tere kuche mein sahee
khaak meiN milne ko mil jaae zameeN thoRee see
mujhe yooN bhi teri shaan.e karimee par bharosaa hai
kisi bande ki tujhse aazizii dekhi naheeN jaatee
regards.
PK Swami
Amit Malhotra
aapne ye to nahin socha ki ham sh'er kah kar bhool hi gaye?? :-)
chaliye, ab sh'er ko "theeq" karein aur aapke kuuchh savaalo.N ka
javaab hi:
> > "gar tira aur mira ek hi waahid yaawar!
> > to mazaahib hame.N aapas me.N la.Raate kyuu.N hai.N ?? "
> >
> > here the word "waahid" is used to denote "God"
> > mazaahib of course is the plural of the word "mazhab"
> :tiraa: kaa muKhaatib kaun hai? :vaahid yaavar: kaa kyaa matlab hai?
> yeh to Theek hai k Islamic terminology meiN :vaahid: Khudaa kaa aik
> naam hai lekin aam taur se yeh lafz iss ma'nee meiN istaimaal naheeN
> hota hai aur aap kaa paRhne vaalaa aap kaa matlab samajh naheeN saktaa
> hai. she'r kaa matlab seedhaa saada hai k :agar ham sab kaa
> parvardigaar aik hee hai to phir yeh mazaahib kaa jhagRaa kaisaa hai?:
>
"tiraa" kaa muKhaatib "yaavar" se hai which brings me to your second
point: "Vaahid yaavar" should have been : "vaahid, yaavar" .
"Yaavar" jaisa ki aap jaante hi ho.nge, means "Friend" . Of course,
to say "Vaahid yaawar" won't make sense. You are also right about
"Vaahid" not commonly used for "God" . Now all in all, the misra
definitely got you confused, hence it is not right and has to be
changed.
> meree raa'e meiN pehlaa misra dobaara kehne kee zaroorat hai taa.k
> matlab saaf adaa ho sake. iss misre meiN :hee: ke saath :hai: kee
> zaroorat bhee ma'loom hotee hai. neez yeh k doosre misre meiN :to: kee
> jagah ko'ee aur ziyaada mozooN lafz laane kee koshish keejiye. thoRee
> see meHnat se aap kaa she'r voh sab adaa kar sakegaa jo aap kehnaa
> chaahte haiN. mujh ko yeh ma'loom hai k aap yeh kar sakte haiN!
ji aapki raa'e ko maante hue, ye ban pa.Raa hai:
"Saari taKhleeq ka gar ek hi Khaaliq hai to phir,
ye mazaahib hame.N aapas me.N la.Raate kyo.N hai.N ??? "
[this with due thanks to Raj Kumar sahib for helping me with the first
misra].
hopefully this came out better Sarwar sahib. aapki islaah aur
khayaalo.N ka i.ntezaar rahegaa :)
Regards,
Amit Malhotra
>
> Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Yashowanto Ghosh
Sarwar Alam Raz (sarw...@yahoo.com) wrote:
: Jasho saaheb aap ko iss kaamyaab koshish per badhaa'ee!
hausala-afzaai ka shukriya! vaise is martaba aapne mashvara hii aisa diya tha
k Ghalati karna kuchh mushkil tha.
aap se aik aur guzaarish karnii thii---socha k lage haath yeh bhii kehta
chalooN---
pichhle dinoN aapne "Ghazal usne chheRii, mujhe saaz dena" k silsile meiN
Ghazal kehne ka aik tareeqa bataaya tha, aur teesrii qist meiN Yogesh saahab
ka aik nazm pe "surgery" bhii kar dikhaaya tha---lekin hameN kisii Ghazal kii
surgery dekhne ko naheeN mila. agar aap ijaazat deN to maiN aap k bataaye
huve tareeqe se kuchh ash'ar kehne kii koshish kar k unheN surgery k liye
pesh karna chaahooNga.
maiN jaanta hooN k aap in dinoN sabbatical pe gaye huve haiN, aur is k
'ilaava is laRi meiN bhi masruuf haiN. lekin mere paas bhi koii sh'er
maujood naheeN hai---agar aap haaN keh deN to maiN yeh kaam shuru' karooNga
---aGjh kii yeh qist Khatm ho jaane k ba'd, aur aap k vaapas aane k ba'd,
jab bhi aap ko vaqt mile, agar aap mere naam aik ittila'-naama post kar deN
to, tab tak mujh se jo bhi ban paaya hoga use pesh karooNga. vaise is qist
ke Khatm hone meiN hii abhi kuchh 6 hafte aur haiN---mujhe umeed hai k
kam-az-kam 6 ash'ar to ho hii jaayenge.
chooNke merii Urdu abhi bahut kamzor hai, mumkin hai k is surgery k dauraan
aap ko zabaan durust karne meiN hii kuchh meHnat karna paRe. lekin maiN
apnii taraf se misre behr meiN kehne kii poorii koshish karooNga.
aap k javaab ka be-sabrii se intizaar rahega.
aik baar aur aap ka shukriya ada karte huve---
Jasho.
Sarwar Alam Raz
> pichhle dinoN aapne "Ghazal usne chheRii, mujhe saaz dena" k silsile meiN
> Ghazal kehne ka aik tareeqa bataaya tha, aur teesrii qist meiN Yogesh saahab
> ka aik nazm pe "surgery" bhii kar dikhaaya tha---lekin hameN kisii Ghazal kii
> surgery dekhne ko naheeN mila. agar aap ijaazat deN to maiN aap k bataaye
> huve tareeqe se kuchh ash'ar kehne kii koshish kar k unheN surgery k liye
> pesh karna chaahooNga.
Jasho jee: namashkaar!
aap apnee Ghazal bhej deN. jaisaa hogaa dekhaa jaayegaa! bohat mumkin
hai k agle 6 haftoN meiN hee vaqt mil jaaye. meree :sabbatical: Khatm
ho gee to Nov. 25 ko India ke liye 2 maah kee ravaanigee hai. vahaaN
se Jan 25, 2003 ko vaapasee hogee! iss taraH ma'loom naheeN kab vaqt
mile. jitnaa ho sakegaa kar dooN gaa. aap Ghazal kehnee shuroo kar
deN.
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
saif
aap ne meri koshish pe nazar daali is ke liye maiN
shukraguzaar hooN. aapne jo beshkimtee rai deeN haiN us ki
roshni mai maine dobaara koshish kee hai, ummeed hai behar aur
bayaan ke tarazoo maiN khari utregee
gul to kyaa sabzaa bi nahee ugegaa shaayad
dil ko mere sahraa banaake jaate kyoN haiN
shukriya
sarw...@yahoo.com (Sarwar Alam Raz) wrote in message news:<267193df.02091...@posting.google.com>...
Nausheen
Aadab arz hai !
Aaapki Nigaah.e.karam ke liye aapki shukarguzaar hooN
Is khayaal ke baare meiN aapki kya rai hai ::
khwaab.e.dildaar se kambakht jagaate kyuN hai
meri jaagi hui qismat ko sulaate kyuN hai
--Nausheen
Yashowanto Ghosh
Sarwar Alam Raz (sarw...@yahoo.com) wrote:
: aap apnee Ghazal bhej deN. jaisaa hogaa dekhaa jaayegaa! bohat mumkin
: hai k agle 6 haftoN meiN hee vaqt mil jaaye. meree :sabbatical: Khatm
: ho gee to Nov. 25 ko India ke liye 2 maah kee ravaanigee hai. vahaaN
Oops! agar mujhe yeh pehle pata hota to is project
ko aapke India kee
safar Khatm hone ke ba'd hii shuroo karta...
: se Jan 25, 2003 ko vaapasee hogee! iss taraH ma'loom naheeN kab vaqt
: mile. jitnaa ho sakegaa kar dooN gaa. aap Ghazal kehnee shuroo kar
: deN.
maiN ise shuroo to kar raha hooN (chooNke maiN surgery dekhne ke 'ilaava
is tareeqe ko seekhna bhi chaahta hooN), lekin agar aap ke paas abhi vaqt
na ho to maiN surgery ke liye agle saal tak intizaar bhi kar sakta hooN.
maiNne apne pichhle Khat meN "be-sabrii" ka zikr to kiya tha, lekin maiN
khoob jaanta hooN k kisii bhi fan ko seekhne kee koshish meiN
sabr kitna zaroori
hai!
aap ka shukrguzaar,
Jasho.
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Sarwar Sahib
> aaddab.
>
> ghazal dekhne ka shukriya.
>
> iss series meiN shirkat karne ka hausla is liye kiya tha
> ki yahaaN nauvaarid ki koshish ko sudharne ka mashvira amlee
> misaal ke saath samjhayaa jataa hai. jahaN tak ban paRa,
> maine apnee koshish meiN kamee naheeN rakhee hai.phir bhi,apnee
> na.ahliyat ke madde.nazar mujhe iss baat ka afsos hai aur
> eitraaf bhi ki ghazal meiN ek bhi sher aisaa naheeN ban paRa
> jo iss qist meiN dekha aur parkha jaa sake.
