Q about T-shirts WERE
Uncle Wolf
ever heard anything final on it. AHWW or were-ness t-shirts was
something that [IIRC] Pinky, now posting as Jakal, was trying to set up.
What happened? Were the t-shirts made and I just missed it? Or was this
something that got RLIed [Real Life Interrupt-ed]?
Here's a design suggestion that I am donating to the group: a white
shirt. On it, a black silhouette of a human hand, but with either the
index or the ring finger longer than the middle ["the bird"] finger [I
always forget which is the folklore sign of wereness]. The thumb of the
shadow-hand should be centermost if the design is placed on the left
chest, like the right hand was placed over the heart. A white generic
animal-paw print silhouette is inside the hand, the hidden paw within
the obvious hand as a motif for the beast hidden within all of us. Two
possible legends encircle the hand-and-paw design: Are You A-Were? [with
or without the hyphen] _or_ Raise Your A-Wereness [again, with or
without the hyphen].
It's just a suggestion, and someone else would have to do the artwork,
since my drawing talent is limited to making Vees into birds. *g* like
so= \/ Sucks, doesn't it? Oh well.
Comments?
Howls and health-wishes to all,
Uncle Wolf
Jakkal
Uncle Wolf wrote:
> I know there was talk on this subject a while ago, but I don't think I
> ever heard anything final on it.
Well, it's not over yet.
> AHWW or were-ness t-shirts was
> something that [IIRC] Pinky, now posting as Jakal, was trying to set up.
> What happened? Were the t-shirts made and I just missed it? Or was this
> something that got RLIed [Real Life Interrupt-ed]?
I offered to do another set of "Official AHWW t-shirts" or something
similiarly cheesy. I got, 3 or 4 replies at most. I can't afford to take a
dive on this, so unless I get a good amount of feedback, it's gonna be a 'no
goer'. Also, Howlie mentioned something about trying to work up some
T-shirts, you might want to ask him :)
>
>
> Here's a design suggestion that I am donating to the group: a white
> shirt. On it, a black silhouette of a human hand, but with either the
> index or the ring finger longer than the middle ["the bird"] finger [I
> always forget which is the folklore sign of wereness]. The thumb of the
> shadow-hand should be centermost if the design is placed on the left
> chest, like the right hand was placed over the heart. A white generic
> animal-paw print silhouette is inside the hand, the hidden paw within
> the obvious hand as a motif for the beast hidden within all of us. Two
> possible legends encircle the hand-and-paw design: Are You A-Were? [with
> or without the hyphen] _or_ Raise Your A-Wereness [again, with or
> without the hyphen].
>
That sounds too much like the "Wolf People" symbol, and I'm sure they'd have
a hissy fit if we stole it :)
--
/\__/\
\/ \/
/|oo \
( | / ) "Two worlds Traveled, Separated, Far Apart
\`@/_/\ |\ But through it all, I remain Wolf-at-Heart"
| | \ / |
|Pinky| \_/ /
|__ __| / \_/
(_/(_|(____/
The WereWoof
WereArt Page: http://www.slash.net/~pinky
------------------------------------------------
Shapeshifting/Therianthropy/Awereness Pages:
http://www.slash.net/~pinky/pshift.html
Includes information/rules for Pshift Mailing List
and IRC channel, and the Shifter's FAQ/encyclopedia.
ash...@my-dejanews.com
Uncle Wolf <tom...@ionet.net> wrote:
> I know there was talk on this subject a while ago, but I don't think I
> something that [IIRC] Pinky, now posting as Jakal, was trying to set up.
> What happened? Were the t-shirts made and I just missed it? Or was this
> something that got RLIed [Real Life Interrupt-ed]?
>
> shirt. On it, a black silhouette of a human hand, but with either the
> index or the ring finger longer than the middle ["the bird"] finger [I
> always forget which is the folklore sign of wereness]. The thumb of the
> shadow-hand should be centermost if the design is placed on the left
> chest, like the right hand was placed over the heart. A white generic
> animal-paw print silhouette is inside the hand, the hidden paw within
> the obvious hand as a motif for the beast hidden within all of us. Two
> possible legends encircle the hand-and-paw design: Are You A-Were? [with
> or without the hyphen] _or_ Raise Your A-Wereness [again, with or
> without the hyphen].
>
> since my drawing talent is limited to making Vees into birds. *g* like
> so= \/ Sucks, doesn't it? Oh well.
>
> Comments?
>
> Howls and health-wishes to all,
> Uncle Wolf
>
Good idea. Ive actually started to put were related logos on my dodge
stealth. Ive asked Al Mackey if I could use his Big Bad Wolf Pic on yerf from
Halloween 96, he obliged and actually said he had always wanted to see his
designs on cars. Its blown up 2 feet across....my liscence plate says
'Bewere'.
