OT The Not So Great Debate

[Ed Pawlowski]

You didn't miss anything. Trump came across as a bully and made his
base happy.

Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.

I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.

[Bod]

I just watched the summing up of the debate from the BBC and that is
exactly what they said.
What they did add, was that it was just a mud slinging contest and
wondered what the point of it was and also is there any point in having
another two of these shouting matches.

[Ed Pawlowski]

I won't waste my time watching another. Trump brought up Hunter Biden.
I thought that was a bit sleazy but typical Trump.

[Ralph Mowery]

In article <bBScH.204023$GQ4....@fx02.iad>, e...@snet.xxx says...

I started watching it and the big looser was the moderator. He let
things get out of hand. I quit after about 15 minutes as all the
moderator did was let the two talk at the same time.
My idea of a debat is that one talks and then the other talks.

[Bod]

Commentators say that after a nasty night, the real loser was the
country - and the poll seems to say the same.

Tonight's debate made 69% of voters feel annoyed, and 19% feel
pessimistic. On a more positive note: 31% were entertained and 17% say
they were informed.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/election-us-2020-54311223

[%%]

"Ed Pawlowski" <e...@snet.xxx> wrote in message
news:bBScH.204023$GQ4....@fx02.iad...

> You didn't miss anything.

But it was clear that Joe isn't demented or senile, yet.

> Trump came across as a bully and made his base happy.

Didn’t make Wallace very happy.

> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.

> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.

There must have been some who changed their vote.

[Bod]

My word! I just listened to the first 15 minutes of the debate and that
was enough for me. Trump just wouldn't stop interrupting.
He ignored the moderator, he just wouldn't shut up.
This so called debate was just a shouting match.......boring.

[Bod]

[%%]

"Bod" <bodr...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:htib9o...@mid.individual.net...

> On 30/09/2020 04:04, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> You didn't miss anything. Trump came across as a bully and made his base
>> happy.
>>
>> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>>
>> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.
> >
> I just watched the summing up of the debate from the BBC

I watched the whole thing, mainly to see how bad Joe is mentally.
He did fine, just had a few mispeaks with some numbers.

> and that is exactly what they said.

But they have always been rabid leftys.

> What they did add, was that it was just a mud slinging contest

And called each other liars.

> and wondered what the point of it was

Its now more about how refusing to get involved would look.

> and also is there any point in having another two of these shouting
> matches.

The next one isnt the same two shouters.

[%%]

"Ralph Mowery" <rmower...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:MPG.39ddc3e3b...@news.east.earthlink.net...

> In article <bBScH.204023$GQ4....@fx02.iad>, e...@snet.xxx says...
>>
>> You didn't miss anything. Trump came across as a bully and made his
>> base happy.
>>
>> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>>
>> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.
>>
>>
>
> I started watching it and the big looser was
> the moderator. He let things get out of hand.

He didn't have any say on that.

? I quit after about 15 minutes as all the moderator

> did was let the two talk at the same time.

He didn't have any say on that. He did a little better later.

> My idea of a debat is that one talks and then the other talks.

Clearly neither trump or biden agree with you on that
and biden didn't really have much choice when trump
started doing the talking over.

[rbowman]

I would guess very few. I didn't watch too much of it but Biden didn't
melt down but he didn't offer anything substantial either. All that
soulful staring out playing on emotion doesn't sway me. That's the most
I've seen of Trump and he performed as expected.

[rbowman]

On 09/29/2020 09:59 PM, %% wrote:
>
> The next one isnt the same two shouters.

Is it the vice squad? That will be the interesting one since it's a
Harris-Biden ticket as far as I'm concerned.

[gfre...@aol.com]

I said this was going to be a food fight, the only thing they were
missing was pies.
Maybe next time.

[%%]

"rbowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message
news:htijdr...@mid.individual.net...

> On 09/29/2020 09:53 PM, %% wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Ed Pawlowski" <e...@snet.xxx> wrote in message
>> news:bBScH.204023$GQ4....@fx02.iad...
>>
>>> You didn't miss anything.
>>
>> But it was clear that Joe isn't demented or senile, yet.
>>
>>> Trump came across as a bully and made his base happy.
>>
>> Didn’t make Wallace very happy.
>>
>>> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>>
>>> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.
>>
>> There must have been some who changed their vote.

