Framing basement: metal headers and plate, with wood studs?
Bryan Scholtes
wall in place. It seems very convenient to just attach metal top
(header) and bottom (plate) studs and then cut the vertical studs to
fit inside them.
However, I also like to hang heavy things on my wall, and I don't like
the added cost of metal-specific electrical boxes. For this reason I'd
prefer wood vertical studs.
Is it possible (or code) to use metal for the top and bottom, and
attach wood vertical studs to them?
LouB
Lou
Mike rock
I did that in my basement a few years back in my previous house. It
worked well. However looking back, the only thing I did not think
about is the bottom plate could rust if the basement is damp. I would
at least use a pressure treated plate on the bottom.
Metal studs are nice, but not as sturdy as wood studs. Also if you
wood studs, you could put any kind of wood paneling on the wall. With
metal studs you are limited to sheetrock.
fftt
Please explain rationale for this comment.
I have seen plywood over steel studs, as in, plywood shear walls.
Gyp or plywood (OSB too) can go over steel studs
OP-
I would suggest you either go all wood or all steel. The main
benefits of steel framing; straighter members, bug & rot free (but
they can rust) & more price stablity than timber. But with prices down
on timber I really don't the advantage since timber framing is quite a
bit easier for most of us. Stud too long, skilsaw or chop saw.
Nailed framing is faster & easier than screwed together framing.
Steel studs are torsionally weak until the wall is skinned. Also
material thinkness can vary from VERY thin to HEAVY DUTY, the thin
stuff is pretty crappy.
cheers
Bob
Mike rock
> On Sep 22, 7:11 am, Mike rock <mikep...@optonline.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sep 22, 9:30 am, Bryan Scholtes <bryanschol...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > I am framing my basement, and love the idea of building a metal-stud
> > > wall in place. It seems very convenient to just attach metal top
> > > (header) and bottom (plate) studs and then cut the vertical studs to
> > > fit inside them.
>
> > > However, I also like to hang heavy things on my wall, and I don't like
> > > the added cost of metal-specific electrical boxes. For this reason I'd
> > > prefer wood vertical studs.
>
> > > Is it possible (or code) to use metal for the top and bottom, and
> > > attach wood vertical studs to them?
>
> > I did that in my basement a few years back in my previous house. It
> > worked well. However looking back, the only thing I did not think
> > about is the bottom plate could rust if the basement is damp. I would
> > at least use a pressure treated plate on the bottom.
> > Metal studs are nice, but not as sturdy as wood studs. Also if you
> > wood studs, you could put any kind of wood paneling on the wall. With
> > metal studs you are limited to sheetrock.
> >>>>>if you wood studs, you could put any kind of wood paneling on the wall. With
>
> metal studs you are limited to sheetrock. <<<<<<
>
> Please explain rationale for this comment.
>
> I have seen plywood over steel studs, as in, plywood shear walls.
>
> Gyp or plywood (OSB too) can go over steel studs
>
fastened with those wood panel nails, then it would be a problem
because of the metal studs. If you put plywood first, then paneling
you are OK.
Bryan Scholtes
> I would suggest you either go all wood or all steel. The main
> benefits of steel framing; straighter members, bug & rot free (but
> they can rust) & more price stablity than timber. But with prices down
> on timber I really don't the advantage since timber framing is quite a
> bit easier for most of us. Stud too long, skilsaw or chop saw.
> Nailed framing is faster & easier than screwed together framing.
>
I suppose I am trying to avoid the hassle of building a wall on the
floor, then hoisting it up, and installing a header and/or shimming.
Is there less labor in that than I am assuming?
It seems nice to be able to throw up some metal top & bottom and cut
studs to fit. Am I "smoking the weed"?
JIMMIE
You dont have to have one or the other. Nail the wood sole plate in
place then put a metal plate on top of it. Solves the problem of
fastening wood plate to metal studs, keeps the metal off the possibly
damp concrete floor.
Jimmie
Jimmie
Wayne Whitney
> I suppose I am trying to avoid the hassle of building a wall on the
> floor, then hoisting it up, and installing a header and/or shimming.
> Is there less labor in that than I am assuming? It seems nice to be
> able to throw up some metal top & bottom and cut studs to fit. Am I
> "smoking the weed"?
You can "throw up" the wood top and bottom plates and then cut wood
studs to fit. Easiest sequence:
1) Cut top and bottom plate and layout the studs locations on them.
2) Securely fasten the top plate where you want it.
3) Lay the bottom plate below it with a plumb bob, don't secure it.
4) Cut the studs to length and toe nail into plates with one nail each.
5) Adjust the bottom plate location until the studs are plumb.
6) Secure the bottom plate and finish toe nailing the studs.
Cheers,
Wayne
Tony Hwang
Tight fit framed wall is not a good idea.
Make it sort of float.
Bryan Scholtes
Thanks, can you elaborate?
RicodJour
If you are, it isn't the good stuff because you're still making sense.
