Cthulhu 101
icarp...@aol.com
booklet, rather. Cthulhu 101 is probably aimed at collectors,
particlarly collectors of comics (which is where Mr. Hite has found
such renown as he has) rather than serious fans of HPL. Perhaps fans
who have read a story or two, or are fond of Chtulhu comics would
really like it. It is a product of the comics company Atomic Overmind
Press, and costs $8.95 for 124 pages. Note, however, the dimensions:
6,5 x 4.7", about the size of two index cards. I finished it in less
than 30 minutes and I read every word. Art was provided Dreew Pcoze,
and did not rise above caricature drwaings of Cthulhu; it was not as
good as the art for Munchkin Cthulhu.
The first half is devoted to a light hearted romp about what is
Chtulhu and the mythos. This is played heavily for humor which
probably plays better in person, but I was at least frequently amused
even if there were no belly laughs. Fans serious about learning about
HPL and the mythos of couse will start with his stories and then those
of the other writers of the various Lovecraft circles. If you want
more informaiton than is available in the introductions to those
books, particular those by Robert Price, then seek out ST Joshi's The
Rise and Fall of the Cthulhu Mythos and Daniel Harms' Cthulhu Mythos
Encyclopedia. Mr. Hite wrote a brief critique called Tour de
Lovecraft (which he, as expected, includes in a list of references)
which is more for the idly curious who are not interested in the work
of more serious scholars.
The second half is basically a bunch of top ten lists or listing of
the best games, music, visual media etc. Perhaps more space is
devoted to comics and related media tha is merited, but recall the
author's roots. Here is where Mr. Hite is expressing his opinion only
and I have a hard time not getting aggravated. Who am I to say he is
not entitled to his own opinion, but for me his choices about the top
10 stories about Cthulhu not by Lovecraft, and the top 10 mythos
stories not about Cthulhu show me that he is not partiuclarly critical
or perhaps not very widely read in the genre. Also he includes novels
in these lists, not just short stories. I cannot object to the
inclusion of Final Draft by Annandale, but nothing by Pugmire,
McNaughton, Sammons, Kiernan, Pulver, Comtois and a dozen others? I
liked The Deep Ones by James Wade well enough but it was a pretty weak
pastiche, better to me when I first read it in the 1970s than now. An
Evil Guest by Gene Wolfe wa a *terrible* novel, a very frustrating
read. Did the Mr. Hite even read anything else? Is the novel Rsume
with Monsters by Spencer even Cthulhu mythos really? As I read it,
HPL's monsters are used as metaphors in the mind of a man really going
insane. It is excellent if depressing and dark, but in the end,
Cthulhu is a figment. I liked the novel by Stross The Atrocity
Archive, but isn't A Colder War his best Cthulhu mythos story by far?
Well, what to do? It isn't much dough, compared to a 48 page comic
that costs $3.99. On the other hand, there isn't much here. Glynn
Barrass wrote a chapbook published by Rainfall Books, a few years out
of date now, that could serve as a better guide to books for
collectors who want to read more Cthulhu mythos stories. I think
Cthulhu 101 will hit it big as an impulse buy at comic book stores.
Matt
Robert J. Parker
Mr. Carpenter,
Hite's primary background is not in comics, but roleplaying games. On
his blog there was a long discussion about his picks for Top 10 Mythos
Stories, and I had no reason to believe that he wasn't familiar with a
larger number of stories: he just happened to pick what he liked. He's
also reviewed Kiernan before, so there's no reason to believe he
wasn't aware of her.
As far as "Resume with Monsters" goes, Joshi recognizes it as a
Cthulhu Mythos novel (and praises it quite highly) in "The Rise and
Fall of the Cthulhu Mythos". Unfortunately, I cannot comment on this
rest of this book, but the marketing for the book didn't leave me with
any illusions: it was a light-hearted introduction to the mythos,
nothing more, nothing less. From the sound of your review, this is a
pretty accurate description.
icarp...@aol.com
> his blog there was a long discussion about his picks for Top 10 Mythos
> Stories, and I had no reason to believe that he wasn't familiar with a
> larger number of stories: he just happened to pick what he liked. He's
> also reviewed Kiernan before, so there's no reason to believe he
> wasn't aware of her.