> Theres more on the way for my car, but if youre interested in getting a
t-shirt design(i would love to have one), id recommend the creative talents of
Al Mackey
Ashwolf
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
Howlie
>Also, Howlie mentioned something about trying to work up some T-shirts,
you might want to ask him :)
Thanks for the free plug Pinkers <g> A RL friend of mine and I have the
idea and the artwork, now we just need the fundage. Already have a pic
of the art on the web if you wanna check it out and let me know what you
think. Feedback so far has been overwhelmingly positive. :-)
WereWear t-shirt page:
http://www.geocities.com/area51/hollow/8134/werewear.html
Howlie the happy werewolf
Visit Howlie's Den http://www.geocities.com/area51/hollow/8134/ "Just
like a circle in a spiral like a wheel within a wheel,
Never ending nor beginning on an ever-spinning reel,
As these images unwind, like the circles that you find, in the
windmills of your mind."
wolfmage
Howlie wrote in message
<12495-36...@newsd-143.iap.bryant.webtv.net>...
<g> A RL friend of mine and I have the
idea and the artwork, now we just need the fundage. Already have a pic
of the art on the web if you wanna check it out and let me know what you
think. Feedback so far has been overwhelmingly positive. :-)
I got a question for both Howlie and Pinky...how much would it cost to make
another run of tshirts?
Wolfmage
NORMAN J REICH
interested in a "T" if I liked the design. I like what I've heard so far,
so count me in too!!
Norm
Uncle Wolf wrote in message <3654742B...@ionet.net>...
Uncle Wolf
> Uncle Wolf wrote:
>
> [snip]
> > Here's a design suggestion that I am donating to the group: a white
> > shirt. On it, a black silhouette of a human hand, but with either the
> > index or the ring finger longer than the middle ["the bird"] finger [I
> > always forget which is the folklore sign of wereness]. The thumb of the
> > shadow-hand should be centermost if the design is placed on the left
> > chest, like the right hand was placed over the heart. A white generic
> > animal-paw print silhouette is inside the hand, the hidden paw within
> > the obvious hand as a motif for the beast hidden within all of us. Two
> > possible legends encircle the hand-and-paw design: Are You A-Were? [with
> > or without the hyphen] _or_ Raise Your A-Wereness [again, with or
> > without the hyphen].
> >
>
Jakkal wrote:
>
> That sounds too much like the "Wolf People" symbol, and I'm sure they'd have
> a hissy fit if we stole it :)
The "Wolf People"? who that? Don't think I've ever had the pleasure of running
across their website. Actually, the generic paw-print is a steal from the Furry
Forever t-shirts that one kind furr over on alt.lifestyle.furry made recently,
except the FF tees also had an infinity symbol, a sideways 8 [or lemniscate],
representing the Forever part of the tee's concept. I simply erased, in my mind
[remember, I'm *not* an artist!] the infinity sign from the generic paw print.
And, yes, it is deliberately generic, so that the tigers can't say "that is a
wolf-paw print, not a tiger, so I'm not going to buy it" it's to maximize the
appeal of the shirt beyond just one species. I imitated that aspect of the
paw-sign as well, in keeping my description likewise generic and not species
specific. The one thing, which I _thought_ was original, that I added was the
human hand silhouette. I thought the finger-length schtick was just too good to
pass up, so I didn't. *g* But if this is taken, then how about a pair of eyes
beneath a single-bar eyebrow, with no explanation or comment. Anyone seeing it
will either understand or they won't -- they'll either be "awere" or they will
be un-"awere".
comments or suggestions, round 2?
Howls and health-wishes,
Uncle Wolf
Jakkal
Uncle Wolf wrote:
> Jakkal wrote:
>
> >
> > That sounds too much like the "Wolf People" symbol, and I'm sure they'd have
> > a hissy fit if we stole it :)
>
> The "Wolf People"? who that? Don't think I've ever had the pleasure of running
> across their website. Actually, the generic paw-print is a steal from the Furry
> Forever t-shirts that one kind furr over on alt.lifestyle.furry made recently,
> except the FF tees also had an infinity symbol, a sideways 8 [or lemniscate],
> representing the Forever part of the tee's concept. I simply erased, in my mind
> [remember, I'm *not* an artist!] the infinity sign from the generic paw print.
