Iqbal Teray Desh Ka Kiya Haal Sunaoon?
A Cassam
Aadaab Arz Hai!!
Eik nazm hum nay eik local Urdu ke risaalay mein parhee thee--Shair ka
naam likha huwa tha "AMIR ISLAM HASHMI" ! Kiya yeh koi mashoor Shaa'ir
Hasti hein??? ( kiya Urdu shaa'iree mein--baray baray poets ki shayeeree
ka mazak uraanay ki ijaazat hai i.e. Allama Iqbal waghaira?)
Aap ALUPers nay zaroor parhee hogee pehlay! agar koi "mehrbaan" apnee
fursat se hamaree pronunciations /spellings waghaira mein hamaree
corrections kar de tau hum unkay bohot mamnoon hongay!!!! kiyoon ke
print us risaalay mein clear nahin thee is liye zer /zabar/ pesh
illegible thay!!!
dehkaan tau mar khap gaya ab kis ko jagaoon?
milta hai kahan khoshaa-e-gandhum ke jalaaoon?
shaheen ka hai gumbhad-e-shahee pay baseraa
kanjshak-e-faro-maya ko ab kis se laraoon?? kanjshak-e-faro-maya????
har daaree mein tinka hai har aankh mein shehteer
momim ki nighaoon se badaltee naheen taqdeer
tauheed ki talwaar se khalee hein niyaamein
ab zauk-e-yakeen se nahin katthee koi zanzeer
shaheen ka jahan aaj mamoolay ka jahan hai
miltee huwee mullah se mujahid ki azaan hai
maana ke sitaron se bhi aagay hein jahan aur
shaheen mein magar taaqat-e-parwaaz kahan hai??
marmar ki silon se koi bezaar nahin hai,
rehnay ko haram mein koi tayyar nahin hai
kehnay ko har eik shaks musalmaan hai lekin
dekho tau kahin naam ko kirdaar nahin hai
baybaakee-o-haq goyee se ghabraata hai momin
makkaree-o-rubahee pay itraataa hai momin
jis rizk se parwaaz mein kotahee ka darr ho
woh rizk baray shaukh se ab khaata hai momin
paida kabhi hotee thee sehr jis kee azaan se
us banda-e-momin ko mein ab laaon kahan se???
woh sajda zamin jis se larraz jaatee thee yaaron
ek baar tha hum choot gayay is baar-e-girhaan se
jhagray mein yahan soobon ke zaaton ke nisub ke
ugtay hein teh sayaa-e-gul khaar ghazab ke
yeh des hai sub ka magar is ka nahin koi
is ke tan-e-khasta pay ab daanth hein sub ke
mehmoodon ki saf aaj ayaazon se parray hai
jhamhoor se sultaanee-e-jamhoor daray hai
thaamay huway daaman hai yahan par jo khudee ka
mar mar ke jiye hai kabhi jee jee ke maray hai
dekho tau zara mehlon ke pardon ko utha kar
shamsheer-o-sana rakhee hai taaqon mein sajaa kar
aatay hein nazar musnad-e-shahee pay rangeelay
taqdeeer-e-umam so gayee taaos pay aa kar
makaaree-o-ayyaree-o--ghadaaree-o heejaan
ab banta hai in chaar anaasir se musalmaan
qaari isay kehna baree baat hai yaaron
is nay tau kabhi khol ke dekha nahin quraan
kirdaar ka guftaar ka aamal ka momin
qaa'yal nahin aisay kissi jhanjhaal ka momin
sarhad ka hai momin koi punjaab ka momin
dhoondhay se bhi miltaa nahin quraan ka momin
//////////////////////
Abida Sultana
Omyprophet
Please write in Urdu and scan your poem. It is hard to read it in english.
If you are interested I can have it published from Pakistani.con
Wa As Salam
R Syed
A Cassam
(Just curious why you named yourself what you did?? Feels really uneasy
addressing someone as O MY PROPHETJI and that someone too from a
Pakistani.con site??????)
Your's is a really good idea --never thought of it 'cause I have not
seen anything on this Urdu forum written in actual Urdu. (but I am new
to this forum myself!) Everyone here I have seen so far is writing Urdu
in English Script .
Yes I can write in Urdu and yes I can scan it too!!
