Enough with the Union bashing
profft
Jimmy Hoffa's they without a doubt some of the most highly trained
individuals on the planet. Just because you don't belong to a union it does
not mean that fine wage you earn now is not do in part to the existance of
unions. Some of you new guys have been ragging on Mike because he proudly
belongs to a union, well that's total bullshit. Mike's a good guy and I can
assure you he has nothing todo with any corruption, real or imagined that
the leadership may or may not be into.
p...@see_my_sig_for_address.com
wrote:
No, Mike's an asshole. Seeing as the Union thing gets his
panties twisted, we use that :-)
And I hardly think it's 'new guys', Junior.
Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
New HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's !! http://pmilligan.net/palm/
Free demo now available online !!!!
--
Free superheat charts for 38 Ref's online at http://pmilligan.net/pmtherm/
My personal site is at http://www.pmilligan.net
Henry77
"profft" <ftay...@BIGcox.net> wrote in message
news:nsVsb.127$uG5.82@okepread03...
Well - I am pretty SURE I am one of the "NEW" guys you refer to HOWEVER I
have made it clear that I am not bashing the union membership but instead
the UNION LEADERSHIP. After reviewing my many jobs I have been a member of 4
unions and none of the leadership were worth a damn. Three of the unions had
leadership that were convicted of State or (mostly) Federal charges
involving kickbacks, corruption ,racketeering (sp?), etc so I hardly have no
experience with unions. I have also worked for non-union companies where yes
the pay was a LITTLE lower but had better health and dental benefits ( as in
$1co-pays for Generic drugs )- NO union job I held had BETTER benefits
overall and the better benefits offset the lower pay. You may argue that the
unions got me the better benefits in the non-union jobs and to that I say -
I worked in 2 electronics jobs locally - 1 union and 1 non. The pay
difference was about $2/hour more for the union job but the benfits were
worse than the lower paying-non-union job. Also the last job I had was union
and when we complained about safety problems we were called whiners by our
union reps and the only time something was done was if someone got hurt. I
have NEVER had a non-union job with problems like that. True - back in the
OLD DAYS unions had their place and maybe still do in the 3rd world
countries but here in the US I say FORGETABOUTIT. I repeat again - when I
bash unions I bash the CORRUPT union HIERARCHY and not the membership <he
said climbing off his soapbox>.
Henry
Non-Member of any local
bill
> Many of our brother and sister technicians are in Unions and despite the
> Jimmy Hoffa's they without a doubt some of the most highly trained
> individuals on the planet.
Yes, some.
Just because you don't belong to a union it does
> not mean that fine wage you earn now is not do in part to the existance of
> unions.
What color is the sky in your world?
Some of you new guys have been ragging on Mike because he proudly
> belongs to a union, well that's total bullshit.
Nobody gives a fuck if mike is in the union. You might.
mike does. Nobody else does.
> Mike's a good guy and I can
mike's an asshole to the bone. His handle should clue even you in to this.
> assure you he has nothing todo with any corruption, real or imagined that
> the leadership may or may not be into.
True. mike sits on the bench too often to get any graft.
FTU
go fish
v698rv4k8624of9l2...@4ax.com
>On Thu, 13 Nov 2003 19:36:03 -0500, "profft" <ftay...@BIGcox.net>
>wrote:
>
>>Many of our brother and sister technicians are in Unions and despite the
>>Jimmy Hoffa's they without a doubt some of the most highly trained
>>individuals on the planet. Just because you don't belong to a union it does
>>not mean that fine wage you earn now is not do in part to the existance of
>>unions. Some of you new guys have been ragging on Mike because he proudly
>>belongs to a union, well that's total bullshit. Mike's a good guy and I can
>>assure you he has nothing todo with any corruption, real or imagined that
>>the leadership may or may not be into.
>>
>
> No, Mike's an asshole.
........talk about the pot calling the kettle black
Seeing as the Union thing gets his
>panties twisted, we use that :-)
>
> And I hardly think it's 'new guys', Junior.
>
>
>
>Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
>
>New HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's !! http://pmilligan.net/palm/
>Free demo now available online !!!!
>--
>Free superheat charts for 38 Ref's online at http://pmilligan.net/pmtherm/
>My personal site is at http://www.pmilligan.net
The oxen are slow, but the earth is patient.
daytona
individuals on the planet.>
I wasn't going to say anything UNTIL I read this
statement................you better check yourself
and you information.
Dr. Hardcrab
kjpro
news:bp2brq$mug$3...@bob.news.rcn.net...
> Isn't a union what you use to connect two flare nuts together???
Nope, it's where you connect two pieces of black pipe together. :-)
--
kjpro
_-~-_>_-~-_>_-~-_>_-~-_>_-~-_>_-~-_>_-~-_>_-~-_>_-~-_>_-~-_>_-~-_>
( kjpro @ starband . net ) remove spaces to e-mail
Want it done yesterday? Or done right today, to save money tomorrow!!
_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>_>
bill
<drhar...@hotmail.spamcom> wrote:
> Isn't a union what you use to connect two flare nuts together???
You mean-
Isn't a union what you use to connect nuts together???
Henry77
"kjpro" <( kjpro @ starband . com ) see-my-sig-for-e-mail> wrote in message
news:7d7tb.4772$OP3.137...@twister2.starband.net...
> "Dr. Hardcrab" <drhar...@hotmail.spamcom> wrote in message
> news:bp2brq$mug$3...@bob.news.rcn.net...
> > Isn't a union what you use to connect two flare nuts together???