> I would guess very few. I didn't watch too much of it

That’s obvious.

> but Biden didn't melt down but he didn't offer anything substantial
> either.

He did actually. a stupid scheme to 'weatherise' a vast
number of existing buildings at an immense cost, no new
coal fired or gas fired power stations, and everything done
renewable and carbon neutral by some specific date, 2050 or
something and a return to the Paris climate change accords.

He was less specific about what he would do about the virus.

> All that soulful staring out playing on emotion doesn't sway me.

But you were actually stupid enough to vote for
someone who you thought had the best ad who had
no nope in hell of ever being elected prez last time.

> That's the most I've seen of Trump and he performed as expected.

Yep tho he did land a few hits, like with that
fool Dem governor who said that the virus
lockdown would be gone just after election
day who made it clear that they were trying
to make Trump look bad on the economy.

[%%]

"rbowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message

news:htiji1...@mid.individual.net...

> On 09/29/2020 09:59 PM, %% wrote:
>>
>> The next one isnt the same two shouters.

> Is it the vice squad?

Yep. next week and a day.

> That will be the interesting one since it's a Harris-Biden ticket as far
> as I'm concerned.

Yeah I have never seen her in action, Pence either.

[%%]

<gfre...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:tb68nftaegkaptfha...@4ax.com...

Unlikely given that it's the vices next time.

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

They should let me produce them.

Two soundproof booths, each with a fixed camera pointed at the candidate
and with a monitor that displays the other guy and a speaker that outputs
the moderator's voice or the opponent's voice. Each man's microphone
is muted while the other uses his allotted time to answer the question or
respond to to his opponent.

Television/Internet viewer see a split screen of each camera feed. The
camera never looks away, so if one of them talks while it isn't his turn,
picks his nose, leaves the camera view, etc., everybody knows.

Cindy Hamilton

[Bod]

Like it, I pronounce you the next producer ;-)

[Dean Hoffman]

I did a search a couple days ago asking if debates change votes.
Most of what
I found said not many votes are changed by the actual debates. The post
debate
commentary supposedly changes just as many.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 9/29/2020 11:59 PM, %% wrote:
>
>
> "Bod" <bodr...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message

>

>> and also is there any point in having another two of these shouting
>> matches.
>
> The next one isnt the same two shouters.

The next one is VP level. That may actually prove more interesting that
the first.

[Bod]

It surely couldn't be any worse.

[rbowman]

On 09/30/2020 12:15 AM, %% wrote:
> Yep tho he did land a few hits, like with that
> fool Dem governor who said that the virus
> lockdown would be gone just after election
> day who made it clear that they were trying
> to make Trump look bad on the economy.

I thought his best shots were pointing out Biden hasn't dome much in 47
years. Why now? What Biden did do, like the crime bill, favorable
legislation for bank and credit card companies, and so forth Joe would
rather not mention.

For the segments I saw it looked more like a SNL skit than what I'd
expect from presidential contenders.

Joe did some fancy ducking and bobbing. Trump was right that if Joe
commits himself he may lose the Bernie Bros or the suburban housewives.

[rbowman]

On 09/30/2020 04:38 AM, angelica...@yahoo.com wrote:
> Two soundproof booths, each with a fixed camera pointed at the candidate
> and with a monitor that displays the other guy and a speaker that outputs
> the moderator's voice or the opponent's voice. Each man's microphone
> is muted while the other uses his allotted time to answer the question or
> respond to to his opponent.

I was thinking a couple of switches to cut the mike of the other side
during the 2 minute statements would have been good. Trump would have
been reduced to silent eye rolling and head shaking and in his turn
Biden could stand there and look soulful.

[rbowman]

That might work after a more civilized debate when the points could be
analyzed. I think those days are gone.

[rbowman]

Pence is Pence but watching Chameleon Harris should be entertaining.

[Ralph Mowery]

In article <39879978-f7ad-49ae...@googlegroups.com>,
angelica...@yahoo.com says...

