Wireless access point/router for home with modem support?
Bill Rubin
who claimed that he had purchased a box from Dell which allowed
him to plug his phone line into it, and then access the Internet
through it from his 2 PC's via wireless adapters. I've never
heard of anything like this (and the person was of no help
telling me exactly what product he had) and any wireless access
pointes/routers I have seen claimed they needed cable or DSL to
be plugged into it. Amongst other things, I don't really see how
this thing would negotiate signing onto the dialup connection.
That said, I would love for this to be true because I am unable
to get DSL or cable in my house and do have a need for wireless
networking. If I were to get one of the normal wireless access
points, could I just have my home machines talk to each other
through it, and use something like Internet Connection Sharing
to have the others go through the network to access the Internet
via a dialup on the other machine?
If not for the fact that he claimed it was a separate box, I'd
figure that maybe he was using the Intel wireless Anypoint
stuff. But he claims is was a box that the phone got plugged
into. Maybe he's really confused and it's just 10mb Homefree
phoneline networking?
Bill
Halfton
station"
you would still need separate HPNA for the phone line networking "In
House"
look here for more
http://www.practicallynetworked.com/reviews/
hth
Joe
"Bill Rubin" <bill...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:3BE0650C...@prodigy.net...
Halfton
using that modem, but both the Orinoco & Apple will still work Very nicely
as an AP "access point" for your house's LAN
hth
Joe
"Halfton" <hal...@pickup.invalid> wrote in message
news:_O%D7.639$Nz.6...@dfiatx1-snr1.gtei.net...
Vinny Gullotta
access point box which is supposed to be quite nice. I haven't played with
it yet so I can't say for sure, but it is a really cool idea.
Vinny
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Vincent J. Gullotta
Head Network Engineer
LANocracy
45 Grove Street
New Canaan, CT 06840
(203) 972-8686 (Work)
(866) WiFiUSA (Toll Free)
(203) 395-0980 (Cell)
Vi...@LANocracy.com
www.LANocracy.com
www.wifidirect.com
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Bill Rubin" <bill...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:3BE0650C...@prodigy.net...
Jim Burks
http://athome.compaq.com/option.asp?leftnavpage=Accessories&ComponentID=8225
&CategoryID=1420&Tab=0&ParentDesc=Accessories&SuperCatDesc=Networking+%2C+Wi
reless+%26+Storage&CatDesc=Networking+Gateways%2FRouters&SuperCategoryID=64&
showroom=&ParentID=15&cpqsid=QJENCCADRESR2HR100A3HBC3T16A8K61
If the URL doesn't wrap properly, it's at athome.compaq.com and is the WL310
product.
Supports both dial up 56k as well as Ethernet to a cable modem. You
configure the base station with your ISP dial-up number, account and
password. It gateways that to the wireless network.
Lucent/Agere make one also. They may make the Compaq unit.
It's at:
http://www.orinocowireless.com/template.html?section=m59&page=129&envelope=9
5
Jim Burks
"Bill Rubin" <bill...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:3BE0650C...@prodigy.net...
Bill Rubin
built into some of their models of their HomePortal.
Unfortunately, I cannot get DSL so that won't help me. I am
looking for something with a POTS 56kb modem (bleach, but it's
all I can get). The Compaq which another poster mentioned is at
http://athome.compaq.com/option.asp?leftnavpage=Accessories&ComponentID=8225
and does seem to do what I want, but it's $370. Fortunately, it
seems like it's just a rebranded Orinoco RG-1000, and there are
plenty of those on ebay for $160 or so. I noticed that Compaq
also has a WL300 "Wireless Software Access Point" which I guess
is the access point actually running in a PC which saves on the
access point box and merges it with a wireless adapter that
plugs into the machine. I will have to look into that and see if
that is the same as an Orinoco as well.
Bill
Bill Rubin
modem and I have no other choice. If I can have 2 machines
accessing it at the same time, I am going to have to deal with
the consequences.
Bill
Halfton
Example: with the Apple Airport "same hardware as RG1000", tried the 56k
modem "had a 48k connection" with 2 shared machines at once, with UDP
streaming "internet talk radio" different channel on each, more than half
the conversations were dropped from both
for simple Usenet, Email and web browsing it was borderline ok ;-\
hth
Joe
"Bill Rubin" <bill...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:3BE1D154...@prodigy.net...