> And, yes, it is deliberately generic, so that the tigers can't say "that is a
> wolf-paw print, not a tiger, so I'm not going to buy it" it's to maximize the
> appeal of the shirt beyond just one species. I imitated that aspect of the
> paw-sign as well, in keeping my description likewise generic and not species
> specific. The one thing, which I _thought_ was original, that I added was the
> human hand silhouette. I thought the finger-length schtick was just too good to
> pass up, so I didn't. *g* But if this is taken, then how about a pair of eyes
> beneath a single-bar eyebrow, with no explanation or comment. Anyone seeing it
> will either understand or they won't -- they'll either be "awere" or they will
> be un-"awere".
>
> comments or suggestions, round 2?
>
> Howls and health-wishes,
> Uncle Wolf
http://www.wolfpeople.com/
that's the wolf Ppl website...
I hear what you're saying about the generic aspect of the t-shirts. But what about
the birds? the roos? I mean, A pawprint is nice, but it only really encompasses the
mammals of the group. Of course, coming up with something that will represent
everywere species is very difficult. That's what we tried on the last one, and I
must say, .. I really didn't like the result (of the art, not the t-shirt). I'm
sure we can all come up with _something_ of course we need to get more people
interested in the shirts first.
Jakkal
wolfmage wrote:
> Howlie wrote in message
>
> I got a question for both Howlie and Pinky...how much would it cost to make
> another run of tshirts?
>
I think it was $7 per shirt for... several hundred shirts (not exactly sure
atm) + shipping. The guy I would have do it, we met in the Mts during the NC
Howl. He can do color designs on the shirts for no charge. Of course, I'm not
sure that several hundred of us want a shirt, so the price would have to go up
just to pay for the shirts themselves.
If I can find the guy's email addy, I'll mail him and ask for sure.
> Wolfmage
Kaurpin
: I know there was talk on this subject a while ago, but I don't think I
: ever heard anything final on it. AHWW or were-ness t-shirts was
: something that
[hackslash]
: Here's a design suggestion that I am donating to the group: a white
: shirt. On it, a black silhouette of a human hand, but with either the
: index or the ring finger longer than the middle ["the bird"] finger [I
: always forget which is the folklore sign of wereness]. The thumb of the
: shadow-hand should be centermost if the design is placed on the left
: chest, like the right hand was placed over the heart. A white generic
: animal-paw print silhouette is inside the hand, the hidden paw within
: the obvious hand as a motif for the beast hidden within all of us. Two
: possible legends encircle the hand-and-paw design: Are You A-Were? [with
: or without the hyphen] _or_ Raise Your A-Wereness [again, with or
: without the hyphen].
for fuck's sake.. is this a newsgroup or a fucking social club? got the
spirit, get the t-shirt? delurked and all i got was this shite clothing?
i'm not knocking the design here, just the fucking fool _idea_ of it in
the first place...
AHWW t-shirts.. totally mindless, that.. no wonder this place turned the
way it is..
--kaurpin, www.Furnation.com/Kaurpin/
Polenth
sw.edu.au> writes
>for fuck's sake.. is this a newsgroup or a fucking social club? got the
>spirit, get the t-shirt? delurked and all i got was this shite clothing?
>i'm not knocking the design here, just the fucking fool _idea_ of it in
>the first place...
>
>AHWW t-shirts.. totally mindless, that.. no wonder this place turned the
>way it is..
This group turned the way it is because of posts like yours. Noone knows
if they're about to be attacked or not, so at the first sign of a
possible insult or problem, they tend to lash out, just in case. Which
causes more problems, everyone gets even more jumpy and agressive, and
so it continues. It's not exactly conductive to a calm, friendly,
environment.
The proof for this is obvious. All you need to do is look at replies to
newcomers talking about P-shifting. If the group has been relatively
argument free, the newcomer is calming informed that P-shifting is
highly unlikely etc. If the group has just had an argument, they shout
troll, and flames the poor thing.
The cycle needs to be broken if you want to see this group inprove. This
means, if you're angry, go calm down, and then post calmly why you
disagree with something[1]. Calmly means without flames or profanity. It
works better too. You'll find a lot more attention is paid to your
opinions if creatures think you were calm when writting them, rather
them being ready to kill your opponents.
[1] Unless it's a troll, in which case, send the message to their
postmaster, not the troll themselves, quoting the whole of the offending
message, headers included. It's a whole lot more constructive than doing
exactly what the troll wants you to (argue back).
(This post isn't just aimed at Kaurpin, but all of those to whom it
applies)
--
Polenth
Howlie
spirit, get the t-shirt? delurked and all i got was this shite clothing?
i'm not knocking the design here, just the fucking fool _idea_ of it in
the first place...
>AHWW t-shirts.. totally mindless, that.. no wonder this place turned
the way it is..
I guess this means you don't want to be on the design commitee then.
<eg>
Look, I just wanted a cool werewolf t-shirt. The screen printing
company requires minimum of 12. I don't need twelve identical shirts!!
