Snow blower power ratings
Worn Out Retread
of the engines are no longer in "Horse Power" but in "Foot Pounds" if given
at all. Sometimes all that is given is the CC's of the engine.
Even the people selling these machines don't know what the "Horse Power"
ratings are so that old geezers like myself can understand what is going on.
Does anyone have any general rules regarding the conversion of Foot Pounds
or CC's to Horse Power?
--
Ron P
Quick questions rarely have quick answers
sa...@dog.com
Your best bet is to find old literature for small engines and make a
chart of displacement=hp. Then use that chart to determine approximate
HP of newer equipment where you know the displacement but not the HP.
It will be a fairly accurate guide.
Ed Pawlowski
"Worn Out Retread" <newdo...@yahoo.ca> wrote in message
news:haq2ic$lml$1...@news.datemas.de...
Horsepower to CC is highly variable and not a good measure of power. My
cars have different engines. The 3800 cc is 190 HP but my 3300 cc is 234
HP. I suspect smaller engines are similar.
Foot Pounds is actually more useful as it is the torque to the shaft that is
doing the work. That said, none are truly meaningful in the whole scheme of
things. What good is high horsepower ratings with a poorly designed snow
throwing system?
Check out some models here
http://www.dontshovel.com/snow_blower_comparisons.html
http://www.consumerdemocracy.com/phelp/cd4/listPosRevs2B.aspx?catId=9996
If I was buying a new machine, I'd base my decision on features, size, drive
type, and what is important for my situation. The manufacturer will couple
the right sized engine to perform with the design of his machine. A half HP
difference is going to be not noticed, but a clogged chute will piss you off
every time.
dpb
Unfortunately, not at all precisely, no...thanks to the dam lawyers :(
One can _VERY_CRUDELY_ estimate hp at about 60-70% of torque.
The relationship I recall (I'd have to go off and think again to
re-derive the denominator) of hp ~ torque (ft-lb)*rpm/5250 which boils
down to the above since most ratings are at 3200-3600 rpm.
Unfortunately, that's about best one can do other than simply try to
find similar engine w/ known rating and compare based on displacement.
Problem there is that tune and emissions requirements, etc., make that
comparison as variable as the above.
Earlier Northern Tool catalog still listed an unofficial "old hp rating"
as well but I just looked and the last one doesn't. Now I'm hoping I
didn't throw the old one away and lose that cross-reference.
All in all, it sucks to guess how to compare even worse than before when
ratings could be tweaked--at least you knew what Sears was doing w/
"peak" or "instantaneous" horsepower; the torque ratings might be
absolutely accurate but they're still nearly useless as a comparison to
previous ratings and certainly there's not even the same measure used if
only provide displacement in one and torque in another.
--
sa...@dog.com
wrote:
>
>"Worn Out Retread" <newdo...@yahoo.ca> wrote in message
>news:haq2ic$lml$1...@news.datemas.de...
>>I am looking for a new snow blower and have discovered that the power
>>rating of the engines are no longer in "Horse Power" but in "Foot Pounds"
>>if given at all. Sometimes all that is given is the CC's of the engine.
>>
>> Even the people selling these machines don't know what the "Horse Power"
>> ratings are so that old geezers like myself can understand what is going
>> on. Does anyone have any general rules regarding the conversion of Foot
>> Pounds or CC's to Horse Power?
>
>Horsepower to CC is highly variable and not a good measure of power. My
>cars have different engines. The 3800 cc is 190 HP but my 3300 cc is 234
>HP. I suspect smaller engines are similar.
>
For the types of engines generally found on lawn equipment, comparison
of new engines and old engines of same brand and displacement is a
valid comparison. These are utility engines designed to run at optimum
RPM's while in use. A car engines is vastly different in it's
requirements.
If an old snowthrower with a 13 hp Briggs engine is 350cc, then a new
350cc Briggs powered snow blower will be about the same HP.
Ed Pawlowski
<sa...@dog.com> wrote in message
> If an old snowthrower with a 13 hp Briggs engine is 350cc, then a new
> 350cc Briggs powered snow blower will be about the same HP.