Bill Rubin
mail/web/instant messaging (i.e., my kids). When I'd be using it
for myself with Usenet stuff, no one else would likely be using
it. How much do I lose simply by going through the box as
opposed to the modem being connected directly to my machine if i
am the only user? Presumably I would be connecting via USB since
I do not have PCMCIA as these are all desktops. Is there a PCI
card?
Would I be better off keeping the modem in my own machine and
use that instead of going through the RG-1000 when I am the only
user? I guess the answer has to be yes.
Bill
Halfton
open up the USB adapters they usually have a Pccard in them as do most AP's
http://www.practicallynetworked.com/
has howtos, hardware reviews w/user feedback & troubleshooters
"the Apple Airport and RG1000 have a Wavelan/Orinoco Silver card as
transceivers"
http://www.msrl.com/airport-gold/
I really don't like either the USB or ISA/PCI options and use Wired
Ethernet on my stationary equipment and save WiFi for the portables
yes, individual dialup from each machine would be better and cheaper in
your current situation "no need to buy any wireless equipment"
if you want to setup a cheap P2P LAN at home just get conventional Nic's
$20 each US, a Hub/Switch $30 to $100 US and patch cables of appropriate
length
hth
Joe
"Bill Rubin" <bill...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:3BE1E434...@prodigy.net...
> Well, the machines would likely not be doing more than
> mail/web/instant messaging (i.e., my kids). When I'd be using it
> for myself with Usenet stuff, no one else would likely be using
> it. How much do I lose simply by going through the box as
> opposed to the modem being connected directly to my machine if i
> am the only user? Presumably I would be connecting via USB since
> I do not have PCMCIA as these are all desktops. Is there a PCI
> card?
>
> Would I be better off keeping the modem in my own machine and
> use that instead of going through the RG-1000 when I am the only
> user? I guess the answer has to be yes.
>
> Bill
>
snipped
Bill Rubin
that I can more easily adjust the direction for the antenna. If
it's a PCMCIA card masquerading as a PCI card, then it's sitting
in the back of my machine, up against the wall.
I would like to get this setup because one of the 3 machines in
my house does not have a phoneline, and my friend who said he'd
come over and run a wire to it (in my daughter's room) hasn't.
Also, this would allow me to have multiple machines using the
Internet at the same time, for those rare (:-) ) times when both
of my kids insist on being on at the same time. Of course, if my
friend would run the wire for me, I could use the Phoneline
networking setup I installed but never got to use in the 3rd
room. However, those are only 1mb cards so it's rather slow (but
of course probably fine for 56kb dialup).
Will the Oronico adapter cards work with Linksys or other
wireless hubs (or can I use Linksys cards to talk to it?). Or do
I have to stay with all the same brand. I'm assuming it's the
latter, which I guess would mean I'd be replacing stuff if/when
I finally can get cable modem access (being 17.8k feet from the
central office, I don't see DSL as being in my future, of course
with the way that Cablevision has been screwing my town
regarding getting cable modems, I don't see that in my future,
either).
Bill
Halfton
"Bill Rubin" <bill...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
news:3BE2CF9E...@prodigy.net...
> The reason why I would have thought that USB would be better is
> that I can more easily adjust the direction for the antenna. <split>
if the USB/WiFi adapters work they work fine, but too many times I've
seen & heard "they go to sleep and require reboot or disconnect/reconnect to
wake them up, this also happens with USB/Wired Ethernet adapters I've used
and on grilling an asic/hardware engineer was told the interface has "Remote
Initialization" Issues, some mfgs still have these problems
> If it's a PCMCIA card masquerading as a PCI card, then it's sitting
> in the back of my machine, up against the wall.
this is one reason I prefer/suggest wired Ethernet to stationary
equipment, and It will also be compatible with your xDsl/cable when
available
>
> I would like to get this setup <snipped>
Go for it
>
> Will the Oronico adapter cards work with Linksys or other
> wireless hubs <snipped>
Yes and the Airport/RG1000 will allow direct connection to a xDsl/cable
modem or just act as a wireless bridge to an exsisting wired Lan with
hardware router
hth
Joe
snipped
David Hettel
> A co-worker introduced me to someone who was in from out of town
> who claimed that he had purchased a box from Dell which allowed
> him to plug his phone line into it, and then access the Internet
> through it from his 2 PC's via wireless adapters.