>
> Nope, it's where you connect two pieces of black pipe together. :-)
>
It can also be used to connect two non-flared copper tubes together and
brazed.
Pipeline9000
Unions are for the weak minded. If you're as good as you think you are
try marketing your skills on the open market. If you're good you'll be
pleased with the results. OR you will be disappointed to find you're
not as good as you thought.
Henry77
"Pipeline9000" <Sweetwate...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:4455998e.03111...@posting.google.com...
RUTRO - the unions worse nightmare - THE WAY THINGS ARE ! All I can say is
WELL PUT - if you need a union to get great wages maybe you are not as great
as you think you are. As I have said - unions have their place - but if you
are talented you can get the wages you deserve without someone sticking
their hand in your pocket.
bill
> RUTRO - the unions worse nightmare - THE WAY THINGS ARE ! All I can say is
> WELL PUT - if you need a union to get great wages maybe you are not as great
> as you think you are. As I have said - unions have their place - but if you
> are talented you can get the wages you deserve without someone sticking
> their hand in your pocket.
Leaves mike's ass out. He's already admitted he can't hack it outside the union.
It's easier to wean welfare recipients off the tit.
ftwhd
>
>"kjpro" <( kjpro @ starband . com ) see-my-sig-for-e-mail> wrote in message
>news:7d7tb.4772$OP3.137...@twister2.starband.net...
>> "Dr. Hardcrab" <drhar...@hotmail.spamcom> wrote in message
>> news:bp2brq$mug$3...@bob.news.rcn.net...
>> > Isn't a union what you use to connect two flare nuts together???
>>
>> Nope, it's where you connect two pieces of black pipe together. :-)
>>
Don't tell me you have never seen a flare union.
>
> It can also be used to connect two non-flared copper tubes together and
>brazed.
>
>
>
No, that's called a coupling. Some couplings have a dimple in them
and some don't. The ones that don't are called slip couplings. Now if
you get in a pinch and just have a regular coupling but need a slip,
you can file the dimple off.
Mike
UA local 370
bill
<ftwhd@fuckoffspammers> wrote:
> you get in a pinch and just have a regular coupling but need a slip,
> you can file the dimple off.
>
> Mike
> UA local 370
Union training eh? Too sad.
Noon-Air
"bill" <swag...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:swag_one-ya02408000R1411032151370001@news-server...
kjpro
news:meqarvo7fu4fq3hhd...@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 14 Nov 2003 18:32:15 -0500, "Henry77" <:-P> wrote:
>
> >
> >"kjpro" <( kjpro @ starband . com ) see-my-sig-for-e-mail> wrote in
message
> >news:7d7tb.4772$OP3.137...@twister2.starband.net...
> >> "Dr. Hardcrab" <drhar...@hotmail.spamcom> wrote in message
> >> news:bp2brq$mug$3...@bob.news.rcn.net...
> >> > Isn't a union what you use to connect two flare nuts together???
> >>
> >> Nope, it's where you connect two pieces of black pipe together. :-)
> >>
> Don't tell me you have never seen a flare union.
You missed my :-), :-)
> Mike
ps Yes, I have seen both. :-)
REL
> Well - I am pretty SURE I am one of the "NEW" guys you refer to HOWEVER I
<he said climbing off his soapbox>.
LMAO, your post made nearly no sense at all.
CLUE <===== print it out so you have one.
To sit and pretend these problems i snipped from your mindless
rambling are associated only with the union companies is so idiotic i
felt compelled to respond.
If you actually buy into your own bullshit, you have more problems
than you know.
Oh yeah, I am not in the union either, however, I am not stupid enough
to pretend that problems associated with the unions is limited to
those groups. you have described problems that evolve and exist in
every facet of business and even more so with politicians.
The bullshit about being able to negociate your own deal and do just
as well is extreemely flawed as well. No you say? Show me a right to
work state and I will show you lower wages every single time.
Get off your soap box and look at the world for what it is and quit
pretending it is all those evil people causing problems and realise
that when it comes down to it, them evil people are everywhere and one
can only consider things for what they really are.
the other rich
TURTLE
"profft" <ftay...@BIGcox.net> wrote in message
news:nsVsb.127$uG5.82@okepread03...
This is Turtle.
I have been listening all the union this and union that and some here seems
to not know what a union is for or what it is used for. I have been around a
while and have seen first hand where a union was needed bad to try to keep
business in line with respectiable practices. Years ago there was union
businesses and no union businesses and you did not want to work for the none
union companys , because they did not give a damn about you and you was just
a tool to use and if that tool could not proform at 100%. Just change that
tool out and get a younger tool to take his place. Now here is a example of
where a union was a very good thing and did got some respect back in
industry. In about 1956 my grand father was working at a paper mill called
Southern Paper [ in Elizabeth , Louisiana ] where the word union was a bad
word and if you said the word union in front of a superviser or in front of
one of the sniches, You was fired on the spot. The mill had been open for 30
years and not one person ever retired from the place the whole 30 years.