So, who am I going to offer the other eleven too that I"m not gonna use?
This is a newsgroup, which is also part of a larger community. A
community made up by people who are proud of what they are. If you
don't want a shirt, then don't order one when they are avaiable, but
there are plenty of us out here who do want a nice shirt as the
responses to my web site and via e-mail to me have shown.
And they're no need to use that kinda fuckin, frickin, mother-fuckin
language to make you goddamn point either.
Uath
I doubt that I could have put it so poetically myself, and as far as
the T-shirts go, put me down as one interested member of the
community.
I am Awere,
Uath
"Beyond the darkest corner of imagination,
sparks the power to alter reality."
Stormrider
>
> for fuck's sake.. is this a newsgroup or a fucking social club? got the
> spirit, get the t-shirt? delurked and all i got was this shite clothing?
> i'm not knocking the design here, just the fucking fool _idea_ of it in
> the first place...
>
> AHWW t-shirts.. totally mindless, that.. no wonder this place turned the
> way it is..
>
I think this could be a textbook example of a pointless and harmful post.
If other people want T-Shirts, and you don't, fine. Ignore the thread.
It's not as if articles are a limited resource, and there's no reason why
they shouldn't discuss something a fair amount of weres *are* interested
in. Expressing your opinion on how pointless it is - fine. Mindlessly
(and not even amusingly :) insulting other people about their interests
is the very aspect of human behaviour that causes most weres so many social
problems in the first place. Of course if you enjoy insulting people like
this then there is nothing we can do about you and people will just have to
ignore you. Considering how few weres there are to start with mindlessly
insulting anyone is a pretty bad idea.
I don't usually bother responding to posts like this since it simply makes
me enemies, spams the relevant group with flamey responses and doesn't
usually do any good. However in this case I think that the above statement
was worth making. Finally, the main idea of this newsgroup is as a social
group - so weres can communicate. If you don't want to be sociable why are
you here (no need to answer if it's "because I enjoy insulting people")?
--- Stormrider ---
Uncle Wolf
> Kaurpin wrote:
> >
> > for fuck's sake.. is this a newsgroup or a fucking social club? got the
> > spirit, get the t-shirt? delurked and all i got was this shite clothing?
> > i'm not knocking the design here, just the fucking fool _idea_ of it in
> > the first place...
> >
> > AHWW t-shirts.. totally mindless, that.. no wonder this place turned the
> > way it is..
> >
> > --kaurpin, www.Furnation.com/Kaurpin/
>
Stormrider wrote:
>
> I think this could be a textbook example of a pointless and harmful post.
> If other people want T-Shirts, and you don't, fine. Ignore the thread.
> It's not as if articles are a limited resource, and there's no reason why
> they shouldn't discuss something a fair amount of weres *are* interested
> in. Expressing your opinion on how pointless it is - fine. Mindlessly
> (and not even amusingly :) insulting other people about their interests
> is the very aspect of human behaviour that causes most weres so many social
> problems in the first place. Of course if you enjoy insulting people like
> this then there is nothing we can do about you and people will just have to
> ignore you. Considering how few weres there are to start with mindlessly
> insulting anyone is a pretty bad idea.
>
> I don't usually bother responding to posts like this since it simply makes
> me enemies, spams the relevant group with flamey responses and doesn't
> usually do any good. However in this case I think that the above statement
> was worth making. Finally, the main idea of this newsgroup is as a social
> group - so weres can communicate. If you don't want to be sociable why are
> you here (no need to answer if it's "because I enjoy insulting people")?
>
> --- Stormrider ---
As the originator of this particular thread, I feel like saying a word or two
on this subject.
First, I agree with Stormrider about how easy it is to just ignore threads
that I'm not interested in. Netscape even has a command that makes it easy
[Message menu, down near the bottom -- ignore thread, right above "watch
thread"].
Second, I have seen too much expressed interest in the idea to think it was an
entirely wrong-headed idea, not just here with my message, but in other places
with other groups. Since we can't [yet -- cross your fingers and wish on
shooting stars] show our true form IRL to "say it loud and say it proud",
tee-shirts will have to do for now, as a substitute for
scales/feathers/hide/fur and distinctive markings.
Third, his attitude won't be bothering me anymore. I just made him the first
non-troll to be put on my list of filters [in otherwords, killfiled]. Not for
sniping at my idea -- one time shots I can easily take. But I have seen this
too often in Kaurpin's messages on other threads. This was just one snipe too
many, and it happened to be on a thread I started. It could have been on any
message thread, it was just a coincidence that it happened on this one.