Well, his taste sure is at variance with mine. Did you read An Evil
Guest? I practically ended up throwing it across the room, it was
such a disappointment. I liked The Deep Ones when I first got into
the mythos but it has not aged well. There are so many better
choices.
> As far as "Resume with Monsters" goes, Joshi recognizes it as a
> Cthulhu Mythos novel (and praises it quite highly) in "The Rise and
> Fall of the Cthulhu Mythos".
Joshi Shmoshi. This gets into what do you think a Cthulhu mythos
novel should be about. Have you read Resume with Monsters? I'd love
to hear your opinion. Spencer can write. His story is one of the
best in Lovecraft Unbound. But Resume With Monsters consists of this
guy who has internal conversations and phone dialogues with the
entities from Lovecraaft, and they encourage him to do crazy things.
He ends up basically ruining his life, although the author gave him an
out in the end. The monsters are not real (you know, I mean in the
story), they are his thoughts not recognized as such but as happens in
schizophrenics. I thought it was well written but ultimately the
protagonist was pathetic and came across to me as an object of pity;
Hite likes humor and maybe he (and others) interpreted these scenes as
funny. My interactions with persons with real mental illnesses has
made this scenario anything but funny for me. Don't get me wrong, I
liked the book as a dark meditation on alienation. But is this
utilization of HPL's creations to be considered the same as in light
as Radiant Dawn? It seemms to me to be a whole different category of
book, one reflecting the influence of HPL on popular culture and
metaphor.
Matt
Robert J. Parker
Matt,
To be fair to Mr. Hite, he was unfamiliar with Goodfellow's work
(which is quite unfortunate, since I think he's the probably the best
amongst the current generation of Lovecraftians and one of the most
distinctive voices in horror in decades) at the time of Cthulhu 101's
writing, although I recently corrected that by sending him a copy of
Radiant Dawn for his birthday, so hopefully that'll correct the error.
In regards to "Resume With Monsters", I felt it was quite a good read
and was certainly intended to be funny at times. Although the mythos
elements were not "real", since the story was about social
degeneration and personal alienation, I felt the themes were very
Lovecraftian. Moreover, I applaud any author that looks to incorporate
new elements to mythos fiction. In this case, the story evoked more
Vonnegut than Lovecraft to me, which is not a bad thing. I've actually
been recently considering how the genre would benefit from pastiches
of Comte de Lautreamont or Louis-Ferdinand Celine with mythos
elements. Certainly the nilhilistic literary surrealism inherent in
their styles would be a good fit for the mythos. This is not to say
pastiches are bad per se, for I love Gary Myers and Robert Price's
work, but few can do so effectively.
While "Resume With Monsters" may not be your particular cup of tea, I
think it would be difficult to assert that it's a bad novel, and
certainly Goodfellow incorporates elements of dark humor in his work
as well.
In regards to "An Evil Guest", I'm afraid I have not. However, he is
not the only author I've heard praise the novel, so I don't believe he
stands alone. Finally, as far as "The Deep Ones" goes, I'd have to say
it wouldn't make it into my personal top ten, but I remember enjoying
it quite a bit on my first read. It's a bit hazy in my memory today
(outside of the central conceit), but I'll give it another look to
remember why I found it so evocative. Speaking of which, here's a
preliminary for my Top Ten:
1. Radiant Dawn by Cody Goodfellow
2. The Ceremonies by T.E.D. Klein (no direct mythos references, but
clearly Lovecraftian)
3. Delta Green: Rules of Engagement by John Tynes
4. The Treader of the Dust by Clark Ashton Smith (or, arguably, the
Werewolf of Averoigne)
5. The Tugging by Ramsey Campbell (this is debatable, depending on the
day I might go for The Faces at Pine Dunes, The Other Names or Voice
of the Beach instead)
6. A Thousand Young by Robert M. Price
7. Fat Face by Michael Shea
8. The Keeper of the Flame by Gary Myers
9. Suicide Watch by Arinn Dembo
10. Atrocity Archives by Charles Stross
Honorable Mentions: 24 Views of Mt. Fuji by Roger Zelazny isn't very
Lovecraftian, despite mythos elements, but is simply fantastic as a
story. Zelazny still stands out as one of the best speculative fiction
authors of all time, and even the hints of mythos in this story are
highly satisfying to me. Stephen Mark Rainey's work deserves mention
too, but there's not a single story that really stands out to me.