>
B & S is using the foot pounds from what I've seen. an 8.5 ft lb is 6.5 hp
11.5 = 7.5 hp 15.5 = 11 hp
Van Chocstraw
They are just trying to pull one over on us by frigging up standard
ratings in the US.
CC's equate more to Cubic Inches. Foot pounds equate to horsepower.
Multiply horsepower by 33,000 to get foot pounds.
It's just another crooked business tactic to screw you over.
See the chart: http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Show/3753/convert.htm
dpb
...
> CC's equate more to Cubic Inches. Foot pounds equate to horsepower.
cc and ci are both displacements, yes.
torque and horsepower aren't the same units at all---
> Multiply horsepower by 33,000 to get foot pounds.
So a 3hp lawnmower has almost 100,000 ft-lb of torque??? Amazing! Them
are some stout crankshafts...
Actually hp*33,000 --> ft-lbs/minute, _not_ ft-lb (as the table shows).
The "per minute" part is significant here.
--
Tony
Yes, "per minute" is the key. Same as how horsepower is measured.
"Horsepower is defined as work done over time. The exact definition of
one horsepower is 33,000 lb.ft./minute. Put another way, if you were to
lift 33,000 pounds one foot over a period of one minute, you would have
been working at the rate of one horsepower. In this case, you'd have
expended one horsepower-minute of energy."
dpb
> dpb wrote:
>> Van Chocstraw wrote:
>> ...
>>> CC's equate more to Cubic Inches. Foot pounds equate to horsepower.
>>
>> cc and ci are both displacements, yes.
>>
>> torque and horsepower aren't the same units at all---
>>
>>> Multiply horsepower by 33,000 to get foot pounds.
>>
>> So a 3hp lawnmower has almost 100,000 ft-lb of torque??? Amazing!
>> Them are some stout crankshafts...
>>
>> Actually hp*33,000 --> ft-lbs/minute, _not_ ft-lb (as the table
>> shows). The "per minute" part is significant here.
>
> Yes, "per minute" is the key. Same as how horsepower is measured.
>
> "Horsepower is defined as work done over time. The exact definition of
Well, DOH! if 1-hp * 33,000 ft-lb/min/hp = 1 hp I guess it would follow
that the definition of 1 hp <==> 33,000 ft-lb/min...
--
ransley
wrote:
CC is cubic centimeters, CI is cubic inch, my new toro is 6.75 ft lbs
of crap, it doesnt cut as well as an old 3.5 hp engine, the new
ratings just decieve all. I thought my toro was 6.75 hp, I was ready
to junk it because it bogs so bad.
ransley
Talk to a local shop that sells and services them, you wont get any
service at the big stores
Steve Barker
the HP is really irrelevant. Don't worry about it.
MLD
"Van Chocstraw" <boobooil...@roadrunner.com> wrote in message
news:vtCdnTy1SMadMk3X...@giganews.com...
Not so! You neglected the time part of the conversion--it's (ft-lbs/Min).
RPM is an input too all of this
MLD
cl...@snyder.on.ca
Foot lbs X rpm /5252 is horsepower. So you need to know the RPM.
The reason they have done this is because several companies were sued
for over-rating the horsepower their engines actually put out.
Like a lawn mower has a 4.5 HP engine (rated at 3600 rpm by the
manufacturer) but because of the blade length and safety regulations
the engine is limited to 2400 RPM on the mower (maximum velocity of
discharge limit). So the 4.5HP engine is now 2.85 HP - but it is STILL
a 6.56 ft lb engine.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
Unless the old 350cc 13hp Briggs is a "side valve" engine with 5.6:1
compression ratio, and the new 350cc engine is an overhead valve
engine with 11.5:1 compression ratio - which MIGHT be a 18HP engine.
Numbers just picked out of thin air, but the principal is there.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
Multiply the old rating X 5252 and devide by 3600 and you have the
torque rating of the old engine to compare. Virtually all of the old
engines were rated at 3600 rpm.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
PARDON?????
My 140HP Corvair puts out 4,620,000 ft lbs of
torque????????????????????????????
WOW!!!!!
cl...@snyder.on.ca
It is the "old" 4.5 HP, but because of speed limits it is really
only 3 hp - assuming 2400 RPM limit.