Dell, like Compaq, and Apple have relabled, RG-1000 access points,
His discription is basicly accurate. check here for more info:
<http://www.wavelan.com/template.html?section=m59&page=129&envelope=95>
For the Dell version look here:(I think this is the RG-1000 not the RG-1100
which you do not want)
<http://accessories.us.dell.com/sna/productdetail.asp?TabPage=Overview&sku=4
30-2762&spagenum=1&category_id=2999&keyword=wireless&mnf=&prst=0&prEnd=0&mnf
sku=&orderby=&searchtype=AND&customer_id=19&pageb4search=search&page=search.
asp&instock=0&refurbished=
For compaq version look here:
<http://www.compaq.com/products/quickspecs/10803_na/10803_na.HTML>
For the best price check ebay, these are allways being sold there. Look for
a new unopen sealed box, or better yet a kit. Search on orinoco rg-1000
I've never
> heard of anything like this (and the person was of no help
> telling me exactly what product he had) and any wireless access
> pointes/routers I have seen claimed they needed cable or DSL to
> be plugged into it. Amongst other things, I don't really see how
> this thing would negotiate signing onto the dialup connection.
Your isp need to accept an PPP logon, so they work with most,
if you have AOL it may not work.
> That said, I would love for this to be true because I am unable
> to get DSL or cable in my house and do have a need for wireless
> networking. If I were to get one of the normal wireless access
> points, could I just have my home machines talk to each other
> through it, and use something like Internet Connection Sharing
> to have the others go through the network to access the Internet
> via a dialup on the other machine?
Yes but if you go with the RG-1000 it has everthing built in and you don't
need to leave one computer always on, and running. The RG-1000 will dial in
when need, logon get what you need and then hang up. You are still
connecting at 56 k or what ever your are getting now, so that part is no
faster. But unless you are mostly downloading large files, programs, mp3,
and the like, the is really no reason why 2 can't share a connection.
>
> If not for the fact that he claimed it was a separate box, I'd
> figure that maybe he was using the Intel wireless Anypoint
> stuff. But he claims is was a box that the phone got plugged
> into. Maybe he's really confused and it's just 10mb Homefree
> phoneline networking?
>
> Bill
It's a seperate box and has a jack on the back for the phone line, and
another for the LAN.
HTH
David
David Hettel
Bill Rubin
Thanks for the info. I've since figured out it's the RG-1000
that he was talking about. I have been looking on ebay and there
is a guy with them for $159 (which seems to include one silver
card), but it only comes with a 30 day warranty. Are these
things reliable? If it works for 30 days is it likely to keep on
working? I actually almost bid on a never used unit that
someone bought from Dell, it was $107.50, but I did not get to
bid before it closed, and I wasn't really sure I wanted to buy a
used one. On the other hand, I might have ended up with a longer
warranty since presumably I could have taken over whatever was
left of the original warranty.
I guess I should go to this site that others have pointed me at
and see what it says about cards. Can I use Linksys (or other)
cards instead or does it have to be Orinoco cards? And do I have
to buy their PCMCIA-PCI card converter, or can I get some
generic one which I would expect to be cheaper?? I found an
Actiontec PC750 on ebay for much less than the $60 I've seen the
Orinoco one going for.
Bill
David Hettel
>
> Thanks for the info. I've since figured out it's the RG-1000
> that he was talking about. I have been looking on ebay and there
> is a guy with them for $159 (which seems to include one silver
> card), but it only comes with a 30 day warranty. Are these
> things reliable? If it works for 30 days is it likely to keep on
> working? I actually almost bid on a never used unit that
> someone bought from Dell, it was $107.50, but I did not get to
> bid before it closed, and I wasn't really sure I wanted to buy a
> used one. On the other hand, I might have ended up with a longer
> warranty since presumably I could have taken over whatever was
> left of the original warranty.
