Is New Yorker boiler OK?

[Don Tomei]

Hello All,

I've been monitoring (aka, "lurking in") this group off and on for about
a year as we've planned and partially executed a basement renovation
project. I posted a question last August (2000) about direct venting
high efficiency boilers, and your responses were very helpful in
formulating our decision not to do that. (In case you're interested, I
was subsequently told by an architect that it is never legal to direct
vent a boiler in the city of Chicago.)

I have one more question that I hope you won't mind my asking. We have
hot water heat in our 105 year old city rowhouse, and rather than
installing bulky baseboards on an old cracked cement floor, we decided
to tear up the old basement floor and install radiant heat in a new
one. (Level the floor, save space and gain some headroom, all in one
fell swoop.) So far, everything seems to be proceeding as planned --
the Wirsbo tubing is buried in the floor and the new boiler is about to
be installed.

Which is where the question comes up. My HVAC contractor and I had
discussed a range of possible boilers and pretty much settled on a
Burnham or Weil-McLain. I told him I didn't care as long as it was a
solid, high quality product. In other words, don't get an inexpensive
boiler, get a good one. Now last week, he showed up with a New Yorker
boiler, and until I saw it down there I had never heard of it. I
questioned his choice and he said, "It's made by Burnham; it's the same
thing."

Well, I did some online research and I've found out New Yorker is indeed
owned by Burnham. But I don't think they are "made by" Burnham, and I
certainly don't think they are the same thing. From what I can tell,
New Yorkers are steel and Burnham and W-M are cast iron. So should I be
concerned about this? Should I ask him to take it back and bring in a
Burnham instead? I hate to ask him to remove and replace something so
cumbersome (especially since it might piss him off, excuse my French),
but we never discussed New Yorker and I'm sensing I might be getting
slightly scammed here. On the other hand, if New Yorker is a quality
product, I'll be fine with that.

Anyway, that's the story. If you feel like responding, I would most
appreciate it. If not, I'll understand that, too. And if you tell me
to go f*** myself for bothering you . . . well, I live in the big city
so that would be about par for the course anyway. : )

Thanks a bunch. This group is not only informative, it's pretty
entertaining too.
Don Tomei
Chicago

[L. d'Rado]

Is there a large block above the burner for cleanout access? If so, that
would be an FR-series boiler, which is preferable to the AP-series (which
vents out the top.) Steel boilers are cheaper than cast iron...the only
advantage I can think of...and even that advantage is small these days. The
FR is not bad for a steel boiler. On par with Burnham, if not a little
better. We've had problems with the AP, though...and it usually doesnt last
as long as an FR. But then again, neither will outlast a good cast iron
boiler. I presume this is an oil boiler?
Don Tomei <d...@christ-tomei.com> wrote in message
news:3BB7372C...@christ-tomei.com...

[Don Tomei]

No it's not an oil boiler, it's gas. And I can't tell if it's FR or AP, since
it doesn't say that anywhere. It's a CG-A Series, Model# CG60ANI-LE2. There
is a removeable access panel in the front bottom for cleaning the burners, but
I don't think that's what you mean by a "large block." And it definitely
vents out the top.

Thanks for the information, though, d'Rado. This means I definitely have to
have a serious discussion with my contractor.

Don

[L. d'Rado]

Disregard most of my post....It's irrelevant since I assumed you were
discussing an oil boiler. Still....cast iron is preferable to steel.

Don Tomei <d...@christ-tomei.com> wrote in message

news:3BB7A89F...@christ-tomei.com...

[Bruce Birbeck]

Don Tomei wrote:
>
> Hello All,

>
> I told him I didn't care as long as it was a
> solid, high quality product. In other words, don't get an inexpensive
> boiler, get a good one. Now last week, he showed up with a New Yorker
> boiler, and until I saw it down there I had never heard of it. I
> questioned his choice and he said, "It's made by Burnham; it's the same
> thing."
>

Well.... The profit from the sale ends up in the same pocket. Burnham
'acquired' New Yorker.

> Well, I did some online research and I've found out New Yorker is indeed
> owned by Burnham. But I don't think they are "made by" Burnham, and I
> certainly don't think they are the same thing. From what I can tell,
> New Yorkers are steel and Burnham and W-M are cast iron.

Bingo.

> So should I be
> concerned about this?

Yes. He's sliding a steel boiler into the space where he promised a cast
iron one.

> Should I ask him to take it back and bring in a
> Burnham instead?

Your call. Is the job cost plus, or contract? If the latter, I'd have
him replace it, and watch him close for other details....

