Buderus Controls and Constant Circulation??
Staff
capability to control high and low temperature circuits, but states that
they will be on constant circulation. Does this mean that the
circulators are to run all the time? Any help and info would be
appreciated.
thanks
John
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Stefan Lang
> I am looking at a Buderus 2105 Ecomatic boiler control. It has the
> capability to control high and low temperature circuits, but states that
> they will be on constant circulation. Does this mean that the
> circulators are to run all the time?
Supposing the Buderus HS 2105 comes with the same technical functions in
your country as in Germany, it can control one heating circuit (heating
water temperature depending on the outside temperature) and one
(domestic) warm water circuit (constant temperature). It should switch
automatically between summer and winter mode, depending on a
programmable outside temperature. In summer mode the pump for the
heating circuit stops, except for a few minutes daily to keep it
functioning. The warm water circuit's pump will only run, when warm
water is loaded.
Also there is a time program, separate for heating circuit an warm water
circuit, which allows you to define times of use and reduced use for
each circuit.
Hope this helps. If you need more info, please describe the system that
HS2105 belongs to.
Stefan
CRIGGALL
Sir
I have 45 Johnson Controllers made in Germany for your specific purpose. Would
you be interested?
James Criggall
crig...@aol.com
Robert P. Tmej
you contact the installer, local wholesaler or vist the Buderus web site, it
may be that the circulation you refer to allows different zones to operate
at the same time, i.e. lower temp in-floor, higher temp cast iron or steel
rads, and the DHW.
rt
Stefan Lang wrote in message <36172F2B...@gi.eulink.net>...
Staff
Domestic Hot Water Tank. It will have a total of 6 zones. One for domestic
hot water and 5 for heating. 3 of the 5 will be low temperature radiant
heated floors and 2 will be high temperature Buderus panel radiators. I will
be using the FM241 module to run the radiant and an additional controller for
the other zones. I plan on having a 4-way mixing valve to knock the boiler
temperature for the radiant. I am going to use 2 4-way mixing valves, the 2
radiant heated floors require two different temperatures. Is it possible to
put a 3-way mixing valve right after a 4-way mixing valve and knock the
temperature down that way. Since I need temperature of 110F for one radiant
zone and 90F for the other.
All that aside, how do you like the Ecomatic 2105? They are only coming to
America this month.
Thanks
John
Stefan Lang wrote:
> Staff wrote:
>
> > I am looking at a Buderus 2105 Ecomatic boiler control. It has the
> > capability to control high and low temperature circuits, but states that
> > they will be on constant circulation. Does this mean that the
> > circulators are to run all the time?
>
> Supposing the Buderus HS 2105 comes with the same technical functions in
> your country as in Germany, it can control one heating circuit (heating
> water temperature depending on the outside temperature) and one
> (domestic) warm water circuit (constant temperature). It should switch
> automatically between summer and winter mode, depending on a
> programmable outside temperature. In summer mode the pump for the
> heating circuit stops, except for a few minutes daily to keep it
> functioning. The warm water circuit's pump will only run, when warm
> water is loaded.
> Also there is a time program, separate for heating circuit an warm water
> circuit, which allows you to define times of use and reduced use for
> each circuit.
>
> Hope this helps. If you need more info, please describe the system that
> HS2105 belongs to.
>
> Stefan
--
Stefan Lang
>
> I'm not an expert on Buderus boilers or their control boards but I suggest
Of course always the best way ;-)
> it may be that the circulation you refer to allows different zones to operate
> at the same time, i.e. lower temp in-floor, higher temp cast iron or steel
> rads, and the DHW.
Higher temparature heat + DHW are standard functions of the HS2105,
there is also a version called HS2105M (including the module FM241)
which allows a second lower temperature circuit, as you suggested.
Stefan Lang
Promisekey
Sounds that way. However why would you need a controller if it simply runs the
circ's all the time?