>
> They should let me produce them.
>
> Two soundproof booths, each with a fixed camera pointed at the candidate
> and with a monitor that displays the other guy and a speaker that outputs
> the moderator's voice or the opponent's voice. Each man's microphone
> is muted while the other uses his allotted time to answer the question or
> respond to to his opponent.
>
> Television/Internet viewer see a split screen of each camera feed. The
> camera never looks away, so if one of them talks while it isn't his turn,
> picks his nose, leaves the camera view, etc., everybody knows.
>
>
>

I was thinking the same thing. Really similar. I would have had them
in 3 locations. The moderator and then 2 for the debaters. Split
screen for the debaters and show the moderator when he asks a question.
Only one microphone on at a time.

I wanted to see if Biden would make a fool of himself, but Trump would
not let him talk long enough. I gave up after about 15 minutes as I
could not get anything from either of them as they were both talking at
the same time.

That has to be the worse moderator of all time. He could not control
the men.

[Ralph Mowery]

In article <htjf6g...@mid.individual.net>, bodr...@yahoo.co.uk
says...

>
> > The next one is VP level.  That may actually prove more interesting that
> > the first.
> >
> It surely couldn't be any worse.
>
>

I would like to see Trump and Harris. I have a feeling that old Joe
will either die shortly after the election or the Democrats will find a
way to make him step down so Harris can take over.

[Bod]

Hmm!

[Jim Joyce]

My understanding is that the debate terms and conditions are negotiated by
teams from the two respective sides. They would never agree to a "mute the
mic" condition. I wish they would, since common courtesy seems to be in
short supply.

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

Ok. No debates, then. It's all kabuki anyway.

Not really an issue for me. I don't watch, any more than I watch other news
or politics. It's all print media for me. (Including reading stuff on the Net.)

Cindy Hamilton

[%%]

"Dean Hoffman" <deanh...@clod.com> wrote in message
news:rl1t48$18nb$1...@gioia.aioe.org...

Problem is that there is no way to actually substantiate either claim.

[%%]

"rbowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message

news:htjgde...@mid.individual.net...

> On 09/30/2020 12:15 AM, %% wrote:
>> Yep tho he did land a few hits, like with that
>> fool Dem governor who said that the virus
>> lockdown would be gone just after election
>> day who made it clear that they were trying
>> to make Trump look bad on the economy.

> I thought his best shots were pointing out Biden hasn't dome much in 47
> years. Why now?

The problem with that one is that Joe was
just one senator for most of that time.

> What Biden did do, like the crime bill, favorable legislation for bank and
> credit card companies,
< and so forth Joe would rather not mention.

Those weren’t his personally.

His attempt at gun law changes that Obama got him to try to
achieve is a much better example of how useless he has been.

> For the segments I saw it looked more like a SNL skit than what I'd expect
> from presidential contenders.

Yeah, the Dems have ended up with just another hopeless candidate.

> Joe did some fancy ducking and bobbing. Trump was right that if Joe
> commits himself he may lose the Bernie Bros or the suburban housewives.

He did commit himself to quite a bit of imo stupid
policy that I listed in what you cut from the quoting.

Committed himself to a lot more than Trump did
in fact except with obamacare and a vaccine.

[%%]

"rbowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message

news:htjgjl...@mid.individual.net...

> On 09/30/2020 04:38 AM, angelica...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> Two soundproof booths, each with a fixed camera pointed at the candidate
>> and with a monitor that displays the other guy and a speaker that outputs
>> the moderator's voice or the opponent's voice. Each man's microphone
>> is muted while the other uses his allotted time to answer the question or
>> respond to to his opponent.

> I was thinking a couple of switches to cut the mike of the other side
> during the 2 minute statements would have been good.

Yeah, me too, tho its less clear how well that would work
when the one who didn’t have the floor could have just
shouted loader. Cindy's sound proof booths would fix that.

[%%]

"rbowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message

news:htjgo1...@mid.individual.net...

Trouble is that some of the effect of debates
is entirely superficial like when Nixon just
looked awful compared with JFK.

I'm not convinced that the average voter
ever did take much notice of analysis.

[Peeler]

On Thu, 1 Oct 2020 04:08:33 +1000, %%, better known as cantankerous trolling
senile geezer Rodent Speed, wrote:


> Problem is that

The problem is that you are lonely sleepless 86-year-old pest who gets up
every night between 1 and 4 am just so he can pester someone on Usenet!