I should mention I haven't read "A Colder War" by Stross and I'm
currently reading Barron and Pulver for the first time, so things may
change. Moreover, I tried to restrict it to one story per author,
otherwise Goodfellow and Klein would've likely dominated the entire
list.
So, how about you, Matt? Lord knows you've probably read more
Lovecraftiana than most of the people on this list.
icarp...@aol.com
> While "Resume With Monsters" may not be your particular cup of tea, I
> think it would be difficult to assert that it's a bad novel, and
> certainly Goodfellow incorporates elements of dark humor in his work
> as well.
Maybe I misspoke. I did not think Resume with Monsters was a bad
book. In fact it was quite well written. However, while using mythos
monsters, I would not consider it mythos. Also I ended up feeling
depressed after reading it; the subject is one I don't find pleasant
as I have seen bad things happen to people I know.
Spencer is very gifted, as his story from Lovecraft Unbound shows. It
just goes to what you would consider mythos.
Matt
icarp...@aol.com
> Lovecraftiana than most of the people on this list
Hmmm, now everyone wants to inlcude novels with short stories! A very
different beast indeed.
Here are my top 10 mythos novels (caveats: I don't recall The Darkest
Part of the Woods and have not read/finished The Ceremonies, Move
Under Ground, Daughter of Hounds, Blue Devil Island, Mr. X and some
others). I can't really narrow it down into a specific order.
Radiant Dawn - Goodfellow ****** my favorite on this list
Ravenous Dusk - Goodfellow
The Atrocity Archives - Stross
Delta Green: The Rules of Engagement
The Midnight Eye Files: The Amulet - Meikle
Where Goeth Nyarlathotep - Reiner
A Night in the Lonesome October - Zelazny
Downward to Darkness - McNaughton
Worse Things Waiting - McNaughton
Threshold - Kiernan (very Lovecraftian but not mythos)
Matt
icarp...@aol.com
> So, how about you, Matt? Lord knows you've probably read more
Wow. I have never actually attempted to list my top 10 mythos
stories. How can I choose between so many in a genre I love filled
with great writers?
Also, I've been reading so long, some of my older books are crumbled
away and who knows what their contents were. Before I wrote reviews,
I didn't keep notes about what I liked, so many books probably have
gems I've forgotten about. I read the Chaosium cycle books more than
10 years ago! I haven't even finished The Last Continent, Shadows
Over Baker Street, Shards of Darkness, Return to Lovecraft Country
etc. I never include CAS stories in mythos lists, as for me Smith is
sui generis. I never include Yellow Sign stories either, as I think
of them as a different subgenre of Dark Fiction. I don't want to list
anything by Pulver or Pugmire, marvelous as their stories are, as they
seem to inhabit their own worlds. Even if that isn't fair, it's how I
think about it. And I know there are some I just can't locate, like a
Delta Green story about a transdimensional entity that went around
ripping people apart to 'hear' the psychic vibrations.
