OT - Blue Rhino proprietary valve

[Stormin Mormon]

http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/bbq/msg031613123088.html
http://www.ripoffreport.com/fuel-companies/blue-rhino/blue-rhino-propane-cylinder-ex-c4md8.htm
Seems, the new Blue Rhino valves are designed so other suppliers can't fill
the tanks.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

[Con La Lengua]

Blu Rhino is the top-poster of the propane business.


.
www.lds.org
Learn more about Jesus
Christopher A. Young

the tanks.
http://www.ripoffreport.com/fuel-companies/blue-rhino/blue-rhino-propane-cylinder-ex-c4md8.htm
http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/bbq/msg031613123088.html

so other suppliers can't fill
Seems, the new Blue Rhino valves are designed

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
news:WBcur.49$E_4...@news.usenetserver.com...

[Ed Pawlowski]

Does not affect me. I'd never buy one of their tanks. Propane is
much cheaper other places.

[RonB]

On May 20, 4:36 pm, Ed Pawlowski <e...@snet.net> wrote:
> On Sun, 20 May 2012 16:36:19 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
>

> <cayoung61***spambl...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >  http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/bbq/msg031613123088.html
> >    http://www.ripoffreport.com/fuel-companies/blue-rhino/blue-rhino-prop...

> >Seems, the new Blue Rhino valves are designed so other suppliers can't fill
> >the tanks.
>
> >Christopher A. Young
> >Learn more about Jesus
> >  www.lds.org
> >.
>
> Does not affect me.  I'd never buy one of their tanks.  Propane is
> much cheaper other places.

Agreed - They are for folks who are too lazy to drive to the local
propane dealer.

RonB

[Stormin Mormon]

High price, proprietary valve. Must appeal to whom? Not me!

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Ed Pawlowski" <e...@snet.net> wrote in message
news:7uoir7dir59i5hpro...@4ax.com...

[Jon Danniken]

A fool and his money are soon parted.

Jon

[Frank]

Surely pisses me off even more.

I've oft complained about their tanks only containing 3.5 gal of propane.

I wouldn't trade tanks except old one is a rust bucket.

I complained to DE state attorney general, Beau Biden (Joe Biden Jr.)
but he's as useless as his old man.

[Stormin Mormon]

I'm not sure why they call em 20 pound tanks, if they can only be legally
filled to 16 pounds. Seems like they would make 25 pound tanks, and call
them 20. So they could sell real 20 pounds.

I've also heard they short fill the Blue Rhino tanks. In addition to the 80%
fill restriction.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Frank" <frankperi...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:jpbr9t$2hp$1...@dont-email.me...

[Stormin Mormon]

I've been looking for my fool, lovey......
(Thurston Howe, III)

.

"Jon Danniken" <jonSPAM...@yaSMPAhoo.com> wrote in message

[bob haller]

how long has blue rhino had a propiety valve?? i have never had a
problem getting a tank filled, at the local exxon and have some rhino
tanks

[Robert Neville]

"Stormin Mormon" <cayoung61***spam...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>Seems, the new Blue Rhino valves are designed so other suppliers can't fill
>the tanks.

Why are you reposting 11 year old stories that were proven to be false?

[Stormin Mormon]

I hadn't heard that. Got a URL? If it's mistaken, I'd sure want to know.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Robert Neville" <do...@bother.com> wrote in message
news:t1tir7lg7u146g0oi...@4ax.com...

[Ed Pawlowski]

On Sun, 20 May 2012 18:32:51 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
<cayoung61***spam...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>I'm not sure why they call em 20 pound tanks, if they can only be legally
>filled to 16 pounds. Seems like they would make 25 pound tanks, and call
>them 20. So they could sell real 20 pounds.
>
>I've also heard they short fill the Blue Rhino tanks. In addition to the 80%
>fill restriction.

They do short fill. Rather than raise prices, they decided to post a
small sign that the cylinders have less in them. Perfectly legal, but
after so many years of filling a tank, it is sort of a scam to fool
the customer. Popular trend these day from ice cream, OJ, to toilet
paper that is 1/4" narrower.

[Robert Neville]

"Stormin Mormon" <cayoung61***spam...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>I hadn't heard that. Got a URL? If it's mistaken, I'd sure want to know.

