How to fix my iron railings?
Nil
embedded directly into the steps. Over time, the iron has rusted and
the railings are all breaking off at ground level. This has been
hastened by the ice melter that I've used on the steps the past couple
of years, which I've discovered is VERY corrosive to metal (it also ate
a screwdriver I had used to break up chunks of the stuff.)
So, here's what state it's in right now:
http://home.comcast.net/~esionder/temp/rail1.jpg
http://home.comcast.net/~esionder/temp/rail2.jpg
I plan to get the railings repaired by having a metal shop weld
extensions onto the legs. What's a "proper" or better way to reattach
them to the steps?
Jim
"Nil" <redn...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9D35A665...@130.133.4.11...
Best way to repair them is to cut them off flush with the concrete, then
weld pads to the base of the rods...drill holes through the pads and re
anchor to the cement using cement anchors or Hilti.. Jim
mike
It depends on the nature of the extensions. It could be a flange to
reattach with concrete fasteners to the top (and cover the ugly break
point), or it could be an extension designed to fasten to the side of
the steps.
I'd want to cover the blemish.
dpb
...
> I plan to get the railings repaired by having a metal shop weld
> extensions onto the legs. What's a "proper" or better way to reattach
> them to the steps?
What Jim said except ... can't tell but what shape is the rest of the
leg in and how heavy were they to start with? Looks like lots of paint
bubbling which is good sign of corrosion on insides and given the
obvious length of time (based on stains) they've been rusting away, it's
quite possible there's hardly enough material left to make them worth
saving. That's a call can't tell from those photo's; you'll probably
get a good input from the shop guys. Which, btw, find a shop that does
such stuff routinely not just a general purpose weld shop; you'll likely
do far better.
--
Oren
It looks like the pad was cored and epoxy used to set the rails?
If so, I would remove all the old material, clean the core and use new
epoxy. The welder can also make a base plate that could be anchored
over the preset spot.
mm
<redn...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote:
>The steps leading up to my front door have iron railings on them,
>embedded directly into the steps. Over time, the iron has rusted and
>the railings are all breaking off at ground level. This has been
>hastened by the ice melter that I've used on the steps the past couple
>of years, which I've discovered is VERY corrosive to metal (it also ate
>a screwdriver I had used to break up chunks of the stuff.)
>
>So, here's what state it's in right now:
>
>http://home.comcast.net/~esionder/temp/rail1.jpg
>
>http://home.comcast.net/~esionder/temp/rail2.jpg
>
>I plan to get the railings repaired by having a metal shop weld
>extensions
Who is designing these extensions? It sounds a bit like you've
already decided what they will look like and only after that are you
trying to come up with a way to attach them.
Steve B
"Nil" <redn...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9D35A665...@130.133.4.11...
Let me say this about that. Yes, no, definitely, maybe, and I don't know.
I used to fix just such things, being an ex steel erection contractor. I
fixed this type of stuff for 275 apartment complexes.
What has happened is that the water has stood in and around this long enough
to rust it out. Not a lot you can do about that unless you want to core
drill out the stubs, and then make the Pourstone footer higher to keep it
out of the water. But then, you would have to weld additions on, and fill
them from the inside, and then, they would probably just rot off at the base
again.
What I would do: The metal is probably rusted out up a ways from the broken
off base. I'd cut about six inches off of that leg, weld a fresh piece of
.120" square tubing on to what's there so as to be close as you can have it
fit onto the plates and give you desired height. Then cut the other trash
stuff off flush with the deck. Clean the holes out best you can and fill
flush with Pourstone. (hydraulic cement) Then put a 4" square 1/4" plate
on the deck so as to center it over the hole. These are available at
wrought iron supply places, or over the Internet. If you don't know where,
Google ornamental metal suppliers. A big one in Houston and LA. Probably
one close to you, or cut your own.
Figure your height. If you did it right, you should come pretty close. If
you are high, cut some off. Weld the legs to the plate, and leave a weep
hole so water going in the inside has a way to seep out. It will look bad,
but will lengthen the life of the post. Get it plumb and level. Paint
using a cardboard mask.
Optional plate fasteners: Nail-ins (not suggested, as they tend to weaken
and pull out), Red Heads, sleeve anchors, or wedge concrete fasteners.