On a 24" mower, the blade tip travels 75.36 inches (6.28 ft) per
revolution. At 3600 rpm that is 22,608 ft per minute - well in excess
of the mandated 19,000 limit. The limit is reached at just 3025 RPM.
So IF it is a 24" mower, it is a 3.88 HP mower.
Steve Barker
I've never heard of two things mentioned here:
#1. a 24" push mower
#2. a 2400 rpm limit
AFAIK, all small engines are governed at 3600 and that's where they operate.
s
sa...@dog.com
The principle is pretty gaseous as well. In the real world, the old
and new 350 cc engines will have about the same HP. Seen any snow
blowers with Briggs or Tecumseh engines that call for premium gas
lately? Ever?
Tony Hwang
It is all matter of useful HP and useful torque. HP rating is often very
misleading. If Peak HP occurs near top rpm it won't be good. I'd pay
more attention to torque. I still remember what I was told when I was a
kid. Torque is how big a stump an engine can pull, HP is how fast.
Van Chocstraw
You shouldn't have to play with your pecker to find out something that
should be stamped on the motor. (HP)
Worn Out Retread
news:RLSdnfhLp6vjN03X...@giganews.com...
This is the most useful of the information supplied so far. I am going to
make note of the ft lbs/hp ratios as the foot pound rating is the most
popular of the ratings around here. The displacement ratings are almost
useless in my opinion.
Thank you.
Worn Out Retread
news:0h62d5lk25ma0052l...@4ax.com...
This is perfectly true. Engines of the same displacement can vary greatly in
power developed due to the ratio of diameter of piston to the length of
stroke, valve configuration, exhaust tuning and other factors.
--
Ron
Worn Out Retread
news:haq825$oq5$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
perfectly adequate. Now that I want a new blower, I don't want to buy a
machine that has less power than the old one but the published specs are
just plainly designed to confuse the buyer and there are very few web sites
that do much to untangle the mess of misleading information.
If all you are doing is clearing 6 inches of snow off a driveway that is one
thing but when the snow plough comes by and dumps a mess 2 feet deep and 6
feet up the drive, that small snow blower is just not going to get the job
done without nearly blowing its guts out especially if the material to be
cleared has had any great amount of salt added to it making the mess very
dense and therefore heavy and difficult to move.
--
Ron
Worn Out Retread
<cl...@snyder.on.ca> wrote in message
news:fo62d5hel140cnrst...@4ax.com...
So that works out to be approximately 70% of the rated torque if rated in
foot lbs. which would be easily calculated while browsing different models.
Someone else gave some equivalents of torque and horse power and the figures
pretty well agreed with what you have given.
Thanks
--
Ron
Worn Out Retread
news:vtCdnTy1SMadMk3X...@giganews.com...
Thanks for the link. I have used it before but the formula that they gave
had me somewhat baffled what is 10 over score 7? Is it 10 to the power of 7,
10 to the power of 1/7, 10 divided by 7? No explanation is given and I have
not ever seen that way of writing a formula.
--
Ron
Worn Out Retread
news:4dae9437-d980-4286...@c3g2000yqd.googlegroups.com...
That is exactly what I have been doing and they have no accurate information
in this regard. They could only offer guesses.
--
Ron
Worn Out Retread
news:zaudnQ3-kYCHf03X...@giganews.com...
I guess that you are only going to look at your machine and not actually do
some work with it. Work requires power and knowing what you have IS
important.
Worn Out Retread
news:aXbAm.226307$sC1.1...@newsfe17.iad...
That is the point of the question asked. I want to buy a machine of at least
the same power as the old machine but the system of measurement has changed
so that creates a problem that I have to solve before parting with my money.
--
Ron
Van Chocstraw
Try this converter: http://www.onlineconversion.com/power.htm
Apparently 5 hp IS 9 million foot pounds per hour.
Ed Pawlowski
>
> I guess that you are only going to look at your machine and not actually
> do some work with it. Work requires power and knowing what you have IS
> important.
How will you know how much power it has? Surely not by the HP ratings on
the engine.
aemeijers
Lordy. Unless you are buying pro-grade gear, odds are it is gonna be an
MTD anyway, no matter what brand name is stuck on it. The same size
blower will have the same engine across all the house brands. Buy the
size you need, and move on. Almost always, it will be adequate. The
manufacturer has no percentage in giving themselves a bad reputation, so
they match them up pretty well. Don't lose sleep over it- life is too
short.