>
> I guess I should go to this site that others have pointed me at
> and see what it says about cards. Can I use Linksys (or other)
> cards instead or does it have to be Orinoco cards? And do I have
> to buy their PCMCIA-PCI card converter, or can I get some
> generic one which I would expect to be cheaper?? I found an
> Actiontec PC750 on ebay for much less than the $60 I've seen the
> Orinoco one going for.
>
> Bill
From what I've read, this is pretty much a case of you get what you pay for.
While you should be able to use any other brand, you need some smarts to do
so.Just look through this newsgroup. Generally the Orinoco cards seem to get
the best range, with Cisco being right up there with them, but much harder
to come by in less than twenty packs. Also be aware that Cisco likes to sell
there firmware, upgrades, where most other companies give it away. I've seen
on ebay, new pcmcia silver cards with free PCI adapters going for around
$100.00~$120.00. With the RG-1000, you can only use silver cards, unless you
replace the silver card in the RG-1000. So it should work with any other
unit that supports 40 or 64 bit security, it doesn't do 128 bit security. As
to how long it will last, that kinda depends. If your PC isn't cooking the
PCMCIA card, I would think that if it last through 30 days it will go right
on working. I have had, some laptops, that bake the PCMCIA card, it would
get so hot, that you needed mitts to pull it and not get burnted. No kind of
PCMCIA would last longer than a year, in it. And most would shut down after
30~ 6o minutes of use.
HTH
David
Bill Rubin
I think I finally have this figured out, just 2 more questions
(and I've changed the subject name so hopefully others will see
it as well, thanks).
First, is it possible to use the Ethernet connection on the
RG-1000 for anything other than bringing in a router? I.e.,
could I hardwire the machine right next to the RG-1000 using an
Ethernet card and save having to purchase one card? I am
assuming the answer to this is no but it would be nice if it
were yes.
Second, if the cost of an Orinoco USB adapter ends up being the
same as the cost of the PCMCIA+PCI adapter, is there any reason
to go with PCI when USB would allow me to move it around easier
for possibly better reception?
Thanks...
Bill
David Hettel
>
> First, is it possible to use the Ethernet connection on the
> RG-1000 for anything other than bringing in a router? I.e.,
> could I hardwire the machine right next to the RG-1000 using an
> Ethernet card and save having to purchase one card? I am
> assuming the answer to this is no but it would be nice if it
> were yes.
I'm sorry, but you have lost me here. Each computer will need either a
Ethernet card, or a silver wavelan card, gold will not work with the stock
RG-1000 unless WEP is turned off. If more than one computer is to be
hardwired to the RG-1000 (through Ethernet) then you will need either a
Switch or a hub with at lease one more port (for the RG-1000) or perhaps two
more ports (one for a RG-1000 and one for your cable/dsl connection) than
the number of computers to be hardwired.
> Second, if the cost of an Orinoco USB adapter ends up being the
> same as the cost of the PCMCIA+PCI adapter, is there any reason
> to go with PCI when USB would allow me to move it around easier
> for possibly better reception?
The only reason I can think of is that USB is kind of slow IMHO, so if your
Hardwire computers are connected with a 10baseT connection or a 100
connection ( Fast Ethernet, which is the smart way to go IMHO) and you are
moving large files, you may find the USB a little slow. For surfing the web
you should never notice a difference, because the web connection is just so
much slower, even with a high speed connection like cable or DSL. The other
reason is USB is becoming such a popular way to connect, that the more you
hang off the USB port, the more problems you are likey to have. So if you
only have one USB on your computer, and you may connect things like
keyboards, mouse, scanner, disk drives, cammera, PDA, printer, and what not,
it **might** not be such a good idea.
HTH
David
>
> Thanks...
> Bill
Bill Rubin
>
> "Bill Rubin" <bill...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
> news:3BE4E99D...@prodigy.net...
> >
> > First, is it possible to use the Ethernet connection on the
> > RG-1000 for anything other than bringing in a router? I.e.,
> > could I hardwire the machine right next to the RG-1000 using an
> > Ethernet card and save having to purchase one card? I am
> > assuming the answer to this is no but it would be nice if it
> > were yes.