Swami jee namaste!
voh baat saare fasaane meiN jiss kaa zikr naheeN
voh baat un ko bohat naa.gavaar guzree hai!
aap to Khafaa ho gaye! bhaa'ee maiN ne kab kahaa k aap kee Ghazal
dekhne ke qaabil naheeN hai? yaa to maiN aap ko matlab samjhaa naheeN
sakaa yaa aap chook gaye. meraa matlab sirf iss qadar thaa k :abhee
Ghazal javaan hai: meiN logoN se aik hee she'r kee darKhwaast hai,
GhazaloN kee naheeN. pesh kiye gaye she'r per raa'e de kar Khud unheeN
ko apnaa she'r behtar banaane kee darKhwaast kee jaatee hai. aap kaa
matla' maiN le naheeN saktaa thaa kyoN.k pehle hee matloN kee bharmaar
hai. sochaa k agar aap se aik she'r kehlaa looN to yeh mushkil bhee
Hal ho jaayegee. aap se jo darKhwaast kee thee uss per maiN Khud bhee
amal kartaa hooN ya'nee aksar misre' adal.badal kar nayaa she'r
taKhleeq kartaa hooN. sirf yehee baat thee!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> main aapka mamnoon hooNgaa agar ap Un kameeyooN ki nishaandehi
> kareN jiskee vajah se mere likhne me koi khususiyat paidaa na
> ho payee.mujhe yaqeen hai aap munaasib waqt par apne mashvire
> meiN fan ki vo girah kholeNge jiskee samajh mashq mein chaar chaaNd
> paidaa kartee hai.
aap kee Ghazal mere paas likhee rakhee hai aur uss ko maiN dekhooN gaa
lekin iss series meiN naheeN. uss ko alag se tabsare ke ba'd chand din
meiN post karooN gaa. inshaa.Allah!
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> aapke hauslaa-afzaa lafzooN ne meri mayoosi ko qasb kiyaa hai.
> aapke hukm ki taameel meraa farz.e avval hai.hidaayat ke daaire
> me paaband sher ki shakl kuchh yooN hai-
>
> khauf.e ruswaai hai to ishq jataate kyoN haiN
> apne pehloo meiN meri yaad basaate kyoN haiN.
dekhiye k jiss cheez se maiN bachnaa chaah rahaa thaa vohee saamne aa
gayee ya'nee aik matla aur aa gayaa! ab maiN iss mas'ale ko yooN hal
kiye detaa hooN k aap kaa ooper vaala matal' dekhooN gaa aur saath hee
apnee pasand kaa voh she'r bhee nazar ke saamne rakhooN gaa jiss kee
jaanib maiN aap kaa Khayaal raaGhib karne kee justujoo meiN thaa! aur
voh yeh hai:
jab naheeN mujh se muHabbat to shikaayat kaisee?
apne lab per voh miraa naam hee laate kyoN haiN?
Khudaa lagtee kahiye k yeh she'r uss matle' se behtar naheeN hai? maiN
aik aadh din meiN in meiN se muntaKhib she'r kaa e'laan kar dooN gaa.
mumkin hai k aap kuChh kehnaa chaaheN.
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> "Saari taKhleeq ka gar ek hi Khaaliq hai to phir,
> ye mazaahib hame.N aapas me.N la.Raate kyo.N hai.N ??? "
>
> [this with due thanks to Raj Kumar sahib for helping me with the first
> misra].
>
> hopefully this came out better Sarwar sahib. aapki islaah aur
> khayaalo.N ka i.ntezaar rahegaa :)
> Amit Malhotra
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Amit saaheb: namaste!
yeh aap kee daryaa.dilee hai k aap meree darKhwaast per baraabar
meHnat kiye jaa rahe haiN. shukriya! aap kaa she'r beHr aur vazn meiN
pooraa hai! aap kee fikr bajaa lekin mujh ko yeh kehne kee ijaazat
deejiye k:
(1) donoN misroN kaa rabt mashkook hai. aap keh rahe haiN k :jab
saaree taKhleeq kaa Khaaliq aik hee hai to yeh mazaahib kaa kyaa
jhagRaa hai: lekiN :saaree taKhleeq kaa aik hee Khaaliq hone: se
:mazaahib: kaa kyaa ta'alluq hai? haaN agar aap :saaree taKhleeq: ko
:sab mazaabib: se aur :gar: ko :agar: se badal deN to matlab vaazeH ho
jaayegaa. albatta iss soorat meiN :mazaahib: kee donoN misroN meiN
takraar zaroor khaTaktee hai! kyaa Khayaal hai aap kaa?
(2) :saaree taKhleeqaat: ziyaada saHeeH hotaa lekin :saaree taKhleeq:
ko she'r kee zarooraat ke pesh.e.nazar :kaa'inaat: ke ma'nee meiN
lenaa Ghair.munaasib naheeN hai, bal.k mustaHsin hai. agar aap pehle
misre per nazar.e.saanee kee zaroorat se mut'tafiq haiN to iss ko dekh
leN. shukriya!
yeh kehne kee shaayad zaroorat naheeN hai k meraa tabsara :tanqeed
baraa'e tanqeed: per mabnee naheeN hai bal.k sirf mere Khayaalaat kaa
aks hai.
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
>
> Aadab arz hai !
>
> Aaapki Nigaah.e.karam ke liye aapki shukarguzaar hooN
>
> Is khayaal ke baare meiN aapki kya rai hai ::
>
> meri jaagi hui qismat ko sulaate kyuN haiN
>
> --Nausheen
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nausheen saaheba: aadaab!
Khayaal dilkash hai! do baateN arz haiN, dekh leejiye:
(1) aik to meHboob kaa Khwaab hotaa hai jiss ko aap ne
:Khwaab.e.dildaar: kahaa hai (aur saHeeH kahaa hai) aur doosraa
:meHboob kee deed kaa Khwaab hotaa hai: jo apne ma'ne meiN :meHboob ke
Khwaaab: se ziyaada shaa'iraana aur naazuk hotaa hai. dekhiye aap kyaa
sochtee haiN aur kyaa kehtee haiN.
(2) yeh vaazeH naheeN huaa k yeh :kam.baKht: kaun haiN jo aap per iss
qadar zulm per tule hue haiN! maiN samajhtaa hooN k yeh duniyaa vaale
bhee ho sakte haiN, aap ke bad.Khwaah bhee aur doosre log bhee. lekin
in kaa tashaKhhus agar saaf ho jaaye to kyaa hee aChhaa ho. yeh yaad
rakhiye k meree raa'e sirf aik raa'e hai. faisila aap ko hee karnaa
hai aur maiN aap ke faisila kaa paaband hooN.
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Janaab Sarwar Saahib aadaab
>
> aap ne meri koshish pe nazar daali is ke liye maiN
> shukraguzaar hooN. aapne jo beshkimtee rai deeN haiN us ki
> roshni mai maine dobaara koshish kee hai, ummeed hai behar aur
> bayaan ke tarazoo maiN khari utregee
>
> gul to kyaa sabzaa bi nahee ugegaa shaayad
> dil ko mere sahraa banaake jaate kyoN haiN
> shukriya
Saif saaheb: aadaab!
aap kee nayee koshish laa'iq.e.daad hai aur yaqeenan hai. afsos k yeh
qaabil.e.qubool naheeN hai kyoN.k ab bhee donoN misre beHr se Khaarij
haiN. meraa Khayaal hai k aap apne ash'aar ko gaa kar yaa gungunaa kar
parakhte haiN aur voh aap ko saHeeH nazar aate haiN. agar aisaa hai to
yeh tareeqa ChhoR deN. she'r ko aahista lekin aavaaz se saHeeH
talaffuz se paRh kar dekhaa kareH.
maiN iss mushkil ko yooN samjhaataa hooN k aap ke she'r kaa Khayaal
qaa'im rakhte hue aap ke donoN misroN ko beHr meiN laataa hooN. aap ko
Khud hee nazar aa jaaye gaa k kahaaN aap se kotaahee huee hai:
gul kaa kyaa zikr k sabza bhee hai naa.ped yahaaN
dil miraa seHraa banaa ke chale jaate kyoN haiN?
yeh sirf beHr dikhaane kee koshish hai. she'r ab bhee Theek naheeN
hai. lekin voh ba'd kee baat hai. aik koshish aur sahee! ba'z martaba
kaam meiN zaraa see der lagtee hai lekin maayoosee kee zaroorat naheeN
hai!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
Zoya jee: sat Sri Akal!
aap ko bazm meiN dekh kar kitnee musarrat huee kehnaa mushkil hai! tum
salaamat raho hazaar baras!
ab she'r kee suniye!
(1) aap ne :ehad: (hey per zabar) likhaa hai, saHeeH :ehd: (hey saakin
hai) hai. iss taraH aap kaa pehlaa misraa beHr se Khaarij ho jaataa
hai.
(2) yahaaN :Hasrat: kaa maqaam naheeN hai bal.k :malaal,
hichkichaahaT, qalaq, taraddud: kaa maqaam hai. alfaaz kee
heraa.pheree se she'r Theek ho jaayegaa. haaN aur zor pedaa karnaa
chaaheN to pehle misre meiN :thaa: laane kee koshish kar dekheN.
kaheeN :voh: bhee aa jaaye to Theek hogaa, lekin iss ko maiN aisaa
:critical: naheeN samajhtaa hooN jitnaa :thaa: ko.
pehle misre per meHnat kareN gee to doosraa uss kaa haath Khud ba.Khud
pakaR kar aage chalegaa!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
Yoqesh saaheb: namaste!
yeh :aalimaana: kyaa hotaa hai bha'i? kyoN kaaNToN meiN Ghareeb ko
ghaseeT.te haiN! she'r inaayat karne kaa shukriya! ab meree arz bhee
sun leN:
(1) aap kaa she'r vazn aur beHr meiN bilkul durust hai, goyaa pehlee
manzil to fatH huee! marHabaa!
(2) shab.e.aaKhir = aaKhiree raat (zindigee kee, hijr kee, visaal kee
yaa kisee aur cheez kee!)
aaKhir.e.shab = raat kaa aaKhiree Hissa jab intizaar kee intihaa ho
chukee hotee hai.
meraa Khayaal hai k aap :aaKhir.e.shab: kehnaa chaahte haiN. kyaa
maiN saHeeH hooN?