--
aem sends....
cl...@snyder.on.ca
You are blowing smoke. Because you don't know anything about engines.
My numbers were a bit high. A 20HP Intek is 8.8:1. A 25 HP Kohler
Command is 9:1, and the Briggs Animal runs 9.5, 9.7, or 10.0 :1
depending on class.
From Popular Hot Rod's tech pages:
Basics
Increasing the CR produces an increase in output throughout the rpm
range. It is also worth an increase in fuel economy. If a longer
duration cam is installed, raising the CR at the same time can be
worth even greater dividends than these two moves considered
separately. When the CR is raised, peak combustion pressures are
increased. As a rough rule of thumb, cylinder pressures are about 100
times what the CR is so, from a 10:1 engine, we would expect to see
about 1,000 psi of peak combustion pressure.
Cylinder pressures and output will increase as the CR is raised, but
what is less obvious is that the increase in compression also
increases the engines thermal efficiency. Thermal efficiency is a
measure of how effectively the engine converts heat into mechanical
power. To appreciate this it is better to consider the engines
expansion ratio (ER). This is the opposite side of the coin to the CR
and describes what is occurring as the piston moves down on the power
stroke rather than what happens as it moves up on the compression
stroke.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
Well you are wrong on both counts. I use a 24" rotary "push" mower to
mow my lot all the time, and current lawn mowers are rpm limited to
prevent tip speeds in excess of 19000 ft/minute - and in some cases
14000. It's the LAW in Noth America for all home use lawn mowers.
Apparently SOME commercial units may excede the tip speed depending on
other fastors that I am not aware of.
It IS because of this that lawn mower power ratings were changed. The
engine is rated at a given HP at 3600 RPM - but the equipment does not
allow it to run at that speed so the HP rating is no longer valid.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
wrote:
If a particular frame size is available with 3 engine options (which
is normal) buy the middle one for normal use, the big one for heavy
snow conditions, and the small one as an ornament. (or for light snow
conditions)
My old 26 incher was available as a 5, 8, and 10 hp.
Mine was a 5 HP Tec Sno-King and was adequate for normal blowing, but
stressed handling deep packed snow plough ridges. When I blew the 5 I
put on an 8, which was the same block as the 5, so fit with absolutely
no modifications.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
You have the tools now.
torqueXrpm/5252=HP
The old engine was rated at 3600 RPM - universally. So your new engine
torque X 3600 /5252 is the rating of old engine that is equivalent.
If it is an OHV engine it will usually have a broader power range, so
will do MORE work than the old side valve equivalent, and on less
fuel.
aemeijers
stores around here that are open evenings and weekends, offer any
choices in engine sizes. I'd wager the price at an equipment dealer is a
lot higher than at the big-box, as well. Of course, you are up in
Canada- I suspect there may be more of a market for heavy-duty stuff up
there. Around here in Baja Ontario (aka lower Michigan), anything over
15" shuts down the city for a day or two.
--
aem sends...
sa...@dog.com
But in THIS category of engines, that isn't generally a factor. Old
and new Briggs utility engines of the same displacement will also have
similar power characteristics.
You probably won't find a snowblower with a turbo option, and lowered
suspension, either.
sa...@dog.com
You are an idiot, Clare. Obviously I understand that engines can and
are built for different types of performance and different uses. We
are talking about SNOW FUCKING BLOWERS, dimwit. They aren't high
performance racing machines. You could even know the horsepower of a
given displacement Briggs snowblower by knowing the horsepower of a 15
year old Tecumseh Snow blower engine of the same displacement. It
would be quite similar.
Popular Hot Rod! Bwhahahahaha!
sa...@dog.com
wrote:
Bought my Ariens from a local mom & pop commercial tractor store for
the same price as the big box stores.