Drill holes deeper than you need so you don't have a lot of threads sticking
up. When you pound the rod down in the hole, be sure to put washer and nut
on it flush to the top so you don't booger up the threads, or remove it if
it mushrooms. Get all of them down to tight with light taps from a hammer,
then tighten them up.
$200 if I was to do this repair in today's market. Less if you can weld and
have RotoHammer and tools.
Steve
There you go.
JIMMIE
> "Nil" <redno...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote in message
Yeah,bolting it to a flange as others have suggested is just all
wrong. Ive seen the results too many times. Its a code violation in a
lot of places, maybe all. The apt I used to live in had to tear them
all out after installing them that way. You can fasten them using
brackets if the top rails are secured at each end of the rail. This
often isn't the case with steps.
Jimmie
dpb
...
> Yeah,bolting it to a flange as others have suggested is just all
> wrong. Ive seen the results too many times. Its a code violation in a
> lot of places, maybe all. The apt I used to live in had to tear them
> all out after installing them that way. You can fasten them using
> brackets if the top rails are secured at each end of the rail. This
> often isn't the case with steps.
...
Not bolt _to_ flange; welded flange mounted.
I'd be _very_ surprised to find anyplace where that is Code violation.
--
Roger Shoaf
"Nil" <redn...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9D35A665...@130.133.4.11...
The way they were designed originally obviously is not good enough, so I
would suggest doing it better this time. Consult with the shop about their
recommendations, but you might consider some stainless steel inserts that
the railing could then be attached to so as to prevent a repeat failure.
If you find that it is expensive to do it the right way, consider what it
will cost you if on an icy morning you go to grab the rail to keep from
falling and the sucker fails on you and you get injured. Lost work and
doctor bills are really costly.
--
Roger Shoaf
If you are not part of the solution, you are not dissolved in the solvent.
Phisherman
<redn...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote:
Why get replacements if they are going to rust too? Aluminum might be
longer lasting. Or, consider PT wood posts with large rabbit joints
that bolt to the side of the steps. These kinds of posts really need
to be secured more than you think due to the sideways forces they need
to take. I've know more than one person who broke bones, tore tenons,
survived 6 months of painful therapy--all could have been avoided with
strong sturdy railings on steps.
Nil
> What Jim said except ... can't tell but what shape is the rest of
> the leg in and how heavy were they to start with? Looks like lots
> of paint bubbling which is good sign of corrosion on insides and
> given the obvious length of time (based on stains) they've been
> rusting away, it's quite possible there's hardly enough material
> left to make them worth saving.
Yes, they are quite rusted where they hit the step, but above that they
are solid. What I meant by "extensions" is that I'll have the bottom
several inches cut off and new material welded on. That way they'll be
strong and will retain the original height. I did that to another
railing further up the steps and they are quite sturdy.
Nil
>>http://home.comcast.net/~esionder/temp/rail1.jpg
>>
>>http://home.comcast.net/~esionder/temp/rail2.jpg
>
> If so, I would remove all the old material, clean the core and use
> new epoxy. The welder can also make a base plate that could be
> anchored over the preset spot.
Yes, I think it is epoxy. How would I clean the core? some sort of
drill? It has to get the old metal out, too.
The base plate idea would be the best, most long-lasting, solution, and
easier to fix if/when it happens again. But if it's a whole lot cheaper
to re-use the current holes, I might go for that and let someone else
deal with the future.
Nil
alt.home.repair:
>> http://home.comcast.net/~esionder/temp/rail1.jpg
>>
>> http://home.comcast.net/~esionder/temp/rail2.jpg
> What has happened is that the water has stood in and around this
> long enough to rust it out. Not a lot you can do about that
> unless you want to core drill out the stubs, and then make the
> Pourstone footer higher to keep it out of the water. But then,
> you would have to weld additions on, and fill them from the
> inside, and then, they would probably just rot off at the base
> again.
Yes, I'm sure they would rot again. The only reason I might do it this
way is the expense of the alternative.
> What I would do: The metal is probably rusted out up a ways from
> the broken off base. I'd cut about six inches off of that leg,
> weld a fresh piece of .120" square tubing on to what's there so as
> to be close as you can have it fit onto the plates and give you
> desired height.