But since you have offerred ---sure you go ahead and post it from
Pakistani.con or wherever!! You needn't ask my permission --as am not
the original poet/writer of this Nazm!!!!! The poet is Ameer Islam
Hashmi?????? But wait and see if any other ALUPERs have any
objections??? Don't think they would! But who knows!!!!!!!!!!
Abida Sultana
A Cassam
A Cassam
Did not notice your name at the end of your message! After hitting the
'send" button --happenned to notice!
I am sorry I addressed you very inappropriately ! And I am guilty of the
same offence twice just in the few days I have been here!!
Would hate to upset ALUPERs ---- therefore I apologize for it to you and
everyone else!!! And if I didn't do so right away who knows --I might be
banished/expelled forever from this forum!
Might not stand a second chance here !!!
Abida
Raj Kumar Pathria
>
> Eik nazm hum nay eik local Urdu ke risaalay mein parhee thee--Shair ka
> naam likha huwa tha "AMIR ISLAM HASHMI" ! Kiya yeh koi mashoor Shaa'ir
> Hasti hein??? ( kiya Urdu shaa'iree mein--baray baray poets ki shayeeree
> ka mazak uraanay ki ijaazat hai i.e. Allama Iqbal waghaira?)
Abida Sahiba:
is nazm mein Allama Iqbal ka mazaaq naheen urhaaya gaya; balke, un ke
kalaam ki tazmeen (y'aani-ke, parody) ki gayee hai. yeh aek normal cheez
hai, jo har zabaan ki shaa'iri mein hoti aayee hai. aek tarah se, yeh
Iqbal ki izzat-afzaai hai!
is nazm mein, Iqbal ki khasoosi tarkeeben iste'maal kar ke shaa'ir ne un
ki "vision of tomorrow" ka "aaj-kal ki asli soorat-e-haalaat" se
muqaabila kiya hai aur, aisa karte huye, hamaare saamne aek
achhchhi-khaasi tanziya nazm pesh ki hai!
> Aap ALUPers nay zaroor parhee hogee pehlay! agar koi "mehrbaan" apnee
> fursat se hamaree pronunciations /spellings waghaira mein hamaree
> corrections kar de tau hum unkay bohot mamnoon hongay!!!! kiyoon ke
> print us risaalay mein clear nahin thee is liye zer /zabar/ pesh
> illegible thay!!!
aap ne apni post mein 'corrections' waghaira ki darkhwaast ki hai, to
main aap ko mamnoon kiye deta hoon..........magar, yeh barhaa naazuk
kaam hai. ain mumkin hai ke main to jaaN-fishaani kar ke aap ki tas'heeh
karoon aur aap ulta buraa maan jaayen! is liye, main aaj sirf aek hi
band ko haath lagaaoon ga. agar aap ko mere mashvare theek lagen to
ittelaa' deejiye ga, taake pataa chal sake ke main is kaam ko jaari
rakhkhoon ya ke manjhdhaar hi mein chhorh doon?
--------------
sab se pehle to is nazm ke unvaan mein 'teray' ko 'tirey' hona chaahiye
(taake misra' bar-wazn rahe) aur 'kiya' ko 'kya' hona chaahiye (so that
'what' is not confused with 'did'). Note the following matla' by Hazrat
Daagh Dehlavi:
aankhoN ko ashk-baar kiya, ham ne kya kiya?
raaz un pe aashkaar kiya, ham ne kya kiya?
Imagine the confusion that would be caused in this beautiful she'r if
one did not distinguish between kya and kiya!!!
> dehkaan tau mar khap gaya ab kis ko jagaoon?
> milta hai kahan khoshaa-e-gandhum ke jalaaoon?
> shaheen ka hai gumbhad-e-shahee pay baseraa
> kanjshak-e-faro-maya ko ab kis se laraoon?? kanjshak-e-faro-maya????
dehkaan should be dehqaan: please note q instead of k. It is the same q
that appears in Iqbal; it shouldn't be the k that appears in kahaani.
Those familiar with the Urdu-Persian alphabet should know the difference
between qaaf and kaaf.
jagaoon should be jagaaoon: please note the differnece between the short
a and the long aa.
kahan should be kahaan, preferably kahaaN.
gandhum should be gandum.
The first she'r here is a parody of Iqbal's
jis khet se dehqaaN ko muyassar na ho roti (or rozi?)
us khet ke har khoshaa-e-gandum ko jalaa do
In the next she'r, shaheen should be shaaheen, gumbhad should be gunbad,
shahee should be shaahi, pay should be pe.
kanjshak should be kunjishk or kunjashk (both are correct), maya should
be maaya, laraoon should be larhaaoon or laRaaoon. The term
kunjishk-e-fro-maaya means 'a sparrow with limited resources, aek muflis
chirhiya', as opposed to shaaheeN, the all-mighty falcon!