Van Chocstraw
* 1.3558179483314 newton meters
A newton metre is dimensionally equal to a joule
A joule is the energy exerted by a force of one newton acting to move an
object through a distance of one metre
1 joule is equal to:
* 1�107 ergs (exactly)
* 6.24150974�1018 eV (electronvolts)
* 0.2390 cal (thermochemical gram calories or small calories)
* 2.3901�10-4 kcal (thermochemical kilocalories, kilogram calories,
large calories or food calories)
* 9.4782�10-4 BTU (British thermal unit)
* 0.7376 ft�lbf (foot-pound force)
* 23.7 ft�pdl (foot-poundals)
* 2.7778�10-7 kilowatt-hour
* 2.7778�10-4 watt-hour
* 9.8692�10-3 liter-atmosphere
* 1�10-44 Foe (exactly)
Units defined in terms of the joule include:
* 1 thermochemical calorie = 4.184 J
* 1 International Table calorie = 4.1868 J
* 1 watt hour = 3600 J
* 1 kilowatt hour = 3.6�106 J (or 3.6 MJ)
* 1 ton TNT = 4.184 GJ
* Hiroshima's "Little Boy" (12-15 kt TNT) = 50-63 TJ
cl...@snyder.on.ca
The difference between a side valve and overhead valve engine of any
displacement in any application is generally considerable.
It IS a factor, as anyone who is fammiliar with small engines will
know.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
wrote:
>cl...@snyder.on.ca wrote:
The same machine was available with 3 different engines from
Canadian Tire and anyone who sold the Noma line of blowers.
Same was true of Sears equipment of the same time period.
MTD built snow blowers about 5 miles from my home and a good friend
was the Canadian parts manager. They built 3 differen blowers on the
same "chassis" - with the same auger - as well as several variations
with the same "chassis" and larger or smaller augers, each with
different power options as well.
This is going back a while, so the actual sizes and horsepower may
not be 100% accurate - But my memory for this stuff is generally
pretty good.
Small frame 20, 22, and 24 blowers, medium frame 24, 26, and 28"
blowers and large frame 28, 30, and 32 if I remember correctly.
Something like that anyway, and the 22 was avaialble as 3, 4, and 5
hp, on the small frame. The 26 was available as 5, 8, and 10 on the
medium frame. and the medium sized large frame was available as at
least a 10 and a 12.
The current situation with the "big box" stores may well have changed
(I'm talking Home Despot and WallMart and their ilk) but most lawn and
garden equipment dealers and large hardware companies still have more
options. At Canadian tire you still have the option of side valve or
OHV engines on the same frame with the same auger - or at least did
have for the 2008/2009 season. The lower priced unit had the old
side-valve engine. If it wasn't a holiday up here tomorrow I'd go
check out the displacement vs torque specs on the 2 different style
engines and put this to rest.
Well, for those who don't believe there is a difference and can't
understand why there is a difference, and have their minds already
made up, I guess it woudn't change anything - so why should I waste
the time or effort.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
And I wouldn't buy major power equipment from the "despot" anyway. For
virtually the same price you can buy DECENT equipment from someone who
KNOWS the product and will be there to supply you with service and
repair parts when needed.
The Ariens line is pretty top notch stuff (or at least it was when I
was in the business) Worked for an Ariens dealer for several years
back when I was a young feller. Back then Ariens, Hahn, and Jacobsen
were the big players in the quality lawn mower and snow blower
business up here.
Today Honda has a good hold on the business, with Toro and Ariens
still definitely holding their fair share.
Briggs and Stratton, having absorbed Murray pretty well own the lower
middle end of the spectrum, with MTD/YardWorks taking up the slack
below.
You generally can't go too far wrong buying Ariens, particularly from
a reputable dealer with good service facilities.
aemeijers
>(long and educational explanation snipped)
Wow- you folks up north sure do have a lot more choices than we do down
here, leastways if we don't want to take a weekday off to shop. I am
curious, what price does a typical 24" 2-stage run up there?
BTW, I didn't buy mine at the Borg. I bought it off Craig'sList,
essentially brand new, from a small-framed fellow who was pretty clearly
scared of it. 100 bucks cheaper than new, which was around 600 at the
time. I did do a lot of shopping around though, at least at the places
that were open on Saturday around here. Only difference between brands
seemed to be color and decals. The 'Fisher-Price' rubber-auger singles,
the 24", and the 26", all had a single model available. I'm sure that if
I was doing driveways for a living, it wouldn't hold up as well as a
thousand-dollar machine, but for my little 20x60 driveway, it seems to
be holding up fine. And my back feels a whole lot better in winter.