The original stories started floating around when OPD valves were introduced.
These were just because people didn't understand OPD. As of last year, it does
look like BR is adding their own proprietary OPD compliant valve on some tanks
in some locations, so your post was correct. My apologies.

[tange...@toyotamail.com]

On Sun, 20 May 2012 20:39:00 -0600, Robert Neville <do...@bother.com>
wrote:

>The original stories started floating around when OPD valves were introduced.
>These were just because people didn't understand OPD. As of last year, it does
>look like BR is adding their own proprietary OPD compliant valve on some tanks
>in some locations, so your post was correct. My apologies.

If these valves do not comply to being filled, how can they comply to be
used with standard LP appliances? The threads must be the same, or the
tanks are worthless for standard use. As long as the filler can attach
their filling equipment to these threads, why can they not fill the
tanks?

[Attila.Iskander]

"Stormin Mormon" <cayoung61***spam...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:WBcur.49$E_4...@news.usenetserver.com...

> http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/bbq/msg031613123088.html
>
> http://www.ripoffreport.com/fuel-companies/blue-rhino/blue-rhino-propane-cylinder-ex-c4md8.htm
> Seems, the new Blue Rhino valves are designed so other suppliers can't
> fill
> the tanks.
>

One article is dated 2001, the other 2004

Can we see actual images of the different valves that Blue Rhine is talking
about ?

[harry]

On May 20, 11:32 pm, "Stormin Mormon"

<cayoung61***spambl...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> I'm not sure why they call em 20 pound tanks, if they can only be legally
> filled to 16 pounds. Seems like they would make 25 pound tanks, and call
> them 20. So they could sell real 20 pounds.
>
> I've also heard they short fill the Blue Rhino tanks. In addition to the 80%
> fill restriction.
>
> Christopher A. Young
> Learn more about Jesus
>  www.lds.org
> .
>

> "Frank" <frankperiodlogu...@comcast.net> wrote in message

>
> news:jpbr9t$2hp$1...@dont-email.me...
>
> Surely pisses me off even more.
>
> I've oft complained about their tanks only containing 3.5 gal of propane.
>
> I wouldn't trade tanks except old one is a rust bucket.
>
> I complained to DE state attorney general, Beau Biden (Joe Biden Jr.)
> but he's as useless as his old man.

That can be easily checked with a bathroom scale/weighing machine.
Our tanks in the UK have the full and empty weights stamped on them.

[Stormin Mormon]

And, the ever popular 13 ounce "pound of spaghetti"?

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Ed Pawlowski" <e...@snet.net> wrote in message

news:e65jr7dobehrbuuuv...@4ax.com...

[Stormin Mormon]

As I read the article, there is a spring loaded steel ball, that acts as a
check valve. Propane can come out. But, you need a strong magnet to get
propane to go in.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

<tange...@toyotamail.com> wrote in message
news:23djr7h26edq57sam...@4ax.com...

[Stormin Mormon]

I did another web search, and found more recent articles
that say the same thing. I guess we both got a chance to
learn, here. Once in a while, I get suckered by some
internet legend, and I do appreciate when I am given
correct information. Please keep looking out for me,
if something doesn't sound right.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Robert Neville" <do...@bother.com> wrote in message

[tange...@toyotamail.com]

OK, Now I'm puzzled.....

I dont buy those tanks or any prefilled ones. I have my own tanks and
get them filled. However, I was under the impression that if I take ANY
tank to a place that sells prefilled tanks, I can trade in my tank for
the deposit and get a full one.

So lets say that I take my store boughten tank, or a tank from another
of these companies that sell prefilled tanks to a Blue Rhino place. I
leave my tank and buy theirs. Are they going to change the valve on
every tank they get that is not their own? That seems pretty stupid as
well as costly for them. I'm sure they apply their label to all tanks,
but sticking on a label is easy. Changing valves is a lot more
complicated and costly. When a new valve is installed, the tank has to
be purged too.

So, if they dont change the valves, we will now have random tanks that
some cant be filled and others can. Sounds like a major fuckup.

