CFL bulb in range hood ?

[Lee B]

I have an older range hood with a light in it. I tend to use it more for
light than I do my finicky fluorescent ceiling light. I've been using
incandescents, but since I often leave the hood light on over night,
they have a limited lifespan. So I'm wondering if it's OK to use a CFL
over the stove? Is the horizontal position a problem? (Asking because I
know I've seen discussion about upside down fixtures).

I do very little stove top cooking (I'm a microwave kinda person), so
I'm not as concerned about the heat, but I'm wondering about that too.
Someone at Home Depot said it would be bad for the electronics inside,
but I figured I trust the collective minds here more, LOL. If it makes a
difference, it has one of those little plastic snap on covers that
squeezes into place.

[philo]

I would never use any type of fluorescent light right next to an area
where food is being prepared simply due to the fact that they contain
mercury. The chance of one breaking is probably not that great...but
personally , I'd just never do it.


The guy at HD was very possibly right too, they'd probably be
negatively affected by heat.

[tra...@optonline.net]

I would agree with the folks at HD. It might work, but for how long
depends on the heat. Is it a gas range or electric? Gas would be
worse. Having it mounted sideways is OK, it's upside down that some
of them don't like. Covering it up adds to the heat issue, at least
usually. In your case, it might help. If it's covered up, it then
depends on how much air is inside the enclosure, can some air get in from
behind to move heat, etc. I have a 100W CFL in an enclosed globe
fixture under a fan and it's lasted a very long time. I've had
others that have failed early that were not in enclosures, so who
knows. A lot also depends on the particular bulb. Which ones are
good, who knows.

[Bob_Villa]

On Saturday, December 14, 2013 8:40:07 AM UTC-6, Lee B wrote:
> I have an older range hood with a light in it. I tend to use it more for
>
> light than I do my finicky fluorescent ceiling light. I've been using
>
> incandescents, but since I often leave the hood light on over night,
>
> they have a limited lifespan. So I'm wondering if it's OK to use a CFL
>
> over the stove?

We have a non-vented hood and we cook a lot...and I have had a CFL uncovered in the hood for many years (I think replaced once in a span of 5 years).
I never use the fan...so heat and steam from cooking doesn't seem to be a problem.
If yours' is covered, heat may build-up more.

[Unquestionably Confused]

??? You mean to say that if an incandescent bulb broke you'd sweep up
the pieces (or pick them out of the soup as the case may be) and go on
to dinner?

If the bulb breaks, it breaks and everything in the area goes in the
trash and it's a do over. Period.

I really think that in this context the only issues to concern yourself
with are bulb longevity due to positioning and, possibly, heat - but the
latter apparently is NOT a concern of the OP

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 12/14/2013 9:40 AM, Lee B wrote:
>
> So I'm wondering if it's OK to use a CFL
> over the stove? Is the horizontal position a problem? (Asking because I
> know I've seen discussion about upside down fixtures).
>

> If it makes a
> difference, it has one of those little plastic snap on covers that
> squeezes into place.

Enclosed with the cover? That could make a difference if the
electronics in the bulb overheat. Otherwise, I'd do it. Consider
leaving the cover off.

[philo]

No. a fluorescent would spew mercury contamination everywhere.

An incandescent...just broken glass.

Yes, you'd have to throw out any food in the area but with the
fluorescent there would still be traces of mercury left behind.

[Frank]

Break a cfl and you must notify the authorities.
They will put yellow tape around your house and send in a HAZMAT team to
clean up. House may be safe to use again in about a month.

[philo]

On 12/14/2013 11:49 AM, Frank wrote:

>>
>>
>>
>
> Break a cfl and you must notify the authorities.
> They will put yellow tape around your house and send in a HAZMAT team to
> clean up. House may be safe to use again in about a month.

I live in Milwaukee and in one of the suburbs, Shorewood that would
probably be true.

About two years ago I crushed a small aluminum V8 can on the curb to
leave for a scavenger and a detective stopped me, asked for my license
and started to call it in.


He was about the age of my daughter.


I then heard him cancel the call-in and he handed me my license back and
said: "I probably don't have to call this in...but that was littering
you know!"

[ChairMan]

guess I'm going to die then because my brother and I had a
bottle of mercury that we would pour out on the table and
play with when we were kids.
Rolling from here to there and making little blobs out of
big ones and then back to big ones.
Someone please come save me!!!!!!

[Frank]

I was being facetious of course but not that much.

Group can read what the EPA says:

http://www2.epa.gov/cfl/cleaning-broken-cfl

It sets the stage for the types of stupidity you dealt with.

I'm a retired chemist and today's chemophobia is one of my pet peeves.

[philo]

On 12/14/2013 01:03 PM, ChairMan wrote:
> p

>>
>>
>> No. a fluorescent would spew mercury contamination
>> everywhere.
>>
>> An incandescent...just broken glass.
>>
>> Yes, you'd have to throw out any food in the area but with
>> the
>> fluorescent there would still be traces of mercury left
>> behind.
>
> guess I'm going to die then because my brother and I had a
> bottle of mercury that we would pour out on the table and
> play with when we were kids.
> Rolling from here to there and making little blobs out of
> big ones and then back to big ones.
> Someone please come save me!!!!!!
>
>

yep, me and my friends all played with mercury when we were kids

and probably within the next 40 years we'll all be dead.