(3) maGhloob = voh jiss pe kisee aur cheez kaa Ghalaba (Hamla, qabza,
tuGhyaanee = over-powering) ho gayee ho.
:maGhloob Khayaalaat: se aap kaa kyaa matlab hai? aap ke she'r kaa
matlab saaf naheeN hai aur donoN misroN kaa baahimee rabt vaazeH karne
kee zaroorat hai. Khaas taur se yeh dekhiye k :aaKhir.e.shab: yaa
:shab.e.aaKhir: kaa aap ke ( ? ) Khayaalat se kyaa ta'alluq bantaa
hai. maiN muntazir rahooN gaa!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Zoya
>
> aap ko bazm meiN dekh kar kitnee musarrat huee kehnaa mushkil hai! tum
> salaamat raho hazaar baras!
Sarwar Sahib,
aap kii muhabbat kaa aur dua kaa shukriya, is par ek_dam se mujhe
Gulzar Sahib kii yeh trivenii yaad aa gaii:
ham_ko Ghalib ne yeh dua dii thii
tum salaamat raho hazaar baras!
yeh baras to faqt dinoN meiN gayaa!!
is par kyaa kaheNge aap?!
>
> ab she'r kee suniye!
>
> (1) aap ne :ehad: (hey per zabar) likhaa hai, saHeeH :ehd: (hey saakin
> hai) hai. iss taraH aap kaa pehlaa misraa beHr se Khaarij ho jaataa
> hai.
arre Sarwar Sahib, aap bhalaa maaneN ya naa maaneN, but any
full-blooded Punjabi will attest to this: ehad hotaa hai, balke ehAd
bhii hotaa hai!!
>
> (2) yahaaN :Hasrat: kaa maqaam naheeN hai bal.k :malaal,
> hichkichaahaT, qalaq, taraddud: kaa maqaam hai. alfaaz kee
> heraa.pheree se she'r Theek ho jaayegaa.
I agree with you, I had used 'hasrat' for the lack of a better word,
dar_asal maiN 'regret' yaa 'hesitation' jaisaa koii lafz DhuuND rahii
thii. meraa Khayaal hai is behr meiN malaal sahiih rahrgaa. to ab sher
dobaaraa suniiye:
vaqt-e-ruKhsat koii aaNsuu na malaal, aur na ehd
duur jaa kar mujhe phir paas bulaate kyoN haiN?!
> pehle misre per meHnat kareN gee to doosraa uss kaa haath Khud ba.Khud
> pakaR kar aage chalegaa!
>
> Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar sahib, aap bhii kyaa baat karte haiN! fil_haal to duusre misre
kaa haath vaath paka.D kar chalne kaa koii iraadaa nahiiN hai, haaN,
agar pehlaa misraa Khud palaT kar vaapas aaye aur do chaar aaNsuu
bahaaye, kuChh malaal zaahir kare, koii ehd vaghairaa baaNdhe, to phir
ghaur kiyaa jaa saktaa hai!! sahiih kahaa na maiN_ne?!
________________ Zoya
Yogesh Sethi
> >
> > vo na aaye, shab-e-aaKhir hai muqaabil mere,
> > ab ye maGluub Khayaalaat Daraate kyuu.n hai.n
>
> manzil to fatH huee! marHabaa!
> :maGhloob Khayaalaat: se aap kaa kyaa matlab hai? aap ke she'r kaa
> Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Sahib, aadaab:
Thank you for your comments. Let me describe the thought behind this
couplet and then you please check to see if the idea is complete and
the words that I have chosen convey it adequately:
The idea:
She has not come - (I waited for her all this time and have now
reached the end of my tether) - I am facing (the end of my life) - my
last night.
(I wish to see her before I die and want to keep that hope alive to
the end) but now why have my thoughts become subdued and threaten me
(to suggest that she will not come.)
maGluub - has many meanings including: 1. Subdued 2. Defeated etc. I
look forward to your critique. In the meanwhile, I had a chance to
write another couplet and would like your opinion on that also if you
find it convenient to do so.
dil lagaane ka nahii.N hai koii maqsad jin ko
vo mire dil ko niGhaaho.N se churaate kyuu.n hai.N
Kind regards,
Yogesh
UVR
> u...@usa.net (UVR) wrote in message
news:<9c085b63.02091...@posting.google.com>...
>
>>is qist ke liye Khaaksaar kii bhi naacheez "entry" haazir hai --
>>
>> duzd-e-dil aap naheeN haiN? to mujhe dekhte hii
>> baGhleN kyoN jhaaNkte haiN? aaNkh churaate kyoN haiN?
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Ravindra saaheb: aadaab arz hai!
[*snip*]
> yeh tajveez ik bilkul :subjective: baat hai. meree chashm.e.tasavvur
> jab meHboob ko apnee :baGhal: jhaaNkte dekhtee hai to tabee'at kuChh
> mukaddar see ho jaatee hai! agar tanzan aik fiqra yahaaN :baGhleN kyoN
> jhaaNkte haiN: kee jagah lagaa diyaa jaaye to she'r kaa raNg badal
> saktaa hai. agar aap ko yeh tabdeelee manzoor naheeN hai to bhee
> az.raah.e.tafannun.e.taba' yeh sochne meiN kyaa harj hai k maiN kiss
> fiqre kee jaanib ishaara kar rahaa hooN? yeh maiN jaantaa hooN k aap
> iss :imtiHaan: meiN :fail: hargiz naheeN hoN ge!
janaab-e-muhtaram Sarwar saahib:
waise sach baat to yeh hai k maiN ne yeh sh'er *sirf* "baGhleN jhaaNkne"
ke muhaavre ko istimaal karne ke liye kiyaa thaa. [There *is* probably
some connection with the previous episode, here ;) ... Anyway]
mujhe sh'er ko badalne se koii aiteraaz naheeN. albattah mushkil yeh
hai, Sarwar saahib, k mujhe aap ek-adad hinT de dete to baRii mehrbaanii
hotii. filhaal is fiqre ke jo badal mere zehn meN aa rahe haiN, woh
bilkul "suit" hote naheeN nazar aa rahe.
haaN, ek kaam aur kiyaa jaa saktaa hai, k sh'er ko dobaara "baGh...jh."
ke baGhair kah liyaa jaaye. I'm willing to do that, too, but I would
really like to give your initial suggestion a shot, before taking the
easy, escapist way out.
-UVR.
paabagil
> visual aur vaaqiaatii hai( attn: pbj Z Sahib!):
>
> vaqt-e-ruKhsat koii hasrat, koii aaNsuu, na ehad
> duur jaa kar mujhe phir paas bulaate kyoN haiN?!
Zoyaa saahiba:
yaad aavaree kaa shukriya:
zikr meraa mujh se behtar hai ... :)
1.
aap ne vaaqiyaatee she'er likhaa hai, is ke mahaasin par to "Qaazi-ul
Quzzaah" janaab e Sarwar hee tabsira farmaa sakte haiN, maiN to sirf
aap ko aik she'er yaad dilaanaa chaahooN gaa:
vaqt e ruKhsat vo chup rahe 'Abid'
aankh meN phailtaa gayaa kaajal!
maiN ne ka'yee saal qabl isee qabeel kaa -- lekin baRaa bai-tukaa saa
-- aik she'er kahaa thaa (jab meN FSc meN paRhtaa thaa), arz kiyaa
hai:
jaise jaise shaam milan kee Gham kee raat meN Dhaltee ga'yee
dheere dheere kaajal phailaa, nainaaN bhar bhar aa'ye bahut
2.
aap ne apnee doosree post meN Ghalib ke misre, "tum salaamat raho",
par Gulzar saahib kee trevenee paish kee thee. is par bhee maiN kuchh
arz karnaa chaahooN gaa. pehle Ghalib aur phir AN Qasmi:
tum salaamat raho 1000 baras
har baras ke hoN din 50,000 (LOLOL)
aik pal bhee zinda rehnaa ik qayaamat thaa hameN
aur tool e umr kee ham ko du'aa miltee rahee!!!
so, Zoyaa jee, is she'er ke saare "consequences" par Ghaur kar ke hee
qubooliyat kee du'aa keejiye gaa :)
aadaab arz hai,
Zaff (not pbj! :)
Vasmi Abidi
> tum salaamat raho 1000 baras
> har baras ke hoN din 50,000 (LOLOL)
>
> aik pal bhee zinda rehnaa ik qayaamat thaa hameN
> aur tool e umr kee ham ko du'aa miltee rahee!!!
ek she'r mujhe bhi yaad aa gayaa, sun leejiye (sha'ir ka naam abhi yaad
naheeN):
ye to kahiye aap kee ulfat meN dil bahlaa rahaa
varna duniya "chaar din" jeene ke bhi qaabil na thi
Vasmi
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Gulzar Sahib kii yeh trivenii yaad aa gaii:
>
> ham_ko Ghalib ne yeh dua dii thii
> tum salaamat raho hazaar baras!
>
> yeh baras to faqt dinoN meiN gayaa!!
>
> is par kyaa kaheNge aap?!
Gulzar saaheb jaaneN aur un ke trivenee! ham to ab bhee aap ke liye
yehee kaheN ge k : har baras ke hoN din pachaas hazaar!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > ab she'r kee suniye!
> >
> > (1) aap ne :ehad: (hey per zabar) likhaa hai, saHeeH :ehd: (hey saakin
> > hai) hai. iss taraH aap kaa pehlaa misraa beHr se Khaarij ho jaataa
> > hai.