While I'm tired of the government controlling every goddamn thing we do,
the gov is the first to regulate what we do as citizens. When they
changed the tanks from the old valves to these OPD types, we all had to
buy new tanks, and that pissed me off since I had 7 perfectly good tanks
that could no longer be filled, and two of them were 12 LB tanks made
for special locations. (cost much more than 20 LB tanks). Yet the gov
does nothing to companies that create fucked up messes like this
apparently will become if they have proprietary valves on some tanks and
standard ones on others. This ought to be outlawed immediately.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On Wed, 23 May 2012 03:37:54 -0500, tange...@toyotamail.com wrote:



>OK, Now I'm puzzled.....
>
>I dont buy those tanks or any prefilled ones. I have my own tanks and
>get them filled. However, I was under the impression that if I take ANY
>tank to a place that sells prefilled tanks, I can trade in my tank for
>the deposit and get a full one.
>
>So lets say that I take my store boughten tank, or a tank from another
>of these companies that sell prefilled tanks to a Blue Rhino place. I
>leave my tank and buy theirs. Are they going to change the valve on
>every tank they get that is not their own? That seems pretty stupid as
>well as costly for them.

Not so dumb. You got rid of a perfectly good tank and took one of
their short fills. Now you have to go back to them for refills. For
a few dollars, they sucked you in to become a regular customer.

I was fortunate in that a local dealer would fill my old style tanks
for a few years. Very sensible, IMO.

[Robert Neville]

tange...@toyotamail.com wrote:

>I dont buy those tanks or any prefilled ones. I have my own tanks and
>get them filled. However, I was under the impression that if I take ANY
>tank to a place that sells prefilled tanks, I can trade in my tank for
>the deposit and get a full one.

That was and is still true.

>So lets say that I take my store boughten tank, or a tank from another
>of these companies that sell prefilled tanks to a Blue Rhino place. I
>leave my tank and buy theirs. Are they going to change the valve on
>every tank they get that is not their own? That seems pretty stupid as
>well as costly for them. I'm sure they apply their label to all tanks,
>but sticking on a label is easy. Changing valves is a lot more
>complicated and costly. When a new valve is installed, the tank has to
>be purged too.

Depends on what they can buy tanks for. IIRC tanks have to be recertified every
10 years. Tanks getting close to recert may just get tossed.

>So, if they dont change the valves, we will now have random tanks that
>some cant be filled and others can. Sounds like a major fuckup.

Not for Blue Rhino. They can fill either style tank. Not for customers who use
BR exclusively. The ones who get stuck are the ones who bring in an open fill
style tank as a one off or because their tank is approaching recert, expecting
the same style in return.

>While I'm tired of the government controlling every goddamn thing we do,
>the gov is the first to regulate what we do as citizens. When they
>changed the tanks from the old valves to these OPD types, we all had to
>buy new tanks, and that pissed me off since I had 7 perfectly good tanks
>that could no longer be filled, and two of them were 12 LB tanks made
>for special locations. (cost much more than 20 LB tanks). Yet the gov
>does nothing to companies that create fucked up messes like this
>apparently will become if they have proprietary valves on some tanks and
>standard ones on others. This ought to be outlawed immediately.

Or you could just not buy from BR and not have the government in your knickers
at all.

[Frank]

Tanks are marked 15 lb but who knows the specific gravity of propane and
would appreciate that the tank is only 3/4 filled?

At least my 11.5 oz can of coffee is completely filled as would be your
13 oz pack of spaghetti.

I'm sure this is unknown by the average purchaser since the product is
never visible.

Blue Rhino is setting themselves up for a class action suit. It only
takes one disgruntled customer to put this in motion and an astute law
firm will pick it up and reap most of the benefit.

[Stormin Mormon]

It will be interesting to see. Some folks (refrigeration repairmen, who
weigh refrigerant bottles) often have scales that can measure the full
weight of a propane tank. Someone will eventually notice. And act.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"Frank" <frankperi...@comcast.net> wrote in message

news:jpin4p$442$1...@dont-email.me...

[k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz]

On Wed, 23 May 2012 09:12:40 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
<cayoung61***spam...@hotmail.com> wrote:

>It will be interesting to see. Some folks (refrigeration repairmen, who
>weigh refrigerant bottles) often have scales that can measure the full
>weight of a propane tank. Someone will eventually notice. And act.