Hopefully, one day K and I will meet face to face, and I will find out that he
is not such a negative person after all, he just came across that way in a few
messages so close together in time as to make the wrong impression. But until
then, I will use the killfile to protect myself from his negative attitude.
I'm a professional security guard, I spend my time at work finding and
correcting people's problems and stupidity, I don't need any help finding
reason to be negative and pessimistic, so I'm giving his future messages a
miss.
Howls and Health-wishes to all,*
Uncle Wolf
* yes, that includes you, Kaurpin; just because I find your messages
to be something I can do without, doesn't mean I wish you ill -- as
Stormrider said, there aren't so many of us that we can do without
you.
ForestWoIf
probably buy a couple, I have no idea how Kaurpin could get so angry and upset
by this idea, and what does he mean by
>no wonder this place turned the way it is..
\|/ Tailwags to all \|/
~~~---_Razortooth Silvermyst_---~~~
http://members.aol.com/Forestwoif/index.html'
"On a summer's night, would you offer your throat to the wolf with the
white nose,if he offered you his hunger?"~Native American Proverb
Starfury
I'd like to say that I think its a great idea.
Starfury
Uath wrote in message <36608907...@news.meganet.net>...
Ol' Everhunger
In article <9lNcfpDE...@polenth.demon.co.uk>, Polenth
<pol...@polenth.demon.co.uk> wrote:
=> >AHWW t-shirts.. totally mindless, that.. no wonder this place turned the
=> >way it is..
=>
=> This group turned the way it is because of posts like yours. Noone knows
=> if they're about to be attacked or not, so at the first sign of a
=> possible insult or problem, they tend to lash out, just in case. Which
=> causes more problems, everyone gets even more jumpy and agressive, and
=> so it continues. It's not exactly conductive to a calm, friendly,
=> environment.
Very well said. I've seen this happening for quite a while, and I know
it's driven quite a few people from the fire. I won't bother naming names,
but I'll say it's caused me to wander off fairly often.
=> (This post isn't just aimed at Kaurpin, but all of those to whom it
=> applies)
I would further say it's more aptly stated: this isn't aimed at Kaurpin at
all, but at everyone who is doing this. I can think of four right off the
top of my head, and IMHO that's getting out of hand.
Remember, everyone: the greatest problem with net communications is
there's no body language, no way of really expressing emotions that aren't
spelled out. That tends to make what we say sometimes sound inflammatory
and insulting without that being the intention at all. I suggest if you're
going to write something like that jokingly, let people know you're just
kiddin' aroun'. And if you see something you think is an insult, stop and
think about it before compounding it by "yelling" back at the poster. I
couldn't tell you how many counter-posts I've cancelled after leaving it
on my screen for five minutes and calming back down. <grin>
Hugs, all. Remember, families don't always see eye to eye, either. Doesn't
mean we have to start hating each other. =)
=-=-= Spyder -- <mailto:spy...@therianthrope.org> =-=-=
Actual instructions found on some Swann frozen dinners:
"Serving suggestion: Defrost."
Kaurpin
first, analysis:
:> Kaurpin wrote:
:> >
:> > for fuck's sake.. is this a newsgroup or a fucking social club?
(scowl and sigh, i thought this was alt.horror.werewolves and not
alt.fan.furry..)
:> > got the
:> > spirit, get the t-shirt? delurked and all i got was this shite clothing
(disappointment)
:> > i'm not knocking the design here, just the fucking fool _idea_ of it in
:> > the first place...
(resentment of that which disappoints)
:> > AHWW t-shirts.. totally mindless, that.. no wonder this place turned the
:> > way it is..
(more disappointment and an attempt at rationalising one thing with
another)
i always have a good laugh when people object to my foul language and
don't bother listening to what i'm saying.. so i've decoded this into
emotional nouns for those of you who need that..
: Stormrider wrote:
:> I think this could be a textbook example of a pointless and harmful post.
(this is a textbook example of the abovementioned person, by the way)
:> If other people want T-Shirts, and you don't, fine. Ignore the thread.
it's hard to ignore something like this - it's like watching the Triads
move in on your old neighborhod, even though you don't live there
anymore.. something just isn't right...
:> It's not as if articles are a limited resource, and there's no reason why
:> they shouldn't discuss something a fair amount of weres *are* interested
:> in.
and i'm not about to tell them that they shouldn't be discussing this kind
of thing at all, either... fucking hell, one objector and the thread dies
- remember that one for when you need it, kids..
:> Expressing your opinion on how pointless it is - fine.
aaah, this is how long and painful fights start - i never said pointless,
i said mindless.. consider my dealing with the rest of your reply a
personal favour of sorts..