--
Marland revealing the senile sociopath's pathology:
"You have mentioned Alexa in a couple of threads recently, it is not a real
woman you know even if it is the only thing with a female name that stays
around around while you talk it to it.
Poor sad git who has to resort to Usenet and electronic devices for any
interaction as all real people run a mile to get away from you boring them
to death."
MID: <gfkt3m...@mid.individual.net>

[%%]

"Ralph Mowery" <rmower...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:MPG.39de5ef7b...@news.east.earthlink.net...

I'm not convinced that anyone could with someone like Trump
and Biden responding in kind when he realised he had to do that.

[%%]

"Ralph Mowery" <rmower...@earthlink.net> wrote in message

news:MPG.39de5f9d6...@news.east.earthlink.net...

> In article <htjf6g...@mid.individual.net>, bodr...@yahoo.co.uk
> says...
>>
>> > The next one is VP level. That may actually prove more interesting
>> > that
>> > the first.
>> >
>> It surely couldn't be any worse.
>>
>>
>
> I would like to see Trump and Harris. I have a feeling
> that old Joe will either die shortly after the election

The average life expectancy for americans of that
age is a surprising number of years still to go.

> or the Democrats will find a way to make
> him step down so Harris can take over.

Guess they could hot shot his drink like Putin just tried with his
alternative.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 9/30/2020 12:32 PM, Jim Joyce wrote:

>>
>> They should let me produce them.
>>
>> Two soundproof booths, each with a fixed camera pointed at the candidate
>> and with a monitor that displays the other guy and a speaker that outputs
>> the moderator's voice or the opponent's voice. Each man's microphone
>> is muted while the other uses his allotted time to answer the question or
>> respond to to his opponent.
>>
>> Television/Internet viewer see a split screen of each camera feed. The
>> camera never looks away, so if one of them talks while it isn't his turn,
>> picks his nose, leaves the camera view, etc., everybody knows.
>
> My understanding is that the debate terms and conditions are negotiated by
> teams from the two respective sides. They would never agree to a "mute the
> mic" condition. I wish they would, since common courtesy seems to be in
> short supply.
>

There is word from the comittee it will be different in the future.
Maybe they hired Cindy.

[Bob F]

trumps lie about the Multnomah sheriff supporting him was great too!

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/portland-sheriff-trump-support-denies-mike-reese/

[Bob F]

The conditions for the debate were negotiated in advance, and apparently
shutting off mics was not an agreed possibility.

[Bob F]

They could negotiate a rule that every second a participant talks over
the other during the others time adds twice that time for the others
response.

[Bob F]

The facts would do that.

Like trumps claim "Almost every law enforcement group in the United
States-- I have Florida, I have Texas, I have Ohio, I have everyo--
excuse me, Portland sheriff just came out today and said I support
President Trump. I don't think you have any law enforcement,"




Multnomah County Sheriff Mike Reese pushed back against a claim by
President Trump that the "Portland sheriff" supports the president. Mr.
Trump mentioned that the "Portland sheriff just came out today and said,
'I support President Trump'" during the first presidential debate on
Tuesday night.

"In tonight's presidential debate the President said the 'Portland
Sheriff' supports him. As the Multnomah County Sheriff I have never
supported Donald Trump and will never support him," Sheriff Mike Reese
tweeted. The county Reese represents includes Portland, Oregon.

Sheriff Reese said also that his wife got mad at him when trump made
that lie. Ho had to explain that trump was lying.

[%%]

"Bob F" <bobn...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:rl2mva$cjb$1...@dont-email.me...

> On 9/30/2020 11:08 AM, %% wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Dean Hoffman" <deanh...@clod.com> wrote in message
>> news:rl1t48$18nb$1...@gioia.aioe.org...
>>> On 9/29/20 10:04 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>> You didn't miss anything. Trump came across as a bully and made his
>>>> base happy.
>>>>
>>>> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>>>>
>>>> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.
>>>
>>> I did a search a couple days ago asking if debates change votes.
>>
>>> Most of what I found said not many votes are changed by the actual
>>> debates. The post debate commentary supposedly changes just as many.
>>
>> Problem is that there is no way to actually substantiate either claim.
>
> The facts would do that.

Nope, there are no relevant facts in that matter.

[Dean Hoffman]

Some reading if you're interested:
<https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=do+debates+change+votes&ia=web>

[T]

On 2020-09-29 20:04, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> You didn't miss anything.  Trump came across as a bully and made his
> base happy.
>
> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>
> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.