Now, this particular she'r is a parody of Iqbal's
garmaao ghareeboN ka lahoo soz-e-yaqeeN se
kunjishk-e-fro-maaya ko shaaheeN se larhaa do
I do hope that these comments are of some help not only to you but to
some other ALUPers as well -------- but I'll continue with this project
only if you find this exercise worth my effort.
khair-andesh, Raj Kumar
---------------
A Cassam
Aadaab!!
Aap ne Urdu ko Roman script mein likhnay ke pehlay sabaq ke saath saath
hamaree nazm ki corrections ke naazuk kaam ka ber'aa bhi apnay sar
utha'aya hai iss ke liye hum aap ka tah-he-dil se shukriya ada kartay
hein . Aap zaroor kaam jaari rakhein--jaisay jaisay aap ko waqt mila
karay!
Hum ne note kiya aap ke comments se ke yeh tanziya nazm kis tarah Allama
Iqbal ki Izzat Afzaai kartee hai!
Ab humein is first lesson se KIYA aur KYA ka difference bilkul samajh aa
gaya. Aur sh'er ka hawaala de kar aap ne bohot umdaa tareeqay se farq
samjhaya hai.Kya Urdu bolnay ka tallafuz sahee hona zarooree hai Urdu ko
Roman script mein sahee sahee likhne ke liye ?
It has really been a very rewarding experience for myself to get all
this information and knowledge from you. Am extremely grateful to you
for all your time and effort spent in this teaching exercise. Am sure
some other ULUPers will benefit as well and will likewise express their
appreciation and gratitude to you.
Yours Respectfully,
Abida Sultana
HARI AND MANJU KHANNA
> Janaab Raj Kumar Saheb,
> It has really been a very rewarding experience for myself to get all
> this information and knowledge from you. Am extremely grateful to you
> for all your time and effort spent in this teaching exercise. Am sure
> appreciation and gratitude to you.
Janaab Professor Saheb,
Aadaab arz hai,
I agree with Abida Sahiba, and thank you for all the knowledge and time
you share with us
so generously.
Regards,
Hari
in article <3754C5F8...@home.com>...
>
> Aadaab!!
>
> Aap ne Urdu ko Roman script mein likhnay ke pehlay sabaq ke saath saath
> hamaree nazm ki corrections ke naazuk kaam ka ber'aa bhi apnay sar
> utha'aya hai iss ke liye hum aap ka tah-he-dil se shukriya ada kartay
> hein . Aap zaroor kaam jaari rakhein--jaisay jaisay aap ko waqt mila
> karay!
>
> Hum ne note kiya aap ke comments se ke yeh tanziya nazm kis tarah Allama
> Iqbal ki Izzat Afzaai kartee hai!
>
> Ab humein is first lesson se KIYA aur KYA ka difference bilkul samajh aa
> gaya. Aur sh'er ka hawaala de kar aap ne bohot umdaa tareeqay se farq
> samjhaya hai.Kya Urdu bolnay ka tallafuz sahee hona zarooree hai Urdu ko
> Roman script mein sahee sahee likhne ke liye ?
>
rpat...@sciborg.uwaterloo.ca
A Cassam wrote:
>
> Aap ne Urdu ko Roman script mein likhnay ke pehlay sabaq ke saath saath
> hamaree nazm ki corrections ke naazuk kaam ka ber'aa bhi apnay sar
> utha'aya hai iss ke liye hum aap ka tah-he-dil se shukriya ada kartay
> hein . Aap zaroor kaam jaari rakhein--jaisay jaisay aap ko waqt mila
> karay!
main poori koshish karoon ga ke is nazm ke baaqi hisson par bhi apne comments
doon; bas zaraa khule waqt ki talaash hai!
> ...................Kya Urdu bolnay ka tallafuz sahee hona zarooree hai Urdu ko
>
> Roman script mein sahee sahee likhne ke liye ?