:> Mindlessly
:> (and not even amusingly :)
now consider it a personal favour which you'll need pay me back grandly
for.. amusingly, fuck - is the world set about you to tickle you, then?
there's a time for wit and a time for force.. sometimes both, sometimes
neither..
:> insulting other people about their interests
:> is the very aspect of human behaviour that causes most weres so many social
:> problems in the first place.
now consider it a personal favour which you'll never repay me - no wonder
i get so much bad reputation with detail-skippers like this fellow around,
fucking bane of the earth if you want to have a good debate.. but i'll
deal with this further down anyway... (skip ahead a few pages down..)
:> Of course if you enjoy insulting people like
:> this then there is nothing we can do about you and people will just have to
:> ignore you. Considering how few weres there are to start with mindlessly
:> insulting anyone is a pretty bad idea.
few? :) *ROFL* you lot are hardly thin on the ground anymore... but in a
way you still are.. (oooh, wasn't that cryptic..)
:> I don't usually bother responding to posts like this since it simply makes
:> me enemies, spams the relevant group with flamey responses and doesn't
:> usually do any good. However in this case I think that the above statement
:> was worth making.
ah people who make enemies out of me are the ones who end up bitter about
it, i laugh it off most of the time because people often have no clue what
they're doing..
:> Finally, the main idea of this newsgroup is as a social
:> group - so weres can communicate.
the main idea.. let's talk about main ideas.. the main idea of a religion
is to morally guide people to something greater than they would otherwise
be, not to justify slaughtering people and other such skite.. there's
ideas and there's actual uses, isn't there?
:> If you don't want to be sociable why are
:> you here
habit, and because this has been my stomping ground for going on four
years next march..
:> (no need to answer if it's "because I enjoy insulting people")?
someone says 'fuck' and it's automatically an insult? :) when did this
rule come in? i like insults if they're witty and bounce off whoever cops
them - in that regard, there are places you do not go with insulting
people.. i like advice or comment if it's thoughtful and sticks into your
head like a well-needed javelin..
the zen master will hit his students if they do not see what they are
doing wrong, but does this make him abusive the same way a soldier
hacking off another soldier's arm is abusive?
right, then, you're done, and if you're not then i'll catch you on IRC -
next! oh, hello..
: As the originator of this particular thread, I feel like saying a word or two
: on this subject.
good, just what we need - more words, but sir, you waffle! like a parrot,
no less! so some editing and else is needed
(waah, he'd say - you can't edit me, this is the Internet! you're denying
my constitutional right to free speech!)
: Second, I have seen too much expressed interest in the idea to think it was an
: entirely wrong-headed idea, not just here with my message, but in other places
: with other groups. Since we can't [yet -- cross your fingers and wish on
: shooting stars] show our true form IRL to "say it loud and say it proud",
: tee-shirts will have to do for now, as a substitute for
: scales/feathers/hide/fur and distinctive markings.
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaa, and this addresses what seemed
to me to be the core issue of my discontent, so it's a dear fucking
tragedy you've killfiled me..
i've got no problems with furries who wander around in fursuits, or put on
their little accessories or just hang out and yarf in the name of the
fandom, but please take a look at this group - shifters, you all are (or
if you're not, skip ahead to the next post as this doesn't concern you),
and as such it puts you in a position of vantage that sets you apart from
non-shifters.. somewhere along the way, you have struck a kinship with an
animal, and it's shaped your life, your perception, how you think and
act.. this is a seriously fucking special way to be, if you haven't
noticed it already, but there is always more to learn and find out in your
way.. the problem is that once people arrive here and set up camp, it
seems as though after all is said and done people are content to socialise
and fuck around while this kinship goes to waste over shit like t-shirts,
buttons, websites and other inconsequentialities... it reminds me of
someone who goes to learn kung fu and then just wears the duds around
because he's identified as a kung fu fella, or a philosopher who's content
to go around saying 'i'm a philosopher' and quoting plato at random
without ever really understanding what the rotten paedophile was on about
anyway.. it's there but what are you going to do with it? nothing?
anything? everything?
that's what i see here, a wasteland of the 'can't-be-fucked's,
'it's-too-hard's, 'it's-taking-too-long's and the 'i'm-bored-with-this's,
not to mention the 'i'm-having-fun-so-why-bother's and the
'this-is-no-fun-so-i-quit's.. a guide is for life, not just for yuletide..
so i reitterate: t-shirts? buttons? bollocks! get on with it! enough words
and promises... if you're in it for fun alone, get off the group because
you're supposed to be on alt.fan.furry.. if you're in it for status and
power alone, get off the group because you belong on alt.games.whitewolf..