That's my plan. That's what I was calling the "extension" - removing
the corroded metal and welding new material on so the leg length is
maintained.
> Then cut the other trash stuff off flush with the
> deck. Clean the holes out best you can and fill flush with
> Pourstone. (hydraulic cement) Then put a 4" square 1/4" plate
> on the deck so as to center it over the hole. These are available
> at wrought iron supply places, or over the Internet. If you don't
> know where, Google ornamental metal suppliers. A big one in
> Houston and LA. Probably one close to you, or cut your own.
>
> Figure your height. If you did it right, you should come pretty
> close. If you are high, cut some off. Weld the legs to the
> plate, and leave a weep hole so water going in the inside has a
> way to seep out. It will look bad, but will lengthen the life of
> the post. Get it plumb and level. Paint using a cardboard mask.
>
> Optional plate fasteners: Nail-ins (not suggested, as they tend to
> weaken and pull out), Red Heads, sleeve anchors, or wedge concrete
> fasteners. Drill holes deeper than you need so you don't have a
> lot of threads sticking up. When you pound the rod down in the
> hole, be sure to put washer and nut on it flush to the top so you
> don't booger up the threads, or remove it if it mushrooms. Get
> all of them down to tight with light taps from a hammer, then
> tighten them up.
>
> $200 if I was to do this repair in today's market. Less if you
> can weld and have RotoHammer and tools.
I like this suggestion very much. I'd be very happy if it only cost
$200 - I was expecting a lot more. I'll have to start calling around to
see what it can be done for around here (Boston area.) I actually have
two more similarly broken railing, but this one is is a safety issue
and the others are only decorative.
Thank you for your great ideas. This has put me on a good path, I
think.
Nil
alt.home.repair:
> The way they were designed originally obviously is not good
> enough, so I would suggest doing it better this time. Consult
> with the shop about their recommendations, but you might consider
> some stainless steel inserts that the railing could then be
> attached to so as to prevent a repeat failure.
That's a good idea. Iron will obviously rust, and I really do need to
treat the steps to keep the winter ice at bay. I guess stainless steel
would resist corrosion better. I do want to keep the iron railings,
though - they match others on the property and it would be too
expensive to replace all of them.
Nil
alt.home.repair:
> These kinds of posts really need to be secured more than you think
> due to the sideways forces they need to take. I've know more than
> one person who broke bones, tore tenons, survived 6 months of
> painful therapy--all could have been avoided with strong sturdy
> railings on steps.
Point taken. I've been thinking that maybe a support piece could be
added to some point along the top of the rail. That leg could be
angled away from the walkway out into the shrubs where it could be
anchored to a small concrete pad. If done right, it wouldn't be
unsightly. I don't know if my description is understandable, but I
am thinking of ways to make it more sturdy and better able to
support the stress of someone grabbing it during a fall. Those stairs
do get VERY slippery sometimes - in fact, the reason this broke now is
that someone fell against it when they slipped.
len...@gmail.com
burfordTjustice
Retired
philo
a cord.
Oren
>
>If it's the cast-iron variety you just heat on the stove, you don't need
>a cord.
and painted they make terrific door stops. Use one every day. With my
set of two I can even use them both for book ends. A matching set.
James Wilkinson Sword
> I need some help to fix the cord on my iron
Out of interest, did you iron the cord? Or did a pet or child eat part of it? Was it on at the time? Do you have any gruesome photos?
--
101 Dalmatians and Peter Pan are the only two Disney animated features in which both the parents are present and don't die throughout the movie.
DerbyDad03
Oren
Old cast iron irons should be upgraded to WiFi and Bluetooth. Forget
the cords.
philo
old irons...I have a few here
Oren
with black glossy enamel. Still pretty after all these years. Amish
didn't need cords I guess.
Oren
>
>On 3-Apr-2017, Oren <Or...@127.0.0.1> wrote:
>
>> I bought mine from the Amish in Pennsylvania. Sandblasted and painted
>> with black glossy enamel. Still pretty after all these years. Amish
>> didn't need cords I guess.
>
>and off the grid.
They didn't have WiFI or Bluetooth devices either.