A Principal Difference Between Urdu And English Poetry
Afzal A. Khan
In the second half of the nineteenth century, when Maulana Haali
and Shams-ul-'Ulema Mohammed Husain Azaad embarked upon a mission
to rid Urdu Poetry of its erstwhile restrictive domain, they
relied on English Poetry as a beacon towards new pathways.
To what extent their criticism of Urdu Poetry was justified is not
something that concerns us at the moment. But, while reading their
scholarly tracts, one gets a distinct impression that they placed
English Poetry on a somewhat higher pedestal, with particular
reference to its realistic and natural poetry.
Nevertheless, there is one aspect of poetry in the two languages
that has always been in my mind --- and I am inclined to feel that,
in this particular respect, Urdu Poetry is definitely "superior" to
English Poetry. The former is replete with a great treasure trove
of Poems concerning important historical personages, events and
places. I don't think English Poetry can match Urdu Poetry in that
respect. I may add that, try as I might, I couldn't seem to find
any worthwhile poems about great (English) Military Commanders.
And if there isn't any such piece about English royalty, that need
cause no surprise either, for, in the past three centuries or so,
no English monarch seems to have done anything deserving of a
laudatory poem. In expressing these views, I am excluding William
Shakespeare whose forte is in the field of Drama. And, of course,
I won't mind at all if a contrary view is expressed.
As stated above, there are a great many poems of the first order,
in Urdu Poetry, which deal with historical personages, important
historical events and noteworthy historical monuments.
Just 2/3 days back, I had posted a poem of Tilok Chand Mehroom
which talks about Empress Noor JahaaN and her mausoleum. And there
are scores of such poems that lie strewn all over the Deewaans of
established poets.
This piece may be considered as an "opening salvo" --- in a couple
of days, I propose to present here one such fine poem. And when
ALUPers see the name of the personage appearing in the header,
they may be startled, as it may come as a surprise.
And, from time to time, I may continue to post other fine poems
in this genre.
Afzal
Naseer
janaab-i-Afzal Sahib, aadaab 'arz hai.
Another difference that I have noted is that within English poetry the
rhyme scheme appears to be very "loose". Compared with Urdu, there
seems to be much more latitude. Shelly's poem that you posted a short
while back provides many examples of this flexibility that I am
talking about.
We shall look forward to all these poems.
Naseer
Afzal A. Khan
Naseer Saheb,
My observations in the preceding post were in the context of the
thematic content of English Poetry.
There are in fact several differences between Poetry in the two
languages --- I had singled out only one of them.
As far as Shelley's poem ("Ode To The West Wind") is concerned,
one would not call its "rhyme scheme" as 'loose' --- this
signifies something rather defective. On the other hand, it has
been composed in a specific style known as "Terza Rima", that
traces its origin to Dante.
The poem contains five cantos of fourteen lines each. Every
canto has four 'tercets' of three lines each, followed by a
(heroic) couplet of two lines.
In each "tercet" (resembling a "qat'aa"), the first and third
lines rhyme with each other. The second or middle line rhymes
with the first and third line of the NEXT tercet.
The metric form is Iambic Pentametre (or Pentameter). It is
perhaps the commonest metre in English Poetry. Each such line
contains five iambic 'feet' --- a 'feet' is a word pattern
consisting of one unstressed syllable, followed by a stressed
syllable. {There are of course variations that have been used
by the poets to correspond with "poetic necessity"}. The whole
scheme signifies a particular rhythm established by the words in
that line.
Urdu "'arooz" have a similar system, as explained by various
experts --- Sarwar Saheb had posted a quite detailed article
on this intricate subject, in 4 or 5 parts, some years back.
It will thus be seen that this English poem has been written in a
most consummate prosodic style. And Shelley has used it most
effectively in highlighting his firm belief in a poet's role ---
as being the agent or advocate of moral and political change.
Afzal
> .......The poem contains five stanzas of fourteen lines each. Each stanza has three tercets and a closing couplet. In poetry, a tercet is a unit of three lines that usually contain end rhyme; a couplet is a two-line unit that usually contains end rhyme. Shelley wrote the tercets in a verse form called terza rima, invented by Dante Alighieri. In this format, line 2 of one tercet rhymes with lines 1 and 3 of the next tercet. In regard to the latter, consider the first three tercets of the second stanza of "Ode to the West Wind." Notice that shed (second line, first tercet) rhymes with spread and head (first and third lines, second tercet) and that surge (second line, second tercet) rhymes with verge and dirge (first and third lines, third tercet).