Also: we put our feet in those 'shoe' xray machines

Kids today are so much deprived of real fun

[philo]

yes, I know you were being facetious

I am not overly paranoid about CFL's but I would not want one directly
in a food area.

[Tony Hwang]

Hi,
I put in a shatter proof CFL bulb. There is such a thing.
I got couple from local HD store.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Sat, 14 Dec 2013 13:03:27 -0600, "ChairMan" <nos...@thanks.com>
wrote:

It is the oranic mercury compounds that are particularly dangerous -
not the pure metalic mercury.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

And we used a mixture of asbestos and plaster of paris as modelling
clay.

[philo]

On 12/14/2013 01:23 PM, Tony Hwang wrote:

>>
>> I then heard him cancel the call-in and he handed me my license back and
>> said: "I probably don't have to call this in...but that was littering
>> you know!"
> Hi,
> I put in a shatter proof CFL bulb. There is such a thing.
> I got couple from local HD store.

Great idea.

[Lee B]

This is true. I do so little cooking on the stove top, that I'm not
really concerned about the heat issue, but the HD guy did make me wonder
if that was a valid concern should I ever get the urge to cook. And yes,
I'm more interested in the longevity/positioning angle.

Maybe I'll just go stock up on some more incandescent bulbs, since for
now I'm keeping a stock pile to use with my X10 modules.

[Malcom "Mal" Reynolds]

In article <l8hqk7$3i4$1...@dont-email.me>,

use an LED?

[Tony Hwang]

Hi,
I picked up few so called shatter proof cfl shaped like
incandescent bulb wrapped in some kinda thin clear rubbery thing. I use
this. From our local HD store.

[Irreverent Maximus]

"Lee B" <not_my_r...@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:l8hqk7$3i4$1...@dont-email.me...

I have had a CFL in my range hood for 3 plus years. Zero issues with it and
I have yet (knocking on wood) to have to replace it. CFL's are a crapshoot.
GE and Phillips are now manufactured in China, I believe. The quality control
from anything in China is suspect, at best. My experience with those brands
is more on the disappointing side. However, at the box stores they are the
brand that usually has the cheap multi-packs for sale. One might get lucky
with them and have an attrition rate that is acceptable.

I have not purchased a CFL in quite some time. All of the ones I currently have
are at least 3 years old. From what I hear Sylvania has the best quality, along
with the highest pricing. So, choosing brand is your only concern. My friend
is switching out to LED's, and I am quite surprised on how bright they are.

As for mercury? Worrying about one breaking is rather pointless. I have never
heard of a lamp breaking on its own, and unless you are doing Ginsu maneuvers
on the stove, concerns are minimal. Not to diminish the threat, but trace
mercury exposure from a CFL seems a bit harmless. Repetitive exposure is
what will give you heavy metal poisoning, not a one time trace amount.

Clean up of the problem, if it happens, is rather easy. "Proper" disposal
is something else. Unless you keep the light on 24/7, just use a regular
lamp or get a small, encased under cabinet fixture. Those lamps are cheap
and if they burn out, replace.

[Unquestionably Confused]

Remember the '50's? Wasn't it mandatory to have a two or three ringed
fluorescent fixture centered over the kitchen table? Fluorescent
fixtures beneath the cabinets over food prep areas? Fluorescent
fixtures (tubes) housed in decorative fixtures?

They looked like crap and I wouldn't want one in the kitchen solely for
esthetic reasons.

The only real problem I have with CFL's is that they look terrible. If
they had true color rendition and looked like incandescent, it wouldn't
be so bad.

The mercury is or can be a problem but when you raise that issue, the
Greenies are quick to point out that "incandescent bulbs are just as
bad" Really? or that just more bullshit from the "do as I say crowd?"

[The Daring Dufas]

I recall reading about a young woman scientist working The EPA who told
her superiors that there was only one form of asbestos that was a health
hazard. Her superiors told her to shut up because the people who were
forced by the government to spend billions to remove or replace asbestos
in their products would show up at the door with pitchforks and torches.

http://users.rcn.com/leadsafe/asbestos.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1253022/The-Great-Asbestos-Hysteria-How-man-claims-BBC-profiteering-firms-politicians-grossly-exaggerated-dangers.html

http://preview.tinyurl.com/k6tus6t

TDD

[The Daring Dufas]

That's silicone rubber and regular incandescent bulbs coated with clear
silicone rubber have been on the market for years. They are usually
rough service bulbs for uses in trouble lights which might be dropped
and the silicone keeps the glass from coming out of the fixture if the
bulb is shattered. ^_^

TDD

[Paul Drahn]

I am sure someone will correct me, but I remember reading that
incandescent appliance light bulbs will always be available. These are
possible too low in wattage for what you want.

Paul

[gregz]

I did it. Never yet had a problem with overheating, even in an outside
globe, in summer sun, left on 24/7 . I like protected housings. That
outside light lasted for it's expected life.

Greg

[gonjah]

That doesn't make a lot of sense.

"Six minerals types are defined by the United States Environmental
Protection Agency as "asbestos" including those belonging to the
serpentine class and those belonging to the amphibole class. All six
asbestos mineral types are known to be human carcinogens."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asbestos

I have heard that because it's a naturally occurring mineral there is no
way to escape exposure in certain areas unless you wear a respirator 24/7.