and if you have some deal of trouble being honest about this because it
means you don't belong here, then there's no hard feelings from me, and
likely none from anyone here.. come here to learn something to take with
you along the way, not _just_ play.. and this is not a fucking hotel, it's
a drive-through store.. you come in, pick up your gear, and get out before
someone tries to scam you for a baggie of bad smack
this group broke down a long time ago and the doctors have long since
abandoned the place - i'm just passing through to remind you that the
group still has a long way to go, and dropping off a case of penicillin in
case any of you feel like using it
if you want, you can stop reading now and go onto the next post; i don't
think i have a lot more to say and the rest of this post is just
mercilessly slandering the rest of this guy's post.. piss-funny if you ask
me :)
: Third, his attitude won't be bothering me anymore.
and this.. 'ooh, i think you're nasty so i'm killfiling you _and_ i'm
going to tell everyone else instead of just doing it quietly'.. how
utterly pathetic :) i started the first raging flamewar on slash.net, and
i got k:lined for provoking the sysop into shutting it down by saying he
didn't have the guts to (which it turned out he didn't) - i'm not fussed..
killfile me if you want, you're the twee bugger who'll miss out in the
end, not me..
oh, this bit i like.. i could print this part out and frame it.. :)
: Hopefully, one day K and I will meet face to face, and I will find out that he
: is not such a negative person after all, he just came across that way in a few
: messages so close together in time as to make the wrong impression.
isn't that just candles? 'maybe he's not such a bad person after all, but
i'll guess i'll never know...' chat chat chat chat chat.. yes, for the
record, i get misunderstood a lot despite meaning well because people
don't bother to read anything but the 'fuck's and the 'shit's in my
posts.. (you shouldn't swear so much then, you say.. bullshit, i say, it's
my dialect).. speaking of which, fuck this guy goes on.. what's next?
(nah, skip that bit...) oh, here we go:
(hang on..you read this far? why are you still reading? go and read the
whole post again as punishment..)
: I'm a professional security guard, I spend my time at work finding and
: correcting people's problems and stupidity,
here he tries to establish a rapport with the group in order to win them
over by disclosing personal details, and also to establish himself as
some authority on the matter whereof he speaks - 'ooh, i'm a real person
here, i have a job and everything..'
: I don't need any help finding
: reason to be negative and pessimistic, so I'm giving his future messages a
: miss.
so i'm not the most diplomatic person in the world in my manner.. so i'm
not the usual fluffy fella from the psychic friends hotline.. so i'm not
made of the same stuff you are.. tell me it hasn't been educational and
thought-provoking along the way and i'll know you're lying..
later, gang
--kaurpin, http://www.Furnation.com/Kaurpin/
Asikaa
Kaurpin wrote in message <74514s$8ro$1...@enyo.uwa.edu.au>...
[BIG snip]
>i've got no problems with furries who wander around in fursuits, or put
on
>their little accessories or just hang out and yarf in the name of the
>fandom, but please take a look at this group - shifters, you all are
[snip]
>somewhere along the way, you have struck a kinship with an
>animal, and it's shaped your life, your perception, how you think and
>act.. this is a seriously fucking special way to be,
[snip]
>if you're in it for fun alone, get off the group because
>you're supposed to be on alt.fan.furry
[snip]
>this group broke down a long time ago and the doctors have long since
>abandoned the place - i'm just passing through to remind you that the
>group still has a long way to go, and dropping off a case of penicillin
in
>case any of you feel like using it
Firstly, apologies for all the snipping. That was a long post and while
I didn't agree with all of it, Kaurpin does have a good point with those
parts that I've quoted above, IMO.
Kaurpin, as he himself says, is not the most diplomatic of people.
There is a massive potential discussion (which could easily become yet
another flamewar) about his use of language, etc. If you have comments
about his literary style, I would respectfully ask you to make those
opinions known to him via private email. But if I may I would like to
set that aside for the purposes of this followup.
The reason I'm responding to this post at all is this: There are those
that would rather wear a werewolf t-shirt than put their were principles
to test in a serious way. With this, Kaurpin has a good point.
I have no objection to people making and wearing were-related t-shirts.
Heck, I've done it myself. However, I consider this to be more of a
'furry' related activity than a spiritual lycanthropy activity. This
is, of course, simply my view. I could digress here into how I refuse
to be compartmentalised and I try not to do it to myself. You can call
be a werewolf or a furry or a zoo, no problem. But don't try to tell me
that I'm a werewolf and therefore the same as KatmanDu, or Coyote, or
Lyka. Sure, I am a werewolf, but only to -my- definition of that.
Ooops, I digressed. :) (maybe I'll put this out to another thread...)