Every place I've filled my tanks, at least for the last ten years, has either
weighed the tanks while filling, measured the propane by volume (gas meter),
or both.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Wed, 23 May 2012 09:02:15 -0400, Frank
<frankperi...@comcast.net> wrote:

>On 5/21/2012 7:56 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
>> And, the ever popular 13 ounce "pound of spaghetti"?
>>
>> Christopher A. Young
>> Learn more about Jesus
>> www.lds.org
>> .
>>
>> "Ed Pawlowski"<e...@snet.net> wrote in message
>> news:e65jr7dobehrbuuuv...@4ax.com...
>>>
>>> I've also heard they short fill the Blue Rhino tanks. In addition to the
>>> 80%
>>> fill restriction.
>>
>> They do short fill. Rather than raise prices, they decided to post a
>> small sign that the cylinders have less in them. Perfectly legal, but
>> after so many years of filling a tank, it is sort of a scam to fool
>> the customer. Popular trend these day from ice cream, OJ, to toilet
>> paper that is 1/4" narrower.
>>
>>
>
>Tanks are marked 15 lb but who knows the specific gravity of propane and
>would appreciate that the tank is only 3/4 filled?
>
>At least my 11.5 oz can of coffee is completely filled as would be your
>13 oz pack of spaghetti.
>

Not necessarily so------ Many containers say "product is filled by
weight - some product settling may occur" - and when you open the can
it's about 75% full - or 100% if you count the air.

[Blue Rhino]

I am an employee of Blue Rhino and would like to respond to this thread.
Please note that Blue Rhino tanks no longer contain the proprietary
valve that is mentioned here. In fact, we have not used that special
valve for several years now. Blue Rhino tanks can be refilled anywhere
by any supplier you choose.

Happy Grilling and Happy Memorial Day to each of you! If you have any
questions, please call us at 800.258.7466 or visit www.bluerhino.com.
Thank you.

tange...@toyotamail.com;2865809 Wrote:
> On Mon, 21 May 2012 07:57:59 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
> cayoung61***spam...@hotmail.com wrote:

> -

> As I read the article, there is a spring loaded steel ball, that acts as
> a
> check valve. Propane can come out. But, you need a strong magnet to get
>
> propane to go in.
>
> Christopher A. Young
> Learn more about Jesus

> 'The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints'
> (http://www.lds.org)

> .
>
> tange...@toyotamail.com wrote in message
> news:23djr7h26edq57sam...@4ax.com...
>
> If these valves do not comply to being filled, how can they comply to
> be
> used with standard LP appliances? The threads must be the same, or the
> tanks are worthless for standard use. As long as the filler can attach
> their filling equipment to these threads, why can they not fill the
> tanks?
>
>

> -

>
> OK, Now I'm puzzled.....
>
> I dont buy those tanks or any prefilled ones. I have my own tanks and
> get them filled. However, I was under the impression that if I take
> ANY
> tank to a place that sells prefilled tanks, I can trade in my tank for
> the deposit and get a full one.
>
> So lets say that I take my store boughten tank, or a tank from another
> of these companies that sell prefilled tanks to a Blue Rhino place. I
> leave my tank and buy theirs. Are they going to change the valve on
> every tank they get that is not their own? That seems pretty stupid as
> well as costly for them. I'm sure they apply their label to all tanks,
> but sticking on a label is easy. Changing valves is a lot more
> complicated and costly. When a new valve is installed, the tank has to
> be purged too.
>
> So, if they dont change the valves, we will now have random tanks that

> some cant be filled and others can. Sounds like a major ****up.

>
> While I'm tired of the government controlling every goddamn thing we
> do,
> the gov is the first to regulate what we do as citizens. When they
> changed the tanks from the old valves to these OPD types, we all had to

> buy new tanks, and that ****ed me off since I had 7 perfectly good

> tanks
> that could no longer be filled, and two of them were 12 LB tanks made
> for special locations. (cost much more than 20 LB tanks). Yet the gov

> does nothing to companies that create ****ed up messes like this

> apparently will become if they have proprietary valves on some tanks
> and
> standard ones on others. This ought to be outlawed immediately.

--
Blue Rhino

[Hell Toupee]

On 5/23/2012 3:37 AM, tange...@toyotamail.com wrote:

> While I'm tired of the government controlling every goddamn thing we do,
> the gov is the first to regulate what we do as citizens. When they
> changed the tanks from the old valves to these OPD types, we all had to
> buy new tanks, and that pissed me off since I had 7 perfectly good tanks
> that could no longer be filled, and two of them were 12 LB tanks made
> for special locations. (cost much more than 20 LB tanks).

