What is it with Emperor Clock Company?
Finite Guy
have had the clock for about 20 years. I mentioned to them that the
chimes have always been sluggish(from day 1) and asked what I can do
to fix it.
They basically told me that the movement is considered old and should
be replaced. In other words a brass clock movement is only designed to
last 20 years? I don't think so. Maybe needs a little cleaning and
minor repair but the clock runs fine.
What a sales pitch
Robert
The Baron
newsgroup; Emperor clock movement problems, Kieninger-Won't run after ...,
read the responses to your original question.
Your movement is worn out, get another one.
"Finite Guy" <finitegu...@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:3f2aae71....@news.genuity.net...
Finite Guy
it didn't get posted for two days after I sent it. The other post was
from another email adress (and computer) that I use.
Sorry for the confusion.
P.S. The movement does work, the chimes need adjusting.
On Mon, 04 Aug 2003 17:53:31 GMT, "The Baron" <theb...@flash.net>
wrote:
The Baron
improvement if you ''dunk&swish'' the movement. You might also be able to
physically put more weight in the chime weight shell, thus making the chime
speed up. This will shorten whatever life that may be left, but it might
speed up for you.
I have two or three customers a week that are in the same situation. They
have a 20 to 30 year modern German clock that : the pendulum just won't
keep going, chime and or strike just won't work or are too slow, (also not
loud enough but that's another story), they are 60+ years old and ''don't
have the money'', for a real repair. I have found that if you do
''anything'' to their clock, you will be married to it for the rest of their
lives. Even if you ''don't'' do anything to the clock they will tell
others that you couldn't fix their clock.
Attempts at a full service/takedown and repair would be a waste of time as
these movements are ''throwaway''. This apparently is difficult for you
to accept, it always is when it happens in a personal way. Go to ebay and
look at all the ''modern German'' movements that are there. They sell for
$5 to $30 (I don't know why), these are changeouts.
"Finite Guy" <finitegu...@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:3f2fad5c....@news.genuity.net...
jduprie
the alternatives? I;ve goyt a couple of them (the disposable movements), and
expect o be replacing them in the next few years (I knew they were throwaway
when I got them...).
So, when I go get new works, who should I look for? wht should I expect to
pay? I know these are very general, but it seems that there is some interest
out there, so I'm looking for general type answers...
thansk
--JD
Finite Guy
The Baron:
Sounds like you are a Clock repair guy who is knowlegeable in clock
repair. I have a friend who also does clock repair but I haven't had a
chance to talk to him about my clock.
Actually I am a bit envyous of clock makers and clock repair persons.
This is a profession thatI I have always admired .
Regarding my Emperor clock, I like the clock case because I made it
from a kit in dark walnut. I spent a lot of time getting the finish
just the way want it.
It is a very attractive piece of furniture for my home.
If I go to the expense of getting another movement, is there a good
replacement that I should be looking for?
I'm not particularly wealthy, but I like to buy good products that
will last.
Maybe 20 - 30 years of service is all one can expect from a
relatively modern day clock movement? I have no idea.
P.S.
Actually this is the second movement that I put in this clock. The
first one was a 1977 vintage German chain and weight type (please
forgive my non technical terms) and back in 1983 there abouts I found
that Emperor had this cable driven movement and Lyre Pendulum, so I
bought it.
On Tue, 05 Aug 2003 15:23:04 GMT, "The Baron" <theb...@flash.net>
Finite Guy
The Baron:
Sounds like you are a Clock repair guy who is knowlegeable in clock
repair. I have a friend who also does clock repair but I haven't had a
chance to talk to him about my clock.
Actually I am a bit envyous of clock makers and clock repair persons.
This is a profession thatI I have always admired .
Regarding my Emperor clock, I like the clock case because I made it
from a kit in dark walnut. I spent a lot of time getting the finish
just the way want it.
It is a very attractive piece of furniture for my home.
If I go to the expense of getting another movement, is there a good
replacement that I should be looking for?
I'm not particularly wealthy, but I like to buy good products that
will last.
Maybe 20 - 30 years of service is all one can expect from a
relatively modern day clock movement? I have no idea.
P.S.
Actually this is the second movement that I put in this clock. The
first one was a 1977 vintage German chain and weight type (please
forgive my non technical terms) and back in 1983 there abouts I found
that Emperor had this cable driven movement and Lyre Pendulum, so I
bought it.
On Tue, 05 Aug 2003 15:23:04 GMT, "The Baron" <theb...@flash.net>
The Baron
Imports. Material houses such as S La Rose, Timesavers and Merritts also
sell the movements, in the USA. Their prices will be about the same. Most
sell all three major brands, so just match the brand that you have. Some of
the older models have no ''direct'' replacement but there is usually a model
can be made to fit. Their quality is about the same. These suppliers
also sell coo-koo movements as well.
If you are not sure about replacement yourself, then most any clockshop will
do the job. A shop's markup will be about twice to three times what your
cost will be. Mantle, wall and Grandfather movements sell for US$65 to
$200, tubular bell movements sell for several hundred $.