I have no objections to people posting about pins, t-shirts, bumper
stickers. There's no reason why we can't have fun and/or be proud of
what we are. Kaurpin's post appears to be born of frustration that a
significant proportion of the group's traffic has been taken up by
"non-spiritually-oriented" posts about t-shirts and suchlike. For that
I do not blame him, as I have felt that way myself. Indeed, it was why
I took a sabbatical from AHWw.
On the other hand, it's quite easy to skip the posts that don't interest
you. I'm sure we all skim posts until we find one that grabs our
attention, whether that be a story, poem, investigation, question,
t-shirt design or pin idea.
Let's be tolerant. Of -everyone's- views. Kaurpin misses the 'old
days', as do I. Respect that. Some people here would like to wear a
therianthrope pin. No problem.
Newsgroups thrive on acceptance or respectful questioning of
non-accepted viewpoints. When that gets forgotten, newsgroups die,
consumed by out-of-control flamewars.
T-shirters - try to be tolerant of Kaurpin's forcefulness.
Kaurpin - Diplomacy makes your message so much easier to find.
.--------.
| Asikaa |--.
.--------------------------------------------------.
'--------' \ / Spiritual wolf . Zoo . Furry . Writer . Artist
\
'--> | AHWW packmember . Lintilla . Sleepy's .
FurryMUCK |
\ Furzone Studio Productions: http://come.to/yiff
/
'--------------------------------------------------'
PS - I am not defending anyone here. It is just my two cents or
whatever the latest phrase is.
Stormrider
--- Stormrider ---
KatmanDu!
I'm serious about my therianthropy. I am what I am, and have always
been; there's not a day that goes by that I don't consider what I am
and how I feel. It is my life and my being because it is what I am.
But I like the t-shirts. I designed a couple of bumper stickers. Does
that make me any less serious?
Sometimes ya gotta have fun. I could spend every day in serious
meditation and spiritual growth, and I'd probably be a better person
for it- but all work and no play makes Kat a dull boy.
Speaking of merchandising projects... To those of you who have
requested a Garoup Therapy CD, I haven't forgotten about you. My
recent move has left me rather cash-strapped for a while. I've got all
but a couple of the CD's burned (thanks, Coyote! *g*) and all I'm
really waiting for is enough extra funds in my bank account to mail
them all. It may be after the holidays, but I should get caught up
with the bills soon.
--
Anti-Spam: Remove the !'s from the address to reply
katmandu!@negia.net * Theriomorph at large * http://www.negia.net/~katmandu
"When the cowboys and arabs drawn down on each other at noon, in the cool
dusty air of the city boardroom, will you stand by a passive spectator of the
market dictators? Will you discreetly withdraw with your ear pressed to the
boardroom door; will you hear when the lion within you roars, will you take
to the hills?" --Roger Waters
Polenth
<katmandu!@negia.net> writes
>But I like the t-shirts. I designed a couple of bumper stickers. Does
>that make me any less serious?
I think the problem here is some weres are forgetting what makes you a
were, and what means you aren't one. Instead of simply saying, 'I
disagree', they say 'I disagree, so you can't really be be a were,
because all weres should share my preferences'.
For all those (sadly a large number here) who have forgotten what it
really means to be a were, here is a description. If you ever start
doubting someone's wereness, see if they comply to this description, and
if they do, they are a were:
A non-were is someone who is physically and mentally human, totally, and
all the time. A were is one who is not like this, though has to be
physically human at least some of the time.
It's very short. I'm sure you can manage to memorize it.
It has nothing to do with how many phenotypes you have, or if you want
to wear a 'Hi! I'm a werewolf!' t-shirt. Using these as definitions of
wereness is an excuse: if you flame someone for having different hobbies
and clothing styles, you're being unreasonable, but if you flame them
with a 'justifyable' cause (the cause of 'you aren't a were if you do
that! I'm protecting the newsgroup against you!'), it makes you feel
better. It means if anyone says you're being unreasonable, you can
'justify' your actions so that you feel good about yourself, and don't
feel internally that you're being un unreasonable bastard.
This could easily esculate. Oneday a were will be someone who hates
football, eats cottage cheese, wears black, plays the flute, grows long
hair, plays cricket every sunday, can cook cauliflour-cheese, speaks
japenese, doesn't wear jewellery, has a tattoo, never wears shorts,
enjoys swimming, reads Issac Azimov books, etc. No hobby, clothing
style, or lifestyle preference will be safe from attack. Culteral and
social diversity in the group will have been lost. Wereness will become
a 'cliche' where you must conform to the groups likes and dislikes, or
you'll be shunned. Wereness will have become an exact replica of the
human society weres profess to dislike.
By this time, everyone will have totally forgotten what it really means
to be a were, because they're too busy flaming each other about the next
rule: do 'proper' weres like Elton John music?
--
Polenth