You didn't have to pitch your old tanks. All you had to do was buy the
new OPD valves and replace them yourself - or take the tanks to a
larger propane dealer and have them do it for you. Or traded them in
at the dealer for new tanks.

You little corner gas station/hardware store that also fills tanks
isn't going to offer those options, but find a larger propane dealer
and they'll do it for you. Same goes for getting your tanks
recertified every 10-12 years, depending on what your state requires.
Don't pitch them. A larger dealer will check them out and recertify
them for you.

[bob haller]

On May 24, 5:11 pm, Hell Toupee <w...@menull.com> wrote:

just trade them at recertify time or new valve time

[JIMMIE]

On Sunday, May 20, 2012 8:36:19 PM UTC, Stormin Mormon wrote:
> http://ths.gardenweb.com/forums/load/bbq/msg031613123088.html
> http://www.ripoffreport.com/fuel-companies/blue-rhino/blue-rhino-propane-cylinder-ex-c4md8.htm
> Seems, the new Blue Rhino valves are designed so other suppliers can't fill
> the tanks.
>

> Christopher A. Young
> Learn more about Jesus

> www.lds.org
> .

Just got one filled at Exxon, no problem. When Im camping and need propane I will grap one if I cant find a place to get a refill. Sometimes that are actually cheaper than campground refills and sometimes its all you can find.

Jimmie

[NotMe]

"Blue Rhino" <Blue.Rhin...@diybanter.com> wrote in message
news:Blue.Rhin...@diybanter.com...

>
> I am an employee of Blue Rhino and would like to respond to this thread.
> Please note that Blue Rhino tanks no longer contain the proprietary
> valve that is mentioned here. In fact, we have not used that special
> valve for several years now. Blue Rhino tanks can be refilled anywhere
> by any supplier you choose.
>
> Happy Grilling and Happy Memorial Day to each of you! If you have any
> questions, please call us at 800.258.7466 or visit www.bluerhino.com.
> Thank you.
>
>

In my personal experience BR tanks still come up short on the amount of LPG
sold/delivered.

As to no longer using proprietary valves more than a few independent refill
stations refuse to deal with BR tanks. In my experience their point is it's
not worth the hassle/potential liability problems or the resulting bad
feelings with their customers.

Perhaps it's no longer an issue of *can* but an issue of *will*. If you're
out in the boonies you still come up empty.

From my view 'screw me once shame on you, screw me twice shame on me.' The
reality is BR has a major pr problem that will be hard for BR to address.
And not there has been no real attempt at that except to cliam BR will sin
no more. In my case it matters not as for me and mine we're not taking a
chance on another screw job.

Says he who has received short shift from BR on complaints and no
reimbursement for gamed tanks of the past.

[Stormin Mormon]

The special ones had a triangle indent, in the side of the valve. Not all
Blue Rhinos had this.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

"JIMMIE" <JIMMIE...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:bcbf84a0-cb99-4b13...@googlegroups.com...

[bob haller]

All in all blue rhinos costs to collect tanks, refurbish tanks,
pressure test tanks, upgrade tanks valves distrubuite tanks then
share the revenue with the local dealer...........

Their costs MUST be a lot higher than the local gas station that fills
tanks as a secondary income.....

So underfilling is likely a attempt to compete with the lower costs of
the low cost operators.......

Not saying underfilling is right but it might just be the only viable
solution:(..

[Ed Pawlowski]

On Thu, 24 May 2012 19:14:52 -0700 (PDT), bob haller <hal...@aol.com>
wrote:

If you have to use sleazy tactics to stay in business, you should not
be in business. For years, they did charge a higher price, but it was
convenient. To suddenly put less gas in the same sized tank to keep
the price down is just plain sleazy and wrong.

It also means you have to change tanks for often and spend money to go
tot he store to get them more often.

[John Gilmer]

On 5/24/2012 10:14 PM, bob haller wrote:
> All in all blue rhinos costs to collect tanks, refurbish tanks,
> pressure test tanks, upgrade tanks valves distrubuite tanks then
> share the revenue with the local dealer...........
>
> Their costs MUST be a lot higher than the local gas station that fills
> tanks as a secondary income.....