When you got over 50 years of age. They just fired you for some trumped up
charge and had you replaced by a younger fellow. In 1956 they went union by
the workers and 90% signed up. The company just fired all 90% and started
hiring new workers and did not ask a question at all as to what they wanted
or what the story was. The mill shut down because everybody was gone. The
mill hired a strike breaker crew to come in and run the mill till they could
hire a new bunch of people. This all took place about 1957 and there was a
bunch of people that got killed but there was more strike breaker that got
killed than union members. The strike breaker fellows was leaving by the
bunches for they did not like the ideal of just being killed and no body
would say a word about. The union members was loosing or being killed about
20 and the strike breaker crew had lost about 60 something. This went on
till about 1958 when the Southern Paper company just shut the doors and left
town. About this time Boise Cascade bought the mill and talk to the union
about reopening the mill and they got together and opened it back up under a
union shop. Bosie offered $3.50 a hour or 3 times the wages per hour as the
Southern Paper co. and they hit it off , right away. The mill was moved
about 15 years ago to a new location about 12 miles away and is still
running today and I might add it is a nice place to work at. In this case
the union was the best thing there was in this world to try to have some
respect in making a living. My grand father did not return for he took a job
with Santa Fe Railroad as a steam engine operator in the railroad system
around here. He was one of the 6 people who started the union in the first
place. When some of the youngesters says the union suck. I think about this
case and say to myself " Hummmmm he must not know much about history and the
union's part in it".
Now day where they have EOE laws and Employement laws to protect a worker
from being railroaded out the door. We my only need union in about 10 or 15%
of the work places we have now. Years ago we needed about 80% of the work
places for there was no child labor laws, minium wages, can't be fired
because your over 50 years of age, can't be fired because you don't have sex
with your boss, or last of all you don't have to give up your respect to
work at a place.
Now if you judge a person by being or not being a Union member. You don't
have much of a yard stick to use to measure a person with. Being or not
being a union member should not matter as to what you think about a person.
A person should be measured by his ability and respect for others and if you
are a non-union man or a union man should not be apart of what you think
about him. If you start judging people by what they belong to you then will
have to start concidering his race, creed , religion, and political party
membership. There is a word for this but I will not go there.
Just some thoughts on this name calling and stereo typing people.
TURTLE
bill
<noon...@comcast.net> wrote:
> Ya know, it seems to me that the worlds best/worst union is the US Military.
They have standards. mike could never get in.
Henry77
"REL" <rl...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3fb5d2b0...@news.west.earthlink.net...
Well - my point was and still is unions have outgrown there usefulnees and
have evolved into corrupt organizations - my posts sometimes ramble but the
points are there . I never said that the corruption was limited to the union
hierarchy (show me where I said that?) - yes it exists in politics (guess
that's maybe why unions are so involved in politics ?) and in upper levels
of management . Unfortunately I have to purchase things from these companies
which unfortunately partially supports the corruption there. I pay taxes
which
unfortunately supports some of the corruption in politics but I say why feed
that beast three times (the 2nd being the contributions from big companies
to politicians) by paying dues to a union which has no use (safety or wages)
. Guess that's why they are refusing to unionize in the southern auto and
other plants. Several news programs have interviewed workers from that area
in the past as the why they don't want unions and the answers were
simmilar - they have good wages, safe working conditions , and good benefits
so why unionize.
Henry
Henry77
Turtle;
I have been saying that all along - at one time unions were desperately
needed but now have evolved into nothing more than corrupt organizations.
Sometimes a union seems to exist for no reason but to collect money. One
such example is a small local grocery store chain - they start their people
at $5.15/hr (wooho - minimum wage) and the pt people average 15 hours a
week. Once a month the union hits the PT for around $50 dues (same as FT
people) so that basicall wipes out his check and for what - no benefts (for
PT people) and mw (this info comes from a neighbors kid who used to work
there).
I also agree that people should not be judged by if they belong to a union.
I have read posts that state that the most talented people are in unions and
that if you want the best work done call a union company - what does that
make the rest of these guys - pond scum? The only union members I
intentionally bash are the reps on up as I see that as the problem. As I
said before I have worked 4 unions and all the reps/officers I ran across
were mainly concerned for themselves. As I stated before - my last job we
complained about a safety issue- we were called whiners and someone got hurt
the next week because of it then it was taken care of (why were we paying
union dues again?). Don't get me wrong - I am sure there are good people
working as reps out there but the are rare and I am judging from my own
experience and what I have heard from others.
Henry
Joseph
I was trying to put together a post to say something like that but it
could not compare to your post. There are trades that still need union
support but the advanced trades only need an association of some type as the
support/lobbyist/watch dog group.
Just my thoughts... Joseph
"TURTLE" <tur...@worldnetla.net> wrote in message
news:bp4nc7$1kklad$1...@ID-79743.news.uni-berlin.de...
Henry77
"ftwhd" <ftwhd@fuckoffspammers> wrote in message
news:meqarvo7fu4fq3hhd...@4ax.com...
Hmm - it seems that this is one of the errors in my textbook. In the book
it says "a coupling (sometimes called a union) is used to join 2 refrigerant
lines together". I just checked into the details of the publisher - wouldn't
ya know it - it is done by a union company. Guess that's why they didn't
catch the errors in this book :-/
profft
digs at Mike which is why I said what I said and PLONKED who I plonked.
"TURTLE" <tur...@worldnetla.net> wrote in message
news:bp4nc7$1kklad$1...@ID-79743.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
Pipeline9000
> Now if you judge a person by being or not being a Union member. You don't
> have much of a yard stick to use to measure a person with. Being or not
> being a union member should not matter as to what you think about a person.
> A person should be measured by his ability and respect for others and if you
> are a non-union man or a union man should not be apart of what you think
> about him. If you start judging people by what they belong to you then will
> have to start concidering his race, creed , religion, and political party
> membership. There is a word for this but I will not go there.
>
> Just some thoughts on this name calling and stereo typing people.
>
> TURTLE
I judge no one according to weather they belong to a union or not.
Unions are about politics and exploitation. Period.