>
> arre Sarwar Sahib, aap bhalaa maaneN ya naa maaneN, but any
> full-blooded Punjabi will attest to this: ehad hotaa hai, balke ehAd
> bhii hotaa hai!!
jee haaN hotaa hogaa aur zaroor hotaa hogaa! ab aap kee :Punjabi zada:
shaa'iree ke liye mujh ko :Punjabi: baptize karnaa hogaa. agar uss kaa
tareeqa aap ko naheeN ma'loom ho to maiN bataaye detaa hooN: makaa kee
roTee aur chane ke saag se naashta karaa'iye aur duaa leejiye!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > (2) yahaaN :Hasrat: kaa maqaam naheeN hai bal.k :malaal,
> > hichkichaahaT, qalaq, taraddud: kaa maqaam hai. alfaaz kee
> > heraa.pheree se she'r Theek ho jaayegaa.
>
> I agree with you, I had used 'hasrat' for the lack of a better word,
> dar_asal maiN 'regret' yaa 'hesitation' jaisaa koii lafz DhuuND rahii
> thii. meraa Khayaal hai is behr meiN malaal sahiih rahrgaa. to ab sher
> dobaaraa suniiye:
>
> vaqt-e-ruKhsat koii aaNsuu na malaal, aur na ehd
> duur jaa kar mujhe phir paas bulaate kyoN haiN?!
bohat Khoob! eh gal huee naa! Vasme saaheb iss she'r per Zoya jee ko
mubaarakbaad de kar daaKhil.e.dafter kar leejiye. shukriya!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Sarwar Alam Raz wrote:
> > u...@usa.net (UVR) wrote in message
> news:<9c085b63.02091...@posting.google.com>...
> >
> >>is qist ke liye Khaaksaar kii bhi naacheez "entry" haazir hai --
> >>
> >> duzd-e-dil aap naheeN haiN? to mujhe dekhte hii
> >> baGhleN kyoN jhaaNkte haiN? aaNkh churaate kyoN haiN?
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> waise sach baat to yeh hai k maiN ne yeh sh'er *sirf* "baGhleN jhaaNkne"
> ke muhaavre ko istimaal karne ke liye kiyaa thaa. [There *is* probably
> some connection with the previous episode, here ;) ... Anyway]
>
> mujhe sh'er ko badalne se koii aiteraaz naheeN. albattah mushkil yeh
> hai, Sarwar saahib, k mujhe aap ek-adad hinT de dete to baRii mehrbaanii
> hotii. filhaal is fiqre ke jo badal mere zehn meN aa rahe haiN, woh
> bilkul "suit" hote naheeN nazar aa rahe.
>
> haaN, ek kaam aur kiyaa jaa saktaa hai, k sh'er ko dobaara "baGh...jh."
> ke baGhair kah liyaa jaaye. I'm willing to do that, too, but I would
> really like to give your initial suggestion a shot, before taking the
> easy, escapist way out.
>
> -UVR.
Ravindra saaheb: namaste!
aik Ghalat.fehmee kaa izaala zarooree hai. meree darj.e.baalaa tajveez
kaa yeh matlab hargiz naheeN thaa k aap apne she'r ko badleN hee! aap
ko :baGhleN jhaaNkne: meiN hee lutf aataa hai to maiN iss per e'tiraaz
karne vaalaa kaun?
:-)
haaN reh gayee meree :tanzan: vaale tajveez. to uss ko mu'amma samajh
kar Hal karne meiN ko'ee harj naheeN hai! meraa ishaara iss taraf thaa
k aap :farmaane: kee kisee soorat ko doosre misre meiN baaNdh kar
dekhiye. agar baat bane to Theek varna aap kaa she'r issee soorat meiN
qubool kar liyaa jaaye gaa (yeh ai dhamkee hai, va'da naheeN :-).
ab :baGhleN na jhaaNkiye: aur iss mu'amme ko Hal keejiye!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
.
> aap ne vaaqiyaatee she'er likhaa hai, is ke mahaasin par to "Qaazi-ul
> Quzzaah" janaab e Sarwar hee tabsira farmaa sakte haiN, maiN to sirf
> aap ko aik she'er yaad dilaanaa chaahooN gaa:
Zafar saaheb: salaam!
:Qaazi.ul.Quzzaah:????
lo voh bhee kehte haiN k yeh be.naNg.o.naam hai
yeh jaantaa agar to luTaataa na ghar ko maiN!
ab aik she'r Jigar kaa bhee lambee umr per sun leN:
museebat hai yeh lambee zindigaanee
buzurgoN kee duaa ne maar Daalaa!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> sarw...@yahoo.com (Sarwar Alam Raz) wrote:
> > yls...@netscape.net (Yogesh Sethi) wrote:
> > >
> > > vo na aaye, shab-e-aaKhir hai muqaabil mere,
> > > ab ye maGluub Khayaalaat Daraate kyuu.n hai.n
> >
> She has not come - (I waited for her all this time and have now
> reached the end of my tether) - I am facing (the end of my life) - my
> last night.
> (I wish to see her before I die and want to keep that hope alive to
> the end) but now why have my thoughts become subdued and threaten me
> (to suggest that she will not come.)
>
> maGluub - has many meanings including: 1. Subdued 2. Defeated etc. I
> look forward to your critique.
Yoqesh saaheb: namaste!
Thanks for your explanation of the thought process behind your she'r.
Having read it I can see where you are coming from. But that is hardly
the way it is supposed to be. I am sure you will agree that the she'r
should be able to explain itself to the reader.
The first misra needs very little tuning. It is the second one that
requires major :surgery: In Urdu :maGhloob: is hardly ever used by
itself to signify :subdued, overpowered: without identifying the cause
of the :Ghalba: For example we say : voh jazbaat (or grief, or ishq
vaGhaira) se maGhloob hai: but we do not just say :voh maGhloob hai:
and hope to get the full import of his predicament across to whoever
is listening. Your misra suffers from this lack of qualification as to
what it is that has caused your thoughts to be :maGhloob: Also the
connection between the two misras is not quite defined in my opinion.
Your new she'r is very good indeed! I would recommend that you perfect
this one and work on the previous one in your Ghazal that I strongly
suggest you compose after this episode. I have the following by way of
a different insight on the second she'r:
dil lagaane ka nahii.N hai koii maqsad jin ko
vo mire dil ko niGhaaho.N se churaate kyuu.n hai.N
(1) There is a basic difference between :maqsad: and :iraada: Perhaps
you will be better off using the latter? Think about it!
(2) The secong misra has no flaws. However, I would like for you to
elevate it to a higher level of expression of the same thought process
by specifying qualities of :nigaah: that suggest :coquetishness:
(naaz, naKhra). For example :tirChee nazareN: or :duzdeeda.nigaahee:
or some other expression of the sort. It is worth a try and I believe
you will be pleased with the result- not that you are not pleased with
the present one!
Thanks for your patience!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
p k swami
aadaab.
aapke jawaab ne maayosii ke donoN peR toR diye haiN.
aap se khafagi? ajee naheeN!! is vaham ko aap dil se qatai nikaal deN.
aapki sadaa dilee
aur ilm.o.fan mein mahir hone kaa maiN taH.e dil se ehatraam kartaa
hooN.agar likhane meiN kasar ke baais ye jazbaa pesh aayaa hai to meri
maazarat qabool kareN.
mai.N aapkaa isharaa k matle' kee bheeR ne sirf she.r ke liye darwazaa
khol
rakhaa hai— qatai na samajh sakaa. ek baat jo dimagh meiN rahee
aur jiskaa zikr aapne Nikaat.e sukhan meiN kiyaa thaa vo ye thee k
matle' ek se jiyaadah ho sakte haiN.
ye gumaan bhi thaa k is qist kee tahreer meiN kaheeN paRhaa hai k
behtar matle' kee
soorat meiN matlaa' badlaa bhi jaa saktaa hai.. asp jaise
jahaa.ndidaa.h log nauvaarid
ke oos eztaraab ko samajh sakte haiN jahaa.N eskee musalsal soorat
dimaagh par
cHhaa jatee hai aur junoon mein baatin ba.zaahir naheeN hotaa. jazba.e
takhleeq ki shiddat is qadar hue k pal bhar ke liye maiN matla’
aur she.r meiN farq bhool gayaa.
aapkaa kaa kahnaa hai k-
voh baat saare fasaane meiN jiss kaa zikr naheeN
voh baat un ko bohat naa.gavaar guzree hai!
meri arz ye hai k-
hue hai mujhse khataa naadim hooN main bahot lekin
teraa khuloos bohat khushgawaar guzraa hai
kaheeN to raah meiN tujhsaa bhi koi mil jaae
jahaaN bhi meraa safar naa.gawaar guzraa hai
(ye she.r bhi aapkii observation kaa muhtaaj hai—PKS)
jab naheeN mujh se muHabbat to shikaayat kaisee?
apne lab per voh miraa naam hee laate kyoN haiN?
mujhe aapse poora ettefaaq hai.yaqeenan ye she.r jo aapne ezaad kiyaa
hai oos matle' se kaheeN kaheeN behtar hai !! shukriyaa!!
apnee haqeer koshish par aapke alag se tabsare kaa intazaar rahegaa.
is ghazal ki mashq meiN kuch mandarjaa ashaar aur bhi bane haiN. enko
bhi tabsare me shaamil kar leN to inaayat hogee. aapki rahnumaai kaa
main shukraguzaar rahooNgaa.
saadagi unkee qayaamat se koi kam to naheeN
tiir.e mizghaaN ko vo naa.haq hi chalaate kyoN haiN
har ghaRii yaad teri har ghaRi teraa hi khayaal
band aaNkhooN se merii aaNkh laRaate kyoN haiN
unkoo laazim hi naheeN ishq meiN daryujagirii/(naadim honaa)
meraa sar uThataa hai to aaNkh jhukaate kyoN haiN
kyaa ghazab faiz hai khilwat meiN teraa husn.e tarab
mujhko ahsaas ki duniyaa se jagaate kyoN hain
hizr kaa soz hai yaa vasl ke imkaaN dil meiN
aasmaaN sar pe vo rah rah ke utHate kyon haiN
ghalateeyooN ki maa’zarat peshgee haazir hai!
deep regards.