Not necessarily.

The places that fill your tank spend some 5 to 10 minutes of labor
starting from the time that the "fill guy" starts to come out to when
the sale is complete and the "fill guy" goes back to whatever else he is
doing.

The "blue guy" stops by a store and loads 5 or 10 empties and replaces
them with a like number of "fills" and goes on his way.

I imagine that at the "factory," the labor cost per container is down in
the noise but on the order of one minute.

It's the natural advantage of an assembly line over piecework.

>
> So underfilling is likely a attempt to compete with the lower costs of
> the low cost operators.......

Well, I suspect it's a combination of factors. The "anti-over-fill"
valves likely reduced the capacity below 20#. Easier to simply cut the
"fill" to 15# than finding a "safe max."

[Frank]

That's my biggest gripe. Don't mind paying a little extra for
convenience but don't want to feel gypped.

[tange...@toyotamail.com]

I agree there have been times when I'm camping that there just is no
place to get a refill, especially on a weekend. Because of this, I have
always brought a spare tank. Only once did I run both tanks empty, and
was unable to find a place to get a refill. Fortunately that same time
I found a business with whom I'm familiar, who sold the prefilled tanks.
It's their own brand and I was comfortable with them. The cost was
slightly higher than a refill, but in a pinch, it served me well, and I
did get a newer tank in the process too.

As far as BR not filling their tanks with as much propane, it's pretty
well known that ALL of the companies that sell pre-filled tanks do not
fill them to their maximum. A 20lb tank is really only a 16lb tank
because ALL propane tanks can only be filled to 80%. This means that
the 500 gal. tank in your yard can only get 400 gallons, and a 20lb can
only get 16lb. But there have been articles in recent years that state
that 20lb pre-filled tanks contain only 13lb or a similar number. I
guess that's the cost we pay for convenience. Same as paying $3 for a
gallon of milk at a convenience store while a grocery store only charges
$2 for the same product. My biggest complaint is that these tanks do
not tell the amount of fill. Because of this, if you normally get a
specific amount of hours of use from a FULL tank, you are not going to
get the same hours of use, and it's not possible to know when the tank
will run out, not knowing the content in pounds. They really should be
required to state the weight or amount of propane.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

NO. A 20 lb propane tank HOLDS 20 lbs of propane. That is the 80%
volume capacity. The NORMAL 20 lb tank weighs 18 lbs emty and 38 lbs
full - legal fill of 80% volume.

>because ALL propane tanks can only be filled to 80%. This means that
>the 500 gal. tank in your yard can only get 400 gallons,

WRONG. a 500 gallon US tank HOLDS 500 gallons of propane. The actual
volume of the tank is 83.56 cubic feet. The only way a 500 gallon
propane tank only holds 400 gallons is if those gallons are IMPERIAL
gallons, and the tank is rated in US Gallons.

>and a 20lb can
>only get 16lb. But there have been articles in recent years that state
>that 20lb pre-filled tanks contain only 13lb or a similar number. I
>guess that's the cost we pay for convenience. Same as paying $3 for a
>gallon of milk at a convenience store while a grocery store only charges
>$2 for the same product. My biggest complaint is that these tanks do
>not tell the amount of fill. Because of this, if you normally get a
>specific amount of hours of use from a FULL tank, you are not going to
>get the same hours of use, and it's not possible to know when the tank
>will run out, not knowing the content in pounds. They really should be
>required to state the weight or amount of propane.

Weigh your refilled tank. Your 20 lb cyl, when full, will ber 37 or 38
lbs, depensing on the tare weight of the cyl. If the TW is 18, full is
38. If the TW is 17, the full weight will be 37.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On Sat, 26 May 2012 18:17:54 -0500, tange...@toyotamail.com wrote:




>

>As far as BR not filling their tanks with as much propane, it's pretty
>well known that ALL of the companies that sell pre-filled tanks do not
>fill them to their maximum. A 20lb tank is really only a 16lb tank
>because ALL propane tanks can only be filled to 80%.

True for all except BR. They use a short fill

Inflationary pressures, including the volatile costs of steel, diesel
fuel, and propane, have had a significant impact on the cylinder
exchange industry. In 2008, to help control these rising costs, Blue
Rhino followed the example of other consumer products companies with a
product content change. We reduced the amount of propane in our tanks
from 17 pounds to 15 pounds.