Here's a little story about how the Unions made the lives of some
small towns people much better (read: brainwashed them and made them
dependant on the Unions)
Say I lived in a poor community where no high paying jobs were within
a 30 minute commute and God forbid we go out of our way and drive to
another town to find work, like many small manufacturing towns in
America were before the plants were built. Everyone here farms, works
in town, or is on welfare. They were born into it and they were taught
to accept this life style by their parents who weren't creative enough
to get out.
Then the textile mill comes along and brings hundreds of jobs and
everyone loves the textile mill! New jobs and better pay! 1750 people
live in this town and only 250 jobs at the mill so if anyone threatens
to quit if they don't get a raise, the mill has no problem replacing
them and doesn't increase wages because of the oversupply of
employees. But noe one ever quits so theres no problem.
Then the union reps come around and tell all the workers how if they
unite, walk off the job and let no one else in to do the work they
will make more money. Basically shut down the company (read: hold the
company hostage essentially placing a gun to their heads and robbing
them). Remember, I'm not inspired enough to drive to the next town to
find work so I'll join up with the Thugs (Union) and rob the company I
work for.
So the Thugs negotiate a contract between the workers and the company
for higher wages and better benefits, the plant reopens and the
employees are happy. Everyone can't wait to join the Thugs and get
higher wages than the free market would normally pay. They don't mind
paying the Thugs a little bit of each check (Thugs call it "dues" but
it really sounds like protection money to me). Over the five year term
of the contract the Thugs and the workers meet regularly to plan their
next attack on the mill. At the end of the contract the workers
"strike" for better pay. (once again holding the gun to the mill
company's head) They are now as leaches the the mill can't get rid of.
The mill invested heavily to build a plant and bring jobs to an
impoverished area but they are now being bled by the Thugs.
And all the people had to do if they wanted more money was to find
work elsewhere. If the mill started losing employees they would up the
wages to protect their investment. Make sense? Not if your a Thug.
'Nuff said
Oscar_lives
Very good post.
I think it depends on the area. In St. Louis, MO, a skilled tradesman can't
hardly get a job without being in the union. The apprenticeship programs in
St. Louis provide skilled training better than most public
vocational-technical schools. I would put the St. Louis apprenticeship
training programs up against any other school as far as putting out great
workers.
The Teamsters in Kansas City are also very community-oriented. Sure, those
guys get paid well, but they also do the job well. They also give back to
the community and support others. The National SkillsUSA-VICA conference
could not be hosted as well as it is now without the KC teamsters support.
Those guys are great to work with, and they are great at sharing what they
know, even to us scabs. (The bastards won't give me a "Hoffa" T-shirt, even
though I have been working with them for over 7 years...)
"TURTLE" <tur...@worldnetla.net> wrote in message
news:bp4nc7$1kklad$1...@ID-79743.news.uni-berlin.de...
>
Noon-Air
Just for grinns, if somebody like me (licensed master mechanical contractor)
in Mississippi was to move to St Louis or LA or Detroit....someplace where
unions are prevolent, what kind of hoops would I have to jump through and
what kind of qualifiers would I need to join a union and start at something
better than a broom pusher or gofer??
I ask this because I just don't know.
"Oscar_lives" <nospam@2no_tspam.net> wrote in message
news:psBtb.208860$Fm2.203877@attbi_s04...
Oscar_lives
"Noon-Air" <noon...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:SKWdnfFHw6Q...@comcast.com...
Bubba
business, I decided to try out a union shop. I went to 2 interviews at
one shop. You have to be recommended to the union by someone in the
union. Bottom line was, even as experienced as I was and the
$750,000 I was able to bring in on my own in a year, they still wanted
me to start as their "bitch" pay dues and all for $16hr. I seem to
remember hearing laughing (my own) as I left.
Not a real promising experience for me.
Bubba
On Sat, 15 Nov 2003 20:53:19 -0600, "Noon-Air" <noon...@comcast.net>
wrote:
TURTLE
This is Turtle.
Sorry to hear about your Union Phobia problem but if you can get some help
with the local doctors. i would be willing to try to help as much as I can.
I had a friend that had the Nigger Phobia problem , but his daughter married
a black fellow and had some kids and he softened up a great deal. He's just
about back to normal now and can understand that black people are human too.
If you could get around some people who belong to a union and see that they
are human too just like you. You might be able to deal with it better and
understand that they are human just like you.
If i can help you in anyay just let me know.
TURTLE
kjpro
Take it easy, Turtle........for the truth sometimes hurts. :-)
Everybody is ok, till they prove it other wise.
TURTLE
"kjpro" <( kjpro @ starband . com ) see-my-sig-for-e-mail> wrote in message
This is Turtle.
I just got tire hearing union this , union that , Mike something -- Union
there, Union that , screw Union something, and It became a broken record
Screw Mike , Screw union and back and forth. Everytime i log on to alt.hvac
I say to myself well I wonder what Bill has to say about Mike or the Union
today. I went back 3,000 post on alt.hvac and all bill has to say is Unions
sucks and mike does to. Now to you Heney 77 , You need to answer for
yourself and not be a echo of Bill. Now everytime Bill starts bashing union
/ Mike / a poster / or anything, Your right there echoing Bills words -- you
got it boss , yea , yes sir rebob, That's it you go boy. Answer for yourself
and not be a echo.
If all this bashing keeps going , I'll Talk to Paul about changing the name
of alt.hvac to <alt.Bash. unions.Mike.and sometimes talk about hvac>. This
shit is getting old.