PK Swami
Zoya
> Zoyaa saahiba:
> >
> zikr meraa mujh se behtar hai ... :)
>
> aadaab arz hai,
>
> Zaff (not pbj! :)
ZIS, Zafar, Zafaraab, paabagil, pbg(j!), Zaf, Zaff Sahib,
A rose is a rose is a rose is a ----------------!!!
____________________Zoya
UVR
... is a "phool"? :))
(PS: *purely* in jest)
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Sarwar sahib
> aadaab.
>
> aapke jawaab ne maayosii ke donoN peR toR diye haiN.
Swami jee: namaste!
aap kee muHabbat aur inaayat kaa kin alfaaz meiN shukriya adaa karooN!
maiN aap kee Ghazal dekh kar pehlee fursat meiN bhejooN gaa, aap
itmeenaan rakheN.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
> jab naheeN mujh se muHabbat to shikaayat kaisee?
> apne lab per voh miraa naam hee laate kyoN haiN?
aap kaa yeh she'r bohat aChhaa hai! maiN iss ko Ghazal meiN shaamil
kar rahaa hooN. Vasmi saaheb se darKhwaast hai k iss ko
:daaKhil.e.daftar: kar leN. shukriya!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Yogesh Sethi
> ... I would like for you to elevate it to a higher level ...
> Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Sahib, aadaab:
I am very appreciative of your constructive critique and valuable
suggestions. I have revised both the couplets and hope that they can
now meet your expectations.
1.
vo na aaye shab-e-aaKhir hai muqaabil ab to,
mere maasuum gunah mujhko rulaate kyuu.n hai.N
2.
dil lagaane ka iraadaa bhi nahii.N hai jin ko
tirchhii nazro.n se miraa dil vo churaate kyuu.n hai.N
I await your comments. Thank you.
Yogesh
saif
-------------------------------------------------
janaab Sarwar Sahaab aadab
aap ki raaye ke liye maiN behad shukraguzaar hooN, use
dhyaan maiN rakh kar yeh koshish kee hai :
jinke zer-e-saaye rahte the mahfuz ham
aag vohi aashiyaane maiN lagaate kyoN hai
shukriyaa
saif ahmed
Sarwar Alam Raz
> Sarwar Sahib, aadaab:
>
> I am very appreciative of your constructive critique and valuable
> suggestions. I have revised both the couplets and hope that they can
> now meet your expectations.
> 2.
> dil lagaane ka iraadaa bhi nahii.N hai jin ko
> tirchhii nazro.n se miraa dil vo churaate kyuu.n hai.N
>
> I await your comments. Thank you.
> Yogesh
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yogesh saaheb: namaste!
aap kee :abhee Ghazal javvaan hai: se jo faa'ida logoN ko huaa hai voh
ba.yak.nazar zaahir hai. zaraa saa ishaara keejiye aur log foran uss
per amal.dar.aamad kar dete haiN. aap kee yeh koshish iss kee umda
misaal hai k aap ne aik ishaare per kaamyaab tabdeelee aasaanee se kar
dee! merHabaa!
aap kee ijaazat se maiN aap ke doosre she'r kaa intiKhaab kar rahaa
hooN- nihaayat ma'moolee tabdeelee ke saath. yeh tabdeelee iss qadar
ma'moolee hai k aap ko phir zeHmat denaa munaasib naheeN ma'loom
hotaa hai. agar aap meree raa'e se mut'tafiq haiN to iss she'r meiN
:bhee: ko :hee: se aur :ko: ko :kaa: badal deN, taa.k she'r kee soorat
yooN ho jaaye:
dil lagaane kaa iraada hee naheeN hai jin kaa
tirChee nazroN se miraa dil voh churaate kyoN haiN!
:hee: se misre meiN zor (emphasis) pedaa karnaa maqsood hai aur :kaa:
lafz :iraada: kee vajh se liyaa hai. ummeed hai k aap ko e'tiraaz na
hogaa. aap kee tasdeeq ke ba'd Vasmi saaheb se darKhwaast ho gee k iss
she'r ko Ghazal meiN shaamil kar leN. aap ke javaab kaa intizaar rahe
gaa. shukriya!
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Vasmi Abidi
saif wrote:
> jinke zer-e-saaye rahte the mahfuz ham
> aag vohi aashiyaane maiN lagaate kyoN hai
>
Saif saahib,
aapke she'r ka Khayaal pasand aaya. lekin is meN 'behr kee samasya' hai.
misra-e-tarah hai:
"duniya vaale mujhe deevaana banaate kyoN haiN"
to aap jo misra kaheN, uskee behr (ya "dhun") bhi is misre kee tarah hona lazmee hai.
pahle, pahla misra dekha jaaye.
"dun ya" --> "jin ke". ye donoN ham-vaz haiN, ya yooN kaheN ki "match" karte haiN.
"vaale mujhe" ---> "zer-e-saaye" ? ye to match naheeN ho rahaa hai. lihaaza yahaaN par behr TooT rahee hai.
kuchh to karna hoga.
agar yooN kaheN: "jinke saaye meN tha ...."
ab dekhiye:
"duniya" --> "jinke"
"vaale" --> "saaye"
"mujhe" --> "meN tha"
zaahir hai ki "jinke saaye meN tha" Theek usee tarah paRhaa jaa saktaa hai jaise "duniya vaale mujhe" paRhaa
jaayega. donoN (partial) misre ek hi behr meN haiN.
ab aglaa TukRaa hai - "deevaana banaate"
is ke joR ke alfaaz ho sakte haiN - "mahfooz maiN kal tak"
aur aaKhrii TukRaa hai - "kyoN haiN"
to isko 'match' karne ke liye ham kah sakte haiN - "yaaroN"
is tarah se pahla misra ho gayaa:
"jinke saaye meN tha mahfooz maiN kal tak, yaaroN"
ab doosra misra dekheN.
"duniya" --> "aag" . ham-vazn haiN
"vaale" --> "vo hii" . ham-vazn haiN
"mujhe" --> "aashiyaane" ? yahaaN behr TooT rahee hai.
agar "aashiyaane" ke badle kaheN "miri ab ghar" to vazn Theek ho jaata hai.
to misra ho gayaa:
"aag vohii miri ab ghar meN lagaate kyoN haiN"
ye behr ke lihaaz se to Theek lag rahaa hai, magar baat zaraa suljha'i jaa saktee hai. chooNke pahle misre meN
hamne "kal tak" ka zikr kiyaa tha, is misre meN "aaj" lafz istemaal karne ki koshish karte haiN:
"aaj vo aag mire ghar meN lagaate kyoN haiN"
she'r ki shakl ab yooN ho gayee hai:
"jinke saaye meN tha mahfooz maiN kal tak, yaaroN
aaj vo aag mire ghar meN lagaate kyoN haiN"
in misroN ko "duniya vaale mujhe deevaana banaate kyoN haiN" se 'compare' kareN, to pataa lagtaa hai kee behr
vuhii hai.
misroN ko behr meN laane ke liye, ye mere sujhaa'o haiN, aur kuchh naheeN.
agar mufeed hoN, to qubool kareN. vaise, khayaal bhi aapka hai, aur she'r bhi aapka hai.
Vasmi
>
> shukriyaa
>
> saif ahmed
Vasmi Abidi
p k swami wrote:
> yaraane alup
> aadaab.
>
> i have made a feeble attempt. pesh hai.
Swami Saahib,
aadaab.
agar ye aapki 'feeble attempt' hai, to aapki 'zordaar attempt' kaisi
hogee?! :)
bahut achhii koshish hai. umeed hai aap apnii kaavisheN pesh karte
raheNge.
> saaNp kaa kaam to dasnaa hi hai pk swami
> ye samajh kar bhi usse doodh pilaate kyoN haiN
is she'r ko dobaara paRha to ek mazedaar baat nazar aa'i!
voh ye ki agar "pk" ko "peeke" (ba-maani "pee kar") paRheN, tab bhee
matlab nikalta hai.
shaayad aapne jaan boojh kar apne taKhallus ka ye dilchasp istemaal
kiya hai.
niyaazmand,
Vasmi
Zoya
> >
> > A rose is a rose is a rose is a ----------------!!!
>
> ... is a "phool"? :))
>
>
> (PS: *purely* in jest)
UVR Sahib,
You are funny! This was definitely an LOL moment!! ab maiN aap ko yaad
dilaaa duuN ke:
phuuloN meiN phuul gulaab kaa!
PS: Zaf Sahib, aap kyoN Khaamosh haiN?! bhai, maiN to compliment de
rahii thii, kahiiN aap buraa to nahiiN maan gaye?