>
> Thou on whose stream, 'mid the steep sky's commotion,
> Loose clouds like earth's decaying leaves are shed,
> Shook from the tangled boughs of heaven and ocean,
>
> Angels of rain and lightning! there are spread
> On the blue surface of thine airy surge,
> Like the bright hair uplifted from the head 20
>
> Of some fierce Mænad, even from the dim verge
> Of the horizon to the zenith's height,
> The locks of the approaching storm. Thou dirge
>
> .......All of the couplets in the poem rhyme, but the last couplet (lines 69-70) is an imperfect rhyme called eye rhyme. Eye rhyme occurs when the pronunciation of the last syllable of one line is different from the pronunciation of the last syllable of another line even though both syllables are identical in spelling except for a preceding consonant. For example, the following end-of-line word pairs would constitute eye rhyme: cough, rough; cow, mow; daughter, laughter; rummaging, raging. In Shelley's poem, wind and behind form eye rhyme.
> .......Shelley unifies the content of the poem by focusing the first three stanzas on the powers of the wind and the last two stanzas on the poet's desire to use these powers to spread his words throughout the world.
> .......
> Meter
>
> .......Most of the lines in the poem are in iambic pentameter, although some of the pentameter lines have an extra syllable (catalexis). The following tercet from the first stanza demonstrates the iambic-pent
Afzal A. Khan
Naseer Saheb,
Baad-e-Siyaah
> This piece may be considered as an "opening salvo" --- in a couple
> of days, I propose to present here one such fine poem. And when
> ALUPers see the name of the personage appearing in the header,
> they may be startled, as it may come as a surprise.
It can't be called a principal difference. If you compare poetry of
two languages there will be differences, this is just one such
difference. The reason why poets of English language did not focus on
eulogy may simply be a) they were/are highly egoistic b) the audience
may not be interested in that kind of poetry. Similarly one can say
there is disproportionate emphasis on wine and sensual in Urdu poetry,
which may be regarded degenerate in other language. I think the
essential difference in Urdu and English poetry is about structure of
poem, the rigidity of meter and the elaborate rhyming rules in Urdu/
Farsi poetry. Another difference in Urdu and any other language is
that poetry dominates in Urdu while prose dominates in other languages
(except Farsi perhaps)
Naseer
I am not in any way sugesting that the rhyme scheme is defective. What
I had in mind was rhymes of the type indicated below.
thou rhyming with low/below
thou>>>>>>> below/know
air >>>>>>>> where/hear
sepulchre>>> atmosphere/hear
is>>>>>>>>> harmonies
own >>>>>> tone/one
To my ears, they are not exact rhymes as in Urdu.
Naseer
Naseer
Anil Sahib, aadaab 'arz hai.
On what basis are you formulating your view that in Urdu, poetry is
dominant ( I presume you might mean greater quantity) compared with
other languages? And what can you tell us about Farsi prose?
Naseer
arahim
One way of quantifying may the number of writers of each category that
are known (for that category). Some ofcourse will fall into two or
perhaps more categories eg Qasmi would fall in the poetry and afsana
categories. Someone like ibn e insha might fall into poetry and
travelogs. There seem to be somewhat less number of writers in the
novel category. Infact who are the great Urdu novelists? Among those
alive probably Bano Qudsia (in my opinion). And even they do not have
large number of works.
There are people like ibn e safi who did have a large body of work and
were good in what they were trying to do but probably would not be
considered literary novelists. By the way one or two poems that I have
seen from him suggest his poetry is not bad even though he is not
known for it.
> Naseer- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Baad-e-Siyaah
> Anil Sahib, aadaab 'arz hai.
>
> On what basis are you formulating your view that in Urdu, poetry is
> dominant ( I presume you might mean greater quantity) compared with
> other languages? And what can you tell us about Farsi prose?
>
> Naseer
Naseer Sahib
aadaab
It is not clear from your post if you are disputing the assertion.
Mine was pure speculation on the basis of my own reading of Urdu
literature.Apart from Manto, Kishan Chander, Qurratulain Haider,
Rajinder Singh Bedi, Prem Chand I haven't read much prose.List of
poets is much longer...
I am actually eager to hear from you the real fact. I did not mean
quantity, it was a merely a comparative view vis a vis English
language. It seems to me poetry is very insignificant part of total
literary out put of English. I know absolutely nothing about Farsi,
but Sanskrit literature is almost entirely poetry.