Stefan Lang
>
> The system is going to run a hydronics gas fired heating system with a Buderus
> Domestic Hot Water Tank. It will have a total of 6 zones. One for domestic
> hot water and 5 for heating. 3 of the 5 will be low temperature radiant
> heated floors and 2 will be high temperature Buderus panel radiators. I will
> be using the FM241 module to run the radiant and an additional controller for
> the other zones. I plan on having a 4-way mixing valve to knock the boiler
> temperature for the radiant. I am going to use 2 4-way mixing valves, the 2
> radiant heated floors require two different temperatures.
Let me tear this apart, to see if I got you right (please correct me if
not):
There are 6 circuits:
1.: DHW
2.: radiators 1 (no mixing valve)
3.: radiators 2 (no mixing valve)
4.: heated floor 1 (110 F, 4-way-valve)
5.: heated floor 2 (90 F, 4-way-valve)
6.: heated floor 3 (?? F)
The FM241 can control only a single additional circuit with a mixing
valve (3- or 4-way). That gives you a total of three circuits (1 DHW, 1
heating without mixing valve, 1 heating with mixing valve).
If you need 2 temperatures (also 2 valves), you'll need the external
controller. What about that third heated floor circuit? Does it need
another temperature?
I would suggest to use the 2105 (without FM241) only to control the
boiler and circuits 1 and 2. I'd use a small DDC unit to control
circuits 3 to 6, that makes it easier for the customer.
> Is it possible to
> put a 3-way mixing valve right after a 4-way mixing valve and knock the
> temperature down that way. Since I need temperature of 110F for one radiant
> zone and 90F for the other.
That should be possible, but you're fast into hydraulic problems with
that, better build separate circuits with 3-way- or 4-way-valves
(4-way-valves only if you need to keep the boiler temperature high ->
condensation).
> All that aside, how do you like the Ecomatic 2105? They are only coming to
> America this month.
The Buderus 2000 "series" (besides the 2105 there's only the 2101 for
constant boiler temperature) is a fine controller for smaller heating
systems. It has all you need for small buildings, nothing more and
nothing less. The 2000 is on the German market since about two years as
a follow-up for the smaller 3000 systems, which are still very popular
(everybody just *knows* the easy-to-use 3000).
While the older 4000-controllers (4201) have many gimmicks that never
really worked, the 2000 simply does its job. Of course not everyone
likes the digital systems, but once you're into it, it's as easy as
every analog controller.
Stefan Lang
Robert P. Tmej
tanks and controls
do you know how they compare to the Viessmann line of products?
thank you
rt
Stefan Lang wrote in message <36195F40...@gi.eulink.net>...
Stefan Lang
>
> very interesting...i'm not familiar with the Buderus line of boilers, dhw
> tanks and controls
> do you know how they compare to the Viessmann line of products?
That's mainly a question of taste, both are high quality products over
the full range from 8 to 10000 kW.
We recently had some trouble with Buderus condensing boilers units (the
SB305 series), where the burners failed time after time in several
buildings because of
mechanical and electronical problems, but that seems to be over by now.
Viessmann is usually a bit more expensive than Buderus, but they started
three seperate product lines ("Basic", "Comfort" and "HighTech") to
compare with low cost producers.
IMHO Viessmann is a little more innovative, they develop almost all of
their systems in house, while Buderus rather buys a successful product
(or the whole company that developed it).
The Buderus 3000 controllers were fine working systems and easy to
handle, but because of their analog design the production is stopped. I
like the Viessmann Dekamatik a little more than the new digital Buderus
4000, but that's only my private opinion.
The DHW tanks again are subject of philosophy. The Buderus steel/enamel
tanks are (somewhat surprisingly) told to be more durable than the
Viessmann tanks of stainless steel, but usually there are no problems
with both.
When a cast-iron boiler is necessary (or might be better) I usually
prefer Buderus, because these are only a side line of Viessmann. Also
Viessmann has no wall mounted condensing boiler bigger than 25 kW, so in
cases where cheap condensing unit are needed, I take the GB112 from
Buderus.
In most other cases it makes no big difference whether you take Buderus
or Viessmann. In my daily practice it often depends on project specific
details, e.g. when I need special controller functions, which are
featured only by either Buderus or Viessmann.
Stefan Lang