Anyway, with all those caveats, here is a list of stories I think are
superb examples of the genre. I've marked with asterisks some stories
that I know would always make my top 50 if I could ever choose them:
Cold Water Survival – Phillips
Come Lurk with Me and Be My Love – Spencer
Houses Under the Sea –Kiernan
Leng – Laidlaw
New Fish – Courters
Tomb in a Dead Moon – Curran
The Long Deep Dream – Clines
Abomination with Rice – Hughes
The Violet Princess – Rainey
To Be As They – Rainey*
A Study in Emerald – Gaimen*
The Doom That Came to Innsmouth – McNaughton*
A Colder War –Stross*
Incident on Highway 19 – Henderson
Rapture in Black – Rainey*
The Pisces Club – Ambuehl
Eldritch-Fellas – Curran
The Roaches in the Walls – Chambers
Dreams.biz – Lupoff
Turf – Moore
The Patriot – Goodrich
Children of the Mountain – Sternberg
The Barrens – Wilson*
Big “C” – Lumley
Once More, From the Top – Glancy
Russian Dolls – Furey
Only the End of the World Again – Gaimen
Daoine Domhain – Tremayne
What Washes Ashore – Thomas
Why We Do It – Schweitzer
The Disciple – Kirtley*
Final Draft - Annandale*
The Other Names – Campbell*
Bangkok Rules – Lestewka*
Clownfish –Baugh
The Wreck of the Ghost – Curran
What Sort of Man – de Bill
The Bookseller’s Second Wife – de Bill
Goat Mother – Comtois
Mail Order Bride – Schwader
Seduced – Shiflet
The Faces at Pine Dunes – Campbell
One Way Conversation – Sammons*
Twenty Mile – Schwader
False Containment – Conyers
Impossible Object – Conyers
Predicting Perdition – Melniczek
Black Man with a Horn – Klein*
The Margins – Weinberg
Wormwood – Curran
Mr. Skin – Milan*
Behold, I Stand at the Door and Knock – Price
Acute Spiritual Fear – Price
The N-scale Horror – Giannattasio
Glimpses – Attanasio
Objects from the Gilman-Waite Colleciton – Schwader
Crouch End – King*
Fat Face – Shea*
Shaft Number 247 – Copper
Old Virginia - Barron*
Fair Exchange - Smith
The Last Feast of Harlequin - Ligotti
Cabinet 34, Drawer 6 - Kiernan
Maybe I'll try to find the time to dig through some other old books.
Matt
james ambuehl
Awesome list! Nice to have made that list with my own "The Pisces Club"
and being able to bask in the presence of such Mythos giants -- Thanks!
;-)
-- Jim
"When the Big Sleep ends, the Nightmares begin!" -- HARDBOILED CTHULHU:
TWO-FISTED TALES OF TENTACLED TERROR, edited by James Ambuehl and out
now from Elder Signs Press! Available from Clarkesworld Books,
Shocklines, Amazon, and Elder Signs Press itself!
Dan Clore
> I've actually been recently considering how the genre would benefit
> from pastiches of Comte de Lautreamont or Louis-Ferdinand Celine with
> mythos elements. Certainly the nilhilistic literary surrealism
> inherent in their styles would be a good fit for the mythos. This is
> not to say pastiches are bad per se, for I love Gary Myers and Robert
> Price's work, but few can do so effectively.
You need to read my story collection, The Unspeakable and Others. I
guess the new edition will be available someday. (Henrik?)
--
Dan Clore
New book: _Weird Words: A Lovecraftian Lexicon_:
http://tinyurl.com/yd3bxkw
My collected fiction, _The Unspeakable and Others_:
(Wait for the new edition: http://hplmythos.com/ )
Lord We�rdgliffe & Necronomicon Page:
http://tinyurl.com/292yz9
News & Views for Anarchists & Activists:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/smygo
Strange pleasures are known to him who flaunts the
immarcescible purple of poetry before the color-blind.
-- Clark Ashton Smith, "Epigrams and Apothegms"
icarp...@aol.com
long ago that most of the titles are blanks to me. Mainly I recall
most of the contents were medicore, Mr. Price not being the most
critical of souls.
Here are some more titles of really good stories:
City of the Dreaming God – Seno
The Road – Aramata
Love for Who Speaks – Shibata
Necrophallus – Makino
Night Voices, Night Journeys – Inoue
Inverted Kingdom – Matsue
Terror Rate – Chiaki
A Night at Yuan-Su – Nanjo
Small Ghost – Minnis
Valentia - Kiernan
Notebook Found in a Deserted House - Bloch
I'll add to this list as I review my collection but it's not going to
be anywhere near definitive.
Matt
icarp...@aol.com
> not the only author I've heard praise the novel, so I don't believe he
> stands alone.
Hmph. I bet they saw it was writtten by Gene Wolfe and predetermined
it had to be good. Nothing salvages it.
Matt
Harksen
> You need to read my story collection, The Unspeakable and Others. I
> guess the new edition will be available someday. (Henrik?)