--
aem sends....
cl...@snyder.on.ca
wrote:
>cl...@snyder.on.ca wrote:
On Sun, 11 Oct 2009 23:16:41 -0400, aemeijers <aeme...@att.net>
wrote:
>cl...@snyder.on.ca wrote:
Currently Canadian Tire has 2 24" blowers listed online. The Troybuilt
is 1149.99 and the yardworks is 999.99
Both use the Powermore 208cc OHV engine. The Troy has"power steering."
They also have a Yarworks with single speed - down and dirty cheapest
thing MTD could throw together, with the same engine for 769.95
Looks like with the death of Tecumseh the L-head engine option (the
old snow-king) is gone.
For the first time I also only see one HP per blower width - on 2
brands listed on their site.
Home harware has both a 26 and 28 inch TORO with 250cc Briggs. 24"
1599.99 and 28 inch with fingertip steering at 1899.99
Sears Canada has Craftsman 24" with 208cc Storm Force OHV (9 ft lb )
(6 HP) for 899.99
Also 24" 208cc Powermate engine for 999.99
Also for 1099.99 a 249cc 11.5 ft lb (8 HP) Briggs on the 24" blower.
Then they have both 27" and 30" with 305cc Briggs 14.5 ft lb (10 HP)
for 1699.99 eachIn the 27 inch size they also have 249cc briggs for
1199.99 and 999.99, as well as Briggs OHV 13.5 ft lb (9 HP) for
1299.99 and a Poulan Pro 291cc 12.4 ft lb (8.5HP)
So it is obvious they are still building and selling the same machine
with different engine options - both HP and valve configuration..
Looking at Briggs specs, the 205cc Intek OHV is 7.5HP compared to
249cc for the flathead 8HP.
The OHV Snow line has a 342cc, 20.85cu inch series at 16.5 and 15.5 ft
lb (10.6 and 11.3HP) as well as a305cc (18.6 cu inch) at 13.5 and 14.5
ft lb (9.25 and 9.9 hp), the 249 at 11.5 and 11 ft lb, and the 205 at
8 and 9 ft lb (5.5 and 6HP)
THe engines referred to as "power mate" are COLEMAN engines.
The "Storm Force" engine is a Chinese LCT engine.
The "Powermore" is also a cheap chinese engine - a cob-rough copy of a
Honda, used by MTD on their "value lines"
So, More than you ever wanted to know about SnowBlowers and engines in
Canada.
sa...@dog.com
Absolutely not a consideration in a snowblower engine, which is run at
two speeds. Stopped and Full Throttle.
Don't bother with a reply unless it actually applies to snowblower
engines specifically. Hint: Snowblowers are not motorcycles.
Worn Out Retread
>>
>> I guess that you are only going to look at your machine and not actually
>> do some work with it. Work requires power and knowing what you have IS
>> important.
>
> Lordy. Unless you are buying pro-grade gear, odds are it is gonna be an
> MTD anyway, no matter what brand name is stuck on it. The same size blower
> will have the same engine across all the house brands. Buy the size you
> need, and move on. Almost always, it will be adequate. The manufacturer
> has no percentage in giving themselves a bad reputation, so they match
> them up pretty well. Don't lose sleep over it- life is too short.
The engines are NOT the same on the snow blowers. Some have Briggs and
Stratton, some are Tecumseh and others are Honda powered. Finding the size
that I need in measurements that I am not familiar with is the problem.
Buying a size that is not up to what I require will inevitably result in the
machine being inadequate for the job at hand.
Worn Out Retread
"aemeijers" <aeme...@att.net> wrote in message
news:w7KdnY_RxvCaok_X...@giganews.com...
My old machine was a 26 inch with an 8 HP Tecumseh engine. It was barely
adequate in heavy snow especially where the snow plough has filled in the
end of the driveway. I don't want to repeat the experience.
Worn Out Retread
news:4oi4d5pq75gbeuo4k...@4ax.com...
I will be buying from a dealership that does the authorized maintenance and
repairs with genuine parts. I have bought power equipment from big box
stores and from mom and pop stores and frankly, timely warranty services was
a real hassle to get.