>
> I'm sorry, but you have lost me here. Each computer will need either a
> Ethernet card, or a silver wavelan card, gold will not work with the stock
> RG-1000 unless WEP is turned off. If more than one computer is to be
> hardwired to the RG-1000 (through Ethernet) then you will need either a
> Switch or a hub with at lease one more port (for the RG-1000) or perhaps two
> more ports (one for a RG-1000 and one for your cable/dsl connection) than
> the number of computers to be hardwired.
I think you figured out what I was talking about. I want to
connect 3 machines through the phone connection on the RG-1000.
I don't have a hardwired network now but I do have a spare
Ethernet card. So if the RG-1000 is going to be sitting right
next to one of the machines, and I have no use for the Ethernet
port to connect a network, would I be able to just run a wire
from the Ethernet card in the PC to the port on the RG-1000 and
use whatever software comes with the RG-1000 to route Internet
requests over to it as they would if I had the Orinoco Silver
card in my system? Obviously if/when I am ever able to get cable
or DSL, I'd have to put another wireless card in the PC so I
could use the Ethernet port for the high speed connection, or
buy a router, or something like that. But for today, I have no
other use for the port.
> > Second, if the cost of an Orinoco USB adapter ends up being the
> > same as the cost of the PCMCIA+PCI adapter, is there any reason
> > to go with PCI when USB would allow me to move it around easier
> > for possibly better reception?
>
> The only reason I can think of is that USB is kind of slow IMHO, so if your
> Hardwire computers are connected with a 10baseT connection or a 100
> connection ( Fast Ethernet, which is the smart way to go IMHO) and you are
> moving large files, you may find the USB a little slow. For surfing the web
> you should never notice a difference, because the web connection is just so
> much slower, even with a high speed connection like cable or DSL. The other
> reason is USB is becoming such a popular way to connect, that the more you
> hang off the USB port, the more problems you are likey to have. So if you
> only have one USB on your computer, and you may connect things like
> keyboards, mouse, scanner, disk drives, cammera, PDA, printer, and what not,
> it **might** not be such a good idea.
> HTH
> David
>
> >
> > Thanks...
> > Bill
I already have a 4 port USB hub for 2 of the machines, and it's
easy enough to get one for the third, so I don't think that
ports are going to be an issue. I'm already PCI port challenged
(i.e. they're full) on one of my systems, and possibly on a 2nd
as well. It's a lot easier to get more USB ports than PCI!
Bill
Lucas Tam
Bill Rubin <bill...@prodigy.net> wrote in
> I think you figured out what I was talking about. I want to
> connect 3 machines through the phone connection on the RG-1000.
> I don't have a hardwired network now but I do have a spare
> Ethernet card. So if the RG-1000 is going to be sitting right
> next to one of the machines, and I have no use for the Ethernet
> port to connect a network, would I be able to just run a wire
> from the Ethernet card in the PC to the port on the RG-1000 and
> use whatever software comes with the RG-1000 to route Internet
> requests over to it as they would if I had the Orinoco Silver
> card in my system?
Yes. But depending on which OS you have it's slightly different.
With Windows XP, you can bridge the Ethernet, HPNA, and Wireless Network.
This will make the entire network visble to all computers. You probably
want to to bridge it if you have XP.
If you don't have XP or Bridging, you'll have to run routing software on
the PC with the Ethernet + HPNA to connect the two networks together.
If you don't want to do this, you can pick up a hardware HPNA/Ethernet
bridge.
> Obviously if/when I am ever able to get cable
> or DSL, I'd have to put another wireless card in the PC so I
> could use the Ethernet port for the high speed connection, or
> buy a router, or something like that. But for today, I have no
> other use for the port.
Anyhow, my home network has HPNA, Ethernet, and Wireless, so I know this
combo works for sure!
However, the only difference is that I am NOT using the routing feature of
the Orinoco home gateway as I have a linksys 1 port router. The linksys
router has much more advanced routing features than the orinoco which are
useful for me (ie port forwarding so I can run a server behind the
router).
David Hettel
<Snip>
> I think you figured out what I was talking about. I want to
> connect 3 machines through the phone connection on the RG-1000.
> I don't have a hardwired network now but I do have a spare
> Ethernet card. So if the RG-1000 is going to be sitting right
> next to one of the machines, and I have no use for the Ethernet
> port to connect a network, would I be able to just run a wire
> from the Ethernet card in the PC to the port on the RG-1000 and
> use whatever software comes with the RG-1000 to route Internet
> requests over to it as they would if I had the Orinoco Silver
> card in my system?
