More Orient Ana-digi pics and short review
Revision
Jack Denver
and logo - both look really tacky and stale - if they cleaned up their act
there, which would cost next to nothing, the watches would look much
classier. I really don't know what rampant lions have to do with this brand
to begin with.
"Revision" <kent...@notechispspam.com> wrote in message
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Revision
"Jack Denver"
> I really don't know what rampant lions have
> to do with this brand to begin with.
The lions look to me to be like Swiss heraldic lions, which is a bit far
afield. The whole "Orient" label is a millstone as far as western
marketing, and should change the name to Astro or Kronos or something.
Instead of Citizen, maybe Republic...or Freedom, and lose the China
market.
tla...@visto.com
I don't mind the Orient name and lions... if you don't like a
particular brand's company representation, don't buy them.
I have a particular affinity for certain brands, I have no particular
feeling for Orient. But I might dislike Heuer or Tissot for example.
I do understand when people say they don't like the font used in that
watch... I wonder why they need to point out what the buttons are for
anyway... if you can't remeber that one button is for 'mode',
'start/stop', perhaps you need to buy a simpler watch.
I'd rather they just left it blank.
Other than that it looks ok but I don't buy quartz.
T.
John S.
rectangular art-deco style looks even better on a black strap. I find
it difficult to fault their choice of logo - the brand is very popular
outside of europe and the U.S.
I acquired this watch from Wayne Lee about 2 years ago and still enjoy
it:
http://www.roachman.com/orient/preserve/PRCFDA2.jpg
Revision wrote:
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Jack Denver
I think their logo is stale, period, anywhere on Earth. If it has high
recognizability, it could be cleaned up and made more modern without being
ditched - the usual deal is to stylize it into something more abstract and
less literal. Many Japanese (as well as Western) companies have been thru
this process and Orient's makeover is long overdue.
"John S." <hjs...@cs.com> wrote in message
news:1110737958....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
John S.
new logo, new name or ene a revision to it's product line there has to
be a purpose for making that change, a goal.
I've had several non-westerners compliment me on the Orient watch and
they all indicated the brand was quite popular in their respective home
country. I take it that Orient (and Seiko) are satisfied with the
performance of their name and logo, recognition does not appear to be a
problem. So if you were advising them, what reasons would you offer to
justify such a potentially risky change.
I personally think the Rolex crown is pretentious, boring and because
it is copied so widely, commonplace. But it is successful in
generating sales, so why change it.
Richard Sexton
Jack Denver <nunu...@netscape.net> wrote:
>Do tacky looking rampant lions play better in Asia?
>
>I think their logo is stale, period, anywhere on Earth. If it has high
>recognizability, it could be cleaned up and made more modern without being
>ditched - the usual deal is to stylize it into something more abstract and
>less literal. Many Japanese (as well as Western) companies have been thru
>this process and Orient's makeover is long overdue.
They're on the crest of the national flag of Singapore. I like 'em.
"More modern" is not always best.
--
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633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | Killies, killi.net, Crypts, aquaria.net
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Jack Denver
Heraldry is just not a popular theme in product logos nowadays. The logo is
one of the things stopping me from buying their watches and I'll bet I'm not
alone. The reason for a logo change is to gain new customers while keeping
your old ones - it can be done.
"John S." <hjs...@cs.com> wrote in message
news:1110750108.1...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
none
> I gave you the reason - I think the logo looks old fashioned and tacky.
> Heraldry is just not a popular theme in product logos nowadays.
This is just an aesthetic issue, but I like corporate logos that have
some intrinsic artistic value. Logos that are purely representational --
for example, the TAG logo, which has the word 'TAG' inside a series of
squares -- are just another form of obstrusive, and therefore, tacky
advertisment.
The Orient lions are nice. I also like the Borel logo, which features a
pair of lovers behind a clock.
-Mike
John S.
in asia" is not really a relevant question. Since the brand is
obviously successful in asia and in other locations I don't see where
your ethnocentric observations on their attractiveness would have much
bearing. Seiko and their sub are quite successful.
Jack Denver
because they were no longer profitable enough to survive as an independent
company. They are not exactly taking the world or even the Asia market by
storm. Hanging on is more like it.