Worn Out Retread
For $600 Cdn you get a "power broom." A decent machine is going to cost
$1600 or more. The toy machines are about $900 to $1100.
Ed Pawlowski
> adequate in heavy snow especially where the snow plough has filled in the
> end of the driveway. I don't want to repeat the experience.
More power may not always be the answer though. If you put a 20 HP engine
on that machine, would it blow the packed snow or would it just break the
shear pin, bend the auger and damage other parts? You may be asking the
machine to do more than it is designed to do, no matter the engine size.
I certainly can't say because I did not see or feel the snow you had. My
small machine takes a while with it though, you just have to take small
bites.
Worn Out Retread
usual some wasn't.
I will have to use my "gut instinct" on this one I think....nothing less
than 11 foot lbs.
--
Ron
cl...@snyder.on.ca
See my later post. I have not been talking motorcycles. I've been
talking lawn mowers and snow blowers.I have been a small engine
mechanic. Worked for an Ariens dealer back before OHV small engines
were available. Have also been an auto mechanic for many years. Have
owned and worked on flatheads as well as OHV and OHC engines and I
know the difference, and the advantages VERY well.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
wrote:
>
Given the machine WAS AVAILABLE with a 10 HP engine, it is pretty
certain the 10 HP machine would have blown more snow. A 20 HP motor
would also have blown more snow - up to the point where the excess
power could have destroyed the machine. As long as the shear pins were
not bypassed, the probability of actually damaging the machine from
excessive power is pretty remote. I could take out the shear pins on
my 5/26 without any problem if I got "stupid" with it.
sa...@dog.com
wrote:
>
I can tell you that putting tire chains on my snow blower was like
doubling the power. What a difference! It's a decent but small
machine. 24 inch Ariens with 7.5 HP Snow King engine. I used to have
to seriously manhandle it to clear the packed berm at the end of the
driveway from the city plows. Now I just put it in low - It digs in
and it GOES. All I do is steer.
Ed Pawlowski
That will get you about 7 to 8 hp from what I've seen.
Look here
http://www.smallenginewarehouse.com/ProductList.asp?PageNum=4&PerPage=30&Category=Engine
Note the 11.5 ft lb. is right in with the 7.5 hp models.
The 14.5 ft. lb. are in with the 10 hp models
http://www.smallenginewarehouse.com/ProductList.asp?PageNum=5&PerPage=30&Category=Engine
The 15.5 are in with the 11 hp
http://www.smallenginewarehouse.com/product.asp?PN=21M114-0620&desc=Briggs &
Stratton Engine 15.50 Ft. Lbs. Torque Horizontal 1" x 2 29/32" Shaft,
342cc, Fuel Tank, Muffler, Snow Intek, EP
aemeijers
I'm lucky, I guess. My rural subdivision usually does not get plowed
till mid-day, so I seldom have to deal with that. I plow halfway across
the street, and 2-3 passes along the edge of the street 'upstream' to
the way the plow comes, and 'downstream' past the mailbox. Only problem
I have, at least with the guy that had the contract last couple of
years, is that he uses the low spot in my front yard as a push-off area
sometimes. (I'm halfway up a straight stretch.) Gee, I wonder why the
grass keeps dying in that part of the yard. I need a boulder pretty bad,
I think.
Although maybe the township hired somebody else this year- they had one
inexperienced driver that plowed big divots out of a lot of front yards.
The people who are turf-obsessed were mighty PO'd, and bitched loudly to
the PTB.
Fingers crossed for a very mild winter. If I can ever afford to retire,
I plan to sell the snowblower with the house, and move somewhere that
has at most an inch or two a couple times a winter. And no more sloped
driveways! :^(
--
aem sends...
cl...@snyder.on.ca
7.5HP Snow King on a 24" machine IS adequate power (seeing a 24"
machine could also be purchaced with a 4 HP engine, with 5 and 6 HP
being the most common on 24" machines.