It seems so, otherwise you wouldn't know whether you are writing it rightly or
wrongly. And that makes a big difference to the reader. For instance, right in
this very sentence, you are using the word 'saheeh' but are writing it as
'sahee'. Not here, but elsewhere it can cause a confusion between the Hindi word
'sahi'
----------- as in "ham khataa-vaar sahi, apne vateere bhi to dekh" -----------
and the Persian word 'saheeh', meaning 'durust'. Not only that, these two words
differ in their 'wazn' too; whereas 'sahi' has the same wazn as 'naqi', 'saheeh'
has the same wazn as 'naqeeb'.
Aside from the question of pronounciation, the real requirement in this activity
is to have a genuine respect for the language and a realization that
(i) the language is one thing that distinguishes us from other species, and
(ii) even in our own species, we are highly fortunate for having come from a
race that developed so many languages with so remarkable a degree of finesse!
It is, therefore, incumbant upon us to use our language with
care...............and with dignity!
I do hope that I'll be able to send in my next 'column of comments' on that nazm
some time today.
khair-andesh, Raj Kumar
Raj Kumar Pathria
----------------
> > har daaree mein tinka hai har aankh mein shehteer
> > momim ki nighaoon se badaltee naheen taqdeer
pehle misre' mein aek lafz ki kami lagti hai; ghaaliban, 'hai' aur 'har'
ke darmiyaan 'to' hona chaahiye. Please check!
daaree should be daarhee or daaRi, meaning beard.
nighaoon should be nigaahoN.
> > tauheed ki talwaar se khalee hein niyaamein
> > ab zauk-e-yakeen se nahin katthee koi zanzeer
khalee should be khaali or khaalee.
zauk-e-yakeen should be zauq-e-yaqeeN.
katthee should be kat'ti or something like that (but with no 'h' in it).
zanzeer should be zanjeer; is baat par mujhe aek baat yaad aa gayee.
[hamaari aek bhaabhi hain jo hamesha zindagi ko jindagi kahaa karti
theen. aek din main ne unhen nihaayat prem-poorvak tareeqe se samjhaaya
ke unhen zindagi ko jindagi naheen kehna chaahiye. isi tarah, zor ko jor
naheen kehna chaahiye aur zulm ko julm naheen kehna chaahiye, vaghaira,
vaghaira, ..... unhon ne meri baat to savikaar kar li, magar nateeja us
ka yeh hua ke ab woh ajeeb ko azeeb kehti hain, jurm ko zurm kehti hain
aur jaa'iz ko zaa'iz kehti hain!] :-))
aap note keejiye ga ke, is she'r mein, shaa'ir ne Allama Iqbal ki aek
favourite term 'soz-e-yaqeeN' ko jaan-boojh kar 'zauq-e-yaqeeN' se badal
diya hai, which I think is pretty smart! un ke aisa karne ka matlab yeh
hai ke aaj kal ki duniya mein sachcha soz-e-yaqeeN (ya'ani ke, a true
burning ardour for faith) to shaaz-o-naadar hi kaheen milta hai.
albatta, zauq-e-yaqeeN (ya'ani ke, faith ka shauq) to jaa-ba-jaa naza
aata hai ...... magar sirf shauq se kya hota hai?
> > shaheen ka jahan aaj mamoolay ka jahan hai
> > miltee huwee mullah se mujahid ki azaan hai
shaheen should be shaaheeN. jahan should be jahaaN.
mamoolay should be mamole or mamolay.
[mamola is a slender bird that continually wags its tail up and down
------- a sign of nervousness or insecurity.......clearly, a 'no match'
for the self-reliant falcon!] Please note the subtlety of the satire
involved!
huwee should be huyee. mujahid should be mujaahid.
azaan should be azaaN.
aap note keejiye ga ke mullah aur mujaahid dono ko shaana-ba-shaana
kharhe kar ke, shaa'ir ne mazhab aur siyaasat ke khatar-naak mel-jol par
kya ta'assuf ka izhaar kiya hai!