Maybe this has something to do with the tacky trademark, maybe not. It has
nothing to do with ethnicity as there is pretty much a unified world market
for this kind of stuff nowadays and good trademarks play equally well
everywhere. There are a few Asian trademarks that had to be fixed to play in
the West, such as "Darkie" toothpaste, whose trademark was a grining
blackface minstrel with white teeth. The minstrel was given a color change
ala Michael Jackson and the toothpaste is now called "Darlie"
Before:
http://photos1.blogger.com/img/99/1034/640/File0199.jpg
After:
http://ianandmanda.typepad.com/photos/oddities/darlie_toothpaste.html
"John S." <hjs...@cs.com> wrote in message
news:1110810267.6...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
John S.
asia not me. The Orient name and logo are clearly recognized in the
non-western part of the world. That you think your evaluation of what
"plays well" in your part of the world has meaning in the rest of the
world is clearly etchnocentric. Why change something that clearly
works in the markets that Seiko wants the Orient brand to compete in.
But please answer the question I posed several messages back: I take it
that Orient (and Seiko) are satisfied with the performance of their
name and logo, recognition does not appear to be a problem. So if you
were advising them, what reasons would you offer to justify such a
potentially risky change.
Brian Talley
> I gave you the reason - I think the logo looks old fashioned and tacky.
> Heraldry is just not a popular theme in product logos nowadays. The logo is
> one of the things stopping me from buying their watches and I'll bet I'm not
> alone. The reason for a logo change is to gain new customers while keeping
> your old ones - it can be done.
Why couldn't they couldn't have different styles of logo
for different markets? In locales where the lion logo works,
keep it. In other locales where it is perceived as tacky,
go with something else.
I confess the aesthetic issues around Orient watches is what
has kept me from buying them. The newer ones are far less
gaudy, IMO.
Jack Denver
is no point in changing. The question is whether they should be happy or
whether they are doing the best they possibly could, especially given the
almost total lack of Orient sales in the West. Someone else mentioned the
possibility of selling the same product under a different brand in the West,
as Toyota does with Lexus (they're all Toyota in the home market). One
solution might be to sell Orients as "Seiko" in the West since Seiko is a
well known name.
"John S." <hjs...@cs.com> wrote in message
news:1110830774....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
Mark South
> On Sun, 13 Mar 2005 20:17:54 -0500, Jack Denver wrote:
>
>> I gave you the reason - I think the logo looks old fashioned and tacky.
>> Heraldry is just not a popular theme in product logos nowadays. The logo is
>> one of the things stopping me from buying their watches and I'll bet I'm not
>> alone. The reason for a logo change is to gain new customers while keeping
>> your old ones - it can be done.
>
> Why couldn't they couldn't have different styles of logo
> for different markets? In locales where the lion logo works,
> keep it. In other locales where it is perceived as tacky,
> go with something else.
The general trend for all global trading companies is in the opposite
direction, consolidating behind fewer trademarks.
In Australia, "Nestle's Quik" became Nesquik and here in Suisse, "Choco
Pops" are becoming "Coco Pops", in both cases to get in line with other
markets.
I'd theorise that Seiko are letting the Orient trademark shrink and die,
but slowly so that there is time to replace it with the Seiko trademark.
This is what they already did with other trademarks of theirs, isn't it?
--
Mark South: World Citizen, Net Denizen
John S.
happy then there
is no point in changing."
But Jack, you originally said: "I think their logo is stale, period,
anywhere on Earth." I'm getting more confused.
Actually Orient does sell under other names, or more correctly it
rebadges several models with minor style changes for designer names
like Kenneth Cole. Seiko is dabbling just a bit with the Orient brand
in the U.S., and presumably elsewhere too. They have to take care
because unless the brands are kept totally distinct they will
canibalize sales. Seiko has tried a couple of different Lexus-like
upscale lines in the past 20 years with only modest apparent success. I
think they were less than successful because Seiko chose to market them
alongside the existing Seiko lines.
Jack Denver
owners can be oblivious and "happy" until it is too late. See Oldsmobile,
Sears, etc.
"John S." <hjs...@cs.com> wrote in message
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Honest John
"Jack Denver" <nunu...@netscape.net> wrote in message
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"oblivious and "happy"
Say, that reminds me, what has happened to Frank Adams ?