06E compressor unloaders
Jmh1110624
We rplcd compressor,txv power head, System is carrier has 2 txv.
on start up 95/220 after 20 min. 85/ 200 odt80' system is 10+ yers old.
cold and sweating on each circuit by txv bulb and 1/4 of comp. body is cool'
Has a hot gas bypass type unloader, not sure if comp. is fully loaded
M#O6EX250, not familiar with unloaders , how can we make sure unit is fully
loaded?Another question is if unit is operating properly ,shold the temp of the
heads be equal, the one without unloader Ican leave my hand on,warm not hot,the
head with unloader is too hot to touch. Thanks for your time
Newmanga
>We rplcd compressor,txv power head, System is carrier has 2 txv
Lots of questions. Hope I can help.
1 What is the superheat that you set these txv at?
>on start up 95/220 after 20 min. 85/ 200 odt80' system is 10+ yers old.
2 Is this a chiller?
3 Air cooler?
4 Did the suction pressure ever come down below 85psi?
>cold and sweating on each circuit by txv bulb and 1/4 of comp. body is cool'
5 Need to know what the superheat is at the txv & 6" from the compressor.
>Has a hot gas bypass type unloader, not sure if comp. is fully loaded
>M#O6EX250, not familiar with unloaders , how can we make sure unit is fully
>loaded?Another question is if unit
6 Check voltage going to the solenoid valve on the unloader. Now watch your
amps & pressures. When loaded- amps will go up & suction pressrue will go down.
When unloaded-amps will go down & suction will go up. That is why it is called
an unloader. BASICALLY when unloaded the compressor horse power is cut in half.
So instead of a (10hp comp. you have an 5hp comp.) that is why the suction
pressure goes up.
>Another question is if unit is operating properly ,shold the temp of the
>heads be equal, the one without unloader Ican leave my hand on,warm not
>hot,the
>head with unloader is too hot to touch. Thanks for your time
>
>
7 Please do not use your body as a temp. meter. This is reserved for MOTHERS
only when they feel your four head to see if you have a temperture. Buy your
self a nice thermomenter to measure the head temp.
8 Hope this helps. Remember, must be fully loaded to check a system out 100%.
9 PS If I have confussed you with my Q&A. Not to worry. The other guys in this
NG will correct me.
NewmanG.A.
justfixthedamnthing
paul milligan
jmh11...@aol.com (Jmh1110624) pondered briefly, and wrote:
>We rplcd compressor,txv power head, System is carrier has 2 txv.
>on start up 95/220 after 20 min. 85/ 200 odt80' system is 10+ yers old.
>cold and sweating on each circuit by txv bulb and 1/4 of comp. body is cool'
>Has a hot gas bypass type unloader, not sure if comp. is fully loaded
>M#O6EX250, not familiar with unloaders , how can we make sure unit is fully
>loaded?Another question is if unit is operating properly ,shold the temp of the
>heads be equal, the one without unloader Ican leave my hand on,warm not hot,the
>head with unloader is too hot to touch. Thanks for your time
Assuming R22, I'd say you have a broken discharge valve on the
head without the unloader, the cylinder with the unloader is 'loaded'
and doing all the work of the unit by itself. Just a guess from here,
of course.
You should be able to turn the unloader adjusting stem enough
to see it kick in and out on your guages, answering that question for
you.
Paul
>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~>~~
pjm@(remove this part )pobox.com
My WWW site is at http://www.pobox.com/~pjm, featuring free HVAC software.
The Sci.Engr.Heat-Vent-AC and Alt.HVAC FAQ is at http://www.elitesoft.com/sci.hvac/
owl
Jmh1110624 wrote:
>
> We rplcd compressor,txv power head, System is carrier has 2 txv.
> on start up 95/220 after 20 min. 85/ 200 odt80' system is 10+ yers old.
> cold and sweating on each circuit by txv bulb and 1/4 of comp. body is cool'
> Has a hot gas bypass type unloader, not sure if comp. is fully loaded
> M#O6EX250, not familiar with unloaders , how can we make sure unit is fully
> loaded?Another question is if unit is operating properly ,shold the temp of the
> heads be equal, the one without unloader Ican leave my hand on,warm not hot,the
> head with unloader is too hot to touch. Thanks for your time
i think your compressor is runing unload if the pressure is above 70psi
what type of unload using on the 06E compressor?..solenoid coil or
manual seting unload (have a big nut to adjust the unloader)
if the compressor is using manual seting u can try to adjust the big nut
n see the low pressure..(the perssure will go down) and the sound of the
compressor will change also the Amp. will raise..