Is your ariens the Pro or the standard? All Ariens Pro machines have a
lockable differnetial on the wheel drive, while the standards have a
solid axle that you can either pin to both wheels or have drive only
one.
sa...@dog.com
>On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 15:21:25 -0400, sa...@dog.com wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 12 Oct 2009 11:47:50 -0400, "Ed Pawlowski" <e...@snet.net>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"Worn Out Retread" <newdo...@yahoo.ca> wrote in message
>>>>
>>>> My old machine was a 26 inch with an 8 HP Tecumseh engine. It was barely
>>>> adequate in heavy snow especially where the snow plough has filled in the
>>>> end of the driveway. I don't want to repeat the experience.
>>>
>>>More power may not always be the answer though. If you put a 20 HP engine
>>>on that machine, would it blow the packed snow or would it just break the
>>>shear pin, bend the auger and damage other parts? You may be asking the
>>>machine to do more than it is designed to do, no matter the engine size.
>>>
>>>I certainly can't say because I did not see or feel the snow you had. My
>>>small machine takes a while with it though, you just have to take small
>>>bites.
>>>
>>
>>I can tell you that putting tire chains on my snow blower was like
>>doubling the power. What a difference! It's a decent but small
>>machine. 24 inch Ariens with 7.5 HP Snow King engine. I used to have
>>to seriously manhandle it to clear the packed berm at the end of the
>>driveway from the city plows. Now I just put it in low - It digs in
>>and it GOES. All I do is steer.
> 7.5HP Snow King on a 24" machine IS adequate power (seeing a 24"
>machine could also be purchaced with a 4 HP engine, with 5 and 6 HP
>being the most common on 24" machines.
>
It did not seem adequate until I added tire chains. Then it was a
whole different machine. Until then, I was regretting that I hadn't
bought a much bigger machine. At the time I just couldn't see buying a
bigger snowblower that took up a lot more room in the garage. The
models up from mine were substantially larger in all dimensions.
It's important to get a good quality machine. Even the cheaper ones
last for 20 or more years. That's a long time to live with a mistake!
Better to spennd a few more dollars and cry once, then to cry every
time you use it.
Worn Out Retread
news:DIednfifFNtU0k7X...@giganews.com...
quite well without overworking the machines. I know very well about taking
small amounts but when you are trying to move snow from the foot of the
drive that is 4 to 5 feet high, even small bites takes a lot of power.
Having used snow blowers for about 40 years, I think that I have some idea
on how to handle them and what to expect of them.
I just don't want to buy a pony when a real horse is what I need.
Worn Out Retread
> It's important to get a good quality machine. Even the cheaper ones
> last for 20 or more years. That's a long time to live with a mistake!
>
> Better to spennd a few more dollars and cry once, then to cry every
> time you use it.
That is exactly what I want to avoid. Life already has enough hassles.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
Buy a matched team of Clydes.
Unlike horses you only need to feed an engine when you use it. There
is no such thing as too much power, too much air under a wing, or too
much fuel left in the tank.
Twayne
news:rds9d59oc5aig5up5...@4ax.com...
>
>
> Buy a matched team of Clydes.
> is no such thing as too much power, too much air under a wing,
You certainly are an intelligent one, aren't you? </sarcasm>
Ed Pawlowski
Tony Hwang
> "Tony Hwang" <drag...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
> news:aXbAm.226307$sC1.1...@newsfe17.iad...
>> Worn Out Retread wrote:
>>> I am looking for a new snow blower and have discovered that the power
>>> rating of the engines are no longer in "Horse Power" but in "Foot
>>> Pounds" if given at all. Sometimes all that is given is the CC's of
>>> the engine.
>>>
>>> Even the people selling these machines don't know what the "Horse
>>> Power" ratings are so that old geezers like myself can understand
>>> what is going on. Does anyone have any general rules regarding the
>>> conversion of Foot Pounds or CC's to Horse Power?
>>>
>> It is all matter of useful HP and useful torque. HP rating is often
>> very misleading. If Peak HP occurs near top rpm it won't be good. I'd
>> pay more attention to torque. I still remember what I was told when I
>> was a kid. Torque is how big a stump an engine can pull, HP is how fast.
>
> That is the point of the question asked. I want to buy a machine of at
> least the same power as the old machine but the system of measurement
> has changed so that creates a problem that I have to solve before
> parting with my money.
Hi,
My local Sears flyer over the week end listed several blowers with only
torque ratings. Did not list HP ratings.