My standard operating procedure for basement partitioning is to use a
PT bottom plate with metal track on top of it and a metal top track at
the ceiling joists. I install the top track first, plumb down to
locate the bottom plate, shoot in (or Tapcon) the PT plate to the
slab, then attach the metal track on top. Cut the wood studs about
1/4" short of a tight fit between the tracks, then slip the studs into
place.
Cutting the studs 1/4" short and having metal track for a top plate
will prevent the partition from inadvertently becoming a bearing wall
(probably not that big an issue, but that's what another post was
referring to).
Alternatively, if you want to go with all wood, use a double bottom
2x4 plate, frame the wall a little bit short, then when you lift the
wall into place use cedar shims between the bottom plates (under the
studs) to lift the framed wall into contact with the ceiling joists.
R
Tony Hwang
Let the frame height has an inch or bit more gap. So in case there is a
settling or sagging of the ceiling, walls won't buckle. I frame that way
always. Bottom sole plate is nailed into floor but I use jack nails thru
a drilled holes to secure the top plate. Also studs little bit off the
wall to make it straight vertically. Wall is not really flat top to bottom.
cl...@snyder.on.ca
<rico...@worldemail.com> wrote:
>On Sep 22, 12:52 pm, Bryan Scholtes <bryanschol...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > I would suggest you either go all wood or all steel. The main
>> > benefits of steel framing; straighter members, bug & rot free (but
>> > they can rust) & more price stablity than timber. But with prices down
>> > on timber I really don't the advantage since timber framing is quite a
>> > bit easier for most of us. Stud too long, skilsaw or chop saw.
>> > Nailed framing is faster & easier than screwed together framing.
>>
>> I suppose I am trying to avoid the hassle of building a wall on the
>> floor, then hoisting it up, and installing a header and/or shimming.
>>
>> Is there less labor in that than I am assuming?
>>
>> It seems nice to be able to throw up some metal top & bottom and cut
>> studs to fit. Am I "smoking the weed"?
Nothing stopping you from doing the same with all wood.
Puit your sill-plate and header in place, cut studs to fit, and screw
together toe-nail style with deck screws.
Fast, easy, and solid.
>
>If you are, it isn't the good stuff because you're still making sense.
>
>My standard operating procedure for basement partitioning is to use a
>PT bottom plate with metal track on top of it and a metal top track at
>the ceiling joists. I install the top track first, plumb down to
>locate the bottom plate, shoot in (or Tapcon) the PT plate to the
>slab, then attach the metal track on top. Cut the wood studs about
>1/4" short of a tight fit between the tracks, then slip the studs into
>place.
I put a strip of DriCore down under the sill plate - no pressure
treated lumber inside my house.
RicodJour
> On Wed, 23 Sep 2009 <ricodj...@worldemail.com> wrote:
> >On Sep 22, 12:52 pm, Bryan Scholtes <bryanschol...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> > I would suggest you either go all wood or all steel. The main
> >> > benefits of steel framing; straighter members, bug & rot free (but
> >> > they can rust) & more price stablity than timber. But with prices down
> >> > on timber I really don't the advantage since timber framing is quite a
> >> > bit easier for most of us. Stud too long, skilsaw or chop saw.
> >> > Nailed framing is faster & easier than screwed together framing.
>
> >> I suppose I am trying to avoid the hassle of building a wall on the
> >> floor, then hoisting it up, and installing a header and/or shimming.
>
> >> Is there less labor in that than I am assuming?
>
> >> It seems nice to be able to throw up some metal top & bottom and cut
> >> studs to fit. Am I "smoking the weed"?
>
> Nothing stopping you from doing the same with all wood.
> Puit your sill-plate and header in place, cut studs to fit, and screw
> together toe-nail style with deck screws.
> Fast, easy, and solid.
The OP asked if what he intended with the metal track and wood studs
makes sense. I do it for a living so I figured I'd tell him it does.
Your way, while standard for some, is also a lot slower with little
benefit. If you're building a bearing wall, you want tight, if it's a
partition you don't need, or necessarily want, tight. As Tony was
pointing out, building an inadvertent bearing wall might not be the
best idea. Using the metal track allows gang cutting of studs and
then just snapping them into place between the two tracks.
> >If you are, it isn't the good stuff because you're still making sense.
>
> >My standard operating procedure for basement partitioning is to use a
> >PT bottom plate with metal track on top of it and a metal top track at
> >the ceiling joists. I install the top track first, plumb down to
> >locate the bottom plate, shoot in (or Tapcon) the PT plate to the
> >slab, then attach the metal track on top. Cut the wood studs about
> >1/4" short of a tight fit between the tracks, then slip the studs into
> >place.
>
> I put a strip of DriCore down under the sill plate - no pressure
> treated lumber inside my house.
To each his own - my point was to use something that is rot and insect
resistant. Cedar would also work. I don't know that I follow you
comment - you cut up the 2' squares to make 3.5" strips? Do you mean
that you install your partitioning on top of a DriCore (sub)floor?
R
Dave
Or use foam sill gasket under the bottom metal plate.
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