You had said watch out for the trueth hurts. Well when it gets to a stupid
level I will speak up. Till that time I keep my mouth shut. This has got to
a stupid level and got old enough to boar anybody.
alt.hvac needs to go back to the hvac talk group and not bash who i want
today.
Ok You can have the Soap Box Back.
TURTLE
bill
> That was my point entirely, and I just got tired of seeing all the little
> digs at Mike which is why I said what I said and PLONKED who I plonked.
Kissing mike's ass does seem to suit you.
bill
Thanks.
Mike is an asshole and anything that goads him works for me.
I don't give a shit about the union one way or another.
I backed off his ass the last time he flipped out.
He isn't getting any kid gloves from me.
p...@see_my_sig_for_address.com
Same here.
Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
New HVAC/R program for Palm PDA's !! http://pmilligan.net/palm/
Free demo now available online !!!!
--
Free superheat charts for 38 Ref's online at http://pmilligan.net/pmtherm/
My personal site is at http://www.pmilligan.net
Bubba
wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 03:51:29 -0600, "TURTLE" <tur...@worldnetla.net>
>wrote:
>
>>I just got tire hearing union this , union that , Mike something -- Union
>>there, Union that , screw Union something, and It became a broken record
>>Screw Mike , Screw union and back and forth. Everytime i log on to alt.hvac
>>I say to myself well I wonder what Bill has to say about Mike or the Union
>>today. I went back 3,000 post on alt.hvac and all bill has to say is Unions
>>sucks and mike does to. Now to you Heney 77 , You need to answer for
>>yourself and not be a echo of Bill. Now everytime Bill starts bashing union
>>/ Mike / a poster / or anything, Your right there echoing Bills words -- you
>>got it boss , yea , yes sir rebob, That's it you go boy. Answer for yourself
>>and not be a echo.
>>
>>If all this bashing keeps going , I'll Talk to Paul about changing the name
>>of alt.hvac to <alt.Bash. unions.Mike.and sometimes talk about hvac>. This
>>shit is getting old.
>>
>>You had said watch out for the trueth hurts. Well when it gets to a stupid
>>level I will speak up. Till that time I keep my mouth shut. This has got to
>>a stupid level and got old enough to boar anybody.
>>
>>alt.hvac needs to go back to the hvac talk group and not bash who i want
>>today.
>>
>>Ok You can have the Soap Box Back.
>
>While I agree with you in principle, Turtle, the flaming runs way
>beyond unions. There are several participants here that apparently
>don't like each other and flame at will. Mike is one of them and
>hardly innocent of flaming others on here. It seems to me to be one
>of those chicken and the egg type of thing.
>
>IMO, it's part and parcel of flaming HOs that come on here asking
>questions. Seems to me if you get tired of the HO questions, skip it.
>The response takes effort so I have to come to the conclusion there is
>some pleasure derived in flaming the HO otherwise why bother? I think
>Noon-Air has the best canned response to the general HO question in
>advising them to call a tech. It's civil and gives what is in most
>cases the best advice.
>
>Some say this group is sort of like a bunch of techs hanging out at a
>bar after work. The way we're eating each other up it must be about
>2am.
Steve Scott,
Mike is no different than most of the rest in here. He will give
answers to some and flame others like the rest of us. Personally, I
think he knows his shit. There will always be confrontations in here.
It comes from strong willed, strong minded people that believe in what
they do. Everyone WON'T always get along. If they did, there wouldnt
be wars, differences of opinion, religion or party. At best, you hope
everyone just trys (I said trys) to be civil. Thats just a part of
life. Hell, look at how Paul and I went at it some time back. No big
deal. Water over the bridge as far as Im concerned. I have an opinion
about him the same as he does me. I can live with that.
Now for the shit flinging:
Personally Im getting a bit tired of hearing Bill go off on his rants
about Mike and his union thoughts. Bill, we all understand your
thoughts about both. Give it a rest. I think we've heard enough.
Henry77, you need to stop following Bills' lead and jumping on the
band wagon everytime Bill brings it up. Start a new subject or
something. We all understand your point of view on that matter now.
There, that being said, Im sure that outta stir the pot just a bit.
Also, Im not the alt.hvac police. Its a free country. Post what you
want. As you can see, I just did. :-P
Have a nice day.
Bubba :-)
bill
<REMOVEl...@iname.com> wrote:
Give it a rest. I think we've heard enough.
> Henry77, you need to stop following Bills' lead and jumping on the
> band wagon everytime Bill brings it up. Start a new subject or
> something. We all understand your point of view on that matter now.
> There, that being said, Im sure that outta stir the pot just a bit.
> Also, Im not the alt.hvac police. Its a free country. Post what you
> want. As you can see, I just did. :-P
> Have a nice day.
> Bubba :-)
Ok.
--
A professional is someone who does a good job even when they don't feel like it.
-me
p...@see_my_sig_for_address.com
wrote:
>life. Hell, look at how Paul and I went at it some time back. No big
>deal. Water over the bridge as far as Im concerned. I have an opinion
>about him the same as he does me. I can live with that.
Yep. Don't know that Bubba's opinion of me has changed any,
nor mine of him, but we both kind of came to an unspoken agreement to
just quit bitching about it. It seems to be working well.
And I tried the same thing with Mike - not good enough for
him, he had to keep throwing his snide shit around. Even in my
kill-file, it leaked out in other people's posts.
I do agree that a lot of what goes on here these days is
useless BS. Yeh, I throw my pokes at Mike periodically - but not to
the degree that others do. The whole Tommy P thing is pretty much
stupid, too.