> I hate to ask him to remove and replace something so
> cumbersome (especially since it might piss him off, excuse my French),
> but we never discussed New Yorker and I'm sensing I might be getting
> slightly scammed here.

You might be, but then again.... Burnham came out with a "new" steel
boiler after the 'acquisition', and it looked like the more foreword
thinking Burnham engineers had kicked some butt in the NY R&D dept.
Swing door, three pass design.
Perhaps NY has come out with a "new" cast iron boiler which, oddly
enough, looks a lot like a Burnham; just green instead of blue. What
color is it?

> On the other hand, if New Yorker is a quality
> product, I'll be fine with that.

It is. It is one of the best steel boilers on the market. Many of the
ones i dealt with 30 years ago are still at work. Some must have been
recycled, but I dunno.

>
> Anyway, that's the story. If you feel like responding, I would most
> appreciate it. If not, I'll understand that, too. And if you tell me
> to go f*** myself for bothering you . . . well, I live in the big city
> so that would be about par for the course anyway. : )
>
> Thanks a bunch. This group is not only informative, it's pretty
> entertaining too.
> Don Tomei
> Chicago

Well, don't go fuLk yerself, but don't get fluked either. If you were
promised a C.I. boiler, and are going to pay for one, be sure you get
it, as well as all the rest of the equipment and fittings
mentioned/implied in the contract. Ask about circulator isolation
valves, for example.
If you were told "I'll give you a deal, this won't cost as much as it
might" you may consider the bargain of having the house heated for less
money verses having a unit that might well be running after you are
dead, at a lofty age, of natural causes.
Your call.
Oh, and one more thing about Burnham. They feature cast iron push
nipples between the sections, rather than steel or >shudder< gaskets.
Like material expands and contracts at the same rate......

[Don Tomei]

Thank you for the information, Bruce. Here's what I've learned so far,
from talking to the local distributer and also to the New Yorker company
directly.

The inside of the boiler (I don't know what you call it, the guts that
hold the water) is made by Burnham and it is indeed cast iron. I don't
know if they just started doing this, but the local distributer said
that New Yorker is new to this particular market and that's why people
here are unfamiliar with it.

From what you've said about New Yorker, I don't need to be concerned
about general quality. If Burnham makes the sections for New Yorker the
same way they make their own, like with the cast iron push nipples you
mentioned, it should be a dandy.

FYI, the boiler is green. Looks fine to me, then again how would I know
anyway?

Bottom line, I think it's a damn fine boiler. Thanks for all your
help. (Now if they would just get it up and running before the first
frost hits, I'll be in hog heavan.)

Thanks again,
Don

[su...@mcpld.org]

This was so informative. I'm getting a New Yorker cg d series put in tomorrow. I hope it is good quality. My 40 yr old crane boiler just died. My semi retired plumber said no to New Yorker but his counter partner says they are made by burnham. Any thoughts steel one.

[petersheatin...@gmail.com]

[petersheatin...@gmail.com]

Hi i dont know when this was posted but i am an heating contractor and burnham makes New Yorker their gas product line is all cast iron, their oil product line comes in cast iron and steel as does Burnham.
i dont know if this helps you in any way best rest assured New Yorker is a great boiler.

[wayn...@gmail.com]

[wayn...@gmail.com]

My New Yorker FR steel oil boiler is 35 years old and still doing fine.

[Richard]

from all the reviews I've read its a decent boiler. Its an offshoot of Burnham.

https://highperformancehvac.com/new-yorker-boiler-reviews-consumer-ratings/

On Sunday, September 30, 2001 at 11:15:56 AM UTC-4, Don Tomei wrote:

[ehaa...@gmail.com]

Absolutely yes. My 47 year old New Yorker is just now needing replacement. No issues ever and it provided for both domestic hot water and hot water baseboards. Getting another New Yorker!

[cathy...@gmail.com]

On Monday, November 6, 2017 at 9:34:26 PM UTC-5, ehaa...@gmail.com wrote:
> Absolutely yes. My 47 year old New Yorker is just now needing replacement. No issues ever and it provided for both domestic hot water and hot water baseboards. Getting another New Yorker!

My father in-law was the owner of NY boiler. While I'm not a boiler expert I know the company history. It was indeed purchased by Burnham. It was sold in 1980's to Burnham and the plant at Colmar, PA manufactured the boilers until the 90's and the plant closed. I think they are now manufactured in Lancaster, Pa still under the name New Yorker.

[Frederick Rose]