"jduprie" <jdu...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:TrWXa.73862$YN5.55670@sccrnsc01...
The Baron
help. They do have different quality available in a given model, things
such as bronze bushings, some high quality steel in some of the pivots,
different escapements etc. Butterworths have been most helpful in
upgrading movements for me.
"Finite Guy" <finitethee...@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:6mo0jvsvn6eih737s...@4ax.com...
J. B. Wood
around 1974. Still runs fine (as long as my Dad remembers to pull the
weights back up when required). I find it unconscionable, however, that a
reasonable quality pendulum-based clock movement would not last well
beyond 20 years without parts replacement. Sincerely,
John Wood (Code 5550) e-mail: wo...@itd.nrl.navy.mil
Naval Research Laboratory
4555 Overlook Avenue, SW
Washington, DC 20375-5337
dAz
> I find it unconscionable, however, that a
> reasonable quality pendulum-based clock movement would not last well
> beyond 20 years without parts replacement.
you would think so, but unfortunatly the materials used in modern
grandfather movements don't compare to movements made in the 20s, 30s and
40s, the brass plates are half the thickness and the steel used is too
soft
the steel in the old movements was hardened, tempered and polished, even
when a pivot is scored it can be stoned and burnished back to a mirror
finish.
in a g'father clock of the last 20-30 years the steel is soft(easier to
machine) and to cut corners because polishing steel parts takes time and
cost money they nickle or chrome plate the steel parts.
unfortunatly this plating can and does flake away, the steel is softer
than the chromium so it wears away leaving a sharp edge of the chromium to
slice away at the brass in the pivot hole.
other problems is rust, it gets under the chromium and causes it to flake
away in places like the pinions, a normal steel pinion can be cleaned and
polished, but unless the chrome is removed from a plated pinion, the rough
surface will damage the wheel over time
I did a Gustav Becker grandfather the other week, made around 1930, its
last service was 30+ years ago, I put 6 bushes in it, 5 of those in holes
that have already been bushed previously and one in hole that was still
original, this clock still had a lot of pivot holes that have never needed
a bush, the pivots were mostly in good condition with very little scoring
and of course came back to a nice shiny finish after polishing. not bad
for a clock thats over 70years old and still with care has a long life in
front of it.
on the other hand a movement from an expensive 20 year old grandfather,
the the usual triple chime/moondial etc, every single hole was worn and
lot of the pivots were badly scored.
I would have to grind every pivot to make sure I remove all traces plating
before polishing, but its not worth the trouble because of the soft low
grade steel used.
better in this case to fit a new movement while they are still availible.
The Baron
late 60's and 70's that have lasted about 30 years, I have no personal
experience to support this. It may well have been, for a short time, the
factories accidentally made a better movement, however they are not doing so
today.
Some of the large, cable driven, flagship types do have thicker plates and
do appear to be of a better quality. But the basic steel in these clocks
is similar to nails. If the clock is ''cleaned'' frequently(even by
dunking or sprayed with some aerosol cleaner) and oiled, you ''may''
experience a longer run time, perhaps 5 years. Not quite worth the cost of
having it done by a clock shop, but something that a tinker could do.
The life time of these clocks is just about right for the owner, they get
them upon retirement and then die about the time they quit. If the owner
lives long enough then they must face this problem. Most of my customers
don't have them repaired but say let the kids pay for it.
"J. B. Wood" <wo...@itd.nrl.navy.mil> wrote in message
news:wood-06080...@jbw-mac.itd.nrl.navy.mil...
jduprie
will last more than the 20 or so that the hermles and such seem to be good
for....
thanks
--JD
.
"The Baron" <theb...@flash.net> wrote in message
news:cj0Ya.2769$H86....@newssvr19.news.prodigy.com...
dAz
> Thanks, but what I was looking for was a *better* movement - something
> that will last more than the 20 or so that the hermles and such seem to
> be good for....
well you could always use a 1930s movement, or make your own
Finite Guy
fit your clock?
Make one yourself? You need lots of tools and machines to do that.
Maybe a clock maker could take an old Emperor movemement and replace
the critical parts that wear with better steel?
One clock maker that I know said that he has seen pourous steel
shafts. May as well use pop metal.
On Thu, 07 Aug 2003 13:00:06 +1000, dAz <da...@nonspam-zip.com.au>
wrote:
dAz
> I suppose you could use a 1930's movemet but How would you get it to fit
> your clock?
umm a lot of work
> Make one yourself? You need lots of tools and machines to do that. Maybe
> a clock maker could take an old Emperor movemement and replace the
> critical parts that wear with better steel? One clock maker that I know
> said that he has seen pourous steel shafts. May as well use pop metal.
well you could always cut off all the pivots, drill out the arbours and
fit blue steel rod as replacement pivots, very hard and can be highly
polished
its a lot of work and would need to done properly to ensure the wheels
and pinions still run true
The Baron
There are loose movements on ebay with dials, perhaps this is what you want.
Clock material houses sell movements such as English pattern T&S.
"jduprie" <jdu...@comcast.net> wrote in message
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