________________Zoya
Amit Malhotra
>
> > "Saari taKhleeq ka gar ek hi Khaaliq hai to phir,
> > ye mazaahib hame.N aapas me.N la.Raate kyo.N hai.N ??? "
Aadab arz hai Munsif sahib :-)
pahli baat to aapke khat ke javaab mein jo taaKhiir hui hai, uske liye
muaafii chaahtaa huuN.. now lets move on to the important subject:
>
> (1) donoN misroN kaa rabt mashkook hai. aap keh rahe haiN k :jab
> saaree taKhleeq kaa Khaaliq aik hee hai to yeh mazaahib kaa kyaa
> jhagRaa hai: lekiN :saaree taKhleeq kaa aik hee Khaaliq hone: se
> :mazaahib: kaa kyaa ta'alluq hai? haaN agar aap :saaree taKhleeq: ko
> :sab mazaabib: se aur :gar: ko :agar: se badal deN to matlab vaazeH ho
> jaayegaa. albatta iss soorat meiN :mazaahib: kee donoN misroN meiN
> takraar zaroor khaTaktee hai! kyaa Khayaal hai aap kaa?
jahaan tak "mazaahib" lafz ka donoN misroN mein istemaal kii baat hai,
to aap bilkul sahi kah rahein hain, takraar bilkul khaTaktee hai!!
isliye ye khayaal to kuchh jachaa nahin.. aur jahaan tak misroN ke
rabt kii baat hai, hamare khayaal se to vo bilkul bi mashkook nahin
hai.. buraa na maaniega, magar baat kuchh aisi hai ki, mazhab to
insaaN ke banaaye hue haiN... aur har mazhab ka ek hi maqsad hota hai,
bas raastaa alag. Magar har mazhab apne raaste ko sabse acchhaa
bataataa hai, aur yahi nahin, sirf usi raaste ko maan ne ke liye kisi
na kisi tarah se "Pressurize" bhi karta hai. (Now, my purpose is not
to start a debate on this issue here, just to explain why I think the
relationship between the two lines is not ambiguous at all.) Every
religion calls this "Khaaliq" with its own given names, "Allah",
"Raam, Krishna", "YHWH", "Jesus"... etc. You agree that hundreds of
name for GOD exist? yet, its the same God! but why doesnt every one
believe that? If everyone does believe that, then why do religions or
people using religion as a tool, push other common folks to fight
against each other in order to show superiority over other religious
beliefs? That was the whole point of the sh'er.
ab isii zamiin par ye do ash'aar aapko hamari baat ka meaning bilkul
saaf bataa deinge:
sar jhukaate hain jo sajde mein tire aie maaliq!
josh mein aake vo sar apnaa kaTaate kyoN haiN??
ik kahe "Raam" to dujaa kahe "Allah, Allah"
ek maqsad hai to talvaar uThaate kyoN haiN???
i hope you can see how i made the connection between the two lines.
its too bad that my connection was not that obvious!
>
> (2) :saaree taKhleeqaat: ziyaada saHeeH hotaa lekin :saaree taKhleeq:
> ko she'r kee zarooraat ke pesh.e.nazar :kaa'inaat: ke ma'nee meiN
> lenaa Ghair.munaasib naheeN hai, bal.k mustaHsin hai. agar aap pehle
> misre per nazar.e.saanee kee zaroorat se mut'tafiq haiN to iss ko dekh
> leN. shukriya!
>
i agree that the usage of "taKhleeq" there is pretty good if it means
"kaa'inaat" which of course it does... but for the purpose of making
the meaning a little clearer in both lines, there are a few
alternatives, please tell me which one is better and then keep a final
sh'er for the episode:
option 1:
"saare maKhlooq ka gar ek hi Khaaliq hai to phir"
here also, same argument can apply that it should be "Saare
maKhlooqaat (as plural of maKhlooq)" but at least one point is
conveyed: "if the whole creation has the same God, then why do these
men made religions make each other fight saying that their God is
better/greater than the other!??"
option 2:
"saarii dunyaa ka agar ek hi Khaaliq hai to phir"
same point as before, "if the whole world has the same Creator"
I think this one does sound much clearer, considering we are not
playing around with plurals of taKhliiq and maKhluuq .
ab ham bharose ke saath to nahin kah sakte ki ye tabdiliyaN sh'er ke
rabt ko behtar banaatii haiN, magar I hope the point can be clearer
with one of them and that at least you understand where I was coming
from when I wrote that :-)
Warm Regards,
Amit Malhotra
UVR
munsif-e-mohtaram Sarwar saahib
jab k aap ne Yogesh saahib ke darj-e-baalaa sh'er ko qaabil-e-Ghazal
qaraar de hi diyaa hai, to phir mujh gustaaKh ko bhii bataa deN k
jab yahaaN dil kii chorii ho rahii hai to woh jo "duzd-e-dil" waalaa
sh'er thaa, aap kaheN to maiN use waapas le looN aur koii aur sh'er
kahne kii koshish kar looN?
niyaazmand
UVR.
UVR
[Ugh! What a rotten, bumbling-idiot-ic way of putting it!]
huzoor, Sarwar saahib, maiN jo kahnaa chaah rahaa thaa, woh yeh thaa k
ek hi miyaan meN jaise do talvaareN naheeN rah sakteeN, :) usii tarah
ek hi qism ke Khayaal kii buniyaad par kahe gaye do alahida-alahida
ash'aar ko ek hi Ghazal meN naheeN honaa chaahiye. lihaaza, chooN-k
aap ne Yogesh saahib ke "dil churaane" waale sh'er ko qubool kar liyaa
hai, meraa 'duzd-e-dil' waala sh'er Ghazal ke qaabil naheeN rahaa.
ab aap ke hukm kaa intizaar hai k maiN koii aur sh'er kahooN?
yaa rahne bhi dooN?
[Hope I've put it better this time.]
Yashowanto Ghosh
aap kaa "patient" (lag-bhag) taiyaar hai---aap ne jo tareeqa bataaya tha voh
vaaqe'ii kamaal kaa niklaa, k mujh se bhi kuchh misre ban gaye! umeed hai k
aap ke haathoN ilaaj ke baad yeh bhi ashaar ban jaayeNge, aur aap kaa
"surgery" dekh kar maiN bhi kuchh siikh jaaoNga.
aap ne misre
kehne ke baad unhe aik level "ooper" le jaane ki koshish karne kaa mashvara
diya thaa---voh kaam
chal raha hai---jab bhi aap ko kuchh vaqt mile
(chaahe voh aap ke India se vaapasii ke baad hii ho), mehrbaani kar ke
mujhe aik baar bataaiyega---maiN misroN ko haazir karooNga. tab tak maiN
Khud inhe maaNjhne kii koshish karta hooN---
ap kaa aihsaan-mand,
Jasho.
Yogesh Sethi
> > Sarwar Sahib, aadaab:
> >
> > I am very appreciative of your constructive critique and valuable
> > suggestions. I have revised both the couplets and hope that they can
> > now meet your expectations.
> > 2.
> > dil lagaane ka iraadaa bhi nahii.N hai jin ko
> > tirchhii nazro.n se miraa dil vo churaate kyuu.n hai.N
> >
> > I await your comments. Thank you.
> > Yogesh
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Yogesh saaheb: namaste!
>
> aap kee :abhee Ghazal javvaan hai: se jo faa'ida logoN ko huaa hai voh
> ba.yak.nazar zaahir hai. zaraa saa ishaara keejiye aur log foran uss
> per amal.dar.aamad kar dete haiN. aap kee yeh koshish iss kee umda
> misaal hai k aap ne aik ishaare per kaamyaab tabdeelee aasaanee se kar
> dee! merHabaa!
Sarwar Sahib, aadaab:
Thank you for your encouraging words. It is gratifying to note that
you think we are improving. The credit for this actually belongs to
the various articles on the meter and the excellent critique by the
experts on this forum. It has lifted notable fog from many of the
enigmatic aspects of Urdu meter!
>
> aap kee ijaazat se maiN aap ke doosre she'r kaa intiKhaab kar rahaa
> hooN- nihaayat ma'moolee tabdeelee ke saath. yeh tabdeelee iss qadar
> ma'moolee hai k aap ko phir zeHmat denaa munaasib naheeN ma'loom
> hotaa hai. agar aap meree raa'e se mut'tafiq haiN to iss she'r meiN
> :bhee: ko :hee: se aur :ko: ko :kaa: badal deN, taa.k she'r kee soorat
> yooN ho jaaye:
>
> dil lagaane kaa iraada hee naheeN hai jin kaa
> tirChee nazroN se miraa dil voh churaate kyoN haiN!
>
> :hee: se misre meiN zor (emphasis) pedaa karnaa maqsood hai aur :kaa:
> lafz :iraada: kee vajh se liyaa hai. ummeed hai k aap ko e'tiraaz na
> hogaa. aap kee tasdeeq ke ba'd Vasmi saaheb se darKhwaast ho gee k iss
> she'r ko Ghazal meiN shaamil kar leN. aap ke javaab kaa intizaar rahe
> gaa. shukriya!
>
Sarwar Sahib, there has been considerable increase in the number of
posts on ALUP and some times it is difficult to keep up with all of
them. I did not realize till I saw UVR Sahib's last post that I had
inadvertently drifted in to the already staked territory. My lapse is
inexcusable and UVR Sahib is correct in pointing this out. Therefore I
would like to withdraw the above given couplet of mine from inclusion
in the final Ghazal.
Instead, please see if the following new idea can qualify:
ri.nd bhii kahte haiN, saaqii ye bataa de sab ko,
Khud jo piite nahii.N, auro.N ko pilaate kyuu.n hai.n
Regards,
Yogesh
jugnoo
> aadaab arz.
> "banke hamdard mire, roz sataate kyoN haiN?
> duniyaa vaale mujhe deevaanaa banaate kyoN haiN?"
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
janaab Sarwar saahib aur janaab Vasmi saahib: aadaab arz!
aik arse ke ba'd phir Haazir ho rahaa huuN. kyaa karuuN Haalaat hii
aise haiN. mujh ko ilm hai k shaayad aap aur kuChh log aur bhii mujh
ko kam tajribe-kaar shoraa meiN nahiiN ginte haiN. ab suurat yeh hai k
maiN Khud ko bilkul nau-sikhyaa samajhtaa huuN! baher-Haal maiN iss
bazm meiN aik she'r pesh kar rahaa huuN. Sarwar saahib jaisaa faislaa
kareN ge maiN uss ko maan luuN gaa. arz kartaa huuN k:
bandigii se hameN kab aap kee inkaar rahaa?
baat be baat phir iHsaan jataate kyoN haiN?