I would have to agree there. A draw vote wise.
No converts in either direction.

I would not say Trump came across as a bully. That
is the narrative. There is a difference between
being confident and forceful and being a bully.

Libs don't like to be disagreed with. They call
those that do bullies/racists/fascists/nazis etc..
The object it to keep Libs from hears opposing
viewpoints

Biden did not come across as dottering old fool,
which was good for him.

Biden did manager to call Trump a "clown" twice,
repeat the lie about "fine people on both sides",
defend the criminal conduct of his family,
blame all the worlds woes on global warming,
accuse Trump of killing 200,000, another lie.

When it comes to the fires, Trump got to say those
forbidden words "forest management" that the libs
all blame on globaloney.

Trump wiped the floor with Biden on law and order.

Wallace was probably not the best choice of
moderators either. I detected a bit of an
agenda from him too, but it could be coincidence.
He sure stunk keeping the arguing/interrupting down.

[%%]

"Dean Hoffman" <deanh...@clod.com> wrote in message

news:rl2q0v$1p0f$1...@gioia.aioe.org...

We know that polls often get it wrong, essentially because
they cant poll just those who bother to vote on the day.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 9/30/2020 3:31 PM, Bob F wrote:

>>
>> Television/Internet viewer see a split screen of each camera feed.  The
>> camera never looks away, so if one of them talks while it isn't his turn,
>> picks his nose, leaves the camera view, etc., everybody knows.
>>
>
> The conditions for the debate were negotiated in advance, and apparently
> shutting off mics was not an agreed possibility.

Sure. with civilized people you would not have to do that. Lesson
learned, I guess.

[Ed Pawlowski]

On 9/30/2020 4:57 PM, T wrote:
> On 2020-09-29 20:04, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> You didn't miss anything.  Trump came across as a bully and made his
>> base happy.
>>
>> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>>
>> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.
>
> I would have to agree there.  A draw vote wise.
> No converts in either direction.
>
> I would not say Trump came across as a bully.  That
> is the narrative.  There is a difference between
> being confident and forceful and being a bully.

Oh, come on. He interrupted many times. Typical bully tactic. He
tried talking often when Biden was talking. Schoolyard bully. Plenty of
reruns to watch.

>
> Libs don't like to be disagreed with.  They call
> those that do bullies/racists/fascists/nazis etc..
> The object it to keep Libs from hears opposing
> viewpoints

Yes, and Trump just accept it gracefully. Cut the crap and look at what
happens on both sides.

> When it comes to the fires, Trump got to say those
> forbidden words "forest management" that the libs
> all blame on globaloney.

It takes more than raking leaves. He is an expert in forestry now?

>
> Trump wiped the floor with Biden on law and order.

Proud boys?

>
> Wallace was probably not the best choice of
> moderators either.  I detected a bit of an
> agenda from him too, but it could be coincidence.
> He sure stunk keeping the arguing/interrupting down.
>

Doubt anyone would have fared will unless they could cut the mic. Not
easy dealing with a bully.

[T]

Because you don't like him does not mean he is a bully.
Trump just did not take any shit from him.

Was Biden a bully when he interrupted Trump? Guess not as
you like him.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Oh, you are so wrong. I don't like Biden. I just like Trump less.
Trump was far more obnoxious. That is his styles and his base is happy
for it. Trump was far more disruptive. Hes fans love it.

[rbowman]

"There you go again..." Trump would have done well to watch some Reagan
clips.

[rbowman]

On 09/30/2020 08:23 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
> That has to be the worse moderator of all time. He could not control
> the men.

He's neck to neck with Crowley in the race to the bottom.

I'd like to apologize for confusing Chris Matthews with Chris Wallace. I
was having a Biden moment...

[rbowman]

They need something better than Novichok. In the last 25 years afaik the
only fatality was the woman who used it for perfume.

[Bob F]

Nonsnese, unless you wanna be a Republican LIAR supporter for "president"

The facts would do that.

[Bob F]

On 9/30/2020 1:57 PM, T wrote:

>
> When it comes to the fires, Trump got to say those
> forbidden words "forest management" that the libs
> all blame on globaloney.
>

So why hasn't trumpsolved that problem? Most of the fires are in HIS
national forests. Give trump a rake and let him solve the problem.