> > maana ke sitaron se bhi aagay hein jahan aur
> > shaheen mein magar taaqat-e-parwaaz kahan hai??
sitaron should be sitaaroN.
hein should be hain (please remember the difference between main and
mein).
again, shaheen should be shaaheeN. kahan should be kahaaN.
vah, vah! kya tevar hain is she'r ke?
pehle misre' mein ishaara hai Iqbal ke is mash'hoor she'r ki taraf
sitaaroN se aage jahaaN aur bhi haiN
abhi ishq ke imtihaaN aur bhi haiN
magar doosre misre' mein to shaa'ir ne ghazab dhaa diya hai, jise
samajhne ke liye aap yeh note karen ke yahaan par parody ho rahi hai
Iqbal ke aek aur she'r ki jo ke isi ghazal mein hai aur, meri raaye
mein, matle' se bhi kaheen ziyaada zor-daar hai. woh she'r hai:
tu shaaheeN hai, parvaaz hai kaam tera
tire saamne aasmaaN aur bhi haiN!!!!!!
yeh tha Iqbal ka vision! magar aaj-kal ki soorat-e-haal kuchh aisi hai
ke, chaahe laakh aasmaan saamne nazar aa rahe hon, magar insaan mein woh
taaqat-e-parvaaz hi naheen rahi jis ki Allama ko ummeed thi. aisi haalat
mein, shaaheen kya kar sakta hai ------ sivaaye is kay ke aasmaan ki
taraf lalchaai hui nazron se dekhta rahe aur apne kamzor aur naa-aihl
baal-o-par ko kosta rahe!
I think that should be enough for now.
khair-andesh, Raj Kumar
A Cassam
Aadaab!!
Thanks for this next SABAQ in "ALUP CYBER SCHOOL"!
Since you are devoting so much of your valued time in every one of these
postings,, do feel obliged to thank you each time you post another one
on ALUP! Thanks once again for your help and guidance on this NAZM!!
It seems that literary writings --as wonderful as yours-(as opposed to
business writings), are designed to be read several times over (which is
exactly what am doing), due to their complex expressions, complex
sentence compositions, colorful tones, imagery and symbolism. Also since
my knowledge in the art (science???) of writing Urdu in Roman script is
very limited - will admit do have to read each one of your very
educational/informative postings several times over -before your highly
effective messages are communicated to this brain !
While it is a pleasure to read every one of your postings on
corrections/ explanations of the NAZM I do very humbly request you to
please take your time in posting further corrections/explanations
--since it must be pretty difficult for you to find so much time every
single day!
Yours Thankfully,
Abida Sultana
Raj Kumar Pathria wrote:
>
> I shall now continue with the nazm posted by Abida Sahiba.
>
> ----------------
>
> > > har daaree mein tinka hai har aankh mein shehteer
> > > momim ki nighaoon se badaltee naheen taqdeer
>
> pehle misre' mein aek lafz ki kami lagti hai; ghaaliban, 'hai' aur 'har'
> ke darmiyaan 'to' hona chaahiye. Please check!
> daaree should be daarhee or daaRi, meaning beard.
> nighaoon should be nigaahoN.
>
> > > tauheed ki talwaar se khalee hein niyaamein
> > > ab zauk-e-yakeen se nahin katthee koi zanzeer
>
> khalee should be khaali or khaalee.
> zauk-e-yakeen should be zauq-e-yaqeeN.
> katthee should be kat'ti or something like that (but with no 'h' in it).
> zanzeer should be zanjeer; is baat par mujhe aek baat yaad aa gayee.
>
> [hamaari aek bhaabhi hain jo hamesha zindagi ko jindagi kahaa karti
> theen. aek din main ne unhen nihaayat prem-poorvak tareeqe se samjhaaya
> ke unhen zindagi ko jindagi naheen kehna chaahiye. isi tarah, zor ko jor
> naheen kehna chaahiye aur zulm ko julm naheen kehna chaahiye, vaghaira,
> vaghaira, ..... unhon ne meri baat to savikaar kar li, magar nateeja us
> ka yeh hua ke ab woh ajeeb ko azeeb kehti hain, jurm ko zurm kehti hain
> aur jaa'iz ko zaa'iz kehti hain!] :-))
>
> aap note keejiye ga ke, is she'r mein, shaa'ir ne Allama Iqbal ki aek
> favourite term 'soz-e-yaqeeN' ko jaan-boojh kar 'zauq-e-yaqeeN' se badal
> diya hai, which I think is pretty smart! un ke aisa karne ka matlab yeh
> hai ke aaj kal ki duniya mein sachcha soz-e-yaqeeN (ya'ani ke, a true
> burning ardour for faith) to shaaz-o-naadar hi kaheen milta hai.
> albatta, zauq-e-yaqeeN (ya'ani ke, faith ka shauq) to jaa-ba-jaa naza
> aata hai ...... magar sirf shauq se kya hota hai?
>
> > > shaheen ka jahan aaj mamoolay ka jahan hai
> > > miltee huwee mullah se mujahid ki azaan hai
>
> shaheen should be shaaheeN. jahan should be jahaaN.