Naseer
This is what you wrote originally:
"Another difference in Urdu and any other language is that poetry
dominates in Urdu while prose dominates in other languages (except
Farsi perhaps)."
Now you are saying:
"It is not clear from your post if you are disputing the assertion.
Mine was a pure speculation on the basis of my own reading of Urdu
literature..I know absolutely nothing about Farsi..."
If any one reads your original statement, there is nothing to indicate
that it is merely a speculation on your part. To me, it seems as if a
fact is being related. And if you know nothing about Farsi, how can
you deduce the "exception to the rule" by saying that in Urdu, poetry
domintates while prose is dominant in other languages "except Farsi
perhaps"?
I was merely questioning your statements. Would I be correct in
assuming that your Urdu prose readings have been in Devanagri?
Naseer
Baad-e-Siyaah
>
> - Show quoted text -
Naseer Sahib
I am unable to decipher tone of your remark. It appears you are not
happy with my assertion. Beats me, why?
Why else will you make that last point. Does it matter (in this
context) if I have read my Urdu prose in Devnagri script? If you are
trying to show me my place, it is a waste of time. I laready know
it.
On the other hand if you have a view on that assertion of mine just
state it I will readily agree to it.
regards
Naseer
On Jan 30, 3:01 pm, Baad-e-Siyaah <ciyahnas...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I am unable to decipher tone of your remark. It appears you are not
> happy with my assertion. Beats me, why?
I believe I have made my point as clear as I am able to. My tone is as
friendly as always although your perception may be somewhat different.
It is true that it is not always easy to fathom out a person's
thought processes in a short exchange of this nature
> Why else will you make that last point. Does it matter (in this
> context) if I have read my Urdu prose in Devnagri script? If you are
> trying to show me my place, it is a waste of time. I laready know
> it.
You have known me for such a long time Anil Sahib. It seems very
strange to me that you should even contemplate the notion that I am
attempting to show you your place. This is not a wrestling arena here.
We are all civilised individuals who care about each other's feelings
and emotions.
My question was linked to your comment about having read various
pieces of Urdu prose. My query arose because on occasions you write a
word like "darjah" as "darzah" etc and if you have been reading Urdu
literature in Urdu script, then the likelihood of this kind of mistake
is almost zero.
Naseer
Afzal A. Khan
Naseer Saheb,
In all this discussion, perhaps the greatest difference or
distinction between the two has not been mentioned at all,
viz. one is in Urdu and the other in English !!!
Afzal
Baad-e-Siyaah
> My question was linked to your comment about having read various
> pieces of Urdu prose. My query arose because on occasions you write a
> word like "darjah" as "darzah" etc and if you have been reading Urdu
> literature in Urdu script, then the likelihood of this kind of mistake
> is almost zero.
Naseer Sahib
aadaab
I wish you will stop this frequent reminder of my inadequacy over
Urdu. You are wrong about making zero mistake in spelling if I read in
Urdu script, which I do frequently (Urdu newspaper and I have several
books in Urdu script). It is a simplistic deduction because what comes
to you naturally will not come to me naturally. You have not only read
Urdu but also written and spoken it in formative years therefore map
of words are clearly etched in your memory. I do not have that
advantage, the map of words are not clear because of overlapping of
other scripts therefore for instance if I write 'fakeera' the image of
the word I have is of the Hindi movie titled 'Fakeera' even though
there is suspicion about its accuracy.
regards
Anil Kala
Naseer
Anil Sahib, aadaab 'arz hai.
aap kii/ke "Tone" se to mujhe yuuN lagtaa hai kih jo mansuube maiN ne
"February 2011 World Cup Cricket" ke mauqa' par aap ke haaN Thaharne
ke banaa'e the, un kaa satyaa-naas ho gayaa hai!
Naseer
Baad-e-Siyaah
> Anil Sahib, aadaab 'arz hai.
>
> aap kii/ke "Tone" se to mujhe yuuN lagtaa hai kih jo mansuube maiN ne
> "February 2011 World Cup Cricket" ke mauqa' par aap ke haaN Thaharne
> ke banaa'e the, un kaa satyaa-naas ho gayaa hai!
>
> Naseer
Naseer Sahib
kyaa aap ruukhaa-suukhaa khaa sakte haiN? mera Ghareeb-Khanaa us
Daak-Khaane ki tarah hi hai.
sawaagat hai (ticket ka intezaam aap kaa )