To ensure our consumers are properly notified, Blue Rhino clearly
marks the amount of propane contained in our tanks, right on the
package.

>This means that
>the 500 gal. tank in your yard can only get 400 gallons, and a 20lb can
>only get 16lb.

It means BR charges more for less. Two pounds less according to their
web page.

> But there have been articles in recent years that state
>that 20lb pre-filled tanks contain only 13lb or a similar number. I
>guess that's the cost we pay for convenience. Same as paying $3 for a
>gallon of milk at a convenience store while a grocery store only charges
>$2 for the same product. My biggest complaint is that these tanks do
>not tell the amount of fill.

There is a sticker on the racks that tells you what they put in the
tank.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Sat, 26 May 2012 21:48:24 -0400, Ed Pawlowski <e...@snet.net> wrote:

>On Sat, 26 May 2012 18:17:54 -0500, tange...@toyotamail.com wrote:
>
>
>
>
>>
>>As far as BR not filling their tanks with as much propane, it's pretty
>>well known that ALL of the companies that sell pre-filled tanks do not
>>fill them to their maximum. A 20lb tank is really only a 16lb tank
>>because ALL propane tanks can only be filled to 80%.
>
>True for all except BR. They use a short fill

They still CAN put 20 lbs into the tank - they choose not to.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Sat, 26 May 2012 22:52:40 -0400, gfre...@aol.com wrote:

>On Sat, 26 May 2012 22:19:07 -0400, cl...@snyder.on.ca wrote:
>
>>They still CAN put 20 lbs into the tank - they choose not to.
>

>Not with the new OPD valve. There is a float in there that shuts it
>off.
No, it shuts it off at 20 lbs, not at the reduced fill that Blue
Rhino, and some other prefilled tank vendors are apparently supplying.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On Sat, 26 May 2012 22:19:07 -0400, cl...@snyder.on.ca wrote:



>

>They still CAN put 20 lbs into the tank - they choose not to.

Not in the US. Max allowed is 4.1 gallons of propane that weighs 4.2#
per gallon. Max ix 17.22 lbs.

Maybe they CAN fit that much, but the OPD valve will close and make it
a real PITA to use that tank. When the new tanks started going into
service, many were overfilled and customers complained that the tanks
did not work when hooked to the appliance. You had to be very careful
to slowly open the valve.

You will also find the tank stamped with WC for water capacity. That
translates to how much propane will fit.

I take my tanks to BJ's and they charge by the gallon. If they do
come up short, I'm not paying a penalty for it.

[k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz]

On Sat, 26 May 2012 23:49:51 -0400, Ed Pawlowski <e...@snet.net> wrote:

>On Sat, 26 May 2012 22:19:07 -0400, cl...@snyder.on.ca wrote:
>
>
>
>>
>>They still CAN put 20 lbs into the tank - they choose not to.
>
>Not in the US. Max allowed is 4.1 gallons of propane that weighs 4.2#
>per gallon. Max ix 17.22 lbs.
>
>Maybe they CAN fit that much, but the OPD valve will close and make it
>a real PITA to use that tank. When the new tanks started going into
>service, many were overfilled and customers complained that the tanks
>did not work when hooked to the appliance. You had to be very careful
>to slowly open the valve.

Mine often "sticks" when they start filling it, particularly in hot weather.
They have to monkey around with a screwdriver to get the OPD valve open.

>You will also find the tank stamped with WC for water capacity. That
>translates to how much propane will fit.
>
>I take my tanks to BJ's and they charge by the gallon. If they do
>come up short, I'm not paying a penalty for it.

I usually buy from a U-Haul place here. They sell by the gallon, too, though
it's also weighed.

[Mark Lloyd]

On 05/26/2012 10:49 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
[snip]

> You will also find the tank stamped with WC for water capacity. That
> translates to how much propane will fit.

I looked at my 20lb tanks (one from BR, and one not). They have the same
markings:

TW - 16.6
WC - 47.6
DT - 4.0

The only one I know about is TW.