Yes, it will, Dan. And it ought to be out this month. However, I am
STILL awaiting my proof copy; if I do not receive it tomorrow I will
contact the printer since by then the latest delivery date is
trespassed. Grrrrr...
The thing is (as Dan already knows, but the rest of you might find
this interesting too), with this book I am trying another format than
what I am used to--size- as well as paper-wise. And I have to see this
proof in real life to determine exactly what to choose.
I will keep y'all posted when I know more. And don't worry, it will be
published (and soon) but I don't want to rush it unnecessarily.
-Henrik
Robert J. Parker
> You need to read my story collection, The Unspeakable and Others. I
> guess the new edition will be available someday. (Henrik?)
>
> --
> Dan Clore
Dan,
If you use elements of Lautreamont or Celine you've got my money as
soon as the book comes out. Now to just write "Azathoth Roi", my Jarry
pastiche.
Robert J. Parker
I've been meaning to read McNaughton, and I should really pick up "A
Night in the Lonesome October". I'm shocked, though: how could you put
down the Ceremonies? Man, I fan that unbelievably gripping.
Robert J. Parker
on those I remember/care about.
On Nov 13, 9:59 pm, "icarpen...@aol.com" <icarpen...@aol.com> wrote:
> Rapture in Black – Rainey*
This story was pretty notable, but I felt disconnected from the story
by the Amazon wishlist of namedrops. While I've noticed that mid-'80s
post-punk/synthpop/goth is extremely popular amongst the last
generation of mythos authors, I did a radio show for two years on the
era, so I really wished Mr. Rainey would just stop. This goes double
for all authors who name the brand of cigarettes your characters
smoke: just stop.
> Once More, From the Top – Glancy
Boy, it sure would be nice if Glancy finished his novel, "Those Who
Win", huh? I spoke with him at the HPLFF and it seems he's about two
thirds done with it, which sounds like there wasn't a lot of progress
in the last year.
> Bangkok Rules – Lestewka*
I liked this, despite the trope of the assassin protagonist, which is
a trope that is always a turn-off for me. While after reading Ravenous
Dusk the idea of a "living room" seemed a lot less clever to me,
Bangkok Rules is still memorable.
> False Containment – Conyers
> Impossible Object – Conyers
Read this collection fairly recently, been working on a review that
I'll post on my blog. I've had some business relations with Mr.
Conyers and found him to be an excellent person, as well as a great
idea man. While I think he should concentrate on game design, the book
was a blast to read.
> Behold, I Stand at the Door and Knock – Price
There's a lot of Price that I like more than this story, although I
felt it was quite good in and of itself. Several of his more academic
and religious themed stories really stood out to me, as well as the
hilarous "Dope War of the Black Tong".
> Fat Face – Shea*
Loved this story, but I'm somewhat dreading the new collection from
Goodfellow's Perilous Press after reading Colour Out of Time, which
was one of the more painful mythos novels I've read in some time.
Let's hope "Face Face" is the standard.
> Shaft Number 247 – Copper
Yeah, this one would definitely be "Top 20". The few mythos stories
I've read that were set in the future usually didn't do it for me, but
this was a great read.
icarp...@aol.com
> Night in the Lonesome October". I'm shocked, though: how could you put
It has nothing to do with Klein and everything to do with my personal
level of disorganization! I' m not even sure where the book is right
now.
Matt
icarp...@aol.com
>
> There's a lot of Price that I like more than this story, although I
> felt it was quite good in and of itself. Several of his more academic
> and religious themed stories really stood out to me, as well as the
> hilarous "Dope War of the Black Tong".
For me, the ending of Behold, I Stand at the Door and Knock was an
absolute riot. I also really like The Horror in the Genizah and Acute
Spiritual Fear, but for the most part I find Price decent rather than
good.
Dope War of the Black Tong really rubbed me the wrong way. Maybe I'll
re-read it to see if my views changed from 15 yrs ago, but the racist
prose was a total turn off, even if it was just meant to imitate 1930s
pulp.