Khaaksaar
:jugnoo:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> UVR wrote:
> >> dil lagaane kaa iraada hee naheeN hai jin kaa
> >> tirChee nazroN se miraa dil voh churaate kyoN haiN!
> ek hi miyaan meN jaise do talvaareN naheeN rah sakteeN, :) usii tarah
> ek hi qism ke Khayaal kii buniyaad par kahe gaye do alahida-alahida
> ash'aar ko ek hi Ghazal meN naheeN honaa chaahiye. lihaaza, chooN-k
> aap ne Yogesh saahib ke "dil churaane" waale sh'er ko qubool kar liyaa
> hai, meraa 'duzd-e-dil' waala sh'er Ghazal ke qaabil naheeN rahaa.
> ab aap ke hukm kaa intizaar hai k maiN koii aur sh'er kahooN?
>
> yaa rahne bhi dooN?
>
> [Hope I've put it better this time.]
Ravindra saaheb: saadar namaste!
saaheb! aap iss qadar jald kyoN ulajh jaate haiN? bhaa'ee! aap kaa
she'r Yogesh saaheb ke she'r se judaa hai. aap jaisaa suKhan.fehm :dil
churaane: aur :nazreN churaane: ke lateef, naazuk magar vaazeH farq se
to vaaqif hee hai. meraa iraada donoN ash'aar lene kaa pehle bhee thaa
aur ab bhee hai. iss zameen meiN yeh mushkil to hai k aik se mazaameeN
muKhtalif log baaNd sakte haiN. lekin aik to iss se logoN kee :upaj:
kaa andaaza hogaa aur doosre seekhne vaale yeh dekheN ge k aik hee
baat kitnee taraH kahee jaa saktee hai. aap ne Haal hee meiN jo she'r
mujh ko e-mail kiye haiN un kee muKhtalif sooratoN ke to aap bhee
qaa'il haiN!
aap kaa she'r qubool karne meiN taaKheer yooN ho rahee thee k maiN ne
sochaa k aap meraa likhaa :mu'amma: Hal kar hee leN to phir kuChh
kahooN. lekin aap masroof haiN aur behtar hai k aur intizaar na kiyaa
jaaye. Vasmi saaheb se iss teHreer ke zarie darKhwaast hai k Ravindra
saaheb kaa she'r :daaKhil.e.daftar: kar liyaa jaaye, inaayat ho gee.
duaa.go
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
UVR
> sarw...@yahoo.com (Sarwar Alam Raz) wrote:
>
>>yls...@netscape.net (Yogesh Sethi) wrote :
>>
>>
>>>Sarwar Sahib, aadaab:
>>>
>>> I am very appreciative of your constructive critique and valuable
>>>suggestions. I have revised both the couplets and hope that they can
>>>now meet your expectations.
>>>2.
>>>dil lagaane ka iraadaa bhi nahii.N hai jin ko
>>>tirchhii nazro.n se miraa dil vo churaate kyuu.n hai.N
>>>
>>>I await your comments. Thank you.
>>>Yogesh
>>-------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>hooN- nihaayat ma'moolee tabdeelee ke saath. yeh tabdeelee iss qadar
>>ma'moolee hai k aap ko phir zeHmat denaa munaasib naheeN ma'loom
>>hotaa hai. agar aap meree raa'e se mut'tafiq haiN to iss she'r meiN
>>:bhee: ko :hee: se aur :ko: ko :kaa: badal deN, taa.k she'r kee soorat
>>yooN ho jaaye:
>>
>>dil lagaane kaa iraada hee naheeN hai jin kaa
>>tirChee nazroN se miraa dil voh churaate kyoN haiN!
>>
>>:hee: se misre meiN zor (emphasis) pedaa karnaa maqsood hai aur :kaa:
>>lafz :iraada: kee vajh se liyaa hai. ummeed hai k aap ko e'tiraaz na
>>hogaa. aap kee tasdeeq ke ba'd Vasmi saaheb se darKhwaast ho gee k iss
>>she'r ko Ghazal meiN shaamil kar leN. aap ke javaab kaa intizaar rahe
>>gaa. shukriya!
>
> Sarwar Sahib, there has been considerable increase in the number of
> posts on ALUP and some times it is difficult to keep up with all of
> them. I did not realize till I saw UVR Sahib's last post that I had
> inadvertently drifted in to the already staked territory. My lapse is
> inexcusable and UVR Sahib is correct in pointing this out. Therefore I
> would like to withdraw the above given couplet of mine from inclusion
> in the final Ghazal.
Not at all, Yogesh saahib, not *AT ALL*! It was not my intention
to suggest that this qaafiya or, worse yet, this tasawwur belongs
to me! If I inadvertently implied any such thing, I withdraw that
implication. Please submit the above sh'er for the series.
> Instead, please see if the following new idea can qualify:
>
> ri.nd bhii kahte haiN, saaqii ye bataa de sab ko,
> Khud jo piite nahii.N, auro.N ko pilaate kyuu.n hai.n
aap to sh'er par sh'er arz kiye chale jaa rahe haiN, Yogesh-ji!
aur sh'er bhi aise-aise Khayaalaat par mabni, k bha`ii waah!
agar yahii haal rahaa, to mumkin hai k agli qist tak aap kaa
naam ham nau-mashqoN kii fehrist se kaaTnaa paR jaaye! merii
jaanib se "sau-sau mubaarkaaN" qubool farmaaiye.
> Regards,
> Yogesh
-UVR.
Vinod Bharadwaj
kai saare adhoore ashaaroN ke baad is manzil par poNhchahooN ke aGjh#3 meN
shirkat ka lutf le sakooN. to huzoor arz kiaa hai:
"vo Khudaa jis ki ijaazt se ho maasoom kaa KhooN"
" haath ham us ki ibaadat meN uThate kyooN haiN?"
niyaaz mand
Vinod
Vinod Bharadwaj
I just want to let you know that how much I am learning from your
interactions with all the people who are participating. Soon I will submit
my composition. I believe that the inclusion or exclusion of a sher in the
final entry is irrelevent. The real gain is the interaction and the comentry
before the last date for submission. Thank you so much for your effforts and
desire to help.
Best regards
Vinod
Vasmi Abidi
Vinod Bharadwaj wrote:
hmmm...
"ijaazat" is a bit strong here.
modifying that to something like "jo dunyaa meN zulm.o.sitam ko naheeN
rokta" might lead to a more subtle and delicate she'r.
just my 2 cents.
Vasmi
>
> niyaaz mand
> Vinod
UVR
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Ravindra saaheb: saadar namaste!
Sarwar saahib, aadaab.
ajii is "aadar-satkaar" ke maiN kahaaN laa`iq hooN? Khwaah-m-Khwaah
meraa mazaaq banaa dete haiN aap? -- :(
> saaheb! aap iss qadar jald kyoN ulajh jaate haiN? bhaa'ee! aap kaa
> she'r Yogesh saaheb ke she'r se judaa hai. aap jaisaa suKhan.fehm :dil
> churaane: aur :nazreN churaane: ke lateef, naazuk magar vaazeH farq se
> to vaaqif hee hai.
aap ba-jaa farmaate haiN: shaa`id maiN "duzd[i]-e-dil" aur "dil
churaane" meN ulajh kar rah gayaa thaa.
> aap kaa she'r qubool karne meiN taaKheer yooN ho rahee thee k maiN ne
> sochaa k aap meraa likhaa :mu'amma: Hal kar hee leN to phir kuChh
> kahooN. lekin aap masroof haiN aur behtar hai k aur intizaar na kiyaa
> jaaye. Vasmi saaheb se iss teHreer ke zarie darKhwaast hai k Ravindra
> saaheb kaa she'r :daaKhil.e.daftar: kar liyaa jaaye, inaayat ho gee.
huzoor, mere kahne kaa yeh hargiz matlab naheeN thaa k aap meraa
sh'er fi`l soorat hii qubool kareN -- sach to yeh hai k _mu'amma_
hal karne kaa meraa bhii *iraada* thaa, aur ab bhii hai, par kyaa
kiijiye agar *qaabiliyat* hii na ho? :( waise dekhaa jaaye to
_aaNgan_ bhii kuchh kam TeRhaa :) naheeN thaa -- aap kaa *hinT*
bhii ain usii qabeel kaa thaa jis kaa k aap kaa *puzzle* thaa --
kam az kam mere liye.
Khair, filhaal ek sh'er aur aap kii nazr kar rahaa hooN; dekh
leN k kaheeN Ghazal ke laa`iq to naheeN? --
jin meN do gaam bhi chalne kii tab-o-taab naheeN
door, manzil pe, nazar apnii jamaate kyoN haiN?
mujhe shak hai k is qist meN meraa ravaiyya dekh kar ba'az
ALUPers mere baare meN bilkul yahii soch rahe hoNge.
aur haaN, *us* mu'amme ke liye ek-aadh hinT aur de dete to
achchhaa thaa -- is AGJH[3] ke daa`ire meN naheeN to us ke
baahar hii maiN is aap ke gorakh-dhande se nibaT letaa?!
niyaazmand
UVR.
> duaa.go
>
> Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Sarwar Alam Raz
>
> > > "Saari taKhleeq ka gar ek hi Khaaliq hai to phir,
> > > ye mazaahib hame.N aapas me.N la.Raate kyo.N hai.N ??? "
> > Amit saaheb: namaste!