Mike brings it on himself - he just can't keep his big fucking
mouth shut.
ftwhd
wrote:
>On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 15:35:22 GMT, pjm@see_my_sig_for_address.com
>wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 15:33:03 GMT, swag...@hotmail.com (bill) wrote:
>>
>>>In article <bp7hck$1gu8va$1...@ID-79743.news.uni-berlin.de>, "TURTLE"
>>><tur...@worldnetla.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Ok You can have the Soap Box Back.
>>>>
>>>> TURTLE
>>>
>>>Thanks.
>>>Mike is an asshole and anything that goads him works for me.
>>>I don't give a shit about the union one way or another.
>>>I backed off his ass the last time he flipped out.
>>>He isn't getting any kid gloves from me.
>>
>> Same here.
>
>What purpose does the incessant sniping serve?
It pumps up their frail ego's.
Mike
UA local 370
profft
"ftwhd" <ftwhd@fuckoffspammers> wrote in message
> >
> >What purpose does the incessant sniping serve?
>
> It pumps up their frail ego's.
>
> Mike
> UA local 370
Lets him feel like the hot turd in the bowl hiding behind a hotmail addy
`The line below is true.
The line above is false.'
profft
all about too. He came sculking around again back in August pretending like
he knew something about something and you nailed him on it bigtime. This
didn't exactly give Paulie a warm and fuzzy in your regard so they cooked
this shit up off line and figured to stir the shit back up again in here.
Good thing I was working out the kinks on the Troll Alert feature on the
Internet Interface on the new Mark V, sinse it's already in production it's
too late to do anything with the ROM for those already shipped but there
will be a downloadable software patch if it didn't come with the upgraded
ROM. ;-)
"ftwhd" <ftwhd@fuckoffspammers> wrote in message
news:3i6frvkottufc0r3e...@4ax.com...
p...@see_my_sig_for_address.com
wrote:
>Told you it was Paulies ButtBuddy Bill Turdsucker.
Back in my kill file, you little thief.
Lord only knows why I ever gave a thief a second chance at
trying to act like an honorable man - I should have realized it's
beyond you. The only thing you know is how to rip people off.
plonk
Pipeline9000
Take it easy Turtle. I worked for a union outfit so my experience is
first hand. I also have friends that belong to unions who consider it
balsphemous ( yes Turtle, its almost like a religion to them )that I
should try to make a living without the the help of the Thugs (I mean
union). The seduction is complete with them. I like the free markets
best because I get paid according to the level of service I provide to
my employer / customer. I call my own shots and if I fail or succeed
its all my doing and I like it that way.
My friends and I get along fine otherwise.
Have a nice day.
TURTLE
"Bubba" <REMOVEl...@iname.com> wrote in message
news:tg6frvcri0l1qs0j0...@4ax.com...
This is turtle.
i totally agree with you and might add this.
You can flame a person / thing / union / subject for about a 100 times then
stop and move on. Don't run it in the ground for people get tire of hearing
it and will turn on you even when they have no opinion to start with.
TURTLE
TURTLE
> Well, Im no expert but about 2 yrs ago just before I started this
> business, I decided to try out a union shop. I went to 2 interviews at
> one shop. You have to be recommended to the union by someone in the
> union. Bottom line was, even as experienced as I was and the
> $750,000 I was able to bring in on my own in a year, they still wanted
> me to start as their "bitch" pay dues and all for $16hr. I seem to
> remember hearing laughing (my own) as I left.
> Not a real promising experience for me.
> Bubba
This is Turtle.
Point here:
Never go to a Grocery Store and apply for a job , you being the best cash
register operator God let walk the earth, and expect to be paid more than
everybody else till you prove yourself and they can move you up the ladder.
You don't start at the top and move down but start at the bottom and move
up.
Now one point here. What in the hell would you want to got to work for
another company as a tech / worker in someway if you have the job skill to
bring in / produce $750K of business in a year. What was you thinking , Son
?
TURTLE
TURTLE
<pjm@see_my_sig_for_address.com> wrote in message
news:jl7frv0kvhose9lkr...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 15:51:12 GMT, Bubba <REMOVEl...@iname.com>
> wrote:
>
> >life. Hell, look at how Paul and I went at it some time back. No big
> >deal. Water over the bridge as far as Im concerned. I have an opinion
> >about him the same as he does me. I can live with that.
>
> Yep. Don't know that Bubba's opinion of me has changed any,
> nor mine of him, but we both kind of came to an unspoken agreement to
> just quit bitching about it. It seems to be working well.
>
> And I tried the same thing with Mike - not good enough for
> him, he had to keep throwing his snide shit around. Even in my
> kill-file, it leaked out in other people's posts.
>
> I do agree that a lot of what goes on here these days is
> useless BS. Yeh, I throw my pokes at Mike periodically - but not to
> the degree that others do. The whole Tommy P thing is pretty much
> stupid, too.
>
> Mike brings it on himself - he just can't keep his big fucking
> mouth shut.
>
>
>
> Paul ( pjm @ pobox . com ) - remove spaces to email me
This is Turtle.
Don't expect a Bob Cat to keep his mouth shut when you poke him with a
willow limb. A Bob cat will hisssss EVERYTIME you poke him with a willow
limb. It's just common nature.
TURTLE
Bubba
wrote:
Unfortunately when I left that company and decided to do it elsewhere,
no one seemed to be set up for the volume and way of work they did. It
was Quite and experience. Gotta have lots of people in the mix to get
it accomplished. Of course, a lot of it was brow beating and bashing
it down their throats but when you are in a company where everyone
does that, it starts to seem ok.......................for a
while.................then you come around to your
senses.........hopefully.