[Bob F]

On 9/30/2020 3:42 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 9/30/2020 4:57 PM, T wrote:
>> On 2020-09-29 20:04, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>> You didn't miss anything.  Trump came across as a bully and made his
>>> base happy.
>>>
>>> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>>>
>>> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.
>>
>> I would have to agree there.  A draw vote wise.
>> No converts in either direction.
>>
>> I would not say Trump came across as a bully.  That
>> is the narrative.  There is a difference between
>> being confident and forceful and being a bully.
>
> Oh, come on.  He interrupted many times.  Typical bully tactic.  He
> tried talking often when Biden was talking.  Schoolyard bully. Plenty of
> reruns to watch.
>

trump would not let ANTONE say anything. He was constantly talking over
both Biden and the moderator. Proving he is incapable of listening.
Proving he is INCAPABLE of following the RULES HE agreed to. Kind of
like he constantly violates the oath he was sworn in to office with.

[Bob F]

And huge numbers of Americans were appalled by it. trump was incapable
of listening to anyone.

[philo]

On 9/29/20 10:04 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> You didn't miss anything.  Trump came across as a bully and made his
> base happy.
>
> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>
> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.

I watched two minutes...it was simply a media farce...I suppose mostly
just to make money.

[rbowman]

On 09/30/2020 12:22 PM, %% wrote:
> The problem with that one is that Joe was
> just one senator for most of that time.

https://projects.propublica.org/represent/members/B000444/bills-sponsored/110

He's been busy but there are a lot of still births and the usual
bullshit resolutions. All in all he's been a relatively uncontroversial
moderate. Why he submitted himself to this circus is beyond me. Like
Jimmy Carter he strikes me as a decent guy that doesn't have what it
takes. I'll feel sorry for him if the not-Trump vote puts him in office.

[rbowman]

On 09/30/2020 02:57 PM, T wrote:
> I would not say Trump came across as a bully. That
> is the narrative. There is a difference between
> being confident and forceful and being a bully.

He came across as a New Yorker, specifically of the NYC breed.Nothing
new there.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Don't know. No commercial breaks. There may be other ways to make
money though.

[rbowman]

On 09/30/2020 04:42 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>
>> Trump wiped the floor with Biden on law and order.
> Proud boys?

Anything the SPLC considers a hate group can't be all bad...

[Jim Joyce]

I watched the whole thing. As a citizen and a registered voter, it's sort
of my duty to keep myself informed. After the debate, I watched some of the
analysis on Fox News, CNN, and MSNBC.

I think a lot of the people who are expressing strong opinions one way or
the other probably didn't watch, or didn't watch all of it. To Ed's point,
very few votes were probably swayed. Most people have made up their mind.

[%%]

"rbowman" <bow...@montana.com> wrote in message

news:htkqfg...@mid.individual.net...

> On 09/30/2020 12:22 PM, %% wrote:
>> The problem with that one is that Joe was
>> just one senator for most of that time.
>
> https://projects.propublica.org/represent/members/B000444/bills-sponsored/110

Still just one senator as far as getting the bills passed
and most of them were cosponsored anyway.

He did much more than that with the changes to gun
laws that Obama got him to try to achieve and that ended
up face down in the mud like most of what he sponsored.

> He's been busy

Not really, someone has to sponsor bills, that doesn’t
mean that he personally actually initiated any of them.

> but there are a lot of still births and the usual bullshit resolutions.

> All in all he's been a relatively uncontroversial moderate.

And didn’t really get anything much done at all.

> Why he submitted himself to this circus is beyond me.

As with most pollys, its all about ego. His last chance
before he dies with maybe some component of keeping
worse fools like Sanders and the stupid women from the job.

> Like Jimmy Carter he strikes me as a decent guy that doesn't have what it
> takes.

Yep, his attempt at changes to gun laws proves that.

> I'll feel sorry for him if the not-Trump vote puts him in office.

Yeah, he would be as useless as Raygun but would at least
stop the worst excesses of Trump. But if the Dems end up
with both houses in Congress due to Trump, would piss
vast amounts of taxpayer money against the wall.

Its unlikely that the dems will get both houses imo but
the virus has made this time very unpredictable and I am
hopeless at predicting most US election results anyway.