[Tony Hwang]

Hi,
I Put in a shatter proof CFL. I got it from local HD store.
It is wrapped in a clear some rubbery Silicon(?) stuff I suspect.

[mrob...@att.net]

Lee B <not_my_r...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> So I'm wondering if it's OK to use a CFL over the stove? Is the
> horizontal position a problem? (Asking because I know I've seen
> discussion about upside down fixtures).

I have been using a CFL in my range hood for about 4 years now without
any problems. When I moved into this house, it had the circa-1969 basic
Roper range hood: lamp, two-speed fan, grease filter. I think it may
have originally had a plastic "shade" over the lamp, but by the time I
got here, that was gone. I used that lightly for about a year - mostly
for illumination, not because I was cooking.

As part of some kitchen improvements, I swapped out that range hood for
the basic ~$80 NuTone range hood from Home Depot: lamp, two-speed fan,
grease filter. This one has a plastic "shade" over the lamp, but it
only completely encloses the lamp on the bottom side (towards the
stove); it goes about 2/3 of the way up both sides of the lamp, but is
open above that and on top. So, I'm not too worried about heat buildup.

In both hoods, I used a 60 W equivalent CFL (13 W), "Great Value" brand
from Wal-Mart, which I think are made by TCP. I think the lamp that's
in there now is the one I installed with the hood in 2010; if not then
I've only replaced it once. The lamp ends up nearly horizontal; the
screw base is very slightly higher than the lamp glass, because the
socket isn't completely level. It hangs down maybe 5 or 10 degrees from
horizontal.

The only thing I've noticed is that when it's cold inside the house, the
CFL in the range hood flickers for a second or two at startup. That CFL
didn't do that when new; it gradually started doing it over time. Other
CFLs in the house from the same batch haven't started doing this.

I wouldn't recommend running without the "shade" - one of its jobs is to
keep cooking grease off of the lamp. Wiping off a regular incandescent
lamp is not too bad of a job, but completely cleaning a spiral CFL takes
some work.

Matt Roberds

[ChairMan]

philo <ph...@privacy.net> wrote:
> On 12/14/2013 01:03 PM, ChairMan wrote:
>> p
>>>
>>>
>>> No. a fluorescent would spew mercury contamination
>>> everywhere.
>>>
>>> An incandescent...just broken glass.
>>>
>>> Yes, you'd have to throw out any food in the area but
>>> with
>>> the
>>> fluorescent there would still be traces of mercury left
>>> behind.
>>
>> guess I'm going to die then because my brother and I had
>> a
>> bottle of mercury that we would pour out on the table and
>> play with when we were kids.
>> Rolling from here to there and making little blobs out of
>> big ones and then back to big ones.
>> Someone please come save me!!!!!!
>>
>>
>
>
> yep, me and my friends all played with mercury when we
> were kids
>
> and probably within the next 40 years we'll all be dead.

I sure the fuck hope so, I''ll damn near be a hundred by
then

>
>
> Also: we put our feet in those 'shoe' xray machines
>
> Kids today are so much deprived of real fun

I was just telling my grandson that the other day.
I use to carry a pocket knife to school and even took my
shotgun into shop class because the shop teacher wanted to
see it.

[The Daring Dufas]

The story could have been or was apocryphal but it had information about
different forms of asbestos where one was rod shaped and another was
shaped like a pigtail or curlicue. The story went on the say that
only one of the types was dangerous. It's been a long time since I read
the story but I suppose I could search the web for it or something like
it. ^_^

TDD

[willshak]

philo wrote:

> On 12/14/2013 08:40 AM, Lee B wrote:
>>
>> I have an older range hood with a light in it. I tend to use it more for
>> light than I do my finicky fluorescent ceiling light. I've been using
>> incandescents, but since I often leave the hood light on over night,

>> they have a limited lifespan. So I'm wondering if it's OK to use a CFL

>> over the stove? Is the horizontal position a problem? (Asking because I
>> know I've seen discussion about upside down fixtures).
>>

>> I do very little stove top cooking (I'm a microwave kinda person), so
>> I'm not as concerned about the heat, but I'm wondering about that too.
>> Someone at Home Depot said it would be bad for the electronics inside,
>> but I figured I trust the collective minds here more, LOL. If it makes a
>> difference, it has one of those little plastic snap on covers that
>> squeezes into place.
>
>
>

> I would never use any type of fluorescent light right next to an area
> where food is being prepared simply due to the fact that they contain
> mercury. The chance of one breaking is probably not that great...but
> personally , I'd just never do it.

I am 76 years old. When I was a kid and they had mercury in
thermometers, we used to break them and play with the mercury.

>
> The guy at HD was very possibly right too, they'd probably be
> negatively affected by heat.


--
Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeros after @

[willshak]

As a kid, I used to throw broken asbestos siding into a trash fire
barrel, and after a minute or two they would blow apart with a bang.
In the Navy in the late 1950s, I used to work on ducts that were
insulated with asbestos without any protective clothing, pulling off the
asbestos to make additions to the ducts.
I also wore an asbestos fire suit and hood during helicopter landing
operations. It was itchy during and after wearing it. I was supposed to
run into the fire to rescue occupants of the helo in case of a crash.
Oh, and like I said before, I'm 76 years old.

[gonjah]

I read part of the article in your first link and it is interesting. I
don't see how it makes disturbing asbestos "safe" which I believe is the
main concern with it. As far as imbedded asbestos, in say a piece of
siding or insulation, it's probably just as dangerous as naturally
occurring asbestos. Maybe more so.