Bubba
bill
Eat shit and die profft. You know my email address. I started running a
hotline email when the last ms virus was filling the in box.
I ran my email in the open for years.
bill
> Told you it was Paulies ButtBuddy Bill Turdsucker. Now I remember what it's
> all about too. He came sculking around again back in August pretending like
> he knew something about something and you nailed him on it bigtime. This
> didn't exactly give Paulie a warm and fuzzy in your regard so they cooked
> this shit up off line and figured to stir the shit back up again in here.
>
> Good thing I was working out the kinks on the Troll Alert feature on the
> Internet Interface on the new Mark V, sinse it's already in production it's
> too late to do anything with the ROM for those already shipped but there
> will be a downloadable software patch if it didn't come with the upgraded
> ROM. ;-)
Bite me. You're just pissed I consider you a thief. $600+ an hour plus
parts for residential is stealing on a repair.
Get over it. I have.
profft
"bill" <swag...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:swag_one-ya02408000R1611031938490001@news-server...
bill
pjm@see_my_sig_for_address.com wrote:
> On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 14:31:41 -0500, "profft" <ftay...@BIGcox.net>
> wrote:
>
> >Told you it was Paulies ButtBuddy Bill Turdsucker.
>
> Back in my kill file, you little thief.
>
> Lord only knows why I ever gave a thief a second chance at
> trying to act like an honorable man - I should have realized it's
> beyond you. The only thing you know is how to rip people off.
>
> plonk
I think it's funny as hell. I've never sent you even an email and profft
has nursed his conspiracy theory all this time.
I prefer to stab profft to his face.
TURTLE
"Pipeline9000" <Sweetwate...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:4455998e.03111...@posting.google.com...
this is Turtle.
i don't have a crystal ball to tell me what your thinking but only what you
write on the newsgroup. We only get to see what you write and not what is on
your mine. Over the internet your thinking has to be reflected in just what
you write or type.
Write what you are thinking at the time and not write and then thinking
about it later and have some dumb old turtle start talking to you about it.
TURTLE
P.S. And I still Don't want to hear anything about Mike's problems or a
Union Problems of some kind.
bill
It wasn't a secret profft. LOL
I'm very easy to find.
You must have been the only one who didn't pick up I'd changed it.
Oscar_lives
I had to defend you to Bubba the other day. He said that you stink, but I
told him "Like shit he does".
<pjm@see_my_sig_for_address.com> wrote in message
news:jl7frv0kvhose9lkr...@4ax.com...
profft
;-)
"Steve Scott" <ssc...@twcny.rr.com> wrote in message
news:rfhgrvg5u9pbh18jb...@4ax.com...
> Is that Yoda-speak? :)
ftwhd
>In article <JWPtb.199$Jz1.114@okepread03>, "profft" <ftay...@BIGcox.net> wrote:
>
>> "ftwhd" <ftwhd@fuckoffspammers> wrote in message
>> news:3i6frvkottufc0r3e...@4ax.com...
>> > On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 15:37:32 GMT, Steve Scott <ssc...@twcny.rr.com>
>> > wrote:
>> <snip>
>> > >
>> > >What purpose does the incessant sniping serve?
>> >
>> > It pumps up their frail ego's.
>> >
>> > Mike
>> > UA local 370
>>
>> Lets him feel like the hot turd in the bowl hiding behind a hotmail addy
>>
>> `The line below is true.
>> The line above is false.'
>
>Eat shit and die profft. You know my email address. I started running a
>hotline email when the last ms virus was filling the in box.
>I ran my email in the open for years.
Hmmm a virus written for MicroSoft Windows fills up a Macintosh mail
box so the Macintosh user begins to use a MicroSoft e mail program.
Ok. Makes sense. Well makes as much sense as anything else that
dribbles off your lips but I guess it can happen. Try and settle down
Bunghole else you're going to end up popping a vein.
Mike
UA local 370
Bubba
shit.....Thanks you bunch a "humps"
Bubba :-)
On Sun, 16 Nov 2003 23:16:51 -0500, "profft" <ftay...@BIGcox.net>
wrote:
bill
<ftwhd@fuckoffspammers> wrote:
> Hmmm a virus written for MicroSoft Windows fills up a Macintosh mail
> box so the Macintosh user begins to use a MicroSoft e mail program.
> Ok. Makes sense.
How cute. You thought I check that email address?
Well makes as much sense as anything else that
> dribbles off your lips but I guess it can happen. Try and settle down
> Bunghole else you're going to end up popping a vein.
>
> Mike
> UA local 370
You and iovedoii seem to have a thing about bungholes.
Is that a union thing?
Henry77
>
> "kjpro" <( kjpro @ starband . com ) see-my-sig-for-e-mail> wrote in
message
> news:iSEtb.5099$Vo2.149...@twister2.starband.net...
> >
> > Everybody is ok, till they prove it other wise.
> >
> > --
> > kjpro
>
> This is Turtle.
>
> I just got tire hearing union this , union that , Mike something -- Union
> there, Union that , screw Union something, and It became a broken record
> Screw Mike , Screw union and back and forth. Everytime i log on to
alt.hvac
> I say to myself well I wonder what Bill has to say about Mike or the Union
> today. I went back 3,000 post on alt.hvac and all bill has to say is
Unions
> sucks and mike does to. Now to you Heney 77 , You need to answer for
> yourself and not be a echo of Bill. Now everytime Bill starts bashing
union
> / Mike / a poster / or anything, Your right there echoing Bills words --
you
> got it boss , yea , yes sir rebob, That's it you go boy. Answer for
yourself
> and not be a echo.