> mamoolay should be mamole or mamolay.
> [mamola is a slender bird that continually wags its tail up and down
> ------- a sign of nervousness or insecurity.......clearly, a 'no match'
> for the self-reliant falcon!] Please note the subtlety of the satire
> involved!
>
> huwee should be huyee. mujahid should be mujaahid.
> azaan should be azaaN.
> aap note keejiye ga ke mullah aur mujaahid dono ko shaana-ba-shaana
> kharhe kar ke, shaa'ir ne mazhab aur siyaasat ke khatar-naak mel-jol par
> kya ta'assuf ka izhaar kiya hai!
>
> > > maana ke sitaron se bhi aagay hein jahan aur
> > > shaheen mein magar taaqat-e-parwaaz kahan hai??
>
A Cassam
Aadaab Raj Kumar Saheb,
Kya KHULA waqt= FREE time????
>====================================================================
> Aside from the question of pronounciation, the real requirement in this activity is to have a genuine respect for the language
> It is, therefore, incumbant upon us to use our language with
> care...............and with dignity!
Then would people who respect and love this language, who are able to
write Urdu in Urdu script fairly accurately, who speak correctly and
whose pronounciations are fine too--really still be guilty of using this
great language with "no care and with indignity"--just because they
fail to write Urdu in Roman script " A CERTAIN PROPER WAY"?
If that is so --sorry as without even realising --I am indeed one of the
biggest "culprits" here. That is because until coming to this ALUP
forum I "unknowingly" thought URDU could be written in Roman script any
odd way one chooses to . Not only that but I also "very conveniently"
believed it was up to the reader to correctly guess/interpret what is
being written??
Had it not been for this "INTERNET" -- would we have needed to write or
even be be aware of this art of writing Urdu in Roman script??
Where else would we have applied this???
Yours Thankfully,
Abida Cassam
Raj Kumar Pathria
>
> rpat...@sciborg.uwaterloo.ca wrote:
> >
> > bas zaraa khule waqt ki talaash hai!
>
> Aadaab Raj Kumar Saheb,
>
> Kya KHULA waqt = FREE time????
ji haaN, it means free time, spare time, etc.
> > Aside from the question of pronounciation, the real requirement in this activity > > is to have a genuine respect for the language .............
> > It is, therefore, incumbent upon us to use our language with
> > care...............and with dignity!
>
> Then would people who respect and love this language, who are able to
> write Urdu in Urdu script fairly accurately, who speak correctly and
> whose pronounciations are fine too--really still be guilty of using this
> great language with "no care and with indignity"--just because they
> fail to write Urdu in Roman script " A CERTAIN PROPER WAY"?
My remark was far more general; it didn't refer, in particular, to
'writing Urdu in the Roman script'. It applied to the use of ANY
language (Urdu, Hindi, Bengali,....) in ANY form ------ spoken or
written (in ANY script). It applied even to English, written in the
Roman script. For instance, I can't stand a student saying in my
presence, "I don't know nothing". Even in an exam., I correct their
English as well as their Physics and Maths.
So, please don't take it solely on yourself!
> .......................... That is because until coming to this ALUP
> forum I "unknowingly" thought URDU could be written in Roman script any
> odd way one chooses to.
If our purpose is to really 'communicate' with one another, then the
adoption of 'any odd way' wouldn't serve the purpose.
> .................... Not only that but I also "very conveniently"
> believed it was up to the reader to correctly guess/interpret what is
> being written??
This is what is generally referred to as 'shifting the responsibility'!
I firmly believe that it is the responsibility of the writer to be as
clear as possible in his/her writings and, as a torch-bearer, show the
readers the path to follow, rather than expecting them to find their own
way through the darkness!
I am afraid that, in the heat of the moment, you may be neglecting your
sabaq # 2.
khair-andesh, Raj Kumar
A Cassam
> My remark was far more general; it didn't refer, in particular, to
> 'writing Urdu in the Roman script'. It applied to the use of ANY
> language (Urdu, Hindi, Bengali,....) in ANY form ------ spoken or
> written (in ANY script). It applied even to English, written in the
> Roman script. For instance, I can't stand a student saying in my
> presence, "I don't know nothing". Even in an exam., I correct their
> English as well as their Physics and Maths.
> So, please don't take it solely on yourself!