I wasn’t surprised when Trump scraped in and wouldn't
be at all surprised if he does again So many of those
who bother to vote are royally pissed off with professional
politicians and Trump does get vast numbers of them off
their arses and actually voting in the states that matter.

Absolutely classic rabble rouser. Less clear if he can get the house tho.

[Bob F]

You could actually look it up.

"Dawn Sturgess and Charlie Rowley fell ill at a house in Amesbury, about
eight miles from Salisbury, on 30 June. Police said they were exposed
after handling a contaminated container - which is now believed to have
been a perfume bottle. Ms Sturgess died in hospital on 9 July and a
murder inquiry has been launched."

[%%]

"Jim Joyce" <no...@none.invalid> wrote in message
news:ijganftgrg936lrof...@4ax.com...

> On Wed, 30 Sep 2020 20:32:25 -0500, philo <ph...@privacy.net> wrote:
>
>>On 9/29/20 10:04 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>> You didn't miss anything. Trump came across as a bully and made his
>>> base happy.
>>>
>>> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>>>
>>> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.
>>
>>
>>
>>I watched two minutes...it was simply a media farce...I suppose mostly
>>just to make money.
>
> I watched the whole thing. As a citizen and a registered voter, it's sort
> of my duty to keep myself informed. After the debate, I watched some of
> the
> analysis on Fox News, CNN, and MSNBC.

> I think a lot of the people who are expressing strong opinions one
> way or the other probably didn't watch, or didn't watch all of it.

I bet most of the trumpets lapped it up and were cheering.

< To Ed's point, very few votes were probably swayed.

So why would you have been ? You one of those fools
to are convinced by the last person who speaks ?

> Most people have made up their mind.

And you haven't ?

[Bob F]

On 9/30/2020 7:23 AM, Ralph Mowery wrote:
> In article <39879978-f7ad-49ae...@googlegroups.com>,
> angelica...@yahoo.com says...
>>
>> They should let me produce them.
>>
>> Two soundproof booths, each with a fixed camera pointed at the candidate
>> and with a monitor that displays the other guy and a speaker that outputs
>> the moderator's voice or the opponent's voice. Each man's microphone
>> is muted while the other uses his allotted time to answer the question or
>> respond to to his opponent.

>>
>> Television/Internet viewer see a split screen of each camera feed. The
>> camera never looks away, so if one of them talks while it isn't his turn,
>> picks his nose, leaves the camera view, etc., everybody knows.
>>
>>
>>
>

> I was thinking the same thing. Really similar. I would have had them
> in 3 locations. The moderator and then 2 for the debaters. Split
> screen for the debaters and show the moderator when he asks a question.
> Only one microphone on at a time.
>
> I wanted to see if Biden would make a fool of himself, but Trump would
> not let him talk long enough. I gave up after about 15 minutes as I
> could not get anything from either of them as they were both talking at
> the same time.

>
> That has to be the worse moderator of all time. He could not control
> the men.
>

You could have done better getting trump to listen to someone else long
enough to actually hear the question?

[Jim Joyce]

On Thu, 1 Oct 2020 13:22:43 +1000, "%%" <%%@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
>"Jim Joyce" <no...@none.invalid> wrote in message
>news:ijganftgrg936lrof...@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 30 Sep 2020 20:32:25 -0500, philo <ph...@privacy.net> wrote:
>>
>>>On 9/29/20 10:04 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>> You didn't miss anything. Trump came across as a bully and made his
>>>> base happy.
>>>>
>>>> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>>>>
>>>> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>I watched two minutes...it was simply a media farce...I suppose mostly
>>>just to make money.
>>
>> I watched the whole thing. As a citizen and a registered voter, it's sort
>> of my duty to keep myself informed. After the debate, I watched some of
>> the
>> analysis on Fox News, CNN, and MSNBC.
>
>> I think a lot of the people who are expressing strong opinions one
>> way or the other probably didn't watch, or didn't watch all of it.
>
>I bet most of the trumpets lapped it up and were cheering.

I don't know about that. I'm no pollster, but 100% of the ~40 or so people
I talked to today, in person and online, said that they didn't watch the
debate, or they flipped the channel after the first few minutes. Most of
those people are diehard Trump supporters.