[tra...@optonline.net]

Voer 3 dedades ago I went to a lecture at college given by David Baltimore,
who won the nobel prize for his work on cancer research. At the time, he
told us that he was not optimistic that a cure for cancer would be found
within our lifetimes. One interesting fact I still remember was him
describing how you could take pieces of glass and insert them in lab rats
and at the same time, insert ground up glass in other rats. One group
of rats developed cancer, the other did not.

So, I would not be surprised at all that some forms of asbestos are
more dangerous than others. Anyone that thinks there is great danger because there is siding on a house which contains asbestos, is IMO, nuts. The
health dangers from asbestos were first found in ship workers and other who
were breathing it in during WWII in environments where it was so dense in
the air you couldn't see. From that, it's gone to an ambulance chasing
bunch of lawyers, who try to claim that if you're sick, it must be from
just looking at asbestos for two months when you had some particular job.

[gonjah]

Sure, leave it alone and there is no problem. True with a lot of things.
Wild animals, rip tides, cliffs, etc....

The problem is when you have it in your house, school, workplace etc.....

"When materials in your home become damaged or disturbed, microscopic
asbestos fibers can become airborne. When this happens, health-risks
become a factor as inhalation of these fibers can cause them to be
trapped in the lungs, to accumulate, and cause scarring and
inflammation." etc....

http://voices.yahoo.com/lead-paint-asbestos-everything-know-3407898.html?cat=5

We could outlaw cfls for the same reason 25 years from now. Maybe not
because the exposure is so minimal.

[The Daring Dufas]

You're too ornery to die. I was sent home from the hospital to die and
put in home hospice care then dropped after 6 months because I wasn't
dying fast enough. I wasn't declining and my visiting nurse would get
mad at me for going out and pushing myself to work as hard as I could.
Folks die when they give up and don't fight it. You could be one of the
growing number of Americans reaching 100 years of age. Of course, with
this Obamacare nonsense it won't be allowed. o_O

TDD

[gonjah]

It's idiotic statements like that that have undermined the tea party
movement.

[The Daring Dufas]

Everything in our environment is dangerous in some way or other, I
simply use common sense. If I ever do anything that would produce a
cloud of dust, I wear a respirator of some kind. Back in the late 1970's
there was a large forest fire in the next county and the smoke was
blowing our way. My nose actually started bleeding but I'm quite
allergic to things like that especially tobacco smoke. I think the
danger of asbestos in things like shingles or brake shoes is from any
dust produced by such products when they're broken up, sawed or ground
into dust in some way. If you're familiar beryllium and how dangerous it
can be, you will notice that no one pays much attention to it because
of all the howling about asbestos. Ignorance of beryllium is rife in our
society even though it's all around us in electrical and electronic
equipment. If you work with electronics you must be careful with any
parts made of beryllium because you don't want cut, file or saw the
metal because could produce dust or particles that may get into your
lungs. Anyway, if people knew of all the things in our environment that
are toxic enough to make you ill or kill you, they may stay in bed and
pull the covers over their heads, which could be dangerous in some way
too. ^_^

http://ewasteguide.info/node/219

http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg311.pdf

http://www.chemicalindustryarchives.org/dirtysecrets/beryllium/2.asp

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beryllium_poisoning

TDD

[The Daring Dufas]

What on earth does not dying have to do with The Tea Party? Perhaps you
are humor and irony impaired and didn't notice a dig at the cluster
coitus know as Obamacare and the rumored "death panels" where who will
live and who will die is decided by some committee. It appears to be
happening in other countries which have government supplied health care
so it is actually a real concern of some people. I'm not a member of The
Tea Party nor do I even know anyone who is a member. The only group
I belong to is humanity but there are some who even question that fact. ^_^

TDD

[k...@attt.bizz]

On Sun, 15 Dec 2013 09:50:05 -0500, willshak <will...@00hvc.rr.com>
wrote:

Yes, the two classes of people who got asbestosis were miners and Navy
shipbuilders. There have been zero cases of little children in
schools getting mesothelioma, regardless of how many ambulance chasers
(Democrats) drone on about it.

>I also wore an asbestos fire suit and hood during helicopter landing
>operations. It was itchy during and after wearing it. I was supposed to
>run into the fire to rescue occupants of the helo in case of a crash.
>Oh, and like I said before, I'm 76 years old.

Pre-Nomex, I presume.

[k...@attt.bizz]

On Sun, 15 Dec 2013 01:55:37 -0600, "ChairMan" <nos...@thanks.com>
wrote:

A guy I used to work with took his .22 rifle to school with him every
day. He lived in New York City (yes, a NYC public school).