> > Fat Face – Shea*
>
> Loved this story, but I'm somewhat dreading the new collection from
> Goodfellow's Perilous Press after reading Colour Out of Time, which
> was one of the more painful mythos novels I've read in some time.
> Let's hope "Face Face" is the standard.
A Quest for Simbilis and The Colour Out of Time were terrible
derivative pastiche novels, one of Vance and one of HPL. I chalk them
up to a young author learning his craft. Unfortunately they sem to
have taken on a life of their own. While Fat Face is by far the best
mythos story I've read by Mr. Shea, most of the rest of his work is
high quality and is often quite creepy. I also really liked his nove
In Yana, The Touch of Undying. Cheap used copies abound on the
internet. My big beef with Copping Squid is likely to be the amount
of overlap with the rest of my collection.
Matt
icarp...@aol.com
> I should mention I haven't read "A Colder War" by Stross
Aha! No excuses any more. Here is a free online copy:
http://www.infinityplus.co.uk/stories/colderwar.htm
Matt
Robert J. Parker
> It has nothing to do with Klein and everything to do with my personal
> level of disorganization! I' m not even sure where the book is right
> now.
>
> Matt
If I were you, I'd put down whatever else you're reading and finish
it. Perhaps it's just that it appeals so highly to my own
sensibilities (the sociology of communal living experiments, 19th
cent. Euro horror, and neurotic literary grad students all sing to me)
but I think "The Ceremonies" is, bar none, Klein's highest achievement.
Dan Clore
> On Nov 14, 12:59 pm, Dan Clore <cl...@columbia-center.org> wrote:
>> You need to read my story collection, The Unspeakable and Others. I
>> guess the new edition will be available someday. (Henrik?)
> If you use elements of Lautreamont or Celine you've got my money as
> soon as the book comes out. Now to just write "Azathoth Roi", my
> Jarry pastiche.
No Celine, but heavy doses of Lautr�amont influence and borrowing. Also
a little bit of Jarry. Not to mention a few doses of William Burroughs--
Robert J. Parker
> Dope War of the Black Tong really rubbed me the wrong way. Maybe I'll
> re-read it to see if my views changed from 15 yrs ago, but the racist
> prose was a total turn off, even if it was just meant to imitate 1930s
> pulp.
>
Hmm. That's a tough one, for sure. However, I felt that the lampooning
of the racist elements was well-handled, even if it was a bit inside-
jokey (the line "...a knot of orientals, their ethnicities obscured in
the rich gloom..." comes to mind). Ultimately, I did not walk away
with the idea that Price was a racist, but instead make a humorous
story that examined how ludicrously Carter and Howard handled these
racial stereotypes. Although Price loves these authors, despite their
faults, it was in this story that he admits, "Well, it's all pretty
cruddy when you look at it, isn't it?"
Robert J. Parker
I'm aware it's online, but I hate reading longer works on a screen.
I'll pick up Wireless soon enough, but I've got a reading list a mile
long. Thanks for pointing out the link, though, and I've enjoyed our
discussion.
Robert J. Parker
> Robert J. Parker wrote:
> > On Nov 14, 12:59 pm, Dan Clore <cl...@columbia-center.org> wrote:
> >> You need to read my story collection, The Unspeakable and Others. I
> >> guess the new edition will be available someday. (Henrik?)
> > If you use elements of Lautreamont or Celine you've got my money as
> > soon as the book comes out. Now to just write "Azathoth Roi", my
> > Jarry pastiche.
>
> a little bit of Jarry. Not to mention a few doses of William Burroughs--
>
> --
> Dan Clore
>
> New book: _Weird Words: A Lovecraftian Lexicon_:http://tinyurl.com/yd3bxkw
> My collected fiction, _The Unspeakable and Others_:
> (Wait for the new edition:http://hplmythos.com/)
> News & Views for Anarchists & Activists:http://groups.yahoo.com/group/smygo
>
> Strange pleasures are known to him who flaunts the
> immarcescible purple of poetry before the color-blind.
> -- Clark Ashton Smith, "Epigrams and Apothegms"
Sold! Thanks for the head's up, Mr. Clore.
John Goodrich
You may be the guest of honor at any and all parties I throw from now
on. Thank you very much.
John Goodrich