Raj Kumaar Ji I clearly understood those to be purely general remarks!
Aap jaise learned Urdu daanon ka tau hum sab bohot ehtaraam karte hein!
======================================================================
> This is what is generally referred to as 'shifting the responsibility'! I firmly believe that it is the responsibility of the writer to be as clear as possible in his/her writings and, as a torch-bearer, show the readers the path to follow, rather than expecting them to find their own way through the darkness!
>
Raj Saheb sorry I only said that as I was amazed at myself for believing
in what I did !! Please take this as coming from my total ignorance on
this tricky subject of writing Urdu in Roman script!
Thanks to you for being the torch bearer helping us find our way in the
darkness!!
=======================================================================
> I am afraid that, in the heat of the moment, you may be neglecting your sabaq # 2.
>
Raj Kumar Ji am totally devoted to my SABAQs! After you have spent all
this time and effort, at my very own humble request --how could I ever
think of neglecting Sabaq #2 or any Sabaq # for that matter!
But since literary writings have to read over and over again before the
message finally sinks in -- sorry this might have given you the wrong
impression Sabaq #2 is being neglected!
All the elaborate explanations of the Philosophy behind Allama Iqbal's
Nazm and then the parody--is ever so enlightning! It is my privilige to
be guided by one as learned as yourself!
Thanks once again for your help !
Yours Respectfully!
Abida Sultana
A Cassam
Aadaab!
Hum ne check kiya--nazm (print in Urdu) mein "to" nahin hai! But that's
not to say this could not still be a printing error! Does sound like the
"to" should really be there!
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
> [hamaari aek bhaabhi hain jo hamesha zindagi ko jindagi kahaa karti
> theen. aek din main ne unhen nihaayat prem-poorvak tareeqe se samjhaaya ke unhen zindagi ko jindagi naheen kehna chaahiye. isi tarah, zor ko jor naheen kehna chaahiye aur zulm ko julm naheen kehna chaahiye, vaghaira,vaghaira, ..... unhon ne meri baat to savikaar kar li, magar nateeja us ka yeh hua ke ab woh ajeeb ko azeeb kehti hain, jurm ko zurm kehti hain aur jaa'iz ko zaa'iz kehti hain!] :-))
>
Raaj Saheb kya aap ki Bhabi Jaan ki mother tongue gujrati hai? Hamaree
Gujrati speaking waaldaa tau hamesha Z ko J aur SH ko S hee pronounce
karti hein! (e.g. "zamaana is jamaana", "zulm is julm " and "shirt is
sirt"--my Mother cannot pronounce Z or SH ever). Sorry that zanZeer got
into my writing as well!!
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++==
> zauq-e-yaqeeN (ya'ani ke, faith ka shauq) to jaa-ba-jaa naza aata hai ...... magar sirf shauq se kya hota hai?
>
Shukriya Allama Iqbal ke she'r ke saath saath parody bhi samajha di aap
ne!
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
> > >
> vah, vah! kya tevar hain is she'r ke?
>
>
> yeh tha Iqbal ka vision! magar aaj-kal ki soorat-e-haal kuchh aisi hai
> ke, chaahe laakh aasmaan saamne nazar aa rahe hon, magar insaan mein woh taaqat-e-parvaaz hi naheen rahi jis ki Allama ko ummeed thi. aisi haalat mein, shaaheen kya kar sakta hai ------ sivaaye is kay ke aasmaan ki taraf lalchaai hui nazron se dekhta rahe aur apne kamzor aur naa-aihl
> baal-o-par ko kosta rahe!
>
> I think that should be enough for now.
>
Thanks ! That is more than enough for now!
Thanks for devoting so much of your valuable time on these elaborate
explanations!
Yours Thankfully,
Abida Sultana
Raj Kumar Pathria
Sahiba.
> ---------------
> > marmar ki silon se koi bezaar nahin hai,
> > rehnay ko haram mein koi tayyar nahin hai
silon should preferably be siloN. nahin should preferably be naheeN.
tayyar shoulb be taiyaar (though most people, even the ones who know
Urdu fairly well, pronounce it wrongly as tayyaar).
> > kehnay ko har eik shaks musalmaan hai lekin
> > dekho tau kahin naam ko kirdaar nahin hai
eik, seemingly correct, should actually be ik (so that the misra'
conforms to the meter of this nazm).
shaks should be shakhs.
kahin should be kaheeN.
Now, in the second she'r of this stanza, the poet is alluding to a
famous couplet of Iqbal, namely
Iqbal baRaa updeshak hai, man baatoN meiN moh leta hai
[aap note keejiye ke, is misre' meiN, Allama ne kis khoob-soorati se
Hindi shabdoN ka pra'yog kiya hai]. khair, poora she'r hai:
Iqbal baRaa updeshak hai, man baatoN meiN moh leta hai
guftaar ka ghaazi yeh to banaa, KIRDAAR ka ghaazi ban na sakaa
is she'r meiN Allama ne khud apne aap par satire kiya hai aur, aisa
karte huye, qaum ke sabhi afraad par chot ki hai. parody karne waale
shaa'ir ne Allama ki is baat se khoob faa'ida uthaaya hai!
> > baybaakee-o-haq goyee se ghabraata hai momin
> > makkaree-o-rubahee pay itraataa hai momin
haq-goi (or haq-goyee) should be one word.
makkaree should be makkaari. rubahee should be robaahi or roobaahi.
pay should be pe (half a syllable only --- to stay in the right meter).
> > jis rizk se parwaaz mein kotahee ka darr ho
> > woh rizk baray shaukh se ab khaata hai momin
A pretty good couplet!
Here, rizk should be rizq. kotahee should be kotaahi.
darr should be dar (no 'tashdeed' here).
baray should be barhe or baRe. shaukh should be shauq.
In this couplet, the poet is drawing upon Iqbal's remarkable she'r
ai taa'ir-e-laahooti! us rizq se maut achhchhi
jis rizq se aati ho parvaaz mein kotaahi!!!!!!
taa'ir-e-laahooti means a divine bird; symbolically, it means "someone
who is capable of undertaking distant flights on the basis of one's
faith in divinity".
I urge you to assimilate this she'r of Iqbal's as fully as you can
-------
and then go back and savour the second she'r of the stanza under
discussion.
achhchha, ab ijaazat deejiye.
khair-andesh, Raj Kumar
A Cassam
Ham eik baar phir tah-e-dil se aap ka shukriya ada karte hein!
You have explained very well the philosophy and thinking of Allama Iqbal
which is normally quite difficult to understand--and I speak here just
for myself !
Once again really really appreciate your very kind gesture!
Yours Respectfully,
Abida Sultana
Raj Kumar Pathria wrote:
>
> I shall now take up the next two stanzas of the poem posted by Abida
> Sahiba.
>
> > ---------------
>
> > > marmar ki silon se koi bezaar nahin hai,
> > > rehnay ko haram mein koi tayyar nahin hai
>
> silon should preferably be siloN. nahin should preferably be naheeN.
> tayyar shoulb be taiyaar (though most people, even the ones who know
> Urdu fairly well, pronounce it wrongly as tayyaar).
>
> > > kehnay ko har eik shaks musalmaan hai lekin
> > > dekho tau kahin naam ko kirdaar nahin hai
>
> eik, seemingly correct, should actually be ik (so that the misra'
> conforms to the meter of this nazm).
> shaks should be shakhs.
> kahin should be kaheeN.
>
> Now, in the second she'r of this stanza, the poet is alluding to a
> famous couplet of Iqbal, namely
>
> Iqbal baRaa updeshak hai, man baatoN meiN moh leta hai
>
> [aap note keejiye ke, is misre' meiN, Allama ne kis khoob-soorati se
> Hindi shabdoN ka pra'yog kiya hai]. khair, poora she'r hai:
>
> Iqbal baRaa updeshak hai, man baatoN meiN moh leta hai
> guftaar ka ghaazi yeh to banaa, KIRDAAR ka ghaazi ban na sakaa
>
> is she'r meiN Allama ne khud apne aap par satire kiya hai aur, aisa
> karte huye, qaum ke sabhi afraad par chot ki hai. parody karne waale
> shaa'ir ne Allama ki is baat se khoob faa'ida uthaaya hai!
>
> > > baybaakee-o-haq goyee se ghabraata hai momin
> > > makkaree-o-rubahee pay itraataa hai momin
>
> haq-goi (or haq-goyee) should be one word.
> makkaree should be makkaari. rubahee should be robaahi or roobaahi.
> pay should be pe (half a syllable only --- to stay in the right meter).
>
> > > jis rizk se parwaaz mein kotahee ka darr ho
> > > woh rizk baray shaukh se ab khaata hai momin
>