[k...@attt.bizz]

On Sun, 15 Dec 2013 09:19:44 -0500, willshak <will...@00hvc.rr.com>
wrote:

>philo wrote:
>> On 12/14/2013 08:40 AM, Lee B wrote:
>>>
>>> I have an older range hood with a light in it. I tend to use it more for
>>> light than I do my finicky fluorescent ceiling light. I've been using
>>> incandescents, but since I often leave the hood light on over night,
>>> they have a limited lifespan. So I'm wondering if it's OK to use a CFL
>>> over the stove? Is the horizontal position a problem? (Asking because I
>>> know I've seen discussion about upside down fixtures).
>>>
>>> I do very little stove top cooking (I'm a microwave kinda person), so
>>> I'm not as concerned about the heat, but I'm wondering about that too.
>>> Someone at Home Depot said it would be bad for the electronics inside,
>>> but I figured I trust the collective minds here more, LOL. If it makes a
>>> difference, it has one of those little plastic snap on covers that
>>> squeezes into place.
>>
>>
>>
>> I would never use any type of fluorescent light right next to an area
>> where food is being prepared simply due to the fact that they contain
>> mercury. The chance of one breaking is probably not that great...but
>> personally , I'd just never do it.
>
>I am 76 years old. When I was a kid and they had mercury in
>thermometers, we used to break them and play with the mercury.

As has been pointed out, here. Metallic Mercury isn't very toxic at
all. The body doesn't know what to do with it. Many Mercury
compounds are extremely toxic, however.

[Irreverent Maximus]

"ChairMan" <nos...@thanks.com> wrote in message news:2gdru.609747$Am5.5...@fx24.iad...

> I was just telling my grandson that the other day.
> I use to carry a pocket knife to school and even took my
> shotgun into shop class because the shop teacher wanted to
> see it.

Those were the days. We could carry non-concealed Buck knives and
our guns could be left in vehicles. My school no longer had a
shooting program.

[Irreverent Maximus]

<k...@attt.bizz> wrote in message news:80tra9h800vmvedhf...@4ax.com...

> As has been pointed out, here. Metallic Mercury isn't very toxic at
> all. The body doesn't know what to do with it. Many Mercury
> compounds are extremely toxic, however.

It is all about the vector. I know of a Indian tribe that mined
mercury. They died. Liquid mercury does not have an easy vector
into the body unless ingested/inhaled. Handling the stuff without
protection over a period of years will have harmful effects.

[Mark Lloyd]

On 12/14/2013 08:40 AM, Lee B wrote:
>
> I have an older range hood with a light in it. I tend to use it more for
> light than I do my finicky fluorescent ceiling light. I've been using
> incandescents, but since I often leave the hood light on over night,
> they have a limited lifespan. So I'm wondering if it's OK to use a CFL
> over the stove? Is the horizontal position a problem? (Asking because I
> know I've seen discussion about upside down fixtures).
>
> I do very little stove top cooking (I'm a microwave kinda person), so
> I'm not as concerned about the heat, but I'm wondering about that too.
> Someone at Home Depot said it would be bad for the electronics inside,
> but I figured I trust the collective minds here more, LOL. If it makes a
> difference, it has one of those little plastic snap on covers that
> squeezes into place.

My situation is very similar. I put a CFL in there about 5 years ago and
it's still working.

BTW, I started leaving the light on for a few minutes after cooking, as
an indication the cooktop may be hot.

--
10 days until The winter celebration (Wednesday December 25, 2013 12:00
AM for 1 day).

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us

"God isn't as great as you think. Hes just got good marketing."

[Mark Lloyd]

On 12/14/2013 10:06 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

[snip]

> Enclosed with the cover? That could make a difference if the
> electronics in the bulb overheat. Otherwise, I'd do it. Consider
> leaving the cover off.

So when the bulb breaks, pieces fall in your food? I put it back on (5
years ago).

[Bob F]

Lee B wrote:

> On 12/14/2013 10:15 AM, Unquestionably Confused wrote:
>> On 12/14/2013 8:49 AM, philo wrote:

>>> On 12/14/2013 08:40 AM, Lee B wrote:
>>>
>>>

>>> I would never use any type of fluorescent light right next to an
>>> area where food is being prepared simply due to the fact that they
>>> contain mercury. The chance of one breaking is probably not that
>>> great...but personally , I'd just never do it.
>>
>>

>> ??? You mean to say that if an incandescent bulb broke you'd sweep
>> up the pieces (or pick them out of the soup as the case may be) and
>> go on to dinner?
>>
>> If the bulb breaks, it breaks and everything in the area goes in the
>> trash and it's a do over. Period.
>>
>> I really think that in this context the only issues to concern
>> yourself with are bulb longevity due to positioning and, possibly,
>> heat - but the latter apparently is NOT a concern of the OP
>>
>>
>>
>

> This is true. I do so little cooking on the stove top, that I'm not
> really concerned about the heat issue, but the HD guy did make me
> wonder if that was a valid concern should I ever get the urge to
> cook. And yes, I'm more interested in the longevity/positioning angle.
>
> Maybe I'll just go stock up on some more incandescent bulbs, since for
> now I'm keeping a stock pile to use with my X10 modules.

My microwave has a glass cover protecting the bulbs, so breaking them is highly
unlikely. Heat might be a problem. I'm not sure how it switches from bright to
dim, so that might be a problem with CFLs.

[WW]

> Yes, you'd have to throw out any food in the area but with
> the
> fluorescent there would still be traces of mercury left behind.

guess I'm going to die then because my brother and I had a
bottle of mercury that we would pour out on the table and
play with when we were kids.
Rolling from here to there and making little blobs out of
big ones and then back to big ones.
Someone please come save me!!!!!!

As a kid in the 30's I would rub mercury onto pennies to make them look like
silver. My teeth fillings have mercury in them I am told.
Because of my great interest in chemistry I knew NOT to heat it as gold
miners did and many lost their lives doing this.
To the original poster>>> I use the coiled type in our hallway over head
fixtures. They are horizonal mounted. Outlast the tungsten type.