Yes but with a but. You'll need a special cable a crossover cable.
Obviously if/when I am ever able to get cable
> or DSL, I'd have to put another wireless card in the PC so I
> could use the Ethernet port for the high speed connection, or
> buy a router, or something like that.
Actually no, all you will need is a hub, or better a switch. This is
what i am using with my system. The Orinoco has a router built in,
that is good enough for my simple network. IMHO it's better this
way because no computer needs to always be on.
When you go to buy additional hubs, I'd buy one at a time and test them
with your system. This is where you can/may run into problems. NOT
all ports are the same. But with your system this is the way I go, first.
Also
buying an expensive hub over a cheap one does seem to mean much. I found
sometimes cheap ones work much better than expensive ones. If anything newer
ones seem like they might work better than older ones.
HTH
David
Bill Rubin
>
> "Bill Rubin" <bill...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
> news:3BE5EB55...@prodigy.net...
> <Snip>
>
> > I think you figured out what I was talking about. I want to
> > connect 3 machines through the phone connection on the RG-1000.
> > I don't have a hardwired network now but I do have a spare
> > Ethernet card. So if the RG-1000 is going to be sitting right
> > next to one of the machines, and I have no use for the Ethernet
> > port to connect a network, would I be able to just run a wire
> > from the Ethernet card in the PC to the port on the RG-1000 and
> > use whatever software comes with the RG-1000 to route Internet
> > requests over to it as they would if I had the Orinoco Silver
> > card in my system?
>
> Yes but with a but. You'll need a special cable a crossover cable.
But presumably still cheaper than another Orinoco wireless card
either in USB form or with a PCI adapter. Are the pins
different, like I remember you used to have to do with serial
cables and plugs?
> Obviously if/when I am ever able to get cable
> > or DSL, I'd have to put another wireless card in the PC so I
> > could use the Ethernet port for the high speed connection, or
> > buy a router, or something like that.
>
> Actually no, all you will need is a hub, or better a switch. This is
> what i am using with my system. The Orinoco has a router built in,
> that is good enough for my simple network. IMHO it's better this
> way because no computer needs to always be on.
It's absolutely better because this way only the machine(s) that
want to be on the Internet need to be turned on. I guess I could
even buy a switch now to plug the machine I want to hardwire
into into and then I'll e ready if/when I ever get cable/DSL.
Both of my USB hubs are the $30 Belkin powered 4 port varieties.
The first I got for free after rebate. The second I got for $10
better than free thanks to price matching and a rebate :-). I'm
only using one at the moment but it seems to work fine.
Bill
David Hettel
> David Hettel wrote:
> >
> > "Bill Rubin" <bill...@prodigy.net> wrote in message
> > news:3BE5EB55...@prodigy.net...
> > <Snip>
> >
> > > I think you figured out what I was talking about. I want to
> > > connect 3 machines through the phone connection on the RG-1000.
> > > I don't have a hardwired network now but I do have a spare
> > > Ethernet card. So if the RG-1000 is going to be sitting right
> > > next to one of the machines, and I have no use for the Ethernet
> > > port to connect a network, would I be able to just run a wire
> > > from the Ethernet card in the PC to the port on the RG-1000 and
> > > use whatever software comes with the RG-1000 to route Internet
> > > requests over to it as they would if I had the Orinoco Silver
> > > card in my system?
> >
> > Yes but with a but. You'll need a special cable a crossover cable.
>
> But presumably still cheaper than another Orinoco wireless card
> either in USB form or with a PCI adapter. Are the pins
> different, like I remember you used to have to do with serial
> cables and plugs?
The ends are RJ45 telephone plugs, the wires inside are crossed, in the
crossed over cable, and wired straight through in the normal cable. Kind of
like a modem cable and a printer cable for serial devices, but not really
because there the ends are actually different, and due to the male, female
state you can not plug the wrong cable in. With the RJ45 if you plug the
wrong cable in, it will not work. A cable should cost around $5 ~ $25
depending on markup and how much business the store does in them
HTH
David
.