>< To Ed's point, very few votes were probably swayed.
>
>So why would you have been ? You one of those fools
>to are convinced by the last person who speaks ?
>
>> Most people have made up their mind.
>
>And you haven't ?

It looks like you misunderstood something.

[Neill Massello]

On 2020-09-29 at 21:04:39 MDT, "Ed Pawlowski" <e...@snet.xxx> wrote:

> You didn't miss anything. Trump came across as a bully and made his
> base happy.
>
> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>
> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.

The best political debate in a long time, marred only by Chris Wallace's
interference.

[rbowman]

On 09/30/2020 09:02 PM, %% wrote:
>
> Absolutely classic rabble rouser. Less clear if he can get the house tho.

I doubt it but I've never been good at predicting elections. Last time
around I was surprised in the morning when the DJ was playing Norah Jones

"Let's just forget, leave it behind and carry on"

I figured it didn't turn out the way he had hoped.

[%%]

"Jim Joyce" <no...@none.invalid> wrote in message

news:oakanflpgmq10thuj...@4ax.com...

> On Thu, 1 Oct 2020 13:22:43 +1000, "%%" <%%@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>>"Jim Joyce" <no...@none.invalid> wrote in message
>>news:ijganftgrg936lrof...@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 30 Sep 2020 20:32:25 -0500, philo <ph...@privacy.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On 9/29/20 10:04 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>>> You didn't miss anything. Trump came across as a bully and made his
>>>>> base happy.
>>>>>
>>>>> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I watched two minutes...it was simply a media farce...I suppose mostly
>>>>just to make money.
>>>
>>> I watched the whole thing. As a citizen and a registered voter, it's
>>> sort
>>> of my duty to keep myself informed. After the debate, I watched some of
>>> the
>>> analysis on Fox News, CNN, and MSNBC.
>>
>>> I think a lot of the people who are expressing strong opinions one
>>> way or the other probably didn't watch, or didn't watch all of it.
>>
>>I bet most of the trumpets lapped it up and were cheering.

> I don't know about that.

I do.

> I'm no pollster, but 100% of the ~40 or so people I talked

? to today, in person and online, said that they didn't watch the

> debate, or they flipped the channel after the first few minutes.
> Most of those people are diehard Trump supporters.

>>< To Ed's point, very few votes were probably swayed.
>>
>>So why would you have been ? You one of those fools
>>to are convinced by the last person who speaks ?
>>
>>> Most people have made up their mind.
>>
>>And you haven't ?

> It looks like you misunderstood something.

Nope, just rubbing your nose in your lack of basic logic.

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

On Wednesday, September 30, 2020 at 10:50:19 PM UTC-4, Jim Joyce wrote:
> On Wed, 30 Sep 2020 20:32:25 -0500, philo <ph...@privacy.net> wrote:
>
> >On 9/29/20 10:04 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> >> You didn't miss anything. Trump came across as a bully and made his
> >> base happy.
> >>
> >> Biden came across as a more gentle person and with some respect.
> >>
> >> I'd say neither gained or lost a single vote.
> >
> >
> >
> >I watched two minutes...it was simply a media farce...I suppose mostly
> >just to make money.
> I watched the whole thing. As a citizen and a registered voter, it's sort
> of my duty to keep myself informed. After the debate, I watched some of the
> analysis on Fox News, CNN, and MSNBC.

I keep myself well informed. There are several reasons I favor print media,
one of which is it's much more difficult for a charismatic speaker to sway
me if all I read is the transcript. Another is that speech is just too damned
slow. I can read a book in 4 hours where the audiobook format is 13 hours.

Cindy Hamilton

[angelica...@yahoo.com]

I bet I could get him to stalk off the stage in a huff, merely by saying stuff
like, "This debate will not continue until you can behave yourself, Donald."

Cindy Hamilton

[Bod]

Or say to him "I'll put you on the norty step until you can control
yourself";-)

[Bob F]

He was being the perfect 5 YO, wasn't he.

[Clare Snyder]

My kids both knew better than to try to get away with that kind of
crap ong before they reached the age of 5 - - - -

[Bob F]

But they farm you out to a "military" school, did they.

[Bob F]

And polls are suggesting a rout.

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/519225-new-polls-feed-gop-fears-of-biden-rout-over-trump