[snip]

--
"A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence." -- David Hume
(1711-1776)

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Sun, 27 May 2012 12:16:08 -0500, Mark Lloyd <non...@none.invalid>
wrote:

>On 05/26/2012 10:49 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>[snip]
>
>> You will also find the tank stamped with WC for water capacity. That
>> translates to how much propane will fit.
>
>I looked at my 20lb tanks (one from BR, and one not). They have the same
>markings:
>
>TW - 16.6
>WC - 47.6
>DT - 4.0
>
>The only one I know about is TW.
>
>[snip]

wc=47.6 lbs water capacity.
That is 5.7 gallons US - and at 80% that is 4.56 gallons
At 4.2 lbs per gallon US, that is a total of 19.152 lbs.
20 lbs of propane would be 4.76 US gallons. If the tare weight of the
tank (in this case 16.6 lbs) is added you get a full weight of 35.72
lbs.

Both my Worthington and Wolfdale 20 lb cyls tare at 18.5, and come
to me full at 40 lbs.
That means I'm getting 20.1 lbs of propane in the tank, filled at my
local propane refill station.

["<<<__ Bøb __>>>"]

WHERE in the US does water weigh 4.2$/gallon ??? Mine weighs the world
accepted standard of ~8#/gallon.

> That is 5.7 gallons US - and at 80% that is 4.56 gallons
> At 4.2 lbs per gallon US, that is a total of 19.152 lbs.
> 20 lbs of propane would be 4.76 US gallons. If the tare weight of the
> tank (in this case 16.6 lbs) is added you get a full weight of 35.72
> lbs.

--
"The danger to America is not Barack Obama but a citizenry
capable of entrusting a man like him with the Presidency.
It will be far easier to limit and undo the follies of an
Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense
and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have
such a man for their? president.. Blaming the prince of the
fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of
fools that made him their prince".

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Sun, 27 May 2012 16:23:33 -0400, "<<<__ Bøb __>>>"
<b.wi...@charter.net> wrote:

>WHERE in the US does water weigh 4.2$/gallon ??? Mine weighs the world
>accepted standard of ~8#/gallon.
>
>
>> That is 5.7 gallons US - and at 80% that is 4.56 gallons
>> At 4.2 lbs per gallon US, that is a total of 19.152 lbs.
>> 20 lbs of propane would be 4.76 US gallons. If the tare weight of the
>> tank (in this case 16.6 lbs) is added you get a full weight of 35.72
>> lbs.

Who cares how much the WATER would weigh?????? We are talking
PROPANE.

[The Daring Dufas]

On 5/20/2012 8:10 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On Sun, 20 May 2012 18:32:51 -0400, "Stormin Mormon"
> <cayoung61***spam...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm not sure why they call em 20 pound tanks, if they can only be legally
>> filled to 16 pounds. Seems like they would make 25 pound tanks, and call
>> them 20. So they could sell real 20 pounds.

>>
>> I've also heard they short fill the Blue Rhino tanks. In addition to the 80%
>> fill restriction.
>
> They do short fill. Rather than raise prices, they decided to post a
> small sign that the cylinders have less in them. Perfectly legal, but
> after so many years of filling a tank, it is sort of a scam to fool
> the customer. Popular trend these day from ice cream, OJ, to toilet
> paper that is 1/4" narrower.

The 11" X 11" paper towels have now become 11" X 10.4". The 16oz pack of
sliced ham is now 12oz, less sliced up dead pig for your money. ^_^

TDD

[Stormin Mormon]

Substitute the word "propane" for "water" and you're closer to fact.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

""<<<__ B�b __>>>"" <b.wi...@charter.net> wrote in message
news:O2wwr.45902$ax3....@newsfe05.iad...

[Ed Pawlowski]

On Sun, 27 May 2012 16:23:33 -0400, "<<<__ Bøb __>>>"
<b.wi...@charter.net> wrote:

>WHERE in the US does water weigh 4.2$/gallon ??? Mine weighs the world
>accepted standard of ~8#/gallon.
>
>
>> That is 5.7 gallons US - and at 80% that is 4.56 gallons
>> At 4.2 lbs per gallon US, that is a total of 19.152 lbs.
>> 20 lbs of propane would be 4.76 US gallons. If the tare weight of the
>> tank (in this case 16.6 lbs) is added you get a full weight of 35.72
>> lbs.

Sorry about your reading comprehension problems. We're discussing
propane that happens to weigh 4.2# per gallon.