>
> Aadab arz hai Munsif sahib :-)
>
> pahli baat to aapke khat ke javaab mein jo taaKhiir hui hai, uske liye
> muaafii chaahtaa huuN.. now lets move on to the important subject:
>
der meiN hee sahee, aap aaye to! sahaj pakey so meeThaa! haaN aik baat
aur k aap kee yaa kisee aur kee baat kaa buraa maan'ne kaa ko'ee
savaal hee naheeN hai. iss liye aap belaag aur be.jhijhak apne
Khayaalaat kaa izhaar keejiye. shukriya!
ab aap ke she'r ko dekhte haiN:
--------------------------------------------------------------------
> > (1) donoN misroN kaa rabt mashkook hai. aap keh rahe haiN k :jab
> > saaree taKhleeq kaa Khaaliq aik hee hai to yeh mazaahib kaa kyaa
> > jhagRaa hai: lekiN :saaree taKhleeq kaa aik hee Khaaliq hone: se
> > :mazaahib: kaa kyaa ta'alluq hai? haaN agar aap :saaree taKhleeq: ko
> > :sab mazaabib: se aur :gar: ko :agar: se badal deN to matlab vaazeH ho
> > jaayegaa. albatta iss soorat meiN :mazaahib: kee donoN misroN meiN
> > takraar zaroor khaTaktee hai! kyaa Khayaal hai aap kaa?
>
> jahaan tak "mazaahib" lafz ka donoN misroN mein istemaal kii baat hai,
> to aap bilkul sahi kah rahein hain, takraar bilkul khaTaktee hai!!
> isliye ye khayaal to kuchh jachaa nahin..
iss takraar ko aap chaaheN to door kar sakte haiN. lekin yeh aap kaa
faisila hogaa, jaisaa aap chaaheN.
aur jahaan tak misroN ke
> rabt kii baat hai, hamare khayaal se to vo bilkul bi mashkook nahin
> hai.. buraa na maaniega, magar baat kuchh aisi hai ki, mazhab to
> insaaN ke banaaye hue haiN... aur har mazhab ka ek hi maqsad hota hai,
> bas raastaa alag. Magar har mazhab apne raaste ko sabse acchhaa
> bataataa hai, aur yahi nahin, sirf usi raaste ko maan ne ke liye kisi
> na kisi tarah se "Pressurize" bhi karta hai. (Now, my purpose is not
> to start a debate on this issue here, just to explain why I think the
> relationship between the two lines is not ambiguous at all.) Every
> religion calls this "Khaaliq" with its own given names, "Allah",
> "Raam, Krishna", "YHWH", "Jesus"... etc. You agree that hundreds of
> name for GOD exist? yet, its the same God! but why doesnt every one
> believe that? If everyone does believe that, then why do religions or
> people using religion as a tool, push other common folks to fight
> against each other in order to show superiority over other religious
> beliefs? That was the whole point of the sh'er.
maiN aap kaa Khayaal samajh gayaa thaa. yeh nukta albatta mujh per
vaazeH naheeN thaa (aur she'r meiN iss kee jaanib ko'ee ishaara naheeN
hai) k aap ke nazdeek saare mazaahib :insaan: kee taKhleeq haiN aur
iss taraH insaan :Khaaliq: hai. mujh ko iss Khayaal per ko'ee e'tiraaz
naheeN hai lekin aap ko iss ko she'r meiN zaahir karnaa hogaa taa.k
log aap kee baat samajh sakeN. filHaal aap kaa she'r yeh naheeN kar
paa rahaa hai aur misroN kaa baahimee rabt meree raa'e meiN ab bhee
vaisaa hee mashkook hai jaisaa pehle thaa. she'r kaa matlab saaf honaa
zarooree hai taa.k uss per :matlab.e.sher dar batn.e.shaa'ir: kaa
ilzaam na lagaayaa jaa sake.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
> ab isii zamiin par ye do ash'aar aapko hamari baat ka meaning bilkul
> saaf bataa deinge:
>
> sar jhukaate hain jo sajde mein tire aie maaliq!
> josh mein aake vo sar apnaa kaTaate kyoN haiN??
>
> ik kahe "Raam" to dujaa kahe "Allah, Allah"
> ek maqsad hai to talvaar uThaate kyoN haiN???
>
> i hope you can see how i made the connection between the two lines.
> its too bad that my connection was not that obvious!
>
in ash'aar se aap kaa maqsad Hal naheeN huaa. dekhiye k pehle she'r
meiN aap ne :maalik: kahaa hai aur yeh yaqeenan :insaan: naheeN hai.
doosre meiN aap ne saaf :Raam: aur :Allah: kahaa hai aur in meiN se
bhee ko'ee aap kaa :insaan: naheeN hai. mas'ala yehee hai k aap ke
she'r ke Khaaliq kaa :mazaahib: se ta'alluq aap ke zehn meiN to vaazeH
hai (aur aap ke :explanation: ke ba'd mere zehn meiN bhee ho gayaa
hai) lekin kaaGhaz per saaf naheeN hai. zaraa se Ghaur se yeh aap per
zaahir ho jaanaa chaahiye.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > (2) :saaree taKhleeqaat: ziyaada saHeeH hotaa lekin :saaree taKhleeq:
> > ko she'r kee zarooraat ke pesh.e.nazar :kaa'inaat: ke ma'nee meiN
> > lenaa Ghair.munaasib naheeN hai, bal.k mustaHsin hai. agar aap pehle
> > misre per nazar.e.saanee kee zaroorat se mut'tafiq haiN to iss ko dekh
> > leN. shukriya!
> >
> i agree that the usage of "taKhleeq" there is pretty good if it means
> "kaa'inaat" which of course it does... but for the purpose of making
> the meaning a little clearer in both lines, there are a few
> alternatives, please tell me which one is better and then keep a final
> sh'er for the episode:
>
> option 1:
>
> "saare maKhlooq ka gar ek hi Khaaliq hai to phir"
>
> here also, same argument can apply that it should be "Saare
> maKhlooqaat (as plural of maKhlooq)" but at least one point is
> conveyed: "if the whole creation has the same God, then why do these
> men made religions make each other fight saying that their God is
> better/greater than the other!??"
>
:saaree maKhlooq: kehnaa munaasib ho saktaa hai agar iss se Raam/Allah
kee uss maKhlooq se muraad hai jiss meiN insaan, jaanvar sabhee
shaamil haiN. lekin zaahir hai k aap sirf insaan hee se Khitaab karnaa
chaahte haiN.
> option 2:
>
> "saarii dunyaa ka agar ek hi Khaaliq hai to phir"
>
> same point as before, "if the whole world has the same Creator"
> I think this one does sound much clearer, considering we are not
> playing around with plurals of taKhliiq and maKhluuq .
>
duniyaa sounds better but has the same flaw that you have not
established its connection with mazaahib. May be I am belaboring a
point but I do maintain that the connection between the two misras is
nebulous on paper. I hope that does not upset you too much! :-)
ab ham bharose ke saath to nahin kah sakte ki ye tabdiliyaN sh'er ke
> rabt ko behtar banaatii haiN, magar I hope the point can be clearer
> with one of them and that at least you understand where I was coming
> from when I wrote that :-)
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
aap ke javaab kaa intizaar rahe gaa.
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar:
Nazimuddin Khalish
> qist #3 haazir hai. is baar ‘Conductor’ ka kaam mujhko mil gayaa hai.
> aur aap sabko yeh batataate huwe Khushee ho rahee hai k ‘Judge’ hoNge
> Sarwar Raz saahib. in dinoN Sarwar saahib ka internet access kaafi
> mehdood hai, phir bhi unhone hamaaree darKhwaast manzoor kar liyaa. ye
> hamaaree Khush-qismatee hai, aur ham unko shukriya adaa karte haiN.
>
> Note keejiyega k sirf is qist ke liye ‘deadline’ baRhaa dee jaayegee.
>
> aap sabhee Khawaateen-o-hazraat se guzaarish hai ki aGjh3 meN bharpoor
> hissa leN. raahe suKhanwaree meN bahut lutf.e.safar miltaa hai!
>
> To reiterate, please take advantage of this opportunity to hone your
> poetic skills.
>
> So let’s start:
>
> A) tarah
>
> Here's the proposed matla of the Ghazal that we (or rather, you)
> will compose:
>
> "banke hamdard mire, roz sataate kyoN haiN?
> duniyaa vaale mujhe deevaanaa banaate kyoN haiN?"
Vasmi Saaheb: Aadaab:
Pehli martaba iss silsilay mein shareek ho raha hooN. Aik shair
paish.e.khidmat hai, daikhiyay ehbaab aur Muhtaram Sarwar Saaheb kiya
kehtay haiN?:
dars.o.tadrees.e.fanaa detee hai fitrat varnaa !
bacchay saahil peh gharooNdouN ko banaate kyoN haiN?
ittifaaq say qaafia vohi istimaal howa hai jo ke aap ke matla meiN
hai. Iss ki ijjazat hai ya nahi?
niyaazmand
Nazimuddin :Khalish:
Sarwar Alam Raz
> janaab Sarwar Sahaab aadab
>
>
> aap ki raaye ke liye maiN behad shukraguzaar hooN, use
> dhyaan maiN rakh kar yeh koshish kee hai :
>
> jinke zer-e-saaye rahte the mahfuz ham
> aag vohi aashiyaane maiN lagaate kyoN hai
>
> shukriyaa
>
> saif ahmed
Saif saaheb: aadaab
yaad karne kaa shukriya! Vasmi saaheb ne tafseel se nihaayat aasaan
alfaaz meiN aap ke she'r per tabsara kar ke meree mushkil aasaan kar
dee hai. uss ko zaroor dekhiye. aap ke donoN misre beHr se Khaarij
haiN. Vasmi saaheb kee tajaaveez aap ke liye mufeed hoN gee. un meiN
ko'ee izaafa karne kee zaroorat fil.Haal meHsoos naheeN hotee hai.
ummeed hai k aap apnee koshish jaaree rakheN ge.
Sarwar Raz :Sarwar: