kuch ashaar ke maani!
Jay Shergill
Majaz saahib kii ek ghazal ke so ashaar pesh hain. Iss
ghazal ko Jagjit Singh ji ne "kahkashan" mein apni awaaz mein adaa kiya
hai. aap sab se guzarish hai ke in ashaar ke maani par kuch raushani
Daalein:
hijaab-e-fitna parwar ab uTha leti to acchaa tha
tu khud apne husn ko parda banaa leti to accha tha
teri neechi nazar khud teri ismat kii muhaafiz hai
tu iss nashtar kii tezi aazmaa leti to accha tha
in dono.n ashaar mei.n sab se baRi mushkil mujhe in ke pehle aur doosre
misro.n ke beech jo naata hai, use samjhne mei.n aa rahi hai.
meherbaani kar iss naate par apne khayal farmaayein.
"kahkashan" hii se Majaz saahib kii ek aur ghazal ka ek she'r aur hai,
jis ke maani agar samjhayein to bahut meherbaani hogi:
taskeen-e-dil-e-mehzoo.n na hui, woh sai-e-karam farmaa bhi gaye
is sai-e-karam ko kyaa kahiye, behla bhi gaye, taRpa bhi gaye
"sai-e-karam" ke matlab se mai.n waakif nahi.n. meherbaani kar isse
bhi samjhayein. aur agar aap ke zehn mei.n koi aur she'r ho jis mei.n
kii iss phrase ka istemaal kiya gayaa ho, to use bhi post karni kii aap
se guzarish hai.
shukriya,
with regards,
Jay Shergill
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Share what you know. Learn what you don't.
Umang Bali
aap ke aakhri sawaal se shuroo karte hain:
jis sher ka zikr aap ne kiya hai vo Majaz sahib ki bahut mashhoor ghazal
mein se hai. Pehle aap ke kiye hue sawaal ka jawaab aur phir vo ghazal jis
ka yeh sher hissa hai, pesh-e-khidmat hai.
saiee: effort/atttempt/endeavour
saiee-e-karam: an effort/attempt of graciousness
Now the ghazal:
taskeen-e-dil-e-mehzooN na hui vo saiyee-e-karam farmaa bhi gaye
is saiee-e-karam ko kiya kahiye behla bhi gaye taRpa bhi gaye
ham arz-e-wafa bhi kar na sakae kuchh kah na sakae kuchh sun na sakae
yaaN ham ne zabaaN hi kholi thi vaaN aaNkh jhuki sharma bhi gaye
aashuftagi-e-vahshat ki qasam, hairat ki qasam, hasrat ki qasam !
ab aap kahaiN kuchh ya na kahaiN ham raaz-e-tabas'sum paa hi gaye
roodaad-e-gham-e-ulfat un se ham kiya kahtae kiyoN kar kahtae
ik harf na nikla hoNToN se aur aaNkh mein aaNsu aa bhi gaye
arbaab-e-junooN par furqat mein ab kiya kahiye kiya kiya guzari
aaye thae savaad-e-ulfat mein kuchh kho bhi gaye kuchh paa bhi gaye
yeh rang-e-bahaar-e-aalam hae kiyoN fikr hai tujh ko aaye saaqi !
mehfil to teri suni na hui kuchh uTH bhi gaye kuchh aa bhi gaye
us mehfil-e-kaif-o-masti mein us anjuman-e-irfaani mein
sab jaam ba-kaf baiThae hi rahae ham pii bhi gaye chalka bhi gaye
hairat to is baat par hai ki aap ki posting ko itnae din ho gaye, aur
Kashif sahib ne paDa bhi nahin...kiyoN ki, mere hisaab se Majaaz sahib un
ke sab se favaourite shayr hain...Actually, Kashif sahib agar aap is post
ko paD rahe hoN to yeh bataiye janaab kahaN ghum hain aaj kal?!
is ghazal ke pehlae sher se jo jazbaat ubharte hain, meri zahaanat mein vo
kuchh is tarah hai:
Majaz sahib farmate hain: abhi dil-e-ghamgeen ko chain bhi na aaya tha ki
vo khayaal mein aane ka karam farmaa gaye, magar is mehrbaani ko koi kiya
naam dejiye ki zara sa dil ka gham bhi chaNT gaya, aur aik taDap bhi jaag
uThi
Umang
I've heard the last sher of this ghazal being quoted quite a lot...and it
is really a gem...
rpat...@sciborg.uwaterloo.ca
Jay Sahib:
chand din qabl, aap ne kuchh ash'aar ke ma'ani talab kiye the, magar kisi
ALUPer ne un ash'aar ki taraf dhyaan naheeN diya tha. is liye, maiN aaj sub'h
yeh soch kar uththa tha ke aaj is kaam ki taraf tavajjoh dooN ga. computer on
kiya to jhat se Umang Sahib ki "sa'ee-e-karam" nazar aayee. socha ke chalo
hamaari jaan chhuti...........magar jooNhi un ki post ko ghaur se paRhaa to
pataa chalaa ke ziyaada-tar jagah to Majaaz ki ghazal ne le rakhkhi hai aur
jis she'r ki tashreeh aap ne talab ki hai us par Umang Sahib ka tabsra
nihaayat mukhtasar hai. maiN ne choonke is she'r ke baare meiN bahut kuchh
soch rakhkha tha, is liye apni tashreeh pesh karne se baaz na reh sakaa.
So here are a few comments ------------ Umang Sahib se ma'azrat ke saath!
taskeen-e-dil-e-mehzooN na hui, voh sa'ee-e-karam farmaa bhi gaye
is sa'ee-e-karam ko kya kahiye? behlaa bhi gaye, taRpaa bhi gaye
sa'ee-e-karam = voh mehnat jo karam karne meiN paRti hai. jaise koi shakhs
hamaare liye (ya hamaari khaatir) koi khaas kaam kare to ham kaheN ge ke
"Sahib, aap ne kiyooN itni takleef farmaaee ya aap ne kiyooN itna kasht
uthaaya, etc". In this sense, the term sa'ee-e-karam implies an appreciation
of some sort.
In another sense, it implies a satire as well. Let me explain, how?
kuchh log (khaas kar, mehboobaan!) aise bhi hote haiN jin ke liye 'karam'
karna aek ghair-fitri amal hota hai. It is simply not in their nature to be
benevolent. agar koi aisa shakhs kabhi karam karne ki soche bhi, to use hazaar
koshish karni paRe gi --- tab kaheeN ja ke us se karam ho paaye ga. aisi
soorat meiN, sa'ee-e-karam aek tanziya tarkeeb ka kaam karti hai.
ab is she'r ke pehle misre' meiN shaa'ir ka kehna hai ke "agarche voh ham par
(aakhir-e-kaar) sa'ee-e-karam farmaa to gaye haiN, magar phir bhi is
karam-farmaai ke baa-vujood hamaare ghamgeen dil ko taskeen naheeN mili". yeh
bilkul vuhi khayaal hai jo Maulana Hasrat Mohani ke is she'r meiN numaayaaN
hai; zaraa husn-e-bayaaN mulaahiza keejiye.
un ke karam se bhi na koi baat ban saki
pehle bhi jee nidhaal tha, ab bhi nidhaal hai!
ab doosre misre' meiN Majaaz keh rahe haiN ke "is sa'ee-e-karam ke baare meiN,
ham kya kaheN? agar yeh poori tarah se raahat-bakhsh hoti to kuchh kehte, ya
phir poori tarah se dukh-daayak hoti to kuchh kehte. magar yahaaN to yeh aalam
hai ke voh jab bhi hameN apni tavajjoh ka markaz banaate haiN to thoRa-bahut
baihlaa bhi jaate haiN aur saath hi saath kuchh na kuchh taRpaa bhi jaate
haiN". ab isi khayaal ko Shamim Karhaani ne yooN baandha hai; farmaate haiN
voh dil bhi dukhaate haiN, rakh dete haiN mar'ham bhi
kya khoob tabi'at hai, sho'le bhi haiN shabnam bhi!
aashiq ke is radd-e-amal (= reaction) ki aek khaas vajah yeh hoti hai ke
mehboob ka karam hamesha us ki expectations se kaheeN kam hota hai. is liye,
us karam se use thoRi-bahut raahat to mil jaati hai magar poori tarah se
sukoon-e-qalb naheeN milta. aur yihi is she'r ka paighaam hai.
----------
aap ne yeh bhi poochha hai ke "kya yeh tarkeeb, sa'ee-e-karam, kisi aur jagah
bhi iste'maal hui hai"? javaaban arz hai ke zaroor hui hogi. mere zehn meiN is
vaqt do she'r aa rahe haiN ------ aek Seemab ka jis meiN sa'ee-e-nazar ka
iste'maal kiya gaya hai aur doosra Ghalib ka jis meiN faqat sa'ee ka. she'r
haazir haiN:
husn ka izhaar tha sa'ee-e-nazar par munhasir
maiN ne jab chaaha, jahaaN chaaha, numaayaaN ho gaya (Seemab)
dost gham-khwaari meiN meri sa'ee farmaayeN ge kya?
zakhm ke bharte talak naakhun na baRh jaayeN ge kya? (Ghalib)
ab in ash'aar ki tashreeh ke liya mujhe mat kahiye ga --------- kiyooNke yeh
aap ka 'home-work' hai! :-))
khair-andesh, Raj Kumar
P.S. In some books, the second line of Ghalib's she'r says: bharne talak,
rather than bharte talak. R.K.
P.S. Jay Sahib: maiN aap ke doosre do ash'aar par jald hi apne comments dooN
ga. R.K.
Umang Bali
rpat...@sciborg.uwaterloo.ca wrote:
> Jay Sahib:
>
> chand din qabl, aap ne kuchh ash'aar ke ma'ani talab kiye the, magar kisi
> ALUPer ne un ash'aar ki taraf dhyaan naheeN diya tha. is liye, maiN aaj sub'h
> yeh soch kar uththa tha ke aaj is kaam ki taraf tavajjoh dooN ga. computer on
> kiya to jhat se Umang Sahib ki "sa'ee-e-karam" nazar aayee. socha ke chalo
> hamaari jaan chhuti...........magar jooNhi un ki post ko ghaur se paRhaa to
> pataa chalaa ke ziyaada-tar jagah to Majaaz ki ghazal ne le rakhkhi hai aur
> jis she'r ki tashreeh aap ne talab ki hai us par Umang Sahib ka tabsra
> nihaayat mukhtasar hai. maiN ne choonke is she'r ke baare meiN bahut kuchh
> soch rakhkha tha, is liye apni tashreeh pesh karne se baaz na reh sakaa.
>
> So here are a few comments ------------ Umang Sahib se ma'azrat ke saath!
Mohtaram Raj sahib,
aap kiyoN mujhe sharminda kar rahe hain, huzoor! Jab kai din tak maine kisi ko Jay
sahib ki post ka jawaab dete hue nahin dekha to socha kuchh apne khayalaat hi pesh
kar doon....ab aap ki la-jawaab tashreeh ke zariye meri zahaanat bhi kuchh saaf ho
gai hai....Once again thank you for the clarification, and if possible could you
please do a session on this ghazal, I'd especially like to get your comments on
the maqta of this ghazal...
Sincerely,
Umang
>
>
Padmanabhan Srinagesh
Once again thank you for the clarification, and if possible could you
> please do a session on this ghazal, I'd especially like to get your comments on
> the maqta of this ghazal...
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Umang
I second this. Two shers of this ghazal were recited in the movie
"Pyaasa" (Guru Dutt and Waheeda Rehman) by a character representing a
famous poet. In the same mushaira, Guru Dutt's character sang "jAne voh
kaise log the jinke pyaR ko pyAr milA". The contrast between the
simplicity of Sahir's ghazal and the complexity of Majaz's was striking.
Nagesh
vijay...@my-deja.com
> "Pyaasa" (Guru Dutt and Waheeda Rehman) by a character representing a
> famous poet. >
>
Nagesh Sahib,
If memory serves me, the poet reciting these she'rs in Pyaasa was
Majaaz himself.
Viajy Kumar
Raj Kumar Pathria
>
> > Hello Everyone,
> > Majaz saahib kii ek ghazal ke so ashaar pesh hain. Iss
> > ghazal ko Jagjit Singh ji ne "kahkashan" mein apni awaaz mein adaa kiya
> > hai. aap sab se guzarish hai ke in ashaar ke maani par kuch raushani
> > Daalein:
> >
> > tu khud apne husn ko parda banaa leti to accha tha
> >
> > teri neechi nazar khud teri ismat kii muhaafiz hai
> > tu iss nashtar kii tezi aazmaa leti to accha tha
> >
> > in dono.n ashaar mei.n sab se baRi mushkil mujhe in ke pehle aur doosre
> > misro.n ke beech jo naata hai, use samjhne mei.n aa rahi hai.
> > meherbaani kar iss naate par apne khayal farmaayein.
> >
Jay Sahib:
maiN aaj aap ke post kiye huye doosre do ash'aar par apne vichaar pesh
karooN ga.
she'r # 1 --- is she'r ka doosra misra out-of-meter hai. yahaaN, 'tu
khud' ki bajaaye, sirf 'tu' ya sirf 'khud' hona chaahiye. Please check
your source; if the singer does employ both these words in his
rendering, then he must be sliding over or skirting around these words!
is she'r ke do misroN meiN jo baa-hami rishta hai, voh rishta hi is
she'r ki jaan hai. yahaaN shaa'ir apni mehbooba se mukhaatib hai aur keh
rahaa hai ke
"yeh parda jo tum ne apne chehre pe daal rakhkha tha (aur jis ki
ba-daulat hazaar-haa fitne barpaa ho rahe the --- fitne is liye ke parde
ki vajah se dekhne vaaloN ka ishtiyaaq aur bhi baRh jaata hai aur un ke
iztiraab ka koi thikaana naheeN rehta), tum agar yeh parda uthaa deteeN
to kya buraai thi? tumheN yihi dar tha na ke aisa karne se tumhaara husn
manzar-aam par aa jaaye ga aur tumhaare hijaab (ya'ani tumhaari
sharm-o-hayaa) ko thes lage gi? Nothing can be farther from the truth!
haqeeqat to yeh hai ke agar tum be-niqaab ho bhi jaateeN, tab bhi koi
tumheN dekh na paata.......kiyooNke, tumhaare husn meiN voh chamak-damak
aur voh taab-naaki hai ke kisi ki himmat na hoti ke voh tumheN aankh
bhar kar dekh sakta. dekhne vaaloN ki aankheN chundhyaa jaateeN (kuchh
halke zarf vaale to ghash hi kha jaate --- remember Moses?). goya,
tumhaara husn, ba-zaat-e-khud, tumhaare liye aek parde ka kaam kar
jaata! is liye, tumheN is 'artificial veil' ko apne rukh se hataane meiN
koi jhijak naheeN honi chaahiye; tumhaara husn hi tumhaara asli parda
hai"!
I am sure you now see the link between the two misras of this she'r.
ain isi khayaal ko Makhmoor Dehlvi ne yooN baandha hai; farmaate haiN
in aankhoN se tajalli ko darakhshaaN kaun dekhe ga?
uthaa bhi do niqaab-e-roo-e-taabaaN, kaun dekhe ga???
doosre misre meiN, jis andaaz se 'kaun dekhe ga?' kahaa hai, us ka
javaab naheeN.
aek aur she'r kuchh isi mazmoon pe hai, jis ki bandish zaraa ajeeb si
hai magar khayaal khoob hai.
(auj = high point, zenith; darmiyaan aa jaana = raaste meiN haa'il ho
jaana)
dekhna aur dekh lena? hai zaraa mushkil si baat
auj-e-husn un ka yaqeenan darmiyaaN aa jaaye ga!
--------------
she'r # 2 --- pehle misre meiN, lafz 'teri' do jagah aaya hai. The meter
requires that the first one of these should bi 'tiri'; the second one
should stay as 'teri'. In the second misra, I would prefer 'nishtar' to
'nashtar', though both are correct.
yahaaN shaa'ir ka kehna hai ke "tum hamesha apni nazroN ko neecha rakhti
ho --- yeh aek achhchhi baat hai kiyooNke yeh sharm-o-hayaa ka andaaz
tumhaari izzat-o-ismat ka zaamin hai. This manner of conduct assures
your respect in the eyes of others.
magar --- har shakhs ko apne ausaaf ( = qualities) ki saheeh khabar honi
chaahiye. agar tum hamesha isi andaaz meiN raho gi to tumheN kaise pataa
chale ga ke tumhaari nigaahoN mein kaisa jaadoo hai, yeh kya kuchh kar
sakti haiN, kitnoN ko tumhaara deevaana banaa sakti haiN, kitnoN ko
neem-bismal aur kitnoN ko be-jaan kar sakti haiN, vaghaira, vaghaira. is
liye, agar hamaari maano to kabhi-kabhaar (just kabhi-kabhaar) in nazroN
ko oopar uthaa kar aur in nishtaroN ko apne chaahne vaaloN ki jaanib
phaink kar itna to dekh liya karo ke yeh kya kya ghazab dhaa sakte
haiN............just for the sake of testing! us ke ba'ad phir,
hasb-e-aadat unheN neecha kar liya karo, taake tumhaari ismat barqaraar
rahe".
Again, I hope you see the link between the two misras here.
----------------
Good news ------- no home-work today! :-))
khair-andesh, Raj Kumar
Irfan Moinuddin
On Sun, 18 Jul 1999, Raj Kumar Pathria wrote:
> Date: Sun, 18 Jul 1999 09:06:13 -0400
> From: Raj Kumar Pathria <rpat...@sciborg.uwaterloo.ca>
> Newsgroups: alt.language.urdu.poetry
> Subject: Re: kuchh ash'aar ke ma'ani!
What I write here is solely my opinion. Others may choose to disagree.
Needless to say, this newsgroup is made rangeen by the opinions and
interpretations of various ash'ar. But I feel that in order to
maintain authenticity and to conduct meaningful discussions, one must
maintain a high degree of responsibility... By that, I mean that when an
interpretation is merely an attempt on one's part to decipher the
meaning of a sher, one must so acknowledge. If one has arrived at some
meaning via perusal of urdu literature, relevant and brief references
should be provided. At the very least, one should make some comment as to
how the interpretation was arrived at, whether it be personal
interperation or from some recognized authority. Otherswise, it becomes
too easy to do injustice to urdu sha'iri. And I feel, in this case,
that this post has been rather irresponsible.
It is not clear from the post whether Mr. Pathria is simply working
his brain or relating knowledge that he has acquired from some acceptable
authority. I personally think that it is very non-poetic to suggest that
a woman's beauty can be so powerful that it actually diverts people's
attention or that it renders men incapable of directing their gaze towards
her. Indeed, if that is the argument that the poet chooses to use to
convince women to abandon their hijab, then he is doing a downright
pathetic job of it. As far as I am concerned, it makes much more sense to
simply say that the the hijab itself is a source of curiosity for many men
and hence draws their attention. By abandoning the hijab, females would
be eliminating this source of curiosity and hence abandoning the hijab
would be a better shield from men's gaze than the adoption of the hijab.
This is my interpretation of the sher in question, authentic or otherwise.
It is akin to telling children not to open a closed door. Inevitably, the
child's curiosity will cause him to open the door. Hence, keeping a door
open is the best way of keeping it closed.
The lack of logic and reality in the proposed interpretation afforded by
Mr. Pathria reduces the poetic strenght of the sher in question. It is Ok
to say things like "the radiance of my beloved's face is greater than the
radiance of the sun". Why? Because the poet isn't suggesting that if you
actually measured the radiation levels emanating from the sun, they would
be lesser than the rays of light emanating from his beloved's face. It is
all too clear that the poet is drawing a metaphor to qualify his beloved's
beauty and not to quantify it (notice the difference between quality and
quantity).
However, anytime a poet tries to express the kinds of mazAmin as are being
expressed in sher #1, the logic must be intact else the sher is nothing
but a bunch of words conforming to meter, which in and of itself is not
sufficient to qualify as sha'iri.
I personally
think that the sher by Dagh that was quoted in this post lacks much merit.
I also think that many of the ash'ar that attempt to undermine the
spirituality of the vAiz (preacher) are rather meaningless.
Consider the following sher by Iqbal:
vAiz sabUt lAyE jo mai ke javAz meiN
Iqbal ki ye zid hai ke pInA bhi chod dE
What's the point? The vAiz does have sabUt: Quran, Sunna, Hadith.
Is Iqbal abandoning Islam? Is he asking the vAiz to provide medical
proof? The vAiz does not need medical proof. Iqbal was clearly in an
agnostic phase when he wrote this sher or he is just playing with words.
Anyway, I digress. Needless to say, many of the ash'aar attacking the
injunction of abstinence from alcohol are manifestations of hypocrisy
because it becomes obvious that the poet is trying to justify his alcohol
consumption while trying to maintain their belief in Islam....or else,
they are mindlessly playing with words. I do think, however, that it is
OK to point out the hypocrisy of some preachers, who preach abstinence on
the outside but consume alcohol in their privacy etc. The following sher
by Ghalib is an example:
KahAN maIkhAne ka darwAza Ghalib aur kahAN vAiz
Par itna jAntE haiN, kal wo jAtA thA ke ham nikle
Sorry about the large digression.
Also, in the second sher, it is unclear whether the poet is asking the
female to aazma the tezi of her nashtar by gazing upon him or, as Mr.
Pathria suggests, by placing her eyes on her chahne waloN: "in nazroN ko
oopar uthaa kar aur in nishtaroN ko apne chaahne vaaloN ki jaanib
phaink kar itna to dekh liya karo ke yeh kya kya ghazab dhaa sakte".
It makes more sense for the poet to be wickedly asking his beloved to make
eye contact with him once in a while, at the same time maintaining her
dignity, and avoiding rusvAi.
I really don't care which interpretation is correct.
We can raise many questions: is it important what the poet meant? Are
readers allowed to form their own interpretations? etc. etc.
I don't care to answer those questions but I feel I must emphazize the
following:
Urdu sha'iri ki hifazat ke liye ye zaroori hai ke tashreeh karne wala ye
hu-ba-hu zahir kar de ke jo khayalat wo bayaan kar raha hai, kya wo uski
rai hai ya kisi alim ne kaha ya sher ka sha'ir ne khud numayaN kiya hai.
Let's be responsible guys. Keep up the discussions.
Irfan
*********************************
Irfan Moinuddin
University of Illinois
College of Medicine
-------------------------------------------
http://icarus.uic.edu/~imoinu1/irfsome.html
-------------------------------------------
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
Jay Shergill
aap ka be_had shukarguzaar hooN jo aap ne yeh
ashaar samjhane ka waqt nikaala, aur inheN intni ba_khoobi samjhaaya
hai.
And thank you for letting me off the hook, as far as homework is
concerned :)
with regards,
Jay
In article <3791D1...@sciborg.uwaterloo.ca>,
ka...@my-deja.com
before going into this discussion i would like to
point out that majaz was a progressive poet. let
me go little into the philosphy of the progressive
movement. in the tradition urdu poetry women were
just treated as objects of husn and ishq with
little or no regard to her intelligence.
progressive writers tried to change that
preception; not all of them, some of them were
like "i am too busy with inqilaab so i don't have
time to appreciate your beauty " etc. to his
credit majaz found a delicate balance between her
beauty and her intelligence.
tere maathe pe ye aanchal bahut hi khoob hai lekin
tu iss aanchal se ik parcham bana leti to achha
tha
this is the aakhri sher of the same nazm. and this
will make everything clear. majaz is not saying
women to get rid of her aanchal and display her
beauty. parcham ( flag) of love??? no but parcham
, which here means movement for a new age where a
women is not just appreciated for her beauty but
her intelligence as well ( inner beauty)
so IMHO i think majaz is provoking women to look
into her innner beauty and make them selves
considered as human being not just as objects. i
guess until then they have to wear hijaab to
protect themselves from the prying eyes.
i am sorry my post is not comprehensive enough and
not well developed. lekin aqal mando ke liye
ishara kaafi hai. and i am really pressed for
time.
tujhe se bhi dil fareb haiN gHam rozgaar ke
kashif
chapraasi of Majaz Fan Club ;-)
http://www.urdustan.com/
ka...@my-deja.com
Irfan Moinuddin
> vAiz sabUt lAyE jo mai ke javAz meiN
> Iqbal ki ye zid hai ke pInA bhi chod dE
>
It should be apparent, as Rajkumar Sahib points out, that
in the above sher Iqbal is attacking the integrity of the
vaiz by saying that if the vaiz were to present evidence in
favor of alcohol consumption, Iqbal would adopt abstinence
(simply because he is distrustful of any argument that the
vaiz defends and will, therefore, adopt the opposite
viewpoint based on that distrust).
The above is a paraphrase/translation, not an interpretation.
Some would find the above sher meritorious.
I personally do not.
Should not one assume a stance based on evaluation of
the evidence? If the vaiz was to say that suicide is
haram, would Iqbal kill himself?