[Lee B]

On 12/15/2013 4:08 PM, Mark Lloyd wrote:
> On 12/14/2013 08:40 AM, Lee B wrote:
>>
>> I have an older range hood with a light in it. I tend to use it more for
>> light than I do my finicky fluorescent ceiling light. I've been using
>> incandescents, but since I often leave the hood light on over night,
>> they have a limited lifespan. So I'm wondering if it's OK to use a CFL
>> over the stove? Is the horizontal position a problem? (Asking because I
>> know I've seen discussion about upside down fixtures).
>>
>> I do very little stove top cooking (I'm a microwave kinda person), so
>> I'm not as concerned about the heat, but I'm wondering about that too.
>> Someone at Home Depot said it would be bad for the electronics inside,
>> but I figured I trust the collective minds here more, LOL. If it makes a
>> difference, it has one of those little plastic snap on covers that
>> squeezes into place.
>
> My situation is very similar. I put a CFL in there about 5 years ago and
> it's still working.
>
> BTW, I started leaving the light on for a few minutes after cooking, as
> an indication the cooktop may be hot.
>

Just wanted to thank everyone for their input. This has been
interesting. and it was also a trip down memory lane - my brother and I
used to play with liquid mercury. My father, a physician, didn't have a
problem with that, assuming that he knew. (Honestly, I'm not sure he was
aware we did it, although I think there was initially mercury in the
children's chemistry set we had). And the local shoe store had the foot
x-ray thing. He told my mother not to let us play on that.

I think I'll look for the shatterproof CFL, but if I don't find one,
I'll use a regular CFL. Ideally, I should get the overhead fluorescent
tube light fixture replaced, but the CFL bulb sounds simpler, ha.

[WW]

"Lee B" wrote in message news:l8hqk7$3i4$1...@dont-email.me...

I have an older range hood with a light in it. I tend to use it more for
light than I do my finicky fluorescent ceiling light. I've been using
incandescents, but since I often leave the hood light on over night,
they have a limited lifespan. So I'm wondering if it's OK to use a CFL
over the stove? Is the horizontal position a problem? (Asking because I
know I've seen discussion about upside down fixtures).

I do very little stove top cooking (I'm a microwave kinda person), so
I'm not as concerned about the heat, but I'm wondering about that too.
Someone at Home Depot said it would be bad for the electronics inside,
but I figured I trust the collective minds here more, LOL. If it makes a
difference, it has one of those little plastic snap on covers that
squeezes into place.

After reading most all of the replies and the subject sort of changed to
deadly other things I wonder why I am still here.
WWll Navy and SeaBee. Worked with asbestos. Also on heating ductwork
covering. Electronic work asbestos wiring covering.
Cut an installed asbestos home siding. Laid asbestos floor tile. And then
other things, Worked for Westinghouse transformer
rebuilding in the late 40's. Transformer oil had PCB in it. Would have my
hands in it. Played with mercury as a kid. Mercury in my teeth fillings.
Hope I am still here next week to still be alive and kicking. WW

[k...@attt.bizz]

No, it's about chemistry. Metallic mercury isn't digested. Some
Mercury compounds are, quite readily. What isn't digested...

Metallic Mercury isn't found in nature.

[philo]

On 12/14/2013 02:27 PM, Unquestionably Confused wrote:
>
>> yes, I know you were being facetious
>>
>> I am not overly paranoid about CFL's but I would not want one directly
>> in a food area.
>
> Remember the '50's? Wasn't it mandatory to have a two or three ringed
> fluorescent fixture centered over the kitchen table? Fluorescent
> fixtures beneath the cabinets over food prep areas? Fluorescent
> fixtures (tubes) housed in decorative fixtures?
>
> They looked like crap and I wouldn't want one in the kitchen solely for
> esthetic reasons.
>
> The only real problem I have with CFL's is that they look terrible. If
> they had true color rendition and looked like incandescent, it wouldn't
> be so bad.
>
> The mercury is or can be a problem but when you raise that issue, the
> Greenies are quick to point out that "incandescent bulbs are just as
> bad" Really? or that just more bullshit from the "do as I say crowd?"
>
>


I haye them mostly because they give poor light. I have a few in areas
that do not require particularly good illumination.

I just cannot believe that no one can prefect LED technology for home
lighting. My LED flashlights are great.

[k...@attt.bizz]

They're OK for a basement. Tubes are much better, though. CFLs are a
lightbulb designed by committee (Congress).

>I just cannot believe that no one can prefect LED technology for home
>lighting. My LED flashlights are great.

There's sound technical reasons this hasn't happened. Light bulbs, by
their nature, are fairly omnidirectional radiators. LEDs are just the
opposite. In flashlights, a directional source is a good thing. For
general illumination, not so much.

[Ashton Crusher]

On Sat, 14 Dec 2013 13:03:27 -0600, "ChairMan" <nos...@thanks.com>
wrote:

>philo <ph...@privacy.net> wrote:
>> On 12/14/2013 09:15 AM, Unquestionably Confused wrote:

>>> On 12/14/2013 8:49 AM, philo wrote:
>>>> On 12/14/2013 08:40 AM, Lee B wrote:
>>>>
>>>>

>>>> I would never use any type of fluorescent light right
>>>> next to an
>>>> area where food is being prepared simply due to the fact
>>>> that they
>>>> contain mercury. The chance of one breaking is probably
>>>> not that
>>>> great...but personally , I'd just never do it.
>>>
>>>
>>> ??? You mean to say that if an incandescent bulb broke
>>> you'd sweep
>>> up the pieces (or pick them out of the soup as the case
>>> may be) and
>>> go on to dinner?
>>>
>>> If the bulb breaks, it breaks and everything in the area
>>> goes in the
>>> trash and it's a do over. Period.
>>>
>>> I really think that in this context the only issues to
>>> concern
>>> yourself with are bulb longevity due to positioning and,
>>> possibly,
>>> heat - but the latter apparently is NOT a concern of the
>>> OP
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>

>> No. a fluorescent would spew mercury contamination
>> everywhere.
>>
>> An incandescent...just broken glass.
>>

>> Yes, you'd have to throw out any food in the area but with
>> the
>> fluorescent there would still be traces of mercury left
>> behind.
>
>guess I'm going to die then because my brother and I had a
>bottle of mercury that we would pour out on the table and
>play with when we were kids.
>Rolling from here to there and making little blobs out of
>big ones and then back to big ones.
>Someone please come save me!!!!!!
>

My sister and I did the same thing. Coated dimes with the stuff. Also
melted down lead and made fake coins with a plaster mould.

[Ashton Crusher]

If you aren't mining the stuff or tearing down a giant room that was
insulated with it, it's really not worth worrying about. Even the EPA
doesn't care how you handle it when you are dealing with less than
something like 20 square feet of "demolition".

[tra...@optonline.net]

No, it's genearlly not a problem when you have it in your house unless you're
dumb enough to do something stupid with it. If it's in you siding, how
exactly is that going to kill you? If you take a grinder to it and breathe
it in extensively, well then maybe you have a problem. If it's in your floor
tile and you're dumb enough to take a grinder or sander to that, then you
increase you're risk. Even the guys who worked in environments with it so
thick in the air you couldn't see, only have a few percent risk of getting
cancer from it.

>
> "When materials in your home become damaged or disturbed, microscopic
>
> asbestos fibers can become airborne. When this happens, health-risks
>
> become a factor as inhalation of these fibers can cause them to be
>
> trapped in the lungs, to accumulate, and cause scarring and
>
> inflammation." etc....
>
>

This is gross extrapolation from workers that were exposed constantly
to huge amounts of it based mostly on scare tactics.

>
> http://voices.yahoo.com/lead-paint-asbestos-everything-know-3407898.html?cat=5
>
>
>
> We could outlaw cfls for the same reason 25 years from now. Maybe not
>
> because the exposure is so minimal.

The exposure to asbestos in a home in most cases is minimal too,
unless you do something stupid, like grind up floor tile or siding that
has some in it and breath in as much as you can. Kind of like sticking
your wang in a 240V outlet. Maybe we should get rid of those too.

[Stormin Mormon]

On 12/16/2013 12:35 AM, tra...@optonline.net wrote:
>> We could outlaw cfls for the same reason 25 years from now. Maybe not
>>
>> because the exposure is so minimal.
>
> The exposure to asbestos in a home in most cases is minimal too,
> unless you do something stupid, like grind up floor tile or siding that
> has some in it and breath in as much as you can. Kind of like sticking
> your wang in a 240V outlet. Maybe we should get rid of those too.
>

I dropped a CFL at my parents house, a couple
weeks ago. Mom got the vacuum cleaner. I was
going to suggest wisk and dust pan, but she was
insistent. I commented to Dad, with all that
air flow through the vac bag, any mercury would
be in the atmosphere. I also remembered commenting
we'd all be mad hatters, and we were all about
to die. Maybe that's it? Dad died a day or two
after Mom vacuumed up a broken CFL.

--
.
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

[HerHusband]

> I haye them mostly because they give poor light. I have a few in areas
> that do not require particularly good illumination.

The early CFL bulbs were garbage, but most of the recent CFL's I've picked
up from places like Home Depot have been great. The same "soft white" color
temperature (around 2700K) and equal or better brightness. We use them
everywhere except on our dimmer circuits where even the dimming bulbs don't
work very well. The only downside to the CFL's is they can be a little dim
when you first turn them on if it's a cold morning. Only takes a minute or
two to get to full brightness though, no biggy.

> I just cannot believe that no one can prefect LED technology for home
> lighting. My LED flashlights are great.

I picked up three CREE 60W LED bulbs for our kitchen from Home Depot. I am
very impressed with them. Instant on, full brightness from the start, and
good color temperature. When I first installed them I thought they produced
more glare than the standard incandescent bulbs they were replacing, but
haven't noticed since then. I don't know if I got used to the different
light, or if the glare went away over time. Either way, it's not an issue
now.

I will be switching to the CREE LED bulbs as my CFL's burn out.

Anthony Watson
www.mountainsoftware.com
www.watsondiy.com

[=]

<k...@attt.bizz> wrote in message
news:hsksa9t6rbhu5he22...@4ax.com...

Lewis and Clark took doses of liquid mercury on their 1804 western
expedition as a laxative. Clark lived to be 68; Lewis died, probably of
suicide, at 35. One biography says that he suffered from alcoholism,
depression and perhaps syphilis or malaria. Was mercury involved? There's
some talk of exhuming his body. Maybe we'll find out.

I've been exposed to liquid mercury and mercury vapor for almost 40 years
because I worked where fluorescent lamps were tested and manufactured. I've
also got several mercury amalgam fillings. Now at 75, there's nothing in my
medical history indicating any health issues from mercury. All that I've
read says that it's mercury compounds and especially methy mercury that does
the damage. The Berkeley dudes who wrote the article at:
http://www.lamprecycle.org/public/images/docs/LD+A%20August%202009.pdf got
it right in my view. They say that breaking a CFL results in exposure to
mercury that is about 1/50 of what you get by eating a "single nibble" of
Albacore tuna. How many of you have been around the broken pieces of a
4-foot fluorescent bulb or worse, an 8-foot fluorescent? If so, those bulbs
can contain up to 1,000 times more mercury than a CFL.

Tomsic

[=]

"philo " <ph...@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:l8lkbs$qg6$1...@dont-email.me...

Lots of LED fixtures, bulbs and controls are now available for residential
applications. There's a catalog of the best ones at
www.lightingfortomorrow.com based on an annual competition. LED fixtures
started showing up in 2006.

Tomsic

[=]

"Bob F" <bobn...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:l8l8v9$pqi$1...@dont-email.me...

IMPORTANT point. Range hoods that have a switch that changes the lights
from bright to dim just switch a diode in and out of the circuit. In the
dim mode, that operates the bulbs on half-wave dc. The electronics inside a
CFL bulb won't like that at all.

On half-wave dc, incandescent bulbs draw half power which results in roughly
1/3 the rated light output.

Tomsic

[Dan Espen]

I just went through the exact same thing.
In a short period of time, 3 of our 7 flood incandescents burnt out.
I finally decided to try LEDs. Now I have 3 CREEs in there and
I'm convinced. Not sure I'll even wait for the other 4 to burn out.

Great looking light color and they work really well with the
dimmer.

The only down side is the initial cost.

--
Dan Espen

[philo]

On 12/16/2013 08:13 AM, HerHusband wrote:
>> I haye them mostly because they give poor light. I have a few in areas
>> that do not require particularly good illumination.
>
> The early CFL bulbs were garbage, but most of the recent CFL's I've picked
> up from places like Home Depot have been great. The same "soft white" color
> temperature (around 2700K) and equal or better brightness. We use them
> everywhere except on our dimmer circuits where even the dimming bulbs don't
> work very well. The only downside to the CFL's is they can be a little dim
> when you first turn them on if it's a cold morning. Only takes a minute or
> two to get to full brightness though, no biggy.
>

My back hall is very cold and when I first turn on the CFL it gives
almost no illumination at all...even after a few minutes it still does
not come up to full brilliance. That said...they are an improvement
over the original ones.

>> I just cannot believe that no one can prefect LED technology for home
>> lighting. My LED flashlights are great.
>
> I picked up three CREE 60W LED bulbs for our kitchen from Home Depot. I am
> very impressed with them. Instant on, full brightness from the start, and
> good color temperature. When I first installed them I thought they produced
> more glare than the standard incandescent bulbs they were replacing, but
> haven't noticed since then. I don't know if I got used to the different
> light, or if the glare went away over time. Either way, it's not an issue
> now.
>
> I will be switching to the CREE LED bulbs as my CFL's burn out.
>

Thanks for the info, next time I go to Home Depot I will get a few and
try them out.

[philo]

Thanks for the info!

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Mon, 16 Dec 2013 10:46:19 -0500, Dan Espen <des...@verizon.net>
wrote:

I dure didn't - they were on sale with a cupon at Home Depot so I
bought replacements for all the PARs and everything else the had the
bulbs to fit.

[Caulki...@work.com]

On Sat, 14 Dec 2013 11:08:13 -0600, philo� <ph...@privacy.net> wrote:

>
>No. a fluorescent would spew mercury contamination everywhere.
>

Dont they make devices like mops to mop up the mercury?
Then be sure to have several 50 gallon buckets to contain all of it.

[HerHusband]

> My back hall is very cold and when I first turn on the CFL it gives
> almost no illumination at all...even after a few minutes it still does
> not come up to full brilliance. That said...they are an improvement
> over the original ones.

I have been using CFL bulbs in our outdoor fixtures for the last several
years. While the fixtures are mostly weather tight, they are open on the
bottoms. I honestly did not expect the CFL's to last outdoors, but I think
I've only replaced one of them in the last five years.

The outdoor CFL's are generally quite dim when they first come on, and it
can take several minutes for them to reach full brightness. Especially if
it is really cold outside. But, the lights are on timers, so they usually
come on an hour or more before we need them. Since these lights are on
several hours each day, the energy savings has been worth it.

I will probably try the CREE LED bulbs in the outdoor fixtures when the
CFL's die just to see if they work OK.

Anthony Watson
www.mountainsoftware.com
www.watsondiy.com

[Tomsic]

<Caulki...@work.com> wrote in message
news:qlnua9dblsd1krdqi...@4ax.com...

Mercury has an affinity for sulphur. You can clean up bits of liquid
mercury with "flowers of sulphur" (sulphur powder such as is used for garden
application). Sweep, don't vacuum. See:
http://www.health.ny.gov/environmental/chemicals/hsees/mercury/cleaning_up_a_small_mercury_spill.htm

Tomsic