u also can know if the compressor is runing on full load ..look at the
Amp..
if u adjust the unloader ...u will know the compressor...full load the
Amp is higher, gas perssure is normal(50-65psi)....if the unit is runing
unload..the Amp will lower..gas pressure will high(75-85psi)..
i hope that all this will help u to solde the problem...
w.l.ong
TMorgen
When you replaced the compressor, did you buy and install a new unloader
or use the old one? If that machine has the mechanical unloader, there is
a
small cap screw covering the unloader adjustment. If you don't have the
cut
sheet on that unloader, a check with your local supplier should allow you
to
read and familiarize yourself on how to adjust them.
Sounds like you are either running unloaded; hot gas bypass unloaders will
heat things up a bit, or could be a broken reed...(so soon?) I would guess
it
to be an unloader stuck open. How does the oil splashing look in the sight
glass, normal or foaming?
Never use your hands to take the temperatures......
Regards,
Ted
>
Jmh1110624 <jmh11...@aol.com> wrote in article
<199803290530...@ladder01.news.aol.com>...
k
Jmh1110624 wrote:
> We rplcd compressor,txv power head, System is carrier has 2 txv.
> on start up 95/220 after 20 min. 85/ 200 odt80' system is 10+ yers old.
> cold and sweating on each circuit by txv bulb and 1/4 of comp. body is cool'
> Has a hot gas bypass type unloader, not sure if comp. is fully loaded
> M#O6EX250, not familiar with unloaders , how can we make sure unit is fully
> loaded?Another question is if unit is operating properly ,shold the temp of the
> heads be equal, the one without unloader Ican leave my hand on,warm not hot,the
> head with unloader is too hot to touch. Thanks for your time
Hmmm, 2 types of unloaders on O6E's, suction cutoff, and discharge bypass. One
has a solenoid coil and the other has an adjustable stem. Both are pretty easy to
check, just pop the solenoid off the stem and watch the suction pressure, or adjust
the adjusting stem.
Paul, why are you thinking broken discharge valve on a fresh compressor (at least
that's the way I interpreted him)? Just curious, because O6E's tend to be pretty
reliable on start up unless you really flood the hell out of them.
ken
Dean A
Carrier has a Tech Training book titled "Capacity Control" (GTC
1A-101/020-300) that walks you through the different types of unloaders
& how they work & how to adjust them. They also have a one page sheet
about pressure operated unloaders (no wires attached to the unloader)
that I can fax you if you want. They also have a book "06D, 06E
Compressor Familiarization & Service" (GTC 3-101/020-343) that tells all
about those compressors & has a little bit about body & head temps.
Call your Carrier distributor or the training lit dept at 888-876-4548
for a list, or to get individual books. They have a lot of good books
if you're interested, & most cost only about $5.
paul milligan
k <ran...@webspan.net> pondered briefly, and wrote:
>Hmmm, 2 types of unloaders on O6E's, suction cutoff, and discharge bypass. One
>has a solenoid coil and the other has an adjustable stem. Both are pretty easy to
>check, just pop the solenoid off the stem and watch the suction pressure, or adjust
>the adjusting stem.
Yep
>Paul, why are you thinking broken discharge valve on a fresh compressor (at least
>that's the way I interpreted him)? Just curious, because O6E's tend to be pretty
>reliable on start up unless you really flood the hell out of them.
Because he said the head with the unloader is too hot to
touch, and the non-unloaded head is merely warm. No work getting done
there. I agree with all comments here about not using one's hand to
determine temperature, as far as other things like superheat, subcool,
etc, but the hand is mighty handy ( had to say it ) to decide between
'too hot to touch' and 'just warm'.
One possibility that comes to mind is if the compressor were
spun ( even momentarily ) without the discharge header rotolock being
opened first.
John Tan
Hello :-)
Just to reply some of your questions:-
Jmh1110624 wrote:
> We rplcd compressor,txv power head, System is carrier has 2 txv.
> on start up 95/220 after 20 min. 85/ 200 odt80' system is 10+ yers old.
> cold and sweating on each circuit by txv bulb and 1/4 of comp. body is cool'
> Has a hot gas bypass type unloader, not sure if comp. is fully loaded
> M#O6EX250, not familiar with unloaders , how can we make sure unit is fully
> loaded?
Carrier O6EX250 is a 4 cylinders compressor for AC duty, hence you
should be using
R22 at about nominal 20 Hp.