Turtle;
Yeah I hear what you are saying but after being a member of 4 unions (the
last being the worst) I just got sick of hearing how "GREAT" the unions are
and that the most talented people only work in the unions or that the best
contractors are unionized. It just happenned I agreed with what Bill was
saying (not because he said it but from personal experience) and then when
personal attacks on my intelligence were being launched by Mike that got
me - if I really wanted to be a jerk I would have corrected evry blatant
grammar error but I held my tongue .
Henry
Henry77
Bubba;
I agree with you and it's not just me a matter of jumpimg on Bill's wagon
(actually in some posts he followed in on mine). It just seems that eveytime
I turn around Mike is saying stuff like the best and most talented people
work for the unions (guess that makes the rest of us what?) and that
homeowners should look for a union shop to get the best work. Those are the
parts I challenged and got in return personal attacks on my intelligence and
schooling. Ok- I got on him for those stupid pictures - enough said. Lately
I have asked questions and in he marches with his union banter so it sounds
like he is starting to be more a troll (but not quite as he can contribute
VERY usefull info as long as he keeps the union label at home )
profft
"Henry77" <:-P> wrote in message news:vriq50...@corp.supernews.com...
>
>
> Turtle;
> Yeah I hear what you are saying but after being a member of 4 unions (the
> last being the worst) I just got sick of hearing how "GREAT" the unions
are
> and that the most talented people only work in the unions or that the best
> contractors are unionized. It just happenned I agreed with what Bill was
> saying (not because he said it but from personal experience) and then when
> personal attacks on my intelligence were being launched by Mike that got
> me - if I really wanted to be a jerk I would have corrected evry blatant
> grammar error but I held my tongue .
>
> Henry
>
Well that's why we're watching you so intently, we have high hopes for you.
bill
>
> Well that's why we're watching you so intently, we have high hopes for you.
And YOU bring what creditials to determine what?
Get off the horse and back away.
ftwhd
>
>Turtle;
> Yeah I hear what you are saying but..
snip
God damn boy, you are dense!
Pssst Henry, no one cares. Get over it and go hack in another
furnace for Catatonic U or something. Sheesh what a maroon.
Mike
UA local 370
RSCamaro
wrote:
>question just came to mind....
>Just for grinns, if somebody like me (licensed master mechanical contractor)
>in Mississippi was to move to St Louis or LA or Detroit....someplace where
>unions are prevolent, what kind of hoops would I have to jump through and
>what kind of qualifiers would I need to join a union and start at something
>better than a broom pusher or gofer??
>
>I ask this because I just don't know.
My qualifiers aren't the same as yours but here is my answer.
I applied for a job with a rather large company which is a union shop.
I went down to the hall and paid something like $250 to set myself up
and the first months dues. Normally it is something like $1,200 to
join. They gave me a B ticket (Steamfitter/Refrigeration) and I was
on my way. I wouldn't have joined for anything less than a
Journeyman, with the time I have behind me in the field.
I would more likely think that you would come in as a contractor
rather than an employee. I'm sure that becoming a contractor is
different than joining as a tech.
...Ron
--
68' RS Camaro
88' Formula Bird
http://www.frontiernet.net/~rscamero
Some are wise and some are otherwise
profft
"bill" <swag...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:swag_one-ya02408000R1711032033160001@news-server...
bill
> When I want to hear from an ASSHOLE I'll eat a can of beans
You should quit talking to yourself.
Henry77
"ftwhd" <ftwhd@fuckoffspammers> wrote in message
>
Thanks for proving my point about you Mike. :-)
Vicki
member today, I can agree (for once) with Profft. We *do* have more
than our fair share of wackos in our union, but they do negotiate our
wages and benefits. At this point, they are doing a better job than
Mike's union as we're making more than folks working out of the UA
local here. But, what do they say, a rising tide lifts all ships.
But I am also in a right-to-work state, which recognizes your
right to decide whether or not to join a union. It also is a tribute
to the fact that there are a lot of fine non-members and former
members out there.
I just object to the PAC money and receive a refund on my portion
of the dues sent to them, and will do so until my union and I agree on
political philosophies...which, as a libertarian, will be when there
are Baskin-Robbins stores in hell. I will be thrilled to death when
they recognize that businesses hiring illegals are bringing down the
wages and benefits of all tradesmen, as people running aboveboard
businesses cannot compete with people paying their painters and
bricklayers five bucks an hour.
Vicki
"profft" <ftay...@BIGcox.net> wrote in message news:<nsVsb.127$uG5.82@okepread03>...
> Many of our brother and sister technicians are in Unions and despite the
> Jimmy Hoffa's they without a doubt some of the most highly trained
> individuals on the planet. Just because you don't belong to a union it does
> not mean that fine wage you earn now is not do in part to the existance of
> unions. Some of you new guys have been ragging on Mike because he proudly
> belongs to a union, well that's total bullshit. Mike's a good guy and I can
> assure you he has nothing todo with any corruption, real or imagined that
> the leadership may or may not be into.
profft
"Vicki" <vic...@usa.net> wrote in message
news:fbf87332.03111...@posting.google.com...
Oscar_lives
"Bubba" <REMOVEl...@iname.com> wrote in message
news:f0ghrv4bo850pkr9m...@4ax.com...
Bubba
"trollin, trollin, trollin........"
Bubba
On Wed, 19 Nov 2003 23:23:26 GMT, "Oscar_lives" <nospam@2no_tspam.net>