I am not sure if you have identified the correct type of unloader but
the hot gas bygass type of unloader has been obsoleted since around
1982, as the compressors (could be also in O6EX250) use new design of
what is called the suction cutoff unloaders.
Both hot gas and suction cutoff unloaders are of electric (solenoid
coil) and gas pressure unloaders.
The hot gas and suction cutoff unloaders can be identify physically at
their unloading heads, click below to view (hope you can distinguish
them as the pics. are in black & white):-
http://members.tripod.com/~teckhoe/index.html
Not sure what is your electrical source, but as some of the respondents
have mentioned you should be approaching the full load ampere if the
compressor is fully loaded (assuming the system does not have other
problems).
If your type is suction cutoff and pressure unloader, here is the
check:-
a) Each unloading valve controls 2 cylinders. On start-up, controlled
cylinders do
not load up until differential between suction and discharge pressures
is approx.
25 psi.
b) The capacity control valve for unloading/loading at the said
unloading head has a adjustment nut which control the set point
(cylinder load point) and is adjustable
from 0 psig to 86 psig. Pressure differential between cylinder load-up
point and
cylinder unload point is adjustable from 6 psi to 16 psi.
c)To regulate control set point, turn adjustment NUT clockwise to its
bottom stop. In this position, set point is 86 psig. Control set point
is then regulated to desired pressure by turning adjustment nut
counterclockwise. Each full turn decreases set point by approx. 7.2 psi.
d)To regulate pressure differential adjustment, turn differential
adjusting SCREW (located at lower side of the control valve and is
covered by sealing cap) counterclockwise to its back-up position. In
this position, differential is
6 psi, approx. 10 turns increases differential to 16 psi. See below url
to view, scroll
down the page.
http://members.tripod.com/~teckhoe/index.html
Coupled with above ampere reading and the above checks, you should be
able to tell
if the unloaders is loading fully or unloading. Note also that unloader
may function
erratically due to clogging of bypass port or spring of bypass piston
becomes weak and
you may need to change the unloader.
And about getting your hand burn from the hotter head, I can't say much.
You should ensure that the temp. should not exceed 110 deg. C to prevent
lubrication oil disintegration in the compressor. Probably, you should
open-up your unloader head to
check and service the internal parts since the compressor is 10 years
plus.
Hopes this help.
Regards,
John Tan
John Tan
Oops....some correction here:-
John Tan wrote:
snipped
>
> And about getting your hand burn from the hotter head, I can't say much.
> You should ensure that the temp. should not exceed 110 deg. C to prevent
> lubrication oil disintegration in the compressor. Probably, you should
> open-up your unloader head to
> check and service the internal parts since the compressor is 10 years
> plus.
I mean as you've mentioned that you've replace the compressor in a 10
years plus system, and assuming the compressor is new not rebuilt, the
unloader head taken from the old may be erratic.
By the way, does your replaced new compressor come with new unloader or
did you use back the old ? If you use the new compressor with its
unloader, it should be the pressure type suction cutoff unloader.
Regards,
John Tan
owl
Dean A wrote:
>
> Carrier has a Tech Training book titled "Capacity Control" (GTC
> 1A-101/020-300) that walks you through the different types of unloaders
> & how they work & how to adjust them. They also have a one page sheet
> about pressure operated unloaders (no wires attached to the unloader)
> that I can fax you if you want. They also have a book "06D, 06E
> Compressor Familiarization & Service" (GTC 3-101/020-343) that tells all
> about those compressors & has a little bit about body & head temps.
> Call your Carrier distributor or the training lit dept at 888-876-4548
> for a list, or to get individual books. They have a lot of good books
> if you're interested, & most cost only about $5.
>
i like to have the training book..
i always repair of overhual hual many O6D & O6E compressor..
can u tell me how to get the book.i m live in malaysia..
i don't think i can get it in malaysia..or maybe u can buy it for me..
please help me!
w.l.ong
Jmh1110624
Thanks to all for help. Comp. finally loaded, not sure why might have been a
low head caused by amb. temp .t-stat out of (3 fans) adjustment . The only
thing that has changed is it's gotten about
15' warmer. as of today 68/270 ODT 85' SLT by comp59'-61'
Sub-cool. 17' 32amp draw RLA 45amps 460v, end bell sweaty ,
middle of comp. cool to warm closer to heads , heads hot
Kitchen return air temp. 74' AHU- top txv 11'-14. ' SH at bulb51 to
54 Lower txv 14-16' sh 54'-56'.Bulb area. Common line going back to comp.
60-61' Need to make it about 4 ' cooler.
;.